Side Hustlers: Sara with Constellation and Co.

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This is Side Hustlers. I'm your host from my Heart Radio,
Carla Marie. Each week during Side Hustlers, I talk to
people following their passion outside of their day job, and
sometimes those people have turned their passion into their full
time job, just like this week's guest, Sarah, who is
the owner and creator of Constellation and Co. A snail
mail company or a card company as most of us

(00:22):
know it. Sarah's story of why she started kind of
stems back to absolutely hating her day job. Like some
people here Sarah's story, You're gonna love it for a
lot of people. You know, why are you wait? Do
you know what you want to do? And this is
what you want to do? Do it. I'm a hustles
side side hustle do it. I'm a hustle hustlo do it.

(00:45):
I'm a hustles shulove. Come on ask about me you don't.
It's the side Hustless podcast call the Root. Today I
am joined by local superstar Sarah McNally or well snail
male superstar. Right, that's what you call yourself. We got
to get into that and how you got that nickname.

(01:05):
But thanks for coming in. Although well it's not too
far from your store? What are we like? It's like
five not even, which is super cool. You are the
owner of Constellation, Inc. Which is a now correct me
if I'm wrong? Is it a greeting card company? How
do you think? That's probably mostly what we do, that's
the main thing. We also have a brick and mortar

(01:26):
stationary store in the Fisherman's Terminal in inter Bay, and
we do all kinds of other things as well, but
those are the main, the main, heavy hitters. And it
started as a side hustle. So what year did Constellation
and Co. Start? I graduated college in two thousand nine
and was really ready to get my dream job and

(01:46):
be a productive member of society. And if you remember
correctly two thousand and eight, two thousand nine was a
tough year for the country. The recession was hitting hard,
and honestly, as a fresh do eyed graphic design beginner,
it was really hard to get absolutely so hard. And
that was kind of before the I don't want to

(02:08):
say rise of social media, but before we really cared
about how things looked where you know, the graphic design
job was cool. But now it's like you can't do
anything without a graphic designer, but ten years ago it
was a little different. So your first job was it
the ad agency? It was yep. I we moved out
here in June of two thou nine from Florida nights

(02:30):
couldn't go any further. Yes, it's correct. We drove all
the way here, super fun. So we moved here in June.
We got married in September, and three days after I
got back from my honeymoon, I started my first ad
agency job. And you didn't love that. I was. It
was a really hard first job. I was working crazy hours.

(02:50):
I was making no money, literally not enough money to
pay my rent with. It just wasn't doing it. And
I just didn't have a life because I didn't when
I could leave at night, I didn't know. I couldn't
plan anything around this job. Unfamiliar, it was really rough
and more than anything without like swelling too much tea,

(03:11):
it was just a really, really bad working environment. Listen.
I've heard it from a lot of people who have
been mentally abused and emotionally abused by their bosses, managers,
and that beats down on you for a while and
you get to a point where like, I'm not doing
this anymore. Absolutely and as a first job, there were
a lot of things that I felt were my fault,
that I just wasn't tough enough, I wasn't smart enough. Absolutely,

(03:31):
and looking back now i'm ten years away from that,
I can say with absolutely, you know, no hesitation, that
it was an absolutely garbage place for my first shot.
It was just not a good place to work. At
one point, the CEO of the company asked me if
I was going to go home and kill myself? Like, no, lie, No,
Like I don't. I'm assuming he was joking. Does this

(03:52):
still exist? And imagine it's totally been a podcast, But
it just was like that was like the epitome of
the worst day. Um, I was that unhappy that apparently
it was obvious and that someone would have the balls
to ask me that. So was Constellation and Coe born
while you were there. Yes, So at that point I

(04:12):
had started in my second bedroom in my apartment designing
cards and printing them on this tiny little screen printing
press that I had, And that's when I opened my
Etsy store and started to sell things on the side
because when I got home from work, I needed creative
energy to be Absolutely, did you always have a thing
for greeting cards. I've always had a thing for snail mail,

(04:33):
for sending letters and sending cards, so it was really
it felt obvious to me to design something like that.
I think I've always worried as a graphic designer that
I'm not doing important work, that I'm not changing the
world like folks want to do and everybody wants to
do that, but I have definitely have anxiety, of a
lot of anxiety in my life. So doing a greeting

(04:54):
card was something really small and simple that the stakes
weren't too high, and it just felt really nice to
make something beautiful and to send someone to make their
day feel better. Now, it was a lot of that
love for snail mail. Because you moved from Florida. Did
you have people that you wanted to mail things to
or when you were in Florida, was like, oh, I
love snail mail. Well I'm here. I've just always loved it.
My grandmother wrote to me when I was a little girl,

(05:17):
camp and all that kind of stuff, and I've always
really enjoyed the written word and then sending it and
then waiting by the mailbox. Like I had my first
little tiny boyfriend when I was in middle school, we
wrote each other letters and like he wrote, drew me
pictures of Pokemon and sent them to me. So it's
just like, there's something really special about receiving something physical

(05:38):
in the mail from someone who cares about you, and
especially now when we don't anymore, when for birthdays or
condolences or whatever it may be, it's text. And it's
funny when I was writing, when I sat down today
to just kind of bullet the things that I knew
about you, one of my friends text me that she
lost her job today and I was at the same
time texting her and going through everything about you, and

(06:01):
I was like, and you just send her a card,
because me texting her is no different than anything she's
been doing today with co workers, with anyone, and text
are kind of just like whatever it's normal to send
their annoying. It's like spam mail at this point, but
getting a paper card in the mail with a message,
it's like a surprise that costs under five dollars most
of the time to send. And it was just so

(06:23):
fitting that that happened today and I you know you
were coming in. It was so bizarre. And that's the
thing that your friend will keep and on those really
bad days in the future, like trying to find a
new job is awful, and she'll have that to look
at and to remind her that she's cared for. That's
for me, That is everything. That's why I've kept doing this.
Have you heard from people who have come into the

(06:44):
store or maybe have purchased from you online say, oh
my god, thank you so much for this or this message,
or you helped me, you know, reach out to a
friend in a time of need. Yes, a lot of
the things that I write about are about anxiety and depression.
I write about cancer and fortilly and you know, grief
and all of these heavy subjects that no one wants
to text about. You're not only seeing that a store

(07:06):
awful to talk about, but there are things that happen
every day to people all around us and to us.
And my whole thing is, it's hard to find words
when you love someone in there going through pain like
that so hard. Not all of us are great with words.
It's just it's normal. I work on the radio and
I'm terrible with words. It's tough. And to have someone

(07:26):
who's like, you know what, these are real. This is
real things that people are going through every day. Let
me help the people closest to them, tell them they're
going to be okay. Exactly, we've all been through it,
and I love it, and we'll get into it in
a little bit. Some of the cards that you do
have in this store, because you brought some in. I'm
so excited, but I'm unfortunately have to take you back

(07:46):
to the time you're at the Adage and this was
a side hustle and you had the Etsy store. What
happened that made you say, I'm at here, I'm done
with this place, I'm leaving. I had gotten to the
point where I just didn't want to get out of
bed in the morning, and and stuff happens, and it's
happened again in my life. And it's not just about
the work that you do, but it had gotten there
to me. And I finally just walked out one Friday afternoon,

(08:08):
and and I had I had already given my two
weeks notice. I think I've gotten about a week into that.
And then I don't even remember what it was, but
something so egregiously terrible happened during the day and I
got home and I looked at myself in the mirror
and just said, like, your life is worth more than this,
and it's just a job. It's really just a job.
And I think for me, leaving that job was leaving

(08:31):
behind my expectation for what my career would look like
because it was my first job out of college and
it was really important to me, and it felt like
a total failure that I hated it and I hated myself.
And when I left that job, I was leaving the
idea of you get a job and it provides for
you and you put your identity into it and all
of that. It was kind of leaving that idea behind.

(08:52):
And I think I've been a side hustler ever since.
To be perfectly honest, I love that you actually said
something to me before we started. You said that you
think you're a part of the side hustler generation. And
you started telling me, well, I did this, and I
did this, and I did that. So let's talk about
the things you were saying to me before we started recording.
How you jumped all around but you left the addingty.
Did you dive right into Constellation and called full time

(09:12):
or did you do something else? No, I actually got
a retail job, so I worked every weekend for a
little stationary store and ballad and I was doing that
during the weekend, and then during the week I would
start to figure out what the heck I was doing.
Did they know that you were doing cards on your
own as well? Not at first. And during that period
of time, I was also freelancing as a graphic designer

(09:34):
where I could, because again that period of my life,
it was never let's pursue my passion. It was what
skills do I have with which I can make a dollar?
Because living in Seattle it was a lot less expensive
than it is, but it was still expensive and he
needed to pay rent and eat. So basically I was
just trying to find any job that I could do anywhere.

(09:56):
But all along I was trying to pursue my and
is trying to figure out what that would be because
again I was twenty two. It's crazy. It's crazy to
think about that, and like now, when I look back
at twenty two, there was no way I was going
to start a business. So more power to you, because
how you even thought that you cared about something that
much is crazy to me. So good for a lot

(10:18):
of necessity. Yeah, and it's scary and it's a big risky,
and in that period of my life, all my friends
were getting engaged and getting married, so it was really
straightforward for me to design wedding invitations. So that's where
I started. This started side hustling really started. So you
started doing wedding invitations, obviously custom for them and where
they were graphics and then walk me through this. You

(10:40):
design it, then you send it to the printer. How
does that work? Well? At that point, I was also
starting an apprenticeship with a letter press printer, so I
was doing all these other things on the side, but
going several times a week over to West Seattle to
learn how to print in a ladies garage. That's crazy.
It was great, But basically at that point I was

(11:01):
designing things fully customed, and then I was learning how
to print them myself. How do you get an apprenticeship?
Am I saying? Yeah? How do you find that? You
email everyone who has a website that says letter press
on it. I emailed a lot of people, and that's
something that I've I'm trying to get back into the
habit of reaching out and asking people for what I want,

(11:22):
because at that point in my life it was all
I had. That's all, yeah, but now it's like, well,
I'll just figure it out on my own or I'll
just get someone else to do it, instead of saying, hey,
teach me this because it's and it's hard. Do we
have the time to learn new things half the time? No?
And but that's an excuse that I think a lot
of us make, or at least that I make, when
I'm like, I don't have time for that, moving on,
but I want to have time for it, and asking

(11:44):
for what we want is something that it's kind of
hard sometimes, absolutely, And I think at thirty two I'm
a lot more fearful than I was at twenty two,
really yeah, because I wasn't as afraid of rejection. I
was like, I have nothing to lose. I don't know
anyone in this city. I don't have a day job
that I'm trying to protect. At that point, I didn't,
I didn't have any There was no downside emailing someone

(12:04):
and being like, hey, once a week, can I come
and like do projects for you for free? Like can
I sweep? Can I wash your kids? Can I wash
your dog? Like I'll do anything. But you're thirty two,
and you're a badass, and you have stuff too, like
you like, Okay, look what I created. You shouldn't be
afraid of rejection. And I didn't want this podcast to
turn into a therapy, so he yeah, but it's okay.

(12:28):
But I think I think in those ten years, I
don't know. I feel like when when you're brand new
to something, when you're a kid, it feels like you
have everything to learn and nothing to lose, and then
I feel like ten years later, I get in that
imposter syndrome mindset sometimes where I'm like I usually record
podcasts in my pajamas at my house, and today I'm

(12:48):
going into a studio and have to like tell somebody
I'm meeting with someone, and like my heart is racing,
and you just you know. I think that happens to
all of us, that the more we've learned in, the
more time we've spent doing the things and building our
little empires, the more we feel like we have to
prove that it's been worth it. Okay, you sold me.
So now I'm scared where we have built ourselves up,

(13:09):
and it's if something goes wrong, it knocks us down.
And that's kind of you and I were talking about
before we started recording as you pour your heart into
your job, your career, and when something happens in your career,
it's as if you've been broken up with or you've
gotten to a fight with a significant other, and that's
all you can think about. But it's at the end
of the day, like you said, it's just a job, absolutely,
but we love it. That's why we do it absolutely.

(13:31):
So after the invitations, what was the next side hustle? Like,
where did you start hopping around too? Well, basically, at
that point, I realized I could only work so many
hours in a day and I have gotten to the
end of that and I was getting super burnt out.
So I started designing greeting cards again. And that was
that was like this thing I did in the evenings.
I'd come home from my studio and I'd be like, Oh,

(13:52):
I'm gonna I'm gonna write some cards. I felt like
it felt like not like I'm spending time doing something
that's not my work, just so silly. But that's what
I started to do. And the more I did that,
the more excited I got about the potential to do
that full time. So I really did this huge like
flip flop where I took the thing I was doing

(14:13):
of the time and made it my ten percent. Took
my thing I was doing ten percent of the time
and made it and that was terrifying. It Like at
that point, I had, I had an overhead, I had
printing presses, I had purchased, I had my first employee,
and I made a complete flip flop of my passion
and my actual makes money like telling people no because

(14:34):
I'm so busy kind of jobs. Wow, you were working
from home during all of this. I had a studio
because with you know, five D six pound printing presses,
you have to have place your husband at home. Yeah,
so you you rent a studio. Is that how that works? Okay,
so you rent a studio and you're you're doing this.
Is this when you called it Constellation and go where
is that started? Back at Etsy? Well, honestly that Yeah,

(14:57):
it's always been called Constellation at cod and I named
it something. I'm a vague because I didn't know exactly
what I wanted to say. What has it been? Lovely?
Because I look at it like I had my first business,
and then my second business, and then later when I
opened my brick and mortar store. It's kind of like
the third business, but they have all been called the
same thing. That's some kind of continuity. I guess it's smart,

(15:18):
and you're building a brand, and whether that brand changes
or not, it's got as followers, it's got the people
who know it and they're going to grow with you.
You're kind should grow with you, which is great. But
when I saw the name, I'm like, what's a cool name?
I wonder why, And now I know. The main idea
with the name was I wanted to be one part
of something bigger, like one star in the constellation. And
I've always looked at it that way, like I've worked

(15:39):
with other freelancers or other small businesses to collaborate and
it's all making something bigger than me and I'm just
one part and I love that. Do you have a
favorite collaboration that you've done with someone? I yes, um,
the folks of at Treehouse Point. But it's the best
thing ever. Sorry, there's a bet at Breakfast in Issaqua

(16:00):
and it's six tree Houses. If you've ever watched the
Animal Planet show Treehouse Masters, I think it's called cat
Treehouse Masters. They have their own show like and it's
it's it's just like cold fallowing it's so great, so
you can go and stay in a treehouse. It's so magical.
And they had found me because one of my invitation
clients got married there and I had done a fun

(16:21):
custom illustration of their treehouses and stuff. So they reached
out to me and asked me to illustrate all their
treehouses and create some greeting cards that they could sell
on the property. And it was so fun and it
has been like a bestseller for years for me, and
they still come back in order and we have worked
together for a long time. That's super fun. That's definitely
a cool collaboration. Can't go wrong with that one. Three

(16:43):
houses of it. So on your website it says we
use our love of snail mail to bring people together.
Has that kind of been the slogan from day one
or where you're like, one day we need a company's slogan. Honestly,
until about six months ago that said we use our
level of letter press to bring people together, because that
was kind of where we started. Was the whole idea
was like everything is letter press, and I still everything

(17:06):
is still letterpress, but I've realized that my passion is
really snail mail is getting people to reach out to
the people in their lives in a concrete way to
like set the phone aside and send a note or
hand to card. Yep. And there's little things like that. Okay,
snail mail, and like we're talking about earlier, it's it's
kind of like vintage now to do snail mill or

(17:26):
it's not. It's unique to do snail mail when it
was something that obviously that's the way people communicated. What
did I say that? Like that it's the way people communicated.
But your email it comes up as snail mail Superstar.
Now that's not your actual email, that's what it shows
that your name is. And I was like, it's so
clever because it stands out. It just pops. And I
don't know when you dubbed yourself that or if you

(17:48):
actually dubbed yourself that, it's just there. I love it.
The email thing was a total mistake because I changed
the name of my YouTube channel to snail Mail Superstar
and it changed it everywhere on Google. I laughed like
three day when I realized that all are going out
saying it. But now it's just a thing. Well, you
also just started a YouTube channel because you weren't doing
enough things so what goes on on the YouTube channel

(18:11):
all kinds of hijinks. Um, it's ridiculous. I basically just
I preach the gospel of snail mail. So I open
snail mail that people send me, which is lovely. So
I received quite a bit of snaw mail actually, and
I unboxed things. I do reviews of things that are
in the snaw mail world, and I also share just
a lot of the behind the scenes of what it's

(18:31):
like to own a stationary store and design greeting cards.
And I also talk a lot about therapy and mental
health that's great in fertility and all of this other
crazy stuff that goes on in real life, because I
think that's the heart of snaw mel is talking about
real stuff. And it's called snail Mail. Superstar is your
actual channel that people want to check it out. By

(18:52):
the way, if you want to check out Sarah's website,
it's Constellation co dot com. And if they want to
go in store. Is it Ballard? Like? What is the
area considered? Everybody calls it something different. I was calling
it Magnolia. I think it's technically like inter Bay, but
we're in the Fisherman's terminal next door to Chinooks. So
if you've ever headed over there, it's like a Seattle stable.
It's like five minutes from my apartment, but that freaking

(19:14):
bridges is the way. So I needed to get kayak
do I seriously, Oh my god, that would be so nice.
I'm going over see Sarah today. I'm gon Kayak. But
you said you're in store three days a week and
home too, because you told me your stay at home mom.
I'm like, you're actually not a stay at home mom
because you're doing all of these things. So you're lying
to me and you're also writing a book, so let's

(19:34):
talk about that stuff. It's all crazy. Yeah. So I
went through the adoption process and adopted my son, and
he was born three months after my brick and mortar
shop open. So the whole thing went from I'm working
crazy hours all the time, which again I went from
a job where I worked crazy hours all the time
to working for myself crazy hours all the time, which

(19:56):
sometimes the trade off. But when I had a new
born at home, I I was really quickly, I need
to hire more people and I need the option to
not be at work, and went from working five days
a week six seven days a week sometimes two. I
was a full time stay at home mom at that point,
which means I'm still doing email, I'm leading a team,

(20:16):
I'm doing the schedule, I'm deciding products. And I was
a working from home mom. But it was never really
my dreamer expectation to be a stay at home mom.
But I had waited so long to be a mom
and worked so hard to be a mom that when
that little tiny guy was in my arms, it was like,
I can't I can't say goodbye to him. I just

(20:38):
made my life work for where I was at. How
old is he now? He is for Wow, So he's
for the stores for than that, which is crazy. Do
you ever take him in the store when he be there? Oh,
he's such a tornado. He loves it. He like takes
the wrapping paper tubes and like beat stuff with and
knocks everything over, climbs my spiral staircase. It's so much

(20:59):
fun for him. But yeah, I don't get anything done
a few were years. You can be like, okay, you're
on cask registers today. This is eventually one day is
he You're You've got a worker. It's great. So what
is the book about though? And have you actually started
writing it. Oh yeah, I'm at this point. I'm pretty
much done writing um in the editing process. It's kind
of crazy. How does that happen? What is the book about?

(21:20):
When can we get it? Tell me? I'm hoping sometime
this year. But since I'm self publishing, it's been a
an adventure in learning new things. I wanted to write
about my childhood experiences with snail mail, and basically, last
summer at a family vacation, I was handed two thousand
postcards that have been collected by my great grandfather. What yeah,

(21:41):
like snam mail superstar over here gets handed like the
most incredible thing. He totally stole your thunder though it's true.
It's true, and I had no idea. And these are
all postcards from the enties, from the whole world. And
he was sending postcards all over the world and receiving
from all over the world, and he was like a

(22:01):
young man. I think he was sixteen seventeen years old
when he was doing this. I was so inspired by this,
this incredible gift that I was given, so I dug
really deep into my ancestry and tried to learn as
much as I could about him and his parents and
my grandmother died when I was fifteen, but this was
her dad. So I kind of dove back into a

(22:23):
lifetime of these beautiful experiences with writing letters and the
person who wrote them to me, and then also into grief.
And last year sort of the catalyst for a lot
of things is my longest tenured employee and one of
my best friends died of cancer, and that was last May,
so it's been almost a year, and that grief hit

(22:45):
me like a freight train. Of course, it was completely unexpected,
and it triggered all of these other griefs, losing my
grandmother and all these other things that had happened throughout
my life. So last year, basically the timeline was in March,
I started my tube channel, and in May my friend died,
and in July I was given the postcard collection, and

(23:05):
so the whole year was this into this past and
all the things I loved, but into all of these
griefs and struggles. And so I just started writing, and
I had no idea what exactly I was writing until
I got like words in and kind of put it
together and was like I'm processing grief and writing a

(23:28):
book and figuring out how the written word has been
part of my life all along, and how I processed
all of it through trying to find exactly the right
words to put to these big feelings that were so
terrifying to me as a little kid. Do you think
if your grandma didn't send you the letters that you
would have loved Snail Milt as much? And her dad
is the one that clearly put instilled that in her.

(23:50):
It's so wild, and I'm like processing this, I'm like, wait,
all of this stuff happened. It happened for a reason.
You're now helping all of these people with something as
simple as greed in cards be able to tell their
friends it's going to be okay, or I understand, or
this girl Sarah is helping me understand through her cards,
and now you're writing the book to also help people

(24:11):
with grief. Like this is crazy, This is amazing. It
felt like a story that was already being told. I
just had to write a town and it was a
crazy experience just kind of watching it all unfold, because
it doesn't feel like something I did. It feels like
something I witnessed. It's like Nicholas Barks without the romance side.
I mean, I'm sure this part of the story is

(24:32):
like that, like almost like like this is all happening
for a reason. It's kind of all been installed in
I'm just learning about it. So this is super cool
for me. I can't wait for the book. And now
I'm like, there's just so many more things I want
to know about you. I don't want to get back
to the side hustler questions. I want your story. I
don't really care about what happening is. We're going to
talk about it at some point, but it's so I

(24:52):
want to talk about the cards though, that you brought
in so people can sign up for this. How does
that whole process work. It's a monthly subscription, just like
any other subscription box, and you receive either three or
six cards or postcards every month in the mail, and
they're usually on a theme, and I always include fun
extras like stickers or postage stamps or some kind of

(25:12):
snail mail theme gift. And basically it's just to inspire
people to keep sending things, and so if they keep
coming in and they keep they'll keep going back out.
And it's just been a super fun time and it's
built a really beautiful community of people who love the
same things I love or are inspired to start sending
things for the first time. I'm looking at everything. Sorry

(25:33):
I'm not listening, but I love that you have stickers.
That's an official podcast nerd club. Can people buy these rights?
So why stickers? That's say official podcast nerd Club Because
everybody needs to be part of a club. And I
have a whole series of things. And it started with
the Mom Club. And as a woman trying to trying
to get pregnant, not able to going through the adoption process,

(25:55):
I looked at all my friends from mom's and felt
like I was being left out of the mom Club,
which is a very sad thing at the time. So
I actually created an embroidered patch this as the official
Mom Club and it started from there. So we have
Dad Club and Grandparents Club, and then we have like
cat Lady Clubs and oh yeah, oh yeah you and
Taylor Yeah. So side note to tell her she's talking

(26:16):
about is um Taylor or Tamoca if you follow her
on Instagram. Taylor Nolan. She was on The Bachelor Bachelor
in Paradise. She's based here in Seattle. She has her
own podcast called Let's Talk About It, which you were
also on, so check that out after that. Just keep
listening too. I love the cat ladies though I feel
like I get cat ladies. Well, I hated cats before
I fostered mine. Oh god, was it almost a year

(26:39):
and a half ago at this point, And I get
it now. I'm like, I get it, guys, I surrender.
I mean, I say cat mom. I say I'm a
cool cat mom, not a regular cat mom. That's so
I need a patch that cat mom. We can work
on that happen. So let's talk about the cards that
you have that you brought in for me, which thank
you very much. So this one says I'm only sending
you a card because science hasn't perfected telepretation yet. Love it.

(27:01):
I'm sorry this card took so long to arrive. The
snail that delivered it was doing its best. I love
talking about podcasts with you. I love these because it's true.
How many times now do you we have like that
one friend that we go to, Oh yeah about podcasts
or it's the number one thing you talk about in
a date or whatever it is. It's such a cool card,
and you can supporting into how you can smell, I
can't talk, it's how you can sound intelligent at all

(27:24):
times and all conversations. I was listening to a podcast
and all you need to listen to two minutes of
a podcast just one fact that you are that probably
isn't true. Podcast and then this says, I am hopeful
for you. And it's a postcard which is not your
standard postcard that has like attacking random picture on it
from a place that doesn't actually look like the picture.
But this is cool. I love that you do this.

(27:45):
I love the idea of the card club because there
really isn't anything like that. And you have a little
thing in here that tells people about you, which is
great because I am a fan of people supporting people
and not just businesses at is, when they make the
connection with you, they're more likely to support the business.
So that's an awesome tip that I've learned from people
who have been in the podcast, which has been huge

(28:05):
for me with the YouTube channel, It's really deepened the
relationship that I have see you and hear you absolutely
and and as a brand, especially like on Instagram for years,
the point is to look as polished as possible and
get that grid in the right colors and do it
all correctly and then on YouTube and you can't You
can't ask how awkward that I am, and you can't

(28:27):
ask when like you're having a bad day, like that
stuff comes through, but it makes you a real person,
and we're all real people, and there's so little about
business and about social media that captures that. And for me,
podcasts like this or YouTube channels have been away where
I've been able to really get to know people and
see see them in all their human glory. How much

(28:49):
time do you think you spend on your YouTube channel?
And that's kind of like I'm asking because I've wanted
to do it, and I know it's a big time investment.
I've realized that I can't do it if my actions
are too high. So I try to release one video
a week. That's my main goal, which it's doable. I
recorded my iPhone so I don't have to like set

(29:10):
up a lot of equipment. I do have like a
beauty light and try to oh, yeah, you got you gotta.
Sometimes I'm like, well, you can see that light reflecting
my eyeballs sets too much. I realized I had to
have it though as soon as because I started the
channel last spring and went through summer and it was
beautiful and glorian and sunshiny, and then fall hit and
I was like, oh god, it is dark here. I

(29:31):
can't record after two because it's nighttime here in Seattle. Totally.
Um yeah, So I recorded my iPhone. I keep it
really simple. I edit my own videos, but I do
it pretty simply and I've just kept it in bite
size chunks that I can do that. And so I
would say like four or five hours a week. It's
still a lot. It's become something that I want to do,

(29:53):
that I get to do. It's a creative outlet for me.
It's awesome when you were doing con stilation and code
as a side hustle. How many hours do you think?
I guess all the way beginning at the ad agency.
How many hours were you putting in back then We'll
start it small, and then the more it rolls, the
more you do. And I remember I remember getting off
work and being like, oh God, I gotta ship that

(30:15):
e's order. It's gotta go out tonight, and like going
to the post office to buy the one envelope to
ship the things. You know, you I started out really
small and one thing at a time, and then started
doing like a craft show here and there as I could,
and and tried to put as much time to it
as I could, but it's oh gosh, yeah, every business

(30:39):
takes as much time as you'll give it. Well, I
think a lot of people are kind of scared to
jump into starting something because they hear people on this
podcast say, oh, I spent about twenty thirty hours on
my side hustle. But it doesn't have to get to
that point if you don't want it, or it doesn't
have to and you can get to that point, but
you can, like you said, start small. And I think
it's important for people to understand you can start with

(31:00):
one hour a week, two hours, whatever it may be.
And my whole thing is and it's something that my
dad taught me. So my parents own their own equipment
rental business in Florida for almost thirty years, and so
I grew up in a small business. And something that
my dad now like post owning a business for all
that time, has really taught me is you are in

(31:20):
a small business to create the life that you want
and not necessarily to make money or to do these
other things. And of course there is money to be made,
but you get to craft your life, and like another
friend of mine has told me recently, like I like
to think of myself as the artist of my own life,
and I'm painting what I want it to look like.
And for me, that looks like I know that I

(31:41):
want to be home with my son a few days
a week, and I want to be in the shop
a few days a week, and most weeks I will
take a day like today to work from home in
the morning and take my dog for a walk and
record a podcast. So for me, it's it's looked like,
give it as much time as you have to give
it when you feel passionate about it. And on days
when I wake up in the morning and I'm super pressed,
I don't work. That's great to be able to have

(32:03):
that option, Like you're saying, do your life the way
you want. It's great to have those days because I
don't have off days. And it's good and bad because
I'll come into work and I have no choice but
to turn it on and I do kind of forget
about what's making me sad or whatever it may be.
But sometimes you do just want to stay home, and
I really I don't have that, So you're right being
able to craft your own life the way you want

(32:25):
and turn things off when you can. It is awesome.
There is that great perk about having a side hustle
turned your own business. And when it's purely a side
hustle and you have all these other things that you
have to be doing, which even you know we had
talked about, like being a mom, you don't when you
wake up in the morning and you feel crappy. It's
like your kids still needs to eat and like use
the bathroom and like function and talk to you and exactly.

(32:50):
But when it's just a side hustle, where it starts
out as a side hustle, like you have the option
to put two hours into it or twenty, and you
can start small and keep it small. But also it's
probably going to be something that you're super passionate about,
that you're super excited about. And that's when I've I've
known along the way that it's what I need to
be doing. Is when I get home from doing a

(33:11):
lot of other things and I'm like, oh, yeah, that's right.
I get to write new cards or make video or
you know, like I just did an a whole watercolor
painting series of what mailboxes look like around the world
is that it's a mailbox. It's it's a watercolor sticker mailbox,
and it's super cute. It's a series of a bunch
of them because they're like so different all around the world.

(33:33):
And I'm a giant nerd, so I was really excited
about that. But that's the kind of thing where a
side hustle has the opportunity to be something that is
so exciting and fun. And like on your last episode,
I was listening to talking about like how excited she
was to make soap and how she was making so
much soap because it was so much fun, and like
that for me is the epitome of a side hustle,

(33:55):
where you're like, yes, I have a day job or
I have these ten other things that I have to
be doing day and a day out, but then you
get that little spark of this is for me, this
is exciting. What is the difference then, between a side
hustle and a hobby? And there's no real right answer,
but it just came into my head because there are
things phases that I go through. I'm like, I can't
wait to go home and color my adult coloring book.

(34:16):
Now I know I can't set there's that clear different.
But that's a phase for me now it's um doing
hand lettering. That's definitely gonna phase out at some point.
So why do you think? I guess then that something
like doing what you're doing with cards has been for
at least ten years what you've loved to do every day.
Like how where does the hobby side hut? Like? Where

(34:36):
does that? I know you can have a hobby your
whole life, but it is something that I not that
I struggle with where I'm trying to wrap my head around. Obviously,
I love podcasting and I do this, So this, I
guess at this point is my side hustle. But or
when does a hobby become more than a hobby? And
I always say I have too many hobbies, So I
do that too, Like I like to knit and I
like to you know, there's a lot of but you're
not knitting for hours on hours and making it your life, correct.

(34:59):
I The difference for me is what I feel like
I bring to the tables a person. And the more
I distilled down who I am and what I love
to do and what I feel like passionate about what
I feel like I have skills in When I look
at my legacy as a person, I hope that people
will remember some of the words that I've been able
to craft to put to these big feelings. And I

(35:20):
think that's what's kept me on this path for more
than ten years. I see people come in the shop
and stand there and look confused, and we asked, like,
is there anything I can help you with? And they say,
I just found out my sister's cancer is back. What
do I say? Or I just found out we had
one day, I just found out my friends son committed suicide.
What do I say? And life is full of those

(35:42):
moments of just like a loss for words and seeing
a few words that I've put together bring comfort to
people in hard times, like that feels important, That feels
is worth putting crazy hours in in the evenings or
in the weekends or whenever they have to be done.
That feels important and worth it. And I think that's

(36:02):
what I've kept doing and and I think that definitely
anybody that makes that actually is the best way to
say it. Where does doing my hobby feel important to
anyone else but me? Really know? But what you're doing,
you're right, is important and it's become your passion and
and your meaning in life. But I guess some days

(36:23):
it does feel like that. Yeah, I mean life, life
always has meaning, but there are a lot of days
where it's like, God, do I really have to go
to the grocery store again? I feel like we just
did this, Why is there no food? Like the doctors
crapped on the rug, my kids crying for no reason.
Like life feels so chaotic so much at the time
that when there's anything that I can pull to find

(36:44):
some kind of larger meaning, that feels really grounding and
really important. And I think that's why a side hustle,
become a small business, or become anything else is so
important to the people who do it, because if you're
going to work for a large corporation in the day time,
that's their goals may not be your goals. There there,

(37:05):
decisions may not be what you would do. But with
your side hustle, you get to be the one to say,
this is how we do it, this is what I
feel best about, this is what I can I can
stand behind. And I think that you feel good about it.
Absolutely love that I've like loved listening to you talk.
By the way, do you have your own podcast, yet
you need to do that also, by the way, to

(37:26):
get that on your list of things that you do.
I just want to touch upon the fact that you
do have people working for you too, because some people
do it all on their own and some people like, no,
I gotta get people to do it otherwise I'm gonna
go insane. Absolutely, What has that process been like having
people on your team? I'm just insane. Yeah, it's I
never set out to be a boss. That was never

(37:47):
a goal of mine. But there's been times along in
the way we're realized that this thing has outgrown me
and I can't be the only one working for the company.
And there's been a lot of times where I'm not
there more than everybody else. There's people who work more
ours than I do because they've been paid to do that.
And they come and and it's one other person who
it's her main hustle, it's her full time job. And

(38:09):
then we have a few several people over the years
who have come and have worked part time for me
and also on their own side hustle, and it's been
really exciting to see them go on and make it
a full time hustle. If they had their side hustles
that are similar to not not really. It's like I
have had a few photographers work for me, and there
was one gal who worked for me and was going

(38:30):
through school to become a therapist and then started her
own practice, and a lot of things like that where
people have their own passions but need some other things
to kind of keep them afloat while they figure out
what they're doing or grow those those passions. And it's
I feel like a happy mama. Hen I'm going to
say that, I mean obviously employees, but I've see interns

(38:51):
that I knew more than ten years ago. At this point,
I'm like, you're also an adult with that job. How
did what? So it is cool knowing that you've known
that before they were at this point of their life.
That's awesome. And you have a pr person also because
that's how we connected. Connections are huge for me and
I love talking about that. But I had been following
consolation Is it just consolation on instag Yes? Yes, So

(39:14):
I had been following for sand is stressful and all,
like you know, and so so I've been following on
Instagram because one of our morning show listeners, Mindy Rice,
reached out to me, I was like, you gotta follow
this um card store. It's it's in Ballard, near where
you live, and they have a lot of great cats
stuff Like, oh god, great, that's just what I need.
So I started following. And then when Brittany reached out

(39:36):
to me like a week and a half ago, I
was like, wait, I already follow you guys. Oh my god,
I do need to talk but yeah, PR person, when
and why and how has that been? So last summer
I did a Mastermind retreat with trade Show boot Camp.
They work with product based small businesses and kind of
do like training and collaboration and things, and I've gone
to three or four of her in person workshops over

(39:59):
the years. It's been really really helpful for me. And
I went to this Mastermind retreat and met Brittany there
and basically every year, I have a set of goals
where I'm like, I really want to push these parts
of my business this year. And as you know, there's
a limited amount of hours in the day, so there's
always things at the end of the year that don't
get touched. And PR has been on that list for

(40:21):
five years and it doesn't get touched because there's so
many other things to do. So after so many years
of being like, I should really reach out to all
these people in town and to try to do this
and that and get our name out there, um, I
had realized I just it was not you know, that
imposter syndrome hits and it's never something that I feel
like doing. So when I met Brittany, that's her whole

(40:44):
gig is she works with small businesses. That's amazing, you know,
people who are freelancing and independent folks, and helps get
them out there. So we worked together, started working together
a few months ago, and I put made a whole
list of here are all the people I would love
to me or work with or collaborate with in some way,
and I'm terrified to reach out. But as she started

(41:07):
to pitch me and I've gotten more and more yeses
and more people being like I didn't know about you,
but this is great. I'm like, oh my god, this
list is a list of friends I haven't met yet. Yeah,
and it's so encouraging. But it really took bringing someone
else on to let them do some of those like
first reach outs for me to give me the confidence

(41:28):
that actually people want to hear what I have to say.
So then how did Brittany find me in this podcast?
You are on my list? Well, yeah, I feel like
you like put me on your vision board or something
and I came and you did well. I like that.
I'm just finding this out on the podcast. I was
on your list totally. Well, I like, you're a badass.
Thank you, lady working in Seattle talking to other small

(41:52):
business people, doing your own thing. You have multiple podcasts,
you're doing, You're you know, you have a radio show,
you are, You're on Instagram, I am doing all the things.
And you're also super authentic in yourself. And I was
like I could be friends with her. So it's just
really obvious to me to want to talk to you
because you're rad AND's so cool. Like it's crazy to

(42:14):
me that I was on like this pod. For me,
it's like the podcast, this podcast was on a list
for you to be a part of. It was one
of your goals this year. Like that's mind blowing to
me because that means this podcast has become something that
people like I want to be on that And it's
just third days when like, oh my god, I can't
believe I have to do this, I have to do
that for the podcast, but it all comes back to

(42:35):
this moment. It's like, this is amazing. Absolutely thank you.
You're like an angle that has come into my life
this week. So thank you. We all have those moments
of imposter syndrome or like questioning if all the time
and energy is worth it. This last year in December,
I had a local TV producer reach out to me
because she had watched my YouTube channel and wanted to

(42:56):
have me on the news to talk about snail. And
then yeah, they had me on the news. It was
like a short segment, but I came and talked about
letter writing on the news. And then the CEO of
a large retailer in Seattle saw me on the news
and liked me and liked my story and then reached
out to me and started purchasing our products for our shores.

(43:19):
And that's how I ended up and made in Washington.
Like my god, that's that kind of thing where I
keep pointing back to that in my own mind when
I have days where I'm like I don't know if
any of this is worth it or working or like
am I working myself too hard? And then I go
oh no, Like the things I'm passionate about that are
really fun for me. They actually do end up somewhere good.

(43:40):
I'm exciting. I'm so excited to hear people's feedback from
this episode to be like, oh my god, Sarah just
made me quit my job. Well, and that's a whole
other thing where I like, I actually I did a
couple of public speaking things, like I did an Ignite
talk it was five or six years ago now, and
I did like a Creative Warnings talk. And my whole

(44:00):
thing was like I couldn't get a job, so I
started my own thing, and you start your own business
because you can do it too, which was great. But
I was like twenty four and telling everybody to quit
their job, which is terrifying. And now at thirty two,
I'm like, no, no, no no, okay, no no, Like you
do need to pay rent or a mortgage and have insurance,
and like if you have kids, they need to wear
clothes and food. Like I have a very different perspective

(44:24):
now and and I feel like I can't have any
of these conversations about saying like my husband has worked
for a full time job that has insurance the entire
time I've run my business I don't do this all
on my own and a lot of years honestly in
the middle here, I've paid my employees well and I've
taken nothing home from my job, because building a business

(44:48):
when you're not able to be there full time, especially
seems since I've been home with my son, you've got
to pay somebody else and they have to live in
this city. And taking care of my employees has been
more important to me than taking home money for all
long time. And so you know, it's it's changing, and
it's not always like that, but there's so much give
and take when it comes to the lifestyle that I'm

(45:10):
enjoying right now with this being my basically full time gig,
you're painting your own life. Like you said, I am exactly,
and there's there's downsides to that too. So my my
thing any anymore is not like quit you rather do
it because what are you writing for? Which, like I
think what are you waiting for? Is definitely the right message,
But what are you waiting for? Like, start it now,

(45:30):
start it small, and do all of that painful growing
while you have support. Because I had so many like
tearful days where I'm like, I can't be a my
rint because it's terrifying and I'm here, and I'm here
because I could not get a job like I've very
rarely been able to like parlay my weird set of

(45:50):
snail male skills into full time employment. So well you don't,
and here you are and writing a book, which I
love writing a book. So what app do you love
to use or your side hustle all now turned full
time hustle. Yes, I love to do itst It's a
really simple to do list app. It's like well designed
and beautiful, and I schedule out to dous for my
whole week, to dost okay, and if I have something

(46:12):
that I'm like, oh, next Wednesday, when I know I'm
going to be home, I need to do this, then
I like schedule it out. So every morning I wake
up and I opened that app and kind of get
a plan for my awesome. Thank you and thank you
for coming in here and bringing cards, And now I'm
gonna donald that app and watch your YouTube channel and
pre order your book whatever I can, which I'll have
updates for whenever that does happen on the podcast. Thank

(46:34):
you for sharing your stories. You check check the thing
off my list for the year. That's what I'm the
most excited about. So check out Sarah. It's Constellation co
dot com, follow on Instagram, Constellation Co. Support her in
any way you can. Thank you, Thank you, thank you
for listening to side Hustlers again. I'm Carla Maurie. You
can follow me on Instagram. Reach out to me. It's

(46:56):
at the Carla Maurie. Head to my website, the Carla
Marie Com for more info and don't forget to rate
and review this podcast whenever you can, and also get
that subscribe button. I will see you next week. The
weekly podcast that started it all. They just wanted to

(47:19):
have fun as they dreamt of one day having their
own morning show, and now they do. But the tradition
continues Every Friday. My Day Friday with Carla Marie and Anthony,
available worldwide on the I Heart Radio kick off Your
Weekend with Carla Marie and Anthony

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