October 31, 2025 • 31 mins
Kelly and Chip pick up where Kelly’s conversation with relationship expert Thais Gibson left off — breaking down the six stages every healthy relationship goes through and why most of us get stuck along the way. From the “honeymoon high” to the power struggle (and everything after), they share their own experiences, what Love Is Blind gets wrong about modern love, and how Thais’ framework can help us move past the bumps toward something deeper and more real.
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Chip Dorsch // @chipdorsch
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
Welcome to Jolila. We would call in from our listener
Kelly to let her boo know she loves him and
she's thinking about him across the country. Here's a little
Richard Marks going out to Kelly's boom.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Oh my god.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
I love like how juicy my mouth sounds.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
It's like ASMR or whatever they call that. Somebody somewhere
is really enjoying.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
That sounds a hundred.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
I love that you just referenced Richard Mars. Have I ever
told you I was working with him for a while?
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Shut up, I'm so jealous. I love Richard Marks so much.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Literally, it was one of those This was back when
I was in my twenties, so this was forever.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
You need to get him back as a client.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
No, he was living in Nashville for a minute.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
I think he still has a house here.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
I think, really, who the fuck is doing his screaming?
I'm just kidding.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
I'm a file hit his manager right now.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
It was one of those childhood moments of like what
is my life? You know, like when you just have
those full circle moments. I was. I remember being at
the Aquatic Club in bed Rouge hearing Richard Mark songs
and just die like I would be doing dances and
you know, such a fan.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
So then a huge When I lived in la I
was like had this like obsession about him, and he
was starting to, like you know, it had been a
while no one was really talking about him, but he
was like slowly starting to make his comeback.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
And I saw him at I saw him at the
l Ray, and.
Speaker 5 (01:44):
I was just trying to get anyone I could to
like be into Richard Marx with me. So I burned
a lot of copies.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
Of his Greatest Dance.
Speaker 5 (01:51):
I would just give them to people's gifts and make
them listen to it.
Speaker 3 (01:55):
Me. I literally had a box of them. I was
like his promo guy. But you just love Richard Marx.
Speaker 5 (02:01):
My friend Lyda, who I don't think listens to this,
but shout out to Leda if she does. She got
on board with me, like because we worked together. So
we would have to like drive to shows and like
riverside and stuff, and I'd be like, this is a
Richard Marx ride and it's all we're gonna listen to.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Oh my god, she was on board.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Oh my god. You know he's sixty two years old.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
I mean I knew he was in he was probably
in his almost well if I'm forty three, you know,
matth that's hard for me. I don't know. I felt
like he was.
Speaker 5 (02:28):
Like fifteen years Oh no, no, no, that's almost twenty
years older than you.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
Yeah, but I I felt like when I was working
with him, he was in his young fifties.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Got it?
Speaker 2 (02:39):
What is he sixty?
Speaker 1 (02:40):
What?
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Sixty two?
Speaker 2 (02:42):
Okay, so twelve years ago. Maybe he was late forties.
It's like what we were talking about last week, where
you thought people were so much older. So now it's
like my age.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
He looks good for his age.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Oh yeah, he's a very handsome guy.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
And he was really handsome. He's a great shape. Daisy Fuentes,
Oh that's new.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
See, that's new since we worked together because he was
married to some woman that was in Dirty Dancing. I
think she was that blonde dancer that danced with Patrick Swayze.
Oh really yeah, I think they were married for a
long time. I love that we're just taking listeners on
this deepak.
Speaker 5 (03:15):
I mean, if you weren't familiar Cynthia Rhodes, Yeah, she
was an actress and a dancer.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Was it the blonde girl from Dirty Dancing?
Speaker 3 (03:22):
Yeah? She was known as Penny for Dirty Dancing.
Speaker 5 (03:25):
She was also Tina Tech and Flash Dance and Jackie
and Staying Alive and offer Sir Karen Thompson in Runaway Wow.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Wow, Well we've given Richard Marks a lot of energy,
but we didn't mention Delilah, which you just really took
me back on that as well. I love that I
started the podcast and you just launched it.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Delilah is a I mean still is.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
I'm still obsessed with her. We used to listen when
she had her tagline was Delightla and then another voice
comes in and goes, love someone tonight.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (04:02):
She fourteen kids or something.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
It's like a million children and they're all adopted. I
think yeah, I think so. Yeah. She's a saint.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
She really is, and she really helped a lot of
people in relationship, which is an interesting transition. That's why
I was like, you know what, we're just going to
start because we're.
Speaker 5 (04:19):
Just going to talk Delilah. Should we get Delilah on here?
Speaker 2 (04:23):
Oh my god? What if Delilah came on? You know,
she would be one that I would probably be nervous
to interview because she's been interviewing for so long, and
those people are sometimes intimidating because you're like, they know
the program, they know how to do this, they can well.
Speaker 5 (04:38):
She has a podcast now too, it's called love Someone
to nic Well and she we might have a we
might have a way to get to her because it
looks like she posted about Lady A two days ago.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
So my god.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
So yeah, friends, our friends know how to get to Delilah.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
So if you're listening, yeah, anyway, we are on relationships
today and I told you Chip that I had Tyie
Skipson back on the podcast on Wednesday. I love her.
She is a wealth of knowledge about relationships. She has
something called the Personal Development School where Gina she used
to be a therapist for many years and then she's
(05:19):
created this school where you can do these different programs
or buy these different programs and complete the programs. But
they're really like helping you learn about how to be
in relationships. So she does a lot of work around,
like attachment theory. But she came on the podcast because
she has a new program about the six Stages of relationships.
You and I were talking about this last night, and
I find it to be such an interesting topic because
(05:42):
it feels so anti the way we are presented relationships,
you know, like I think we're presented in our society
that they're supposed to be this fairy tale. You meet someone,
you French charmav you meet Prince Charming, that's gonna rescue
you on the white who No, it's just the fairy tale.
(06:02):
And then maybe you get married and then all of
a sudden you hear a lot of people saying, well,
it's not what I thought it was going to be
or reality. So everyone says the first year of marriage
is the hardest year, and it's because there's actually six
stages of a relationship to get to this blissful love
era where you really do have a steady foundation within
(06:25):
that relationship and with your partner, and we don't talk
about that. So when people get to these different stages
that are a necessary route to the thing we all want,
I believe a lot of times people dip out because
they're like, this isn't what I thought it should be.
And I thought that was That's a really interesting thing
to think about, isn't it.
Speaker 5 (06:44):
I think about a couple of my friends who I
think are in some of the happiest marriages that I've
witnessed okay, and I remember both of them, but I
was friends with the women and the relationships before they
got married, and now I'm friends with their husbands. But
I can clearly remember both of them when they met
these future husbands of theirs telling me that they met
(07:08):
their husband and that big thought he was ugly. And
I think it's a really interesting point because they like
they were honest about it, but they were like, it
wasn't what I was expecting, but this guy's everything I've wanted,
you know. And I think, you know, I bring that
up because we're going to get into sort of love
(07:29):
being blind, and you know, that's obviously very trendy with
the television show.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
That's a big hit.
Speaker 5 (07:34):
But I do think that the root of a lot
of our problems is the superficial things that come along
with dating. You need someone with a lot of money.
You need someone that's going to take care of you.
You need someone that looks really good, you need someone
that's well endowed, someone that's got big tits, whatever it is,
and we're missing the point, like we need someone who's
going to love us for who we are, and that ultimately,
(07:56):
I think when you get through the six steps of
dating or relationship is sort of where you land.
Speaker 3 (08:02):
It's like someone that.
Speaker 5 (08:03):
It sees you and chooses you and is willing to
fight with you to keep you you. And I think
that's a really hard thing for any of us to stomach.
And a lot of us go into dating trying to
be this like perfect version of ourselves or like even
falsify who we are, just to win the acceptance of
(08:24):
the hottest person in the room. And I think that
makes it really dangerous, you know, It's there's nothing that's
sustainable about that unless you're really fucking lucky.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
You know, Like, yeah, well, it's interesting because I don't
think that we necessarily even discuss what real love looks like.
I think we have fairy tale love. I think we
have storybook love. I think we have movie love, and
then a lot of us it's the same as I
feel about sex. It's like we just kind of stop
learning about it. Like you just have this idea that
(08:56):
you created somewhere along the lines in childhood. We all
bring baggage from whatever it is, but we have this idea,
and we go looking after that idea. Like you said,
it could be anything that's superficial even and we're like, Oh,
if I find the hottest person in the world, then
I'll be happy in our relationship and we'll build this
fantasy life with a picket fence or whatever it is
(09:18):
that you desire in your life. And we miss, Oh,
there's another human in this relationship too, with all their
own baggage and all their own narratives and all their
own desires and dreams that we have to learn to
basically almost run a business with is what it is.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
Yeah, fit them into your life, work.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
Together, yes, like how to compromise. Yeah. It's just really
kind of wild to me that we're not taught that ever.
And so I think when you see couples in relationship
later down the line that are either going through some
of these phases or they have gone through them, there
can be different outcomes because it's like, if they're going
(09:58):
through the stages, you might be going, oh, maybe they
need to break up, you know, like if they're in
a power struggle stage, maybe it doesn't look so pretty,
But it's how you learn to work together, and can
you do that or are you just going after each
other and it's not going anywhere and it's going around
in a circle. You know, there's a lot of different
things that I think can be indicators of Okay, this
does need to go to the next step, or this
(10:20):
does need to end. So anyway, Tysa and I really
broke all of that down, and she taught me a
lot about the six stages. But I did keep bringing
up love is Blind to her because I just was
watching the new season and I know you've watched some seasons.
I don't think you this one, like spoiler alert. If
anyone is watching, I'm warning you right now. I'm about
(10:41):
to say what happened, So go ahead and like mute this,
turn it off. Whatever. This season nobody gets married.
Speaker 3 (10:57):
Any well, wasn't this the first season?
Speaker 5 (10:59):
And I haven't watched shit, but someone told me it's
the first season that the people are the most average
looking too, like se in seasons before, like no one's
arguably like the hottest thing in the world, but everyone's
like arguably attractive, And this one, this season finally had
some just like really average people.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
That's probably true, yeah, but there's also some really pretty people.
So yeah, okay, it wasn't It wasn't anything that stood
out to me as overwhelmingly ooh, these people are not cute.
Speaker 5 (11:32):
I kind of wish that that's how the show was,
Like I wish that it was like there were bigger
surprises and you know, not to tokenize anybody, but like
the world is made up of a lot of people,
Like there should be overweight people, there should be handicapped people,
there should like you know, again, they're selling the false
narrative of the prince charming, you know, like because.
Speaker 6 (11:55):
Of looks, because of looks, and you know, I would
love to see a surprise where, yeah, I would love
to see a surprise where this beautiful woman ends up
with like a chubby, bald dude because she connected with
his spirit.
Speaker 5 (12:10):
But you know, it's the programming goes all the way
back to our childhood. Like not to harp on the
prince charming thing, but like it's always a beautiful like
damsel in distress with a hot prince on a white horse,
and then there's like the ogre and the ugly troll,
and it's like we're set up to think that that
is what we're supposed to fit in with in terms
of relationships, and it's just a bunch of bs.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
Do you ever think through the confusing chemistry and connection
piece because you're talking a lot about being really good looking.
And I think what love is blind is trying to
do is actually find true connection with people, right and
take out that like physical piece of it. But again,
you still have to have chemistry, like emotional chemistry or
(12:54):
conversational chemistry or you know, you have to like connect
with people. So it's still kind of the same thing.
But I do think we get that one a little
confused in our world. Like if you're so attracted to
someone and you have that like racing heart, often we're like,
oh my god, I'm so into that person. But if
you really dive into like therapeutic practices with this, a
lot of times that can be coming from a dysfunctional place.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
Yeah, And if we just.
Speaker 5 (13:18):
Feel desire to connect, yeah, well, and it's coming from
a wound.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Often, like you met someone who is re enacting the
same wound you have in relationship with one of your
parents or something like that, and so.
Speaker 5 (13:32):
That's filling a narrative that you've imagined and you're like, oh,
this is the person, and you're ignoring all of the
other potential red flags or signs. Well, first of all,
what is the more important one when it comes to relationship.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Is it connection or chemistry?
Speaker 2 (13:48):
What do you think?
Speaker 3 (13:50):
Look, I think I.
Speaker 5 (13:51):
Can connect with a lot of people, but I don't
know that I have chemistry with a lot of people. Interesting,
But I also think too like you could have chemistry
and have like why sex with someone and not connect
in any real way. And ultimately, I think you know
you have to be in lockstep with your partner for
a relationship to work. You know, it doesn't necessarily have
(14:12):
to be like chemistry the whole time. I feel like
true connection is probably the stronger bond.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
I always heard you need two things to have a relationship,
the right timing and compatibility, So I mean compatibility. I
don't know. It could involve chemistry and connection ultimately, but
I think you can be really compatible with somebody. But
y'all could be in totally bad or different times of
your life right and that could be a factor of
(14:41):
it not working. Or you could be in the right time.
Y'all both want the same things, but you just don't.
You're not compatible and you don't have the right chemistry
and connections. I guess I would say both is important,
but I think long lasting you definitely need to be
able to connect with your partner, yeah, because as you said,
like you can't just be magnetic towards each other. And
(15:05):
that's where I think the trauma from the past can
get a little bit like dicey if you haven't worked
through that well.
Speaker 5 (15:11):
Because chemistry probably is that, like you feel that butterfly thing.
More so, it's like a physical reaction.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
To which they feel. Like when you meet the person
that isn't activating your nervous system like what we're talking about,
it's gonna feel calm and you're going to feel like
more peaceful than the butterfly like feeling, you know, right, yeah,
which is it's just hard to decipher all the time
because obviously, like you want to be attracted to the
(15:41):
person you're with, and you want to be drawn to
them and excited about them and all those things. Like
I remember meeting my boyfriend for our first date, and
we had been talking on the phone, and we also
had known each other a long time, so I already knew,
like he's hot all this kind of thing, right, right,
But I spent two months talking to him on the
(16:01):
phone because he lives somewhere else and so like we
really connected too. But then on our first date. I
remember feeling nervous before, but then getting with him and
feeling calm, if that makes sense, And that was like
a really I.
Speaker 3 (16:14):
Felt excited and not nervous, that's true.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
Yeah, maybe it was more like, well, it was also,
is what we've been doing for the last two months
going to translate into real life and like work when
we're in front of each other. Because we had had
such great conversation and sometimes we would spend like five
hours on the phone. We would just like lose track
of time talking to each other, you know, and then
there was almost this like pressure when we met up
(16:39):
for the Yeah, like or is this going to be
really awkward and we're not going to be able to You've.
Speaker 5 (16:45):
Already talked about everything like this soup is so good?
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Okay, I remember that one time we were talking about.
Speaker 5 (16:52):
Like, yeah, you're like, oh, you know, if we had
spent five hours on the phone talking about it, something
to talk about today. Yeah, I mean, look, I think
that butterfly feeling too, is often in the same way
that we just said that excitement and fear sort of
feel the same way. Are those butterflies something that is
also the fear of rejection that is like making you
(17:14):
feel this thing where you're like, oh my god, I
really want them to like me.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
I want them to like me. I want them to
like me.
Speaker 5 (17:18):
And it's not your body being like oh my god,
this is a real connection. So back to the question
that I post, I go connection. I think that is
truly the more important thing. And back to the story
about my two friends that said that they met these
ugly guys, who, by the way, aren't that ugly, you know,
They're just not they're not feel I don't think they listen,
(17:40):
but they didn't fit the mold, you know, but they
felt this like massive connection to them and believed out
of the gate like holy shit, like that I just
met my my soulmate and they knew and I'll never
forget that. So I do think it's important, especially when
we live in an economy now where we're like swiping
left and right and everyone is two dimensional on a phone.
(18:02):
I think that serves the chemistry part more than the
connection part. Because I know myself, like, I'm lazy when
it comes to like putting together my profile because it
all feels like a waste of time now, So I
think that we need to figure out a way to
get back into the dating space that centers more on
(18:24):
connection versus chemistry.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
But chemistry doesn't just have to be like attraction, right, like,
because I feel like chemistry you could have emotional chemistry,
mental chemistry with people, like it could be a bigger picture.
So it kind of is both. But I think what
you're saying is, don't just base it on attraction and
the external like good on paper kind of shit, right,
(18:47):
And it's interesting about when you were talking about your friends.
I do think something that another point that maybe you're
kind of dancing around is we have this idea of
just the magical falling in love like the fairy tale,
but we don't ever talk about building love and like
(19:08):
what the connection, the really the true connection with someone
looks like and the process of that. And that's really
what Tys is doing with this six stages work is like, hey,
there's a full dating stage and yes, that's really fun,
but that's also the time where you really need to
do your due diligence and like get to know a person,
(19:29):
do they actually align with you, like really digging into
that process of vetting and not just jumping into something
because it's there and you're been lonely or you know whatever.
It's like, really, does this person align with what I'm
looking for ultimately in a value system and a partner
(19:49):
in a foundation, and can we build with each other.
Then you go into the honeymoon phase, which is all magical,
and I said to her, I was like, oh, I
love the honeymoon phase, like it's the best phase, and
it is. It's so fun and exciting. Then you get
to power struggle though, which is like that's when you
were saying, everyone's almost showing up with their representative. But
(20:11):
then it's the power struggle stage, like shit gets real
and everyone's seeing all sides of a person. Hopefully you've
done your vetting and you've really like fallen in love
in the honeymoon stage, so that you want to work
through the power struggles phase like with each other, you know.
But like that's where a lot of people break up
because the second stuff gets hard. We don't have a
(20:33):
blueprint for how to do that, and so we break out.
Speaker 5 (20:44):
I know that for me, that's where my faults come
into play.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Well, well just.
Speaker 5 (20:52):
It's and now that I'm almost fifty, it's like I
feel like it's even harder because I'm more set in
my ways. I know that in my last relationship, it
was one of those things where it's like I and
a lot of it was unspoken. I couldn't see myself
moving into his house, and I couldn't see him living
in mind. That's not necessarily a power struggle, but it is.
You know, It's like there's a lot of compromise in that.
(21:15):
But I also wasn't ready to leave my house to
like go get at one with him. And I think
in those moments, that's where you have to like sort
of dig deep and be like ask yourself, well, why
can't I see that?
Speaker 3 (21:27):
You know, is it something that.
Speaker 5 (21:28):
I want to see or is it something that I
don't want to see? But I you know, I also
was like hyper aware of the fact that like if
the relationship was going to progress any further, like those
things needed to be something that I could envision. And
then you know, there were other power struggle things that
now I see in hindsight, that's what That's exactly the
phase that we were in was the power struggle phase
(21:50):
because my friendships were coming into play, and my work
was coming into play, and his friendships were coming into play.
So it was when you sent me the six the
six steps, it was really easy to see I could
look back at my relationships and be like, the power
struggle one is I think the one that I have
the most trouble with. Even though I think that, like
(22:12):
I feel like I'm still like open and willing to
like sacrifice and do all the things, and I'm like,
maybe not.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
You know, it's harder than we all want to think.
I think we all want to think, oh, I'm so
good at compromise and oh said whatever, but we all
are set in our ways or you see life through
your perspective. Yeah, to really truly be in a relationship
where you're you know, like looking at someone else's perspective
and compromising and working together takes more effort than I
(22:42):
think anyone wants to actually admit.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
Right.
Speaker 2 (22:45):
But it also, like we talked about that on the
podcast on Wednesday, the reason so many people leave in
the power struggle stage is like you are getting real.
So it could have been the thing where you were realizing, Okay, hey,
we when we were in the honeymoon phase, we weren't
fully being on honest about who we are, what our
goals are, like our foundation stuff. Maybe isn't as aligned
(23:07):
and so maybe we're not as compatible like we were
saying at the beginning, or it's when you learn how
to fight with each other, work together, accept the other
person's jobs. Like for instance, my boyfriend and I in
the last week and a half have been in these
little like round about they're not fights, but we've been
stuck on a loop of the same conversation. And it's
(23:29):
been a season for me where I've been really busy,
and so I was feeling like I was doing all
this stuff and he was feeling like he's doing all
you know, and we're just if you don't communicate, it's
easy for things to get blown up. Well, we were
just talking today about all of it, and kind of
I was just like, let's just try to get to
a place of resolve, and I realized we are able to.
(23:52):
The reason I think like our relationship is working and
why we've been able to maintain for now is because
whenever we get to these places, we really both have
the goal of trying to hear the other person's perspective
and like listening and actually just holding space for it,
regardless of if we agree or not. Like you and know,
(24:12):
very different people, and we live very different types of
lives and so it does take a lot of just
like open conversation sometimes. And we're also long distance, so
like we have to be communicating about how to make
that work or it's going to fall off. And so
but what I respect about him and like the way
(24:33):
we've been able to move together is that we can
have these conversations and I've never had that before where
you can actually like find the workable solution for both people.
Speaker 5 (24:43):
You know, I think it's really easy to fall into
a pattern of where you feel like you're in a
relationship and you're fighting with the person a lot, I think,
And I think that's the distinction that you have to make,
like are you fighting with them or for them? And
you know, I like I think sadly human nature is
we're all selfish in ways because it's a few and
(25:06):
I don't mean selfish in like the sort of traditional
sense of the word, but like we're all protecting ourselves.
We're trying to survive, and in doing that, we have
to be selfish. We have to put ourselves.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
First, self focused a little.
Speaker 5 (25:19):
Bit, yeah, self focused, And so when you're fighting for something,
I think it's really important to make it clear, which
it sounds like you all are doing that you're fighting
for the other person, that you're.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Not literally said those words. Today, I was like, I
think the goal of this conversation just has to be, like,
how do we fight for the relationship to be the
best environment for both of us in these seasons where
life is like pulling us in two different directions or whatever,
And because that was both of our goals, you resolve
it like yes, no, And it doesn't.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
Mean oh I hear you, I see that.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Yeah, if I get out of my own way, I
can always see his side, you know. It's just like
I think our human nature makes us want to defend
our side and see it and be heard and seen,
and that is important and so I need him to
do that for me too, And sometimes it takes us
like a couple conversations to get to that, you know,
(26:15):
like we don't do it perfectly, but I just think
it's important for all of us to talk about this
so that we're setting ourselves up one for reality like
realistic expectations, but two also success because this to me,
like what Tys is doing with these six steps is
the way to get what I think most people are seeking,
(26:38):
but we get stuck. And you know, she did mention that,
you said, you get stuck in this power struggle stage
or you feel like that's kind of where thing's in
for you, And she was like, if you find yourself
getting stuck in the same phase in every relationship, there's
probably like some sort of barrier within you that needs
to be looked at, you know, And so maybe that's
something to think about. But to me, that's helpful because
(26:59):
it's like, the only way out is through, and the
only way any of us ever change is by looking
at the reality of what we keep bumping up against.
And it's not always pleasant, but it does take us
deeper and it does get us to what we want
most of the time.
Speaker 3 (27:16):
Right, what's the phase after the power struggle?
Speaker 2 (27:20):
I can't remember the name of it, and you just
put me on the spot.
Speaker 3 (27:23):
Oh wait, I have it, I have it, I have
your notes.
Speaker 5 (27:26):
It was a stability stage, which is really interesting because
if you think about two people that are seemingly disagreeing,
but if they're truly fighting for the same thing, and
you can come to some sort of agreement or understanding
that like, you know, what's that famous saying like, we
can agree to disagree, which is I mean, it sounds
(27:48):
like such a way to just end an argument, but
it's actually a really interesting.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
It's always something I do assual because to disagree.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
Yeah, I mean, it's fine. We don't all have to
agree things.
Speaker 5 (27:59):
We can disagree on things, but you can like it
in a way you're saying like, look, I get your point,
You're never gonna get mine. I'm never going to fully
get yours in the way that you see it, but like,
I love you.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
We need to fucking make.
Speaker 2 (28:11):
This work well, and you can. I think, like one
of the things that I've been working on is if
I don't see it through the same lens, truly trying
to embrace it through someone else's lens and respect that lens.
Right in my former days, I think I would bump
up against that and I wouldn't have an amount of
a certain amount of respect for certain people's life lenses.
(28:34):
And that's not fair because we're all truly here. I
say this all the time on the podcast, like we're
here on different journeys, So how unfair of me to
be like, well, your lens and what the way you
see the world is just a dumber version of mine
or something, you know, like that's not what I think,
but I'm just giving that as an example. That would
be unfair, I believe, And so the goal being to
(28:57):
truly allow this for the space, like not just agree
to disagree, but also like, hey, but I respect where
you're coming from. My life experience or my perspective is
different because of this, and hopefully they see where you're
coming from because of that, And that's when you can
get into stability, I think is when you learn. For me,
it's been knowing that when we bump up against these things,
(29:17):
like we are going to work through it with each other,
and we're also going to hold a relationship at high
value still, so we will work to get back to
ground zero or whatever, and that having that steady foundation
does help with your stability. So it's like we know
when life because life just be life in you know,
like when life gets wild or whatever. Even if you
(29:40):
get a little bumpy with each other, you're like, okay,
but we've done this before. We know how to fight
through this. We know the conversations we need to have
or movements we need to take, and it just feels
a lot more stable, not so like threatening to.
Speaker 3 (29:55):
The relationship right right, Yeah, which I.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Have not always had so anyway, I just think it's
important to discuss because the older I've gotten, the more
I've realized how misguided most of us are on what
actual love and true like connecting relationships look like. So
I really I loved tay USA's work for that. You
guys can go hear our full conversation on the Wednesday
(30:18):
episode and also just check out her work. She has
her own podcast, The Personal Development School is amazing as well,
and the work they're doing. So I'll put all of
that in the description of this podcast so you guys
can go check it out. We always want to know
what you think or what you're going through in your
relationships as well, so you can email us at the
Edge at velvet edge dot com. You can hit me
up on Instagram. I'm at Velvet's Edge.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Chip I's set at Velvet's Edge. I'm at Chip Doorshits.
We're like laughing at each other.
Speaker 5 (30:47):
Chip d o r scch weal Velvet Edge.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
Yeah, thank god, it's Friday, guys, Like agif all right,
do you guys go into the weekend and you're living
on the edge. I hope you always remember
Speaker 3 (31:04):
To a casual man.
Welcome to Jolila. We would call in from our listener
Kelly to let her boo know she loves him and
she's thinking about him across the country. Here's a little
Richard Marks going out to Kelly's boom.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Oh my god.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
I love like how juicy my mouth sounds.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
It's like ASMR or whatever they call that. Somebody somewhere
is really enjoying.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
That sounds a hundred.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
I love that you just referenced Richard Mars. Have I ever
told you I was working with him for a while?
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Shut up, I'm so jealous. I love Richard Marks so much.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Literally, it was one of those This was back when
I was in my twenties, so this was forever.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
You need to get him back as a client.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
No, he was living in Nashville for a minute.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
I think he still has a house here.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
I think, really, who the fuck is doing his screaming?
I'm just kidding.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
I'm a file hit his manager right now.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
It was one of those childhood moments of like what
is my life? You know, like when you just have
those full circle moments. I was. I remember being at
the Aquatic Club in bed Rouge hearing Richard Mark songs
and just die like I would be doing dances and
you know, such a fan.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
So then a huge When I lived in la I
was like had this like obsession about him, and he
was starting to, like you know, it had been a
while no one was really talking about him, but he
was like slowly starting to make his comeback.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
And I saw him at I saw him at the
l Ray, and.
Speaker 5 (01:44):
I was just trying to get anyone I could to
like be into Richard Marx with me. So I burned
a lot of copies.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
Of his Greatest Dance.
Speaker 5 (01:51):
I would just give them to people's gifts and make
them listen to it.
Speaker 3 (01:55):
Me. I literally had a box of them. I was
like his promo guy. But you just love Richard Marx.
Speaker 5 (02:01):
My friend Lyda, who I don't think listens to this,
but shout out to Leda if she does. She got
on board with me, like because we worked together. So
we would have to like drive to shows and like
riverside and stuff, and I'd be like, this is a
Richard Marx ride and it's all we're gonna listen to.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Oh my god, she was on board.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Oh my god. You know he's sixty two years old.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
I mean I knew he was in he was probably
in his almost well if I'm forty three, you know,
matth that's hard for me. I don't know. I felt
like he was.
Speaker 5 (02:28):
Like fifteen years Oh no, no, no, that's almost twenty
years older than you.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
Yeah, but I I felt like when I was working
with him, he was in his young fifties.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Got it?
Speaker 2 (02:39):
What is he sixty?
Speaker 1 (02:40):
What?
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Sixty two?
Speaker 2 (02:42):
Okay, so twelve years ago. Maybe he was late forties.
It's like what we were talking about last week, where
you thought people were so much older. So now it's
like my age.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
He looks good for his age.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Oh yeah, he's a very handsome guy.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
And he was really handsome. He's a great shape. Daisy Fuentes,
Oh that's new.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
See, that's new since we worked together because he was
married to some woman that was in Dirty Dancing. I
think she was that blonde dancer that danced with Patrick Swayze.
Oh really yeah, I think they were married for a
long time. I love that we're just taking listeners on
this deepak.
Speaker 5 (03:15):
I mean, if you weren't familiar Cynthia Rhodes, Yeah, she
was an actress and a dancer.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Was it the blonde girl from Dirty Dancing?
Speaker 3 (03:22):
Yeah? She was known as Penny for Dirty Dancing.
Speaker 5 (03:25):
She was also Tina Tech and Flash Dance and Jackie
and Staying Alive and offer Sir Karen Thompson in Runaway Wow.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Wow, Well we've given Richard Marks a lot of energy,
but we didn't mention Delilah, which you just really took
me back on that as well. I love that I
started the podcast and you just launched it.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Delilah is a I mean still is.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
I'm still obsessed with her. We used to listen when
she had her tagline was Delightla and then another voice
comes in and goes, love someone tonight.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (04:02):
She fourteen kids or something.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
It's like a million children and they're all adopted. I
think yeah, I think so. Yeah. She's a saint.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
She really is, and she really helped a lot of
people in relationship, which is an interesting transition. That's why
I was like, you know what, we're just going to
start because we're.
Speaker 5 (04:19):
Just going to talk Delilah. Should we get Delilah on here?
Speaker 2 (04:23):
Oh my god? What if Delilah came on? You know,
she would be one that I would probably be nervous
to interview because she's been interviewing for so long, and
those people are sometimes intimidating because you're like, they know
the program, they know how to do this, they can well.
Speaker 5 (04:38):
She has a podcast now too, it's called love Someone
to nic Well and she we might have a we
might have a way to get to her because it
looks like she posted about Lady A two days ago.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
So my god.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
So yeah, friends, our friends know how to get to Delilah.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
So if you're listening, yeah, anyway, we are on relationships
today and I told you Chip that I had Tyie
Skipson back on the podcast on Wednesday. I love her.
She is a wealth of knowledge about relationships. She has
something called the Personal Development School where Gina she used
to be a therapist for many years and then she's
(05:19):
created this school where you can do these different programs
or buy these different programs and complete the programs. But
they're really like helping you learn about how to be
in relationships. So she does a lot of work around,
like attachment theory. But she came on the podcast because
she has a new program about the six Stages of relationships.
You and I were talking about this last night, and
I find it to be such an interesting topic because
(05:42):
it feels so anti the way we are presented relationships,
you know, like I think we're presented in our society
that they're supposed to be this fairy tale. You meet someone,
you French charmav you meet Prince Charming, that's gonna rescue
you on the white who No, it's just the fairy tale.
(06:02):
And then maybe you get married and then all of
a sudden you hear a lot of people saying, well,
it's not what I thought it was going to be
or reality. So everyone says the first year of marriage
is the hardest year, and it's because there's actually six
stages of a relationship to get to this blissful love
era where you really do have a steady foundation within
(06:25):
that relationship and with your partner, and we don't talk
about that. So when people get to these different stages
that are a necessary route to the thing we all want,
I believe a lot of times people dip out because
they're like, this isn't what I thought it should be.
And I thought that was That's a really interesting thing
to think about, isn't it.
Speaker 5 (06:44):
I think about a couple of my friends who I
think are in some of the happiest marriages that I've
witnessed okay, and I remember both of them, but I
was friends with the women and the relationships before they
got married, and now I'm friends with their husbands. But
I can clearly remember both of them when they met
these future husbands of theirs telling me that they met
(07:08):
their husband and that big thought he was ugly. And
I think it's a really interesting point because they like
they were honest about it, but they were like, it
wasn't what I was expecting, but this guy's everything I've wanted,
you know. And I think, you know, I bring that
up because we're going to get into sort of love
(07:29):
being blind, and you know, that's obviously very trendy with
the television show.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
That's a big hit.
Speaker 5 (07:34):
But I do think that the root of a lot
of our problems is the superficial things that come along
with dating. You need someone with a lot of money.
You need someone that's going to take care of you.
You need someone that looks really good, you need someone
that's well endowed, someone that's got big tits, whatever it is,
and we're missing the point, like we need someone who's
going to love us for who we are, and that ultimately,
(07:56):
I think when you get through the six steps of
dating or relationship is sort of where you land.
Speaker 3 (08:02):
It's like someone that.
Speaker 5 (08:03):
It sees you and chooses you and is willing to
fight with you to keep you you. And I think
that's a really hard thing for any of us to stomach.
And a lot of us go into dating trying to
be this like perfect version of ourselves or like even
falsify who we are, just to win the acceptance of
(08:24):
the hottest person in the room. And I think that
makes it really dangerous, you know, It's there's nothing that's
sustainable about that unless you're really fucking lucky.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
You know, Like, yeah, well, it's interesting because I don't
think that we necessarily even discuss what real love looks like.
I think we have fairy tale love. I think we
have storybook love. I think we have movie love, and
then a lot of us it's the same as I
feel about sex. It's like we just kind of stop
learning about it. Like you just have this idea that
(08:56):
you created somewhere along the lines in childhood. We all
bring baggage from whatever it is, but we have this idea,
and we go looking after that idea. Like you said,
it could be anything that's superficial even and we're like, Oh,
if I find the hottest person in the world, then
I'll be happy in our relationship and we'll build this
fantasy life with a picket fence or whatever it is
(09:18):
that you desire in your life. And we miss, Oh,
there's another human in this relationship too, with all their
own baggage and all their own narratives and all their
own desires and dreams that we have to learn to
basically almost run a business with is what it is.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
Yeah, fit them into your life, work.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
Together, yes, like how to compromise. Yeah. It's just really
kind of wild to me that we're not taught that ever.
And so I think when you see couples in relationship
later down the line that are either going through some
of these phases or they have gone through them, there
can be different outcomes because it's like, if they're going
(09:58):
through the stages, you might be going, oh, maybe they
need to break up, you know, like if they're in
a power struggle stage, maybe it doesn't look so pretty,
But it's how you learn to work together, and can
you do that or are you just going after each
other and it's not going anywhere and it's going around
in a circle. You know, there's a lot of different
things that I think can be indicators of Okay, this
does need to go to the next step, or this
(10:20):
does need to end. So anyway, Tysa and I really
broke all of that down, and she taught me a
lot about the six stages. But I did keep bringing
up love is Blind to her because I just was
watching the new season and I know you've watched some seasons.
I don't think you this one, like spoiler alert. If
anyone is watching, I'm warning you right now. I'm about
(10:41):
to say what happened, So go ahead and like mute this,
turn it off. Whatever. This season nobody gets married.
Speaker 3 (10:57):
Any well, wasn't this the first season?
Speaker 5 (10:59):
And I haven't watched shit, but someone told me it's
the first season that the people are the most average
looking too, like se in seasons before, like no one's
arguably like the hottest thing in the world, but everyone's
like arguably attractive, And this one, this season finally had
some just like really average people.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
That's probably true, yeah, but there's also some really pretty people.
So yeah, okay, it wasn't It wasn't anything that stood
out to me as overwhelmingly ooh, these people are not cute.
Speaker 5 (11:32):
I kind of wish that that's how the show was,
Like I wish that it was like there were bigger
surprises and you know, not to tokenize anybody, but like
the world is made up of a lot of people,
Like there should be overweight people, there should be handicapped people,
there should like you know, again, they're selling the false
narrative of the prince charming, you know, like because.
Speaker 6 (11:55):
Of looks, because of looks, and you know, I would
love to see a surprise where, yeah, I would love
to see a surprise where this beautiful woman ends up
with like a chubby, bald dude because she connected with
his spirit.
Speaker 5 (12:10):
But you know, it's the programming goes all the way
back to our childhood. Like not to harp on the
prince charming thing, but like it's always a beautiful like
damsel in distress with a hot prince on a white horse,
and then there's like the ogre and the ugly troll,
and it's like we're set up to think that that
is what we're supposed to fit in with in terms
of relationships, and it's just a bunch of bs.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
Do you ever think through the confusing chemistry and connection
piece because you're talking a lot about being really good looking.
And I think what love is blind is trying to
do is actually find true connection with people, right and
take out that like physical piece of it. But again,
you still have to have chemistry, like emotional chemistry or
(12:54):
conversational chemistry or you know, you have to like connect
with people. So it's still kind of the same thing.
But I do think we get that one a little
confused in our world. Like if you're so attracted to
someone and you have that like racing heart, often we're like,
oh my god, I'm so into that person. But if
you really dive into like therapeutic practices with this, a
lot of times that can be coming from a dysfunctional place.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
Yeah, And if we just.
Speaker 5 (13:18):
Feel desire to connect, yeah, well, and it's coming from
a wound.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Often, like you met someone who is re enacting the
same wound you have in relationship with one of your
parents or something like that, and so.
Speaker 5 (13:32):
That's filling a narrative that you've imagined and you're like, oh,
this is the person, and you're ignoring all of the
other potential red flags or signs. Well, first of all,
what is the more important one when it comes to relationship.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Is it connection or chemistry?
Speaker 2 (13:48):
What do you think?
Speaker 3 (13:50):
Look, I think I.
Speaker 5 (13:51):
Can connect with a lot of people, but I don't
know that I have chemistry with a lot of people. Interesting,
But I also think too like you could have chemistry
and have like why sex with someone and not connect
in any real way. And ultimately, I think you know
you have to be in lockstep with your partner for
a relationship to work. You know, it doesn't necessarily have
(14:12):
to be like chemistry the whole time. I feel like
true connection is probably the stronger bond.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
I always heard you need two things to have a relationship,
the right timing and compatibility, So I mean compatibility. I
don't know. It could involve chemistry and connection ultimately, but
I think you can be really compatible with somebody. But
y'all could be in totally bad or different times of
your life right and that could be a factor of
(14:41):
it not working. Or you could be in the right time.
Y'all both want the same things, but you just don't.
You're not compatible and you don't have the right chemistry
and connections. I guess I would say both is important,
but I think long lasting you definitely need to be
able to connect with your partner, yeah, because as you said,
like you can't just be magnetic towards each other. And
(15:05):
that's where I think the trauma from the past can
get a little bit like dicey if you haven't worked
through that well.
Speaker 5 (15:11):
Because chemistry probably is that, like you feel that butterfly thing.
More so, it's like a physical reaction.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
To which they feel. Like when you meet the person
that isn't activating your nervous system like what we're talking about,
it's gonna feel calm and you're going to feel like
more peaceful than the butterfly like feeling, you know, right, yeah,
which is it's just hard to decipher all the time
because obviously, like you want to be attracted to the
(15:41):
person you're with, and you want to be drawn to
them and excited about them and all those things. Like
I remember meeting my boyfriend for our first date, and
we had been talking on the phone, and we also
had known each other a long time, so I already knew,
like he's hot all this kind of thing, right, right,
But I spent two months talking to him on the
(16:01):
phone because he lives somewhere else and so like we
really connected too. But then on our first date. I
remember feeling nervous before, but then getting with him and
feeling calm, if that makes sense, And that was like
a really I.
Speaker 3 (16:14):
Felt excited and not nervous, that's true.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
Yeah, maybe it was more like, well, it was also,
is what we've been doing for the last two months
going to translate into real life and like work when
we're in front of each other. Because we had had
such great conversation and sometimes we would spend like five
hours on the phone. We would just like lose track
of time talking to each other, you know, and then
there was almost this like pressure when we met up
(16:39):
for the Yeah, like or is this going to be
really awkward and we're not going to be able to You've.
Speaker 5 (16:45):
Already talked about everything like this soup is so good?
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Okay, I remember that one time we were talking about.
Speaker 5 (16:52):
Like, yeah, you're like, oh, you know, if we had
spent five hours on the phone talking about it, something
to talk about today. Yeah, I mean, look, I think
that butterfly feeling too, is often in the same way
that we just said that excitement and fear sort of
feel the same way. Are those butterflies something that is
also the fear of rejection that is like making you
(17:14):
feel this thing where you're like, oh my god, I
really want them to like me.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
I want them to like me. I want them to
like me.
Speaker 5 (17:18):
And it's not your body being like oh my god,
this is a real connection. So back to the question
that I post, I go connection. I think that is
truly the more important thing. And back to the story
about my two friends that said that they met these
ugly guys, who, by the way, aren't that ugly, you know,
They're just not they're not feel I don't think they listen,
(17:40):
but they didn't fit the mold, you know, but they
felt this like massive connection to them and believed out
of the gate like holy shit, like that I just
met my my soulmate and they knew and I'll never
forget that. So I do think it's important, especially when
we live in an economy now where we're like swiping
left and right and everyone is two dimensional on a phone.
(18:02):
I think that serves the chemistry part more than the
connection part. Because I know myself, like, I'm lazy when
it comes to like putting together my profile because it
all feels like a waste of time now, So I
think that we need to figure out a way to
get back into the dating space that centers more on
(18:24):
connection versus chemistry.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
But chemistry doesn't just have to be like attraction, right, like,
because I feel like chemistry you could have emotional chemistry,
mental chemistry with people, like it could be a bigger picture.
So it kind of is both. But I think what
you're saying is, don't just base it on attraction and
the external like good on paper kind of shit, right,
(18:47):
And it's interesting about when you were talking about your friends.
I do think something that another point that maybe you're
kind of dancing around is we have this idea of
just the magical falling in love like the fairy tale,
but we don't ever talk about building love and like
(19:08):
what the connection, the really the true connection with someone
looks like and the process of that. And that's really
what Tys is doing with this six stages work is like, hey,
there's a full dating stage and yes, that's really fun,
but that's also the time where you really need to
do your due diligence and like get to know a person,
(19:29):
do they actually align with you, like really digging into
that process of vetting and not just jumping into something
because it's there and you're been lonely or you know whatever.
It's like, really, does this person align with what I'm
looking for ultimately in a value system and a partner
(19:49):
in a foundation, and can we build with each other.
Then you go into the honeymoon phase, which is all magical,
and I said to her, I was like, oh, I
love the honeymoon phase, like it's the best phase, and
it is. It's so fun and exciting. Then you get
to power struggle though, which is like that's when you
were saying, everyone's almost showing up with their representative. But
(20:11):
then it's the power struggle stage, like shit gets real
and everyone's seeing all sides of a person. Hopefully you've
done your vetting and you've really like fallen in love
in the honeymoon stage, so that you want to work
through the power struggles phase like with each other, you know.
But like that's where a lot of people break up
because the second stuff gets hard. We don't have a
(20:33):
blueprint for how to do that, and so we break out.
Speaker 5 (20:44):
I know that for me, that's where my faults come
into play.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Well, well just.
Speaker 5 (20:52):
It's and now that I'm almost fifty, it's like I
feel like it's even harder because I'm more set in
my ways. I know that in my last relationship, it
was one of those things where it's like I and
a lot of it was unspoken. I couldn't see myself
moving into his house, and I couldn't see him living
in mind. That's not necessarily a power struggle, but it is.
You know, It's like there's a lot of compromise in that.
(21:15):
But I also wasn't ready to leave my house to
like go get at one with him. And I think
in those moments, that's where you have to like sort
of dig deep and be like ask yourself, well, why
can't I see that?
Speaker 3 (21:27):
You know, is it something that.
Speaker 5 (21:28):
I want to see or is it something that I
don't want to see? But I you know, I also
was like hyper aware of the fact that like if
the relationship was going to progress any further, like those
things needed to be something that I could envision. And
then you know, there were other power struggle things that
now I see in hindsight, that's what That's exactly the
phase that we were in was the power struggle phase
(21:50):
because my friendships were coming into play, and my work
was coming into play, and his friendships were coming into play.
So it was when you sent me the six the
six steps, it was really easy to see I could
look back at my relationships and be like, the power
struggle one is I think the one that I have
the most trouble with. Even though I think that, like
(22:12):
I feel like I'm still like open and willing to
like sacrifice and do all the things, and I'm like,
maybe not.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
You know, it's harder than we all want to think.
I think we all want to think, oh, I'm so
good at compromise and oh said whatever, but we all
are set in our ways or you see life through
your perspective. Yeah, to really truly be in a relationship
where you're you know, like looking at someone else's perspective
and compromising and working together takes more effort than I
(22:42):
think anyone wants to actually admit.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
Right.
Speaker 2 (22:45):
But it also, like we talked about that on the
podcast on Wednesday, the reason so many people leave in
the power struggle stage is like you are getting real.
So it could have been the thing where you were realizing, Okay, hey,
we when we were in the honeymoon phase, we weren't
fully being on honest about who we are, what our
goals are, like our foundation stuff. Maybe isn't as aligned
(23:07):
and so maybe we're not as compatible like we were
saying at the beginning, or it's when you learn how
to fight with each other, work together, accept the other
person's jobs. Like for instance, my boyfriend and I in
the last week and a half have been in these
little like round about they're not fights, but we've been
stuck on a loop of the same conversation. And it's
(23:29):
been a season for me where I've been really busy,
and so I was feeling like I was doing all
this stuff and he was feeling like he's doing all
you know, and we're just if you don't communicate, it's
easy for things to get blown up. Well, we were
just talking today about all of it, and kind of
I was just like, let's just try to get to
a place of resolve, and I realized we are able to.
(23:52):
The reason I think like our relationship is working and
why we've been able to maintain for now is because
whenever we get to these places, we really both have
the goal of trying to hear the other person's perspective
and like listening and actually just holding space for it,
regardless of if we agree or not. Like you and know,
(24:12):
very different people, and we live very different types of
lives and so it does take a lot of just
like open conversation sometimes. And we're also long distance, so
like we have to be communicating about how to make
that work or it's going to fall off. And so
but what I respect about him and like the way
(24:33):
we've been able to move together is that we can
have these conversations and I've never had that before where
you can actually like find the workable solution for both people.
Speaker 5 (24:43):
You know, I think it's really easy to fall into
a pattern of where you feel like you're in a
relationship and you're fighting with the person a lot, I think,
And I think that's the distinction that you have to make,
like are you fighting with them or for them? And
you know, I like I think sadly human nature is
we're all selfish in ways because it's a few and
(25:06):
I don't mean selfish in like the sort of traditional
sense of the word, but like we're all protecting ourselves.
We're trying to survive, and in doing that, we have
to be selfish. We have to put ourselves.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
First, self focused a little.
Speaker 5 (25:19):
Bit, yeah, self focused, And so when you're fighting for something,
I think it's really important to make it clear, which
it sounds like you all are doing that you're fighting
for the other person, that you're.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Not literally said those words. Today, I was like, I
think the goal of this conversation just has to be, like,
how do we fight for the relationship to be the
best environment for both of us in these seasons where
life is like pulling us in two different directions or whatever,
And because that was both of our goals, you resolve
it like yes, no, And it doesn't.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
Mean oh I hear you, I see that.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Yeah, if I get out of my own way, I
can always see his side, you know. It's just like
I think our human nature makes us want to defend
our side and see it and be heard and seen,
and that is important and so I need him to
do that for me too, And sometimes it takes us
like a couple conversations to get to that, you know,
(26:15):
like we don't do it perfectly, but I just think
it's important for all of us to talk about this
so that we're setting ourselves up one for reality like
realistic expectations, but two also success because this to me,
like what Tys is doing with these six steps is
the way to get what I think most people are seeking,
(26:38):
but we get stuck. And you know, she did mention that,
you said, you get stuck in this power struggle stage
or you feel like that's kind of where thing's in
for you, And she was like, if you find yourself
getting stuck in the same phase in every relationship, there's
probably like some sort of barrier within you that needs
to be looked at, you know, And so maybe that's
something to think about. But to me, that's helpful because
(26:59):
it's like, the only way out is through, and the
only way any of us ever change is by looking
at the reality of what we keep bumping up against.
And it's not always pleasant, but it does take us
deeper and it does get us to what we want
most of the time.
Speaker 3 (27:16):
Right, what's the phase after the power struggle?
Speaker 2 (27:20):
I can't remember the name of it, and you just
put me on the spot.
Speaker 3 (27:23):
Oh wait, I have it, I have it, I have
your notes.
Speaker 5 (27:26):
It was a stability stage, which is really interesting because
if you think about two people that are seemingly disagreeing,
but if they're truly fighting for the same thing, and
you can come to some sort of agreement or understanding
that like, you know, what's that famous saying like, we
can agree to disagree, which is I mean, it sounds
(27:48):
like such a way to just end an argument, but
it's actually a really interesting.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
It's always something I do assual because to disagree.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
Yeah, I mean, it's fine. We don't all have to
agree things.
Speaker 5 (27:59):
We can disagree on things, but you can like it
in a way you're saying like, look, I get your point,
You're never gonna get mine. I'm never going to fully
get yours in the way that you see it, but like,
I love you.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
We need to fucking make.
Speaker 2 (28:11):
This work well, and you can. I think, like one
of the things that I've been working on is if
I don't see it through the same lens, truly trying
to embrace it through someone else's lens and respect that lens.
Right in my former days, I think I would bump
up against that and I wouldn't have an amount of
a certain amount of respect for certain people's life lenses.
(28:34):
And that's not fair because we're all truly here. I
say this all the time on the podcast, like we're
here on different journeys, So how unfair of me to
be like, well, your lens and what the way you
see the world is just a dumber version of mine
or something, you know, like that's not what I think,
but I'm just giving that as an example. That would
be unfair, I believe, And so the goal being to
(28:57):
truly allow this for the space, like not just agree
to disagree, but also like, hey, but I respect where
you're coming from. My life experience or my perspective is
different because of this, and hopefully they see where you're
coming from because of that, And that's when you can
get into stability, I think is when you learn. For me,
it's been knowing that when we bump up against these things,
(29:17):
like we are going to work through it with each other,
and we're also going to hold a relationship at high
value still, so we will work to get back to
ground zero or whatever, and that having that steady foundation
does help with your stability. So it's like we know
when life because life just be life in you know,
like when life gets wild or whatever. Even if you
(29:40):
get a little bumpy with each other, you're like, okay,
but we've done this before. We know how to fight
through this. We know the conversations we need to have
or movements we need to take, and it just feels
a lot more stable, not so like threatening to.
Speaker 3 (29:55):
The relationship right right, Yeah, which I.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Have not always had so anyway, I just think it's
important to discuss because the older I've gotten, the more
I've realized how misguided most of us are on what
actual love and true like connecting relationships look like. So
I really I loved tay USA's work for that. You
guys can go hear our full conversation on the Wednesday
(30:18):
episode and also just check out her work. She has
her own podcast, The Personal Development School is amazing as well,
and the work they're doing. So I'll put all of
that in the description of this podcast so you guys
can go check it out. We always want to know
what you think or what you're going through in your
relationships as well, so you can email us at the
Edge at velvet edge dot com. You can hit me
up on Instagram. I'm at Velvet's Edge.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Chip I's set at Velvet's Edge. I'm at Chip Doorshits.
We're like laughing at each other.
Speaker 5 (30:47):
Chip d o r scch weal Velvet Edge.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
Yeah, thank god, it's Friday, guys, Like agif all right,
do you guys go into the weekend and you're living
on the edge. I hope you always remember
Speaker 3 (31:04):
To a casual man.
Host
Kelly Henderson
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