Star Trek 2x22 - "Return to Tomorrow" Review - Star Trek Universe

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
All right, let's do it.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
I guess, let's do it. I guess I'm.

Speaker 1 (00:05):
Always so late. I'm iffy about everything.

Speaker 2 (00:09):
I'm effy about everything I know.

Speaker 1 (00:14):
On this episode of Star Trek Universe, Effie and I
learned that sometimes it's best to let star gones be
by gones. I'm sorry, I shouldn't laugh, especially when you
meet douchebags with big ball energy who like to call
your son. We are discussion, of course, discussing Star Trek

(00:39):
two twenty two return to tomorrow right after these words
from our mystery sponsors.

Speaker 3 (00:53):
Welcome in to Star Trek Universe.

Speaker 1 (00:54):
You're embarking on yet another classic Trek watch rewatch session.
I am David C. Robertson. I have watched many many times, and.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
I am I fiel Pelller's meaning. I have only seen
this the once.

Speaker 1 (01:09):
The once.

Speaker 2 (01:10):
It's I'm just doing the watching. I'm not rewatching ship.
I can forget everything, and I'm still not allowed to
watch it a second time. It's a rough, rough set
of rules around here. People.

Speaker 1 (01:20):
Oh no, you can watch it as many have as
you want.

Speaker 2 (01:22):
Yeah, no, I'm I'm aware, but that would cost me
more time and effort.

Speaker 1 (01:25):
I won't tell them.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
I mean, I'm just I'm just making the rules for myself,
but then pretending I'm suffering under under their rule, right
we are. So it is it is early in the
day for me, guys.

Speaker 1 (01:42):
Come on, it is late in the day. Well it's
not only late late in the day for me, Like
I will up like seven hours ago.

Speaker 2 (01:48):
So it could could be worse. But you have some
hours to go.

Speaker 1 (01:52):
But I didn't get much sleep.

Speaker 2 (01:54):
Oh well, me neither. So we're we're we're level on
that in that regard.

Speaker 1 (02:00):
But but You're still in your twenties barely, but I'm
in my forties, which means that, like, you know, I
told you, I told you about having to do like dude,
like shit comes up that you just don't you would
never think. I didn't think of it, like oh god,
like oh my god, Like I didn't get enough sleep
last night, which means that like I'm doing prep for

(02:22):
the show today and my eyes are just fucking burning
out of my skull, like they are just killing me
and itching, and I'm like, you know, I've already got
like allergy issues anyway.

Speaker 2 (02:34):
Sure, but it's winter, like.

Speaker 1 (02:36):
I know, part of fucked, so like part of my
like pre show fidgets, like I told you I have
because you were like call me and well, I'll introduce
you to my girlfriend. I'm like, uh, I'm gonna try this.
I'm gonna try this. I'm gonna try to call in
a minute, but I gotta lay down first, pop my

(02:59):
mid bet because my head is killing me. And then
of course I've got to like do this thing where
I put my hands behind my head and push my
skull up so that like I get more blood flow
to my brain so I can think.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
And also glad you're still limber enough to put your
hands by back. I know people my age who can't.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
Dude, that's that In some days it's hard. But then
I also had to put eye drops in because my
eyes were burning and itching so bad that I could
barely read the screen.

Speaker 2 (03:29):
So yeah, that doesn't help. That's that's a fidget of sorts,
I suppose.

Speaker 1 (03:33):
Yeah, yeah, just like you know, blinking and it takes.

Speaker 2 (03:39):
A targeting with that tiny fucking bottle to squeeze out
the droplets. It's a fidget.

Speaker 1 (03:45):
I'm just it's just like you know, just like getting yourself,
getting yourself comfortable, getting your like okay, well I gotta
get my eyes to stop burning, I gotta get my head.
Just let the blood flow in fair enough.

Speaker 2 (03:56):
Well, I'm glad you have vision again and somewhat blood
in your or your brain. I suppose that's that's good.
I would make it.

Speaker 1 (04:04):
I would.

Speaker 2 (04:05):
I would have been more specific in the vision part.
But I honestly don't know how twenty twenty goes down
on which side is your score, like just the front
of it? Is it just, oh, you have ten out
of twenty vision or I don't know how does any
of this shit work. It's an American thing. I have
no clue. You just get the scores of like, hey,
the dioptics of your fucking eye, Like this is your score.

(04:28):
You have minus four and you need thick ass glasses.
Go fuck yourself. But I don't know.

Speaker 1 (04:35):
I have not been to an eye doctor since I
was thirteen. So my version of this is I go
into the dollar tree to see I go into the
dollar tree, and I pick up the dollar twenty five
glasses and I put them on until the words aren't
blurry anymore.

Speaker 2 (04:51):
My goodness, that is that is a privilege, because I
could not go far enough down the dollar tree line. Basically,
to find my my the strength I need in my glasses, Like,
that's just it doesn't exist.

Speaker 1 (05:05):
Yeah, it'll I'll probably eventually get to a point where,
you know, I'll wind up having to have some kind
of fucking surgery. It's a it's a genetic things in
my family, like my grandma to.

Speaker 2 (05:17):
Get the same same for me. My grandpa like lost
a lot of his vision in the later years. My
dad has like eye pressure issues glaucoma, and that that's
just that's gonna genetically fuck me eventually. But at least
I know to be on the lookout for it because
my dad didn't know before my grandpa ever found out

(05:38):
he was losing his vision. So you know, my dad
was a bit further along the way before he ever
walked into the eye hospital.

Speaker 1 (05:47):
Yeah. Yeah, I told you about driving to I think
we're driving to Nashville to see bright Eyes or somebody
or wheezer, somebody play. And my sister's in the backseat.
I'm the front seat. My brother in law is driving,
and my brother in law decides to They were talking

(06:07):
about eyeglasses because my my sister's guy glasses on and
he's like, well, let me see what they look like,
and he like puts them on on the fucking road,
on the road. He puts on my sisters. This fucker
he puts on my sister's eyeglasses and then goes, I
can see leaves now.

Speaker 2 (06:23):
No no, no, no, no, no, that's worse. That's worse.
That's the exact thing I said when I was like
eight and first got glasses, and I was like, oh,
trees have leaves on them, even when you're not standing
like a foot close to them.

Speaker 1 (06:39):
What the Yeah? My sister was like, I was gonna read,
but you know what, keep them?

Speaker 2 (06:45):
Yeah? Yeah, you you keep driving. Jesus Christ. I see leaves.
Oh that's that's worrisome. But also, I mean, I know
it must be at least slightly easier given that cars
are big, so you can just see the right sort
of blur next to you and be sure not to

(07:08):
hit those blurs. And also you have stay in your
lane kind of rules, which is different here from what
I understand because I don't have a driver's license. What
do I know about traffic? Shit, I just know we
switch lanes a lot more than in the US. That's
about all I can tell you about our highway. I've
set in the passenger seat. It's a luxury. That's my privilege.

(07:32):
I can't see shit, but trust me, I can sit
next to you and honey, you missed, you missed an exit.

Speaker 1 (07:38):
So you're saying you are what we would call a
passenger princess.

Speaker 2 (07:43):
Yes, yes, indeed, I would probably also be be uh.
I might not be allowed to drive even if I
wanted to, just because of like three kinds of psych
meds like that might actually impact the ruling against me.
I'm not sure you're allowed to operate heavy machinery. Do

(08:04):
you see those labels on the little boxes with pills
that say don't operate heavy machinery? No, No, I don't.
I'm not wearing my glasses ha trich Yes cpb' that's
how I get through the DMV officer.

Speaker 1 (08:21):
This car is not heavy machinery. It's light as a
motherfucker exactly.

Speaker 2 (08:25):
I kind of lift it with one hand. I'm not
allowed to drive it now. Again. Superhero Podcast is a
different show. Maybe we should get to the synopsis. What
was this episode about?

Speaker 1 (08:36):
Hey, the the incredibly insufficient memory Alpha summary telepathic aliens
take over Kirkan's box bodies.

Speaker 2 (08:46):
That is technically true. Yeah, it is very short. Yeah,
I'm sure there was some other shit that happened, but yeah,
their bodies get inhabited, they get to do some acting.

Speaker 1 (08:59):
Yeah. Really it's kind of a mess of an episode
if you ask me.

Speaker 2 (09:03):
Ah, interesting I mean it is in some ways, but
also I did find it interesting to see them do
some shit, like see them stretch their muscles as actors,
a bit like The Priding. Wise, it's a bit forced
because it is very much an episode that's like, oh,
let's introduce a woman and get and write an excuse

(09:24):
around the concept of getting her to kiss bock Kirk. Sorry,
like just just we need them to make out. I
guess we're making them spouses, but like telepathically, Yeah, I
don't think it feels like that on some level. But
still the emotional resolution at the end felt fine. It

(09:46):
just there seems to at least it hints towards a
lot of intricate dynamics within the society they come across,
which felt like, you know, more world building than we
occasionally get, right, especially because it leaves some of it open.

Speaker 1 (10:03):
Yeah, I think overall, like I really like how they
open it with you know, the hundreds of light years
past where any Earth ship has ever explored. DA's cooler. Yeah,
it'll take over three weeks for the Kirk's logs to
reach Starfleet.

Speaker 2 (10:18):
DA's cool Yeah, that gives you the realism of space
is fucking huge and fucking dark, and you won't be
able to instantly communicate. You're out there on your own.
It's scary, and I do it adds texture to the mission.

Speaker 1 (10:34):
I do love the idea that there's some ancient dead
civilization and they may have seated life on Earth. They
may have seated vulcan We don't know. They don't Yeah, they.

Speaker 2 (10:50):
Don't know because they were different people, of course, But like, yeah,
we send some ships that way vaguely. Maybe they got there.
Maybe we're your gods. Maybe we're douchebags. Who cares.

Speaker 1 (11:04):
I did laugh. I did laugh because the episode, like
Saragon tells Kirk and the teaser, you know, I am,
I am as dead as my planet. Does that frighten you,
James Kirk? For if it does, if you let what
is left of me perish, then all of you, my children,
all of mankind must perish too. And then he never

(11:27):
explains what that means. Like they get down there and
He's like, we want we want robot bodies. That's it.
And Kirk never said, wait, how what was that shit about?
Like all of humanity fucking when.

Speaker 2 (11:39):
When you threaten your existence? No, no, no, I just
mean like, I'm gonna give you a lot of really
mythical cool technology that you can't even comprehend yet, and
that will hopefully prevent you from going the way of
our society that did have this knowledge as well. N
now that I think about it, maybe you'll perish either way.

Speaker 1 (12:04):
I just meant some philosophically, like you thought you you're
in a starship, or don't you have some sort of
spirit of adventure? And don't you have some kind of
curiosity if you understand.

Speaker 2 (12:20):
If you kill our entire state of being, our our
very essence, then isn't your soul in a way also
dead and gone because you let us perish? Is that
not a spiritual perishing of your your morality as humans?

(12:41):
What even are humans worth? If they kill planets they
come across? I am stretching reaching hard.

Speaker 1 (12:55):
Mankind shall die if you shrug at me? All right?

Speaker 2 (13:00):
I have shrugged a lot.

Speaker 1 (13:02):
And it was weird because it was like He's like, no,
I'm sorry, gone, I'm cool, you may go your own
way the com Fleetwood Max song. And then like they're like, well,
we don't want to send we don't want to send
Spock down there, and then like all the all the
ship goes fucking dead.

Speaker 2 (13:19):
Yeah, and it's just like, okay, they really want Spock
down there.

Speaker 1 (13:24):
Okay, well okay, how about uh we let you go?
Oh the lights are back. So if we decided to
just say, if we just decided to be like fuck you,
fuck your couch, We're gonna move on. Are they gonna
shut down the.

Speaker 2 (13:38):
Ship or are we free to leave? Or is that
just the thing you say to make us not leave.

Speaker 1 (13:43):
Yeah, I'm curious. I'm curious. It's a weird episode, though,
I get the feeling Sargone I feel. I get the
feeling Sargon is supposed to be God and Hannock or
Enoch is the devil. I mean he even in a
pointy eared body.

Speaker 2 (14:02):
How subtle. I mean, they do keep pointing out that
the pointy ears are a thing demonic to anyone who
looks at them, and I'm just like, have you never.

Speaker 1 (14:14):
Seen over the course of the series.

Speaker 2 (14:16):
Yeah, I mean Tolkien was out by by this point
in time, come ons are no longer, but presumably just
devil ship.

Speaker 1 (14:27):
In the United States, there.

Speaker 2 (14:30):
Has always been a satanic panic somewhere.

Speaker 1 (14:34):
Yeah, in the pop pop culture, pointy ears means devil.
They didn't like the studio was scared to put him
in the show. Yep, the whole thing. So we also
have like Saragone, he keeps calling him son and my
children he's talking about.

Speaker 2 (14:50):
Yeah, it is conscious, realistic. Is it is clearly a
well I am I'm not a heavenly father, but I
am your father from heaven. Like right, it's on the
nose in that regard. It's it's very clearly trying to
make a point of that of like, oh, maybe God
was just some guy who came from very far away
and had magical technology and you know, created us in

(15:13):
his image. Yeah, it's it's it's there, it's in there. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (15:17):
Sure. He even mentions like, I don't know, maybe you're Adam
and Eve.

Speaker 2 (15:20):
Was that that one? That one struck me as being
slightly slightly forced, where I'm like, I mean, I get
he should. He should have the wherewithal to be like,
I've seen your history. Banks. That's a fucking myth makes
zero sense for all of you to stem from one
fucking genetic person, Like, no, no, that's a mess that

(15:44):
will not go well.

Speaker 1 (15:45):
Yes, yes, but you know he might be intelligent enough
to be like, okay, so the general myth might have
come from settlers who landed on your planet and y'all
remembered Adam and Eve and that's what she kind of
morphed it out of. It doesn't have to be like
a one to one like.

Speaker 2 (16:05):
I mean, maybe they were Adam and Eve and they
just you know, got some spacier names for the same names,
and that's what God bastardized over the over the decades,
over the centuries.

Speaker 1 (16:16):
Maybe it is. It could also just be Adam and
Eve and we just took those names.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
I suppose, But then that would still not explain all
of the let's say, non Abrahamic religions that don't give
a fuck about Adam or Eve.

Speaker 1 (16:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (16:29):
No, like it's it's still pretty specific about the place
and time where where these myths originated.

Speaker 1 (16:36):
Sure, sure, sure everything is. Like there's an old Twilight
Zone episode where they literally like it's like, uh, some
dude crashes an alien crashes on this planet and he's
roaming around and he finds a woman and they slowly
become like she's from a different place, and then of
course they wound up being Adam and Eve, like their

(16:56):
names are Adam and Eve, right, yeah, but like you know,
I'm just saying, like I think they're oversimplifying and so
and Sargon would oversimplify and just not he.

Speaker 2 (17:07):
Is he is a patronizing dick hole. That would definitely
be like, oh, son, here for you to understand this way.

Speaker 1 (17:15):
He might be patronizing in a dick hole, but at
the same time, like he was clearly the good guy.

Speaker 2 (17:21):
Yeah yeah, yeah, but he's still he's not he he
is the good guy next to the ass, right, he's
just kind of a kind of an ass going evil.
Let's take let's steal these bodies and fuck everybody else.
Going back to it just seemed like the good guy.

Speaker 1 (17:40):
Like going back to the god of of Judah. Do
you notice that he basically required Kirk to sacrifice Spock.
It was like an Isaac and his son, and then
he restores the the a Spock to Kirk.

Speaker 2 (17:57):
Like oh, after all, yeah, fair enough.

Speaker 1 (18:01):
Yeah, yeah yeah inspired, So yeah, there's we'll talk about
the guy we'll talk about it. We'll talk about the
guy who wrote it.

Speaker 2 (18:17):
That part.

Speaker 1 (18:18):
We'll get to that in a second. By the way,
I do think it's interesting and kind of annoying that
they did by any other name, where there are a
bunch of aliens who like take over the enterprise and
they've converted themselves to human beings and now they're like, uh,
instead of learning how to be human in this episode,
it's like, oh, they're remembering what it was like to

(18:39):
be human. It's aliens going into human form again, but
instead of learning to be human, now they're remembering what
it was to be human.

Speaker 2 (18:48):
Yeah, just senses.

Speaker 1 (18:52):
Yeah, it's it's aggravating that they did. They also aired
them really quick closely together. They're not just produced them closely,
but it's aggravating that that is that those two concepts
are a little similar, more similar than I would.

Speaker 2 (19:09):
Like short short time after each other. I can see
why they space them out in release order more than
production order. But still but is similar, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:19):
It is. Yes, it is a different resolution and largely
a different execution.

Speaker 2 (19:26):
The direction goes a very different way thanks that little nuance.
It does split off into different episodes easily.

Speaker 1 (19:36):
But it does feel like it's an appropriate time, under
this criticism for me to remind you and the audience
that this was this was the last minute production. They
have been canceled a couple episodes previously, and then all
of a sudden got in order for more episodes, and
this is what they're bottom of this one.

Speaker 2 (20:00):
When does that stop? Like, when when do they get
back to a normal ish timeline to write?

Speaker 1 (20:09):
Never? Oh good point, Yeah, it gets worse and worse,
and it's.

Speaker 2 (20:16):
Looking forward to season three.

Speaker 1 (20:17):
Jesus, we're already dealing within the time. We're like, I think,
oh gosh, I can't remember. I think I've got it
written down on one of these notes. But Ralph Seneski
was talking about I think it was Ralph Sineski talking
about how you know, you you had to stop filming
at six twelve every day and then you had eighteen
minutes to get everything set up for the next day

(20:37):
and get the fuck out the lot. All the lights
would go out, and does.

Speaker 2 (20:42):
It That's that's rough.

Speaker 1 (20:44):
They had They had guys standing there holding the plug
and at a certain time before whether you were the
littleest scene.

Speaker 2 (20:50):
Or not out. Yeah that's rough. Yeah, yeah, that's not
a not a great condition to work and no, no.

Speaker 1 (20:58):
Yeah, And you remember I told you like when they
went from Desilu to Pair Hmount, they lost a day,
like a full.

Speaker 2 (21:03):
Day, right, Yeah, you mentioned that. It was just yeah
that they just you know, do it in four instead
of five. Go fuck yourself. Yeah, yeah that matters.

Speaker 1 (21:15):
But you know, once Gene Roddenberry leaves and we were
getting the season three, it's like they have no money,
they have no production time. They are cranking shit out.

Speaker 2 (21:26):
They're just doing whatever. I don't think I knew Roddenberry
left midway through TOS. I think you just spoiled that
for me. Ah.

Speaker 1 (21:38):
I think that's how I'll remember it. Oh, we'll see,
We'll make sure I'm right eventually.

Speaker 2 (21:42):
That's fair, that's fair. Uh. But yeah, I remember he
came back at some point. I just said I wasn't sure.

Speaker 1 (21:49):
Well, yeah, Animated series, and he tried to come back
for the movies. He came back for one movie and
then they kind of scuttled him for the rest of
the movies.

Speaker 2 (21:57):
Then he came back for TG That's what I remember,
or that he came back for TNG. But I was
under the impression that he was scottled during the movies, probably,
and you know, I wasn't sure if he'd gone and
came back before that.

Speaker 4 (22:13):
No, I know, somewhat, Yeah, all right, but yeah, I
think this one just it takes a little too long
to get going, and then like I feel like the
ending is a bit rushed.

Speaker 2 (22:25):
Yeah, yeah, and I feel.

Speaker 1 (22:27):
Like we never it feels like, okay, so I know
you have a switch.

Speaker 2 (22:32):
Through and say goodbye and awkwardness.

Speaker 1 (22:36):
I don't know, I never. I don't know. I'm pretty
good at picking stuff out on television shows that I
haven't seen, but I've seen all these so many times
since I was a little like, I don't remember a
time when I wasn't watching Star Trek. So I don't
know if I've ever acknowledged a time where I didn't

(22:56):
realize that when Sargun was like, oh, yeah, Hannock was
from the other side and he's oh, he's gonna be
the villain of the piece immediately, Yeah, yeah, I don't
trust that guy, but we shouldn't.

Speaker 2 (23:09):
Yeah, But also it wasn't It wasn't very clear to
me what the fuck that meant. He was just if
that meant another family tree, another side of the planet
and no.

Speaker 1 (23:20):
Well he was talking about how they were like engulfed
in in a.

Speaker 2 (23:23):
War and r yeah, yeah, that's true. I forgot about that.
There was the whole shebang about well, we almost got
rid of our entire society and then we saved ourselves
just in time, which was clearly the peaceful side. He
that that overcame reason, but yeah, yeah, yeah, and then

(23:44):
I get a warring faction.

Speaker 1 (23:46):
There are some weird bits in there where like, no,
it's like Sargon and Kirk measuring like dicks or something
where Sarragon is and it could have just been cut
where Sargon is like, oh, yeah, so we almost destroyed
our So Kirk is like, yeah, we had like a
nuclear age thing, right right.

Speaker 2 (24:05):
Oh, we we overcame that. And then we're like no, no, no, worse. Yeah,
you don't even know how bad it's gonna get.

Speaker 1 (24:13):
Like we had we overcame our nuclear era too, I
speak of a greater cataclysm.

Speaker 2 (24:21):
Yeah, but you have yet face good bluff. I mean
that was interesting, if at all explored. Yeah, like you
that that could have pointed to something, And I was like, okay,
tell me, tell me more. What is this conflict? And
the conflict turns out to be can we steal these
bodies instead of building our own?

Speaker 3 (24:43):
Uh huh?

Speaker 2 (24:44):
Just just dickery versus not that big a dickery.

Speaker 1 (24:50):
I just feel like it once it gets to the enterprise. Really,
I don't know it, just dude like Hannock change like
he's so obviously evil.

Speaker 2 (25:00):
Because clearly the moment he wakes up and calls Nurse Chapel.

Speaker 1 (25:05):
A female, which is you know, code for like uga
halmana hamana, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (25:16):
Which I did. I did find that fun where there
was in that roundabout way, slightly more exploration of that
tension between Chapel and Spock, where it's like, oh, okay,
she's glad. He's certainly flirtatious because he can he can feel,
and we goddamn know it because every time someone telepathic

(25:37):
starts to be in his body, they're like, oh huga.
But also then by the end, having sort of mind melted,
you have been inside me quite literally with your entire being,
but you know, mentally and and not at all sexually.
That is about as intimate as those people are ever

(25:58):
gonna get, given their let's say peculiarities. That was cute,
sort of I'm sure, I'm sure there's more boning in
other timelines. Man, I can't wait to get there, but
I'm not there yet. This is this is the sexy
time I have to live for okay.

Speaker 1 (26:16):
Yeah yeah, where they've both been in each other's minds
and be like we don't know what we want to do,
but we ain't gonna do it.

Speaker 2 (26:23):
Yeah, yep, We're we're gonna be It's just teasing denial.
It's just a lot of chastity devices. But you know,
mentally like logical people. Yeah, it's a lot of uh yeah, restrictions.
I am sure they're having fun.

Speaker 1 (26:38):
Ah uh yeah. I thought like Hannock was just too
too much, too quick, too obvious. It was a lot
of fun seeing Leonardinoy do it though.

Speaker 2 (26:50):
Oh absolutely that guy was going for it, Like Kirk
could have sped up some of his fucking sargle onlines
like when first, I mean he is chewing scenery in
the way where I'm like, come on, man, you can
just be another person without first going striking three different
poses to get into character or some shit like the

(27:13):
camera really really took its time with that one, whereas
Nimo it just just does a fucking non spock while
looking like Spock, which is interesting because you can see
his entire physicality change where it's like, oh, he is
no longer that sort of logical, robotic, cool, monotone kind

(27:38):
of person. He is much like he has. He suddenly
gets to showcase his range for a bit. And yeah,
I mean it's pretty damn obvious from the get go, like,
oh this he ain't great though I didn't like I
like you said, oh he was from another faction, Like,
it didn't immediately tip me off where we were going,

(28:00):
but I figured, you know, there's the couple, there's the
third guy. Yeah, the third guy probably wants to bone
the girl or something or something or something. I mean
it was very much like, look at me putting together
your body. We'll make it feminine later, I'll give you
some boobs, but for now, I want you to really

(28:21):
hate the cold metal.

Speaker 1 (28:23):
Yeah. Well, she felt like they didn't have enough time
to really get into those characters.

Speaker 2 (28:30):
Yeah, and like they kind of rushed to the point
where she was convinced real quickly and then convinced back
real quickly.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
But I mean, if you look at like the horrifying
nature of it, you know, you just now get back
the feelings and the sensations. Yeah, do a really good
job with the like to fill air and their lungs
again and to see with eyes. But and the.

Speaker 2 (28:52):
Nimoy sold me on the fucking premise of you don't
want to go into that robot body. That's a that's
a lot to lose. That's barely life anymore. Yeah, at
that point, we are just you know, sentient slaves who
are teaching. We're just teachers at that point. It is
very much a we have lost that connection with with

(29:13):
being alive. We're just there to relay information. Can't we
just write that down in the computer and kill ourselves?
Because drop the ball quite lightly.

Speaker 1 (29:24):
You know, with his statement about Chapel, I do get
the feeling that Hinnock was just like, okay, girl, I'm horny,
like let's do something.

Speaker 2 (29:33):
Sure, But also he was hanzy withal as well when
Sargon went around. Yeah, absolutely like he he felt some
some some vulcan emotions under under the surface. Which is
fun because I do think that everything he feels does
relate back to Spock and what he is repressing, which

(29:54):
makes it more interesting because Spock I actually care about it,
and I know I'll never see this guy again. So
for the for that sense of world building, to me,
it is fun to be like, oh, oh you are
this is what he actually has to deal with all
of the time and can't act on, can't react to.
But it's there. We know he has the hots for Chapel.

(30:16):
We just know he spuck and he can't really do
a fucking thing about it.

Speaker 1 (30:20):
He chooses not to do anything about it. Like he
could absolutely about it.

Speaker 2 (30:24):
Yeah, of course he could. He could, but he would
be a complete societal outcast, more than he already is
to an extent that he is not willing to be
because he has lived his entire life trying to be
fully vulcan while I'm not being fully vulcan.

Speaker 1 (30:40):
Yeah, he's he's definitely got some trauma from childhood.

Speaker 2 (30:43):
Oh yeah, yeah, no, it's it's clear with the dad
like that, even at this point, like knowing there will
be more fleshing out of that, but even just having
met his parents, it's very much like, yeah, this is
this is pretty much the kid who has been told boys,
don't cry, don't tell your mom shit, just close yourself off,
just turn inward fully makes this kind of worrying. How

(31:06):
many fans identify with him, but still just generally it's
an interesting character because of the fucking repression, the trauma
that decades of just I can't show anything to anyone
that's lonely man.

Speaker 3 (31:20):
Fuck yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:21):
I mean I'll tell you something. When I was little,
m all through my childhood, if I cried or had
any kind of like real, like negative emotion, my dad
would be like, oh, here comes Shatner for fox sake,
melodramatic Shatner because we watched Star Treks Christ.

Speaker 2 (31:40):
Yeah, yeah, and you knew what the fuck that meant.
I did, yeah Christ's sake. Yeah, so absolutely, Well I'm
sure your dad had a lovely childhood too. Oh god,
we don't get a shit about that, though. He should
have been a better dad regardless.

Speaker 1 (31:57):
Uh you know, well yeah, you know. I think the
characters are, which I.

Speaker 2 (32:03):
Am saying as a friend. It's not the entire opinion
of this entire show. I can't speak for my co host,
but hey, look, everybody wrong. If you were to disagree, I'll.

Speaker 1 (32:12):
Say this, everybody everybody deals with something, you know, and
I try.

Speaker 2 (32:18):
To absolutely that is the distinction I'm trying to make
like he probably had his shit childhood it's just that
doesn't undo your responsibility as a parent.

Speaker 1 (32:30):
It is.

Speaker 2 (32:30):
It's an explanation, not an excuse. That's sort of the
difference I always try to keep in mind I can
empathize with basically everyone. Doesn't mean I always have to
agree with their choices.

Speaker 1 (32:40):
Yeah, like my dad and I have our issues, but
I will say he did better than his dad did.

Speaker 2 (32:48):
Oh of course. Yeah, you know, the bar is on
the floor, of course, and and every improvement generationally adds
up well until you because you don't have kids, but
you know, ideally that would get to a better point eventually.
I guess.

Speaker 1 (33:09):
Children to the son, let.

Speaker 2 (33:16):
Me raise you in the ways of Trek.

Speaker 1 (33:23):
Oh god.

Speaker 5 (33:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:25):
I also do enjoy how they in the sixties had
the goal to be like we overcame our nuclear era,
like they were pretty sure of themselves. Technically, of course,
in the track timeline they would have to have reached peace,
but still they had a couple of decades to go.

Speaker 1 (33:44):
Dude. It was like one of those things where I
might be wrong. I might be wrong. There's so much
stuff that I've watched over the years, even though I've
watched All Star Treks so many times, but I think
I don't think they mentioned until next generation. The card
says something about World War Three. I was like, what
the fuck? Wait, what.

Speaker 2 (34:03):
Don't they because I was thinking, I thought that the
whole con rise thing that we've already been through was
World War three. Yes, that is a that was the
nineties thing.

Speaker 1 (34:14):
Right, that is a point of contention among the fans
and even among.

Speaker 2 (34:20):
The riders, and of everybody has their own idea. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (34:24):
Yeah, like there, world War three was separate for a
while from the eugenics wars.

Speaker 2 (34:31):
And then oh and then that overlapped, and.

Speaker 1 (34:34):
Then later on it was kind of a well, okay,
because originally the eugenics were the eugenics wars happened in
the nineties. Yeah, and then World War three happened sometime,
you know, in the two thousand.

Speaker 2 (34:47):
When the nineties came close to the production time, they
were like, let's put it in the two thousands. That's
far away still.

Speaker 1 (34:53):
And then they were kind of vague enough about it
where they were like, well, it's kind of all same
with part of the same conflict, and the.

Speaker 6 (35:01):
Vacuum elongated sort of fin the vacuum left by the
fucking dictators of the eugenics Wars started and then.

Speaker 1 (35:12):
Yeah, and it slowly just keeps getting pushed back.

Speaker 2 (35:15):
And they're both the same thing, and of course there yeah,
we don't know it. And in the current time, Trump
still has three more years or some ship.

Speaker 1 (35:24):
So hey, okay. So in Deep Space nine they established that, uh,
there was a big conflict that happened in twenty twenty
four and even went back in time and there there
was a thing called the Bell Riots.

Speaker 2 (35:41):
And there were like, uh, we were a couple of
years off.

Speaker 1 (35:46):
There were encampments in Los Angeles and.

Speaker 2 (35:48):
San Francisco and yeah, fucking damn.

Speaker 1 (35:52):
It, like there was a whole thing and on Star
Trek and some of that stuff has been pushed back,
and some of it it's just like they none of
the current series know what they're doing.

Speaker 2 (36:03):
It feels like that's a shame because at some point
you're just gonna have to be like, it's a different
timeline than the one you're living in. A duh, just
just do fiction. Just write a timeline instead of going,
remember those eugenics were us in the nineties. I guess
we shifted the timeline because they haven't happened in real
life yet. Like a right man, you don't have to

(36:24):
keep playing it to the sixties sentiment of like this
could be your future. Like, yeah, we're past that. We
know what sci fi is.

Speaker 1 (36:31):
I definitely believe that as a fandom and as far
as the production is concerned, we should move past the
notion that Star Trek is quote unquote our future. Yeah,
because it's fucking us up. It's fucking up the show.

Speaker 2 (36:46):
It's it's always gonna make it harder on you, like,
you know, like it worked in the sixties because they
assumed they were never gonna make forty fucking seasons to
reach into the nineties. But whoops, they stopped for a
few decades and made an new show and made a
new show and made it. Yeah, by the time you
were a franchised you should stop doing that shit, or

(37:06):
you need to I guess be old twenty sixth century
at some point and just say, hopefully we won't survive
another two hundred, three hundred, four hundred years. Yeah, but
come on, man, Yeah, it's it's easier on yourself if
you just tell a coherent story. Yep, if you just
decide something right and it's.

Speaker 1 (37:29):
It's just as one of those whereas you know, a
season up a card. They tried to go into twenty
twenty four, twenty twenty three or something, and they were
he did show some of like the encampments and stuff,
and like, oh, this is happening.

Speaker 2 (37:42):
Strange New World ageous, My goodness.

Speaker 1 (37:44):
Yeah, Strange New World seems reliant on pushing the timeline back.
It's just weird.

Speaker 2 (37:51):
It's just weird, just a different different creative teams trying
to fuck with it. Basically, it's like, oh, this writing
room has a different, different idea about it, and and.

Speaker 1 (38:02):
I haven't sat down and tried to like suss it
all out, and if we're to and if we're to
take that one episode of Strange New Worlds, they basically said,
there's a temporal cold war that keeps that And a
press spy said, who has been waiting for con to
show up for fucking ever? It complains that this was

(38:25):
all supposed to happen in nineteen ninety six or nineteen
ninety two or whatever. It hasn't happened yet, so like
and goddamn it says that all of these temporal war
factions keep changing the timeline.

Speaker 2 (38:36):
That's that's fun, yes, but that's a that's a good
way out, but also it's not getting the story further.

Speaker 1 (38:43):
Yeah, it's kind of aggravating for me.

Speaker 2 (38:46):
Yeah, yeah, exactly because it is. It is also a
cop out, like it makes every retcon retroactively work. But
also every contradiction means that at this point you don't
know where you are in the timeline and just go
with it is not the fun of a sci fi
show at that point. Go make a comedy, sure, Yeah,

(39:09):
but we're not all Trouble with Dribbles forever hopefully, because
that that doesn't seem to be the show that most
rekis fell in love with.

Speaker 1 (39:18):
Yeah, I don't know, man, I don't it's I don't
know either. Look, man, I'm not going to like the
I go onto like the Star Trek reddits and I
get down voted.

Speaker 2 (39:28):
Man.

Speaker 1 (39:29):
Like people don't like my thoughts. They just want to
be like, no, it's the same, it's the same timeline.
Fuck it's not. But okay, what the ship?

Speaker 2 (39:38):
Yeah, but that's that's the thing. If fans are still
trying to make it work in one timeline when the
show says, no, the fuck it can't work like that. Yeah,
Like there is at least besides the fact that they're
dead wrong. There is the demand for Oh, but we
like connected universes. We know that Marvel has been really successful,

(39:59):
and they fuck their timeline every so often, even with
a central figy figure trying to oversee everything. Ye occasionally,
because it's like, yeah, even without the different writing teams
not interacting enough to go in a similar direction, you're
still gonna fuck up. But we do, we do like

(40:20):
that ship. We do want some some continuity, some semblance
of it all mattered. It'll led up to hear. That's
that's how stories become more satisfying over time, and how
franchises try not to die.

Speaker 3 (40:33):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (40:35):
I have a really easy out for them. M But
I'll never work for them, apparently, so apparently when I
was a kid, I thought I would, but no, Oh,
that's a lovely emission.

Speaker 2 (40:46):
Fuck. Yeah, I always thought I was gonna work for
for Disney as a as a Donald Duck comics writer
and artist. But then I figured out that that's a
very European thing, and Disney itself does not have a
fuck about those characters anymore over in the US. It's
a tragedy. But yeah, I also stopped drawing at some point,

(41:09):
as much at least because I got overly critical of
myself because there's that that point in life where you're like,
but it doesn't look like in my head, and I'm
trying to make it look like in my head and
my hands are not working. And then you're, you know,
a very self critical kid who doesn't draw enough anymore.

(41:31):
It's a sad thing. Yeah, and you stopped writing Star
Trek episodes apparently, sorry you were you were having an idea.
You were like, what I would do?

Speaker 1 (41:41):
No, No, I wasn't having what I would do. I know,
but I would. I do have an out.

Speaker 5 (41:46):
Now.

Speaker 1 (41:46):
I'm not going to talk about it on the.

Speaker 2 (41:47):
Show, but we'll talk after. That's fine. Yeah, we're not
We're not giving away our non copyrighted ideas. Come on now, Yeah, there.

Speaker 1 (41:58):
Are anyway Going back to this episode, Like I said,
I think all of these, all of these aliens here
were a kind of just a rough sketch, and that
was like, to put it up against the Kelvins from
the last episode, the Kelvins, it was fine. Yeah, since

(42:20):
I compared them already, I'll go with that. With this,
they were discovering who they were now in these new
human bodies, and they didn't have any idea that, like
all these sensations were going to push them in certain directions. Here,
there's a feeling that these were real well rounded characters
before the bodies, Yeah, before entering the Bodies and now

(42:41):
the Bodies and the sensations and all of these millennia
of not having that and having to now deal with
the nostalgia and remembering what it was to be corporeal. Yeah,
I just didn't feel like the characters got a chance
to really shine. And Nimoy did all he could with
with Hick, but I wanted more than he's a mustache twirler,

(43:04):
I you know, I wanted more. Maybe he was in
love with the Lesa. Maybe she was the reason of
the first place, you know. Maybe she was the diplomat,
she was the Siux storm. Maybe she was the one
who convinced him to join Saragan's side in the first
place and put it into the hostilities. Maybe, uh, which.

Speaker 2 (43:23):
Would have been fun. Yeah, just just more more of
a backstory or of a character background, so you get
more of a feel for that because it is very
much sort of sort of flat, and they don't have
characterization beyond the oh boy. But it's it's good being
physical again, like, oh, the.

Speaker 7 (43:42):
Corporeal, the corporality, corporate, corporeal, corporeality, whatever, there is that
that that motivation suddenly, but there is not much beyond that,
so we don't really get to know them beyond you
want to steal the bodies, you want to give them back.

Speaker 2 (44:01):
Ye, are kind of stuck between these two men as
a female character trying to make up their mind.

Speaker 1 (44:07):
I guess yeah, and then we get less of five
minutes of the Spock's death thing.

Speaker 3 (44:13):
Yeah that.

Speaker 2 (44:16):
It's not threatening whatsoever. There is no real sense of
he did die, like the stakes Yeah, don't feel real.

Speaker 1 (44:25):
There's no discussion, just cold hard decisions to trick McCoy
into believing so that, you know, Hannick doesn't since that anything.

Speaker 2 (44:34):
Exactly, and I don't feel like that you can sense
all of our thoughts being it's it's it's said in
the beginning, like, oh, you don't have to speak, we
can tell. But beyond that, it doesn't feel utilized often
enough to be really set up, like it's like, oh,
remember that we have this power. We need to be
aware of that when we devise our plan mm hmm,

(44:56):
which is basically everything.

Speaker 1 (45:00):
So yeah, overall, I think it was an interesting It
was a show. It was an episode full of interesting
ideas and interesting setups that just never went anywhere.

Speaker 2 (45:10):
Yeah, yeah, I get that the resolution is a bit quick.
It's like, because we can presume that Nurse Chapel was
able to inject Hannock because Hannock was only controlling her
one personality inside her, her brain, essence whatever.

Speaker 1 (45:25):
Well Spock was inside of Nurse Chapel.

Speaker 2 (45:28):
Yeah, exactly, so Spock could do it in her body
because he was unaware that Spock was there, so he
was only controlling Chapel but not the body. If that
still makes any sort of sense.

Speaker 1 (45:38):
Really, because it doesn't make a lot of sense.

Speaker 2 (45:40):
It doesn't. Uh, that's why they hand waived as quickly
as possible, like oh he's dead, he's alive again. Oh
they have to say goodbye, which was like they were acting.
They were doing an emotional scene. Sure, good fun. It
just wasn't all earned. It could have been better. Is
basically the thing where you're like, eh and I and

(46:00):
I also Nurse Chapel shouldn't have to say oh that
was beautiful when like, if everything goes well as an audience,
we're saying, oh, that was beautiful and we don't need
to be told what to feel. That's just one on one. Yeah, anyway,
you know.

Speaker 1 (46:19):
What, I bet it was. I bet because she didn't
have a lot of lines in the episode. I bet
like they were like, no, we need to go she's
featured heavily in the episode. We need to get needs. Yeah,
to make sure she gets paid.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
Yeah, like she needs to be starring instead of like
at the bottom of the fucking credits. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (46:39):
I don't know how that works. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (46:41):
I'm sure there's numbers. I'm sure there were at that
time too, like just you need this many lines to
be considered a recurring character instead of an overpaid extra.
I don't know, like there are regulations and someone was
her agent was paying attention probably.

Speaker 1 (47:00):
Yeah, yeah, maybe, I don't know, which means she was
with Roddenberry.

Speaker 2 (47:04):
So like, all right, you're forgetting that.

Speaker 1 (47:07):
Oh yeah, we had some good quotes from this episode.
One day, our minds became so powerful we dare think
of ourselves those gods. I don't like that line.

Speaker 2 (47:17):
It's it's a it's a it's a neat line, but
also it immediately like to me, that's warning lights of
like that seems like y'all went off the rails. Should
I trust you as benevolent? No, No, you're just arrogant.
This seems weird.

Speaker 1 (47:33):
Yeah, well, you know this episode in.

Speaker 2 (47:35):
The context of the decline of the society, of course,
but still uh.

Speaker 1 (47:41):
This episode had the pretty famous speech from Kirk in
the star Trek myth thoughs the risks are gentlemen. Sorry,
the risk is our business. I don't know where I
got gentlemen. Risk is our business. That's what the Starship
is all about. It's why we're aboard her. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
pretty pretty famous speech.

Speaker 2 (48:03):
It is, it is And that's the fun with the
opening setup we we talked about of of Oh, yes,
that is the mission. The strange New World is that
being out there so far away from everything else that
you're just you are on your own and you're exploring
ship that hasn't been seen before that new We're looking
for something and we may find we may stumble upon

(48:25):
species and technologies that are beyond our comprehension, and yet
we have to because progress or some ship. That's that's
at the core of the show. But yeah, that that's
that's the risk they're taking every day. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (48:39):
Yeah, uh, I enjoyed the I will not pedal flesh.
I'm a physician, a physician in contrast to what we are.
You are a prancing savage medicine man.

Speaker 2 (48:50):
Oh you were called a brown person. Just now what No,
I'm sorry, it's it's just medicine. Man immediately evokes the
whole ha ha, You're still a savage. But there is
that sort of orientalist dimension to to like, oh, you're
you're a native physician, not a not, not like our
evolved white technological scientific Like there's there's a in the

(49:14):
word choice. There is that sort of undertone where I'm like, ah,
savage is never a great word, but the points that's
because it is very much a but. But at the
same time, he like the coy has a an entire
point there where it's like, yeah, I'm not I'm not
in the business of trading bodies and ignoring the fact

(49:38):
that I'm technically killing someone mm hmm. But yeah, it
is very much a dig where it only speaks to
to her her her having gone over to the Hennox
side of we are so advanced, we are so much better,
we are more important. Uh yeah, that it is very

(49:58):
much a it's not even patronizing anymore, it's just detegrating.

Speaker 1 (50:02):
Yeah, sure, but as well, see, this was a This
was an episode that was It was originally outlined, the
story outline was by John Dougan, and then there was
a revised story outline by Gene al Coon, and then
the first draft teleplay was Dugan, and then Gene roden
Berry got a hold of it.

Speaker 2 (50:25):
Of course, of course, of course.

Speaker 1 (50:27):
Writer John T. Dugan wrote the original script of the
episode after he had read an article about highly sophisticated
robots or as I like to pronounce that, robots. Yeah,
and his original draft, Sargon and the Lisa continued their
existence as spirits without bodies floating around in the universe. However,

(50:47):
Gene Roddenberry, who did an uncredited rewrite on the script,
changed the ending to the aliens fading out into oblivion.
This led to Dougan using his pen name John Kingsbridge
in the episode's credits.

Speaker 2 (51:05):
I'm I'm I'm on this one. I'm just on Roddenberry's side,
because it's bullshit to be like, oh, yeah, they were
stuck in balls for eternity, but now that you can
just float around and be bodyless.

Speaker 1 (51:15):
But Dugan was a devout Catholic, and he says that
line totally went against my philosophy and cosmology. I didn't
want to be associated with it. The oblivion idea is
Roddenberry's philosophy, not mine. That might be a small thing,
but I have a reputation and a philosophy, and everybody
who knows me knows what I stand for. I certainly

(51:37):
don't stand for oblivion in the afterlife. When you write
a script, you don't expect to have your worldview changed
by a producer. The rest of Rodenberry's yeah, yeah, you
probably should. The rest of Rodberry's changes were all trivial.
The big thing was the change of the episode's philosophy.
Is an incredibly stupid That is so fucking.

Speaker 2 (51:59):
Much like you are fixating on the word oblivion. You
could have changed it to fucking death and you would
have been fine, Because apparently whether or not there's an
afterlife is a discussion for for off screen, for for
not in the writer's room, you know, like fuck off,
Like yeah, just just take it as they're dying. They're

(52:20):
choosing not to exist anymore in that body. Whatever it's
it's it's it's it's I'm sorry, man, but US Catholicism
has some weird, weird takes sometimes most of the time.
My god, it's it's different from how I was raised.
Let's put it that way. Not that US Protestants are not,

(52:42):
you know, out there, because they are, but my goodness,
both both have different flavors of let's say, THEO fascism.
Sometimes it's it's it's interesting.

Speaker 1 (52:55):
Well, you know, I it was as someone who was
raised so they're Baptists and whose friends were all Southern
Baptist for a long time, long time when I would
try to write within the context of being those of
that path and of that belief, you know, I would

(53:16):
have friends who read my stuff and would just shit
on it, like, you can't say this, you can't say that. Well, no,
to make art in this, yeah, my motherfucker. We both
watched Star Trek together. Why are you going? You know,
it would just be that kind of thing. And it's like, well, no,
but you're you're you're supposed to be this, and you're
saying this, and I'm like, it's.

Speaker 2 (53:35):
We can't enjoy things that atheists make. We just can't
make things that other people would enjoy. It because we're
not atheists or.

Speaker 1 (53:44):
Some shit right right right, So like you know, it was, Yeah,
it was blasphemy or or at the very least sacrilegious.

Speaker 2 (53:53):
To even imagine anything right, to.

Speaker 1 (53:57):
Imagine or suggest that anything would be outside of biblical
canon in your own fictional work.

Speaker 2 (54:05):
And even though it is fiction. That's how literature works.
But you can't read books outside of the Bible, presumably
because that doesn't always add up. Yeah, I love I
love it when people try to censor other people's art
and what you can and cannot consume more create. It's delightful.

Speaker 1 (54:24):
It was a big part of why I stopped writing
a long time ago.

Speaker 2 (54:29):
Fuck those friends, go right, Oh yeah, that's that that part,
that's where we're at. Yeah, well, not necessarily fucking the friends.

Speaker 1 (54:37):
You don't have to them they well I probably one.
I think there's only one who is still a Christian. Anyways.

Speaker 2 (54:48):
I mean that means all of the rest, you know,
those heathens are now quite available for fucking outside of marriage.
So I just saying I.

Speaker 1 (54:59):
That, Yeah, none of that is of interest to me.

Speaker 2 (55:02):
No, I'm well aware, okay, taking it awkward.

Speaker 1 (55:06):
So Dugan's original outline was approved by NBC program manager
Stan Robertson on fifteenth of May nineteen sixty seven, with
the conditions that quote, the highly cerebral portions of the
story would be eliminated and the complex nature of the
plot would be materially simplified.

Speaker 2 (55:23):
Well that's shit, Robert Jim. We don't want an interesting story.
Come on now, dumb it down, dumb it down, throw
some action in there.

Speaker 1 (55:31):
Robertson also found Saragon's speculation about your own legends of
an Adam and Eve for two of our travelers to
be sacrilegious and offending two Christian viewers. Hence the line
by Ann Mulhall stating that our beliefs in our studies
indicate that life on our planet Earth evolved independently had
to be inserted into the script. Okay, I mean which
is also funny because.

Speaker 2 (55:52):
Because you were so blasphemous as to suggest Adam and
Eve were not, you know, God's perfect creation, we need
to throwing as an atheist scientific approach to cure the blasphemy.
I am glad Christians are consistent. It's one of their
greatest strengths.

Speaker 1 (56:11):
Oh, I know, I was gonna say it was interesting
because you know that could that could mean that could
be seen to mean our beliefs and studies indicate that
life on plar planet Earth evolved independently, i e. God
created life on planet Earth and that's how we got there.
But by then the word evolve, I know, but but

(56:34):
book by then here's yeah. But here's the thing though,
is that for me personally in my life down here,
you like, evolved does not mean that it was not.

Speaker 2 (56:49):
There was Adam and even they evolved into whatever, sure right, and.

Speaker 1 (56:53):
There even became a weird place in Christian society here
where it was like, well, you have to be careful
with your language. You have to say, you know, God
created a thing and then that thing adapted, So you
could say adaptation. But if you say evolution, they get mad.

Speaker 5 (57:11):
No, no, not.

Speaker 1 (57:12):
Man didn't come from no damn ape, So you can't
say evolved.

Speaker 2 (57:16):
No one said evolved. Evolution work that way. Like apes,
go fuck yourself. The apes did not adapt into us.
Something adapted into both apes and us, right, fuck yourself.

Speaker 1 (57:28):
So yeah, I'm just saying like there were certain triggers
that would get certain responses around here. And I think
it's funny that in the in the sixties, they said evolved. Okay,
well that you know, they were of a higher literal,
literary understanding where they could say, like, oh, yes, that
just means that something happened independently on Earth and that's

(57:51):
where life came from. But like in the nineties, I
was growing up, if you said evolved, that's a trigger word.

Speaker 2 (58:00):
Say that ship we're in the south, goddamn it. Yeah,
so did I say goddamn it? Oh my?

Speaker 3 (58:12):
All right?

Speaker 2 (58:12):
So uh.

Speaker 1 (58:15):
In the names of the rit survivors have some cultural
connections to Earth and Greek mythology. The Lesa was a
sea goddess. Some Assyrian and Mesopotamian kings were named Sargon.
The Bible, the name Hannock appears several times, sometimes spelled Enoch,
sometimes Hannock, and including as the father of Methuselah. So

(58:36):
that's interesting, and I feel like that's just straight from Dougan.
That was like him weaving a bunch.

Speaker 2 (58:42):
Of Yeah, I am militant about this ship. Let me
write some Yeah.

Speaker 1 (58:48):
The name of the planet, the name of the planet
itself Eric Terra Earth and Latin inverted, is never mentioned
on screen, much as much like neural The sight of
a private Little war is all so unspoken.

Speaker 2 (59:01):
I'm glad Aret was not named in the show, because
my god, that's a terrible fucking name for a planet.

Speaker 1 (59:07):
That's it is bad, Like ne'.

Speaker 2 (59:10):
All, sure that works, that's something. It's a word, but
still it's it's it's something. Let's let's flip terra is.
Just come on, man, be creative. Just make up some
fucking consonants and vowels and call it a day. It
doesn't have to be a trick every time, like yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:29):
Joseph Joseph Pevney was originally slated to direct this episode. However,
he quit the series after The Immunity Syndrome, citing the
lack of discipline from the actors after Gene l Coon
left the showof.

Speaker 2 (59:42):
Okay, a lack of discipline from which actors anyway.

Speaker 1 (59:46):
Oh all of them? Probably all of them.

Speaker 2 (59:50):
It was that sixties. Who knows?

Speaker 1 (59:52):
Yeah. Still, photos of a smiling Spock leaning against a
doorway and a non canonical image of William Blackburn dress
does the Android were used in the end credits for
The Immunity Syndrome. That episode was produced before this one,
but did not go to air until January nineteenth, nineteen
sixty eight. Huh Blackburn. Yeah. Blackburn told about his experiences

(01:00:14):
filming this episode. Because of his latex android makeup, he
could not eat or drink properly during the twelve hour
shooting day and had to consume nourishment through a straw.
The white blank eyes of the android were achieved with
him simply moving and holding his eyeballs upwards.

Speaker 2 (01:00:29):
Get the fuck out. That must have been so straining. Like,
good on you. That's very impressive because like I hadn't
really thought it through. I figured it was an actor,
but I hadn't considered that he must have been really
able to clear all of his iris into his skull.
Like that's impressive. Well done.

Speaker 1 (01:00:48):
Yeah, I don't think I can do it.

Speaker 2 (01:00:49):
I mean I might be able to, but I couldn't
hold that for too long, like for eighteen's takes, go
fuck yourself. Well, well, nimoy is over there being an
I got to like look up into my eyeball socket. Fuck.

Speaker 1 (01:01:04):
Yeah. This episode. This episode marks George to Kay's returned
to the series after an absence of some months. While
filming The Green Berets mm hmm uh. Doctor Ann Moulehall
was portrayed by Diana Mouldar, who later played the roles
of Miranda Jones in the TOS episode is There in Truth,
No Beauty, and most famously, I would say, Catherine Pulaski

(01:01:27):
in Stars at the Next Generation for an entire season.

Speaker 2 (01:01:30):
Hot, damn, the girl comes back. I mean in TNG,
I get it because it makes sense she's older. We
wouldn't have recognized her as this character, but she's in
another episode. There were just reusing female guys.

Speaker 1 (01:01:43):
Oh yeah, and she never looks different to me. She
doesn't look any different, like the face, you know, it's her.

Speaker 2 (01:01:50):
Delightful good to know. I'll be on the lookout.

Speaker 1 (01:01:53):
She has a terrible haircut in TNG.

Speaker 7 (01:01:56):
Oh.

Speaker 2 (01:01:57):
Oh, in TNG. I was hoping she got a terrible
haircut for the other TS episode because you know, to differentiate.

Speaker 1 (01:02:05):
No, man, is that like it's that like nineteen eighties,
like old lady, like uh perm and bob oh, you know, yes,
where it just makes her look like thirty years older
than she actually is. You're just like, it's one of
the golden girls. I look back now and I'm like, wait,
she's like eighty nine right now. So if I like

(01:02:25):
look at her and like, yeah, he looks like that. Yeah, yeah,
you're just that's oh man, it's weird.

Speaker 2 (01:02:33):
Yeah, well we'll see how eighties is. I'm the that's
going to be interesting.

Speaker 1 (01:02:37):
Cool, did you did you? Could you tell who was
the voice of Saragon?

Speaker 2 (01:02:42):
Just like I could not? I could not from from Ere,
but I I am terrible with voice actors. I don't
recognize most people. It was Scotty oh right, okay, that's interesting,
like but without the scots or right, Yeah, he was
just doing a okay, okay. I like that because I

(01:03:03):
recognized the name in the credits and I was like,
I know that guy from something. Fuck, And then I
didn't look it up because that would be kind of
wrecking the point of doing trivia on this show. But
that was Gotti. Cool? Nice, Yeah, Yeah, that's that's fun.

Speaker 1 (01:03:18):
He is not Scottish in real life. No, although because
of the accent that he does, whenever I hear or
heard him in interviews, I could hear Scottish in his
actual voice.

Speaker 2 (01:03:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:03:30):
Every once in a while, I'd.

Speaker 2 (01:03:31):
Be like, every once in a while, you're you're like
doing the by accident. Yes, it's it's a It gets
to be a blend at some point. If you, if you,
if you've done that for that long on set, I
get it.

Speaker 1 (01:03:45):
Walter Keening does not appear in this episode. It is
huh oh check off.

Speaker 2 (01:03:50):
Oh check off. Right, Yeah, yeah, ye had to. I
had to hover over the name and be like, oh
that face.

Speaker 1 (01:03:57):
Mm hmm, it says here is unclear how Arat might
have inspired the Adam and Eve story on Earth, especially
since they ended their galactic colonization before their civil war.
Their colonizing period, which occurred six hundred thousand years ago,
is the earliest estimate for this. For the appearance of
homoheidel Bergenesis and early ancestry.

Speaker 2 (01:04:18):
He Heidelbergen, I'm pretty sure that guy is from around
these parts because I remember seeing buildings at the university
with his name. Anyway, it doesn't matter. It might have
also been named after a place, because God knows people
in places are named after each other all the time.

Speaker 3 (01:04:36):
Mm hm.

Speaker 1 (01:04:36):
That was an early ancestor humans shared with the Neanderthals,
So yeah, probably probably doesn't work out to ben.

Speaker 2 (01:04:45):
Not not really. Yeah, but if they were Adam and
Eve and they were very evolved and then sort of
inbred for many generations into humans, that's that's how we
can make it work biblically ethics.

Speaker 1 (01:05:01):
Hey, you look in Genesis, there's always that great verse
about the sons of God finding the daughters of man
fair and taking them as his wives and creating with
them men of great renown.

Speaker 2 (01:05:11):
You know, you remember Bible versus word for word, But
that's a.

Speaker 1 (01:05:17):
I remember that one. I remember that one because it
pisses I remember. I like it because it pisses Christians off.

Speaker 2 (01:05:27):
Yeah, of course that's the best kind of thing to remember,
to be like, because okay, but what about levitic Is
this one, this one, this one.

Speaker 1 (01:05:34):
Well, this is the reasons them off. But it pisses
them off because I say, hey, you know this, uh
you know what this sounds like, right, No, sounds like
the Greek gods.

Speaker 2 (01:05:46):
Yes, sounds sounds like a pantheon, sounds polytheistic.

Speaker 1 (01:05:54):
Sounds like they're making Dimmi gods.

Speaker 2 (01:05:57):
They're just making some heracleses heroic class Anyway, it's.

Speaker 1 (01:06:03):
Not necessarily that don't want toiss any by office, is that,
you know? I think one of the most interesting interesting
things is how when you look back at even religious
texts in terms of history, there are lots of gaps
that are filled in by other yea overlap that are
pushed out. Oh we don't consider that, right, and that's interesting. Yeah,

(01:06:25):
but but this is interesting because this leaves out this section,
and this has that section.

Speaker 2 (01:06:32):
Sacred And why are other takes from around the same
time somehow bullshit when this was written by other guys
or the same guys. We don't know in every case, Yeah, what.

Speaker 1 (01:06:45):
What was inspired by?

Speaker 2 (01:06:46):
What?

Speaker 1 (01:06:46):
And what was the truth behind the inspirations? Like that's a.

Speaker 2 (01:06:51):
Lot of oral tradition that blended and changed over time.
And that's fucking interesting in every mythology, in every literature,
in every sort of kind.

Speaker 1 (01:07:00):
Then now, pissing off Christians is also just that's the
cherry on the.

Speaker 2 (01:07:05):
That's just a hobby. Yeah, some of them just they're
asking for it. If you're that easily offended, your your
faith is easily shaken, let's put it that way, right,
And you know here, I mean, come.

Speaker 1 (01:07:22):
On, it's just you know, the lack of curiosity pisses
me off.

Speaker 5 (01:07:26):
Like the.

Speaker 2 (01:07:29):
Far more about Christianity than some of those Christians know
about science or and vice versa.

Speaker 1 (01:07:35):
Atheist Christianity.

Speaker 2 (01:07:37):
I don't want to know about this. Yeah, go fuck yourself.

Speaker 1 (01:07:40):
Yeah, I mean, you know, it's just it's it's maddening,
the lack of curiosity, the lack of like the way
that a lot of Christians and a lot of religious
people in general just will they create their own superstition
based on their faith to the point of like they
have no interest in expanding their knowledge of their own

(01:08:03):
of what was supposed to be their own faith. Yeah,
because no, it might. I don't want to question anything, No, exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:08:10):
It's it's it becomes more dogmatic, which was I believe
the problem before the whole schism between Catholics and presidents.
But you know, uh, it's it's there is just a
zero interest in other people's perspectives. It's at a certain
point where you're like, man, if if you're if you're
that easily gonna be convinced by the devil that all

(01:08:33):
of it is bullshit, then maybe you're not all that
faithful to begin with, Like, come on, it's it's it's
a it's a shame that there is that disinterest because,
like I said, there are people of my generation who
were raised by atheists and just don't know shit about
any of the big religions. To the point where I'm like,

(01:08:53):
how do you engage with art or literature at university,
especially when you don't know shit about any of the
Christian imagery that keeps popping up in everything, not to
speak of Judaism or or or Islam for that matter,
which is closer to most Christians than they fucking want
to realize, because you have more in common with them

(01:09:14):
than you do with some atheists who who should not
talk about his evolution shit.

Speaker 1 (01:09:21):
Like I don't know, man, Well, I mean you know, yeah,
I mean also you know, not to hammer too hard
on Christians specifically.

Speaker 2 (01:09:29):
Because it just happens to be a prominent faction with
power in the US specifically.

Speaker 1 (01:09:34):
And yeah, well you know, more more broadly. But I've
I've had a lot of atheist friends who like, if
you say, if you bring up anything and you're like
talking about the context of something like a movie or
a book or something, uh and it's very or artwork
that's very obviously uh contextualized through Christianity, they cut you

(01:09:56):
off and say, why not believe in that? I have
to believe it.

Speaker 2 (01:10:00):
It can, it's a story structure, it is, it.

Speaker 1 (01:10:04):
Is the context for which this art should be understood. Yeah, like, I'm.

Speaker 2 (01:10:10):
Always happy when you bring up something biblical I hadn't
realized yet, because you know, sometimes I'm like, oh, right,
that was in there too, and I missed that name
or whatever. Yeah it some references are really fucking obvious,
but not all of them. So sometimes it's it's good
to have more context. It's fun to know more about
the thing you're discussing. I feel like, especially nowadays, there

(01:10:34):
is also a lot of just quote unquote spirituality, like
unbranded Like okay, fair enough, I'm not a big fan
of organized religion necessarily, I don't need a megachurch telling
me what to fucking think. But then it becomes that
sort of agnostic let's let's let's not label anything with

(01:10:56):
terms that already exists in other belief systems, because now, yeah, no,
you gotta call it spirit or the divine, but we
can't say God anymore, we can't say the creator. And
you know, there's that sort of clear anti I'm avoiding
saying the thing, you know, I mean, where I'm like,
come on, just get off, just just just come out

(01:11:18):
with what you think it is. If the word means
a different thing to you, explain the word the meaning
to me anyway, And of course there is like, yeah,
there are connotations when you say God because you know,
we were still kind of raised with a it's a
white man with a beard on a cloud. But that's

(01:11:40):
we sort of need to get away from that anyway, sure,
because it was bullshit to begin with. And anyway, it's
it's very much the child, like, well, we got to
depict him some way. I guess what did Michelangelo do.
Let's do that but with a robond because God muscles.
They might become gay, the kids. Anyway, Let's be real.

(01:12:04):
Michelangelo was, wasn't he. I'm pretty sure he was into guys.
Have you seen the Sistine Chapel?

Speaker 1 (01:12:13):
You know, I I'm just not that interested in celebrity,
you know, sex, habits.

Speaker 2 (01:12:20):
I don't care, that's fair. I wouldn't call Michelangelo a
celebrity per se at this point.

Speaker 3 (01:12:26):
Why not.

Speaker 1 (01:12:27):
Motherfucker's a celebrity.

Speaker 2 (01:12:28):
He's a famous painter. But he's also been dead for centuries.
He's not out there on Instagram trying to reach his fans. Still,
maybe that's that's a connotation I have with celebrity, where
it is like, oh, it's a celeb like Paris Hilton. Uh,
Perez Hilton like posts pictures of them with their feet out,

(01:12:48):
and Pradashian is wearing I don't know something sheer. So
now the internet has to see it.

Speaker 1 (01:12:55):
Yeah, I'm I'm as an artist, as a writer, as
an artist. I say this with every bit of glee,
knowing that there's some other artists out there who's going
to feel nauseous that I'm saying this.

Speaker 2 (01:13:11):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:13:12):
Michael Angelo was a content creator.

Speaker 2 (01:13:18):
Yeah, fair enough. If if I can split hairs about
him being about fame versus celebrity, then can absolutely be like,
yeah he was.

Speaker 3 (01:13:26):
He was.

Speaker 2 (01:13:27):
He was, you know, doing some content for the people
who paid him. You know, That's that's how it works.

Speaker 1 (01:13:32):
He was a he was a hired gun. He was
a freelance artist.

Speaker 2 (01:13:37):
Exactly.

Speaker 5 (01:13:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:13:37):
He got he got his he got his orders. He
did a pretty painting.

Speaker 1 (01:13:42):
He's good.

Speaker 2 (01:13:42):
That's how you survive. Rich people pay for your art
instead of paying for machines to seal your art. It's wonderful,
good old times.

Speaker 1 (01:13:51):
I comment. I talked to somebody about this a few
weeks ago when Drew Strusen died, famous movie poster art
who did All Star Wars and back in the future.

Speaker 2 (01:14:03):
And probably seen a lot of them without knowing his name.

Speaker 1 (01:14:06):
Harry Potter bunch of Oh he still did Harry Potter.

Speaker 2 (01:14:09):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (01:14:09):
Oh yeah, Yeah, he had a ton of stuff over
the years. But you know, someone was like, you know it,
really it really bothers me, you know, looking at his
work now and having heard the interview where he said
that he doesn't care about any of that stuff. He's
you know, not, that's not anything that he's interested in.
He was just like a hired gun on all of that.

Speaker 2 (01:14:27):
Yeah, he wasn't a fan of the thing that wasn't
out in theaters yet, why would he? He just contributed
to culture. Go fuck yourself.

Speaker 1 (01:14:35):
And I'm like, so, if money was involved, it's not art,
it's not art.

Speaker 2 (01:14:43):
Off of it, and you're not doing it from the
pure love of the exposure. I guess then you're you're
a fake artist. Go fuck yourself.

Speaker 1 (01:14:51):
Artists need to eat artists artists loved like create arbitrary
rules for what a true artist.

Speaker 2 (01:15:02):
If you haven't been starving trying to finish that first
draft of your novel, are you even a novelist despite
having you know, published a novel? That's that's not how
that works, like, yeah, you got paid to do it. Good,
you should be paid to do it. Yeah, it tends
to motivate people to actually do it.

Speaker 1 (01:15:20):
By the way, I saw someone, a different person say, uh,
you know, I'm glad that you you got you're getting published,
but how many compromises did you make? And I just
like I moved on. I couldn't. I did not want
to read any of the responses. I didn't want to
know how far it went. I you did that person
and moved on. I couldn't handle it.

Speaker 2 (01:15:41):
Compromises, Like what the fuck do you think the publishing
world is? Like, like the compromises are kill your fucking
darlings because this book is too long, or hey, editor
says this is a shitty sentence. Fix that sentence. You're
getting help. That's not the same as being like this
is very political, Like if they were if if if

(01:16:03):
they were like, well there's too many gay people in
this novel, we're not publishing it, they wouldn't publish it.
They wouldn't then say take out the gay people and
we'll publish it. That doesn't work. The world doesn't work
like this. And at the same time, especially in publishing,
it's it's bullshit that you have to sort of finish
a fucking manuscript on your own time, I guess by

(01:16:23):
breathing air and eating a lot of ramen or something
before you ever get the chance to be paid. Like,
it's it's hard to.

Speaker 7 (01:16:33):
Say.

Speaker 2 (01:16:34):
Even like the entertainment world we're talking about, you have specs, strips,
you have outlines, you have pitches. You know you have oh,
we want to see your voice. That's a lot harder
with writing a book if you're nobody basically, and that's
that's that's a weird system inherently, where it's like I
do a lot of free label labor first, and if
we decide the labor was good enough and then you

(01:16:55):
get paid. That's hard, man. Sometimes you have to take
a risk. YEP, it's not exactly fair, but hey, it's
fucking late stage capitalism. None of it is fair. Good luck, guys,
good luck.

Speaker 1 (01:17:09):
So this is the second time a reference is made
in Star Trek about the Apollo Moon program, after Tomorrow's Yesterday,
filmed more than a half sorry a year and a
half before the first Lunar landing. Kirk rhetorically asked McCoy
in the episode, do you wish that the first Apollo
mission hadn't reached the Moon.

Speaker 2 (01:17:26):
Whoops.

Speaker 1 (01:17:27):
The first man Apollo mission, Apollo one, intended to be
a test flight of the Command and Service Module on
Earth orbit, only never flew since the tragic fire claimed
the lives of three astronauts. This happened on January twenty seventh,
nineteen sixty seven, months before the script was submitted to
the production team and a full year before the episode aired.
A first Apollo mission in which astronauts orbited and technically

(01:17:50):
reached the Moon was Apollo eight in December of nineteen
sixty eight, ten months after this episode aired. However, the
Apollo eleven astronauts were the first to reach the Moon
by landing on it July twenty, nineteen sixty nine. After
Star Trek was canceled, Kirk's next comments about going on
to Mars and then to the near nearest stars seemed
to suggest that he's referring to the Apollo eleven lunar mission. Yeah, man,

(01:18:16):
one of those things.

Speaker 2 (01:18:17):
It was a good guess basically, like you don't. I
didn't take it as the first one, like we all know,
Apollo one wasn't the one, but he was.

Speaker 1 (01:18:26):
That speech was true when he said it, but because
of the temporal wars worlds, God damn it.

Speaker 2 (01:18:35):
It was Apollo eleven after all. Yeah, okay, oh oops, fine,
it took us a bit longer the whole But the
comment about going on to Mars and the next star
that was, that was, you know, sort of inspirational, like
hopeful in a way where I'm like, oh, I want
to watch for all mankind again because it is a
thing where it's it is a shame that we we

(01:18:58):
sort of stopped most of NASA shit funding over the decades.
It's it's a darn shame. It would have paid for
itself by now.

Speaker 1 (01:19:08):
M one of the fiberglass globes was reused later as
part of the Romulan cloaking device in the Enterprise incident.

Speaker 2 (01:19:17):
I'm looking forward to that and for M.

Speaker 1 (01:19:20):
Four in Requiem for a Methuselah.

Speaker 2 (01:19:22):
These are old words to me, I know.

Speaker 1 (01:19:25):
Yeah, I'm looking for episode words.

Speaker 2 (01:19:27):
Yeah, exactly, we'll get there.

Speaker 1 (01:19:29):
The stand for one of the The stand for one
of the globes was later turned upside down and used
as a piece of technology on Atoz's desk. And all
of our yesterday, all our yesterday scar all of them
the episode, all of them. The episode features colorful back
lights on the Enterprise sets, mostly green and purple, which
were not used since the early episodes of the first season.

Speaker 2 (01:19:53):
Huh, I didn't notice, but it sounds cool. Oh yeah,
I think that showcased this. There were those really green
walls in the meeting room.

Speaker 1 (01:20:04):
That was.

Speaker 2 (01:20:06):
The troubling to a certain extent where I'm like, okay, okay,
I'm this is just very in my face. But other
than that, the people I don't really remember.

Speaker 1 (01:20:14):
But cool, Yeah, I remember, I remember the greens and
the purples in an early original like early season one, right,
it does very much look you know, you know when
like when when Sargon is like leaving or Sargon or
whoever they're leaving the bodies and it goes in purple
those lights.

Speaker 3 (01:20:34):
All yeah, yeah, fair enough.

Speaker 2 (01:20:37):
Cool, They're doing something interesting and like lighting and cinematography
is fun to pay attention to.

Speaker 1 (01:20:44):
Let's say, John T. Dugan, the writer, earned a Writer's
Guild of America Award nomination in the category Best Written
Dramatic Episode in nineteen sixty eight.

Speaker 2 (01:20:54):
Oh I thought he used his pen name mother.

Speaker 3 (01:20:56):
I know.

Speaker 1 (01:20:58):
Oh yeah, And there's like a whole thing where I
was annoyed with him, where he was mad. He complained
about like, uh, Roddenberry's name was on it on like
the VHS cover, but then like you know, on the
actual episode it has his name. But then if you
look at.

Speaker 2 (01:21:16):
This book and had rotten the episode of Jesus Christ,
Jesus Christ, that's how showrunners, creators like they get a
different credit, Go fuck yourself. What the fuck did you expect?

Speaker 1 (01:21:26):
Well, I don't know if it says written by Gene Roddenberry.
I don't know, maybe but.

Speaker 2 (01:21:31):
Did some writing. I guess. I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:21:34):
What aggravates means. What aggravates me is he like he
took it to arbitration and then he didn't like the
line cut, so he changed he gave a did a
pen name, and then he wound up going and and
being mad and complaining about like different adaptations having Jane's
name on it instead of his name, And I'm like, motherfucker,
you didn't want to your hand in it. You said

(01:21:54):
that numerous times, you didn't want to be associated with
it because of your you know, your Christian ships.

Speaker 2 (01:22:00):
That it's popular, it's it's it's successful. And now I
do want to be associated with it. Come on, it's
a really good way to never be hired by that
show again.

Speaker 1 (01:22:11):
Christ's Sake director Ralphson is Sinetsky, who, by the way,
we just lost. He was the last living director of
the original series and he died like a week ago.

Speaker 2 (01:22:20):
Ship. I'm sorry.

Speaker 1 (01:22:21):
Uh he uh called this episode the huge ping pong balls.

Speaker 2 (01:22:25):
But he was one hundred and two yeah Jesus.

Speaker 1 (01:22:30):
Also, he also described this episode as about which the
less the less said, the better.

Speaker 2 (01:22:38):
I didn't hate it that much. I feel like we've
seen worse.

Speaker 1 (01:22:42):
Yeah, I've seen worse.

Speaker 2 (01:22:44):
It wasn't the worst, but there were huge ping pong balls,
fair enough.

Speaker 1 (01:22:48):
Yeah, Yeah, that's all I've got on this one. Are
you good a go?

Speaker 2 (01:22:53):
I think I am? Okay, I am. We've we've we're
we're we've been talking for a minute.

Speaker 1 (01:22:59):
Yeah, we've thoroughly scraped the Fermando cheese from under the foreskin.

Speaker 2 (01:23:04):
Indeed, indeed, a right people are circumcised, so we don't
have to do that.

Speaker 1 (01:23:11):
I'm so thankful they circumcised meed Man.

Speaker 2 (01:23:16):
But then when I finally was circumcised, they took a
lot with them.

Speaker 1 (01:23:21):
Yeah, so you know, you never know what you're gonna get. Well,
as I understand it, Trelaine still has it on his mantle.

Speaker 2 (01:23:27):
So I've heard, so I've heard they did. It is
still weird to me. They did the circumcision right and
then took the entire thing away. It's real, real interesting. Yeah,
it's it's looking looking, you know, trophy to have on
your mantle though.

Speaker 1 (01:23:45):
Uh, next time on our classic track, watch rewatch Fi
and I find ourselves in Another Earth history contaminated culture
as a matter of course, with space Nazis, space Jews,
and patterns of force until then Joe Lantrue, livlog and
prosper and of course.

Speaker 2 (01:24:04):
Eat a dick. People eat a dick, especially the space Nazis.

Speaker 5 (01:24:09):
Thank you for listening to the Star Trek Universe podcast,
a Stranded Panda production. If you'd like to hear more
from David C. Robertson, check out the DC on Screen
podcast or malagus dot tv for his web videos. If
you'd like to hear more from Matthew Carroll, check out
the Marvel Cinematic Universe podcast or listen to his music.

Speaker 1 (01:24:30):
Just search for Matthew Carroll anywhere you get music

All Episodes

Star Trek 2x22 - "Return to Tomorrow" Review

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know

Ruthie's Table 4

Dateline NBC

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Star Trek 2x22 - "Return to Tomorrow" Review