August 29, 2024 • 47 mins
As the world eagerly anticipates the premiere of the new documentary on The Tragically Hip: No Dress Rehearsal at the Toronto International Film Festival (TIFF), I am thrilled to bring you an exclusive interview with Jake Gold, one of the world's music mavens, Canadian Idol Judge, and the legendary manager who played a pivotal role in shaping The Hip's iconic career. Jake Gold managed The Tragically Hip during their rise to fame, offering unparalleled insights into the band's journey, their chemistry, the genius of Gord Downie, and the music that moved the world.
Jake shares stories from the heart—what it was like to see the raw, untamed talent of Gord Downie and the band for the first time, how they crafted their unique sound, and the challenges they faced along the way. As we delve into their legacy and the deeply emotional moments surrounding Gord Downie's passing, Jake provides a behind-the-scenes look at how the band’s music continues to resonate across generations.
Jake shares what he and others are doing to preserve their legacy, including this upcoming documentary.
Mark Thomas from RBC joins me to discuss their plans with TIFF. Spoiler alert: They include RBC House, RBC Red Carpet Gallery, Elton John: Never Too Late and Antonio Bocelli's documentary 'Because I Believe, and so much more.
The Tiff Premier is Thursday Sept 5, 2024
You can also watch it on Amazon Prime: September 20, 2024
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:03):
If you're a regular listener to Chatter That Matters, you know I love
watching or reading documentaries about artists. People
who have this extraordinary talent, but find a way to monetize it, sing for
their supper, chase their dreams. And when they do, they change the world
while moving the world around them. But I've come to learn talking to people like
Bob Ezra, one of the world's most legendary producers, or Harry Conner
(00:25):
Junior, that it takes more than sheer talent. You have to build a team.
You have to be supported by people that have vision, people that
believe in you and there to shape your destiny. One of the key
roles is managers. Think of Scooter Braun. He discovered
Justin Bieber on YouTube, played a pivotal role in turning him into a
global superstar. Sharon Osbourne, I mean, we we might have known her from
(00:48):
the reality show, but behind the scenes, one of the world's most successful
female managers, credited for revitalizing the career of Ozzy
Osbourne after Black Sabbath. And it was her vision that led to OZfest, an
annual rock and metal music festival. Many people
called George Martin the 5th Beatle for the work he did in the studio, but
you can't forget about Brian Epstein, his positioning,
(01:10):
his influence, his ideas. He discovered The Beatles in
Liverpool, played a role in shaping their image, first recording
contract in guiding him to superstardom. And despite his untimely
death in 67, his impact on the music industry and the legacy of The
Beatles remain unparalleled. Well, my guest today is another
one of those managers. Managers that see beyond
(01:32):
the norm. We want people to buy the records before they
heard him. That that's what you want. You wanna build the constituencies that
that is basically trusting you to
deliver the goods, and they will judge you differently
because they already like you. When I was growing up listening to music, there were
certain bands like, you know, Genesis and Yes. When they would cut a new record,
(01:54):
I would just go get it. I didn't have to hear it first. I would
go get it, and then I would put it on and I'd make my own
judgment. His name's Jake Gold, well known for his work managing the
Tragically Hip, one of the world's most iconic rock bands. His
guidance was instrumental in shaping them from somebody that
sounded really good in concerts to eventually take him into
(02:15):
the recording studio. Beyond the tragedy hip, Goldsman and other
artists contributed to the broader music scene. Keen Eye for
Talent, his ability to help artists navigate the complexities of the music
industry. His style, when you talk to people, they say, we
we love about Jake. He's hands on. He's artist centric. He
focuses on long term career developments versus trying to that one hit
(02:37):
wonder.
This is Chatter That Matters with Tony Chapman,
presented by RBC. And for a lot of people that might not
know the people in the industry, you certainly know him from Canadian Idol, where
he's the judge on that hit show for many years. I know I
(02:59):
know it's a great song. I've never been a fan of it, but the way
you did it, you made me a fan of that song. Fantastic.
Quite a song sheet. And Jake, I'm so happy you found the time to join
me on Chatter That Matters. Nice to see you again, Tony. It's
been a while. I can't wait to get into everything you're doing because your
energy and the the body of work that continues to come from your desk.
(03:21):
But I wanna wind it back because I often start with sort of that the
sense of where did you come from? I guess you were born in New Jersey,
raised in Toronto. Yeah. So my my mom was from Manhattan, and my
parents met in Florida. And my
dad ended up following my mom back to Manhattan.
They got married there, and a year later, I was born in New Jersey,
(03:42):
which is where they settled, not far from where Bruce Springsteen's from,
from Asbury Park, a place called Lakewood, New Jersey. And
within 6 months, we ended up moving to Manhattan. And a year, you know, a
year after I was born, my brother was born. And then a year after
that, we moved to Canada. And I think because my father's support systems
and, you know, he had his parents here and everything else. So
(04:05):
we moved to Canada when I was 2. So basically, I was raised here, but
I am a dual citizen. You used the word move. From what I understand from
your childhood, it was far from a skip in the park. Lots of moves,
financial insecurity. I'm always curious, how does
that impact you as a child? And what did you carry with you going
forward? I have to talk to my therapist about
(04:29):
no. You know, at the time, you're just moving around. You don't even realize how
it's impacting you, and and you don't realize till years later that
you have, you know, all this shit that you deal with because of it.
You know, my father died when I was 17. I was kind of left on
my own at that point. You know, my mother was around, my younger brother, my
younger sister. I probably didn't do great in
(04:50):
school as after that just because I was, you know, messing
around a lot, smoking weed and, you know, being into music
and sports and stuff, but not I would always do really well in school,
but I could have always done way better if I'd actually shown up. You know,
I was I was that guy. I was just bored. I did
have one teacher, I remember in my grade 13 accounting
(05:13):
who, I I managed to get a passing grade and he wouldn't pass
me, and he said, you should be getting nineties, so I'm
not passing you. You gotta come back in the next semester. We were on a
semester system and I said, okay. He said, you've got to come back and really
take this seriously because you're way better than this. And you know,
it was the year my father died and, you know, it was a lot of
(05:34):
turmoil to say the least. My mother wasn't a working person,
so my father was and he and he was he was a
gambler, loved the horse races. So, you know, my life was
if he made money that day, we'd be going out for dinner. If we didn't
hide the stereo because it could be hoft, you know, like, that was that was
my life. But at the time, you're just living it. And I took
(05:56):
the accounting class again, and I ended up getting in the nineties. And I
always remember this teacher was like, you know, if you actually pay attention and put
put yourself into it, you're going to win. And that was a lesson
then. And I studied I was teacher was Mr. Goldberg, and he was the only
one that sort of gave a where he saw, like, this guy's got something
going on and he needs just a push. I can't believe how much our
(06:18):
lives are like the similar song sheet. I mean, my teacher was mister Macpherson,
who said to me, like, half the teachers want you thrown out of the school.
The other half think there's something there. Why don't you join the debate team?
And I went, the debate team. And he said, do you believe in God? I
said, no. I said, so next week, you're gonna debate why God exists.
And that was the beginning, I guess, is, you know, just having somebody reach out
(06:39):
and say there's something inside you is so important. But I also like, I
we don't underestimate the fact that in grade 6, if
my research is right, you managed a talent contest. So, I mean,
management was came early. Yeah. I didn't manage the talent contest. What it
was was and it's a funny story because I reminded I was reminded of it
by some guys that I grew up with because one of them said, you
(07:01):
always wanted to be a manager. And I was like, what are you talking about?
Don't you remember in grade 6? So there were these 3 girls and they
wanted to enter the school talent contest in grade 6. And
and I said, okay, I will rehearse you for 2 weeks, and then we'll enter
the talent contest. And I rehearsed them for 2 weeks, and they won the
contest. So my friends remembered that was my first
(07:23):
crack at being a manager. So I want to talk I want to move it
up to 1985. You met Alan Gregg. I knew Alan back
then as a public pollster with Decima, really brilliant guy that
really had his hand on the rudder of how people think, felt, and
and voted. What was his connection to music and to you? So I
was at an event put on by a a magazine called Music
(07:45):
Express, which Alan was an investor in. And I was had
already been a manager for about 5 years. This was December 1985.
And Alan had been investing
also in this singer that he grew up with, and he needed someone to
help him, you know, put on a showcase, put a band together
that he could play for some A and R people. And it seemed like
(08:08):
everyone he had talked to, because they saw him as a guy with money and
that that that everyone had their hand out. And he was introduced to me
by a guy named Earl Seymour, who I knew through he was a sax player
that I knew through the business. And Earl said, look, Jake's super trustworthy.
He's not gonna, like, take advantage of you. So him and I had a meeting.
It's interesting because it's in the the Tragically Hip documentary where I
(08:30):
tell the story where him and I have this meeting at his house after
this party where we met. His wife comes in and says his Nims is on
the phone. He gets up and leaves and comes back, and he goes, sorry. It
was the prime minister. And I'm like, who the is this
guy? Like, he he asked me if I would help him with this thing, and
I said, sure. And he goes, well, what do you wanna get paid for? And
(08:51):
I said, look, if we get a deal for the guy, I'm the manager. That's
what we'll do. I was the first guy that never asked him for money.
I was working with another guy at the time, and things weren't going well. There
was drug issues and stuff like that. And I decided I was
going to go out on my own. And I called Alan in mid January
of 86, literally 3 weeks later. And I said, I'm going to
(09:12):
work on work on my own. I'll be working out of my house. And I
lived right at Eglinton and Bathurst. Alan's office was at Yonge and Eglinton, and
he lived around there, too. And he says, why don't you come see
me? So I went over to his office and we sat down and we put
together a business plan and a cash flow projection. He goes, look, I'll put up
the money. You run the company and we'll be partners.
(09:34):
And January 31, 86, we started the business.
And I saw him as someone I could learn from. He also saw you in
a certain way. In an in an article in Investment Executive, he's talking about people
like you. He said, there's a pattern in the course of my career. It is
basically when I learn to recognize what my strengths are and
seize opportunities that allow me to exhibit those strengths, but at the same
(09:55):
time, learn to understand your weaknesses and get partners. 1 of the partners
he was talking about was you, the fact that he found somebody that he could
trust. Like, a lot of people always wanna be partners because I
that's my best friend, and we play sports together. But what is the secret
sauce of bringing 2 very different people, one who's
starting out, and one who's taking a phone call from the prime minister and making
(10:16):
it work? Well, it's interesting you say that, but because at the core
of it, we were really similar people. Alan was like,
just a regular guy, grew up. His dad was the shoe salesman in
Edmonton. You know? Like, he had a love for music. And
and I was a same kind of guy from North Toronto. We
had a lot in common. We saw the world the same way. We
(10:39):
understood the truth was important. We understood that, you know, be
diligent. We understood that if you wanna stand out, you gotta be different.
I learned a lot about marketing and
positioning and that kind of thing from him. Because if you remember, Decima,
while it was known for its political work, 90% of its
business was corporate work, was brands and companies
(11:01):
and general foods and that. But I think they got a lot of that
business because, they had the political influence. I
think at the end of the day, what what brought us together is we
both came from kind of meager places and saw
ourselves as, you know, this is an opportunity to to grow
bigger. And we're not afraid of hard work, and we're not afraid of getting out
(11:22):
there and doing things. I still talk to Alan once a week. And another
interesting thing that I I was fascinated about, for a guy that grew up with
a lot of uncertainty, dad was a gambler, dad dies
early, mom has to, you know, you have to find a way to make it
work. You didn't choose the most secure
career. I mean, managing is not what I would say, you know,
(11:43):
accounting or being a lawyer. I mean, it's it's pretty volatile. There's good
days and bad days and good years and bad years. What inspired you to sort
of chase that path knowing that you had a lot of baggage to still
unpack with your therapist about your previous past. And that didn't
start happening till, like, way later in life. I took a year off and
started and was involved in a carpet cleaning business. And I
(12:05):
injured my knee and I couldn't work. And so they
ended up buying me out. And I was like, maybe I'll go back to school.
And I went back I went to Centennial College for business administration,
figuring, well, I got a good math head, a good business head. I
was really bored. And I remember I knew this wasn't for me. When I
came into the marketing class, there was a note on the board from the
(12:26):
teacher that said, Jake, I'm going to be late. Can you please go over this
stuff with the class? And I was like,
okay. I'm gonna go on the road with a rock band. Because a friend of
mine was in a band, and I went on the road as their lighting guy.
It was me and a sound guy, and they let me get up and sing
because I used to sing in bands in high school. So I got up and
sing with them for encores. And I just I was making $50
(12:50):
a week in 1979, and I just went on the road and I loved
it. And I ended up moving to LA for a couple of years, worked
in various different jobs there, worked in a phone bank
selling office supplies where I really learned how to cold
call people, literally just getting on the phone and selling people stuff that
you've never met or talked to before. And I did I did really
(13:12):
well. Like, in 1980, I was making, like, $50 a year.
In 1980, I was, you know, 22 living in LA.
It was kind of fun. But I ended up coming back in 81,
and a buddy of mine, was in a band, and they asked
me if I would, be their manager. And I said, I don't know anything about
it. And he was a high school friend that was the drummer in the back.
(13:34):
He was a public school friend. And he said, don't worry. You'll be good. I
know it. And that's when I started. And I just learned
to do it. I just hustled and hustled and met people and
connected and hung out at agencies looking for
gigs. And, you know, I had a part time job working at a
stereo store. And I remember this date
(13:56):
so specifically, November 29th was a Friday. I
came into work, 1981. The owner calls me. He says,
where were you yesterday? They owned a chain of stores called Hi Fi Express.
And he said, where were you yesterday? I said, oh, I was sick. He goes,
no, you weren't. I said, well, my band had a last minute gig and I
had to go to London, Ontario. And he goes, you're fired. I said,
(14:16):
okay. And I walked out and that was the last
day I ever worked for anybody again in my life. No dress rehearsal, this is
our life. That's what you gotta do. You gotta make the most of
it. From Kingston, Ontario, Canada, my friends that tragically hit. Your move on the street.
If any of us were tragically hit.
If any of us were in another band, I don't think we'd be able to
(14:39):
do it because we wouldn't be in another band with our friends. Crowds would get
so loud that you couldn't hear anything happening on stage. They put
on a monster show. They were loud and tight and
forceful, and Gord was mesmerizing. They made
it cool to be Canadian. I feel silly being sort of emotional about it. The
songs that we wrote matter a lot to people. It came at its
(15:02):
cost.
I want you now take me to Larry's hideaway, the evening you first
saw Tragically Hip, and obviously, Gord Downey,
their lead singer. I just I know you're you've been asked this a 1000000 times,
but just share with the audience what it must have been like to see
such raw talent in front of you. You know, I had been a manager for
(15:24):
5 years. Alan had been sent a tape, by
another politics friend named Hugh Siegel, whose brother-in-law was friends
with the guys in in the hip. We listened to it and thought, oh, this
is interesting. Let's set up a gig. So we set up a gig at Larry's
Hideaway. I knew Fred, who was the booker there,
and I said, I need a place to see this band. And they put him
(15:44):
on on a Saturday night at, like, 8 o'clock or something. I said hello to
the band beforehand, had no idea what we were about to see.
And they walked on stage, and within 30 seconds, I looked at
Alan. I said, we gotta sign these guys tonight. It was it
was explosive. How do you know that? Like, is it the mood you're walking in
on? I mean, is there what are these all the fact circumstances, or do you
(16:05):
just so zero in on the talent and go, it doesn't matter if they were
playing at Larry's hideaway or, you know, on a subway
stop. They they were the ones. Well, it it's it's funny because, you
know, when I did when I was on the TV show, it was on Canadian
Idol. People used to ask me the same thing. How do you know? How do
you know when you see greatness? And for me, it was always
(16:26):
an involuntary response. You know? Did it make you feel
something that you didn't before you saw them? Did it
create that involuntary response in you? And that's what happened. Like,
you know, every hair on my neck and everything stood up. I was like,
holy what did I just see here? And then you realize, oh, this
is the bar. This is what greatness is. This is how good it has
(16:49):
to be. And it wasn't just Ford, it was all of them. It was so
powerful and so dynamic. And the audience
was there to see the next act. And back then, you
sat. Larry's Hideaway was cabaret. Everybody sat. Remember, almost
all the bars weren't standing bars. They were sit down bars. And they were there
to see a Rolling Stones clone band. That's that's who the headliner
(17:11):
was. And at the end of the 40 minutes, the whole place stood
up and cheered. They had just seen the band play 2 covers and the rest
all original music that they'd never seen before. So even
though I felt it off the top, that whole audience felt it
too. And you kinda chase that for the rest of your life. You
know, you're looking for that again and again and again and again. Am I gonna
(17:33):
feel that again? Am I gonna feel that again? Do you ever try to force
your brain to believe that, or do you just trust your instincts that it might
not never happen again? Because sometimes that's just a once in a
lifetime. It is once in a lifetime for that kind of greatness because
that's, you know, Gord Downey as a singer was a special thing. And the
band, the way they played with him and how he moved off them and
(17:55):
everything, that's a that's a special thing. Right? I've worked with other acts that
are super talented, that have great communication skills, that
fans love their music and everything else, that haven't gotten
as big as that. And that's because that is a once in a
lifetime thing. That is a really special thing. And that doesn't demean
the other apps in terms of their talent and their songwriting ability and everything
(18:18):
else, but there's a difference between, you know, being really, really good and
great and being iconic. And I think they have fallen to the iconic
place. The best place I've seen it many times was at Canada
Day and Trafalgar Square. Right. I mean, a lot of people
were there that had you know, they just didn't have the same
Canadian connections that I did, and it didn't matter. What I'm
(18:41):
curious about is, you know, this is a tight group. They're friends. There's an
incredible bond. There's they have trust. How do you
work your way in as a manager so that you are part of
the family versus, I don't wanna say this wrong, but a
necessary evil. I need a manager. I need this interruption.
Without him, I or her, I can't get to where we wanna go. How do
(19:04):
you break that down so suddenly they look and say, hey. When we sign the
canvass at the end of the year, here's the pen. You're part of this. I
think that you have to prove yourself. You know? Like and and it's interesting
because in the, you know, the the the deals
change very quickly. Right? Where at the
beginning, the bands need you. You're the experienced one. You've been in the
(19:24):
business. You have the contacts. You have the Rolodex. You remember that
Rolodex. You have the ability to make things happen. You
can get gigs. You can get them record deals. You do all of that.
Right? So you become an important
thing for them because you're the conduit to the industry. And,
you know, I I always like to say that the greats, the
(19:46):
truly greats, are unemployable. Like, they don't they couldn't
have a real job. You can see Bob Dylan working anywhere or
John Lennon or like, those kind of people are just not they're
not employable. Could you see Prince working, like, at a bank? You
know? Like, that's not gonna happen. Right? So they need people like
us that can be their spokespeople on the business side.
(20:09):
But what happens is that the dynamic starts to change because as you they
become more successful, the dynamic changes.
While you can maintain that need, at the same time,
there's a balance now because now they start to feel
more powerful. They're the ones in charge, and they start to dictate
the schedule and dictate how they're gonna do things and what things are gonna
(20:33):
look like and everything else. And if you work with great artists, you
they see you as an asset to help them deliver their vision.
Sometimes you see it, in a situation where, you know, they
start to have disdain for the manager or for everyone
around them because they think that the relationship can be like, I listened to
you telling me what to do all these years. Now I'm gonna tell you what
(20:54):
to do. And I guess that's just natural evolution, right, as you said, of who's
got influence and authority. Because early on, you kinda
held them back a bit by saying before we really chase
radio, let's build this community of fans. Let's create
electricity you created at Larry's Hideaway in other
areas. Were they receptive to that? Did they sort of say, listen. This guy knows
(21:16):
what he's doing? Or Honestly, they
really wanted to take things slow, and I think that's why they liked
what what our plans were, is they weren't chasing
fame. They wanted it to be on their terms
at the right time. You know, Gord Downey would always say to me, I
want success on my own terms. So if it meant
(21:39):
not chasing the the golden calf, so to
speak, they didn't wanna do that. They liked what
our plans were. They liked the fact that they wanted to take things slow,
and that we wanted to take things slow. You know, we purposely put them into
smaller venues and did multiple nights because we wanted
everybody in the town to get a chance to see them. Because if you came
(22:01):
in for 1 night, you're gone. And the word-of-mouth would spread, and you weren't
wouldn't be there to meet it. We would put them in for 3 nights in
places, and by the 3rd night, it was always packed no matter that where they
were. Because back then, word-of-mouth spread. We didn't need the
Internet to spread word-of-mouth. It literally happened old
school way. You managed it from 86 to 2,000 and 3, and we're
(22:23):
gonna come back because you came back later to preserve their legacy.
But before we get to the legacy part, what's on your highlight reel?
There's 2 really big ones for me. We we launched another
roadside attraction, which was the the traveling festival, which had
never traveled across Canada. No one had ever done a festival across Canada,
and we launched it. 2nd night at Markham Fairgrounds,
(22:45):
they walked on stage, and I was side staged, walked on with them and, you
know, stayed on the wings. And they opened with locked in the trunk of a
car, and the song kicks in, and the whole crowd gets lit
up. I just remember that feeling like, holy like,
we pulled this off. We're now playing to 40,000 people
in Toronto. We hadn't even played an arena yet. You know, we had held back
(23:07):
about playing arenas until the next record. And then the next one
was, we did a concert in Winnipeg in 2,001
to raise money for War Child. It was something that we had been talking
about for a long time with me and the guys about doing a free concert
but still being able to raise money. How can you do a free concert and
raise money for a charity? Yeah. She wanted they wanted to do, like, a ticketing
(23:29):
event and all this other stuff and do it at the Forks. And I said,
let's make a lot of noise. Let's fill the Forks with, like, 70
to a 100000 people. I said, but we'll do it for free.
So we thought if we get enough sponsors, it'll look like a a race car
driver suit, which had tons of sponsors on it. Right? So
it wasn't like any one sponsor would own it. And then we
(23:51):
passed a bucket around the crowd. We raised $400,000 for them
and basically put WarChild on the map. And I remember when they walked on stage,
I was standing side stage with Denise Donnelley because MuchMusic was gonna
film it, was filming it and gonna broadcast it after. And Gore took the
mic, and he just said put the money in the bucket. And in 20 minutes,
a $140,000 went into the buckets that were being passed
(24:13):
around. And I looked at Denise, and I just heard that crowd, and you
couldn't see where the crowd ended. There was a 100,000 people there. And
I said to her, I go, this is why we do this, for this feeling.
We do this for this feeling right now. And Denise looked at me. She goes,
you're right. This is exactly why we do it. So you and I have
another similarity. We were both in television shows. I was in
(24:36):
Recipe to Riches. You happened to be in the number one television show,
Canadian Idol, and you did it for 6 years. Right. And you
were fantastic in it. How did that come about? Because that was a very different
role for you. I mean, this isn't behind the scenes. I mean, the camera's
on, and and you've gotta you've gotta be the lead singer. Well, interestingly
enough, the hip and I parted ways in January of
(24:57):
2003. There was a lot of tension. There was mistrust everywhere.
It and it was amongst them, me, them, them
amongst themselves. It it it wasn't a a good time for anybody.
And 2 weeks later, I got a call to do, to
do the show, and I I turned them down because I thought, it's not
really me. That's not my kind of music. I
(25:20):
don't really see myself that way. And my my now ex
wife said, you know, you should go meet with them. I think you'd
be good at this. I'd never even seen the American show. The American show had
been on for 1 season. It was it became a cultural phenomenon
after 1 season. And so I said, okay. I'll go take a meeting with them.
And I took a meeting with them, and Yeah. They had a studio set up
(25:41):
in the basement. Cameras, and they had fake singers. They had
hired musical theater people to pretend to be
Susie from Saskatoon and stuff like that. And they give you
notes and you do the thing. Right? And when I walked out of there, the
guy, one of the camera guys said to me, have you done this before? And
I said, no. He goes, oh, you're the best guy we've had here. Because they
(26:03):
didn't say anything. Right? Because you know TV, how it works. Right? And then they
call me back for another audition. There was 6 of us. And then they picked
the 4 of us. And by March, we were on the road to Vancouver
starting the show. Nobody knew how it was gonna go.
But the idol thing, it sort of had a life of its own, and we
were sit we were country 4. So it started in England, then it went
(26:24):
to Australia, then it went to the US, and then it came to Canada.
But Canada was the only country that saw other
countries idle because we saw the American Idol. But the
UK never saw the other countries. None of the other countries saw
it. So that's why they chose to go with 4
judges because they didn't want it to look like the American show. So I
(26:45):
was lucky enough that I got to be myself because they had, you know,
the mean guy was Zach, and they had, you know, the black guy,
which was Farley, you know, who came from the urban world, and they had the
girl singer, which was sass, and me. I kinda got to
play myself. I didn't have to sort of play the type, which was good
because I I did lay down some rules at the beginning. I told
(27:07):
them because none of it was scripted, but they would say, you know, maybe you
shouldn't say that or, you know, stuff like that, but none of it was scripted.
And I said, look, I'm only gonna ever say the same thing I would say
to a client of mine. So don't expect me to, like, be
any meaner or any tougher or any nice or whatever. I said, I'm
just gonna tell the truth all the time because that's who I am. So I
(27:29):
remember walking with Alan when we were start before we started the show, and he
said, you know, you have an opportunity now to really define yourself.
He gave me some good advice. He said, really define who you
are because now you're gonna have an audience
of 2,000,000 people. It must have been so different for you because, you know, a
handful of people would know you well outside your Rolodex, which is
(27:49):
like anybody else in life. And next thing you know, everybody knew you.
Well, it's funny. It it was funny seeing your face on billboards and bus
shelters and television commercials and getting recognized.
And now you're, like, you're being asked to go to all these fancy parties
and red carpets and all this other stuff, and and you're getting
clothing budgets. And, you know, it wasn't a life
(28:11):
I I asked for. It wasn't a life I wanted.
I learned very quickly that you have to be magnanimous.
You have to appreciate the fans. And it's the same kind of stuff that
I talked to my clients about. Now I was telling myself,
you know, like, this is how you have to act around people. Funny
story. I was, it was Christmas, and we
(28:34):
were shopping at the Loblaws up around,
I lived in Riverdale, up around Danforth and Broadview there.
And, I was outside. It was snowy and I was like, you
know, big park. I hadn't shaved in a few days because I'd been off
and holding the dog. And some woman comes up to me and she
goes, are you Jake Gold from Canadian Idol? And I'm like, yeah.
(28:56):
Yeah. That's me. She goes, you look like
shit. So before we get back into the
returning to the hip and the legacy because this preserving their legacy
because you're doing such brilliant work, You just got recognized with one
of the highest honors, did you not? I was inducted into
the Canadian Music Industry Hall of Fame in, June. That's
(29:19):
incredible. I mean, this is such a testament and it would
almost, like, often when you go into a hall of fame, you you
feel like your career is over, but it's far from it. But instead of going,
why are you giving him a hall of fame? He seems busier today than any
time that I've ever met you. They asked me if I would, if I would
accept, And I looked at it as an opportunity to
(29:40):
remind everybody I'm still here as opposed to I'm going away, you
know. 2 of the guys in the hip did the induction, which
was beautiful. My other group, The Pursuit of Happiness, performed 2
songs. I had my friends and family there, and it was it was
nice to be honored. It's nice to be recognized. And especially it was
done during Canadian Music Week at the Live Music Awards, which
(30:02):
were by people, managers, agents. People say, oh, it's just great to be
honored. And it's true. It's great to be honored.
When we come back, Jake and I delve into the day he found out that
a Canadian icon, a global icon, and even more
importantly his lifelong friend, Gord Downey, had passed away.
(30:24):
Hi. This is Tony Chapman. I'm a huge fan of the arts and a champion
for all RBC is doing to support the Canadian artist community. Take the
Toronto International Film Festival. This is the 17th year RBC
has been a sponsor. As a fan, you might have heard of the RBC House,
the go to venue for film industry parties. You might have found your way onto
the RBC Red Carpet Gallery, one of the most coveted spots for stargazing.
(30:46):
But what many of you might not know is what RBC is doing behind the
scenes to help emerging women film directors. State's intimate
cocktail fundraiser celebrating the world premieres of Elton John's Never Too
Late and Andrew Buccelli's Because I Believe, the TIFF Black Excellence
Brunch in partnership with Brand USA, and so much more. Culture,
community, and festivals, well, that matters to you, to me, and to
(31:07):
RBC.
30 years, relationships can get strained. We probably should have had
some therapy. I think at that point, we probably needed it. We knew there
were problems. There was anger and frustration and resentment, and
then Gore got his diagnosis.
(31:30):
It was Frank cancer and was incurable. The worst
of the worst. Memories, which used to be my forte, and
now I can't remember people's names and can't remember lyrics. What he's planning
to do next is nothing short of awe inspiring. We got together
and started to rehearse to write an end to our own story.
(31:58):
People came out and they showed their appreciation, gave Gord their love,
and it helped him.
And I swear as we progressed, he got better, and it was
unbelievable. And by the end of the tour, he felt like
old Gorn.
(32:24):
Multiple generations of Canadians decided that
to tragic people were our band. They will
define for generations to come the
music that exemplifies this country. You're listening to
Chatter That Matters with Tony Chapman presented by RBC.
Today, my special guest is Jake Gold. He's a friend. He's someone I've admired for
(32:46):
decades. He focuses on what matters most and that's music
and how it makes us feel. But of equal importance,
helping the artists that pursue their craft, find a way to
monetize it, so they can, in fact, sing for their supper.
Talk to me about Gord Downey and his passing.
(33:06):
That must have impacted you in a most profound
way. Well, it's interesting because that was during
the time where I wasn't working with the band, but we were still all
friends in that. And I I did go to a bunch of the
shows off the final tour, including the final one in Kingston. And I had
a chance to talk to Gord a few times during that.
(33:29):
He was being pretty protected because, you know, after each
show, there was physio and it was this. It was he had to do all
this stuff just to be able to do the next show, you know. And
they never played, they never played back to back. It
was always it was always a day off between the shows. But I
remember I was sitting at home. I got a text
(33:50):
from somebody that had heard before I got up in the morning. And I looked
at my phone, and there was this text. You know, turn on the TV, and
there's, you know, Trudeau crying about
it. And I realized, wow. This is, like, this
is something. And, Randy Lennox, who at the time
was running Bell Media, but we worked together when he was running
(34:11):
Universal, I messaged him. I said, what are you doing? He
goes, oh, I'm just sitting at Soho House. I got the bat booth. I don't
know. Kind of bummed out. What are you doing? I said, nothing. He goes, come
on over. And we just sat there for 7 hours reminiscing.
You know? It was a tough day for sure.
Lost a a lifelong friend. You know, even even after the
(34:33):
band and I split, I continued to work his solo stuff for 2
more records because he really wanted me involved in his life.
When I lived in New York, I lived in New York for 4 years from
98 to 2002. His mother-in-law rented my house,
which was 8 doors down the street from where he
lived. And so it was he was always in my house with his
(34:55):
wife and his kids even though I wasn't there. So we were we were
very close, and it was hard. It was hard just to see what he had
to go through. You know, when I'm watching the documentary, I'm
seeing stuff that none of us really knew because Mike included
home video footage of Gord when he was
going through that right up until he died. Well, talk to me about this
(35:17):
documentary because you you shared the trailer with me, and it just gave me
chills, the same kind of chills that you you talking about you and Randy at
the back booth. You've really dedicated a lot of time
and effort in the last couple of years to making sure that their legacy
continues. So in 2020, the guys who
were managing the band, who happened to be one of
(35:39):
them worked with me and one of them was my roommate for 4 years.
They decided they didn't wanna do it anymore. I had always thought, wow, there's so
much more we can do. And I also think the guys were in
mourning. You know, they were still pretty fractured.
I heard they quit. I sent the guys a letter. I said, you know, we
we need to talk. And we had a 3 hour Zoom meeting, and 2
(36:02):
days later, they went, yeah. Let's do this. So I immediately went to
work, finding old tapes, that they they
couldn't find these tapes for 2 years. I found them in 24 hours.
And I got great advice. A good friend of mine, is
the CEO of of Apple Corps, which is The Beatles.
So he basically does what I do, but he does it for The Beatles. And
(36:23):
I called him up. I said, I'm back. And he said I said,
what advice can you give me? He said, first, find out what you got,
then you'll know what to do with it. And then we knew Mike wanted to
make the doc, so he put together his template, Mike Downey,
Gord's brother, who's a documentary filmmaker. When we made
the deal with Amazon, and it was all timed. All you know, we've been
(36:45):
putting up boxsets and unreleased music and new singles and
everything else, but it was all the doc and the
book that's coming out and the box set for up to here that's coming out
this year was all timed around the 40th anniversary of the band.
This is the 40th year of the tragedy. They played their first gig in
in 1984. So we're now rolling everything out. The
(37:07):
doc's gonna premiere at at the Toronto International Film Festival on
September 5th. It's gonna come out on, Prime
worldwide sometime in September. The guys are now regretting.
They're like, we were retired. I'm like, not anymore.
How much is is Gord channeling this
through you? Is he there approving it in your mind? Is he
(37:30):
helping to shape Interestingly enough, you know, Pat Downey, Gord's younger
brother, and Mike and Gord's, widow,
they run the estate, but Mike and Pat are sort of the day to day
guys on it, And Pat more than anyone. So Pat sits in on
all the meetings. So Pat is Gord in the meetings.
So he's the one that holds all the Gord's notebooks at his
(37:53):
house. So in a lot of ways, there is Gord. Gord is there, You
know? And a lot of times, we'll say there'll be
decisions. There have been decisions where Pat has said, I don't know if Gord would
go for that. And the other guys would go, yeah. You're right. Yeah. We can't
do that. You know, where we've turned down the chance to put a song
in a TV commercial or something like that. And if it's not the right brand
(38:15):
or the right kind of thing, yeah, it's been turned down. So when
this is wrapped up, I mean, because there's so many things you're
putting out there now. I mean, from a guy that was, you know yeah. I
I don't know much about managing bands to now doing movie deals and
book deals and everything else. When this gets wrapped up, is that your
legacy, or is there what do you think is next for you? I have a
(38:35):
young guy in my office that, is my right hand guy, and he's
bringing in new acts, and I'm sort of guiding him. Who
knows? Maybe we'll break a new young act or something like that. I still have
people coming to me to work with them. I don't have an appetite necessarily
for starting with someone from this from the bottom, and my time
management is important as you know. You know, you have to look at
(38:58):
the value of your time. But the hip thing, it it's gonna go I don't
know if it's gonna wrap up. You know, we're working on a lot
of stuff that I can't really talk about right now, but there's a lot of
stuff that's gonna go for another 5, 10 years for sure, at
least. You know, I'm kinda tireless, and I don't know what else
I'd do if I wasn't doing this anyways. Like, I'd be bored.
(39:20):
I can't play tennis every day. I mean, I'd like to and I
probably could, but I'd still wanna work
because I don't see it as work. I'm the same way. I think the thing
I fear the most in life is retirement because I have no plans. I wouldn't
know. No. And and it's not even it's not even about the money, Tony. It's
it's never been about the money. Like, I've never been you know, it's
(39:41):
important to get the money. You have to pay your bills, you
know, those kinds of things. But I've never been motivated by money.
I've been motivated by do the right things, the money's gonna come. You know?
And that's always been sort of how we did things with the guys in the
hip. It's like so when I when I meet these young acts and they just
wanna be famous, I I'm kind of turned off by that.
(40:03):
Like, you know, tell me you wanna make great work. Tell me you wanna change
the world. Tell me you wanna make a difference. Then we got something to talk
about. But if you just wanna be famous, yeah, it's not really for me.
You know, Jake, I've talked to you over the years about coming on this show,
and I'm glad we timed it when we did because there's so
much happening. And I do believe sometimes in intervention. I think it was meant
(40:25):
to for this episode to come out as as the, show premieres. But I
always end with my 3 takeaways. And the first one I think that I really
admire about you is this sense of crawl,
walk, and then sprint. And the sense that it that it doesn't
have to happen overnight, and the people you've worked with and done your
best work are the people that really understand that it's better to
(40:47):
spend 4 nights in one town because word-of-mouth don't create
a vacuum. You gotta fill that. And just the fact that you take the time
where today everybody wants instant gratification. The second
one is this, all the things you packed in your knapsack, you just rolled off.
You know, I worked in carpet cleaning, then I learned how to sell on the
phone and stuff. And I always say to people, any situation you're in, even if
(41:09):
you don't like where you're in, there's always something to take away and put in
your knapsack and work on another day. But the most important thing
you shared, and I would say it'd be on my highlight reel, is this
is why we do it for that feeling. To open
your mind out there to realize there's gonna be times when you have
this feeling, cherish it, preserve it, yes, chase it for the
(41:31):
rest of your life, but never ever forget
what it felt like when you find yourself in that moment in
life where the compression of creativity and
intensity and feelings and emotions are all there and they
explode. So for all of that and more, my friend, it's just been a pleasure
to have you on Chatter That Matters. Well, thank you. And it's funny you talk
(41:52):
about the crawl then walk then sprint because this year
I had double knee replacement surgery, and I literally have gone
from crawl to walk to sprint.
If you're a fan of the show, you'd know that my guest has appeared on
several occasions. He's Mark Thomas. He's the senior director of brand marketing at
(42:14):
RBC. He's got his hand on the rudder with everything to do
with Toronto International Film Festival. Mark, welcome back to chat of the
matters. Thanks, Tony. Thanks for having me. This has been a partnership that RBC has
been involved with for many years. I guess the real the first
question is why, and, why does it matter so much to your
organization? RBC this year will be our 17th year as the
(42:36):
official, bank sponsor of TIFF. We're incredibly proud
of that. We genuinely believe that the
arts are essential to building vibrant and
prosperous communities. I think all of us at RBC are just proud
to support such a vital, important
cultural event, one that celebrates ideas, diversity,
(42:58):
and nurtures emerging Canadian talent from all backgrounds. I'm
curious because a lot of people really don't understand the dynamics of
marketing. And your RBC is involved with TIFF, the Olympics,
PGA Golf. They're bringing Taylor Swift to Canada.
How do you prioritize all of that and make sure that the consumer
gets a consistent message, that they really understand sort of
(43:21):
that song sheet that you're singing from when you're talking RBC? Beyond our
belief that supporting, the arts is essential
for community, for society. More broadly, what we're trying to do is
support the things that our communities care about and that our clients care about. And
so, you know, when you list some of the things that we're involved in, TIFF,
you know, we just we marvel at how not only the film community, but the
(43:44):
general population comes to life during the festival. It's such
a unique mix of filmmakers, both emerging and established,
stars, fans, and the entire community coming together to support
something important, art and film. There's a passion there.
Candidly, we find it energizing to be part of something that generates such
passion. You know, a lot of cities are struggling, and a lot of
(44:07):
festivals are struggling to to stay vibrant, to
stay alive in these tough economic times. How important is it as
a society that we put our collective consciousness towards
having these things that sort of focus on positivity and possibility?
One of the ways that we can make our way through this complex world, one
of the ways in which we can bring some positivity to people's lives
(44:29):
is by all of us opening up our hearts,
to hearing about each other's stories, each other's perspectives,
truly listening to how we're all trying to get through this very complex world and
the, you know, the diverse background experiences that we all come from. And I
think film is one of the most important and impactful mediums
to do so, Even to play a small role in all of
(44:51):
that is why we continue to partner with TIFF. And I think why we're so
proud, of our collective efforts year over year in and around
the festival. A couple of the themes that you've talked about, diversity,
talent, emerging filmmakers. What can we expect this year
from RBC and TIFF that's gonna, put a smile on my
face and I hope millions of other Canadians? This year, we're exceptionally
(45:13):
excited about some of the things that we've got going on. Many of
the tried and true festival's favorite activations and events will
return. All of it is designed to enhance that festival experience
for talent, fans, creatives, and clients. A few of the
things that, you know, you can expect to see out there, RBC House will be
back for its 6th festival season, and that continues to be the
(45:36):
go to venue for film and industry parties. And
we'll once again host several noteworthy events for emerging and
established talent filmmakers. Also returning is the RBC red carpet
gallery, which is one of the most coveted spots for celebrity spotting during during
TIFF, which is, I know something that the fans genuinely care about. To
champion programming that's focused on nurturing diverse and emerging Canadian
(45:58):
talent, we're proud to co present the 2nd annual TIFF Black
Excellence Brunch in in partnership with Brand USA. It's an event that
supports black creatives while providing meaningful networking opportunities
and a panel discussion with industry experts. We're also
supporting events throughout the the festival that are benefiting
the TIFF Every Story Fund through intimate cocktail fundraisers
(46:21):
celebrating the world premieres of Elton John Never
Too Late and Andrea Bocelli because I believe. Both
events are going to be incredibly special. I think they're gonna be highly talked about
and I think they're gonna be something that people care about And all of that
goes towards giving back to the communities at large. Mark Thomas, always
a pleasure to have you on my show, my friend, and, just continue to
(46:42):
congratulations for everything you're doing for the arts, for
emerging artists, and putting the smile on the faces of Canadians
that so desperately need to smile nowadays. So thank you for joining me in Chatter
That Matters. Thanks, Tony. Truly is, our pleasure. Chatter That
Matters has been a presentation of RBC. It's Tony
Chapman. Thanks for listening, and let's chat soon.
If you're a regular listener to Chatter That Matters, you know I love
watching or reading documentaries about artists. People
who have this extraordinary talent, but find a way to monetize it, sing for
their supper, chase their dreams. And when they do, they change the world
while moving the world around them. But I've come to learn talking to people like
Bob Ezra, one of the world's most legendary producers, or Harry Conner
(00:25):
Junior, that it takes more than sheer talent. You have to build a team.
You have to be supported by people that have vision, people that
believe in you and there to shape your destiny. One of the key
roles is managers. Think of Scooter Braun. He discovered
Justin Bieber on YouTube, played a pivotal role in turning him into a
global superstar. Sharon Osbourne, I mean, we we might have known her from
(00:48):
the reality show, but behind the scenes, one of the world's most successful
female managers, credited for revitalizing the career of Ozzy
Osbourne after Black Sabbath. And it was her vision that led to OZfest, an
annual rock and metal music festival. Many people
called George Martin the 5th Beatle for the work he did in the studio, but
you can't forget about Brian Epstein, his positioning,
(01:10):
his influence, his ideas. He discovered The Beatles in
Liverpool, played a role in shaping their image, first recording
contract in guiding him to superstardom. And despite his untimely
death in 67, his impact on the music industry and the legacy of The
Beatles remain unparalleled. Well, my guest today is another
one of those managers. Managers that see beyond
(01:32):
the norm. We want people to buy the records before they
heard him. That that's what you want. You wanna build the constituencies that
that is basically trusting you to
deliver the goods, and they will judge you differently
because they already like you. When I was growing up listening to music, there were
certain bands like, you know, Genesis and Yes. When they would cut a new record,
(01:54):
I would just go get it. I didn't have to hear it first. I would
go get it, and then I would put it on and I'd make my own
judgment. His name's Jake Gold, well known for his work managing the
Tragically Hip, one of the world's most iconic rock bands. His
guidance was instrumental in shaping them from somebody that
sounded really good in concerts to eventually take him into
(02:15):
the recording studio. Beyond the tragedy hip, Goldsman and other
artists contributed to the broader music scene. Keen Eye for
Talent, his ability to help artists navigate the complexities of the music
industry. His style, when you talk to people, they say, we
we love about Jake. He's hands on. He's artist centric. He
focuses on long term career developments versus trying to that one hit
(02:37):
wonder.
This is Chatter That Matters with Tony Chapman,
presented by RBC. And for a lot of people that might not
know the people in the industry, you certainly know him from Canadian Idol, where
he's the judge on that hit show for many years. I know I
(02:59):
know it's a great song. I've never been a fan of it, but the way
you did it, you made me a fan of that song. Fantastic.
Quite a song sheet. And Jake, I'm so happy you found the time to join
me on Chatter That Matters. Nice to see you again, Tony. It's
been a while. I can't wait to get into everything you're doing because your
energy and the the body of work that continues to come from your desk.
(03:21):
But I wanna wind it back because I often start with sort of that the
sense of where did you come from? I guess you were born in New Jersey,
raised in Toronto. Yeah. So my my mom was from Manhattan, and my
parents met in Florida. And my
dad ended up following my mom back to Manhattan.
They got married there, and a year later, I was born in New Jersey,
(03:42):
which is where they settled, not far from where Bruce Springsteen's from,
from Asbury Park, a place called Lakewood, New Jersey. And
within 6 months, we ended up moving to Manhattan. And a year, you know, a
year after I was born, my brother was born. And then a year after
that, we moved to Canada. And I think because my father's support systems
and, you know, he had his parents here and everything else. So
(04:05):
we moved to Canada when I was 2. So basically, I was raised here, but
I am a dual citizen. You used the word move. From what I understand from
your childhood, it was far from a skip in the park. Lots of moves,
financial insecurity. I'm always curious, how does
that impact you as a child? And what did you carry with you going
forward? I have to talk to my therapist about
(04:29):
no. You know, at the time, you're just moving around. You don't even realize how
it's impacting you, and and you don't realize till years later that
you have, you know, all this shit that you deal with because of it.
You know, my father died when I was 17. I was kind of left on
my own at that point. You know, my mother was around, my younger brother, my
younger sister. I probably didn't do great in
(04:50):
school as after that just because I was, you know, messing
around a lot, smoking weed and, you know, being into music
and sports and stuff, but not I would always do really well in school,
but I could have always done way better if I'd actually shown up. You know,
I was I was that guy. I was just bored. I did
have one teacher, I remember in my grade 13 accounting
(05:13):
who, I I managed to get a passing grade and he wouldn't pass
me, and he said, you should be getting nineties, so I'm
not passing you. You gotta come back in the next semester. We were on a
semester system and I said, okay. He said, you've got to come back and really
take this seriously because you're way better than this. And you know,
it was the year my father died and, you know, it was a lot of
(05:34):
turmoil to say the least. My mother wasn't a working person,
so my father was and he and he was he was a
gambler, loved the horse races. So, you know, my life was
if he made money that day, we'd be going out for dinner. If we didn't
hide the stereo because it could be hoft, you know, like, that was that was
my life. But at the time, you're just living it. And I took
(05:56):
the accounting class again, and I ended up getting in the nineties. And I
always remember this teacher was like, you know, if you actually pay attention and put
put yourself into it, you're going to win. And that was a lesson
then. And I studied I was teacher was Mr. Goldberg, and he was the only
one that sort of gave a where he saw, like, this guy's got something
going on and he needs just a push. I can't believe how much our
(06:18):
lives are like the similar song sheet. I mean, my teacher was mister Macpherson,
who said to me, like, half the teachers want you thrown out of the school.
The other half think there's something there. Why don't you join the debate team?
And I went, the debate team. And he said, do you believe in God? I
said, no. I said, so next week, you're gonna debate why God exists.
And that was the beginning, I guess, is, you know, just having somebody reach out
(06:39):
and say there's something inside you is so important. But I also like, I
we don't underestimate the fact that in grade 6, if
my research is right, you managed a talent contest. So, I mean,
management was came early. Yeah. I didn't manage the talent contest. What it
was was and it's a funny story because I reminded I was reminded of it
by some guys that I grew up with because one of them said, you
(07:01):
always wanted to be a manager. And I was like, what are you talking about?
Don't you remember in grade 6? So there were these 3 girls and they
wanted to enter the school talent contest in grade 6. And
and I said, okay, I will rehearse you for 2 weeks, and then we'll enter
the talent contest. And I rehearsed them for 2 weeks, and they won the
contest. So my friends remembered that was my first
(07:23):
crack at being a manager. So I want to talk I want to move it
up to 1985. You met Alan Gregg. I knew Alan back
then as a public pollster with Decima, really brilliant guy that
really had his hand on the rudder of how people think, felt, and
and voted. What was his connection to music and to you? So I
was at an event put on by a a magazine called Music
(07:45):
Express, which Alan was an investor in. And I was had
already been a manager for about 5 years. This was December 1985.
And Alan had been investing
also in this singer that he grew up with, and he needed someone to
help him, you know, put on a showcase, put a band together
that he could play for some A and R people. And it seemed like
(08:08):
everyone he had talked to, because they saw him as a guy with money and
that that that everyone had their hand out. And he was introduced to me
by a guy named Earl Seymour, who I knew through he was a sax player
that I knew through the business. And Earl said, look, Jake's super trustworthy.
He's not gonna, like, take advantage of you. So him and I had a meeting.
It's interesting because it's in the the Tragically Hip documentary where I
(08:30):
tell the story where him and I have this meeting at his house after
this party where we met. His wife comes in and says his Nims is on
the phone. He gets up and leaves and comes back, and he goes, sorry. It
was the prime minister. And I'm like, who the is this
guy? Like, he he asked me if I would help him with this thing, and
I said, sure. And he goes, well, what do you wanna get paid for? And
(08:51):
I said, look, if we get a deal for the guy, I'm the manager. That's
what we'll do. I was the first guy that never asked him for money.
I was working with another guy at the time, and things weren't going well. There
was drug issues and stuff like that. And I decided I was
going to go out on my own. And I called Alan in mid January
of 86, literally 3 weeks later. And I said, I'm going to
(09:12):
work on work on my own. I'll be working out of my house. And I
lived right at Eglinton and Bathurst. Alan's office was at Yonge and Eglinton, and
he lived around there, too. And he says, why don't you come see
me? So I went over to his office and we sat down and we put
together a business plan and a cash flow projection. He goes, look, I'll put up
the money. You run the company and we'll be partners.
(09:34):
And January 31, 86, we started the business.
And I saw him as someone I could learn from. He also saw you in
a certain way. In an in an article in Investment Executive, he's talking about people
like you. He said, there's a pattern in the course of my career. It is
basically when I learn to recognize what my strengths are and
seize opportunities that allow me to exhibit those strengths, but at the same
(09:55):
time, learn to understand your weaknesses and get partners. 1 of the partners
he was talking about was you, the fact that he found somebody that he could
trust. Like, a lot of people always wanna be partners because I
that's my best friend, and we play sports together. But what is the secret
sauce of bringing 2 very different people, one who's
starting out, and one who's taking a phone call from the prime minister and making
(10:16):
it work? Well, it's interesting you say that, but because at the core
of it, we were really similar people. Alan was like,
just a regular guy, grew up. His dad was the shoe salesman in
Edmonton. You know? Like, he had a love for music. And
and I was a same kind of guy from North Toronto. We
had a lot in common. We saw the world the same way. We
(10:39):
understood the truth was important. We understood that, you know, be
diligent. We understood that if you wanna stand out, you gotta be different.
I learned a lot about marketing and
positioning and that kind of thing from him. Because if you remember, Decima,
while it was known for its political work, 90% of its
business was corporate work, was brands and companies
(11:01):
and general foods and that. But I think they got a lot of that
business because, they had the political influence. I
think at the end of the day, what what brought us together is we
both came from kind of meager places and saw
ourselves as, you know, this is an opportunity to to grow
bigger. And we're not afraid of hard work, and we're not afraid of getting out
(11:22):
there and doing things. I still talk to Alan once a week. And another
interesting thing that I I was fascinated about, for a guy that grew up with
a lot of uncertainty, dad was a gambler, dad dies
early, mom has to, you know, you have to find a way to make it
work. You didn't choose the most secure
career. I mean, managing is not what I would say, you know,
(11:43):
accounting or being a lawyer. I mean, it's it's pretty volatile. There's good
days and bad days and good years and bad years. What inspired you to sort
of chase that path knowing that you had a lot of baggage to still
unpack with your therapist about your previous past. And that didn't
start happening till, like, way later in life. I took a year off and
started and was involved in a carpet cleaning business. And I
(12:05):
injured my knee and I couldn't work. And so they
ended up buying me out. And I was like, maybe I'll go back to school.
And I went back I went to Centennial College for business administration,
figuring, well, I got a good math head, a good business head. I
was really bored. And I remember I knew this wasn't for me. When I
came into the marketing class, there was a note on the board from the
(12:26):
teacher that said, Jake, I'm going to be late. Can you please go over this
stuff with the class? And I was like,
okay. I'm gonna go on the road with a rock band. Because a friend of
mine was in a band, and I went on the road as their lighting guy.
It was me and a sound guy, and they let me get up and sing
because I used to sing in bands in high school. So I got up and
sing with them for encores. And I just I was making $50
(12:50):
a week in 1979, and I just went on the road and I loved
it. And I ended up moving to LA for a couple of years, worked
in various different jobs there, worked in a phone bank
selling office supplies where I really learned how to cold
call people, literally just getting on the phone and selling people stuff that
you've never met or talked to before. And I did I did really
(13:12):
well. Like, in 1980, I was making, like, $50 a year.
In 1980, I was, you know, 22 living in LA.
It was kind of fun. But I ended up coming back in 81,
and a buddy of mine, was in a band, and they asked
me if I would, be their manager. And I said, I don't know anything about
it. And he was a high school friend that was the drummer in the back.
(13:34):
He was a public school friend. And he said, don't worry. You'll be good. I
know it. And that's when I started. And I just learned
to do it. I just hustled and hustled and met people and
connected and hung out at agencies looking for
gigs. And, you know, I had a part time job working at a
stereo store. And I remember this date
(13:56):
so specifically, November 29th was a Friday. I
came into work, 1981. The owner calls me. He says,
where were you yesterday? They owned a chain of stores called Hi Fi Express.
And he said, where were you yesterday? I said, oh, I was sick. He goes,
no, you weren't. I said, well, my band had a last minute gig and I
had to go to London, Ontario. And he goes, you're fired. I said,
(14:16):
okay. And I walked out and that was the last
day I ever worked for anybody again in my life. No dress rehearsal, this is
our life. That's what you gotta do. You gotta make the most of
it. From Kingston, Ontario, Canada, my friends that tragically hit. Your move on the street.
If any of us were tragically hit.
If any of us were in another band, I don't think we'd be able to
(14:39):
do it because we wouldn't be in another band with our friends. Crowds would get
so loud that you couldn't hear anything happening on stage. They put
on a monster show. They were loud and tight and
forceful, and Gord was mesmerizing. They made
it cool to be Canadian. I feel silly being sort of emotional about it. The
songs that we wrote matter a lot to people. It came at its
(15:02):
cost.
I want you now take me to Larry's hideaway, the evening you first
saw Tragically Hip, and obviously, Gord Downey,
their lead singer. I just I know you're you've been asked this a 1000000 times,
but just share with the audience what it must have been like to see
such raw talent in front of you. You know, I had been a manager for
(15:24):
5 years. Alan had been sent a tape, by
another politics friend named Hugh Siegel, whose brother-in-law was friends
with the guys in in the hip. We listened to it and thought, oh, this
is interesting. Let's set up a gig. So we set up a gig at Larry's
Hideaway. I knew Fred, who was the booker there,
and I said, I need a place to see this band. And they put him
(15:44):
on on a Saturday night at, like, 8 o'clock or something. I said hello to
the band beforehand, had no idea what we were about to see.
And they walked on stage, and within 30 seconds, I looked at
Alan. I said, we gotta sign these guys tonight. It was it
was explosive. How do you know that? Like, is it the mood you're walking in
on? I mean, is there what are these all the fact circumstances, or do you
(16:05):
just so zero in on the talent and go, it doesn't matter if they were
playing at Larry's hideaway or, you know, on a subway
stop. They they were the ones. Well, it it's it's funny because, you
know, when I did when I was on the TV show, it was on Canadian
Idol. People used to ask me the same thing. How do you know? How do
you know when you see greatness? And for me, it was always
(16:26):
an involuntary response. You know? Did it make you feel
something that you didn't before you saw them? Did it
create that involuntary response in you? And that's what happened. Like,
you know, every hair on my neck and everything stood up. I was like,
holy what did I just see here? And then you realize, oh, this
is the bar. This is what greatness is. This is how good it has
(16:49):
to be. And it wasn't just Ford, it was all of them. It was so
powerful and so dynamic. And the audience
was there to see the next act. And back then, you
sat. Larry's Hideaway was cabaret. Everybody sat. Remember, almost
all the bars weren't standing bars. They were sit down bars. And they were there
to see a Rolling Stones clone band. That's that's who the headliner
(17:11):
was. And at the end of the 40 minutes, the whole place stood
up and cheered. They had just seen the band play 2 covers and the rest
all original music that they'd never seen before. So even
though I felt it off the top, that whole audience felt it
too. And you kinda chase that for the rest of your life. You
know, you're looking for that again and again and again and again. Am I gonna
(17:33):
feel that again? Am I gonna feel that again? Do you ever try to force
your brain to believe that, or do you just trust your instincts that it might
not never happen again? Because sometimes that's just a once in a
lifetime. It is once in a lifetime for that kind of greatness because
that's, you know, Gord Downey as a singer was a special thing. And the
band, the way they played with him and how he moved off them and
(17:55):
everything, that's a that's a special thing. Right? I've worked with other acts that
are super talented, that have great communication skills, that
fans love their music and everything else, that haven't gotten
as big as that. And that's because that is a once in a
lifetime thing. That is a really special thing. And that doesn't demean
the other apps in terms of their talent and their songwriting ability and everything
(18:18):
else, but there's a difference between, you know, being really, really good and
great and being iconic. And I think they have fallen to the iconic
place. The best place I've seen it many times was at Canada
Day and Trafalgar Square. Right. I mean, a lot of people
were there that had you know, they just didn't have the same
Canadian connections that I did, and it didn't matter. What I'm
(18:41):
curious about is, you know, this is a tight group. They're friends. There's an
incredible bond. There's they have trust. How do you
work your way in as a manager so that you are part of
the family versus, I don't wanna say this wrong, but a
necessary evil. I need a manager. I need this interruption.
Without him, I or her, I can't get to where we wanna go. How do
(19:04):
you break that down so suddenly they look and say, hey. When we sign the
canvass at the end of the year, here's the pen. You're part of this. I
think that you have to prove yourself. You know? Like and and it's interesting
because in the, you know, the the the deals
change very quickly. Right? Where at the
beginning, the bands need you. You're the experienced one. You've been in the
(19:24):
business. You have the contacts. You have the Rolodex. You remember that
Rolodex. You have the ability to make things happen. You
can get gigs. You can get them record deals. You do all of that.
Right? So you become an important
thing for them because you're the conduit to the industry. And,
you know, I I always like to say that the greats, the
(19:46):
truly greats, are unemployable. Like, they don't they couldn't
have a real job. You can see Bob Dylan working anywhere or
John Lennon or like, those kind of people are just not they're
not employable. Could you see Prince working, like, at a bank? You
know? Like, that's not gonna happen. Right? So they need people like
us that can be their spokespeople on the business side.
(20:09):
But what happens is that the dynamic starts to change because as you they
become more successful, the dynamic changes.
While you can maintain that need, at the same time,
there's a balance now because now they start to feel
more powerful. They're the ones in charge, and they start to dictate
the schedule and dictate how they're gonna do things and what things are gonna
(20:33):
look like and everything else. And if you work with great artists, you
they see you as an asset to help them deliver their vision.
Sometimes you see it, in a situation where, you know, they
start to have disdain for the manager or for everyone
around them because they think that the relationship can be like, I listened to
you telling me what to do all these years. Now I'm gonna tell you what
(20:54):
to do. And I guess that's just natural evolution, right, as you said, of who's
got influence and authority. Because early on, you kinda
held them back a bit by saying before we really chase
radio, let's build this community of fans. Let's create
electricity you created at Larry's Hideaway in other
areas. Were they receptive to that? Did they sort of say, listen. This guy knows
(21:16):
what he's doing? Or Honestly, they
really wanted to take things slow, and I think that's why they liked
what what our plans were, is they weren't chasing
fame. They wanted it to be on their terms
at the right time. You know, Gord Downey would always say to me, I
want success on my own terms. So if it meant
(21:39):
not chasing the the golden calf, so to
speak, they didn't wanna do that. They liked what
our plans were. They liked the fact that they wanted to take things slow,
and that we wanted to take things slow. You know, we purposely put them into
smaller venues and did multiple nights because we wanted
everybody in the town to get a chance to see them. Because if you came
(22:01):
in for 1 night, you're gone. And the word-of-mouth would spread, and you weren't
wouldn't be there to meet it. We would put them in for 3 nights in
places, and by the 3rd night, it was always packed no matter that where they
were. Because back then, word-of-mouth spread. We didn't need the
Internet to spread word-of-mouth. It literally happened old
school way. You managed it from 86 to 2,000 and 3, and we're
(22:23):
gonna come back because you came back later to preserve their legacy.
But before we get to the legacy part, what's on your highlight reel?
There's 2 really big ones for me. We we launched another
roadside attraction, which was the the traveling festival, which had
never traveled across Canada. No one had ever done a festival across Canada,
and we launched it. 2nd night at Markham Fairgrounds,
(22:45):
they walked on stage, and I was side staged, walked on with them and, you
know, stayed on the wings. And they opened with locked in the trunk of a
car, and the song kicks in, and the whole crowd gets lit
up. I just remember that feeling like, holy like,
we pulled this off. We're now playing to 40,000 people
in Toronto. We hadn't even played an arena yet. You know, we had held back
(23:07):
about playing arenas until the next record. And then the next one
was, we did a concert in Winnipeg in 2,001
to raise money for War Child. It was something that we had been talking
about for a long time with me and the guys about doing a free concert
but still being able to raise money. How can you do a free concert and
raise money for a charity? Yeah. She wanted they wanted to do, like, a ticketing
(23:29):
event and all this other stuff and do it at the Forks. And I said,
let's make a lot of noise. Let's fill the Forks with, like, 70
to a 100000 people. I said, but we'll do it for free.
So we thought if we get enough sponsors, it'll look like a a race car
driver suit, which had tons of sponsors on it. Right? So
it wasn't like any one sponsor would own it. And then we
(23:51):
passed a bucket around the crowd. We raised $400,000 for them
and basically put WarChild on the map. And I remember when they walked on stage,
I was standing side stage with Denise Donnelley because MuchMusic was gonna
film it, was filming it and gonna broadcast it after. And Gore took the
mic, and he just said put the money in the bucket. And in 20 minutes,
a $140,000 went into the buckets that were being passed
(24:13):
around. And I looked at Denise, and I just heard that crowd, and you
couldn't see where the crowd ended. There was a 100,000 people there. And
I said to her, I go, this is why we do this, for this feeling.
We do this for this feeling right now. And Denise looked at me. She goes,
you're right. This is exactly why we do it. So you and I have
another similarity. We were both in television shows. I was in
(24:36):
Recipe to Riches. You happened to be in the number one television show,
Canadian Idol, and you did it for 6 years. Right. And you
were fantastic in it. How did that come about? Because that was a very different
role for you. I mean, this isn't behind the scenes. I mean, the camera's
on, and and you've gotta you've gotta be the lead singer. Well, interestingly
enough, the hip and I parted ways in January of
(24:57):
2003. There was a lot of tension. There was mistrust everywhere.
It and it was amongst them, me, them, them
amongst themselves. It it it wasn't a a good time for anybody.
And 2 weeks later, I got a call to do, to
do the show, and I I turned them down because I thought, it's not
really me. That's not my kind of music. I
(25:20):
don't really see myself that way. And my my now ex
wife said, you know, you should go meet with them. I think you'd
be good at this. I'd never even seen the American show. The American show had
been on for 1 season. It was it became a cultural phenomenon
after 1 season. And so I said, okay. I'll go take a meeting with them.
And I took a meeting with them, and Yeah. They had a studio set up
(25:41):
in the basement. Cameras, and they had fake singers. They had
hired musical theater people to pretend to be
Susie from Saskatoon and stuff like that. And they give you
notes and you do the thing. Right? And when I walked out of there, the
guy, one of the camera guys said to me, have you done this before? And
I said, no. He goes, oh, you're the best guy we've had here. Because they
(26:03):
didn't say anything. Right? Because you know TV, how it works. Right? And then they
call me back for another audition. There was 6 of us. And then they picked
the 4 of us. And by March, we were on the road to Vancouver
starting the show. Nobody knew how it was gonna go.
But the idol thing, it sort of had a life of its own, and we
were sit we were country 4. So it started in England, then it went
(26:24):
to Australia, then it went to the US, and then it came to Canada.
But Canada was the only country that saw other
countries idle because we saw the American Idol. But the
UK never saw the other countries. None of the other countries saw
it. So that's why they chose to go with 4
judges because they didn't want it to look like the American show. So I
(26:45):
was lucky enough that I got to be myself because they had, you know,
the mean guy was Zach, and they had, you know, the black guy,
which was Farley, you know, who came from the urban world, and they had the
girl singer, which was sass, and me. I kinda got to
play myself. I didn't have to sort of play the type, which was good
because I I did lay down some rules at the beginning. I told
(27:07):
them because none of it was scripted, but they would say, you know, maybe you
shouldn't say that or, you know, stuff like that, but none of it was scripted.
And I said, look, I'm only gonna ever say the same thing I would say
to a client of mine. So don't expect me to, like, be
any meaner or any tougher or any nice or whatever. I said, I'm
just gonna tell the truth all the time because that's who I am. So I
(27:29):
remember walking with Alan when we were start before we started the show, and he
said, you know, you have an opportunity now to really define yourself.
He gave me some good advice. He said, really define who you
are because now you're gonna have an audience
of 2,000,000 people. It must have been so different for you because, you know, a
handful of people would know you well outside your Rolodex, which is
(27:49):
like anybody else in life. And next thing you know, everybody knew you.
Well, it's funny. It it was funny seeing your face on billboards and bus
shelters and television commercials and getting recognized.
And now you're, like, you're being asked to go to all these fancy parties
and red carpets and all this other stuff, and and you're getting
clothing budgets. And, you know, it wasn't a life
(28:11):
I I asked for. It wasn't a life I wanted.
I learned very quickly that you have to be magnanimous.
You have to appreciate the fans. And it's the same kind of stuff that
I talked to my clients about. Now I was telling myself,
you know, like, this is how you have to act around people. Funny
story. I was, it was Christmas, and we
(28:34):
were shopping at the Loblaws up around,
I lived in Riverdale, up around Danforth and Broadview there.
And, I was outside. It was snowy and I was like, you
know, big park. I hadn't shaved in a few days because I'd been off
and holding the dog. And some woman comes up to me and she
goes, are you Jake Gold from Canadian Idol? And I'm like, yeah.
(28:56):
Yeah. That's me. She goes, you look like
shit. So before we get back into the
returning to the hip and the legacy because this preserving their legacy
because you're doing such brilliant work, You just got recognized with one
of the highest honors, did you not? I was inducted into
the Canadian Music Industry Hall of Fame in, June. That's
(29:19):
incredible. I mean, this is such a testament and it would
almost, like, often when you go into a hall of fame, you you
feel like your career is over, but it's far from it. But instead of going,
why are you giving him a hall of fame? He seems busier today than any
time that I've ever met you. They asked me if I would, if I would
accept, And I looked at it as an opportunity to
(29:40):
remind everybody I'm still here as opposed to I'm going away, you
know. 2 of the guys in the hip did the induction, which
was beautiful. My other group, The Pursuit of Happiness, performed 2
songs. I had my friends and family there, and it was it was
nice to be honored. It's nice to be recognized. And especially it was
done during Canadian Music Week at the Live Music Awards, which
(30:02):
were by people, managers, agents. People say, oh, it's just great to be
honored. And it's true. It's great to be honored.
When we come back, Jake and I delve into the day he found out that
a Canadian icon, a global icon, and even more
importantly his lifelong friend, Gord Downey, had passed away.
(30:24):
Hi. This is Tony Chapman. I'm a huge fan of the arts and a champion
for all RBC is doing to support the Canadian artist community. Take the
Toronto International Film Festival. This is the 17th year RBC
has been a sponsor. As a fan, you might have heard of the RBC House,
the go to venue for film industry parties. You might have found your way onto
the RBC Red Carpet Gallery, one of the most coveted spots for stargazing.
(30:46):
But what many of you might not know is what RBC is doing behind the
scenes to help emerging women film directors. State's intimate
cocktail fundraiser celebrating the world premieres of Elton John's Never Too
Late and Andrew Buccelli's Because I Believe, the TIFF Black Excellence
Brunch in partnership with Brand USA, and so much more. Culture,
community, and festivals, well, that matters to you, to me, and to
(31:07):
RBC.
30 years, relationships can get strained. We probably should have had
some therapy. I think at that point, we probably needed it. We knew there
were problems. There was anger and frustration and resentment, and
then Gore got his diagnosis.
(31:30):
It was Frank cancer and was incurable. The worst
of the worst. Memories, which used to be my forte, and
now I can't remember people's names and can't remember lyrics. What he's planning
to do next is nothing short of awe inspiring. We got together
and started to rehearse to write an end to our own story.
(31:58):
People came out and they showed their appreciation, gave Gord their love,
and it helped him.
And I swear as we progressed, he got better, and it was
unbelievable. And by the end of the tour, he felt like
old Gorn.
(32:24):
Multiple generations of Canadians decided that
to tragic people were our band. They will
define for generations to come the
music that exemplifies this country. You're listening to
Chatter That Matters with Tony Chapman presented by RBC.
Today, my special guest is Jake Gold. He's a friend. He's someone I've admired for
(32:46):
decades. He focuses on what matters most and that's music
and how it makes us feel. But of equal importance,
helping the artists that pursue their craft, find a way to
monetize it, so they can, in fact, sing for their supper.
Talk to me about Gord Downey and his passing.
(33:06):
That must have impacted you in a most profound
way. Well, it's interesting because that was during
the time where I wasn't working with the band, but we were still all
friends in that. And I I did go to a bunch of the
shows off the final tour, including the final one in Kingston. And I had
a chance to talk to Gord a few times during that.
(33:29):
He was being pretty protected because, you know, after each
show, there was physio and it was this. It was he had to do all
this stuff just to be able to do the next show, you know. And
they never played, they never played back to back. It
was always it was always a day off between the shows. But I
remember I was sitting at home. I got a text
(33:50):
from somebody that had heard before I got up in the morning. And I looked
at my phone, and there was this text. You know, turn on the TV, and
there's, you know, Trudeau crying about
it. And I realized, wow. This is, like, this
is something. And, Randy Lennox, who at the time
was running Bell Media, but we worked together when he was running
(34:11):
Universal, I messaged him. I said, what are you doing? He
goes, oh, I'm just sitting at Soho House. I got the bat booth. I don't
know. Kind of bummed out. What are you doing? I said, nothing. He goes, come
on over. And we just sat there for 7 hours reminiscing.
You know? It was a tough day for sure.
Lost a a lifelong friend. You know, even even after the
(34:33):
band and I split, I continued to work his solo stuff for 2
more records because he really wanted me involved in his life.
When I lived in New York, I lived in New York for 4 years from
98 to 2002. His mother-in-law rented my house,
which was 8 doors down the street from where he
lived. And so it was he was always in my house with his
(34:55):
wife and his kids even though I wasn't there. So we were we were
very close, and it was hard. It was hard just to see what he had
to go through. You know, when I'm watching the documentary, I'm
seeing stuff that none of us really knew because Mike included
home video footage of Gord when he was
going through that right up until he died. Well, talk to me about this
(35:17):
documentary because you you shared the trailer with me, and it just gave me
chills, the same kind of chills that you you talking about you and Randy at
the back booth. You've really dedicated a lot of time
and effort in the last couple of years to making sure that their legacy
continues. So in 2020, the guys who
were managing the band, who happened to be one of
(35:39):
them worked with me and one of them was my roommate for 4 years.
They decided they didn't wanna do it anymore. I had always thought, wow, there's so
much more we can do. And I also think the guys were in
mourning. You know, they were still pretty fractured.
I heard they quit. I sent the guys a letter. I said, you know, we
we need to talk. And we had a 3 hour Zoom meeting, and 2
(36:02):
days later, they went, yeah. Let's do this. So I immediately went to
work, finding old tapes, that they they
couldn't find these tapes for 2 years. I found them in 24 hours.
And I got great advice. A good friend of mine, is
the CEO of of Apple Corps, which is The Beatles.
So he basically does what I do, but he does it for The Beatles. And
(36:23):
I called him up. I said, I'm back. And he said I said,
what advice can you give me? He said, first, find out what you got,
then you'll know what to do with it. And then we knew Mike wanted to
make the doc, so he put together his template, Mike Downey,
Gord's brother, who's a documentary filmmaker. When we made
the deal with Amazon, and it was all timed. All you know, we've been
(36:45):
putting up boxsets and unreleased music and new singles and
everything else, but it was all the doc and the
book that's coming out and the box set for up to here that's coming out
this year was all timed around the 40th anniversary of the band.
This is the 40th year of the tragedy. They played their first gig in
in 1984. So we're now rolling everything out. The
(37:07):
doc's gonna premiere at at the Toronto International Film Festival on
September 5th. It's gonna come out on, Prime
worldwide sometime in September. The guys are now regretting.
They're like, we were retired. I'm like, not anymore.
How much is is Gord channeling this
through you? Is he there approving it in your mind? Is he
(37:30):
helping to shape Interestingly enough, you know, Pat Downey, Gord's younger
brother, and Mike and Gord's, widow,
they run the estate, but Mike and Pat are sort of the day to day
guys on it, And Pat more than anyone. So Pat sits in on
all the meetings. So Pat is Gord in the meetings.
So he's the one that holds all the Gord's notebooks at his
(37:53):
house. So in a lot of ways, there is Gord. Gord is there, You
know? And a lot of times, we'll say there'll be
decisions. There have been decisions where Pat has said, I don't know if Gord would
go for that. And the other guys would go, yeah. You're right. Yeah. We can't
do that. You know, where we've turned down the chance to put a song
in a TV commercial or something like that. And if it's not the right brand
(38:15):
or the right kind of thing, yeah, it's been turned down. So when
this is wrapped up, I mean, because there's so many things you're
putting out there now. I mean, from a guy that was, you know yeah. I
I don't know much about managing bands to now doing movie deals and
book deals and everything else. When this gets wrapped up, is that your
legacy, or is there what do you think is next for you? I have a
(38:35):
young guy in my office that, is my right hand guy, and he's
bringing in new acts, and I'm sort of guiding him. Who
knows? Maybe we'll break a new young act or something like that. I still have
people coming to me to work with them. I don't have an appetite necessarily
for starting with someone from this from the bottom, and my time
management is important as you know. You know, you have to look at
(38:58):
the value of your time. But the hip thing, it it's gonna go I don't
know if it's gonna wrap up. You know, we're working on a lot
of stuff that I can't really talk about right now, but there's a lot of
stuff that's gonna go for another 5, 10 years for sure, at
least. You know, I'm kinda tireless, and I don't know what else
I'd do if I wasn't doing this anyways. Like, I'd be bored.
(39:20):
I can't play tennis every day. I mean, I'd like to and I
probably could, but I'd still wanna work
because I don't see it as work. I'm the same way. I think the thing
I fear the most in life is retirement because I have no plans. I wouldn't
know. No. And and it's not even it's not even about the money, Tony. It's
it's never been about the money. Like, I've never been you know, it's
(39:41):
important to get the money. You have to pay your bills, you
know, those kinds of things. But I've never been motivated by money.
I've been motivated by do the right things, the money's gonna come. You know?
And that's always been sort of how we did things with the guys in the
hip. It's like so when I when I meet these young acts and they just
wanna be famous, I I'm kind of turned off by that.
(40:03):
Like, you know, tell me you wanna make great work. Tell me you wanna change
the world. Tell me you wanna make a difference. Then we got something to talk
about. But if you just wanna be famous, yeah, it's not really for me.
You know, Jake, I've talked to you over the years about coming on this show,
and I'm glad we timed it when we did because there's so
much happening. And I do believe sometimes in intervention. I think it was meant
(40:25):
to for this episode to come out as as the, show premieres. But I
always end with my 3 takeaways. And the first one I think that I really
admire about you is this sense of crawl,
walk, and then sprint. And the sense that it that it doesn't
have to happen overnight, and the people you've worked with and done your
best work are the people that really understand that it's better to
(40:47):
spend 4 nights in one town because word-of-mouth don't create
a vacuum. You gotta fill that. And just the fact that you take the time
where today everybody wants instant gratification. The second
one is this, all the things you packed in your knapsack, you just rolled off.
You know, I worked in carpet cleaning, then I learned how to sell on the
phone and stuff. And I always say to people, any situation you're in, even if
(41:09):
you don't like where you're in, there's always something to take away and put in
your knapsack and work on another day. But the most important thing
you shared, and I would say it'd be on my highlight reel, is this
is why we do it for that feeling. To open
your mind out there to realize there's gonna be times when you have
this feeling, cherish it, preserve it, yes, chase it for the
(41:31):
rest of your life, but never ever forget
what it felt like when you find yourself in that moment in
life where the compression of creativity and
intensity and feelings and emotions are all there and they
explode. So for all of that and more, my friend, it's just been a pleasure
to have you on Chatter That Matters. Well, thank you. And it's funny you talk
(41:52):
about the crawl then walk then sprint because this year
I had double knee replacement surgery, and I literally have gone
from crawl to walk to sprint.
If you're a fan of the show, you'd know that my guest has appeared on
several occasions. He's Mark Thomas. He's the senior director of brand marketing at
(42:14):
RBC. He's got his hand on the rudder with everything to do
with Toronto International Film Festival. Mark, welcome back to chat of the
matters. Thanks, Tony. Thanks for having me. This has been a partnership that RBC has
been involved with for many years. I guess the real the first
question is why, and, why does it matter so much to your
organization? RBC this year will be our 17th year as the
(42:36):
official, bank sponsor of TIFF. We're incredibly proud
of that. We genuinely believe that the
arts are essential to building vibrant and
prosperous communities. I think all of us at RBC are just proud
to support such a vital, important
cultural event, one that celebrates ideas, diversity,
(42:58):
and nurtures emerging Canadian talent from all backgrounds. I'm
curious because a lot of people really don't understand the dynamics of
marketing. And your RBC is involved with TIFF, the Olympics,
PGA Golf. They're bringing Taylor Swift to Canada.
How do you prioritize all of that and make sure that the consumer
gets a consistent message, that they really understand sort of
(43:21):
that song sheet that you're singing from when you're talking RBC? Beyond our
belief that supporting, the arts is essential
for community, for society. More broadly, what we're trying to do is
support the things that our communities care about and that our clients care about. And
so, you know, when you list some of the things that we're involved in, TIFF,
you know, we just we marvel at how not only the film community, but the
(43:44):
general population comes to life during the festival. It's such
a unique mix of filmmakers, both emerging and established,
stars, fans, and the entire community coming together to support
something important, art and film. There's a passion there.
Candidly, we find it energizing to be part of something that generates such
passion. You know, a lot of cities are struggling, and a lot of
(44:07):
festivals are struggling to to stay vibrant, to
stay alive in these tough economic times. How important is it as
a society that we put our collective consciousness towards
having these things that sort of focus on positivity and possibility?
One of the ways that we can make our way through this complex world, one
of the ways in which we can bring some positivity to people's lives
(44:29):
is by all of us opening up our hearts,
to hearing about each other's stories, each other's perspectives,
truly listening to how we're all trying to get through this very complex world and
the, you know, the diverse background experiences that we all come from. And I
think film is one of the most important and impactful mediums
to do so, Even to play a small role in all of
(44:51):
that is why we continue to partner with TIFF. And I think why we're so
proud, of our collective efforts year over year in and around
the festival. A couple of the themes that you've talked about, diversity,
talent, emerging filmmakers. What can we expect this year
from RBC and TIFF that's gonna, put a smile on my
face and I hope millions of other Canadians? This year, we're exceptionally
(45:13):
excited about some of the things that we've got going on. Many of
the tried and true festival's favorite activations and events will
return. All of it is designed to enhance that festival experience
for talent, fans, creatives, and clients. A few of the
things that, you know, you can expect to see out there, RBC House will be
back for its 6th festival season, and that continues to be the
(45:36):
go to venue for film and industry parties. And
we'll once again host several noteworthy events for emerging and
established talent filmmakers. Also returning is the RBC red carpet
gallery, which is one of the most coveted spots for celebrity spotting during during
TIFF, which is, I know something that the fans genuinely care about. To
champion programming that's focused on nurturing diverse and emerging Canadian
(45:58):
talent, we're proud to co present the 2nd annual TIFF Black
Excellence Brunch in in partnership with Brand USA. It's an event that
supports black creatives while providing meaningful networking opportunities
and a panel discussion with industry experts. We're also
supporting events throughout the the festival that are benefiting
the TIFF Every Story Fund through intimate cocktail fundraisers
(46:21):
celebrating the world premieres of Elton John Never
Too Late and Andrea Bocelli because I believe. Both
events are going to be incredibly special. I think they're gonna be highly talked about
and I think they're gonna be something that people care about And all of that
goes towards giving back to the communities at large. Mark Thomas, always
a pleasure to have you on my show, my friend, and, just continue to
(46:42):
congratulations for everything you're doing for the arts, for
emerging artists, and putting the smile on the faces of Canadians
that so desperately need to smile nowadays. So thank you for joining me in Chatter
That Matters. Thanks, Tony. Truly is, our pleasure. Chatter That
Matters has been a presentation of RBC. It's Tony
Chapman. Thanks for listening, and let's chat soon.
Popular Podcasts
Are You A Charlotte?
In 1997, actress Kristin Davis’ life was forever changed when she took on the role of Charlotte York in Sex and the City. As we watched Carrie, Samantha, Miranda and Charlotte navigate relationships in NYC, the show helped push once unacceptable conversation topics out of the shadows and altered the narrative around women and sex. We all saw ourselves in them as they searched for fulfillment in life, sex and friendships. Now, Kristin Davis wants to connect with you, the fans, and share untold stories and all the behind the scenes. Together, with Kristin and special guests, what will begin with Sex and the City will evolve into talks about themes that are still so relevant today. "Are you a Charlotte?" is much more than just rewatching this beloved show, it brings the past and the present together as we talk with heart, humor and of course some optimism.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com