May 13, 2025 • 24 mins
One dark, stormy and fateful night, Nicki met Mervyn at a comic book store in south Florida, and the rest is history! We learn the hidden origins of how they started as artists at conventions as well as the pros and cons of working with a partner.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hi, I'm Nicky McCoy and I'm an illustrator, fashion designer,
and traditional artist.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
I'm Mervin McCoy, illustrator, storyteller and digital artists.
Speaker 3 (00:12):
For more than a decade, we've traveled in the convention
scene from coast to coast.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
We'd love to share what we've learned and are still
learning on our journey.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
You're listening to paper podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
You hear that music? He stole it off the internet,
just kidding.
Speaker 4 (00:27):
It's spicy beats b E E T s and he
hates beats. Let's check you out that sound thloud huh
ha ha ha. We're back right right. You like this
(00:53):
raspy voice that I have right now?
Speaker 1 (00:55):
I mean some might consider it even husky.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
Is this the voice that you know made you say
I have to work with this person?
Speaker 1 (01:05):
The allure?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (01:07):
Yeah, yeah. Listen to that gentle growl.
Speaker 4 (01:11):
PAPERLVE podcast coming at you live. She literally wins wins.
What was that then? I don't know, you couldn't even
look me in the face.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
Maybe you're taking in personally? How about that? Well?
Speaker 4 (01:30):
Is that is that how we met? Because you know,
Carrington was talking about well, he was very curious about
you know how we met, you know, we started working
together and whatnot, and uh, you know, what's your take
on that?
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Like, well, a mutual friend of ours was having an
opening at his comic book store at the time, and
I wanted to, I guess, show some support, and it
was also around Halloween, so I rolled up in cosplay,
and lo and behold, you were there hosting some quick
(02:09):
draws and I entered half as a half as a joke.
Half is just a oh like let's like see where
this goes sort of thing. And I ended up winning
the first one, and I think you were really impressed.
And then later that evening, uh, you were going to
(02:29):
host another one, and I thought it would be bad
sportsmanship to enter again, but you know, you just wanted
me to enter as like a ringer, and even then
I don't think I entered.
Speaker 4 (02:40):
Yeah you did not.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Yeah, it's just bad sportsmanship, man, you know, once you win, like, yeah,
you can't you can't go back to that. You shouldn't
go back to that.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
So I mean at this point, you were like, you know,
when you came to this and you were doing shows
by yourself, right, yeah, yeah, what what like what got
you into those?
Speaker 1 (03:00):
I started doing conventions as an artist during college, and
because I was already going to like a bunch of
the shows locally, and this was in the Midwest, and
so I was like, oh, hey, you know, I'm already
going to these shows. Maybe I can sell some of
my art and see what people think. And I don't
(03:21):
even remember the first show that I officially did artist
dally yet, but I remember it went like really well,
and I was like, Wow, this is great.
Speaker 4 (03:29):
So do you mind saying what a number well is?
Speaker 1 (03:34):
No?
Speaker 4 (03:34):
You don't, Okay, It's fine.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
I mean, like long story short, like I had some Yeah,
I had some pocket money. Like it's like, oh, you know,
I can I can you know, eat out or something
like that, or like get some Chipotle.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
It's funny, right when you do that first show where
you make money at and you're like, oh my gosh,
I just did this. It's a little shocked by myself,
Like it's it's especially from your it's.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
So self validating that, Like, I mean, you know, you
can definitely see the appeal. It's like, Wow, people actually
like gave me money for my stuff. This is fantastic.
Speaker 4 (04:10):
Yeah, And just in a petty way. It's like the
physical embodiment of saying suck it.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Yeah, yeah, it's it's nice look at me now. So yeah,
So so I went to this event, and I think
like later that evening, one of our other I guess
now mutual friends who used to be a photographer was
(04:39):
I think I just like roped him into like taking
some photos of my costume or something like that in
the parking lot, and then you were out there for
some reason, I guess, to just like hang with him,
and then I think he pretty much insisted that you
like get into the photo with me for whatever reason.
And so we have this like great memory, like memory,
(05:00):
uh like literally just captured in a photo of it's
it's like it's like us eating popcorn and the Watchman
or something like that.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
That's not what the image is what you mean?
Speaker 1 (05:12):
No, no, no, no, like in Watchman when Doctor Manhattan has
his photograph and it's like the two of them and
they're eating popcorn at like a fair.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Oh wow, that's a deep cut.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Okay, it is a deep cut. It's like a polaroid.
Speaker 4 (05:24):
But anyway, are you saying you're gonna be on a
moon somewhere contemplating when you you know.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Yeah, everything's a watch No. So so this photo is
of me in like a tront outfit and then Irvin
in front of me.
Speaker 4 (05:42):
Can I interject? Real? Yeah? So does that mean doctor
Manhattan's dad was a watch Man?
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Oh another one, oh Man.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
And he wanted to be a Watchman as well, but
he became a Watchman.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
More the word.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
Yeah, And it's like laughing somewhere, yeah, just laughing.
Speaker 4 (06:05):
Everybody takes it so seriously.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
He's just like ha ha watch Watchman.
Speaker 4 (06:11):
Yeah. Sorry, no, if you've never read Watchmen or even
watched Watchmen, absolutely no. And you're like, what is wrong
with these people? What are they talking about?
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Cheesy aos?
Speaker 4 (06:20):
And if that's the case, then come on, get with it.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
Yeah, read it. Yeah, this is twenty twenty five baby,
Yeah so sorry so yeah, so but yeah, we have
this nice memorabilia of like literally the night that we met,
and it's just it's like funny that, uh you know,
we can look back at it because that was twenty
(06:46):
twenty eleven, I want to say twenty ten. Okay, Yeah,
so that's like wild because I think, like, I don't know,
I feel like some people get into like arguments about
like twenty years ago met and stuff like that. Yeah,
but I feel like our alibi is pretty solid.
Speaker 4 (07:04):
Yeah, pretty much. You know. It's interesting though, you said
that right that image. It's like your your skill is
actually on display in the image, like where you came
from because you're a textiles person, right, yeah, because you're
in this trans suit that you made. It was Tron
sore right, yeah, from king and.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
Then it kind of evolved into just like a Tron character.
Speaker 4 (07:24):
But yeah, yeah Tran. If you're not familar Kingdom Hearts,
it's a Disney Final Fantasy mashup game.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Yeah. Tron was a sort of like cyberpunk esque almost
movie made in the eighties. Definitely recommend watching the original.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Yeah, but no, it's a pretty pretty cool costume. I
was just you know, it's it's interesting. The meeting kind
of led to many things down the road because the
person taking the picture, no run shows. Yeah, person that
took the picture, I should say, not taking a person
that took a picture a friend of ours, which we
have one of his events coming up in a bit yeats, Yeah,
(08:05):
which is fascinating. It's just interesting and you know, and
this is just to add to your points. It's it's
fascinating looking at all this because this is like a
weird networking situation where the person who was opening that
store is someone who I met through another friend, and
(08:26):
I had no interest in doing conventions. They just kind
of randomly set me up and said, yeah, just just
show up, just show up. And I felt bad because
I didn't want to make my friend look bad. So
I showed up at this thing and they said ask
for this guy, and went to the thing. Didn't make
any money. I was just staring at nothing for like
the whole the whole day, and then the promoter pretty
(08:52):
much then comes over to me at and says, hey,
you know, you should come to my show in their summer.
And that's a show where that's the first show where,
like I really I made money with the help of
a lot of my colleagues, you know, Crystal and Joel.
Like you know Crystal specifically, she showed some salesmanship that
(09:14):
I don't know. I mean, I ain't never seen that
in my life, and it really emboldened me.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
You know.
Speaker 4 (09:21):
It was a nice way the balance of the weekend
because that was the release weekend of Indiana Jones and
a Crystal Skull, so it was nice to bookend that
weekend with a really bad movie because I fell asleep.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
It was such a bad I wish I had fallen
asleep in it. I was so shocked at how terrible
that movie.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
I woke up and I saw people swinging through trees,
and I fell asleep. I remember that part. I fell
asleep somewhere after when he's at the he's doing his
professor thing, and I fell asleep somewhere in I think
much shows up at some point and I fell asleep,
and then I woke up there swinging through trees, and
then I know there was a something flew off in it.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
And then I was like, Okay, you didn't miss anything.
I assure you.
Speaker 4 (09:59):
Listen. I'm made like like I made such good money
that weekend that I didn't even care. I was like,
it was just it felt so good, just like you're saying,
it just made you feel like, oh man, where has
this been all my life? Why haven't I taken a risk?
It's almost like people don't want you to bet on
yourself in some cases, you know what I mean. Message, Yeah,
(10:21):
it's interesting.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
So yeah, So I guess that confluence of events almost
led us to meeting each other because I think I
had been going to the same owner of the comic
book store at the time ran conventions down in South Florida,
and I guess I regularly attended them, so, uh yeah,
(10:44):
just a small world, I guess.
Speaker 4 (10:45):
Yeah. Well, so what would you say at meeting whatnot?
What would you say was the biggest or is the
biggest benefit to having met and no working together? I'm
looking for self, you know, ego.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
It's it's like it's nice knowing that somebody has your back, Like,
like we go to these shows and I feel like
it's been a series of almost like trial and error Almo.
And I mean not to say that it's even still
not trial and error, because I think that like we're
constantly sort of like innovating both like our products and
(11:22):
like our setups. And I think it's like one of
the biggest benefits is that I think that we're both
very uh what's the word that I'm looking for? Versatile? Yes,
And I think that that's really important when you're an
artist that does basically, you know, the equivalent of like
(11:44):
pop up shows, because you know, we do these in
enough cities and basically like all over the states to
where you can't really pinpoint. People. You can have like
a general idea, sure, but the product is going to
vary definitely, like state by state and city by city.
And like we've we've like noticed like it's like literally
(12:07):
certain places that will gravitate more towards like a certain
property versus like others. And so it's just kind of
cool like being able to observe that and then like
having somebody on your team that is willing to grow
with you throughout that time.
Speaker 4 (12:25):
Yeah, it's it's a very good observation. Some places like
pre made art more than others. Some places are all
about the customer. I don't care what the premate. Some
places just like a little bit of everything. And you know,
it's it's also helpful from a mental standpoint to you know,
bathroom breaks as simple as simple as bathroom breaks at
(12:47):
a booth. You know, you're there, however many hours a
day or you know, you know, we're detail oriented in
different ways.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
Yeah, sure, Yeah.
Speaker 4 (12:57):
So it's like you know, paying attention to start, you know,
when the exhibition floor opens or when it closes, or
just being up on emails correspondence. You know, you know,
because they'll tell you you know, oh, sometimes a convention
will tell you like overnight that hey, show's going to
be open half an hour earlier, you know, and it's like,
(13:21):
remember that means you got to restock half an hour
earlier or an hour earlier, depending on what kind of
booth you're running, So that means you got to get
up earlier.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
So drinking guys, it's nice to have the bases covered exactly.
Speaker 4 (13:35):
It's it's very helpful. And you know, sometimes one of
us isself down for the count, so the other one
has to go, you know, do the networking or just
make friends or whatnot, you know what I mean. I
remember one time at Tampa was it Tampa Comic Con
when I got definitely sick. And it's interesting, this is
(13:57):
way back in the day. We're sharing a room with
a friend of ours that does a T shirt business.
He was trying to test out the show. So we're like, yeah,
just come to the show. We'll just we'll just share
a room or whatever and call it today. And I
got like it was like I felt like sniffley like
maybe the first day, and then by the middle of
the weekend, I was I was just wrecked. And you know,
(14:19):
if if that was just me by myself game over
man playing and simple, there would be no no show happening.
So it's definitely helpful to have somebody in your corner.
Not saying you can do it by yourself. You can.
You can, it's just you should plan accordingly. I recommend
having people around you. I think it's more it's it's
(14:42):
definitely more helpful that way. Divide and conquer, right, Yeah, yeah,
so what would you say is the biggest con working together?
Speaker 1 (14:56):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (14:57):
On the spot, she didn't expect this question.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
By the I didn't.
Speaker 4 (15:01):
In the hot seat.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
I feel like I feel like that was a Carrington
asked question.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
Yeah, I was a nice question. I think he did.
He may have asked that. I can't even remember you
guys listening, probably now because I can't remember, because.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
I would say that, like we both have pretty strong
opinions about certain things, so it's good. So sometimes it's
like difficult to agree on certain things or sometimes I
think maybe just in terms of like communication, I'm gonna
blame most of this on myself is just like not
(15:36):
necessarily hearing what the other persons saying. Maybe, so it
just kind of like causes uh, miscommunication or just like
things to take a little bit longer than they probably should.
And I would say like the workarounds, the workaround for
(15:56):
that is like is usually I find these days at
least like especially like in front of customers, is just
kind of like going along with it and then just
sorting it out privately afterward.
Speaker 4 (16:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Yeah, Like it's like there's no point in like sitting
like and basically like arguing with your partner like in
front of like a like a client, because they're not
going to understand, like they're like, oh, like what do
you mean there's like different styles or something like that.
So it's just best to.
Speaker 3 (16:26):
You know.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
And I think that like just just like part of
like professionalism and like presenting yourself in a way that
is still just very you know facing forward, front facing, Yeah.
Speaker 4 (16:41):
Forward facing to put it, I think that's a reason.
That's a that's a reasonable statement. Well you know, it's
it's it's really fascinating because I I so yeah, the
point being that, Okay, this is a little inside baseball
(17:05):
when when say, we'll have people working with us, sometimes
they'll try to balance commissions between us, right, So it's
interesting because we work at different paces and everyone always
assumes I'm significantly slower, much more slower than Nicole and
than I actually am, which is that I have a
(17:30):
and you can correct me if I'm wrong. I probably
have more stamina when it comes to the work. But
you were like, you're like, what no, okay, no, no, no, yeah, yeah,
like I will, I will go, you know, I'll I
don't consider it torture because I'm not like you know whatever.
I kind of find it. It's kind of in a
weird way, exhilarating. But I'll go hard, like straight through,
(17:55):
and you have a point where you're like, you're done.
Is that fair?
Speaker 1 (17:58):
That fair?
Speaker 4 (17:59):
But you work fast? Yeah, like I said, I'm not
you know, like I said, I'm not as fast as her,
but I'm not as slow as people think I am.
So what happens is sometimes they'll go back and forth, right,
so they'll give a commission to me, commission to her,
and then we end up in a situation where I'm
I'm still going, but they're still going back and forth
(18:20):
and she's done. And then so we end up in
situations where they like say, they'll ask the person or
they'll ask us need getting the doing the transaction? Hey,
who wants this one? And it's like we don't need
to ask that in front of the customer, which I
brought up, but I get it in the heat of it,
Like it can get pretty intense at the booth because
(18:40):
when it's people back and forth and I get it
that you forget or you just don't want to slight
either of us. But the thing is just we can
do it and I say it, but nobody listens to me.
No one listens to me at the booth, Like I
will literally say, hey, this is what we're doing, and
people will always go to Nicole anyway, which I guess
that's that's nice, right, It's a nice change of pace. Yea,
(19:02):
the world usually doesn't isn't as deferential. I'm not talking
about you in general. Yeah, women think so. But it's
just funny because you know, I literally have like they'll
say something that.
Speaker 1 (19:15):
They should be more afraid of you.
Speaker 4 (19:16):
And I mean to be fair. But that's the funniest thing.
This is more inside small about how we work, like
like it's it's just interesting, like the perceptions, which is fine.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
I mean, I'll get mad at the drop of a hat,
like you know, but it's like if you're mad.
Speaker 4 (19:34):
Oh boy, well that's the thing. It's like I eat
like I don't. Yeah, I don't eat Anger for breakfast.
Mine is cooking in a crock pot delicious. Get my point? No,
you like you eat Anger for breakfast like you have
Anger flakes, and but mine is in a crock pot.
Speaker 1 (19:48):
No, it's like those terribly pressure card and crumbly like
granola bars. Is that you break your teeth?
Speaker 4 (19:55):
Is that mine?
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Or is that your that's mine?
Speaker 4 (19:56):
Yeah? Okay, that's for Anger bars. I like that. All right,
we are we going to sell them already? So let
all grocery stores or.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
There's a Pizza Hut coupon on the back.
Speaker 4 (20:09):
Anger bars be able to let your daily apothecary and
that's CBS and writing whatever. Right, No, we don't want to.
So is that it? Is that how we meant? Is
that a good uh?
Speaker 1 (20:24):
I think that's a good summary of it. I mean
everything that came afterward is just kind of like trials
and tribulations, and I'm sure that you went into a
little bit of it.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
But not a lot. Like you you asked certain specific questions.
I mean, like I said, if you're listening to this podcast,
you'll probably learn about different things as we go along. Right,
you know about their injuries, some of them. I mean,
maybe we'll get into more in the future, but I
think this was a good way to kind of introduce
you to how we got introduced to each other. Though,
(20:57):
I will ask you one more thing that just one
more thing, where where would you like to see this
partnership go in future? Like what would what would you
don't have to go pie in the sky, but whatever
way you want, it could be as smaller as big
as you want.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
I mean, I think just like seeing I think that
like you know, both of us kind of have sort
of like I don't even want to say pie in
the sky like ideas or whatever. I just think like
if there is like a way to sort of have
like just like the day to day stuff kind of
like be able to be more sort of autumn automat. Yeah, whoa,
(21:44):
I wasn't going to go there, but I mean, if
there is just like a way for it to be
more like self sustaining, I guess, and then that would
basically give us more time to focus on the creative stuff,
because I because like I know that there are like
certain projects that like both of us have kind of
to put on the back Burner, and I would really
like to see those, you know, published, because I think
(22:04):
that some of them are really exciting and I would
want to share those with people.
Speaker 4 (22:09):
Chat, GPT and Claude. I think Claude is one of
those organized organizing. It is over in the corner holding
the hand behind the ear saying who shoh what you say?
Speaker 1 (22:23):
Twelve light bulbs and some water later?
Speaker 4 (22:25):
Right? So no, I mean, did you have any questions
for me though? Before we.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
Not? Off the top of my head, I guess I'll
have to listen to your podcast on this and.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
Hear the other here, the other side of things. You
can listen to us on all podcast platforms.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
You can find us at payper Lab Studios on Instagram
or payperlap studios dot com, or just drop us a
line at design at paper lab studios dot.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
Com and support us on Patreon.
Speaker 3 (22:59):
It Lab Studios Thank you for listening to paper Lab podcast.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Amongo music. Turn that music up.
Hi, I'm Nicky McCoy and I'm an illustrator, fashion designer,
and traditional artist.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
I'm Mervin McCoy, illustrator, storyteller and digital artists.
Speaker 3 (00:12):
For more than a decade, we've traveled in the convention
scene from coast to coast.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
We'd love to share what we've learned and are still
learning on our journey.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
You're listening to paper podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
You hear that music? He stole it off the internet,
just kidding.
Speaker 4 (00:27):
It's spicy beats b E E T s and he
hates beats. Let's check you out that sound thloud huh
ha ha ha. We're back right right. You like this
(00:53):
raspy voice that I have right now?
Speaker 1 (00:55):
I mean some might consider it even husky.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
Is this the voice that you know made you say
I have to work with this person?
Speaker 1 (01:05):
The allure?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (01:07):
Yeah, yeah. Listen to that gentle growl.
Speaker 4 (01:11):
PAPERLVE podcast coming at you live. She literally wins wins.
What was that then? I don't know, you couldn't even
look me in the face.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
Maybe you're taking in personally? How about that? Well?
Speaker 4 (01:30):
Is that is that how we met? Because you know,
Carrington was talking about well, he was very curious about
you know how we met, you know, we started working
together and whatnot, and uh, you know, what's your take
on that?
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Like, well, a mutual friend of ours was having an
opening at his comic book store at the time, and
I wanted to, I guess, show some support, and it
was also around Halloween, so I rolled up in cosplay,
and lo and behold, you were there hosting some quick
(02:09):
draws and I entered half as a half as a joke.
Half is just a oh like let's like see where
this goes sort of thing. And I ended up winning
the first one, and I think you were really impressed.
And then later that evening, uh, you were going to
(02:29):
host another one, and I thought it would be bad
sportsmanship to enter again, but you know, you just wanted
me to enter as like a ringer, and even then
I don't think I entered.
Speaker 4 (02:40):
Yeah you did not.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Yeah, it's just bad sportsmanship, man, you know, once you win, like, yeah,
you can't you can't go back to that. You shouldn't
go back to that.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
So I mean at this point, you were like, you know,
when you came to this and you were doing shows
by yourself, right, yeah, yeah, what what like what got
you into those?
Speaker 1 (03:00):
I started doing conventions as an artist during college, and
because I was already going to like a bunch of
the shows locally, and this was in the Midwest, and
so I was like, oh, hey, you know, I'm already
going to these shows. Maybe I can sell some of
my art and see what people think. And I don't
(03:21):
even remember the first show that I officially did artist
dally yet, but I remember it went like really well,
and I was like, Wow, this is great.
Speaker 4 (03:29):
So do you mind saying what a number well is?
Speaker 1 (03:34):
No?
Speaker 4 (03:34):
You don't, Okay, It's fine.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
I mean, like long story short, like I had some Yeah,
I had some pocket money. Like it's like, oh, you know,
I can I can you know, eat out or something
like that, or like get some Chipotle.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
It's funny, right when you do that first show where
you make money at and you're like, oh my gosh,
I just did this. It's a little shocked by myself,
Like it's it's especially from your it's.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
So self validating that, Like, I mean, you know, you
can definitely see the appeal. It's like, Wow, people actually
like gave me money for my stuff. This is fantastic.
Speaker 4 (04:10):
Yeah, And just in a petty way. It's like the
physical embodiment of saying suck it.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Yeah, yeah, it's it's nice look at me now. So yeah,
So so I went to this event, and I think
like later that evening, one of our other I guess
now mutual friends who used to be a photographer was
(04:39):
I think I just like roped him into like taking
some photos of my costume or something like that in
the parking lot, and then you were out there for
some reason, I guess, to just like hang with him,
and then I think he pretty much insisted that you
like get into the photo with me for whatever reason.
And so we have this like great memory, like memory,
(05:00):
uh like literally just captured in a photo of it's
it's like it's like us eating popcorn and the Watchman
or something like that.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
That's not what the image is what you mean?
Speaker 1 (05:12):
No, no, no, no, like in Watchman when Doctor Manhattan has
his photograph and it's like the two of them and
they're eating popcorn at like a fair.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Oh wow, that's a deep cut.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Okay, it is a deep cut. It's like a polaroid.
Speaker 4 (05:24):
But anyway, are you saying you're gonna be on a
moon somewhere contemplating when you you know.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Yeah, everything's a watch No. So so this photo is
of me in like a tront outfit and then Irvin
in front of me.
Speaker 4 (05:42):
Can I interject? Real? Yeah? So does that mean doctor
Manhattan's dad was a watch Man?
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Oh another one, oh Man.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
And he wanted to be a Watchman as well, but
he became a Watchman.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
More the word.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
Yeah, And it's like laughing somewhere, yeah, just laughing.
Speaker 4 (06:05):
Everybody takes it so seriously.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
He's just like ha ha watch Watchman.
Speaker 4 (06:11):
Yeah. Sorry, no, if you've never read Watchmen or even
watched Watchmen, absolutely no. And you're like, what is wrong
with these people? What are they talking about?
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Cheesy aos?
Speaker 4 (06:20):
And if that's the case, then come on, get with it.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
Yeah, read it. Yeah, this is twenty twenty five baby,
Yeah so sorry so yeah, so but yeah, we have
this nice memorabilia of like literally the night that we met,
and it's just it's like funny that, uh you know,
we can look back at it because that was twenty
(06:46):
twenty eleven, I want to say twenty ten. Okay, Yeah,
so that's like wild because I think, like, I don't know,
I feel like some people get into like arguments about
like twenty years ago met and stuff like that. Yeah,
but I feel like our alibi is pretty solid.
Speaker 4 (07:04):
Yeah, pretty much. You know. It's interesting though, you said
that right that image. It's like your your skill is
actually on display in the image, like where you came
from because you're a textiles person, right, yeah, because you're
in this trans suit that you made. It was Tron
sore right, yeah, from king and.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
Then it kind of evolved into just like a Tron character.
Speaker 4 (07:24):
But yeah, yeah Tran. If you're not familar Kingdom Hearts,
it's a Disney Final Fantasy mashup game.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Yeah. Tron was a sort of like cyberpunk esque almost
movie made in the eighties. Definitely recommend watching the original.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Yeah, but no, it's a pretty pretty cool costume. I
was just you know, it's it's interesting. The meeting kind
of led to many things down the road because the
person taking the picture, no run shows. Yeah, person that
took the picture, I should say, not taking a person
that took a picture a friend of ours, which we
have one of his events coming up in a bit yeats, Yeah,
(08:05):
which is fascinating. It's just interesting and you know, and
this is just to add to your points. It's it's
fascinating looking at all this because this is like a
weird networking situation where the person who was opening that
store is someone who I met through another friend, and
(08:26):
I had no interest in doing conventions. They just kind
of randomly set me up and said, yeah, just just
show up, just show up. And I felt bad because
I didn't want to make my friend look bad. So
I showed up at this thing and they said ask
for this guy, and went to the thing. Didn't make
any money. I was just staring at nothing for like
the whole the whole day, and then the promoter pretty
(08:52):
much then comes over to me at and says, hey,
you know, you should come to my show in their summer.
And that's a show where that's the first show where,
like I really I made money with the help of
a lot of my colleagues, you know, Crystal and Joel.
Like you know Crystal specifically, she showed some salesmanship that
(09:14):
I don't know. I mean, I ain't never seen that
in my life, and it really emboldened me.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
You know.
Speaker 4 (09:21):
It was a nice way the balance of the weekend
because that was the release weekend of Indiana Jones and
a Crystal Skull, so it was nice to bookend that
weekend with a really bad movie because I fell asleep.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
It was such a bad I wish I had fallen
asleep in it. I was so shocked at how terrible
that movie.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
I woke up and I saw people swinging through trees,
and I fell asleep. I remember that part. I fell
asleep somewhere after when he's at the he's doing his
professor thing, and I fell asleep somewhere in I think
much shows up at some point and I fell asleep,
and then I woke up there swinging through trees, and
then I know there was a something flew off in it.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
And then I was like, Okay, you didn't miss anything.
I assure you.
Speaker 4 (09:59):
Listen. I'm made like like I made such good money
that weekend that I didn't even care. I was like,
it was just it felt so good, just like you're saying,
it just made you feel like, oh man, where has
this been all my life? Why haven't I taken a risk?
It's almost like people don't want you to bet on
yourself in some cases, you know what I mean. Message, Yeah,
(10:21):
it's interesting.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
So yeah, So I guess that confluence of events almost
led us to meeting each other because I think I
had been going to the same owner of the comic
book store at the time ran conventions down in South Florida,
and I guess I regularly attended them, so, uh yeah,
(10:44):
just a small world, I guess.
Speaker 4 (10:45):
Yeah. Well, so what would you say at meeting whatnot?
What would you say was the biggest or is the
biggest benefit to having met and no working together? I'm
looking for self, you know, ego.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
It's it's like it's nice knowing that somebody has your back, Like,
like we go to these shows and I feel like
it's been a series of almost like trial and error Almo.
And I mean not to say that it's even still
not trial and error, because I think that like we're
constantly sort of like innovating both like our products and
(11:22):
like our setups. And I think it's like one of
the biggest benefits is that I think that we're both
very uh what's the word that I'm looking for? Versatile? Yes,
And I think that that's really important when you're an
artist that does basically, you know, the equivalent of like
(11:44):
pop up shows, because you know, we do these in
enough cities and basically like all over the states to
where you can't really pinpoint. People. You can have like
a general idea, sure, but the product is going to
vary definitely, like state by state and city by city.
And like we've we've like noticed like it's like literally
(12:07):
certain places that will gravitate more towards like a certain
property versus like others. And so it's just kind of
cool like being able to observe that and then like
having somebody on your team that is willing to grow
with you throughout that time.
Speaker 4 (12:25):
Yeah, it's it's a very good observation. Some places like
pre made art more than others. Some places are all
about the customer. I don't care what the premate. Some
places just like a little bit of everything. And you know,
it's it's also helpful from a mental standpoint to you know,
bathroom breaks as simple as simple as bathroom breaks at
(12:47):
a booth. You know, you're there, however many hours a
day or you know, you know, we're detail oriented in
different ways.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
Yeah, sure, Yeah.
Speaker 4 (12:57):
So it's like you know, paying attention to start, you know,
when the exhibition floor opens or when it closes, or
just being up on emails correspondence. You know, you know,
because they'll tell you you know, oh, sometimes a convention
will tell you like overnight that hey, show's going to
be open half an hour earlier, you know, and it's like,
(13:21):
remember that means you got to restock half an hour
earlier or an hour earlier, depending on what kind of
booth you're running, So that means you got to get
up earlier.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
So drinking guys, it's nice to have the bases covered exactly.
Speaker 4 (13:35):
It's it's very helpful. And you know, sometimes one of
us isself down for the count, so the other one
has to go, you know, do the networking or just
make friends or whatnot, you know what I mean. I
remember one time at Tampa was it Tampa Comic Con
when I got definitely sick. And it's interesting, this is
(13:57):
way back in the day. We're sharing a room with
a friend of ours that does a T shirt business.
He was trying to test out the show. So we're like, yeah,
just come to the show. We'll just we'll just share
a room or whatever and call it today. And I
got like it was like I felt like sniffley like
maybe the first day, and then by the middle of
the weekend, I was I was just wrecked. And you know,
(14:19):
if if that was just me by myself game over
man playing and simple, there would be no no show happening.
So it's definitely helpful to have somebody in your corner.
Not saying you can do it by yourself. You can.
You can, it's just you should plan accordingly. I recommend
having people around you. I think it's more it's it's
(14:42):
definitely more helpful that way. Divide and conquer, right, Yeah, yeah,
so what would you say is the biggest con working together?
Speaker 1 (14:56):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (14:57):
On the spot, she didn't expect this question.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
By the I didn't.
Speaker 4 (15:01):
In the hot seat.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
I feel like I feel like that was a Carrington
asked question.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
Yeah, I was a nice question. I think he did.
He may have asked that. I can't even remember you
guys listening, probably now because I can't remember, because.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
I would say that, like we both have pretty strong
opinions about certain things, so it's good. So sometimes it's
like difficult to agree on certain things or sometimes I
think maybe just in terms of like communication, I'm gonna
blame most of this on myself is just like not
(15:36):
necessarily hearing what the other persons saying. Maybe, so it
just kind of like causes uh, miscommunication or just like
things to take a little bit longer than they probably should.
And I would say like the workarounds, the workaround for
(15:56):
that is like is usually I find these days at
least like especially like in front of customers, is just
kind of like going along with it and then just
sorting it out privately afterward.
Speaker 4 (16:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Yeah, Like it's like there's no point in like sitting
like and basically like arguing with your partner like in
front of like a like a client, because they're not
going to understand, like they're like, oh, like what do
you mean there's like different styles or something like that.
So it's just best to.
Speaker 3 (16:26):
You know.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
And I think that like just just like part of
like professionalism and like presenting yourself in a way that
is still just very you know facing forward, front facing, Yeah.
Speaker 4 (16:41):
Forward facing to put it, I think that's a reason.
That's a that's a reasonable statement. Well you know, it's
it's it's really fascinating because I I so yeah, the
point being that, Okay, this is a little inside baseball
(17:05):
when when say, we'll have people working with us, sometimes
they'll try to balance commissions between us, right, So it's
interesting because we work at different paces and everyone always
assumes I'm significantly slower, much more slower than Nicole and
than I actually am, which is that I have a
(17:30):
and you can correct me if I'm wrong. I probably
have more stamina when it comes to the work. But
you were like, you're like, what no, okay, no, no, no, yeah, yeah,
like I will, I will go, you know, I'll I
don't consider it torture because I'm not like you know whatever.
I kind of find it. It's kind of in a
weird way, exhilarating. But I'll go hard, like straight through,
(17:55):
and you have a point where you're like, you're done.
Is that fair?
Speaker 1 (17:58):
That fair?
Speaker 4 (17:59):
But you work fast? Yeah, like I said, I'm not
you know, like I said, I'm not as fast as her,
but I'm not as slow as people think I am.
So what happens is sometimes they'll go back and forth, right,
so they'll give a commission to me, commission to her,
and then we end up in a situation where I'm
I'm still going, but they're still going back and forth
(18:20):
and she's done. And then so we end up in
situations where they like say, they'll ask the person or
they'll ask us need getting the doing the transaction? Hey,
who wants this one? And it's like we don't need
to ask that in front of the customer, which I
brought up, but I get it in the heat of it,
Like it can get pretty intense at the booth because
(18:40):
when it's people back and forth and I get it
that you forget or you just don't want to slight
either of us. But the thing is just we can
do it and I say it, but nobody listens to me.
No one listens to me at the booth, Like I
will literally say, hey, this is what we're doing, and
people will always go to Nicole anyway, which I guess
that's that's nice, right, It's a nice change of pace. Yea,
(19:02):
the world usually doesn't isn't as deferential. I'm not talking
about you in general. Yeah, women think so. But it's
just funny because you know, I literally have like they'll
say something that.
Speaker 1 (19:15):
They should be more afraid of you.
Speaker 4 (19:16):
And I mean to be fair. But that's the funniest thing.
This is more inside small about how we work, like
like it's it's just interesting, like the perceptions, which is fine.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
I mean, I'll get mad at the drop of a hat,
like you know, but it's like if you're mad.
Speaker 4 (19:34):
Oh boy, well that's the thing. It's like I eat
like I don't. Yeah, I don't eat Anger for breakfast.
Mine is cooking in a crock pot delicious. Get my point? No,
you like you eat Anger for breakfast like you have
Anger flakes, and but mine is in a crock pot.
Speaker 1 (19:48):
No, it's like those terribly pressure card and crumbly like
granola bars. Is that you break your teeth?
Speaker 4 (19:55):
Is that mine?
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Or is that your that's mine?
Speaker 4 (19:56):
Yeah? Okay, that's for Anger bars. I like that. All right,
we are we going to sell them already? So let
all grocery stores or.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
There's a Pizza Hut coupon on the back.
Speaker 4 (20:09):
Anger bars be able to let your daily apothecary and
that's CBS and writing whatever. Right, No, we don't want to.
So is that it? Is that how we meant? Is
that a good uh?
Speaker 1 (20:24):
I think that's a good summary of it. I mean
everything that came afterward is just kind of like trials
and tribulations, and I'm sure that you went into a
little bit of it.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
But not a lot. Like you you asked certain specific questions.
I mean, like I said, if you're listening to this podcast,
you'll probably learn about different things as we go along. Right,
you know about their injuries, some of them. I mean,
maybe we'll get into more in the future, but I
think this was a good way to kind of introduce
you to how we got introduced to each other. Though,
(20:57):
I will ask you one more thing that just one
more thing, where where would you like to see this
partnership go in future? Like what would what would you
don't have to go pie in the sky, but whatever
way you want, it could be as smaller as big
as you want.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
I mean, I think just like seeing I think that
like you know, both of us kind of have sort
of like I don't even want to say pie in
the sky like ideas or whatever. I just think like
if there is like a way to sort of have
like just like the day to day stuff kind of
like be able to be more sort of autumn automat. Yeah, whoa,
(21:44):
I wasn't going to go there, but I mean, if
there is just like a way for it to be
more like self sustaining, I guess, and then that would
basically give us more time to focus on the creative stuff,
because I because like I know that there are like
certain projects that like both of us have kind of
to put on the back Burner, and I would really
like to see those, you know, published, because I think
(22:04):
that some of them are really exciting and I would
want to share those with people.
Speaker 4 (22:09):
Chat, GPT and Claude. I think Claude is one of
those organized organizing. It is over in the corner holding
the hand behind the ear saying who shoh what you say?
Speaker 1 (22:23):
Twelve light bulbs and some water later?
Speaker 4 (22:25):
Right? So no, I mean, did you have any questions
for me though? Before we.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
Not? Off the top of my head, I guess I'll
have to listen to your podcast on this and.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
Hear the other here, the other side of things. You
can listen to us on all podcast platforms.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
You can find us at payper Lab Studios on Instagram
or payperlap studios dot com, or just drop us a
line at design at paper lab studios dot.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
Com and support us on Patreon.
Speaker 3 (22:59):
It Lab Studios Thank you for listening to paper Lab podcast.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Amongo music. Turn that music up.
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