In this episode, we’re talking about something we don’t often hear enough about—the emotional aftermath of disaster. When hurricanes, fires, or other large-scale emergencies strike, the physical damage is easy to see—but the mental and emotional toll is just as real, and often much harder to navigate.
Joining us today is Dr. Tom Hlenski, a dedicated leader in the American Red Cross Disaster Mental Health program, based in Long Island, New York. With years of experience supporting individuals and communities through unimaginable moments, Dr. Hlenski offers a deep look into how disaster affects mental health—and how trained Red Cross volunteers step in to provide comfort, guidance, and a path toward healing.
From immediate psychological first aid to longer-term recovery and finding a sense of normalcy again, Dr. Hlenski walks us through the mission, methods, and humanity behind the Red Cross's disaster mental health efforts.
Stay tuned—this conversation is both eye-opening and heartening, and it reminds us that recovery isn’t just about rebuilding homes, but also restoring hope.
www.mentalwealthpod.com
DISCLAIMER: The views, thoughts, and opinions expressed are the speaker’s own and do not constitute legal, medical, or other forms of professional advice. The material and information presented here is for general information and entertainment purposes only. The "Mental Wealth Podcast" and "Pedal My Way" names and all forms and abbreviations are the property of its owner and its use does not imply endorsement of or opposition to any specific organization, product, or service.
Joining us today is Dr. Tom Hlenski, a dedicated leader in the American Red Cross Disaster Mental Health program, based in Long Island, New York. With years of experience supporting individuals and communities through unimaginable moments, Dr. Hlenski offers a deep look into how disaster affects mental health—and how trained Red Cross volunteers step in to provide comfort, guidance, and a path toward healing.
From immediate psychological first aid to longer-term recovery and finding a sense of normalcy again, Dr. Hlenski walks us through the mission, methods, and humanity behind the Red Cross's disaster mental health efforts.
Stay tuned—this conversation is both eye-opening and heartening, and it reminds us that recovery isn’t just about rebuilding homes, but also restoring hope.
www.mentalwealthpod.com
DISCLAIMER: The views, thoughts, and opinions expressed are the speaker’s own and do not constitute legal, medical, or other forms of professional advice. The material and information presented here is for general information and entertainment purposes only. The "Mental Wealth Podcast" and "Pedal My Way" names and all forms and abbreviations are the property of its owner and its use does not imply endorsement of or opposition to any specific organization, product, or service.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
We'd like to start today's podcast with a brief announcement.
We are delighted to share with you that The Mental
Wealth Podcast has partnered with the American Red Cross. As
part of our partnership, fifty percent of all proceeds from
products purchased through our online store will now go to
support the urgent needs of the American Red Cross. We
(00:22):
want to thank everyone at the American Red Cross for
their instrumental work. Please visit support dot mentalwealthpod dot com
to learn more about our partnership and thank you everybody
for your support. They are the organization known the world
(00:45):
over for responding to disaster hit communities in their hour
of need. Beyond their vital work collecting blood donations, providing food, aid, shelter,
and medical supplies, the Red Cross is life saving about
response work extends to mental health. In this episode, we're
joined by doctor Tom Lenski, Long Island, Regional program lead
(01:10):
for Disaster mental Health at the American Red Cross. He
guides us on the vital work of Red Cross disaster
mental health volunteers and the steps they take to write
support when crisis strikes. You'll hear powerful stories, expert insights,
and learn more. About life on the ground for the
Red Cross Team, DoD Lenski, how are you. I am fine,
(01:35):
Thank you, Thank you so much for joining us. We
really appreciate you being here on a Saturday, giving up
your weekend time to be with us, and we really
appreciate it. If you could please give us an introduction
to your role at the Red Cross and talk to
us a little bit about disaster mental health and what
that means in terms of the Red Cross organization.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Sure, I'm the coordinator for disaster mental health here on
Long Island. I'm also the volunteer partner for the Long
Island Care, the executive director for the American Red Cross,
and I'm the volunteer partner for national program People Matters,
and so three different hats in the Red Cross. But
to the issue of disaster mental health, a quick background.
(02:14):
Disaster mental health in the American Red Cross started nineteen
ninety two. That was following a rather catastrophic hurricane and
a recognition that our clients and our workforce.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
Two.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
It's a dual mandate clients and our workforce would benefit
from disaster mental health interventions. And that's really basically, generally speaking,
to provide for the emotional and psychological well being of
those two groups. I had my first experience with the
American Red Cross Disaster Mental Health in nineteen ninety six.
(02:50):
Twa Flight eight hundred had gone down off the coast
of Long Island, and I was at that time considered
what we called then a spontaneous volunteer. Today we refer
to that as event based volunteer, and both my wife
and I. My wife worked at Stonybrook. She's also a
disaster mental health volunteer, as is my daughter. My wife
(03:12):
was asked to go out she worked for Stonybrook at
that time if she would support the Red Cross. She
asked me if I would join. I did, and we
provided services. We actually worked the respite tent for the
divers and the Navy divers on that operation. So our
job was to meet with them and to just be
(03:33):
there and provide what we call a compassionate presence for
people that were doing a very difficult job. So that
was my first experience with the Red Cross, and I
was very taken by that. My wife was always involved
in volunteer work. She was involved with Make a Wish Foundation, etc.
And she would encourage me to get involved, and I
said when I'm ready, when I finish what I need
(03:56):
to do with my dissertation, my practice, and every think
I'm going to join the Red Cross. When the big
Hurricane Katrina hit, that's when I officially joined, took the classes,
and was my first deployment during Hurricane Katrina.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Oh, I didn't realize that Katrina was the part of
that process for you. That was when you officially became
part of the organization.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
That's when I said, I'm ready to serve. I have
the time, I can do this. And after two days training,
I was deployed down to actually Florida for Hurricane Wilmer
had come across at the same time, and I was
assigned to a shelter that housed five hundred people in
the Fort Lauderdale area of Florida. And it was a
(04:41):
two week experience and that was my first official national
deployment with the American Red Cross.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
In terms of disaster mental health in general, is there
a typical deployment for experts such as yourself or is
it sort of ad hoc tailored to the event itself.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
No disaster is the same, always some variation, but there
are common threads that one can expect, especially when there's
loss of life and destruction, which we often see. But
I want to be clear, there's two domains that we
operate in, and I'm speaking now generally not just Disaster
Mental Health but Red Cross. There's the domain of our chapter,
(05:19):
our region, and there's the domain of national deployment. So
I'm busy as the coordinator here on Long Island, busy
building the team, the disaster mental health team, in preparation
for something that might happen locally. So we have fires
that happen every three or four days. We're responding to
a home fire. Some of them are fatal fires or
(05:42):
various circumstances that we may deploy for here in our
region or in our chapter area Long Island. And then
there's national So then national something happens on a national level.
So when we had the Pulse shooting a number of
years ago, and I was asked to deploy for that,
so that's my putting on the national hat and going
(06:05):
out and supporting the response for that.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
Yeah, I suppose the Pulse nightclub, for example, is one
of those headline grabbing events where everyone sort of knows
what it is. I think a lot of people perhaps
don't realize the extent to which the Red Cross deals
with those smaller events. Though it's like you said, those
house fire events. Could you speak to some of the
differences involved in the scale of those events and speak
to your individual role in some of the smaller events
(06:31):
like a house fire. What does that look like from
the first time you arrive on the scene for that
kind of event.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
I can give you what I would call what I'm
going to frame as a Margaret moment. So Margaret is
a name I make up. It's totally confidential. If you
allow me, I'll speak to that. So Margaret moment was
a case that happened in February, and this is a
typical of what we do here on the chapter level,
but you can scale that up to some extent on
(06:58):
a national response. We'll talk now on the local level,
on the regional level. So this woman was in February,
there was a house fire and the house was destroyed,
so she had nothing. Not only that, she was injured
and she required going to the hospital to be put
on event because she had smoke inhalation. I want to
(07:18):
be very clear, disaster mental health is one part of
a collaborative response for a client or for our workforce.
They all work together. It's like a very good recipe.
They all have a piece in this and they have
a certain order. If you go out of order with
a good recipe, it doesn't work right. There's a cadence,
(07:41):
there's an order that we have. So our disaster action
team goes to the fire scene first here in Long Island,
and they will give out immediate assistance we call it. Well,
she was in the hospital, so she didn't get immediate assistance.
Two of our team members went up to the hospital,
visited with her and did an assessment and then sent
(08:02):
an email to me indicating that she requested and needed
disaster mental health. When I saw that case, I noticed
that she qualified for us to activate what we call
the Integrated Care Condolence Team, typically activated not by me,
but by person right above me. So I got the
green light for that. And what that does is provide
(08:24):
its fatality assistance typically, but it also supports people that
have been injured and Margaret was injured. So the team
gets activated and what I call a wrap around service
casework gets involved. So we have casework which goes through
all the possibilities that she was going to a shelter.
There was no way around it. But we were doing
(08:46):
everything we could to support her in that process, that transition,
and also to get her out of that shelter as
soon as possible. So casework worked with her. Disaster Health
service work with her around needs that she had, around
medication or walking support, and of course disaster mental health
was me. I worked with her just on what she
(09:09):
experienced and where she was going. Her big issue, quite frankly,
was that and understandably, in a hospital, she felt like
she was alone and she didn't matter, and no slight
of the staff, because you know, people are busy in
hospitals and if she wasn't the squeaky wheel, she wasn't
going to get the attention. But she noted that what
(09:31):
the Red Cross did for her, besides supporting her on
her way out of the hospital for discharge, was that
she didn't feel alone and she felt like she mattered.
So that was key and that's a great example. That
case got spotlighted by National a couple of weeks ago
because it really showed how we worked together in tandem,
all these different activities come together and support that client.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
I love that you just mentioned the isolation element of
that topic, how do you those emotions when people are
probably confused, they're angry, they're a lot of frustrated, they
don't have the resources that need in that moment. What
tools do you use when you get on the ground
during a disaster.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
It's a great question. And what I will say first
is it depends on the context. So when I deployed
to Vegas for the shooting at the casino, I had
to do some television, some work with the television crews.
I talked about moving from from fear to hope because
(10:30):
the community was struck, just like in Orlando, Florida, the
community was absolutely devastated. People were frightened. The Muslim population
needed the support of the American Red Cross. We went out.
I was considered an ambassador at that time because I
went to one of the mosques for breakfast. Four of
us went as ambassadors for the American Red Cross to
(10:54):
support the Muslim population that was frightened about any retaliation
post the shoes at the Pulse. So you think of
these various contexts that we work. So yes, sometimes in
my first deployment in that shelter, in that vital shelter
that for some people it was all they had. So
(11:14):
people would come up to me, and some had a
home that they were eventually going to return to. So
it was about the transition and being in a shelter
and some of the hectic, you know, the difficulties that
can happen inside a shelter, the stressors that are there.
For some, they knew they had no home to go to,
so that's a different conversation. For some they had left Katrina,
(11:39):
They were transported to Florida and got away from Katrina,
only to have Wilmer hit them first. For those, the
depression was just dripping from them, the sadness and almost
like is there something following me? Different conversation, different listening tools.
When I deployed for the call in airline crash in Buffalo,
(12:02):
the fatalities were high, they had lost people. They didn't
want to talk. They just knew I was there. They
knew it was all disaster mental health, and some did
but a lot of just knew that we were there,
and we call that compassionate presence, you know. So that
(12:23):
changed after a few days and we got more involved
with people. In fact, I was involved with supporting the
dog teams up in Buffalo, so when you bring the
dogs into an operation, people open their doors and all
of a sudden you're engaged in a different way. It's
amazing what these therapy dogs can do. I also worked
with the therapy dog team down in Orlando. Again, it's
(12:45):
amazing what can happen. You know, the context is so critical.
And when I visited with the nine to eleven callers
in Orlando, that group of people that took the those
calls on that frantic night of the shooting, when they
saw us come in, they saw the Red Cross come
(13:05):
in and the dogs come in, some of them just
started crying. They just needed to cry, right.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
That's sort of vulnerability, that acceptance of there is help available.
I am vulnerable, I need this help, and I guess
the sort of realization that that help exists and it's
a tangible help that is available right now. It must
be such a transformative impact for people that are going
through these horrible events.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
It is. And the important thing about that transformation is
that we come in, we're in, and we're out' That's
the way. That's part of the design. The importance of
our connection with the community and the community resources so
we can connect people. Going back to the Margaret moment.
The key aspect of our work with Margaret was connecting
(13:51):
her with all those community resources that can lift her up,
that I can bring her to the next step in
her life, in her journey. And that's what we do.
We don't take over. We try to work with and
side by side with community resources.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
You facilitate the next step in that recovery process.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
It's a terrific word. We do facilitate that. Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
You yourself must be going through a lot emotionally when
you're dealing with people that have had a tragic event
happen to them suddenly. Is there steps that you take
personally to help your own mental health going through these processes.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
Yes. Well, the one thing we do in the Red
Cross is we try to take care of each other.
We have a disaster mental Health call team. So what
that means is when I go out on a deployment,
I have available to me on that deployment, on that
dro a disaster relief operation, I can go to mental
health if I feel I need something, I need to
(14:52):
talk about something that was very difficult. Typically when I
get home, though, I'm going to get a call from
my team. We call everybody that goes out regardless of
what the operation was, they get a phone call from
Disaster Mental Health, a check in call. Keep in mind,
now it's probably about eighteen hundred volunteers across the nation
and Disaster Mental Health, and these are all volunteer. So
(15:16):
what I'm talking about here on Long Island is all volunteer.
We go out in that field, whether it's local or
whether it's national, we are in volunteer organization for the
most part. To get to be Disaster Mental Health, you
have to have professional training, you have to have degrees.
You know, in my other life, I've been a psychotherapist
since nineteen seventy five. What I see on deployments is
(15:39):
often very similar to what you have in your practice.
You know, people have disasters, there's loss, there's illness, there's
all kinds of things that happen. So you learn to
find ways yourself in addition to the support I get
from Red Cross. In addition, my wife and I are
both therapists, so we can support each other. A lot
(16:00):
of these apps that I recommend for my patients, the
breathing apps, the headspace for meditation. I love to cook
and I love to gard and I'm very fortunate. So
those are very calming for me, very relaxing. I love
to exercise, which is also a release. So if I
go out on an operation and I'm doing what we
(16:20):
call psych first aid or psycho educational stuff, I'll look
to see what their strains are. Do you like to cook?
Do you take cooking classes? Do you do this? Have
you thought about yoga? Have you thought about walking or running?
Have you thought about this or that or what kind
of hobby?
Speaker 1 (16:35):
Do you have?
Speaker 2 (16:36):
To help people connect as quickly as possible to their routine,
because that's a good predictor for a positive outcome post disaster,
looking back to your routine and getting connected to the
people that love you family, it's typically your family.
Speaker 3 (16:52):
I know it's easier said than done for people who
have lost loved ones. There's no consolation that can replace them.
So doctor Mike Qristen is how do we even start
helping them in the situation.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Yeah, that's a great question because you know, as you
both know, anybody that's alive knows that we've all had
experience with losses personal or with friends. And you know,
in those first those first week, the first week and
a half two weeks, people are basically very numb, and
they're they're just in a cloud, and so people have
(17:26):
very little memory of conversations they've had with you in
those first couple of days. That said, in the most
terrific of times, it's important. It's important to listen. It's
also very important. What not to say is probably more
important than anything else, because when you're around somebody that's
(17:46):
been devastated by loss, the impulse to want to do
something or say something give themselves is very powerful. But
a lot of times people will say things and it
just just because they feel they have to. So the
importance of listening carefully and making that eye to eye
contact and that presence and is critical in those early stages,
(18:13):
very critical. Let me let me give a great example.
It was a very powerful moment. I want to share
this in terms of what people needed in the most
difficult time in Buffalo. Four or five days after the crash,
maybe it was a few days longer, we had a
site visit. I had been to the site earlier where
the crash was, so there was still part of the
(18:34):
plane that was in the ground. The site had been cleared,
but we could have a site visit and the bus
ride to the site visit. There were maybe about eight
or ten buses. I was on one of the buses,
and you could hear a pin drop. You could hear
a pin drop on that bus, even with the motor
running of the that's the only thing you heard. And
(18:55):
as we got closer and closer to the crash site,
the intensity that I was beginning to feel, you know,
I was beginning to practice breathing because I felt the intensity.
When those buses parked and people started to get off,
I was in the front of the bus. I got off.
There was a number of It was mostly DMH, but
(19:18):
there were a number of other activities from the Red
Cross involved. People got off the bus. Some people were
vomiting immediately from the tension, from the anticipation. This was
the most powerful. They were going to see the site
where their loved ones parrot when they got to the site.
When I walked to the site, when all the people
(19:38):
were down there, what I saw was groups of people
centered around spiritual care, around priests, rabbis, you name what
the groups were. They were centered around those groups praying together.
They didn't need mental health per se. They need we
got We were there for them. They knew it, but
(19:58):
they needed that that faith based support at that moment
of the most critical crisis, very powerful experience. Never forgot it.
It was something to see.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
The spiritual thing is more people trying to find meaning
of what happened? Is the correct doctor in terms of
finding closure? Is that the reason you think people congregate
around spiritual leader spirituality?
Speaker 2 (20:22):
I think that's absolutely correct. I think it's also when
all else has failed, it's the hope that some higher
power that there'll be some meaning, some understanding, something, some comfort,
some connection. Yes, yeah, it's it's it's very powerful, very powerful.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
And for situations where somebody has lost a loved one,
is there a checklist? Do you follow or the organization
follows the right approach? Is that a right approach?
Speaker 2 (20:50):
Well, the right approach is to be careful about what
not to say, and that takes some you know, learning,
some practice. If I spoke to the two of you
in that shelter, if you were in that shelter in
Florida when I first deployed, I would be listening for
your strengths. I would be listening to see if what
(21:11):
we call the pre morbid personality, if prior to the
disaster you were compromised. If prior to the disaster you
were compromised, then I have to listen even more carefully
to see if you might require more observation or an evaluation,
possibly at the hospital. So in my role during Sandy,
(21:34):
at times I'd had to go to a shelter because
there was a shelter resident that was erratic. And so
you have to make an assessment and based on what's
happening in that moment and what you know the history
to be as best as you can, and then make
a recommendation is like they're okay, they're fine to stay,
(21:54):
or that they may need to go to the hospital
for evaluation. So again, it depends. It was a title
of a book written by a psychiatrist, Listening with the
third Year, And I like that title because there's a
certain level of listening that occurs. Actually, when I was
in Florida, there was a man who was moved from
(22:15):
Texas and brought over to Florida, and Wilma followed him.
I just remember after I spoke with him, something flashed
inside me that said, I need to go back to
him because I suspect his depression is deeper than I
originally thought, there's something just triggered that I had to
reconnect with him and make sure that he wasn't at risk.
(22:39):
So there is that level of listening that has to
occur when we're on an operation.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
And do you have any sense of what that thing
that triggered that emotion or that feeling was or is
it just an innate understanding after years of practice.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
Yeah, we call that practice wisdom, you know. So yes, yeah,
it was something intuitive that you say, wait minute, wait
a minute, you know, things just collided and you just
you just go with it. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
You mentioned that there are communication mistakes that people make
in those kind of events. Could you speak to the
tangible words the mistakes people make when they're trying to
comfort people, they're trying to give advice, for example, after
a tragic event. Is there a sort of a number
of catch all phrases people used that are not helpful
that you know, you know, might actually benefit people listening
(23:26):
right now?
Speaker 2 (23:27):
There are So again, that's a great question. There's probably
a long list of them. But when I think about
some of the you know, things happen for reasons, he
or she's in a better place, they're they're at peace now,
Things like that the person still processing the laws, They
still haven't really accepted it. The denial is still at play.
(23:49):
I think the intent is clearly to help somebody, the
idea to make them feel a little better in a
horrible moment. But it's best to listen and to be
very very careful and deliberate about what to say. You know,
sometimes the best thing to say is I don't know
what to say.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
That's a great point. I love that point.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
Do you watch for those stages, doctor, the different stages
like denial, anger, acceptance, somebody going to a traumatic pace.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
There have been a lot of things positive about the
stages of grief and bereavement, and there's some challenges to that.
I will say that what I have found over the
years is that everybody grieves differently. Everybody grieves differently, but
you can see certain things. You can see that you know,
(24:38):
initially the person's like, wait a minute, I'm not there yet,
I'm not ready to hear this, And then it moved
to another stage, and eventually, more often than not, people
get to the acceptance level. And many people I talked to,
you know, who have gone to groups and stuff, feel like,
oh my god, I wasn't ready to hear what they
were telling me in that group. I just I was
(25:00):
there yet, which you know, sometimes they're not, and sometimes
those groups are phenomenal for people, So the bereavement groups
I'm talking about, So it is complicated work. And one
of the reasons I was so happy to be at
this podcast was that anything that I can do to
push out the message of the American Red Cross and
(25:22):
also the American Red Cross Disaster Mental Health because when
we respond, typically even here on Long Island, a lot
of people when we support schools that may have had
a loss or a bus crash or whatever it is,
they'll say, I didn't know that the American Red Cross
did that, you know, I didn't know that they would
support you know, this bus crash that happened and there
(25:45):
were fatalities that we were there with sixteen Disaster Mental
Health workers in person to support that school over a
three week period. They said, I didn't know you had
that capability. Yes we do, Yes we do here on
Long Island. We have that capability around the nation.
Speaker 3 (26:04):
Had there been situations where your help has not been welcome.
They might be going through something very traumatic that they
don't realize the help is of value.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Yes, oh yes, yes, well what will happen? We do
is best we can. So we'll go back to Margaret, right,
Margaret is asked one, if not two, if not three times,
do you want to speak with a disaster mental health worker,
so that when she gets the call from me or
whomever it is on my team, she's not like, why
(26:34):
is mental health calling me? Who told you that? Because
that does happen sometimes. I remember when I was in Florida,
there was a line of people out the door that
wanted to talk to about Some of them thought that
I had financial resources for them. Somebody told them that's
the line for the financial resources, and when they got
(26:55):
to the front of the line and they spoke to me,
they were not happy about what I was paddling, which
was awareness, psychological, first date and support. Yes, it does happen,
which we were very careful to not impose ourselves on people.
By the way, what we don't do in the American
Red Cross is ask mental health. We don't do psychotherapy.
(27:17):
We don't grab a person and start doing psychotherapy. So
when a new volunteer joins the Red Cross and wants
to be a disaster mental health worker. They are required
to take seventeen hours of training. But more importantly, they
got to work in the field with me. They got
to have a mentor, they got to have somebody that says, look,
this is what we do, and this is what we
don't do, and this is you know, this is how
(27:39):
it works. So it's very important the training, the mentoring
that happens within that's going on twenty four to seven,
seven days a week behind the scenes.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
In terms of responding to tragedies, you said you've been
doing this with the Red Cross in Skatrina bents of
years ago. Now, how is your understanding of the human
nature resilience changed over that time in those twenty years.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
That's another great question. When I first came out of school,
I went right to the Veterans Hospital here on Long Island.
That was my first job, and I worked what we
call a therapeutic community for returning Vietnam vets. So I'm
prefacing that because what I saw was I saw combat veterans.
(28:25):
I saw veterans that were not necessary combat, but were
in Vietnam and experienced a lot of different things. And
what I saw was certainly a challenge to the human condition.
The taboo of war and what happens to people. And
I saw how resilient some people were, and I also
saw a subset of the population that was not resilient
(28:49):
and succumbed to that kind of pressure and required a
lot more inputs and maybe for a very long time.
So I learned that early working with a very challenged population.
And it's similar to what you see in disaster response.
There's most people have the resources, they have the resources
(29:11):
and the connections of family or church or friends that
they can move forward. That they're resilient. Most people are
resilient even in the worst of times, even with the losses.
Most people are resilient. And then there's a subset of
that population that pre existing were compromised, where we might
(29:32):
call an at risk population, and that population, that subset
will obviously have had difficulty prior and will have more
difficulty certainly after a disaster, certainly, you know, whatever it
may be. And there's so many different disasters that could
happen out there they can't even name all.
Speaker 1 (29:52):
I'm assuming now that the Red Cross is looking for
jest mental health volunteers on a constant basis. They're always
looking for addition specialized help in the dissest mental health units.
Speaker 2 (30:03):
Correct, because we age out, there's turnover, and quite frankly,
disaster work is very stressful and sometimes people go out
and they realize it's just it's too much for them.
And look, I can tell you personally, as much as
it has been one of the most rewarding experiences to
go out and deploy, whether it be locally or nationally.
(30:23):
And some of my best friends that I have today
are people that I've met through the Red Cross. It's
just it's that kind of that kind of culture that
comes together. But there's no question that people go out
and they realize this is just not for me. I
can't it's too much. When I get the call to
go out, say to my wife, I'm ready, Are we good?
(30:46):
I'm okay, I'm going, or she's going to go. It depends.
She went to Parkland and she went to Connecticut for
Sandy hook So these are two very powerful deployments for her.
But when we go out, we'll talk to each other.
But I can feel in my stomach all of a sudden,
I've got to cancel all my patients in my private practice.
I realize, wait a minute, I'm not doing this. I'm
(31:07):
not going to do that. And then you know that
your days are going to be very long days. So
all of a sudden it hits you and then you
go and then you get into it and then you return.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Is the website a phone other people could use or
email address people use it to contact if they're interested
in applying for a role in disaster mental health.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
Yes, if they go to the Americanredcross dot org and
they can follow that, there'll be links for joining the
American Red Cross and when they hit that, it'll begin
to sort out what activity, so mental health will be
right there, or disaster health, nursing or spiritual care for
that matter. But yes, and we do always we always,
(31:52):
I am always looking for new recruits. You just don't
know when the next lead for for the region is
coming and working their way up. And absolutely again I
don't think people know what we do. Even the mental
health workers in the community don't know what the American
Red Cross is doing. So getting the word out, getting
(32:12):
the message out, hopefully this podcast out. With that, go
back to that American Red Cross dot org. You'll see
that they have disaster preparedness that they speak to flood
safety tips, house home fire safety tips. The American Red
Cross is very, very big. They have been for years
on installation of smoke detectors. In terms of prevention, that's
(32:36):
a very big piece of the American Red Cross that
is constantly going on and in play. It's an important
part of what we do. If you look at the
American Red Cross dot org, if you look at just
the CPR training, or you know, in terms of what
we do for blood, because blood collection is huge in
the American Red Cross. We're one of the biggest providers
of blood in the country. But the CPR for adult
(32:59):
and for pediatric, when I saw that the other day,
I said, I've got to sign up for that. It's
been a while since I've taken it, but I never
took for the infant CYPR. So again, to have those
tools ready to go, the prevention for the planning and
building in advance will mitigate a lot of the possibilities
of things that could happen. But I also would ask
(33:19):
people to call your local chapter of the American Red Cross.
So if they were to call the chapter here, they
might connect with me or one of the people on
the Disaster Mental Health team. But they also can call
their community mental health representatives. SAMSA is another one that
is disaster response. If you go on their website, you'll
(33:39):
see community resources. You click in your area code and
they will pop up resources in your community. I think
you know it's safe to say that we're all compromised
on some level. We're all under stress of some kind
all the time, and sometimes it's more elevated based on
what's going on external or within our family system. So
(34:00):
it's always important to prepare. Like they talk about well,
to have a will in place, right, some people don't
do that, but to prepare for the possibility of a
home fire, or for a flood, or for a tornado,
or for the unforeseen a tree, a lot of the
trees falling, and the destruction that could happen during that.
(34:21):
The importance of preparing, being prepared, I can't talk about
that enough. It makes a world of difference when something
happens and you don't have your medication. There's a world
of difference if you do have your medication for a
few days, a world of difference.
Speaker 1 (34:37):
We will also add those resources to the podcast release
as well. Doctor Lensky, I wish I could put words
to how much We appreciate your time today. We are
so happy that you could join us today. When I
heard what this aster mental health was all about, I thought,
we have to make sure that we learn more about
this and speaking to an expert such as yourself, it
means so much to myself and Makanda and to the
(34:59):
entire team here. We really appreciate first of all, what
the Red Cross and yourself are doing, and secondly you
for your time this week. It has been a real
pleasure speaking with you about the Red Cross's work. We
just wanted to again thank you again for your time.
Speaker 3 (35:13):
Yeah, thank you so much. Asking
We'd like to start today's podcast with a brief announcement.
We are delighted to share with you that The Mental
Wealth Podcast has partnered with the American Red Cross. As
part of our partnership, fifty percent of all proceeds from
products purchased through our online store will now go to
support the urgent needs of the American Red Cross. We
(00:22):
want to thank everyone at the American Red Cross for
their instrumental work. Please visit support dot mentalwealthpod dot com
to learn more about our partnership and thank you everybody
for your support. They are the organization known the world
(00:45):
over for responding to disaster hit communities in their hour
of need. Beyond their vital work collecting blood donations, providing food, aid, shelter,
and medical supplies, the Red Cross is life saving about
response work extends to mental health. In this episode, we're
joined by doctor Tom Lenski, Long Island, Regional program lead
(01:10):
for Disaster mental Health at the American Red Cross. He
guides us on the vital work of Red Cross disaster
mental health volunteers and the steps they take to write
support when crisis strikes. You'll hear powerful stories, expert insights,
and learn more. About life on the ground for the
Red Cross Team, DoD Lenski, how are you. I am fine,
(01:35):
Thank you, Thank you so much for joining us. We
really appreciate you being here on a Saturday, giving up
your weekend time to be with us, and we really
appreciate it. If you could please give us an introduction
to your role at the Red Cross and talk to
us a little bit about disaster mental health and what
that means in terms of the Red Cross organization.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Sure, I'm the coordinator for disaster mental health here on
Long Island. I'm also the volunteer partner for the Long
Island Care, the executive director for the American Red Cross,
and I'm the volunteer partner for national program People Matters,
and so three different hats in the Red Cross. But
to the issue of disaster mental health, a quick background.
(02:14):
Disaster mental health in the American Red Cross started nineteen
ninety two. That was following a rather catastrophic hurricane and
a recognition that our clients and our workforce.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
Two.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
It's a dual mandate clients and our workforce would benefit
from disaster mental health interventions. And that's really basically, generally speaking,
to provide for the emotional and psychological well being of
those two groups. I had my first experience with the
American Red Cross Disaster Mental Health in nineteen ninety six.
(02:50):
Twa Flight eight hundred had gone down off the coast
of Long Island, and I was at that time considered
what we called then a spontaneous volunteer. Today we refer
to that as event based volunteer, and both my wife
and I. My wife worked at Stonybrook. She's also a
disaster mental health volunteer, as is my daughter. My wife
(03:12):
was asked to go out she worked for Stonybrook at
that time if she would support the Red Cross. She
asked me if I would join. I did, and we
provided services. We actually worked the respite tent for the
divers and the Navy divers on that operation. So our
job was to meet with them and to just be
(03:33):
there and provide what we call a compassionate presence for
people that were doing a very difficult job. So that
was my first experience with the Red Cross, and I
was very taken by that. My wife was always involved
in volunteer work. She was involved with Make a Wish Foundation, etc.
And she would encourage me to get involved, and I
said when I'm ready, when I finish what I need
(03:56):
to do with my dissertation, my practice, and every think
I'm going to join the Red Cross. When the big
Hurricane Katrina hit, that's when I officially joined, took the classes,
and was my first deployment during Hurricane Katrina.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Oh, I didn't realize that Katrina was the part of
that process for you. That was when you officially became
part of the organization.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
That's when I said, I'm ready to serve. I have
the time, I can do this. And after two days training,
I was deployed down to actually Florida for Hurricane Wilmer
had come across at the same time, and I was
assigned to a shelter that housed five hundred people in
the Fort Lauderdale area of Florida. And it was a
(04:41):
two week experience and that was my first official national
deployment with the American Red Cross.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
In terms of disaster mental health in general, is there
a typical deployment for experts such as yourself or is
it sort of ad hoc tailored to the event itself.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
No disaster is the same, always some variation, but there
are common threads that one can expect, especially when there's
loss of life and destruction, which we often see. But
I want to be clear, there's two domains that we
operate in, and I'm speaking now generally not just Disaster
Mental Health but Red Cross. There's the domain of our chapter,
(05:19):
our region, and there's the domain of national deployment. So
I'm busy as the coordinator here on Long Island, busy
building the team, the disaster mental health team, in preparation
for something that might happen locally. So we have fires
that happen every three or four days. We're responding to
a home fire. Some of them are fatal fires or
(05:42):
various circumstances that we may deploy for here in our
region or in our chapter area Long Island. And then
there's national So then national something happens on a national level.
So when we had the Pulse shooting a number of
years ago, and I was asked to deploy for that,
so that's my putting on the national hat and going
(06:05):
out and supporting the response for that.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
Yeah, I suppose the Pulse nightclub, for example, is one
of those headline grabbing events where everyone sort of knows
what it is. I think a lot of people perhaps
don't realize the extent to which the Red Cross deals
with those smaller events. Though it's like you said, those
house fire events. Could you speak to some of the
differences involved in the scale of those events and speak
to your individual role in some of the smaller events
(06:31):
like a house fire. What does that look like from
the first time you arrive on the scene for that
kind of event.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
I can give you what I would call what I'm
going to frame as a Margaret moment. So Margaret is
a name I make up. It's totally confidential. If you
allow me, I'll speak to that. So Margaret moment was
a case that happened in February, and this is a
typical of what we do here on the chapter level,
but you can scale that up to some extent on
(06:58):
a national response. We'll talk now on the local level,
on the regional level. So this woman was in February,
there was a house fire and the house was destroyed,
so she had nothing. Not only that, she was injured
and she required going to the hospital to be put
on event because she had smoke inhalation. I want to
(07:18):
be very clear, disaster mental health is one part of
a collaborative response for a client or for our workforce.
They all work together. It's like a very good recipe.
They all have a piece in this and they have
a certain order. If you go out of order with
a good recipe, it doesn't work right. There's a cadence,
(07:41):
there's an order that we have. So our disaster action
team goes to the fire scene first here in Long Island,
and they will give out immediate assistance we call it. Well,
she was in the hospital, so she didn't get immediate assistance.
Two of our team members went up to the hospital,
visited with her and did an assessment and then sent
(08:02):
an email to me indicating that she requested and needed
disaster mental health. When I saw that case, I noticed
that she qualified for us to activate what we call
the Integrated Care Condolence Team, typically activated not by me,
but by person right above me. So I got the
green light for that. And what that does is provide
(08:24):
its fatality assistance typically, but it also supports people that
have been injured and Margaret was injured. So the team
gets activated and what I call a wrap around service
casework gets involved. So we have casework which goes through
all the possibilities that she was going to a shelter.
There was no way around it. But we were doing
(08:46):
everything we could to support her in that process, that transition,
and also to get her out of that shelter as
soon as possible. So casework worked with her. Disaster Health
service work with her around needs that she had, around
medication or walking support, and of course disaster mental health
was me. I worked with her just on what she
(09:09):
experienced and where she was going. Her big issue, quite frankly,
was that and understandably, in a hospital, she felt like
she was alone and she didn't matter, and no slight
of the staff, because you know, people are busy in
hospitals and if she wasn't the squeaky wheel, she wasn't
going to get the attention. But she noted that what
(09:31):
the Red Cross did for her, besides supporting her on
her way out of the hospital for discharge, was that
she didn't feel alone and she felt like she mattered.
So that was key and that's a great example. That
case got spotlighted by National a couple of weeks ago
because it really showed how we worked together in tandem,
all these different activities come together and support that client.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
I love that you just mentioned the isolation element of
that topic, how do you those emotions when people are
probably confused, they're angry, they're a lot of frustrated, they
don't have the resources that need in that moment. What
tools do you use when you get on the ground
during a disaster.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
It's a great question. And what I will say first
is it depends on the context. So when I deployed
to Vegas for the shooting at the casino, I had
to do some television, some work with the television crews.
I talked about moving from from fear to hope because
(10:30):
the community was struck, just like in Orlando, Florida, the
community was absolutely devastated. People were frightened. The Muslim population
needed the support of the American Red Cross. We went out.
I was considered an ambassador at that time because I
went to one of the mosques for breakfast. Four of
us went as ambassadors for the American Red Cross to
(10:54):
support the Muslim population that was frightened about any retaliation
post the shoes at the Pulse. So you think of
these various contexts that we work. So yes, sometimes in
my first deployment in that shelter, in that vital shelter
that for some people it was all they had. So
(11:14):
people would come up to me, and some had a
home that they were eventually going to return to. So
it was about the transition and being in a shelter
and some of the hectic, you know, the difficulties that
can happen inside a shelter, the stressors that are there.
For some, they knew they had no home to go to,
so that's a different conversation. For some they had left Katrina,
(11:39):
They were transported to Florida and got away from Katrina,
only to have Wilmer hit them first. For those, the
depression was just dripping from them, the sadness and almost
like is there something following me? Different conversation, different listening tools.
When I deployed for the call in airline crash in Buffalo,
(12:02):
the fatalities were high, they had lost people. They didn't
want to talk. They just knew I was there. They
knew it was all disaster mental health, and some did
but a lot of just knew that we were there,
and we call that compassionate presence, you know. So that
(12:23):
changed after a few days and we got more involved
with people. In fact, I was involved with supporting the
dog teams up in Buffalo, so when you bring the
dogs into an operation, people open their doors and all
of a sudden you're engaged in a different way. It's
amazing what these therapy dogs can do. I also worked
with the therapy dog team down in Orlando. Again, it's
(12:45):
amazing what can happen. You know, the context is so critical.
And when I visited with the nine to eleven callers
in Orlando, that group of people that took the those
calls on that frantic night of the shooting, when they
saw us come in, they saw the Red Cross come
(13:05):
in and the dogs come in, some of them just
started crying. They just needed to cry, right.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
That's sort of vulnerability, that acceptance of there is help available.
I am vulnerable, I need this help, and I guess
the sort of realization that that help exists and it's
a tangible help that is available right now. It must
be such a transformative impact for people that are going
through these horrible events.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
It is. And the important thing about that transformation is
that we come in, we're in, and we're out' That's
the way. That's part of the design. The importance of
our connection with the community and the community resources so
we can connect people. Going back to the Margaret moment.
The key aspect of our work with Margaret was connecting
(13:51):
her with all those community resources that can lift her up,
that I can bring her to the next step in
her life, in her journey. And that's what we do.
We don't take over. We try to work with and
side by side with community resources.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
You facilitate the next step in that recovery process.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
It's a terrific word. We do facilitate that. Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
You yourself must be going through a lot emotionally when
you're dealing with people that have had a tragic event
happen to them suddenly. Is there steps that you take
personally to help your own mental health going through these processes.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
Yes. Well, the one thing we do in the Red
Cross is we try to take care of each other.
We have a disaster mental Health call team. So what
that means is when I go out on a deployment,
I have available to me on that deployment, on that
dro a disaster relief operation, I can go to mental
health if I feel I need something, I need to
(14:52):
talk about something that was very difficult. Typically when I
get home, though, I'm going to get a call from
my team. We call everybody that goes out regardless of
what the operation was, they get a phone call from
Disaster Mental Health, a check in call. Keep in mind,
now it's probably about eighteen hundred volunteers across the nation
and Disaster Mental Health, and these are all volunteer. So
(15:16):
what I'm talking about here on Long Island is all volunteer.
We go out in that field, whether it's local or
whether it's national, we are in volunteer organization for the
most part. To get to be Disaster Mental Health, you
have to have professional training, you have to have degrees.
You know, in my other life, I've been a psychotherapist
since nineteen seventy five. What I see on deployments is
(15:39):
often very similar to what you have in your practice.
You know, people have disasters, there's loss, there's illness, there's
all kinds of things that happen. So you learn to
find ways yourself in addition to the support I get
from Red Cross. In addition, my wife and I are
both therapists, so we can support each other. A lot
(16:00):
of these apps that I recommend for my patients, the
breathing apps, the headspace for meditation. I love to cook
and I love to gard and I'm very fortunate. So
those are very calming for me, very relaxing. I love
to exercise, which is also a release. So if I
go out on an operation and I'm doing what we
(16:20):
call psych first aid or psycho educational stuff, I'll look
to see what their strains are. Do you like to cook?
Do you take cooking classes? Do you do this? Have
you thought about yoga? Have you thought about walking or running?
Have you thought about this or that or what kind
of hobby?
Speaker 1 (16:35):
Do you have?
Speaker 2 (16:36):
To help people connect as quickly as possible to their routine,
because that's a good predictor for a positive outcome post disaster,
looking back to your routine and getting connected to the
people that love you family, it's typically your family.
Speaker 3 (16:52):
I know it's easier said than done for people who
have lost loved ones. There's no consolation that can replace them.
So doctor Mike Qristen is how do we even start
helping them in the situation.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Yeah, that's a great question because you know, as you
both know, anybody that's alive knows that we've all had
experience with losses personal or with friends. And you know,
in those first those first week, the first week and
a half two weeks, people are basically very numb, and
they're they're just in a cloud, and so people have
(17:26):
very little memory of conversations they've had with you in
those first couple of days. That said, in the most
terrific of times, it's important. It's important to listen. It's
also very important. What not to say is probably more
important than anything else, because when you're around somebody that's
(17:46):
been devastated by loss, the impulse to want to do
something or say something give themselves is very powerful. But
a lot of times people will say things and it
just just because they feel they have to. So the
importance of listening carefully and making that eye to eye
contact and that presence and is critical in those early stages,
(18:13):
very critical. Let me let me give a great example.
It was a very powerful moment. I want to share
this in terms of what people needed in the most
difficult time in Buffalo. Four or five days after the crash,
maybe it was a few days longer, we had a
site visit. I had been to the site earlier where
the crash was, so there was still part of the
(18:34):
plane that was in the ground. The site had been cleared,
but we could have a site visit and the bus
ride to the site visit. There were maybe about eight
or ten buses. I was on one of the buses,
and you could hear a pin drop. You could hear
a pin drop on that bus, even with the motor
running of the that's the only thing you heard. And
(18:55):
as we got closer and closer to the crash site,
the intensity that I was beginning to feel, you know,
I was beginning to practice breathing because I felt the intensity.
When those buses parked and people started to get off,
I was in the front of the bus. I got off.
There was a number of It was mostly DMH, but
(19:18):
there were a number of other activities from the Red
Cross involved. People got off the bus. Some people were
vomiting immediately from the tension, from the anticipation. This was
the most powerful. They were going to see the site
where their loved ones parrot when they got to the site.
When I walked to the site, when all the people
(19:38):
were down there, what I saw was groups of people
centered around spiritual care, around priests, rabbis, you name what
the groups were. They were centered around those groups praying together.
They didn't need mental health per se. They need we
got We were there for them. They knew it, but
(19:58):
they needed that that faith based support at that moment
of the most critical crisis, very powerful experience. Never forgot it.
It was something to see.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
The spiritual thing is more people trying to find meaning
of what happened? Is the correct doctor in terms of
finding closure? Is that the reason you think people congregate
around spiritual leader spirituality?
Speaker 2 (20:22):
I think that's absolutely correct. I think it's also when
all else has failed, it's the hope that some higher
power that there'll be some meaning, some understanding, something, some comfort,
some connection. Yes, yeah, it's it's it's very powerful, very powerful.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
And for situations where somebody has lost a loved one,
is there a checklist? Do you follow or the organization
follows the right approach? Is that a right approach?
Speaker 2 (20:50):
Well, the right approach is to be careful about what
not to say, and that takes some you know, learning,
some practice. If I spoke to the two of you
in that shelter, if you were in that shelter in
Florida when I first deployed, I would be listening for
your strengths. I would be listening to see if what
(21:11):
we call the pre morbid personality, if prior to the
disaster you were compromised. If prior to the disaster you
were compromised, then I have to listen even more carefully
to see if you might require more observation or an evaluation,
possibly at the hospital. So in my role during Sandy,
(21:34):
at times I'd had to go to a shelter because
there was a shelter resident that was erratic. And so
you have to make an assessment and based on what's
happening in that moment and what you know the history
to be as best as you can, and then make
a recommendation is like they're okay, they're fine to stay,
(21:54):
or that they may need to go to the hospital
for evaluation. So again, it depends. It was a title
of a book written by a psychiatrist, Listening with the
third Year, And I like that title because there's a
certain level of listening that occurs. Actually, when I was
in Florida, there was a man who was moved from
(22:15):
Texas and brought over to Florida, and Wilma followed him.
I just remember after I spoke with him, something flashed
inside me that said, I need to go back to
him because I suspect his depression is deeper than I
originally thought, there's something just triggered that I had to
reconnect with him and make sure that he wasn't at risk.
(22:39):
So there is that level of listening that has to
occur when we're on an operation.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
And do you have any sense of what that thing
that triggered that emotion or that feeling was or is
it just an innate understanding after years of practice.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
Yeah, we call that practice wisdom, you know. So yes, yeah,
it was something intuitive that you say, wait minute, wait
a minute, you know, things just collided and you just
you just go with it. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
You mentioned that there are communication mistakes that people make
in those kind of events. Could you speak to the
tangible words the mistakes people make when they're trying to
comfort people, they're trying to give advice, for example, after
a tragic event. Is there a sort of a number
of catch all phrases people used that are not helpful
that you know, you know, might actually benefit people listening
(23:26):
right now?
Speaker 2 (23:27):
There are So again, that's a great question. There's probably
a long list of them. But when I think about
some of the you know, things happen for reasons, he
or she's in a better place, they're they're at peace now,
Things like that the person still processing the laws, They
still haven't really accepted it. The denial is still at play.
(23:49):
I think the intent is clearly to help somebody, the
idea to make them feel a little better in a
horrible moment. But it's best to listen and to be
very very careful and deliberate about what to say. You know,
sometimes the best thing to say is I don't know
what to say.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
That's a great point. I love that point.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
Do you watch for those stages, doctor, the different stages
like denial, anger, acceptance, somebody going to a traumatic pace.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
There have been a lot of things positive about the
stages of grief and bereavement, and there's some challenges to that.
I will say that what I have found over the
years is that everybody grieves differently. Everybody grieves differently, but
you can see certain things. You can see that you know,
(24:38):
initially the person's like, wait a minute, I'm not there yet,
I'm not ready to hear this, And then it moved
to another stage, and eventually, more often than not, people
get to the acceptance level. And many people I talked to,
you know, who have gone to groups and stuff, feel like,
oh my god, I wasn't ready to hear what they
were telling me in that group. I just I was
(25:00):
there yet, which you know, sometimes they're not, and sometimes
those groups are phenomenal for people, So the bereavement groups
I'm talking about, So it is complicated work. And one
of the reasons I was so happy to be at
this podcast was that anything that I can do to
push out the message of the American Red Cross and
(25:22):
also the American Red Cross Disaster Mental Health because when
we respond, typically even here on Long Island, a lot
of people when we support schools that may have had
a loss or a bus crash or whatever it is,
they'll say, I didn't know that the American Red Cross
did that, you know, I didn't know that they would
support you know, this bus crash that happened and there
(25:45):
were fatalities that we were there with sixteen Disaster Mental
Health workers in person to support that school over a
three week period. They said, I didn't know you had
that capability. Yes we do, Yes we do here on
Long Island. We have that capability around the nation.
Speaker 3 (26:04):
Had there been situations where your help has not been welcome.
They might be going through something very traumatic that they
don't realize the help is of value.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Yes, oh yes, yes, well what will happen? We do
is best we can. So we'll go back to Margaret, right,
Margaret is asked one, if not two, if not three times,
do you want to speak with a disaster mental health worker,
so that when she gets the call from me or
whomever it is on my team, she's not like, why
(26:34):
is mental health calling me? Who told you that? Because
that does happen sometimes. I remember when I was in Florida,
there was a line of people out the door that
wanted to talk to about Some of them thought that
I had financial resources for them. Somebody told them that's
the line for the financial resources, and when they got
(26:55):
to the front of the line and they spoke to me,
they were not happy about what I was paddling, which
was awareness, psychological, first date and support. Yes, it does happen,
which we were very careful to not impose ourselves on people.
By the way, what we don't do in the American
Red Cross is ask mental health. We don't do psychotherapy.
(27:17):
We don't grab a person and start doing psychotherapy. So
when a new volunteer joins the Red Cross and wants
to be a disaster mental health worker. They are required
to take seventeen hours of training. But more importantly, they
got to work in the field with me. They got
to have a mentor, they got to have somebody that says, look,
this is what we do, and this is what we
don't do, and this is you know, this is how
(27:39):
it works. So it's very important the training, the mentoring
that happens within that's going on twenty four to seven,
seven days a week behind the scenes.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
In terms of responding to tragedies, you said you've been
doing this with the Red Cross in Skatrina bents of
years ago. Now, how is your understanding of the human
nature resilience changed over that time in those twenty years.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
That's another great question. When I first came out of school,
I went right to the Veterans Hospital here on Long Island.
That was my first job, and I worked what we
call a therapeutic community for returning Vietnam vets. So I'm
prefacing that because what I saw was I saw combat veterans.
(28:25):
I saw veterans that were not necessary combat, but were
in Vietnam and experienced a lot of different things. And
what I saw was certainly a challenge to the human condition.
The taboo of war and what happens to people. And
I saw how resilient some people were, and I also
saw a subset of the population that was not resilient
(28:49):
and succumbed to that kind of pressure and required a
lot more inputs and maybe for a very long time.
So I learned that early working with a very challenged population.
And it's similar to what you see in disaster response.
There's most people have the resources, they have the resources
(29:11):
and the connections of family or church or friends that
they can move forward. That they're resilient. Most people are
resilient even in the worst of times, even with the losses.
Most people are resilient. And then there's a subset of
that population that pre existing were compromised, where we might
(29:32):
call an at risk population, and that population, that subset
will obviously have had difficulty prior and will have more
difficulty certainly after a disaster, certainly, you know, whatever it
may be. And there's so many different disasters that could
happen out there they can't even name all.
Speaker 1 (29:52):
I'm assuming now that the Red Cross is looking for
jest mental health volunteers on a constant basis. They're always
looking for addition specialized help in the dissest mental health units.
Speaker 2 (30:03):
Correct, because we age out, there's turnover, and quite frankly,
disaster work is very stressful and sometimes people go out
and they realize it's just it's too much for them.
And look, I can tell you personally, as much as
it has been one of the most rewarding experiences to
go out and deploy, whether it be locally or nationally.
(30:23):
And some of my best friends that I have today
are people that I've met through the Red Cross. It's
just it's that kind of that kind of culture that
comes together. But there's no question that people go out
and they realize this is just not for me. I
can't it's too much. When I get the call to
go out, say to my wife, I'm ready, Are we good?
(30:46):
I'm okay, I'm going, or she's going to go. It depends.
She went to Parkland and she went to Connecticut for
Sandy hook So these are two very powerful deployments for her.
But when we go out, we'll talk to each other.
But I can feel in my stomach all of a sudden,
I've got to cancel all my patients in my private practice.
I realize, wait a minute, I'm not doing this. I'm
(31:07):
not going to do that. And then you know that
your days are going to be very long days. So
all of a sudden it hits you and then you
go and then you get into it and then you return.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Is the website a phone other people could use or
email address people use it to contact if they're interested
in applying for a role in disaster mental health.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
Yes, if they go to the Americanredcross dot org and
they can follow that, there'll be links for joining the
American Red Cross and when they hit that, it'll begin
to sort out what activity, so mental health will be
right there, or disaster health, nursing or spiritual care for
that matter. But yes, and we do always we always,
(31:52):
I am always looking for new recruits. You just don't
know when the next lead for for the region is
coming and working their way up. And absolutely again I
don't think people know what we do. Even the mental
health workers in the community don't know what the American
Red Cross is doing. So getting the word out, getting
(32:12):
the message out, hopefully this podcast out. With that, go
back to that American Red Cross dot org. You'll see
that they have disaster preparedness that they speak to flood
safety tips, house home fire safety tips. The American Red
Cross is very, very big. They have been for years
on installation of smoke detectors. In terms of prevention, that's
(32:36):
a very big piece of the American Red Cross that
is constantly going on and in play. It's an important
part of what we do. If you look at the
American Red Cross dot org, if you look at just
the CPR training, or you know, in terms of what
we do for blood, because blood collection is huge in
the American Red Cross. We're one of the biggest providers
of blood in the country. But the CPR for adult
(32:59):
and for pediatric, when I saw that the other day,
I said, I've got to sign up for that. It's
been a while since I've taken it, but I never
took for the infant CYPR. So again, to have those
tools ready to go, the prevention for the planning and
building in advance will mitigate a lot of the possibilities
of things that could happen. But I also would ask
(33:19):
people to call your local chapter of the American Red Cross.
So if they were to call the chapter here, they
might connect with me or one of the people on
the Disaster Mental Health team. But they also can call
their community mental health representatives. SAMSA is another one that
is disaster response. If you go on their website, you'll
(33:39):
see community resources. You click in your area code and
they will pop up resources in your community. I think
you know it's safe to say that we're all compromised
on some level. We're all under stress of some kind
all the time, and sometimes it's more elevated based on
what's going on external or within our family system. So
(34:00):
it's always important to prepare. Like they talk about well,
to have a will in place, right, some people don't
do that, but to prepare for the possibility of a
home fire, or for a flood, or for a tornado,
or for the unforeseen a tree, a lot of the
trees falling, and the destruction that could happen during that.
(34:21):
The importance of preparing, being prepared, I can't talk about
that enough. It makes a world of difference when something
happens and you don't have your medication. There's a world
of difference if you do have your medication for a
few days, a world of difference.
Speaker 1 (34:37):
We will also add those resources to the podcast release
as well. Doctor Lensky, I wish I could put words
to how much We appreciate your time today. We are
so happy that you could join us today. When I
heard what this aster mental health was all about, I thought,
we have to make sure that we learn more about
this and speaking to an expert such as yourself, it
means so much to myself and Makanda and to the
(34:59):
entire team here. We really appreciate first of all, what
the Red Cross and yourself are doing, and secondly you
for your time this week. It has been a real
pleasure speaking with you about the Red Cross's work. We
just wanted to again thank you again for your time.
Speaker 3 (35:13):
Yeah, thank you so much. Asking
Popular Podcasts
NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal
Gregg Rosenthal and a rotating crew of elite NFL Media co-hosts, including Patrick Claybon, Colleen Wolfe, Steve Wyche, Nick Shook and Jourdan Rodrigue of The Athletic get you caught up daily on all the NFL news and analysis you need to be smarter and funnier than your friends.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com