July 20, 2025 • 41 mins
Deena Baikowitz, aka Fireball Deena, is a dynamic coach, trainer, facilitator, speaker, and comedian with a unique way of delivering serious business and career advice that’s infused with creativity, compassion, and, of course, humour. Deena’s educational and career background spans social work, healthcare, marketing, events, and the arts, which have expanded into global networking, branding, marketing, and special events. Beyond her professional accomplishments, Deena’s motivated to encourage women to step into their power by embracing the spotlight. “I think that for women, taking the stage is about making a difference. It's about leading by example. It is definitely empowering to know that you can stand up and make a difference.“ Christopher & Heather are privileged to introduce you to a little Fireball named Deena.
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Episode Transcript
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Virgin, Bitch, Podcast (00:00):
Inspiring women to overcome social stereotypes and share unique
(00:10):
life experiences without fear of being defiantly different.
Your hosts, Christopher and Heather, let's talk, shall we?
In all of human history, women have never had more access, more opportunity or more
invitation to speak their truth and share their unique experiences.
(00:31):
Yet many of those opportunities come and go in silence.
But why?
It's a topic for conversation with coach, trainer, writer, speaker, marketing director,
and comedian, Deena Baikowitz, aka FireballDeena.
Welcome to Virgin Beauty Bitch.
I love that introduction, that is so much of what I'm about women in particular, but
(00:57):
people in general speaking their truth.
That's right.
Telling our stories.
I clipped the quote actually from a recent article you did and I'm paraphrasing here
a bit, but basically the quote reads, "It's so important for women to speak up and show
up instead of it, the message being quite frankly the usual pale, stale, and male."
(01:22):
Now Heather and I agree, but please some context to that tantalizing it, take of yours.
Wow.
I'm not sure which article I wrote that in.
I agree with it, obviously I said it.
I can't, I don't take credit for other people's words.
I use a lot of words in my own.
I don't go who coined the term pale, stale, and male.
I'm involved in so many women's groups and I truly believe in pay it forward, each one
(01:46):
teach one we learn and we teach.
But women tend to, to shrank back, to shrink back, to be more afraid to speak up for all
the reasons we know of because it puts us in the hot seat in a bad way.
If you show up, your risk of being hurt, if people see you, they can do something to you,
(02:06):
they can criticize you, they can knock you down.
And I truly believe that whatever fear and insecurity and shame and hesitation and all the
things that are going through our heads, we have to show up.
We have to speak up and speak out not just for ourselves because it is incredibly empowering
(02:28):
to push through your fears, but also for others to lead by example because I have learned
from women who I've seen, like the first time I heard a woman stand up at an event and
she was talking about banking and finance.
And I was in awe because I didn't know that women could or did talk about money in positions
(02:52):
of power in corporate America.
And this is 2003.
So a long time ago, but not that long ago.
You know, it's not that I didn't know it, but I hadn't seen it much and hadn't seen a lot
of women were doing it.
So hearing women negotiate and show up and be bold and brassy and brave, I was like, I
(03:15):
want to do that.
And so there's a recent example where I almost hesitated to speak up because of the room.
It didn't feel like the most welcoming room.
It didn't feel like there was a place.
There wasn't.
Nobody said, hey, does anyone have any questions or anything they want to share or say?
But I knew it was something I had to say and I went back like waving frantically because
(03:38):
I'm really, really tiny and it happened to me in the back, even though nobody puts baby
in the corner and nobody puts fireball in the corner.
And I said something to that effect of women need to show up and speak up and make our voices
heard and the message was along those lines.
And I didn't know how well it would or wouldn't be received.
It wasn't about being received.
(03:59):
It was just, I couldn't live with myself that day.
If I didn't say what was on my mind because this is what I do.
And so many women came up to me afterwards with all ages and said thank you for saying
that.
It was encouraging and inspiring.
And I also shared the fact that I was like, this might not be the room because nobody
asked me if I wanted to say something.
Maybe we need to stop waiting for permission and wait, not wait to be asked, but like how
(04:25):
did we connect, right?
I reached out to Sharon and I linked in comment.
She met in a comment section of somebody's LinkedIn posts and I said, I would like to talk
to you more.
I would like to get to know you.
You seem like a really interesting person.
No sales pitch.
Like I said, are you open to a networking?
And I always do this.
I put brackets and not sales call.
(04:48):
And that's led to she introduced me to both of you for this show.
And she and I are recording our own show where we speak up and we speak out.
And yes, the pale, stale and male, unholy trinity, we've all heard that.
We need male allies.
There's no question.
And everyone has had their, and I know I speak from white privilege.
(05:11):
And yet I think we can all be allies to each other.
The more diverse voices, the better.
I do comedy.
I understand that.
I have my own point of view and my own premises about, I talk about dating.
A lot of people talk about dating.
I talk about it with hope and optimism and a little bit of frustration, but also, and
I got back online because I'm a resilient little fireball.
(05:31):
I used a different word.
Some of my comedy is clean for the corporate stages and some of it is pretty filthy at night
at the clubs because we are all a combination of extremes on every spectrum.
What was the question and did that answer it?
(05:51):
You did answer it for sure.
It's about giving mentorship and giving examples for women to follow that they don't feel
so isolated or so afraid of taking the stage and stepping into the spotlight.
It's so important.
And whatever anyone's message is, like we all are, you know, I like to say, you are truly
(06:16):
unique, just like everybody else.
So we all have something about us that's different.
We could deliver the same line in different ways.
We have the same message, right?
Speak up and speak out, but from different lived experiences.
And I find a lot of women, and it's because of society and history and just the way we're
cultured to want to do it right.
(06:39):
What's everyone else doing?
Well, I have never fit in.
I've never looked or acted or thought or walked or talked like anybody else.
And that was a source of pain and trauma for so much of my life.
And when I finally learn to embrace, no, I'm never going to look different.
I am who I am.
My brain is my brain.
My personality is my personality.
I can either fight it or work with it.
(07:02):
And for me, the idea that we should all have to conform, you know, one size never fits
all.
So to help women speak their truth and tell their story in their own way and realize that
that's okay.
And you might not be, I'm not for, I am not, you know, what is it?
I am not everybody's cup of tea, but I am somebody's triple shot of fireball.
(07:25):
I have my expression.
I don't steal jokes or lines, but I love that.
People send them to me all the time.
There's another one that says, you will never be too much for someone who can't get enough
of you.
Right?
So whether you think you're too much or too little or too quiet or too loud or too tall
(07:47):
or too short, you are who you are and your message, your story, your lesson will resonate,
will matter, will inspire somebody, not everybody, but somebody.
And that to me, that's what makes us interesting.
I don't, God, nobody wants to meet more than one of me.
(08:09):
Oh my goodness, you're on it.
There is only one of each of us.
But that's what makes things interesting, like eating one food for the rest of your life
every single day all day.
Who would want that?
Variety.
And that's how we learn.
I want to learn from people with a different life experience, with different perspective,
(08:30):
with different opinions.
So I mean, I just so enjoy what you've said already and I think, wow, I mean, how that
one phrase that you just said, you know, you'll never be too much for someone who can't
get enough of you.
I mean, that one's going to stay with me for a long time because, you know, historically
women have been told, if you're not quiet, pleasant, and, you know, in your lane, then
(08:50):
you're too much.
So it's been a very purposeful effort to keep us silenced and easy to manage for quite
a long time.
So that is a very humbling and healing phrase.
But you know, as Christopher started us off with, you know, that women have more access
than we ever have to be able to vocalize, you know, what we're thinking are contributions,
(09:15):
see ourselves in different lights and strive for our own ambitions.
You know, with your podcast and with your work and with your humor, what do you think are
still some of the things that women feel like they're being held back or that they're
not showing up in their full authentic self?
Mm.
And so many ways.
That's a great question.
(09:37):
There's one term that I really do not like, the imposter syndrome, which we've all talked
about, right?
Women, I have the imposter syndrome.
I don't think I'm good enough.
And some of the work I do, listen, people pay me and give them confidence to get past these
ideas.
But in the sense of how do you translate it into work?
So how do you speak on a podcast when you're worried that people won't want to hear what
(10:01):
you have to say or how do you get up on a panel at a conference when you think you're
not as worthy or experienced or accomplished as the other men or even the other women on
the panel?
So to that point, the imposter syndrome is actually, they've done research about it.
It's been flipped the script and reframe it and rename it because imposter syndrome puts
(10:22):
the responsibility and the blame back on us, right?
It's our fault.
No, back to what's it that ingrained?
It's the authority gap.
It's another word, people.
The ambition penalty where if we've been told you're not good enough or who do you think
(10:42):
you are?
Oh, you're too bossy, right?
Men are bosses, women are bossy.
I've got a key chain since I was a kid and I still have it somewhere.
It's purple and pink and plastic.
Probably all microplastics or maybe before my capacity.
Everything in my life is micro, I'm this big.
But this tiny little key chain says, I'm not bossy, I just have better ideas.
(11:08):
And I look at them like damn, like younger me, actually kind of had her shit together in
some ways, like knew who she was.
But how did you or I never knew how to articulate that going into a job interview?
How do I say I have really great ideas?
Well now I know it's actually one of the 34 strengths and strengths finder themes proven
(11:28):
by the Gallup organization, like through evidence-based research, it's called ideation.
My number one strength is ideation.
I have incredible ideas that other people have in the bottom.
I see connections and connect the dots and put things together and why nobody else might
have them.
I can call it innovative and creative, it's strategic, but it's ideation.
So I'm not bossy, I just have better ideas.
(11:50):
Is a way to reframe and I think part of that reframing for women, I'm not as good as
them.
I don't know as much as they do.
You know differently.
You know maybe not as much, not the same, but that's what makes it interesting.
And one client that I was coaching and she said, well if I go up on stage and I take this
(12:11):
position on this panel, what if someone asked me a question, I don't know the answer to.
I can't say I don't know, I'll look like an idiot.
And to validate her point, this is a corporate America, short sort of Fortune 500, dealing
with money, banking and finance.
And I said, well first of all, people in that room are not trying to trip you up.
(12:34):
Their goal is not to make you look bad.
If somebody does that, somebody else better shut them down.
But like let's put that aside, let's assume that all the professionals in that room 99.9
percent are not actually, they're asking you to speak on the panel because you have something
to offer.
And if someone says ask you a question that you don't know the answer to, let's flip that
to an opportunity.
That's a great question.
(12:54):
So they're saying, I don't know, that's not my area of expertise.
But so and so on my team specializes in that, why don't I set up a meeting for us?
So now you've seen that she's confident, right?
Because I believe most competent people have the ones who are willing to submit, I don't
know something or want to learn more.
(13:15):
She's talked about her team because she's a leader and that she has diverse people.
And that's now an opportunity to get to know somebody else and you're still selling
them your expertise in a way.
One of my biggest beeps is people who walk in and think they know everything.
Like the stupidest person in the room is the guy and it's always the guy who thinks he
knows more than everyone else and cannot be convinced of anybody's opinion other than his
(13:37):
own.
So I'd rather say I don't know, teach me or I was wrong.
I'm sorry, I made a mistake.
You know, I thought I knew, I got that fact wrong.
Okay, fact checks, they'll check.
And also does it like what matters most?
(13:57):
Like what matters most in life and to me that's relationships.
People coming together, a friend is someone who knows everything about you and loves you
anyhow.
Right?
Like we have to as women especially and I do believe men need this too and it's not fair
to men that they've been trained and nurtured to always be right and never show weakness
(14:20):
and man up and balls this and balls that I say this.
An ironically is a woman whose company is Fireball Network because my boss, a woman, said
she's a little Fireball of energy higher her as a recommendation for a consulting gig.
But this idea that we're not allowed to be wrong, that we're not allowed to make mistakes,
that we're not allowed to fail is garbage.
(14:45):
We're human.
We're gonna make mistakes.
We're gonna fail.
We're gonna f up.
But if we don't, where's the growth otherwise?
It's interesting you said that because I read a piece where someone asked you about basically
if you could correct the mistakes you've made in the past, what would that look like?
(15:10):
And you mentioned that you wouldn't give up those mistakes or the things you were afraid
of or whatever it might be because they formed who you are today.
Wow.
You've done more research.
I don't even remember that one either but I'm like you gotta tell me because I gotta put
that out there.
But it's true.
I mean I'm not joking.
Yeah, I believe that.
(15:31):
Also we can't go back, right?
The trauma and the bullying and the insecurities that I've had because I was not always
this confident show up, you know, balls out whatever the expressions are like I, I mean
it now it's genuine.
I'm not pretending in any way.
Although there's still moments where I'm insecure and I feel a little, little and I suck
(15:54):
it up and you know, be brave.
I'm not fearless by any means but A, we can't go back.
So there's no point like and this is, I say this often.
I learned about this in therapy last week.
I'm gonna share with you this week which is something none of us would have said 10, 20
years ago you wouldn't admit this kind of stuff in a professional setting.
(16:17):
I was so shawker.
Like I was on the track to become a therapist.
I ran therapy with patients and their families.
Why would we be ashamed of it?
Because we're all human beings and we're dealing with very, very complicated worlds and complicated
lives.
So this is the expression that one of the many expressions, concepts that I really truly
(16:40):
believe in is no amount of regret will change the past and no amount of anxiety is gonna
change the future, create the future.
We're living in the here now.
And so for me at least a lot of the mistakes I made was, I did the, there's another, like
(17:00):
I did the best that I could with what I had in the situation I was in.
And I used to say so it wasn't my best.
It was just the best that I could do in that time and place under those circumstances.
Somebody who I was very, very close with for many years said, well, if you did the best
you could, under those circumstances, then that was your best.
(17:23):
And that's okay.
Like that really was the best you could do.
Don't diminish that.
And that also helped me reframe.
So, you know, are there some mistakes I would like to change that if I had the magic wand,
sure.
You know, maybe that outfit was really not a great idea.
You know, wrap dress on Park Avenue on a windy day is just Marilyn Monroe but without
(17:45):
the stylists around her.
The dress was cute but not, wasn't Marilyn Monroe like, you know, I just flashed Park Avenue.
That's probably not a mistake I would ever change because that popped up in my Facebook
memory and I'm like, well, that was a funny poster wrote about it.
Expose yourself.
Like show up and you know, speak your truth.
(18:05):
Like, again, is there a point to that story?
I don't know why I worked.
But like I could make one on, you know, women's fashion choices, wrap dresses.
I still like wrap dresses but I just, you know, plan according to, are there mistakes or
are there people I've dated or relationship, business relationships I've gotten into.
Have I let people take advantage of me or take advantage of my innocence or naive or kindness.
(18:31):
Was I a people pleaser?
Yes, those are all things that I have had to unlearn and relearn.
Are there people that didn't do that and like, we're not to begin with great but that's,
it's my truth and it's how I've gotten to where I am now.
And if, if and not just if but when and how I can help other people like, that is my
(18:55):
story and those, that is my transformation.
I was like, I used to be like this.
I'm still the same person but I got rid of some of the bad habits.
I learned some new ones.
I used to be ashamed of certain things like, I'm not being able to fit in or match up or
be like other people, which is a stupid thing to be ashamed of but it's also what we were
(19:16):
taught.
Like, oh, you're not, you're not this successful.
You're not that, but it's your looks or your money or your job title or whatever.
Your living situation and learning to let go of that transformative.
So I've learned from other people, right?
Again, that is the number one lesson is we learned from others, we teach others.
(19:38):
So as long as there is a meaning in it and we can make, it's not that everything happens
for a reason.
Sometimes there's just bad luck and shit happens.
But if we can make meaning out of it or use it as a, you know, don't repeat the same
mistakes twice.
A little too often if I had to say after bad day, well, that was another learning experience.
(19:59):
Oh, no, not another effing learning experience.
But now it's like, it's material.
It's calming.
I love that.
I mean, I think that, you know, I'm just really curious on this question because you have
(20:21):
articulated something that a lot of us feel, which is, you know, that failure is kind of
part of the human code and just part of our experience.
And also sometimes we tend to repeat the same learning experiences, shall we say.
(20:41):
So I mean, what do you find a good balance for you where you really try to learn from
the past and apply it to moving forward?
But sometimes the universe or our lives, we just feel like we're stuck in a pattern or
making those same learning experiences again and again.
What do you have for our guests when they're feeling a bit stuck?
(21:03):
That is a really great question.
One that I'm going to bring to my therapist next week.
He's awesome.
My therapist is a man.
In fact, male and pale, but definitely not stale.
So there's a few things, right?
Getting stuck, but making the same mistakes over and over again, my thought is a really big
(21:25):
problem, right?
Those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it.
So recognizing our patterns is really important.
And back to like no matter what, we'll change the past, no matter anxiety is going to create
your future.
I mean, we'll just create a really anxious one.
For me at least, I can't speak for everybody, but even for my clients, there's three ways.
(21:48):
One, we need to look at ourselves and say, what did I do wrong there?
Like, what wrong in the sense of what did I not like about that interaction?
Did I give up something from a people-pleasing standpoint?
If I really wanted to spend the day doing XYZ, but a friend asked me to do ABC and I didn't
really want to, but I said yes because I didn't want to disappoint her because that might
(22:09):
mean I'd lose the friendship or I didn't want to hurt her feelings or all that stories.
Well, that's shame on me.
Like, I have to be able to set, you know, boundary standards, expectations.
And being honest, I think what people is really important.
Also getting feedback from other people, friends, trusted friends, coaches, therapists, like
do not try to figure it out alone.
And I don't just say this because I am a coach who's also a social worker, but no one succeeds
(22:35):
alone, no one thrives.
We don't live in a vacuum.
We need perspective.
So that's another mistake I think I made in the past was not asking for more help, not
asking, not opening up.
And one of my new but still very dear friends, when I confided something to her and she's
like, you gotta let that shit go.
(22:56):
That baggage is way too heavy.
Stop dragging it around.
And that was like, you make a choice.
Do I want to keep carrying and schlepping the bags that are bigger than me?
Because I over pack.
I tend to over pack.
That's another lesson.
Right?
Metaphorically and literally.
(23:17):
Or do you want to face the fear and who do you want to be?
So one of the first step in fixing a problem is acknowledging that you have a problem.
If you know there's something getting you stuck that you feel bad about it.
I have lots of systems values, like a gut check for me.
It's really critical.
And again, a coach taught me this.
(23:38):
And then I took it and I expanded on it.
So one of the things I do is I sit down, sit somewhere quietly, generally close my eyes,
because visual stimulation gets me thinking, so it's like, okay, if I have to make a choice
between two friends, two things, you know, two things I want to do or don't want to do.
How do I feel?
How do I want to feel if I do XYZ?
(24:00):
How will I feel or do I want to feel if I do ABC?
If I miss, if I don't do the first one, how will I feel about missing it?
And sometimes I'll say, well, it could be a choice between two networking events or going
to networking event or going to dance class.
I mean, this, to me, this framework works personally, professionally, almost anything.
(24:20):
How will I feel if I miss it?
Well, if I miss it, I missed it.
I'll never know, right?
Or how will I feel if I didn't do this?
Or how will I feel if I go to this and it's bad?
Now I can either kick myself all day long and say, oh, you made a bad choice.
Oh, look at you.
You're dumb.
That was really wrong.
Or I can say, okay, try it.
At least I tried it or I didn't go.
(24:42):
That's it.
One of the things I do for networking events is I kind of, I go in with a strategy, I go
in with a goal.
But I also say, serendipity, let's just see something will happen, something good will
happen.
What shall be shall be I will meet who I will meet.
I always end up meeting somebody interesting.
(25:03):
Many people.
So figuring out what you're willing is the pain of making the same mistake over and over again,
is the pain of living with old habits of being afraid to speak up at work, of being afraid
to chase a client and make a cold call, make a warm introduction, get on a podcast, is
the pain and the fear of all that.
(25:25):
Is it worth letting that go on versus the pain and fear of like taking a chance?
And one thing and I will say this forever and ever and ever, and this is like social work
is about empowerment.
It's not about telling people what it's to do.
It's helping them figure out what's right for them.
When you face a fear, whatever the result, when you try something that you were scared of
or you try something new, it builds confidence.
(25:49):
It inherently, like I know that when I have admitted something to someone and they're
like, you go girl, don't let anybody else dim your lights or put out your fire.
Don't take that crap from somebody else.
Whatever the situation or like go after it, what sort of thing can happen?
It's like, oh wow.
And all of a sudden, I'm a little more confident and the things that scared me last week don't
(26:11):
scare me anymore.
There's another scary thing up ahead to try, but like I'm more equipped to deal with it.
I've done the reps.
I carried the heavy bags.
So to me, I like that idea.
I don't talk about getting outside your comfort zone necessarily.
It's stretching your comfort zone.
So it's even bigger.
(26:31):
This is somebody who only has this much reach, but I'm very flexible.
It's only like, it's only like, I can reach things.
I go all the stretch.
I love because on my screen, the way I see your arms are going beyond like the box that
you're in.
So it looks like you could reach anywhere girl, literally anywhere.
I know that.
(26:52):
But for a clean, can we say that to all your listeners, girl, you can reach anywhere.
Like truly virgin beauty bitch, whoever you are, reach, reach for it, stretch.
Like why can't there's a lot I can't reach, but that's why I have people in my life who
help me.
That's why I have the order of advisors and I collaborate with other people and I have
(27:16):
a thing for tall women apparently to collaborate with tall women.
And whatever it is, most of my female collaborators like close to six feet or over six feet tall
because there's things I can't reach without them.
And things they can't reach without you.
You drop something on the floor.
I'm going to visit you.
I'm closer to the ground.
(27:37):
It's easier for me.
I want to feel needed.
You might throw your back out.
It's going to take you longer to see.
I'm ready.
Right.
You have like a really strong center.
Gravity.
And there's like stability there.
It's not the only stability in my life, but yeah.
I am not what we would call stable.
No, I'm joking.
It's part of my comedy.
(27:58):
I'm not, you know, God is not a great structural engineer.
I have like really short legs and really big brains.
Really, God is fair, but she is a lousy structural engineer.
And so like I say, I'm not physically stable or mentally stable or rent stable.
The humor lens is how I get through a lot of things in life.
(28:20):
So I appreciate that that's an element that you bring to the table.
We love to ask our guests this question of the virgin, the beauty and the bitch.
Is there one that really stands out to you and brings something out for you?
Bitch.
I have to go with that because it's not something I ever embraced in the past.
Or maybe I did, but I didn't really own it.
(28:41):
And also there's a song, a bitch, babe in total control of herself.
And this was a gut check.
Because at first I was like, they all mean something in former English major.
And as a creative, like we can find meaning in anything, right?
Beauty, actually I played the lead that I played in.
(29:03):
She played the devil.
Her name was Lucy, like Lucifer.
It was a play.
I was young.
I was just at a high school.
And it was a scene about beauty.
She wanted a baby more than anything in the world and she couldn't have a baby and do the
performers and her freak show, which is of course totally like NPC.
And this is unfortunately what circuses were about.
(29:24):
They were the ugliest couple in the world.
And they wanted beauty more than anything they were going to give up their child for.
Now, why do I tell you this?
I mean, it's a whole other story.
And I walked into there thinking, well, if I'm lucky, I'll get cast in the back row of
the chorus.
And like the most incredible show, they're like, we want you for the lead.
And so I didn't step into the beauty part.
(29:44):
I was a virgin back then in every way of like shy and insecure and naive and innocent.
I think we're all virgins in a lot of ways.
There's things we don't know.
There's things to learn.
I was watching an old comedy set.
I said, well, I was a virgin until today.
I just got my first dick pick.
I was like, wait, you're out of 50, 51.
(30:07):
Oh my god, my first photograph of unsolicited, because solicited is all other story.
So we're all virgins in some ways.
But that word only applies to women, which is a whole other problem.
People don't ask, men, are you?
Are you not?
Do they check?
Beauty is what?
We've always been judged for our exterior appearance for women so much more than men.
(30:32):
So that carries so much weight.
But I think what is beauty is your soul, is your personality.
You know, if you show up and not care what we look like or what we're dressed and who cares
about it, like beauty is your soul.
Are you a beautiful human being?
That to me is what matters.
Are you kind to others?
Do you work for what you want?
(30:52):
Do you speak up for what you believe in?
But bitch is like, let's only, like we, we, I have learned to be a bitch.
I was not in the past.
I was truly shy and insecure.
I would advocate for others.
I would fight for others, no matter what.
Like that didn't scare me, but to advocate for myself, to speak up and stand out and fight
(31:15):
back against abuse and all of it.
No, and somebody wants to call me a bitch for standing up for myself or standing up for
somebody else.
They even total control for self.
Thank you for the compliment.
Thank you for acknowledging my power.
It's also a bit of a fear thing, right?
If someone thinks you're tough and strong and scary, they won't mess with you, which is
(31:39):
why Chihuahua is the yapiest and nice.
What?
I am like a Chihuahua.
Not regard.
My bark is generally worse than my bite.
Oh, there's no way it goes all my negotiating thread.
Oh, like yeah, she's actually, I'm like, no, people are like, "Dena's really, really sweet
behind, but don't mess with her because you will regret it."
(32:02):
If you cross her, if you do the wrong thing, I don't talk to you, making mistakes is one
thing.
But if you hurt me or my friends, again, misconjeionality, if anyone here hurts any of my
friends, they will feel the wrath of you.
(32:24):
It's like you're hitting the nail on the head as far as Heather and I are concerned and
why we use these words the way they have been presented.
They are seen historically as one way, but as you just articulated, they are deeper, wider,
broader, and carry such weight.
(32:46):
That is why we are called what we're called.
As far as the vicious concern, that is an area that Heather and I will be getting into
in depth over the next little while.
As you said, it is a woman expressing her true self.
It is a woman stepping out of what she has been conditioned to be.
(33:12):
It is who we all are, but for women, especially, and the way they're conditioned in society,
the bitch is power, true power.
That is an area we will be going into in depth with talking with people who are experts on
these kinds of topics.
(33:35):
Thank you for sharing your perspective on that.
We are so in alignment, it is not even funny.
Thank you.
This really was a treat.
Thank you for giving.
We started off.
You said you don't have to tell a woman to take a platform and speak up and you've let
me talk almost non-stop for the better part of 45 minutes.
(33:57):
I appreciate it because I do your platform and your questions.
Your questions are really good.
Thank you.
It is a lot of fun.
They are deep.
They're not the usual.
I purposely didn't prepare for today.
I don't script.
I think a little bit about what I want to talk about, but because of the way you structured
(34:21):
it and positioned it, we want it to be organic.
We want it to be honest and authentic and great.
No agenda.
Either them show up, have fun.
Be myself.
Knowing what the title was, knowing that the two questions, when you said you want us to
ask you about what being feminine means or beauty bit.
I was like, why not both?
(34:44):
I don't love rules.
I don't like playing favorites.
I know there was something I said that I said that I wanted to note to that.
I said something that I think may have come out not exactly the way I meant it.
At this point, I was right before you asked me to be one of a beauty bit.
No one's for it.
Whatever.
(35:05):
Quote and Quote mistakes.
We're all here to support each other and connect and build the community and relationships.
Let's have fun at it.
That was my whole plan about diminishing myself.
Not stable.
It always comes back to it.
(35:25):
We should not diminish ourselves.
All kidding aside, this is really adequate.
It's one thing to joke about diminishing ourselves.
I may say, oh, I'm unstable.
That's a joke.
We do need to own our power.
I'm saying this to anybody that thinks, oh, we need to pretend like we're not so strong.
Once we are confident enough, that's the friend of someone who knows everything about you
(35:46):
and loves you anyhow.
When you're confident enough in your power, you can joke about yourself in a way that isn't
diminishing, self-deprecating for a reason, for a lesson, to say, hey, none of us are entirely
stable or perfect.
It's an unstable world.
But not to own that message of, oh, I'm a failure, I'm an F-Ob, look, I'm horrible.
(36:08):
Now, on the other hand, you say, I'm a bitch like it's a bad thing.
Oh, it's a compliment.
It's missing what fireball bitch you, babe.
I'm like Queen bitch to you.
To get in touch with me, I really do love connecting with people.
(36:30):
Truly, I design networking events.
I design networking experiences to bring people together.
So for all of you who are listening, I take phone calls.
I mean, I have a scheduler to set up.
Networking calls and Zoom calls and coffee meetings.
It's fireballnetwork.com is our website.
I am FireballDena on Instagram.
(36:50):
Dena Bakelitz on LinkedIn.
You can also find me on most of the dating apps.
[laughter]
It's not me asking that one.
I'm like, "Where can we find you?" I'm like, “Bumble, Hinge, Tinder, Change it."
She's like, "No, social media.
I'm like, same thing."
I'm on all the dating apps.
(37:11):
LinkedIn, New York Stock Exchange.
I don't even know me.
I just like to be on somebody's lineup on HBO Netflix.
But I'm Apple+TV.
But right now, find me on all the socials or most of them under FireballDena.
Fireball Network, Deena Baikowitz.
I genuinely mean that.
(37:33):
If anybody wants to talk, I truly love connecting with human beings.
I'm in the business and pleasure of relationships.
It's all about the sparks and the chemistry that happens when we share our stories and connect.
Funny to say that because in reading about you and now meeting you and talking to you,
I see the wire that goes between one lamp post of the next.
(37:57):
The next through the entire city or the entire world basically, you are that wire.
You see electricity that runs through that wire connecting these points of light.
That's how I see who you are.
Oh my God.
That's beautiful.
I love that analogy, Christopher.
Electricity.
And light.
Thank you.
(38:20):
I'm Fireball.
Thank you.
I mean, we talk about, you know, networking is sparks and chemistry between people.
It's like when you are on a date, if there's chemistry of the second date, if you're at a networking event,
you're at work, you're interviewing for a job, you want to join a committee,
you want to do volunteer work, you have a meeting a friend, you're trying out a new dance class.
Is there chemistry?
(38:41):
Is it a fit?
Like, do we want to get to know each other better?
It's not a one night stand, like anything else.
I mean, one night stands or one night stands.
No, that's just what they are.
But I like to say there's no instant gratification networking, except for the instant gratification of having a human interaction.
Even if it doesn't lead to anything, it's that in that moment.
(39:03):
What did you learn?
Night, Learn, I never want to talk to that person again.
Or this woman does not know how to shut up.
But she was very entertaining.
So I should probably buy tickets to her show or book her out of conference.
But yeah, I thank you for that.
I truly though that is, it's taken me a while to own an embrace.
(39:26):
Because I don't believe in false modesty, but I also don't like narcissists and ecotists or just it's me.
It's me. It's me.
I always say I would always rather share the spotlight than be on stage alone.
Like if one light can try, like, let me shine the light on what you do.
We totally understand that.
But thank you so much for taking time to be with us, for being yourself with us.
(39:51):
Which we appreciate more than you can imagine.
It can only be ourselves, right? Who else are we going to be?
Maybe that's the thing to embrace to all of your listeners.
Just embrace who you are. You can only be yourself.
Don't ever try to be somebody else unless you're acting in a role.
In real life, like, show up as you. You are enough.
(40:13):
You're not too much. You're not enough. You're just who you are.
That's what we're working with.
And yes, on that note, you have been listening to the Virgin Beauty and the rich and the fiery bitch.
Yeah, sure.
Share us and bring your friends. Come on back to become a partner in the BBB community.
(40:37):
We invite you to find us at virginbeautybitch.com
Like us on Facebook, Instagram and LinkedIn.
And share us with people who are defiantly different, like you.
Until next time, thanks for listening.
(upbeat music)
Inspiring women to overcome social stereotypes and share unique
(00:10):
life experiences without fear of being defiantly different.
Your hosts, Christopher and Heather, let's talk, shall we?
In all of human history, women have never had more access, more opportunity or more
invitation to speak their truth and share their unique experiences.
(00:31):
Yet many of those opportunities come and go in silence.
But why?
It's a topic for conversation with coach, trainer, writer, speaker, marketing director,
and comedian, Deena Baikowitz, aka FireballDeena.
Welcome to Virgin Beauty Bitch.
I love that introduction, that is so much of what I'm about women in particular, but
(00:57):
people in general speaking their truth.
That's right.
Telling our stories.
I clipped the quote actually from a recent article you did and I'm paraphrasing here
a bit, but basically the quote reads, "It's so important for women to speak up and show
up instead of it, the message being quite frankly the usual pale, stale, and male."
(01:22):
Now Heather and I agree, but please some context to that tantalizing it, take of yours.
Wow.
I'm not sure which article I wrote that in.
I agree with it, obviously I said it.
I can't, I don't take credit for other people's words.
I use a lot of words in my own.
I don't go who coined the term pale, stale, and male.
I'm involved in so many women's groups and I truly believe in pay it forward, each one
(01:46):
teach one we learn and we teach.
But women tend to, to shrank back, to shrink back, to be more afraid to speak up for all
the reasons we know of because it puts us in the hot seat in a bad way.
If you show up, your risk of being hurt, if people see you, they can do something to you,
(02:06):
they can criticize you, they can knock you down.
And I truly believe that whatever fear and insecurity and shame and hesitation and all the
things that are going through our heads, we have to show up.
We have to speak up and speak out not just for ourselves because it is incredibly empowering
(02:28):
to push through your fears, but also for others to lead by example because I have learned
from women who I've seen, like the first time I heard a woman stand up at an event and
she was talking about banking and finance.
And I was in awe because I didn't know that women could or did talk about money in positions
(02:52):
of power in corporate America.
And this is 2003.
So a long time ago, but not that long ago.
You know, it's not that I didn't know it, but I hadn't seen it much and hadn't seen a lot
of women were doing it.
So hearing women negotiate and show up and be bold and brassy and brave, I was like, I
(03:15):
want to do that.
And so there's a recent example where I almost hesitated to speak up because of the room.
It didn't feel like the most welcoming room.
It didn't feel like there was a place.
There wasn't.
Nobody said, hey, does anyone have any questions or anything they want to share or say?
But I knew it was something I had to say and I went back like waving frantically because
(03:38):
I'm really, really tiny and it happened to me in the back, even though nobody puts baby
in the corner and nobody puts fireball in the corner.
And I said something to that effect of women need to show up and speak up and make our voices
heard and the message was along those lines.
And I didn't know how well it would or wouldn't be received.
It wasn't about being received.
(03:59):
It was just, I couldn't live with myself that day.
If I didn't say what was on my mind because this is what I do.
And so many women came up to me afterwards with all ages and said thank you for saying
that.
It was encouraging and inspiring.
And I also shared the fact that I was like, this might not be the room because nobody
asked me if I wanted to say something.
Maybe we need to stop waiting for permission and wait, not wait to be asked, but like how
(04:25):
did we connect, right?
I reached out to Sharon and I linked in comment.
She met in a comment section of somebody's LinkedIn posts and I said, I would like to talk
to you more.
I would like to get to know you.
You seem like a really interesting person.
No sales pitch.
Like I said, are you open to a networking?
And I always do this.
I put brackets and not sales call.
(04:48):
And that's led to she introduced me to both of you for this show.
And she and I are recording our own show where we speak up and we speak out.
And yes, the pale, stale and male, unholy trinity, we've all heard that.
We need male allies.
There's no question.
And everyone has had their, and I know I speak from white privilege.
(05:11):
And yet I think we can all be allies to each other.
The more diverse voices, the better.
I do comedy.
I understand that.
I have my own point of view and my own premises about, I talk about dating.
A lot of people talk about dating.
I talk about it with hope and optimism and a little bit of frustration, but also, and
I got back online because I'm a resilient little fireball.
(05:31):
I used a different word.
Some of my comedy is clean for the corporate stages and some of it is pretty filthy at night
at the clubs because we are all a combination of extremes on every spectrum.
What was the question and did that answer it?
(05:51):
You did answer it for sure.
It's about giving mentorship and giving examples for women to follow that they don't feel
so isolated or so afraid of taking the stage and stepping into the spotlight.
It's so important.
And whatever anyone's message is, like we all are, you know, I like to say, you are truly
(06:16):
unique, just like everybody else.
So we all have something about us that's different.
We could deliver the same line in different ways.
We have the same message, right?
Speak up and speak out, but from different lived experiences.
And I find a lot of women, and it's because of society and history and just the way we're
cultured to want to do it right.
(06:39):
What's everyone else doing?
Well, I have never fit in.
I've never looked or acted or thought or walked or talked like anybody else.
And that was a source of pain and trauma for so much of my life.
And when I finally learn to embrace, no, I'm never going to look different.
I am who I am.
My brain is my brain.
My personality is my personality.
I can either fight it or work with it.
(07:02):
And for me, the idea that we should all have to conform, you know, one size never fits
all.
So to help women speak their truth and tell their story in their own way and realize that
that's okay.
And you might not be, I'm not for, I am not, you know, what is it?
I am not everybody's cup of tea, but I am somebody's triple shot of fireball.
(07:25):
I have my expression.
I don't steal jokes or lines, but I love that.
People send them to me all the time.
There's another one that says, you will never be too much for someone who can't get enough
of you.
Right?
So whether you think you're too much or too little or too quiet or too loud or too tall
(07:47):
or too short, you are who you are and your message, your story, your lesson will resonate,
will matter, will inspire somebody, not everybody, but somebody.
And that to me, that's what makes us interesting.
I don't, God, nobody wants to meet more than one of me.
(08:09):
Oh my goodness, you're on it.
There is only one of each of us.
But that's what makes things interesting, like eating one food for the rest of your life
every single day all day.
Who would want that?
Variety.
And that's how we learn.
I want to learn from people with a different life experience, with different perspective,
(08:30):
with different opinions.
So I mean, I just so enjoy what you've said already and I think, wow, I mean, how that
one phrase that you just said, you know, you'll never be too much for someone who can't
get enough of you.
I mean, that one's going to stay with me for a long time because, you know, historically
women have been told, if you're not quiet, pleasant, and, you know, in your lane, then
(08:50):
you're too much.
So it's been a very purposeful effort to keep us silenced and easy to manage for quite
a long time.
So that is a very humbling and healing phrase.
But you know, as Christopher started us off with, you know, that women have more access
than we ever have to be able to vocalize, you know, what we're thinking are contributions,
(09:15):
see ourselves in different lights and strive for our own ambitions.
You know, with your podcast and with your work and with your humor, what do you think are
still some of the things that women feel like they're being held back or that they're
not showing up in their full authentic self?
Mm.
And so many ways.
That's a great question.
(09:37):
There's one term that I really do not like, the imposter syndrome, which we've all talked
about, right?
Women, I have the imposter syndrome.
I don't think I'm good enough.
And some of the work I do, listen, people pay me and give them confidence to get past these
ideas.
But in the sense of how do you translate it into work?
So how do you speak on a podcast when you're worried that people won't want to hear what
(10:01):
you have to say or how do you get up on a panel at a conference when you think you're
not as worthy or experienced or accomplished as the other men or even the other women on
the panel?
So to that point, the imposter syndrome is actually, they've done research about it.
It's been flipped the script and reframe it and rename it because imposter syndrome puts
(10:22):
the responsibility and the blame back on us, right?
It's our fault.
No, back to what's it that ingrained?
It's the authority gap.
It's another word, people.
The ambition penalty where if we've been told you're not good enough or who do you think
(10:42):
you are?
Oh, you're too bossy, right?
Men are bosses, women are bossy.
I've got a key chain since I was a kid and I still have it somewhere.
It's purple and pink and plastic.
Probably all microplastics or maybe before my capacity.
Everything in my life is micro, I'm this big.
But this tiny little key chain says, I'm not bossy, I just have better ideas.
(11:08):
And I look at them like damn, like younger me, actually kind of had her shit together in
some ways, like knew who she was.
But how did you or I never knew how to articulate that going into a job interview?
How do I say I have really great ideas?
Well now I know it's actually one of the 34 strengths and strengths finder themes proven
(11:28):
by the Gallup organization, like through evidence-based research, it's called ideation.
My number one strength is ideation.
I have incredible ideas that other people have in the bottom.
I see connections and connect the dots and put things together and why nobody else might
have them.
I can call it innovative and creative, it's strategic, but it's ideation.
So I'm not bossy, I just have better ideas.
(11:50):
Is a way to reframe and I think part of that reframing for women, I'm not as good as
them.
I don't know as much as they do.
You know differently.
You know maybe not as much, not the same, but that's what makes it interesting.
And one client that I was coaching and she said, well if I go up on stage and I take this
(12:11):
position on this panel, what if someone asked me a question, I don't know the answer to.
I can't say I don't know, I'll look like an idiot.
And to validate her point, this is a corporate America, short sort of Fortune 500, dealing
with money, banking and finance.
And I said, well first of all, people in that room are not trying to trip you up.
(12:34):
Their goal is not to make you look bad.
If somebody does that, somebody else better shut them down.
But like let's put that aside, let's assume that all the professionals in that room 99.9
percent are not actually, they're asking you to speak on the panel because you have something
to offer.
And if someone says ask you a question that you don't know the answer to, let's flip that
to an opportunity.
That's a great question.
(12:54):
So they're saying, I don't know, that's not my area of expertise.
But so and so on my team specializes in that, why don't I set up a meeting for us?
So now you've seen that she's confident, right?
Because I believe most competent people have the ones who are willing to submit, I don't
know something or want to learn more.
(13:15):
She's talked about her team because she's a leader and that she has diverse people.
And that's now an opportunity to get to know somebody else and you're still selling
them your expertise in a way.
One of my biggest beeps is people who walk in and think they know everything.
Like the stupidest person in the room is the guy and it's always the guy who thinks he
knows more than everyone else and cannot be convinced of anybody's opinion other than his
(13:37):
own.
So I'd rather say I don't know, teach me or I was wrong.
I'm sorry, I made a mistake.
You know, I thought I knew, I got that fact wrong.
Okay, fact checks, they'll check.
And also does it like what matters most?
(13:57):
Like what matters most in life and to me that's relationships.
People coming together, a friend is someone who knows everything about you and loves you
anyhow.
Right?
Like we have to as women especially and I do believe men need this too and it's not fair
to men that they've been trained and nurtured to always be right and never show weakness
(14:20):
and man up and balls this and balls that I say this.
An ironically is a woman whose company is Fireball Network because my boss, a woman, said
she's a little Fireball of energy higher her as a recommendation for a consulting gig.
But this idea that we're not allowed to be wrong, that we're not allowed to make mistakes,
that we're not allowed to fail is garbage.
(14:45):
We're human.
We're gonna make mistakes.
We're gonna fail.
We're gonna f up.
But if we don't, where's the growth otherwise?
It's interesting you said that because I read a piece where someone asked you about basically
if you could correct the mistakes you've made in the past, what would that look like?
(15:10):
And you mentioned that you wouldn't give up those mistakes or the things you were afraid
of or whatever it might be because they formed who you are today.
Wow.
You've done more research.
I don't even remember that one either but I'm like you gotta tell me because I gotta put
that out there.
But it's true.
I mean I'm not joking.
Yeah, I believe that.
(15:31):
Also we can't go back, right?
The trauma and the bullying and the insecurities that I've had because I was not always
this confident show up, you know, balls out whatever the expressions are like I, I mean
it now it's genuine.
I'm not pretending in any way.
Although there's still moments where I'm insecure and I feel a little, little and I suck
(15:54):
it up and you know, be brave.
I'm not fearless by any means but A, we can't go back.
So there's no point like and this is, I say this often.
I learned about this in therapy last week.
I'm gonna share with you this week which is something none of us would have said 10, 20
years ago you wouldn't admit this kind of stuff in a professional setting.
(16:17):
I was so shawker.
Like I was on the track to become a therapist.
I ran therapy with patients and their families.
Why would we be ashamed of it?
Because we're all human beings and we're dealing with very, very complicated worlds and complicated
lives.
So this is the expression that one of the many expressions, concepts that I really truly
(16:40):
believe in is no amount of regret will change the past and no amount of anxiety is gonna
change the future, create the future.
We're living in the here now.
And so for me at least a lot of the mistakes I made was, I did the, there's another, like
(17:00):
I did the best that I could with what I had in the situation I was in.
And I used to say so it wasn't my best.
It was just the best that I could do in that time and place under those circumstances.
Somebody who I was very, very close with for many years said, well, if you did the best
you could, under those circumstances, then that was your best.
(17:23):
And that's okay.
Like that really was the best you could do.
Don't diminish that.
And that also helped me reframe.
So, you know, are there some mistakes I would like to change that if I had the magic wand,
sure.
You know, maybe that outfit was really not a great idea.
You know, wrap dress on Park Avenue on a windy day is just Marilyn Monroe but without
(17:45):
the stylists around her.
The dress was cute but not, wasn't Marilyn Monroe like, you know, I just flashed Park Avenue.
That's probably not a mistake I would ever change because that popped up in my Facebook
memory and I'm like, well, that was a funny poster wrote about it.
Expose yourself.
Like show up and you know, speak your truth.
(18:05):
Like, again, is there a point to that story?
I don't know why I worked.
But like I could make one on, you know, women's fashion choices, wrap dresses.
I still like wrap dresses but I just, you know, plan according to, are there mistakes or
are there people I've dated or relationship, business relationships I've gotten into.
Have I let people take advantage of me or take advantage of my innocence or naive or kindness.
(18:31):
Was I a people pleaser?
Yes, those are all things that I have had to unlearn and relearn.
Are there people that didn't do that and like, we're not to begin with great but that's,
it's my truth and it's how I've gotten to where I am now.
And if, if and not just if but when and how I can help other people like, that is my
(18:55):
story and those, that is my transformation.
I was like, I used to be like this.
I'm still the same person but I got rid of some of the bad habits.
I learned some new ones.
I used to be ashamed of certain things like, I'm not being able to fit in or match up or
be like other people, which is a stupid thing to be ashamed of but it's also what we were
(19:16):
taught.
Like, oh, you're not, you're not this successful.
You're not that, but it's your looks or your money or your job title or whatever.
Your living situation and learning to let go of that transformative.
So I've learned from other people, right?
Again, that is the number one lesson is we learned from others, we teach others.
(19:38):
So as long as there is a meaning in it and we can make, it's not that everything happens
for a reason.
Sometimes there's just bad luck and shit happens.
But if we can make meaning out of it or use it as a, you know, don't repeat the same
mistakes twice.
A little too often if I had to say after bad day, well, that was another learning experience.
(19:59):
Oh, no, not another effing learning experience.
But now it's like, it's material.
It's calming.
I love that.
I mean, I think that, you know, I'm just really curious on this question because you have
(20:21):
articulated something that a lot of us feel, which is, you know, that failure is kind of
part of the human code and just part of our experience.
And also sometimes we tend to repeat the same learning experiences, shall we say.
(20:41):
So I mean, what do you find a good balance for you where you really try to learn from
the past and apply it to moving forward?
But sometimes the universe or our lives, we just feel like we're stuck in a pattern or
making those same learning experiences again and again.
What do you have for our guests when they're feeling a bit stuck?
(21:03):
That is a really great question.
One that I'm going to bring to my therapist next week.
He's awesome.
My therapist is a man.
In fact, male and pale, but definitely not stale.
So there's a few things, right?
Getting stuck, but making the same mistakes over and over again, my thought is a really big
(21:25):
problem, right?
Those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it.
So recognizing our patterns is really important.
And back to like no matter what, we'll change the past, no matter anxiety is going to create
your future.
I mean, we'll just create a really anxious one.
For me at least, I can't speak for everybody, but even for my clients, there's three ways.
(21:48):
One, we need to look at ourselves and say, what did I do wrong there?
Like, what wrong in the sense of what did I not like about that interaction?
Did I give up something from a people-pleasing standpoint?
If I really wanted to spend the day doing XYZ, but a friend asked me to do ABC and I didn't
really want to, but I said yes because I didn't want to disappoint her because that might
(22:09):
mean I'd lose the friendship or I didn't want to hurt her feelings or all that stories.
Well, that's shame on me.
Like, I have to be able to set, you know, boundary standards, expectations.
And being honest, I think what people is really important.
Also getting feedback from other people, friends, trusted friends, coaches, therapists, like
do not try to figure it out alone.
And I don't just say this because I am a coach who's also a social worker, but no one succeeds
(22:35):
alone, no one thrives.
We don't live in a vacuum.
We need perspective.
So that's another mistake I think I made in the past was not asking for more help, not
asking, not opening up.
And one of my new but still very dear friends, when I confided something to her and she's
like, you gotta let that shit go.
(22:56):
That baggage is way too heavy.
Stop dragging it around.
And that was like, you make a choice.
Do I want to keep carrying and schlepping the bags that are bigger than me?
Because I over pack.
I tend to over pack.
That's another lesson.
Right?
Metaphorically and literally.
(23:17):
Or do you want to face the fear and who do you want to be?
So one of the first step in fixing a problem is acknowledging that you have a problem.
If you know there's something getting you stuck that you feel bad about it.
I have lots of systems values, like a gut check for me.
It's really critical.
And again, a coach taught me this.
(23:38):
And then I took it and I expanded on it.
So one of the things I do is I sit down, sit somewhere quietly, generally close my eyes,
because visual stimulation gets me thinking, so it's like, okay, if I have to make a choice
between two friends, two things, you know, two things I want to do or don't want to do.
How do I feel?
How do I want to feel if I do XYZ?
(24:00):
How will I feel or do I want to feel if I do ABC?
If I miss, if I don't do the first one, how will I feel about missing it?
And sometimes I'll say, well, it could be a choice between two networking events or going
to networking event or going to dance class.
I mean, this, to me, this framework works personally, professionally, almost anything.
(24:20):
How will I feel if I miss it?
Well, if I miss it, I missed it.
I'll never know, right?
Or how will I feel if I didn't do this?
Or how will I feel if I go to this and it's bad?
Now I can either kick myself all day long and say, oh, you made a bad choice.
Oh, look at you.
You're dumb.
That was really wrong.
Or I can say, okay, try it.
At least I tried it or I didn't go.
(24:42):
That's it.
One of the things I do for networking events is I kind of, I go in with a strategy, I go
in with a goal.
But I also say, serendipity, let's just see something will happen, something good will
happen.
What shall be shall be I will meet who I will meet.
I always end up meeting somebody interesting.
(25:03):
Many people.
So figuring out what you're willing is the pain of making the same mistake over and over again,
is the pain of living with old habits of being afraid to speak up at work, of being afraid
to chase a client and make a cold call, make a warm introduction, get on a podcast, is
the pain and the fear of all that.
(25:25):
Is it worth letting that go on versus the pain and fear of like taking a chance?
And one thing and I will say this forever and ever and ever, and this is like social work
is about empowerment.
It's not about telling people what it's to do.
It's helping them figure out what's right for them.
When you face a fear, whatever the result, when you try something that you were scared of
or you try something new, it builds confidence.
(25:49):
It inherently, like I know that when I have admitted something to someone and they're
like, you go girl, don't let anybody else dim your lights or put out your fire.
Don't take that crap from somebody else.
Whatever the situation or like go after it, what sort of thing can happen?
It's like, oh wow.
And all of a sudden, I'm a little more confident and the things that scared me last week don't
(26:11):
scare me anymore.
There's another scary thing up ahead to try, but like I'm more equipped to deal with it.
I've done the reps.
I carried the heavy bags.
So to me, I like that idea.
I don't talk about getting outside your comfort zone necessarily.
It's stretching your comfort zone.
So it's even bigger.
(26:31):
This is somebody who only has this much reach, but I'm very flexible.
It's only like, it's only like, I can reach things.
I go all the stretch.
I love because on my screen, the way I see your arms are going beyond like the box that
you're in.
So it looks like you could reach anywhere girl, literally anywhere.
I know that.
(26:52):
But for a clean, can we say that to all your listeners, girl, you can reach anywhere.
Like truly virgin beauty bitch, whoever you are, reach, reach for it, stretch.
Like why can't there's a lot I can't reach, but that's why I have people in my life who
help me.
That's why I have the order of advisors and I collaborate with other people and I have
(27:16):
a thing for tall women apparently to collaborate with tall women.
And whatever it is, most of my female collaborators like close to six feet or over six feet tall
because there's things I can't reach without them.
And things they can't reach without you.
You drop something on the floor.
I'm going to visit you.
I'm closer to the ground.
(27:37):
It's easier for me.
I want to feel needed.
You might throw your back out.
It's going to take you longer to see.
I'm ready.
Right.
You have like a really strong center.
Gravity.
And there's like stability there.
It's not the only stability in my life, but yeah.
I am not what we would call stable.
No, I'm joking.
It's part of my comedy.
(27:58):
I'm not, you know, God is not a great structural engineer.
I have like really short legs and really big brains.
Really, God is fair, but she is a lousy structural engineer.
And so like I say, I'm not physically stable or mentally stable or rent stable.
The humor lens is how I get through a lot of things in life.
(28:20):
So I appreciate that that's an element that you bring to the table.
We love to ask our guests this question of the virgin, the beauty and the bitch.
Is there one that really stands out to you and brings something out for you?
Bitch.
I have to go with that because it's not something I ever embraced in the past.
Or maybe I did, but I didn't really own it.
(28:41):
And also there's a song, a bitch, babe in total control of herself.
And this was a gut check.
Because at first I was like, they all mean something in former English major.
And as a creative, like we can find meaning in anything, right?
Beauty, actually I played the lead that I played in.
(29:03):
She played the devil.
Her name was Lucy, like Lucifer.
It was a play.
I was young.
I was just at a high school.
And it was a scene about beauty.
She wanted a baby more than anything in the world and she couldn't have a baby and do the
performers and her freak show, which is of course totally like NPC.
And this is unfortunately what circuses were about.
(29:24):
They were the ugliest couple in the world.
And they wanted beauty more than anything they were going to give up their child for.
Now, why do I tell you this?
I mean, it's a whole other story.
And I walked into there thinking, well, if I'm lucky, I'll get cast in the back row of
the chorus.
And like the most incredible show, they're like, we want you for the lead.
And so I didn't step into the beauty part.
(29:44):
I was a virgin back then in every way of like shy and insecure and naive and innocent.
I think we're all virgins in a lot of ways.
There's things we don't know.
There's things to learn.
I was watching an old comedy set.
I said, well, I was a virgin until today.
I just got my first dick pick.
I was like, wait, you're out of 50, 51.
(30:07):
Oh my god, my first photograph of unsolicited, because solicited is all other story.
So we're all virgins in some ways.
But that word only applies to women, which is a whole other problem.
People don't ask, men, are you?
Are you not?
Do they check?
Beauty is what?
We've always been judged for our exterior appearance for women so much more than men.
(30:32):
So that carries so much weight.
But I think what is beauty is your soul, is your personality.
You know, if you show up and not care what we look like or what we're dressed and who cares
about it, like beauty is your soul.
Are you a beautiful human being?
That to me is what matters.
Are you kind to others?
Do you work for what you want?
(30:52):
Do you speak up for what you believe in?
But bitch is like, let's only, like we, we, I have learned to be a bitch.
I was not in the past.
I was truly shy and insecure.
I would advocate for others.
I would fight for others, no matter what.
Like that didn't scare me, but to advocate for myself, to speak up and stand out and fight
(31:15):
back against abuse and all of it.
No, and somebody wants to call me a bitch for standing up for myself or standing up for
somebody else.
They even total control for self.
Thank you for the compliment.
Thank you for acknowledging my power.
It's also a bit of a fear thing, right?
If someone thinks you're tough and strong and scary, they won't mess with you, which is
(31:39):
why Chihuahua is the yapiest and nice.
What?
I am like a Chihuahua.
Not regard.
My bark is generally worse than my bite.
Oh, there's no way it goes all my negotiating thread.
Oh, like yeah, she's actually, I'm like, no, people are like, "Dena's really, really sweet
behind, but don't mess with her because you will regret it."
(32:02):
If you cross her, if you do the wrong thing, I don't talk to you, making mistakes is one
thing.
But if you hurt me or my friends, again, misconjeionality, if anyone here hurts any of my
friends, they will feel the wrath of you.
(32:24):
It's like you're hitting the nail on the head as far as Heather and I are concerned and
why we use these words the way they have been presented.
They are seen historically as one way, but as you just articulated, they are deeper, wider,
broader, and carry such weight.
(32:46):
That is why we are called what we're called.
As far as the vicious concern, that is an area that Heather and I will be getting into
in depth over the next little while.
As you said, it is a woman expressing her true self.
It is a woman stepping out of what she has been conditioned to be.
(33:12):
It is who we all are, but for women, especially, and the way they're conditioned in society,
the bitch is power, true power.
That is an area we will be going into in depth with talking with people who are experts on
these kinds of topics.
(33:35):
Thank you for sharing your perspective on that.
We are so in alignment, it is not even funny.
Thank you.
This really was a treat.
Thank you for giving.
We started off.
You said you don't have to tell a woman to take a platform and speak up and you've let
me talk almost non-stop for the better part of 45 minutes.
(33:57):
I appreciate it because I do your platform and your questions.
Your questions are really good.
Thank you.
It is a lot of fun.
They are deep.
They're not the usual.
I purposely didn't prepare for today.
I don't script.
I think a little bit about what I want to talk about, but because of the way you structured
(34:21):
it and positioned it, we want it to be organic.
We want it to be honest and authentic and great.
No agenda.
Either them show up, have fun.
Be myself.
Knowing what the title was, knowing that the two questions, when you said you want us to
ask you about what being feminine means or beauty bit.
I was like, why not both?
(34:44):
I don't love rules.
I don't like playing favorites.
I know there was something I said that I said that I wanted to note to that.
I said something that I think may have come out not exactly the way I meant it.
At this point, I was right before you asked me to be one of a beauty bit.
No one's for it.
Whatever.
(35:05):
Quote and Quote mistakes.
We're all here to support each other and connect and build the community and relationships.
Let's have fun at it.
That was my whole plan about diminishing myself.
Not stable.
It always comes back to it.
(35:25):
We should not diminish ourselves.
All kidding aside, this is really adequate.
It's one thing to joke about diminishing ourselves.
I may say, oh, I'm unstable.
That's a joke.
We do need to own our power.
I'm saying this to anybody that thinks, oh, we need to pretend like we're not so strong.
Once we are confident enough, that's the friend of someone who knows everything about you
(35:46):
and loves you anyhow.
When you're confident enough in your power, you can joke about yourself in a way that isn't
diminishing, self-deprecating for a reason, for a lesson, to say, hey, none of us are entirely
stable or perfect.
It's an unstable world.
But not to own that message of, oh, I'm a failure, I'm an F-Ob, look, I'm horrible.
(36:08):
Now, on the other hand, you say, I'm a bitch like it's a bad thing.
Oh, it's a compliment.
It's missing what fireball bitch you, babe.
I'm like Queen bitch to you.
To get in touch with me, I really do love connecting with people.
(36:30):
Truly, I design networking events.
I design networking experiences to bring people together.
So for all of you who are listening, I take phone calls.
I mean, I have a scheduler to set up.
Networking calls and Zoom calls and coffee meetings.
It's fireballnetwork.com is our website.
I am FireballDena on Instagram.
(36:50):
Dena Bakelitz on LinkedIn.
You can also find me on most of the dating apps.
[laughter]
It's not me asking that one.
I'm like, "Where can we find you?" I'm like, “Bumble, Hinge, Tinder, Change it."
She's like, "No, social media.
I'm like, same thing."
I'm on all the dating apps.
(37:11):
LinkedIn, New York Stock Exchange.
I don't even know me.
I just like to be on somebody's lineup on HBO Netflix.
But I'm Apple+TV.
But right now, find me on all the socials or most of them under FireballDena.
Fireball Network, Deena Baikowitz.
I genuinely mean that.
(37:33):
If anybody wants to talk, I truly love connecting with human beings.
I'm in the business and pleasure of relationships.
It's all about the sparks and the chemistry that happens when we share our stories and connect.
Funny to say that because in reading about you and now meeting you and talking to you,
I see the wire that goes between one lamp post of the next.
(37:57):
The next through the entire city or the entire world basically, you are that wire.
You see electricity that runs through that wire connecting these points of light.
That's how I see who you are.
Oh my God.
That's beautiful.
I love that analogy, Christopher.
Electricity.
And light.
Thank you.
(38:20):
I'm Fireball.
Thank you.
I mean, we talk about, you know, networking is sparks and chemistry between people.
It's like when you are on a date, if there's chemistry of the second date, if you're at a networking event,
you're at work, you're interviewing for a job, you want to join a committee,
you want to do volunteer work, you have a meeting a friend, you're trying out a new dance class.
Is there chemistry?
(38:41):
Is it a fit?
Like, do we want to get to know each other better?
It's not a one night stand, like anything else.
I mean, one night stands or one night stands.
No, that's just what they are.
But I like to say there's no instant gratification networking, except for the instant gratification of having a human interaction.
Even if it doesn't lead to anything, it's that in that moment.
(39:03):
What did you learn?
Night, Learn, I never want to talk to that person again.
Or this woman does not know how to shut up.
But she was very entertaining.
So I should probably buy tickets to her show or book her out of conference.
But yeah, I thank you for that.
I truly though that is, it's taken me a while to own an embrace.
(39:26):
Because I don't believe in false modesty, but I also don't like narcissists and ecotists or just it's me.
It's me. It's me.
I always say I would always rather share the spotlight than be on stage alone.
Like if one light can try, like, let me shine the light on what you do.
We totally understand that.
But thank you so much for taking time to be with us, for being yourself with us.
(39:51):
Which we appreciate more than you can imagine.
It can only be ourselves, right? Who else are we going to be?
Maybe that's the thing to embrace to all of your listeners.
Just embrace who you are. You can only be yourself.
Don't ever try to be somebody else unless you're acting in a role.
In real life, like, show up as you. You are enough.
(40:13):
You're not too much. You're not enough. You're just who you are.
That's what we're working with.
And yes, on that note, you have been listening to the Virgin Beauty and the rich and the fiery bitch.
Yeah, sure.
Share us and bring your friends. Come on back to become a partner in the BBB community.
(40:37):
We invite you to find us at virginbeautybitch.com
Like us on Facebook, Instagram and LinkedIn.
And share us with people who are defiantly different, like you.
Until next time, thanks for listening.
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