11-17-25 Scott Sloan Show

Scott discusses a potential new property tax with Commissioner Alicia Reece. Also Gregg Murset breaks down if 14 year olds should be allowed to enter the workforce. Finally James Rapien breaks down the disaster in Pittsburgh.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Do you want to be in a Man County?

Speaker 2 (00:02):
All right, here we go at this Bengals Hangover Monday
on seven hundred WLW.

Speaker 1 (00:08):
Awful, right, awful.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
There's the old adage about, hey, you get enough crumbs,
you make a loaf, and that's true a lot of things,
especially money, enough crumbs you make a loaf. So Hamlin
County is considering a one mill increase in the real
estate transfer text the hold on second, I have no
idea what this means. So a millage basically is a
dollar for every thousand dollars that your purchase price is.
So you know, you buy three hundred thousand dollars house

(00:33):
every thousand dollars. Do the math, and that's paid by
the subtle closing. So you already have a transfer tax
in Warren County, Butler Count's about three dollars per thousand.
In Clare Mountain, Hamlin County it's four dollars per thousand,
and now Hamlin County wants to add another buck to that.
Joining the show this morning on seven hundred WLW is

(00:54):
Commissioner Elesa Reese Hope, trust you ad a good weekend?

Speaker 1 (00:57):
Alicia? How are you?

Speaker 3 (01:00):
I'm doing good but not good about this proposal. It's
been a rough a rough month, a rough year. You know,
I was young the last time I was on. We
were talking about the affordability, the snap benefits, and I've
been out there, you know, trying to help people. Of course,
the government's opening back up, but they didn't cash at

(01:21):
us the money. You know, we don't have it right now.
We're still operating, you know, on a skeleton. And so
we've got the five one to three relief bus out there.

Speaker 4 (01:31):
I've been out there.

Speaker 3 (01:32):
We've we've we've had the bus and cleeves. We're getting ready.
We've been in Mount Healthy, We're going to we're getting
ready to go to a new Hope and Avendale this
week in Bethel and Wanner Hills food deserts. But I've
been seeing and talking to people, you know, just middle
class family's, even veterans who've been there. And while we're
helping them with food, at the same time, they're still saying, hey,

(01:54):
you know, there's still affordability because everything is going up
and it's just making it harder and harder to afford anything.
And so now we're getting ready to do the county
budget and we get the proposed budget from the administrator.

Speaker 4 (02:10):
That's how it goes. He gives us his budget and.

Speaker 3 (02:13):
Then we've got to go in and look at it.
And the thing that stuck out to me, I'm looking
at the budget because I'm trying to figure out how
can we make it affordable for folks who are out
here struggling in Hamilton County. You know, the homeowners and
you know me, I'm trying to help grandma and grandpa
hold onto their house too. When we talk about we

(02:33):
say we want to have affordable housing. Affordable housing is
not just new housing. It's helping people hold on to
the house they already have. And as you know on
this show, I've been with you. We've been fighting on
these property taxes. And while you know, the state has
you know, the ultimate power, they've got to come up
with a better formula, and how they fund public education

(02:57):
can't be on the backs of property taxes. But at
the same same time, the county has some things that
they can do, and I wanted to look everything we've doing.
One of those things was the thirty percent they promised.
The voters went out voted for two stadiums. Is the
only time the voters got to vote on this, and
they voted and they were told that they would get
thirty percent property texts rollbacks for the county's portion. And

(03:21):
since I've been there, this is my fifth year, my
only my second term, I've been able to get it done,
you know, a couple times, but every year we got
a fight for it. And then this new Bingle deal. Yeah,
this new Bengal deal. You know, three hundred million dollars
guarantee to the Bengals, but in there, there's no guarantee

(03:46):
to the homeowners, as I was telling you, And in
this budget, the administrator only recommends for about four point
five percent rollback. Now we went from thirty to now
he's recommending single digits for the peace people. And then
on top of that, if you try to sell your house,
then they want to add add another tax to the

(04:08):
clothing toss. So you know, this is just the craziest thing.
And then we talk about taking a million that would
be generated from this extra dollar per thousand, which is
you know, that's a lot of money. That's not a
small chunk, and we already had four. Now we're going
to go to five. And that extra he said, put

(04:28):
toward CDF. Who does affordable housing. We did sixty million
dollars toward affordable housing when we had the American Rescue money.
That was a one time thing, and we've been doing
a lot of good things with housing. We just broke
your ground on one of my major initiatives with also
having housing for people with disabilities. We broke ground just

(04:52):
last week at Coloring Township, which I'm happy about with
lad who where we're gonna have smart homes, but we
want to make sure that again affordability is also new homes,
which we've supported, but now we've got to make sure
also that the people who already have a home able
to keep their home. And I saw the Inquire doing
a series, and I know some of these faces of

(05:15):
men who own their homes. One of them is in Madisonville.
Worked pages dues, he retired, and now he's going to
lose his home because the property tax is about to
make him lose his home. Being Yeah, it's horrible, isn't it.
So we have to be mindful as we're going into
this budget. We can't be robbing Peter to pay Paul,

(05:38):
robing the homeowners.

Speaker 4 (05:39):
Yeah, let me.

Speaker 1 (05:40):
Shut this up.

Speaker 2 (05:42):
Alicia Race Hamilin County can let this up because at
the intro I said, you know you already have you
already have property tax valuation in skyrocket. He mentioned the
rollback got it this year. Who knows it's going happened
next year? Probably not, we'll see. H but Warren County,
Baller County about three dollars per thousand dollars worth of house.
So three hundred dollars three in a thousand dollars house. Right,
that's how millage work, called millage Claremont County and Hamlin County,

(06:03):
not four. Y'all want to add another buck, so it'd
be five. Would be the highest tax around in the
Tri state. And so that three hundred thousand dollars home
will cost about fifteen hundred dollars at closing. Same house
in Warner Butler County is nine hundred dollars on top
of the property taxes as we've been talking about here.
So what am I getting in Hamlin County that would

(06:24):
cost me two thirds more in taxes?

Speaker 3 (06:28):
Well? I think you raised a great question. I mean
that is a great question. And when this came out,
I've been getting calls from people saying, well, wait a minute,
you know, how how is this affordable because some people
will sell their homes trying to you know, some of
them sell homes trying to make the ends meet. And
now we're talking about it's going to be hier to sell.
But we can't be the champion in Hamilton County that

(06:51):
everything is higher. We can't be the county whereas it's
hard to live here. It's hard to sell a house,
it's hard to you know, to be able to live.
And again, we can't have you know, I was telling
the administrator and and and open forum, we have to
have the theme. We can't have the theme that we're

(07:12):
broke when it's time for the homeowners and the taxpayers
and let's just keep putting extra burden on them. And
then in the same meeting, we'll have a big idea
come in and we say, oh my god, we can
find the money. We can find this. And I told him,
I said, let's think a lot more creative, but we

(07:33):
can't keep taxing the homeowners. And then on the other hand,
I said, well, let's give the home owner thirty percent break.
Oh no, we can't afford that. Oh no, we can't
give them a break. We can't give them a break
at all.

Speaker 1 (07:43):
And so let you have money to do the stadium.

Speaker 2 (07:45):
And I think the way this team is this year,
that's just bad optics.

Speaker 3 (07:50):
Well, yeah, we're giving them guaranteed, which you say, three
hundred million guaranteed. And when you look at some of
these other deals, I'm starting to see you see Denver,
you see some of these other the trend is not
the trend we have. The trend of these NFL stadiums.
The owners are putting in a lot more money because
they know that the taxpayers are not putting up with it.

Speaker 4 (08:10):
You see it.

Speaker 3 (08:11):
You saw that in Kansas City. They put it they
want to do, they put it on the ballot and
the people said, we'll give you a parade, but we're
not going to tax We're not going to increase our taxes.
We'll give you a parade, though, And so if you
look at Denver, you look at all these other teams
when they're doing these new deals, they're including the taxpayers
that they're in terms of a break for the taxpayers,

(08:32):
they're putting up their private You look at you know,
some of these other teams, and you look at us,
and we're still stuck in the old way where the
taxpayers are on the hook bear the brunt, and we
don't even have to guarantee. They don't even have to
guarantee a winning product. So three hundred million guaranteed in
the budget, and the administrator will say we have to

(08:55):
do that. And then when I said, well what about
the homeowns, well no we can't. We're only gonna do
four percent when we were we were supposed to get
thirty percent. And then they say, well, that's not fiscally
uh you know, responsible. But I said, well, why is
it not fistically responsible for the homeowners to get a break?
I mean, we are in affordability fight right now, and Sloan,

(09:16):
like you said, all these things come together. It's not
like a one thing. Now you're talking about if a
Selma house, I got to pay more more than like
you said, other.

Speaker 2 (09:25):
Counting countries, right, and it's people go around three hundred
thousand dollars house. Not okay, it's a but again, enough
crumbs you make a loaf. And I get we're Jeff
Aluto County administrators. He's that's a difficult budget to balance.

Speaker 1 (09:37):
For sure.

Speaker 2 (09:38):
You got a budget that's going to be about three
point three percent from this past year, just north of
four hundred million dollars is the number. And you know,
when you have expenditures growing just the rate of inflation
and the growth and revenue is not there. You got
to look at getting other income sources in there too,
because you have it's mandated you balance a budget. So

(09:59):
in your world, Alisha Rees said, what do you do?
How do you balance a budget and get the same
time without sticking to the taxpayers?

Speaker 3 (10:07):
Yeah? Well, I think number one, you look at all funds.
You don't look at each deal as a separate deal.
And that's what we've been doing. We should have been
saying that when we had the Bengals deal, we need
to look at everything and say, well wait a minute,
if we do this, it's going to hurt over here.
We need to be looking at all things. But we
don't do that. We look at a big deal comes

(10:28):
in and we find money, and then we come back
and now say, oh we can't balance the budget. Now
we won't be able to. I think you start off
with who you know, who are we supposed to be representing?
Who are our shareholders? And you go and say, okay,
our shareholders are taxpayers of Hamilton County. So we got
the number one, keep that first and foremost in the forefront,

(10:48):
and as you saw in that article, they'll be taken
right If the person can't afford it, they're going to
take that home, say maybe a port authority for example.
But when they take the home, they don't have to
maybe pay the clothes and costs because they're gonna they
don't have to pay the taxes. They're gonna put it
in a land bank. So the homeowner, the gentleman that

(11:08):
owns the house, he had to pay taxes, but now
we're gonna take his same house and put it in
a land bank for a couple of years and there's
no tax getting collected on it. So that's another thing.
The other thing, I have an idea. It's time for
us to look at everything creatively. I've asked jeff A Luto,
because when we get the budget, you know, we just

(11:28):
get these you know, buckets in high level. That's great,
but where I come from, we gotta have line items.
And I told him, I said, I need to know
every account that the county has and what's inch because
what happens is maybe we can think of something more creative.
The last thing I'll tell you that I am proposing
that we look at is the liquor license. Now at

(11:51):
the state, we can't come and just add a tax
to the liquor license. But what we could possibly do,
For example, that site where the Millennium was, and they're
gonna make that ice skating of you know, free entertainment
and all that, we don't get any money off of it.
I said, why don't we get the liquor license as
a county, which we can do, and then we sub

(12:16):
lease it and people do this all the time, and
then that can bring in additional revenues, not just at
that site, but look at other things that we own,
and let's come in through that. We've got to instead
of taxing the homeowner, we could come in with those
kind of things. We spent fifty something million dollars to
buy it before I got there, and we're not making

(12:37):
one dime off of it. It was just an open space.
So that's one of the ideas. I said, we got
to think creatively. Don't tell me what will you bring something.
Don't bring it to me and say, oh, we've just
never done it. First of all, let's see can we
do it. We've got to do We're in some desperate times,
and we need to be thinking a lot more creatives
and not just giving away the house on all these

(13:00):
different deals, because if you look at it, some of
the new housing that comes in there's a tax abatement,
but the person that's been there twenty years, they get
a tax increase and they're getting ready to do another reevaluation,
and they said taxes, probably taxes are going to go
through the roof. So I'm saying, all hands on.

Speaker 1 (13:19):
It, oky good.

Speaker 2 (13:20):
It's not good to get more people or people who
would sell normally move and get new blood in there.

Speaker 1 (13:25):
That's not happening.

Speaker 2 (13:27):
But relative to this, and by increasing the millage to
five dollars per thousand, Hamlin County making by far the
most expensive in our region. You mentioned affordable housing, but
only like a million dollars of the almost five million
dollars generated goes to affordable housing. So is that just
the way to sell us and go, hey, we're trying
to help. I mean, a million dollars is not all
that much money when you consider how big this budget is.

Speaker 3 (13:50):
No, it's not much money. And I think that maybe
it sounds good, but we got to read through the
fab front. You can't Rob Peter to pay Paul No,
you know, make it unaffordable. Some people are forced to sell,
or some people are selling because this is an asset.
They got to sell it because they got to downsize.
Some people say, hey, I got I got a downsize

(14:13):
so I can afford to live. And now you're going
to make it even tougher for the person to even
downsized and be able to sell the house because the
market will say, well, I'll go somewhere else and buy.
The bottom line is we just can't keep adding to
the consumers. You know, we're talking buyer consumer. We're adding there.

(14:35):
And again a million dollars is not going to not
going to get us. We put sixty million dollars and
it's a one time. I mean some stuff we did
was the one time, and we did sixty million. We
did it with CDs. They were able to stretch as
much as possible. But you can't make it affordable on
one hand and then on the other hand make it unaffordable.

(14:57):
And at the end of the day, a lot of
people they negotiate closing costs when they get ready to
sign the deals. They try to negotiate somewhere can I
can negotiate. What can I do? Uh, And so on one
hand we're saying we want more affordable, but on the
other hand, we're always adding and they always say, always
just one dollar, always just two dollars, you know, and

(15:20):
then when you add it up like a second, you
know it's going up. You know. I tell people all
the time, they say, oh, they're only going to get
two hundred dollars. That's two hundred dollars. It's some medicine
somebody can get, or two hundred dollars worth of grocery
somebody can get, right, and so all these things. Sloan,
I'm fighting it, but keep your eyes open. So closing
costs they want to go up. Uh, property tax rollback

(15:42):
we're going from a thirty percent now down to only
four point five percent roll back. And then MSD in
the budget they're going with an increase of that for
four percent.

Speaker 2 (15:56):
It doesn't make it attractive to want to, you know,
do business or of her work in Cincinnati, but in
particular in Hamlin County. She's Commissioner Alisha Reese all over
this one. I know it's kind of a minor point.
It's kind of a little bit of real estate wonkiness
going on here when you talk about these tax transfer taxes.
But uh, you know, again, as we've been saying, enough

(16:16):
crumbs make a loaf. All the basketball chat again soon
be well.

Speaker 3 (16:20):
Okay, all adds up, Sloan. And at the end of
the day, the consumer, the taxpayer, is the one is
getting all these bills and everything's going up. So thank
you for having me on. And keep your eyes. We
got to keep your eyes on this before the bull
comes to people or before they try to close on
a house.

Speaker 2 (16:38):
You're a fiscal pit bull. Reese, You're a fiscal pit bull.
All right, take care of there you go. We got
news on the way, pitbull. We need a pit bull
in there. Just I think the thing that rubs you
to in Hamlin County is effect. And you look at
the what we did for the Bengals and how bad
that product is and refuse to change. And then the

(16:59):
news is hey bye, by the way, uh, you're gonna
have to pay more when you want to sell your house.
So we got that going on, which is terrible. Sloany
here seven hundred ww we.

Speaker 5 (17:08):
Built this city, We built this city. This we built
this city.

Speaker 1 (17:24):
Forty years ago.

Speaker 2 (17:25):
Today this song by Starship number one of the Billboard
Hot one hundred music charts and has since been voted
and it has a distinction of the worst song ever.

Speaker 1 (17:41):
Oxact.

Speaker 2 (17:42):
I think Billboard said worst song ever, you'd be the judge.
Forty years ago. This song was interesting because this band,
it's fund like said ken Brew. Here by the way,
still ken Brew's act. This band, though, it embodied like
the progressive San Francisco Go Height Ashbury sixties progressive.

Speaker 1 (18:04):
Movement, right the hippie movement, and a couple.

Speaker 2 (18:07):
Decades later, after it become Jefferson Air Plet became Jefferson
Starship and then just Starship. They turned this thing out
and the far cry from where they're where they began
just straight up pop. Some people say pop crap. I
don't know that. The people I know that actually like
the song, don't mind the song. But forty years ago,
worst song ever was recorded by Starship. Worst team ever

(18:33):
looking like the Cincinnati Bengals right now, the worst defense
of all time certainly on pace for that, although yesterday
that was not what held them. It's the fact that
you're coming off of bye week, you have one focus
and has beat the Steelers and the Steelers defense I
think twenty seven eight twenty at right around there. Certainly

(18:56):
not as bad as the Bengals, but I mean, you know,
there's two teams still pretty bad. And then for the
second half crunch time, you get their backup quarterback in
Mason Rudolph, who was terrible the first time there left,
came back as the backup and looked like the second
coming of Ben Roethlisberger. Uh it just you lose by

(19:23):
three touchdowns. Who is that on? And that is magnified
by the fact, of course Jamar Chase is now looking
at a suspension. When we left the game yesterday, we thought, okay,
Jalen Ramsey's going to get a suspension for punching, and
then we saw the video later on somebody did some
focusing and heading it saw that it was Jamar Chase

(19:44):
that clearly spit on Jalen Ramsey, which caused him to
then punch Jamar Chase, which makes sense. That's a punchable offense.
I don't know what guys was spitting in the NFL
this year, but here we go, and now Chase is
looking at least a game suspension, and with New England
in a town on Sunday. So can you beat the
New England Patriots with Jamar Chase? Probably not without him,

(20:08):
definitely not. And it wasn't really a factor yesterday. So
the frustration, the spinning and everything else. They had what
three catches for thirty yards yesterday after he had sixteen
the first time they met. And you look at this
the what's ailed the defense has now transferred over to
the offense to some degree. Joe Flacco looked like, well,
Joe Flacco backup quarterback after that first week, and we thought, wow,

(20:32):
man high flying Joe Flacco.

Speaker 1 (20:33):
Man not so much.

Speaker 2 (20:34):
And you know, you learn how to other teams watch film,
they learn how to game plan against this guy, and
this is what you get. So in that regard, you
just wonder if this whole thing is collapsing in on itself.
Joe Burrow aside, and now at this point, with them
being three and seven, does it make any sense? What's
however to bring him back anytime in the season. And

(20:55):
who would be the one to tell Joe Burrow, guess
what you're the future year, we still have a window.
Offense is still fairly solid despite we're seeing here. We
got to rework the defense, get some help. It's going
to be a project. Be patient. But we built this
whole thing around you. Does it make sense to thrust
this guy in a losing situation. We're in a chance.
You could reregorate the turf tost something else could happen.

(21:17):
You could wind up screwing your offseason regiment up getting
ready for twenty twenty six. Because twenty twenty five is over.
You'd have to win what six or last seven to
get to nine, and that's what it's gonna take. The
win the division, probably get the playoffs, and you've got
New England at home, You've got two games more against

(21:38):
Baltimore with Lamar Beck, and you've got Buffalo and Miami
down the stretch. That's man, that's not gonna It's not
gonna happen.

Speaker 1 (21:47):
It is over.

Speaker 2 (21:47):
And so bringing Joe Burrow back right now it doesn't
make any sense whatsoever. I know that while the fans
wont and Joe Burrow wants to it, at some point
there's gonna be some leadership, and that is the I
think that's inpe in On Zach Taynlor. Is he the
guy that's gonna be able to tell Joe Burrow no,
And to a degree. Also, it's Duke Tobin because it's
just incapable of getting anyone on defense it can perform.

(22:10):
At some point, you've got to change the regime here.
And you know, if you don't do it after you
lose to your division foe in the Pittsburgh Steels, do
you do it after the New England loss, because that's
going to happen. I don't see how New England. I mean,
they're kind of due, but is this a team to
knock off New England? I don't think so. You can
feel good about Baltimore. Buffalo seems like a coin toss,

(22:31):
and Miami is also a coin toss. But by then
it may be over. If it's not over today, we'll
talk to James Repeen later, like eleven thirty five on
this on seven hundred WLW. It just feels like, yeah,
you watch this and go, my god, you just find
new ways to lose.

Speaker 4 (22:46):
You know.

Speaker 1 (22:46):
Was the the defense played?

Speaker 2 (22:47):
Okay, say, maybe like Gino Stone and some other guys
are terrible, but they hung in there for most of
the game first half of the game, and of Mason
Rover comes in and now the offense gives up fourteen
points the offense gave up fourteen.

Speaker 1 (23:00):
It's insane. I'm banking on the some.

Speaker 2 (23:04):
Sort of special teams collapse next week and you know,
three fumbles on kickoffs or something like that. Who knows,
we'll come up with We'll come up with new schemes
to lose here in Cincinnati, Ohio.

Speaker 1 (23:16):
How the stuff going on? Do you agree with this?

Speaker 2 (23:18):
Michelle Obama believes that Americans are not ready to elect
a female to the White House, and that, in her opinion,
is evidenced by Kamala Harris's loss in the twenty twenty
four presidential election. She's pushing another book of the books
she has. She's got to lead the I think the
all time first lady team in books. Published one of

(23:40):
her books you can crank out, But none of saying
you're not ready for a woman.

Speaker 1 (23:43):
You're not.

Speaker 2 (23:44):
And this is the same thing what happened when Hillary
could win. It is the fact she's a woman, or
is the fact that you're just a flawed candidate. Now,
some people may say the left rood's, oh yeah, we
turn around elected Trump. Well, it's kind of the devil
you know versus the devil you don't know. I don't
think anyone really felt confident, especially in the eleventh hour
that Kamala Harris and based on what she said in

(24:05):
her performance that she just seemed like she was empty,
like an empty suit, And so people voted ay that
somehow it's every time a female loses, it's got to
be sexism, much like someone of color loses, it's got
to be racism, or it could just be they just
people don't agree with their policies. Like it's not like
the Democrats are sitting in the world on fire right now.

(24:27):
That's a party that is completely out of control, like
a leadership. I mean, Chuck Schumer is on the hot seat,
if not on the way out at this point, he
may be gone before Zach Taylor, by the way.

Speaker 1 (24:40):
So yeah, the.

Speaker 2 (24:40):
Idea that it's not like we don't have female governors
and other females and leadership positions around, Like if that
were true, then you wouldn't have female governors and at
some point will it lacked a female president. We will,
But you know you can't just simply so what you're
saying is, you know, if you want to stamp out sexism,
the way to do that is to vote for someone

(25:00):
because of their gender. Skin color. That's the exactly opposite
of why I should vote for one. I don't get it.
We're seeing a number of young women now expressing it
as especially young women, to move out of the United
States because of this. Over the last two decades, in
the fifteen to forty four year old age group, forty
percent of women expressed a desire to immigrate. That's four
times higher than it was ten years ago. Nineteen percent

(25:23):
of men in the same group expressed a desire to
move top countries Canada, New Zealand, Italy, and Japan. The
fascination in Italy is incredible to me. Just love the
talking one of these people going, okay, so what is
it about Italy? Well, yeah they have if you think
the nepotism or nepotism, but also the sexism and racism
is worse here, pretty bad in Italy. I was talking

(25:47):
to someone who friends of theirs had moved to Spain
their expats. So they moved to Spain two months ago,
and Okay, we got to get out of here. This
climate is too much, The political climate is terrible. Trump's
running things the ground. We gotta get out. We're going
to We're gonna be we're gonna keep our American citizen.
We're moving to Spain. Guess who's coming back to two
months later? Because all the things you take for granted

(26:10):
they don't have in Spain. One of the ones is
that I heard was having a having a dryer, Like
I don't know if that was like one of the
big things, but you go, what they don't have dryer. No,
everyone hangs their laundry out, I guess, And it was
like I missed my dryer. Yeah, it's you're gonna a
lot of things you take for granted in America and

(26:31):
you go abroad. It's different when you're on vacation, traveling,
I guess, looks great because you're you know, you're in
a hotel, Airbnb or whatever. It's fine, but living there
is a different toury entirely. And so it was two
months going, uh, yeah, you know what, we made a mistake.

Speaker 1 (26:43):
We're coming back.

Speaker 2 (26:44):
You hear about the people leaving the United States, but
you wonder about those who do it and go Either
they come back or they begrudgingly go, Okay, this is
not what I expected it to be. But I can't
come back as I lose face. I just you just wonder.
I'm sure there's some people that move in abroad it
are totally happy and confident, but you know people coming back.

(27:05):
You hear about them leaving, but you don't hear stories
about how many people go. I made a mistake, Yes,
is not what I thought it is. Yeah, we've got
some problems, but it's good to be home. Just something
to be said about that. And then that group coming
up at eleven, I'm sorry to eleven. How about ten
oh seven? Greg mursaid, is here. Have you heard about this?
There's a debate now and I'll have some lawmakers on

(27:28):
about this at some point in the near future for sure.
And the debate is over teenagers working. So it's I
think send Bill fifty. I want to say something along
those lines. It'll allow teenagers who are fourteen years old
fifteen years old to work until nine o'clock throughout the
school year. As it stands right now, the law says

(27:49):
that you can work till nine during the summer or
during a school holiday or maybe on the weekends, but
you can't work past seven on a school night, and
they want to change that to nine pm. So letting
a teenager younger than sixteen or per seven and nine.
As long as the teen has the permission of the
parent or guardian, that's what they want to do. And

(28:11):
it seems to me like, you know, if you're fourteen fifteen,
you work in your hustland working an extra hour or
two if at a grocery store or busting tables or
working at fast food, whatever it might be, and there's
limited things you can do there as well, it seem
seems like a good thing. And there's a representative Lauren
McNally out of Youngstown Democrat says that she was shocked

(28:32):
about this. How dare we pretend that putting fourteen year
olds on late night shifts in dangerous workplaces is somehow
helping families. It's not helping anyone. It's exploitation, plain and simple. Well,
mom and dad are signing off on that it's not exploitation.
It's parental choice. Secondly, nine o'clock is not exactly a

(28:54):
late night shift. Like if you know your typical fourteen
fifteen to mid twenties thirty, you know they are nocturnal creatures.

Speaker 3 (29:02):
You know.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
The whole thing is when you're older now, you go
to bed about the time somebody young is getting up,
And it's true.

Speaker 1 (29:10):
It's your body clock.

Speaker 2 (29:11):
Your body clock's just different at that age, right, you're
more nocturnal.

Speaker 1 (29:15):
You want to stay up all night.

Speaker 2 (29:16):
And that's why I think kids have trouble in schooling, like,
is because you're trying to force into the daytime ours
for obvious reasons, when in fact they're more nocturnal. You know, hell,
now I'm going home at ten o'clock. And when I was,
you know, thirty years ago, you'd be going out at
ten o'clock. But fourteen fifteen year old's say, how many

(29:36):
are staying up gaming, how many are going to I
don't know sports practices, and things like why is that
any different? Like why would it be different if you're
up studying or gaming or at practice or whatever it is,
you're still at past nine o'clock, Like, well, what is
the bedtime of your typical fourteen fifteen year old?

Speaker 1 (29:52):
It's not nine.

Speaker 2 (29:53):
It might be ten o'clock, maybe eleven o'clock, but certainly
not nine o'clock gives you an extra hour. It sounds like,
you know, they're forcing I could see or it's like, hey,
you know what, we're just getting rid of the rules
entire that you can work till you can do an
overnight shift if you want, you know, work it to
work till two in the morning or midnight. It's fill extreme,
but nine o'clock doesn't seem unreasonable at all. And the
idea that this is somehow exploiting kids. Yeah, if the

(30:15):
parents are consenting to this and sign off, that's not exploitation.
That's the parents going, yeah, I want my kid to
work and have a job if maybe the household needs
some money, or maybe they should have their own money,
or maybe you have a strong work ethic at that age.
And the idea that somehow work and work is a
bad thing, it's look this, my god, it's it's slave.
You're indenturing these kids in the servitude and now it's

(30:38):
just working. You learn at an early age how to
hustle for a buck. You learn and the host of
problem things. Now i'll get in this with my guest,
but you learn so many things in your first job.
You know, setting expectations and budgeting and being accountable and
managing people and managing and dealing with superiors and all
the headaches of working in the in the real world.
You learn how to solve conflict in real time too.

(31:00):
By the way, I think that's a great lesson for
any kid, but certainly by the time you're fourteen fifteen
it seems to work out. So anyway, that's what they
want to pass in Ohio. And there's some pushback on
this one, not from all, but the idea here is
that you know, it's fourteen fifteen year olds also make
a federal minimum wages seven twenty five an hour, which
is less than ten seventy because well, your skill set

(31:21):
is less than that. When you're fourteen or fifteen and
you start somewhere, you start at the bottom. Is that exploitative? No,
you're you're probably producing less. And also the idea that
somehow this is more dangerous, this dangerous environment they're working in.
I don't know, are you out there, you're work in
a nuclear facility? Are you what do you do when
you butcher in hogs?

Speaker 4 (31:40):
Like?

Speaker 2 (31:40):
I don't know about other states, but I was pretty
strict about what they can do and what they can have.
I think, even like the work in the fast foods,
they can only work some certain things. If I'm not
mistaken anyway. More in this after a ten o'clock here
with gregmor sat here on seven hundred WW Scott Sloan Show,
also happening today. We I hadn't a chance to maybe
I'll save this for tomorrow a little bit more about

(32:01):
I had a chance to look through some of the
Epstein stuff as well.

Speaker 1 (32:03):
It's not good.

Speaker 2 (32:04):
I think it's fascinating the breakup though between between Donald
Trump and uh MTG and him going after her calling
a range, a ranting lunatic and a trader. Somehow, Boy
a lot of people who stood by Trump even when
it's inexplicable, and she would be one of those people.
But somehow now she's a trader. And even now they're

(32:26):
going to turn around and they're going to release, allegedly
release all this stuff.

Speaker 1 (32:29):
And why would they do that?

Speaker 2 (32:30):
Well, because I think they also know that there are
things that they can resist and hopefully get a vote against.
We'll find out probably pick this up more, but one
of the more fascinating stories over the weekend watching that
that whole thing play out. Get the popcorn right news
on the way. We'll get you updated roads, traffic, weather,
all that stuff, and Mortifile coming up here ten six
today with Greg Marsett and teenage work rules about to

(32:52):
change in Ohio seven hundred WWT Cincinnati slowly on seven
hundred WLW. There's a new piece of legislation working his
way through the house. They want to increase the work
hours for teenagers up to a certain age till nine
o'clock PM. And there's a fight against us saying, you know,
it's indentured servitude, and you're going to ruin kids' lives

(33:14):
and just what we need more people than the workforce,
and granted, kids like money, and we miss out on
the value of working at a young age. You know,
nine o'clock doesn't on the school night, doesn't seem that
light quite honestly, considering kids and athletics and everything else
will stay up till well pass that because well, athletics,

(33:35):
if you want to work, I think that should be encouraged,
certainly at midnight one am. But nine o'clock seems reasonable
for teenagers, don't you. And then the question is, well,
how young is too young for a kid to do something,
to do a test, to do something age appropriate and work.
And that's where my guest comes it to him is
Greg Mercaid. He's a financial planner locally here in Cincinnati,
and it developed an app to help kids sort through this. Greg, welcome,

(33:58):
how are you.

Speaker 6 (34:00):
I'm doing great, Thanks for having me on, sir.

Speaker 2 (34:03):
Let's start at the beginning here, and that is the
age old question. Why don't we talk to kids about
money earlier in life? Why does it seem like, I
don't know, you know, it's like sex. In a lot
of cases, let the streets raise them. No one talks
about money. It's a taboo subject. And a lot of houses,
you don't talk about finances, you don't talk about budgets.
You go to school, you don't really get taught it

(34:24):
in high school. Maybe you go on to college, and
if you don't, of course you got to learn it firsthand.
But you go to college, they don't talk about it
all that much. You get credit card debt, you get
in trouble, you get upside down, you get student loans,
and we have all these issues of bailing student loan
recipients out in the like, And it seems like if
we taught people earlier, that would be the best way
to do it.

Speaker 6 (34:44):
Absolutely, geez, now I'm depressed, right. This is one of
those things that I think the reason why we don't
talk about it very much is I think is is
that we're not all that great out of ourselves. And
it's just like, I think avoid that topic because I'm
not super good at it myself. I think it's the

(35:05):
complete opposite of what we should be doing. We should
be talking to this about kids early and often. We
should be putting them to work. Like you said, fifteen
hours a week in a summer job, I'm thinking sixty.
That's what I'm talking about. I think that that kids
should be here's a good example. Okay, I had a

(35:26):
backyard that was just a mess, right, It just wasn't
where I wanted it to be. So what did I do?
I went around and I took pictures of everything that
I would like to do myself but I never have
time to do. And I put it together and I
gave it to one of my sons and said, this
is now your job. Isn't this wonderful? And I took
my pencil, you know, my Apple pencil, and I literally

(35:49):
wrote exactly what I wanted him to do on every picture.
And guess what, in two weeks it was all done.
Like that is amazing to me.

Speaker 1 (36:01):
Did you did you pay?

Speaker 3 (36:02):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (36:02):
Okay, you paid him for it? Well, normally'd be like,
oh damn, this is stupid. Right, And that's large of
the problem. It's just easier to play cake kids and
and not put them to work. But they're quite capable.
It gives them a sense of accomplishment and money and
and so much more. Right And and you may you
mentioned a second ago, Greg that you know, if you're
not good with money, your kid's not good with money.
It's a cyclical thing. And it's because you know, we

(36:23):
don't do it early enough in life. Someone's got to
start this process and go early on. They need to
learn about money.

Speaker 3 (36:30):
You know.

Speaker 2 (36:30):
On that point, I had my my grandson in law
is eight years old, nine years old, and uh, it
was it was all looking for money. He's like, oh,
I want to I want to buy Well what do
you need the money for? I want to buy this
video game or whatever. It is, like, well, can I
have money? I'm like, it doesn't work that way.

Speaker 1 (36:45):
So I'll know. He'll come over.

Speaker 2 (36:47):
I'll put him to work and he want, you know,
he'll and his kid's a great worker.

Speaker 1 (36:50):
I love it.

Speaker 2 (36:51):
But you know, rather than just giving it to them,
it's got to be earned. When you get to the
teen years. Now, it seems like a lot of parents
in suburbia anyway where I live, and you know the drill, right,
you're more worried about taking maybe some classes or remedial
work in the summer, or sports or just relaxing whatever
it might be, as opposed to work. I think that's
an important component of summer, especially for a teenager, is

(37:13):
to have a job.

Speaker 6 (37:15):
Absolutely, if they're sitting around and doing nothing, that actually
drives me crazy. And I think the worst thing you
can do as a parent is to just hand them
over money. Hey, I want to go to the movies, Boom,
you give them twenty bucks? Are you kidding me? That's
the worst thing you could do, because then that cycle
perpetuates itself. And to your point, that kind of this

(37:38):
kind of is a repeating cycle.

Speaker 7 (37:40):
If you're not good at it, kids.

Speaker 6 (37:41):
Won't be all that good at it. That is absolutely true.
And the way you break that cycle, in my opinion,
is to be more transparent with what this stuff really means.
So let me give you a really simple example. You're
sitting on the couch, your kids next to you. You
guys are doing essentially nothing right Netflix or something, and

(38:02):
your phone buzzes and it's your electric bill, or it's
your insurance bill, or it's your whatever bill. This is
a perfect opportunity for you to say, hey, come here,
I want you to see this. I just got an
electric bill. I live in Phoenix. It's August. It's five
hundred and fifty dollars. Like that is where you need
to expose them to that and say this is what's
going on. And even better, let them help you pay

(38:24):
it so they can see how that all works. And
you can do that so easily with the electric bill.
Next time you pull into the gas station, you can
have a little conversation, have them stand out there with
you when you're pumping the gas and let them realize
that it costs eighty bucks, yeah, to fill up your car.
Good point, like this is how you do it. Just

(38:45):
be a little bit more transparent and they're going to
realize really quickly. Holy smokes, this is what it takes
to make this all happen.

Speaker 2 (38:53):
Yeah, you have no idea how much a dolo a
gas will. You may drive by the signs, but okay,
it's four bucks a gal, three bucks a gal, whatever
it is, and you look at it, you go, okay,
that's isn't gonna affect on me. But if you look
at it and go, okay, here's this and this is
how much it costs.

Speaker 1 (39:06):
But we all pay with a credit card.

Speaker 2 (39:08):
Is there somebody said about not paying with a credit
card when you're teaching, because now, if you're a kid,
you can touch it, you can only can feel it.
Here's you know, as you said, here's eighty bucks, right,
I got four twenties.

Speaker 1 (39:20):
Here you go.

Speaker 2 (39:22):
And it's a different thing rather than just swiping the car.
And I think that's also part of the problem, right,
is if it's plastic, we don't realize the.

Speaker 1 (39:28):
Value of it.

Speaker 6 (39:29):
This is called what I what I call invisible money.
Money is just little numbers on a screen now and
they just change. And so you have to teach your
kids in a different way. Listen, we're not going to
go back in time and say, well, if I'm going
to teach little Johnny about money, I'm going to carry
around five hundred dollars and twenties in my pocket because
it's not going to work. You're not going to do it.

(39:51):
It's annoying, it's not convenient. So you have to teach
them about invisible money. And this is the way I
think you should do it. I think you should get
them there card. And then all of a sudden they
realized when they swiped their card at the at the
movie theater and it cost them, you know, thirteen dollars
to get into the movie. And they think, oh my goodness,

(40:12):
I had to scoop dog poop, I had to wash
my mom's vand I had to mow the lawn and
that's all I had to do to pay the thirteen
bucks to movies and boom, if you use they swipe
it and it happened, and all of a sudden, it clicks.
So let them do it. Because kids learn best by
doing this stuff, not by you know, anything else.

Speaker 2 (40:35):
And there's some kids you see you just go they're
gonna be fine. Example, I was at a a charity
golf outing and my buddy Daneal I was golf with
him and he has two beautiful daughters.

Speaker 1 (40:44):
And you know what they did.

Speaker 2 (40:45):
They want to because they're they're kind of he's a hustler,
and he teach him how to hustle.

Speaker 3 (40:49):
Right.

Speaker 2 (40:49):
It is like, hey, you gotta work, you gotta you
gotta you want to make money, you want stuff you got,
So they sat out in front they went to Big
Lots or something and bought a ten dollars box of beads,
and we're making bracelets for people and then selling to
the people after they got through the line check in
at the golf trip.

Speaker 1 (41:05):
But guess what they made? Over one hundred bucks?

Speaker 3 (41:08):
Yeah, how about that?

Speaker 5 (41:09):
Right?

Speaker 6 (41:10):
I love it. I love that kind of other girls
with a very bright future.

Speaker 1 (41:14):
There's no question about it. I'll be working for them someday.

Speaker 2 (41:16):
Greg Murson's on the show certified Financial Planner CEO of
Busy Kid, which is a product that's going to help
parents hire their own kids and teach them the stuff.

Speaker 1 (41:26):
How's it work?

Speaker 6 (41:28):
Okay, So Busy Kids an app that gives kids real
life experiences not only earning money, but managing money. So
the earning part is really important. It's work, it's fundamental, right.
But once you get the money, what in the world
do you do with it? I always say, if you
let your kids just earn it and burn it and
you're not doing much other than you're making it easier

(41:51):
for them to spend it, you have to teach them
a very balanced approach. And this is not hard. Okay.
The money goes in when you use busy kids, you
earn the money and it goes into three big buckets. Okay,
the first bucket is saving and investing, where they can
literally learn about how investing in stock works, amazing, eye
opening stuff. The second pieces is you can teach them

(42:14):
how to share and give to charity, which teaches them
that the world is a bigger place than just them,
which is very important. And then lastly, the money can
go into spend where they can have their own cards,
they can load it, and they can spend like the
rest of us. So save and invest, share and spend.
These are the fundamentals of a balanced financial approach.

Speaker 1 (42:37):
And it's such a simple concept.

Speaker 2 (42:38):
If you're an adult, you get that right as I
have money, that I have my needs, I have my wants,
i have charity, and then I've got investments.

Speaker 1 (42:44):
And those are the four buckets to say what we
do as adults right.

Speaker 2 (42:47):
Right, or should be doing it. So if you're not
doing that, going, wait, let me write this down in
you got problems. But if you look at I mean,
look at credit card debt in America. We're seeing incredibly
high numbers right now. And look at the United States
and the debt sealing crisis, right, I mean, we're a
nation of dead beats.

Speaker 6 (43:05):
Oh, it's out of control. Debt is at an all
time high, national debt thirty two trillion dollars. I mean,
I don't even know how many.

Speaker 1 (43:13):
Zeros out of control?

Speaker 6 (43:15):
Right, Consumer debt all time high, student loan debt all
time high. So, yes, you're exactly right. It's out of control.

Speaker 7 (43:22):
And if we think we.

Speaker 6 (43:24):
Can just kind of keep going down this path, we're
tricking ourselves. We have to stop, and we have to
change it. I think we need to change it with
this next generation. Yeah, if they're smarter with their money,
then hopefully they can turn it around.

Speaker 2 (43:37):
Now, you as a certified financial planner, though, Greg, you
know you hear the thing is well, Okay, when you
were coming up, when you were young my age, it
was a lot easier, you know, And now it's so hard.
I have to have two or three or four more
jobs and service all my debt and all the things.

Speaker 1 (43:51):
Oh is that true?

Speaker 2 (43:52):
I mean I have an appreciation for younger people now
because there are a lot more things coming at them.
Is there less opportunity than we had and the less
opportunity to make money?

Speaker 4 (44:01):
Though?

Speaker 6 (44:01):
Yet I think there's more opportunity. Frankly, I mean, it's
an amazing thing.

Speaker 3 (44:06):
I have.

Speaker 6 (44:07):
I have six kids, okay, five have left the nets,
and all five of the ones that have left the
nests that's had more than ten grand sads before they left,
which I think is an amazing thing. And listen, Scott,
I'm not paying them two hundred dollars to wash the car. Okay.
They have so many opportunities. You can jump on, you know,
when you're when you're an eighteen year old, you can

(44:28):
jump on and you could be delivering you know, food
to people in like twenty minutes. It's an amazing if
you go door dashing or uber eat in twenty minutes
like and you can go drive an uber like. You
could do so many things these days. And you know,
well that's for the older kids, But what about the

(44:48):
younger kids. They can mowd lawns, they can tutor people,
they can walk somebody's dog, they can do all this stuff.
We created busy pape, which is literally a QR code
that kids can have and the person that you know
hires them to go walk my dog and then I
just scan your two R cards code and I pay
you ten bucks, Like it's that easy.

Speaker 1 (45:10):
Yeah, like that.

Speaker 6 (45:10):
Seems like a very easy thing to right, Right, you
go out and figure stuff out.

Speaker 2 (45:14):
Yeah, you have Busy Kid, which is the app that
you have, But I mean things like venmo, right, just
venmo me the money? I got an account? Okay, boom,
it's right there. It's it's easier than ever zeal it
or it's easy to ever before to transfer money, but
also to develop side hustles in your downtime.

Speaker 1 (45:28):
So yeah, you may have to.

Speaker 2 (45:31):
You know, the days of having a goal plated pension
are long since gone. God knows, I've never seen that,
but you know, love saving for a four long kid
and start to my thirties because I'm like, I don't
have that kind of money. Yeah, you know, and then
all of a sudden you start realizing it's important and
you've got to start You got to start paying yourself
a little bit here too. But learning that at age
at age five is a lot easier than learning that

(45:52):
at age fifty.

Speaker 6 (45:54):
Yeah, oh my goodness. And just think of the trajectory
that changes if you start doing that balance financial pros
and not just wasting all your money early in life.
You you turn eighteen and you got ten grand, you
leave the house like that's what happened. It's an amazing
thing if you if you start to see that early
in life.

Speaker 1 (46:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (46:13):
So, if your kids or grandkids are tripping at you
because they want money, download the busy kid app busy
kid and put them on the right path here and
it's a it's a good lesson. They can actually see
the money that they earn as opposed to just having
it given to them.

Speaker 6 (46:28):
Absolutely, if they learn how to work early and get
some money, you watch out, they're gonna they're going to
figure out some amazing things. I had a kid tell
me the other day that he was so excited because
he had earned some money. Then he had learned to invest.
He bought some stock and the next thing you know,
he got a dividend. What in the world is a dividend?

(46:49):
And he was so excited to learn that a dividend
is just money that the company that you invested in
gave you for nothing. And all of a sudden, it
was an eye opening the experience. Wait, I can invest
in a company they pay me to do nothing. Wow,
that's an amazing Thingah So let your money work for your.

Speaker 2 (47:09):
So now basically The way I explained is you're a bank, right,
you're loaning money and the dividends kind of like interest.

Speaker 6 (47:15):
It's amazing.

Speaker 1 (47:16):
It's amazing.

Speaker 6 (47:17):
Right. Rather, I would much rather do that than have
to tho more dog coop in the backyard.

Speaker 2 (47:23):
Yeah right, Well I got to get going, Greg, because
I got to go scoop dog poop.

Speaker 1 (47:27):
That's my side hustle.

Speaker 2 (47:28):
So thanks for demeaning me, Greg Murce, certified Financial Planner.

Speaker 1 (47:33):
CEO of Busy Kid.

Speaker 2 (47:35):
That is the app and it's how you you can
basically how your own kids during summer break. And we're
not talking about teenagers here. We're talking about young kids.
And this gives them the experience and know how to
get to get money and doing hands on work and
and yeah, whatever you have them do is age appropriate
chores or whatever it is, but that this helps bridge
the conversation we don't have and that is about kids

(47:57):
and money. And this is why we're so lost by
financially in this country, I think because we never learned
it growing up. And here's an opportunity to do that. Greg,
all the best, thanks for coming on the show. I
appreciate it.

Speaker 6 (48:08):
Good be with you, Scott.

Speaker 2 (48:09):
Yeah, I bring up the work issue because Ohio it's
center pill fifty. I believe right now, if you're in Ohio,
fourteen fifteen year olds can work till nine o'clock during
the summer school holiday, can't work past seven pm during
school nights, and they want to extend that. They want
to change it to make it nine pm during the
school year for obvious reasons. Of course, the outrage machine
is full going here, Democrats and Columbus saying it's not

(48:32):
about filling workforce gaps, it's about filling corporate pockets. I
don't know if kids fourteen fifty year old's getting seven
to twenty five an hour, that seems like a pretty
good deal for the kid. It's minimum wage, and you
learn how to manage money, work with people, how to
problem solve, all that good stuff. One lawmaker from Youngstown said,
how dare we pretend that putting fourteen year olds on
late night shifts and dangerous workplaces is somehow helping families.

(48:55):
It's not helping. Its exploitation. So what we need more
programs to give people money? It's fourteen year olds aren't
working in dangerous workplaces. We have laws against that. In
late night shift nine o'clock is not late. If you're
fourteen fifteen, you scream at your fourteen fifteen year old
it's time to go to bed because they're nocturnal.

Speaker 1 (49:13):
What world do you live in?

Speaker 2 (49:14):
Lady Scott Flowing seven hundred w al the Everyone needs
help every.

Speaker 1 (49:19):
Now and then, and she's here to help us get
our heads right.

Speaker 2 (49:24):
This is Mental Health Monday with mental health expert Julie Hattershire.
Something like seventy percent of all Americans engage in some
form of infidelity at some point in life. And that
could mean intellectual, it could mean emotional, online, financial, physical,
There's a whole bunch of different ways.

Speaker 1 (49:41):
But twenty forty percent.

Speaker 2 (49:42):
Of married men in twenty to twenty five percent of
married women in the US will have a sexual affair
bonafide adultery in their lifetime. And typically you hear about
how healing together in couple's therapy is the right way
to go. But my guest here and for Julie Hattersh
here here on Mental Health Money. Julie's got the week
office doctor all a seem and he says, not always

(50:03):
is that the case? Sometimes you shouldn't fix a relationship
broken by infidelity good morning, doctor.

Speaker 1 (50:09):
How are you.

Speaker 7 (50:10):
I'm doing fine things for having in the show.

Speaker 2 (50:12):
Yeah, interesting, because you know, I think conventional wisdom is
that that healing together is always the right path. And
I have friends that have been through this before, and
it's always tragic and heartbreaking. And yet you're kind of
like the salmon swimming upstream on this one saying, well,
you know what, maybe you're better off not repairing the relationship.

Speaker 7 (50:33):
That was importunate that we've been socialized that the only
way to go from a fidelity by repairing the relationship.
The fact of the matter is that that's not attainable
for everybody. Sometimes infidelity is actually the wake up call
that people need to know that this relationship shouldn't have
been in the first place.

Speaker 2 (50:49):
So how do you determine that. Let's go in the
way back machine. But before we do that, let's let's
define that. So there's is infidelity in an adultery exchangeable
terms or are their nuanced? Is the distinction between the two.

Speaker 7 (51:03):
I'm a big fir, a firm believer in the connotation
of the words adult rereasently tend to have spiritual connotation.
Infidelity tends to be a little bit more, a little
bit more neutral, regardless of people spiritual belief system. Okay,
actually one, I'll go ahead.

Speaker 1 (51:17):
No, say so.

Speaker 2 (51:19):
The sexual act itself crosses the line from infidelity to
full on adultry.

Speaker 1 (51:22):
Okay, So that's the distinction.

Speaker 7 (51:24):
So really, infidelity is the breach of contract of exclusivity
that people have from one another, whether it's emotional exclusivity
or sexual exclusivity, and infidelity needs something different based on
everybody's relationship and the type of cultural belief system that
they have. For example, flirting with others in some relationship
might see it might be be considered as a harmless behavior.

(51:46):
Another relationship, it might be seen a form of infidelity.
Same thing with pornography. So that's one of the challenging
things of treating infidelity is that most of the time
people don't even have the same reference point on what
to define it.

Speaker 1 (51:58):
Yeah, what do we call agree?

Speaker 2 (51:59):
The physical exchange, that's where adultery comes in adults, is
what it is.

Speaker 1 (52:04):
But infidelity is there.

Speaker 2 (52:05):
But but we also had things like would you consider uh,
you mentioned digital cheating or pornography, but like financial for example,
or emotional cheating, those that that's infidelity as well, Right,
and and how many different types of forms of infidelity
are there in that regard.

Speaker 7 (52:20):
Well, I think you.

Speaker 6 (52:21):
Know, you can't have infidelity without.

Speaker 7 (52:23):
Dishonesty, but none every dishonest behaviors, you know, fill that
up infidelity it's really uh. And you can also argue that,
you know, betraying somebody's trusts as a form of infidelity.
To me, it's you know, how often people are clear
with one another about when they expect but also treating
that virtual world like you deal with the physical world, right,
you know, anything that you do virtually, yeah, this you

(52:45):
should have the same roles that if you do it
virtually or you do it in person. And that's not
so sometimes you'll kind of whitewash it and justify this because.

Speaker 1 (52:51):
It's virtual, all right.

Speaker 2 (52:54):
And doctor al Saline, now that we've set what the
definitions are here, let's get into the realist. And this
is where you're a little bit different than a lot
of therapists I think. And I got to get Julie's
take on here, but you're in for her this morning.
And that is when you can't fix this thing when
it's irreparable. And a lot of people spend a lot
of time effort and emotion trying to fix something that

(53:16):
can't be fixed in the first place. What are the
signs that something like this is unfixable if you should
just maybe you were with the wrong person to begin with.

Speaker 7 (53:25):
Well, a clear sign of that if you have an
unfaithful partner who is lacking empathy, who is not having
the feeling that you're expected to have want somebody discover
in fidelity, somebody who blame you for that there, So
think of it this way. Infidelity doesn't always happen for
a relationship deficits, but a lot of times where infidelity happened,

(53:45):
what having to do with the relationship has to do
with unfaithful partner and individually to deal with whether it's
it's a big shit personality disorder or something along those lines.
And sometimes we have environmental factors that lead to infidelity.
So you know, when you have an unfaithful partner will
blame you for the affair. That's problematic because ire is
supposed to be a building a relationship with somebody who

(54:06):
blame you.

Speaker 4 (54:06):
For with their action.

Speaker 7 (54:08):
And I was the example. You could have the worst
partner in the universe. You have options, and then they
can drag with the counseling and takes those issues or
and the relationship before you cross those lines of fidelity.
So when you're dealing with somebody who's lacking contrition, that's
a difficult person to work with. When you're dealing with
somebody who is not even willing to give you the
story of what happened, why it happened, that's a problematic behavior.

Speaker 1 (54:30):
Yeah, uh no, that makes sense.

Speaker 2 (54:32):
But be saying there, I mean, blame is to share,
There's no doubt about it. You wouldn't seek something else
somewhere else for that matter, if there wasn't a void
in that relationship.

Speaker 1 (54:42):
Does that mean that's victim blaming them?

Speaker 7 (54:45):
I believe so, because, like I said, you know, as
them faithful partner, you have options in terms of how
do you act on that relationship deficit. Ale I said,
there's seen the hundreds of relationship where that person actually
with a partner who is ready and willing to meet
all their needs. But it's like a say things. So,
for example, if you're dealing with somebody with narcissistic personality disorder,
they could have the perfect partner of us whore filling
all their needs, but it doesn't matter they need more

(55:07):
than one person. They need that constant attention. So it's
not always about relationship beficit.

Speaker 1 (55:12):
I understand.

Speaker 2 (55:12):
So what you should be doing is going to your
significant other. In this case, the person you've had a
relationship is Hey, listen, here's my thoughts.

Speaker 1 (55:19):
There's what's going through my head.

Speaker 2 (55:21):
And maybe it's narcissism, or embarrassment or fear of rejection,
could be a lot of things. Is the reason why
someone would turn somewhere else to their needs met?

Speaker 6 (55:30):
Absolutely?

Speaker 7 (55:31):
Sometimes the seasons in fidelity been planned a long time ago.
There's a lot of folks who have self as being
a selfworth issues, or somebody who had traumatic event and
being abused actually when they were a child, and they
developed this idea of themselves that the only thing they
can offer to the world is their sexuality. So sometimes
I said, it has nothing to do with the relationship.

Speaker 2 (55:49):
It's mental health Monday in the Scotsland shown seven hundred
WW Julie Hattershare, our regular license mental health therapist has
day off Todays, taking a little vacation much deserved and
sitting in this morning is doctor Tallala Sleam, unfaithful and
unrepentant affairs be on the hope of repairent infidelity. So
he's kind of a little bit different when it comes
to therapy and saying that not all relationships are fixable,

(56:10):
which is kind of refreshing but also depressing in the way,
meaning that can I look at this and go, well,
if you tell me what categories or what are the
red flags here, that's indicators I shouldn't get in a
relationship with this person in the first place, because I
would think by the time you get in a relationship,
all of those markers, all of those bad habits are

(56:32):
already set in stone. So you know, love kind of
glosses over that. But after a year or more of marriage,
maybe things start to change and water gets back to
self leveling and things get back to your normal in
that regard, can I spot these trends before I get
in a serious relationship with someone that's going to wind
up ultimately breaking my heart?

Speaker 7 (56:51):
Great question, Scott. I always tell people that, you know,
if you want to be in a healthy relationship, you
have to have relationship maturity. What does that mean? That
means that you need to know who you are, the
kind of qualities that you're looking for in a partner
and the type of relationship that works for you. But
also when you find that person and this person is
meeting all your needs, the relationship needs to be maintained.

(57:12):
A lot of the times when people have more conflict
resolution and communication skills, they're going to struggle one having
their needsments in their relationship, which is the fastest way
to have a relationship deficit, which would lead to infidelity. Also,
other things to look for is how invested the person
that you are trying to let into your life, and
are they willing to talk about parameters of exclusivity, what
is their idea of privacy versus transparency. I really believe

(57:35):
if you're in a healthy relationship and you're not doing
anything creating, there shouldn't be this sense of, you know,
there's something for my eyes only. Oftentimes when people hide
things from their partner, it's either because they don't trust
their partner with that information or they doing something that
they're not supposed to. And also, you want to be
with somebody who is invested in somebody who's willing to
reciveticate your effort, because incited relationships often fail.

Speaker 2 (57:57):
Is part of this to the person may adrenaline junkie
that there's a thrill of the pursuit and the catch.
I mean, let's face it, if you've been in a
relationship for a long time, and that's the news you
have to those who are newly marriage, Hey, the honeymoon
doesn't last forever. It's supposed to ebb and flow, and
it's a different relationship the older you get, but you
still love each other. Where is there a people out
there looking for that adrenaline rush that they're not getting
from a stable relationship.

Speaker 7 (58:19):
There is an aspect of that for people who had
limited the relationships experience. So a lot of times people
maybeing them in a relationship and escalated their commitment because
somebody got pregnant or maybe they were young, and then
know what they're looking for, and you know, there's an
excitement of you know, the thrill of a hunt for
a lot of better work. But oftentimes also it's an
issue of people have the capacity of doing this in

(58:42):
their marriage and their relationship, but they just don't take
the time. Unfortunately. You know, people work all the time
and they take their partner for granted and sometimes school,
you know, make all these excuse and dollar way till
the kids grow out and go out to college, and
that point of time, their relationship is already strained.

Speaker 1 (58:56):
Yes.

Speaker 7 (58:57):
And also sometimes let's say somebody who actually cheat because
of the relationship deficit, and their relationship somehow got fixed
because their partners showing up and meeting their needs. Now
they have this thing extra on the side, right, So
what might have started with a deficit, now they're going
to be struggled with giving this thing as starting the side.

Speaker 2 (59:14):
No, that makes makes perfect sense because there's a thrill
of a new attraction, a new conquest, or the thrill
of a new relationship in getting to know someone intimately
as well as physically and emotionally, all those factors as well,
kind of like when you were pursuing the person you're
cheating on. But do you in your practice, doctor Auslin,
you tend to see that's when someone cheats, they they

(59:34):
cheat in the future. I mean, can is that someone
who can't be trusted from that point forward?

Speaker 7 (59:38):
You know that that isn't the once a futer all
with a tutor. Those people do exist, but it's a
smaller segment of the population. Oftentimes when encounter that is
when people have personality disorders such as antisocial personalit disorder
or personality disorder, because we have to remind ourselves people
cheat for different reasons. So even if you are with
somebody who cheated in their past relationship, it doesn't mean

(59:59):
all the reasons for the fidelity was the same. So
we have to be looking at each incident in case
by case and identify those factors, because if you understand
why then fidelity happens, those reasons don't help you decide
whether or not you want to rebuild with this individual
and what not. That individual is willing to work on
those issues, all.

Speaker 2 (01:00:16):
Right, So give me an idea here, Give me reasons
which and let's start with this one. Give me reasons
that you hear in your practice as to why people
are unfaithful and commit acts of adultery or in fidelity.
And we'll start with the ones that are fixable, the
ones you go, okay, we can work on this.

Speaker 7 (01:00:33):
I would say the relationship deficit. When somebody is having
these are unbaked man in relationship. I would say these
are the most common ones, and oftentimes it's because either
people are not good about figuring out what their needs
at or being able to express them effectively to their
partner because that one becomes an easier one to fix
because when we identify those needs though these are healthy,

(01:00:55):
are compatible, then we can help the couples actually identify
their barriers for meeting those needs and get better in
conflict resolution and communication. Because it's a cause and effect,
I would say the most challenging one to fix or
the ones are caused by personality disorders, because personalit disorders
tend to be you have fancy ten dollar word egosyntnics,

(01:01:15):
meaning that people are aokay with those behaviors. There is
no clinical distress. So if I'm not having a problem
with my behavior, I'm going to be less likely to
seek help.

Speaker 1 (01:01:25):
All right, Yeah, that makes sense.

Speaker 2 (01:01:26):
Is that the underlying cause is mental deficiency or an
incompetency or a clinical diagnosis that you could give. You're
never going to be able to have a stable relationship
if you don't treat that.

Speaker 7 (01:01:37):
Right what I'm saying, and not all individual mental health
issues are going to be having a good prognosis because
if you are not having if you don't see the
problem with your behavior, you're going to be willing to
seek treatment and you're going to be resist central the
all time.

Speaker 2 (01:01:51):
All right, how long typically do you see therapy working
for someone like that, though you're talking about probably years.
I would think of therapy right before you can get
before you can fix your relationship. You got to get
yourself right. But that person probably is not going to
hang around for you well.

Speaker 7 (01:02:07):
And I think when there is an individual issue in
addition to the relationship issue that I've let to infidelity,
I right, I recommend for people is engaged in couple
counseling and individual counseling, and the type of disorders that
the individual dealing with determined the treatment. So I can
speak about infidelity recovery and what is the shortest and
the longest time of recovery that I have seen. I
would say that we're use in my model systematic affair

(01:02:28):
recovery therapy. The shortest one for treatment I've seen what
six months, and the longest was about two years and
a half. And the start of the situation where everything
goes wrong where somebody slept with someone in the work
place and you know they have to go to court
and testify and relive the trauma's And that's the other
issue too, is that the type effectair department that you
have could complicate your dealing journey as well.

Speaker 2 (01:02:48):
During that time, people hear this, Okay, I've been married
a while, I have a lot at stake. Everyone I
know who's been divorced and remarried is happier, But at
the same time they lost a lot financially, emotionally and
otherwise in the interim. Do you reckon how men people
stay apart at that point, separate residences, things like that
until this issues are resolved, if they ever can be resolved.

Speaker 7 (01:03:07):
I think if people are trying to engage in fidelity recovery,
if they're able to be physically and emotionally safe in
the same counsehole, it's important for them to be staying together.
Why is that Because if you are the betrayed partner
and you found out the partner has been shooting on
you and now you're only separate houses, if your mind's
going to be wondering are they seeing the fair partner?
Are they impacted by this and they feel guilty? Do

(01:03:27):
they feel ashamed? So you don't want the betrayed partners
to feel alone and isolated in their trauma. But also
they need to discover this together, right because it's a
team decision. They have to figure out why this happened
and decide whether or not they want to work in
this relationship.

Speaker 2 (01:03:41):
And that's easier said than done because often cases we're
not mature. We should be mature, but we're not.

Speaker 7 (01:03:47):
Absolutely And then that's one I always tell people, like
you know, when you discover in fidelity, to come women
to stake couple's make they involve their kids in this,
and that's very tragic, right, And when I say kids,
not just like you know, little ones and sometimes even
you know, younger adults can be impacted by this because
you know, if you see this happening here, you know
you have siblings who end up choosing sides and their relationship.
What could be impacted? You have that it's growing up

(01:04:09):
not knowing what is healthy relationship look like, so can
cause all this damage.

Speaker 1 (01:04:14):
Yeah, yeah, I understand that.

Speaker 2 (01:04:15):
And because you're trying to gain allies, and often with
people who are divorced, right, you have the couples friends
that you had before, and so they've got it. You
have to friends to feel like they have to choose sides.
I can't imagine being a family member.

Speaker 7 (01:04:27):
And I can't tell you this time that you know
anybody can tell you from the from the sidelines how
to live your life. Those people are going to move
on and you're going to be dealing with the consequences
of choices that you make. So people decision about the
future should not be motivated by external factors.

Speaker 2 (01:04:42):
Yeah, but I'll tell you what, man, Yes, you look
at all the problems. When you wide up sploit him,
you may be happier and maybe in a better place
at some point where there's a lot of things, a
lot of baggage I know from folks who've been divorced
that they still carry and had to go through to
get where they are today. Doctor, I'll a seem unfaithful
and unrepentant affairs to beyond the hope of a and
in fidelity. In for Julie Hattershare this morning, it's Mental

(01:05:03):
Health Monday, talking about some relationships can't possibly be resolved
after being unfaithful, committing adulterer in fidelity.

Speaker 1 (01:05:11):
Thanks so much for joining the show. I appreciate it,
my pleasure.

Speaker 2 (01:05:14):
Julie back next Monday, Mental Health Monday. Julie Hattershare at
beconnected dot Care by the Way news update and then
when return was a shutdown a breaking.

Speaker 1 (01:05:23):
Point for politics.

Speaker 2 (01:05:24):
You would hope so, because in about what ten weeks,
we will do it all over again unless there's some
sanity restored to our government. She's Victoria Churchill, and she
has studied this issue. We'll find out exactly what the
likelihood of doing this all over again in just a
few short weeks is, like January thirtieth, so by February
we could be doing this all over again. Sloaney home
of the best Bengals coverage, win or lose or in

(01:05:46):
this case loser lose? Seven hundred W Dowty, Cincinnata.

Speaker 1 (01:05:49):
Do you want to be in a mad.

Speaker 7 (01:05:52):
What's up?

Speaker 1 (01:05:53):
Floony? Back on seven hundred WLW.

Speaker 2 (01:05:55):
With the record forty three day federal shutdown behind us,
we can look forward to about ten weeks from now
when we do it all over again because we're stupid
like that?

Speaker 1 (01:06:06):
Or will we? Hopefully some answers here.

Speaker 2 (01:06:08):
Victoria Churchill, political reporter for the US Daily Mail, also
a contributor with The Young Voices. Welcome back, How.

Speaker 1 (01:06:13):
Are you hey?

Speaker 8 (01:06:14):
Doing well?

Speaker 3 (01:06:15):
Always great?

Speaker 6 (01:06:15):
About to be back on with you.

Speaker 2 (01:06:17):
Yeah, so handicapped for this this for me, Victoria, inside
the Beltway, What are the odds are we going to
do this again in ten weeks January thirtieth.

Speaker 8 (01:06:26):
Well, I will say I hope that senators and representatives
are smarter than that, But that also means that we
are expecting them to be smarter than that, which I
think may be a little.

Speaker 1 (01:06:35):
Bit of a tall order. No, it's I We'll see
it feels like a coin flat.

Speaker 2 (01:06:40):
You've felt though as long as this was, and how
many people really felt it in the last few days
of this thing. Look at airports, look at snap recipients.
I mean a lot what's going on here? A lot
of people already feeling the squeeze with the economy more
so now with this. I get that it's palpable, and
you think, hey, maybe we put a not a foot,
but maybe a little toe over the line.

Speaker 1 (01:07:01):
With the forty three days.

Speaker 2 (01:07:02):
Doing it again so soon seems like an exercise not
only in futility, but insanity. And yet it's set up
to do that simply because well, let's start with it.
Let let's get into the whys here. And of course
I think you need two strong parties in order to
come to some sort of compromise in terms, and right
now the Democrats are very very.

Speaker 1 (01:07:24):
Weak in this regard.

Speaker 8 (01:07:26):
The Democrats are definitely very weak. And I mean, I'm
sure you've talked with other guests on your show about
just the failure of leadership from Chuck Schumer, the Senate
minority leader. He's being you know, really reprimanded by members
of his own party. There's kind of been some tensions
really throughout the second Trump term where Democrats have been
upset that he has caved to Trump and Republicans demands.

(01:07:49):
But you know, this is just really the latest iteration
of this. You've had groups like the Young Democrats in
New York as well as nationwide calling for kind of
a rebuke consumer but even groups like Our Revolution, you know,
that's a Democrat, socialist, burning standards aligned grassroots group on
the left, and they're calling for Schumer to go. You've
also got other, you know, other members of his caucus

(01:08:12):
and his party on Capitol Hill. You know, two of
the more prominent ones that I can think of is definitely,
for example, comic women Jasmine Crockett from Texas. She's been
one to speak out against Schumer. And then I have
even some of his Senate colleagues. So you know, as
a minority leader, you're supposed to be able to hold
your caucus together, and that's something that Schumer failed to do.

(01:08:32):
I think definitely. Jeffries also in the House to an extent,
because of course the House did have to vote to
pass the Senate version of the package, but at least
the initial passage of the funding bill. You know, no
Democrats supported it in the initial stages in the House.

Speaker 4 (01:08:47):
So you know, I think.

Speaker 8 (01:08:48):
Schumer's really bearing the brand of this. And you know,
at the end of the day, if he wanted to
dig his the end and really at the end of
the day, accomplished nothing for his party for American people,
that's really what he won is accomplishing nothing.

Speaker 2 (01:09:04):
Yeah, and you look at the you know, the essentially
the people are the party. But look at Mamdanie in
New York and what just happened in Portland, but specifically
in New York City is that you have a socialist
who's going to be the next mayor of the City
of New York. And all that is is it's it's
the Democrats version of populist. It's the progressive populism, is
what it is. Like Trump is a conservative populace sure, and.

Speaker 8 (01:09:26):
I mean here's the thing with Mom Donnie, right, something
that actually sound quite interesting is that he actually lost
the demographic of the poorest New Yorkers, which I think
just goes to show that he is not going to
be the mayor for the common man. He's going to
be the mayor for you know, these Ivory Tower College
graduatests that are just burdened with student debt and who

(01:09:46):
think that life is just super unfair and that they
should get handouts instead of a handout.

Speaker 2 (01:09:53):
But at the same time, I know he was rallying
immigrants to his cause as well. And just the way
he ran his CA campaign and very untraditional, totally social
media and organic kind of thing, didn't he do well
with immigrants?

Speaker 8 (01:10:06):
He did to an extent. I think it's also interesting
to note that it's uh and you know, I think
we've actually seen this in both parties. Is not your
first generation immigrants, but your second generation immigrants and how
they fall politically. And so I saw a report, I
forget who's the news outlet. It might have even been
up at the Daily Mail, but not not one hundred
percent surround that. But I saw one report where you know,

(01:10:29):
there was a Chinese mom a Chinese immigrant mom who
was absolutely flabbergasted that her children had voted for Mom
Doami because she came from communism, right, she knows that
this government control of everything is a horrible idea. Yet
just one generation later, living in America, her children have
absolutely forgotten what you know, their parents fled and why

(01:10:51):
their parents came to America to through the American dream
and to know, participate in our system of democracy. And so,
you know, I think you really say that split is
that you know, for example, you had I thought clips
like this all over social media. You know, you had
a group of Muslims against mom Dommy. Yeah, uh, you know,
speaking out saying, you know, he doesn't represent us. You

(01:11:13):
know we we came from countries where shari Allah is
a thing, and guess what this is why we live
in America because we don't want this and we don't
want these values to be you know, combined with government.
And so I think it's really interesting to note, you know,
there's I think it really is that you know, kind
of second maybe even third generation of immigrants that maybe

(01:11:34):
have kind of you know, my generation, and even jen
AffA will play I think they've kind of lost the
plot a little bit.

Speaker 2 (01:11:40):
Yeah, and Victoria on that too, you know, socialists in
New York and Portland, and you know, giving more rise
to AOC. That's not the solution though, for the top leadership,
federal leadership anyway, simply because that is not going to
play outside of those cities, outside urban areas. That's no
way that's going to play, and that they're doomed if
that's the direction they're at it, aren't they?

Speaker 4 (01:12:01):
You know, I think so.

Speaker 8 (01:12:02):
And I think it's interesting to note just yesterday on
CNN rom Emmanuel of course, the Fromer mayor of Chicago,
former Congressman Fromer Obama administration official. He's somebody that's really
presenting himself as a potential candidate.

Speaker 4 (01:12:14):
For the Democrats in twenty twenty eight.

Speaker 8 (01:12:16):
And you know, even he said that his party needs
to figure out what they're actually for versus just being
against Donald Trump and against everything.

Speaker 6 (01:12:24):
That he stands for.

Speaker 8 (01:12:25):
And you know, I think that was honestly a little
bit refreshing to hear that. And then also Gavin Newsom,
of course, governor of California, he also said that, I
think the exact line was that the Democrat Party needs
to be a mansion to mom dommy party. So you know,
he realizes that the coalition, if the Democrats want to

(01:12:47):
win in twenty twenty eight, has to be big, it
has to be broad, and so they can't have these
ultra progressive, progressive populous that are gaining notoriety. I would
even argue, not he's necessarily same, but just really true notoriety.
They can't have them as a figurehead of their party
because that's not going to play. And those you know,
those you always talk about the swing states, that's primarily

(01:13:09):
what I covered in the last election in twenty twenty four.
That's not going to play in a bunch of those communities.

Speaker 2 (01:13:15):
Victoria Churchill's political report. Usaly Mail also contributed for Young Voices.
Joined the show this morning and talking about the next
shutdown in about ten weeks because obviously, as divide as
we are, and what the the powers that be simply
what happens, what happens with Schumer, we'll see who knows.
At this point, you'd expect there'd be some change in
the next few weeks, but that sets up another that's

(01:13:39):
such another fight. And I look at this and go,
I'm not quite sure who won the shutdown. It's it
feels like a myth to me that both parties are
claiming victory, but in blaming the other, what do you
think people buy?

Speaker 8 (01:13:52):
Well, I think I heard this said quite well yesterday,
is that the Republicans one in terms of pol seeds,
but Democrats won very slightly in terms of public opinion.
And I think that's the best way to sum it
up is that Democrats caved on absolutely nothing. But also

(01:14:12):
I think it's important to note that this continuing Resolution
government funding package is actually not conservative in the slightest.
It is a continuing resolution, so it is a continuing
of Biden era federal spending. And another point that well,
I guess i'll correct myself a little bit. The one
thing that the Democrats did went on is that they
are having the reversions of the reductions of force. So

(01:14:35):
people that had their jobs cut over the course of
the shutdowns, they now are getting those jobs back. And
so you know, we've been talking about the throughout the
entire Trumps administration so far about all these wonderful dog's
cups and how that's going to save people money. Democrats
were able to put their foot down and say we
actually want these.

Speaker 4 (01:14:54):
People to keep their jobs, which I thought was a
little bit interesting.

Speaker 2 (01:14:56):
Yeah, that is interesting. You know, federal workers alway support Democrats.
Nothing new there in those big unions. But the subjects,
the guarantees on subjects is what they gave up to me.
That's the big one here, and I've talked about before,
is that Democrats are taking money from a different pile
than transferring it to make healthcare affordable, which it's not.
But only if Republicans had a plan that would be great,

(01:15:18):
because they just talk about how bad it is. But
we've had what it's been ten fifteen years and they
still want to repeal and replace, but they don't have
a plan. I mean, how long does it take for
the GOP to come up with a healthcare plan that's
better than this? And why don't they do it?

Speaker 8 (01:15:32):
Yeah, you know, that's a great question, and that's definitely
a debate that's going to be raging on top of
the hill over the next few weeks. That's when I'm
going to be falling very closely, so you know, for
all your listeners, be sure to follow my work at
Dailymail on that. But I actually do want to make
a quick note on terms of the unions. I actually
thought this was very interesting from the President with these signs, Yeah,
you know, to build a reels in the government. It's

(01:15:53):
he actually thinks the unions, he thinks the AFGE, the
American Federation government employees, as well as groups like the
police unions. He actually thanks them for putting pressure on
Democrats reop in the government. So I thought that was
a very interesting note from him, in a very interesting
move from those groups previously, because again the AfD Government
Workers Union, they were actually one of the major groups

(01:16:14):
that started putting pressure on Democrats about a week to
ten days before the shutdown ended.

Speaker 2 (01:16:20):
You know, the term unsustainable brinkmanship has been used here,
and so what does a sustainable aproach look like? Is
there any political incentive free the party at this point
to pursue a long term budget entitlement reform revenue solutions
or is this just the way it's going to be
for the rest of our lives.

Speaker 8 (01:16:37):
Well, you know, I would hope that some of these
guys in Washington would come to their senses, but they
of course like yelling at each other. They like yelling
at each other through the TV screens. So I'm not
sure if we will actually get something like a long
term budget. But I also do know that the Trump
administration is looking and has again been talking about for

(01:16:57):
the entirety of their time in office, about long term
cuts that can lead to a balanced budget. You know,
we've had talked about the you know, the tariff revenue
potentially going to pay down some of the national debt. Personally,
I would love to see if they've spent on that
instead of those two thousand dollars tecks, even though you know, personally,
of course I'd love the two thousand dollars tecks. But

(01:17:18):
you know, I think long terms for the country, it
would really, uh really set us up for success if
we are able to pay down some of that debt.
And you know, of course, I think the thing that's
interesting to note is that lots of state governments actually
do know how to pass balance budgets.

Speaker 4 (01:17:33):
So you know, it's not like the.

Speaker 8 (01:17:34):
American system is so terrible that nobody can figure out
anywhere how to balance the budget. And you know, maybe
maybe not in this current administration, but I'm sure in
twenty twenty eight, on the Republican side, I'm sure we'll
see a couple of governors running for office that actually say, hey,
I know how to work with people that may not
necessarily like me, but to actually have you know, that
boon to the tax there. And you know, I think

(01:17:56):
he's done somethings great, something's not so great. But Glenn Youngkin,
my governor Virginia, I think he's actually a pretty good
example of that. He's had to work with a legislature
that at least expas at least a part of his
term has you know, been a Democrat, right, but legislature
as opposed to of course him being the Republican governor.
And we've actually gotten rebate tech back into the pockets

(01:18:18):
of Virginians with a balanced budget. So you know, maybe
not an immediate term, but that's actually just an example
of the fact that you actually can't have both. You
can you know, fund your your state services, but you
can also send money back to the factors.

Speaker 2 (01:18:31):
The shutdown all over ACA Affordable Care Act subsidies is
ten weeks too short a period for the Republicans to
come up with, Okay, fine, we're going to we're going
to do this battle again. We're going to replay it
and run it back. Is that enough time for them
to actually come up with a plan that's a better alternative.
If they couldn't do it in a decade decade and
a half, could they do it now?

Speaker 8 (01:18:53):
Well exactly, I think you're hitting the nail on the
head here. Why do something in ten weeks from you
haven't done it in ten years? You know, if the
only answer might be political pressure, is that going to
be enough?

Speaker 1 (01:19:04):
I'm not sure.

Speaker 8 (01:19:05):
And again I don't know if the administration is willing
to lead on this. At least the way that I'm
seeing it is the legis the administration actually kind of
took a back seat in.

Speaker 4 (01:19:16):
Terms of negotiations.

Speaker 8 (01:19:17):
At least I wasn't aware of them, you know, really
pulling any lovers behind the strings. This really seemed to
be the you know they call them the Big four, right,
that's you know, Schumer, Soon, Jeff Brees, and Johnson. It
really seemed like they were doing a lot of the
negotiations as well as you know, I think maybe the
administration did have some play in terms of for example,

(01:19:39):
the I did here. For example, Senator Katie Britt of Alabama,
she actually called the White House to get those those
risks that we just talked about, to get those in
the in the budget package to get people like Kim
Kaine on board. So, you know, I think there was
a little bit of that, but I think they were
more of like a yeah, Okay, we can do this
versus this is exactly what we want and these are
the demands that we have. And so maybe if the

(01:20:01):
administration is willing to kind of wheel and build behind
the scenes, which you know, I think we know that
they are able to do that. I think we saw that,
for example with the Big Beautiful Bill. I think I
had some lines that I've reported actually both out of
the House and the Senate that you know, the White
House was kind of the closer and the deal maker
when it came to the Big Beautiful Billy. You know,
I think they know how to be involved legislatively and

(01:20:22):
know how to drive traffic, but I don't really think
they did that on the shutdown. So I think if
they're able to kind of get their demands and be
in the room, maybe that's something that could actually leave
lead Congress to get there, you know, get their ducks
in a row.

Speaker 1 (01:20:35):
All right.

Speaker 2 (01:20:35):
Victoria Churchill, she's at USDLAIL Political Report also with Young Voices.

Speaker 1 (01:20:40):
And why don't we table it? And we'll have the
same exact conversation about ten weeks. How's that sound.

Speaker 8 (01:20:46):
Well, yeah, absolutely, and hopefully let's say catch up sooner
while I try and figure out what's going to happen.

Speaker 4 (01:20:51):
No care on capital.

Speaker 1 (01:20:51):
All right, I appreciate it. Thanks for the inside Victoria,
Thank you.

Speaker 4 (01:20:55):
Great.

Speaker 2 (01:20:56):
We'll do a news in a few minutes here in
the Big one seven hundred WLW, and then you heading
to the lunch hour. He needs something to talk about.
Arm yourself with the facts, the information. James Rapeene from
Locked on Bengals and Bengals Talk dot com well rehashed
the horrible lopsided loss yesterday when the by the way,
with the Bengals, you've got you got the backup quarter

(01:21:17):
ry back in for the second half in Mason Rudolph.
You got a terrible Steelers defense. I mean they're they're
really bad. Maybe not Bengals bad, but pretty close. And
you still put that effort in that we saw yesterday.
The offense gave up fourteen points. The defense played well decent,
not great, but okay, and yet the offense is the

(01:21:38):
one who gave up fourteen points. And at what point
does this, you know, start looks like it's starting to
the defense is starting to infect the offense. And at
what point do you simply have to move on from
Zach Taylor and Duke Tobin? And what about Joe Burrow?
That's next seven hundred. It's the stats loan shows seven
hundreds WLW licking our wounds after the beatdown yesterday administered

(01:21:59):
that Hans the Pittsburgh Steelers thirty four to twelve. Bengals
now sit at three and seven, meaning they've dropped seven
of their last eight after that two game two and
oh start and at next up back to pay Corps
for Derek May and the first place New England Patriots.
How we looking We're looking like it's over. James Repeat
is here from Lockdown Bengals and Bengals Talk dot Com

(01:22:21):
at s I. James, welcome. How's your head today?

Speaker 1 (01:22:29):
Not good?

Speaker 4 (01:22:30):
Right?

Speaker 3 (01:22:31):
Not good?

Speaker 4 (01:22:32):
No, it's of course, you caught me taking a drink
of water, Scott. No, it's good, it's good. It's it's
actually clear. And here's why we know who the twenty
twenty five Bengals are. And when you know that, you
can think pretty clearly. But yeah, it's obviously not the
ault that a lot of people listening, were expecting to

(01:22:53):
get this year or hoping to get yesterday.

Speaker 2 (01:22:56):
You come off the buy the Steelers d is, by
the way, near the bottom in the average of the league.
I think the twenty eight twenty nine do you get
their backup quarterback for the second half and Mason Rudolph
the cast off and you still lose by three touchdowns.
You know, that's on Zach Taylor, and that's the lack
of defensive talent, and that's on Duke Tobin. And yet

(01:23:16):
at what point does this organization make a change? I
feel it's there's no way they can lead this team
in the future.

Speaker 3 (01:23:22):
Is there.

Speaker 4 (01:23:24):
It's a good point, the Mason Rudolph point. And I
almost think there was so much that happened during that
game that stood out that people forget. That wasn't Aaron
Rodgers out there completing seventy five percent of his passes
in the second half and marching up and down the field.
And that's where it's just so unacceptable. Is Mason Rudolph.

(01:23:48):
All he had to do was throw it two yards
downfield and then whoever was catching it. But there was
Kenneth Gangwell, Darnel Washington. It didn't matter guess what those
guys were doing. They were breaking tackles, they were scoring touchdowns.
In Kenneth Gainwolf's case, they were humiliating multiple members of
your starting defense. And so the answer is, yes, everyone

(01:24:09):
should be embarrassed. I think the seats are hot, or
at least they should be hot. And in how do
you readout? Because that was a must win game and
not just they must win game for us, like something
I said on my platforms. No, that's how the Bengals
approached it internally. Hey, Joe Burrow's getting close. If we

(01:24:32):
win this game, we're only a game back in the division.
We have two matchups against Baltimore. Let's get this game.
And they came out, scored twelve points, had far more
than twelve miss tackles. And anytime you have more tax
than miss tackle open points, guess what, you have no
chance And they certainly had no chance.

Speaker 1 (01:24:50):
Yeah, and it's the deep.

Speaker 2 (01:24:51):
You look at the score, right, it's typically you go, okay, well,
what did Pittsburgh change defensively in scheme and personnel and coverage?
And they shut Ja March down more than that in
the second with his suspension that he's probably facing.

Speaker 1 (01:25:04):
But I look at it.

Speaker 2 (01:25:05):
They allowed fourteen points on offense. It was the defense collapsing.
That was the offense collapsing, which is well.

Speaker 1 (01:25:11):
That's new.

Speaker 4 (01:25:13):
It is new, and I'm not shocked. I'm not shocked.
It was a really weird debate that I had to
have last week with some Bengals fans, like, hey, Joe
Burrow makes this team better. And I thought I was
in weird, weird land that I had to say that
to people, because I know how great Joe Burrow is

(01:25:33):
and Joe Flacker has been good. But I also understand
that he's Joe Flacmow and we have twenty years of
what he is as a quarterback, and so yeah, he
took a little bit of a step back yesterday. It
wasn't just him, of course, I think the Jamar thing
to me that speaking of stuff that falls on Dak,
all right, well, what's your next pitch? If they do

(01:25:54):
take Tamar Chapes away, Either find a way to get
him the ball anyway, or two, make sure t Higgins
or andre Yosabash or insert whoever else it is open
and gives Joe Flacos some easy reads and easy ways
to get the ball out of his hand. And they
clearly didn't do that after that opening drive touchdown, and
really for most of the second half, they could not

(01:26:15):
get Mo rhythm on offense, and that's up to Zach
to find those answers, and they weren't able to find
the answers on offense. And I knew they would come
back to earth a little bit on offense. But yeah,
scoring twelve points, you have no chance to win many
games in the NFL and.

Speaker 2 (01:26:32):
Losen to a backup and it's so disheartening, right, And
so now the question is, Okay, you've got New England
come of to town. Okay, you'd have to win six
of your last seven for even a shot at the
division title. And you've got New England, you got Baltimore twice,
they're rolling Buffalo one yesterday. Miami has been playing much

(01:26:52):
better than Miami has in years past. And so do
you see a path here? Because I don't.

Speaker 4 (01:26:59):
No, No, yesterday was it. And I think internally they
viewed it that way too. And the reason I keep
saying that is because I really want to hammer home
what they were, what they were preaching, and how they
were preaching it Still alive, Let's get this game in
Pittsburgh and see how it shakes out. Well, you never
had a lead, you know, it was it was so bad.

(01:27:21):
It was like to me after the game, Zack Taylor said,
the score wasn't indicative of the game like and how
the game went. And I thought about it, and yeah,
there were times obviously there was seven to six at
one point, ten to nine at one point. I never
felt like the Bengals were in control. I never felt
like they were the better team yesterday. And that doesn't
mean that they weren't in it at point. That doesn't

(01:27:42):
mean that they couldn't have found a way to get
the lead at it and point. I get that, I
understand that, but there's a difference between that and being
in control, and they never were. And so I think
the score certainly indicated how the game went and who
was the better team for sixty minutes, And that's that's concerning.
At least I would be concerned if I was ownership

(01:28:04):
about that, because that was the game and that's the.

Speaker 2 (01:28:07):
Performance you got, you know it, it was a punt fest,
and so it was I think the last drive of
the first half, Washington's angry run with less than a
minute in the first half, he leveled three Bengals for
thirty one yards. That is, if you're to look at
this season on microcosm of things, that was the inability
to tackle and block is incredible at this level for
this team. The pun ended with Pittsburgh down at there

(01:28:29):
on seven yard lines and they were able to convert
that move about eighty four yards and under two minutes
and took a shot at the end zone before the
field goal. Now it was what ten six at the half,
Chase brown legs get them to ten to nine, and
so for the longest time it felt, hey, this game
is not a reach at all. And then the second
half comes along and usually it's defensive collapse, but we

(01:28:50):
saw a complete collapse of the offense in that regard,
and so you wonder if what's going on in the
football club the defense has now permeated to the offense.
And look at this will time somewhat with Jamar Chase's actions,
where now it looks like he's looking at at least
a game suspension for the spit and getting physical with

(01:29:10):
Jalen Ramsey. So does that attitude then transfer to now
the offense. It's it's like an infection. It feels like,
am I wrong?

Speaker 4 (01:29:20):
Well, no, losing is an infection, and when you're losing
and you're frustrated and you look up and you're just
not getting anything going, well, it is frustrating. I honestly
don't know why Jamar gives Jalen the time of days.
Jalen Ramsey is not as nearly the player that he

(01:29:41):
used to be, and you had to switch positions, and
all I would call him is an old man that
had to switch positions, and that would be it. But
they clearly got in his head, and that, to me,
that's concerning because I think Jamar Chase is mentally tough,
I really do. And so if you get in his
head and what's going on where he's rattled that the

(01:30:07):
team isn't moving the ball, like how bad is it?
And so to your point, like, yeah, the defense finally
shows up for a half, I'm not going to give
them credit for not being able to stop me. Some
Rudolf fish up for a half, they give up ten points,
still can't tackle Scott Sloan, let alone start in Washington.
And then on the other side you have a washed

(01:30:28):
up Jalen Ramsey. And I'm not trying to say that,
like the pick sides, I just mean going into Sunday's game,
I really wasn't worried about Jalen and he shouldn't be
good at He shouldn't be good enough to disrupt any
game plan you have, right, Jamar Chasen C Higgins And
so I don't know what the Steelers did to take
those guys away, but that that really shouldn't happen, and

(01:30:50):
yet it did because he didn't do much after his
his touchdown catch either. But yeah, for for Jamar to
be that rattled, that's that's the league guy that you
were turning to. And it does show where his head
at and probably where the team is that to a

(01:31:11):
lesser extent, knowing what they they knew and by the way,
in that moment, I did think, I was like, all right,
well maybe this will be a turning point where you're down,
You've been down through the office game. You get the
fifteen yard penalty, you're in scoring range. And then they
settled for a field and they had to take two timeouts,

(01:31:32):
and they had analty in attack, and instead of going
and getting a touchdown and goving some momentum with jam
and Ramsey out, it was sort of the opposite. The
Steelers defense was even better, even harder to deal with,
and in the Bengals they could not could not get anything.

Speaker 2 (01:31:47):
Going on off of Pittsburgh converted seven to thirteen third downs,
including multiple third and longs. And then Barrett Carter at
the end talked about, well, this should be ended on defense.
But I'll look at Barrett Carter. He got the green
die for defensive calls after they got rid of Logan
Wilson and has continued to struggle.

Speaker 1 (01:32:04):
So there's your core.

Speaker 2 (01:32:05):
And then you could talk about how bad Jordan battlings,
you know, Stone look and the inability to tackle guys
and yards after tackle, but it's all part of the
same thing.

Speaker 1 (01:32:15):
Yeah, and it is.

Speaker 4 (01:32:17):
It's the the tackles. To me, like a lot of
people are gonna say Darnel Washington, right, like, oh, he's
such a big you can't tack Well, then why don't
the Steelers throw to him every time?

Speaker 6 (01:32:30):
Right?

Speaker 4 (01:32:31):
It's because he can be tackled, right, And yeah, he's
a really good athlete. Throw him out of back, like
if he's near out of bounce, just make sure he
gets out of bounce. And you know, Barrett Carter gets
stiff armed into the ground, and then Gino Stone. It
was the poorest tackle of I mean he was waiting
and turning before even coming in contact with Washington. I look,

(01:32:56):
I don't really understand why they continue to deal with
Genos Stone lack of efforts in miss tackles. I think
Barrett Carter is really searching here and he got shaken
out of the shoes multiple times. Pat Fryar and Mouth
got him. Kenneth Gainwell got him. Yeah, And that's what's
wild is the two leading receivers for the Steelers. Wasn't

(01:33:18):
dk Metcalf, it wasn't Calvin Austin. They're speeding young receiver
and no, no, no, it's Kenneth Gainwell. They're backup running back.
Seven catches eighty one yards, two touchdowns. And Darnell Washington,
a tight end that really is kind of like another
offensive tackle that they use for blocking purposes. But because
you're so bad at miss tackles, you're so bad and

(01:33:41):
not physical enough that that's what you had to deal
with in Darnell Washington. In a game that had Jamar
Chase dk Met, captain Te Kakings had the longest catch
up the game, thirty one yards.

Speaker 2 (01:33:51):
You're making Dark Washington look like he's you know, prime
Travis Kelsey or Gronk or something like that.

Speaker 1 (01:33:57):
That's not the cat.

Speaker 2 (01:33:57):
He's a good player, but that's not the case. And
guys are bouncing off of him. And it makes no
sense until you get back to the central thesis here,
and that's Zach Taylor and that is certainly Duke Tobin.
And you wonder how much long this goes on. Or
let's say that the New England comes in and the
game goes according to Hoyle and they get smoked. Then
what I mean, what point do you go, Okay, We've

(01:34:18):
got to stop the bleeding here because you're seeing season
ticket holders jump off the cliff. The lack of interest
in the football team. They just got the new stadium
deal put together. It's not a good look that they
even care.

Speaker 4 (01:34:34):
They better care because here's why they should care. Like
if they called me, said James, why should we care,
Joe Burrows hurt whatever? As someone that has I mean,
I wrote a book, I wrote End of the Jungle
Book about the history of the Bengals. They have, Their
window to win a title should be the most open

(01:34:57):
that it's ever been during any part of their franchise
because right now when Joe Burrow and Jamar Chase and
t Higgins John on the same team, and it obviously
doesn't feel that way today, and so that one is
embarrassing too. You can't screw up your chance to make
a real run here and to get your Super Bowl

(01:35:22):
because you know how hard it is to get and
you have the quarterback to do it. You do, and
so do you have the coach to do it? Do
you have the front office to do it? Do you
have the scouting part of the department to do it?
And do you have the rest of the coaching stats
to do it? Even before we get to all right,
we'll clear you don't have the players to do it.
I think you know Stone isn't a good player. I
don't have to tell you that. Should you really be
starting two rookie linebackers and Orenburg's probably not, you know,

(01:35:46):
it doesn't take a football savant to see them, as
he said, But the higher level discussions they need to
be had now because it needs to get fixed. We've
seen it get fixed in or her To twenty twenty one.
Look how different they were different as a team, and
that was without major coaching changes. Yeah, but I definitely

(01:36:09):
think that that's something you have to consider as well
as the coaching part of this, given where you're at
and given the fact that you're more than likely going
to go three years in a row now without making.

Speaker 1 (01:36:22):
It's not acceptable.

Speaker 4 (01:36:23):
It's not acceptable, and it doesn't even feel like you're
gonna have a chance in December. Yeah, just to make
a room.

Speaker 2 (01:36:28):
Yeah, and it's Taylor, but it's it's just as much,
if not more, Duke Tobin with the personalities get on defense.
It's just simply it's not working. What he sees is
how to whack with what the NFL demands for your players.
Final question for a James at this rate, what is
the point of bringing Joe Burrow back?

Speaker 4 (01:36:45):
And that that's what if they get to three and eight?
I said it lastly, if they called a three and eight,
I would not bring him back.

Speaker 1 (01:36:52):
Why would you?

Speaker 4 (01:36:53):
And uh So, it's exactly right, And I get it.
If he's healthy, he wants to play. He's a competitor
that well. And I think there's one person in that
building that can have that conversation, and that would be
Mike Brown. I don't think Zach Taylor is capable of it. No,

(01:37:13):
I don't think Dotoga is capable of it. I don't
think Katie Blackburn or Towards Blackburn is capable. I think
Mike Brown is someone that can say, look, Joe, you
can play. We know it, We know you give us
our best chance. But this is about the twenty twenty
six Bengals. Now, you aren't going to play. We aren't

(01:37:36):
going to activate you in your twenty one day window.
We know you want to play, and we respect that,
but this is a decision we have to make because
we have to evaluate the rest of this rockter, yeah,
this coaching staff, and see what other changes we have
to make because we are not going to be We
are not going to be sitting at home in January
again next year, right.

Speaker 2 (01:37:56):
And God forbid, nothing season ending, career ending injury happens.
I mean again, to look at Washington a couple of
weeks ago and look what happened next.

Speaker 4 (01:38:03):
Yeah, and if he reaggravates his toe and it just
drops his office in training, you just don't want to
deal with.

Speaker 1 (01:38:07):
You don't want to do that. But now, what's the
likelihood Mike Brown has that conversation.

Speaker 4 (01:38:12):
I think it's good. I do I think Mike. The
thing that I think Mike is best at and it
annoys a lot of people and sometimes annoys me when
it comes to making moves and trades and stuff like that.
But he does not act with emotion. He's very He's
like a robot. And so he's not going to overreact.

(01:38:35):
After you signed Joe bro to this record setting deal
and now he's got a calf issue, He's not going
to say, oh man, you got to get this guy
on the field. He's not going to do that. He's
going to do the opposite. He's not going to overreact
after one loss because he knows it's a long season.
He's not going to do and I think that's why
a lot of people like him, and so I think
he's going to look at this from a that type

(01:38:57):
of perspective. Now, is there a chance Joe gets back
on the field. Sure, you know why. He's even more
important than Mike Brown. He's the most important person in
the building, no question, And so could he get his
way back on the field. Maybe the odds are greatest
that that does happen. But if they're three and eight,
I'm not chatting him out there on Thanksgiving and they
fall to three and nine, and really, what is the point?

(01:39:17):
And I do think they're going to be three and nine,
by the way, maybe with or without Joe Burrow. I'm
not sure it's gonna matter.

Speaker 2 (01:39:22):
Yeah, yeah, it's it's over at this point. Thirty four
to twelve the final yesterday, Pittsburgh, James Rapeene. More on
this at Bengals Talk dot com and the Daily podcast
locks on Bengals James, all the best will chat again
next week, as with the season, will never end. Appreciate
Appreciate it, buddy, I have a good one, Thanks God,
appreciate it. I've got to get to news update here momentarily,

(01:39:44):
and Willie takes over at twelve oh six. Here, I'm
the home of the best Bengals covered seven hundred w
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