November 10, 2025 • 42 mins
This week, we catch up with WB Ricardo Rosado to discuss his incredible 86-day, 1500-mile pilgrimage along the Camino de Santiago. Bro. Rosado shares the motivations behind this profound journey of self-discovery and spiritual renewal. From the physical challenges of the long walk to the moments of quiet contemplation and the bonds of fellowship formed with fellow pilgrims, this is a story of perseverance, reflection, and the timeless quest for light.
Show notes:
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Show notes:
- Read WB Rosado's blog post on his journey on Craftsmen Online
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The Commons. Opinions and views shared during this program are
of those individual Freemasons and do not reflect the official
position of a Grand Launch Concordant Body, a pendant Body,
Asonic Authority, or Craftsman online dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Hey, welcome back to the Graftsman Online Podcast, the only
Masonic podcast endorsed by the Grand Bogs of New York.
I'm your host, right worshipro Brother Michael Arse a cool
Veterans Day special edition as we actually are going to
be featuring a former US Marine and veteran as our
guest for this week's episode. Before we get into it,
let me catch you up on things here. We are
ever so close to heading our goal of twenty new
(00:50):
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(01:11):
Craftsman Online on Patreon. I immediately start thinking of the song
that was very popular when I was in high school.
I would walk five thousand miles. It was close. He
was about four thousand miles short, but hey, who's counting
when you're tracking almost fifteen hundred to an incredible goal.
And that is the story this week with our guest,
(01:32):
worshipful brother Ricardo Rosado. Welcome back to the Craftsman Online podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Thank you for having me. Brother.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Here's how long ago it was when you first visited
the podcast. I believe you were the junior warden of
your launch, maybe senior deacon. This is a couple of
years back, like maybe three years back.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
So yeah, I was. I was the I believe senior master.
Ceremony is the last time I did it? Wow, okay,
And the first time I did it, I was a
fellowcraft Look at that.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Yeah, yep, I do remember when we did Yeah, jeez,
i'm dating myself here now, Harlem help fighters. I remember
that that was a really really cool conversation. Well, for
this episode, we're going to be sitting down to talk
about standing up. I've heard guys say hey, I'm gonna
go for a walk. I've never known anybody that goes
for an eighty six day, five hundred mile walk. When
(02:22):
I got the outline and the final product for your
blog for Craftsman Online and was reading this, I was like, Hey,
I know this guy, but wow, this sounds crazy. What
inspired you to do this?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Worship another crazy brother? So I went. I went to France.
I had a trip to Paris back in twenty twenty two,
and our good brother, right Worshipful Stenric Adams, who's a
brother in our lodge, we were doing a brother bring
a Friend night and he happened to mention he has
to send the package to Paris, and I was like,
(02:55):
I'm going in three weeks. I don't mind delivering it.
So is the brother that he and coordinated. Wound up
meeting up with the brother brothers Gerald Ure. He's actually
a New York Mason, entered pass and raised in Chicamago Lodge.
He was French. He was out here for work. Great brother.
He took me and my lady out and that was
(03:16):
the first time I ever heard of the Comino the Santiago.
So he said he was a pilgrim and I didn't
know anything about it. I thought the only pilgrimage was
the Hodge. So I said, oh, I didn't, are you Muslim?
So he said no. So he was telling me about
pilgrimages in general, and then he spoke about it.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
When people would say pilgrim around me, I would think Thanksgiving,
wouldn't for those not familiar with Camino de Santiago. What
is so special about that place?
Speaker 3 (03:43):
So, Santiago de Compostela is believed to be where the
bones of Saint James the Greater, the brother of John
the Evangelist, one of the Twelve Disciples, are laid to us.
When you get there and you get to the cathedral
there you can do the tour and there's a silver
(04:04):
silver box that you can see off behind the gate
that are believed to be his remains. However, recently it's
begun to get more popular. There was a movie called
The Way starring Emilio Estevez and Martin Sheen that came
out about the Camino, and I know a few celebrities
(04:24):
have since, but it is very ancient pilgrimage. When brother
Bret told me about it, I walked. He had walked
the road four times. He did all four major roads
in France, so starting in Paris and going and I
walked away from that conversation thinking he's crazy, and now
(04:44):
I am counted among the crazy having done it.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
I do want to jump into that because as a
former marine, you might be more familiar with this phrase,
because I'm just thinking about the end of it, where
they it's it's not about the something something something, it's
about the journey or it's a the mission.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
I can't remember how.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
It goes, so yes, of course it's about getting to
go to this holy place and seeing this amazing site,
but it's also about the five hundred mile trip that
you're taking. And for those trying to relate to what
this must feel like like, the closest I can get
to is whenever I go for a run, like a
(05:21):
long run, like a six mile run, I'm by myself,
but I usually have headphones and I'm running. The other
time it will make me think, Like the first car
that I had when I was in high school didn't
have a radio, so I would have to drive around
just listening to the music in my head. What is
it like when you have eighty six days all by yourself?
Speaker 3 (05:38):
Actually, the only time I was by myself the entire time,
definitely the first ten days completely by myself at night,
I would stay with someone, but like walking during the
day and small slight correction, it's actually fifteen hundred miles,
not five hundred.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
That's a that's a big difference, dude. That's okay, we'll
make sure that gets updated. Wow, fifteen hundred miles, that's
like halfway across the United States. Like for people that
are trying to think, it's like if you left New York, now,
by the time you get to Iowa, that's how far
you walk.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
That's amazing. And there were people who had longer start
points than I did. I met a pilgrim, the first
pilgrim I began walking with. I met him in vessel.
I'll mention it. I'll talk more about that later. But
he started in the north of Germany, like right by
the North Sea. And so when I was hitting my
(06:34):
one month mark, he was hitting his three month mark,
and he was taking a longer route than the one
I well.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
That we got to talk about that too. Eighty six
days that's almost three months. So how do you carve
that amount of time out of your life to be
able to go do this thing?
Speaker 3 (06:52):
I had no clue how I was going to do it. Fortunately,
right now I'm concentrating on I'm doing school full time,
so I'm in my master's and using the Gibo. It
gives me a little bit of flexibility where I don't
have to maintain a job as well. So I just
did not take classes for the summer. I usually spend
that time with my daughters, and they had already been
(07:13):
expressing that they wanted to spend the summer at home
with their friends. So I spoke with them before I
decided to do this, and they were like, yeah, go ahead.
I know. They were just like I want to stay
and hang out with my friends.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
You get the idea from a brother, you go to dinner,
he talks about the idea of the pilgrimage. You start
getting the concept of what this journey is all about.
You sign up for it. You're like, okay, I'm doing
eighty six days. I'm buying the airline ticket, I'm making
all the travel accommodations that i need to do. What
I loved about getting your blog article on Craftsmen Online
(07:47):
and reading it was, you know, as a former marine,
you talk about having that marine mindset at lodou tell
me about that moment, like once the boots hit the
ground and the walking started. What was going through your mind?
Then orienting myself. It was kind of using that what
we call him the military, that Dulo observe, orient the side,
and act. So I started at the cathedral Notre Dame,
(08:11):
and you know that was the start point. But now
I have to begin.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
I had my my guidebook that he provided me, brother
Bearay provided me, and now I'm looking for literally the signs,
so they have different signs along the way that'll mark
that you're on the right path and not a different path.
So now I begin between the guidebook and just kind
of trying to orient myself. I flew in early in
(08:39):
the morning on a Saturday, and I knew I had
to try and get I was staying at a gentleman's home,
and so I knew I wanted to get there at
a reasonable hour. I had already coordinated with him, and
so I'm just like, okay, let me, let me not
waste time. I had about fourteen miles that first day
that I had to walk, so it was just trying
(09:03):
trying to make sure I'm going the right way. My
pack was ready, I had overpacked, but it's at first
it's just okay, let me start walking, let me start
getting there. I slowed myself down. I stopped to take
a couple of pictures of some some of the sites.
(09:25):
I have a little GoPro on my chest that, you know,
I would record videos to send to my daughters or
just to kind of keep that log. But it was
let me, let me start going. I was more mission
focused in the beginning, where it's like I had to
get to this waypoint. That waypoint was Monton, I believe
(09:46):
was the name of the town that I was going to.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
Here's what's fascinating is most people when they go on
a trip or like a vacation, it's like, Okay, we're
gonna get here. We'll stay here, we'll get apple, have
a meal, there's some sites, some sounds. We'll maybe hang out,
take a nap, do this. You're waking up in the
morning and going like, okay, I got a log fourteen
miles today. I got to make sure I got enough
water to drink. Where's the sun? Where's my gear? You're
(10:09):
talking to yourself in your head. You know that you
need to get to the next point. Was there ever
a moment where you're like, Okay, you know what I
don't have to do all of this. Maybe I could
just jump on a bus or take a taxi or
like ride a bike or maybe a horse or a
donkey just to get a little further. To spare myself
this trial the entire time, I actually have to trick
(10:29):
myself to get on this. I found myself in the
planning phase, kind of putting it off.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
I had set a date. Originally I was like, well,
maybe next year won't work, I might do it another
and I was like, okay, So what I did was
I bought a one way non refundable ticket to Paris,
and I bought a one way, non refundable ticket from Madrid.
So I had the option to either lose that money
or make the Camino the whole way. There came several
(10:58):
points where I'm just like, nobody would know. I could
just get in a cab. But that's kind of like
that internal struggle because then this is like, well then
why did I come out here? Why did I, you know,
sacrifice the money, sacrifice the time, And it's just like
I'm not gonna I'm not gonna quit, Like I just
(11:19):
gotta let me go to this, let me see how
I feel. Let me go here. You know, especially those
early days. Your body, I had to relearn how to
just walk, like just just walking that much, ensuring that
I'm taking breaks, ensuring that I'm drinking enough as I'm going,
and just you know, I'm stretched out. I finally figured
(11:42):
out what people mean when they said they have tight hips.
I never experienced that before.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
I'm guessing you didn't train for this, or did you
have any kind of training for your body or even
for your mind.
Speaker 3 (12:20):
Brothers, You're all was amazing and sending me like a
great guide on how to get ready, what I needed
to down from like the socks and underwear you should
be wearing, to how to pack, and like exercise. He
sent all of that. I did maybe a quarter of it.
(12:43):
I was there. I was just like, I'm a marine.
I'm just gonna be walking. I could go at a
slow pace. I was like, I've done this before, forgetting
that it's been ten years since I got out of
the Marine Corps. So I was. I did not train
as I went on a few hikes with my dad.
We started going for some walks here in Westchester. Found
(13:07):
a couple of trails, but not as many as I
should I.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
Think we covered the physical part because that's where everybody
would be like, now that we know, fifteen hundred miles,
eighty six days, no thanks, I'll just look at the
video or watch the pictures like I'm good. But what
would be a typical day like for you on a
trip like run us through? Like waking up in the morning, lunchtime, breaks,
(13:33):
when would you go to bed? What was your routine?
Speaker 3 (13:36):
So it shifted. There were two basic routines. In the beginning.
There was a routine with just myself. Those first few days,
I was staying in either people's homes convent I stayed
in a monastery. So because of that, you know, I
would wake up at an early hour, prep everything, get ready,
(14:00):
and then I would usually have If I was staying
in someone's home, I would have breakfast with the family.
Whoever I was staying with, I would usually have breakfast
with them. So probably around eight thirty nine o'clock I
would start on my way. In the beginning, when it
was just me by myself, I probably wouldn't take a
break until about two in the afternoon, unless it was
(14:21):
like a stop, put my pack down, stretch out a
little bit, or stop and see something that was in
the guidebook that I thought might be interesting, but it
was a lot more of just the walking and again
trying to make sure I'm seeing all the signs along
the way, to ensure I'm going the right way. Once
I fell in with other pilgrims again, there was the
(14:45):
German pilgrim Voker. I walked with him for a little bit.
Then it was at one point me and three other
German pilgrim and you know, so we would walk together.
We'd probably stop and get coffee or breakfast in the morning,
make a stop maybe around eleven o'clock, sit down, have
(15:05):
another coffee somewhere, and just keep walking. We probably get
into whatever town we were getting five six pm, you know,
seven latest, if we had an extra long walk that day,
and either have dinner with the family that we're staying with,
if we were staying in someone's home, or just stopping.
(15:25):
A lot of the restaurants had little pilgrim menus, so
it would be like the prefix that like Applebee's only
way cheaper and way better food.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
How much weight did you lose on this trip? I'm
just curious.
Speaker 3 (15:39):
We us thirty two pounds.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
Damn yeah, because you're probably not drinking any soda. It's
just water, water, water, a lot of protein, a lot
of greens.
Speaker 3 (15:48):
Water and wine. Europe is amazing in that. I mean,
the prefixed menus usually came with you know, so you
had the salad, the main, and then the dessert, so
you were having like some sweets. You were eating like
regular meals. But then they also come with a drink
usually and it's usually a wine. And if it's up
(16:10):
to three people, you get the entire bottle. So if
I was the only one having a wine, then I
just had the bottle of wine. So water during the day.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Magically nothing hurts the next day. Yeah, I'm just making
a note to myself, like, Okay, if I ever have
a summer that's free and I want to lose thirty pounds,
but I gotta walk eighty for eighty six days, fifteen
hundred miles, I might give this a shot. But no, seriously,
I want to give you time to think about memorable
moments because looking at your blog and seeing the pictures
(16:46):
that you shared with us, and you shared a lot
more than we were able to get up at crassmanonline
dot com. I mean, I know that we're going to
talk about the lodge presentation that you've built around this,
and how you talk to brothers about it, and some
of the Masonic connections over there. But I want you
to tak think about those moments that are in your
head that one hundred years from now, if we get
(17:07):
to live that long and you know, you're sitting there
and you're on your deathbed and this is these are
the little things that you're going to be thinking about
that you weren't able to take a picture of physically,
but in your mind it's there mentally, or maybe it's
the people or some of the encounters that you had
along the way. Can you tell me about a few
of those little gems.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
Yeah, definitely, so immediately. And what comes to mind is
my first day of rest. I only took one day
of rest in the first eighty In the first eighty
one days, I only took one day of rest. Every
other day I walked. But it was in a town
called Vessel that I have mentioned earlier. I met some pilgrims.
(17:49):
This was the first night that I stayed with pilgrims,
and I just happened to be getting there. It was
the first day of the summer Sostice and the way
the basilica is set up, it's during the summer solstice
from the beginning until Saint John's Day June twenty fourth,
A path of light was shining in at one o'clock
(18:11):
in the afternoon, going down the center of the the
basilica all the way to the Eucharist in the in
the nave. So it was I had no plans to stop.
One of the pilgrims was like, oh, you got to
see it, so once in a lifetime thing, you're here,
So I decided to stay in extra day. That was
(18:31):
amazing to see in itself, and just seeing how the
basilica was made. But I remember that evening I went
in to pray and not used to going in in old,
old cathedrals and basilica is, but I remember I went
into the U in the evening to the basilica and
(18:54):
the monks I believe they might have been Franciscan friars,
but it's escaping right now. They began singing their nightly
hymns and just hearing the way their voices reverberated, I
had I'm getting goosebumps on my skin right now just
thinking about that, and it just moved me so profoundly.
(19:16):
Just hearing that gave me a very different perspective on
the mellowing tides of old cathedral airs vibrating through aisles
and arches, you know, just that bit of it. So
that was definitely the first, extremely impactful. The people along
the way, the pilgrims that I met along the way.
(19:38):
You meet so many people and hear so many stories
of people that you maybe don't even see later on
down the camino, like you'll see them for a little bit,
you'll walk with them for a little bit, and then
you just part ways. But the stories that I felt
were the stories I to hear with the people who
(20:02):
sold everything and were just figuring out life on the camino.
They just got rid of everything that they had and
they were starting over and the Camino was their their
first step. But you they'd still exchange stories. Like a
lot of times, people will speak to you as if
they know you forever. And I love to hear the
(20:25):
stories of the pilgrims who they sold everything, they quit
their job, They you know, have nothing but what they
have on their back and they're just going to figure
out life. I met a few. I met one he
was he was a veteran and he was out in
(20:47):
Hawaii and he just sold everything. I see him still
on Instagram right now. He's all around. Young French lady,
same thing. She left a very lucrative job, sold and
you know, I still follow them on social media and
to see that. I think as far as the Pilgrims,
(21:07):
and then the Italian Pilgrims were my favorite because they're
just so full of life. They're loud, they laugh, and
they're gonna make sure you're fed. But just walking into
the square, yes, walking into that square that last day,
and like having that moment with them in you know,
(21:28):
in the plaza in front of that cathedral. I would
go back before my train to Madrid, and like I
after I had done the older pilgrimage to Festare and
I came back to Santiago, I would go back, especially
in the early hours, to the plaza and just watch
people have their first moment and just you know, be
(21:51):
off in the side and just remember what that was
like for me and just enjoy seeing them have that moment,
everything from breaking down trying to you know, just cries
of triumph. Yeah, and a lot of U.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
I imagine, well, if our listeners like, Hey, I'd love
to read this story. You can go to our website
craftsman online dot com in the blog section, it's the
only one that says Camino de Santiago Pilgrimage, and that's
the story of worshipful Brother Ricardo Rosado. You can also
get the link for to the blog article in the
notes for this episode if you're listening on Spotify and
(22:30):
Apple podcasts. It's interesting when you were talking about this,
and I really appreciate you talking about those memorable moments,
those little gems, because you know what I'm saying, like,
it's it's hard to capture those with the camera, even
a video camera. You know, it's one of those things
you have to be there to experience, which is to
me it sounded like part spiritual, you know, getting to
go into a church and really having that inner reflective
(22:53):
time to figure out who you were. Plus you know,
there must have been some times where you felt like
somebody that was living back in biblical times because you're walking,
you're not taking a shower. It was funny to see
her before picture and at the end you almost had
the full Jesus beard going on there anyways, kind of
look like a disciple. There were probably nights where you
(23:14):
maybe it smelt like you had slept near a manger
and a barn, you know, just from the long days
of walking, but also the brotherhood that you were sharing
with the other travelers and the stories. And I think
that's a great place to kind of get into the
Masonic angle here. Did you get a chance to meet
other Masons on your travels worship?
Speaker 3 (23:33):
So I met one that I know of, And it's
very interesting because in Europe a lot of Masons they
will not wear Masonic rings or anything. This one was
a gift. So I wear this one all the time.
And you know, so I was just wearing it and
I met the it's the same pilgrim who convinced me
(23:55):
to stay in Vesle, and he's like, you know, oh,
he said something to the effect of, you know, you
have this big ring. You know, tell me about you.
He's like, he's like, I know who you are, I
know you're all and so he knew brothers you're all
(24:17):
and so.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
Oh, okay, yes, I've never heard that expression before, if
identifying yourself as a Mason.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
So he knew brothers, you're all. And I guess they
had spoke and he was like, be on the lookout
in case you run into this American, this American pilgrim.
He's also a brother, so he was the one. He
kind of he convinced me to stay in Beslet, and
I fell in with him and his group. It was
a German couple, you know, French French lady and the
(24:51):
other gentleman. He might have been French as well, but
they were my first crew walking together, and you know,
just as far as we spoke a little bit about
the craft. But he had done other little pilgrimages. So
he was going to to Lord was it Lord or No?
(25:16):
He was going and uh, he was going to Nice
to see uh Saint Catherine. I believe that's interred there.
So he was doing a different pilgrimage. He wasn't going
all the way to Santiago, but it was we were.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
So there's a certain point I'm guessing where your paths
kind of diverged. You went one way, he went the
other way, and I was like, so long brother, and
it's a long friend.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
And and then they remerged. So I met him back
along the way shortly before I got to Nice and
and yeah, so it was good because it was like again,
it was like meeting old friends that you'd known for years.
And I spent three days with him before In the
morning after, he gave me very good advice in regards
(26:04):
to just the pilgrimage, a little bit on masonry and
just life in general. I think it was just you know,
he was the second after Brother Gerald. He was the
second pilgrim to really take me as a little mentee
and just kind of give me some guidance on it. So,
Brother Pierre, I still I still text him. I wouldn't
(26:29):
say regularly, but I still check in on him. And
uh so when I ascended.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
The hopefully you share this episode with him.
Speaker 3 (26:35):
So yes, yes, And Brother Gerald, is.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
There anything you want to say to him while he's listening?
Speaker 3 (26:40):
Now? Thank you, just thank you. I've said it all before,
but great brother. He he invited me and all American
New York Masons out to France. He did invite me out.
So any brother who wants to go out there, he said,
they're always welcome.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
I'll be happy to go by plane and then a
car and I'll walk to the front door of the large.
(27:30):
While you're talking about this, I'm thinking, you know, we
talk about our Masonic journey, and there's a lot of
steps as we go through our degrees and framemasonry, and
there's a lot of personal development that happens, and growth
and introspection and reflection as you look out at life.
But nothing like spending eighty six days and a lot
(27:51):
of the time with yourself and you in your own thoughts.
What's the thing that when you're sitting there and you're
thinking about in your life, like I grew so much
as a person in this way because of this journey,
this experience.
Speaker 3 (28:06):
It's it's humbling, it's humbling to the utmost. You are
putting yourself. I don't speak French, my Spanish. I can,
it's possible, but I'm definitely not fluent. You're putting yourself
really at the the at the how do I put it?
(28:30):
The mercy, right, the mercy, but more the charity of
other people to open up their homes. It's different when
you're staying in the pilgrim refuge, oring the hostel, because
that's a transactional, you know. But just even in the
convent that I stayed in in the monastery, you know,
(28:51):
these religious brothers and sisters, you know they're opening up
their space to you, it's it's it does change who
you are. Earlier you had said, how do you carve
out eighty six days? And that was one of the
things I was wondering. And at the end I came
back and the world I thought like, there were so
(29:11):
many things I was dropping, and you know, I was
responsible for X, Y, and Z, and then the world
just kept going and I came back and they were like, oh, hey,
you're back.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
Yeah, three months in the summertime. There's a lot of
stuff that's always going on in the US, whether politically
or socially or you know, just in pop culture, and
people like, oh, don't you feel like you missed out
on it? And You're like no, because I had such
a much better and different experience. I literally unplugged from
all of this madness and it got to spend some
time with myself. I kind of became my own best
(29:44):
friend during that three month span.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
And to a degree, I wasn't missed. Like to a degree,
it was like, you know, there was one young man.
I met, one young man seventeen years old, and this
took me back so part of the history of the
pilgrimage as it used to be an indulgence as a
penance for people who had committed certain sins for forgiveness. Right, Well,
(30:11):
I met a young man. He was there from Morocco
and he was there with his boss. So they were,
you know, talking around it. They were excited. I was
kind of a mini celebrity, being an American let alone
from New York on the caminos, so they had heard
about me. But we were talking. He had gotten in
(30:32):
some trouble, I don't know what, but his sentence was essentially,
you can either go to jail or you can go
on this pilgrimage in the care of someone who's going
to take responsibility for you. And his supervisor vouched and
was walking the comino with him, and I understand at
(30:53):
the end of it why that would be a sentence
to carry out instead of going to jail, because there's
probably more reform that you'll get on that.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
So, well, it's fascinating to me to hear you talk
about this, and you mentioned like mercy and charity and
just the kindness and goodwill of the people that were
on this trail that knew that these passengers were going
to be going along, and as you talked about like
this is an ancient trial that's still possible to do
today in the world that we live in that's highly overconnected,
(31:29):
it's supercharged, it's extremely divisive, and yet there's still people
who are willing to open their homes and their hearts
to some stranger that barely speaks the language, and that
you're still able to And I can imagine, I'm in
my head thinking he's probably walking up with just a
couple of euros in his pocket. That are you know, changed,
that's jingling, and you know, getting the money out there
(31:51):
for a quick meal and some some water, and then
you know, moving onto the kindness of someone that's opening
their house or their monastery or their church so that
you have a bed to sleep in at night. It's
crazy to think about that, that if you tried to
do that to some extent in this country, in the
United States, that would not be possible today.
Speaker 3 (32:09):
They always asked, what's the American equivalent of the Camino,
And I said, the closest you can get is maybe
the Appalachian Trail, the Pacific Crush Trail, like one of those.
I was like, but even then, it's more to what
you were alluding to earlier, where those are more solitary
(32:30):
where especially because there are many roads that you can take.
The one I took, the Camino Francis, it's the French road,
so it's one it's the most popular, more than most
likely the road that Charlemagne took. It's you know, it's
(32:51):
the most storied one. But that road it's very communal,
whereas if you maybe take the Comino No going along
the north skirting the Mediterranean, that's maybe less. So you know,
the the Via portu Guest going up from Lisbon or Porto,
(33:13):
you know, it may take you thirty days or two weeks,
but it's a lot more mountains, better views. So there's
so many different and especially in Spain, there's a better infrastructure,
like they're used to pilgrims. They have more hostels and
places that you can stay, and you know, you could
pay with credit card most places, because that's part of
(33:34):
their business. But especially in the beginning going from Paris,
you know, it was definitely you know some some some
towns only took cash and you may not have had cash,
and now you're trying to figure it out, and you know,
one gentleman, I remember he I was the day I
(33:55):
was in Veslee I had to try and get a
little my SIM recharged because I would call my daughters
like once a week on weekends, or I would need
it to map where I'm going the next day, just
to make sure I'm on the right path. After my
first guidebook ran out, and this gentleman I was walking
(34:15):
in the rain, he just stopped. His name was Bernard.
He just stopped. He drove me into the closest town,
drove me to another town, drove me by his house.
He told me, oh, you're walking, you'll pass by my
house tomorrow, and then drove me all the way back
to resulate where I was staying and didn't didn't wouldn't
(34:39):
accept money, you know, he was just we figured it
out through the language barrier, you know. And it was
just like those those little acts of charity and just
people I don't I don't even know where I'm going,
just walking into the town because somebody said, hey, it
might need that way, and he was like, no, we'll
figure it out. Hey try here. No they didn't. All right,
(35:00):
I'll take you over there. He must have spent three
hours with me on a day that I don't know
what he was doing.
Speaker 2 (35:07):
So it's one of the things that I was getting
your blog up on the Craftsman Online website. I reached
out to you. I was like, I want to see
your lodge program about this experience. What is the theme?
How do you present this to your lodge?
Speaker 3 (35:21):
Brothers I was actually do it. I was trying to
think of what was what was that golden thread that
went through all of it. There's so many things, but
again a fifteen hundred mile journey, trying to distill it
in something that is going to be fitting for a
lodge meeting. And I kind of was just thinking about
(35:44):
it going through some of the journal notes and voice
notes that I took, and I found throughout the way,
I found myself divesting myself of something. Well. Day two,
I stopped in Brothers Gerald's town and he helped me
to lighten my pack and literally, hey, you don't need this,
(36:05):
you don't need this. He gave me my pilgrim staff
that you see me with. I had it there, made
from a walnut tree. You know. Along the way, as
I was mentally in my head just still wondering how
all the things that I was leaving behind were coming along,
you know, I learned to let just let go of
those thoughts and be present in the moment. And remember
(36:29):
I was when it kind of really hit me. I
was coming onto a crest and I looked in my
guidebook and it said this is an ancient Roman road
that the legions used to walk, and I just see
it and there's a small little stone marking it, and
I'm just like, this is literally a history I'm walking on.
(36:49):
And then, you know, towards the end, especially you know,
stopping it, I would I would try my best to
stop and say a little, you know, prayer of thanks,
prayer for strength to continue on in the cathedrals or
the churches of the towns. And you know, I felt
(37:10):
compelled a couple of times to call a couple of
people that I hadn't talked to in a while, and
maybe we ended on a bad note, you know, kind
of just let go of some grudges towards others, towards myself.
It was just like that idea of divesting yourself and
little by little letting go until nice you're learning who
you are now. You know, there's a very death and
(37:33):
rebirth idea of it, where you're slowly dying along the
way and you come back someone different.
Speaker 2 (37:39):
One of your paragraphs in your blog that really spoke
to me and I want to share it with our
listener is in the end, the Camino is not just
a trail across the continent. It's a path carved through
the heart. It teaches you how to carry less, worry less,
and love more. It teaches you how to divest yourself
of everything that keeps you from becoming who you truly are.
(38:00):
And you just spoke to that. But those were the
words that you wrote, and those when you talked about
goosebumps earlier, like that got my attention. I'm like, I
may want to do something like this someday. May maybe
someday for you though worship. So that's how it started
with That's how it started with me. I didn't have
(38:20):
a committal. I did not.
Speaker 3 (38:22):
I emailed the brother and I said I may one
day email you because I'm thinking about walking this path,
and he immediately sent me this is how you get right.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Yeah, okay, may maybe in my mind, but for you, you've
done it. And you know, I thank you so much
for coming on and sharing this story. I'll get you
out of here on this one because you know, and
I ran my first five k, They're like, oh, are
you going to run a ten k? I was like, okay, sure,
are you going to do a half marathon? Hell no,
(38:53):
that's crazy. I'm just going to stop right here. Why
does everybody keep pushing you to the next thing? So
forgive me France in this question, but you've taken in
this huge physical, spiritual personal journey. What's next for you?
What's the next goal? Did you have set for yourself?
Speaker 3 (39:09):
What do you want to do? So, in regards everybody,
this is the question everybody asked. So I feel you
on that. I've always said this was something that I
never planned to do and I very much felt called
to do. So I think if I'm ever gonna do
something like this again, it will be under two conditions.
(39:30):
One I feel called to another one like there's something
going on and there are different roads. There's one in Italy,
there's one to Mont Saint Michel and Normandy. There are
ones throughout Scotland and England. So there are many places
that you can go. Then there's also I would go back,
(39:51):
I believe on the Camuno that Santiago if someone I
knew wanted to go and they wanted me to go
as a guy. I read the What really threw me
that I felt called. I read Paul looko ELO's book
The Pilgrimage, and I wasn't thinking about like, I just
picked it up off the shelf. I think it actually
might be behind me somewhere, yeah, right here. So I
(40:16):
wasn't thinking about it. I just had this box set
and had to read it. But in there he's speaking
way more mystical. But one of the things with the
order that he speaks about in his book was you
go on this with the implicit agreement that when you
get called on to go back as a guy, you go.
(40:37):
And that always stuck with me, and it very much
was in line with the Marine Corps as well, and
even with masonry, because it's like you kind of take
what you know and you helped to bring the next
person up along. So I've always said if my daughters
or someone that I know, if they wanted to go,
I would go as their guide if they wanted me.
(40:59):
And you know, other than that, I would have to
feel called in the same way I felt called this time,
where it's like I know something's nudging me to go.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
Just a fascinating story, and if you want to read
his blog posts on the Craftsman Online Podcast. You'll find
that in the notes for this episode, as well as
the link to join us on Patreon. Yeah please, we're
so close to hitting that twenty subscriber goal before we
close out the year, and we thank you in advance.
I'm right worship for brother Michael arse.
Speaker 3 (41:33):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
We have our holiday shopping special coming up on Cyber Monday.
That's gonna be a lot of fun with Matthew Brockbank.
Until then, at peace and harmony prevail
Speaker 1 (42:00):
M
The Commons. Opinions and views shared during this program are
of those individual Freemasons and do not reflect the official
position of a Grand Launch Concordant Body, a pendant Body,
Asonic Authority, or Craftsman online dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Hey, welcome back to the Graftsman Online Podcast, the only
Masonic podcast endorsed by the Grand Bogs of New York.
I'm your host, right worshipro Brother Michael Arse a cool
Veterans Day special edition as we actually are going to
be featuring a former US Marine and veteran as our
guest for this week's episode. Before we get into it,
let me catch you up on things here. We are
ever so close to heading our goal of twenty new
(00:50):
subscribers on Patreon. You can get the link in the
notes for this episode. You get a seven day free
trial on us figure out. Hey if this is a
good fit. What's inside? Had free episodes? Yeah, no more
annoying commercials. Plus you get access to our full catalog
of all the subscriber extra that's the bonus time we
get with some of our select guests. Try it out
for yourself. See it's a good fit and help support
(01:11):
Craftsman Online on Patreon. I immediately start thinking of the song
that was very popular when I was in high school.
I would walk five thousand miles. It was close. He
was about four thousand miles short, but hey, who's counting
when you're tracking almost fifteen hundred to an incredible goal.
And that is the story this week with our guest,
(01:32):
worshipful brother Ricardo Rosado. Welcome back to the Craftsman Online podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Thank you for having me. Brother.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Here's how long ago it was when you first visited
the podcast. I believe you were the junior warden of
your launch, maybe senior deacon. This is a couple of
years back, like maybe three years back.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
So yeah, I was. I was the I believe senior master.
Ceremony is the last time I did it? Wow, okay,
And the first time I did it, I was a
fellowcraft Look at that.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Yeah, yep, I do remember when we did Yeah, jeez,
i'm dating myself here now, Harlem help fighters. I remember
that that was a really really cool conversation. Well, for
this episode, we're going to be sitting down to talk
about standing up. I've heard guys say hey, I'm gonna
go for a walk. I've never known anybody that goes
for an eighty six day, five hundred mile walk. When
(02:22):
I got the outline and the final product for your
blog for Craftsman Online and was reading this, I was like, Hey,
I know this guy, but wow, this sounds crazy. What
inspired you to do this?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Worship another crazy brother? So I went. I went to France.
I had a trip to Paris back in twenty twenty two,
and our good brother, right Worshipful Stenric Adams, who's a
brother in our lodge, we were doing a brother bring
a Friend night and he happened to mention he has
to send the package to Paris, and I was like,
(02:55):
I'm going in three weeks. I don't mind delivering it.
So is the brother that he and coordinated. Wound up
meeting up with the brother brothers Gerald Ure. He's actually
a New York Mason, entered pass and raised in Chicamago Lodge.
He was French. He was out here for work. Great brother.
He took me and my lady out and that was
(03:16):
the first time I ever heard of the Comino the Santiago.
So he said he was a pilgrim and I didn't
know anything about it. I thought the only pilgrimage was
the Hodge. So I said, oh, I didn't, are you Muslim?
So he said no. So he was telling me about
pilgrimages in general, and then he spoke about it.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
When people would say pilgrim around me, I would think Thanksgiving,
wouldn't for those not familiar with Camino de Santiago. What
is so special about that place?
Speaker 3 (03:43):
So, Santiago de Compostela is believed to be where the
bones of Saint James the Greater, the brother of John
the Evangelist, one of the Twelve Disciples, are laid to us.
When you get there and you get to the cathedral
there you can do the tour and there's a silver
(04:04):
silver box that you can see off behind the gate
that are believed to be his remains. However, recently it's
begun to get more popular. There was a movie called
The Way starring Emilio Estevez and Martin Sheen that came
out about the Camino, and I know a few celebrities
(04:24):
have since, but it is very ancient pilgrimage. When brother
Bret told me about it, I walked. He had walked
the road four times. He did all four major roads
in France, so starting in Paris and going and I
walked away from that conversation thinking he's crazy, and now
(04:44):
I am counted among the crazy having done it.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
I do want to jump into that because as a
former marine, you might be more familiar with this phrase,
because I'm just thinking about the end of it, where
they it's it's not about the something something something, it's
about the journey or it's a the mission.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
I can't remember how.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
It goes, so yes, of course it's about getting to
go to this holy place and seeing this amazing site,
but it's also about the five hundred mile trip that
you're taking. And for those trying to relate to what
this must feel like like, the closest I can get
to is whenever I go for a run, like a
(05:21):
long run, like a six mile run, I'm by myself,
but I usually have headphones and I'm running. The other
time it will make me think, Like the first car
that I had when I was in high school didn't
have a radio, so I would have to drive around
just listening to the music in my head. What is
it like when you have eighty six days all by yourself?
Speaker 3 (05:38):
Actually, the only time I was by myself the entire time,
definitely the first ten days completely by myself at night,
I would stay with someone, but like walking during the
day and small slight correction, it's actually fifteen hundred miles,
not five hundred.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
That's a that's a big difference, dude. That's okay, we'll
make sure that gets updated. Wow, fifteen hundred miles, that's
like halfway across the United States. Like for people that
are trying to think, it's like if you left New York, now,
by the time you get to Iowa, that's how far
you walk.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
That's amazing. And there were people who had longer start
points than I did. I met a pilgrim, the first
pilgrim I began walking with. I met him in vessel.
I'll mention it. I'll talk more about that later. But
he started in the north of Germany, like right by
the North Sea. And so when I was hitting my
(06:34):
one month mark, he was hitting his three month mark,
and he was taking a longer route than the one
I well.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
That we got to talk about that too. Eighty six
days that's almost three months. So how do you carve
that amount of time out of your life to be
able to go do this thing?
Speaker 3 (06:52):
I had no clue how I was going to do it. Fortunately,
right now I'm concentrating on I'm doing school full time,
so I'm in my master's and using the Gibo. It
gives me a little bit of flexibility where I don't
have to maintain a job as well. So I just
did not take classes for the summer. I usually spend
that time with my daughters, and they had already been
(07:13):
expressing that they wanted to spend the summer at home
with their friends. So I spoke with them before I
decided to do this, and they were like, yeah, go ahead.
I know. They were just like I want to stay
and hang out with my friends.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
You get the idea from a brother, you go to dinner,
he talks about the idea of the pilgrimage. You start
getting the concept of what this journey is all about.
You sign up for it. You're like, okay, I'm doing
eighty six days. I'm buying the airline ticket, I'm making
all the travel accommodations that i need to do. What
I loved about getting your blog article on Craftsmen Online
(07:47):
and reading it was, you know, as a former marine,
you talk about having that marine mindset at lodou tell
me about that moment, like once the boots hit the
ground and the walking started. What was going through your mind?
Then orienting myself. It was kind of using that what
we call him the military, that Dulo observe, orient the side,
and act. So I started at the cathedral Notre Dame,
(08:11):
and you know that was the start point. But now
I have to begin.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
I had my my guidebook that he provided me, brother
Bearay provided me, and now I'm looking for literally the signs,
so they have different signs along the way that'll mark
that you're on the right path and not a different path.
So now I begin between the guidebook and just kind
of trying to orient myself. I flew in early in
(08:39):
the morning on a Saturday, and I knew I had
to try and get I was staying at a gentleman's home,
and so I knew I wanted to get there at
a reasonable hour. I had already coordinated with him, and
so I'm just like, okay, let me, let me not
waste time. I had about fourteen miles that first day
that I had to walk, so it was just trying
(09:03):
trying to make sure I'm going the right way. My
pack was ready, I had overpacked, but it's at first
it's just okay, let me start walking, let me start
getting there. I slowed myself down. I stopped to take
a couple of pictures of some some of the sites.
(09:25):
I have a little GoPro on my chest that, you know,
I would record videos to send to my daughters or
just to kind of keep that log. But it was
let me, let me start going. I was more mission
focused in the beginning, where it's like I had to
get to this waypoint. That waypoint was Monton, I believe
(09:46):
was the name of the town that I was going to.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
Here's what's fascinating is most people when they go on
a trip or like a vacation, it's like, Okay, we're
gonna get here. We'll stay here, we'll get apple, have
a meal, there's some sites, some sounds. We'll maybe hang out,
take a nap, do this. You're waking up in the
morning and going like, okay, I got a log fourteen
miles today. I got to make sure I got enough
water to drink. Where's the sun? Where's my gear? You're
(10:09):
talking to yourself in your head. You know that you
need to get to the next point. Was there ever
a moment where you're like, Okay, you know what I
don't have to do all of this. Maybe I could
just jump on a bus or take a taxi or
like ride a bike or maybe a horse or a
donkey just to get a little further. To spare myself
this trial the entire time, I actually have to trick
(10:29):
myself to get on this. I found myself in the
planning phase, kind of putting it off.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
I had set a date. Originally I was like, well,
maybe next year won't work, I might do it another
and I was like, okay, So what I did was
I bought a one way non refundable ticket to Paris,
and I bought a one way, non refundable ticket from Madrid.
So I had the option to either lose that money
or make the Camino the whole way. There came several
(10:58):
points where I'm just like, nobody would know. I could
just get in a cab. But that's kind of like
that internal struggle because then this is like, well then
why did I come out here? Why did I, you know,
sacrifice the money, sacrifice the time, And it's just like
I'm not gonna I'm not gonna quit, Like I just
(11:19):
gotta let me go to this, let me see how
I feel. Let me go here. You know, especially those
early days. Your body, I had to relearn how to
just walk, like just just walking that much, ensuring that
I'm taking breaks, ensuring that I'm drinking enough as I'm going,
and just you know, I'm stretched out. I finally figured
(11:42):
out what people mean when they said they have tight hips.
I never experienced that before.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
I'm guessing you didn't train for this, or did you
have any kind of training for your body or even
for your mind.
Speaker 3 (12:20):
Brothers, You're all was amazing and sending me like a
great guide on how to get ready, what I needed
to down from like the socks and underwear you should
be wearing, to how to pack, and like exercise. He
sent all of that. I did maybe a quarter of it.
(12:43):
I was there. I was just like, I'm a marine.
I'm just gonna be walking. I could go at a
slow pace. I was like, I've done this before, forgetting
that it's been ten years since I got out of
the Marine Corps. So I was. I did not train
as I went on a few hikes with my dad.
We started going for some walks here in Westchester. Found
(13:07):
a couple of trails, but not as many as I
should I.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
Think we covered the physical part because that's where everybody
would be like, now that we know, fifteen hundred miles,
eighty six days, no thanks, I'll just look at the
video or watch the pictures like I'm good. But what
would be a typical day like for you on a
trip like run us through? Like waking up in the morning, lunchtime, breaks,
(13:33):
when would you go to bed? What was your routine?
Speaker 3 (13:36):
So it shifted. There were two basic routines. In the beginning.
There was a routine with just myself. Those first few days,
I was staying in either people's homes convent I stayed
in a monastery. So because of that, you know, I
would wake up at an early hour, prep everything, get ready,
(14:00):
and then I would usually have If I was staying
in someone's home, I would have breakfast with the family.
Whoever I was staying with, I would usually have breakfast
with them. So probably around eight thirty nine o'clock I
would start on my way. In the beginning, when it
was just me by myself, I probably wouldn't take a
break until about two in the afternoon, unless it was
(14:21):
like a stop, put my pack down, stretch out a
little bit, or stop and see something that was in
the guidebook that I thought might be interesting, but it
was a lot more of just the walking and again
trying to make sure I'm seeing all the signs along
the way, to ensure I'm going the right way. Once
I fell in with other pilgrims again, there was the
(14:45):
German pilgrim Voker. I walked with him for a little bit.
Then it was at one point me and three other
German pilgrim and you know, so we would walk together.
We'd probably stop and get coffee or breakfast in the morning,
make a stop maybe around eleven o'clock, sit down, have
(15:05):
another coffee somewhere, and just keep walking. We probably get
into whatever town we were getting five six pm, you know,
seven latest, if we had an extra long walk that day,
and either have dinner with the family that we're staying with,
if we were staying in someone's home, or just stopping.
(15:25):
A lot of the restaurants had little pilgrim menus, so
it would be like the prefix that like Applebee's only
way cheaper and way better food.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
How much weight did you lose on this trip? I'm
just curious.
Speaker 3 (15:39):
We us thirty two pounds.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
Damn yeah, because you're probably not drinking any soda. It's
just water, water, water, a lot of protein, a lot
of greens.
Speaker 3 (15:48):
Water and wine. Europe is amazing in that. I mean,
the prefixed menus usually came with you know, so you
had the salad, the main, and then the dessert, so
you were having like some sweets. You were eating like
regular meals. But then they also come with a drink
usually and it's usually a wine. And if it's up
(16:10):
to three people, you get the entire bottle. So if
I was the only one having a wine, then I
just had the bottle of wine. So water during the day.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Magically nothing hurts the next day. Yeah, I'm just making
a note to myself, like, Okay, if I ever have
a summer that's free and I want to lose thirty pounds,
but I gotta walk eighty for eighty six days, fifteen
hundred miles, I might give this a shot. But no, seriously,
I want to give you time to think about memorable
moments because looking at your blog and seeing the pictures
(16:46):
that you shared with us, and you shared a lot
more than we were able to get up at crassmanonline
dot com. I mean, I know that we're going to
talk about the lodge presentation that you've built around this,
and how you talk to brothers about it, and some
of the Masonic connections over there. But I want you
to tak think about those moments that are in your
head that one hundred years from now, if we get
(17:07):
to live that long and you know, you're sitting there
and you're on your deathbed and this is these are
the little things that you're going to be thinking about
that you weren't able to take a picture of physically,
but in your mind it's there mentally, or maybe it's
the people or some of the encounters that you had
along the way. Can you tell me about a few
of those little gems.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
Yeah, definitely, so immediately. And what comes to mind is
my first day of rest. I only took one day
of rest in the first eighty In the first eighty
one days, I only took one day of rest. Every
other day I walked. But it was in a town
called Vessel that I have mentioned earlier. I met some pilgrims.
(17:49):
This was the first night that I stayed with pilgrims,
and I just happened to be getting there. It was
the first day of the summer Sostice and the way
the basilica is set up, it's during the summer solstice
from the beginning until Saint John's Day June twenty fourth,
A path of light was shining in at one o'clock
(18:11):
in the afternoon, going down the center of the the
basilica all the way to the Eucharist in the in
the nave. So it was I had no plans to stop.
One of the pilgrims was like, oh, you got to
see it, so once in a lifetime thing, you're here,
So I decided to stay in extra day. That was
(18:31):
amazing to see in itself, and just seeing how the
basilica was made. But I remember that evening I went
in to pray and not used to going in in old,
old cathedrals and basilica is, but I remember I went
into the U in the evening to the basilica and
(18:54):
the monks I believe they might have been Franciscan friars,
but it's escaping right now. They began singing their nightly
hymns and just hearing the way their voices reverberated, I
had I'm getting goosebumps on my skin right now just
thinking about that, and it just moved me so profoundly.
(19:16):
Just hearing that gave me a very different perspective on
the mellowing tides of old cathedral airs vibrating through aisles
and arches, you know, just that bit of it. So
that was definitely the first, extremely impactful. The people along
the way, the pilgrims that I met along the way.
(19:38):
You meet so many people and hear so many stories
of people that you maybe don't even see later on
down the camino, like you'll see them for a little bit,
you'll walk with them for a little bit, and then
you just part ways. But the stories that I felt
were the stories I to hear with the people who
(20:02):
sold everything and were just figuring out life on the camino.
They just got rid of everything that they had and
they were starting over and the Camino was their their
first step. But you they'd still exchange stories. Like a
lot of times, people will speak to you as if
they know you forever. And I love to hear the
(20:25):
stories of the pilgrims who they sold everything, they quit
their job, They you know, have nothing but what they
have on their back and they're just going to figure
out life. I met a few. I met one he
was he was a veteran and he was out in
(20:47):
Hawaii and he just sold everything. I see him still
on Instagram right now. He's all around. Young French lady,
same thing. She left a very lucrative job, sold and
you know, I still follow them on social media and
to see that. I think as far as the Pilgrims,
(21:07):
and then the Italian Pilgrims were my favorite because they're
just so full of life. They're loud, they laugh, and
they're gonna make sure you're fed. But just walking into
the square, yes, walking into that square that last day,
and like having that moment with them in you know,
(21:28):
in the plaza in front of that cathedral. I would
go back before my train to Madrid, and like I
after I had done the older pilgrimage to Festare and
I came back to Santiago, I would go back, especially
in the early hours, to the plaza and just watch
people have their first moment and just you know, be
(21:51):
off in the side and just remember what that was
like for me and just enjoy seeing them have that moment,
everything from breaking down trying to you know, just cries
of triumph. Yeah, and a lot of U.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
I imagine, well, if our listeners like, Hey, I'd love
to read this story. You can go to our website
craftsman online dot com in the blog section, it's the
only one that says Camino de Santiago Pilgrimage, and that's
the story of worshipful Brother Ricardo Rosado. You can also
get the link for to the blog article in the
notes for this episode if you're listening on Spotify and
(22:30):
Apple podcasts. It's interesting when you were talking about this,
and I really appreciate you talking about those memorable moments,
those little gems, because you know what I'm saying, like,
it's it's hard to capture those with the camera, even
a video camera. You know, it's one of those things
you have to be there to experience, which is to
me it sounded like part spiritual, you know, getting to
go into a church and really having that inner reflective
(22:53):
time to figure out who you were. Plus you know,
there must have been some times where you felt like
somebody that was living back in biblical times because you're walking,
you're not taking a shower. It was funny to see
her before picture and at the end you almost had
the full Jesus beard going on there anyways, kind of
look like a disciple. There were probably nights where you
(23:14):
maybe it smelt like you had slept near a manger
and a barn, you know, just from the long days
of walking, but also the brotherhood that you were sharing
with the other travelers and the stories. And I think
that's a great place to kind of get into the
Masonic angle here. Did you get a chance to meet
other Masons on your travels worship?
Speaker 3 (23:33):
So I met one that I know of, And it's
very interesting because in Europe a lot of Masons they
will not wear Masonic rings or anything. This one was
a gift. So I wear this one all the time.
And you know, so I was just wearing it and
I met the it's the same pilgrim who convinced me
(23:55):
to stay in Vesle, and he's like, you know, oh,
he said something to the effect of, you know, you
have this big ring. You know, tell me about you.
He's like, he's like, I know who you are, I
know you're all and so he knew brothers you're all
(24:17):
and so.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
Oh, okay, yes, I've never heard that expression before, if
identifying yourself as a Mason.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
So he knew brothers, you're all. And I guess they
had spoke and he was like, be on the lookout
in case you run into this American, this American pilgrim.
He's also a brother, so he was the one. He
kind of he convinced me to stay in Beslet, and
I fell in with him and his group. It was
a German couple, you know, French French lady and the
(24:51):
other gentleman. He might have been French as well, but
they were my first crew walking together, and you know,
just as far as we spoke a little bit about
the craft. But he had done other little pilgrimages. So
he was going to to Lord was it Lord or No?
(25:16):
He was going and uh, he was going to Nice
to see uh Saint Catherine. I believe that's interred there.
So he was doing a different pilgrimage. He wasn't going
all the way to Santiago, but it was we were.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
So there's a certain point I'm guessing where your paths
kind of diverged. You went one way, he went the
other way, and I was like, so long brother, and
it's a long friend.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
And and then they remerged. So I met him back
along the way shortly before I got to Nice and
and yeah, so it was good because it was like again,
it was like meeting old friends that you'd known for years.
And I spent three days with him before In the
morning after, he gave me very good advice in regards
(26:04):
to just the pilgrimage, a little bit on masonry and
just life in general. I think it was just you know,
he was the second after Brother Gerald. He was the
second pilgrim to really take me as a little mentee
and just kind of give me some guidance on it. So,
Brother Pierre, I still I still text him. I wouldn't
(26:29):
say regularly, but I still check in on him. And
uh so when I ascended.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
The hopefully you share this episode with him.
Speaker 3 (26:35):
So yes, yes, And Brother Gerald, is.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
There anything you want to say to him while he's listening?
Speaker 3 (26:40):
Now? Thank you, just thank you. I've said it all before,
but great brother. He he invited me and all American
New York Masons out to France. He did invite me out.
So any brother who wants to go out there, he said,
they're always welcome.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
I'll be happy to go by plane and then a
car and I'll walk to the front door of the large.
(27:30):
While you're talking about this, I'm thinking, you know, we
talk about our Masonic journey, and there's a lot of
steps as we go through our degrees and framemasonry, and
there's a lot of personal development that happens, and growth
and introspection and reflection as you look out at life.
But nothing like spending eighty six days and a lot
(27:51):
of the time with yourself and you in your own thoughts.
What's the thing that when you're sitting there and you're
thinking about in your life, like I grew so much
as a person in this way because of this journey,
this experience.
Speaker 3 (28:06):
It's it's humbling, it's humbling to the utmost. You are
putting yourself. I don't speak French, my Spanish. I can,
it's possible, but I'm definitely not fluent. You're putting yourself
really at the the at the how do I put it?
(28:30):
The mercy, right, the mercy, but more the charity of
other people to open up their homes. It's different when
you're staying in the pilgrim refuge, oring the hostel, because
that's a transactional, you know. But just even in the
convent that I stayed in in the monastery, you know,
(28:51):
these religious brothers and sisters, you know they're opening up
their space to you, it's it's it does change who
you are. Earlier you had said, how do you carve
out eighty six days? And that was one of the
things I was wondering. And at the end I came
back and the world I thought like, there were so
(29:11):
many things I was dropping, and you know, I was
responsible for X, Y, and Z, and then the world
just kept going and I came back and they were like, oh, hey,
you're back.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
Yeah, three months in the summertime. There's a lot of
stuff that's always going on in the US, whether politically
or socially or you know, just in pop culture, and
people like, oh, don't you feel like you missed out
on it? And You're like no, because I had such
a much better and different experience. I literally unplugged from
all of this madness and it got to spend some
time with myself. I kind of became my own best
(29:44):
friend during that three month span.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
And to a degree, I wasn't missed. Like to a degree,
it was like, you know, there was one young man.
I met, one young man seventeen years old, and this
took me back so part of the history of the
pilgrimage as it used to be an indulgence as a
penance for people who had committed certain sins for forgiveness. Right, Well,
(30:11):
I met a young man. He was there from Morocco
and he was there with his boss. So they were,
you know, talking around it. They were excited. I was
kind of a mini celebrity, being an American let alone
from New York on the caminos, so they had heard
about me. But we were talking. He had gotten in
(30:32):
some trouble, I don't know what, but his sentence was essentially,
you can either go to jail or you can go
on this pilgrimage in the care of someone who's going
to take responsibility for you. And his supervisor vouched and
was walking the comino with him, and I understand at
(30:53):
the end of it why that would be a sentence
to carry out instead of going to jail, because there's
probably more reform that you'll get on that.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
So, well, it's fascinating to me to hear you talk
about this, and you mentioned like mercy and charity and
just the kindness and goodwill of the people that were
on this trail that knew that these passengers were going
to be going along, and as you talked about like
this is an ancient trial that's still possible to do
today in the world that we live in that's highly overconnected,
(31:29):
it's supercharged, it's extremely divisive, and yet there's still people
who are willing to open their homes and their hearts
to some stranger that barely speaks the language, and that
you're still able to And I can imagine, I'm in
my head thinking he's probably walking up with just a
couple of euros in his pocket. That are you know, changed,
that's jingling, and you know, getting the money out there
(31:51):
for a quick meal and some some water, and then
you know, moving onto the kindness of someone that's opening
their house or their monastery or their church so that
you have a bed to sleep in at night. It's
crazy to think about that, that if you tried to
do that to some extent in this country, in the
United States, that would not be possible today.
Speaker 3 (32:09):
They always asked, what's the American equivalent of the Camino,
And I said, the closest you can get is maybe
the Appalachian Trail, the Pacific Crush Trail, like one of those.
I was like, but even then, it's more to what
you were alluding to earlier, where those are more solitary
(32:30):
where especially because there are many roads that you can take.
The one I took, the Camino Francis, it's the French road,
so it's one it's the most popular, more than most
likely the road that Charlemagne took. It's you know, it's
(32:51):
the most storied one. But that road it's very communal,
whereas if you maybe take the Comino No going along
the north skirting the Mediterranean, that's maybe less. So you know,
the the Via portu Guest going up from Lisbon or Porto,
(33:13):
you know, it may take you thirty days or two weeks,
but it's a lot more mountains, better views. So there's
so many different and especially in Spain, there's a better infrastructure,
like they're used to pilgrims. They have more hostels and
places that you can stay, and you know, you could
pay with credit card most places, because that's part of
(33:34):
their business. But especially in the beginning going from Paris,
you know, it was definitely you know some some some
towns only took cash and you may not have had cash,
and now you're trying to figure it out, and you know,
one gentleman, I remember he I was the day I
(33:55):
was in Veslee I had to try and get a
little my SIM recharged because I would call my daughters
like once a week on weekends, or I would need
it to map where I'm going the next day, just
to make sure I'm on the right path. After my
first guidebook ran out, and this gentleman I was walking
(34:15):
in the rain, he just stopped. His name was Bernard.
He just stopped. He drove me into the closest town,
drove me to another town, drove me by his house.
He told me, oh, you're walking, you'll pass by my
house tomorrow, and then drove me all the way back
to resulate where I was staying and didn't didn't wouldn't
(34:39):
accept money, you know, he was just we figured it
out through the language barrier, you know. And it was
just like those those little acts of charity and just
people I don't I don't even know where I'm going,
just walking into the town because somebody said, hey, it
might need that way, and he was like, no, we'll
figure it out. Hey try here. No they didn't. All right,
(35:00):
I'll take you over there. He must have spent three
hours with me on a day that I don't know
what he was doing.
Speaker 2 (35:07):
So it's one of the things that I was getting
your blog up on the Craftsman Online website. I reached
out to you. I was like, I want to see
your lodge program about this experience. What is the theme?
How do you present this to your lodge?
Speaker 3 (35:21):
Brothers I was actually do it. I was trying to
think of what was what was that golden thread that
went through all of it. There's so many things, but
again a fifteen hundred mile journey, trying to distill it
in something that is going to be fitting for a
lodge meeting. And I kind of was just thinking about
(35:44):
it going through some of the journal notes and voice
notes that I took, and I found throughout the way,
I found myself divesting myself of something. Well. Day two,
I stopped in Brothers Gerald's town and he helped me
to lighten my pack and literally, hey, you don't need this,
(36:05):
you don't need this. He gave me my pilgrim staff
that you see me with. I had it there, made
from a walnut tree. You know. Along the way, as
I was mentally in my head just still wondering how
all the things that I was leaving behind were coming along,
you know, I learned to let just let go of
those thoughts and be present in the moment. And remember
(36:29):
I was when it kind of really hit me. I
was coming onto a crest and I looked in my
guidebook and it said this is an ancient Roman road
that the legions used to walk, and I just see
it and there's a small little stone marking it, and
I'm just like, this is literally a history I'm walking on.
(36:49):
And then, you know, towards the end, especially you know,
stopping it, I would I would try my best to
stop and say a little, you know, prayer of thanks,
prayer for strength to continue on in the cathedrals or
the churches of the towns. And you know, I felt
(37:10):
compelled a couple of times to call a couple of
people that I hadn't talked to in a while, and
maybe we ended on a bad note, you know, kind
of just let go of some grudges towards others, towards myself.
It was just like that idea of divesting yourself and
little by little letting go until nice you're learning who
you are now. You know, there's a very death and
(37:33):
rebirth idea of it, where you're slowly dying along the
way and you come back someone different.
Speaker 2 (37:39):
One of your paragraphs in your blog that really spoke
to me and I want to share it with our
listener is in the end, the Camino is not just
a trail across the continent. It's a path carved through
the heart. It teaches you how to carry less, worry less,
and love more. It teaches you how to divest yourself
of everything that keeps you from becoming who you truly are.
(38:00):
And you just spoke to that. But those were the
words that you wrote, and those when you talked about
goosebumps earlier, like that got my attention. I'm like, I
may want to do something like this someday. May maybe
someday for you though worship. So that's how it started
with That's how it started with me. I didn't have
(38:20):
a committal. I did not.
Speaker 3 (38:22):
I emailed the brother and I said I may one
day email you because I'm thinking about walking this path,
and he immediately sent me this is how you get right.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Yeah, okay, may maybe in my mind, but for you, you've
done it. And you know, I thank you so much
for coming on and sharing this story. I'll get you
out of here on this one because you know, and
I ran my first five k, They're like, oh, are
you going to run a ten k? I was like, okay, sure,
are you going to do a half marathon? Hell no,
(38:53):
that's crazy. I'm just going to stop right here. Why
does everybody keep pushing you to the next thing? So
forgive me France in this question, but you've taken in
this huge physical, spiritual personal journey. What's next for you?
What's the next goal? Did you have set for yourself?
Speaker 3 (39:09):
What do you want to do? So, in regards everybody,
this is the question everybody asked. So I feel you
on that. I've always said this was something that I
never planned to do and I very much felt called
to do. So I think if I'm ever gonna do
something like this again, it will be under two conditions.
(39:30):
One I feel called to another one like there's something
going on and there are different roads. There's one in Italy,
there's one to Mont Saint Michel and Normandy. There are
ones throughout Scotland and England. So there are many places
that you can go. Then there's also I would go back,
(39:51):
I believe on the Camuno that Santiago if someone I
knew wanted to go and they wanted me to go
as a guy. I read the What really threw me
that I felt called. I read Paul looko ELO's book
The Pilgrimage, and I wasn't thinking about like, I just
picked it up off the shelf. I think it actually
might be behind me somewhere, yeah, right here. So I
(40:16):
wasn't thinking about it. I just had this box set
and had to read it. But in there he's speaking
way more mystical. But one of the things with the
order that he speaks about in his book was you
go on this with the implicit agreement that when you
get called on to go back as a guy, you go.
(40:37):
And that always stuck with me, and it very much
was in line with the Marine Corps as well, and
even with masonry, because it's like you kind of take
what you know and you helped to bring the next
person up along. So I've always said if my daughters
or someone that I know, if they wanted to go,
I would go as their guide if they wanted me.
(40:59):
And you know, other than that, I would have to
feel called in the same way I felt called this time,
where it's like I know something's nudging me to go.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
Just a fascinating story, and if you want to read
his blog posts on the Craftsman Online Podcast. You'll find
that in the notes for this episode, as well as
the link to join us on Patreon. Yeah please, we're
so close to hitting that twenty subscriber goal before we
close out the year, and we thank you in advance.
I'm right worship for brother Michael arse.
Speaker 3 (41:33):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
We have our holiday shopping special coming up on Cyber Monday.
That's gonna be a lot of fun with Matthew Brockbank.
Until then, at peace and harmony prevail
Speaker 1 (42:00):
M
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