October 19, 2025 • 30 mins
Six Flags is losing more of its board—Executive Chairman Selim Bassoul and Lead Independent Director Daniel Hanrahan will leave the board at year’s end, following CEO Richard Zimmerman’s exit announcement. Bassoul, who also lined up a new role outside the industry, will remain as a consultant through the launch of Six Flags Qiddiya City in Saudi Arabia. The company stumbled when its first press release listed Qiddiya City opening in 2026, only to issue an immediate correction claiming 2025—adding to investor confusion. Philip and Scott unpack what the back-to-back departures mean for a company still struggling to execute its “Great Reset” strategy and whether the Qiddiya slip hints at deeper internal misalignment. They also discuss IAAPA’s Q3 Global Outlook—highlighting how weather, tariffs, and economic uncertainty continue to shape operators’ planning worldwide. Listen to weekly BONUS episodes on our Patreon.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Okay from our studios this week in Detroit and in Tampa.
This is Green Tag to Theme Parker and thirty. I'm
Philip and I'm joined as always on my co host
Scott Swinson of Scott Twinson creat Development. On Green Tag,
we look at the top news each week and explain
why it matters to business professionals. And this week we're
going to be talking a little bit about the uh
more news from six Flags, so there's always use with
(00:22):
six Flags nowadays. And then we're going to look at
the latest global trans report from AYAPA and discuss some
of the takeaways from that. So first, more is brewing
over at six Flags. We got we got.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Just the season for brewing, just the season for brewing.
There's there's a coven sitting around a big cauldron somewhere
and and it's certainly brewing, all right.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
And I guess two more members of that coven are leaving.
So yeah, six Flags did announce that two.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
More members of the board are going to be resigning
at the end of the year.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
This follows news a course of the CEO step down.
So the two that are leaving first is Selim Bessel,
which was the previous CEO of the previous six Flags
only chain, right, so he's leaving along with Daniel who
is the lead independent director. Now Selim would seem like
(01:20):
the you know, the more important, not too more important,
but you know, he has a lot of projects still
in the mix. But they said that he's he will
be staying on as a consultant for the company through
the opening of the new six Flags Kadia Park in
Saudi Arabia. And that's where the other piece of news,
kind of news came in where in the initial press
release where they announced that Seleem and Daniel were going
(01:43):
to be stepping down at the end of the year,
they mentioned that the six Flags Park was going to
be moving its opening date till twenty twenty six. However,
very soon after that press release went out, they issued
a correction saying that no, it was actually going to
still open in and so that created a second piece
(02:04):
of news about that kind of back and forth. But
the official news, I guess is that these two are
stepping down, and like I said, that follows the news
that we had previously about Richard Zimmerman stepping down. Now,
a replacement or successor for Zimmerman has not been named,
so it's kind of like, well, Zimmerman will be around
while they find a replacement, and then also Slim will
(02:25):
be around until this opens as a consultant. So it's
not a complete loss of this. But in terms of
what Basul said, I just thought his quote was interesting.
He said, leading the Six Flags board directors through a
period of transformation has been one of the most super
awarding experiences of my career. Together we built a stronger,
(02:46):
more innovative company, one that successfully completed the industry's largest merger,
expanded its growth opportunities, and refined the guest experience through
technology and creativity. I'm especially proud of that Six Flags
has been recognized as one of the best and brightest
companies to work for a nation. I'd prove of our
exceptional culture and dedication of our people.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
I'm not sure how much of that is true.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Well, you know, I don't know whether I have just
become in this world or because of my age or whatever.
I've just kind of become cynical, especially when I immediately
recognize rhetorics speak and that's exactly you know, basically, I mean,
let's break this down here. I'm so proud I'm so
glad that we got through this transition proving that this
(03:26):
is a great place to work, and now I'm leaving,
and not only leaving work. We got to point out
he's not just leaving work, he is now actually leaving
the industry because he's lined up a new gig as
the chairman of a Canadian online grosser.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
Yep.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
So it was like, oh, my god, my guess and
this is pure speculation, So pure speculation on my part.
My guess is he feels so beat up by this
whole transition period that it is time to focus on
something new, something different, to just kind of relax a
(04:01):
little bit. I don't know whether that's true or not.
That maybe oversimplifying the situation, but yeah, it's it's unfortunate
because again, I'm I've become very very cynical when I
hear when I hear phrases like together we built. As
you're leaving, you're saying together we built, I just get
(04:23):
a little sarcastic, I guess about that because it's hard
to buy.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
Yeah, it's one of those whatever the saying is where
you know, everything you say is an admission you kind
of thing where it's like, well, you know why, there
are other things he could have said, So it's kind
of like joining attention to these things almost makes it
seem like, yeah, it is a.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Weird lily a bit. It's it's it's certainly really. I mean,
if he had said, if he had said, you know,
this has been a rewarding experience for me, I'm very
proud of what we were able to accomplish. But it
is I recogniz that it's time for me to move on.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Yes, right, that's a great story. That's right, that's right,
that's right.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
But he's still but he's still a consultant, so he can't. Yes,
he has to still tow the party line, which I understand.
You know, we've all worked for corporations. I understand that
that necessity.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
But it just it's it's.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
A whole paragraph that basically says absolutely nothing in my opinion.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Yeah, well, uh, and so was speaking of him staying
on as a consultant.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
So that.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
This is interesting again because I think the first time
we heard about Richard, I meant I mentioned how that
was kind of like not a great sign when you
were trying to execute this this big vision, right that
we talked about they had the whole leadership vision where
they presented to investors about this plan that we thought
was actually a good plan. But where we have argued
(05:53):
and again this is just us where we have been
arguing it is it kind of seems like it has
not really been executed. And maybe that's because there's so
many staff, it's such a big who knows why. But
the execution doesn't seem like it's quite gotten there. And
so then you're saying we're going to remove leadership. Well
that's never a good sign classically when you're trying to
get a new initiative done through. Is the leaderships changing
and now it seems it seems like it's now more
(06:16):
leadership is leaving. However, maybe not, because a lot of
the pushback we got in comments when I said that
was that he's still going to be around anyway, and
that this gives the opportunity for new blood to come
in and maybe connect more of the park manager park Nation,
you know, maybe basically be a better bridge. And so,
you know, I think maybe that's the same case here,
(06:37):
like Saline will still be around. If somebody has a
question about working with the government in Kadea or something
about logistics he'll still be around, but maybe it gives
the opportunity for a better bridge between the people need
to actually execute, which would be the park managers and
the area managers, and then the people who are in
the Ivory tower, which is the board.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
So maybe.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
So I mean, yeah, I think that anytime you have
two major conglomerates coming together, there's always going to be
growing pains, and sometimes it is beneficial to instead of
doing it six Flags way or Cedar fairway, is to
do it a new way and to find new people
who can and execute that. With this number, however, abandoned
(07:23):
abandoning ship, I think is probably a safe analogy to use.
With this number of people abandoning ship, I have to
ask what do they know that we don't know.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
That's true, because you know.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
They have information that will not be released, nor should
it be it's you know, proprietary business stuff. But and
could it be something may be something as simple as
they know what the new leadership is going to look like,
and they don't necessarily recognize their place in it, or
they don't recognize their it's contrary to their belief in leadership,
(07:58):
because let's face it, there's a million different ways to
lead a company, and well not a million, but there's
many different ways to lead a company, and sometimes you know,
it is it is best for the company overall to
cut ties with the opposition. You know, it's it's time
to say, okay, we're now. I don't know, I didn't
see it anywhere in the in the article, but maybe
you've seen anything. What kind of what kind of exit
(08:21):
packages did these guys get? What kind of golden parachutes
were there?
Speaker 3 (08:25):
So I didn't see that.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
I'm sure the information is probably out there somewhere, but
I didn't see any articles that I read.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
I'm assuming that there's there's something. There's always always something. Yeah,
there's always something. But I but again, I I hope,
I hope that what we're saying here is is true
for the company as a whole. I hope that there
is you know, it will bring in the or will
open up the possibility to bring in some new blood.
(08:51):
The challenge, I think is going to be finding that
balance between pruning to allow for new growth and cutting
so far back that the tree dies. So you kind
of have to find in any corporation. You know, I'm
not even speaking necessarily about six flags in any corporation
where you have a change of strategy or as change
of leadership leadership strategy, you have to kind of find
(09:16):
that balance. You have to figure out how much can
we trim back so that we can allow for some
new growth, some new ideas, some new people, some new experiences,
And how much is it when we cut too far
back that we don't have any sort of history knowledge.
You know, you're kind of going in green, because then
you're tempted or likely to make the same mistakes that
(09:37):
have been made before, because you know, the first time
they made those mistakes, it sounded like a good idea.
And if there's nobody around to remember that it was
we thought it was a good idea, but it wasn't,
then you just end up spinning your wheels and making
the same mistakes over and over again. So I'm hoping
that this is not a landslide the beginning of a
landslide trend. And I'm hoping that, you know, the folks
(09:58):
who commented it opens up space for new you know,
new blood, new ideas. But I don't know, you know,
based on what we've seen with the Six Flags properties
and the Six Flags parks, and I'm not sure who
they're going.
Speaker 3 (10:15):
To be able to draw into their fold. That is true.
That is true.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
It is worrying that there's not a successor being like
groomed like more publicly, you know, for zimmer Man, that
is that is concerning, you know. And yeah, but the
the other piece too, which I think is interesting, it
is about.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
The date change and yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
And so basically six Flags is is a telling everybody, oh,
it was just a typo, basically like it was just
a mistake, you know, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
Now, Scott, you know, as someone.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
Who's worked in corporation, so that both of us have,
I don't really think it's likely that there was a
mistake of that magnitude in the press release. I think
it's more likely that it was announced because now there
have been quite a few reporters that have talked about
who are more there locally in the area, who have
talked about how the site is not doesn't look like
(11:18):
it's at all close to being reaid open, right, this
is not prepared. So there's been quite a few reporters
mentioning that. But we also know that when they want
something to open, they can just throw money at it.
I mean the amount of money they can throw that
will really that they can build stuff very quickly there
if they want to.
Speaker 3 (11:36):
But so I do.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
Again, this is conjecture, right, I do suspect that they
probably thought that. I think maybe it's a difference of Again,
that's like a cultural difference. Like probably when this site
will be ready it is probably twenty twenty six, but
when it will open will be twenty twenty five, and
it will just open where not everything is ready, but
it will still be open.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
If any, if any of our listeners have ever worked
in the Middle East, you know, you know as well
as I do.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
You do not, you do not, You.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Do not open late, doesn't matter what you open. Those
gates open on time. And you know, having having opened
two different attractions there, it's amazing what can happen in
the last I would say month or even week as
to what gets installed. And there are even times that
(12:31):
I have witnessed, not in the attractions that I've worked in,
but the attractions that were adjacent to some other attractions,
and talking to other people, there were times where things
were opened and then sections were opened and then closed
again so that they could go back and do it correctly.
But they had to they had to open on time.
You know, in the US, it's we think about it
in many cases as let's let's underpromise and over deliver.
(12:55):
But the mindset, from at least my experience in the
Middle East is if we announce a date and then
we back away from it, that shows weakness. So we
don't want to show weakness. We want to show that
we know what we're doing. We're completely in we're completely
in sync with you know, what we said we were
going to do, we are going to do, and it
(13:15):
is going to be the biggest, fastest. I find it
interesting that, you know, even on social media, we're seeing
test runs of the Falcon coaster, Falcon's flight, We're seeing
we're seeing ads for it looking like the park is
completely open and people are playing in it and having
(13:35):
a lovely time. So yeah, I think that it was
probably an attempt to manage expectations so that way, if
they did open, you know, say they opened at the
end of twenty five for a sneak peek or a
(13:58):
preliminary open or whatever, then open fully in twenty six.
It's just an attitude shift, you know. It's really if
you think about it, It's really no different than saying
we will officially open in early twenty five, I'm sorry,
in early twenty six, and then do a beta test
or a sneak peek or whatever in twenty five. You know,
(14:20):
you either open in twenty five or you don't. That's
the mentality they have in the in the Middle East.
And when we say we're going to open in twenty five,
we are going to open in twenty five. I've also
found that in many cases, and again this is conjecture,
but in many cases in the Middle East, with the
construction companies, they don't get paid until the job is done,
(14:40):
so they've been fronting salaries for all of the workers
and some cases, in some cases, let me put it
that way, I don't know whether it's true with everything
at Kidea City or not, but in some cases they
will have to front the salaries and literally hold the people,
hold the workers in the country until the project is complete.
(15:02):
So I could I could see it, and I'm this
is a hypothetical situation based on my experience, but I
could see very comfortably them saying, well, if we're not
opening until twenty six, then we're not paying you until
twenty six and companies going that will shoot twenty five
in the foot for all of us. So there's a
(15:23):
lot of there's a lot of unique cultural issues that
are going on here. And to me, it sounds kind
of like the Americans were the American side was trying
to say, yeah, we're going to open, but we won't
be completely open, and and the other side is saying, no,
we're gonna open. We're gonna open and people are gonna
be in the door, and we're gonna start making our
(15:44):
money back and then we'll pay you.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
So I don't know. I think it's I think it's interesting.
I think it's unfortunate because you know, when we were
there obviously, when we when we toured six Flags Kadea,
it was no where and you're ready and we knew it,
but that was quite quite some time ago. Well, yeah,
you're absolutely right though, when you throw money at it, Yeah,
(16:09):
when you have to make it's amazing how your your
work schedule can expand or contract to the amount of
time you actually have.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
That's right. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
See, I actually disagree with some of the reporters just
because when you and I were there on site, I
was like I was almost shocked at how much was
ready then in a paradoxical way, like they had the
basic infrastructure, the buildings, the sewer lines, the power, and
that's the stuff you can't I mean all the other stuff,
like you know, maybe you don't you don't have to
(16:37):
open this one section or you know whatever, But I.
Speaker 3 (16:40):
Mean, as long as you have like the main area.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
We were in the main hub area, and then there
was a few food and beverage locations that were pretty
close to opening. That's all you really need, you know,
just open one ride and some food and beverage locations
and the main hub and that's that's open basically. That's
that's close enough I think for for what they're doing,
then you can open the rest of the lands later.
But and I think, knowing how quickly they work in
(17:04):
that region when there's money, I think that they can
get there.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Yeah, I don't see it. I was kind of surprised
when when they pushed the date back originally because it
didn't it didn't seem like it didn't seem like that
was necessary. But you know, again, we were there earlier
in the year, so.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Well, Okay, our next story here is about the the
state of the Global Attractions industry for the third quarter,
and this was put out by AYAPA and it is
basically a synthesis of interviews that they did with their
advisory committee, which is about twenty two members that operators
(17:48):
that are spread all throughout the world about trends are seen.
Speaker 3 (17:51):
And basically they.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
They identified three trends and then there's an information per region,
and then there's some.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
Additional research they added to it.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
And the first trend, the biggest one is of course weather,
So I can't it says unfavorable weather has defined twenty
twenty five. Many operators report that the spring months have
proved wet and unseasonably cold, discouraging guest visitation. By contrast,
the early summer months proved exceedingly hot, which also had
(18:25):
a negative impact on visitation. Well, geez, and I will
just say that also. You know, here in Detroit where
we are, it has been unseasonably warm for a long
period of time, like it just this week and we're
already halfway through October, is when it started to drop
below sixty five and then the tree started to change color.
(18:46):
And so that does discourage people going to haunted houses
and going to indoor attractions because if it's warm in Michigan,
you're going.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
To want to do stuff as long as you can. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
Yeah, So there is some to it, right, But at
the same time, as we've always been saying over and
over and over, at this point, the weather trend isn't
a trend.
Speaker 3 (19:03):
It is just a fact.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
Well, and to me, this shouldn't be This shouldn't be
excuses for why twenty five is going to be low
for me. This should be a list of here's what
we need to plan for for twenty six, you know.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
Right.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
It goes back to that post crisis leadership mentality of Okay,
what do we learn here, and we need to have
parallel paths going going. If it's if it's too cold,
then we need to have heaters for our cues.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
If it's too.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Warm, then we need to find a way to perhaps
move some of our attractions outside. I mean, we need
to find you need to find ways to deal with
this kind of thing. And that's that's what long range
business planning is, you know. And and yes it may
have come up, you know, for some reason weather magically
started in twenty twenty five. I don't necessarily think that's true.
(19:53):
But it's the kind of thing that I think we
should all look at and the takeaway should be plan
for whatever. You know, have a plan in place. If
you never use it, you never use it, not a problem.
But but go through that exercise and find somebody who can,
you know, help you with those kinds of with those
kinds of plans. It may be something as simple as marketing.
(20:15):
You know, it may be some market it differently if
if the if the weather is rough. You know. One
of the things that locally they did here for a while.
I don't know whether they're still doing it or not,
but Florida Aquarium and Zoo Tampa used to say they
had a reciprocal ticket agreement, so that if it was
(20:35):
raining and you had a ticket to the zoo, you
could go to the aquarium. And if you had a
ticket to the aquarium and it was a beautiful sunny day,
you could go to the zoo. So to me, that's
just good business planning. And then they would share in
those they would share in those revenues. So it's making
certain it's kind of going back to the basics. It's
making certain that your guests are happy. It's making certain
(20:58):
that you're because the happy guests are gonna come to
your park.
Speaker 3 (21:02):
You know, I do.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
I do think this is a little bit of a pendulum.
Of of course, during the pandemic, we went all the
way to the one, you know, to one side with
ticketing where we're saying you have to have a date
reserved and a time slot reserved, and this whole time ticketing,
and there is a lot of merit to that. You know,
how much have we discussed time ticketing and dynamic pricing
(21:24):
and how much it helps and et cetera, et cetera.
But then on the flip side, if your attraction is
not prepared for weather, then I don't think that you
can enforce that sort of those sort of rules about
time ticketing and about you. I mean again, if you're
telling the customer they have to show up in this
half hour window for your attraction, but then parts of
(21:44):
your attraction are not open during that time or there's
negative weather on there, I don't think that's going to work.
So I do kind of think that we're going a
little bit into the other side of it, being more
flexible like it was pre pandemic, you know, But even
now with a we were talking about last week the
Disneyland prices and Disneyland. I mean, you still have to
(22:05):
make your park reservations in California, and then there's again
that thing what happens if it's something closes or this
or that or whatever, well then you've just and that's
a lot of money in that case, you know, and
they're not going to give you a refund or let
you change your day.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
Like that's we're starting. That's starting to get difficult. And
one a.
Speaker 2 (22:23):
Perfect example where time ticketing is beneficial to the company
but not to the guest.
Speaker 3 (22:27):
That's right, that's right.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
And I think one example recently that I just just
this weekend, I visited Hannah Haunted Acres in Indianapolis, and
they changed their policy last year due to rain, and
they've kept the policy, which is that they have their
tickets are good for their five attractions. I believe any
general tickets good for those five. And they changed the
(22:50):
policy last year to say if you as long as
you do at least one attraction, you can come back
any other night that they're open and do any of
their attractions. So if you show up and it does
happen to rain and you don't want to go through
the corn maze in the rain, then you can come
back and do it another night. And they also are
open every day in October, like every their Halloween stuff
(23:12):
is open every day, you know, seven days a week,
and so you truly can come back anytime. Now that
still doesn't help people that are visiting who are just
there for one day, but I think for the locals
it does make a big difference where you can say
and it also you talk to me about how basically
you can cheat the system because you can buy a
(23:32):
Monday ticket for twenty five dollars and then you come
back back that on Saturday, And he kind of was
saying that it's worth it to him to allow that
just because of the goodwill that it buys them, where
if price really, really really is a concern for them,
then you just buy a Monday ticket, show up, and
then come back with your friends on Saturday. And I
(23:53):
think that attitude is probably more where we're going to
have to start swinging if if nobody can do anything
about like if the attractions continue to just say we
can't do anything about weather and like cross their arms,
and then I just think you're gonna have to start
going to that direction with ticketing.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Yeah, and it's so it's funny because I'm listening to
I've gone back and I'm revisiting make it stick or
made the stick and make it and one of the
things they one of the things that they talk about.
I just listened to it this morning as a matter
of fact, that you know, they talk about the guests
(24:30):
the customers. The customers don't want to buy a drill bit.
They want to buy a three quarter inch hole so
they can kick pictures of their kids. Guests don't want
to buy tickets. They want to have an experience where
they have fun. And if the if the ticket doesn't
you know, is only for this time, the ticket's useless.
The ticket is worthless to them because they can't get in.
(24:51):
And I love the idea that. Okay, so you get
somebody who cheats the system. We're so you know, we're
so concerned about cheating the system. But it goes back
to you know, my slice of cheese story. There's so
many stories about how when you make a guest centered
choice that you actually improve your business. It doesn't, it's
not detro metal to your business. So I guess my
(25:13):
argument or a con argument or the opposite argument to
the people say you can scam the system is okay,
but you sold a ticket that you might not have sold.
That's right, you know, because if they are and they
are cost averse, then.
Speaker 3 (25:26):
Yeah, and most people don't do that, you know.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Again, it's back to the whole thing about it's usually
like eighty or seventy twenty twenty. It's where it's like,
you know, eighty percent of the people are just gonna
do the normal thing, and then you're always going to
get the ten percent that are going to try you
whenever they can to do anything. And then you're always
going to get the ten percent that will always you know,
you get the really really good and the really really
you know how we want to call it that, or
(25:50):
the people that want to you know, but that's not
the majority of people. And so if you're punishing the
majority just to prevent something from the minority, you need
to just look at it is sunk costs, Right, You're
always going to get people that are going to claim
that they never received the package you sent them, or
that it was defective even though they used it improperly
and all that. So you actually just have to plan
for that in rather than punishing the rest of the
(26:12):
people by making your policies too strict. Yep, yep.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Agree, And just recognize, just recognize that what we're selling
is not tickets. What we're selling is experienced and anytime
we can make that experience easier, better, more more memorable
than our revenue. And I know this sounds counterintuitive, and
I know there are accounting people out there who are
looking at me and saying, Scott, you don't understand You
(26:37):
just don't understand money. But I do understand human behavior.
And if people are pissed off at you, they're not
going to come to your park.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
YEP, that's right.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
Well, the next trend here, there are three trends that
IOP identified in this quarter. The next trend is Uncertainty
in the economy and politics also affected consumer sentiment, as
guests adopted a weight and see mentality before committing to visit. Yeah,
I don't know, I've actually heard. So I've been trying
to put together some sort of article about the haunted
(27:08):
attraction in space and how the trending data is going there.
And I've talked to a lot of folks in a
lot of different regions and I'm just getting so many
mixed signals. You know, some markets are up, some markets
are down, Some attractions in a market are up, and
some are down. But it does seem like talking to
some of the owners, a lot of them are saying
(27:29):
that it's just it is due to these things like
whether and I would my hypothesis here again is a
disomb been four is there's two things at play in
both of them, Iyapa captured. There's the uncertainty in the economy,
and then there's the politics of it, and so like,
for example, the attractions I've talked to in Chicago say
that their numbers are down, and they think it's due
(27:52):
to the stuff going on in Chicago, right the perceived
danger happening there. But then when you talk to people
in other segments, you know they they're up, like in
Vegas is up and some other markets are up. But
you hear people on the other side saying that they
had they change their ticket options to make it more
(28:12):
like like the Hannah option like talked about, or they
change their ticket options to make it more value option,
and that value option is selling better now than you know.
So I've seen both trends. But it's hard because there's
so many it's like everyone is almost saying a different story.
And I feel like, only with a large amount of
data could you really look at it and say, oh,
this is what's going on.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
But it does feel like it's and.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
I think that just I think that just reinforces the
uncertainty of things some people are, you know, it's it's
there is no there is no clear cut answer. And
if we think that this uncertainty is just in the
United States, it's not.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
It's global.
Speaker 2 (28:49):
And that was probably one of the biggest discussions during
I app Europe with with some of my friends that
are just like, tourism around the world is being impacted
because they don't know quite what's going to happen with
the US, and with the US in conjunction with other
countries around the world, there's nobody knows, so no one acts.
(29:12):
I think what's going to happen with the seasonal experiences.
I think they will make up money as we get
closer to Halloween, because people will finally go, well, we've
waited as long as we can and we don't want
to miss out, so let's go Yeah.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
Yeah, that's my guess. That's right, that's right. I guess
the last big trend.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
We're almost out of time, so we're going to discuss
the rest of this on our Patreon show. But the
last trend here is just about uh. While terrorsts remaining concern,
many manufacturers are optimistic for the years ahead, as orders
for new equipment to be delivered in twenty twenty seven
and beyond or strong. So the onliest story, we did
hear about the Mattel Park in Kansas City that has
(29:49):
been delayed and primarily due to terrorists. But so we
have again heard about but we've been talking about that
for the entire year. So I think that that's not
even a trend. That's also just like a fact of
you know, the and I think that ties factually, it.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
Ties back into the uncertainty as well, because again you
can't necessarily make plans if you don't know what tariffs
are going to happen this week.
Speaker 3 (30:07):
So that's right.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Yeah, anyway, all right, well we'll dive we'll probably, if
I know Philip and I, we will dive into this
tariff thing a little bit more deeply in our Patreon
show in Unhinged. But for those of you who are
listening here, thank you so much. Please subscribe. If you
are watching us on YouTube, please subscribe. We would really
appreciate that. Send us your comments, we'd love to hear them.
And until next week on behalf of Philip Bernandez myself
(30:29):
Scott Swinson. This is Green Tag Theme Park in thirty
and we will see you next week
Okay from our studios this week in Detroit and in Tampa.
This is Green Tag to Theme Parker and thirty. I'm
Philip and I'm joined as always on my co host
Scott Swinson of Scott Twinson creat Development. On Green Tag,
we look at the top news each week and explain
why it matters to business professionals. And this week we're
going to be talking a little bit about the uh
more news from six Flags, so there's always use with
(00:22):
six Flags nowadays. And then we're going to look at
the latest global trans report from AYAPA and discuss some
of the takeaways from that. So first, more is brewing
over at six Flags. We got we got.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Just the season for brewing, just the season for brewing.
There's there's a coven sitting around a big cauldron somewhere
and and it's certainly brewing, all right.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
And I guess two more members of that coven are leaving.
So yeah, six Flags did announce that two.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
More members of the board are going to be resigning
at the end of the year.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
This follows news a course of the CEO step down.
So the two that are leaving first is Selim Bessel,
which was the previous CEO of the previous six Flags
only chain, right, so he's leaving along with Daniel who
is the lead independent director. Now Selim would seem like
(01:20):
the you know, the more important, not too more important,
but you know, he has a lot of projects still
in the mix. But they said that he's he will
be staying on as a consultant for the company through
the opening of the new six Flags Kadia Park in
Saudi Arabia. And that's where the other piece of news,
kind of news came in where in the initial press
release where they announced that Seleem and Daniel were going
(01:43):
to be stepping down at the end of the year,
they mentioned that the six Flags Park was going to
be moving its opening date till twenty twenty six. However,
very soon after that press release went out, they issued
a correction saying that no, it was actually going to
still open in and so that created a second piece
(02:04):
of news about that kind of back and forth. But
the official news, I guess is that these two are
stepping down, and like I said, that follows the news
that we had previously about Richard Zimmerman stepping down. Now,
a replacement or successor for Zimmerman has not been named,
so it's kind of like, well, Zimmerman will be around
while they find a replacement, and then also Slim will
(02:25):
be around until this opens as a consultant. So it's
not a complete loss of this. But in terms of
what Basul said, I just thought his quote was interesting.
He said, leading the Six Flags board directors through a
period of transformation has been one of the most super
awarding experiences of my career. Together we built a stronger,
(02:46):
more innovative company, one that successfully completed the industry's largest merger,
expanded its growth opportunities, and refined the guest experience through
technology and creativity. I'm especially proud of that Six Flags
has been recognized as one of the best and brightest
companies to work for a nation. I'd prove of our
exceptional culture and dedication of our people.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
I'm not sure how much of that is true.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Well, you know, I don't know whether I have just
become in this world or because of my age or whatever.
I've just kind of become cynical, especially when I immediately
recognize rhetorics speak and that's exactly you know, basically, I mean,
let's break this down here. I'm so proud I'm so
glad that we got through this transition proving that this
(03:26):
is a great place to work, and now I'm leaving,
and not only leaving work. We got to point out
he's not just leaving work, he is now actually leaving
the industry because he's lined up a new gig as
the chairman of a Canadian online grosser.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
Yep.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
So it was like, oh, my god, my guess and
this is pure speculation, So pure speculation on my part.
My guess is he feels so beat up by this
whole transition period that it is time to focus on
something new, something different, to just kind of relax a
(04:01):
little bit. I don't know whether that's true or not.
That maybe oversimplifying the situation, but yeah, it's it's unfortunate
because again, I'm I've become very very cynical when I
hear when I hear phrases like together we built. As
you're leaving, you're saying together we built, I just get
(04:23):
a little sarcastic, I guess about that because it's hard
to buy.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
Yeah, it's one of those whatever the saying is where
you know, everything you say is an admission you kind
of thing where it's like, well, you know why, there
are other things he could have said, So it's kind
of like joining attention to these things almost makes it
seem like, yeah, it is a.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Weird lily a bit. It's it's it's certainly really. I mean,
if he had said, if he had said, you know,
this has been a rewarding experience for me, I'm very
proud of what we were able to accomplish. But it
is I recogniz that it's time for me to move on.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Yes, right, that's a great story. That's right, that's right,
that's right.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
But he's still but he's still a consultant, so he can't. Yes,
he has to still tow the party line, which I understand.
You know, we've all worked for corporations. I understand that
that necessity.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
But it just it's it's.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
A whole paragraph that basically says absolutely nothing in my opinion.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Yeah, well, uh, and so was speaking of him staying
on as a consultant.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
So that.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
This is interesting again because I think the first time
we heard about Richard, I meant I mentioned how that
was kind of like not a great sign when you
were trying to execute this this big vision, right that
we talked about they had the whole leadership vision where
they presented to investors about this plan that we thought
was actually a good plan. But where we have argued
(05:53):
and again this is just us where we have been
arguing it is it kind of seems like it has
not really been executed. And maybe that's because there's so
many staff, it's such a big who knows why. But
the execution doesn't seem like it's quite gotten there. And
so then you're saying we're going to remove leadership. Well
that's never a good sign classically when you're trying to
get a new initiative done through. Is the leaderships changing
and now it seems it seems like it's now more
(06:16):
leadership is leaving. However, maybe not, because a lot of
the pushback we got in comments when I said that
was that he's still going to be around anyway, and
that this gives the opportunity for new blood to come
in and maybe connect more of the park manager park Nation,
you know, maybe basically be a better bridge. And so,
you know, I think maybe that's the same case here,
(06:37):
like Saline will still be around. If somebody has a
question about working with the government in Kadea or something
about logistics he'll still be around, but maybe it gives
the opportunity for a better bridge between the people need
to actually execute, which would be the park managers and
the area managers, and then the people who are in
the Ivory tower, which is the board.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
So maybe.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
So I mean, yeah, I think that anytime you have
two major conglomerates coming together, there's always going to be
growing pains, and sometimes it is beneficial to instead of
doing it six Flags way or Cedar fairway, is to
do it a new way and to find new people
who can and execute that. With this number, however, abandoned
(07:23):
abandoning ship, I think is probably a safe analogy to use.
With this number of people abandoning ship, I have to
ask what do they know that we don't know.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
That's true, because you know.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
They have information that will not be released, nor should
it be it's you know, proprietary business stuff. But and
could it be something may be something as simple as
they know what the new leadership is going to look like,
and they don't necessarily recognize their place in it, or
they don't recognize their it's contrary to their belief in leadership,
(07:58):
because let's face it, there's a million different ways to
lead a company, and well not a million, but there's
many different ways to lead a company, and sometimes you know,
it is it is best for the company overall to
cut ties with the opposition. You know, it's it's time
to say, okay, we're now. I don't know, I didn't
see it anywhere in the in the article, but maybe
you've seen anything. What kind of what kind of exit
(08:21):
packages did these guys get? What kind of golden parachutes
were there?
Speaker 3 (08:25):
So I didn't see that.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
I'm sure the information is probably out there somewhere, but
I didn't see any articles that I read.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
I'm assuming that there's there's something. There's always always something. Yeah,
there's always something. But I but again, I I hope,
I hope that what we're saying here is is true
for the company as a whole. I hope that there
is you know, it will bring in the or will
open up the possibility to bring in some new blood.
(08:51):
The challenge, I think is going to be finding that
balance between pruning to allow for new growth and cutting
so far back that the tree dies. So you kind
of have to find in any corporation. You know, I'm
not even speaking necessarily about six flags in any corporation
where you have a change of strategy or as change
of leadership leadership strategy, you have to kind of find
(09:16):
that balance. You have to figure out how much can
we trim back so that we can allow for some
new growth, some new ideas, some new people, some new experiences,
And how much is it when we cut too far
back that we don't have any sort of history knowledge.
You know, you're kind of going in green, because then
you're tempted or likely to make the same mistakes that
(09:37):
have been made before, because you know, the first time
they made those mistakes, it sounded like a good idea.
And if there's nobody around to remember that it was
we thought it was a good idea, but it wasn't,
then you just end up spinning your wheels and making
the same mistakes over and over again. So I'm hoping
that this is not a landslide the beginning of a
landslide trend. And I'm hoping that, you know, the folks
(09:58):
who commented it opens up space for new you know,
new blood, new ideas. But I don't know, you know,
based on what we've seen with the Six Flags properties
and the Six Flags parks, and I'm not sure who
they're going.
Speaker 3 (10:15):
To be able to draw into their fold. That is true.
That is true.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
It is worrying that there's not a successor being like
groomed like more publicly, you know, for zimmer Man, that
is that is concerning, you know. And yeah, but the
the other piece too, which I think is interesting, it
is about.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
The date change and yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
And so basically six Flags is is a telling everybody, oh,
it was just a typo, basically like it was just
a mistake, you know, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
Now, Scott, you know, as someone.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
Who's worked in corporation, so that both of us have,
I don't really think it's likely that there was a
mistake of that magnitude in the press release. I think
it's more likely that it was announced because now there
have been quite a few reporters that have talked about
who are more there locally in the area, who have
talked about how the site is not doesn't look like
(11:18):
it's at all close to being reaid open, right, this
is not prepared. So there's been quite a few reporters
mentioning that. But we also know that when they want
something to open, they can just throw money at it.
I mean the amount of money they can throw that
will really that they can build stuff very quickly there
if they want to.
Speaker 3 (11:36):
But so I do.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
Again, this is conjecture, right, I do suspect that they
probably thought that. I think maybe it's a difference of Again,
that's like a cultural difference. Like probably when this site
will be ready it is probably twenty twenty six, but
when it will open will be twenty twenty five, and
it will just open where not everything is ready, but
it will still be open.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
If any, if any of our listeners have ever worked
in the Middle East, you know, you know as well
as I do.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
You do not, you do not, You.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Do not open late, doesn't matter what you open. Those
gates open on time. And you know, having having opened
two different attractions there, it's amazing what can happen in
the last I would say month or even week as
to what gets installed. And there are even times that
(12:31):
I have witnessed, not in the attractions that I've worked in,
but the attractions that were adjacent to some other attractions,
and talking to other people, there were times where things
were opened and then sections were opened and then closed
again so that they could go back and do it correctly.
But they had to they had to open on time.
You know, in the US, it's we think about it
in many cases as let's let's underpromise and over deliver.
(12:55):
But the mindset, from at least my experience in the
Middle East is if we announce a date and then
we back away from it, that shows weakness. So we
don't want to show weakness. We want to show that
we know what we're doing. We're completely in we're completely
in sync with you know, what we said we were
going to do, we are going to do, and it
(13:15):
is going to be the biggest, fastest. I find it
interesting that, you know, even on social media, we're seeing
test runs of the Falcon coaster, Falcon's flight, We're seeing
we're seeing ads for it looking like the park is
completely open and people are playing in it and having
(13:35):
a lovely time. So yeah, I think that it was
probably an attempt to manage expectations so that way, if
they did open, you know, say they opened at the
end of twenty five for a sneak peek or a
(13:58):
preliminary open or whatever, then open fully in twenty six.
It's just an attitude shift, you know. It's really if
you think about it, It's really no different than saying
we will officially open in early twenty five, I'm sorry,
in early twenty six, and then do a beta test
or a sneak peek or whatever in twenty five. You know,
(14:20):
you either open in twenty five or you don't. That's
the mentality they have in the in the Middle East.
And when we say we're going to open in twenty five,
we are going to open in twenty five. I've also
found that in many cases, and again this is conjecture,
but in many cases in the Middle East, with the
construction companies, they don't get paid until the job is done,
(14:40):
so they've been fronting salaries for all of the workers
and some cases, in some cases, let me put it
that way, I don't know whether it's true with everything
at Kidea City or not, but in some cases they
will have to front the salaries and literally hold the people,
hold the workers in the country until the project is complete.
(15:02):
So I could I could see it, and I'm this
is a hypothetical situation based on my experience, but I
could see very comfortably them saying, well, if we're not
opening until twenty six, then we're not paying you until
twenty six and companies going that will shoot twenty five
in the foot for all of us. So there's a
(15:23):
lot of there's a lot of unique cultural issues that
are going on here. And to me, it sounds kind
of like the Americans were the American side was trying
to say, yeah, we're going to open, but we won't
be completely open, and and the other side is saying, no,
we're gonna open. We're gonna open and people are gonna
be in the door, and we're gonna start making our
(15:44):
money back and then we'll pay you.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
So I don't know. I think it's I think it's interesting.
I think it's unfortunate because you know, when we were
there obviously, when we when we toured six Flags Kadea,
it was no where and you're ready and we knew it,
but that was quite quite some time ago. Well, yeah,
you're absolutely right though, when you throw money at it, Yeah,
(16:09):
when you have to make it's amazing how your your
work schedule can expand or contract to the amount of
time you actually have.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
That's right. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
See, I actually disagree with some of the reporters just
because when you and I were there on site, I
was like I was almost shocked at how much was
ready then in a paradoxical way, like they had the
basic infrastructure, the buildings, the sewer lines, the power, and
that's the stuff you can't I mean all the other stuff,
like you know, maybe you don't you don't have to
(16:37):
open this one section or you know whatever, But I.
Speaker 3 (16:40):
Mean, as long as you have like the main area.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
We were in the main hub area, and then there
was a few food and beverage locations that were pretty
close to opening. That's all you really need, you know,
just open one ride and some food and beverage locations
and the main hub and that's that's open basically. That's
that's close enough I think for for what they're doing,
then you can open the rest of the lands later.
But and I think, knowing how quickly they work in
(17:04):
that region when there's money, I think that they can
get there.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Yeah, I don't see it. I was kind of surprised
when when they pushed the date back originally because it
didn't it didn't seem like it didn't seem like that
was necessary. But you know, again, we were there earlier
in the year, so.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Well, Okay, our next story here is about the the
state of the Global Attractions industry for the third quarter,
and this was put out by AYAPA and it is
basically a synthesis of interviews that they did with their
advisory committee, which is about twenty two members that operators
(17:48):
that are spread all throughout the world about trends are seen.
Speaker 3 (17:51):
And basically they.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
They identified three trends and then there's an information per region,
and then there's some.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
Additional research they added to it.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
And the first trend, the biggest one is of course weather,
So I can't it says unfavorable weather has defined twenty
twenty five. Many operators report that the spring months have
proved wet and unseasonably cold, discouraging guest visitation. By contrast,
the early summer months proved exceedingly hot, which also had
(18:25):
a negative impact on visitation. Well, geez, and I will
just say that also. You know, here in Detroit where
we are, it has been unseasonably warm for a long
period of time, like it just this week and we're
already halfway through October, is when it started to drop
below sixty five and then the tree started to change color.
(18:46):
And so that does discourage people going to haunted houses
and going to indoor attractions because if it's warm in Michigan,
you're going.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
To want to do stuff as long as you can. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
Yeah, So there is some to it, right, But at
the same time, as we've always been saying over and
over and over, at this point, the weather trend isn't
a trend.
Speaker 3 (19:03):
It is just a fact.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
Well, and to me, this shouldn't be This shouldn't be
excuses for why twenty five is going to be low
for me. This should be a list of here's what
we need to plan for for twenty six, you know.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
Right.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
It goes back to that post crisis leadership mentality of Okay,
what do we learn here, and we need to have
parallel paths going going. If it's if it's too cold,
then we need to have heaters for our cues.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
If it's too.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Warm, then we need to find a way to perhaps
move some of our attractions outside. I mean, we need
to find you need to find ways to deal with
this kind of thing. And that's that's what long range
business planning is, you know. And and yes it may
have come up, you know, for some reason weather magically
started in twenty twenty five. I don't necessarily think that's true.
(19:53):
But it's the kind of thing that I think we
should all look at and the takeaway should be plan
for whatever. You know, have a plan in place. If
you never use it, you never use it, not a problem.
But but go through that exercise and find somebody who can,
you know, help you with those kinds of with those
kinds of plans. It may be something as simple as marketing.
(20:15):
You know, it may be some market it differently if
if the if the weather is rough. You know. One
of the things that locally they did here for a while.
I don't know whether they're still doing it or not,
but Florida Aquarium and Zoo Tampa used to say they
had a reciprocal ticket agreement, so that if it was
(20:35):
raining and you had a ticket to the zoo, you
could go to the aquarium. And if you had a
ticket to the aquarium and it was a beautiful sunny day,
you could go to the zoo. So to me, that's
just good business planning. And then they would share in
those they would share in those revenues. So it's making
certain it's kind of going back to the basics. It's
making certain that your guests are happy. It's making certain
(20:58):
that you're because the happy guests are gonna come to
your park.
Speaker 3 (21:02):
You know, I do.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
I do think this is a little bit of a pendulum.
Of of course, during the pandemic, we went all the
way to the one, you know, to one side with
ticketing where we're saying you have to have a date
reserved and a time slot reserved, and this whole time ticketing,
and there is a lot of merit to that. You know,
how much have we discussed time ticketing and dynamic pricing
(21:24):
and how much it helps and et cetera, et cetera.
But then on the flip side, if your attraction is
not prepared for weather, then I don't think that you
can enforce that sort of those sort of rules about
time ticketing and about you. I mean again, if you're
telling the customer they have to show up in this
half hour window for your attraction, but then parts of
(21:44):
your attraction are not open during that time or there's
negative weather on there, I don't think that's going to work.
So I do kind of think that we're going a
little bit into the other side of it, being more
flexible like it was pre pandemic, you know, But even
now with a we were talking about last week the
Disneyland prices and Disneyland. I mean, you still have to
(22:05):
make your park reservations in California, and then there's again
that thing what happens if it's something closes or this
or that or whatever, well then you've just and that's
a lot of money in that case, you know, and
they're not going to give you a refund or let
you change your day.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
Like that's we're starting. That's starting to get difficult. And
one a.
Speaker 2 (22:23):
Perfect example where time ticketing is beneficial to the company
but not to the guest.
Speaker 3 (22:27):
That's right, that's right.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
And I think one example recently that I just just
this weekend, I visited Hannah Haunted Acres in Indianapolis, and
they changed their policy last year due to rain, and
they've kept the policy, which is that they have their
tickets are good for their five attractions. I believe any
general tickets good for those five. And they changed the
(22:50):
policy last year to say if you as long as
you do at least one attraction, you can come back
any other night that they're open and do any of
their attractions. So if you show up and it does
happen to rain and you don't want to go through
the corn maze in the rain, then you can come
back and do it another night. And they also are
open every day in October, like every their Halloween stuff
(23:12):
is open every day, you know, seven days a week,
and so you truly can come back anytime. Now that
still doesn't help people that are visiting who are just
there for one day, but I think for the locals
it does make a big difference where you can say
and it also you talk to me about how basically
you can cheat the system because you can buy a
(23:32):
Monday ticket for twenty five dollars and then you come
back back that on Saturday, And he kind of was
saying that it's worth it to him to allow that
just because of the goodwill that it buys them, where
if price really, really really is a concern for them,
then you just buy a Monday ticket, show up, and
then come back with your friends on Saturday. And I
(23:53):
think that attitude is probably more where we're going to
have to start swinging if if nobody can do anything
about like if the attractions continue to just say we
can't do anything about weather and like cross their arms,
and then I just think you're gonna have to start
going to that direction with ticketing.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Yeah, and it's so it's funny because I'm listening to
I've gone back and I'm revisiting make it stick or
made the stick and make it and one of the
things they one of the things that they talk about.
I just listened to it this morning as a matter
of fact, that you know, they talk about the guests
(24:30):
the customers. The customers don't want to buy a drill bit.
They want to buy a three quarter inch hole so
they can kick pictures of their kids. Guests don't want
to buy tickets. They want to have an experience where
they have fun. And if the if the ticket doesn't
you know, is only for this time, the ticket's useless.
The ticket is worthless to them because they can't get in.
(24:51):
And I love the idea that. Okay, so you get
somebody who cheats the system. We're so you know, we're
so concerned about cheating the system. But it goes back
to you know, my slice of cheese story. There's so
many stories about how when you make a guest centered
choice that you actually improve your business. It doesn't, it's
not detro metal to your business. So I guess my
(25:13):
argument or a con argument or the opposite argument to
the people say you can scam the system is okay,
but you sold a ticket that you might not have sold.
That's right, you know, because if they are and they
are cost averse, then.
Speaker 3 (25:26):
Yeah, and most people don't do that, you know.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Again, it's back to the whole thing about it's usually
like eighty or seventy twenty twenty. It's where it's like,
you know, eighty percent of the people are just gonna
do the normal thing, and then you're always going to
get the ten percent that are going to try you
whenever they can to do anything. And then you're always
going to get the ten percent that will always you know,
you get the really really good and the really really
you know how we want to call it that, or
(25:50):
the people that want to you know, but that's not
the majority of people. And so if you're punishing the
majority just to prevent something from the minority, you need
to just look at it is sunk costs, Right, You're
always going to get people that are going to claim
that they never received the package you sent them, or
that it was defective even though they used it improperly
and all that. So you actually just have to plan
for that in rather than punishing the rest of the
(26:12):
people by making your policies too strict. Yep, yep.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Agree, And just recognize, just recognize that what we're selling
is not tickets. What we're selling is experienced and anytime
we can make that experience easier, better, more more memorable
than our revenue. And I know this sounds counterintuitive, and
I know there are accounting people out there who are
looking at me and saying, Scott, you don't understand You
(26:37):
just don't understand money. But I do understand human behavior.
And if people are pissed off at you, they're not
going to come to your park.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
YEP, that's right.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
Well, the next trend here, there are three trends that
IOP identified in this quarter. The next trend is Uncertainty
in the economy and politics also affected consumer sentiment, as
guests adopted a weight and see mentality before committing to visit. Yeah,
I don't know, I've actually heard. So I've been trying
to put together some sort of article about the haunted
(27:08):
attraction in space and how the trending data is going there.
And I've talked to a lot of folks in a
lot of different regions and I'm just getting so many
mixed signals. You know, some markets are up, some markets
are down, Some attractions in a market are up, and
some are down. But it does seem like talking to
some of the owners, a lot of them are saying
(27:29):
that it's just it is due to these things like
whether and I would my hypothesis here again is a
disomb been four is there's two things at play in
both of them, Iyapa captured. There's the uncertainty in the economy,
and then there's the politics of it, and so like,
for example, the attractions I've talked to in Chicago say
that their numbers are down, and they think it's due
(27:52):
to the stuff going on in Chicago, right the perceived
danger happening there. But then when you talk to people
in other segments, you know they they're up, like in
Vegas is up and some other markets are up. But
you hear people on the other side saying that they
had they change their ticket options to make it more
(28:12):
like like the Hannah option like talked about, or they
change their ticket options to make it more value option,
and that value option is selling better now than you know.
So I've seen both trends. But it's hard because there's
so many it's like everyone is almost saying a different story.
And I feel like, only with a large amount of
data could you really look at it and say, oh,
this is what's going on.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
But it does feel like it's and.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
I think that just I think that just reinforces the
uncertainty of things some people are, you know, it's it's
there is no there is no clear cut answer. And
if we think that this uncertainty is just in the
United States, it's not.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
It's global.
Speaker 2 (28:49):
And that was probably one of the biggest discussions during
I app Europe with with some of my friends that
are just like, tourism around the world is being impacted
because they don't know quite what's going to happen with
the US, and with the US in conjunction with other
countries around the world, there's nobody knows, so no one acts.
(29:12):
I think what's going to happen with the seasonal experiences.
I think they will make up money as we get
closer to Halloween, because people will finally go, well, we've
waited as long as we can and we don't want
to miss out, so let's go Yeah.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
Yeah, that's my guess. That's right, that's right. I guess
the last big trend.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
We're almost out of time, so we're going to discuss
the rest of this on our Patreon show. But the
last trend here is just about uh. While terrorsts remaining concern,
many manufacturers are optimistic for the years ahead, as orders
for new equipment to be delivered in twenty twenty seven
and beyond or strong. So the onliest story, we did
hear about the Mattel Park in Kansas City that has
(29:49):
been delayed and primarily due to terrorists. But so we
have again heard about but we've been talking about that
for the entire year. So I think that that's not
even a trend. That's also just like a fact of
you know, the and I think that ties factually, it.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
Ties back into the uncertainty as well, because again you
can't necessarily make plans if you don't know what tariffs
are going to happen this week.
Speaker 3 (30:07):
So that's right.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Yeah, anyway, all right, well we'll dive we'll probably, if
I know Philip and I, we will dive into this
tariff thing a little bit more deeply in our Patreon
show in Unhinged. But for those of you who are
listening here, thank you so much. Please subscribe. If you
are watching us on YouTube, please subscribe. We would really
appreciate that. Send us your comments, we'd love to hear them.
And until next week on behalf of Philip Bernandez myself
(30:29):
Scott Swinson. This is Green Tag Theme Park in thirty
and we will see you next week
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