Forged in Firelight: Bex Simon on the Art, Grit, and Grace of Modern Blacksmithing

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'm Bex Simon and I'm an art smith.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
Hello and welcome to Art the podcast where we get
to know creative women from around the world of visual arts.
I'm Chris Stafford and this is season three, Episode five.
My guest this week is the British art smith Bex Simon,
who has overcome difficult mental health issues to become highly

(00:28):
sought after for her creative work in metal. Bex is
unconstrained in her approach to design by combining geometric shapes
and textures as sculptures and public art tell stories relative
to the surrounding environment and can be found around the UK.
Bex was born in Chertsey, Surrey, in nineteen seventy three,

(00:50):
the third of four children. She has an older sister
and brother, and a younger brother. Bex reflects on a
very strict upbringing from her parents, Tim, a computer engineer,
and Gel, a retired teacher who later volunteered at school
for handicapped children, a relationship now which has mellowed with
time and understanding of Bex's mental health. Bex was attracted

(01:16):
to the art of blacksmithing as a teenager, and despite
struggling at school with dyslexia. She studied at the Surrey
Institute of Art and Design Foundation, graduating in nineteen ninety two.
In nineteen ninety five, she graduated with a BA in
Three Dimensional Design in Metal from the Surrey Institute of

(01:37):
Art and Design, followed in nineteen ninety eight by a
diploma and National Certificate from Hereford College of Technology, and
in twenty seventeen a Level three Diploma in Advanced Forge
Work DFS from Herefordshire and Ludlow College. In twenty nineteen,
she began studying geometry at the Prince's Foundation's School of

(02:00):
Traditional Arts. In nineteen ninety nine, Bes moved to London
and established her creative blacksmithing business with the help of
the Prince's Trust. Initially, she worked on private commissions acquired
from exhibiting regularly at the Chelsea and Hampton Court Flower Shows. Later,
she moved on to larger scale public artwork projects via

(02:22):
collaborations with a selected group of artist blacksmiths, her biggest
commission to date being a forty meter public artwork for
Westminster Magistrates Court in London. It was for that installation
that she became the first woman to receive the Tony
Pandy Cup, the most prestigious award given by the Worshipful
Company of Blacksmiths. Bex lives in North Devon with her

(02:45):
husband Dave and their daughters Molly and Leone. Bex Welcome
to the podcast.

Speaker 1 (02:52):
Hi, how are you well?

Speaker 2 (02:54):
Thank you for taking the time to do this, because
I know your working day is pretty intense, isn't it.
I think would be fair to say you're a hard
working art smith.

Speaker 1 (03:04):
Yeah, we are juggling quite a bit, but it's all good.
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (03:10):
Well, let's start with that because I know you specifically
call yourself an art smith. Now I go back to
riding Ponis and riding my pony to the blacksmith in
the next village. But we've come a long way since then.
Now we call the blacksmith the farrier, but the art smith.
And the other word that you're using now is geometalist
and geometalism, So unpack that for us, would you please,

(03:32):
so that the audience understands exactly what you do.

Speaker 1 (03:36):
So I decided to adopt the name art smith because
the moment you mentioned the word blacksmith, people sort of
ask you. One of the main things is so you're
like horses then and shoe horses, like you said, which
is a farrier. And also it conjures up a sort
of image of a viking, you know, striking hot metal,

(03:58):
forging swords and things. So I kind of wanted people
to be a bit more inquisitive into you know, what
it is, and it's art basically over the anvil, so
you know, forging, forging art over the anvil, and yeah,
well that's basically what it is. Losing the word, you know,

(04:21):
blacksmith because it has been artist Blacksmith, which I think,
you know, we've had a good run of the artist Blacksmith,
but I think it needs a fresher sort of take
on what we Sorry, it's a fresher take what we
actually do these days, you know, just sorry, my mind
has just gone completely blank. It's basically, we've had the

(04:46):
artist Blacksmith. It was a big revival in sort of
the seventies and eighties, and I just feel like we
sort of need another look at what we do. We
need the art world to take note, we need craft world,
like the Craft Council to sort of look at what
we do again. So it's sort of refreshing, bringing in

(05:08):
a new sort of interesting shorter name as it were.

Speaker 2 (05:16):
Well, it does seem perfectly fitting. I hope this is
a name that's going to be adopted because it speaks
to exactly what you do. And for those who are
not familiar with your work, it's very hard work. It's
very physical. It's very heavy work. I know, you don't
pick the anvelope and throw it around the room, but
it's very hard work physically, isn't it. So give us

(05:38):
a sense of what your day might be like, Bex.

Speaker 1 (05:43):
Yes, it is incredibly physical. So you know, I go
in the morning, and it depends on what project I'm
working on. But you know, if I know I'm forging
all day, then you know, the next day I will
sort of consider what it is I'm actually doing that day,
because doing two physical days and forging in a road

(06:07):
in a row is you know, is very exhausting, and
it's quite hard on your hands, on me, especially now
that I'm you know, over my fifties, so I do
sort of really have to figure out how my week
goes in the workshop. So I'll go in, I'll like
fire up and I'll prepare my steel whilst my fire
is getting to a good heat and stuff and I

(06:29):
generally forge for as many couple of hours as I can,
and I'll stop and have a break and you know,
look at what I'm doing, switch to fire off, maybe
do a bit of welding in the afternoon and things. Also,
you know, try and have some time in the office designing,
so you know, just sort of break up a little

(06:50):
bit more, you know, not like the old days when
you just sort of leap about the whole week. Well
mind you you know, yeah, because now we're teaching on
the whek, so we are consistently doing things. So yeah,
it's known when to have a break and things between.

Speaker 2 (07:09):
Well I'm going to ask you about the wei of
that when you refer to the whee, but I just
I just want to come back to the fire when
you say you get the fire going, because back in
the day, in my childhood, all the forges were coal
or coke. And nowadays, of course one of there's so
many more mobile forges, but there are gas now, So
what's yours.

Speaker 1 (07:30):
When I do have a gas forge, I do use
that for like repetitive little things like if we're doing
the skewers, perhaps, but I mean at the moment it's
not working anyhow, but I much prefer using the fire,
so I use coke traditional coat. Yes, I use coke.

Speaker 2 (07:50):
So that's still readily available in the West Country.

Speaker 1 (07:53):
Yeah, it's more expensive and it's not as good quality
as when I first started out, but that's that's currently
what I use. I much prefer to have the traditional
fire because I've trained like that. I was only really
introduced to using a sort of furnace with that, well,
it was when I moved here, so about four years ago,

(08:17):
so I might you know, since nineteen ninety nine, I've
only ever used coke and the traditional fire.

Speaker 2 (08:25):
Explained to us why you prefer that heat to gas?

Speaker 1 (08:31):
I think because partly because of the traditional nature of fire.
You know, it's it's such a beautiful thing. It's so exciting,
and you know, you learn fire management. So I mean,
I mentioned about the skewers, but I've before having you know,
a furnace, I've you know, always done it in the fire.

(08:53):
I've learned how to control the heat and where to
put all the skewers in a row so you know
when the heat's ready so you don't burn your work.
And I find that really, Oh it's lovely, it is an.

Speaker 2 (09:06):
Art in itself. What are skewers in your terms?

Speaker 1 (09:09):
Oh, skewers for barbecue, you know, barbecuing.

Speaker 2 (09:12):
Oh those kinds of skewers. Okay, I was looking for
something more complex, but get it. Okay, talk about the
Wii part. Because you're referred to we, So someone else
is in the forge with you.

Speaker 1 (09:24):
Yeah, so, well, so it's me and my husband. So
when I set my business up in nineteen ninety nine,
it was just myself and then every now and then,
you know, working with somebody. But Dave, my husband, came
into business in twenty ten when we were expecting our
first child. And now I mean he we work full

(09:47):
time together then. But now we've moved to North Devon,
we've got the two different businesses. So we have Old
Pound Smithy, which is a glampitting at Unique Stays and
blacksmith Experience, and then I have my my art that
I'm building. So I mean, really, this is only happens

(10:07):
in the last couple of years. This is why we
moved to North Devon because I've always always wanted to
do art without commission, just my own art, but funding that.
So we had to think of a way, you know,
for funding that need. So he runs the old Palm
smithy and the glamping and I'm in my workshop, but

(10:31):
I often need Dave to come in and help me
and we chat things through and stuff. And also I
teach with him or I assist him teaching, and I'm
also a cleaner.

Speaker 2 (10:44):
What are you teaching?

Speaker 1 (10:46):
Just you know, traditional blacksmith thing. We have traditional bellows,
We've got six anvils, so we teach bottl opener's skewers.
I teach some forge geometry. Yeah, it's a blacksmith experience.
So it's very traditional basic skills.

Speaker 2 (11:06):
And what was Dave's background then before you joined forces?

Speaker 1 (11:11):
So when we first started seeing each other, he was
living in France and running a renovation company, you know,
on the chalets and buildings out there, and then he
moved back to England and he studied charter building charter
building surveying, and then he worked for Cluttons in London,

(11:34):
you know, surveying their buildings, and then obviously he came
and joined me in my business. So he's got a
very wide broad range of skills which was fantastic, especially
when we did a lot of the public art in London.
You know, he was really good at shairing, you know,
well the projects, project managing and then all the foundations

(11:55):
and stuff like that. So we actually made a really
good team. He does a lot a lot of the work,
you know, I mean I do the designing on like
the complete artists. So yeah, we're a good solid team together.

Speaker 2 (12:11):
How did you meet?

Speaker 1 (12:13):
So both our brothers met, Well, we're best friends at
medical school, so I think our birth meeting with he
was eighteen, I was twenty one, and we were aware
of each other then and then it was a mutual
friend's wedding sort of many many years ago. Actually it's
our wedding anniversary on Friday and will be married sixteen years.

Speaker 2 (12:36):
Well, congratulations, thank you very much. Well let's wind the
clock back a little bit here, Bex, because we've got
a picture of what you're doing now, what a day
looks like for you, and it's obviously full on. But
it all started for you in London. You're in londoner,
aren't you. You're not exactly a company. You grew up

(12:57):
in Surrey. We're exactly in Surrey. Ye, So I'm born
and bred Surrey.

Speaker 1 (13:02):
I was born in Chertsey, Saint Peter's and grew up
in Walton and Weybridge. But then the moment I could,
I moved to London and I lived moved different places,
but I was mainly in Shepherd's Bush and the workshop
was over in a Hackney.

Speaker 2 (13:22):
So you started this very very young. What was your
childhood like? What was the initial catalyst then for you
breaking and making this are your career?

Speaker 1 (13:32):
Well, basically just being dyslexic and not any good at
school whatsoever. Obviously they didn't know when I was at school,
so I really really didn't enjoy school. But then I
found our college. I used to work in clay, but
I am incredibly impatient, so the rolling of slabs and

(13:53):
leaving things to dry overnight really didn't suit my impatientness.
So you know, I went. I went and did a
foundation at what's it the Surrey Institute, I think it's
called something different now, and then I was introduced to
the forge and you know, blacksmithing, swinging hammers with fire

(14:17):
and and welding. So yeah, that was when I started
my interest in that.

Speaker 2 (14:25):
What was childhood like for you? You're one of four children.
You have an older sister and two brothers. Yeah, tell
us a little bit about what childhood was like for you.
What are your earliest memories?

Speaker 1 (14:36):
Oh, my goodness, well your child of the seventies. You know,
I remember power cuts and all sorts. Parents were quite strict.
My mum's quite religious and stuff. You know. We were
a close family, you know, four kids, and that I
was very close with my younger brother because we're very

(14:57):
close in age. But yeah, just yeah, I mean my siblings,
my big system, big brother both medics, and me my
little brother, both the creative ones. My dad was a
chartered building not sorry, not a charter. He was a
computer programmer. It's because I visualized the sea then took

(15:20):
me off on a tangent. He's a computer programmer. And
my mum was a teacher up until she had the
four of us, and she had all four of us
by the time she's twenty eight. We're all under the
age of five. Yeah. Catholics.

Speaker 2 (15:40):
Did that stick with you? The religion and then her beliefs, Well.

Speaker 1 (15:47):
I sort of. I grew up you know, obviously in
a Catholic school and going to church and stuff, but
obviously mental health, being bipolar. I didn't trust a lot
of people. So I used to go to church because
I found you know, I sort of would talk to God,
which now is my universe, you know, so I sort

(16:09):
of found some sort of peace in that until I've
discovered geometry and realized that basically religion is geometry and
God is the universe. So I've sort of adapted it
over and stuff. But yeah, I mean my mum was
very strict. Well, my folks were very strict, I suppose,
you know, for young kids, you kind of had to

(16:32):
really and it also is a different era then, you know,
growing up in those era, I think most people were smacked.

Speaker 2 (16:41):
Well, yes, it certainly was a different disciplinary attitude. But
does that come from their parents, from maybe from your
maternal grandparents or your paternal grandparents. Where do you think
that originally comes from?

Speaker 1 (16:53):
I think probably they all had pretty you know, strict parents.

Speaker 2 (16:59):
I mean, I know, my mom's a.

Speaker 1 (17:02):
Grand I mean, well she was bipolar, money depression, so
all sorts was going on there. But yeah, I think
generally growing up because they're all quite old like traditional,
well yeah, I mean my great grand not my grandparents
on my mom's side were from north and then my

(17:24):
other grandparents, my grand on my dad's side, their family
escaped the walks they're Jewish, you know, and escaped over here,
changed their names and stuff.

Speaker 2 (17:36):
Yeah, what do you know of that story? Did they
share that with you?

Speaker 1 (17:40):
Yeah? Yeah, well they so it was my grand my
Granny Tilly, So her parents they got wind of, you know,
the all the things were kicking off with the Jews
and you know, and everything, and they're Jewish, so they
their family escaped over to England and changed their names
sort of more British sounding names and things, and you know,

(18:06):
sort of blended into society as it were.

Speaker 2 (18:10):
Do you know what they were escaping where they were
escaping from in Germany? Was it Germany or Poland? Where
were they actually escaping from?

Speaker 1 (18:19):
It was Germany. I don't know those sorts of details, but.

Speaker 2 (18:25):
They managed to get away before the war.

Speaker 1 (18:28):
Yeah, it was just sort of rumbling, so you know.
And it was my Granny Tilley, her parents and they, yeah,
they came over to England the dog. Yeah, so they
made it over and stuff. So we've got that sort
of Jewish part in us as well.

Speaker 2 (18:48):
Yeah, on your father's side that is.

Speaker 1 (18:52):
Yeah, on my father's side and my mom's side, my
grandpa Billy, he was a tool maker in the war
and him and his brother Johnny. They used to do
like balancing and balancing on each other and they used
to get a pounds of show at the circus.

Speaker 2 (19:13):
That's interesting, the brilliant they tell you your stories. Did
you have a bond with any of your grandparents? Often
we do, don't we. There's one or two that we
particularly bond with. Yeah, well my.

Speaker 1 (19:27):
Grandpa Billy grands Yeah, me and him were really close
because it was Molly, my granny, his wife. She had
manic depression and so when she died, I used to
go and visit him loads, and I'd just been diagnosed,
and so he would tell me stories that he hadn't

(19:49):
even told my mum about Grannie because he understood what
was going on with me. Well, I used to go
every Tuesday evening after work. He'd get the old slides out,
slides on and just go through it and have dinner together.
So we had a really close relationship. My granny Tilly
was completely eccentric and just incredible human being. I wish

(20:12):
I wish I had spent more time with her because
she was really eccentric. And you know, you'd say, oh, Grannie,
I love your jumper, and she'd go when I'm dead,
you couldn't have it. She was really cool, like, you know,
collect really amazing clothes and antique furniture. She used to
be a ballerina, but obviously she got anorexia from it,

(20:35):
which slightly ruined her life, which she told me about.

Speaker 2 (20:40):
Did they have any crafts than your grandparents that you're
aware of, Well, my.

Speaker 1 (20:46):
Grandpa was a toolmaker, so used to tell me about,
you know, how to warm up your tools in the winter.
He said, they used to put a heater under a
metal table, pull their spanners on, so in the wintertime
when they pick up their tools, be warm.

Speaker 2 (21:02):
Good advice. I hope you use that device now.

Speaker 1 (21:06):
Yeah, that sort of.

Speaker 2 (21:09):
It must have been difficult for you when you were
diagnosed because you knowing that there was a family history there,
and how did you feel that you coped with it?
Were your parents very supportive and guiding you.

Speaker 1 (21:24):
No, it was all a bit weird, to be honest,
because I was getting more and more peculiar, and I
figured that there was something wrong with my brain that
wasn't wasn't normal, because you know, I could hear voices
and things, you know, groups of people sort of over
in a corner. I could sort of hear exactly what

(21:45):
they were saying, and you know, and I webs of
things and I just, yeah, it was it was a
very strange time. So and I mean I was really
anorexic because I was really scared of people poisoning my
food and stuff. So you know, I was a bit
like mad anyway. And so yeah, so when they diagnosed me,

(22:07):
I think it was quite hard for my parents to
accept at first, just because I was quite naughty. I
really rebelled because I didn't know what was going on
in my head. So I was, yeah, I was a
bit wild, to be honest that I'm you know, big
on drinking and things.

Speaker 2 (22:26):
And what age were you when you were diagnosed bic.

Speaker 1 (22:30):
Ooh, I think I was around twenty five, twenty five,
twenty six sort of thing.

Speaker 2 (22:39):
And how did you distract yourself? What were ways that
you could calm your mind and distract yourself? Did you
enjoy sports or music?

Speaker 1 (22:49):
Drinking? Which is terrible, but so from a very early age,
I used to drink. But I've always been into running
and exercise, swimming and running. I just had to run
and exercise because I knew that it helped my head.
But then you know, obviously I did drinking. Well, I

(23:09):
got diagnosed last the beginning of last summer with ADHD,
so that solves that problem of what was going on there.
So yeah, but I've always been very into exercise and
swimming and running to quiet my brain.

Speaker 2 (23:26):
And do you still do those things?

Speaker 1 (23:29):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (23:30):
I have to, don't other on a daily basis, you
go off and give her a run, do you?

Speaker 1 (23:36):
Well, it depends now with the workshop because obviously I
have to conserve my energy. So on like Monday evening,
I swim and then I'll who I take the dog
on a hike Wednesday morning, and then Friday morning I
go running, and then obviously I ex over the weekend.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
And I'm sure that will helps your general fitness anyway.
Do you do any strength for the work that you do?

Speaker 1 (24:02):
No? Not really, It's just what I do in the
workshop again, because you kind of have to conserve your
energy because you do get really tired.

Speaker 2 (24:12):
And when you were in high school then what kind
of teenager were you? Apart from the drinking, I think
came a little bit later, but did you have many friends?
Were you able to perform your own community and your
own team around you and to get that sort of
support or you know, to help you through your family.

Speaker 1 (24:34):
Yeah. No, at school, we had you know, a good
little crew of mates. But again, I was really naughty,
and I did start drinking when I was at school,
So but I was sort of, you know, one of
the rebels, that the naughty one, smoking underneath the classrooms
and things. And because I really didn't understand school, so

(24:56):
I didn't know as to sex it. I just thought
everybody was talking in different language. The only place I
really loved was art. The moment I stepped into that
art room, I just it was just relief for me
because I just knew what I was doing and I
just really enjoyed it. And then the rest of the time,
because I didn't understand what was going on, then I

(25:18):
try and cheat so I wouldn't get bad mark, and
then I'd get caught, so you know, it just it
was just all very confusing at school.

Speaker 2 (25:27):
Very challenging, I would think, very challenging for you as
a teenager.

Speaker 1 (25:32):
Yeah. Yeah, but he's sort of I suppose, you know,
you sort of get through it. And then I, you know,
I was just really naughty. So I think I was
a real handful for my parents.

Speaker 2 (25:43):
You know, I'm wondering then that naughtiness how it played out,
you know, into you said you were very rebellious. So
give us an idea of what kind of tricks you
were up to in school and if you got caught
or you know, for those you didn't get caught caught for,
because I'm sure that people listening thinking, well, yeah I

(26:03):
did that, but I didn't get caught for it.

Speaker 1 (26:06):
Well, there's things I you know, when they're about to
ask someone a question, because I just didn't know what
everyone was talking about. So I do things like I'd
cough because the moment you start coughing, they're not going
to pick on you. The other one was if you
if you got a piece of paper and you made
it into a spike and you waggle it up in

(26:27):
your nose the bro If you do it for a bit,
your eyes water, but then you sneeze like loads and
loads and loads of times, and then they'd send you out.

Speaker 3 (26:38):
So then you stay out of the lips and stuff.
So yeah, not something like that, anything to just not
get asked, especially reading out loud.

Speaker 1 (26:50):
I mean that was just you know, horrenderous.

Speaker 2 (26:57):
Absolutely What did you enjoy your youth generally.

Speaker 1 (27:05):
I had lots of you know, I mean my friends
were I mean, it sounds really unfair to my mom
and dad souse. I absolutely love my mom and dad now,
but obviously we had lots of issues back then. But
I absolutely adored my friends going out with my friends.
Obviously the parties, you know, rave scene started, so we'd
go off to the raves and growing up in Walton

(27:26):
and Waybridge, you know you'd have Waybridge Cricket Green and
all of the kids, not just our young age school abe,
you know, we'd have sort of people up over late twenties,
so we had pockets of all these different crews of
people hanging out and you know, and we'd go and
like look for old house parties and things. So that

(27:49):
was just absolutely brilliant fun because you know, we didn't
have phones and you'd make one arrangement on your house
line and everyone sticked to it. So Raybridge Cricket Green,
you know, and then like you know, get in the pubs,
you do the old light of fag to try and
look a bit older to get in the pub. So
you know, that side of things was right off. It

(28:09):
was you know, it was brilliant, you know, good fun
for a global audience.

Speaker 2 (28:14):
Lighting a fag is lighting a cigarette.

Speaker 1 (28:16):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (28:18):
In terms of then your own ambitions, at what point
did you decide to explained a little bit about your
early interest in what you're doing now, But give us
a sense of what that milestone was like. What was
that point in your life, in your early life where
you thought, Okay, this is what I want to do.
I can I can rationalize geometry this, I can figure
out this works for my brain, and this is something

(28:41):
I can do and possibly be successful at What was
that turning point for you?

Speaker 1 (28:46):
So, I mean the geometryes come a lot later. I
mean the geometries, you know, sort of relatively new. It
was the blacksmith thing. I mean the blacksmith thing for
me has actually that was my saving grace, That was
my art therapy. I just consumed myself in work, so

(29:07):
I realized I wanted to do blacksmithing. I went to
Hereford College of Technology in nineteen I think I was
nineteen ninety six and I was only meant to be
there for a year and I was two years there
and I absolutely loved it. And I just be working
with the fire, just a whole craft of technical you

(29:30):
know when I yeah, anyway, so that was the first thing.
You know, I absolutely knew I had to do this,
so I immersed myself in my business. You know, all
my friends at sort of that sort of age were
going off traveling and things. But I just set my
business up and just worked and worked. I mean I
worked seven days a week solidly for about six years

(29:55):
when I first set the business up. Just consumed which
was absolute amazing. But obviously, you know, you have to
pay the bills, so I couldn't just make what I
wanted to make. You know, you have to do commission work.
So I'd do Chelsea Flower Show and Hampton Court Flower Show.
I'd create you know, gates and outdoor furniture and create

(30:18):
a stand. I'd get a huge overdraft from the bank,
which was really easy to do back then, and then
I'd build my stand. Then you do the show. You'd
make stuff you'd sell off off the show stand to
pay back for your stands, and then you'd get enough
commissions for the rest of the year. So I did
that for many, many years we did, and then obviously

(30:39):
Dave came into the company, so we started to do
more public art. But all of this is commission based,
so you know, it's under other people's briefs. It's not
necessarily what you want to do. And I remember when
I first lived in London, the standing and god it

(31:00):
was old gardens, gardens looking over you know, to the
O two and just saying I just all I want
to do is make art, you know, And it's taken
me up until like literally a couple of years ago,
you know, having found geometry. I got a scholarship from
quest to the Queen Elizabeth Scholarship Trust which enabled me

(31:23):
to study geometry at now the King's Foundation in London
to study geometry and understand more about it and then
you know, fully adopt the two. So my love of
blacksmith in the craft and doing my own work with
the geometry. So, I mean, it's been such a long time.
I mean, you know, I'm now going to be fifty

(31:46):
two this year. I set up my business in nineteen
ninety nine, waited twenty six years that this very excited
movement now where I've adopted this geometallism created aism.

Speaker 2 (32:06):
Talk a little bit more about that, because that's obviously
a critical part of your design and you're responsible for
all your designs. Now give the picture of what that
looks like.

Speaker 1 (32:16):
Well, so basically, you know, isms are I mean they've
been what's sort of recorded art throughout you know, since
the Renaissance period, you know. And I was looking at
blacksmithing and you know, our craft and thinking because isms, yeah,
record what's going on, you know, cultural, lease, society, you know,

(32:40):
around what is happening? And I just thought, with us,
with with our work, what what what is it that
we're doing. I mean I was doing a lot of
art nouveau, and I'm like, well, I'm just regurgitating art
nouveau and you know, and I love nature, but I'm
just doing sort of like realism. So then I was like, well,
what is actually going on around us? And you know,

(33:01):
we'd had things like Brexit, we'd had the virus, you know,
all these things separating us. There's wars, you know, and
geometry is very much about togetherness, working together, working, you know,
and this is what we should be doing, working with
our communities, looking after each other. You know, if you
draw geometry really badly, it doesn't link up, and so

(33:25):
it doesn't work. And that's like societies and communities. You know,
if we all linked together, looked after one another, looked
after the universe of the nature. You know, all these
things wouldn't be falling apart. And I really loved that aspect.
And then I also the craft. You know, with forging geometry,

(33:46):
if you're doing the process and then you have to
do it over and over and over again, you're you're
improving your craft meanship skills, which you know, with blacksmithing
is incredibly difficult. You know, it's not just things with
the hammers. So I really liked the bringing the two
aspects together. So it's geo, the geometry, and then metal,

(34:09):
so the forging and blacksmithing and also contemporary forms of metalworking,
so not necessarily just blacksmithing, because you know we're in
a twenty first century. So it was all those things
you know in maism. So I wrote and manifesto and stuff,
just hoping that other people would feel inspired as well. Right,

(34:30):
and then you know, my work when I'm long gone,
you know, it's a reflection of what was going on
at the moment. You know, you should be together.

Speaker 2 (34:40):
Yes, I mean our art often does, doesn't It depict
where we are as an artist and what's going on
in life. And it's interesting how your geometry now in
your mind, Bex, is a much more global premise, really is.
It is a much more global notion. It's a lot
more than your art. But it pulls together so many

(35:02):
things and cross pollinates to many aspects of life. From
what you're.

Speaker 1 (35:06):
Saying, yeah, definitely, yeah, without doubt.

Speaker 2 (35:11):
It makes perfect sense to you.

Speaker 1 (35:14):
Yeah. I mean, like everything in the world is and
you know us, like the stars, like everything is geometry.
It's I mean, it's just absolutely fascinating. My poor mama
because she says to me, now, I'll say a prayer
to God and then she looks at me and I'll
go universe and she goes, well, whatever it is. And

(35:36):
I'll go, well, mum, your God is my universe. It's
the same thing. But you know, mom, just makes a
lot more sense.

Speaker 2 (35:42):
You said you have really good relationships with your parents
now you're very fond of them, But when you were
a child, it was a lot more difficult. We were
very strict and it would have been difficult for you
given your own challenges. But what would you tell your
younger self now about how it might have been different
for you if you knew then, what you know now

(36:05):
about adult relationships.

Speaker 1 (36:08):
Oh gosh, I think that I've got two things I
would definitely tell my younger self, and that would be,
you know, the feeling that is inside of you that
you know you're going to have the opportunity to make
this incredible art and just be so oh god, so

(36:28):
excited and so involved. It will come and you know,
this is the moment now, and this is what has
driven me all these years to you know, when I've
been really depressed and you know, thinking, oh my god,
that just thinking it's going to happen. It's going to happen,
because it happens. It is happening now for me. Obviously,

(36:50):
I'm still building the work, but this is what I've
waited for my whole entire life. So I would say,
just hang in there, just take it on the chimne,
whatever bad happens, but just keep that focus because it
will happen. The other thing I would tell myself is
not everybody is going to like you, and that is okay.

(37:10):
You do not have to try and please anybody, and
the people that don't like you, the chances are you
don't like them anyway, so just ignore it and just
get on with your life.

Speaker 2 (37:22):
And you have two daughters, Molly and Leonie. How do
you parent them given your experiences? Are you strict?

Speaker 1 (37:31):
No, We're very very open with them and very My
mum says that we're quite free range parents. We you know,
we chat with them. We're very open about things like
mental health. But obviously they have me for a mom,
so no, we're Yeah, we're very chilled with them. We're

(37:53):
not very strict, but we do expect them to give
us respect for that. If they don't respect us for that,
then things will change. Which we've treatened when they've got
a bit like you know, and it's like, hey, guys,
if we're going to treat you, you know, like this,

(38:14):
then you have to act responsible basically. So I think
we've got a very good open relationship. They're very very
cool girls. I'm very very proud of them.

Speaker 2 (38:25):
Are they artistic at all?

Speaker 4 (38:28):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (38:28):
Yeah, they're both botht of them not very academic, but
they are very artistic and just really lovely people to
have around, funny, entertaining, you know.

Speaker 2 (38:41):
Yeah, and what ages are they now?

Speaker 1 (38:43):
So Molly's fourteen going on eighteen and Leone's eleven.

Speaker 2 (38:49):
In terms of your work, then and obviously understand what
you do, you and your husband Dave. But do they
take an interest? Do they come out and watch you?

Speaker 1 (38:58):
Yeah, I mean it's fun. They've both been, you know,
down to forge and stuff. Molly's not so much now
because you know, she's really into sort of beauty and
you know, what we do is really dirty, so it's
not really good on the nails and hair. But Leoni does.
She'll come down and forge and you know, and I'll

(39:20):
say to her, do you want to do smith and striker?
So that's where she will have the metal and hit
it with a hammer, but I'll have a sledge hammer
to sort of speed the process up. And she'll say, no, Mum,
I want to do it without you. I just want
to forge on my own, which is really lovely. You know.
You feel really late, and I think later on they'll

(39:41):
come back round to it, just because it's here. And
like you know, when we do have a group of
friends up and we get the fires going, they do
always end up coming and making something. Well.

Speaker 2 (39:51):
Your repertoire is extensive now in terms of the artwork
to either form or function. It really is a very
very palette so to speak. That do you have now,
how much of that would be of your current work
bex would be commissioned because, as you said, you had
to do the commissions for the bread and Butter when
you started the business. But how different is that now?

Speaker 1 (40:13):
Oh my goodness, Well, all the work up until just
this's geometric stuff. There's all commission based work on the
whole lot. The only the only pieces probably on my website.
I mean, I've taken a lot of stuff off. Now
is the bench I did, the forged bench that looks
like a tofted bench. That was just I had to

(40:34):
make something other than commissions, and I think it was
there was an exhibition going on and then there was
the uh what's it called? It's the one with the
poles and stuff. Well, basically there's two pieces in my goodness,
and there's two pieces I'm in a in my sort

(40:55):
of portfolio that were sort of my own work, and
then it's just the geometric stuff. So literally, Iemony just
starting to do what I want to do.

Speaker 2 (41:06):
I was wondering that, you know, how much And that's
often the challenge for any artists, isn't it how much
time you have to just create what you want to create?

Speaker 1 (41:15):
Yeah? Well, now it's very exciting. It's because you know,
every day I can go into the workshop. Well that's
unless I'm teaching, but you know, at the moment we're
working with North Devon Rural Crafts and Heritage Crafts. Sorry,
so we're doing two days a week forging. You know,

(41:37):
we've got full full house, which is great because obviously
you know, we're teaching the craft and we're playing the bills.
So then all the rest of the time I can
go in the workshop, which is just so exciting.

Speaker 2 (41:49):
Which part of the whole process do you find the
most satisfying? Is it at the design stage and then
the materials obviously pulling those all together and start and
then starting the project, and then the outcome when people
get to look at it for the first time and
you have that validation.

Speaker 1 (42:09):
Yeah, I think. I mean, I absolutely love design. I
love the research. I love you know, going out getting
inspired all of that stuff. I you know, I just
I just crave that. When I'm out running, you know,
and I go down to the sea, you know, I'll
just watch the sin I'll sort of break it down

(42:31):
into patterns, and I think I think that's what I do.
You know, I sort of look at things differently, So
I love all that bit again. I love starting the things.
It's really exciting. I think there's there's that little bit
in the middle, the way you have a bit of
mid j'or blues, just because it's like I'm so impatient,

(42:54):
and you know, it's like that bit in the middle
sort of you know, it's like, oh wait, goodness me.
But then when you come out the other you know,
and it's just about to come together and they sheer excitement.
But yeah, to be fair, the whole thing is just wonderful.
Love it.

Speaker 2 (43:12):
And when you have that design, unlike you know, an artist,
a painter, shall we say, that goes into the studio
and has an idea but has to get into a
certain mindset before they start work on the canvas. Do
you have to have a moment of sort of transition
or is it such a physical job you just get
straight onto the practicalities of it.

Speaker 1 (43:35):
Yeah. I think because my brain's so sort of hectic,
I have to sort of just try and be very
rigid with myself or else I can sort of lose,
you know, what I'm doing and stuff. So I have
to sort of just think, no, just get in and Yeah,
I try to cite myself up as well, you know,

(43:57):
and think, oh, you're going to make this it's really
exciting today, you know, and have a little bit of
a plan and stuff because I can I can be
very disorganized, so you know, I do need to work
out what I'm doing the day before, so I can
you know, get get a good day's working. Really, I'll

(44:17):
always sort of lose a few hours by accident.

Speaker 2 (44:21):
But you try and be disciplined.

Speaker 1 (44:24):
Yeah, I mean, obviously I'm waiting for the ADHD meds.
It's we've only got to think about another three months
to go. It was nine months since they diagnosed me.
To help with the concentration. But I'm working, trying to
work really hard on it myself. But yeah, so I'm
work currently working on three sculptures at the same time,

(44:46):
so I can do a bit on that one and
then think, right, I'm starting to stray my thoughts, so
do a bit on this one. That's how I'm sort
of trying to manage it.

Speaker 2 (44:56):
So that's helpful, is it then, so that you can
just switch around just to keep your mind in the
same in the right place.

Speaker 1 (45:03):
Yeah, definitely. I think if I tried to just work
on one of the Yeah, sculpture continuously in one day,
it wouldn't really happen. It was just my brain would
just wonder. So I get so if it starts to wonder,
then I think, right, let's do something on that. So
then I'm equently as enthusiastic and just try and keep

(45:23):
that sort of level going.

Speaker 2 (45:26):
What's your parents' reaction to your success as an artist?

Speaker 4 (45:30):
Oh my god, they're so proud of me, Like they
really are, you know from what I was as a kid,
and you know, they're really proud because you know, they're
sort of jaw dropped when I said, you know, I
want to pay a blacksmith, We'll not you know, well
an artist blacksmith.

Speaker 1 (45:48):
They're just like you what, So, No, they are. They're
incredibly proud of me, which yeah, it makes me really happy.

Speaker 2 (45:56):
And when you finish a piece, at what point then
does it leave the forge once you've finished it? Do
you have to get it out of the way so
that you can move on mentally to another piece? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (46:11):
I mean, you know, with what I'm making now, because
if I leave stuff in the workshop, I mean it's
a big workshop and I'd love to be able to
but things rusting there. So we've got a bit of
a bit of a blocked up living room at the moment.
You have to mind yourself when you going there. So

(46:33):
but yeah, sort of move it out the way, clean
it up, get nice photo because at the moment, what
my dream is is to have a body of work
and put you know, put it on a big gallery
exhibition of my pieces. My pieces aren't just going to
be static metal work. I'm involving sound. So I build

(46:58):
sculpture by by this rock black Church rock here. It's
absolutely stunning place. And I've met a mind called Alex
who he records data from like seaweed and then creates music.
So he went down there and found seaweed there and
took frequencies from below the rocks down there, and he's

(47:19):
created all this sound like music. It's absolutely stunning. So
that's going to go with the sculpture that rotates, and
it's going to have lights, and I've got well, there's
other things that I'm bringing in, So it's not just
going to be a static exhibition where you walk in
and there's just pieces of metalwork. There's going to be

(47:40):
different things going on to bring it alive. A bit more.

Speaker 2 (47:44):
I was going to ask you that if you are
combining other mediums too, I mean, it would be hard
for you to have time. I would imagined to do
other things like painting or things that are artistic but
for your own pleasure. But do you like the idea
of combining other mediums with your work in the future.

Speaker 1 (48:04):
Well, I mean I used to love what it used
to be called textiles before it was known as sort
of doing fabrics, and I used to mix loads of mediums.
I mean I am going to be using like water, lighting, sound,
you know, so things like that. I am definitely I've
got just little bits of copper and stuff. But again,

(48:27):
this is such early doors for me. I mean, who
knows at this stage. I mean I've got a lathe,
you know, I've been dying to get my hands on
working and make stuff. So yeah, all sorts of things,
hopefully in the future. I'm just right at the beginning
of this, which, yeah, it's all very exciting. I just
wish I could clone myself and have like five mes.

Speaker 2 (48:52):
What about wood, then you mentioned the ladies. Would you
do you like working in wood?

Speaker 1 (48:57):
Well, I mean the late we did mess all work
on it, so yeah, sort of sculpting bars and things
like that. So yeah, just different components, components and things
like that.

Speaker 2 (49:10):
What's on your bucket list of what.

Speaker 1 (49:13):
Making or visiting places or.

Speaker 2 (49:18):
All of the above life work, family, personal goals?

Speaker 1 (49:22):
Oh my goodness, well bucket list. The one that you
just instantly popped at my head then is go to
Iceland and not the shop because the rock formations there,
the atmosphere of the place, you know, just I mean
that would just be amazing experience, you know that. My well,

(49:45):
my goal through my whole life is to build an
incredible body of work and have it all in an
amazing exhibition space and literally pour my heart and soul
or my feelings just everything that I've bottled up for
all these years and just making incredible art, you know.

(50:08):
But with forge steel metal work, I mean, you know
that geometry sort of bringing people together, that's the sort
of main goal of everything.

Speaker 2 (50:21):
And what are you most proud of now? When you
look at the body of work that you have, which
is extensive, becks, what would you say that you're most
proud of?

Speaker 1 (50:30):
I think it's the work that I'm doing now, the
geometalism work. I mean, every piece that I've made in
my whole career, every piece that I got commissioned and
I designed and I built and I made, I loved
it so much and I wouldn't ever let it leave
the workshop unless I was one hundred happy. So if

(50:53):
I lost money on it, because it had to be good,
I would do, you know, I would just literally it
has to be the best of my ability. So and
so every single piece I look at fondly and you know,
really happy. There's ones that where I can remember exactly
what was happening in my life and stuff. But I
think the most proudest now is what I'm making now

(51:16):
because I've waited so long and I've I've got this
sort of formula now that i want to work to
and I mean, gosh, the ideas I'm literally I go out,
I walk with the dog, and I come back and
I've got another piece I want to make. So yeah,
I just I need to go five years to just
literally bed down in the workshop create.

Speaker 2 (51:41):
I'm wondering what your teachers might say about you now,
because obviously which school was so challenging back then, but
you found your niche, you found your pathway, and they
may have been frustrated with you back then. But I'm
wondering if they know what you're doing now and how
successful you are.

Speaker 1 (51:59):
Yeah, I mean, i'd be interesting to know. I remember
Susie Fortune when I was doing my degree, because I
tried to actually leave, you know, halfway through my degree,
and she actually sat down and sat me down and said, look,
I really think there's something you know in you There's

(52:20):
something there, and she persuaded me to stay. And I
did actually have some contact with her. Well this is
now many years ago, and I did actually thank her
and stuff, and you know, it was a really sweet
moment actually. But yeah, well, i'd love to think that
they are proud of me now.

Speaker 2 (52:43):
Well, you mentioned the challenges that you've been through obviously
mentally in your life. But I'm wondering, now, with the
commissions that you have, the pressure that you have to
produce the work continually, how you cope with that pressure
and also do you feel that you're confident person now
that you've proved yourself and your self worth that you

(53:05):
know you can balance all of these things in your mind?

Speaker 1 (53:08):
Yeah, I mean it's funny. I mean, I'm going to
be fifty two this year and I think for the
first time, I feel like, you know, really sort of
satisfied place. I've got an amazing husband, I've got two
brilliant kids, I've got a lovely family. Where we live

(53:29):
is amazing, and now, you know, I'm going to create
some amazing art that I've always wanted to and so
I feel so happy. I'm really blessed, you know, really
fortunate to be you know, in this, And yeah, I
suppose I do. Actually, for the first time, I have
a bit of confidence about myself, you know. I yeah,

(53:53):
I mean, I'm turning everything down at the moment. So
it was just when you know, I saw you're promoting
women and stuff, so I thought, no, I do want
to do this. But yeah, before I always felt like
I had to do everything, you know, because you've got
to get the name out. But now I'm like, I
don't want to do anything else anymore. I just want

(54:15):
to create my art. So you know, I don't need
to go out and do any public speaking or hold
a masterclass because that's not what I want to do.
I just want to make my own art. So yeah,
I for the first time, I do feel amazingly content.
We're working incredibly hard, though because you know, we're teaching
and then I'm doing this and we're running the family.

(54:37):
But I just love it all. So I just feel
really fortunate and grateful.

Speaker 2 (54:45):
Yes, it sounds like you're in a wonderful place right now,
and of course that helps you creatively too, if you're
in a very good place personally.

Speaker 1 (54:53):
Oh my goodness, you know what you said at the
beginning of just that question. The thing about when I
did actually step into the workshop for the first time
without commission and with this new I'm going to be
an art smith, I actually spun out and I felt

(55:14):
really lost and really like I had vertigo because I thought,
my god, this is a huge responsibility because I'm not
bringing in commission, so I'm not putting money on the table.
I'm playing for this workshop. I have to come in
here and make art every day. Now, Yeah, you feel
really panicked. Well, I don't know if anyone else did.

(55:35):
So I contacted a few friends who are artists and
they gave me some great advice, you know, and stuff,
and that's really helped me settle into this role. But
I think because I've been so desperate to get to
this place in my life, now it's just it's endless
the amount of things I'm swibbling down. I I don't

(55:58):
think I'm going to get artists look at all.

Speaker 2 (56:01):
It doesn't sound like it. No, And I can imagine
there's been some really cool moments in your life personally
and also professionally. Can you reflect on maybe a couple
of those that were milestones in your life, that were
turning points and that you're always treasure Oh my goodness.

Speaker 1 (56:20):
I think that there was a big pair of double
leaf gates I made for my mum and dad as
a thank you because they let me move back to
theirs for I can't remember how many years at the
beginning of my business, and that was I mean, you know,
on my own making those gates was you know, it
was quite a feat and I felt really pleased. They

(56:42):
were very beautiful at the time, you know. And then
another time was the Covent Garden gates and you know,
working with Chris Brammle that was another opportunity. I think
the people that we work with along the way, that's
something that I will always be very grateful to, you know,

(57:02):
to any collaboration that we did. Richard Hillan has always
been a fantastic person to work with and he's done
quite a few designs. Well I've given him over like
a scratchy, sketchy design and he's like turned it into
amazing pieces. And also the Ministry of Justice a job there,
like Terry Clark, you know, he's been an amazing help,

(57:26):
Like we've rented space off him, but we did that.
That job was like collaboration with him and we had
a team of blacksmiths and you know that that was
an incredible piece of artwork. It took a year to
build with a team of brilliant blacksmiths and everyone put
their heart and soul into that, so that you know,
that was another thing. And they're not obviously getting the

(57:49):
being awarded Tommy Pandy, which is the Worshipful Company of
blacksmith which is a high achieving award that you get,
and obviously it was for the whole team, not just myself.
So yeah, there are there's some brilliant you know, things
that have happened along the way that you know, you
do think, gosh, really that's.

Speaker 2 (58:10):
Happened something for the memoir. Yeah, completely, Well, it seems
there's a lot more work to come and a lot
more to look forward to. Bes. Thank you very much
for being my guest this week.

Speaker 1 (58:25):
Oh well, thank you very much for having me.

Speaker 2 (58:28):
It's been brilliant and you'll find more information as well
as links to Bex's website and at social media, and
also a link to our YouTube video with bonus content.
In fact, you'll find every season of the Art Podcast
that's over a one hundred episodes so far on the
Art Podcast YouTube channel, as well as these videos of

(58:51):
bonus content where you will get to see our guests
in conversation with me at which we record right after
we've recorded the podcast episode. And whilst you're on YouTube,
be sure to hit that subscribe button so you don't
miss an episode, and also follow us on social media.
We're on Instagram at the Art Podcast, and of course

(59:12):
you can reach us here directly at the Art Podcast
at gmail dot com. If you have any suggestions for guests,
we always love to hear from you, and we already
have some great guests lined up for you, including the
award winning National geographic photographer Esther Horforth, the British painter
Francis Featherstone, the American food stylist Criscilla Browning, and the

(59:34):
British textile artist and free motion embroiderer Alison Holt. So
lot's to look forward to here on the podcast. I
hope you'll share this with anyone that you think might
enjoy the show as well, and again, don't forget to
subscribe on our YouTube channel at the Art Podcast, and
also click the follow button on your podcast app. My

(59:55):
thanks again to my guests this week, Beck Simon, and
to you for listening back in two weeks time, so
I do hope you'll join me then

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