House of Bigelow - 253 - Point Break

Join Houselights as we explore "Point Break," Kathryn Bigelow's 90s cult classic that blends extreme sports with high-stakes heists. With Keanu Reeves and Patrick Swayze leading the charge, this film is a thrilling ride of surfing, skydiving, and philosophical musings on freedom. Discover why this action-packed spectacle remains a beloved piece of pop culture.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to the Net party.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
Tonight on house Lights, we're jumping out of planes, saving
Lori Petty in her ninety and maybe just maybe learning
to ride the endless wave of friendship. We're talking Catherine
Bigelow's point Break, the nineteen ninety one high speed concoction
of surfing, parachuting and reaganing. I am your host, Tristan

(00:42):
Rudel and joining me as always as a man who
has never ordered just one meet bal sub in his life.
John Mills and the incredibly responsible FBI agent who empties
an entire clip in the air near a populated area,
Darren Moser. It's cops versus surfers, freedom versus order, Keanu

(01:04):
versus a flying pitbull. This episode will hit you like
a wave against a stunt surfer.

Speaker 1 (01:10):
Bravo, Bravo, Bravo.

Speaker 3 (01:13):
Indeed, is two even enough for meatball subs? I say no,
It all depends on the type of bread and how
much cheese you put on it.

Speaker 2 (01:22):
Gary Busey was so much fun in this movie, and
I know that's a common phrase for most Gary Busey films,
but he was especially fun in this one.

Speaker 3 (01:31):
If there is anybody in the movie who I think
completely understood the assignment and the fact that you had
to walk a very fine line between earnestness and parody.

Speaker 1 (01:41):
It was Gary Busey.

Speaker 3 (01:43):
He totally got what they were doing in this movie
and just had a blast.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
Absolutely.

Speaker 4 (01:49):
Now, I really enjoyed him in this role. I had
just watched Under Siege, as one does when they want
to watch fine movies, and so seeing him, you know,
he's a villain, he's a bad guy, he's an ass
in that movie, and in this one, I'm like, oh,
I get to enjoy you. You get to be a
nice guy that I want to see do well. Because

(02:10):
I think of like Predator too. I think like he
doesn't often get this kind of a role like now,
maybe if I thought two seconds about it, I'd think
of a dozen other options. But I really enjoy.

Speaker 2 (02:22):
That aspect of his character this time. Now, this was
the first time that I watched this movie start to finish.
Like I've seen several clips of this online, you know,
I've watched big chunks of it while it was on TV,
but never from start to finish in one go. And
so I was really looking forward to this to finally
sitting down because this is a whether you like it

(02:44):
or not, this movie is a classic. Whether you think
it's good or not is immaterial. This is a chasteric
film where it is constantly referenced in pop culture. It
is parodied constantly. There's jokes about it constantly. There's even
a inspired a parodied play, a live play where people

(03:07):
will they'll take an audience member and that audience member
plays utah and they read from Q cards.

Speaker 1 (03:14):
Oh my gosh.

Speaker 3 (03:15):
The thing is, I would love to have a version
of that where they're like, Okay, what you can play
Gary Busey's character. I'd be like, if you my life
is led to this moment, Please let me play Gary
Busey's character.

Speaker 1 (03:26):
We heard the audience for.

Speaker 2 (03:27):
That one time Gary Busey showed up to a performance
and played Ary Busey Like, I mean he played Papa's
I love that y did the same thing another night.

Speaker 3 (03:39):
Oh Jesus, But see that's that is. I think that
speaks to it. And of course you failed to mention
that it inadvertently launched another very popular franchise, The Fast
and the Furious, Because if you watch The Fast and
the Furious after this, there are several sign posts where
you're like huh, somebody really watched Point Break a whole

(04:00):
lot before they made this movie. There are very similar
story beats in that movie.

Speaker 2 (04:06):
I watched this with my wife and when we got
to the bank robbing scene and they're all dressed as
I mean, they have the ex president's masks on, I
turned her and say, oh, by the way, this is
where the bank robbering trope of wearing a presidential mask
came from. She's like, really, because that's everywhere.

Speaker 1 (04:25):
I think that.

Speaker 3 (04:26):
Supposedly James Cameron did a lot of ghostwriting on the script,
and according to at least one source, I mean, this
could be just Cameron trying to be a credit hog,
which you know would be fitting, but supposedly he's the
one that really brought the ex president's concept together. And
I'm like, I don't know how true it is, because

(04:47):
you know, hearsay people taking credit over time and everything
like that, but I'm like, it does seem like a
very James Cameron type of thing to come up with
something so cinematically pleasing that it just became a thing
in cinema for all time after that.

Speaker 2 (05:03):
And apparently they die in the order of the President's
leaving office. Like those guys, and which is interesting, Which
is interesting because when body dies at the end, Reagan,
Reagan was the last one.

Speaker 1 (05:19):
Hey, wait a minute, did body die at the end?

Speaker 2 (05:21):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (05:22):
Did he?

Speaker 3 (05:23):
Do you think he really did? Did I see a body?
Or did body? Did he find a way and he
did that whole thing so that he could get to
his underwater submarine and escape with all of the money
that could have happened.

Speaker 2 (05:39):
While we're talking about James Cameron, apparently on the Terminator
two director's commentary, he said that body did die at
the end, and him and Catherine Bigelow rewrote the original
ending to be that way.

Speaker 1 (05:51):
I you know what, I didn't see a body.

Speaker 3 (05:53):
We are still open for point break two with body's
son or something like that, like coming for revenge against Utah.
But then the sudden reverse at the end as you
find out that body's been alive the whole time and
its father son bonding time to come back after as old.

Speaker 1 (06:10):
There you go. I just wrote the sequel. You're welcome, everybody.

Speaker 2 (06:13):
Apparently they were going to make a sequel and they
wrote the script. It was gonna come out in ninety three.
They wrote the script. They were in pre production and
for some reason I got scrapped. Don't know why, Darren.
Was this the first time you saw it? Or had
you seen it before? What do you know about this film?

Speaker 1 (06:30):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (06:30):
This was also my first time watching it all the
way through. The only clips I'd seen, though, are those
from the wonderful movie Hot Fuzz, which references this movie
all the time. So I knew about the you know,
shooting the gun up in the air. I had no
context as to why you know that was going to happen.

(06:50):
So this is one of those like you watch a
pop culture movie and you get all those references that
have been in movies and television. You're like, oh, okay,
that point break is everywhere. But it was fun to
see that come together. But no, this I didn't know
a lot about it. You know, I knew it was
a Keanu Reeves movie, but that was really all I

(07:13):
knew of actors wise. Obviously the main actress pop up
pretty quick in the very beginning. But yeah, and then
again not even knowing much at all, so I'm like,
oh surfing, Oh, we're jumping, Like everything was just a turn.
I had no idea what to expect in this movie,
and it just kept kept running. I mean, I did
put together that he would be going towards the fifty

(07:35):
year storm, and I saw that coming a mile away.
But besides that, it was I just enjoyed the ride.
It was really fun.

Speaker 3 (07:44):
Well, let me ask you a question, says, this is
your first time seeing it. I've never seen it on
the big screen. Tristan, I know you haven't seen it
on the big screen. This is your first time all
the way through, I'll put it out to you, you know,
like Darren Trista, like this time. While I'm watching it,
I sat there and my entire vibe with it was, boy,
I wish I could see this on the big screen.
This really seems to me a movie that was directed

(08:06):
for that in theater experience, where it's like, if you
watch it on a TV, I think you're a little
more critical of it than if you're in the movie
theater surrounded by all of this. I mean, let's be honest,
terrific photography of these insane situations like that movies photograph
pretty darn well, and it really seems like it's framed
for the big screen for you know, the in theater experience.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
I could see that. I really could. I mean, it
was it was a ninety one film, and so that's
definitely what they had in mind. And you know, like
home video was in its infancy and it was you know,
it's it's interesting that you say that because there's so
many it's what's the word I'm looking for. It's not
it's not scenes, but there's so many not moments, but

(08:52):
like there's so much spectacle. There's so much spectacle, Like
you're going from moment to moment, moment you going from
that the word is eluding me and it's really bothering me.
And like you're going surfing and then you're going night surfing,
which was totally in the night and not during the day,
even though you could see the sun. And then you

(09:12):
you know, like then you went skydiving, and then you
went in a car chase, and then you did on
a foot chase, and then you know, like it was
just like and then there was shooting, and then there
was that bank robbery and then there was a fight,
and then there was a drug rate and you're just
like going from moment to moment to moment, and it
was I feel like if it was I'm gonna you know,

(09:34):
like leak my my rating a little bit. But if
I feel like if I was watching this on the
big screen and I was enveloped by the screen, you know,
like my if I was close to it, and you know,
like it was within my peripheral and I got that
sound and I got that sub and just to you know,
like you during the skydiving, seen everybody's kind of going
around you and everything like that, I probably wouldn't have

(09:56):
gotten as bored as I did watching this movie. And
I know this is going to sound ridiculous, but there
was so much going on and there were so many
constant events that I was getting tired and so I
had to shut down a little bit. Does that make
sense at all?

Speaker 3 (10:12):
I I could see that. I could see that where
it's like the movie is so concerned with conveying the
spectacle of the adrenaline junkie that you can't participate in it,
and so you you're not emotionally invested in what's going on,
because let's you know, let's be honest, these are not
the most three dimensional characters that have ever been written

(10:33):
for the screen, and I think that that probably plays
a part to it as well. Right, these are all
very much caricatures that are just if anything, I think
that what you're talking about speaks to that idea that
you can throw you know what it's like the you know,
I'll draw a line to like Godzilla, which is about

(10:56):
what seven years after this. You can throw as much
aduction value and spectacle as you want at the screen,
But if you don't care deeply about the characters, you
are just done. You're just like, okay, whatever, Like you're
not wowed by it anymore. You're just sort of technically
admiring it and saying, oh, wow, that's really well shot

(11:19):
and well put together, instead of like being in the
moment and enjoying it.

Speaker 4 (11:25):
Yeah, I will say, I see what you're saying, Tristan.
I didn't because I was watching for the first time
that I wasn't as bored as far as just going
along for the ride. And maybe because I I kind
of took the posture of like you're sitting back in
your chair and you're just like, here we go. You know,
I'm not oh, this better do it for me or

(11:47):
you know, be my next favorite movie. But I will say,
while I like plot wise, the red Hairing of the
Drug Bust and the other people it did sack time
we could have been spending with our group of surfers
and actually getting to know them more than the surface level.

Speaker 1 (12:09):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (12:09):
There was also one moment for me that was slightly
confusing as far as it was the the It was
the moment where he shoots his gun and doesn't kill
the bank robber because he looks at him really closely
and we see, you know, his blue eyes. For some reason,
even though I knew I was wrong, I kept thinking, Oh,

(12:33):
is that the girl that he's fallen in love with,
which doesn't make any sense, like body type and all
that stuff like, but we never see them, you know,
without the masks. So for a moment, I thought, oh,
is he thinking that's her? Obviously it's not, it's one
of the four you know surf surfers, but it was
enough to I don't know, there could have been maybe

(12:54):
it was just the eyes to make that connection, but
I don't know. There could have been other people that
didn't quite nail that moment. I'm sure you guys got
it right away when you first saw it.

Speaker 3 (13:06):
Well, I want to go back to the thing you
talked about with the whole drug bust thing, right, you
know that that raid going wrong? Is I think that
that highlights where the film struggles a little bit. Is
Bigelow is really really a gifted technical director, I think.
But what was puzzling to me about that scene watching

(13:26):
it this time is it's a small house, so I
should be able to have a sense of place the
entire time I'm there. I should know where each room is,
it should know where I'm going through. And it's so
chaotically put together and shot that I still to this
day if you wanted me to diagram where everybody was,
I'm like, wherever they needed to be when it happened?

(13:47):
And how did the naked girl wind up in two
places suddenly? And wait, the girl in their underwear is
still over there? And like I was that whole thing.
I was like, what is even where it is?

Speaker 2 (13:57):
Everybody terrifying? By the way, the woman with the knife
was freaking terrifying. That was really well done, Like it
could I like, I know what I obviously like with
the woman and the thong at the door, and then
like we see the woman in the shower, like okay, yes,
we get it. They're putting, They're they're putting, you know,
beautiful woman's bodies in there to kind of raise your eyebrows.

(14:17):
But when she comes out and she's naked and she's
she's got the knife, you're not thinking like, oh, what
a sexy woman, You're like, oh my god.

Speaker 3 (14:25):
Well, I enjoyed the fact that they you know, that
they had her just beat the living tar out of
Utah because that was you know, like it immediately imbued
that sense of danger. But I still don't know where
that bathroom was in the house, Like, I don't know
how anybody got any I was like, are there three
doors in each room?

Speaker 2 (14:44):
Like?

Speaker 1 (14:44):
What is this an octagonal house? Like what's happening here?

Speaker 3 (14:47):
And I think that that speaks to it's so concerned
with throwing the spectacle together that it's moments like that
where you see it stumble and even you know, apply
that out to where you know, Utah gets jumped at
the shower with Anthony Keatis and everybody you know, uh
what's his name?

Speaker 1 (15:07):
Uh that warhammer, what's his name? War child? War child?

Speaker 3 (15:12):
And everybody is there and it's still like, wait a minute,
where where is that shower? Because he's you know, Papas
is viewing him. He sees him go behind a bush,
and then when he runs out to him, he's like
on the other side of everything, like what where is everyone?

Speaker 2 (15:27):
But but more to to what Darren was saying about,
you know, utilizing that time for the surfers, Darren, I
completely agree with you, even though like I'm with you guys,
like that scene was great. It was really entertaining, and
when like Keanu was getting his face kind of pushed
into the lawnmower, I was like, holy crap, like that
really that really brought me in, Like it was a
really well done scene, but it did sacrifice time because,

(15:50):
as you know, we're mentioning the really really famous scene
where he's gonna shoot body and then decides not to,
Like that's probably the scene that this movie is most
widely known for. Uh, when we got to these like yeah,
like as like everybody knows that scene. I knew that scene.
I've seen that scene, you know, fifty times in my
life without seeing the movie. Now that I've seen the

(16:12):
movie and like watching the build up, I don't know
if it's biased because it's been built up in my
mind for the past thirty years or whatever, but it
felt completely unearned, completely unearned. Keanu had no reason not
to take him down. Zero reason. There was no connection
between Utah and Body. There was no emotional connection between

(16:35):
the two of them. At no point previous to that
scene was there ever a moment where they're like, you
know what, maybe we're more than just a cop and
a robber. Maybe we're friends on a deep level. No, Like, yes,
body saved Keanu's butt from getting the crap kicked out
of them, but that's it. That is literally it discussed.

Speaker 1 (16:57):
Well, it's like a cookie life did.

Speaker 2 (17:00):
Yeh wookie?

Speaker 4 (17:02):
Well I was gonna say, you know that, I think
is what led to my confusion where I thought it
was the girl because that was the only character I
could think of that he would be like, Oh, I
can't kill her. I'm in love with her because I
did not feel that kinship at that moment get with
Bodie for him to be like, oh, I'm gonna not

(17:24):
try to shoot you in the lay or whatever.

Speaker 1 (17:26):
I'm going to let you go.

Speaker 3 (17:28):
Yeah, I think that I agree that Keanu doesn't earn
enough of a friendship with him by that point for
me to say, oh, yeah, this is worth throwing away
your entire rookie FBI career for this guy. Sure, sure,
and let him get away with with all of this stuff.
But I think that that's because of the there's a
sort of sense of this being like an old exploitation movie,

(17:51):
Like it's almost like another very famous Patrick Swayzee movie
from the late eighties Roadhouse, where when you watch it,
you're like, what even is going on here? And it's
not the best written movie, but if you're willing to
let yourself go and go with it, you're like, oh,
I understand all of the beats that are happening right now,

(18:12):
and so you're willing to let it go and play along.
And I think the movie here relies on that, so
that it's one of those things where, if anything, I
would give Bigelow credit for the fact that she sort
of is acknowledging that this is not high art, that

(18:33):
she's telling a story that is going to be comfortable
with the spectacle being the thing and not trying to
make it any deeper. And it says, why does Johnny
Utah feel this way at this point? Well, I know
he's supposed to by this point in the story, and
so we're just going to go along with that.

Speaker 1 (18:54):
That sort of thing.

Speaker 4 (18:55):
Yeah, it also not necessarily meaning the in a mean way,
but the movie kind of had a this is what
the young kids want to see checklist vibe. Yeah, like,
we're going to put so much spectacle, as Tristan says,
into this movie, But the plot, the drive for the

(19:19):
movie didn't feel like I want to tell the story
of this rookie and these surfers and all this stuff.
It was more like, yeah, that's a nice framing device
for all these spectacle events.

Speaker 1 (19:31):
Sure, but yeah.

Speaker 3 (19:33):
But the thing is, you know, and I think this
can sort of be where some of us more movie
snobbish or movie consumer types and everything, right, Like, this
is something that an average movie goer. And I'm not
saying this in a pejorative sense or a dismissive sense
at all, but somebody who's plunking down a couple of

(19:54):
bucks to forget their troubles for a Saturday night and
they want to see something. I think this is a
director who's fully delivering what we would call a popcorn movie,
a term that in and of itself now gets abused
to now reference movies that they're spending seven hundred and
fifty dollars seven hundred and fifty million dollars making and

(20:15):
oh my gosh, and look at all this. Oh well,
it's a popcorn move. No, no, no, this is a
popcorn movie. It's like, hey, I have a limited judge
I on one. Yeah, it came out like this was
a yeah, but it also came out I want to
say it was like a week or two after Terminator two,
and which is funny because Bigelow is married to Cameron
at the time. And so, yeah, July third, ninety one

(20:38):
is when Terminator two came out.

Speaker 1 (20:40):
Because it was July. I'm pretty sure it was July.

Speaker 3 (20:42):
Fourth weekend is when it came out, So it's either
late June orarly July something like that. So yeah, no, no,
July ninety one is when Terminator two came out, So
this would have come out like it, yeah, one or
two weeks after that.

Speaker 1 (20:54):
And so this, though, is the type of movie in.

Speaker 3 (20:58):
A non Terminator Too summer that would have done I
think even better Bank because it would have been, hey,
here's your spectacle summer movie, Like this is a summer movie.
And this is a director who's comfortable saying this is
a summer movie. Guys, let's just have a lot of fun.
And I think that's probably why I wind up being

(21:19):
you know, Tristan tipped his hand earlier. This is probably
why I wind up being a little more generous with
it this time than I have been in the past.
Is I sort of see it and I go, oh,
I okay, I get it. You don't want me to
expect the Godfather right now. You want me to expect this.
And I'm like, okay, Yeah, if I was expecting this.

Speaker 1 (21:38):
I'm on board. I you know, like I'm there for
the ride. I get it. I get it.

Speaker 4 (21:43):
Oh. And this movie, I mean, it wasn't Terminator too money,
but it made eighty three million on a twenty four
million budget. That's not that's more than double your your investment,
So that's not terrible.

Speaker 3 (21:56):
Yeah, I mean it did very respectably, you know, stateside
and worldwide, and you know, everybody refers to it as.

Speaker 1 (22:03):
A cult movie.

Speaker 3 (22:04):
But I always get confused because this movie made enough
money to be not a flop. And for me, a
cult movie is always something that I always took as
something that was a flop that found life on home
video or something like that.

Speaker 4 (22:18):
So for instance, like flop first budget wise, but not
it right commercial or not social right.

Speaker 3 (22:25):
A flop, but This sort of like disabuses me of
that where I'm like, oh, I must be defining cult
movie wrong. In my brain, cult movie just means that
it just gets a following. It doesn't matter what the
box office was.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
This is definitely one of those movies that found its
following with home video. Like even though it made its
budget back and then some like it made good money,
it really made decent home video money. Like I think
it was like real fast, it made twenty million just
in the US just from home video rentals, and that

(23:01):
was early on, and I think worldwide it was even
more than that. So I think it was enough to
make people notice. And I think because of like you,
you know, like John you talked about it earlier on
about walking the line like Gary Busey walked the line
between parody and sincerity or something like that. I think
it helps when the movie has an edge of stupidity

(23:23):
to it, like it has some prifolity to it, where
it's just like, oh, Okay, this is the tone that
we're going for. And when you can find an audience
that can embrace that, you know, ridiculousness, it I think
it really works and it helps add to the cult following. Like,
to me, I think the ultimate cult following movie is
Rocky Horror Picture Show in my mind, of.

Speaker 1 (23:43):
Course, yeah, you know, just because it's easy.

Speaker 2 (23:46):
Yeah, it's so campy, it's so it's so big. But
it didn't make that much money when it first came out,
but there's midnight showings everywhere. People still celebrate it. We
just celebrated i think the fiftieth anniversary and yeah, fiftieth anniversary.
But yeah, like it's it's that's the kind of gold standard,
like you said, well.

Speaker 3 (24:05):
And then the Room is the first one to really
sort of like be the inheritor. Oh yeah, that's the
air to the throne on that one. But here's it, Like,
here's a question, because like I'm praising the photography and
stuff like that, you know, especially pan and scan video. Like, okay,
so it finds its cult following on video, you know, obviously,

(24:26):
you know, it does decent money, but in a pre
home video era, it becomes a forgotten you know, a
budget earner. My question is I'm sitting here praising the photography.
Does that just prove that cinematography isn't that important to people?
If this did so well in pan and scan er
do you think that the way that everything is staged

(24:46):
it makes it one of those movies where it's better
if you saw it on the big screen, but if
you see it cropped, it still doesn't hurt because it's
shot so well.

Speaker 4 (24:56):
I will say it's less about out how you watch
a cult movie and more about who you watch it with.
I think many of the cult movies that I were
as exposed to, I call them like camp movies, like
the ones we would see on the giant CRT television
cart in the meeting room or maybe a projector so.

(25:17):
It's definitely not the best viewing viewing experience, but you're
surrounded by people who grew up on it or it's
their favorite movie, and so that trand like that's the
first time I saw Princess Bride was a camp movie,
and like that, which obviously is a great movie in itself,
But that experience, Yeah, it's not a cinematic experience as

(25:38):
so far as a movie theater, but if you're surrounded
by people who really are passionate about a movie, they
can elevate that experience.

Speaker 3 (25:48):
Just as a side note, the cinematographer for this film
also was the cinematographer for Star Trek for the Voyage Home.
He was also for not just She's having a baby,
but planes, trains, and automobiles, and he worked on Men.

Speaker 2 (26:04):
In Black like Donald Donald Peterman. Yeah, that's honestly pretty
well you said when you said voyage Home, and what
was the other one that you said.

Speaker 3 (26:13):
Oh, well there was voyage Home, there was planes, trains
on automobiles.

Speaker 5 (26:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:18):
So if you put if you put a point break
voyage Home and planes, trains and automobiles, you can see
the visual language. I know that can sound crazy, but
I think you can really see it. Like you're just like, oh,
that's a Peterman film.

Speaker 3 (26:30):
Yeah, I agree with you. There's there is something there
that's pretty wild. And I guess, especially since those are
all movies that you know, people watched on video, like
like maybe there's something to the fact that he shot
it in such a way that pan and scan didn't
kill it that because the thing is, this is uh,

(26:51):
I'm trying to remember it was this one two to one,
one point six. What was the aspect ratio on this,
because I'm pretty.

Speaker 2 (26:57):
Sure this was one point three nine, I mean two point.

Speaker 1 (26:59):
Three nine, one point three nine, two point two point.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
Three Really pretty sure. I'm pretty sure.

Speaker 1 (27:02):
I don't like, oh wow, was it okay?

Speaker 3 (27:04):
Well, are you going to be way like maybe it's yeah,
but maybe it's just some way that like he knows
to keep everything center frame so that pan and scan
wound up not hurting it in any way.

Speaker 2 (27:14):
I don't know. Yeah, well, okay, think about think about it,
think about simplifying it.

Speaker 1 (27:20):
He's worked on some amazing films.

Speaker 2 (27:22):
But if you if you think about the set pieces,
which was the term I was trying to think about earlier,
if you think about the set pieces, and you think
about the surfing, like you're focused mainly on one surfer
at a time, and so even though you have it
in widescreen and you're taking in the huge tunnel, the
huge wave, you're focusing on the surfer that you can
pain and scan. When you're skydiving, you're mainly focusing on

(27:46):
one skydiver at a time, but then when they get together,
they're in a giant circle, so you can still focus
on it in pan and scan. And same with the chase.
You know you're utilizing that Z access the most during
the chase scene, and and and even think, yeah, even
in the bank robbing scenes, there's there's no really wide
vistas that you're that you're looking at. It's really just

(28:08):
clusters of information that's going on, and they spend a
lot of time, Like even in the car chases, it's
close together in frenetics. So I think, I think penis game.
This is a movie, even though it has huge set
pieces and a lot of adrenaline. I think the way
that Peterman shot it lends itself to a four x
three conversion fascinating.

Speaker 3 (28:29):
Well, I mean undeniable talent, you know, somebody who knew
how to frame a film effectively, no doubt, no doubt.

Speaker 4 (28:36):
And talking about and shots for one second because for
the skydiving, it made me wonder just I don't know
if you know the answer to this, but it made
me wonder if they did the same technique that they
did in Star Trek two thousand and nine, where they
basically had them stand on mirrors and shot not for

(28:58):
every shot obviously, but for pickup shot of like close
ups of the actors where they had them stand on
a mirror shot down which show shoots up and then
you know, blow wind in their face and it gives
the illusion that you're, you know, flaw falling through the
clear sky. I know there was a couple of shots
where I'm like, this could have been done in that technique.

Speaker 2 (29:18):
But what they what they did for the close ups
was they had Keanu and Swayze on a rig where
it was like a gimbal pole, like it was a
pole sticking out of the ground. They put their clothes
on over this pole, over this rig so that they
could rotate them and spin them and they were shooting

(29:38):
at an upwards angle to shoot at the sky, and
they had tons and tons of wind fans, you know,
like blown at them and everything like that. And it's
actually it's actually really really noticeable for some like during
the first guy diving seen with with Keanu, uh, for
like the first two thirds, maybe even three fourths of

(29:59):
the sky I've everybody has wide shots of skydiving and
we see them floating around and everything like that, and
then we the only time we see Keanu is the
close ups of him on the rig, and it's it's
very obviously spliced in where he's just like, yeah, yeah,
way to it go, Like he's like cheering from the

(30:20):
sidelines because you're like, oh, okay, Keanu or his stunt
double did not want to skydive that day, but apparently
Patrick Squeezey did fifty skydiving jumps for the film. Yep,
and he's a huge I should say it was. He
was a huge skydiver, like he was obsessed with it. Yeah,
I actually convinced Gary Busey to do it.

Speaker 3 (30:39):
Yeah, I think that, And I think that's why, like
in the scene where you know he's he jumps out
at the end like that's really him, Like he was like, yeah,
sure I got this and it I mean, the thing
is it watching this is one of those movies that
reminds me even more than ghost which I can't go
back to complicated, but even more than ghosts, this is

(31:03):
one of those movies that makes me wax nostalgic about
what a talent Patrick Swayze was. He's so charismatic on
screen and I think that this movie is a complete
dud without him. It is his energy and when he's
on screen and when he is with Keanu Reeves, there

(31:24):
is something that lights up that happens, and it is
that guy just had like a just a natural chemistry
with everybody around him that made you want to like him,
to spend time with him to learn more about him.
And you know, as I think back on his other
roles that I've seen and stuff like that, it's like

(31:45):
just a guy who he just brought.

Speaker 1 (31:47):
I mean Body, when you think of body is a
bank robbing never do well.

Speaker 3 (31:53):
As the kids might say, who's He's got this weird
philosophy on life, all this stuff, Like everything about this
guy screams I wouldn't want to hang out with him,
but Patrick Swayzey I would want to hang out with.
And so when he's sitting there and he's like, yeah, man,
you just got to get the adrenaline, and it's like, yeah,
would you charge in and you hold up people at gunpoint?

(32:13):
That that's a conflict of character that I can't quite resolve.
But I resolve it for him because I'm like, Okay,
I could get somebody like wanting to be with him
and wanting to, you know, just hang with him and
have a good time and to like go along with
any crazy idea that he had.

Speaker 2 (32:28):
Darren, how did you feel about the themes of freedom
and identity in this film? Do you feel like it
was secondary third fourth? You know, like because there's some people,
like people who really really like this film will tell
you about you know, Body's philosophy of chasing the edge
or living without regret and you know risk as an identity,

(32:50):
you know, authority versus one's own rebellion and everything like that.
Did that land for you or was it just like
you know, sprinkles on a cupcake?

Speaker 4 (33:00):
Was it was good? I think, Aleka, what John was
saying about, you know body is. I mean, look at
the poster. It's him and Keanu. It's those two characters.
Their dynamic doesn't work, then the movie suffers and his
his you know worldview with the yeah, chasing the edge,
I guess it worked, but it was writing, it was

(33:25):
riding the edge. It was writing the line because there's
there were times during the movie where I'm like, why
are they letting you know, Utah into this world, Like
like there's no way. And then there's times they're like,
oh I buy it. Oh yeah, he's you know, he
was an old sports guy and they made that connection. Okay,
and then it would go again like oh yeah, but
now they're like seeing him and that would be suspicious. Oh,

(33:48):
but then you know he's hanging out with the girl,
he's learning to surf.

Speaker 1 (33:51):
And and so it was.

Speaker 4 (33:52):
It was just walking that tightrope the whole movie, not
not in a bad way, but so all that to say, like,
when that is not the view point of your main
character of Keanu, and he's being kind of inducted into
that worldview, it's a harder sell than if your main

(34:15):
character is the one pitching you that universe, because now
body has to convince him and the audience. So I
think that's that's like you said, people who are already
right in that line, right in that high are like, oh, yeah,
he's speaking to me, and everyone else is like, yeah,
maybe you convinced Johnny Utah, who sounds like a video

(34:37):
game character name, you know. But but I'm gonna take
a little more convincing, you know, just.

Speaker 1 (34:44):
Because you know Johnny Utah. The FBI, I have to
believe that.

Speaker 3 (34:48):
Now, there's an old joke that FBI stands for famous
but incompetent. I'm not saying that's my joke. I've heard
it said having grown up in the DC area, but
no law enforcement agency on the face of the planet
would take somebody who was a very famous college quarterback
and be like, you're the one to go under cover.

(35:09):
Nobody's gonna know who you are. You're a freaking household name.
In some quarters, it's like, oh, you know, let's get
Nick Saban and have him infiltrate the surfing do what
was like, No, no, that's not gonna work too well.

Speaker 2 (35:24):
Other ish to be fair, that's why it worked because
he was a famous quarterback.

Speaker 3 (35:31):
Oh I see, it's a double reverse. Okay, you'd never
expect the world famous quarterback.

Speaker 2 (35:36):
I know, I know, honestly, yeah, I mean, like, okay,
but that's like what got him in because you know,
like in the surfer world with him being so green
and you know, like surfers are some of the worst
people I've ever met on the planet and to get
into their house listeners.

Speaker 3 (35:53):
Tristan Raddell is speaking for himself during this segment. Neither
Aaron Moser nor John Mills are represented by the statements
that are about to come out of mister Radelle's mouth.

Speaker 2 (36:03):
Man Surfer, Tristan, how dare you if surfers knew how
to read, I'm sure I would get crazy emails from them.

Speaker 1 (36:12):
They don't need to. This is a podcast, an audio.

Speaker 4 (36:15):
Medium, Tristan.

Speaker 2 (36:19):
But in order to infiltrate they had to, he had
to have some sort of standing elsewhere outside of the
surfer world. So I personally think it works. Did everything
in this movie work? No, not at all. Oh, but
I think that one thing, I think, I don't know,
I'm going to defend that one.

Speaker 3 (36:33):
I I think it speaks more to the fact that
the movie is just having fun with it, and it's like,
you know, I don't think that there was any logical
thought behind it necessarily. It was just like and now
it's like, if anything, the script feels like it was
written by a child, And I mean that in the
best possible way.

Speaker 1 (36:49):
This sounds like a story that my.

Speaker 2 (36:50):
Young name James Cameron film before.

Speaker 3 (36:53):
Yeah, but but like it feels like a story that
my kid would have written. And rereading it, I was like,
you know, for it's a lot of imagination here, I admire. Yeah,
why wouldn't he be a high school and they're bank
robbers too?

Speaker 4 (37:06):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (37:06):
And they and they Oh they're skydivers, of course they are.
Why not? Like everything and.

Speaker 6 (37:12):
Then and then there's skydivers and then they jump out
of the plane. But he doesn't know if his if
his parachute is is good but it is. But now
and now we're in Mexico, and and then exactly, Yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (37:26):
Love that, and now we're in Mexico. Okay, so okay,
so it's so Darren. Okay. One thing that I love
to repeat is something from Trey Parker and Matt Stone
where they said, poor poor stelly storytelling is and this happens,
and then this happens, and then this happens. That's poor storytelling.

(37:49):
Good storytelling is this happened, Therefore this happened. Therefore this happened,
and because of that this happened. Point Break is the
epitome of and then this happened, and then this happened,
and didn they're in Mexico.

Speaker 3 (38:08):
Yes, yes, I would say that is a fair criticism
of the film.

Speaker 5 (38:13):
This is, you know.

Speaker 3 (38:14):
I don't think it's any mistake that this was not
nominated for Best Original Screenplay. I think that is not
an oversight by the Academy for this year in film.
But I think that what's crazy about it is it
really I look at it as part of this retrospective.
I didn't care for Blue Steel. I see Point Break

(38:38):
as the director of Near Dark. This feels more like
the sophomore effort. To me, I see a connection between
Near Dark and this in the sense that, like you
have this sort of crazy outsider group, you have the
decent guy who's caught up, you have the love interest
that doesn't want to be part of the evil people,

(38:58):
and all of those sorts of things. And it's not
a one to one, obviously, but I see it as
that sort of thing. I can see a direct line
for the director between Near Dark and Point Break. Unquestionably
this is the same director, but I think this is
a director who, between Near Dark and Point Break said

(39:18):
screw it, I'm gonna have fun with it. I'm not
going to be super earnest about it. And I think
that the absolute epitome of that is that John c McGinley,
one of my favorite actors on the planet ever, absolutely.

Speaker 2 (39:34):
Such a good note.

Speaker 3 (39:35):
But the thing is he seemed just to get the
note between takes of but could you do it even
more unhinged? And then they just got him as far
as it go, and usually usually you go that far
and then the director says, now, pull it back a
little bit. I don't feel that anybody pulled anything back,
because he would just walk in and just start shouting
like it was.

Speaker 5 (39:56):
It was a parody character, but it works because Kennu
is so low key in those scenes that you're like, somehow,
this weird alchemy happens. And that's where I got to
give big Low credit because she's not She's not doing
anything other than I have these these two extreme forces,

(40:17):
and I'm just going to play it in such a
way that they wind up balancing each other out instead
of having both of these people act like sane human
beings that actually exists in the world.

Speaker 1 (40:27):
And I really admire that about the movie. I don't
know it worked for me this time while I was
watching it.

Speaker 4 (40:34):
Yeah, McGinley is definitely channeling the police chief from Last
Action Hero vibes. Yes, he is almost.

Speaker 2 (40:43):
I never get tired of that trope. I really don't.

Speaker 4 (40:47):
Trop you crush twenty cars, give me your badge and
your gun, but you're two dag valuable. So here's your
gun and your badge back.

Speaker 1 (40:58):
Sure you broke the bad is.

Speaker 3 (41:00):
Sure you broke twenty five loss, and maybe there are
twenty deaths that we can attribute to you.

Speaker 1 (41:05):
But you know what, I think you're gonna get the
job done. Yeah it's the mayor's chewing my ass out.

Speaker 2 (41:13):
Yeah, my ass is on the line for you.

Speaker 3 (41:16):
But the thing is, that's what makes such that that's
what makes certain scene so much fun where this insanely
tragic bank robbery has happened, but the caper to it
is is Gary Busey saying, uh, you know what you
never learned and knocking his supervisor out and saying respect
for your elders. I'm like, that's so crazy, it's so insane.

(41:40):
It's such an embrace of every awful trope we lived
with in the eighties.

Speaker 4 (41:44):
And then the other cops will let him leave, like right,
nobody says, you just think thebi director.

Speaker 2 (41:52):
But yeah, but that's why they allowed him to leave.
Like it's just like cuff the director said you can't leave,
but he just punched him out. It's a card at Trump's,
you know, Darren, Darren, tell me about tell me about
Lori Petty. What did you think about Lorry Petty's performance
in this.

Speaker 4 (42:10):
No, I mean, I like what John was saying about
the similar elements to uh was it until dawn? There's
dang it? Oh dawn near dark, near dark. It's dawn
and dark for these movies. I gotta keep them straight.

Speaker 2 (42:24):
But no, like you you confused until dark or near
dark and dust till dawn. Yeah, and then I probably
do some of other third movie. I don't know, but yeah, No,
I think her performance was great.

Speaker 4 (42:36):
She you know, she's the love interest, she's the inn,
you know, and it's textbook of like you didn't tell
me the truth and now I hate you, but I
actually love you. And then I think story wise, I
think it went a little far with her being the
hostage because yeah, it all worked out, but it practically didn't.

(43:01):
Like she should be dead. There's there's no real reason
that she should be alive right now.

Speaker 3 (43:08):
Like I I think that Lori Petty brings a very
necessary energy to the role. I think she does very
well with it.

Speaker 1 (43:15):
I think that.

Speaker 3 (43:17):
Before that whole ending thing, though, the the kind of
dysfunctional relationships that Hollywood modeled for us over time were
very interesting because the minute, regardless of what the inciting
sort of thing is, I know, the minute, the minute
somebody fires a gun at me while I'm asleep, I'm

(43:40):
going to kind of bail at that. I'm gonna be like,
you know what, I don't think we're going to resolve
the personality issues that are that are underlying here. I
think maybe, just maybe we should.

Speaker 1 (43:51):
Call it off at this point. There's something fundamental there.

Speaker 2 (43:54):
Even within the world of Point Break, that was too far,
Like Keanu was very much, way too forgiving of that moment,
Like he was the one who was trying to apologize
and trying to explain himself. No, in that moment, that's
when you go, No, miss Petty, you are the one

(44:17):
I'm kicking out. You are the one who should be apologizing,
not me. I don't care how much I lie to you.
You fired a pistol in my pillow while I was sleeping.
We are done. You should be thankful I'm not falling
charges against you.

Speaker 3 (44:34):
Yeah, and never mind the fact that distance she was at.
You know, thank god that gun didn't pull.

Speaker 1 (44:39):
Right a little bit, because that was a little close
for the liking.

Speaker 2 (44:46):
I'm a big fan of Lori Petty. I loved her
in Tank Girl, I loved her in a League of
their own, and I loved her in her performance and
Voyager and I I was so happy to see her
again in this. I feel like she gives this this
different kind of energy that's very unique to her, Like

(45:06):
her voice is unique, her look is unique, and I
just love her acting style. I really do, because it
gives this this raw vulnerability to every role that she's in,
Like you just feel like as an actress, she puts
everything out there, and I feel like this this movie
is no different.

Speaker 1 (45:26):
I think I agree with you. I haven't seen I
saw a Tank Girl in the theater. I don't remember
loving it.

Speaker 2 (45:32):
Oh it's crazy, it's crazy, it's it's unhinged. I'm not
saying it's a good movie. It's a fun movie, yeah,
like in a bad way.

Speaker 1 (45:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (45:41):
I think that it's if I remember correctly, it was
a lot like ang Lee's Hulk, where it was like these.

Speaker 1 (45:47):
Are images and it's a film. I'm not sure if
it really makes sense.

Speaker 2 (45:52):
Listen, I didn't say I liked Tank Girl. I said
I liked Lori Petty in Tank Girl.

Speaker 1 (45:57):
Fair enough, Free Willie, Yeah, there you go.

Speaker 2 (46:00):
I don't remember that.

Speaker 3 (46:01):
I never saw Free Willy. That does not mean we
are going to discuss the director of Free Willy as
an excuse for me to see Free Willy. I'm willing
to live with the l on that one. At that's
fine point. It's fine, it's good, it's good, it's good.

Speaker 1 (46:14):
You know.

Speaker 3 (46:15):
I think that I think that the biggest accomplishment for
Bigelow is that she gives Petty the space to be
I think, the one three dimensional character that exists for
all of her flaws, like for like, I think if anything,
that might that might be the biggest clue that there

(46:36):
is a woman behind the camera in that the female character,
the main female character, actually seems to have a presence
on screen as opposed to just existing as a side note.
And I think that that probably has something to do
with Bigelow, right because you know, maybe maybe there, maybe

(46:56):
there's an effort from her to give a little extra
attention to a character that in a movie like this
typically is nothing more than set dressing.

Speaker 2 (47:05):
It's interesting because Bigelow, I feel like sometimes sometimes gets
a lot of heat for having very masculine energy in
her movies. And it's there. I mean, it's it's it's there.
Like it's true. That's that's not up for debate. She
has very she has a very masculine energy to her
characters and to her story. And I feel like up

(47:26):
until zero dark thirty, we're getting primarily machismo on the screen.
Even with Blue Steel, even though Jamie Lee was the protagonist,
you still had protagonist confused, and you had you still
had very male toxicity on the screen and machisma on
the screen and everything like that, and Point Break is

(47:47):
very much no different. But you were one ondred percent
right that even in the midst of that, even in
this cloud, this fog of machismo, Lori Petty, is able
to shine. I think because you have that that female
lens behind the lens and yeah, like behind the camera.

(48:08):
I think there's definitely some credence to that.

Speaker 1 (48:11):
And I will say for anybody that waxes nostalgic about
nineties fashion, watching Point Break should completely disabuse you of
that and just.

Speaker 2 (48:20):
The Okay, so speaking of like as we as we
round third, John, I want you to answer this question
as a part of your answer as to what rating
you're giving this And Darren, I'm giving you a break
for not and I'm not going to have you go
first with your rating. But John, you are what I
would call an officionado of eighties action films.

Speaker 1 (48:43):
Thank you. That's one of the nicest things you've ever said.

Speaker 2 (48:47):
With this coming out in ninety one. What makes this
movie different? What makes this action film different from what
came before in the previous decade and give us your rating.

Speaker 1 (49:00):
In that answer, I.

Speaker 3 (49:02):
Would say that very little, if anything. Honestly, I think
that probably the extreme sports that it highlights are that's
more nineties than eighties. If this came out in the eighties,
it would have probably been like motorbike racing and you
know some other stuff.

Speaker 2 (49:21):
You were, you know, God, dang it, you were.

Speaker 1 (49:24):
You're welcome, sough and that's that's why you gave me
the title of aficionado. I appreciate that.

Speaker 2 (49:31):
You right, It's very painfully right. It would have been
a BMX race. It would have been a dirt bike race.
I'm sorry, Yes, I just I gotta give you. I
gotta give credit on that one. I can't even I
can't even say anymore. Please continue.

Speaker 1 (49:45):
I'm so high, corrupted, high point of my week.

Speaker 3 (49:48):
Honestly, it's all downhill from here, and I'm going to
say that the I actually looked this up on letterbox
at what I rated it the last time I watched it.
I did not care for this movie the last time
I watched it, recognizing it's you know, impact, all of
that stuff. I kind of dragged it the last time
I watched it. But I gotta be honest, I don't
know if I was just in a better mood when
I watched it this time, but I was having fun

(50:10):
the way I think Bigelow wanted me to have fun
with this, and so my rating definitely was better. This
is low art of the highest caliber. This is people
showing up to work and saying, I am not trying
to win an Oscar. I am just trying to make
it so that, you know, Johnny Blue Jeans is having

(50:31):
a rough week at the factory and he's just got
to unplug and he wants to have fun, and he's
never gonna get to do these things. He's never gonna
get to skydive, he's never going to get to surf,
he's never gonna get to live like a beach bum.
He's never gonna have beautiful girls around him. You know what,
I'm gonna throw it all.

Speaker 1 (50:47):
In his face, and I'm gonna do it in such
a way that he's gonna walk out and be like, oh,
that was so cool. So I got to give this
a solid four this time.

Speaker 3 (50:56):
This is a director who has grown so that by
this entry, I think if you give this script to
Bigelow at near Dark, you get near Dark if you
give this script to Bigelow after she has two films
behind her, you get Point Break. And yes, it benefits
from Swayzey's energy, But I think that Swayzey's been in

(51:18):
some bad movies too, where with directors who didn't know
what to do with them, and I think that this
is not one of those movies. I think this is
a director who knew who was on screen, and so
that is a solid four for me for Point Break.

Speaker 2 (51:34):
Darren, I want to hear why you think this is
a cult classic wrapped in with your answer.

Speaker 4 (51:43):
Yeah, I mean, besides the obviously definition I gave of
cult classic being which who you watch this movie with?
And I will say in tangent, watching it technically with
you guys, you know, being able to have this discussion,
that's part of that experience. But I think, yeah, it's
in ninety one. You know, you also don't have there's

(52:07):
no social media. There's no way to get the love
of these extreme sports out there, you know, besides movies
or things like that. So it became a touchstone of
people who, yeah, as John says, they're never gonna go skydiving,
They're gonna go surfing, you know, but to watch an

(52:28):
awesome movie of friends. You know, they're never gonna rob Banks,
but maybe they want it. But all that, yeah, it's
a I think that is the reason and why. You know,
as we're discussing this movie, it feels like set dressing
between these set pieces of you know, because that is
the point of the movie. And it's not horribly told

(52:51):
the in between bits, but it's definitely has that vibe.
It is not a story first, it is a action
set first by a margin, by a thin margin. So
I'm going to give this one a three overall. I think,
you know, she's improving. You know, we're on an upward trajectory.
I think I really resonate with what we said about

(53:14):
this feels like the next chapter after Near Dark as
far as the forming and the groups of individuals. And
I'm not quite sure where Strange Days is going to go,
but I think she's only getting better. So that's gonna
be that's gonna be great. So three wipeouts from me.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
Well, I'm giving it three flying piples. I'm with you, Darren.
I wanted to give this this more. I wanted to
give it, like at least a three point five. But
as I was talking about it. There was just you know,
I just I had a real hard time connecting with
this film. And I think it's hard because it's so
freaking nineties. I mean, we're talking Keanu Surfing, extreme sports,

(54:02):
Crazy Swayze, you know, like it's it's very much an
encapsulation of its time. And so I give it full
credit for what it is. I give it full credit
for being a cult film with a cult following. I
love that people love this. I love that it's been
in pop culture. I think it deserves to be in
pop culture. I think there is I think I probably

(54:24):
I will revisit this again, Like I will watch this
film again.

Speaker 1 (54:28):
I will.

Speaker 2 (54:30):
I will watch it, and I hope I will. I
will watch it with a buddy of mine and you know,
like maybe we'll have a few drinks and eat a
pizza and just kind of just like you know, riff
on it. I think it very much. This is a
movie that I should have watched with a male buddy
of mine. You know, I should have had my hot
fuzz moment with you know, like you know, with Nick

(54:50):
Frost and and Peg and everything like that. I think
I would have enjoyed it more so I'm giving it
a three just because I think for all the things
that we like, I think there's a lot wrong technically.
I think it's just set piece to set piece to
set piece. I would have liked to have had a
little bit more emotion and connective tissue. Will I watch
the remake? No, but I will revisit this. And so

(55:14):
I'm excited to continue on with Bigelow's career because I mean,
like soon, like in a couple of movies, we're going
to get an Oscar performance. Here, we're going to get
an Oscar nominated and winning movie. And so, Darren, what
are we doing next?

Speaker 4 (55:31):
Well, next week we're going forward a couple of years
to nineteen ninety five's Strange Days.

Speaker 2 (55:38):
Next on House Sits, Join the Revolution, Join the Net Party.