October 14, 2025 • 47 mins
Episode Focus: "The Nervous System & New Beginnings"
What does it really take to start over—not just survive a life change, but truly begin again with clarity, confidence, and a calm, grounded body? Today, I’m joined (for the second time!) by Patrick Murphy— a nervous system expert, trauma-trained somatic practitioner, and host of the Successful and Stuck podcast. Patrick knows the messy, nerve-wracking reality of reinvention firsthand. After two major career pivots, he now helps others move from stuck and spiraling to steady and self-trusting.In this conversation, we get real about:
-Practical tools for navigating big transitions
-What safety really means when you’re starting over
-The difference between fixing and healing
-How to reconnect with your body, your voice, and your next chapter
Whether you're moving through heartbreak, divorce, or just feeling lost in a life shift—this episode is your roadmap for calming your body, healing your heart, and rewriting your story.
Follow Patrick-@murph.live
What does it really take to start over—not just survive a life change, but truly begin again with clarity, confidence, and a calm, grounded body? Today, I’m joined (for the second time!) by Patrick Murphy— a nervous system expert, trauma-trained somatic practitioner, and host of the Successful and Stuck podcast. Patrick knows the messy, nerve-wracking reality of reinvention firsthand. After two major career pivots, he now helps others move from stuck and spiraling to steady and self-trusting.In this conversation, we get real about:
-Practical tools for navigating big transitions
-What safety really means when you’re starting over
-The difference between fixing and healing
-How to reconnect with your body, your voice, and your next chapter
Whether you're moving through heartbreak, divorce, or just feeling lost in a life shift—this episode is your roadmap for calming your body, healing your heart, and rewriting your story.
Follow Patrick-@murph.live
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to The Rewrite, a podcast about divorce, choice and
new beginnings. I'm your host Wendy Sloan, former TV producer,
mom of two and one sweet golden retriever. This is
a space for real talk about the moments that break us,
the choices that define us, and the power we have
to begin again. You'll hear personal stories, heartfelt insights, and
(00:22):
honest conversations about healing relationships and reclaiming your life one
choice at a time. I'll be joined by experts in divorce, finance,
mental health, wellness and more and everything you need to
support your next chapter. The most powerful chapters might be
the ones you write next. Let's begin your rewrite together.
This episode is brought to in part by the Needle
(00:44):
Kuda Law Firm guidance that moves lives forward. Welcome back
to the Rewrite. I'm your host Wendy Sloan, and because
one conversation with him was just not enough for me
and for my listeners. Patrick Murphy is back nervous system expert,
trauma trained practitioner and hosts of the Successful and Stuck podcast.
Patrick knows firsthand the messy, uncertain, and nerve racking reality
(01:07):
of starting over. Having experienced two major career privots of
his own, he now helps people go from stuck and
uncertain to grounded and confident so they can face life's
challenges without being overcome by self doubt and overwhelmed. His
work is all about creating clarity and confidence. People need
to rewrite their own story and this is so much
(01:28):
of what we need in our everyday lives to just
live a better, healthier life. Welcome back, Patrick.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Murphy, Thanks, happy to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
We're going to dive deeper into this nervous system and
how it affects us. And I'm beginning to understand this
even more so with the Rewrite podcast because so much
of mindfulness and the nervous system and somatic healing has
found their way to the Rewrite And it's just amazing
what our bodies are, what we hold in our bodies.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Yeah, I mean, our nervous systems are responsible for every thought,
every sensation, every feeling, every action that we take. I mean,
it is it is the central you know, effectively the
central operating system. And you know, I like to kind
of start out like, let's you know, I know we
did it last time, but let's define what somatic means right,
(02:20):
and you know, I like to define it as it's
the language of your nervous system. Our nervous systems don't
speak in rational thought or you know, timelines, or you know,
even just like English or whatever language you know.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
You you speak.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
It speaks in the language of sensation and behavior and
feeling and image, all of these things. And when we
learn to work with our nervous systems rather than against
our nervous systems, that's when everything really changes. And what
I mean by that is, you know, it's so easy.
(02:58):
You know, let's say, let's well obviously use transitions as
examples here, but anytime we're going through a transition like
change creates stress.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Period.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
It doesn't matter if it's like a major transition like
a divorce or a job change or something, or just
you're taking a new way to work or work.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Right that I was going to say.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
The same thing, right, yeah, love it great, same page. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
You know, it's like, oh, you're you're buying a new
product that you know, the grocery store for a first time,
Like there might be a little bit you might even
even notice it, a little bit more activation, you know,
in your system, because that thing is unknown, That new
route to work is unknown. Certainly, you know, the bigger transitions,
there's massive unknown there. And so you know, our nervous systems,
(03:44):
because they're wired for safety, are going to send us
these signals in the form of things that we call
just anxiety, overthinking, procrastination, perfectionism, all of these things that
kind of get like villified in our society and even
by let's kind of like the mainstream you know, mental health,
(04:08):
you know construct it's you know, these things aren't necessarily
signals that something is wrong with you. These might be
very natural reactions to something that happened to you in
the present or in the past. And so what somatic is,
(04:28):
especially smatic experiencing. That's the modality that I'm trained in
that I practice, is it's like taking those signs and
signals and following them like little breadcrumbs and and seeing
what they're actually trying to tell you from a nervous
system perspective. And so instead of let's say vilifying them
(04:52):
and saying like, oh, we've you know, we have to
get rid of your anxiety, it's because obviously that's the goal, right,
Like none of us wants to be anxious you know.
But but we just follow those signs and signals like
little bread crumbs to see, oh, where is this anxiety
leading us? Where is this anger leading us? Where is
(05:14):
this h the grief or the sadness or you know,
all of these different things.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Where is that leading us?
Speaker 2 (05:20):
And what is it trying to tell you? And so
when we learn the language of our nervous systems, we
learn to be able to follow those bread crumbs and
understand what's happening underneath the surface, so that then we
can get to where we really need to go and
we can resolve you know, the the stress cycles and
certainly the trauma, you know, trauma cycles that that get
(05:41):
stuck in our bodies, so that we can you know,
free ourselves from these protective patterns and and live the
the bigger, bolder, more fulfilling lives that we really want.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Okay, So before we get into like tools and stuff
like that can help us, let's take us through Like
let's say, Okay, we're changing jobs. M hm, so we're
starting that process of you know, we're getting a new job,
we're starting over, like and we're take us take walk
us through somebody that you're dealing with that's changing jobs.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Yeah, So first I just want to say it's always
a highly individualized process. Everybody has, you know, different responses.
But so I'm going to give a more generalized answer, Right.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
Changing jobs, getting a divorce, you know, new relationship, even
can bring up anxiety and stress, right.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
Yeah, some of the core principles, I mean, they're going
to a lot of what I explain is really going
to apply to every situation. You know, there's me nuance
to everything, right, but just in general, it kind of
goes back to that statement that I that I said
change creates stress, right, Right, And so our bodies are
nervous systems. They are wired for certainty. And so it
(06:50):
doesn't matter if you know, this new job, if it's
like the thing you really really want, right, if it's
like perfectly aligned and you you know, really went through
the interview process and you really like the people you're
going to be working with or for, you know, there's
still this element of change creates stress. And because our
nervous systems and our brains are wired for certainty, they're
(07:11):
going to look for certainty at any place they can.
And that certainty might be in the past, right, you know,
that's why so many people come to new jobs and
like okay, like, well this worked at my last company,
I'm going to implement this system at the new company.
You know, even if that system clashes with like the
new company's culture, you know, corporate culture. I mean, we've
(07:32):
seen so many corporate disasters right where where that happens.
Sometimes that might be a good thing, but just understanding
that change creates stress and that you know a lot
of the anxiety, you know, a lot of that activation
that you're you know that somebody might be feeling in
their system, is just their system actually looking for some
(07:54):
solid ground, you know, some some sort of certainty, and
you know, the biggest you know, I would say in
times of transition, any type of transition, the biggest tool
that you can use is connecting with others. Right, Because
what's the first thing we do when we change jobs.
We find our people, right, We find like the like
(08:18):
minded people, you know, the people that we can really
trust in that new and we're also looking out for
those we can't.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
Right.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
But whether we're consciously doing this or not, because as
soon as we find you know, that person, it's like, oh,
we're in the lunch room, we're on a zoom or
whatever that we're like, oh my gosh, like this person
just said this thing really aligns with like my ethos
and my values and my belief like, oh this is
this is one of my people. And we immediately feel
this settling in our system because we found some safety,
(08:50):
We found a little bit more at least in the moment,
we found a little bit more certainty.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Right.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
So the biggest tool that I could offer for people
in any type of transition is connect with others, you know,
find some support. And I know that sounds maybe a
little overly simplified, but that's that's always step one. That's
always step one. And then the second is see if
you can slow things down, you know, because there's there's,
(09:18):
like I said, there's always kind of that scramble you know,
to to you know, go into a new job and
you know, prove yourself and you know, because if I
don't prove myself, well, then I'm not safe. My job
isn't safe, right, And these days are our jobs and
our livelihood and our well being and you know, our
mortgage and you know, sending the kids to school and whatever,
it's all tied to our paychecks. So paycheck equals safety,
(09:42):
and so again, our nervous systems are wired to find safety,
and so just understanding, you know, and asking yourself in
any given moment, like, oh, where might my system be
looking for safety right now? And you know that that
sense of anxiety really might be you know, your system
saying well, hold on, we're not sure if this is
safe yet. It doesn't necessarily mean that it's like a hard.
Speaker 3 (10:05):
Stop, right, It just it's just.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Asking you to slow down and go at a pace
that your nervous system can digest. Because you know, like
I said, it's so easy to want to like, Okay,
I'm gonna switch examples real quick, but this is so
relevant because I know you and I both know like
dozens of people who do this, right, the person that
(10:28):
gets out of you know, one relationship or one marriage
and then immediately jumps into another one, right right?
Speaker 3 (10:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (10:36):
More I think more men than women, right. I mean,
I'm just saying from.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
I have no idea, I honestly, I I yeah, I
can't tell you experience.
Speaker 1 (10:44):
Talking to not that I'm so experienced, but from talking
to so many people, I feel like it's more men
than when. But it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
Yeah, I can't speak to that statistically, So you know,
it's like I don't I don't want to make a
claim one way or another because I genuinely don't know.
Speaker 3 (11:01):
But here's the thing, everybody listening.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
Knows at least one person, if not multiple people who
have done that, right. And that's the thing is that
you know that nervous system, you know, is looking for
safety because they feel safer with you know, in relation
to somebody, even if the relationship is a disaster, right right, Yeah,
(11:26):
And this is why people stay.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
This is what I'm gonna do that How do we
know does it come out in certain ways? Like? How
do we know that our nervous system is not like
this just happens. How do we know does it come
out in certain ways or it just happens and sometimes
we don't know about it?
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Uh, say more can you ask? Yeah, give me a
little more context of that question.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
Yeah, okay, So I'm changing jobs. Yeah, so you like
obviously change comes with stress, right, So our nervous system
knows that. But how but what if I'm not feeling
stressed at all?
Speaker 3 (11:58):
Oh, here's the thing.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
If you're not feeling stressed, this is not necessarily going
to apply to everybody, you know. It's like there's different levels, right,
you know, So for somebody, let's say, for somebody who
has like past trauma that they haven't fully worked through
and it's unresolved, any type of change might get amplified,
(12:21):
you know. So that job change. That's actually my personal story.
So I used to work for the Wall Street Journal.
I worked for the Journal for six years, and I
was so unbelievably loyal to my team there. Like, I
absolutely loved my team because they had become like family
(12:42):
to me. They were really really safe people, and they're
still some of my best friends to this day, including
my boss there. But you know, the culture had started
to change, you know, things had started to change, and
I was like, and I'm getting emails from recruiters offering me,
you know, twenty thirty forty thousand dollars more, you know,
but I had always just said no because the Journal
(13:07):
felt so safe for me and and I just felt
this real deep sense of loyalty, you know.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
And there's a lot of people too, I think Patrick, right,
they feel safe, so they stay maybe stuck, maybe not stuck,
but they just stay there because it's a safety.
Speaker 3 (13:23):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
Yeah, and so, you know, going back to it's like,
our nervous systems are wired for safety. They're wired for
the thing that we know versus the thing that we
don't know. Even if the thing that we know is
unhealthy or harmful, it's still like our nervous system shape
in a certain way, and they're like, oh, we know
how to navigate this pain, we know how to you know,
versus like, you know, logically, we might know that we
(13:47):
need to leave the job or leave the relationship, but
it still feels it literally feels like a life threat
sometimes to our nervous systems. And so kind of going
back to your original question, you know, there's there's varying degrees, right.
You know, there's certain people that might just you know,
like navigate a job change or a relationship shift very well.
(14:10):
And you know, bravo to them. You know, at some
point along the way they learned the skills and the
safety and the communication methods and all the things that
they needed in order to make that transition as smooth
as possible. Now, I mean, there's always going to be
you know, at least a little bit of stress.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
Right.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
It might not feel like anxiety, might feel like excitement,
because anxiety and excitement are actually two sides of the
same coin. It's it's quite literally the same energy. So
you know, when you're walking into the new job and
you feel really excited, that's a little bit of the
same thing.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
You know.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
It's not bad to feel excited, obviously, it's also not
bad to feel anxious, you know, but like there's just unknowns, right,
It's like, well, you know, why am I going to
sign in? Like how do I get into my email?
Just all the things right, you know. So it's just
that even just onboarding process.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
Yeah that I was going to say that onboarding it
could be a lot too, that could be the most stressful.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
But the really simple tool that I would offer for
people really in any given moment, and this is overly
simplified again, but it's a really easy one is tune
into your body. Do I feel a sense of expansiveness
or do I feel a sense of contraction right now?
(15:27):
And generally, for the most part, expansiveness is going to
lead or just relaxation. That's going to be indicative of
like oh there's safety here, like we're feeling okay, We're
feeling good about this contraction is potentially more of a
signal of you know, your system signaling like, oh, we're
not sure about this, you know, we don't we don't
(15:48):
quite know, right, And so maybe tightness in your chest,
maybe you know, your shoulders kind of bunch up a
little bit. But that is, you know, that's in general,
just the broadest tool that I can really offer for
just that one little check in of you know, how
am I feeling about this in this moment?
Speaker 1 (16:06):
Yeah, okay, so it makes sense, makes a lot more
sense now. I mean, you could tune into Patrick's part
one learn more about Patrick and his whole journey how
he got here. But we're getting a little bit deeper
into the nervous system with this one and more precise
with this interview. So it passed trauma. What if you
don't know if we have past trauma, Like what if
(16:29):
there was trauma that didn't hit us? And I'm going
to ask you those you're going to answer that, and
we come back around doing a quick break for one
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that a good question or what? Patrick?
Speaker 3 (18:05):
I love?
Speaker 2 (18:05):
That's honestly one of my favorite questions.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
Sorry, what were you gonna say?
Speaker 1 (18:09):
I'm so happy? Okay, no, because I was wondering, like,
what if someone doesn't know they have past trauma, but
it's coming out in different ways.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
That's the thing I always say, like it will come
out sideways in some way, shape or form. So here's
the thing. And it doesn't matter whether it's actual like
past trauma or just unresolved past stress. Right, I mean,
there's just like life happens.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
Right.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
It's so easy to get caught up in job kids,
you know, taking them to sports, like all these different
things and not be able to complete those stress cycles.
And then that leads to things like burnout and depression
you know, and whatnot, which you know, just because you're
burnt out or depressed doesn't necessarily mean that you have
(18:56):
past trauma, but that could also be a sign or
say know that you know one might The beauty of
somatic work is because we don't It certainly helps to
know what happened to somebody in the past, but we
don't necessarily have to know because your nervous system is
going to send us those signs and signals. So those
(19:19):
signs and signals might be you know, the person that
they you know, they go go go all day and
you know, then they feel like exhausted, but as soon
as they lay down lay down to go to sleep,
their mind starts racing with all the things that they
didn't get done that day and all the things they
still have to get done tomorrow, and they just you know,
they have trouble falling asleep or they're waking up in
(19:41):
the middle of the night. You know, these are very
clear signs and signals of a nervous system that is
disregulated and you know can't necessarily come back down to
that state of calm, that state of relaxation and rest
and digest So one sleep is generally always want to
(20:01):
be first indicators that someone either has unresolved past trauma
or unresolved stress. Right, So that's that's always a clear
sign or signal. Other things could be some of the
stuff we've already mentioned, just this chronic overthinking, feeling chronically overwhelmed, perfectionism, anxiety,
(20:23):
you know, constant procrastination.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
These they don't.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Always point to past trauma, but sometimes you know they could.
But whether they point to past trauma or not, perfectionism
is getting in your way, like it is taking you know.
One of my favorite examples, like, anytime I put this
up on Instagram or you know, talk about this, you
know the client, you know, like taking forty five minutes
(20:47):
to write a five sentence email, so so many people, Yeah,
you just gave me a knowing look there, right, so
many people identify with that. And any time I put
up any sort of content around it or say something
about it, you know, so many people I'll get DMS
or whatever and they're like, oh my gosh, like this
is me, Like I didn't know this happened to other people, right,
(21:09):
Like logically, we know it's a five sentence email, right,
Like this shouldn't be that hard, right, But we're sitting
there and like, wait, hold on, should I use an
exclamation point? Or should I use a period, you know,
should I adjust this word like wait, hold on, does
this sound a little too.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
Over the top?
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Or should I pull it back a little bit? And
we'll sit there and get in these you know, perfectionist loops.
But that's actually a nervous system pattern, right, perfectionism from
a nervous system perspective. And I'm getting a little bit
deeper than the question here. Yeah, but I could I could.
Speaker 1 (21:44):
Take the deepest good Patrick, that's.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
You okay, cool, yeah, passionate.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
About this, and you know you're trying to really explain
it's good, it's all good.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Right, cool, Yeah, I just want to make sure. But
here's the thing I could. I could go down the
similar rabbit hole and explain like the nervous system, constructive,
any one of these things, anxiety, overthinking, et cetera.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Let's just use.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Perfectionism because so many people identify as you know, a perfectionist.
Perfectionism is a form of a free state. It's like
having one foot on the gas and one foot on
the break at the same time, Like, you know, you
need to do the thing you know you need to
you know, rework or you know, kind of look over
the presentation, you know again, but you know, perfectionism is like, no,
(22:24):
let's do this ten more times because you know, we
really have to make sure it's dialed in. It's like, oh,
let's anticipate every single question that I might get asked
in the meeting or the presentation or on the new date.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
Right.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
You know, it's like this advice to relationships too, perfectionism
shows up there as well. And so so that's like
the one foot on the gas, but then the one
foot on the break is like weight, hold on, are
we sure?
Speaker 3 (22:47):
Should I use a period?
Speaker 2 (22:48):
Should I use an exclamation point? You know? It's these
types of things. These are all nervous system patterns. And
so bringing this back around to you know, your question
of how do we know if we have unresolved past trauma?
You know, like I said, this answer comes with like
a big asterisk, right because just because you have anxiety,
just because you know perfection perfectionism is there, doesn't necessarily
(23:12):
mean that you have past trauma. But there's something there
to be investigated. But the good news is that actually
the path out is the same, you know, and I
know no better modality I do, no better path than
using somatic work specifically somatic experiencing because even if we
(23:32):
can't remember it, because it's very common and including in
my own story, for people to not remember past trauma
and then all of a sudden, you know, that person
like they get in like like a minor fender bender
or you know, just like some accident and then all
of a sudden it wakes up. Because you know that
stuff can stay buried, you know, for so long until
(23:55):
some events or you know a certain amount of safety
potentially doesn't have to necess really be a car wreck
or something you know harmful, allows it to wake back up,
and you know, it can be really sudden, it can
be really jarring for people. And what this looks like
in people's day to day lives very often is you know,
kind of one the example I already gave, like they
(24:17):
can't calm down, like they can't just turn off, right,
and you know it's like Okay, I'm trying to sit
down and watch Netflix, but like, oh, I'm gonna grab
my phone and check email or I'm still checking email,
you know, before I go to sleep. Now, some of
that is our phones, right, you know they're designed to
be addictive, but yeah, it's it is, Yeah, that's a
(24:38):
whole nother thing.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
We could talk about what we want.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Just like I'm leaving my phone because I don't want to.
I don't want to.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
I don't want it, Yeah, which is good.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
Yeah, Like sometimes I just try to leave my phone.
Isn't that healthy for all of us? Oh?
Speaker 3 (24:53):
Yeah, for sure? For sure.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
I know my kids are safe and I'm good, and
I'm leaving my phone case that's all I you know, work,
that's my you know what I mean, that's all. If
they need me, then I'm here. But otherwise I don't
need it.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Yeah, exactly, exactly. So yeah, so like not you know,
not being able to shut off that that could be
one sign or signal because that's an indication that there
is any of us.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
So it's amazing though, because I think that's so many
of us.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
Yeah, it's so many of us. And like I said,
I can emphasize enough if it doesn't necessarily mean that
it's you know, indicative of past trauma, but it's also
indicative of a culture that keeps us on all the time, right,
you know. So so I just want to be really
clear about that. But either way, if we can't calm down,
if we can't you know, complete those stress cycles and
(25:39):
come down not just at the end of the day,
but also like at lunchtime or at three pm and
just realizing like okay, like the morning's over, I can
let all of that go and then I can you know,
from a grounded place. You know, it's like having multiple
different browser tabs open.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
Right.
Speaker 1 (25:56):
I'm wondering because of society, if this is more prevalent
now than in the past. Like when I was young,
I was outside on my bike. I was never inside.
Never when the TV wasn't on, the games weren't that
wasn't my life growing up. Yeah, the generations now, it's
it's so different.
Speaker 3 (26:15):
Yeah, it's it's really hard.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
I mean we are are like I said, like we said,
these these systems, these devices, they are designed to hijack
our attention. You know, I could go down a hole
like dopamine rabbit hole right now. I mean it's literally
they're using brain science. You hijack our attention and like,
(26:37):
you know to what you just debscribed. You didn't use
the word, but like boredom, Like think about you know,
when you and I were kids, like when we were bored, right,
and it's like Mom, Dad, I'm bored. Nowadays, it's like, oh,
they've got ten different options of like video games or
some sort of screen or here's an iPad or something
like that, which you know, those.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
Moms nowadays just plopping our phone right in front of
their kids, and that's what they're doing.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
And yeah, and it's it's not inherently bad in small doses,
but if that's like the only solution, if that's you know,
if we're always on, that's the thing we don't learn
to to come back down. And so what happens though,
because the next sign of dysregulation we're potentially past trauma
(27:24):
is when we shut down.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
You know.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
It's it's like, because what happens is when our nervous
systems stay in that heightened state of dysregulation, we call
it sympathetic activation, that fight or flight, that like constantly doing,
constantly on, constantly going. Eventually our systems will say, because
if we don't learn to follow those signs and signals, right,
you know, the signs and signals being like well I
(27:48):
can't quite calm down, or like I just feel on
all the time. That's a sign or a signal. Right,
if we're not following that we're not listening to our
systems or we don't know how actually to calm, you know,
to come back down. Our our nervous system will step
in and do it for us, and it will say no,
like shut it all down. And that's where so it's
(28:09):
our we call it our Dorsal Vagel complex from a
you know, a nerdy brain science standpoints there, right, that
is our system of shutdown. That's and when that comes in,
it can feel really jarring. And you know, just colloquially
(28:30):
we would call that depression or burnout. It's an I
can't energy. It's kind of this knowing that you need
to and like wishing that you could do the thing.
And I'm talking, you know, not just the big stuff.
Sometimes it's literally just like taking out the garbage or
doing you know, or cleaning the kitchen or whatever, just
these little things that you know, for somebody who is
(28:54):
used to operating at a high level, you know, those
high achiever types, right, these you know, these are most
of the people that I work with. That's also my
past story. But you know, it becomes this real like
you know, mind bending uh uh, you know.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
It's just it's difficult.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
It's so difficult to rationalize because we're not meant to
actually rationalize it. It's a nervous system signal, you know,
and it's that person sitting there being like, what is
wrong with me? I used to be able to do
these things easily? Why can't I do this now? And so,
you know, just a simple tool here we go to
kind of decide like where you're where you are in
(29:38):
you know, kind of nervous system activation is like does
the energy always feel like it wants to go up?
Speaker 3 (29:44):
You know?
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Is it always like a doing? You know, and it's
is it always like you know, you're always on, You're
always doing, You're always in motion, can't calm you know,
your brain down. That is an indication that your system
might be stuck in that sympathetic fight or flight activation
could also be a free state, but we'll get to
that next. The other you know, the other extreme of
(30:08):
that or sorry, the other category you know of that
activation is activation on the low side, right, because you
know that is you know, we always think of like
dysirculation or activation as.
Speaker 3 (30:20):
Fight or flight.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
No, like dysregulation can also be that shut down that
I was describing. So, yeah, feeling you know, just overly lethargic.
It's an I can't energy. It's a shut down energy.
It's you know, like we said, we we call it
depression or burnout or various things, but it's just just
like why can't I? You know, I used to be
(30:43):
able to, but why can't I.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
That's indication that.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Your system is in dorsal, that it is, that it
is shut down, and that is also a form of dysregulation.
Now here's the thing we are meant to. It's okay
if we go into one of these states a little bit,
say that again.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
It's okay to shut down a little bit.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
Is that what you're saying, Yeah, it's we need that sometimes.
But also even from a disreg because there's a difference
between activation and disregulation, right like activation because everybody wants,
you know, especially like on Instagram, social media, whatever, everyone
wants to say like everybody's disregulated these days, which isn't
necessarily true. Like if you know, if you're in line
(31:29):
at a grocery store and somebody comes and stands too
close to you and you feel like a rise and
energy in your system, that's a healthy nervous system activation.
That's your system saying we don't know who this person is,
you know, yeah, again, like this is an unknown human
(31:50):
and so you know, a lot of people want to
call that disregulation. Not necessarily, you know, that's just a normal,
healthy activation of your system sending them signs of signals.
It's like, we don't know this person, like with let's
you know, let's either let's move away. That would be
our flight response, or let's ask them to take a
step back. That would be a healthy fight response, right,
(32:13):
And obviously you're not fighting them, but that is fight energy, right,
So so it's okay.
Speaker 3 (32:19):
And then also even.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
Being disregulated for a period of time, because it's perfectly fine.
You know, if you're going through like if you get
fired from your job, you know, or laid off, right,
or you're going through like a sudden divorce that you
know somebody like where there's infidelity or something. You know,
it's like you didn't see it coming. It's okay to
(32:41):
be disregulated during those periods of times. The thing is
we don't necessarily want.
Speaker 3 (32:47):
To stay there.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
That's when it starts to cause problems. So on a
short term basis, we you know, our nervous systems are
designed to create, you know, create dysregulation to help keep
us safe, to help us survive. But we don't want
to get stuck there. And so when we're stuck in.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
That stufftor causes other problems.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Oh so many problems, like all the way down to
you know, chronic illness. And you know what, because when
we get this regulated, our nerve endings actually retract from
our organs and they pull back because they're essentially saying, hey, like,
can you give up some energy because we need to
to you know, fight. You know this response, you know,
we need to be in fight or flight because you know,
(33:28):
it's like, all right, I've got so many projects at work.
I'm not sure. So I'm just gonna work. I'm gonna work, work, work,
I'm gonna work till midnight, you know, every single day.
And you know, if that person's not coming down, if
they're not getting a sleep, that's chronic dysregulation. So it's
gonna you know, our help the.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
Body and other That's what I was gonna say. So
beyond fixing it, helping people understand the difference between trying
to fix themselves and truly healing.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
Ooh, I love this question too. So I'm a I'm
a former fixer. I'm a recovering fix myself er. Okay,
I'm just I'm.
Speaker 3 (34:01):
Gonna be yeah, just straight up with that.
Speaker 2 (34:03):
So for years, you know, because my body was sending
me so many signs and signals that like something was off.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
You know, that's what were they What kind of signs
and signals were they sending it?
Speaker 2 (34:14):
Oh, just chronic anxiety for me. I had panic attacks,
you know, any time that I would get into a
new relationship, you know, anything that was past like a
third or a fourth date, you know, or something like that.
Blinding anxiety, like blinding anxiety even actually just like the
prospect of asking a woman out, you know, I mean,
(34:36):
and I just vividly remember this like back into my teens,
like I would what I now realized, like I was dissociating.
But that actually all of that traces back to my
the childhood sexual trauma for me. For me, but I
was having these extreme reactions, you know, and then like
other people are like, oh, yeah, you're always gonna have
some nerves, like when you're asking somebody out, Like there's
(34:57):
always be nerves at the beginning of a relationship. And
I was like, Okay, I guess this is like something
I just need to push pass right, No, not at all.
So you know, it was things like that. Definitely, like
my mental I joke around my mental health startup that
I founded and launched took a toll on my mental
health because I was just going I mean, I was working,
you know, ten eleven hour days consistently and eventually got
(35:22):
to this point where I was, I was burnt out.
And despite all of my knowledge, you know, and all
of my training in this, like I wasn't recognizing this,
but I was waking up in the morning being like
I just don't feel motivated to do anything, and I'd
sit down at my computer and I would just stare
blankly at it, and that like.
Speaker 3 (35:39):
Two hours would go by where I.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Would just kind of like pitdle around here and there.
These are the signs and signals you know that like
for my own life, and I know that you know,
certain people listening will identify with them too. But you
know there's a long list, you know, of ways it
can show up. But you know, just in general, it's like,
does something feel off, you know, something feel like are
you feeling how you want to feel? Do are you
(36:05):
where you want to you know, to be in life,
and like, how's your you know, how's that feeling your system?
Speaker 3 (36:10):
Right?
Speaker 2 (36:10):
And so if something feels a little off, you know,
if you start it feels like like.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
Cracks are starting to form.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
Or you know, the things that used to be easy
now feel really hard, or you're losing a lack of
you know, if you're withdrawing socially, if you are, you know,
it's like taking a long time to respond to texts, right,
if you know, hobbies that once lit you up are
no longer enjoyable. These are all pretty clear signs and
(36:39):
signals that your nervous system is saying, hey, like we
need some attention, you know, something, something's off. So then
it's pretty easy to go into I have to fix
myself right, especially for the high achiever types, you know,
because like we're used to getting stuff done, Like you're
used to being the person that can get it done,
who other people rely upon, who can figure out any problem,
(37:01):
you know, et cetera, et cetera. And so we go
into this mode of approaching our healing and our growth
from the same perspective of, Okay, here's a problem, I
have to fix it right. The thing that is inherently
wrong about that approach or difficult. I want to say
(37:23):
it's wrong, but it's difficult about that approach. And why
that approach won't work is that the baseline, the undertone
of I need to fix myself is shame. Because if
you're saying I need to fix myself, that is inherently
saying something is wrong with me, right right, and you're
(37:45):
not one hundred percent right. It's like something feels wrong,
something feels off, that is one hundred percent correct, like
that that languaging I would, you know, I would absolute encourage.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
People to use but there's nothing wrong with you.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
And so again going back to you know this, you
know it's like, oh, just because somebody's feeling anxiety or
just to become because somebody is like a you know,
a hardcore perfectionist, that doesn't necessarily mean something's wrong with you.
It just means something's getting in the way. And this
is why I love somatic work, because it's the assumption
(38:24):
is not ever something is wrong with you, it's oh,
something happened to you. You've been shaped in a particular way,
and then your nervous system then shapes in a particular way.
With these protective patterns, you know, so anxiety, you know,
my blinding anxiety around dating and relationships really helped protect
(38:51):
me from intimacy. It helped protect because that trauma from
my childhood was still looping in my system, and so
it associated because it again, our our nervous systems don't
how did you.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
Get how did you get out of that?
Speaker 2 (39:06):
It was my it was my own somatic healing. Yeah,
So my journey has been like really up and down,
you know, with with all of this, because I had
done over a decade of very dedicated healing work and
and and definitely made some progress, but I still felt
stuck and so kind of what I said earlier, like
(39:28):
all of a sudden a few years ago, that unresolved
trauma really woke up in my system in a major
way through another unhealthy relationship of mine. Trauma very often
wakes up in relationships, by the way, just for anybody listening,
you know, if you're going through it, you know, in
relationships or you know, you've got a passive words and
I'm not saying it always you know, traces back to trauma,
(39:50):
but that can very often, you know, especially if it's
childhood trauma, developmental trauma, and so once all of that
woke up. I was like, wait, hold on, like talking
through this isn't working even e M D. Are you
know a trauma modality that I, you know, helped me really,
you know, that was the first trauma modality I practiced,
(40:11):
not practice, but was a recipient of. It was really helpful,
but it wasn't the full story because it doesn't work
directly with the nervous system. And so then I, yeah,
I found a really really amazing somatic experiencing practitioner. And
that's when just the light bulbs started to go off
and I was like, oh, like this, this isn't my fault,
(40:32):
you know, just because I'm like just exhausting. I feel
like I just can't work right now. I mean there
was a year long period where like I was just
kind of stuck on the couch and you know, but
then shaming myself because I'm like, oh, I should be
doing these things, you.
Speaker 3 (40:47):
Know, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
But my nervous system was saying, no, hold on, this
goes much deeper than you know, than I realize, and
so I just I had to give. And thankfully, you know,
I have the means, you know, I had the space
to be able to do all of this. Not everybody does,
you know, I mean.
Speaker 1 (41:06):
Especially so different now inside and out.
Speaker 2 (41:10):
Wendy, I cannot tell you the difference that I feel like.
It's so hard to do. Well, sorry I can. I
can't tell you how different I feel like just in
the the there's not even strong enough words in the
English language. Amazing.
Speaker 1 (41:26):
I love that. I love that. So I could talk
to you all day long, except unfortunately I don't have
that much more time. So I want you to and
I'll have you back again and again and again, because
I think this is so what you do is so
powerful and so helpful to all of us. Thanks. So
when someone comes to see you, you don't start with like,
(41:47):
oh this happened you. You tell us a little bit
about that, You back back, way up, like you take
them way back briefly, tell us that I'll have you
back again. We'll dive deeper, deeper into this, but there's
not a long time left.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
Yeah, that's okay. So so for you know, for anybody
listening like the process, it's not about let's talk through
what happened to you for for every session like that,
because that's not going to help. You know, there's a
little bit of talking, you know, especially for some you know.
But so it's like I said, it's really following the
(42:23):
signs and signals you know, in your nervous system in
real time. So you know, for example and and this,
you know, it's gonna be different for everybody. If somebody's
really shut down, there's a whole set of exercises that
I might bring in and tools, you know, for shutdown.
If somebody can't calm down. You know, I've had clients
show up and they're you know, they're kind of like
(42:44):
rocking in their chair and they're wringing their hands, you know,
and it's very clear that they're really really you know,
activated and just regulated on the high end of things.
So I might say, let's let's stand up, let's start
to move, because that energy wants to move. But it's
it's all about reading the signs and signals, you know,
how we said earlier of like trauma can come out sideways.
(43:07):
It's those sideways signals that we start to follow. But
the main thing we do is we create safety, because
that's the thing. People get sucked into what we call
the trauma vortex, and it's really easy to just only
pay attention to what's wrong or what feels bad or
what feels off, you know, in our bodies, and we
(43:29):
cannot heal from that place. We heal from a place
of safety. So we teach their systems over time, using
various methods, various exercises. I always like to say, somebody,
you can't. I tell every client this, they can't do
somatic work wrong. And it's as if we've got like
one hundred doors lined up and they're all closed. But
(43:50):
we're going and we're knocking on each door, and we're
jiggling the handle a little bit, and we're seeing how
their system responds to various things. And then when we
find a tool that works, you know, that might be
like taking a fast walk or even you know, imagining like,
let's say like all of that activation in their system,
(44:14):
just imagine it as if it were a lake and
you're way far away from the lake, right, and so
we get some distance from it, you know, we get
some separation from it, and their system then learns, oh wait,
hold on, this isn't my identity, This isn't happening right now.
You know, in this moment, there's something else. And so
(44:35):
it's these little bits of just chipping away, you know,
we call it titration, just chipping away at these layers,
you know, And over time we build capacity, we build
more capacity not just to be with the hard stuff,
but also to be with the good stuff.
Speaker 1 (44:52):
Right because we might miss that, right, we might miss
the good stuff if we're stuck.
Speaker 2 (44:56):
Yeah, one hundred percent. Well, here's the thing. When our
systems don't have have capacity to be with the hard stuff,
our capacity to be with the good stuff simultaneously shrinks.
Every time they are directly proportional. They're directly proportional, and
so we have to go at a certain pace with
the hard stuff, and we also have to go at
(45:17):
a certain pace with the good stuff. But when we're
working with the good stuff and going slow with that,
we're simultaneously, even though we're not feeling at the moment,
we're also working on the hard stuff and vice versa.
So it's not this process is not just about sitting
with your tough feelings and you know, working through it
all the time. It's actually more about teaching your system
(45:39):
to orient more towards Since.
Speaker 1 (45:41):
They love this so much, and I wish more people
and I hope more people are going to start doing
this work with you or with somebody, because it's I
always like, I feel like sometimes if you just continue
to talk about the past, you don't move past the past.
Speaker 2 (45:57):
Yeah, exactly, exactly, So beyond this patch.
Speaker 1 (46:00):
Murphy Nervous system expert, trauma trained patristser and hosts of
Successful and Stuck podcasts had him back again for the
second time today. He's going to come back the third,
fourth bit. We're going to come back. You're going to
come back so many more times because there's so much
more to talk about. There's just not enough in one podcast.
So please come back again and thank you for sharing
your insight, your wisdom, and your strength, your your heart
(46:22):
everything with us.
Speaker 3 (46:23):
Thanks. I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (46:24):
Yeah, I would love to come back.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
Thanks so much. Patrick Nito Kuda Divorce and family laws
attorneys have guided Connecticut and New York families through complex
divorce actions, contested child custody, and alimony disputes for over
thirty years. Their Connecticut and New York attorneys have extensive
experience in family matters involving substance abuse, domestic violence, mental illness,
(46:45):
and many other X factors that can complicate a divorce.
Their attorneys at deptly managed privacy and reputation concerns inherit
to public divorce proceedings and the related exposure for their
ultra high net worth clients. Find your new path forward,
define your post divorce family, and secure an enforcable agreement
to protect your future with Needle Cuda ACT now put
(47:08):
the strength of their team behind you. Visit them at
needlecuda dot com or call two O three five five
seven nine five zero zero
Welcome to The Rewrite, a podcast about divorce, choice and
new beginnings. I'm your host Wendy Sloan, former TV producer,
mom of two and one sweet golden retriever. This is
a space for real talk about the moments that break us,
the choices that define us, and the power we have
to begin again. You'll hear personal stories, heartfelt insights, and
(00:22):
honest conversations about healing relationships and reclaiming your life one
choice at a time. I'll be joined by experts in divorce, finance,
mental health, wellness and more and everything you need to
support your next chapter. The most powerful chapters might be
the ones you write next. Let's begin your rewrite together.
This episode is brought to in part by the Needle
(00:44):
Kuda Law Firm guidance that moves lives forward. Welcome back
to the Rewrite. I'm your host Wendy Sloan, and because
one conversation with him was just not enough for me
and for my listeners. Patrick Murphy is back nervous system expert,
trauma trained practitioner and hosts of the Successful and Stuck podcast.
Patrick knows firsthand the messy, uncertain, and nerve racking reality
(01:07):
of starting over. Having experienced two major career privots of
his own, he now helps people go from stuck and
uncertain to grounded and confident so they can face life's
challenges without being overcome by self doubt and overwhelmed. His
work is all about creating clarity and confidence. People need
to rewrite their own story and this is so much
(01:28):
of what we need in our everyday lives to just
live a better, healthier life. Welcome back, Patrick.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Murphy, Thanks, happy to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
We're going to dive deeper into this nervous system and
how it affects us. And I'm beginning to understand this
even more so with the Rewrite podcast because so much
of mindfulness and the nervous system and somatic healing has
found their way to the Rewrite And it's just amazing
what our bodies are, what we hold in our bodies.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Yeah, I mean, our nervous systems are responsible for every thought,
every sensation, every feeling, every action that we take. I mean,
it is it is the central you know, effectively the
central operating system. And you know, I like to kind
of start out like, let's you know, I know we
did it last time, but let's define what somatic means right,
(02:20):
and you know, I like to define it as it's
the language of your nervous system. Our nervous systems don't
speak in rational thought or you know, timelines, or you know,
even just like English or whatever language you know.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
You you speak.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
It speaks in the language of sensation and behavior and
feeling and image, all of these things. And when we
learn to work with our nervous systems rather than against
our nervous systems, that's when everything really changes. And what
I mean by that is, you know, it's so easy.
(02:58):
You know, let's say, let's well obviously use transitions as
examples here, but anytime we're going through a transition like
change creates stress.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Period.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
It doesn't matter if it's like a major transition like
a divorce or a job change or something, or just
you're taking a new way to work or work.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Right that I was going to say.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
The same thing, right, yeah, love it great, same page. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
You know, it's like, oh, you're you're buying a new
product that you know, the grocery store for a first time,
Like there might be a little bit you might even
even notice it, a little bit more activation, you know,
in your system, because that thing is unknown, That new
route to work is unknown. Certainly, you know, the bigger transitions,
there's massive unknown there. And so you know, our nervous systems,
(03:44):
because they're wired for safety, are going to send us
these signals in the form of things that we call
just anxiety, overthinking, procrastination, perfectionism, all of these things that
kind of get like villified in our society and even
by let's kind of like the mainstream you know, mental health,
(04:08):
you know construct it's you know, these things aren't necessarily
signals that something is wrong with you. These might be
very natural reactions to something that happened to you in
the present or in the past. And so what somatic is,
(04:28):
especially smatic experiencing. That's the modality that I'm trained in
that I practice, is it's like taking those signs and
signals and following them like little breadcrumbs and and seeing
what they're actually trying to tell you from a nervous
system perspective. And so instead of let's say vilifying them
(04:52):
and saying like, oh, we've you know, we have to
get rid of your anxiety, it's because obviously that's the goal, right,
Like none of us wants to be anxious you know.
But but we just follow those signs and signals like
little bread crumbs to see, oh, where is this anxiety
leading us? Where is this anger leading us? Where is
(05:14):
this h the grief or the sadness or you know,
all of these different things.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Where is that leading us?
Speaker 2 (05:20):
And what is it trying to tell you? And so
when we learn the language of our nervous systems, we
learn to be able to follow those bread crumbs and
understand what's happening underneath the surface, so that then we
can get to where we really need to go and
we can resolve you know, the the stress cycles and
certainly the trauma, you know, trauma cycles that that get
(05:41):
stuck in our bodies, so that we can you know,
free ourselves from these protective patterns and and live the
the bigger, bolder, more fulfilling lives that we really want.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Okay, So before we get into like tools and stuff
like that can help us, let's take us through Like
let's say, Okay, we're changing jobs. M hm, so we're
starting that process of you know, we're getting a new job,
we're starting over, like and we're take us take walk
us through somebody that you're dealing with that's changing jobs.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Yeah, So first I just want to say it's always
a highly individualized process. Everybody has, you know, different responses.
But so I'm going to give a more generalized answer, Right.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
Changing jobs, getting a divorce, you know, new relationship, even
can bring up anxiety and stress, right.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
Yeah, some of the core principles, I mean, they're going
to a lot of what I explain is really going
to apply to every situation. You know, there's me nuance
to everything, right, but just in general, it kind of
goes back to that statement that I that I said
change creates stress, right, Right, And so our bodies are
nervous systems. They are wired for certainty. And so it
(06:50):
doesn't matter if you know, this new job, if it's
like the thing you really really want, right, if it's
like perfectly aligned and you you know, really went through
the interview process and you really like the people you're
going to be working with or for, you know, there's
still this element of change creates stress. And because our
nervous systems and our brains are wired for certainty, they're
(07:11):
going to look for certainty at any place they can.
And that certainty might be in the past, right, you know,
that's why so many people come to new jobs and
like okay, like, well this worked at my last company,
I'm going to implement this system at the new company.
You know, even if that system clashes with like the
new company's culture, you know, corporate culture. I mean, we've
(07:32):
seen so many corporate disasters right where where that happens.
Sometimes that might be a good thing, but just understanding
that change creates stress and that you know a lot
of the anxiety, you know, a lot of that activation
that you're you know that somebody might be feeling in
their system, is just their system actually looking for some
(07:54):
solid ground, you know, some some sort of certainty, and
you know, the biggest you know, I would say in
times of transition, any type of transition, the biggest tool
that you can use is connecting with others. Right, Because
what's the first thing we do when we change jobs.
We find our people, right, We find like the like
(08:18):
minded people, you know, the people that we can really
trust in that new and we're also looking out for
those we can't.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
Right.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
But whether we're consciously doing this or not, because as
soon as we find you know, that person, it's like, oh,
we're in the lunch room, we're on a zoom or
whatever that we're like, oh my gosh, like this person
just said this thing really aligns with like my ethos
and my values and my belief like, oh this is
this is one of my people. And we immediately feel
this settling in our system because we found some safety,
(08:50):
We found a little bit more at least in the moment,
we found a little bit more certainty.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Right.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
So the biggest tool that I could offer for people
in any type of transition is connect with others, you know,
find some support. And I know that sounds maybe a
little overly simplified, but that's that's always step one. That's
always step one. And then the second is see if
you can slow things down, you know, because there's there's,
(09:18):
like I said, there's always kind of that scramble you know,
to to you know, go into a new job and
you know, prove yourself and you know, because if I
don't prove myself, well, then I'm not safe. My job
isn't safe, right, And these days are our jobs and
our livelihood and our well being and you know, our
mortgage and you know, sending the kids to school and whatever,
it's all tied to our paychecks. So paycheck equals safety,
(09:42):
and so again, our nervous systems are wired to find safety,
and so just understanding, you know, and asking yourself in
any given moment, like, oh, where might my system be
looking for safety right now? And you know that that
sense of anxiety really might be you know, your system
saying well, hold on, we're not sure if this is
safe yet. It doesn't necessarily mean that it's like a hard.
Speaker 3 (10:05):
Stop, right, It just it's just.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Asking you to slow down and go at a pace
that your nervous system can digest. Because you know, like
I said, it's so easy to want to like, Okay,
I'm gonna switch examples real quick, but this is so
relevant because I know you and I both know like
dozens of people who do this, right, the person that
(10:28):
gets out of you know, one relationship or one marriage
and then immediately jumps into another one, right right?
Speaker 3 (10:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (10:36):
More I think more men than women, right. I mean,
I'm just saying from.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
I have no idea, I honestly, I I yeah, I
can't tell you experience.
Speaker 1 (10:44):
Talking to not that I'm so experienced, but from talking
to so many people, I feel like it's more men
than when. But it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
Yeah, I can't speak to that statistically, So you know,
it's like I don't I don't want to make a
claim one way or another because I genuinely don't know.
Speaker 3 (11:01):
But here's the thing, everybody listening.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
Knows at least one person, if not multiple people who
have done that, right. And that's the thing is that
you know that nervous system, you know, is looking for
safety because they feel safer with you know, in relation
to somebody, even if the relationship is a disaster, right right, Yeah,
(11:26):
And this is why people stay.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
This is what I'm gonna do that How do we
know does it come out in certain ways? Like? How
do we know that our nervous system is not like
this just happens. How do we know does it come
out in certain ways or it just happens and sometimes
we don't know about it?
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Uh, say more can you ask? Yeah, give me a
little more context of that question.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
Yeah, okay, So I'm changing jobs. Yeah, so you like
obviously change comes with stress, right, So our nervous system
knows that. But how but what if I'm not feeling
stressed at all?
Speaker 3 (11:58):
Oh, here's the thing.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
If you're not feeling stressed, this is not necessarily going
to apply to everybody, you know. It's like there's different levels, right,
you know, So for somebody, let's say, for somebody who
has like past trauma that they haven't fully worked through
and it's unresolved, any type of change might get amplified,
(12:21):
you know. So that job change. That's actually my personal story.
So I used to work for the Wall Street Journal.
I worked for the Journal for six years, and I
was so unbelievably loyal to my team there. Like, I
absolutely loved my team because they had become like family
(12:42):
to me. They were really really safe people, and they're
still some of my best friends to this day, including
my boss there. But you know, the culture had started
to change, you know, things had started to change, and
I was like, and I'm getting emails from recruiters offering me,
you know, twenty thirty forty thousand dollars more, you know,
but I had always just said no because the Journal
(13:07):
felt so safe for me and and I just felt
this real deep sense of loyalty, you know.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
And there's a lot of people too, I think Patrick, right,
they feel safe, so they stay maybe stuck, maybe not stuck,
but they just stay there because it's a safety.
Speaker 3 (13:23):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
Yeah, and so, you know, going back to it's like,
our nervous systems are wired for safety. They're wired for
the thing that we know versus the thing that we
don't know. Even if the thing that we know is
unhealthy or harmful, it's still like our nervous system shape
in a certain way, and they're like, oh, we know
how to navigate this pain, we know how to you know,
versus like, you know, logically, we might know that we
(13:47):
need to leave the job or leave the relationship, but
it still feels it literally feels like a life threat
sometimes to our nervous systems. And so kind of going
back to your original question, you know, there's there's varying degrees, right.
You know, there's certain people that might just you know,
like navigate a job change or a relationship shift very well.
(14:10):
And you know, bravo to them. You know, at some
point along the way they learned the skills and the
safety and the communication methods and all the things that
they needed in order to make that transition as smooth
as possible. Now, I mean, there's always going to be
you know, at least a little bit of stress.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
Right.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
It might not feel like anxiety, might feel like excitement,
because anxiety and excitement are actually two sides of the
same coin. It's it's quite literally the same energy. So
you know, when you're walking into the new job and
you feel really excited, that's a little bit of the
same thing.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
You know.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
It's not bad to feel excited, obviously, it's also not
bad to feel anxious, you know, but like there's just unknowns, right,
It's like, well, you know, why am I going to
sign in? Like how do I get into my email?
Just all the things right, you know. So it's just
that even just onboarding process.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
Yeah that I was going to say that onboarding it
could be a lot too, that could be the most stressful.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
But the really simple tool that I would offer for
people really in any given moment, and this is overly
simplified again, but it's a really easy one is tune
into your body. Do I feel a sense of expansiveness
or do I feel a sense of contraction right now?
(15:27):
And generally, for the most part, expansiveness is going to
lead or just relaxation. That's going to be indicative of
like oh there's safety here, like we're feeling okay, We're
feeling good about this contraction is potentially more of a
signal of you know, your system signaling like, oh, we're
not sure about this, you know, we don't we don't
(15:48):
quite know, right, And so maybe tightness in your chest,
maybe you know, your shoulders kind of bunch up a
little bit. But that is, you know, that's in general,
just the broadest tool that I can really offer for
just that one little check in of you know, how
am I feeling about this in this moment?
Speaker 1 (16:06):
Yeah, okay, so it makes sense, makes a lot more
sense now. I mean, you could tune into Patrick's part
one learn more about Patrick and his whole journey how
he got here. But we're getting a little bit deeper
into the nervous system with this one and more precise
with this interview. So it passed trauma. What if you
don't know if we have past trauma, Like what if
(16:29):
there was trauma that didn't hit us? And I'm going
to ask you those you're going to answer that, and
we come back around doing a quick break for one
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that a good question or what? Patrick?
Speaker 3 (18:05):
I love?
Speaker 2 (18:05):
That's honestly one of my favorite questions.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
Sorry, what were you gonna say?
Speaker 1 (18:09):
I'm so happy? Okay, no, because I was wondering, like,
what if someone doesn't know they have past trauma, but
it's coming out in different ways.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
That's the thing I always say, like it will come
out sideways in some way, shape or form. So here's
the thing. And it doesn't matter whether it's actual like
past trauma or just unresolved past stress. Right, I mean,
there's just like life happens.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
Right.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
It's so easy to get caught up in job kids,
you know, taking them to sports, like all these different
things and not be able to complete those stress cycles.
And then that leads to things like burnout and depression
you know, and whatnot, which you know, just because you're
burnt out or depressed doesn't necessarily mean that you have
(18:56):
past trauma, but that could also be a sign or
say know that you know one might The beauty of
somatic work is because we don't It certainly helps to
know what happened to somebody in the past, but we
don't necessarily have to know because your nervous system is
going to send us those signs and signals. So those
(19:19):
signs and signals might be you know, the person that
they you know, they go go go all day and
you know, then they feel like exhausted, but as soon
as they lay down lay down to go to sleep,
their mind starts racing with all the things that they
didn't get done that day and all the things they
still have to get done tomorrow, and they just you know,
they have trouble falling asleep or they're waking up in
(19:41):
the middle of the night. You know, these are very
clear signs and signals of a nervous system that is
disregulated and you know can't necessarily come back down to
that state of calm, that state of relaxation and rest
and digest So one sleep is generally always want to
(20:01):
be first indicators that someone either has unresolved past trauma
or unresolved stress. Right, So that's that's always a clear
sign or signal. Other things could be some of the
stuff we've already mentioned, just this chronic overthinking, feeling chronically overwhelmed, perfectionism, anxiety,
(20:23):
you know, constant procrastination.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
These they don't.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Always point to past trauma, but sometimes you know they could.
But whether they point to past trauma or not, perfectionism
is getting in your way, like it is taking you know.
One of my favorite examples, like, anytime I put this
up on Instagram or you know, talk about this, you
know the client, you know, like taking forty five minutes
(20:47):
to write a five sentence email, so so many people, Yeah,
you just gave me a knowing look there, right, so
many people identify with that. And any time I put
up any sort of content around it or say something
about it, you know, so many people I'll get DMS
or whatever and they're like, oh my gosh, like this
is me, Like I didn't know this happened to other people, right,
(21:09):
Like logically, we know it's a five sentence email, right,
Like this shouldn't be that hard, right, But we're sitting
there and like, wait, hold on, should I use an
exclamation point? Or should I use a period, you know,
should I adjust this word like wait, hold on, does
this sound a little too.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
Over the top?
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Or should I pull it back a little bit? And
we'll sit there and get in these you know, perfectionist loops.
But that's actually a nervous system pattern, right, perfectionism from
a nervous system perspective. And I'm getting a little bit
deeper than the question here. Yeah, but I could I could.
Speaker 1 (21:44):
Take the deepest good Patrick, that's.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
You okay, cool, yeah, passionate.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
About this, and you know you're trying to really explain
it's good, it's all good.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Right, cool, Yeah, I just want to make sure. But
here's the thing I could. I could go down the
similar rabbit hole and explain like the nervous system, constructive,
any one of these things, anxiety, overthinking, et cetera.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Let's just use.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Perfectionism because so many people identify as you know, a perfectionist.
Perfectionism is a form of a free state. It's like
having one foot on the gas and one foot on
the break at the same time, Like, you know, you
need to do the thing you know you need to
you know, rework or you know, kind of look over
the presentation, you know again, but you know, perfectionism is like, no,
(22:24):
let's do this ten more times because you know, we
really have to make sure it's dialed in. It's like, oh,
let's anticipate every single question that I might get asked
in the meeting or the presentation or on the new date.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
Right.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
You know, it's like this advice to relationships too, perfectionism
shows up there as well. And so so that's like
the one foot on the gas, but then the one
foot on the break is like weight, hold on, are
we sure?
Speaker 3 (22:47):
Should I use a period?
Speaker 2 (22:48):
Should I use an exclamation point? You know? It's these
types of things. These are all nervous system patterns. And
so bringing this back around to you know, your question
of how do we know if we have unresolved past trauma?
You know, like I said, this answer comes with like
a big asterisk, right because just because you have anxiety,
just because you know perfection perfectionism is there, doesn't necessarily
(23:12):
mean that you have past trauma. But there's something there
to be investigated. But the good news is that actually
the path out is the same, you know, and I
know no better modality I do, no better path than
using somatic work specifically somatic experiencing because even if we
(23:32):
can't remember it, because it's very common and including in
my own story, for people to not remember past trauma
and then all of a sudden, you know, that person
like they get in like like a minor fender bender
or you know, just like some accident and then all
of a sudden it wakes up. Because you know that
stuff can stay buried, you know, for so long until
(23:55):
some events or you know a certain amount of safety
potentially doesn't have to necess really be a car wreck
or something you know harmful, allows it to wake back up,
and you know, it can be really sudden, it can
be really jarring for people. And what this looks like
in people's day to day lives very often is you know,
kind of one the example I already gave, like they
(24:17):
can't calm down, like they can't just turn off, right,
and you know it's like Okay, I'm trying to sit
down and watch Netflix, but like, oh, I'm gonna grab
my phone and check email or I'm still checking email,
you know, before I go to sleep. Now, some of
that is our phones, right, you know they're designed to
be addictive, but yeah, it's it is, Yeah, that's a
(24:38):
whole nother thing.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
We could talk about what we want.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Just like I'm leaving my phone because I don't want to.
I don't want to.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
I don't want it, Yeah, which is good.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
Yeah, Like sometimes I just try to leave my phone.
Isn't that healthy for all of us? Oh?
Speaker 3 (24:53):
Yeah, for sure? For sure.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
I know my kids are safe and I'm good, and
I'm leaving my phone case that's all I you know, work,
that's my you know what I mean, that's all. If
they need me, then I'm here. But otherwise I don't
need it.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Yeah, exactly, exactly. So yeah, so like not you know,
not being able to shut off that that could be
one sign or signal because that's an indication that there
is any of us.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
So it's amazing though, because I think that's so many
of us.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
Yeah, it's so many of us. And like I said,
I can emphasize enough if it doesn't necessarily mean that
it's you know, indicative of past trauma, but it's also
indicative of a culture that keeps us on all the time, right,
you know. So so I just want to be really
clear about that. But either way, if we can't calm down,
if we can't you know, complete those stress cycles and
(25:39):
come down not just at the end of the day,
but also like at lunchtime or at three pm and
just realizing like okay, like the morning's over, I can
let all of that go and then I can you know,
from a grounded place. You know, it's like having multiple
different browser tabs open.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
Right.
Speaker 1 (25:56):
I'm wondering because of society, if this is more prevalent
now than in the past. Like when I was young,
I was outside on my bike. I was never inside.
Never when the TV wasn't on, the games weren't that
wasn't my life growing up. Yeah, the generations now, it's
it's so different.
Speaker 3 (26:15):
Yeah, it's it's really hard.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
I mean we are are like I said, like we said,
these these systems, these devices, they are designed to hijack
our attention. You know, I could go down a hole
like dopamine rabbit hole right now. I mean it's literally
they're using brain science. You hijack our attention and like,
(26:37):
you know to what you just debscribed. You didn't use
the word, but like boredom, Like think about you know,
when you and I were kids, like when we were bored, right,
and it's like Mom, Dad, I'm bored. Nowadays, it's like, oh,
they've got ten different options of like video games or
some sort of screen or here's an iPad or something
like that, which you know, those.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
Moms nowadays just plopping our phone right in front of
their kids, and that's what they're doing.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
And yeah, and it's it's not inherently bad in small doses,
but if that's like the only solution, if that's you know,
if we're always on, that's the thing we don't learn
to to come back down. And so what happens though,
because the next sign of dysregulation we're potentially past trauma
(27:24):
is when we shut down.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
You know.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
It's it's like, because what happens is when our nervous
systems stay in that heightened state of dysregulation, we call
it sympathetic activation, that fight or flight, that like constantly doing,
constantly on, constantly going. Eventually our systems will say, because
if we don't learn to follow those signs and signals, right,
you know, the signs and signals being like well I
(27:48):
can't quite calm down, or like I just feel on
all the time. That's a sign or a signal. Right,
if we're not following that we're not listening to our
systems or we don't know how actually to calm, you know,
to come back down. Our our nervous system will step
in and do it for us, and it will say no,
like shut it all down. And that's where so it's
(28:09):
our we call it our Dorsal Vagel complex from a
you know, a nerdy brain science standpoints there, right, that
is our system of shutdown. That's and when that comes in,
it can feel really jarring. And you know, just colloquially
(28:30):
we would call that depression or burnout. It's an I
can't energy. It's kind of this knowing that you need
to and like wishing that you could do the thing.
And I'm talking, you know, not just the big stuff.
Sometimes it's literally just like taking out the garbage or
doing you know, or cleaning the kitchen or whatever, just
these little things that you know, for somebody who is
(28:54):
used to operating at a high level, you know, those
high achiever types, right, these you know, these are most
of the people that I work with. That's also my
past story. But you know, it becomes this real like
you know, mind bending uh uh, you know.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
It's just it's difficult.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
It's so difficult to rationalize because we're not meant to
actually rationalize it. It's a nervous system signal, you know,
and it's that person sitting there being like, what is
wrong with me? I used to be able to do
these things easily? Why can't I do this now? And so,
you know, just a simple tool here we go to
kind of decide like where you're where you are in
(29:38):
you know, kind of nervous system activation is like does
the energy always feel like it wants to go up?
Speaker 3 (29:44):
You know?
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Is it always like a doing? You know, and it's
is it always like you know, you're always on, You're
always doing, You're always in motion, can't calm you know,
your brain down. That is an indication that your system
might be stuck in that sympathetic fight or flight activation
could also be a free state, but we'll get to
that next. The other you know, the other extreme of
(30:08):
that or sorry, the other category you know of that
activation is activation on the low side, right, because you
know that is you know, we always think of like
dysirculation or activation as.
Speaker 3 (30:20):
Fight or flight.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
No, like dysregulation can also be that shut down that
I was describing. So, yeah, feeling you know, just overly lethargic.
It's an I can't energy. It's a shut down energy.
It's you know, like we said, we we call it
depression or burnout or various things, but it's just just
like why can't I? You know, I used to be
(30:43):
able to, but why can't I.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
That's indication that.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Your system is in dorsal, that it is, that it
is shut down, and that is also a form of dysregulation.
Now here's the thing we are meant to. It's okay
if we go into one of these states a little bit,
say that again.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
It's okay to shut down a little bit.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
Is that what you're saying, Yeah, it's we need that sometimes.
But also even from a disreg because there's a difference
between activation and disregulation, right like activation because everybody wants,
you know, especially like on Instagram, social media, whatever, everyone
wants to say like everybody's disregulated these days, which isn't
necessarily true. Like if you know, if you're in line
(31:29):
at a grocery store and somebody comes and stands too
close to you and you feel like a rise and
energy in your system, that's a healthy nervous system activation.
That's your system saying we don't know who this person is,
you know, yeah, again, like this is an unknown human
(31:50):
and so you know, a lot of people want to
call that disregulation. Not necessarily, you know, that's just a normal,
healthy activation of your system sending them signs of signals.
It's like, we don't know this person, like with let's
you know, let's either let's move away. That would be
our flight response, or let's ask them to take a
step back. That would be a healthy fight response, right,
(32:13):
And obviously you're not fighting them, but that is fight energy, right,
So so it's okay.
Speaker 3 (32:19):
And then also even.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
Being disregulated for a period of time, because it's perfectly fine.
You know, if you're going through like if you get
fired from your job, you know, or laid off, right,
or you're going through like a sudden divorce that you
know somebody like where there's infidelity or something. You know,
it's like you didn't see it coming. It's okay to
(32:41):
be disregulated during those periods of times. The thing is
we don't necessarily want.
Speaker 3 (32:47):
To stay there.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
That's when it starts to cause problems. So on a
short term basis, we you know, our nervous systems are
designed to create, you know, create dysregulation to help keep
us safe, to help us survive. But we don't want
to get stuck there. And so when we're stuck in.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
That stufftor causes other problems.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Oh so many problems, like all the way down to
you know, chronic illness. And you know what, because when
we get this regulated, our nerve endings actually retract from
our organs and they pull back because they're essentially saying, hey, like,
can you give up some energy because we need to
to you know, fight. You know this response, you know,
we need to be in fight or flight because you know,
(33:28):
it's like, all right, I've got so many projects at work.
I'm not sure. So I'm just gonna work. I'm gonna work, work, work,
I'm gonna work till midnight, you know, every single day.
And you know, if that person's not coming down, if
they're not getting a sleep, that's chronic dysregulation. So it's
gonna you know, our help the.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
Body and other That's what I was gonna say. So
beyond fixing it, helping people understand the difference between trying
to fix themselves and truly healing.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
Ooh, I love this question too. So I'm a I'm
a former fixer. I'm a recovering fix myself er. Okay,
I'm just I'm.
Speaker 3 (34:01):
Gonna be yeah, just straight up with that.
Speaker 2 (34:03):
So for years, you know, because my body was sending
me so many signs and signals that like something was off.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
You know, that's what were they What kind of signs
and signals were they sending it?
Speaker 2 (34:14):
Oh, just chronic anxiety for me. I had panic attacks,
you know, any time that I would get into a
new relationship, you know, anything that was past like a
third or a fourth date, you know, or something like that.
Blinding anxiety, like blinding anxiety even actually just like the
prospect of asking a woman out, you know, I mean,
(34:36):
and I just vividly remember this like back into my teens,
like I would what I now realized, like I was dissociating.
But that actually all of that traces back to my
the childhood sexual trauma for me. For me, but I
was having these extreme reactions, you know, and then like
other people are like, oh, yeah, you're always gonna have
some nerves, like when you're asking somebody out, Like there's
(34:57):
always be nerves at the beginning of a relationship. And
I was like, Okay, I guess this is like something
I just need to push pass right, No, not at all.
So you know, it was things like that. Definitely, like
my mental I joke around my mental health startup that
I founded and launched took a toll on my mental
health because I was just going I mean, I was working,
you know, ten eleven hour days consistently and eventually got
(35:22):
to this point where I was, I was burnt out.
And despite all of my knowledge, you know, and all
of my training in this, like I wasn't recognizing this,
but I was waking up in the morning being like
I just don't feel motivated to do anything, and I'd
sit down at my computer and I would just stare
blankly at it, and that like.
Speaker 3 (35:39):
Two hours would go by where I.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Would just kind of like pitdle around here and there.
These are the signs and signals you know that like
for my own life, and I know that you know,
certain people listening will identify with them too. But you
know there's a long list, you know, of ways it
can show up. But you know, just in general, it's like,
does something feel off, you know, something feel like are
you feeling how you want to feel? Do are you
(36:05):
where you want to you know, to be in life,
and like, how's your you know, how's that feeling your system?
Speaker 3 (36:10):
Right?
Speaker 2 (36:10):
And so if something feels a little off, you know,
if you start it feels like like.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
Cracks are starting to form.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
Or you know, the things that used to be easy
now feel really hard, or you're losing a lack of
you know, if you're withdrawing socially, if you are, you know,
it's like taking a long time to respond to texts, right,
if you know, hobbies that once lit you up are
no longer enjoyable. These are all pretty clear signs and
(36:39):
signals that your nervous system is saying, hey, like we
need some attention, you know, something, something's off. So then
it's pretty easy to go into I have to fix
myself right, especially for the high achiever types, you know,
because like we're used to getting stuff done, Like you're
used to being the person that can get it done,
who other people rely upon, who can figure out any problem,
(37:01):
you know, et cetera, et cetera. And so we go
into this mode of approaching our healing and our growth
from the same perspective of, Okay, here's a problem, I
have to fix it right. The thing that is inherently
wrong about that approach or difficult. I want to say
(37:23):
it's wrong, but it's difficult about that approach. And why
that approach won't work is that the baseline, the undertone
of I need to fix myself is shame. Because if
you're saying I need to fix myself, that is inherently
saying something is wrong with me, right right, and you're
(37:45):
not one hundred percent right. It's like something feels wrong,
something feels off, that is one hundred percent correct, like
that that languaging I would, you know, I would absolute encourage.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
People to use but there's nothing wrong with you.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
And so again going back to you know this, you
know it's like, oh, just because somebody's feeling anxiety or
just to become because somebody is like a you know,
a hardcore perfectionist, that doesn't necessarily mean something's wrong with you.
It just means something's getting in the way. And this
is why I love somatic work, because it's the assumption
(38:24):
is not ever something is wrong with you, it's oh,
something happened to you. You've been shaped in a particular way,
and then your nervous system then shapes in a particular way.
With these protective patterns, you know, so anxiety, you know,
my blinding anxiety around dating and relationships really helped protect
(38:51):
me from intimacy. It helped protect because that trauma from
my childhood was still looping in my system, and so
it associated because it again, our our nervous systems don't
how did you.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
Get how did you get out of that?
Speaker 2 (39:06):
It was my it was my own somatic healing. Yeah,
So my journey has been like really up and down,
you know, with with all of this, because I had
done over a decade of very dedicated healing work and
and and definitely made some progress, but I still felt
stuck and so kind of what I said earlier, like
(39:28):
all of a sudden a few years ago, that unresolved
trauma really woke up in my system in a major
way through another unhealthy relationship of mine. Trauma very often
wakes up in relationships, by the way, just for anybody listening,
you know, if you're going through it, you know, in
relationships or you know, you've got a passive words and
I'm not saying it always you know, traces back to trauma,
(39:50):
but that can very often, you know, especially if it's
childhood trauma, developmental trauma, and so once all of that
woke up. I was like, wait, hold on, like talking
through this isn't working even e M D. Are you
know a trauma modality that I, you know, helped me really,
you know, that was the first trauma modality I practiced,
(40:11):
not practice, but was a recipient of. It was really helpful,
but it wasn't the full story because it doesn't work
directly with the nervous system. And so then I, yeah,
I found a really really amazing somatic experiencing practitioner. And
that's when just the light bulbs started to go off
and I was like, oh, like this, this isn't my fault,
(40:32):
you know, just because I'm like just exhausting. I feel
like I just can't work right now. I mean there
was a year long period where like I was just
kind of stuck on the couch and you know, but
then shaming myself because I'm like, oh, I should be
doing these things, you.
Speaker 3 (40:47):
Know, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
But my nervous system was saying, no, hold on, this
goes much deeper than you know, than I realize, and
so I just I had to give. And thankfully, you know,
I have the means, you know, I had the space
to be able to do all of this. Not everybody does,
you know, I mean.
Speaker 1 (41:06):
Especially so different now inside and out.
Speaker 2 (41:10):
Wendy, I cannot tell you the difference that I feel like.
It's so hard to do. Well, sorry I can. I
can't tell you how different I feel like just in
the the there's not even strong enough words in the
English language. Amazing.
Speaker 1 (41:26):
I love that. I love that. So I could talk
to you all day long, except unfortunately I don't have
that much more time. So I want you to and
I'll have you back again and again and again, because
I think this is so what you do is so
powerful and so helpful to all of us. Thanks. So
when someone comes to see you, you don't start with like,
(41:47):
oh this happened you. You tell us a little bit
about that, You back back, way up, like you take
them way back briefly, tell us that I'll have you
back again. We'll dive deeper, deeper into this, but there's
not a long time left.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
Yeah, that's okay. So so for you know, for anybody
listening like the process, it's not about let's talk through
what happened to you for for every session like that,
because that's not going to help. You know, there's a
little bit of talking, you know, especially for some you know.
But so it's like I said, it's really following the
(42:23):
signs and signals you know, in your nervous system in
real time. So you know, for example and and this,
you know, it's gonna be different for everybody. If somebody's
really shut down, there's a whole set of exercises that
I might bring in and tools, you know, for shutdown.
If somebody can't calm down. You know, I've had clients
show up and they're you know, they're kind of like
(42:44):
rocking in their chair and they're wringing their hands, you know,
and it's very clear that they're really really you know,
activated and just regulated on the high end of things.
So I might say, let's let's stand up, let's start
to move, because that energy wants to move. But it's
it's all about reading the signs and signals, you know,
how we said earlier of like trauma can come out sideways.
(43:07):
It's those sideways signals that we start to follow. But
the main thing we do is we create safety, because
that's the thing. People get sucked into what we call
the trauma vortex, and it's really easy to just only
pay attention to what's wrong or what feels bad or
what feels off, you know, in our bodies, and we
(43:29):
cannot heal from that place. We heal from a place
of safety. So we teach their systems over time, using
various methods, various exercises. I always like to say, somebody,
you can't. I tell every client this, they can't do
somatic work wrong. And it's as if we've got like
one hundred doors lined up and they're all closed. But
(43:50):
we're going and we're knocking on each door, and we're
jiggling the handle a little bit, and we're seeing how
their system responds to various things. And then when we
find a tool that works, you know, that might be
like taking a fast walk or even you know, imagining like,
let's say like all of that activation in their system,
(44:14):
just imagine it as if it were a lake and
you're way far away from the lake, right, and so
we get some distance from it, you know, we get
some separation from it, and their system then learns, oh wait,
hold on, this isn't my identity, This isn't happening right now.
You know, in this moment, there's something else. And so
(44:35):
it's these little bits of just chipping away, you know,
we call it titration, just chipping away at these layers,
you know, And over time we build capacity, we build
more capacity not just to be with the hard stuff,
but also to be with the good stuff.
Speaker 1 (44:52):
Right because we might miss that, right, we might miss
the good stuff if we're stuck.
Speaker 2 (44:56):
Yeah, one hundred percent. Well, here's the thing. When our
systems don't have have capacity to be with the hard stuff,
our capacity to be with the good stuff simultaneously shrinks.
Every time they are directly proportional. They're directly proportional, and
so we have to go at a certain pace with
the hard stuff, and we also have to go at
(45:17):
a certain pace with the good stuff. But when we're
working with the good stuff and going slow with that,
we're simultaneously, even though we're not feeling at the moment,
we're also working on the hard stuff and vice versa.
So it's not this process is not just about sitting
with your tough feelings and you know, working through it
all the time. It's actually more about teaching your system
(45:39):
to orient more towards Since.
Speaker 1 (45:41):
They love this so much, and I wish more people
and I hope more people are going to start doing
this work with you or with somebody, because it's I
always like, I feel like sometimes if you just continue
to talk about the past, you don't move past the past.
Speaker 2 (45:57):
Yeah, exactly, exactly, So beyond this patch.
Speaker 1 (46:00):
Murphy Nervous system expert, trauma trained patristser and hosts of
Successful and Stuck podcasts had him back again for the
second time today. He's going to come back the third,
fourth bit. We're going to come back. You're going to
come back so many more times because there's so much
more to talk about. There's just not enough in one podcast.
So please come back again and thank you for sharing
your insight, your wisdom, and your strength, your your heart
(46:22):
everything with us.
Speaker 3 (46:23):
Thanks. I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (46:24):
Yeah, I would love to come back.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
Thanks so much. Patrick Nito Kuda Divorce and family laws
attorneys have guided Connecticut and New York families through complex
divorce actions, contested child custody, and alimony disputes for over
thirty years. Their Connecticut and New York attorneys have extensive
experience in family matters involving substance abuse, domestic violence, mental illness,
(46:45):
and many other X factors that can complicate a divorce.
Their attorneys at deptly managed privacy and reputation concerns inherit
to public divorce proceedings and the related exposure for their
ultra high net worth clients. Find your new path forward,
define your post divorce family, and secure an enforcable agreement
to protect your future with Needle Cuda ACT now put
(47:08):
the strength of their team behind you. Visit them at
needlecuda dot com or call two O three five five
seven nine five zero zero
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