All Things On Growing Orchids - Garden America Gardening Podcast & Radio Show [3.8.25] - Garden America - Gardening Podcast & Talk Radio Show

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome one and all. Here we are back in the studio,
San Diego, California. That is our headquarters, our home from
the iHeartMedia and Entertainment Studios in his garden, America, Happy weekend.
Kicking things off. I'm Brian Maine along with Tiger Palafox.
A few minor glitches just prior to going.

Speaker 2 (00:18):
On the air.

Speaker 1 (00:20):
Well about I think we're about what ten seconds late,
fifteen seconds.

Speaker 2 (00:23):
Lateh FCC is gonna be all over.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
All over us, right, Usually we try to get on
the air at six minutes after the hour. That could
be six minutes after eight, nine eleven, depending upon where
you are across the country. But it's Tiger myself, Brian Maine.
I was surprised this morning when I met you in
the parking lot and you said, no John today.

Speaker 2 (00:41):
Yeah, no John today.

Speaker 1 (00:42):
And it's like, wait a second, he was off last week.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
I know he's we can let him. Busy guy. There's
a wedding, right, there's a wedding going, a wedding going on.
He's got to get ready for that.

Speaker 1 (00:50):
So he's getting ready for his son's wedding.

Speaker 2 (00:52):
Yeah, not his wedding, Not his wedding. He's already married.

Speaker 1 (00:54):
Reconfirming his vows. So again it's it's just you and I.
No guest this week.

Speaker 2 (00:59):
No, well, we were planning on having a guest from
the Santa Barbara Orchid Show.

Speaker 1 (01:04):
Right because the newsletter said possible guests.

Speaker 2 (01:06):
We're not sure, right, and you know, no matter what,
they have a lot going on up there. Couldn't couldn't
work it all out. But you know, I mean we
can talk about orchids still. And you know there's also
the Philadelphia Flower Show. I got some info that happened
as well. There's a lot. There's a lot happening right now.
You know, it is spring to some degree in the

(01:26):
sense of this is the time when all of these
events start to happen. It is the beginning of it.
You know, the music and movie industry have their awards season.
This is the gardening ste.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
Everybody's waking up. Yes, now we had some good rain.
Oh right, I'm telling you it will flood flood advisory
warnings and script's ranch right wow. So yeah, things got soaked.
Things look really good.

Speaker 2 (01:52):
And the nice thing about is we're getting these rains
that space themselves out. So we get a good rain,
it'll allows the ground to absorb it a little to
their dry out a little bit, and then we're projected
to get a little bit more rain next week. So yeah,
it should be nice because that's going to be just
in time for you to not have to turn on
your irrigation system again. And now you get another couple

(02:14):
of weeks where you can just let nature water for you.
With with the San Diego water prices going up as well,
it's a good savings.

Speaker 1 (02:24):
If you get the newsletter, we were talking about orchids
a few moments ago. Yeah, nice article about orchids. The
newsletter was full of orchid information. John's article dealt with
you know what you should or shouldn't do, you know,
people thinking you should do this or that to orchids
when maybe you shouldn't as far as growing and propagating orchids.
So if you get a chance, if you haven't read

(02:44):
the newsletter yet, we're going to be talking about orchids
today to some degree, check it out. You can learn
a lot about orchids and maybe some myths that we
can debunk today. Do you have orchids?

Speaker 2 (02:55):
Oh? I love orchids. They're one of my favorite plans
and I have a bunch and I have a whole
I have a little orchid area orchid hospital that I
put them in between blooming cycles. Right, yeah, I love.

Speaker 1 (03:06):
Them, and people can overwater orchids. That was when the
newsletter as well. Yep, you gotta be careful. So again,
the newsletter a great source of information if you're into orchids.
And I think orchids are one of those things where
you buy one, you buy two. Now you're hooked because
there's so many different varieties of orchids. And I caught
myself getting into that category at one time too.

Speaker 2 (03:27):
And especially if you can get them to rebloom. A
lot of people will just buy them as like a
cut flowers, so to speak, and it blooms, throw it away,
get a new one, by another one. But that's why
you know, I say I have a little orchid hospital,
because I collect them, and then when they're not in bloom, obviously,
you know you don't have them in your window seal,
you don't put them on the counter. You you know

(03:49):
they're not that great to have out there, so you
put them in the little hospital. You see that spike again,
Now it's time to bring it back in the house.
Show it off, it's done blooming back out side.

Speaker 1 (04:00):
So that's that's the key right there. I think a
lot of people may think, I don't know. That just
seems too difficult. In between blooms, what do I do?
So what do you do when you buy an orchid
and then it starts to you know, look a little
peak in. It looks like it's dying, but it's not.
What's the key? What does your hospital do for your orchids?

Speaker 2 (04:18):
So the key thing is number one. Outside. A lot
of people think that orchids need to be kept inside
all the time, but that's not the case. A matter
of fact, faalian oposis need a chill to bloom. So failianopsis,
which is like the moth orchid. You know what you
see at the grocery store. Ninety percent of the time.

Speaker 1 (04:38):
Trader Joe is a good place, exactly.

Speaker 2 (04:39):
Yeah. Yeah, they always have them right when you walk in.
And a lot of people think, oh, I just have
to keep it inside. No, your your interior house temperature
is usually kept somewhere between sixty nine and seventy five
degrees and that's way too warm for them to bloom. Again.
They need that chill, so outside, protected patio porch.

Speaker 1 (05:01):
Indirect sunlight because you don't want to burn the leaves.

Speaker 2 (05:04):
That is one hundred percent true. Because they also think
about where they're native to under canopies. You know, yes
they are warm sunny areas, but they're undercanopies. They're protected.
And then like what you said, they can get over watered.
So they need to have that airflow. So wherever they're at,
they need to have airflow all around them, top and bottom.

(05:25):
A lot of orchids are just in bark and so
they just need to make sure that the root system
isn't sitting in water. And if you do that, you've
got an orchid hospital. Anything will rebloom in that area.
I think.

Speaker 1 (05:38):
I think orchids are very cool. They just basically basically
need a host. Yeah, they need someplace to set up roots.

Speaker 2 (05:45):
Yep, they're not something to attach on to. Remember when
in Costa Rica, we just see them in the trees everywhere.

Speaker 1 (05:50):
All over, yeah, all over the place.

Speaker 2 (05:52):
And it's true, orchids are the largest well not just
but no, but I'm but the largest family the genus
of plants. You know, with so many varieties, so many
different areas they grow. And then there's these weird orchids
that grow like in the Alps and different areas like that.

(06:13):
People think like, oh, or kid, it's Costa Rica and Hawaii. No, no, no,
there's orchids all over the world.

Speaker 1 (06:19):
So that show is this weekend Santa Barbara.

Speaker 2 (06:21):
Yeah, up there in Santa Barbara. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (06:23):
So if anybody had a chance to go buy or
plans to go buy and let us know please, I
can imagine share some photos. Any any kind of convention
or get together, whether it's a reptile convention orchid show,
row show, whatever, you have a lot of like minded
people there.

Speaker 2 (06:39):
They should do like a combo event where it's that
you got the reptiles over here, the orchids over here,
and then the miniature pine trees something.

Speaker 1 (06:48):
It's the closest thing you can get to as an
adult when you were a kid going into a toy
store looking around, and when you're an adult it's kind
of the same thing. You're like, Wow, look at I
didn't even know this existed. How much is that? Can
I get one of those? Do you grow it?

Speaker 2 (07:01):
You know? It'd be so much fun to kind of
just pruse the aisles and talk to people and see
what you want. I mean, you know, we go to
the Plumeria show and I'm like that, I always pick
up two or three new plum areas.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
Yeah, you have to. It's kind of kind of an
unwritten role that before you leave you must make a purchase.

Speaker 2 (07:17):
Yeah. The only thing about orch is they could be
pretty pricey, right of course. Yeah. You know, they are
not fast growing all the time like some of the
other plants are, so they're very The reason why price
goes up on plants is the rate of reproduction and
the ease of it growing. The harder they are to
grow and the slower they are to reproducing each other,
the price of any plant's going to go up.

Speaker 1 (07:37):
So the harder they are, the harder they are to grow,
the price is gonna now you would think. So you're
saying that the easier they are to grow, the price
is lower.

Speaker 2 (07:48):
Oh EASi, Yeah, because you know, I mean, if I'm
growing an agapanthus, I can pretty much drop it in
my front yard and it would grow. So for a
grower who is growing ten thousand agapanths, it's really easy.
They put it in some pot with some soil, they
water it, they fertilize it. The plant grows. But now,

(08:09):
you know we talked about boga villa. You know, they
don't transplant real well. So for a grower, they can't
just put it in a one gallon, then put into
a five, and then put it in a fifteen. It's
much more difficult. They're gonna lose a few along the
way when they do that, or they're gonna start that
one gallon in a fifteen and then just let it
put its whole life in there rather than do the transplant,

(08:32):
because they're gonna lose them. Right, so they have loss
that they're gonna factor into the price of the plant,
and right then and there they might lose ten to
twenty percent, where an agapanth is you don't lose any percentage.

Speaker 1 (08:46):
So if you have a plant, or you know, take
a dive into trying to grow something that you haven't
grown before, and like you say, it's gonna be harder.
This is gonna be harder to grow, it's gonna take longer. Yeah,
and it's gonna cost you more money because of that.

Speaker 2 (08:59):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (09:00):
Wow, you're taking kind of a chance because it's not
easy to grow. You're gonna you're gonna spend this money
hoping you can do it, because it's harder and it
takes longer, you don't see your return quite as quickly.
So so it's kind of a gamble. You're rolling the
dice in a sense.

Speaker 2 (09:15):
It's not a gamble if you listen to the show
and you know how to go.

Speaker 1 (09:18):
That's that's true.

Speaker 2 (09:19):
But you know a lot of people.

Speaker 1 (09:21):
You know, you go to a box store and you
know this that they're selling things out of season. So
it's like, why wait a minute, hold on you and
the average person, you know, the delayed person who is
you know, they don't spend their whole life in the garden. Well,
this looks nice. I think I'll make a purchase. It
looks so pretty in the store.

Speaker 2 (09:39):
They get home and then they get home and.

Speaker 1 (09:40):
It's like, what, you know, what happened to this thing?
You'll need to keep a good eye in the comments.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
Yeah, I'm watching right now.

Speaker 1 (09:45):
Okay, we have a break coming up here in just
about a minute. Do you have that quote? And again,
John is not here. John is home preparing for a
wedding today, two weeks off. So we will give them
a hard time next week.

Speaker 2 (09:58):
So the quote, I I read this book per John's
recommendation Susan Orlean's from The Orchid Thief. This is where
the quote is from, and it's a really interesting story.
If you anybody has a chance to read The Orchid
Thief read it. You know. Number one, it's to some
degree political when it comes to plants, and then it
also gives you a bit of insight and plant hunting

(10:20):
and all of the fun stuff that you know whenever
you we're looking for new plants. When a man falls
in love with orchids, he'll do anything to possess the
one he wants. It's like chasing a green eyed woman
or taking cocaine. It's a sort of madness. I don't
know where Susan Orlean came up with that, because maybe

(10:43):
maybe she had a lot of experience with cocaine and
greeneed riding.

Speaker 1 (10:46):
But but you're right, hey, get it to take a break.
Welcoming our friends listeners on biz Talk Radio. I'm Brian
Main along with Tiger Palafox. John is off for the weekend,
so we're going to take a break and pay some bills.
A big thanks to Fertilomar major Sponsori Talk Radio. This
break is for you. Stay with us, Okay, we are back.
Thank you to those tuned in on BIS Talk Radio.
Big thank you to Stephanie in charge of keeping us

(11:09):
on the air nationally and BIS Talk Radio Stephanie and
her team, So thank you the rest of us on
Facebook Live BIS Talk Radio Facebook Live every weekend here
on guard in America, Brian Maine, John Beg Nasco usually
and Tiger Pella Fox As we talk about a lot
of things this morning, no guest, we kicked the show
off talking about orchids. Anybody with any questions or comments
so far?

Speaker 2 (11:28):
Tiger, Oh yeah, We've got Tanya and Carla and Leonor
and Kevin and his thumb on the program with us,
and a lot of them are talking about the newsletter photos,
you know, because you know, John did such a wonderful
job this week putting together that newsletter with the different
orchid photos and different articles and stuff. But you know,

(11:48):
with our guests, you know, I number one had a
paint lily photo in there, really unique plant. I'll have
to do a close up photo of the bloom because
I've number one. I started off with that one plant
a few years back that John gave to me. Now
it's got three blooms on.

Speaker 1 (12:07):
Yeah, it's in the newsletter for those that do get
the newsletter.

Speaker 2 (12:10):
Right. So, the the close up bloom is very pretty.
The faraway bloom almost doesn't do it.

Speaker 1 (12:15):
But you could put that on our page right now,
write that picture.

Speaker 2 (12:18):
It's on yeah, yeah, I'll do it on our page one.
Yeah that way.

Speaker 1 (12:21):
Yeah, those that are watching right now can can click
and take a look at it. Uh yeah, very nice.
It looks like I told, like a doctor Seuss plant. Yeah,
it just doesn't look real. It's very very nice.

Speaker 2 (12:30):
And then it's funny. Then Sherry had a protea picture.

Speaker 1 (12:34):
Right, But who had the outdoor lighting?

Speaker 2 (12:36):
So that's Tanya. Yeah, and it's funny because it's it's
a outdoor light. It's covering her water feature, beautiful plants
all the way around.

Speaker 1 (12:45):
You talked about outdoor lighting last was it last week
or two weeks ago? No?

Speaker 2 (12:48):
Last week last week? Right, Yeah, And it's funny because
then there's the chatter on how did they get the
light up there? And you know they copper condu it
running into the lamp. You know, like it's got an
nice patina now because of the copper exactly. So yeah,
there's a fun chat going on right now. With our listeners.
So thank you very much for joining the program everyone,
And you know it's kind of see it's see you

(13:11):
know we talk about right now. It's also going to
be garden garden walk season coming up, where people walk
or take tours and go in people's homes and they
get these inspirations. They get this inspiration from seeing other
people's yards. Well, that's our newsletters.

Speaker 1 (13:27):
I don't want to do that.

Speaker 2 (13:28):
Yeah, now they can do that. So Carlo says Tiger,
I put my moth ork it's outside to make room
for my Christmas decor. And now two of them have
new bloom spice. Yep. You just move them outside for
a little bit protected area and they'll bloom right away
for you. And then Cherry, thank you. After our trip

(13:51):
to Africa, I need to change up my landscape. She
got inspired on it, exactly.

Speaker 1 (13:57):
I don't think. I don't think legally you can keep
a lion out where you live. You want to double
check with a county on that.

Speaker 2 (14:07):
Oh wow, can you imagine a lion?

Speaker 1 (14:13):
And well, you know who had a lion in their
backyard back in the day. Uh, Now some of our
listeners will know the name. You know who Tippy Hendron
is no. Tippy Hendron is the mother of Melanie Griffith,
and Tippy Hedrin was in I believe the birds Alfred Hitchcock.

Speaker 2 (14:30):
Oh that way.

Speaker 1 (14:31):
Anyway, they her and your husband at the time. For
some reason, they had lions and they're living in la
I don't know. I'm assuming it was out and about someplace,
but had a lion like around their pool and just
as part of the family. And I think a few
things might have happened. Uh, you know, a love bite
might have gone too far. But yeah, speaking of lions here.
So did me to get you off track?

Speaker 2 (14:53):
Cherry wrote, yeah, don't let them know. Oh another so,
another fun event that's happening this weekend is tomato Mania
at Mischill's Nurse.

Speaker 1 (15:04):
Shit, you're a nursery.

Speaker 2 (15:05):
Yeah, so if you're in the San Diego area and
you're looking to get your selection of tomatoes, right now
is the time to go and visit the nursery. And
you know, hundreds and hundreds of varieties of tomatoes, small, big, compact, giant, sweet, sour, sweet, sour, yellow, purple,
what was the sweet apertive?

Speaker 1 (15:28):
Well, we talked about that, but then I brought up
the fact that like, like a sandwich tomato.

Speaker 2 (15:32):
Oh, a slicing tomato. Yeah, and you.

Speaker 1 (15:33):
Mentioned one that was sweet, someone of our listeners.

Speaker 2 (15:35):
Did, Yeah, what was it? Pineapple?

Speaker 1 (15:37):
Pineapple? Yeah, slicing tomato pineapple for a sandwich.

Speaker 2 (15:40):
Yep, that's a good one for a sandwich for sure. Yeah,
there's so many varieties. Yeah, it's really cool, and it's
it's almost hard to grow tomatoes every year because obviously
when you find one that you like, you want to
keep planting it, right, you know, why not? It's safe,
you like it, you know it. Then at the same

(16:00):
time you see something new and you're like, ooh.

Speaker 3 (16:03):
So I always do new, you know. It's I always
do three, like the glitter and the glitz. Yeah, I
always do three. I do a cherry tomato, and that
one can change and rotap because I kind of feel like,
I don't know, I don't need the same cherry tomato
every year. I do a big slicing tomato, right, and
then I always do like a really obscure, weird one

(16:27):
that I've never done before. So the cherry tomato and
the big slicing tomato, they could be the same one
year after year, or I change it up, maybe depending
on what strikes me interesting. But then I always throw
in a random you know, Brad's atomic grade or you
know carbon.

Speaker 1 (16:46):
Now, there's a couple of two or three years ago.
One of the tomatoes you gave us was a very
small tomato spoon.

Speaker 2 (16:51):
And it was that small one. Remember, it was like
like almost like a jelly bean like little.

Speaker 1 (16:56):
Yeah, with sweet, pretty sweet, I think, And I'd be
out they're working in the patio and I would just
pick them and eat them like grapes. Yeah, really really good,
but yeah, very small. You said, that's called spoon.

Speaker 2 (17:08):
Yes, spoon tomato, Tony, how do I find out when
San Diego garden walks are? I'll be in San Diego
end of April for the Cactus and Succulent Convention. So
for Tanya, I mean, you know, there's a Santye Home
and Garden magazine that actually puts together a full list

(17:28):
of all the different garden walks. I don't know if
they continue to do that, but I mean that is
one way to do it.

Speaker 1 (17:36):
Isn't there not one up in next to your nursery
or in that neighborhood that.

Speaker 2 (17:42):
Guard Yeah, there is one, and that one is Mother's
Day weekend. So that's the first weekend I think in.

Speaker 1 (17:47):
May, so maybe a little bit past the time.

Speaker 2 (17:50):
Yeah, but no, she might still be in town if
she's Yea, it says end of April for the Cactus Convention,
so yeah. Or I mean, you just google garden walks
San Diego because there's the Mission Hills one, there's La Joya,
there's Point Loma, and these are all central San Diego ones.

(18:11):
I think there's a Claremont one and I then I
think the other ones kind of get you know, maybe
like Ensiginnitas or Escondido or more East counties. You know.

Speaker 1 (18:22):
The Cactus convention we're talking about now, See, that would
be another one where you'd go because you're curious, and
you would come across so many different varieties that you
never even knew existed.

Speaker 2 (18:34):
Really cool.

Speaker 1 (18:34):
You'd say, cactus, that's a cactus, that's a succulent. Really
I can grow that. Look at the colors. I didn't
know that succulents and cactus had so many colors. So
you're talking, we talked about the varieties of orchids. That
would be another eye opener.

Speaker 2 (18:47):
You know, my favorite and my my orchid, cactus succulent
is the new varieties of mangave. So a mangave is
a criss across between it and I know it starts
with a mango, a mango mangave. But they're very cool

(19:08):
colors and cool shapes and the leafs on them are
just very interesting and there's a lot of variety. So
mangavi's are my new passion.

Speaker 1 (19:20):
Okay, hold on to that thought. Any other comments. It's
break time for biz Talk Radio. So again, thank you
to Fertil on major sponsor. We have other supporters too
on biz Talk Radio. As we take this break, do
stay with us those on Facebook Live. Yeah, keep those
questions comments rolling our way. We'll try to hit as
many topics as we can today. Whatever's on your mind.
I'm Brian Main John has the day off again. Tigers
with me. We're gonna take a break these messages for

(19:42):
biz Talk Radio. All right, Just like that, we are back.
We trust you had a good break. I love the
fact that on Facebook Live you can see our listeners
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the show on Facebook Live. You can be a part
of that as well. If you do tune in on
talk radio, go to our Facebook page Garden America Radio

(20:03):
Show Every weekend eight o'clock in the West Coast eleven
o'clock Eastern time zone. You can watch us live, interact,
take part, and hey, make some new friends on our
Facebook page it is Garden America.

Speaker 2 (20:15):
Carla really liked my format of growing tomatoes, she says,
a discipline and an effective way to grow tomatoes by
having my three you know, my cherry, my slicing, and
then my weird one. Tanya, she says, Tiger Camellia question.
I planted a spring song that I was planted around

(20:35):
nineteen eighty seven. This year has many yellow leaves. I
gave it iron about a month ago, but I don't
see a change. Is there anything else to green it up?

Speaker 1 (20:46):
What is the lifespan normally of that time?

Speaker 2 (20:49):
I mean, camelias can live, they can go forever time. Yeah,
they can live for a very long time. So I
don't think it has anything to do with the lifespan.

Speaker 1 (20:56):
Is it in ground or a pot?

Speaker 2 (20:59):
That's a great question, Tanya, Yeah, is it in the
ground or a pot? But I think that I can
help her out, you know, just from that because number
one iron, Iron is very easy to identify, and iron
deficiency is very easy to identify on a plant because
it's yellow leaves with green veins, so meaning you know,

(21:19):
the leaf is yellow, but the little veins in the
leaf are still green. That's an iron deficiency, so it's
easy to kind of see that in the plant. So
if that's happening, you're putting on iron is great. There's
a lot of ways that iron is delivered to the plant,
so you might want to look at the prod iron

(21:40):
product that you used, whether you know it's chelated iron
or liquid iron or different things like that, because sometimes
that could affect the way that the plant absorbs it.
But if it's just yellow leaves on the camellia so
an overall, that could mean another couple things. It's not
an iron thing. Number one, Camellias are an acid rich

(22:04):
fertilizer plant. So using a proper fertilizer is going to
be important because it has to do with a pH. Yeah,
and if you keep using regular fertilizers, over time, you
change the pH of the soil and now the plant
doesn't absorb it properly. And I know for a fact
that's very true because my guardiania is my camellias. I've

(22:25):
been using regular fertilizer for a long time. They were great,
and then I started seeing this issue where no matter
how much fertilizer I put on them, they weren't changing.
They weren't growing, they weren't graining. Then I switched to
acid fertilizers, and I do now see a change. So
Number one, you want to be using a camellia azalea

(22:46):
fertilizer or something that's going to change the pH to
be more properly aligned with the plant. But then also
camellias get this yellow overall leaf sometimes through sp addict
parts of the plant, and that's usually due to a
watering issue.

Speaker 1 (23:05):
My next question was watering.

Speaker 2 (23:06):
Yeah, so camellias are very hardy shrubs and they can
withstand a lot of difference in you know, years has
been there for what are we going on? Eighty seven
thirty years?

Speaker 1 (23:18):
Thirty years?

Speaker 2 (23:19):
Yeah, yeah, no, twenty almost forty almost forty right, eighty
seven to twenty twenty five.

Speaker 1 (23:24):
Eight at ninety seven, two thousand and seven, seventeen, Yeah,
so thirty eight years.

Speaker 2 (23:29):
Yeah, wow, that is impressive.

Speaker 1 (23:31):
I was going to say the longevity right.

Speaker 2 (23:33):
Yeah, and so it's probably not so much a watering
issue as more of all like a drainage root issue,
which I recommend. Fertilom has a humic produst product which
helps amend the soil, help improve drainage and things like that.
So that might just be something you need to kind
of look into, is humic in the soil to help

(23:56):
with the root health in development?

Speaker 1 (23:58):
Speaking of putting things on our Facebook page and maybe
a link to fertil them, is that possible?

Speaker 2 (24:03):
H Yeah?

Speaker 1 (24:04):
And then and then while people are watching the show
and listening to us we talk about these products, you
can click the link and then obviously support Fertile Home
is our major sponsor, but get some of the products
that we're talking about now. You mentioned you mentioned too
that over a period of time, adding fertilizer can change
the pH of the soil. I would imagine not just
for what you're talking about, but for other plants as well.

(24:25):
Or are more plants susceptible to those changes in the
soil depending upon if the plant is more acid needing,
you know, higher pH or lower pH. So what's a
good rule of thumb if there is one? As far
as fertilizing over the years in the same area with
plants that may have some deficiency in the soil after
a period of time.

Speaker 2 (24:44):
Well, you know, it's good to not feed your plants
the same thing every day. So meaning just like you
wouldn't survive on a peanut butter and jelly sandwich every day.
You need to mix it up. There's there's other foods
that have other minerals, vitamins, you know, metals, you know.

(25:04):
So same thing with with plants that people think, oh,
it's just NPK, throw it in the soil, Well it's
each product is delivered a little bit different. Each product
has other micro minerals and minerals and different you know
elements in it that you know affect the way it's
absorbed and it could be lacking one and you keep

(25:27):
putting the same thing in there and then it never
gets it. So it's good to you know, not just
mix up brands, but also mix up what you're fertilizing.
You know, Like I'm gonna put the link right nowt
of the fertil and humid product. This is a good
overall product for your yard. I tell people to do
once a year just because it it improves the soil health,

(25:50):
so that way, whatever fertilizers you're using are more effective.
So it's not necessarily a fertilizer by itself, but it
helps the fertilizers become more effective and water absorption phs
in the soil changes and stuff like that. So you know,
once a year, once every couple of years is good

(26:13):
to use this human product. And again it helps with
like root rod issues or just just overall concerns with
your soil, like you know, breaking down clay and other
things like that. So yeah, and then let me see
if I can post this other picture. Let me see
write a comment.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
Yeah, you know, we talked about back in the old
days of fertilization that you're fertilizing the plant itself, whereas nowadays,
and it's been this way for a while, you're fertilizing
the soil. You're fertilizing the environment. You know, the healthier
the soil, the more effective fertilizers are going to be
or other additives.

Speaker 2 (26:51):
Yeah, exactly, I am trying to see if I can
post a picture of that of your plant. Yeah, I
don't think I could post a picture in the chat.
I'll have to post it to the web. I'll have
to post it to the Facebook.

Speaker 1 (27:05):
Okay, yeah, Facebook, that's even better.

Speaker 2 (27:07):
Yeah, but let me see what else we got? All
kinds of man they're they're yeah, they're busy beavers this morning, right, Yeah.
What is the rule of thumb for the maximum size
of pot when I should use to repot my orchids? So,
you know, Veronica asked this question, and this is a

(27:29):
very common question. And orchids that are put in bark,
you know that you normally purchase and bark, they really
don't need. The pot is insignificant, you know, like as
far as repotting it. The repotting is more for stability
so it doesn't fall over more so than it needs
to be in the pot. So, so I have this,

(27:52):
I have this really small failire in opsis that's only
about as big as my hand, and it's in this
pot that's only like a two inch pot, and the
roots are all coming out the side of it. Well,
I just have it propped up properly, and it's fine.
It doesn't need anything more than that. Now, if I
was trying to put it somewhere whereas a standalone plant,

(28:13):
I would need to probably about a four inch pot.
Now fill it with the bark down there, and it's stability. Right.
So any of the you know those epiphyte orchids, it's
the pot size is just for stability some of those
growing trees, right, so they don't need a certain pot size.
But now also then you can work into the you know,

(28:36):
the cataleas and some of the other ones that are
in soil. Those love to be crowded, so they again
they don't want you to keep increasing the pot size
either because they love to be crowded in that pot
and constrained. So as far as what is the pot size,

(28:58):
I say it's more for stable abilities because even the
ones that are crowded, you don't want to go super
big because then they won't bloom as much. They really
don't like it. It's too much soil mass around them.
The orchids are really prone. Like people you mentioned in
the beginning of the show, people over water a lot
because they think these are tropical. They just need water
all that time.

Speaker 1 (29:18):
The water.

Speaker 2 (29:19):
They like humidity, but they like drainage. And so in
a big pot with a small orchid, you're giving it
too much soil that will actually.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
Rot it much more than it needs right, right.

Speaker 2 (29:33):
So so you just want to go up the bare minimum.
And really I think the golden rule is just stability
of the plant. So whether it will fall over or not,
or you know, whether it can you know withstand, you know,
being in that pot without getting knocked over or blown
over or something like that.

Speaker 1 (29:52):
Okay, we are going to take a break already for
bizetok radio.

Speaker 2 (29:55):
Really they're moving right along.

Speaker 1 (29:57):
Yeah, and this is actually the next segment will be
the last segment for hour one. If you are tuned
in on BIS Talk Radio. Yeah. The Facebook page, the
comments section is on fire this morning. Keep it going,
Tyger Palafox, I'm Brian Main John has the day off again.
These messages are for you. You'll be listening to fridle
omen a few others, a few other of our major

(30:17):
sponsors here on the Garden America. Stay with us BIS
Talk Radio Facebook Live. This is Garden America. Okay, we
are back. We actually never went anywhere. We stayed in
the studio, but we're back from the break. And if
you are tuned in on BIS Talk Radio, this would
be the final segment of our number one news coming
up top of the hour. Then we usually come back

(30:38):
at about six minutes after two hours of BIS Talk
Radio one continuous show on Facebook Live the Veterans, the
Facebook Live Veterans and BIS Talk. People who listen know
this already. If you're new, that's new information.

Speaker 2 (30:53):
Rick had a question, you know, and this is kind
of like a great reminder, a great check up for everybody,
and he asks, speaking of fertilizer, why is NPK different
on the various products? What point is? What is point point?
I think, what is the point of that or why

(31:15):
so NPK? Let's first off break that down. Do you
remember what NPK is, Brian?

Speaker 1 (31:18):
That I think it has to do with because we
talked about this a while back, to different fertilizers.

Speaker 2 (31:24):
Yeah, have different they're all based on NPK. So it's
it's nitrogen, phosphorus and potash npkosh Okay, yeah, I know
it's a k. It's weird, but it's potash. So those
are the basic elements in fertilizer that give plants their value.

Speaker 1 (31:42):
Now would it be the difference, would that be how
it's delivered to the soil.

Speaker 2 (31:46):
No, No, it is simply the value. So for instance,
like you know, you might buy one hundred.

Speaker 4 (31:51):
Milligram vitamins, you know, and then you like I use yeah,
okay exactly, and then you might have you know, whatever
vitamin B in there, and then whatever vitamin D in there.

Speaker 2 (32:04):
And you take these vitamins based on these certain numbers.
And that's basically nitrogen, phosphorus, and potash infertilizers. And the
generalization of all of this is nitrogen is for green
or growing. So if your plants are yellow or you
want them to grow, you want a high nitrogen fertilizer.
That's why lawn fertilizers are usually only nitrogen.

Speaker 1 (32:26):
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 (32:27):
You're not worried about, you know, flowering. You're not worried
about overall health. You just want to green, green and growth,
green and growth, right exactly. Phosphorus normally is flowering, or
I like to tell people also reproduction because that groups
into this whole like tomatoes and citrus and apples and avocados.

(32:47):
Phosphorus is where a lot of plants get their flowering
value from. So that's going to encourage flowering. There's a
lot of products out there called like super bloom or
ultra bloom. Would use it on your annuals or perennials
to just get them to blue phosphorus high and phosphorus,
so that's going to force the plant to flower more
or reproduce more. So that's where that number kind of

(33:11):
comes from. And then potash that's kind of like your
multi vitamin. That's your overall plant health. A lot of
root development value in potash, a lot of overall you know,
bug resistance, disease resistance health in the plant gets it
from potash. Now, all soils kind of have those in there,
so when you're planting in the ground, you're just kind

(33:34):
of blending that into the soil and then the roots
absorb it. Now, the reason why you'll see fertilizers with
different numbers is because you know, over the years they've
done research and they say, like lawns, they really only
need nitrogen. We don't need to worry about putting potash
in there. You know, we talked about citrus and tomatoes

(33:55):
that are going to be higher in phosphorus. I'll tell
you right now, organics are always going to be low.
You know, a number five is going to be high
for an organic fertilizer because they're made out of organic
products and they don't get the extreme numbers that you
do from chemicals then in organics, but you know, you

(34:16):
can buy a chemical triple fifteen or like I said,
I think super bloom product I think is like thirty
thirty for phosphorus and it's got like zero nitrogen.

Speaker 1 (34:26):
So knowing what your plant needs, what particular species of plant,
whether you're going to greet it up, you know, whether
you're going to encourage flowers, and then there's the overall.
The potash is the overall. Yeah, so so Rick, Yeah,
it depends on what you're fertilizing and what it needs. Yeah,
you know, is it grass or is it you want
it to grow? So there's three factors basically.

Speaker 2 (34:47):
Right, So those are the basics, and then you brought
up a great question is how it's delivered. So we
talked about chemical fertilizers are are forced on the roots
of the plant. So they're forced into the plant.

Speaker 1 (35:00):
On the root again and not the soil, not the environment.

Speaker 2 (35:03):
Yeah, so even though a plant might not need nitrogen,
chemical fertilizers force that plant to absorb it, and now
there's effects down the road because of that. Organic fertilizers
make the minerals and available, you know, available, but they
don't force it. So the plant takes what it needs

(35:23):
in how much it needs. Right, it's there, it's always there,
but it's not forcing it into the plant. So therefore
the plant on organics are usually overall healthier. And so
I'm not saying you never need chemicals. And if I'm
having a wedding at my house or a party and
i want my plants looking great, i mean, go through

(35:45):
super bloom the heck out of it, miracle grow the yard.
It'll be looking good for a while.

Speaker 1 (35:50):
You hit the nail on the head there Becau's a
lot of people, well, what's the difference between organic and chemicals?
And chemicals aren't good, And you know, chemicals are okay
if applied responsibly, and if applied because like what you
just said, Tiger, you need some quick growth, you need
something in the short term, as opposed to being a

(36:14):
little more gentle with the organic and giving whatever particular
aspect of the nitrogen, the potash, the phosphorus, whatever your
plant may need at the time. Yeah, and I think
that was good that you broke that down because that
makes total sense. And it makes a lot of sense
too as far as feeding the environment, feeding the soil
as opposed to feeding the roots of the plant, forcing
the plant to take something when you should leave the

(36:35):
plant alone in some cases and let the plant take
what it needs as often or as little as at
once at that particular time.

Speaker 2 (36:42):
Yeah, exactly, And so you know, I mean John is
always a huge advocate for not really fertilizing because he
feels our soils all. You know, if you were to
do a soil test, a lot of soils have like
a lot of nitrogen. It's very rare that you to
walk into a situation in your yard where your garden
has zero nitrogen or zero potash or phosphorus. Like we're

(37:07):
talking about. This is things. These are helping your plants.
They're not always necessary. You know, we go back to
Tanya's camellia. You know, iron, nitrogen, podash, what could be
creating a you know, that's when you kind of step
in with these products. Sure, or you just wanting to
encourage things to grow faster, like we talked about, like

(37:27):
you might have a slow growing plant, you want to
grow it a little, You want to grow a little quicker,
or like throw a little bit of my more nitrogen on.

Speaker 1 (37:34):
It, or like me who has most everything in pots. Yeah, okay,
I'm going to deplete a lot of nutrients. Yeah, quick
goes right out the bottom, and it's going to go
out the bottom. And so this is the time of
the year right now especially, I've got to be very
aware of that. Yeah, because I've got to start feeding.
I've got to start to like I say, when it
comes to soil topping off.

Speaker 2 (37:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (37:53):
Now the Ocean Forest bag that you delivered to me too.

Speaker 2 (37:57):
Yeah, I actually brought your recipe for twenty okay, which
is it's a good comparable product to ocean for us.
We you know, I brought that one to you because.

Speaker 1 (38:07):
You guys, everything it's got a lot in there.

Speaker 2 (38:09):
It's got everything in there. It's already ready to go
with a lot of fertilizers in there. Again, take a break, good, okay,
And we got a question again from Tanya I think, uh,
regarding is potash potassium?

Speaker 1 (38:23):
Okay, So we're going to take a break for Bistalk
Radio News coming up top of the hour for you.
We come back at six minutes after withour number two
on Bistalk Radio. Facebook life much quicker. This is Garden
America stayed with us a lot more ahead of us. Hey,
as they used to say, and maybe they still do
say quick as a buddy. We are back here Tiger Palafox.
I'm Brian main John with the day off. Welcome if
you're BIS Talk radio to our number two lively discussions

(38:46):
going on right now on our Facebook page with questions
and comments and just prior to the break the news
break for Bistalk Radio, Tiger requestion we want to continue.

Speaker 2 (38:55):
Yes, we had a question. Is powtash potassium? And I'm
gonna answer it.

Speaker 1 (39:00):
Yes and no very it was n K on the
on the fertilizer and PK and p K and K
is potatas but.

Speaker 2 (39:11):
K is K is potassium on the It's very confusing
why K. Well, potash is a group of minerals that
contain potassium. So it's not potassium, like it is not
straight potassium. And you could buy straight potassium for plants.
But no, potash is not potassium. But I would you

(39:34):
you could say that potash contains potassium. Okay, so you
know it's a you know there's a potassium chloride, potassium sulfate,
potassium nitrate. Those are all pot ash. You know it
is not straight potassium though, and then you know kind
of what we're talking about what the chamelee is. Acid
loving plants. They don't want a lot of potash because

(39:59):
it's a increases of soil pH which can be negative
to the health of like azalea's, rhododendrons, camelias, gardenias. So,
you know, just a good note that if you do
have those plants, you don't want to use a high
pot ash fertilizer on those plants. You know, kind of
a thing. But so to answer to answer the question,

(40:20):
is pot ash potassium? No, it contains, but it contains potassium, Yeah, exactly,
So answer that question. And man, we had so much
I can't even keep track of everything. Margaret says. It's
beautiful and sunny and redding right now. That's wonderful.

Speaker 1 (40:42):
And it's going to be hot obviously another hot summer
in reading.

Speaker 2 (40:46):
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (40:46):
If we do miss a question or comment, go ahead
and repost it as we as we scroll up and
down here to try to keep up with everybody.

Speaker 2 (40:55):
Joyce wrote, is it too late to prune my skin?
Lime tree? So, Mexican lime otherwise known as key lime
or sweet lime, are the small limes, Brian, the key
lime pie, You know, the small limes that you find
usually in a grocery store. The bigger limes, the ones

(41:17):
that are like the size of what would you say,
a bear's lime is size of a not a baseball,
not a baseball, but it's bigger than a golf ball.

Speaker 1 (41:26):
In between a golf ball and a baseball.

Speaker 2 (41:28):
Yeah, what sports ball is in between a golf ball
and a baseball? Handball? No? Yeah, either like a racquetball,
a rackuetball. Yeah, racketball would be like a good size
let's go with that. Yeah, anyways, those are bears limes.
So she's asking, is it too late to prune my
Mexican lime? And and no, it is not. Because the

(41:49):
Mexican limes, you know, they're usually they need to be
thinned out a bit because they can grow pretty quickly.
You do risk pruning off some of the blooms when
you do it now, because it should be getting into
the time of year where you're going to start to
see some blooms. If it's a mature tree, though, there's
gonna be no lack of limes. So I would say,

(42:12):
if you're counting on your crop, meaning meaning it's a
young tree and you need all twenty limes, it's going
to produce this year, it is too late. But if
it's a mature tree that is going to produce you
one hundred plus limes, No, you can prune it almost anytime.
Don't worry about it. Now.

Speaker 1 (42:31):
This is such a thing as a hard prune or
a soft prune.

Speaker 2 (42:34):
Yeah, and that is a That's a great question, Brian,
because if you're in an area that's still going to
get frost, you don't want to prune because if you prune,
you're going to encourage growth and then if a frost
comes along, it's going to damage the plant more.

Speaker 1 (42:47):
You're going to stress a plant big time.

Speaker 2 (42:49):
Yeah, you want to leave that tough, leathery foliage on
the plant during a frost. So if she's in an
area where she's going to get frost, ill, maybe hold
off on pruning it. But she's asking is it too late,
which I'm thinking she's in an area which is already
warming up and now you're warm for the next nine months,
so you're not gonna have any problems. No, Yeah, a

(43:12):
rick rick ass. Is there a standard ratio of NPK No?
Just I mean, all purpose fertilizers are usually like even
numbers five, five, five, ten, ten ten six sixty six.
Oh that was a bad one. Why did that jump
in my head? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (43:28):
Yeah, we want to scrap out one.

Speaker 2 (43:30):
Yeah, but no, there's not an overall like you know, oh,
this is a standard of practice, like John uses ozma
coat and that has a weird jumping back number.

Speaker 1 (43:42):
Anytime John gives you a plant, yeah, you know, a
small plant for growth, he always puts osma coat.

Speaker 2 (43:49):
Yeah in it. Yeah, because it's just a great time
release fertilizer.

Speaker 1 (43:52):
Yes, exactly.

Speaker 2 (43:53):
So you know, an even number just covers all the bases.
But I will say most soil has nitrogen in it.
So even if you were to not do nitrogen and
only phosphorus and potash, you're probably doing just as good
as if you had a high nitrogen fertilizer. There's there's
usually not a lot of soils lacking nitrogen. Yes, trees

(44:16):
are flowering and I did a few days ago. So
based on the fertilizer info, now is the time to
fertilize all my fruit trees. You want to wait to
fertilize all your fruit trees until after your last frost.

Speaker 1 (44:30):
March, but it's we're still gonna get some cold.

Speaker 2 (44:31):
I mean it depends on where. We've got people listening
right now that are in snow, and it got snow
and Julien last night or two days ago.

Speaker 1 (44:41):
It's so cold, really cold.

Speaker 2 (44:42):
So you want to not fertilize any fruiting tree until
your last frost, because again, if you fertilize, you're going
to encourage growth. If you encourage growth during a frost,
more damage, more stress to the plant. But if you're
free from frost, yes, now is the time to start fertilizing. Carla,

(45:04):
I don't know if there is anything you can do
to hurt a key lime tree. My husband proved ours
to basically the trunk and it has branches with limes on.

Speaker 1 (45:16):
It now, so tenacious.

Speaker 2 (45:19):
I think I told this story before about my lime
tree too, where I actually tried to kill it on accident.

Speaker 1 (45:26):
Oh, I remember this. You wanted to see what it
would do.

Speaker 2 (45:28):
It dump chemicals on it on accident and like I
thought it was fertilizer. I dump chemicals on it, and
it like killed it and it's thriving now. It came
back obviously exactly. So yeah, it is pretty challenging to kill.

Speaker 1 (45:41):
I had a discussion the other day with somebody about
those uh that fire up by Montezuma. Uh huh where
I'm headed today. How those palms came back scorched and
it didn't matter, They're coming right back.

Speaker 2 (45:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:53):
Now it still kind of smells a fire and smoke
to some degree. But you look at them, you go, wow,
look at that. They took it.

Speaker 2 (46:01):
Yeah, they took it.

Speaker 1 (46:03):
And what those are? What those are Washington, Washington Toonia, right, yeah, Washingtonia.

Speaker 2 (46:08):
Or Mexican fan palms? Ye, yeah, exactly. Which So so
we covered the tomato mania San Diego right now, Santa
Barbara or kids show if you're in the Santa Barbara area,
that's happening right now too.

Speaker 1 (46:27):
Garden walks, you said to go online you can find
out about a garden walk in your area.

Speaker 2 (46:31):
The Philadelphia Flower Shows. So I saw the report after
the Philadelphia Flower Show about some of the highs of
the show. Obviously a lot of wonderful displays. If you
go and just uh, you know, go online and go
to the Philadelphia Flower Show website, they'll show you a
lot of videos or the social media of what happened
over the past a week over there. But I would

(46:53):
say that the trend that I'm seeing right now with
gardening is kind of more backing into the flowers. So
we went away from flowers flowers color. Yeah, you know,
I think a lot of people focus on like the
edibles and vegetables and you know, and then we moved
into this whole like drought tolerant, you know, native grass water. Yeah,

(47:19):
that kind of move, you know, back to flowers. Lots
of color, lots of perennials, lots of annuals because I
think we're back into that time where they've they've done
that cycle and now we're seeing some new caliber cos
we're starting to see some new petunias, We're starting to
see some new different impatients and things like that. Right,

(47:41):
So lots of fun color. So I think this year
when you go to the garden center, you're going to
see stuff that you haven't seen before. So if you're
interested in doing you know, borders or container plants or
or just providing color, you're gonna see that now a
lot in gardens centers this year. So get excited about that.

Speaker 1 (48:01):
It's like fashion. Oh, it's the same thing.

Speaker 2 (48:05):
In terms leads fashion is it gardening or is it fast?

Speaker 1 (48:07):
And you know, like in fashion, oh look, hey, bell
bottoms are back or look, you know, you know, long
skirts are back, and in gardening, color is back, or no,
now it's drought tolerant. You know. Now it's it's it's whatever.
So same kind of thing, and it recycles. Because every
time something recycles, be it fashion or plants, you have
new people, new people either buying the clothes, young people
or somebody just starting out in gardening. So you know,

(48:28):
to them it's new, you.

Speaker 2 (48:29):
Know, yeah exactly. Brian Rochelle's saying, are you coming to
the Aztec game? You mentioned coming to that area?

Speaker 1 (48:40):
Oh no, I'm just I just have im going to
get a haircut up in that area. Once a month,
I go up to the college area and I drive through,
you know, the freeway up through Montezuma.

Speaker 2 (48:52):
One of Leonora's cherry trees is blooming and full bloom. Yeah,
you know, I mean it's it's a weird season right now,
it's going to be happening. Rick said that if you
heard your soil is amended high in wood products, it
takes more nitrogen to break it down. That means you
need a fertilizer that is higher in nitrogen for soil

(49:16):
amended in wood products.

Speaker 1 (49:17):
Now, so what he's saying, he's saying questioning or saying
that you know, if you have a wood product, then
it takes more nitrogen to break down that wood.

Speaker 2 (49:26):
Yes, so, which is true and that's why. But it's
true and false because that's where nitrogen comes from. Also,
it comes from mulch in the wood. When it's breaking down,
it will also release nitrogen. So Rick, to answer that question,
it's what we call a nitrogen sucking wood and that

(49:47):
comes from when we're.

Speaker 1 (49:49):
Gonna help them break them.

Speaker 2 (49:50):
Okay, sorry, we'll get to those questions we get back from.

Speaker 1 (49:52):
I apologize to the network back after these messages BIS
Talk Radio. Yeah, okay, we are back. Yeah, this is
my first rodeo, trying to stay on time for the
next here.

Speaker 2 (50:00):
It's we talked about this last time that when it's
just the two of us, if we have to go
bagaboard the wagon, there's no downtime.

Speaker 1 (50:06):
I forget we're doing a show.

Speaker 2 (50:07):
Yeah, this is there's there's a clock involved.

Speaker 1 (50:12):
From the moment you're on radio, there's a format clock.
You got to stick with it. So my apologies to Stephanie.
Maybe you can make that work anyway, Back to the show, So.

Speaker 2 (50:21):
To answer Rick's question about wood products in your mult
or barks and nitrogen, okay, And normal mulches that are
like natural mulches or compost materials actually have nitrogen in
them already and they should break down and release that nitrogen,
and it doesn't require more nitrogen to make that happen.

(50:45):
But a lot of cheap mulch or compost products use
wood products that are already been processed or kilned or
heat treated, or so to speak dead. So the best
example I could use is sometimes you'll see a bark

(51:06):
and it'll just have shredded up palette wood. That wood
is dead. There is no it is dry, it is dead.
There is zero value to that wood. Besides, it is
now takes some space in the bag, okay, So it
requires a microbial chemical reaction to break down that and

(51:31):
turn it into soil. So it sucks nitrogen and other
things out of the soil to make that happen. So
if you're using cheap mulches or a lot of time
that stained bark product or a cheap compost, there's a

(51:51):
very good chance that they're using wood products that are
already so to speak, dead, and they're no longer going
to be breaking down in that natural fashion. Now, if
you buy a premium compost or you buy natural mult
those will not require more nitrogen to break down, and

(52:14):
they'll just naturally amend your soil. So so, to answer
your question, Rick, it really depends on your product. But
if you if you know it's basically like shredded up
two by fours, yes, it will suck nitrogen out of
your soil to help break that down.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
Okay, you know what, there's not a template. People would
love a template for all of this, but it depends
on what you're growing. It depends on We talked about
the nitrogen, the phosphorus, the ash, all of that to
know what it is you need out of whatever it
is you're growing. I mean, I mean you talked about

(52:51):
fertilizers that have a five to five y five kind
of general. I guess that's a basic platform, a starting point,
but then from there there's all kinds of variables. I
guess what I'm trying to say, lots of variables.

Speaker 2 (53:04):
Yeah, ooh, this is a great question from Carla. Let
me let me get some info on it, because I
am familiar with it and I saw the same Carla do.
Where did you see the ad? Because I saw this
same ad I think it was on TV and it

(53:25):
kind of intrigued me. And uh, I.

Speaker 1 (53:28):
Saw that too.

Speaker 2 (53:28):
Is this spruce?

Speaker 1 (53:29):
Yes, I just saw that commercial Safe around pads, Safe
around everybody, no problem?

Speaker 2 (53:36):
Yeah, yeah exactly. So, you know, because you know, everybody's
all up in arms with the whole glyciphi.

Speaker 1 (53:43):
The first thing I thought of was was roundup that
that Okay, round Up's got all this publicity for how
dangerous it is, cancer causing and so on and so forth, right,
and without them directly mentioning that, just based on the
ad itself, you knew kind of what they were saying
with their point.

Speaker 2 (53:57):
Was yeah, exactly, so, Jerren, the oil is the essential
oil that's in it. Corn Mint oil is also an
essential oil that's in it, and then sodium oil sulfate
which is salt, which is in it as well, and

(54:17):
so kind of you know, back to what we've talked about.
I'm not gonna I'm not gonna talk badly about this
product like I'm it probably works and.

Speaker 1 (54:28):
We don't have any experience with it.

Speaker 2 (54:29):
Well, no, I'm just gonna say it probably works. I
mean from what its ingredients are it's going to work
and it's gonna kill weeds. But to say it's safe,
I would argue that there's no herbicides out there that
are safe in the sense of there's a lot of

(54:52):
herbicides out there that now use clove oil, time oil,
you know, all these oils, right, and and they're basically dehydrants,
so they get onto the foliage and they dehydrate the
plant and they work and they are safe. Then you know,
I mean, if you were to go drink this product,
it's not going to be harmful to you. You know,
it's not gonna write it. But I will say a

(55:13):
lot of them and contain salt, and that's the residual
effects in the soil are way more harmful than some
of the chemicals out there that did the same job.
And so you have to be careful with where you
use it and how you use it because sometimes you
can almost do more damage with these safe products than

(55:35):
you can do with some of the other chemical products.
Like for instance, there's a lot of you know, Furnilom
has like selective weed killers, so meaning they have chemicals
that you can put in your lawn that's going to
kill weeds, but not kill the lawn or kill weeds
in your flower beds, but not kill the shrubs in
your flower beds. Or you know, they're very selected targets, right. Well,

(56:00):
those are really easy to use and safe to use. Yeah,
it's a chemical. You're not gonna want to drink it,
you know, it's not you know, you know good in
that way. But it's easier to use and to some
degree almost safer to use for you where some of
these other products that are gonna just you know, put
salt on the plants. Yeah, you're gonna kill a lot
of other things in your garden, do more damage. And

(56:22):
a lot of the chemicals, you know, do your research.
You know, you don't want to overdo them or let
them get into waterways or have your kids out there
or or you know, you know your pets out there
when you do it. But a lot of them, once
they're dry, become a nerd and you you know, they're
safe again. So it's funny. I did see that ad
and I think I thought saw it on TV, and

(56:45):
it's that spruce service side and you know, I'm sure
it works, and I'm sure it's a good product, and
it's ingredients are safe for people and for kids and
for pets.

Speaker 1 (56:55):
Being safe and how it's applied. Yeah, two different things, right,
the application and I love the go to it's always
the go to save for kids and pets, however, not
safe for most adults or your next door neighbor. Kids
and pets.

Speaker 2 (57:09):
Yeah, can you imagine? Can you imagine if it was
safe for kids and pets and not adults, not adults, Like,
where where did that come from? Wait a minute, kids
and pens?

Speaker 1 (57:17):
But yeah, application exactly like you talked about. Yeah, sure
it's safe and it won't do this, but it may
get into the soil and it may harm something else.
So yeah, you know what, Trial and air, Yeah exactly.
We got about a minute till the next break.

Speaker 2 (57:31):
Oh right, let's see here, where did I go? Where
did I leave off of? I gotta review it. The
Royal Lee, I forget, it's if it's self pollinating. Oh
she's talking about what did she have a cherry? Umm?

(57:56):
Was it a cherry? The Royal Lee?

Speaker 1 (57:58):
You know what? You can look this up because we
can go to a break, okay right now, which is
what we're gonna do. And that means that for bistalk
Radio Facebook Live. We have but two more segments coming up,
so is still plenty of time for your questions, your comments.
Very active today on the Facebook Live. So again going
to take a break for BIS Talk Radio. Thank you
to Friddle Home. I'm Brian Main John is off today.
Tiger's with me. This is Garden America back after these messages,

(58:21):
these words from the many sponsors on biz Talk Radio,
stay with us, all right, just like that, we are
back from the break. This is our long segment. Two
more segments to go here. As Tiger mentioned, dirty, when
it's just Tiger and myself, we just tend to chit
chat and forget that we're on the on the radio,
on the internet, on Alexa, Spotify, Pandora, Google, all those

(58:42):
play offs. Cover it, cover it it all. So back
to what you were researching during the break.

Speaker 2 (58:46):
Yeah, so the Royal Lee cherry does require a polonizer,
so Mini Royal or Royal Crimson is going to be
your best polonaisy pollinating choice. So who was it? A Leonore?
Leonore had the Royal Lee cherry that was in full bloom,
full bloom. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 (59:07):
I imagine it's still very cold where she is.

Speaker 2 (59:10):
She knows. She says she's getting full blooms right now.
So I do worry that. Well, I'm not so much
worried necessarily about the cold, but a storm coming through
and knocking off all those flowers, all those flowers are
potential cherries. Yeah, and so you know that's going to
be a bummer if it is early, and you know
you've got to watch out for that. I mean, there's

(59:31):
really nothing you can do. It's nature. But it's not fun.
Go out there, go out there and hug it, put
a bag around it, protect it. Yeah exactly. But yeah,
and that's the that's the tough thing when you're a
you know, earlier we talked about the Mexican line and
is it too early to prune it? And you know

(59:53):
that's something that people don't worry about as their trees mature,
because there's gonna be no shortage of apricots or apples
or limes or you know, as the tree matures. You
almost like you're like, oh my gosh, like it'd be
better if I had less production this year.

Speaker 1 (01:00:10):
Yeah, exactly. I don't want to have to people bring all those
lemons to work, people and say here, have some lemons
have some avocados.

Speaker 2 (01:00:17):
Right, avocados, although I don't know if people are could
be bringing in avoca. Avocados are now like eggs also,
like people don't just bring those in and give them
away anymore.

Speaker 1 (01:00:28):
There was a sales guy here last month or so
who brought me to and they were really good.

Speaker 2 (01:00:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:00:33):
Oh, I had to let them ripen a little bit,
but they were good. You know, one day we had
too then then the second one. One day I squeezed
and it was real soft and went, hey, we have
to eat this today.

Speaker 2 (01:00:42):
Yeah, just cut it open to put a little salt
on it. Anything. Yep. I love avocado. Yeah, I've I've yet.
I'm gonna prepare an area. I've yet to plant. I
planted a tree, but then then we did that construction
and it was.

Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
You're contemplanting an avocado tree.

Speaker 2 (01:01:00):
No, I am going to I gotta get it in
the ground.

Speaker 1 (01:01:03):
Shallow root system. Obviously, I know all that You're gonna
trip over it. Kids are gonna trip over it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:08):
No, they're not putting it in the back of the yards,
away from everything. It's gonna be my secret stash. It's
gonna be my retirement if I have one. Avocado tree.
I'm gonna retire off of that thing.

Speaker 1 (01:01:17):
Secret stash.

Speaker 2 (01:01:18):
That's good.

Speaker 1 (01:01:19):
Everyone needs a secret staf. What's in that box? My
secret stash. Yeah, those from the sixties and seventies know
what we're talking about.

Speaker 2 (01:01:26):
Yeah, I love it. Yeah, in California's not a secret anymore.

Speaker 1 (01:01:32):
No, I'm not right out in the open.

Speaker 2 (01:01:35):
Yeah. I got billboards for it.

Speaker 1 (01:01:37):
So uh yeah, March. This is March eighth. We got
more rain coming here in southern California. Still call the
many many parts of the country. Yeah, but you know,
I'm inspired. It's so funny that soil inspires me to
go out transplant the ficus that I have.

Speaker 2 (01:01:53):
It's a beautiful weekn to do it.

Speaker 1 (01:01:54):
Fertilize a little bit HB one on one on a
few tired looking plants, and then basically fill up the
rest with soil. I may need another bag in a
week or two because I've got to fill We talked
talk about soil and pots and drainage to top them off.
I like to say, is I don't want to read
I don't need to completely.

Speaker 2 (01:02:15):
Plant? Is shit? Well so so oh it's I thought
of this when we were talking earlier, and I know
I've brought this up before because you were talking about
we were talking about fertilizers, we were talking about pots,
and people need to realize, like, yeah, like a lot
of the nutrients in the soil goes right out the
bottom of the pot. The plants take it up, and
unlike natural soils, it doesn't just replenish itself, you know,

(01:02:38):
meaning like it's a pot. It's in a pot, it
just decreases. And and if a plant is growing, it's
using that soil to grow that branch, to grow those leaves,
to grow those flowers. So it's constantly using up what
you're giving in which if you came.

Speaker 1 (01:02:56):
Over and saw the condition of most of my plants
in the patio, you'd say, hey, they look pretty good,
because they do. Yeah, And I would have to be
honest and say, I don't really replenish the soil as
much as I should. And I feel now I'm feeling
guilty because the plants are like they were hanging on,
don't know how much longer, A.

Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
Little help, a little helper, please.

Speaker 1 (01:03:18):
Need little help. But but but point well taken that
in the ground, they have the resources of the soil
around them to get the nourishment and the nitrogen.

Speaker 2 (01:03:26):
Yeah, in a pot, and you know, debris falls down
onto it and then it turns it into nutrients. You
got worms moving.

Speaker 1 (01:03:35):
Through it all the whole whole life cycle.

Speaker 2 (01:03:37):
Yeah, it's a whole thing.

Speaker 1 (01:03:38):
I do have worms in my patio.

Speaker 2 (01:03:40):
No, I mean, but like we say, in a pot,
the whatever you give it is whatever it has. And
if you don't give it anything, eventually one day you're
going to go out there and those plants are not
gonna look good.

Speaker 1 (01:03:51):
They're not going to look good. One plant that's looking good. Actually,
it's a tree, the Australian bottle tree. So when John
gave it to me, it was about maybe halfway between
my waist and my shoulders. It's a good eighteen feet
And now John always said, I'm really sure, I go,
I'm gonna take a picture.

Speaker 2 (01:04:09):
It's huge.

Speaker 1 (01:04:10):
This thing is huge.

Speaker 2 (01:04:11):
How is the bottle part of it?

Speaker 1 (01:04:13):
Oh, the bulb, it's well. I transplanted probably about a
month after John gave it to me, to a big pot.
It's I don't know. Again, we're trying.

Speaker 2 (01:04:23):
To volleyball, basketball, volleyball, volleyball, volleyball, and you know, because
it stores water in there, it does, they swell, They swell,
and then they also use it up. So careful in
the watering.

Speaker 1 (01:04:38):
Be careful in the watering. Like what you said, it stores.

Speaker 2 (01:04:40):
Water, Yeah, so it it swells right now and then
it'll deplete it a bit through the summer month.

Speaker 1 (01:04:47):
How big is it? Put it this way? In the
last two or three days, with the rain and the wind,
it knocked over two or three times. I had to
go out there and you know, pull it back up again.
That's that's how tall it is.

Speaker 2 (01:04:58):
Because you need a heavier pot or.

Speaker 1 (01:05:01):
Or what I do, whichever way it blows over, I
just move a pot next to it so it can't
blow overmore well, just at least during the storm.

Speaker 2 (01:05:08):
Yeah, yeah, a bigger pot or heavier pot. What do
you think would you need? Does it need a bigger pot?

Speaker 1 (01:05:15):
I don't think it needs a first of all, I
don't need it to get twenty five feet. I'd say
a heavier pot might.

Speaker 2 (01:05:21):
Be a heavier pot because because that's another question, right,
like meaning we talk about stability of pots. A bigger
pot would make it more stable. But if it doesn't
need a bigger pot, then you just buy a heavier
pot in that way it's more stable.

Speaker 1 (01:05:33):
Exactly, yeah, exact, Yeah, I do need you know, the
doctor needs to come by today this weekend. And I'm
the doctor check up on the pat check up on
the patients.

Speaker 2 (01:05:43):
I love it. So that's funny.

Speaker 1 (01:05:46):
Can I love new soil? Opening that bag all warm
and just want to run your hands through it.

Speaker 2 (01:05:52):
It smells good too. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:05:53):
It's like it's like when I work here, when they
cut the grass. You go out there and smell that
grass or the landscapers.

Speaker 2 (01:05:59):
Yeah, grass, yeah, fresh cut grass.

Speaker 1 (01:06:02):
I was a kid, I'd be rolling around and getting
an itchy back.

Speaker 2 (01:06:04):
Oh so itchy, Oh so itchy. Now when Isaac, Isaac
hasn't learned that lesson. Him and his friends are wrestling
out there, throwing grass in each other's shirts and stuff,
and I'm like, Then he comes home and he's like, oh,
I'm so itchy. I'm like, yeah, because he just ran
around and grass.

Speaker 1 (01:06:16):
What's in the grass that makes you witch?

Speaker 2 (01:06:18):
I don't know? Yeah, right, and allergy?

Speaker 1 (01:06:21):
But I remember as a kid, Yeah, grass make you witch? Well,
what's in it? It's only when you become an adult
or you know, well, no, you just learn to do it. No,
But I'm saying where you ask these questions when you're
a kid, you just take it for granted. Yeah, grass
makes me itchy, and I'm like, well, wait a minute,
what's in the grass that makes you.

Speaker 2 (01:06:36):
Itch Let's see what is.

Speaker 1 (01:06:38):
There's something going on, and is it all? Is it
all types of grass?

Speaker 2 (01:06:43):
I know that there are grasses more some which more
than others. Okay. The grass has tiny hairs and these
help protect the grass from being eaten by insects and animals,
damaged by ultra violet rays, or losing too much water.
It's cry Combes can also cause tiny scratches the skin,
and then the skin reacts by coming red and may

(01:07:04):
feel itchy. So it's it's like a twofold thing. It
scratches you, and then that allows the allergies in the
grass and all that to have a reaction in the scratch,
which is now.

Speaker 1 (01:07:18):
What makes you It makes perfect sense.

Speaker 2 (01:07:20):
Yeah, okay, so next, so grass with less tricones hair
hair less itchy grass. So that's why fescues probably are
more itchy than a bermuda grass or some.

Speaker 1 (01:07:35):
Of the other exactly, So you know, next time he
says I'm itchy, saying, well, you know why don't you,
And you.

Speaker 2 (01:07:41):
Can tell yeah, yeah, exactly, that's funny. It scratches you
small cuts. So we got touting a bunch of small cuts.

Speaker 1 (01:07:55):
A minute to go. Rick wants to know how you
get orchids to bloom.

Speaker 2 (01:07:58):
So, Rick, we're talking about Faelionopsis, you know, we we're
talking about they need cold so that triggers it to
bloom again. And a lot of other orchids are like that.
They're temperature based bloomers. There's a lot of fertilizers out
there that say, oh, if you bloom with it, if
you fertilize with this during this time and then this
one at that time. There is some truth to that,

(01:08:22):
but more so it's time and cycle. Orchids are not
huge feeders. Again, these are being epiphytes, Like they don't
have soil. They're not sucking up huge sources of nitrogen
and phosphorus and potash and requiring all these minerals. A
lot of their nutrients just comes from the water that

(01:08:42):
they rains down on them. And so yeah, we might
not be able to provide it that, but you can
provide it other ones. Break time mild fertilizers.

Speaker 1 (01:08:50):
Break time one more segment coming up here on Guard
in America. To stay on time, Brian mayntage Pealafox be
right back, I should say, with our final segment, all right,
just like that, we have returned already, Tiger. We talk
about this every time. It's just you and me. Final segment,
very quick show. We covered a lot. I'm so glad
no guest today, but the viewers listeners on Facebook Life

(01:09:11):
kept us going a lot of great questions.

Speaker 2 (01:09:13):
Yeah, a lot of great stuff out there happening right now.
And it is the time of year we're we're getting
into it with spring. You know, you're planting your tomatoes,
you're planting your spring gardens. No peppers quite yet. You
know you're getting into the cucumbers, and you know that
no pepper not quite yet. You know that's along with peppers, spranting,
planting your spring flowers. You know. So now's the time

(01:09:36):
we're transitioning from pansies to petunias, you know, stock all
kinds of wonderful annuals and prenia peppers.

Speaker 1 (01:09:43):
What's the hottest pepper you've ever eaten or tasted?

Speaker 2 (01:09:46):
I don't know. I probably just hollowpanion are not probably
just hobb in air.

Speaker 1 (01:09:50):
I cannot go past that. I'm not a goat Carolina Reapers. Well,
there's some people actually on YouTube that have these channels
that they're kind of a sores. They're like wine tasters
and they'll have two or three peppers in front of them,
very hot, and then they'll, you know, they'll take a
bite and go, okay, now the heat starting to come

(01:10:10):
up a little sweet that it gets kind of soary,
and they're breaking it all down to if it was me,
I would just be like, my tongue's on fire, I
can't taste anything, Get me out of here. Well, but
they savor it.

Speaker 2 (01:10:22):
You know what we should do since we do do Facebook?
We do do we do do Facebook? We do Facebook
live and be fun to watch is there's a show
that is out there for a lot of celebrities where
they bring him on a show and it's called It's
the Hot Ones. Yeah, and they eat, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:10:38):
They go right down the line. They start with kind
of a mild sauce all the way until.

Speaker 2 (01:10:43):
And there is truth to it that when you eat
these foods and you have this reaction, you tend to
tell the truth more like you don't hide, you don't
you don't guys yourself as much. So it's a great
interview process because you can ask some real revealing questions
and the people will answer that.

Speaker 1 (01:11:04):
Millions what. It's a great concept. I forget the guy's name.
He's got there. There's like sixteen million subscribers and they
have no problem getting celebrities on there, I know, which.

Speaker 2 (01:11:13):
Is super funny because they tell really revealing stuff. Interview them.

Speaker 1 (01:11:17):
Yeah, back in the late eighties, this movie you were
in and tell us about the director and stuff, and
they're they're eating and you're right, it's almost like truth serum,
it is.

Speaker 2 (01:11:25):
And so we should do that one time where you know, no, no.

Speaker 1 (01:11:30):
I can't eat anything. I'm telling you I can't go Well, but.

Speaker 2 (01:11:32):
That just means after a couple of chicken wings you'll
be spilling your guts.

Speaker 1 (01:11:37):
Yeah, And there's people that have no business eating these
ghost peppers or Carolina reapers, and they panic because there's
no relief and they get up and they're they're they're
doing like a tribal war dance, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:11:48):
I mean there's all the things like oh, eat salt,
drink milk, Well, none of it really makes it go away.

Speaker 1 (01:11:54):
The only but you're right. First of all, water is
like throwing gas on a fire. They didn't want to
drink water. Ice Cream or dairy is probably the best
thing you can do, right, milk ice cream, but not water,
not anything.

Speaker 2 (01:12:07):
But it doesn't like make it go away. No, you
still have to just suffer through it.

Speaker 1 (01:12:11):
Curtails it a little bit. Yeah, it curtails it because
because some of these challenges, you eat it and you
gotta wait five minutes before you have anything milk, dairy, anything.

Speaker 2 (01:12:22):
And you know, it's funny. We talked about this and
talking about being gardeners and and yes, if we have
peppers in our yard, we usually are pretty savvy to
that as far as like working and then like you
rub your eyes or something, and sure you have that
on your hands. You gotta be real careful.

Speaker 1 (01:12:36):
You should wear gloves, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:12:37):
But there's even other plants out there that you got
to be real careful of too. So we have working
in the garden pencil a pencil plant. Oh yeah, yeah,
that has that milky white substance.

Speaker 1 (01:12:46):
You got Dana gottsap probably thirty five forty years ago
before we met, which I inherited. It's but yeah, you
gotta I wear goggles around that thing.

Speaker 2 (01:12:57):
Yeah, because you're burning your skin.

Speaker 1 (01:13:00):
Yeah yeah, so who knows? It looks so innocent out there,
you know.

Speaker 2 (01:13:04):
And a goaves me working with a gave too. When
I cut it, I'll be very careful. All wear long sleeves,
I'll wear gloves. I'll be very careful. It always gets me.
I don't even know how. I don't know how it
gets me. It gets me.

Speaker 1 (01:13:16):
Gardening is dangerous.

Speaker 2 (01:13:17):
It is very Just don't get out there and just you.

Speaker 1 (01:13:19):
Know, willy nilly start cutting things.

Speaker 2 (01:13:21):
Not all of us are cut out for it.

Speaker 1 (01:13:23):
That's true.

Speaker 2 (01:13:23):
That's true.

Speaker 1 (01:13:24):
Okay, a couple of two or three minutes left, I
think all we call it.

Speaker 2 (01:13:27):
Let me check. Have we done our job? Yeah? Right,
I think we answered a lot of questions.

Speaker 1 (01:13:31):
Milk and yogurt. Yeah, that's a good one.

Speaker 2 (01:13:33):
Leonor let's see here, Wow, waiting a long anticipated launch
this evening. Oh, Colleen's up there and lompoking. They're going
to see a launch.

Speaker 1 (01:13:50):
Oh from that Vandenburg Edenburgh. Yeah. Yeah, the silence is deafening,
isn't it.

Speaker 2 (01:14:02):
Right here we go two minutes. Ghost peppers, new milk,
yogurt and course peppers are the serranos.

Speaker 1 (01:14:14):
Every every year, somebody is trying to come up with
the the hottest pepper on Earth. You know this. They're
measured by Schoolville units, as most of us know.

Speaker 2 (01:14:24):
I don't know if Margaret's going to be able to
answer this question. She wrote, get some colder temperatures. I'm
thinking you talking about orchids and banana water every couple
of weeks. What is banana water? What is banana water?
The ut we're talking about? List of garden tours. The
Ute in today's edition has a list of garden tours.

(01:14:47):
So Union Tribune, which is the local newspaper here. You
can probably go online and probably see that article on
their website. There. We're all cut up, lots of great answer.
Hopefully people will be more successful today after listening to
the program and they learned. I'm inspired, are you?

Speaker 1 (01:15:06):
I really am mean? I want to transplant, I want
to top off some soil. I want to do you know,
I hesitate to do too much feeding, but I don't
I don't get that cold.

Speaker 2 (01:15:13):
I should be okay, yeah, yeah, you'll be fine. We're
in the four you're protected too.

Speaker 1 (01:15:17):
You're in a patio and we're in the forties we're
not thirty two thirty five degrees.

Speaker 2 (01:15:21):
Yeah, you're not even Yeah, you're even during the dead
of winter. You're not very frost stricken in the area,
and it is protected. Yeah, so be fun get out there.
Do you ever use your fish tank water in your plants? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:15:36):
When when when the guy comes over again, I usually
I kind of help him a little bit. I say, yeah,
go ahead and dump the water out there in some
of those plants. Yeah, just don't don't dump it in
the plumb area, but dump it, you know everywhere else.

Speaker 2 (01:15:47):
It's probably got good stuff in there. It's absolutely because
you know, you can't have too many chemicals in that
fertile in that No, because you.

Speaker 1 (01:15:52):
Know what we're not using. We're not using city water anymore.

Speaker 2 (01:15:55):
Well, but I'm just saying you can't have a lot
of chemicals in fish water anyway.

Speaker 1 (01:15:59):
No, not at all. Now. One thing I did learn though,
going to more purified water is he still has to
treat that purified water because it lacks certain nutrients and
good bacteria that the fish needs. With that in mind,
that's going to do it. Tiger. Thank you. John is
back next week for the rest of you on bistalk Radio,
Facebook Life. Thank you for tuning in. Hope we all
learn something today, good, better, indifferent, So enjoy the rest

(01:16:22):
of your weekend. We'll reconvene next week right here on
Garden America for the entire crew. Again, I do want
to thank Stephanie at Bistok Radio her and your team
for the entire crew here, John Magnascar or Tiger Palafox,
I'm Brian Maine. Enjoy the rest of your weekend. Be safe.
We'll do it again next week right here on Garden America.

Speaker 2 (01:16:38):
Take care,

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All Things On Growing Orchids - Garden America Gardening Podcast & Radio Show [3.8.25]

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}All Things On Growing Orchids - Garden America Gardening Podcast & Radio Show [3.8.25]