May 9, 2023 • 26 mins
WSU Men's Basketball Coach Kyle Smith joins the program. Kyle shares what led up to DJ Rodman hitting the transfer portal, how does he feel when he invested so much time w/ players, and then in the snap of a finger that player is in the portal, what's the latest on Mouhamed Gueye, could he be back in a WSU uniform, and much more.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Let's a head across the mountains.Guys. Our next guest is a man
that enjoys himself. I can't rememberwhat it is. Is it MODELO?
Is at Coors Light? It's MODELO. But he had to say Coors Light
because the whole program or something isbrought to buy Corps Light was not the
deal. Can you play the fightsong for him? Do you have that?
We don't have it. Hold onhis wife. Many would say his
(00:22):
wife is an actual better basketball playerthan him, like a legendary basketball He
might even say that. And Idon't even know if Kyle Smith played.
In fact, what I've been toldthrough sources that when they play one on
one, she skunks him. It'sthat bad of a game. Ladies and
gentlemen. The head basketball coach atWashingt State University, our favorite guy,
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Kyle Smith. Hello, coach,how's it going? How? I mean,
how bad does she give it toyou in those one on ones?
Huh? No, I could stillbe there one on one's. She might
be a better shooter. She mightbe Oh, but she's definitely she's definitely
more famous on the side of theCascades in the small towns, that's for
sure. I'm Katie. I'm KatieDavis's husband most places around here. Coach,
(01:07):
you can shoot it though me.Yeah, oh I could shoot it.
But she and I did play atHamilton College graduate nineteen ninety two.
Shot fifty one percent from three Damn. Anyone was really doing their research for
the year, their guests coming on. Uh, that's that's proud. That
might even be in the wiki page. But wow, man, he took
(01:30):
a shot at me. There shouldwe check the wiki page. You took
it. You took a shot,and I'm one of your biggest fans.
Let's let's take it. Let's see. Let's see if the wiki page is
really accurate. I am one ofyour biggest fans. But you might have
to go in the coupe page whatever. But yeah, but she still all
to her horn. She still holdsthe record for Class B single game.
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I think it's fifty fifty. Listento this. It's on the Wikipedia page
here, guys, give give atime out here, Coach Smith, Hamiltons
basketball team. I wrote it,so see that's the point you wrote it.
Yeah, fifty one percent from thethree point line still stands as a
(02:12):
Hamilton single season a record. Youwere like Steph Curry before Steph Curry.
Not exactly. I had two AllAmerican post players and I think I had
twelve in a row that year overthe course of five games. That's not
a lie. And they someone toldme in our conference last game we players
Conference championship against Verdonia State, tobring it back for you. One of
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my best friends named Snake. I'lljust leave it at that. He's a
post player. And they said,they said, Kyle, because I didn't
have a lot of attempt They said, you need one more. You need
to make one and a half agame to qualify for the lead the country.
That's how that's how dialed in.We were up twenty and and so
Snake knows this and I throw inthe post. He gets doubled. I
(03:00):
said, yo, I'm just clappingmy hands. He shoots it willingly with
a grin on his face, andI never I never get a number three
to this day, to this day, we still don't. We're the relationships
good. It's just not right.We gotta get Snake on the show next
time. Oh, no one wouldNo one would love it more. I
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wish she was listening right now.No question, he might have a different
spin to that story, but that'sgospel. I just gave it to you.
It's horrific. Hey, coach,we all remember seeing your night with
DJ Rodman jumping into your arms.Uh, what the hell happened after that?
I mean, that's one of themost disappointing things that's that's happened in
Cougar basketball history to my way ofthinking, How do you feel about it?
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You know, I'm not sure ifhe jumped in. I think it
was the other way. I thinkI jumped into his arms, and that'll
that'll probably be the last time Ido that. But oh, I don't
know. I just think this,Uh you know, he I don't know.
I like to note to tell youother than they figured out that they're
marketable and there's free agency and andhe you know, he graduated and it
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was a great experience for both parties. And I thought we were gonna go
another year, but he still might. But I you know, it's just
it's just a wild, wild wildWest out there. Well, what did
he say to you? This issomething I have to do with his with
his mom in the background. It'sfor my I need to grow, I
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need to check and see what's outthere. So I don't know it was
you know, I thought we werein good space, but you know,
just that and we actually we saweach other graduation and it was good and
we talked about some things. Andhe's gonna he's gonna, I think he's
gonna look at some options and uh, hopefully still circles back. I mean,
we'd love to have him and thatthat kind of it's just kind of
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what we're the dynamic we're dealing with. Yeah, I just I just,
you know, a huge Cougar fan, and I just don't get it because
he's a good player. He's agood glue guy. I mean I love
having him. Hold on, holdon, hold on, you're a smart
guy. Yeah, what's another radiostation came by and offered you three X
Are you gonna listen at this pointin my career, No, well you're
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special. No, No, No, I like to think no. I
mean, you know, okay,I mean this station, this station tossed
me a life ring. You know, I'm sixty five years old and I'm
I'm I don't think I'm gonna turnmy back. I mean, he's had
a good I mean, okay,you're twenty two. You're twenty two,
and your your salary is gonna betripled, all right. It's just a
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Coogan, man, I believe it. I believe he's a Goog. He
graduated. It's um, it's tricky, it's tricky. It's tricky. We
got some guys that don't you know, they're got degrees and then they have
an opportunity to not only have nodebt walking out call or they might have
a nice nest egg and and thiswar and I know that the coupe bleeding
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hearten I can I can tell itinstinks. But we got to take care
of our people a little bit.And uh, I don't know if there's
as much an appetite. Here's someother places like that. The Purple and
Gold seem to be doing pretty well, pretty well on their their The Modo
Lake Collective seems to be doing reallywell for that place. So is it
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a comment on the collective? Whateverhandles the Wazoo basketball team just isn't doing
enough. It's like, do younot have enough resources for them the collective
to be able to retain your ownplayers and go out and get other players.
Uh that yes, but I thinkthey're Yes, that's fair, but
yes, but it's kind of yeah, but it's that it's a ridiculous amount
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of money that that some of thesepeople are thrown around. I don't think
that was the intention of the ruleby any stretch, and uh, but
it is what it is, andit's it's a I don't think people,
I don't think people can quite fathomwhat the kind of the money that's being
thrown around. But it's again,Kyle Smith is our is our guest here.
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He's on the Beacon Plumbing hotline.Basketball coach at Washington State. But
it has to be maddening as abasketball coach that you find and develop these
guys. Rodman being one, MuhammadGay being another. I know he's not
in the portals, so he's goingto go to the NBA Draft, but
you look at um, why amI blanket Aborghidi? I know went to
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the G League, but t JBomba. I mean, here's a guy
you you pluck out of New YorkCity, you develop, and that that's
a guy that has gotten better everysingle year and took a huge leap this
year. But then when you thinkyou're you're ready to fire away, I
haven't even gotten to Sean Jackson yet. That you are really building a core
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of a good basketball like a realgood basketball team, and you've done it
the right way. But the timeI'm where it gets to where they're gonna
pop, they just leave. Imean that that has to be frustrating to
I mean a million degrees. H. I wouldn't say a million degrees.
I'm I don't a free market capitalists. Uh and uh, you guys know
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it's all right. And the TampaBay Devil rights and I'm sure and how
they operate. Yeah, I'm afraid. I think we're gonna be fine.
I'm not worried. That's just there'sstill the same number of players out there.
We're just gonna have to if thatmight be our let things change significantly
in people, some coup alums andbusinesses step forward, Well, we'll probably
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be in this boat. And Iknow I don't know what to and it's
just economics and and kind of knowwhy I do this life. It is
h my hawaiis I want to empowerpeople to empower themselves. And so our
guys are listening. Untun this thatwasn't there used to be used to have
to sit out of here and leave. So that was I realized that as
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the Trent that was and you knowa lot of guys that part of ourselves.
How you're gonna play against the BestPact twelve and have an opportunity to
play against it. You know,they're just a letting of the NBA players
that come to this league. Andyou know, FA might Bill get in
there. I think Muhammad will getin there at some point in Bomba and
I can be more proud of someof these guys. Um, But I
do think it's it's ah, yeah, i'd say disappointing. But at the
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same time, it's like how WashingtonState fans aren't disappointed. We need someone
to say we need sell. Wedon't have it. We don't have the
same resources. So I don't know, And that's what it's going to be
like. I'm afraid, Yeah,I think. I mean, I would
speak maybe from I'll speak as analum and we're both our alums of the
school. I mean, I'll speakfrom the alum side of it when it
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comes to I think a lot ofalums would fall on this boat. I'm
not going to speak for all them, but I'll speak for some of them.
You know, there's one thing togive money. I mean, you
are being asked to give money toeveryone. Now it's not only the Cougar
Athletic Fund, which is separate thanfrom the Cougar collective. But then you
get whatever school you graduated from.I graduated from the Merdle School of Communication,
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so then I get asked to donateto the Mural School of Communication if
you graduate from the business school.So you're getting it from three different entities.
And it used to be back inthe day. If you wanted to
give to the athletic Fund, yougive it to the Athletic Fund. And
that's where my money is going.You know. If I buy, if
I have season season football tickets,it's a donation to the Cougar Athletic Fund.
And I think there are some andI'll throw myself in a boat that
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feels, you know what, that'senough. And I'm not made of money,
and I can't just get keep givingall these collectives money. So I
wonder, how do you how doyou fight through that? Because it is
kind of a it's a money numbersgame right now. Yeah, we're watching
it in real time. We'll see. I'm not mad at you, I
understand, just yeah, I justdon't think that I said less. I'm
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I'm not blaming the lums that aresaying it's just these are the facts.
I mean, there's a Motley collection. Do your research and due diligence on
how they're doing it, UM,and we have some collectives that are really
trying to really and let me tellyou those there's only a couple that have
really stepped up and one specifically forUM that's really taken kind of the I
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guess you said the Olympic Sports islike crypto coups um. You can find
them at cryptocups dot com. Butit's great and they're doing the best part
of the best way. But Imean, it's it's UM. It's there's
some disparities there. It's just simple. It's it's just what it is.
So I don't mean to I hopeI didn't praye, but it's like yeah,
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no, it's just like, hey, it's just there's a reset coming.
So we're we're at it. We'regetting some guys where they are from
the state. Uh. I thinkthat helped, you know, So taking
the guy out of high school thatcan like TJ, who's from the Bronx
and doesn't come from a lot um. That's gonna be that's gonna be tricky
as it develop. He graduating threeyears. He was a great player for
us, good leader. We've goneto two n I T s went to
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NT Final four, and I thinkthat is going to track the next TJ.
Bamba And that's just how that's howwe're gonna have to be unless there's
some you know, and like there'sonly with Washington State ethics, there's only
so much you can do in negotiatingsthat we're trying to We're playing by the
rules and trying to get this NISLEand um, I think you know that
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SEC and that stuff. It's notthere's just different states have different rules too,
So it's just kind of what itis. Well now get I feel
good about our team next year.It's just unfortunate. You're not gonna have
the same relationships. Like I thinkRodman's probably the most gosh thing. He's
probably the most popular players since Clay. This are just so many people stopping
on the street and they love themin this mat Now they are disappointing.
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I get it, and that one, that one hurts me too because I
love that guy and I wanted toI mean the fact I jumped into his
arms. Yeah, you know whatI mean. So, yeah, it's
it's just it's unfortunate, it's foryou know, it's just we're watching in
real time. It's changing. Ithink what you want to talk college basketball,
he probably need to look Division twoand Division three is more in the
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same model of what we're used to. So things have changed. That's just
reality. Well, I I usedto love DJ. I'm past Hense on
that coach. That's fair. Yeah, I bothered. I think, Yeah,
that's fair, that's fair. Idon't blame you on that one.
I don't whatever. I get itbecause he has given he has a legacy,
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and like I said, I reallydo think he's one of more popular
coups since that I mean, andthat that's some you know, and we
want him back. Uh, butthat is you know, because he played,
played so hard, he took Iprobably led the country and charges you
have thirty one of them and umsgot better too and helped us win.
He always big on a plus minusso um, you know. But he's
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he's an adult now, he graduating, he has some opportunities and maybe hopefully
he'll he'll make a good decision.So how do you how do you do
it when you're coaching when player getsX amount of dollars and player B is
getting nothing, do you feel likeyou need to play player A over player
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B even though player A isn't playingall that well. No, I'd rather
play the player B because he probablyhe beats out. It's like that,
remember the d rays. We wantthe young, young emerging talent to win.
You want to get rid of thehold. I'm half kidding, but
honestly, coaching him not a problem. It wasn't. It wasn't the team.
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And like I said, I've beendoing a lecture series on the transformational
leadership in the transactional world, sothat's kind of what That's why I said,
it's not College's not what my skillset, what we're trying to do.
College athletics or essentially everyone just gotscholarship, which is great. It's
just different now. But I wasworried because that we did have some guys
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that are getting different amounts based ontheir abilities or whatever they're I don't I
shouldn't say that because that's not whatit's about. But their their ability to
influence and persuade and where there's socialmedia and that, and they make.
It wasn't any different coaching them.It really wasn't, I understand. Like,
and so we had some guys thatwere you know, and that may
be a by product. Two theydidn't didn't get as much. And as
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I said, they're looking at well, wait, wait a second, maybe
I worn't this, and you know, we don't have salary caps. That's
the deal. So it's like there'sother people that are you know, you
can look at their pretty public likeGeorgia Tech and Georgetown that have put millions
of dollars into their collective and Ithink Georgetown did something like thirty five million
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over ten years. Um. Andthat's why. You know, schools that
don't have football, that's that's that'sa big nut. You can get pretty
good. So, um, that'skind of what that's that's the lay of
the land. How how is itin the locker room with the players?
You know what I mean? Said, yeah, I mean all these guys,
some guys make a lot, someguys don't make anything. Honestly,
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it wasn't. It wasn't. Itwasn't a problem. I didn't feel so
like. It wasn't. And itbecomes more the postseason stuff becomes tricky because
here comes the agents, agents,and now then say has allowed you to
work with agents, whether it's youknow, if you're going to get workouts,
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you get an NBA draft, youcan have one that's work on your
nil. So they have agents andreally the agents will get in there and
they'll tell you that you're whatever,this is what you're worth. I've talked
to such and such schools blah blahblah, which may or may not be
illegal. Good look and proving that. And so that's the part where it
gets tricky. That's the part wherepeople and it's legal worth an agents.
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So these agents and then for instance, I won't may name, but one
of my I said, I said, hey, is an agent taking a
percentage of this? He said yeah, I said twenty percent. It's goodness
gracious, I said, I wouldhave done it for four percent. You
don't need an agent to do this. But that's that's literally what's going on.
And you know, working having anagent, there's nothing wrong. They're
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allowed to have that, and soit's that's kind of how this thing is
um falling out too. But tounderstand it correctly, they're allowed to have
an agent, but is that anagent allowed to shop them to other schools.
No, no, but that's nobody. But that's way. But but
that's what's but that's what's happening,right Yeah, once they yeah, absolutely
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once they Yeah. I don't thinkthat's a that's a hard one to I
don't even know if it's there's athird part of discussing. I don't even
know if it's illegal. When whendid you guys as a staff realize that,
like bomba mate was tampered with.I don't even know if he was.
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I don't think I don't know ifit was. Um. I think
we had a discussion right after thebecause he really we talked to him all
year and and uh and I meanwith him every he was a captain s
I met with him every every weekwhen other things and I asked him our
agents trying to reach out to you, and he's very we have a really
good relationship and he's very honest.That I said, yes, I said,
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how do you want to handle that? Said reading that deal with to
end of the season. I reallydon't think he did. And then his
plan was to try and uh,you know, do the draft. He
took how to work out with theBucks today in fact um and then kind
of I said, we tend toyou're kind of where Mo was last year.
I said, if you you mightbe ready to do UM workouts and
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then you know, see where you'reat. Maybe he's done the radar.
Obviously, if someone falls in love, would you, that's a great opportunity
where you come back and do it. So that process of getting a certified
agent, well that's when some peoplefrom other places says, hey, I
got this school that didn't and there'seven kind of they even said I want
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I don't want to name the school, but this stuff. But you have
to go on the portal to dothat. So that's where it's twisted.
And that's kind of where out thereonce it gets it's just overwhelming when they
get in there. How much doyou know a figure? I know Ryan
Day gave a figure out. He'sthe head football coach at Ohio State and
to be to field a competitive Pactwelve basketball team, do you have a
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figure in overall salary and overall capso to speak, that you would need
for a year. I won't sayI don't know. I'm not supposed to
do I'm not so, but Iwill say I will say that and it's
hard to get. You know,I was jotting down figures last year what
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guys were making because we're recruiting theretaking choices and like Sueley Boone's guy coached,
and uh San Francisco. And thenhe was at Utah and he wanted,
he's out, I'm looking for oneplace where I can go the tournament
and you know, play a lot, blah blah blah. And I said,
and that obviously anyone for He wentto or and he kind of gave
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me the number, and it's Iwas like, wow, Now I'm thinking
it's not that much. I thinkthere's just been a exponent. So I'd
say to give you a ballpark,oh my goodness, probably to probably the
million, a million, five tobe that's just to be. I'd say,
I would say pack twelve, butI'd say that'd be top sixty team,
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which be an I ten sixty toforty. But there'll be some teams
that aren't doing much that will beon those guys. Feels you don't know,
that's that's just a guess. Idon't know. Hey, last thing
I have for you, coach,and thank you, thanks so much for
your really appreciate your time. No, No, it's just I was like,
I just want to make sure therewith like this is kind of what
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it's it's just the landscape where Yeah, it sucked. Yeah. I mean
I'm just a fan who follows theteam and I just think it sucks.
I don't know how you're doing it. I mean I know, I know
you make your good salary. Yeah, No, root hard for us,
hard for us, and be empatheticor sympathetic to which everyone that would I
(21:00):
think would be sympathetic to what we'retrying to do. Yeah, we've done
a good job and I've got I'mproud of our staff and proud of our
players. They really did do agood job. But that's you know,
keeping them as a as a trickypart. Yeah. I just wanted to
ask you about Deshaun Jackson because alot of us were excited about him coming
back the heart condition or whatever happened. I mean I heard he almost like
died at practice, and yet he'she's going to transfer to Charlotte. And
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you look at that and you're goingCharlotte. That seems like a lateral move
at best, and I would sayit's a move down. But I mean,
how disappointing? Was that? Andwas that all about money? That
one I don't want him comment onand not in just out of respect of
Deshaun's privacy on that a little bit. So that one. Uh yeah,
that one, that one. Justscratch that one off as far as like,
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it's not what everyone thinks, sowhat you would think on that and
that shouldn't be discussing about him withanyone, especially on the radio. Okay,
fair enough? Is there any what'sthe chance what's the status with Mohammed
Gay He's Is he all in onthe NBA or is there a chance he
could come in? Oh? Ithink he's all in on the NBA.
Okay, he is, And Ithink it's uh. I think he's a
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little undervalued, but I think it'stoo early to tell a little bit.
I think that the smart teams,there's a few teams that really have done
it. It's crazy. It's likerecruiting now. The NBA teams have really
circled them up and been out topullman. I know who really likes them,
and I know where they're picking,and they're asking all the questions that
that that someone's serious about doing it. And I always tell him, I
(22:33):
said his characters. What's going tocarry the day? You know, the
guy's only played basketball really for fouryears. He's always been a full time
starter that was expected to score oneyear and and it's like, just let
it. Let this guy marinate.He's going to become a really good player.
And but more importantly, he's justa wonderful person. He is.
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I love the Senegalese. They're awesome. He's just a warm guy. That's
great those teammates as a great leader, he uh and he'll fight for you.
So I've no doubt that he's goingto be um a really good NBA
player. Let's leave on a happynote, all right, I want to
know I believe I have no Listen, here's the thing. I have faith
(23:21):
in you. I think you're ahell of a basketball coach. You have
done and have recruited and developed exactlywhat me as a fan wanted, because
I know how hard it is toget players there, and you've gone about
it by going to Europe, goingto Africa. That's exactly. It's a
really stealing kind of Gonzaga's model whatthey have done a little bit, it
feels like it's exactly what you guyshave I love it. I just want
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them to stay and not leave.That's that's what I do. I do
think I do, and I dothink. It's uh. I think everyone's
aware of it. You hit onthe head. It's like it's ah,
they're just there's no there's no salarycaps and a certain number of it.
So it's uh, you know,I don't want to whatever. I hear
you, I feel the thing.I get the same thing from other people,
(24:06):
like, Hey, I just hadthe Cougar Morrow Business School, Calle
and it's like, yeah, youknow, I know, I get it.
I get it. I get it. I get it. Um.
So you know we're in search tomorrow, Cuban. We need someone that wants
to own a college basketball team.It might come to that, Jesus.
I thought about no, no,it has it. Will the Miami guy,
Oh yeah, kind of set thetable last year. He was a
life wallet guy. And you knowwhat about Clay Thompson. Can't Clay do
(24:30):
this? Have you reached out tohim? Ask Clay for some money?
Play give us ten million bucks?Hey, and what we're way late?
I want to ask you give meClay's great. Clay is great, plays
great, He's supportive, I knowhe's great. Give me, give me
thirty seconds on this young man.And I can't pronounce his last Ruben.
What's Ruben's last name? You shouldn'tyou hope? Okay, Well that sounds
(24:53):
good. Six ten, two fortyfive. I've seen a video of him.
I mean, he looks the part, especially physics. What kind of
player are you getting in him nextyear? You know? He is uh
really again this one. I'm reallyproud of his characters. I believeable.
He's a four O student, reallyhard worker. Um or who he is
and then what he is on thefloor. He is a rim protector,
(25:15):
shop blocker, offensive rebounder. Uh. When I saw him, I was
like, man, this guy's he'sgot a big motor and his great big
heart. So, um, youknow he's a little he's a little like
they got hurt at Washington this yearand who thinks and Internet and may one
(25:37):
of those guys. You know,he's just in which we need those who
play against those guys. Those twoguys over, um are good. So
you need though there and it seemslike everybody has one. And he's you
know, coming from the NBA Academy. Um, so he's he's been really
well coached and well suited to makethis jump. So we're excited about him.
Obviously, well we kept you,we kept you away along. We
(25:59):
appreciate, we appreciate it, weappreciate the honest I really that's all.
Hey, I know, that's that'sall I talk about every day. So
I didn't know if it's good becausethey're trying to trying to educate everyone on
and h what what's going on?And you know it, it does and
that's the part that's hard. It'slike, it is heartbreaking. I see
a guy like DJ um, youknow, but he got his degree.
I was always saying like, heyman, he got his degree, and
(26:22):
DJ got his degree, so Iwant to say they're doing um. Yeah,
I would love for him to beto take all their eligibly here.
Absolutely um. But those are reallygood kids and really good and they while
they're here, they were roll andI understand if you're better that they left
because but but I get it.I get it.
Let's a head across the mountains.Guys. Our next guest is a man
that enjoys himself. I can't rememberwhat it is. Is it MODELO?
Is at Coors Light? It's MODELO. But he had to say Coors Light
because the whole program or something isbrought to buy Corps Light was not the
deal. Can you play the fightsong for him? Do you have that?
We don't have it. Hold onhis wife. Many would say his
(00:22):
wife is an actual better basketball playerthan him, like a legendary basketball He
might even say that. And Idon't even know if Kyle Smith played.
In fact, what I've been toldthrough sources that when they play one on
one, she skunks him. It'sthat bad of a game. Ladies and
gentlemen. The head basketball coach atWashingt State University, our favorite guy,
(00:42):
Kyle Smith. Hello, coach,how's it going? How? I mean,
how bad does she give it toyou in those one on ones?
Huh? No, I could stillbe there one on one's. She might
be a better shooter. She mightbe Oh, but she's definitely she's definitely
more famous on the side of theCascades in the small towns, that's for
sure. I'm Katie. I'm KatieDavis's husband most places around here. Coach,
(01:07):
you can shoot it though me.Yeah, oh I could shoot it.
But she and I did play atHamilton College graduate nineteen ninety two.
Shot fifty one percent from three Damn. Anyone was really doing their research for
the year, their guests coming on. Uh, that's that's proud. That
might even be in the wiki page. But wow, man, he took
(01:30):
a shot at me. There shouldwe check the wiki page. You took
it. You took a shot,and I'm one of your biggest fans.
Let's let's take it. Let's see. Let's see if the wiki page is
really accurate. I am one ofyour biggest fans. But you might have
to go in the coupe page whatever. But yeah, but she still all
to her horn. She still holdsthe record for Class B single game.
(01:51):
I think it's fifty fifty. Listento this. It's on the Wikipedia page
here, guys, give give atime out here, Coach Smith, Hamiltons
basketball team. I wrote it,so see that's the point you wrote it.
Yeah, fifty one percent from thethree point line still stands as a
(02:12):
Hamilton single season a record. Youwere like Steph Curry before Steph Curry.
Not exactly. I had two AllAmerican post players and I think I had
twelve in a row that year overthe course of five games. That's not
a lie. And they someone toldme in our conference last game we players
Conference championship against Verdonia State, tobring it back for you. One of
(02:35):
my best friends named Snake. I'lljust leave it at that. He's a
post player. And they said,they said, Kyle, because I didn't
have a lot of attempt They said, you need one more. You need
to make one and a half agame to qualify for the lead the country.
That's how that's how dialed in.We were up twenty and and so
Snake knows this and I throw inthe post. He gets doubled. I
(03:00):
said, yo, I'm just clappingmy hands. He shoots it willingly with
a grin on his face, andI never I never get a number three
to this day, to this day, we still don't. We're the relationships
good. It's just not right.We gotta get Snake on the show next
time. Oh, no one wouldNo one would love it more. I
(03:20):
wish she was listening right now.No question, he might have a different
spin to that story, but that'sgospel. I just gave it to you.
It's horrific. Hey, coach,we all remember seeing your night with
DJ Rodman jumping into your arms.Uh, what the hell happened after that?
I mean, that's one of themost disappointing things that's that's happened in
Cougar basketball history to my way ofthinking, How do you feel about it?
(03:46):
You know, I'm not sure ifhe jumped in. I think it
was the other way. I thinkI jumped into his arms, and that'll
that'll probably be the last time Ido that. But oh, I don't
know. I just think this,Uh you know, he I don't know.
I like to note to tell youother than they figured out that they're
marketable and there's free agency and andhe you know, he graduated and it
(04:06):
was a great experience for both parties. And I thought we were gonna go
another year, but he still might. But I you know, it's just
it's just a wild, wild wildWest out there. Well, what did
he say to you? This issomething I have to do with his with
his mom in the background. It'sfor my I need to grow, I
(04:29):
need to check and see what's outthere. So I don't know it was
you know, I thought we werein good space, but you know,
just that and we actually we saweach other graduation and it was good and
we talked about some things. Andhe's gonna he's gonna, I think he's
gonna look at some options and uh, hopefully still circles back. I mean,
we'd love to have him and thatthat kind of it's just kind of
(04:53):
what we're the dynamic we're dealing with. Yeah, I just I just,
you know, a huge Cougar fan, and I just don't get it because
he's a good player. He's agood glue guy. I mean I love
having him. Hold on, holdon, hold on, you're a smart
guy. Yeah, what's another radiostation came by and offered you three X
Are you gonna listen at this pointin my career, No, well you're
(05:17):
special. No, No, No, I like to think no. I
mean, you know, okay,I mean this station, this station tossed
me a life ring. You know, I'm sixty five years old and I'm
I'm I don't think I'm gonna turnmy back. I mean, he's had
a good I mean, okay,you're twenty two. You're twenty two,
and your your salary is gonna betripled, all right. It's just a
(05:43):
Coogan, man, I believe it. I believe he's a Goog. He
graduated. It's um, it's tricky, it's tricky. It's tricky. We
got some guys that don't you know, they're got degrees and then they have
an opportunity to not only have nodebt walking out call or they might have
a nice nest egg and and thiswar and I know that the coupe bleeding
(06:04):
hearten I can I can tell itinstinks. But we got to take care
of our people a little bit.And uh, I don't know if there's
as much an appetite. Here's someother places like that. The Purple and
Gold seem to be doing pretty well, pretty well on their their The Modo
Lake Collective seems to be doing reallywell for that place. So is it
(06:26):
a comment on the collective? Whateverhandles the Wazoo basketball team just isn't doing
enough. It's like, do younot have enough resources for them the collective
to be able to retain your ownplayers and go out and get other players.
Uh that yes, but I thinkthey're Yes, that's fair, but
yes, but it's kind of yeah, but it's that it's a ridiculous amount
(06:50):
of money that that some of thesepeople are thrown around. I don't think
that was the intention of the ruleby any stretch, and uh, but
it is what it is, andit's it's a I don't think people,
I don't think people can quite fathomwhat the kind of the money that's being
thrown around. But it's again,Kyle Smith is our is our guest here.
(07:12):
He's on the Beacon Plumbing hotline.Basketball coach at Washington State. But
it has to be maddening as abasketball coach that you find and develop these
guys. Rodman being one, MuhammadGay being another. I know he's not
in the portals, so he's goingto go to the NBA Draft, but
you look at um, why amI blanket Aborghidi? I know went to
(07:32):
the G League, but t JBomba. I mean, here's a guy
you you pluck out of New YorkCity, you develop, and that that's
a guy that has gotten better everysingle year and took a huge leap this
year. But then when you thinkyou're you're ready to fire away, I
haven't even gotten to Sean Jackson yet. That you are really building a core
(07:54):
of a good basketball like a realgood basketball team, and you've done it
the right way. But the timeI'm where it gets to where they're gonna
pop, they just leave. Imean that that has to be frustrating to
I mean a million degrees. H. I wouldn't say a million degrees.
I'm I don't a free market capitalists. Uh and uh, you guys know
(08:18):
it's all right. And the TampaBay Devil rights and I'm sure and how
they operate. Yeah, I'm afraid. I think we're gonna be fine.
I'm not worried. That's just there'sstill the same number of players out there.
We're just gonna have to if thatmight be our let things change significantly
in people, some coup alums andbusinesses step forward, Well, we'll probably
(08:43):
be in this boat. And Iknow I don't know what to and it's
just economics and and kind of knowwhy I do this life. It is
h my hawaiis I want to empowerpeople to empower themselves. And so our
guys are listening. Untun this thatwasn't there used to be used to have
to sit out of here and leave. So that was I realized that as
(09:03):
the Trent that was and you knowa lot of guys that part of ourselves.
How you're gonna play against the BestPact twelve and have an opportunity to
play against it. You know,they're just a letting of the NBA players
that come to this league. Andyou know, FA might Bill get in
there. I think Muhammad will getin there at some point in Bomba and
I can be more proud of someof these guys. Um, But I
do think it's it's ah, yeah, i'd say disappointing. But at the
(09:26):
same time, it's like how WashingtonState fans aren't disappointed. We need someone
to say we need sell. Wedon't have it. We don't have the
same resources. So I don't know, And that's what it's going to be
like. I'm afraid, Yeah,I think. I mean, I would
speak maybe from I'll speak as analum and we're both our alums of the
school. I mean, I'll speakfrom the alum side of it when it
(09:48):
comes to I think a lot ofalums would fall on this boat. I'm
not going to speak for all them, but I'll speak for some of them.
You know, there's one thing togive money. I mean, you
are being asked to give money toeveryone. Now it's not only the Cougar
Athletic Fund, which is separate thanfrom the Cougar collective. But then you
get whatever school you graduated from.I graduated from the Merdle School of Communication,
(10:11):
so then I get asked to donateto the Mural School of Communication if
you graduate from the business school.So you're getting it from three different entities.
And it used to be back inthe day. If you wanted to
give to the athletic Fund, yougive it to the Athletic Fund. And
that's where my money is going.You know. If I buy, if
I have season season football tickets,it's a donation to the Cougar Athletic Fund.
And I think there are some andI'll throw myself in a boat that
(10:31):
feels, you know what, that'senough. And I'm not made of money,
and I can't just get keep givingall these collectives money. So I
wonder, how do you how doyou fight through that? Because it is
kind of a it's a money numbersgame right now. Yeah, we're watching
it in real time. We'll see. I'm not mad at you, I
understand, just yeah, I justdon't think that I said less. I'm
(10:54):
I'm not blaming the lums that aresaying it's just these are the facts.
I mean, there's a Motley collection. Do your research and due diligence on
how they're doing it, UM,and we have some collectives that are really
trying to really and let me tellyou those there's only a couple that have
really stepped up and one specifically forUM that's really taken kind of the I
(11:16):
guess you said the Olympic Sports islike crypto coups um. You can find
them at cryptocups dot com. Butit's great and they're doing the best part
of the best way. But Imean, it's it's UM. It's there's
some disparities there. It's just simple. It's it's just what it is.
So I don't mean to I hopeI didn't praye, but it's like yeah,
(11:39):
no, it's just like, hey, it's just there's a reset coming.
So we're we're at it. We'regetting some guys where they are from
the state. Uh. I thinkthat helped, you know, So taking
the guy out of high school thatcan like TJ, who's from the Bronx
and doesn't come from a lot um. That's gonna be that's gonna be tricky
as it develop. He graduating threeyears. He was a great player for
us, good leader. We've goneto two n I T s went to
(12:01):
NT Final four, and I thinkthat is going to track the next TJ.
Bamba And that's just how that's howwe're gonna have to be unless there's
some you know, and like there'sonly with Washington State ethics, there's only
so much you can do in negotiatingsthat we're trying to We're playing by the
rules and trying to get this NISLEand um, I think you know that
(12:22):
SEC and that stuff. It's notthere's just different states have different rules too,
So it's just kind of what itis. Well now get I feel
good about our team next year.It's just unfortunate. You're not gonna have
the same relationships. Like I thinkRodman's probably the most gosh thing. He's
probably the most popular players since Clay. This are just so many people stopping
on the street and they love themin this mat Now they are disappointing.
(12:43):
I get it, and that one, that one hurts me too because I
love that guy and I wanted toI mean the fact I jumped into his
arms. Yeah, you know whatI mean. So, yeah, it's
it's just it's unfortunate, it's foryou know, it's just we're watching in
real time. It's changing. Ithink what you want to talk college basketball,
he probably need to look Division twoand Division three is more in the
(13:03):
same model of what we're used to. So things have changed. That's just
reality. Well, I I usedto love DJ. I'm past Hense on
that coach. That's fair. Yeah, I bothered. I think, Yeah,
that's fair, that's fair. Idon't blame you on that one.
I don't whatever. I get itbecause he has given he has a legacy,
(13:26):
and like I said, I reallydo think he's one of more popular
coups since that I mean, andthat that's some you know, and we
want him back. Uh, butthat is you know, because he played,
played so hard, he took Iprobably led the country and charges you
have thirty one of them and umsgot better too and helped us win.
He always big on a plus minusso um, you know. But he's
(13:48):
he's an adult now, he graduating, he has some opportunities and maybe hopefully
he'll he'll make a good decision.So how do you how do you do
it when you're coaching when player getsX amount of dollars and player B is
getting nothing, do you feel likeyou need to play player A over player
(14:09):
B even though player A isn't playingall that well. No, I'd rather
play the player B because he probablyhe beats out. It's like that,
remember the d rays. We wantthe young, young emerging talent to win.
You want to get rid of thehold. I'm half kidding, but
honestly, coaching him not a problem. It wasn't. It wasn't the team.
(14:31):
And like I said, I've beendoing a lecture series on the transformational
leadership in the transactional world, sothat's kind of what That's why I said,
it's not College's not what my skillset, what we're trying to do.
College athletics or essentially everyone just gotscholarship, which is great. It's
just different now. But I wasworried because that we did have some guys
(14:52):
that are getting different amounts based ontheir abilities or whatever they're I don't I
shouldn't say that because that's not whatit's about. But their their ability to
influence and persuade and where there's socialmedia and that, and they make.
It wasn't any different coaching them.It really wasn't, I understand. Like,
and so we had some guys thatwere you know, and that may
be a by product. Two theydidn't didn't get as much. And as
(15:13):
I said, they're looking at well, wait, wait a second, maybe
I worn't this, and you know, we don't have salary caps. That's
the deal. So it's like there'sother people that are you know, you
can look at their pretty public likeGeorgia Tech and Georgetown that have put millions
of dollars into their collective and Ithink Georgetown did something like thirty five million
(15:33):
over ten years. Um. Andthat's why. You know, schools that
don't have football, that's that's that'sa big nut. You can get pretty
good. So, um, that'skind of what that's that's the lay of
the land. How how is itin the locker room with the players?
You know what I mean? Said, yeah, I mean all these guys,
some guys make a lot, someguys don't make anything. Honestly,
(15:54):
it wasn't. It wasn't. Itwasn't a problem. I didn't feel so
like. It wasn't. And itbecomes more the postseason stuff becomes tricky because
here comes the agents, agents,and now then say has allowed you to
work with agents, whether it's youknow, if you're going to get workouts,
(16:14):
you get an NBA draft, youcan have one that's work on your
nil. So they have agents andreally the agents will get in there and
they'll tell you that you're whatever,this is what you're worth. I've talked
to such and such schools blah blahblah, which may or may not be
illegal. Good look and proving that. And so that's the part where it
gets tricky. That's the part wherepeople and it's legal worth an agents.
(16:36):
So these agents and then for instance, I won't may name, but one
of my I said, I said, hey, is an agent taking a
percentage of this? He said yeah, I said twenty percent. It's goodness
gracious, I said, I wouldhave done it for four percent. You
don't need an agent to do this. But that's that's literally what's going on.
And you know, working having anagent, there's nothing wrong. They're
(17:00):
allowed to have that, and soit's that's kind of how this thing is
um falling out too. But tounderstand it correctly, they're allowed to have
an agent, but is that anagent allowed to shop them to other schools.
No, no, but that's nobody. But that's way. But but
that's what's but that's what's happening,right Yeah, once they yeah, absolutely
(17:23):
once they Yeah. I don't thinkthat's a that's a hard one to I
don't even know if it's there's athird part of discussing. I don't even
know if it's illegal. When whendid you guys as a staff realize that,
like bomba mate was tampered with.I don't even know if he was.
(17:44):
I don't think I don't know ifit was. Um. I think
we had a discussion right after thebecause he really we talked to him all
year and and uh and I meanwith him every he was a captain s
I met with him every every weekwhen other things and I asked him our
agents trying to reach out to you, and he's very we have a really
good relationship and he's very honest.That I said, yes, I said,
(18:06):
how do you want to handle that? Said reading that deal with to
end of the season. I reallydon't think he did. And then his
plan was to try and uh,you know, do the draft. He
took how to work out with theBucks today in fact um and then kind
of I said, we tend toyou're kind of where Mo was last year.
I said, if you you mightbe ready to do UM workouts and
(18:27):
then you know, see where you'reat. Maybe he's done the radar.
Obviously, if someone falls in love, would you, that's a great opportunity
where you come back and do it. So that process of getting a certified
agent, well that's when some peoplefrom other places says, hey, I
got this school that didn't and there'seven kind of they even said I want
(18:48):
I don't want to name the school, but this stuff. But you have
to go on the portal to dothat. So that's where it's twisted.
And that's kind of where out thereonce it gets it's just overwhelming when they
get in there. How much doyou know a figure? I know Ryan
Day gave a figure out. He'sthe head football coach at Ohio State and
to be to field a competitive Pactwelve basketball team, do you have a
(19:11):
figure in overall salary and overall capso to speak, that you would need
for a year. I won't sayI don't know. I'm not supposed to
do I'm not so, but Iwill say I will say that and it's
hard to get. You know,I was jotting down figures last year what
(19:33):
guys were making because we're recruiting theretaking choices and like Sueley Boone's guy coached,
and uh San Francisco. And thenhe was at Utah and he wanted,
he's out, I'm looking for oneplace where I can go the tournament
and you know, play a lot, blah blah blah. And I said,
and that obviously anyone for He wentto or and he kind of gave
(19:53):
me the number, and it's Iwas like, wow, Now I'm thinking
it's not that much. I thinkthere's just been a exponent. So I'd
say to give you a ballpark,oh my goodness, probably to probably the
million, a million, five tobe that's just to be. I'd say,
I would say pack twelve, butI'd say that'd be top sixty team,
(20:18):
which be an I ten sixty toforty. But there'll be some teams
that aren't doing much that will beon those guys. Feels you don't know,
that's that's just a guess. Idon't know. Hey, last thing
I have for you, coach,and thank you, thanks so much for
your really appreciate your time. No, No, it's just I was like,
I just want to make sure therewith like this is kind of what
(20:40):
it's it's just the landscape where Yeah, it sucked. Yeah. I mean
I'm just a fan who follows theteam and I just think it sucks.
I don't know how you're doing it. I mean I know, I know
you make your good salary. Yeah, No, root hard for us,
hard for us, and be empatheticor sympathetic to which everyone that would I
(21:00):
think would be sympathetic to what we'retrying to do. Yeah, we've done
a good job and I've got I'mproud of our staff and proud of our
players. They really did do agood job. But that's you know,
keeping them as a as a trickypart. Yeah. I just wanted to
ask you about Deshaun Jackson because alot of us were excited about him coming
back the heart condition or whatever happened. I mean I heard he almost like
died at practice, and yet he'she's going to transfer to Charlotte. And
(21:23):
you look at that and you're goingCharlotte. That seems like a lateral move
at best, and I would sayit's a move down. But I mean,
how disappointing? Was that? Andwas that all about money? That
one I don't want him comment onand not in just out of respect of
Deshaun's privacy on that a little bit. So that one. Uh yeah,
that one, that one. Justscratch that one off as far as like,
(21:47):
it's not what everyone thinks, sowhat you would think on that and
that shouldn't be discussing about him withanyone, especially on the radio. Okay,
fair enough? Is there any what'sthe chance what's the status with Mohammed
Gay He's Is he all in onthe NBA or is there a chance he
could come in? Oh? Ithink he's all in on the NBA.
Okay, he is, And Ithink it's uh. I think he's a
(22:11):
little undervalued, but I think it'stoo early to tell a little bit.
I think that the smart teams,there's a few teams that really have done
it. It's crazy. It's likerecruiting now. The NBA teams have really
circled them up and been out topullman. I know who really likes them,
and I know where they're picking,and they're asking all the questions that
that that someone's serious about doing it. And I always tell him, I
(22:33):
said his characters. What's going tocarry the day? You know, the
guy's only played basketball really for fouryears. He's always been a full time
starter that was expected to score oneyear and and it's like, just let
it. Let this guy marinate.He's going to become a really good player.
And but more importantly, he's justa wonderful person. He is.
(22:55):
I love the Senegalese. They're awesome. He's just a warm guy. That's
great those teammates as a great leader, he uh and he'll fight for you.
So I've no doubt that he's goingto be um a really good NBA
player. Let's leave on a happynote, all right, I want to
know I believe I have no Listen, here's the thing. I have faith
(23:21):
in you. I think you're ahell of a basketball coach. You have
done and have recruited and developed exactlywhat me as a fan wanted, because
I know how hard it is toget players there, and you've gone about
it by going to Europe, goingto Africa. That's exactly. It's a
really stealing kind of Gonzaga's model whatthey have done a little bit, it
feels like it's exactly what you guyshave I love it. I just want
(23:45):
them to stay and not leave.That's that's what I do. I do
think I do, and I dothink. It's uh. I think everyone's
aware of it. You hit onthe head. It's like it's ah,
they're just there's no there's no salarycaps and a certain number of it.
So it's uh, you know,I don't want to whatever. I hear
you, I feel the thing.I get the same thing from other people,
(24:06):
like, Hey, I just hadthe Cougar Morrow Business School, Calle
and it's like, yeah, youknow, I know, I get it.
I get it. I get it. I get it. Um.
So you know we're in search tomorrow, Cuban. We need someone that wants
to own a college basketball team.It might come to that, Jesus.
I thought about no, no,it has it. Will the Miami guy,
Oh yeah, kind of set thetable last year. He was a
life wallet guy. And you knowwhat about Clay Thompson. Can't Clay do
(24:30):
this? Have you reached out tohim? Ask Clay for some money?
Play give us ten million bucks?Hey, and what we're way late?
I want to ask you give meClay's great. Clay is great, plays
great, He's supportive, I knowhe's great. Give me, give me
thirty seconds on this young man.And I can't pronounce his last Ruben.
What's Ruben's last name? You shouldn'tyou hope? Okay, Well that sounds
(24:53):
good. Six ten, two fortyfive. I've seen a video of him.
I mean, he looks the part, especially physics. What kind of
player are you getting in him nextyear? You know? He is uh
really again this one. I'm reallyproud of his characters. I believeable.
He's a four O student, reallyhard worker. Um or who he is
and then what he is on thefloor. He is a rim protector,
(25:15):
shop blocker, offensive rebounder. Uh. When I saw him, I was
like, man, this guy's he'sgot a big motor and his great big
heart. So, um, youknow he's a little he's a little like
they got hurt at Washington this yearand who thinks and Internet and may one
(25:37):
of those guys. You know,he's just in which we need those who
play against those guys. Those twoguys over, um are good. So
you need though there and it seemslike everybody has one. And he's you
know, coming from the NBA Academy. Um, so he's he's been really
well coached and well suited to makethis jump. So we're excited about him.
Obviously, well we kept you,we kept you away along. We
(25:59):
appreciate, we appreciate it, weappreciate the honest I really that's all.
Hey, I know, that's that'sall I talk about every day. So
I didn't know if it's good becausethey're trying to trying to educate everyone on
and h what what's going on?And you know it, it does and
that's the part that's hard. It'slike, it is heartbreaking. I see
a guy like DJ um, youknow, but he got his degree.
I was always saying like, heyman, he got his degree, and
(26:22):
DJ got his degree, so Iwant to say they're doing um. Yeah,
I would love for him to beto take all their eligibly here.
Absolutely um. But those are reallygood kids and really good and they while
they're here, they were roll andI understand if you're better that they left
because but but I get it.I get it.
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