May 20, 2025 • 26 mins
In this Very British Edition of The DEX Show, Tom welcomes Jack Bourne, Head of IT Operations at the British Transport Police. Jack shares insights into the unique challenges of delivering seamless digital experiences across a highly mobile, widely dispersed police force operating across 170+ sites. Jack offers a fascinating look at proactive IT, digital adoption, and collaboration in a public service context. Plus, find out how rebooting really can be revolutionary—when you do it at scale. And how there are no robot dogs (yet).
Download part 1, 'Transformation: Driving Adoption, Productivity, and Change in the AI Era', free of charge right hereÂ
Register for Nexthink Experience 2025 here
Download a free copy of the Gartner® Magic Quadrant™ for DEX Tools here (or head to Nexthink.com)
For more amazing DEX content, including podcasts, articles and exclusive research, head over to the DEX Hub (dex.nexthink.com).
To hear more interviews like this one, subscribe to the Digital Employee Experience Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your preferred podcast platform
Download part 1, 'Transformation: Driving Adoption, Productivity, and Change in the AI Era', free of charge right hereÂ
Register for Nexthink Experience 2025 here
Download a free copy of the Gartner® Magic Quadrant™ for DEX Tools here (or head to Nexthink.com)
For more amazing DEX content, including podcasts, articles and exclusive research, head over to the DEX Hub (dex.nexthink.com).
To hear more interviews like this one, subscribe to the Digital Employee Experience Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your preferred podcast platform
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome it, change Makers to the Deck Show with Tim
Flower and Tom mcgra let's get into it.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Hello, change Makers, we're back. It's the Deck Show. So
I'm flying solo today, no Tim Flower, who's on a
well well earned sabbatical following his deck World tour. And
we we you know, it's kind of almost fitting because
we have a very kind of I think, a very
British themed guest an organization to join this solo British
(00:32):
host and that is Jackbourne, head of IT Operations at
the British Transport Police. Hello Jack, Welcome to the show, sir.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Yeah, Hi, good after, Thanks for having me over.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Great pleasure, great pleasure. Very interesting organization as we'll get to,
especially from an IT perspective, but for the listeners they
can't see it. But I have a big like a
happy birthday, would you say, like bunting behind me, and
so Jack came our happy birthday. It's your birthday and
it's not exactly but Jack, but we are. We are
moving through birthday season in my household, so all of
(01:06):
my children and then the tay and myself, we all
have like congested number of birthdays between April and May.
There's like five in quick succession. So we just we
put up some bunting at the beginning of it. We
just leave it there for like eight weeks. Basically.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
That's he who knows when when this is released it
might be one of your children's birthdays or someone in
the household's birthdays. Happy birthday to them.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
That's a really good point. I didn't I don't actually register.
We may have all grown up many, many, many years
by ven hope.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
I'm sure.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
I'm sure it won't be that long. But listen, I mean,
thanks so much for joining us, and I think a
great place to start. As I say, we do have
a very global audience out of there, and I wonder
how unique a service like the British Transport Police is
or isn't internationally, Jack, So let's begin, as it were,
with the basics. How would how would you describe the
(01:57):
structure and mission of the BTP?
Speaker 3 (02:00):
First of all, yeah, so great question. I'm really glad
to have the opportunity to obviously talk about British Transport Police.
So we are the guardians of the railway. We're a
specialist and national police force that is responsible for policing
a railway network across England. Scotland and Wales, And just
to put that into sort of perspective, that's roughly one
(02:22):
point eight billion passenger rail journeys annually and billions of
freight obviously traving on the rail network throughout that time
as well. Our mission in terms of b TOPS is
obviously working together protecting the rail community and creating that
hostile environment for crime and criminality. And what we do
is we ensure the security of millions of people who
(02:46):
use the railway in Britain and we provide policing services
to rail operators, their staff, passengers and covering not only
the national rail network also systems like the London Underground
Doclrians like Railway and various obviously tram systems. And our
vision really is to be that sort of weld leading
police force that's trusted to provide safe, reliable railway, helping
(03:11):
and making people get home on time and safely. And
what I love about BTP is and what some of
your kind of listeners will be thinking really is, Okay, yeah,
we're a similar organization too many out there with our hardware,
perhaps our laptops, our HR, our people systems, our finance systems, etc.
But we've got some really cool technology as well, drones
(03:35):
and capabilities with dogs and firearms, tons of CCTV, sophisticated
network and it's all there to I guess, gather intelligence
and support criminal investigations. And it's really rewarding to know
that you're having that direct impact and what you're doing
within an IT environment, it's having that direct impact on supporting, protecting,
(03:56):
helping people and defeating criminality.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
We do we don't have any of those terrifying AI
robot dogs yet, do you, Jack? No.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
I did see an interesting article the other day in
terms of holographic policing, So who knows what the future
hold in that respect?
Speaker 2 (04:13):
I don't know. Yeah, will will we live to CBDA
where we sat on a train in a sort of
one of those robot dogs kind of pads past us
gives us a quick scan of our of our terrifying
prospect that I was just curious before we get into it, Jack,
do you know that like is there is there is
the institution of the transport police in this country relatively unique,
(04:35):
completely normal in terms of there's a French transport police
and an American transport police. Do you have had perspective?
I guess it's so you probably meet colleagues from around
the world sometimes, don't you.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
Yeah, indeed, Yeah, we we have a lot of sort
of international relationships. Obviously, there's there's Interpol across across the
top as well supporting and we have that kind of
great relationship. And if you look at kind of some
of our policing with the euro style with that kind
of direct link in as well.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
We.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
Cross border police, and I guess that's our uniqueness in
terms of being that national force where we operate with everybody,
We touch all of their other home office forces that
are out there, and like you say that international boundaries
as well, and we've done some great stuff around the globe.
But in terms of supporting that policing and almost giving
that specialist BTP touch and spin on policing on that
(05:27):
kind of national scale to kind of demonstrate the capabilities
that we really have and are capable.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Of doing fantastic And you already think of a sort
of a more mobile as it were, organization and transport police, right,
So what are some of the sort of standout challenges
that come with supporting what is I assume pretty disperse,
pretty mobile workforce overall.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
Yeah, indeed, and I guess things spot on the noil
there really with that geographical spread, hardware support can obviously
be challenging covering the kind of three countries there with England,
Scotland and Wales, and some users or some employees may
never see an IT resource in their career, and that
(06:11):
could be a very long career hopefully with us at BTP,
because we are spanned across one hundred and seventy different
sites across those three countries. And the additional challenge we
have within there as well is obviously shift patterns of
officers and staff working throughout different times in the night,
in the day, and there's so many varied roles. I
(06:34):
guess within BTPs it's not just what people may think
or assume with that kind of frontline officer and all
that Bobby on the beat and then that kind of
support staff in the background. We within officers alone, there
are so many different varied roles and almost personas, if
you like, in terms of their digital experience that they
use and have, And I guess cross pollination can be
(06:57):
challenging because of that. That's first workforce, as you kind
of said, so they're kind of leaning over the shoulder
and somebody in the office said to me the other day, Oh, yeah,
we're trying to do something like this, and what capabilities
have we got And it was almost obvious to me.
But that kind of cross pollination where you think one
hundred and seventy sites, five thousand roughly employees, there's going
(07:20):
to be times where people won't have that, I guess
opportunity for that cross pollination and therefore systems that help
us with collaboration and communication. Technology is really important in
our organization, and there's always a right time as well.
In terms of communication. I always say, if we're leading
change and technology change, don't go too soon with the communication.
(07:42):
Who wants to know that this thing is coming when
they're really busy and bogged down with their day to
day work of constant updates, and this thing is coming,
it's coming, it's coming. I think what the feedback is
that we have is no tell us when it's imminent,
tell us when it's almost coming. Because sometimes change can
be slow. Sometimes change to be coming for a long time,
and we could be excited about things, but make it
(08:05):
relevant to their end users so they can easy more
easily adopt it and understand it. At the point and
time that's relevant and best sort of worthy to them.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
Really absolutely, And you know, I don't think on the
deck show we've tended to associate like policing and digital
employee experience. But obviously, to you, dex is important, and
you know, maybe part of that is understanding what to
you and your your your your employees, good digital experience
(08:34):
looks like, and I say employees, I could be officer,
it could be a staff member on the front lines,
you know.
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Yeah, indeed, And and for me, agile working and having
efficient and effective digital ways of working is key across
everything that they do. And I guess, like you said,
with an organization like ours, some some kind of I
guess buzzwords that are kind of real resonate with me.
And key in this area is that mobility, that connectivity
(09:02):
and that communication are so key. And one which I
think is almost underestimated at time is simplicity. I think
at times, particularly and sometimes a technology world, we can
we can perhaps over engineer things or make things perhaps
more complex than they need to be. And I guess
simplicity for me around a digital employee experience is one
(09:23):
of the foundations that we should all kind of start
with and link with. And something that I've recently been
doing and trying to embed across British Transport Police at
the moment is embedding guiding principles which for me will
help us with with digital adoption. And these digital kind
of guiding principles help kind of give us strategy directive
(09:47):
or or establish boundaries, allow us for something to work within.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
And and for.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
Me that those things and those those guiding principles they
need to be relevant, long lasting, have rationale for existence,
be easily digest and of course followed. So for me,
things like customer experience, simplicity, security requirements driven and exploiting
(10:11):
and managing data are absolutely prime examples of guiding principles
that we should almost use and deploy across all of
our work and things and change that we are doing
or delivering.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Absolutely, I mean in your context they're anything but sort
of hollow buzzwords, are they They're kind of deeply intrinsic
to what it means to actually deliver a service.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
And I guess you're there. They could be buzzwords perhaps
if not implemented. Well, it's about keeping championing that change,
to drive it home, make sure it's understood and why
they're there in the first place, because I guess without it,
without guiding principles, change could go off on a tangent
and not go the right way or the way that
(10:57):
it's proposed to. And if if you miss off that
employee en user experience and you're delivering change, guess what,
your change may may not be as accepted as what
you'd perhaps hoped.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
I mean, look, in the world of policing, we may
or may not be far from the aforementioned robot dog
that I seem to have a bit of a fixation
with right there. But we are away off, I would say,
from the pre cogs of minority report notoriety. If you've
seen that movie Jack, you know you've got vasically pre crime.
(11:33):
They're like psychic technological police force. But we have our
we have an equivalent, real world equivalent in it right,
which is proactive it preventative ital What does it mean
at the British Transport Police? What does it mean for you?
How do you define it? Why does it matter? And
how far along that that kind of endless journey to
proactivity or preventative predictive it?
Speaker 3 (11:55):
Are you? Yeah? So I think you're right. I think
it is a journey. I think is the first thing
to kind of call out. And for me, that kind
of proactive analysis really is receiving those alerts and analysis
and and and being aware of it to then be
able to take that corrective action. Okay, we need to
(12:18):
use analytics to inform decision making. We do it throughout
our daily lives and in it it's it's it's no different.
You know, we gather the data, we pinpoint therefore what
the data says, and then we're able to act upon it. Okay.
So so for me in terms of that kind of
proactive experience, it's about pinpointing software and versions and being
(12:40):
able to push updates and take that correct corrective action
to overcome effectively the issue that that that might be
presenting itself. And I guess what we what we tend
to see and probably is is relatable across many organizations,
is those that suffer in silence, perhaps those that maybe
don't raise those service desk technology service desk calls and
(13:04):
perhaps suffer in silence. And I guess proactivity can help
to overcome that by investigating looking at some of those issues,
looking at some of those trends and thinking, Okay, what
can we do about this? Too? Effective improves the end
user experience, So for us, yeah, perhaps we're on the journey.
(13:25):
I think for next year. It's a real key ambition
for me to be exploring it further around how we
move from that reactive to proactive also with a preventative
mindset at the end of it. Okay, even if the
less the end user knows about the issues that they
have experienced or maybe about to experience, and the faster
(13:48):
quicker we can resolve them, whether that be in the
background without them knowing or with them, the faster quicker
we can do that with the less they know about it, obviously,
the greater the enjuriers, your experience is going to be
for them fantastic.
Speaker 4 (14:02):
And can you give us an example, Jack, like one
super concrete example of how dex positively impacts the BTP
to kind of bring that to life a little more
kind of precisely.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Yeah, definitely. And the first one that springs to mind
really is and it seems so simple in practice. Yeah, Yeah,
it's effectiveness is incredible. It's a remote restart campaign. And
I guess what we saw and what we have seen
across British Transport Police is the typical service desk supporting
(14:37):
end users with calls for service by simply saying, have
you turned it on and turned it off again? Right?
Something familiar with the ages gone by, the simple switch
it off, switch it on again, as it resolved your issue.
And I guess some of that from a technical perspective,
it's not too technical. It's probably likely because of background
updates or policies not being applied, and therefore a good
(14:58):
old fashioned reboot or a kick is what's needed. And
what we did was we kind of understood this end
user experience of maybe not shutting down a laptop or
restarting at night from quickly simple simply start it up
in the morning the next day and continue where I
left off. What we needed to do is kind of
(15:19):
overcome that so that updates would be pushed out, restarts
would occur, and what we did was deploy a remote
restart campaign which which could only be deferred a couple
of times, and that significantly improved the end user experience
because that meant that policies are applied, updates occurred pretty
rapidly and people on the latest and best and greatest
(15:41):
versions that we know are in support and the best
delivering the best end user experience that they could ask for. Really,
So for me, remote restart campaign is definitely one that
there's been a real success for us. And if I
made to a second one that into mind, we're talking
to you about, this one is actually utilizing again data
(16:06):
and analytics to inform that end user experience, and what
we're doing at the moment is kind of on that
modern management journey with a new platform for device management,
and we've seen some great improvements across things like boot
time and dex scores, and just to put that into
perspective with that kind of that, yes, it's a mass
(16:27):
upgrade of a new platform around device management. In life management,
the average brute time has actually changed from two minutes
down to just thirty nine seconds, and across other scores,
we've seen the DEX score increase from a thirty one
(16:49):
up to something like an eighty eight. So the work
that we're doing around change in the background around all
of our systems, platforms and services, we're seeing some real
great improvements and the use of analytics is really helping
us to understand see and engage with that juruser experience
and that injuries of journey and be real sured that
(17:12):
the improvements and change we are making and delivering is
having a real positive impact because we can see it
in the analytics and the school's coming back to us absolutely.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
And you know, harkening back to your to your first example, there,
it today should really be asking itself? Have we turned
it off and off and on again? Shouldn't it? It
shouldn't be asked, it should be self inquiry. Now, So
I assume elements of the BTP were technologically fairly conservative
(17:43):
not long ago, and how would you chart the development
of that perspective? Is then more strategic recognition for it,
for instance now compared to say five years ago, would
you say, and where does it go from here?
Speaker 3 (17:58):
Yeah? Definitely? So I t everyone's using it right, name
name a process without it these these these days, it's everywhere, right,
And I guess we we have therefore a greater reliance
on it, and therefore we've got a greater reliance understanding
(18:20):
and also desire for dex and digital employee experience right
we It's it's pivotal and we need to be be
understanding how we've come through from this kind of evolution
around utilization of technology now looking at analytical insights and
no longer is it those those kind of days of
(18:40):
supply and demand. We're actually looking at Okay, what what
what is it that you're trying to achieve? What what
is your score? Utilize analytics so that we can now
see take action, be on that journey with you rather
than just a supply of providing you with something. Okay,
And I guess pivotal to all of this is obviously
(19:01):
change and adoption. I know something that you and Tim
talk heavily about on your show is that kind of
user adoption and how key and peopletol that that is
to technology and everything that we do. It's not about
just delivering something, but it's being on that journey with
the end user, aligning to the strategy and the goals
(19:23):
of the organization, and embedding technology, embedding decks so that
we know that our people at the end of it
around what they're trying to do in their many varied roles,
can achieve the outcomes that they desire in their kind
of working practices.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Really beautiful, it's a good vision and this is a
fun one for you, Jack. I was happy with this.
So if you had a magic wand and you could
instantly fix or automate any major challenge across any major
challenge across your IT landscape, which would it be.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
It's a great question and a great power in terms
of the magic one, if only. Okay, So for me,
I think, and something I always talk about is I
think there was an article probably quite a few years
ago now that I always refer back to seeing which
(20:17):
was how that the most valuable resource was no longer oil,
but in fact actually was data, and therefore sort of
managing exploiting data, making sure that we're not falling behind
is a real key one. And even in any sort
of police strategy or report you look at, it will
(20:40):
refer to along the lines of something that the pace
and change of today will never be this slow again. Okay,
So for me, I think it's about using the magic
wand will most create integration and connectivity across policing. At times,
we have many blue light organizations that do the same
(21:06):
thing in probably many different ways, with buying their own
finance system, procurement system, a system that does that, an
application that does that, infrastructure that does this, hardware that
does this, and I think we can be joined up
a lot greater and better. It's not to say that
we aren't, because we are. There's a lot of great
practices and processes out there where where we have some
great partnership working out there cross blue light organizations. But
(21:30):
in a technology and systems and application sense, I think
we can have much greater into into integration connectivity across
pleasing blue light systems so that we can achieve that
that exploitation of data and use it to its maximum
best business benefit.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
Right, so that I already I already kind we already
I already kind of raised this with you. But just
looking ahead, you know, and almost every professional, whatever field
you're in, you know, the truly passionate professional, they look ahead,
they know it exactly what excites from about their job
in the coming years, exactly what they want to achieve,
what stands out to you on that horizon.
Speaker 3 (22:15):
So, for me, improving that digit went Jews experience right
known shock considering the show that we're on here today,
right for me, yeah, it's improved that digit went user
experience in a wide sense. Right. How is that achieved? Though?
I guess is probably the key in coret question, Right,
(22:36):
we need to do it by innovating new services, enhancing
self service and streamlining processes and optimizing. Really this and
this is a key, key one that I want to
pay a lot of attention to over the next year. Right,
we pay a lot of attention or deliver change with
always adding more or delivering this this new app that
(22:59):
does this, or this new process that does this, and
we're kind of all, we're really good at adding more
and adding more layers. But all that does is obviously
leads to people perhaps doing more times. And for me,
it's it's using tools, skills, AI opportunities, things like that
to optimize, streamline, remove, take away, simplify for that end
(23:26):
user experience so that it's a in a real simplistic,
easy to deliver manner so that people could be the
most effective and efficient self they can be. And I
guess all of that is needs to be linked to
the strategic objectives of the organization, making sure that what
(23:47):
we are doing and delivering in terms of change, in
terms of that ambition of a digital employee experience is
underpinned by that kind of organizational umbrella of organizational strategy
and objectives that we are We are one love it.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
That's a great vision and a great Your passion is
very evident, Jack, And what I was thinking earlier about
the show is, yes, it's a very British theme, but
what I love about it is, you know, anybody who's
visited London, anybody who's visited the UK, you know they've
they've gone straight to the Gatwick Express, or they've taken
the tuban from hethrow and you know they've probably seen
(24:24):
something about the British Transport Police. It might have seen
one of your officers, surely seen one of your posters,
and they've been in safe hands, being in safe hands
because of you, right, And.
Speaker 3 (24:32):
That's that's right. And I guess a key one I
probably couldn't come in here without saying it, but a
lot that will be familiar with and we'll play in
people's heads and minds if they're thinking of us. It's
sorted to text you six six if you ever need
US or British Transfer Police obviously nine nine nine in
(24:53):
an emergency. If not text six six you'll be in
direct contact five two x with our control rooms and
receive the support and help you may need.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
And who knows, Jack, perhaps you need to well, I
hope you don't. It's the number you might want to
have in mind if you're visiting the UK, perhaps for
next Think Experience twenty twenty five. You see what I did?
Speaker 1 (25:16):
There?
Speaker 3 (25:16):
See who you did?
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Is coming to and there's going to plug the London
event today because it's only it's only us. London is here, Okay,
thirtieth of September to the first of October London. The
UK links will be in the shows. They'll be links
to the Boston Boston show as well. I'm sorry, I'm
not not trying to exclude our larger pair audience. I
promise just a little plug for the London event at
(25:38):
the Intercontinent for London, the biggest, best, longest experience yet.
Will you be there, Jack, I will be there.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
I will be there. I have my ticket, I'm signed
up and I yeah, really looking forward to it, looking
forward to meeting yourself and in him as well.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
Phenomenal phenomena And I should say, you know it's a
Boston the fourteenth to the fifteenth of October at Omni
C What links in this show? Note you should be
at iver event depending on which part of the world
you live in. Jack, Great, great pleasure, to have you
on the show. Appreciate your work as an organization, and
I've loved hearing about hearing a bit more about what
goes into it from a kind of technological perspective. Extremely
(26:19):
interesting and look forward to meeting you in London this
year too.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
Thank you really appreciate the opportunity and I'm glad to
be showcasing the work of British Transport. Place.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
To make sure that you never miss an episode, subscribe
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next Think dot com. Thank you so much for listening.
(26:50):
Until next time,
Welcome it, change Makers to the Deck Show with Tim
Flower and Tom mcgra let's get into it.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Hello, change Makers, we're back. It's the Deck Show. So
I'm flying solo today, no Tim Flower, who's on a
well well earned sabbatical following his deck World tour. And
we we you know, it's kind of almost fitting because
we have a very kind of I think, a very
British themed guest an organization to join this solo British
(00:32):
host and that is Jackbourne, head of IT Operations at
the British Transport Police. Hello Jack, Welcome to the show, sir.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Yeah, Hi, good after, Thanks for having me over.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Great pleasure, great pleasure. Very interesting organization as we'll get to,
especially from an IT perspective, but for the listeners they
can't see it. But I have a big like a
happy birthday, would you say, like bunting behind me, and
so Jack came our happy birthday. It's your birthday and
it's not exactly but Jack, but we are. We are
moving through birthday season in my household, so all of
(01:06):
my children and then the tay and myself, we all
have like congested number of birthdays between April and May.
There's like five in quick succession. So we just we
put up some bunting at the beginning of it. We
just leave it there for like eight weeks. Basically.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
That's he who knows when when this is released it
might be one of your children's birthdays or someone in
the household's birthdays. Happy birthday to them.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
That's a really good point. I didn't I don't actually register.
We may have all grown up many, many, many years
by ven hope.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
I'm sure.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
I'm sure it won't be that long. But listen, I mean,
thanks so much for joining us, and I think a
great place to start. As I say, we do have
a very global audience out of there, and I wonder
how unique a service like the British Transport Police is
or isn't internationally, Jack, So let's begin, as it were,
with the basics. How would how would you describe the
(01:57):
structure and mission of the BTP?
Speaker 3 (02:00):
First of all, yeah, so great question. I'm really glad
to have the opportunity to obviously talk about British Transport Police.
So we are the guardians of the railway. We're a
specialist and national police force that is responsible for policing
a railway network across England. Scotland and Wales, And just
to put that into sort of perspective, that's roughly one
(02:22):
point eight billion passenger rail journeys annually and billions of
freight obviously traving on the rail network throughout that time
as well. Our mission in terms of b TOPS is
obviously working together protecting the rail community and creating that
hostile environment for crime and criminality. And what we do
is we ensure the security of millions of people who
(02:46):
use the railway in Britain and we provide policing services
to rail operators, their staff, passengers and covering not only
the national rail network also systems like the London Underground
Doclrians like Railway and various obviously tram systems. And our
vision really is to be that sort of weld leading
police force that's trusted to provide safe, reliable railway, helping
(03:11):
and making people get home on time and safely. And
what I love about BTP is and what some of
your kind of listeners will be thinking really is, Okay, yeah,
we're a similar organization too many out there with our hardware,
perhaps our laptops, our HR, our people systems, our finance systems, etc.
But we've got some really cool technology as well, drones
(03:35):
and capabilities with dogs and firearms, tons of CCTV, sophisticated
network and it's all there to I guess, gather intelligence
and support criminal investigations. And it's really rewarding to know
that you're having that direct impact and what you're doing
within an IT environment, it's having that direct impact on supporting, protecting,
(03:56):
helping people and defeating criminality.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
We do we don't have any of those terrifying AI
robot dogs yet, do you, Jack? No.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
I did see an interesting article the other day in
terms of holographic policing, So who knows what the future
hold in that respect?
Speaker 2 (04:13):
I don't know. Yeah, will will we live to CBDA
where we sat on a train in a sort of
one of those robot dogs kind of pads past us
gives us a quick scan of our of our terrifying
prospect that I was just curious before we get into it, Jack,
do you know that like is there is there is
the institution of the transport police in this country relatively unique,
(04:35):
completely normal in terms of there's a French transport police
and an American transport police. Do you have had perspective?
I guess it's so you probably meet colleagues from around
the world sometimes, don't you.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
Yeah, indeed, Yeah, we we have a lot of sort
of international relationships. Obviously, there's there's Interpol across across the
top as well supporting and we have that kind of
great relationship. And if you look at kind of some
of our policing with the euro style with that kind
of direct link in as well.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
We.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
Cross border police, and I guess that's our uniqueness in
terms of being that national force where we operate with everybody,
We touch all of their other home office forces that
are out there, and like you say that international boundaries
as well, and we've done some great stuff around the globe.
But in terms of supporting that policing and almost giving
that specialist BTP touch and spin on policing on that
(05:27):
kind of national scale to kind of demonstrate the capabilities
that we really have and are capable.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Of doing fantastic And you already think of a sort
of a more mobile as it were, organization and transport police, right,
So what are some of the sort of standout challenges
that come with supporting what is I assume pretty disperse,
pretty mobile workforce overall.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
Yeah, indeed, and I guess things spot on the noil
there really with that geographical spread, hardware support can obviously
be challenging covering the kind of three countries there with England,
Scotland and Wales, and some users or some employees may
never see an IT resource in their career, and that
(06:11):
could be a very long career hopefully with us at BTP,
because we are spanned across one hundred and seventy different
sites across those three countries. And the additional challenge we
have within there as well is obviously shift patterns of
officers and staff working throughout different times in the night,
in the day, and there's so many varied roles. I
(06:34):
guess within BTPs it's not just what people may think
or assume with that kind of frontline officer and all
that Bobby on the beat and then that kind of
support staff in the background. We within officers alone, there
are so many different varied roles and almost personas, if
you like, in terms of their digital experience that they
use and have, And I guess cross pollination can be
(06:57):
challenging because of that. That's first workforce, as you kind
of said, so they're kind of leaning over the shoulder
and somebody in the office said to me the other day, Oh, yeah,
we're trying to do something like this, and what capabilities
have we got And it was almost obvious to me.
But that kind of cross pollination where you think one
hundred and seventy sites, five thousand roughly employees, there's going
(07:20):
to be times where people won't have that, I guess
opportunity for that cross pollination and therefore systems that help
us with collaboration and communication. Technology is really important in
our organization, and there's always a right time as well.
In terms of communication. I always say, if we're leading
change and technology change, don't go too soon with the communication.
(07:42):
Who wants to know that this thing is coming when
they're really busy and bogged down with their day to
day work of constant updates, and this thing is coming,
it's coming, it's coming. I think what the feedback is
that we have is no tell us when it's imminent,
tell us when it's almost coming. Because sometimes change can
be slow. Sometimes change to be coming for a long time,
and we could be excited about things, but make it
(08:05):
relevant to their end users so they can easy more
easily adopt it and understand it. At the point and
time that's relevant and best sort of worthy to them.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
Really absolutely, And you know, I don't think on the
deck show we've tended to associate like policing and digital
employee experience. But obviously, to you, dex is important, and
you know, maybe part of that is understanding what to
you and your your your your employees, good digital experience
(08:34):
looks like, and I say employees, I could be officer,
it could be a staff member on the front lines,
you know.
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Yeah, indeed, And and for me, agile working and having
efficient and effective digital ways of working is key across
everything that they do. And I guess, like you said,
with an organization like ours, some some kind of I
guess buzzwords that are kind of real resonate with me.
And key in this area is that mobility, that connectivity
(09:02):
and that communication are so key. And one which I
think is almost underestimated at time is simplicity. I think
at times, particularly and sometimes a technology world, we can
we can perhaps over engineer things or make things perhaps
more complex than they need to be. And I guess
simplicity for me around a digital employee experience is one
(09:23):
of the foundations that we should all kind of start
with and link with. And something that I've recently been
doing and trying to embed across British Transport Police at
the moment is embedding guiding principles which for me will
help us with with digital adoption. And these digital kind
of guiding principles help kind of give us strategy directive
(09:47):
or or establish boundaries, allow us for something to work within.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
And and for.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
Me that those things and those those guiding principles they
need to be relevant, long lasting, have rationale for existence,
be easily digest and of course followed. So for me,
things like customer experience, simplicity, security requirements driven and exploiting
(10:11):
and managing data are absolutely prime examples of guiding principles
that we should almost use and deploy across all of
our work and things and change that we are doing
or delivering.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Absolutely, I mean in your context they're anything but sort
of hollow buzzwords, are they They're kind of deeply intrinsic
to what it means to actually deliver a service.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
And I guess you're there. They could be buzzwords perhaps
if not implemented. Well, it's about keeping championing that change,
to drive it home, make sure it's understood and why
they're there in the first place, because I guess without it,
without guiding principles, change could go off on a tangent
and not go the right way or the way that
(10:57):
it's proposed to. And if if you miss off that
employee en user experience and you're delivering change, guess what,
your change may may not be as accepted as what
you'd perhaps hoped.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
I mean, look, in the world of policing, we may
or may not be far from the aforementioned robot dog
that I seem to have a bit of a fixation
with right there. But we are away off, I would say,
from the pre cogs of minority report notoriety. If you've
seen that movie Jack, you know you've got vasically pre crime.
(11:33):
They're like psychic technological police force. But we have our
we have an equivalent, real world equivalent in it right,
which is proactive it preventative ital What does it mean
at the British Transport Police? What does it mean for you?
How do you define it? Why does it matter? And
how far along that that kind of endless journey to
proactivity or preventative predictive it?
Speaker 3 (11:55):
Are you? Yeah? So I think you're right. I think
it is a journey. I think is the first thing
to kind of call out. And for me, that kind
of proactive analysis really is receiving those alerts and analysis
and and and being aware of it to then be
able to take that corrective action. Okay, we need to
(12:18):
use analytics to inform decision making. We do it throughout
our daily lives and in it it's it's it's no different.
You know, we gather the data, we pinpoint therefore what
the data says, and then we're able to act upon it. Okay.
So so for me in terms of that kind of
proactive experience, it's about pinpointing software and versions and being
(12:40):
able to push updates and take that correct corrective action
to overcome effectively the issue that that that might be
presenting itself. And I guess what we what we tend
to see and probably is is relatable across many organizations,
is those that suffer in silence, perhaps those that maybe
don't raise those service desk technology service desk calls and
(13:04):
perhaps suffer in silence. And I guess proactivity can help
to overcome that by investigating looking at some of those issues,
looking at some of those trends and thinking, Okay, what
can we do about this? Too? Effective improves the end
user experience, So for us, yeah, perhaps we're on the journey.
(13:25):
I think for next year. It's a real key ambition
for me to be exploring it further around how we
move from that reactive to proactive also with a preventative
mindset at the end of it. Okay, even if the
less the end user knows about the issues that they
have experienced or maybe about to experience, and the faster
(13:48):
quicker we can resolve them, whether that be in the
background without them knowing or with them, the faster quicker
we can do that with the less they know about it, obviously,
the greater the enjuriers, your experience is going to be
for them fantastic.
Speaker 4 (14:02):
And can you give us an example, Jack, like one
super concrete example of how dex positively impacts the BTP
to kind of bring that to life a little more
kind of precisely.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Yeah, definitely. And the first one that springs to mind
really is and it seems so simple in practice. Yeah, Yeah,
it's effectiveness is incredible. It's a remote restart campaign. And
I guess what we saw and what we have seen
across British Transport Police is the typical service desk supporting
(14:37):
end users with calls for service by simply saying, have
you turned it on and turned it off again? Right?
Something familiar with the ages gone by, the simple switch
it off, switch it on again, as it resolved your issue.
And I guess some of that from a technical perspective,
it's not too technical. It's probably likely because of background
updates or policies not being applied, and therefore a good
(14:58):
old fashioned reboot or a kick is what's needed. And
what we did was we kind of understood this end
user experience of maybe not shutting down a laptop or
restarting at night from quickly simple simply start it up
in the morning the next day and continue where I
left off. What we needed to do is kind of
(15:19):
overcome that so that updates would be pushed out, restarts
would occur, and what we did was deploy a remote
restart campaign which which could only be deferred a couple
of times, and that significantly improved the end user experience
because that meant that policies are applied, updates occurred pretty
rapidly and people on the latest and best and greatest
(15:41):
versions that we know are in support and the best
delivering the best end user experience that they could ask for. Really,
So for me, remote restart campaign is definitely one that
there's been a real success for us. And if I
made to a second one that into mind, we're talking
to you about, this one is actually utilizing again data
(16:06):
and analytics to inform that end user experience, and what
we're doing at the moment is kind of on that
modern management journey with a new platform for device management,
and we've seen some great improvements across things like boot
time and dex scores, and just to put that into
perspective with that kind of that, yes, it's a mass
(16:27):
upgrade of a new platform around device management. In life management,
the average brute time has actually changed from two minutes
down to just thirty nine seconds, and across other scores,
we've seen the DEX score increase from a thirty one
(16:49):
up to something like an eighty eight. So the work
that we're doing around change in the background around all
of our systems, platforms and services, we're seeing some real
great improvements and the use of analytics is really helping
us to understand see and engage with that juruser experience
and that injuries of journey and be real sured that
(17:12):
the improvements and change we are making and delivering is
having a real positive impact because we can see it
in the analytics and the school's coming back to us absolutely.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
And you know, harkening back to your to your first example, there,
it today should really be asking itself? Have we turned
it off and off and on again? Shouldn't it? It
shouldn't be asked, it should be self inquiry. Now, So
I assume elements of the BTP were technologically fairly conservative
(17:43):
not long ago, and how would you chart the development
of that perspective? Is then more strategic recognition for it,
for instance now compared to say five years ago, would
you say, and where does it go from here?
Speaker 3 (17:58):
Yeah? Definitely? So I t everyone's using it right, name
name a process without it these these these days, it's everywhere, right,
And I guess we we have therefore a greater reliance
on it, and therefore we've got a greater reliance understanding
(18:20):
and also desire for dex and digital employee experience right
we It's it's pivotal and we need to be be
understanding how we've come through from this kind of evolution
around utilization of technology now looking at analytical insights and
no longer is it those those kind of days of
(18:40):
supply and demand. We're actually looking at Okay, what what
what is it that you're trying to achieve? What what
is your score? Utilize analytics so that we can now
see take action, be on that journey with you rather
than just a supply of providing you with something. Okay,
And I guess pivotal to all of this is obviously
(19:01):
change and adoption. I know something that you and Tim
talk heavily about on your show is that kind of
user adoption and how key and peopletol that that is
to technology and everything that we do. It's not about
just delivering something, but it's being on that journey with
the end user, aligning to the strategy and the goals
(19:23):
of the organization, and embedding technology, embedding decks so that
we know that our people at the end of it
around what they're trying to do in their many varied roles,
can achieve the outcomes that they desire in their kind
of working practices.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Really beautiful, it's a good vision and this is a
fun one for you, Jack. I was happy with this.
So if you had a magic wand and you could
instantly fix or automate any major challenge across any major
challenge across your IT landscape, which would it be.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
It's a great question and a great power in terms
of the magic one, if only. Okay, So for me,
I think, and something I always talk about is I
think there was an article probably quite a few years
ago now that I always refer back to seeing which
(20:17):
was how that the most valuable resource was no longer oil,
but in fact actually was data, and therefore sort of
managing exploiting data, making sure that we're not falling behind
is a real key one. And even in any sort
of police strategy or report you look at, it will
(20:40):
refer to along the lines of something that the pace
and change of today will never be this slow again. Okay,
So for me, I think it's about using the magic
wand will most create integration and connectivity across policing. At times,
we have many blue light organizations that do the same
(21:06):
thing in probably many different ways, with buying their own
finance system, procurement system, a system that does that, an
application that does that, infrastructure that does this, hardware that
does this, and I think we can be joined up
a lot greater and better. It's not to say that
we aren't, because we are. There's a lot of great
practices and processes out there where where we have some
great partnership working out there cross blue light organizations. But
(21:30):
in a technology and systems and application sense, I think
we can have much greater into into integration connectivity across
pleasing blue light systems so that we can achieve that
that exploitation of data and use it to its maximum
best business benefit.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
Right, so that I already I already kind we already
I already kind of raised this with you. But just
looking ahead, you know, and almost every professional, whatever field
you're in, you know, the truly passionate professional, they look ahead,
they know it exactly what excites from about their job
in the coming years, exactly what they want to achieve,
what stands out to you on that horizon.
Speaker 3 (22:15):
So, for me, improving that digit went Jews experience right
known shock considering the show that we're on here today,
right for me, yeah, it's improved that digit went user
experience in a wide sense. Right. How is that achieved? Though?
I guess is probably the key in coret question, Right,
(22:36):
we need to do it by innovating new services, enhancing
self service and streamlining processes and optimizing. Really this and
this is a key, key one that I want to
pay a lot of attention to over the next year. Right,
we pay a lot of attention or deliver change with
always adding more or delivering this this new app that
(22:59):
does this, or this new process that does this, and
we're kind of all, we're really good at adding more
and adding more layers. But all that does is obviously
leads to people perhaps doing more times. And for me,
it's it's using tools, skills, AI opportunities, things like that
to optimize, streamline, remove, take away, simplify for that end
(23:26):
user experience so that it's a in a real simplistic,
easy to deliver manner so that people could be the
most effective and efficient self they can be. And I
guess all of that is needs to be linked to
the strategic objectives of the organization, making sure that what
(23:47):
we are doing and delivering in terms of change, in
terms of that ambition of a digital employee experience is
underpinned by that kind of organizational umbrella of organizational strategy
and objectives that we are We are one love it.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
That's a great vision and a great Your passion is
very evident, Jack, And what I was thinking earlier about
the show is, yes, it's a very British theme, but
what I love about it is, you know, anybody who's
visited London, anybody who's visited the UK, you know they've
they've gone straight to the Gatwick Express, or they've taken
the tuban from hethrow and you know they've probably seen
(24:24):
something about the British Transport Police. It might have seen
one of your officers, surely seen one of your posters,
and they've been in safe hands, being in safe hands
because of you, right, And.
Speaker 3 (24:32):
That's that's right. And I guess a key one I
probably couldn't come in here without saying it, but a
lot that will be familiar with and we'll play in
people's heads and minds if they're thinking of us. It's
sorted to text you six six if you ever need
US or British Transfer Police obviously nine nine nine in
(24:53):
an emergency. If not text six six you'll be in
direct contact five two x with our control rooms and
receive the support and help you may need.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
And who knows, Jack, perhaps you need to well, I
hope you don't. It's the number you might want to
have in mind if you're visiting the UK, perhaps for
next Think Experience twenty twenty five. You see what I did?
Speaker 1 (25:16):
There?
Speaker 3 (25:16):
See who you did?
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Is coming to and there's going to plug the London
event today because it's only it's only us. London is here, Okay,
thirtieth of September to the first of October London. The
UK links will be in the shows. They'll be links
to the Boston Boston show as well. I'm sorry, I'm
not not trying to exclude our larger pair audience. I
promise just a little plug for the London event at
(25:38):
the Intercontinent for London, the biggest, best, longest experience yet.
Will you be there, Jack, I will be there.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
I will be there. I have my ticket, I'm signed
up and I yeah, really looking forward to it, looking
forward to meeting yourself and in him as well.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
Phenomenal phenomena And I should say, you know it's a
Boston the fourteenth to the fifteenth of October at Omni
C What links in this show? Note you should be
at iver event depending on which part of the world
you live in. Jack, Great, great pleasure, to have you
on the show. Appreciate your work as an organization, and
I've loved hearing about hearing a bit more about what
goes into it from a kind of technological perspective. Extremely
(26:19):
interesting and look forward to meeting you in London this
year too.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
Thank you really appreciate the opportunity and I'm glad to
be showcasing the work of British Transport. Place.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
To make sure that you never miss an episode, subscribe
to the show in Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your favorite
podcast player, and if you're listening on Apple Podcasts, make
sure to leave a rating of the show. Just have
the number of stars you think the podcast deserves. If
you'd like to learn more about how Next Thing can
help me improve your digital employee experience, head over to
next Think dot com. Thank you so much for listening.
(26:50):
Until next time,
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