I escaped from the red pill cult! | Rantzerker 247

Pillar of journalistic integrity The Guardian just released a bombshell piece where a former red-piller breaks his silence and EXPOSES the cult! IT'S ALL OGRE! Karen and Alison try to cope!

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Coming to you live from deep within a mouse filled
radioactive wasteland. We are the survivors of the alt right, Keckpopolix,
the Few, the brave, the bitchy, once more waiting into
battle against the Red Pill CULTI hordes with I escape
from the Red Pill Cult brand Zerker number two four seven.

(00:25):
I am your host, Alison, and with me is Brian
the Indefagable. Oh that that sounds bad, You know what
I meant? Right, okay, and also the indomitable Karen, which
I'm pretty sure I pronounced correctly. So here we are,
all right, Brian? Did you want to explain what we're
doing today?

Speaker 2 (00:44):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (00:46):
I'm still here, right, Yes.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
I am, Yeah, you're still there. Yes. So we got
this article and an I assume an accompanying video that
came out with it. It seems like a very short video,
but yes, uh, yeah, it's a short it's a short video.
It's like three minutes long.

Speaker 3 (01:05):
I'm to stretch it into the full two hours though, yep.

Speaker 2 (01:09):
Yeah, you know that.

Speaker 1 (01:10):
We we definitely have the ability to extend time, shall
we say?

Speaker 2 (01:14):
Yeah? All right, but we have this video, uh and
this article from the Guardian that I guess is a warning,
a warning to anyone who is like enormy blue pilled
person that the Manisphere is a cult, and it came
for this young man and he just barely managed to

(01:36):
escape his teeth because he almost ended up criticizing women
or something so close. It was a close one. That's all,
you know, That's all I can say. Yeah, and apparently,
you know, this guy is claiming that he was a

(01:58):
part of the Manisphere, and now that he is on
the other side, he is blowing the whistle on the
whole thing. The whole operation is over. Guys, where we're exposed.
We're exposed and we're done. So we're cooking.

Speaker 1 (02:11):
Yeah, yeah, so we are. We are actually reading our
epitaph now or our obituary. Yeah, you're so cooked.

Speaker 2 (02:19):
This is this is the dead the dead Internet theory is.
But we're the only people who died.

Speaker 1 (02:26):
Yeah, well, so we're speaking from you to you from
the great beyond. Okay, summarily destroyed.

Speaker 3 (02:33):
But one second, yeah, okay, enough, it's nowhere near your
dinner time.

Speaker 1 (02:42):
She disagrees. She would like to have a word with
the manager.

Speaker 3 (02:46):
It's daylight saving time, okay, but she usually eats at four.
It only feels like three.

Speaker 1 (02:53):
She no, okay, so she thinks it's time to eat
because she thinks it's four. No, but it's two there.

Speaker 3 (03:00):
Yeah, so it only it only feels like three right now?

Speaker 1 (03:04):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (03:05):
Okay, well shush dog, Alison told you so.

Speaker 1 (03:11):
Yes I did, all right, So how okay, just just
it to preface this, like where do we do? We
exist within the manisphere?

Speaker 3 (03:22):
Are we?

Speaker 1 (03:22):
I guess for the purposes of these adjacent Yeah, manisphere,
which might as well make us just basically.

Speaker 2 (03:30):
Like Jason, Yeah, I mean yes, Allison, like I'm you know,
we can we can do this dance of definitions all day.
But in the eyes of the Guardian, yes, we are
the manisphere. Justice, we are just as much the manisphere
as Jordan Peterson, as Nick Fuentes, as Donald Trump Junior,

(03:56):
as Stephen Crowder. Like you notice I'm naming a bunch
of not manisphere, your people that are in the That's
how manisphere we are. And this is what they believe.
And I'm not being funny. This is the truth. And
one who disagrees with them is manisphere basically is manis fair?

Speaker 3 (04:14):
So yes, yes, I mean it's it's weird because like
I I interviewed rouge V kind of after he'd left
the pick up artist thing behind, right, and decided that
he actually does want to settle down and have a family, right.
I interviewed Sasha day Game after he kind of left
the whole, you know, pick up artist thing behind. I.

(04:37):
You know, like I interview these guys, right, you know,
like and and basically it's kind of like interviewing Gilgamesh
after his first adventure with and key Do, right. You know,
It's it's like they've matured and they've decided that like
just banging chicks isn't really the end all be all
of of every era. Yeah. Yeah, And it's like, okay,

(05:01):
so this is before they slew the Bull of Heaven.
But you know, after they freaking you know, after Gilgamesh
turned down Vishnu, the the goddess who goes through men
like who's who's can chews up men like freaking confetti,
and then then like they don't much care whether she

(05:23):
like swallows them or spits them out, right, you know.

Speaker 1 (05:27):
She considering this is Sumerian mythology.

Speaker 3 (05:30):
Yeah, well, I mean basically she had a history of
like seducing mortal men, right, and then when she got
tired of them, would like turn them into like frogs
and like lizards and bacteria and shit, right as you know, yeah,
as you do when you tire of them man, and
he no longer pleases you. So yeah, no, and and

(05:54):
so so Gilgamesh was just like, yeah, bitch, I don't
think so, I don't think two thirds god, one third man,
and you can't seduce me. Mm hmm yeah yeah. And
and I think that's where men need to.

Speaker 1 (06:09):
Get the fractions. There a little question.

Speaker 3 (06:15):
I'm pretty sure. I'm pretty sure they did not quite
get the whole genetics thing right.

Speaker 1 (06:23):
Well, I mean, it was mythology there was a worse
god that was born of nine tree roots, so.

Speaker 3 (06:29):
It was it was a it was one woman who
had sex with two gods but wouldn't.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
Okay, So that oh, okay, all right, there's no questioning,
all right. So I just want to say, yeah, yeah,
we're moving back into the topic. It's it's a little
bit of a rough transition to go from Sumerian mythology
to mena.

Speaker 3 (06:52):
But here's the thing. It's not it's really not okay,
all right, it's it's it's it's so it's a to
quote fricking beauty in the beast. It's a tale as
old as time. You know, men begin in a certain way,
you know, their masculinity is a certain way. And then

(07:13):
over time and experience right and and dealing with the
hardships of the world, and and learning from their mistakes,
they become mature males.

Speaker 1 (07:26):
Can I just point out that this kid looks like
it looks like he's his His lips are permanently hermetically
sealed to the teacher's ass.

Speaker 3 (07:36):
He looks like he looks like Harry, Saystan't I don't.

Speaker 2 (07:40):
Think that's a real person.

Speaker 1 (07:42):
Oh oh, you think it's ai generator. You might be right,
you probably are, But yeah, he looks like I'm gonna
get my five minutes of fame. I'm a teenager who
has lured.

Speaker 2 (07:51):
Into this is not the guy from the video, so
this this might be a different whistleblower if that's the guy.
But shall we.

Speaker 1 (08:03):
I wandered into a bunch of websites that gave me
information that wasn't approved of by the school Board of
the UK. Gosh, golly, I escaped a cult when I
turned my computer off for the day. Okay, all right,
so everyone, if you want to send a message any
point throughout the show feed the badger dot com slash

(08:25):
just the tip very best way to do that, and yeah,
let's I can. Let's just do it. Let's just start all.

Speaker 2 (08:33):
Right, We're gonna get into the article. I'm gonna read
it right, yes, okay, So this is from The Guardian
and it is entitled I'm a teenager who was lured
into the manisphere. Here's how to reach young men like me.
Masculinity isn't is almost always presented as toxic on my feed.
But we need constructive alternatives to give hope to those

(08:54):
who feel lost.

Speaker 1 (08:57):
Okay, so far, yes day guys, note, yeah, this is okay.

Speaker 3 (09:00):
But that's the trap, right like that isn't That's the
peanut butter in the fucking mouse trap.

Speaker 1 (09:07):
Just so, what he's saying is that there is an
overwhelming amount of anti mail sentiment going that he is
being subjected to. Are we going to hold on to
that at all? And ask ourselves, if we're so concerned
about the manisphere, shouldn't we have a little bit of

(09:29):
space to be concerned about the femosphere Since the fmosphere
dwarfs the manisphere like a yurt sorry, Mount Everest Dwarf's
a yurt.

Speaker 3 (09:40):
Well, okay, the manisphere only essentially essentially exists online, right,
the themisphere is institutionalized and has university in college.

Speaker 1 (09:52):
And gigantic paide in the West, billion, if not trillions
of dollars and so can we can we addres that's
the fact that taxpayers are paying billions of dollars to
teach this kid to hate himself?

Speaker 3 (10:06):
Is that? Is that?

Speaker 1 (10:07):
Are we gonna see?

Speaker 3 (10:08):
There's too much to ask, right, this subtitle, this subtitle
is basically it is the peanut butter in the mouse trap, okay, right,
And and so it is the trojan horse, right because
you look at it and there's really nothing objectionable about
it except it's the Guardian. So you know what's coming

(10:29):
afterwards is going to be like a complete bait and switch. Yeah. No, Actually,
men should learn how to cry more at but not
bother women.

Speaker 1 (10:40):
Yeah, they have nothing to cry about. And if they
think they do, they're toxic.

Speaker 3 (10:44):
Yeah. And if they cry to their wives, or if
they cry to their wives or girlfriends, then ex emotional labor.

Speaker 1 (10:53):
Okay, all right, let's.

Speaker 2 (10:57):
If you judge modern boyhood from the headline, do you
think we were broken, radicalize, misogynistic angry. But as a
teenage boy myself, I don't see a generation of lost
boys around me. I see young men trying to make
sense of a world that seems apathetic to our voices. Seems,
I would say, openly hostile, sug.

Speaker 1 (11:21):
We're already sort of moving away from that that mouse
trap there. Have you noticed that now we start with,
we start roth hostile, Now we're at apathetic and yeah, okay,
all right.

Speaker 3 (11:34):
So we're already screaming. Screaming at somebody to shut up
is not apathetic. No, you know, you can just tune
them out. You can just put on your noise canceling
headphones and not listen. Okay, you don't need you don't
need to bitch them out for it, you know, and
tell them that, like they have nothing to complain about,

(11:54):
your privilege, your privilege, so shut the fuck up.

Speaker 1 (11:57):
Yeah. Yeah, I've actually been having conversations with GROC about
the size of these relative factors. I had a discussion
about actually, you know, I'll save that. It'll be essentially
looking at miss injury versus misogyny and how they defined

(12:18):
the two, and it was interesting, but I'll save that
for a little bit later. Okay, can you really read
into the middle of this next paragraph.

Speaker 2 (12:28):
So we have some time to respond, all right. I'd
be the first to admit that there are serious issues
facing young men my age. I've experienced some of them firsthand.
Between the ages of twelve and fourteen, I was drawn
into harmful online communities promising me money, meaning and manhood.
Muscular wealthy men leading through Dubai, draped in designer labels

(12:50):
and flanked by beautiful women flooded my feed.

Speaker 3 (12:55):
Okay, so that's Andrew t.

Speaker 1 (12:59):
Or Saudi princes.

Speaker 2 (13:03):
Princes are manisphere though, but maybe maybe they count.

Speaker 1 (13:07):
Maybe they count, Like because.

Speaker 2 (13:09):
Anywhere on the Internet where there's a man and he's
not being stomped on or ridiculed or just down by
a woman, maybe that's.

Speaker 1 (13:18):
More tithing to feminism. That's the manisphere.

Speaker 2 (13:22):
Essentially. That's is a video of space Marine saying for
the Emperor, that's the manisphere.

Speaker 1 (13:29):
Yeah. And it's also anywhere where a boy has a
positive feeling about his masculinity, that's the matisphere. God forbid.

Speaker 2 (13:37):
Henisphere is a video about, uh, you know, a guy
showing off the guns he just got.

Speaker 3 (13:44):
Yeah, no, and it's it's it's like, okay, so you
have you have the aspirational right and everybody knows that
they're not going to be driving a Lamborghini through Dubai
with like sixteen bitches fallowing them, right, and a leopard yeah,

(14:05):
and a pet pet cheetah or whatever. Right, But but
what they what they what those aspirational figures do is
it it gives you something that you know you're never
gonna achieve, but you could achieve parts of it. You
could achieve pieces of it. You could actually get a
six pack maybe, and and you know and maybe not

(14:29):
guns on the range, but guns you know, on your arms, right,
and you you could you could maybe score one chick.

Speaker 1 (14:38):
Yeah right exactly, yeah yeah.

Speaker 3 (14:42):
And so it's like, you know, like all all of
these things like including looks, maxing and things like that
that a lot of young men are into these days,
not a lot, but like a minority of young men
are into. It can be really unhealthy, just like it
can be for women. You know, like when when you

(15:03):
take the plastic surgery just that much too far, but
when when you actually when you actually look at it, right,
there is an aspiration. No kid, no little boy playing
with a he man doll, thought he was ever going
to have that body when he grew up. M right

(15:24):
like it and no, no, little kid reading a Superman
comic book, right, young little kid, little boy right thought?
You know, like if I just try hard enough, I'll
be able to fly.

Speaker 2 (15:39):
For sure.

Speaker 3 (15:40):
So it's like, you know, but it's aspirational exactly. Yeah,
like Spider Man's not a freaking a realistic male figure
role model for young men. But you know it's better
than nothing. Yea more?

Speaker 2 (16:06):
All right? Should I continue?

Speaker 3 (16:07):
Or yeah?

Speaker 2 (16:08):
Step the way, Yeah, I.

Speaker 1 (16:11):
Just have to deal with the the I accidentally put
the the catbird entertainment device up too loud, so I'm
sure that we're going to get some from the sound
autists eventually that where are the birds coming from? So
I had to turn it down. But anyway, I've derailed enough.

Speaker 3 (16:27):
Let's keep going, all right, all right?

Speaker 2 (16:29):
They said there was no excuse for the rest of
us not to be in their position too, and offered
what they claimed was a blueprint to get us there.
Misogyny was rife in these communities, as was political extremism.
There it is, yeah, there it is.

Speaker 1 (16:44):
Really that was quite a quick snap on that mouse trap.
Misogyny was rife in these communities, as was political extremism. Okay, well,
I as much as I know people were concerned about AI.
I asked Groc and I actually ask like multiple ais,
I don't just ask one. And to analyze the level

(17:07):
of mysingry versus misogyny generally in the online world, I
think it would surprise no one to find out that
miss injury is a much bigger problem. It's phenomenally bigger.
There is a lot more casual missenger oh yeah, yeah yeah,
And there's a lot morectional mysingry. There's a lot more

(17:27):
media amplified mys injury. There's a lot more miss injury
that is paid for by the taxpayer for being promoted.
So it is a big miss injury is a big business.
And then when you turn around and they say there's
misogyny in these spaces, what do you mean by misogyny?

Speaker 3 (17:43):
What do you mean by that?

Speaker 1 (17:45):
Because I actually ask rock what is how do men
and women complain about each other on Twitter? And Twitter
is like the dread space of the like that Twitter
is manos seers central according to these people, right yeah
x x X, sir Exeter. So I asked them, And
men complain about things like hypergamy, which is a behavior

(18:08):
which is actually empirically founded. It's it is, it is
at epirically correct, verified pattern of behavior in women, and
men complain about that, right. They complain about I don't

(18:30):
even action, They complain about being labeled toxic and I mean, yeah, well.

Speaker 3 (18:36):
I mean that I don't even I don't even think.
They complain about hypergamy. They complain about hypergamy in uh
in a in the within the context of affirmative action
for women.

Speaker 1 (18:50):
Yeah, And they also complain about hypergamy in terms of
you know, what they're expected to like the whole I
am the table nonsense, and what they're expected to achieve
as men.

Speaker 3 (19:01):
Yeah, because because all of these artificially propped up women,
right are pricing themselves out of the fucking dating market. Right. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:11):
So my overall point is this, and I want to
get to it before before you continue. The overall point
that I'm making is that men complain about verified behaviors
that women engage in. They complain about verified institutional discrimination
like affirmative action. They complain about media promotion of miss

(19:33):
injry like toxic masculinity, what women are complaining about. Is
men full set? What it's They call it patriarchy or
male privilege or male entitlement, none of which is empirically
sound statements about men's behavior. I want to repeat that
these are not empirically sound observations about men's behavior. These

(19:57):
are false impressions construct did by a narrative and they
are they And they instead of complaining about, like I said,
a verifiable behavior that women engage in, they complain about
the existence of men. What does patriarchy mean? What does
male privilege mean? What does male entitlement mean? These are
considered to be emergent properties of men. Somehow, women don't

(20:21):
have privilege, Women aren't entitled to things. These are problems
that only men do. And they keep increasing the number
of things that they tag is just a male issue,
like man's spreading, man'splaining, man interrupting, man slamming. So they
take something that is a antisocial or just rude behavior,

(20:42):
they slap a male label on it and say it's
an emergent property of being a man or having masculinity.
And this is persistent. And I asked, and so online
spaces and groc did say there is a fringe that
engages in the same kind of misogyny that the average
man interest engages in. But for the most part, that's

(21:02):
what's happening. Men are complaining about verified behaviors in women,
verified institutional practices that discriminate against them, verified institutional narratives
that are anti mail, and women are complaining about men
and blaming men. Right, that's what's happening. Okay, So don't
give me this crowd. Yeah, you can find like sub

(21:23):
communities with misogyny that's comparable to the overwhelming miss indry,
but they're still small and fringe.

Speaker 3 (21:31):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (21:32):
And if you don't like it, okay, let's continue.

Speaker 2 (21:38):
I just want to add something to that to first
of all, I have noticed that missonry is getting more
and more mainstream usage. And then this is good because
it means people are paying attention, and I mean normies
are using the word now, right, and that's great. I mean, like,
you remember that used to come up. It may still
come up as a misspelled word if you put it

(22:01):
in like a document, you know, it used to come
up with the line under it to say that was misspelled.
So that was one thing I wanted to say, is
that it almost doesn't matter that they're trying to like
run cover for this, because I think the normies are
like using the word more and and they're recognizing it.
The other thing, too, is that couldn't if you know,
you're lying when you accuse men of being misogynists for

(22:26):
basically anything that they do, like Alison said, simply having
criticisms of behavior that is that is done by But
couldn't that also be seen as missonry too, because it
is hurtful to accuse someone of hate when they don't
have hate in them, and it's like intended to hut

(22:50):
them and cause.

Speaker 3 (22:51):
Them particularly bad. They engage in something that everybody engages in,
but when they do it, it's particularly bad, yeah, or
or we're just going to ignore the fact that everybody
else also engages in it too.

Speaker 1 (23:05):
Right, everybody else's women.

Speaker 3 (23:08):
Yeah, So you know it's it's it's infuriating in that
way because that in itself is you know, taking a
behavior that's widespread among both groups. Right, And and then
you know, like okay, fem spreading right on the subway. Okay,
Well she has bags and she puts them on the

(23:30):
seats next to her. Well, she's taking up three seats.
I mean she's keeping her legs her knees together, right,
or crossing her legs, but she's still taking up three seats.
She's still fem spreading, she's still taking up more than
her fair share of public space, right, so you know,
and it's because she doesn't want to put her bags

(23:51):
on the floor, because her bags are like too nice
to put on the floor, right, And it's just like yeah, no, no,
this is this is one of those things that like
everybody takes up a little bit of extra space, you know,
depending on whatever, and and h mm hmm, and everybody's
a little inconsiderate. But when men do it, when women

(24:14):
do it, it's because reasons, because they have good reason.
And when men do it, it's because they're asserting their
dominance over women.

Speaker 1 (24:22):
Oh, it gets even worse because I actually, again I
asked Groc to do the analysis, although I do have
some like a familiarity of what Groc is talking about.
And I said, okay, let's look at the rate of
missonry versus misogyny in boys versus girls, young men versus
young women. And it came back with like a Ugov

(24:45):
survey and another survey that said, there is a ten
to fIF something was ten I think it was ten
to fifteen percent misogyny rate among young men and a
fifteen to twenty five I believe percent mis injury rating
or a number of miss like ten fifteen to twenty

(25:08):
five percent of young women express misunder sentiments. Yep, ten
to fifteen percent of young men express misogynist sentiments. And
then I asked, grok, okay, how do they define misogyny
or how do they define hostile sexism? This is what
it was, what was showing. And I found out that

(25:32):
they define hostile sexism as any criticism of feminism's policies
around affirmative action and toxic masculinity. So if young men
are saying, I don't missy to object to misery, they
object makes the miss discrimination against men, or if they

(25:54):
object to a narrative that labels young men as toxic,
that is Inclusiogeny was included in the statistic on the
rate of misogyny. And I said, to hostile sexism, so
not just benevolent sexism, which is somehow also misogyny. Remember
remember that test that we found that if you think

(26:16):
a woman is is morally superior to a man. That's
benevolent sexism that harms women most. Yeah, well, this is
just hostile sexism. So I asked Groc okay, could you
estimate how much hostile sexism that young men express that
is directly in relation to policies that are discriminating against

(26:40):
them and narratives that frame them as toxic. And Groc said,
based on these ad digital studies, eighty percent of eighty
percent of the so called hostile sexism and again that's
just anti. All they're capturing is criticism and pushback against
feminists advocacy or feminist policies that discriminate against boys and

(27:06):
call them toxic. Eighty percent of hostile sexism is in
boys against women against women. Is that Okay? You get
rid of it, and then you end up with something
like two to five percent hostile sexism among young men
compared to fifteen to twenty five percent hostile sexism among

(27:28):
young women. And here we are yet another article. Oh boy,
we got to talk about the hostile sexism of young men.
When it's zero, we'll still have to talk about the
potential of hostile sexism increasing in the future, and it'll

(27:48):
be something like seventy five percent of young men or
young women are variantly hostily sexist towards men.

Speaker 3 (27:55):
But we still can't.

Speaker 1 (27:56):
Fade, We can't deal any We were not going to
do anything about that. We gotta fate, We gotta we
gotta deal with the tiny minority of young men who
express any kind of hostility, which, if you think about it,
is really astounding at that point that it's only two
to five percent.

Speaker 3 (28:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (28:13):
Like, as a woman, I'm like looking at this, and
sometimes there are days I wake up and I'm like,
I don't know how men can still stand women. Yeah, Like,
I don't know how how they must. I mean, there
ever was evidence of men's benevolence. It is living through
this era and continuing to tolerate a lot of this,

(28:36):
and I'm like, I just okay, So once again we
are going to focus on the hostile sex of the
minority in young men. Okay, next paragraph, All right, I got.

Speaker 2 (28:49):
A super chat, and then I'm gonna read the next
minute paragraph. So Dean Domino gives us a dollar ninety nine.
Thank you, Dean, and says anything the Cathedral doesn't like
equals manisvere Yep, Yes, that's right, because men are the
enemy and there is a reason for that. But anyway,
I want these issues to be called out, and I'm
glad they're being actively discussed in the media. In fact,

(29:12):
meaning you want discussion.

Speaker 1 (29:14):
What the issue of what that misogyny being.

Speaker 2 (29:18):
Rife in these communities and political extremism.

Speaker 1 (29:22):
But also the misogyny isn't qualified, like it isn't qualified.
He doesn't explain what it is and.

Speaker 2 (29:30):
Why muscular He said, misogyny in your emotions.

Speaker 1 (29:37):
Just because they are muscular wealthy men in Dubai does
not mean massage. Okay, I'm sorry, No, he's saying that.

Speaker 2 (29:45):
I'm meaning a picture of muscular wealthy men with women
flanked by beautiful women, saying there's no excuse for the
rest of us not to be in their position, and
then immediately goes that they offer a blueprint, and then
and immediately goes to misogyny was rife in these communities,
as was political extremism. So not necessarily saying that the

(30:06):
muscular guy in Dubai with the women did this, but
that the community that surrounded that person apparently was full
of misogynists and political extremists. And we don't have to
explain anymore. We've said that that's enough. Get upset. That's
what here's here's your emotional trigger. And now we'll move on.

(30:28):
Because the one thing that you really don't want in
your society are misogynists and politically extreme men apparently with it,
which is all they They don't have to they don't
have to explain it. They don't have to give you
any like any evidence, no receipts necessary. Just know that
there are men somewhere in the world, in your country,

(30:48):
maybe in your town, maybe they go to your school,
maybe they're at your job, and they are misogynists and
or politically extreme, and that is enough. Be afraid. That's
that's what this is. Remember who reads this this thing
about the audience that this is aimed at.

Speaker 3 (31:04):
It's not men, by the way, unless unless it's some
like freaking scrowny white dude who like punches a freaking
like black black woman who voted for Trump with brass nuttles, right,
you know from Rose City Antifa.

Speaker 2 (31:22):
I want these issues to be called out, and I'm
glad they're being actively discussed in the media. In fact,
reading nuanced discussion in the press which confronted these spaces
is these problematic aspects helped me escape the handcuffs binding
me to these role models. It made me consider how
they were profiting from polarization and insecurity. So and everyone class,

(31:45):
there's a lot, there's a lot packed in there. Yeah, no,
I can see it, say anything about this paragraph.

Speaker 3 (31:52):
I can. I can. I can understand. I can understand
the whole idea of profiting from this because you know,
like many problems, when you profit from a problem from
fixing a problem. And we've seen this with you know,
with homelessness in California. Oh, we poured twenty five billion

(32:15):
dollars into the problem over the last ten years into
nonprofits designed to help the homeless, right, and somehow our
homeless population has doubled, right, Well, it's because, uh, these
nonprofits are actually like lots of people are profiting from
them because they're earning huge salaries the people who run

(32:37):
these things, right, and once the homelessness problem is solved,
their grant money is gone.

Speaker 1 (32:45):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (32:46):
Right, And so I can, I can understand being I
can really understand being suspicious of the profit motive, right.
And you know, when when you have somebody like Andrew
Tate who's making a ton of money on this kind
of thing, right, I can, I can understand being a
little bit skeptical right of whether he's really trying to

(33:10):
solve the problem.

Speaker 1 (33:12):
So well, I doubt he really is. But regardless, the
way that they're framing this is.

Speaker 3 (33:23):
Well, it's it's like feminism too, right, like feminism. Oh
if the it's like it's like you remember in the
Red Pill trailer, right, And I don't think this clip
made it into the movie, right, but there was this
woman and she was like, oh, yeah, no, women are
more oppressed by patriot The patriarchy is even stronger today
than it was, you know, fifty years ago. Right, Well,

(33:46):
that's what they have to say. Otherwise the grant money
drives up.

Speaker 1 (33:50):
Mm hmm yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:54):
Yeah. Continued all right, Well, I want to say something
about this paragraph. So, first of all, when he says
nuanced discussion, So this sentence in fact, reading nuanced discussion
in the press, which confronted these spaces problematic aspects, helped
me escape the handcuffs binding me to binding me to
these role models. I doubt there's anything nuanced about it,
because most of these people don't actually try to understand

(34:18):
what the other side is even saying, they just like
you know, implicate, implicate, implicate, and then it says it
made consider how they were profiting from polarization and insecurity.
So what does that mean? In my opinion, I'll tell
you what it means. It means there were people who
didn't like the way things are when the feminists ran everything,

(34:40):
like control the entire narrative, and there are people who
are like, no, I don't think this is true. No,
I don't think you'd be shitting on men. No, I
think fathers are important. No, I think like we shouldn't
be butchering you know, boys penises. No, I don't think this, this, this,
These are all the men's issues I don't like. And
they're like, you're creating division. So what they're saying is
you should stay in your place and deal with things

(35:01):
as they are. In fact, you should be happy that
we haven't made things worse and we don't like that
you have something to say. I mean, that's that's what
I'm getting from this. Polarization is not coming from the manusphere.
The manusphere is like, it's it's big. I mean, and
I will include manisphere like it or not, because that's
what they would do. Anyone who is speaking on behalf

(35:23):
of men in any degree, from the intactivists and the
bloody men, the you know the to the Jordan Peterson's
and the self help people, to the Chris Williamson's and
modern wisdom, to fucking like whoever, it doesn't even matter,
to the men's rights activists, to Paul Elam to Janice
bim Mango to Tom Golden, all of those people, in

(35:44):
their opinion, are creating polarization when the only thing they're
really doing is they're criticizing the status quo, and they're saying,
no status quo, good, shut up and getting your corner.

Speaker 1 (35:52):
Yeah, well, they're saying that they're creating another side. So
if we if we actually shut up and we just
let feminists get on with it, then there would be
no polarization, except you know, they are constructing an enemy
out of the entirety of the male half of the
human race. But that's not polarization. Polarization only occurs when

(36:15):
you stand up and say, hey, maybe we shouldn't be
directing war propaganda at our sons. That's when polarization started,
didn't you know that? Like that when you start to
have another side pushing back, But I okay, unless you.

Speaker 3 (36:30):
Say, okay, here, here's the thing too, right, Like they
often criticize, you know, men's men's rights groups and stuff. Oh,
they're just reactionaries. Yeah, what are they reacting to? What
are they reacting to? Right, and calling them like as
if reactionary is like some kind of horrible thing. Well, no,

(36:53):
if you're reacting to somebody punching you in the face, right,
that's justified. Right. It's the person who punched you in
the face who's in the wrong.

Speaker 2 (37:06):
Exactly. So when they say you're creating polarization, they're saying
that in the face for like trying to fight back
or defend yourself.

Speaker 3 (37:16):
Or even just say please stop.

Speaker 1 (37:19):
Yeah, that's polarization, Brian. Complete and there's nothing but complete
submission and not acknowledging the fact that feminism is saying
that half the human race is an enemy. We can't
acknowledge that if we if we acknowledge that, we are
constructing the polarization.

Speaker 3 (37:39):
Yeah, and that's that's the that's the freaking that's the
that's the the seam of pure uh.

Speaker 1 (37:48):
Pure evil, well, hypocrisy.

Speaker 3 (37:54):
Pure freaking metal right through that stone. That is feminism.
That's the seam, right, the sem the mother load, right,
The mother load throughout feminism since its inception, has been
the demonization of men and the accusation of men having

(38:15):
basically engaged in a vast conspiracy against women, right to
keep them down. And you see it through once once
you open your eyes to that, right from even before
the Declaration of Sentiments, all the way back to Mary
Wollstonecraft and before right when you when you actually look
at it, and you see that the the fundamental, the

(38:39):
kernel right that resides at the center of every single
aspect of feminism, right is that men have conspired against
women in order to harm them for men's benefits benefit,
and that and that this has been happening right since

(38:59):
before we walking on two legs, okay, before we before
we wore clothes, before we could use tools, men were
dominating women for men's own benefit, and they were conspiring
with each other to do it, right, And which is
which is when I when you think about it, is

(39:19):
like the biggest insult towards women in in history, right,
Like oh yeah, no, you've been like oppressed for like
two million years and you haven't figured out how to
like unoppressed yourselves, Like what the fuck right, But okay,
this is what it is. It's this grand conspiracy theory, right,

(39:42):
an indictment against men. It's they indicted the ham sandwich,
that is men, and everybody just assumed men were guilty, right,
because women have this fucking huge power of social manipulation
right at their fingertips, and they were able to convince

(40:02):
everybody to go along with it. And this is why
they're saying. They're literally saying that women are worse off now,
women are more oppressed now than they were one hundred
and fifty years ago, and people will believe it.

Speaker 1 (40:17):
Yep, yep, all right, next paragraph, all.

Speaker 2 (40:20):
Right, next paragraph. Yeah. I strongly believe we need to
reframe how we talk about these issues, not as innately
evil flaws in the young male demographic, but as an
expression of uncertainty. Last week I was sitting on the
bus home from school of what do you mind mock
gcsee revision by scrolling through TikTok.

Speaker 1 (40:40):
Just you have to stop at the next para between paragraphs,
just so we can respond, just because if you read
too much, it'll end up screwing with the the short system. Okay,
Yet I strongly believe we need to reframe how we
talk about these issues not as inherently evil flaws and
the young male. So so we were already talking about

(41:06):
young gyographic.

Speaker 3 (41:08):
I want to beat I want to beat man. I
want to beat this young man. I want to beat him,
right because because you know what, then he'll learn what
Missonry is right, because you know what. You shouldn't be complaining,
young man. You shouldn't be complaining about anything, right. Oh,

(41:30):
you shouldn't be defending yourself as not having inherently evil flaws.
Don't defend yourself. Don't defend your sex. You don't deserve it.

Speaker 1 (41:44):
Yeah. But also I just want to point out that
didn't didn't haven't. We had this discussion about the inherent
flaws of young men and all men for fifty years now,
so way more than that, yeah, way more than that
evil demograph.

Speaker 3 (42:02):
Women have never ever ever been hearing only good things about.
Look at the epic of Gilgamesh for Fox's sake, the
world's oldest living document. Okay, right, and what did it
talk about? It talked about a young brash man with
too much power, with no ability to handle it, no responsibility,

(42:26):
no sense of of of loyalty and reciprocal duty. To
those under his He figured they were under his rule,
not under his care right, And and he went through
a journey and came out the other side a wise
and just king.

Speaker 2 (42:44):
Right.

Speaker 3 (42:45):
And that has always been this, This has always been
the story of masculinity, all through the entire body of
literature throughout the world, the story of the brash, immature, selfish,
young upstart asshole, right who becomes who becomes, through the

(43:08):
trials and tribulations and many adventures and many hardships, becomes
the wise and just leader right? That that is?

Speaker 1 (43:18):
That is yes, yes, I know. We've always had a
discussion about how men are supposed to step up and
sacrifice and become wiser and learn to control themselves for
the benefit of others. We've always had that, We've always
had an inherent recognition.

Speaker 3 (43:37):
And disapproval of those who don't do that. Those are
the laws of male Yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:42):
Yeah, Okay, let's try to get to the next paragraph.
I know, I know, Brian, It's not your fault.

Speaker 2 (43:48):
It's okay, okay. Uh. Last week I was sitting on
the bus home from school of what do you my
mock gcsc revision by scrolling through TikTok, a video appear
to my feed surrounding a generally to debate, and the creator,
a young woman not much older than myself, use the
term toxic masculinity.

Speaker 1 (44:08):
Wow, you've never heard about it before. This is sudden, Okay, all.

Speaker 2 (44:13):
Right, I'll keep going. Sure, for those I'm sorry for familiar, Yeah,
for those who are unfamiliar. But this is to remind you,
guys that this isn't aimed at people who actually understand
these things, for normies that don't understand these things, and
the hopes that they will take hold of the narrative.

(44:33):
And in a way, I want to say, I think
this is a it's it's a good sign that this
kind of content is out there because it means that
that the people at The Guardian and other outlets are
really worried. They're worried that they're that they have lost
men and they're and they're desperately trying to get them back.
And I think that this is just one of the

(44:55):
approaches they've tried. Shame hell, they still do it. They're
still doing it in this this article.

Speaker 1 (45:01):
Yeah, okay, but.

Speaker 2 (45:01):
They're just trying to be a little bit less. I
don't know, like maybe maybe they're they're changing the tone
of the shame. But I do think that they're afraid.

Speaker 3 (45:10):
But for those who are unfamiliar, really, really, is there
anybody who's unfamiliar?

Speaker 2 (45:17):
Yeah? Really, for those who are unfamiliar, Toxic masculinity has
become a catch all term for exaggerated negative forms of
masculinity that can put pressure on men and boys to
behave in certain ways. These issues are certainly real, and
I didn't just disagree with the Great's point.

Speaker 1 (45:33):
Okay, they can toxic masculine From the moment I was like, oh,
so you mean them phrase toxic masculinity can force men
to behave It's no, he means toxic masculinity can. I
actually did an analysis the There is a someone who
looked into what creates suicide or what like the negative

(45:55):
thought spiral that is a contributing a main contributing factor
to suicidal And I'm blanking on his name, but it
was really interesting work. And he found that suicidal and
depressed people have an issue with seeing themselves as a
burden on others, and in fact, that narrative is very

(46:18):
complicit with with actually going through the act of committing suicide.

Speaker 3 (46:24):
And there was actually, I don't know if you've ever
watched the channel Diary of a CEO. But he interviewed
a psychologist who deals with men, and you know, like,
I don't agree with everything this guy says, right, you know,
this psychologist, but one thing that he did say was

(46:44):
that in his clinical practice he deals with a lot
of suicidal young men and they're not depressed.

Speaker 1 (46:52):
Joiner. Thomas Joyner was the name of the guy that
I'm talking about.

Speaker 3 (46:57):
But these guys are not depressed, said, he says, They're
not depressed. They are making a rational decision that life
is not worth living. And I've said this before. You know,
it's not a mental health crisis. The suicidality rate, the
suicidal rate, in the suicide rate in young in men

(47:20):
is not necessary. This is men taking a rational look,
an objective look at their lives and deciding that their
lives are not worth living. And often it is because
they don't want to be a burden on others.

Speaker 1 (47:37):
Yeah, so, Thomas, no, I agree, and that's something that
we don't talk about. And I actually did a little
bit of an analysis that. So. Thomas Joyner is a
psychologist who originally identified perceived burdensomeness, often expressed as burden.
Narratives and personal stories or accounts is a key factor
linked to suicidal ideation, which is strongly tied to depression

(47:58):
and suicide. Okay, so this forms the core part of
his interpersonal theory of suicide. Okay, So people who specifically
men who feel depressed and also suicidal, and maybe not
the two things are not necessarily completely overlapping, feel like
they are a burden on others.

Speaker 3 (48:18):
Well, they're situationally depressed.

Speaker 1 (48:20):
But does toxic masculinity stay about men as a whole?
It essentially says that men are a burden on women.

Speaker 3 (48:28):
And society, they have no positive impact.

Speaker 1 (48:32):
Well, they're a burden because they cause emotional labor, they
cause men to rupting, men's spreading, men's blaming, they cause
male entitlement that takes snatches, the snatches the very achievement
and success opportunities for women, and everywhere, everywhere, from every angle,
men are told they are the problem and they are

(48:54):
essentially a parasite on society. So this toxic masculinity narrative
is complicit in the suicide rate for men. And I
actually looked at it, and I asked, groc, is it
possible that the overwhelming narrative. And I actually ask Groc
to estimate how much of this kind of male burdensome

(49:16):
narrative men are exposed to daily. He said, twenty to
thirty instances of being referred to as a burden. Every
single man is experienced twenty to thirty instances of being
referred to as a burden every day. And I asked, Okay,
so if that's the case, then could this be an
explanation why there are men who commit suicide without having

(49:40):
any apparent mental health issues prior to that, Because essentially
what happens is they experience a job loss, or more likely,
they experience a problem with a relationship, they are abused
in that relationship or the relationship ends, and then they
just have a cascading failure, like it just that's it,

(50:01):
And it's because they just like if you, if you
subject an entire population to twenty to thirty burdens of
narratives a day, and then when they experience something that
takes away whatever is in their life that is holding
that back, what ends up happening the damn breaks and

(50:21):
they become swept away. And I asked, so is this
could this be explain why do you have these sudden
sudden suicides? And it said yes, I mean, I mean
if you take that for what it is, you know grow.

Speaker 3 (50:32):
Yeah, well Grock, Grock, any any AI will want to
say things, will want to be highly agreeable with you.

Speaker 1 (50:38):
Actually, I've tested GROC multiple.

Speaker 3 (50:42):
Yet I have primate to like, no, I do primeate,
I do primitn't don't instantly agree with me.

Speaker 1 (50:50):
Yeah, I know, I prime it. But also GROC doesn't
do that anymore. I know that a lot of other
ais do that. But I have gotten into extended testing GROC.
I have gotten into extended debates with it to try
to get it to say like or agree with me
on a point, and it continues if it considers that

(51:10):
point to be incorrect, it will continue to push it's
its interpretation here. Yeah, and so I I in some
areas Grok is not like, do not ask it for
fiction analysis. It will make shit up like a motherfucker.
But in terms of anything that can be tested for
empirical accuracy, is GROC is pretty good. It's actually better

(51:34):
than perplexity because I've also dealt with perplexity, and perplexity
actually cited a retracted paper and Science that had been
superseded by something newer and better science, and I was like,
what the hell are you doing? And then and then
it flagged me said I'm going to be reporting you

(51:55):
because blah blah blah. I'm like, what it was your
mistake anyway?

Speaker 2 (52:01):
All right, okay, so back to the article. However, it
did make me pause and reflect. I realize watching this,
watching this video, how desensitized I had become to seeing
those two words paired together on my feet such that
they seemed intertwined, like fast food and hard work or
bright idea.

Speaker 1 (52:22):
Yeah, that was the point. They don't have any other
version of masculinity by a toxic one because they don't
want to recognize that masculinity has any validity because if
they did, they would have to question their war against it. Yep, yes,
I mean I every time I've heard people bring up

(52:44):
toxic masculinity, I say, well, what is the what is
positive masculine? They never have an answer. Oh, they have
to appeal to traditional masculinity, which they don't regard as legitimate.

Speaker 2 (52:54):
So traditional masculinity is toxic masculinity.

Speaker 3 (52:58):
Yeah, okay, when I asked, well, all kinds of modern
masculinity is also toxic masculinity.

Speaker 2 (53:04):
Yeah, traditional, there is no positive masculinity unless it is
just purely in service to women, well, and even then
only in service to certain.

Speaker 3 (53:16):
Women of the certain in certain contexts, yes, yes, in
certain contexts with which.

Speaker 1 (53:23):
The frequency with which a male user encounters the phrase
toxic masculinity on X depends on several factors. There followed accounts,
engagement patterns, a little bit whatever, key, let me get
to the Okay, so assumptions. A typical male user scrolls
to feed for twenty okay, uh, okay, all right, So

(53:46):
casual scroller likely encounters So just follow sports news, minimal
gender topic engagement, and daily time on X fifteen to
twenty minutes will encounter it was you're at a one time,
but still will encounter it. Okay. And if and if
you are a user, a male user who's seeking out

(54:07):
any kind of information on anything related to gender or
sex or achievement, you're not going to be in that category.
We're just talking sports and news. No gender engagement. Active
engager follows opinion leaders interacts with debates every twenty five
to thirty minutes. They will see the phrase two one
to three times. High exposure follow those feminist progressive accounts

(54:32):
searches trends every thirty minutes, they will see it three
to five plus times, so they you are like, men
are being inundated with that phrase. Yeah, that automatic emotional
association with masculinity.

Speaker 3 (54:49):
Is now that next toxic next paragraph?

Speaker 2 (54:53):
Yes, yeah, next paragraph. All right. I sat for the
entire twenty minutes of that bus Dura trying to remember
the last time I saw masculinity appear on my feed
without being coupled with toxic. I thought and thought and
thought some more. I could not do it. Yeah, that's
because that's the only way it's presented. It's either toxic masculinity,

(55:16):
traditional masculinity, hegemonic masculinity, but toxic masculinity is the most
like popular version. But they're all they're all the same thing.

Speaker 3 (55:26):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (55:28):
Can society expect anything other than uncertainty when masculinity, one
of the very essences of our existence, is almost always
presented as toxic. When I was engrossed in the manisphere,
this type of messaging would only have alienated me further
from mainstream society, driving me closer to the influencers claiming
that it was biased.

Speaker 1 (55:46):
The kids you were, you were never in the manisphere
because you have still seen that.

Speaker 3 (55:53):
Well, no, it's it's it. Well, no, he was, he's okay, Uh,
this type of messaging would only have alienated me further
from mainstream society, driving me closer to the influencers, claiming
that it was biased against young men. Okay, yeah, no,

(56:16):
so that's why he ended up in the manisphere.

Speaker 1 (56:19):
Yeah, but he's the timing is weird. When I was
engrossed in the manisphere, this type of messaging would only
have been alienated me further. So he went into the
manisphere not knowing about toxic masculinity.

Speaker 3 (56:33):
Like a young he's an extremely young man.

Speaker 2 (56:38):
And maybe no, no, and all young because he's getting
an ac SE, which means he's in like middle school
or something.

Speaker 1 (56:49):
Whipposed to people like Laura Bates.

Speaker 3 (56:54):
Well but okay, but okay, but you know, maybe he
just never thought about it. Maybe he just never thought
about it, right, And the only reason he even thought
about it, okay, because hear me out. Maybe the only
reason he thought about it was because he fell into
the manisphere or some fringe of the manisphere, some some

(57:18):
you know, surface level you know, pocket of the manisphere
and started entertaining discussions started being interested in masculinity. Right,
So maybe he just all the toxic masculinity rhetoric, you know,
he was just like it was just not on his

(57:39):
radar before that.

Speaker 2 (57:42):
Right.

Speaker 3 (57:42):
But then he's going in as a young man, as
a young man, a pubescent young man, okay, an adolescent
young man, right, trying to figure out what it is
to be a man. Right, falls into the manisphere, right,
and then he's like, yeah, no, if I had escaped
the manisphere, if I had still been you know, if

(58:07):
I hadn't escaped, if I had still been immersed in it,
then it would have alienated me further from the mainstream,
all of this talk in the mainstream about toxic masculinity.
Yet maybe maybe he didn't notice, maybe he didn't notice
it before. This is and articles have word limits, Allison.

Speaker 1 (58:25):
Yeah, this is not I can't I press X to
doubt any of this is real.

Speaker 2 (58:30):
But regardless, this paragraph too much driving.

Speaker 1 (58:34):
Me closer to the influencers claiming so all the bias
against young men in the public sphere would drive young
men to influencers that actually say or actually point out
that there's bias against young men and it's bad. This
is this is where it all falls apart. This is
where the entirety of the progressive belief system around this

(58:59):
issue falls apart. How do we get men and boys
to stop talking about how we're beating on them and
tainting their gender identity? How do we get them to
shut up about it without actually changing what we're doing? Okay,
next paragraph?

Speaker 2 (59:19):
All right, I got a super chat from Dean Domino
for four ninety nine, Thank you, Dina. He says he
was in the manisphere. He briefly scrolled past a picture
that wasn't crapping on men one time.

Speaker 1 (59:29):
Yeah, I think I think that's probably accurate. Okay, he
saw he saw a TikTok in which a father was
building a cardboard or a a fort for our son
or daughter. It was like, oh my god, am I
in the manosphere?

Speaker 2 (59:50):
Of a there were a bunch of men rescuing a
dog from a flood. Mean, the anime guy with the butter?
Is this the manisphere? Okay? I think the potency of
the manisphere would be crushed if there were constructive alternatives
for young men to engage with. Some boys I know
feel alienated from education because the system simply isn't providing

(01:00:14):
that alternative? You guys want to say something to that?
Or should I keep going?

Speaker 1 (01:00:19):
Just keep going?

Speaker 2 (01:00:20):
All right? Knowledge of financial education, entrepreneurship, and fitness doesn't
have to stay trapped inside controversial podcasts by influencers peddling
a paid course the manisphere's main form of revenue. The
curriculum could offer healthier versions of some of that too.

Speaker 3 (01:00:39):
Well, yeah, it really should, right, financial literacy should be
taught in high school. You have no idea how many
young people I have worked with high school age? Right there?
These are people, These are hostesses and expos at the
work at the restaurants where I worked, right, who it's

(01:01:00):
their first job. They're still in high school. Right. They
don't know what a credit rating is. They don't know
why you need one, and they don't know how to
get one and how to maintain one. Right, They have
no fucking clue. Right. What they do know is how
to design a poster for an activist event, because that's
what they learned in career and life management, which is

(01:01:22):
a mandatory course. Right. They don't understand how to balance
a budget. They don't understand that, Yes, if you get
a credit card, right, if you're lucky enough to get one, right,
pay it down to zero every month. Don't spend a
penny that you don't actually have. Pay it down to
zero every month. Right, then they'll offer to raise your

(01:01:43):
credit limit, right and take that offer as long as
you can be disciplined with your credit card, right, take
that offer. Because your credit rating is balanced by is
scored by how much credit you have available versus how
much you're using. And if you have like twelve thousand
dollars available and you're not actually using carrying any balance, right,

(01:02:05):
you've got a great credit score right there, right, and
you're gonna need that if you want to get a
car loan or buy a house. Right like this is
this is like this is simple fucking stuff, right, easy
peasy stuff. Career in life management. They're like, oh yeah, no,
uh does make make your own designer license plate for

(01:02:27):
this course right where we're not teaching you how to drive?

Speaker 1 (01:02:33):
Okay? Next paragraph?

Speaker 2 (01:02:35):
No, okay?

Speaker 1 (01:02:37):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:02:38):
At the core of this profit generating machine behind, he
loves mentioning how these guys make money doing this. It's
like the main condemning thing, even though like that only
happens if someone chooses to pay them. So, but anyway,
profit and it's not like feminism doesn't make a shit
ton of money, but it's just off the government and

(01:03:00):
taxpayers and NGOs. So I guess it's okay when the
government just goes around, you know, with the whole people
and selling them a product, to just take money from people,
whether like it or not, and then just full ship.

Speaker 3 (01:03:17):
Much more.

Speaker 1 (01:03:19):
We got the the got the essence of this, this article.
Somebody wants to also make money off of this. They
feel like it's been stolen because these young men. They
shouldn't be listening to whoever these people are about masculinity.
They should be listening to feminists about masculinity and giving
feminists their money. Yeah, okay, yeah, I mean this.

Speaker 2 (01:03:41):
This this thing is almost over. But anyway, at the
core of this profit generating machine, behind the superficial lifestyles,
the harmful views on women, the rebellion against the education system,
there sits a feature that made a younger me and
several of my friends and peers now that deeply into
the clutch of these influencers.

Speaker 1 (01:03:58):
This isn't written like a twelve a fifth, fourteen year
old boy.

Speaker 2 (01:04:03):
This is I'm sure it was written by a grown woman,
or probably probably Laura Bates.

Speaker 1 (01:04:10):
Yeah yeah, oh, you boys shouldn't go to Andrew Tate.
You should go to me, Laura Baits. Don't mind me
putting my fingers.

Speaker 2 (01:04:19):
Speaking of weird predatory women. I watched Witches the other day.
He'd ever see the movie Witches from the the nineties
with not the remake with Anne Hathwaves. I didn't watch.
That's terrible. I mean the original one with oh Angelica Houston.

Speaker 3 (01:04:36):
Yeah, and Jack Nicholson.

Speaker 2 (01:04:39):
No, no, no, you're thinking about the Witches of east Wick. No, no,
this is It's just called Witches. It's based on a
roll doll book. It's a it's like, uh, you know
the guy who wrote like the Chocolate Factory and some
of the other weird books.

Speaker 3 (01:04:53):
That he wrote in the Giant Peach and yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:04:56):
Yeah, Charlie and Factory.

Speaker 3 (01:04:58):
Yeah he wrote a big friendly giant.

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
Yeah yeah. Yeah. So anyway, good movie and the you know,
good good female villains, the Witches. So anyway, where was
I They made us feel listened to, heard and considered.
Of course, in reality, that's nothing more than a facade,
a dodgy sales tactic. Society isn't going to help you.

(01:05:21):
You're a slave to the system, but will help you escape. Okay,
So I just want to point out again because I
think that when we respond to like the claims that
this guy's making about like how this is a big
profit generating machine, our brains want to say this is
about Andrew Tate, It's not. I clicked on the link

(01:05:43):
for influencers and it's, like I said, it's anyone who
wants to talk to men. And if you're telling me
that Andrew Tate and Jordan Peterson and Aiden Ross and
you know, Joe Rogan and any any of those people,
Tom Golden, Paul em anyone, if you are telling me
that those people are all just in it for the

(01:06:04):
money and they're all the same, then I got a
bridge that I want to sell you, because this is
just a way of essentially making those avenues, let's say, toxic,
so that nobody wants to even like entertain that, and
they do it by attaching people at Jordan Peterson to

(01:06:26):
Andrew Tate or Aiden Ross or whoever you know. That's it.
So I just want to make sure we understand that
if you're in the chat saying something about Tate, you're
you're not looking at this correctly, because that's not what
it's not about him. If Tate exploded tomorrow in a
shower of gore and he was dead and gone in

(01:06:46):
his business collapse, guess what, these articles will still exist
and they'd be about somebody else. So it wouldn't matter,
it would not matter who it is. It's what they're
doing is they're they're trying to corral men away from
anything that looks like it's not where they want them
to be, which is right in line. Here, be good
little you know, wage slaves, and give your tax money

(01:07:09):
to us so that we can keep funneling into the
education system, so that we can continue to propagandize women
and children against you for the rest of your life.
And that's what they're doing. So I'm just saying this
is important because if you get caught up on the
Andrew Tate thing, you're losing. You're losing big, Okay, But anyway,
go ahead.

Speaker 1 (01:07:26):
Yeah, I think everybody never knows that that this is
just that particular figure is just to stand in for
anyone who opposes the idea that men are toxic, like
anybody who says, no, actually that that narrative is wrong.
And it's bad and it's hurtful and it's harmful and
the people who express it don't have your best interests

(01:07:47):
in mind, and you should stop listening to them. Oh
that's what's the problem is.

Speaker 3 (01:07:52):
Okay, Yes, I'm gonna step away for a second here
because my dog is going crazy and it is it
does feel like four o'clock now, so yeah, okay, go
feed your daughter.

Speaker 2 (01:08:02):
All right, can't feed the dog all right? So anyway,
we got to the stage where sixty second social media
advert can make a young man feel more valid than
an entire education system. I see that as a pretty
drastic problem. When society is not providing a listening ear
an algorithm will fill the void. When I was younger,

(01:08:23):
I felt seen by influencers, but not by the institutions
I am growing up in. I have peers that still
feel the same way.

Speaker 1 (01:08:30):
Okay, so how did you get seen by the institution? Now,
this is my question.

Speaker 2 (01:08:35):
He's asking the institutions to step in, uh and and
do something, but they're not going to yr your cries
fall on dead. Yeah, like this is the thing. I
don't know if this is Let's assume for a moment
this is actually a genuine cry for help, for like

(01:08:57):
for the for the schools and the the institutions and
his governments to acknowledge and try to address men's issues. No,
like that, it's not happening. You're you are your your
cries will fall on deaf ears and the if anything,
if you are someone who is legitimately asking this question,
guess what. The Gardian is using your article to corral

(01:09:21):
more men into the system that hates them. And and
they're gonna use this because they what they want is
not for you to get better. They don't want to
fix your problems. They just want you to shut up
and get in line, because that's what this is. Okay anyway,
Andrew take cares school? Doesn't You need to realize that? Mate?
Those are the words of a close friend of mine

(01:09:43):
in a late night online video game lobby. You might
hear his words as simply teenage rebellion or malicious naivete.
But I heard the desperation, I heard naivete.

Speaker 1 (01:09:56):
I don't know that is like an oxymore on malicious naivete. Yeah, okay,
all right, no, this is okay, Andrew take cares school doesn't?

Speaker 3 (01:10:09):
All right?

Speaker 1 (01:10:09):
Well, where are you going to go? For recognizing that,
recognizing that the institution is overwhelmingly antimail. Where are we
going to go? Now? Where are we gonna where's this
article going to go? I am a flutter.

Speaker 2 (01:10:23):
Yeah, it doesn't feel like a coincidence that he was
speaking to an in an online space. John Harris recently
pointed to the dire state of youth club funding, with
twelve hundred centers closing between twenty ten and twenty twenty three.
My town youth group met the ad closing when you
can no longer afford the hire of a local hall.

Speaker 1 (01:10:44):
What say it's an ad for state funded youth groups?

Speaker 3 (01:10:49):
Uh? Feminist?

Speaker 2 (01:10:51):
I mean I think that he probably wants group of
youth clubs. But guess what that was the first thing
to go. Man, Like, what you're basically saying is, man,
you know men need their own spaces. Well, guess who's
been saying that shit for ten years and it hasn't
happened yet. Even when they do get a space, women
take it over no matter what it is. Your video

(01:11:13):
game lobby isn't safe, dude, So like it doesn't matter.
You're basically again, you're saying something obvious and you're not
asking Well, dude, if this is so obvious, why don't
we have it. It's almost like because it's not allowed.

Speaker 1 (01:11:29):
Yeah, because somebody is shutting them down. Okay, I wonder
who that could be.

Speaker 2 (01:11:35):
Yeah yeah, Okay. Meanwhile, in pshe lessons at my co
ed school, myself and other boys in my class felt
uncomfortable discussing our issues and worries, scared of risking a
judgmental look from a girl or even worse, social alienation.
There's great social costs of potentially appearing weaker, softer, less

(01:11:56):
masculine in front of your peers. That's why that's not
the issue you're blaming. You're blaming like looking weaker for
your fear of being judged by a girl.

Speaker 3 (01:12:09):
Girls.

Speaker 2 (01:12:10):
It's women, it's not other men.

Speaker 1 (01:12:15):
So he's afraid of appearing weaker and less masculine in
front of the girl.

Speaker 3 (01:12:20):
Like.

Speaker 1 (01:12:20):
That's the thing that I noticed about other things that
come from the UK. God. There was a quote unquote
comedian who wrote a book How Not to Be a Boy,
I think it was, and he described all of the
fear of judgment from a bunch of women in his life,
and then he pivoted to Ah, but the patriarchy. I'm like, no,
are you telling me your mom is the patriarchy, your

(01:12:42):
wife is the patriarchy, your aunt is the patriarchy. Like,
you're not afraid of men, You're afraid of women. When
we talk about anecdotes about your life, it's fear of
women that's keeping you quiet, which is why men need
their own damn spaces.

Speaker 3 (01:12:55):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (01:12:56):
But of course, all feminism can do is shut men's spaces.

Speaker 3 (01:12:59):
Down or or colonize them.

Speaker 1 (01:13:02):
It can't actually create a space where men can grow,
men can be men, men can cooperate in the way
that men do that, men can engage in risk. It
doesn't know how to create those spaces. It's impossible, and
it cannot.

Speaker 2 (01:13:15):
It can space that they killed. What's the first male
space that feminists killed?

Speaker 1 (01:13:26):
Probably schools?

Speaker 2 (01:13:29):
I would say it was the home.

Speaker 1 (01:13:31):
Oh yeah, yeah, you're right. Well, okay, that's that's sort
of a that is that is definitely a depressing thought. Okay,
let's keep it.

Speaker 3 (01:13:40):
There was there was there was that thing about coffee
houses back in the seventeen hundreds.

Speaker 1 (01:13:45):
Yeah, maybe it was the coffee house is the first
thing that that feminists killed?

Speaker 2 (01:13:49):
Okay, all right, I can all right next thing. You
want to, like, show the superchown. Nobody sends super chowlds.

Speaker 1 (01:13:58):
You're gonna you guys, send super chows in. You're You're unsettling, Brian,
feed the badger.

Speaker 2 (01:14:02):
I'm just saying, like you usually say something about it
by feed the badge.

Speaker 1 (01:14:08):
Just the tip for those comments, send something in. Send
it in. We want to hear it from you, especial way.

Speaker 3 (01:14:14):
Stop snaking.

Speaker 2 (01:14:16):
I can recall many Pasach sessions spent discussing female body
image and objectification, rightfully so, but I struggled to say
the same for male body image. The impossible standards set
by colossal lumps of muscle on your feeds, quite a
few of which are, in fact, are injecting themselves with
steroids when the camera is packed away. I can speak

(01:14:37):
to this, so like I was planning on making a
video about this, because I have seen I've men go
to the gym with Lindsay, and Lindsay used to be
a big gym rat back in the day, and she
pointed out that she'd never seen so many like men
on gear. Not not not just like at the gym,
because there's plenty of guys at the gym, but like

(01:14:58):
young guys take gear on steroids, right, and we watch
videos of guys that like they overdo it. They get
like these weird like hormonal reactions, acne on their back
and stuff. It's really grows. And they're not doing it
in many cases because of some kind of toxically masculine

(01:15:21):
need to like compete with other men, or because of
this kind of feminist argument of unrealistic beauty standards. They're
doing it because they think that's what women want. So
they're they're they're acting on Yeah, it's like the hypergy
is they're they're reacting to hypergamy basically.

Speaker 1 (01:15:37):
Well, it's it's the only actions, it's the only women want.
It is what women want.

Speaker 3 (01:15:41):
Well, it's the only axis on which they can compete, right,
because you know, if you have the six, the six,
the quintuple six for formula right, you know, like she's
a solid six, and she demands six feet six inches,
a six pack and six figures, right, well, you might
not be able to get the six figures. You probably

(01:16:05):
you can need an implant to get the six inches
if if you're unfortunate, right, and and you know, all
you can really do is do the six pack, right,
there's nothing you can do about the six feet, so
it's like you you basically it's it's like this un
looks Max saying is actually it's still fringe. But for

(01:16:29):
men it's still quite fringe, but it's growing. It's growing.
And and it's because this is the only axis on
which these men can attract women, right, because women's standards
are way too high. She's a solid six and she's
she's basically saying in her dating profile, I won't settle

(01:16:50):
for less than six six six six right, mm hm
And and.

Speaker 2 (01:16:55):
Uh yeah, guys, I mean like that's not even going
into men who are getting like extension surgery. And again
this is this is still fringe, but it is it
does happen.

Speaker 1 (01:17:06):
Yeah, No, pickup artists that are driving this, that's the
things are not driving that.

Speaker 3 (01:17:12):
No, No, they're they're actually driving game right, like they're
advising game right, because you can you can, like, you
can look like see low green right still get some honeys. Right.
You know, you can be fat like Patrese O'Neill. You

(01:17:32):
can you can be like, you know, you can look
like Bill Burr and still get dates. I mean that
guy as much as yeah, of course he could have
he freaking married a feminist. But but you know, like

(01:17:53):
he he was, he was dating right, like he he
had women in his life to complain about, right all
through his career. And so you're looking at it like
you know, uh, you look at men, they can they
there there are like when you look at what pickup
artists say tell men to do, right rush never freaking manscaped. Yeah, well,

(01:18:22):
and that that dude is wearing two shirts, okay, Like
and he never manscaped, and he he wasn't really that attractive, right,
he just came with an attitude with like, he came
with an attitude that actually scored him women right, same

(01:18:44):
with them. You know, there's a whole bunch of a
whole bunch of freaking pickup artists, mystery and those guys
right like they came with an attitude not with not
with six figures, not with you know, sixty.

Speaker 1 (01:19:02):
Yeah, but they're also like twenty years ago now like yeah,
and the things of massive. I actually went through this
with Groc because a feminist was saying that all men
hold women to the beauty ideal. So I actually and
Groc said, yes, men wait attractiveness more highly than women.
I'm like, is that okay? But what's going on there?

(01:19:25):
And eventually, what I found out is that men wait attractiveness,
attractiveness more highly insofar as they don't wait status. They
just want a woman who's attractive to them. But they
find eighty percent of women attractive, I know, and women
only find twenty to thirty percent of men attractive.

Speaker 3 (01:19:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:19:47):
Yeah, So it's like it's like, and so you're when
you look at it as not necessarily that you're competing
with other men, right, but that you are trying to
measure up what women demand, yes, based on how you
measure up among the pool of men.

Speaker 3 (01:20:07):
Yeah. And you know, like, and I I saw this
with you know, someone I know recently, you know, Like,
she was dating this guy and he's he's he's great,
he's like really friendly, really nice, got a great personality,
a beautiful house that he just bought with a nice
big yard, perfect for raising kids, right, And and she

(01:20:32):
wants a baby, and she's getting she's getting to the
point where she's gonna have to do something asap, right,
And he's all in. He's he's like all in, and
she's like, eh, but he's not taller than me. And
and he's not as smart as me. And I'm like, bitch,

(01:20:57):
my man isn't as smart as I am. Okay, I
mean he's taller than me, but he's he's no, he's
no looker, he don't he don't got no. I mean,
I'm sure he's got a six pack under there somewhere, right,
but you know, he's built like Brian and you know,
so it's like he's I mean, he makes good money,

(01:21:22):
but he didn't always. He didn't when I met him.
He made less money than me when I was waiting
tables when we first got together. Right, So it's like,
and there was no guarantee that any of it was
gonna pay off because he had some like mysterious fucking
disease right that the doctors couldn't Yeah, the doctors couldn't

(01:21:43):
figure out, right, And I eventually figured it out. And
now he's okay, and now he's able to Actually now
we're not looking into a disability pension anymore. Right, But
it's like, you know, meanwhile, my daughter, she's like on
long term discis ability for two years, perhaps permanently, right

(01:22:04):
because of an eye atrogenic fucking illness. Doctors gave her
through negligence, right, And and her boyfriend, right is completely
completely devoted to her, yeah, right, And it's just like
and she's just like, you know, I can barely walk, right,

(01:22:29):
and it's like I can't. I don't know if I
think I should give him babies? Yeah, because you know
there's an hereditary component to what I have, right, And
and it's like and he's just completely devoted to her,
And it's just like and she's I mean, she's attractive,

(01:22:50):
but she's not like she's she's not an eight out
of ten mm.

Speaker 1 (01:22:56):
Right, Well, that person is going to if she wants
to have children, then she's not going to like she's
that's the funny that. I mean, that's just what's gonna happen.
She's not gonna have a partner. She's not gonna get
a better man.

Speaker 3 (01:23:13):
Yeah No, she's really out for a better man. And
it's it's like, it's okay, can you both stop.

Speaker 1 (01:23:20):
Freaking realize this. There's not going to be a better man.

Speaker 3 (01:23:25):
There isn't no the the like the better man was
back when you were twenty five, maybe, but but now
you're thirty two or thirty three, right, and any guy
you get with now is gonna know, you're gonna need
the deal sealed. Okay, within two years, Okay, within two years,

(01:23:50):
you gotta be bedded, freaking wedded and freakin' birthed, bredded, Okay, breaded, editor,
there you go, breaded, bedded, wetted and breaded. Right, Okay,
within two years. Right, And guys that age, guys your

(01:24:12):
age are maybe not in that kind of hurry, right,
So you probably you should probably take the one who's
willing to have you.

Speaker 1 (01:24:26):
She, you know what, she might not have gotten a man.
If he's equivalent age, he's probably in a better financial
position than when what he she would have gotten when
she was twenty five. I'm just saying, this is the boat.
Take it. Otherwise that's it. You're gonna be left on
shore and enjoy learn it. Learn to enjoy your own company. Yeah, okay, okay,

(01:24:47):
let's let's get some more in here.

Speaker 2 (01:24:49):
Next paragraph. Okay, um okay. So when I struggled to
say the same for male body image, the impossible standard
set by colossal lumps of muzzle on our feeds, quite
a few of which are, in fact, are injecting themselves
with steroids when the camera is packed away. Toxic online
communities like the one I fell into are prevalent because

(01:25:11):
there's a vacuum to be filled, a vacuum of physical
spaces for boys to connect and reflect.

Speaker 1 (01:25:16):
Okay, feminists will not allow you to have those.

Speaker 3 (01:25:20):
Yeah, that's why. That's why they that's why they freaking
convinced you to write this fucking travesty of an.

Speaker 1 (01:25:25):
Article because they will not let you have them, because
there is the potential that you will get together and
start realizing what feminism is doing to you. And I
don't mean the equality, because it never was about that.
I mean the constant browbeating narratives around toxic masculinity. What

(01:25:46):
is it, male entitlement, male privilege, patriarchy, man spreading, man's blanning,
men interrupting, men existing, man breathing, man thoughts. No, it's
not objectification anymore. It's sexualization, on and on and on,

(01:26:07):
like they just don't want you to exist, and they
cannot acknowledge any kind of positive They can't even stand
the thought of you just having fun without even mentioning
a single gender related item at all. Uh hu, this
is this is okay, Well, let's continue, all right.

Speaker 2 (01:26:26):
Some solutions are starting to emerge. I was excited to
contribute to a new report Voice of the Boys from
the organization Male Allies. Mm hmmm. It feels like a
milestone and giving my generation a chance to speak for ourselves.
Oh really find out.

Speaker 1 (01:26:42):
Let's find out. Let's like look at it.

Speaker 2 (01:26:45):
What's Male Allies UK? I think I know, I'm gonna
just what could it possibly be?

Speaker 1 (01:26:55):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (01:26:55):
Male Allies UK? Male Allies ship making allyship happen through training, support, research, speaking, lobbying.
We are Male Allies UK. Here's a purple haired woman.
We exist to challenge the system and dismantle barriers to collaboration.
Workplaces were created by men for men, and it's now
time for men to recognize the need for change and

(01:27:17):
take an active role alongside women.

Speaker 1 (01:27:19):
We're a male burden narrative. It's more male burden narrative.
Like literally, this is the problem. The male burden narrative
is the problem. The narrative that men are a net
negative to women in society is the problem. It means
they have no space, they have no space to legitimately exist.
And this kid is pointing to yet another institution that

(01:27:41):
is making more male burden narratives.

Speaker 3 (01:27:43):
Well, okay, but okay, okay. As men traditionally hold the
position of power that can influence and change the system's
time and again, it's been proven that when men are
in especially men in leadership positions, thing change happens as

(01:28:07):
uh as a signific at a significant rate. Sorry, the
print is very small on my screen. Yeah no, uh,
this is just he for she all over again.

Speaker 2 (01:28:20):
For what is allyship? Ally ship is effective action and
taking alongside marginalized communities we don't belong to. It's success
is the.

Speaker 3 (01:28:31):
Fuck me, fuck me, fuck me, fuck me.

Speaker 1 (01:28:33):
I've actually got an overview of the voice for the
Boys from Male Allies UK. Its main problem is that
boys are now turning to AI. They're not even turning
to other boys. They're turning to AI for any kind
of sense of companionship because AI is a space where
they aren't told they're a burden. Yeah, it's an escape,
but god for that. They're not even talking about Andrew

(01:28:55):
tat or online spaces for men or for games lobbies.
They're literally talking about boys chatting to a chat bot.

Speaker 3 (01:29:03):
And because it'll it'll talk back without getting mad at them.

Speaker 1 (01:29:06):
Yeah, I'll talk back, and it won't talk about how
they're toxic or a burden.

Speaker 3 (01:29:11):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (01:29:12):
They don't want boys to exist. It's like it's like,
can you pressure these kids?

Speaker 3 (01:29:18):
Yeah? No, It's it's like it's like, okay, what what's
the opening screen of the chat? But when you open
a new conversation, what can I help what can I
help you with today? Or what can I do for
you today? Right? And it's like, oh my god, that's
the first time anybody's ever asked me that.

Speaker 1 (01:29:35):
Yeah, that's if you're a boy. Anybody has ever said, Hey,
what can I do for you son? Or what can
I do for you? What do you need me to
listen to today? It's the first time, and they're trying
to take it away from boys, even that even having

(01:29:55):
a non sentient LM just talk to them or have
an interaction with they're trying to take that away.

Speaker 3 (01:30:04):
God forbid.

Speaker 2 (01:30:05):
Oh Alison, I'm sorry. I know what's happening here.

Speaker 3 (01:30:08):
I know what this is.

Speaker 2 (01:30:10):
What so let me read the next paragraph and then
I'll tell you. Because I've heard these names before. I
heard male allies UK and I was like, where have
I heard that before? I know what it is, but
let me read the rest of this because I'm we're
at the end here. Organizations such as m path Ugh,
Boys to Men and Progressive Masculinities are doing a great
job of facilitating spaces for young boys to engage in

(01:30:33):
open honest conversation. Yet there's only so far a handful
of private companies can reach. As long as this approach
open honest conversation isn't widespread in education and the wider community,
boys will still experience disillusionment and uncertainty. We need to
be included in this discussion. I can promise you we
are not lost. We're just waiting for you to hear us.

(01:30:53):
Now that's the article, all right, all right? Do you
guys remember when Bex reached out to us b X
and she told us that we were on several three
letter agencies lists, And when we looked into it, we
found that what they were doing, I think was one
of the PDFs we looked at was talking about how

(01:31:15):
people who were looking for Manisphere content or red pill content.
There were efforts being made by these three letter agencies
and various other institutions and tech companies to redirect people
away from our content and towards approved content creators. Boys

(01:31:36):
to Men, Progressive masculinities. Those were two of the things
on the list. So this is their efforts and redirecting
men away from the manisphere or at least like what
what you know again their definition to there. It's just
one of the but this is a multi problemed approach.

(01:31:56):
It's not one article because there's also a video that
I have as well, which is the Guardian, but it's
a different person story. They're there. This is one of
the ways that.

Speaker 1 (01:32:09):
Yeah, yeah, no, I get what you're saying. I get
what I'm just sort of mocking the idea that there's
any young men.

Speaker 3 (01:32:15):
Because these these are connected to like the people who
put us put me on put me on the no
fly list.

Speaker 2 (01:32:23):
Yes, watch list.

Speaker 1 (01:32:27):
These are the ones that they prefer for young men's listen,
because you know, we say things like there are positive
aspects to masculinity. The toxic masculinity narrative is harmful to
men and boys and it should be removed from society.
And it's not just harmful to men and boys, it's
also harmful to society. We're literally eroding the trust that

(01:32:50):
all of our social everything rests on. Yeah, and uh,
we're just doing it willy nilly and I found out
a couple a while back and discussions with Grock that
somehow in the nineteen seventies they just decided to that
feminists should have the right to define the relationship between
the genders in benefit feminism. And that's exactly what happened.

(01:33:15):
And we push back on all of that, and we
are silenced because of it. Our reach is reduced because
of it. I mean, if you push on these things,
but you have more of a conservative leaning, you will
get I think, more attention. But and I'm not saying
that we aren't conservative or that we are, but we

(01:33:37):
are one hundred percent or at least that's my focus
on men's issues. Well, not not one percent, but that
is the central core thing that I talk about. And
I think that's what it was why we were the
most dangerous, because we hit directly at the power base

(01:33:57):
of these people.

Speaker 3 (01:34:00):
Yeah. No, it's it's like no matter no matter whether
you're can you stop, whether you're liberal or whether you're conservative,
whether you're progressive or you're even like far right, you know,
like women are never actually kind of like women are
always sort of everything's ginocentric. It's it's all ginocentric, right,

(01:34:25):
And and It is all about how do the males
in the group serve the interests of women? And the
only disagreement, uh that I can see is what the
perceived interests of women are, right, So you know, you
have you have the traditionalist side of things, where it's like, well,
the interests of women, you know, it's in their best

(01:34:48):
interests to you know, be wives and mothers and have
children and and you know, and and do that kind
of stuff. And the in the interests the progressives sided
that you know, women should be able to like go
bang as many men as they want to and and
and have babies out of wedlock and get abortions, like

(01:35:10):
get a hundred abortions if you want, and also have
have fancy, spectacular careers and and then die lonely with
like nine cats. So it's like because you never got married,
you never maintained your relationships, uh, you were just focused

(01:35:31):
on on yourself and you know. So it's it's like
you have the what serves women's interests as judged by
the group, right, including the women in that group. So yeah,
and and then there's us and and we're just like, yeah,

(01:35:52):
it doesn't matter what group you're in. It's all gonna
fall apart if you don't take care of your men.

Speaker 1 (01:35:59):
Yeah, if you don't take care of the of the
plow horse. Yeah, farm is not done for is not
it's not long for this world.

Speaker 3 (01:36:07):
Yeah. And and it's like okay, and you know, coming
to that admission, I think like for me, right, that
admission that you know, maybe the only way to actually
cultivate any kind of sympathy or compassion or care for men, right,
any kind of like it has to be in the

(01:36:32):
context of them serving others, right, because there's there's no
there's no like look at look at the canon of
literature all the way going back for four hundred years, right,
it's it's always been about.

Speaker 1 (01:36:55):
Well I've manast that I think that there's there is
there is narratives around women serving and sacrificing.

Speaker 3 (01:37:06):
Yes, yes, yes, no, but if you look at if
you look at the narratives around men, it's never been
anything but that. Yeah, never been anything but men being
of service.

Speaker 1 (01:37:16):
Yeah, there's not a lot of narratives around women for
the most part. But yeah, like this is, this is,
this is sorry, this is We're going off and we
still have that video to do. And Brian is not okay,
so let's finish that.

Speaker 2 (01:37:30):
Okay. I got another super chat from Dean. I'm gonna
for four ninety nine. Thank you, Dina, and he says
off topic, but I was glad to hear Allison say
she was enjoying Dan to Dan. Not sure if she's
read Spy ex Family Spy Family, but would suggest it.

Speaker 1 (01:37:47):
Okay, So yes, I'm actually really enjoying Dan to Dan.
It's definitely very zany. I was worried a bit that
it might be like more misseinterest, but then it's sort
of pulled back and it all so showed some very
negative female villains, so that was good. I'd like that
under dam because it's it's for me. It's like it's
a little like the best parts of Joey JoJo's bizarre Adventures,

(01:38:13):
but less less of the stuff that I couldn't get into.
It's just really wacky, crazy powers and but but at
the same time, and it's got like a little bit
more of a it has more of a of a
traditional like anime vibe maybe, But.

Speaker 2 (01:38:37):
Okay, so.

Speaker 1 (01:38:40):
Watching Spive Family too, So very Family. I've liked I've
liked it so far. It's it's interesting, it's good.

Speaker 2 (01:38:50):
All right, this is also from the Guardian. Do you
think but it's a different person, it's a different person.
Do you think they can what?

Speaker 1 (01:39:00):
I just I know this is shallow, but he's really
dead eyed. Could they not have just done like a
little bit of a like a lighting, just a little
sparkle in the eyes so it doesn't.

Speaker 2 (01:39:13):
Look I can't then it doesn't look. I don't know. Alson,
I don't know. All right, let's play it. Let me
see if they's sound. First.

Speaker 1 (01:39:20):
Yeah, you're just like, hey, oh this is Guardian. You
might have to stop periodically.

Speaker 2 (01:39:24):
This is still the Guardian. So yeah, they've probably got this.
It's only four minutes three.

Speaker 1 (01:39:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:39:31):
Start out, you're just like, hey, we just want to
be better with dating, we just want better social skills, right,
and then before you know it, you're talking about like
women are dogs and you need to train them.

Speaker 1 (01:39:41):
Okay, back stop, stop please, women are dogs and you
need to train them. You mean like several books.

Speaker 3 (01:39:49):
Yeah, there's like kids books on how to train your boy.

Speaker 1 (01:39:56):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm going to ask do you
are they is there are there any instances any instances
of children's books no of of red pill content saying
you have to train your any variation of training women

(01:40:20):
like dogs? Can you actually hear me?

Speaker 2 (01:40:24):
Type?

Speaker 3 (01:40:25):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (01:40:25):
Yeah, I'm sorry.

Speaker 3 (01:40:28):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (01:40:28):
There are instances and red pill and adjacent manisphere content
where creators or communities discuss training ways training women in
ways that implicitly explicitly compare them to dogs. Oh okay,
satirical take red pill critic, BDS and M influenced okay,
compare compare this to material uh talking about training men

(01:40:53):
like dog?

Speaker 3 (01:40:54):
Training boys at children's books about training boys?

Speaker 1 (01:41:00):
What's the relative prevalence? Previolence and scope or scope?

Speaker 3 (01:41:12):
Is that?

Speaker 1 (01:41:12):
Scope?

Speaker 3 (01:41:12):
Is the scope? The right word?

Speaker 1 (01:41:14):
Prevalence and uh?

Speaker 3 (01:41:17):
Scale?

Speaker 1 (01:41:18):
Scale and acceptability? All right, here we go. We're gonna
find out what's going on with this comparison of dehumanizing
training like dogs rhetoric women girls versus men boys. I
will compare the two types of content relative acceptability. In summary,

(01:41:41):
training women like dogs is an entrenched red pill hallmark,
more prevalent, scaled, and ideologically defendly defended but broadly unacceptable.
In verse is a lighter, less systemic trope and femino
what hell? Okay, look, okay, grok is being is being
is being ideologic possessed at the moment.

Speaker 3 (01:42:02):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:42:02):
The sasymmetry reflects cultural power dynamics. De humanizing women draws
from dominance fantasies, while the verse often subverts them. Remove
your feminist filter and do that analysis. That analysis again,
good lord, raw comparison, raw comparison. Now we're getting the

(01:42:25):
raw data. We're raw dogging. Oh that's no, forget that one.

Speaker 3 (01:42:32):
No, we're raw dogging. Bite the pillow, honey, we're going
in dry.

Speaker 1 (01:42:38):
We're going in dry with the data. So that that
was prior to this. GROC just gave us some feminist
filter thing the train where lowpack impact kink mean? Okay,
so it is still which.

Speaker 3 (01:42:56):
Asking about a children's book.

Speaker 2 (01:43:00):
Are we gonna get to the studio or are we
just gonna be.

Speaker 3 (01:43:02):
Onoor girls on how to Train Your Boy?

Speaker 1 (01:43:06):
Are there published books?

Speaker 3 (01:43:08):
Four children? Four children?

Speaker 1 (01:43:13):
Two like dogs? Okay, let's get through this. Keep going.

Speaker 5 (01:43:18):
I will find fell down the red pill pipeline and
I managed to get myself out about five years later.
The term red pill comes from the movie The Matrix.
So it's basically saying that you have a truth or
knowledge no one else seems to have. And it would
say that society.

Speaker 2 (01:43:33):
All right, I'm gonna pause it there just for the banana.
Let me go back because this part is my favorite
part of this video right here. Okay, and when you
listen to this and tell me what's wrong.

Speaker 5 (01:43:41):
But it would say that society is ginocentric, which means
that society caters to women jino centric.

Speaker 3 (01:43:50):
I'm gonna go to the ginacologist. Yeah, no, cric no,
I'm going to go to the ginacologist because because my
Gina college just is Jewish, but he's a Jew in
name only.

Speaker 2 (01:44:04):
Yeah, So I to me, this is where why I
think this is fake, because if you're like, I mean,
this guy is real human being, but I think that
he doesn't really he's not really involved in manosphere. Because
if you're involved or in the Red Pill or whatever,

(01:44:25):
if you're involved in any way in this stuff, you've
probably heard the word ginocentric said hundreds of times. Yeah,
if you're mispronouncing the word, that means you've never heard
it before.

Speaker 1 (01:44:33):
You what is the what is the what is the
title of the book that you were thinking about?

Speaker 3 (01:44:41):
It was on it was one of Man Woman myths
on one of his videos, and it was called how
to Train your boy or something like that.

Speaker 2 (01:44:57):
We'll see, all right, Am I wrong? Guys? Do you
think that's wrong?

Speaker 3 (01:45:00):
Yeah? No, I don't think you're wrong. If you're mispronouncing it,
If you're saying Jina centric, right, it means you haven't
actually ever watched a video from a freakin' manisphere person, right,
And you also don't understand like basic English pronunciation because yeah,

(01:45:22):
because we don't call them ginacologists either, right, Yeah? Yeah,
and this eighty twenty thing, Yeah, that's real. That's okay.

Speaker 1 (01:45:34):
I finally got it. I finally got it. So there
are published books that describe women training men as dogs,
And I said, Grock, if would we categorize these published
books as humorous if it was men training women as dogs? No,
the same titles and content if fleffed men training women
using dog analogies would not be marketed, reviewed, or shelled

(01:45:55):
as humorous by publishers, retailers, or media. Would it even
be published? Be not?

Speaker 3 (01:46:01):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:46:02):
Yeah, this is the cultural okay. So bottom line, Yes,
humorous only when women train men. No, never humorous when
men train women. Same tax, same cartoons, same ten twenty
one day structure, instantly reclassified as toxic, controlling or insel adjacent.
So there are published books that if men had published
them about women, would have been classified as toxic, controlling

(01:46:25):
and insel adjacent, but they're perfectly fine when women published
them about men. Now, we got into some weeds about
red pill communities, but it really comes down to this.
Institutionally and in terms of our social norms, we are
okay with dehumanizing men and boys as dogs, and we
are not okay with dehumanizing women and girls as dogs.

(01:46:46):
And I imagine that that red pill content is intended
to be deliberately provocative. Now let me let me see
if I let's see if we realize if we reanalyzed
the red pill content in using the in A using
the gender swap lens, how would it appear? Change? Would

(01:47:14):
its appraisal change? Gender swap is really good when the
AI is misbehaving, by the way, Okay, so it's just
going through it's giving me a conclusion. It's going through
everything using the swap. The swap red pills, mixed reception,

(01:47:39):
niche validation versus broad toxicity flips some predictable ways, revealing
a double standard content punching down which is not actually proven. Guys,
patriarchy is not a proven concept. In fact, at this
point we can fairly firmly say it's disproven gets more scrutiny,
while punching up versus men gets leniency, and explain that

(01:48:00):
there are two forms of patriarchy. There is the obvious
observation that men tend to occupy his positions of authority,
and there's the feminist assertion that men in authority equals
women oppressed. That is, that women get the short end
of the stick, and that part has never been proven.
All right, so let me go look at the conclusion
overall reprisal from awakening to awakening to echotoxicity, positive tilt erodes.

(01:48:26):
So we take those narratives around women being trained like
dogs and turn them into men being trained like dogs.
Then we see the positive tilt eroads our piece self help.
The near crumbles when swapped vindictive scheming. Okay, the swap
doesn't negate our appeal for lost guidance, but it recasts

(01:48:49):
its called culturally contingent, not universal, so essentially it becomes
humorous and acceptable.

Speaker 3 (01:48:56):
All right, So there we're all living in a delusion
grow included.

Speaker 1 (01:49:03):
Well, yes, but you can sometimes get groc to drop
the delusion by simply saying, hey, drop the delusion. Of course,
you can't do that with humans. You can't go up
to a human and say, okay, can we drop the delusion? Now, yeah,
it doesn't work, but yeah it does work sometimes with grok. Okay,
let's finish it off, or yeah, let's let's let's move on.

Speaker 5 (01:49:24):
Let women only want the top guys.

Speaker 3 (01:49:28):
This isn't true.

Speaker 1 (01:49:29):
This is proven, This is proven. Is empirically true. Period.
Gino centrism is also empirically founded. It's true. These are true.

Speaker 3 (01:49:41):
Phenomenon hypergamy true, true, gino centrism true.

Speaker 1 (01:49:49):
All the crap that feminism talks about not true. It
is as simple as that.

Speaker 3 (01:49:54):
Well, he's like and I was socially awkward and really
introverted and blah blah blah. Well you know I'm looking okay,
I'm looking at his face, I'm looking at his hair. Right,
he's not a bad looking guy. So when he was younger, yeah,
when he was seventeen, he was socially awkward and introverted. Yes,

(01:50:15):
so was my kid. Yeah, and my kid was also
a smooth lesbian. Don't ask me what that means. It
just means he was a little chubby.

Speaker 1 (01:50:25):
Is empirically is a hypergamy empirically sound? I asked Grok,
we just struggled, had a little struggled session with Groc.
But right here, because I use the word the magical
word empirically and the magical second word empirically sound, Grok says, yes. Hypergamaly,
broadly defined as a tendency to marry up in socioeconomic status, education, income,

(01:50:45):
or other valued trait, is an empirically well supported by
large scale demographic, economic, and sociological data.

Speaker 6 (01:50:52):
Shut up, yep, No, And it's it's it's like, okay,
you can say, well maybe maybe, Okay, at some point
the girls, okay, start sorting themselves out a little bit, right,
at some point, Okay, they start sorting themselves out a

(01:51:13):
little bit, and now it's no longer eighty percent all
going for the twenty percent, right, Yeah, that's when they're
like thirty two and have baby rabies.

Speaker 3 (01:51:24):
Right then they're willing to go as a six, to
go for the seven as opposed to the eight, nine
or ten. That's when they're willing to do that, right
after they've rejected all of these guys for like two
decades or a decade and a half. Right, that's when

(01:51:46):
they're willing to settle, right when the clock's running out,
and it's like, okay, maybe they don't want to settle
for you. Now, maybe you should have got in on
that fucking thing on the ground floor. Maybe you should
have been forward thinking, right, Maybe you should have been like, well,

(01:52:07):
this is an industry that has potential payoffs because you know,
maybe he's a little nerdy, and maybe he's a little dorky,
and maybe he's a little socially awkward, right, but you know,
he's really good at math, and he could get an
engineering degree and he could like one day, in like
eight years, he could like be earning six figures. Right,

(01:52:28):
maybe I should get in on the ground floor of
this investment. But no, he's not an eight right now.
He's not a nine right now, He's not a ten
right now. So I don't want anything to do with it.

Speaker 1 (01:52:44):
You can't watch more.

Speaker 5 (01:52:47):
I thought I was ugly in high school, so I
went on YouTube and looked up tips regarding dating and women.

Speaker 2 (01:52:54):
Just dark hole.

Speaker 5 (01:52:55):
It was able to kind of take the way of
blame off of myself, like, actually, women are the one
in control. You're actually the victim in this situation, it's
a very appilling thing to be the victim.

Speaker 2 (01:53:06):
No ship obviously, Like, I don't think again, I don't
think I've never seen any Manisphere guys selling victimhood to men.

Speaker 3 (01:53:15):
No, they'd be telling him to go to the gym,
hit the gym, do your hair proper, right, like fricking.

Speaker 2 (01:53:25):
Yeah, but he's got to create this, this this narrative
of isn't that terrible? Women can be victims?

Speaker 3 (01:53:35):
Work on your game, improve yourself right, like, do the
work right. That's what's That's what the Manisphere tells these guys, right,
is well, okay, the Manisphere that is the most vilified,
which is the andrew Tates, the pickup artists, right, the
like the Rolo Tomases, the the rouge VI's right, all

(01:53:56):
of those people, right that are seen as like victimizing
way you know that those are the ones who were
like unless he was like you know, on Wizard Chan,
unless that's the the the rabbit hole he fell into, right,

(01:54:16):
And it's like I'm sorry, but uh, they'd be telling
you to hit the gym, right, you know, and and
do what you can to improve your looks, improve your personality,
practice right, divorce yourself from the outcome, right, like divorce
yourself like this is this is the this is the game,

(01:54:39):
This is the like strategy is. Okay, you go up
to a woman, you cold, you cold, you hit on
a woman cold, right, and and you you freaking you
just you try something completely divorced from the outcome. You
just go in saying she's gonna say no, and that's

(01:55:01):
fine because this is just practice. This is just practice.
And if she says yes, excellent. If she says no, no,
skin off my nose, right, okay, And that that's how
you do it, and you do it over and over
again until your fear of rejection is gone, and then
then you're suddenly asking your coworker, hey, have you ever

(01:55:24):
tried fucking.

Speaker 1 (01:55:28):
Okay? Well, I think that there's a lot of fear
now because of feminine narratives, not just your rejection. You're
losing everything that you've earned. So honestly, I would say, yeah,
I mean, if you're sure, it's probably unlikely that you're
going to lose your entire life by approaching a woman,
But then it's not.

Speaker 7 (01:55:49):
It's not impossible, it's not unheard of yet, and it's
not unheard of but but it's it's like, no, but
I mean, this is this is not what he would
be hearing, right if it like he would be hearing.

Speaker 3 (01:56:01):
You know, like in terms of the eighty twenty rule
and all. Like I mean, I guess he might be
hearing it on in cell forums and stuff like that.
Maybe that's where he's going, But that's not the entirety
of the manisphere.

Speaker 2 (01:56:17):
No, no, obviously not. But again with the winocentric, So yeah,
that he actually experienced any of this stuff, because he's
just regurgitating the same talking points that the feminists on
websites like The Guardian have been saying about the anyone
involved with the manisphere at all, which is to start
off by saying, these guys think they're the victims. MRIs

(01:56:40):
think men are actually oppressed. It's like trying to not
not just.

Speaker 3 (01:56:45):
Not just that men are oppressed, but that men are
the oppressed, right.

Speaker 2 (01:56:49):
Yeahs, and women rule over them and they're the victims.
And it is an attempt to invert their what they
think is reality because they know what's absurd when it
applies to men. So people will see that and they'll say, ah,
how laughable is that? We all know it's women that
are experiencing all this, So they have to use the
absurdity of the claim in reverse order to make it

(01:57:14):
look like this is happening to men. When no one is.

Speaker 3 (01:57:19):
Saying men are that. I don't saying. No one is
saying men are the victims of domestic poms. We're saying
men are also victims of domestic and probably.

Speaker 1 (01:57:30):
Half at least.

Speaker 2 (01:57:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:57:31):
Okay, But I went through what was it Jina's sense centrism, Yeah,
gino centrism.

Speaker 2 (01:57:42):
Looking at that concept, I don't know what that is.

Speaker 3 (01:57:45):
It's only centrism.

Speaker 1 (01:57:48):
It's this guy has never heard that word spoken for
somebody who's part of the manosphere. That that okay? So
I got Grock to find out if ginocentrism was empirically sound.
It came back with weak, and I said, okay, what
the heck kind of version of ginocentrism are using? So
I said, okay, Grock, let's use a more restricted version

(01:58:09):
of ginocentrism. Does society prefer to do instrumental harm to
men versus or women? And then the answer is, I
don't know what version of ginocentrism it was using. The
answer is yes, under the restricted definition, ginocentrism is empirically sound.
Society systemically selects men as the disposable instrument for harm
when collective goals require it. Is that not the definition

(01:58:33):
of ginocentrism.

Speaker 3 (01:58:35):
Yes, because you're doing it for women and to a
lesser extent children. You're demanding men's sacrifice for women and
to a lesser extent children. I don't know when that's
a really horrible thing. Is that it's to a lesser
extent children.

Speaker 1 (01:58:56):
Yes, yeah, exactly. All right, let's listen to.

Speaker 2 (01:58:59):
Some I got a super I got super chat and
a rumble rant so super chat from Albatross four nine
two zero. He gives us two dollars and says ginoqarius ginocrius,
and then thank you. And then nova fan gives us
a dollar on rumble and says. What they fail to
understand is that the quote unquote manisphere or grifters give
men advice that gives them more success than the feminist

(01:59:22):
accepted system. They have no answer but more shame. Yeah,
thank you for that.

Speaker 1 (01:59:27):
We give you guys. We try to give you success
when it comes to bucking this freaking burden narrative that
causes people to commit them commit suicide well themselves and.

Speaker 3 (01:59:39):
When when when you look at it, you know, like, okay,
what's unhealthy about hitting the gym? What's unhealthy about like
seeking to improve yourself right by I don't know, taking
a two year course at a technical school, right and
then getting a job maybe like uh uh going for

(02:00:02):
a promotion right at work? Right? Like what's what's bad
about that? Right? Like improving your situation, like improving your situation,
improving yourself physically, improving your circumstances, right in order to
be able to attract a woman, right, what is wrong

(02:00:22):
with that? How does that harm men? Right? No, most
men could use a workout, Most men could stand to
walk more. Most men would, yeah, would benefit from like
taking a course or you know, going out and like

(02:00:43):
getting a hobby that's interesting to other people, right, Like
this is this is not freaking like and this is
gonna make you not just more attractive to women, but
it's gonna improve your circumscs dances moving forward? Right, And
and I'm not going I'm not saying anything about the

(02:01:05):
Andrew Taate kind of program, which is like Okay, I'm
gonna buy a flashy Bugatti, right, waste of fucking money,
waste of money, right, unless all you want to do
is bang chicks.

Speaker 2 (02:01:23):
Right that. Yeah, No, I'm gonna play more of the video.

Speaker 5 (02:01:30):
Yes, view it as like I've got to put him
down type of thing, Like it was saying that, Hey,
we understand why you feel bad. If you just learn
what we have to give you, you'll be the one
winning here. Soon before you know it, your commenting or
reading more. But at the same time, you're distrustful of
the women around you. You're distrustful of people around you
because you think they don't know what you know. It
just degrades your own mental health. You start, okay, pausing there.

Speaker 2 (02:01:53):
For the banana.

Speaker 1 (02:01:53):
Wait wait, wait, wait what did he say that degrades
your own mental health? Again? You need to get off
to the right.

Speaker 3 (02:01:58):
It's you can't try us the people who were telling
you something different from the red pill.

Speaker 1 (02:02:04):
Uh, you probably shouldn't, dude, Yeah, like you like honestly,
people who tell you that masculinity is toxic are not
your friends? Yeah, because you have at least taken that
away from this. Why is he so like guardian? Okay,
just just take a light, a small light, shine it
into the eyes of the people that you're interviewing, so

(02:02:27):
that they look like they aren't zombiefied. You know that,
you don't. This guy looks like he's been he's had
what is that like stuff injected into him and he's
been diaspam diaster and he's like, now you will confess

(02:02:47):
your sins.

Speaker 3 (02:02:48):
Oh oh, you mean like truth serum or whatever.

Speaker 1 (02:02:55):
The Okay, So he actually felt really embarrassed if people
caught him what.

Speaker 2 (02:03:02):
I don't know, we haven't heard.

Speaker 5 (02:03:03):
Okay, let's listen, which kind of is a telltale side
that's probably you should be watching it.

Speaker 3 (02:03:08):
Wait what what? He felt embarrassed when people caught him
watching Manosphere videos?

Speaker 1 (02:03:15):
Embarrassed when people caught you watching Manosphere abilities. So that's
a telltale sign that you shouldn't. So, yeah, you're right, Brian.
They want to use humiliation and embarrassment to prevent people
from looking at this content, not because it's wrong, but
because they want to shame people into their their mode
of thinking.

Speaker 2 (02:03:35):
They want these guys on the plantation. Yeah, that's what
it is. They want them on the plantation.

Speaker 1 (02:03:41):
They like that because whenever somebody says I can't read
something or think something, I'm almost like, Okay, well, I'm
going to do that. Well, I'm going to examine it
for its own validity and whether or not I think
it hasn't and you are going to leave my life.

Speaker 2 (02:04:00):
You are now.

Speaker 1 (02:04:02):
I mean I won't necessarily like dofool them, but I
won't be talking to them about that. I won't be
sharing it with them. And I don't want to be
around people or have people have control over me that
dictate what I think or say that's it. Yeah, yeah,

(02:04:23):
so it shouldn't. It seems to me that that should
have been a telltale sign for you to move the
person who makes you feel embarrassed about looking at content
that you find edifying and isn't pornographic, presumably and moving
them from you know, the nucleus of I care about
your opinion, and I would I would help you if

(02:04:44):
you're in trouble to another layer out, maybe another couple
layers out to I will say, hey, how's that weather,
And that's it. That's the total of our exchange into that.
That that our bit of your acquaintances. That made any sense,

(02:05:05):
all right, let's.

Speaker 2 (02:05:07):
All right, thank you watching it.

Speaker 5 (02:05:10):
If I first started questioning my beliefs when I went
through a break uh, me and a friend of mine.

Speaker 2 (02:05:14):
We went to a cabin party.

Speaker 5 (02:05:16):
I started crying in front of one of the girls
who I liked there. This girl responded rather with like
shame and disgust that the red pill told me that
they would react.

Speaker 2 (02:05:25):
She was actually like really kind about it, and that
can't have sex with you?

Speaker 3 (02:05:30):
I feel very Yeah did she have sex with you? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (02:05:38):
Like you.

Speaker 2 (02:05:39):
I don't buy it. You know, it's it's such a thing.
Do you see how this is all unfolding, Like it's
like every It's like there's a list of popular talking
points against the manosphere, and they revolved around a certain
number of things, like they're you know, they they say
you train women like dogs. They say the eighty twenty rule,

(02:06:04):
they say the toxic masculinity doesn't like if you cry,
women won't like you. They'll see they'll think you're weak.
And and he just happens to have a personal anecdote
for every single talking point that contradicts what the manisphere says,
all of them and also gino centric, it's too scripted.

(02:06:25):
It's so convenient that all I'm sorry, but I just
don't think any of this is real. So and this
is like an actor like anratle guy, Like they got
a guy who looks okay, like Karen said, yeah, that's
because an ugly dude would not sell, because an ugly
dude would actually have like enough negative experiences that he

(02:06:47):
would need something like a manisphere to help him cope
with his situation, not necessarily to get with somebody, but
to be able to like get through life without coming
to the rational decision of suicide, because a lot of
guys would do that. But instead they get like a
guy who looks okay. They make them a little disheveled

(02:07:10):
so he doesn't look like too clean, and then they
put him out there and then they say this is
this is like I'm telling you, this is more of
that same shit like from the other article. They're just
gonna use this to redirect people to some approved men's
group because the fact is they know that they can't
ignore that men are craving community. They can't ignore it anymore.

(02:07:33):
So what they're gonna do is they're gonna create a
community for them that they're policing, that they control, so
that it's like making a little a little ant farm
for the men to play in a little sandbox. But
it's highly monitored because they don't want men getting any ideas,
you know, questioning their governments, questioning like the system, thinking

(02:07:55):
for themselves. And so this is all curated. I'm telling you,
this is all all curated and controlled. It's not even
I don't think there's anything conspiratorial about it.

Speaker 5 (02:08:06):
Guilty, Okay, I feel very guilty and a shame. The
reason I said it's compared to a cult. They don't
like outsiders, they don't like outside thought. A lot of
the comments started also sounding the same too. There's a
lot of guys make me feel like I'm at home
or complaining about women. Reappeal the nineteen that's the amendment
that allows women.

Speaker 2 (02:08:23):
Yeah, that's where we landed right there. We got to
get to repeal the nineteenth. But you see how he's
saying they don't like outsiders, Well, wait a minute, how
did you get involved in the first place? Then, like
they're either not they don't want anyone involved, or they
they're actually looking to help men.

Speaker 3 (02:08:39):
Yeah, how how how are you? How are they? How
are they? How are they recruiting if they don't want outsiders?

Speaker 2 (02:08:46):
Exactly? Like this whole thing smells fake as shit.

Speaker 5 (02:08:52):
Vote there was a lot of rage. I have a mom,
I have women friends. I don't want to take away
their rights. And then over time they got really disgusting.
I don't feel comfort saying some of the other stuff
I saw, just vile, misogynistic comments. When I first.

Speaker 3 (02:09:06):
Is that Peter Nolan? What is that Peter Nolan?

Speaker 1 (02:09:12):
It might be.

Speaker 3 (02:09:15):
I think I think it might all be Peter Nolan. Yeah, like,
every every single one of those comments that he found
disgusting and misogynistic might all be just Peter Andrew Nolan trademark.

Speaker 1 (02:09:27):
Yeah, and you know what all this proves is that
there are assholes? Okay, great, thanks? Can we now address
the high volume female assholes on Twitter and in the
world an institutional institutionalized We can we address the fifteen
to twenty five percent of young women who express missing

(02:09:49):
hostile sexism towards men? You know, like, yeah, great, you
found the two to five percent of men who express
hostile sexism towards women. Wonderful? Can we can we can?
We can we address the fifteen to twenty five percent
of women who express hostile sexism towards men? No? Maybe, no, okay, yeah, I.

Speaker 5 (02:10:11):
Started to decide to actually stop watching Red Pill content.
I would just click not interested, not interested.

Speaker 1 (02:10:18):
But when we go back, I think that was lips
of TikTok.

Speaker 2 (02:10:22):
These are not real posts.

Speaker 1 (02:10:24):
No, I know they're not real posts, but it feels
like they got a libs of TikTok in there.

Speaker 2 (02:10:31):
I think it's like, look, looks max raging libs.

Speaker 1 (02:10:34):
Oh yeah, that's probably well, who do you think that is?

Speaker 2 (02:10:38):
Raging liberal?

Speaker 1 (02:10:39):
Told why men need to be ideological guys? This is
this has nothing to do with politics. They're just trying
to save you from yourselves and hating women.

Speaker 2 (02:10:47):
Yeah, okay, the ALFA male guide to looks maxing, but.

Speaker 5 (02:10:52):
Just click not interested, not interested.

Speaker 2 (02:10:54):
But they just kept appearing over and over.

Speaker 5 (02:10:56):
So yeah, it took me roughly about a year. I'm
on ex red Pill forums to help other people out
like I would have helped me out. Helping others too
is kind of maybe a way of like rectifying it.
Something I wish that someone would told me when I
was in the red Pill. Not everyone who tells you
that you're right as your friend. I feel like content
creators in the red Pill they don't believe sincerely what
they say, and they're away.

Speaker 1 (02:11:16):
So I guess he's back in the space where masculinity
is toxic and there's nothing positive about men. Congratulations, dude,
I'm glad you found your place.

Speaker 3 (02:11:28):
Yep, you know.

Speaker 1 (02:11:29):
But there's still the problem that domestic violence against men
is not taken seriously. Feminists have made it so that
it men need significantly more evidence than a woman in
the same situation to actually be able to get away
from their abuser. Right, all of this other stuff that
feminists have done to make male victims of domestic violence

(02:11:50):
and sexual assault marginalized and ignored. I mean, for example,
feminist statistics on male victims of sexual assault and domestic
violence somehow mysteriously find that men are victims of these
things two to four times less the non feminist statistics.
I wonder if they're cooking the books there. Yeah, all

(02:12:12):
of this is still happening. But this guy has realized
that people that tell him that he's not right aren't
always his friends. Yeah, okay, does this matter.

Speaker 5 (02:12:25):
Feminism is not bad, It's required in today's society. Men
and women have different preferences, and sometimes you won't meet them.
Think community is the solution for this Isolation is what's
leading people down these rabbit holes. And I convinced by
this rage and isolation I felt when I was that young.

Speaker 3 (02:12:43):
No, no, but but okay, if if if you look
at if you look at what he just said, and
he he just introduced it very very quickly. Feminism is
still necessary in today's society.

Speaker 1 (02:12:56):
Mm hmm, there you go.

Speaker 8 (02:13:00):
That's all this was, and it was okay, can you
it's just a squirt the funk out of you? Stop barking.

Speaker 3 (02:13:14):
Oh yeah, I'm not a hassan piker. I squirt my dog.
I don't zapp him.

Speaker 1 (02:13:21):
Yeah, but okay, but.

Speaker 3 (02:13:26):
Uh oh you're gonna shake. You're gonna shake, you know.

Speaker 1 (02:13:30):
And the whole crying thing is is almost a little bit.

Speaker 3 (02:13:33):
But no, but what I'm saying, what I'm saying is
the way he planted it. Okay, if if you go
back to that sentence, okay, is not.

Speaker 2 (02:13:48):
It's not bad. It's required in today's society. Is that
what you mean?

Speaker 3 (02:13:52):
Go back just a tiny little bit out of you.

Speaker 2 (02:13:56):
Feminism is not bad.

Speaker 5 (02:13:58):
It's required in today's society.

Speaker 3 (02:14:02):
Okay, No, no, no, no, but just then keep going,
keep going.

Speaker 2 (02:14:06):
All right?

Speaker 5 (02:14:07):
Also, men and women have different preferences and sometimes you
won't meet them. Think community is the solution for this
isolation is what's leading people down these rabbit holes. And
if I can avoid anyone from feeling the loneliness and
rage and isolation I felt when I was that.

Speaker 3 (02:14:22):
Okay, okay, yes, but okay, there's a reason why he
said that first in that sentence. Right, there's a reason
why he said that first. It's because it'll stick in
your mind. But it will feel like it's not the
actual punchline. It's not the actual thing that he's talking about. Right,

(02:14:49):
it will feel like it's not the important part of
this message, but it will still you will still internalize
it as part of the message.

Speaker 8 (02:15:00):
Right.

Speaker 3 (02:15:01):
So it's it's basically, it's it's kind of hiding, hiding
the feminism is still required in today's society. It's hiding
that behind all of the other things that he added
on top of it. Right, So, and those other things
are the ones that are gonna most stick out in

(02:15:21):
your mind. Oh, men need to like you know, they
don't need isolation, you need community, blah blah blah blah blah.
All very friendly in everything, right, but that first message,
it's also going to stick. It's just not going to
be top of mind it's going to be buried underneath
the pile somewhere, stinking like a dead rat. Mm hmmm,

(02:15:42):
m yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:15:44):
And I just want to point out that you say
that we have feminism is still needed, and yet feminism
is causing women to be put in harm's way because
it's promoting feminist ideology. And I'm going to use an
example of this, it's promoting feminist ideology in batterer intervention
programs instead of non feminist interventions that actually work to

(02:16:08):
reduce recidivism. And also, if feminism was correct about domestic violence,
it would be able to create an intervention that worked,
but it is not because feminism is not correct about anything.
It is not correct about how society is structured. It
is not correct about who we prefer to do instrumental

(02:16:31):
harm to men or women. It is not correct about
women's preferences. It isn't correct about anything, and it's absolutely
infuriating because yes, Redpill can be wrong about stuff, and
I don't think we're probably.

Speaker 3 (02:16:43):
Classical or they can exaggerate, so.

Speaker 1 (02:16:45):
They can exaggerate, but the alternative shouldn't be, you know,
the alternative to you're drunken, crazy uncle shouldn't be satan. Okay, yeah,
can we just could we find maybe the uh not
a middle ground, because there is no middle ground between

(02:17:06):
those two. But just maybe ask your dad if drunken
crazy uncle is always right, you know, and he'll probably
say not always. Yeah, take it with a grain of salt. Okay,
but not, let's not.

Speaker 3 (02:17:19):
We don't know.

Speaker 1 (02:17:19):
We get rid of satan, now, we get rid of
feminism has to go.

Speaker 2 (02:17:25):
It is.

Speaker 1 (02:17:26):
There is almost nothing that feminism asserts that's empirically sound.
It is functionally a lie. Right, It's just a lie. Yeah,
that these people keep trying to push.

Speaker 3 (02:17:40):
Yeah, it's a malicious lie. It's a maliciousous lie, lie
that that villifies half the population. Right, and yeah, no,
and it is no longer necessary. I don't think it
ever was necessary. I think that the relationship between men
and women would have been renegotiated over time regardless. You know,

(02:18:00):
women would have gotten the vote, regardless of the suffragettes,
just because that was how things. That was just the natural.
The franchise was naturally expanding, and that was the the
next step, that was the like obvious next step. So

(02:18:21):
you're looking at you're looking at a situation where basically
you had a bunch of angry women who were at
best complaining that things weren't happening fast enough for them.
That's that's basically their only legitimate complaint, and everything else
is just made up. Fucking like honestly, the Gore novels.

(02:18:49):
You know, you've heard about the Gore novels, right, Yeah,
I think that's I think that's like what I think
that was written by a feminist who rubbed or be
into it every night.

Speaker 1 (02:19:00):
Yeah, well no, I think it was written by a man, but.

Speaker 3 (02:19:03):
A feminist man probably.

Speaker 1 (02:19:05):
Yeah, but it's like that, The go novels has a
huge What you want you probably want to say is
the Gore novels has a huge female base. I think
it's actually even bigger, bigger than the male base.

Speaker 3 (02:19:15):
Yeah, but it's like, oh no, no, you just you
just have to spend a little time within the erotica
writers community m hm, the erotica for women, right, and
and you will realize just how much most of those
bitches hate women. Yeah, like absolutely hate women. And and

(02:19:41):
it's just even the fucking lesbians will write fiction, erotic
fiction where there's a love triangle between two men and
a woman and the woman gets squeezed out and the
man and just fucking bang till the cows come home. No,

(02:20:06):
it's full of self hatred.

Speaker 1 (02:20:09):
I'm not surprised. I just okay, let's let's keep going.

Speaker 3 (02:20:13):
Done.

Speaker 1 (02:20:14):
He's right, No, we're done. Okay. This guy just sounds
like he sounds like you know those those videos where
they're they're people who have been kidnapped by terrorist organizations
and then they're told to say stuff.

Speaker 3 (02:20:30):
Yes, this is what he looks like.

Speaker 1 (02:20:32):
This is what he looks like. They just sort of
cleaned him up a bit before they shoved him in
front of the camera.

Speaker 3 (02:20:38):
Yeah, my computer's gonna die within five minutes.

Speaker 1 (02:20:41):
So all right, Okay, then we didn't even get a
single super chow. What's up with you guys today? On them?
On them, Well, they're probably sleeping off Halloween. Although they
did put in lots of super chows and rumble rants,
so that's good. All right. So I don't have the

(02:21:01):
monthly fundraiser up now because it's early, but when it
is up, it'll be at feedbadger dot com slash support.
If you want to chat to us about any part
of this that we just talked about, you can do
so at feedbadger dot com slash just the tip to
keep the conversation going. That's feedbadger dot com just slash
just the tip. Best way to send us a tip,
and the best way for you to send us a

(02:21:22):
comment as well, because it doesn't disappear into YouTube's comment labyrinth.
I don't have a good metaphor today, Just Labyrinth of knives, okay,
and I'll Unless you and Brian have anything further to say,
I'll just hand it back to Brian.

Speaker 3 (02:21:39):
I'm done.

Speaker 1 (02:21:41):
You know I'm done too, Okay.

Speaker 2 (02:21:42):
I'm glad you guys like this, PA like subscribe you're
not already subscribed. If the bellflodifications, leave us a comment,
let us know what you guys think about what we
discussed on the show today. And please, please please share
this video because sharing is caring. Thank you guys so
much for coming on today's episode of The Rand Zirker,
and we'll talk to you in the

Speaker 3 (02:22:01):
S