Brett McGrath is back E353

Brett McGrath returns to the show again to chop up some hobby.


Talking points on this episode may include:


*Wrestling Hobby Community and Cards

*Football Hobby and discussion

*Going full time in the hobby

*Balancing Hobby work and family time

*NSCC talk



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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Sports guard Nations Hobby is the people weekly news and interviews.
It's your number one song. Sports Garnations Hobby is the people.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
Sports Guardation. What is up everybody? Welcome to episode three
fifty three Sports Carnation. John Newman glad to be back
at a guest on today. It's been on the show
but it's been a wow and always a pleasure getting
to talk to him. Chop Up the Hobby has his

(00:37):
own podcast that's doing super well and full time in
the hobby now between that and other things. And so
Brett McGrath is our guest from Stacking Slabs on today's program.
Before we get started, kudos to all our great sponsors
for without who Without them, this show doesn't happen. So

(01:02):
Iron Sports Cards, Sports Collectors, Digest, Hobby, Hotline and Upper
Deck and great great to have them part of the
Sports Cardination family. So with that out of the way,
let's get to talking with Brett McGrath of Stacking Slabs.

(01:32):
All right, happy to have this next gentleman on the
Sports Cardination guest line. He's been a part of this
program before, but it's been a couple of years and
I tell you truth, I didn't even realize it till
I kind of looked it up and much too long.
So time to have him back on and a great
guy doing great content in his own right. Brett McGrath

(01:55):
of Stacking Slabs, Welcome.

Speaker 3 (01:56):
Back, John, Thanks for having me and time flies when
you're having fun. What I even though it's been a
couple of years, I definitely tune into sports Cardination and
enjoy all the conversations you have, especially when doctor Becket's on.
I always find his his insight always gives me something
new to think about. But what I like about this

(02:17):
is you You were doing this before I started, and
you're still doing it now, and I just I love
not not only creators being here and creating and sharing
thoughts and their opinions and bringing on guests, but just
the longevity and consistency. So sports Cardination has been an
institution for quite a while and glad to be a
part of it today.

Speaker 2 (02:37):
Well, well, thank you. And that's just another way of
saying I'm old and you're right. I can't deny it.
My birth certificate gives me away. No, No, I appreciate
all choking side and you're right with whatever I have,
Doctor Jim on and I've known him a while and
he's a friend, and I know you know him. You know,
it's it's he makes you think he sees it from

(02:58):
a different hang on, Like, after I talk with him,
I'm like, how come I like that was like, you
made that seem so easy? How Come I didn't you
almost kind of second guess yourself. But that's just you know,
he's done this a long time. He's a brilliant guy.
And that's just the genius of doctor Jim. And so yeah, no,

(03:19):
no doubt. That's why he's a great guess, right, is
because he makes you look at it from a different perspective.
And uh uh and listen, uh you likewise right, you're
you're very intelligent. You've been in this out. You're not
new to the hobby. You know, like you said, you
started after me. It wasn't like that far after me.
So you're in that og category. Uh as well, And

(03:42):
that's that category has there's a lot of shows now
compared to four six years ago when we started, uh
and whatnot? Well kind of we'll start off there, Brett, like,
you know, is that good? Is that bad? Is it?
It'll just shake itself out? Will people just listen to
shows that enjoy. And the proof sort of in the
putting is that really is as simple as that.

Speaker 3 (04:06):
I think I often say this like I create a
lot of content and have a ton of conversations as
do you, John, and share those out publicly and just
go through this cycle of constantly doing it. But on
the other side of it, I'm probably just as big
of a consumer of content in the hobby. I go
on a lot of walks, run and I'm always listening

(04:28):
to hobby podcasts. And I'll tell you this, like, I'll
listen to other podcasts outside of hobby podcasts, but when
they're new hobby podcasts available, they're always the ones that
I want to listen to first. And I just think,
like the diversity of a voice's opinions, different flavors of
the hobby. Like even if it's something that I don't
do or don't collect in someone's covering it on the podcast,

(04:50):
I try to listen because it makes me more informed.
And so I think what I've noticed over this stretch
of you know, talking into a microphone to collectors for
so long, is that you know, a lot of people
will start projects, but it's really hard to keep them going.
And I think the creators that continue to keep their

(05:13):
podcast going have a passion and usually that passion shines through.
So I always encourage any listeners, like if you have
a unique tangle or something you want to talk about,
like start a podcast and it's all listen to it.
I'll definitely listen to it. But yeah, it's as you know,
it's it's not easy to keep the ship going for

(05:34):
a long time. But yeah, it's been fun and I
always appreciate new shows to listen to.

Speaker 2 (05:39):
Yeah, well said. And I was saying, you know, you
look at yourself, and you look at myself. You know
who's doing more running and more walking. That's more parent
and listening to probably more content because because of that,
sou But no, it's it's you know, there's just so
many The hobby's just so diverse as well. You said

(06:00):
that there is room for content that's kind of being
done different, you know, And and I've I've stayed sort
of true. I've I've changed things here and there. You know,
I've talked even before we went uh live and and
and told you you know, we went even double episodes
here with with guests instead of one big long one
just for just from from listener feedback and just you know,

(06:24):
for for my schedule too. That full transparency, it's made
kind of my job, I don't even want to say job,
but made my life a little bit easier in kind
of scheduling these out and getting folks on. But yeah,
you know, uh, you know, it's it's no matter what
your collect there is probably a show that pertains to it.
And I want to segue into a part of the

(06:47):
hobby you're a part of and very familiar with, and
that's the wrestling hobby and wrestling in general.

Speaker 4 (06:53):
Right.

Speaker 2 (06:54):
I had about a month ago Drake mcgruter, a friend
of yours on I had Gelman Adam Gelman on in
the past. And the one thing I even though I'm
not a wrestling card guy, you don't have to be
to see how tight knit that community and how passionate
that community is. I didn't even say, like, I don't

(07:15):
know if you agree with it. I know it's the
smallest segment, but if they see me even closer than
other sports hobby, I guess two pronged, right, am I right?
And and what do you attest that too?

Speaker 3 (07:29):
I think if there's a nature of It's kind of
like a startup category in a way. And when you're
forming and you're growing, you tend to know everybody or
most people, and you know what the types of cards
or wrestlers or products that you those collectors in the
community collect, and there's a sense of wanting to help
those individuals out. I'm not gonna there there's competition, right,

(07:53):
there's competition in other categories, but I think the shared passion,
which for many wrestling card collectors comes from childhood, is
something that people are able to connect on. I'll also
say you mentioned Gelman, like there's individuals in the space
who've been organizers, and sometimes it takes individuals who are

(08:13):
super passionate and have a voice and want to create content.
And I think like we are in this era where
we're moving towards like more focus and niche content for
specific categories, and Gellman has really been the leader of
that for the wrestling card community. I'm a member of
his Patreon group a main event and he's got it.

(08:34):
I get it up. I get an email regularly that
new article, new conversation, whatever is put out there. But
I know Geleman pretty well, and Geleman is super passionate,
and he wants to share information, and that information coming
from manufacturers, information coming from people he's talking with. And
so I just think, what's what I like about the
wrestling card community is there's just always a flood of information,

(08:58):
always information about sales and where cards are, what's available,
and yeah, as you expand and categories grow, it gets
harder and harder to operate that like that. But I
think that's what a cool part is about wrestling cards
in the community around it right now.

Speaker 2 (09:14):
Yeah, And I think you tell me if you agree
with this too, Brett. Like, even you know, even with
sports cards obviously, now sports cards and the hobby it's
making mainstream news at record clips, especially the last few years,
especially since COVID. You know, at one point you were
probably well, it wasn't really as cool to be in

(09:34):
the hobby as it is, let's say today, people were
reluctant to even say, hey, you know, I collect baseball
cards or football card whatever, you know. And I think
even with wrestling cards, there was that stigma whether it
was right or wrong or But now I think just
with the explosion of everything else and less, no one's

(09:56):
denying how popular wrestling is you see the the soda
arenas and the pay per views. But I think too,
it's it's there was sort of a bugaboo like if
you if if someone knew, like, oh, you collect cards.
I think we're way past that point. But I think
because we're way past that point, uh, it's it makes
it easier to do and that tighter. And I think

(10:19):
maybe because that community remembers when it wasn't like it
was like it is now, uh, and how it was
a little more like you kind of kept it behind
closed doors or yourself, that that maybe that's that factors
in there too.

Speaker 3 (10:34):
Yeah, those those individuals who were collecting cards when they
weren't cool, and especially collecting wrestling cards when they weren't cool,
and have been here the whole time are certainly probably
doing pretty well for themselves because you know that that
category is has grown, right, new people coming in, passion
being shared. You've got you know, the Netflix deal with WWE.

(10:57):
You've obviously got Tops coming in grabbing the license, which
adds a whole nother marketing element to everything at new eyeballs.
It's it's been growing quickly in real time. I'll tell you.
I went to WrestleMania in Vegas this year with my
best friend. We met when we were three or four
years old playing with wrestling figures at our brother's YMCA

(11:19):
basketball game. Still friends today, best friends, still talk about
wrestling all the time. But we got the hall pass
from our wives that you know, we both turned forty
this year, and it was like, all right, we're going
to go to Vegas and be you know.

Speaker 2 (11:32):
Young Bucks. He's still young Bucks over the hill.

Speaker 3 (11:36):
But yeah, I'll take it, John. But yeah, we went
there and we went to WWE Access and went through
and did it all. And I'll tell you what, man, No,
everywhere you turned were wrestling cards, promotion of tops Crumb.
We walked into Allegiance where the Raiders play, where the
event was, and right when I walked in, there was

(11:57):
a huge cardboard cutout of a top chrome autograph rear
Ripley card. And I look around and there's just promo
for cards everywhere. Now. I've been going to wrestling events
my entire life. I've never seen anything like that. So
part of the growth, right is people sharing information and
people passionate and community organizers like Gelman. But then it's
also like you've got a manufacturer who's like going all

(12:20):
in on the promotion of new products and exposure to
an audience. And what's crazy about wrestling fans is wrestling
fans aren't scared of spending money. They'll spend money on tickets,
t shirts, memorabilia, action figures, but cards have never really
been a part of that, and now they very much are.
And it's fun to see it getting going.

Speaker 2 (12:40):
Yeah, and it's important I think too, for the sport
itself to embrace the hobby because I think they sort
of they have to. They have to. They're not mutually exclusive.
I think they need sort of need each other, or
at least you know, the hobby needs wrestling, maybe more so.
But you know, the more people who are into the hobby,
the more fans. What are you gonna have.

Speaker 1 (13:03):
Time for a quick break? Thoughts will be right bank.

Speaker 4 (13:08):
Hobby Hotline is the Hobby's only live, interactive call in show.
Join some of your favorite hobby personalities every Saturday eleven
am Eastern eight am Pacific to discuss the hottest hobby topics.
If you miss us live, catch us after the fact
on all major podcast platforms. Follow us on socials at

(13:31):
Hobby Hotline.

Speaker 1 (13:36):
Sports Combnation has returns.

Speaker 2 (13:42):
When I had Gelman and I talked about this, like
does the sport itself like do enough to promote the
fact that because you mentioned i'd love to see you know,
when you go to a wrestling event, you know, you
go through, you come through the door, and you had
a promo pack of some sort and I would vent

(14:04):
your guests, and you tell me if I'm right or wrong, Brett.
There's people going to get this promo pack who probably
don't even realize they're actually wrestling cards. Maybe they're buying
the shirts and the memorabilia and that sort of thing,
or the belts and stuff. They don't even realize they're
trading cards and that might be their their avenue to

(14:24):
know that they exist. And here we have a new
wrestling card hobbyist, right, and what's that take?

Speaker 1 (14:31):
Right?

Speaker 2 (14:31):
It doesn't. It doesn't you know, I know, the printing
and stuff like that. But I mean just think about what.
You know, A kid walks through, he's already excited, he's
going to watch some of his favorite wrestlers, probably performed
live in front of him rather than on TV. And
then he's handed the pack and maybe he doesn't even
know cards exist, and I mentioned the kids, but this

(14:52):
could be adults as well. Kind of your thoughts on
maybe seeing some more.

Speaker 3 (14:57):
Of that, Yeah, I think I think we will see
more of that, just based on my observations of how
TOPS is operating right now. One of the things that
I noticed was, you know, they dropped the cactus Jack
version of TOPS Chrome while we were at WrestleMania. You know,
you could buy it at the show and you could

(15:20):
you know, resell it the the online for you know, multiples.
So like there's that element too of like people like
immediately flipping wrestling cards, but it just adds a whole
other element I think in terms of exposure. One of
the things that just like blew my mind seeing this
for the first time. But I was like sitting on
my couch. I was watching Raw on Netflix and this

(15:42):
was like a few months ago. But they were doing
like a matchup. They're like highlighting the main event or
the next matchup, and I remember vividly, like one of
the performers was Damian Priest and I can't remember who
was wrestling against, but they showed the matchup as they
segued a commercial, and they were highlighting them in cardboard.
For him, it was like their tops chrome cards on

(16:03):
the screen, and I was like, that's a pretty cool
way to promote the product, like during the show as
a part of the show. And so I think in
this era of ww EI, they're definitely more open to
sponsors than they were in a previous era, and I
think it's a good opportunity for wrestling cards to get
more eyeballs.

Speaker 2 (16:23):
Yeah, and I think the Fanatics slash Chops Brandon, that's
kind of you know, they do a good job of
promoting themselves and what they've gotten the license for. Do
you think it's as simple as that where maybe a
prior card company just kind of failed in that department
and maybe it hurt. Maybe it's why they don't have

(16:45):
the license anymore. You know, I hate to make it
as black and white as that, but you know, you
have you almost have to see. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (16:52):
I I what I can say is that whether you
like what they're doing or you don't like what they're doing,
the approach that Fanatics Slash Tops is taken to get
attention has never been seen before, and it works in
this era of being online scrolling. It's the way they're

(17:17):
approaching influencers. The way they're approaching getting each product line
out events like Fanatics Fest is something like we we
haven't seen before. So if you're a company like WWE
and they're talking about all this new modern ways to
promote and involving talent and you know, using digital channels
and different strategies and using influencers, like if your chances are,

(17:40):
that's probably going to be appetizing for those decision makers.
And I don't I couldn't tell you begin to tell
you how all those deals went down and why they
went down. But their Fanatics is a marketing machine. They're
a marketing company and like they promised they were going
to do that and they're delivering on that. At least.
I've been seeing that in the wrestling card category.

Speaker 2 (18:01):
Yeah, no doubt. I'm not even a wrestling guy, per
se Brett, and yet I'm picking that up. So what's that?
What's that? Typic? There?

Speaker 3 (18:09):
You go?

Speaker 2 (18:10):
I've seen some promos for matches and like you said,
they're using the the you know, the wrestlers on the
cards as part of that promo for that match. And uh,
maybe as simple as that, someone says, hey, that's a card,
like we get those who makes them, how do I
obtain them that sort of thing. It's it's it's I

(18:31):
know it's not as simple as that, but something as
simple as that can can bring a whole bunch of
new hobbyists into the fold. And I proofully, I don't
know if you're great. I expect. I'm assuming that the
wrestling hobby is going to grow as a result of
the fanatic slashtops.

Speaker 3 (18:49):
I would imagine so. And one thing that I'll just
call out that I've noticed that just to show to
tell the listeners where this is right now in terms
of the promotion inside. Whenever I've observed this, whenever there's
a new product to be opened, you have Triple H
icon WWE Hall of Famer Chief Creative Officer, the guy

(19:12):
in charge of the product. Right now. They do a
video of him and Sam Roberts, who's a he's got
a wrestling podcast, but they just Triple H just is
sitting there opening up the packs and they're talking about
the cards, and it's like that never would have been
done under the Vince McMahon era. And I just think
it's like that content's probably not for everyone, but if

(19:34):
you're a kid and you're watching wrestling and you collect
cards and never have connected the dots, and you see
a video of Triple H opening up the new tops
Chrome pack, like it's probably gonna get your attention. So
I think those sorts of tactics they're they're employing right now,
and I think you know, we're talking about them on
a podcast, so they're they're doing something right.

Speaker 2 (19:54):
Yeah. And I'm not a wrestling guy, and I have
none to guess it. I'm just not my it's not
my lane, right, like you just said, we're both talking
about it. So and I've had even more people on
the show to talk about it, and that's that's saying
something right there. All right, So we'll put a bout
a little bow on on wrestling as it's about to

(20:15):
grow even more. Uh, you know, let's talk about your
content stacking slabs like you said, I know you said
after me. I don't look at it like that. I
look at it like we're all on the fraternity, right.
We all can't graduate the same year. And if you
if the graduations earlier just means I'm older and I'm
getting older quicker. Again, we've seen a change, but even

(20:39):
even your kind has changed. Them. I don't know when
I'll kind of put you not really on the spot,
but you're now full time in the hobby, which which
is awesome. Kind of talk about that progression, how tough
of a decision or maybe not to do that, any
nervousness to you know, anytime yet, I think any anyone

(21:00):
I've talked to who's done that brat always so yeah
it is, you know, it's a little unknown like it's
known and unknown and where about. But every story is unique,
in every journey's unique kind of for you kind of
talk how how you got there and the thoughts about
doing it.

Speaker 3 (21:18):
Yeah, I'll give the brief overviews. So I have. I
spent previously the last fifteen years in my career working
in uh B to B marketing, mostly for software companies
in a marketing function, and worked for companies all shapes
and sizes. But throughout that experience I did a lot.
I did marketing, and I did content, and I built brands,

(21:40):
and I did podcasting. I did did a lot of
uh you know, brand building, And during COVID, I got
really bored and was working from home and was thought,
you know, I could take what I'm doing professionally and
apply it to the hobby. And that's was really the
genesis of stacking slabs is like I was bored. I

(22:00):
just wanted to meet other collectors who've been doing it
longer than me, and maybe we can create some content
along the way. That turned into a four year passion project.
And it's like, you know it, It's like once you
start and you're really into it, you can't really stop.
And while I was working, it felt like, you know,
kind of two jobs at once. And then twenty twenty four,

(22:23):
I was working for a startup that I put three
years in and it ran out of funding and I
lost my job. So it was like the first time
in my career I did not have a job and
I had to figure out what I wanted to do.
And really my mindset was around while I'm spending all
this time with stacking slabs and the content, I made
all these connections like what can I do in order

(22:45):
to set myself up and be able to do this
full time. During that time, as I was plotting, meeting
with people trying to figure out the path, I took
a contractor job. And then that contractor job I didn't
want it to but it ended up becoming a full
time gig while I'm trying to run stacking Slabs and
take it off the ground and do it full time.

(23:07):
And then it just reached this crossroads. It was it
was okay, well, I've made enough of the right connections
and financially, I think I'm in a position to be
able to make this happen luckily because I've got an
awesome audience and some great sponsors. And I talked to
my wife November of last year and she said, go

(23:30):
do it. And I next day I got on and
talked to my CEO and felt like maybe blindsided him
a little bit, but I left and really never looked back.
And so I've been working for myself building out stacking
Slabs since November twenty twenty four, and I haven't looked back.
I can't tell you how fortunate I feel every day

(23:53):
that I can wake up after I take my kids
to school and come back to the desk and have
just an endless amount of UH content and things to
work on, all hobby related, and it's I feel very fortunate,
and it feels very much like I'm just getting started.
This year, we have expanded, We've almost got a new show,

(24:13):
coming out every day. We're starting new shows niche folk
category specific. W NBA Card Podcast is one of them
that's launched. We just launched the Football Card podcast. We're
working with shows with sponsors and so there's no in
it's the work is. It's never ending. It's never ending.
There's there's there formatting, there's the outreach to have these conversations,

(24:35):
there's the conversations, and then it's do it all over again.
I was looking at my calendar John for tomorrow and
I have a many little vacation with my family, which
I haven't taken a vacation in forever with my family,
right before the National and I just looked and I
have four recordings all in a row tomorrow, and I'm
just like, this is what I signed up for. But
I love it, so I feel very fortunate. It's the best.

Speaker 2 (24:56):
This is the best.

Speaker 3 (24:57):
I've had many jobs, and I've worked for a many
awesome come but these many great people, this is easily
the best job I've ever had.

Speaker 2 (25:04):
Yeah, and you love it. You're passionate about I know
we throw that word around sometimes too easy, right love
or passionate, but when you really do right, it comes through.
I think it comes through in your content. I know
I get that from you. It's not there's no phoniness there,
it's it's genuine. You can tell sometimes, you know when

(25:24):
someone's sort of going through the motions. You know, someone
asked me Brett, like, you know, John, how when we
you know, like your podcast is like you're done, And
it's a real simple answer. I didn't even have to
think about it when I turn on the mic and
I don't want to it's not fun anymore. Or I
look at it as like, uh, you know, I'm in

(25:44):
the teaching profession by day now, and I love that gig.
I'm not going to give it up, even though I
probably could with like you with the hobby side, but
I love the kids. But you know, if I ever
turn like it's like even knowing, Hey, I'm gonna come
home and I'm gonna have a great conversation, most likely
with Bread, like I look forward to that if and

(26:05):
I don't foresee this, but hypothetically, if I would have
been thinking, like, ah, man, I gotta talk to Bread,
I'd rather jump in my hot if I get to
that point, like and I get sometimes it might be
a day. You know, you're just having an off day
like an athlete, right, I went over four. But if
that becomes more like the norm, which I don't, I

(26:27):
don't ever see that happening, But if it did, that's
when that's when I know, and I always tell when
I get asked that question, bred, I always say, I
have nothing to do with downloads. You know, when I
started this show, it wasn't sponsored. It was slow going,
oh at first, and then it just sort of built up.
I'm sure you're you know exactly what I'm talking about.

(26:47):
And I never did the show to make money. That's
a nice what's become a nice perk of it, but
it's still not the real reason. Like if that even
went away now, even after getting used to it, I
still would do the show. It's it's more the internal
feeling that like I don't want to do this anymore,
I don't want to have this cover or I rather

(27:08):
do this than that, And if that ever happens again,
I don't. I don't see that. But if that became
the happened stamps or the circumstance, then that's all I need.
I'll know then and it'll have nothing to do with
all the superficial and financial aspects. Always awesome having bred
on the program. And here's the best part. This was

(27:30):
only part one, so part two will continue next week
our conclusion with Brett McGrath and I hope you enjoyed
listening as much as I enjoyed the conversation I had
with bretton again Part conclusion, Part two next Friday. All right,
before we close out the show here with with some

(27:53):
closing thoughts. You know, I don't often bring in like
outside the High be stuffed into this program, but unless
you're living under rock, you know this week was a
particularly difficult one living here in this country, with some

(28:14):
incidents and killings that were senseless, terrible, tragic, and you know,
makes me very sad and sad to see it. I
pray for families affected by these tragedies. I pray for everybody,

(28:34):
because we're all should be affected by these tragedies. That
you could just be minding your own business somewhere and
still be killed. That you may give your opinion of
your beliefs and it may cost your life, and it's
sad to say, but that's sort of where we are.

(28:57):
I still believe there's more good than bad in this world,
just like I believe there's more good than bad in
this hobby. But I pray for everybody to get through
these difficult times, and I pray that hopefully, uh, you know,
these stories are less prevalent than they have seemed to become.

(29:24):
So we're going to close out the show with some
more closing thoughts and wrap up this week's episode.

Speaker 1 (29:32):
Time for our Hobby is the People Announcer of the Week.

Speaker 2 (29:39):
Hello, this is Mark Oyle, and remember the Hobby is
the People.

Speaker 1 (29:44):
If you'd like to be the Hobby is the People
Announcer of the Week to one or m P three
file and send it to Sportscott Nation PC at gmail
dot com.