Ochelli Effect 11-7-2025 Lancer Special with Bob and Janet Groden - Ken Zendiker - Alex Harris - Joe Scooter Borelli - The Ochelli Effect

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
So about an hour and twenty deep into this little
special JFK presentation for Lancer, which I'm going ahead of live.
You're not going to care because most of you're going
to catch the podcast anyway. But I'm doing this early
live on a Friday, Okay, And that's the way it is.
I've got Joe BURRELLI with me and uh he you
heard him a little bit with Larry, but he's one

(00:34):
of the guys with the lone gunman over there.

Speaker 2 (00:37):
Okay, the lone gunman over there. I don't know, you know.

Speaker 3 (00:40):
Over there, we gotta paison on someone else.

Speaker 1 (00:45):
They go both of our names end with an eye
and it's okay, don't worry, don't get nervous.

Speaker 2 (00:50):
As a matter of.

Speaker 1 (00:50):
Fact, they're going to have a guest in a little
while that some of my older listeners would definitely be
familiar with, because Carlin and Sabistano will be over there.

Speaker 2 (00:59):
And are you d do that? Library? Did you just
record it? What's up with the TLG?

Speaker 3 (01:03):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (01:03):
So, man, we have been doing it live every Friday
night at seven pm Eastern since November twenty second, twenty twenty.

Speaker 3 (01:17):
Three, the weekend I met you and Larry at lancer.
Oh and man, it's a lot of work. It makes
me appreciate what you do, sir.

Speaker 1 (01:30):
Hey, Look, I do a bunch of these a week,
which is funny because I cut down on them a
little bit and people are like, what, you don't hardly
do anything anymore. I'm like, I do like four shows
a week still, you know. I at one point I
was doing seven, and it's on a bunch of things.

Speaker 5 (01:46):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
Look, I don't just do the Kennedy assassination, although I've
done what about five hundred of those, but I mean
the other couple thousand podcasts might have had to do it.
I don't know the news, other books I'm reading, other
areas of interest.

Speaker 2 (02:00):
You know, stuff like that.

Speaker 1 (02:01):
But the thing is, I've been doing this now for
I started in twenty thirteen, so you know, that's what
I've been doing with my time. And you know, a
lot of people don't realize it takes a little bit
of it takes a little bit of effort.

Speaker 3 (02:15):
To do that anyways does.

Speaker 1 (02:18):
But but you guys do that on YouTube, right, I
mean you're you're on YouTube.

Speaker 4 (02:21):
So yeah, we we're on YouTube live video every week
at seven, So like, I mean, listen.

Speaker 3 (02:29):
We're kind of.

Speaker 4 (02:30):
Like a in the weeds type of podcast, right the
Lone Gunman. It sounds like it's a lone number podcast.
Obviously a conspiracy based podcast, but you know, we're I'm
sharing documents, we're reading through them. It's probably not for
the person that's just getting into the jfkase. That's an issue,
you know, because we assume and a lot of knowledge,

(02:54):
if that makes sense. But you know, our audiences has
more than doubled in the past year. I think there's
an interesting conspiracy dynamic with a lot of things these days,
you know, Charlie Kirk, Trump assassination. I'm not trying to

(03:15):
get political, but it's just like there's so much craziness
out there. And the reason I'm mentioning this is I'm
segueing into my Lancer presentation this year, which is going
to be we don't have a direct official title yet.
I'm letting the lawyers, okay, Matt Crumpton do that, Okay,

(03:40):
but it's going to be something like JFK podcasting today
on YouTube and you know, other formats or something like that,
and it's going to be me from Long Dome and podcast. Obviously,
Matt Crumpton, who I'm happy to call a friend after
meeting him at Lancer last year. Again, Lancer ereat place

(04:00):
to go and by the way, Chuck. When I came
to Lancer in twenty three, do you know how many
people I knew in the community community.

Speaker 2 (04:09):
I couldn't guess three, I mean.

Speaker 4 (04:14):
Talk to maybe. I never met one. I went by myself.
I flew down there.

Speaker 3 (04:20):
I was very nervous, and I.

Speaker 4 (04:24):
Made a bunch of friends. I went last year. I
made even more friends like Crumpton and him and Jeff
Crudell of JFK The Enduring Secret asked me to join them,
and I wasn't originally planning on going this year, but
I was like, you know what, I want to see
my friends.

Speaker 3 (04:43):
I want to hang out.

Speaker 4 (04:45):
I want to talk JFK because that's essentially what we
do every Friday night on the Lone Gun. And we
just talked documents. We got in trouble a couple of
weeks ago, that funny story. We reviewed Ed Hoffman's story.

Speaker 1 (05:01):
Right okay, and the Ed Hoffman story Just for my listeners, Joe,
just a second, Just.

Speaker 2 (05:08):
For my listeners.

Speaker 1 (05:09):
Ed Hoffman is the guy who most famously was the
deaf mute that most people were exposed to for the
first time on the men who killed Kennedy, And there
was a book that was created to tell his story
what he claims to have witnessed on the day of
the assassination, which involves a railroad man and a guy
throwing a gun to another guy, and a whole bunch

(05:29):
of other stuff that they definitely tied into the massive
conspiracy salad that was on the men who killed Kennedy.
And he used to give live presentations even at different places,
often with the assistance of his daughter, who had helped
to interpret things because death and mute, he could not speak,
and also was working with sign language.

Speaker 2 (05:51):
So that's the way that was.

Speaker 1 (05:53):
And his claim essentially is that he witnessed something the
authorities didn't want to hear it, and he had seen
things that others had on the day of the assassination.
That's my best summation off the top of my head,
Brad Hoffman, But please continue.

Speaker 4 (06:08):
That sums it up. That's a good one. So Mike
rob and I do every week. He goes you cover
this stuff, I'll cover this like we don't come up
with a preconclusion.

Speaker 3 (06:19):
Right we had no idea where we were going to
go with this, and.

Speaker 4 (06:25):
Throughout the story we found you know, he didn't come
out till nineteen, I think sixty six to the FBI.
His own family didn't believe him. Where he said he was.
His Van's point would be not the best.

Speaker 3 (06:42):
And and like we gave some you know, criticism.

Speaker 4 (06:46):
Just subjectively, and we got a lot of hate from it.

Speaker 3 (06:51):
And it's not saying I don't believe that Hoffman.

Speaker 4 (06:54):
In fact, the men that killed Kennedy got me into this.
I was six when the JFK movie came out, right,
I didn't see it.

Speaker 3 (07:02):
I think meat. I didn't see it at six. That
didn't get me into it. And like we didn't know
where we were going to land, and we kind of
landed in like I'm not quite sure. Story changed over time.

Speaker 4 (07:16):
And then they say we're making front of a handicap
and this and that. So essentially JFK podcasting today is
very difficult. Yes, I'm sure you know, yes it is,
and you're battling all the bullshit. So if we were
to do a show on James Files, for example, using

(07:38):
him as an example, or the Tramps, right, we would
get ten times more views than if we did a
show on jam Wave.

Speaker 1 (07:48):
Yeah, it is sad, to be honest with you.

Speaker 2 (07:51):
You can do the shows.

Speaker 1 (07:53):
You could do a show on something that you don't
think is very important and as a matter of fact,
is weird because the JFK Myths episodes I did where
basically I'm mocking a whole bunch of things on there
with Carmine essentially for most of it, you know, and
we're going through and saying, look, there's a bunch of

(08:14):
stuff out there that is friendly to someone who is
a conspiracy advocate. But here's all the holes in the
story and why we believe it's part of the mythology
as opposed to the facts. People really hated us at first,
and then it became a thing where people wanted more
of them, and of course, most famously I go after

(08:35):
Judith Barry Baker constantly.

Speaker 2 (08:37):
But you know, it is what it is.

Speaker 1 (08:39):
I listen, anytime you guys want to do one of
these shows where you think you're going to draw hate,
by all means, I'm available. I can make myself more
available on a Thursday.

Speaker 3 (08:50):
But yeah, sure, i'd love to.

Speaker 1 (08:51):
Well, you've already got Carmine, You've already got Carmine.

Speaker 6 (08:54):
You don't need me.

Speaker 1 (08:54):
But I'm saying, if you ever want an extra voice
for you, decide to do the James Files thing, but
blow them apart.

Speaker 2 (09:00):
Let's do it if you want to. You know, I like.

Speaker 4 (09:09):
It, And yeah, we we do have a MythBusters type
episode plan tonight.

Speaker 3 (09:16):
Unfortunate on someone else that is speaking.

Speaker 4 (09:20):
I'm not going to mention you can film the blanks
and figure it out if you watch. But you know, uh,
the algo, the algorithm pushes the bullshit. And there are
a couple people that I think are fighting the good
fight and what Jeff Crudell, Matt Crumpton and I and

(09:43):
Rob do are very different.

Speaker 3 (09:45):
Rob and I go on live almost no plan and
you know the basics of one.

Speaker 4 (09:50):
You know, I have a little power point and we
bs about JFK for two hours.

Speaker 3 (09:57):
Right. That's that's the structure of our show. Matt Crumpton
as a very structured show. Jeff Crudell great storyteller, different
type of show.

Speaker 4 (10:07):
So I think this panel at Lancer is going to
be very interesting as we discussed the different challenges we are.

Speaker 3 (10:15):
Having trying to push back. You know, I guess what's
the term like shovel shit against the tide.

Speaker 1 (10:22):
Well, look, it's a difficult thing being.

Speaker 2 (10:25):
The veteran of this.

Speaker 1 (10:26):
Just remember I went live with it for the first
time in twenty fourteen, right, and.

Speaker 2 (10:34):
My first show was.

Speaker 1 (10:35):
Bringing on Joan Mellon to talk about how the mac
Wallace thing is invalid. Okay, that was my first show,
and it's really really tough. And back then, to be
honest with you, anytime you search jfk assassination on YouTube
or whatever in your top ten videos that they recommended.

(10:57):
When you put that in, you were guarantee need to
have at least two of the limo drivers shot him.
And it was it was driving me crazy, and I
wound up talking to Carmine about it and creating the
myths subset because of it. Anyway, it's gonna be an interesting.

Speaker 4 (11:14):
Pickause because of the Limo things specifically, Well.

Speaker 2 (11:18):
That's what was driving me nuts.

Speaker 1 (11:19):
And then I started talking to Carmine and I said,
the worst thing in the world, though, is actually Judith Baker,
and he agreed, and we started talking about it. Because
there were Facebook groups back then that were like hucksters,
scammers and con artists or whatever.

Speaker 2 (11:36):
In the JFK community.

Speaker 3 (11:37):
That's how you met. That's how you met.

Speaker 2 (11:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (11:40):
Yeah, And I said, oh, you wrote a book, let
me check it out. Because I was bringing on authors
to talk about their new books.

Speaker 2 (11:46):
That was my whole plan.

Speaker 1 (11:49):
And that's what I did mostly when I brought people on,
and I was doing guest oriented stuff mostly. But then
Carmine's like, well, I could do this with you regularly
and we could just you know, and so we just
kind of threw together an idea and he would write
a structure and I would have none, and I wouldn't
even see it until like right before air. So I

(12:09):
would look at his little outline and just dance around
on it and we would go through it and the
next thing, you know, is two hours are gone and
we would cover the whole thing.

Speaker 2 (12:18):
Yeah, that was it.

Speaker 4 (12:20):
So I made I made the mistake of asking Carmine
for some documents for my PowerPoint, my legendary.

Speaker 3 (12:28):
PowerPoint that I do all.

Speaker 7 (12:31):
Every week.

Speaker 4 (12:32):
And I'm legendary, I'm in air quotes here.

Speaker 3 (12:37):
And I think I regretted that because he sent me
like a million things.

Speaker 1 (12:41):
Yeah, you gotta you gotta get you got it. But
he got to give Carmine a limit. You gotta give
Carmine a limit like ten fifteen something.

Speaker 8 (12:49):
But he is what he is just one of the
great researchers, like one of the you know, you can't
quote to Larry Hancock, for example, with a story or
hearsay this and that.

Speaker 3 (13:01):
You got to have the documents all right on so level,
like you just got to like he.

Speaker 4 (13:06):
Might say, oh, that's interesting because he's very nice and polite,
but he's not going to take it seriously.

Speaker 3 (13:14):
As well Carminal as well any serious researcher.

Speaker 4 (13:18):
So tonight we are going to be debunking the myth
that Frank Sturgis killed not only Sam g and Conna,
but Johnny Rosellie as well.

Speaker 1 (13:33):
Oh wow, well, good, good luck, good luck with that,
because we.

Speaker 3 (13:39):
Don't need luck. We got all, he got everything we need.

Speaker 2 (13:42):
Good good But.

Speaker 4 (13:45):
You know what, it's just that's and and you know what,
and here due to the very bigger point, yes, yeah,
you had her on this guy, Danny Jones's podcast.

Speaker 3 (13:54):
Do you know this guy?

Speaker 2 (13:55):
I've heard of him.

Speaker 1 (13:56):
I've seen him with John uh with with Unfortunate, I
saw him with the Doctor.

Speaker 4 (14:02):
Nileys have millions of listeners, millions.

Speaker 3 (14:07):
This must have hundreds of thousands. I'm trying to find the.

Speaker 4 (14:11):
Video the people people, but hundreds of thousands off not millions.

Speaker 1 (14:18):
Joe, John Hughes, Joe people, people who know very little
seem to attract very many listeners, I got to tell you.
And that's the sad reality in current podcasting. Because I
love the work that Crumpton does. I even the second
I discovered at around episode three or whatever, I said,
this is great. I'm glad he's doing solving JFK. This
is a wonderful format. I was happy with it. I've

(14:40):
always endorsed the Lone Gunman. Uh you know, I'll tell
you that leno'sank, even though he's kind of jerky. Sometimes
the guy has a hell of a repository, a hell
of an archive of an incredible amount of people that
he just lets speak, you know, on his podcast. We
have had the fortune of a variety of podcasters who

(15:02):
have presented us with a lot of stuff over the
years on the JFK stuff. But I'm looking forward to
this because I know for a fact that Sturgis had
nothing to do with those murders.

Speaker 4 (15:12):
But anyway, yeah, wow, But that's the thing.

Speaker 8 (15:17):
It's like, at what point is it about clicks.

Speaker 3 (15:21):
It's just a lot of people are muddying the waters.
I'm not naming any names.

Speaker 2 (15:26):
It's just yeah, I know.

Speaker 4 (15:28):
I did a search on JFK podcasts. I found forty
podcasts I had never heard about.

Speaker 2 (15:33):
Yeah, there's a bunch of them.

Speaker 1 (15:35):
There's a bunch of them out there, and there's a
couple of AI ones and I'm telling you, there's a
lot of crap.

Speaker 2 (15:39):
So yeah, I'm happy.

Speaker 3 (15:41):
And there's a lot of ones. To bring it back
to unidentified and Larry Hancock.

Speaker 4 (15:47):
There's a bunch of them that say JFK and UFOs.
I found like five of those, So like, at what
point is it like these made to discredit? And I
don't know, but I bet that's why.

Speaker 3 (16:03):
They're there at me.

Speaker 1 (16:04):
Come on, of course, Look, when somebody pops up with
a well funded, well placed podcast that has high production
values and all this other stuff, it is either the
very very hard work of somebody who is doing this
out of a labor of love, or somebody's funding it
and they're funding it because of their own self interests.

Speaker 2 (16:24):
And we'll leave it at that. Where can people find this?

Speaker 1 (16:26):
If they go and search on YouTube, they'll be able
to find you guys tonight live in just a little
while the Lone Gunman podcast.

Speaker 2 (16:34):
But also what do we got tled? What is the website?

Speaker 1 (16:37):
And everything else? Tell everybody so we don't forget. And also,
if you get time, email me the links so I
can put them in my show notes and point people
to you guys, and again the better podcasters out there.
I'm looking forward to this panel discussion. I'm definitely going to.
I don't know if I'll be able to watch it
in person, but if not, I'll definitely catch it later.

(16:57):
And you know everybody who's listening. Assassinated Conference dot com
is the website to go to for Lancer catch this
and much much other material that will be going on there.
I think you guys will be doing the panel in
the breakout room. I'm not sure though the scheduling right
this second, but I think it'll be in the breakout
room and I look forward.

Speaker 7 (17:18):
To that it might be.

Speaker 4 (17:19):
I leave these big decisions up to you, sir. I
know you're you do a ton of work. I've seen
you run around and work on issues or this or
that or whatever comes up.

Speaker 3 (17:33):
You definitely do a lot for.

Speaker 4 (17:34):
The conference, and uh, you know, I'm very happy to
call you a friend.

Speaker 3 (17:40):
I've been on here before.

Speaker 4 (17:41):
I'm named Joe Scooter BURRELLI because I fell from a
scooter Lancer twenty three.

Speaker 2 (17:48):
I've told everyone.

Speaker 3 (17:50):
Joey Scars is another nickname. We even have merch about it.

Speaker 2 (17:55):
Not that wait a.

Speaker 1 (17:56):
Minute you wrote, wait a minute, do you have a
Joey's school Brelli shirt?

Speaker 2 (18:01):
Like, is there a Scooter Morelli shirt?

Speaker 3 (18:02):
I'm wearing one right now. That's a Lancer.

Speaker 2 (18:07):
I gotta get one of these things.

Speaker 3 (18:09):
I'm gonna put my camera on right now so you
can see it.

Speaker 1 (18:12):
Because Okay, guys, I gotta get a Scooter Berelli shirt
because I was involved in how he got that name,
so I I really have to get that shirt. And
we're not going to tell the story now because I
know Joe's got to get going.

Speaker 2 (18:28):
But yeah, but okay, I see you.

Speaker 4 (18:31):
You were the one that pointed out, oh, bro, you're bleeding.

Speaker 2 (18:36):
You might want to take.

Speaker 4 (18:36):
Care of my nice collared shirt.

Speaker 1 (18:41):
Yeah, he's all dressed up and I notice it. The
blind guy sees you bleeding. You know you got a problem, right,
And I'm like, listen, this thing is you might want
to take care of that blood before you go up
on the stage there, Joe.

Speaker 2 (18:53):
I mean just saying, you know, I mean you want
to bleed up there, It's up to you. But sorry, Yeah,
I still funny. I know it hurt.

Speaker 4 (19:02):
But the front desk, the front desk was very gracious
and they gave me a lot of bandages.

Speaker 3 (19:07):
I just like the scar has pretty much gone away,
just all concerns.

Speaker 2 (19:12):
I'm glad.

Speaker 3 (19:15):
I really appreciate what you do.

Speaker 4 (19:17):
We also there's a few people trying to fight to
good fight, and I think that's what our panel will
mostly be about. We might get into like a couple
other topics, maybe current events in the community, which is
a whole other yikes, you know, going for hours about Yeah, yikes.

Speaker 3 (19:38):
But but it will be fun to see you and
Alex and Kenneth and.

Speaker 4 (19:47):
And the Growdens and everyone else and all the friends
I've made in this wonderful community. So I just want
to thank you for what you do, thank you for
having me on and including me in the lineup. Larry
Hancock and I too, very nice. Yeah, no, I appreciate it.
Profile I listen, I appreciate it.

Speaker 1 (20:07):
And I'm glad to I'm glad to be friendly with
you guys, and and say hello to Rob and Carmine
for me.

Speaker 9 (20:13):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (20:14):
You know, I I'd love to get both of I'd
love to get both of them on again soon too.
But you know, we'll figure it out after I get
back from the conference. And yeah, we still do have
Robert Grodin coming up. Uh and maybe we'll be joined
by Ken Zendercar before we're all done too. So you
know these couple hours I'm spending here before I go
to my regular shows which begin at eight pm here

(20:35):
on Ocelli dot com Radio.

Speaker 2 (20:37):
But I know you got a run, man, and I
appreciate it. And there you go, the Loan Gunman. Where
can they go, by the way, besides searching out on YouTube?

Speaker 3 (20:44):
Okay?

Speaker 4 (20:45):
Yeah, so yeah, if you search the YouTube the Loan
l O n E Gunman Podcast on YouTube, but we'll
come up.

Speaker 3 (20:55):
You could find uh it on Twitter.

Speaker 4 (20:58):
I think it's if you just searched a long un men,
we don't really have a website, but uh, the Lone.

Speaker 3 (21:05):
Gunman Podcast at gmail dot com if you ever want
to ask us anything.

Speaker 4 (21:10):
And yeah, man, let's let's collapse soon, man, and I'm
looking forward to seeing you in a couple of weeks.

Speaker 3 (21:15):
Absolutely shit, a week or week and a half.

Speaker 1 (21:18):
Yeah, I mean, look, I'm going to be leaving leaving
here on the nineteenth, no problem. I'm going to be
leaving here on the nineteenth, and it'll be from the
twenty first to the twenty third, will be at the
uh what is the name of that hotel again? Oh?

Speaker 2 (21:30):
Right, the uh Fairmont, the other Fairmont.

Speaker 1 (21:33):
Right, the Fairmont, which is at seventeen seventeen North ackerd
Street in Dallas, Texas. But if you're attending at virtually
you can do that too by going to Assassination Conference
dot com and sign up there. Use the code if
you will, ocelly ten that's my name and one zero
you get ten percent off. And it seems like nobody
signs up with my coupon code, So please somebody sign

(21:55):
up my coupon.

Speaker 2 (21:56):
Code over there. Let him know you're alive. Uh o'
Shelley the.

Speaker 1 (22:02):
Assassination Conference dot com. Joe BURRELLI good luck with tonight's
show and we'll be looking for you on YouTube.

Speaker 4 (22:08):
Tiks Man, I will I will tell Carmine and Rob
you say hi and uh and yeah that that the
Fairmount looks amazing as a venue, so uh, definitely use
Chuck's code because we don't have one.

Speaker 3 (22:22):
But okay, Chuck, thank you again. I appreciate the time.
I'm sorry for budding in and crashing out on Larry.
I just wanted to say I to him, because I do.
You'd just spoken a week before.

Speaker 2 (22:33):
No, no, no worries, Hey, no worries.

Speaker 1 (22:36):
And the good thing is well, we'll have a coffee
shop that's open all weekend this time too.

Speaker 2 (22:40):
So here you go from the twenty Yeah, yeah, anyway.

Speaker 3 (22:44):
I mean the smoking slash vape section is like the
place to be well.

Speaker 2 (22:50):
Before, that's where I am all the tized. That's that's
where I am almatizer.

Speaker 3 (22:55):
Yeah, so okay, help me too, you buddy, But thank you.
It's great to talk to you, and I look forward
to seeing you very soon.

Speaker 2 (23:03):
There you go the.

Speaker 1 (23:06):
Loan Gunman podcast and find it on YouTube tonight, seven
pm Eastern. There you go, and I'm sure there's plenty
of archive shows over there.

Speaker 2 (23:15):
Check them out.

Speaker 1 (23:16):
Rob is definitely different than me, and so is Joe,
and I appreciate their work and they're gonna have car
Mine on tonight.

Speaker 2 (23:23):
So there you go.

Speaker 1 (23:24):
Triple Threat on the Loan Gunman on YouTube tonight stick Around.
We'll get back to this in just a little bit.
Hopefully I'll be returning with Robert Grodin or Ken Zendacar,
depending on when I returned stick Around.

Speaker 3 (24:33):
Go ahead call it in the Truth about the Day
he assassination?

Speaker 2 (24:37):
Right, Well, what do you want to know?

Speaker 10 (24:38):
Dy Baker's wild claim Oswald girlfriends you knew Ruby and
Barry hands the weapons.

Speaker 1 (24:43):
Really, I imagine I could claim I have four wheels.
It doesn't make me a wagon, But okay.

Speaker 11 (24:47):
Oswald was on the building and I'm trying to prevent
the murder of John Kennedy. Come on now has a.

Speaker 12 (24:52):
Real effort on the Day of pay assassination.

Speaker 7 (24:54):
Book Into Reclaimed.

Speaker 1 (24:55):
Go to Amazon dot com enter Judith Baker in her
own word. You'll get the results for a digital copy
of a book where Walt Brown utilizes her own words
and the known evidence in the case to get at
well a different perspective. Let's say you can get Judith
Barry Baker in her own words from the author himself,

(25:15):
signed if you request it by contacting doctor Brown at
k I.

Speaker 2 (25:19):
As jfk at aol dot com. It's a fun book and.

Speaker 1 (25:23):
It actually dissects the many, many fantastic claims.

Speaker 2 (25:27):
Judith Vary Baker in her own words, can.

Speaker 6 (25:32):
You express my callers to there anyone else who happens
to get on the air who's only dot com? Do
not necessarily reflect views of Kelly dot Com or Jolly
and we are not responsible for any stupidity which might ensue.

Speaker 3 (25:41):
Thank it.

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(26:24):
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Speaker 6 (26:34):
Can use express my callers, tools there anyone else who
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You not, necessarily replied Hews of Kelly dot Com or
job Kelly, And we are not responsible for any stumidity
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Speaker 7 (26:43):
Thank you, revel like.

Speaker 2 (26:53):
To come Sage.

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Shell you.

Speaker 15 (27:09):
A fact, oh Shelley fast stream and throws right, Jack
throw You are the fact.

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I ain't on the world. You are the yeah yeah,
m h.

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M h h yeah.

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Of that.

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Speaker 17 (31:37):
Do boy delagion to the front of Macamania and from
the mercier that being made in China South built?

Speaker 3 (31:55):
Stay for nothing? Wisim a broken nation and.

Speaker 5 (32:00):
Divide must window the members being jumpin denied for all
because Lena is all. Rather than not noting bould that
be a coming for me on the coming land, not
a man.

Speaker 16 (32:12):
Have been of rot by a something with the won
the comfort to the lead practice, go.

Speaker 5 (32:17):
Play and ships made him being non simultaneously deprecated from
a hole in an actual real estate. The queens the
way more us through coming to a fully state there too,
relected brier Wood mag no compeers in two point all
the bioga, the freemo who lacks that, the cast, the
biot bond and the wolt general of babbling and had

(32:37):
this massive pod.

Speaker 18 (32:39):
From buffet the water ride by paying.

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The bascom a going cap and brom the Elbert brings
diaco for candle and lecti brial Man's man of the
Maniscare wrote to pod people and down the road, no
s off frame and no pads. Also no fast melton
and no case to men fit.

Speaker 2 (32:57):
Absolutely no check with.

Speaker 18 (32:59):
Six father, do the street of simplest but that the
physical back n see your frock flam or something that
is here recus like lead us to a box flight.

Speaker 5 (33:09):
You're right, man, stay to macada or the sing your
rader one. They've been breaking the yetty done in anything
differently more than you're prating completely DeLine and it's blending.

Speaker 18 (33:18):
The ripon that a number lever and is breaking freely nothing.
Don't be leading to a m own that never owned
nothing for be it self transhumanist.

Speaker 5 (33:32):
Tell me about good, double plus good and no God,
because now I'm not the little greeman be doing both
the property old President.

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You are Scottish or gotten down whether they do know anything.

Speaker 5 (33:46):
I'll go back and book underwear.

Speaker 16 (33:54):
Again.

Speaker 1 (34:02):
Hey, and we are back live on the stream, and
this time I've got Kenneth Zendercar with me and also
Alex Harris, So here we go. Okay, I didn't expect
to have Alex. I wasn't sure, hadn't heard from him,
so you know, but here we go. I've got him
and I've got Ken with us to keep talking about
the Lancer conference here in this early show on the stream.

(34:25):
But of course you guys will be catching the podcast,
so there you go. Anyway, Ken, first of all, you know,
how are you doing? And also check in with Alex.
How's he doing.

Speaker 2 (34:36):
I haven't talked to him in a while.

Speaker 1 (34:37):
I've been talking about him in a couple of different
places and mentioning the people they got to go check
out his channel and should probably contact him if they
need somebody who's got a fresh pair of eyes regarding.

Speaker 2 (34:49):
The films and such. But Ken, tell me about I.

Speaker 1 (34:53):
Mean, you're going to participate in the mythst thing with
me at the conference, but I have no idea what
Alex is doing at the conference. Action I know it'll
have something to do with the films, but I don't
know much else.

Speaker 2 (35:04):
So I leave the Florida. You guys tell us about it.

Speaker 10 (35:09):
Okay, Well, as I'm said, we are going to be
talking about this, so do we actually stay with one
that we're doing or or keep out of a speacret well,
because I know it's going to be very controversial for

(35:29):
the Enlancer crowd.

Speaker 1 (35:31):
Yeah, you and I are going to do sort of
a combined presentation which is going to go in two
different directions.

Speaker 2 (35:37):
So I'm gonna let you go first.

Speaker 1 (35:39):
That way they'll have time to calm down while I'm
pissing them off because I think we're gonna I think
we're both gonna irritate people there.

Speaker 2 (35:47):
So we're gonna do that.

Speaker 1 (35:49):
We're gonna split the myths panel like so and uh
and and see if we can get it into a
full hour. I'm still debating as to how many slides
or if I should use slide or not for my
part of the presentation, but I think you might need
some visual aids. We'll see, But I have no idea
what Alex has planning on doing because he's got a

(36:10):
whole other presentation. So you know, tell us about yours
and then you know, pass the phone Alex and we'll
see what he's got to say.

Speaker 10 (36:19):
Okay, well, I'll think this the this that I would
like to be dunk is who so basically beverly altered.
She claims to be the infamous.

Speaker 3 (36:38):
Lady.

Speaker 10 (36:39):
And let's just say, I'm going to be showing some
evidence that people have not really done before. And to
the extent that I'm going at we will be talking
about her destince, what she had the camera and her height.

Speaker 2 (37:01):
See that's the thing people have.

Speaker 1 (37:03):
Yeah, people have often said over the years that she's,
you know, this legit witness, and she has an interesting story,
and of course it sounds like the kind of story
that people want to hear.

Speaker 4 (37:13):
You know.

Speaker 2 (37:13):
The FBI came took my film, and I didn't.

Speaker 1 (37:17):
Want to reveal to him that I, you know, had
weed in my bag and this and that and don't
you dare say I was a stripper because I was
a singer, you know, and stuff like that. Over the years,
and she's been a very popular figure. And look, it's
not about her or attacking her or anything. It's really
about we need to filter out some of the noise,

(37:39):
some of the static here, some of the misleading information,
because it's not real information. You know, this is my
same argument with Judy Baker, which of course I'm not
going to be talking about this year, but instead, you know,
I'm constantly talking about that on the show, so people
have heard it already. But the point is, you know,

(38:00):
I don't want to hear from James Files because I
don't believe him. I don't want to hear from Judith
Barry Baker because she's not believable. I don't want to
hear from guess what, anybody who is going to give
me a fiction here. You know, I don't want to
trade the official fiction for the conspiracy fiction either. You know,
even though my mind and my emotions might be more

(38:20):
friendly to it, it doesn't mean that it's valid information.
And look that the mainstream media, the official historians, the government,
nobody's going to help us clear this stuff away if
we don't do it ourselves. So this is the point
of doing the myth presentation. Kenneth you know, so it
has to be done. And you know, look, if she's

(38:43):
a legit witness, then I want to hear everything she
has to say. But if not, we need to put
that aside now and say, look, that was interesting.

Speaker 10 (38:52):
That was not to find out who she actually is. Yeah,
I mean, look who is this young lady? Because she
was one of the closest people to the assassination and
she had a camera, right, I mean, who knows what's
on it?

Speaker 2 (39:10):
Well, so yeah, so if people think it's her, well
that stops the.

Speaker 10 (39:14):
Research into actually trying to find who the actual lady is.

Speaker 2 (39:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 10 (39:20):
That and but you said, it's not it's not about
ever we herself. Like, I know her, I've had dinner
with her, I've seen her many times. It's not about her.
She's she's nice, Uh, she's friendly. It's just is her

(39:40):
story true? And since I research this, it it's not
that about her. It's about what is true and what isn't.
I mean, I'll say the same about Judith, about James Styles.
It's not about these people I can have with, hang

(40:00):
out with, taught with, it's fine, But when it comes
to them telling the story and stopping with legitimate research
and giving us all uh faig story. I mean some
people want to hear what actually happened. I mean sure,
it's not going to be as entertaining to say that

(40:25):
Judas and James Files and all these people aren't telling
these truth because a good story, Hey, that sells hard research.
It's harder, it's hard to help that. Let me let
me know, people don't have these interests.

Speaker 1 (40:40):
Right, let me go over something with you here, because
this is something that's not connected to either yours or
my research, but is something that needed to be established
a long time ago. There was this idea for a
long time that people had about Secret Service agents being
all over.

Speaker 2 (40:56):
The knowll right, they were everywhere in Dally.

Speaker 1 (40:59):
Plas, and it seems like they keep popping up because
a bunch of different witnesses, who we know were legitimate witnesses,
said they had Secret Service credentials flashed at him in
a rush in the immediate aftermath of the assassination. Okay,
here's the problem. The Secret Service has always said we
didn't have people stationed in the plaza, so that left

(41:21):
the door open for a bunch of different people who again,
you and I I don't think, I don't know maybe
you have a history here that I don't know about.
But there was a guy named Chauncey Holt who for
a while talked about having factor. You were thinking of him,
But have you ever done any work on him? Because
I didn't have to, but I saw this, and Okay,

(41:44):
here's what the problem is. If you simply go back
to the Warrant Commission and I know it's not you know,
the definitive answer for anything, but it does contain some
valuable information. Sure, yes, well you see if you pay
attention to it, certain Secret Service agent he leaps off
of a car and goes running around Deally Plaza trying

(42:05):
to find out what happened. If you pay close attention
to his testimony, the guy is telling you the truth
as to where it is. He was running around and
flashing his Secret Service credentials. This is how you know
how these people encountered the Secret Service agent. Okay, Now
this ties to Chauncey Holt because he later claims that

(42:27):
he fabricated, you know, fake stuff and this and that,
blah blah. But also there's a guy named Gordon Arnold
who says that you know, a guy kicked him, took
away his film, this and that, and he said he
was a CIA agent, he flashed something at me and
all this other stuff. And meanwhile I got to tell you,
I got no proof that Gordon Arnold was ever present.

(42:47):
I know it was a fascinating story. The guy got
upset talking about Badgeman, who again is another optical illusion
in the film.

Speaker 2 (42:56):
I can prove that to you, Okay, But the thing is, sure, look.

Speaker 1 (43:01):
At all the but look at all the mythology that
ends up getting built around somebody claiming to be a
witness and filling in blanks that we don't need filled
in by them. We need to do the proper research
to figure it out. Like I said, if you trace,
and the Secret Service agent's name is slipping my mind
right now, but I swear to you if you go

(43:22):
into it took me a while, but I went through
and figured out there's this one Secret Service agent running
around and he's showing his credentials to these people. And
if you trace what he says he did, it starts
to make sense with the witness statements. Why there was
somebody flashing a badge in three four different locations. It's
that simple. You have to pay attention to the core

(43:45):
stuff to begin with, and when somebody else throws a
bunch of other information in. Okay, And I'm gonna talk
to Alex about this in a minute, regarding the Zabruterer
film if you don't mind, because I was in a
conversation last night with a guy who's producing a film, okay,
and he's, look, I need some technical advice and you know,

(44:07):
and I said, okay, well I'll do what I can
for you. But he started asking me about Zubruder film
stuff and I'm like shaking my head. I'm going, wow, man,
you don't realize what you're talking about, because you've been
you now went you know, three four hours on YouTube
and you think you know what you're talking about.

Speaker 2 (44:25):
Regarding the back of John F.

Speaker 1 (44:27):
Kennedy's head in the Zubruder film, it's you got your
stuff wrong. I had to explain it to this guy
at like, you know, one o'clock in the morning last night,
while he's sitting there sorting through stuff that he's gonna,
you know, put together for a film, and he's like, wow,
I didn't know that part of it. And I'm like yeah,
and I'm not even the expert on this guy. There's

(44:48):
people who know better than me. But I'm telling you
this is the basics of what's wrong with the story
you're telling me. So I'm informing guys whenever I can,
okay about this stuff. But it's amazing, Alex. Help me
out here though, because when again, when you leave these
doors open and you don't properly go through and test,

(45:11):
you know, certain holes in the story and figure them out,
this is where you end up with people filling it
in with I'm sorry, the mythology of it all.

Speaker 2 (45:22):
This is the bruder film, Alex. The back of Kennedy's head.

Speaker 1 (45:26):
What is the biggest thing that's brought up all the
time to me by people who just say, look, you
have general knowledge, you know, help me out. The back
of his head is blacked out, they say, And I say,
you know what the problem is. You don't have a
good copy because it's not blacked out. If you have
a good copy, there is a texture there. It's not

(45:47):
a solid black thing. Yes, if you're looking at it
on YouTube and you're looking at somebody's bad copy, it
can appear that way, but that's not the way it
appears on the film.

Speaker 2 (45:59):
So help me out out.

Speaker 1 (46:00):
I mean you know, if you leave that door open, though,
then people create a mythology to fill it in the blanks.
And this is what the problem is, So help me
out with it. I mean, you've seen better copies of
the Subruder film than most people, right, so you know
what I'm talking about regarding this. You know, Oh, the
back of his head is blacked out like somebody colored

(46:21):
it in with a marker. Give me a little bit
of help from your perspective as to how to explain
that to somebody, just real quick, and then, you know,
give us an idea about your presentation, and then we'll
get right on into talking to the Grodents next. But
because they're they're up next, and I think they might
have actually joined us on the uh on the on

(46:41):
the Jetsy, but we'll wait and get to them as
soon as I'm done talking to you.

Speaker 2 (46:45):
Okay, So please go ahead and tell us about the
back of the head.

Speaker 9 (46:51):
Well, uh, well, a lot of people don't realize is
a lot of the copies that are out there are
like really really a lot of contrast to them, and
that can contribute to that because the back of his
head is already a very dark place because he had
dark brown hair like most people do. And when you

(47:14):
combine that with several other factors in the film, and
given the fact you have a very contrastye copy, it
can really appear like it's been blacked out, when in
fact hasn't. It's just a very dark area of the film. Actually,
my present plation this year, I had to switch it

(47:38):
because the other one didn't work out. I'm going to
be talking about this Appariter film. Something I found that's
very interesting about it, but I won't be saying yet.
But it does give room for some speculation, but I'm
not going to really allow much speculation because I have
a theory as to what could possible explain it.

Speaker 1 (48:01):
Okay, so we're gonna get a little bit of a
surprise look at the subruder film from your examination, and
you're gonna do this in person, right, yes, Okay, Well
I'm looking forward to it, Alex.

Speaker 2 (48:15):
And look, you don't need to say anything else.

Speaker 1 (48:18):
I have been, you know, telling other people that I
really want them to keep a watch on you, you know,
because as you're developing here with the films, with the
images that you're gonna in the future be the go
to guy when it comes to examining this stuff, because
I mean, it's an incredible amount of information that you've
amassed and you're still a teenager. And I was really

(48:41):
proud to actually introduce you for the first time at
the conference. What was that two years ago? I guess,
and you know you were the youngest guy to ever
present there, go ahead, I was just agreeing with you.
I'm sorry, no, no problem at all. But I'm really
pleased that we have, you know, younger guys who are

(49:04):
coming in because the fight is still on here to
get at all of the information that's available, and you know,
it's it's still taking time. It's taken yet another generation,
and you know, I'm kind of the ex generation. We
need guys your age to continue on to get smarter
as the technology evolves, as every you know, avenue of

(49:26):
exploration evolves, we need.

Speaker 2 (49:29):
More and more people like you.

Speaker 1 (49:31):
And are you going to have your friend with you
about the ballistics or is that off?

Speaker 9 (49:36):
Now that's what I had to change. He wasn't able
to make it out this year, but I could see
about next year.

Speaker 1 (49:44):
Okay, fair enough, So you're going to focus on the
Supruter film and I don't know which day you're presenting on.
But I'm telling you it's going to be one that
everybody's going to want to see and I definitely am
looking forward to it. So Alex and Ken, you know what,
I'm gonna put you guys on hold, and we're gonna
move on to our next guest. But I want to

(50:06):
remind everybody again that that'll be from the twenty first
to the twenty third, okay of this month, and we'll
be there at the conference. I'll be there in person,
Alex will be there, Can will be there, and also
my next guests, Robert and Janet Groden will be there.
But we're all gonna be there from the twenty first
to the twenty third. And if you're not able to

(50:27):
get there in person, especially if your flight was canceled
or something now because that's a thing, you know, Look,
you'll be able to attend, and you can sign up
for tickets at Assassinationconference dot com. That's all one word,
Assassinationconference dot com. And i'd really appreciate it if you
use the code o'celly ten, which is my name, and

(50:49):
ten one zero you'll get ten percent off if you
do so. So, guys, I'm gonna put you on hold
and we're gonna get right on over to the Grodins.
If you stick around, maybe will you'll help me close
this out because I only reserved about a half hour
with Robert and Janet, so that's the best they could do.
And I think they're traveling, so they've probably stopped somewhere

(51:12):
to talk to me, and I want to get right
to them. But of course, if you don't know who
Robert Grodin is, please pause my show, go ahead and
look him up. Okay, he's a guy who worked with
the House Select Committee on assassinations. That's where I would
start your resume, Bob, but believe me, it's longer than
I have time for here. So he is what the

(51:35):
guy who has been the film expert now as far
as I'm concerned for decades and as far as anybody
should be concerned on the images that are connected to
the assassination of John F.

Speaker 2 (51:45):
Kennedy.

Speaker 1 (51:46):
You saw him on The Men Who Killed Kennedy, You've
seen him on various other documentaries, rightfully, so, Also he
was a consultant for the JFK film on and on
large resume, but also he'll be presenting at Lancer.

Speaker 2 (51:59):
This year as he has the past few years, I
know straight.

Speaker 1 (52:04):
And he's been presenting on this stuff since jeez, I
don't know the nineteen seventies as far as my knowledge goes,
maybe longer because after all, this occurred on a significant day,
the assassination of John F. Kennedy in his life as well,
And maybe he'll tell you a little bit about that.
Bob and Janet, can you guys hear me?

Speaker 2 (52:23):
Okay?

Speaker 19 (52:26):
Just fine, sure, Ken, We're at a rest stuff in Arkansas.

Speaker 2 (52:30):
All right.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
Also also, I forgot to mention in that little introduction,
Janet Groden is with him, that's his wife. But she'll
be presenting at the conference as well. I know Bob
is presenting on the media's interaction with the Kennedy assassination,
with the guys from Untold American Stories, I know that's
one of the things going on there. Kind of wish
you would do a presentation with me one day, Bob,

(52:53):
if we can arrange that for next year, but you know,
we'll get there. But Janet also presenting. She does work
as well, and they what they work alongside each other
with each other as well, so let's hear about But
what both of you are going to do at the
conferences year. If you don't mind, I'll start with.

Speaker 2 (53:10):
You, Bob.

Speaker 20 (53:13):
Okay, Well, I heard you talking with Alex just now,
and the subject matter is very important to me, and
that's the Upruiter film. The question has become kind of crazy.
Is a film legitimate or not? And the thing is
that the people who say it's fake been altered know

(53:35):
nothing about phil They seriously know nothing about it. They
quote people who don't know what they're talking about and
present false evidence. There are three major points are Number one,
they think there's a Truiter film is fake because it
doesn't show the car is stopping as it turns onto
Elm Street. Well, the answer to that is very very simple.

(54:00):
Pruter didn't film it. He had a manual wind camera,
which means that it doesn't run on batteries.

Speaker 7 (54:07):
It runs on a.

Speaker 20 (54:08):
Manual wind situation. Whereas as the spring runs out, the
camera stops, and he knew this was gonna happen, or
maybe it did, and he stopped. He brought the camera
down and he winded it up. He wounded up, wounded up,
wounded up, and as he did that, the car turned

(54:28):
on to Elm Street. He didn't film it. That's why
we don't see it. And there's a Britter film. That's
the first one. The second one is that we don't
see the car stop. Well, the reason why we don't
is because it didn't stop. It slowed down, which we
can we can judge, but it didn't stop.

Speaker 7 (54:49):
The closest single witness to.

Speaker 20 (54:52):
The President Jackie was Mary Anne Mormon and uh we
asked her that question not ago, two weeks ago, and
she said, the car never stopped. It slowed down, but
it did not stop. We have the Zapruda film, the
next film, a much more film in the Bronze film.
All four of them showed the car never stopped. Right,

(55:15):
the question that becomes critical and you just.

Speaker 7 (55:19):
Dealt with it. Alex fell with it that.

Speaker 20 (55:24):
The about one frame out of four hundred and eighty
six frames shows what appears to be a black spot,
it's not, it's a shadow. There are only two frames
of the Zabruter film that show them the damage to
the back of the head in after the headshot. That's

(55:47):
frame three thirty five and three thirty seven. Because the
pan raid is a Bruter's panning with the film against
the car they're going at the same speed.

Speaker 7 (56:00):
And the thing is that you can see.

Speaker 20 (56:02):
In profile the back of the head and the whole
which is much bigger, much larger than the old the
piece of dark area on the other frame. So you know,
I'm going to be talking about the uh, the Zubruder film,

(56:24):
of course, but we have a friend who is also
going to be talking to and presents an extremely.

Speaker 7 (56:33):
Technical issue I'm sorry, a technical evaluation, yeah, of.

Speaker 20 (56:40):
The same thing, and what he does and what I
do present exactly the same thing from totally different aspects.
And the people who are saying that the film is
fate truly know nothing about film. I think that most
people that say it know difference between videotape and film.

Speaker 1 (57:03):
No, they don't, Number one, Bob, but number two. Let
me put a question to you that was put to
me last night. Okay, during this conversation I was describing
to Alex because not only did the blackened out part
of the head thing come up and I tried to
explain it. Of course, I don't have the same technical
knowledge that you or this other presenter are going to.

Speaker 2 (57:22):
Have, but I did my best.

Speaker 1 (57:25):
The next thing they brought up, though, is this other
thing I hear all the time, which is, oh, they
removed frames, And I grab my head every time and
I shake it because I'm like, oh god, listen, do
you not understand what would happen if theoretically they pulled
frames out of this thing?

Speaker 2 (57:44):
It would not appear the way it does.

Speaker 1 (57:46):
You've got to look at the frame rate to begin
with and realize that there's quite a bit of distance
in between things. Okay, it's not high resolution. Okay, these
cameras were designed a certain way. I talked about the
wind up thing like you just did, and I explained
to him, listen, it's, first of all, it's a little
bit rickety. It might not have been exactly perfect when

(58:09):
it went through the gate as the film went through
Number one. Number two, If you pull frames out of there,
you're not going to see what you think you're seeing.
It doesn't work that way. Okay, This isn't you know
Adobe editing software where it fills in the blanks for you,
all right, This would create huge gaps. If somebody pulled

(58:30):
frames out of this thing, that would be so obvious,
and it's so ridiculous that you wouldn't even you wouldn't
take it seriously. So this removed frames nonsense is complete nonsense.
So Bob, tell me I'm wrong.

Speaker 7 (58:45):
Oh, you're absolutely right.

Speaker 20 (58:47):
Okay, Well, what happened is that if they pulled frames out,
people in the background and images in the background would
jump from point A to point B, they wouldn't continue
in a fluid motion, right, And you're absolute right, absolutely right.
And the thing is that, you know, these people want
to do something on their own that makes it look

(59:08):
as though they've discovered something.

Speaker 7 (59:11):
We're talking about.

Speaker 20 (59:12):
A major, major conspiracy here, which is real, and they're
trying to add their own little twist on it to
make it look like they found a second one, which
is not real. And the thing is what they present
as their evidence is not what's happening is not the truth.
The third thing that they talk about is the fact

(59:33):
that in the Suppruiter film, one person who saw a
copy of it originally, who was told it was the
original and it wasn't, says that you can see the
explosion of the president's head at frame of three thirteen,
going up about three feet above the president's head. You can, yes,

(59:55):
you can, in a good copy and a good copy,
but as you just mentioned, a couple of moments agod
on the bad copies, you lose a great deal of detail.
But they keep bringing the same three issues up, and
none of it's true. And the point is that the
scares me is the fact that the people are buying

(01:00:17):
into this crap.

Speaker 19 (01:00:18):
Well, they're buying in because they don't understand film, not
because you know, and some of them presented do their
presentation very well. Just because they do a good presentation
doesn't mean what they're presenting is correct, right.

Speaker 20 (01:00:32):
Plus the fact that there are six frames that are
missing from the original film because when Live Magazine bought it,
they put the film in the hands of a junior
lab technician to make four by five blow up copies
of individual frames, and when he did it twice during

(01:00:53):
the film, he put it down in such a way
that the gate on the enlarger actually cut the film,
so it's got two spices in it before the shots
are fired.

Speaker 7 (01:01:06):
But but the Secret Service copy did not have that problem.

Speaker 19 (01:01:13):
So when Robert's book you can see what those frames are,
and in many of Robert's copies because he inserted them.

Speaker 20 (01:01:21):
I reinserted them, yes, where they belong.

Speaker 7 (01:01:24):
Yeah, but you can tell.

Speaker 20 (01:01:26):
Exactly for the reason he mentioned before, where the frames
were cut out. You see the whole background jump and
then one of the two frames, well, one of the
two spices, you see a tree start growing.

Speaker 7 (01:01:43):
Up out of the ground and then moving.

Speaker 20 (01:01:45):
Over about maybe a yard or so, and then going
back up. So you know, again it's important to me.
You know, I took a tremendous chance for releasing the
Zibruder film in the first place, and it bothers me
personally to your people, misrepresented.

Speaker 1 (01:02:04):
Right, well, but that's why I pointed out and I
always correct it, you know, using much of the information
that you presented.

Speaker 2 (01:02:11):
Over the years.

Speaker 1 (01:02:11):
Frankly, UH as as part of my background for explaining this,
because you've given the best explanations in fact in the
UH you know, in the original VHS and UH later
on DVD releases of a collection of films. You even
showed us here where you inserted the frames from the
Shaw copy, which you know, the clay Shaw trial copies

(01:02:31):
are terrible. I had a hold in one of those
some years ago, somebody gave it to me as a gift, UH,
and you know they're really watered down. You've barely got
any color, the contrast is bad, but you have all
the frames, okay, So initially you inserted those in one
of your presentations and showed us that so that it
was smooth, and then later on you got the better

(01:02:53):
frames and you put them in.

Speaker 2 (01:02:54):
It seems like to me, I'm not.

Speaker 1 (01:02:56):
Sure of the entire phrenology, but this is essentially what
people could see with their own eyes. You've shown it
all over the place, So I mean, you.

Speaker 20 (01:03:04):
Know, anybody good, If anybody wants to see the frames,
they're all in my latest book, Absolute Proof. Absolute Absolute
Proof has a total of a thousand frames. Those thousands, yeah,
a thousand pictures. Sorry, you can see. I take this
very very seriously and I'm trying to get as much

(01:03:28):
in about it as I can. So if anybody wants
to know about it, you know, we'll be at the
conferences and we'll have a book which is not readily
available in bookstores.

Speaker 7 (01:03:40):
So right, anybody's interested in it, And here's the toys.

Speaker 1 (01:03:45):
I think it's an essential part of your collection. Look,
if you're studying this and you want to see the
visual record of the assassination, it's absolutely essential to get
all three of the big picture books that that Bob
put out and I mean, get a hold of them
however you can. I hope you'll have some copies with you,
because the death of a President is something that I've
given out as gifts for years for people that are

(01:04:07):
even mildly interested to get them to dig into this
quite a bit more. But also the search for Lee
Harvey Oswald is a little harder to get. I highly
recommend that. And also Absolute Proof, which is the newest one.
I think between the three of them, you have like
three thousand images all together, and I think they are

(01:04:28):
a complete collection.

Speaker 20 (01:04:29):
Go ahead, sorry, of course, I'm saying there's twenty two
hundred photographs between the killing of a President, the search
for Lee Harvey Oswald, and Absolute Proof. Okay, mine is
twenty two hundredment Yeah, the twenty two hundred pictures that
the government did not release that the Warrant Commission had

(01:04:50):
had available to it and printed none of them.

Speaker 7 (01:04:53):
You know, another thing, just to mention to you, Chuck.
You mentioned it's.

Speaker 19 (01:04:57):
Hard to get search for Lee Harvey Oswald. Where the
process of trying to get it reprinted.

Speaker 2 (01:05:02):
Oh great, yeah, it's gone.

Speaker 20 (01:05:06):
Well, we're going to give a little update to it
as well, because Jennen has done a tremendous amount of
work on.

Speaker 7 (01:05:13):
The tip of killing, and that's the major part of
the books.

Speaker 20 (01:05:17):
Who are going to update it with all the due
information that she's developed, which is very very good and
very convincing, excellent.

Speaker 1 (01:05:25):
I look forward to that, and if there's an update
on it, let me know, because I want to get
a copy as soon as possible. If you're going to
include new images, and we'll go past the twenty two
hundred mark, but I'm telling you for now what's available,
get a hold of it. I'm telling my listeners this
because if you want a shot at understanding the totality

(01:05:46):
of the visual record which could be collected, you get
at least an idea from these three books.

Speaker 2 (01:05:52):
And I have all three of them on my shelf.

Speaker 1 (01:05:55):
I don't recommend anything that I don't have myself, and
I'm telling you now flue Proof is really a great one,
but I recommend all three, and if there's a new one,
as soon as it comes.

Speaker 2 (01:06:06):
Out, we need to get hold of that too.

Speaker 1 (01:06:08):
But meanwhile, I do want to go over to Janet's work, Yeah, please,
I want to go over to Janet's work and her
presentation next because I don't want to hold you guys
up too long, but I want to get into because
she's going to be talking about something other than the
films and the American untold stories, guys. I mean, she's
going to be doing a different presentation, and so I

(01:06:30):
wanted to get an idea from her what that's going
to be for people to be aware.

Speaker 19 (01:06:34):
Go ahead, Well, what I'm trying to talk about is
what actually happened at the scene that we know at
the Tippic killing, all of the different information because things
have changed over the years in terms of what Helen
Markham has said and.

Speaker 7 (01:06:53):
Things like that.

Speaker 19 (01:06:54):
I did speak about the witnesses last time, but this
time I'm going to talk a little bit more about
what happened at the scene and also go into the
autopsy report rather, you know, in depth, and the ballistics
and how did the actual shooting happen, what did and

(01:07:15):
what did not happen. So we're gonna we're gonna go
down that road. And I even have some information regarding
the uh calls that were made into the police okay
from his car and think yes, so we're gonna talk
really about what happened on Tenth Street.

Speaker 1 (01:07:36):
Okay, So you're going to get into the radio traffic
because somebody turns around and grabs tippets radio after he
shot and calls in. You're going to describe that and
give people an idea. Are you gonna have any of
that audio as part of your presentation or okay, sure will, excellent,
I will.

Speaker 2 (01:07:55):
I'm looking forward to that.

Speaker 1 (01:07:56):
But also that means you're gonna have to address the
the mismatched cartridge is here, right, I mean you're gonna
wind up having to talk about that.

Speaker 19 (01:08:03):
Go ahead, absolutely, absolutely, and just you know, some differences
in what may have happened during the actual shooting. There's
a lot of doubt that has been cast on the
fact that somebody came around and shot him point blank
in the head.

Speaker 2 (01:08:23):
Close up.

Speaker 19 (01:08:25):
It doesn't fit with the autopsy, and it doesn't fit
with there's some problems with what Dale Myers wrote about
it well, which even Dale Myers is kind of back
off on now.

Speaker 2 (01:08:35):
So well, yeah, I'm just saying that's a good thing.

Speaker 1 (01:08:40):
And look using the autopsy information because Earl Rose would
have conducted that autopsy, and unlike what we got out
of Bethesda, Unlike what we got out of Bethesda, this
should be a competent autopsy to explain things, give you
proper landmarks, et cetera. So guess what you're working with
way better information than we are when it comes to

(01:09:00):
the body of the president. All right, and look, I'll
tell you what, Janet, because I had to go through
the crazy theories with Bob. I'll throw the crazy theory
at you and ask you because this one I hear
all the time now and it drives me nuts because
it makes no sense. Okay, but they give me the
body swapping, you know, conspiracy, which it drives me crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:09:25):
And it's here.

Speaker 1 (01:09:26):
It is for the listener's edification. Janet already knows what
I'm gonna say. But for you guys, here's the stupid
here's the stupid idea.

Speaker 2 (01:09:34):
That drives me crazy. They switched JD.

Speaker 1 (01:09:37):
Tippett's body with President Kennedy's body, and therefore they had
to doctor Kennedy and like, so they have this whole
complex thing where Earl Rose ends up with what Kennedy's
body and JD. Tippett's body goes to Bethesda. I guess
they switched bodies. They looked alike, they tell me, and
I'm like shaking my head again. It's almost like the

(01:09:59):
same thing with pull the frames out of the film.
That is not the result you're going to get if
you swap these bodies. Guys, anyway, can you just address
that for me, Janni, go ahead, Well, that.

Speaker 3 (01:10:12):
Is something people have said over and over.

Speaker 19 (01:10:15):
A couple of things I was able to find was
actually I pulled off some of these Facebook page. I
won't say who, but most of the pictures we see
of JD. Tippett are the ones with the you know,
combed back hair that looks like a fifties greaser. That
is not how he looked in nineteen sixty three. His
face was heavier, his hair was short, combed to the side, not.

Speaker 3 (01:10:39):
That big pompadori looking thing.

Speaker 9 (01:10:42):
So I have some photos like that that will help.

Speaker 19 (01:10:44):
Us to realize that, No, absolutely he did not look
like President Kennedy. That's a dream, Absolutely a dream. And
President Kennedy's hair was rather reddish, had a reddish tint
to it, right, Tippets was It's just plain flat, dark brown,
and so that's you know, that's crazy. And also just

(01:11:06):
you know the fact that the police took his uh,
there were people with that body all the time. It's
not like they had an opportunity to do this. There
was always a police escort right for most of the
time with the body. So you know that doesn't that
dog don't hunt, as they say in Texas.

Speaker 2 (01:11:26):
You know, there you go.

Speaker 7 (01:11:27):
Also the fact that.

Speaker 20 (01:11:29):
Jacqline Kennedy and Robert Kennedy were at the autopsy, and
they would have known if it wasn't John.

Speaker 19 (01:11:37):
Well, they didn't see it in the autopsy though.

Speaker 7 (01:11:40):
They weren't they were with a body when it was
brought in.

Speaker 1 (01:11:43):
Well, but here's the thing forget about during the autopsy, Bob.
But here's another well known fact is that Jackie opens
up the casket and clips a piece of hair, clips
a lock of hair away from JFK. And if she
had been sitting there with a body that was not
recognizable with an open casket that she opened herself there

(01:12:05):
at the White House, I think she might have said something.
I mean, I'm just saying, this is not my husband's
body might have come out of her mouth, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:12:14):
If they had put JD. Tippittt there in its place,
I mean, do you agree or no?

Speaker 19 (01:12:20):
I'm sure she surely she and Bobby would have known
they did have the casket open for a while at
the White House, right, as she said, in the east rooms.

Speaker 3 (01:12:30):
So yeah, people would have noticed.

Speaker 19 (01:12:33):
There are just too many, too many reasons that couldn't be.
I know, people say, oh, that's where they got the
back of the head, you know, for those autopsy photos
that are not really the back of Kennedy's head. Well,
let's be honest here, the Fensta Naval Hospital did not
need to import JD. Tippett's body from Texas in order

(01:12:55):
to get the back of somebody else's head to photograph.

Speaker 2 (01:12:57):
Yeah, no kidding.

Speaker 7 (01:12:58):
Plus plus the fact that I'm of all of that.

Speaker 20 (01:13:01):
A few years after I released all the films of
the assassination, eighteen of them in all the I released
the the color autops and photographs as well. And that's
definitely John Kennedy. It is not somebody else.

Speaker 7 (01:13:17):
Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 19 (01:13:19):
And you can even see in that back of the
head picture that the hair that looks like it's been
put over the hole is darker and wet as opposed
to if you get a good copy, as opposed to
the actual hair.

Speaker 3 (01:13:33):
And color of the president.

Speaker 7 (01:13:35):
So right now there's two.

Speaker 19 (01:13:37):
You're right, there's just too many problems with it. I
think Robert needs to tell you what he's going to
talk about with GROWBT.

Speaker 2 (01:13:45):
Okay, let's let's do that real quick. Like I said,
I don't want to hold you guys up too long.
A go ahead.

Speaker 7 (01:13:50):
Yeah, same thing that Mark came up with. He wanted
to do a.

Speaker 20 (01:13:57):
Presentation on murder on film in you know, Hollywood films,
and I was thinking that that and I started to
call it murder at twenty four frames per second.

Speaker 7 (01:14:10):
But the assassination cinema, yeah, we'll call.

Speaker 20 (01:14:13):
It an assassination cinema, and we're going to deal with
that is an issue too. It's something I think, it's
a good idea, something I'd like to do, something that
Mark wants to do, but I you know it, to me,
dealing with the issue of the Kennedy films being altered
and not being altered is far more important historically, So we'll.

Speaker 7 (01:14:40):
Do them both.

Speaker 2 (01:14:41):
Absolutely. That that's great.

Speaker 1 (01:14:43):
I mean, you know, to me, that back of the
head photo, I think the key issue is there you
got a gloved hand holding it up, you know. So
there's lots of ways to look at how that photo
is being taken. There's plenty of questions to be asked here.
But again, we need to ask the legitimate questions not
end up, you know, wasting our time on well they

(01:15:04):
pulled frames out, you know, and silliness like this. There
are serious questions here with some of these things. I mean,
I'm not saying that I believe that everything is authentic.
I'm just telling you that we need to ask the
real questions and not get bogged down in the fantasies.
So you know, I'm looking forward to this, Yeah, exactly,
just like with the body swapping with you know JD.

Speaker 2 (01:15:25):
Tippett.

Speaker 1 (01:15:26):
Yeah, nobody even thinks that, ol G. You know, they're
using a photograph of him from earlier. You know that
when they usually show you the picture of JD. Tippitt,
the typical one displayed is from earlier on.

Speaker 2 (01:15:38):
It's not the sixty three photo, is it?

Speaker 10 (01:15:41):
You know?

Speaker 2 (01:15:42):
So how did he? Yeah, how did he look that day?
Is the question?

Speaker 7 (01:15:47):
Right?

Speaker 2 (01:15:47):
And here you go and it doesn't work. It just
doesn't work.

Speaker 1 (01:15:52):
Anyway, I'm looking forward to seeing what both of you present.
You know, I think we're going to do the thing
with Grobert at the bank which is on Saturday. But
either way, I'm looking forward to this. And again people
go to Assassinationconference dot com. All right, it's all one
word Assassination Conference dot com. You can sign up there

(01:16:14):
and I would like it if you use the code
Ocelli ten because my name and one zero and you'll
save ten percent and you can attend you know, directly,
or you can go there virtually that way, and there
might actually be an extra day of presentations on Monday too,
if we still get everything in we're supposed to. But

(01:16:36):
I'm looking forward to seeing you guys you know there
and hopefully we'll get to I don't know, if I
get a minute to myself, we'll go somewhere get something
to eat because that's always fun to do.

Speaker 2 (01:16:49):
But yeah, I'm looking forward to it. So anything you
guys want to add.

Speaker 1 (01:16:52):
Before I let you go and get back on the road,
because I really appreciate you taking the time. They're traveling
somewhere right now and they're actually like in the car
talking to me, uh, Janet and Bob right now.

Speaker 2 (01:17:04):
I appreciate it. But go ahead, anything you want to
add before.

Speaker 3 (01:17:08):
I let you go.

Speaker 20 (01:17:10):
Jack, We're really looking forward to seeing you again, and
really so, and we're looking to see any of your
listeners as well.

Speaker 7 (01:17:20):
There's a lot to be learned and a lot to
be straightened out.

Speaker 20 (01:17:24):
Both Janet and I are going to do our best,
and you're doing a great job too, and thank you
so much for having us well.

Speaker 19 (01:17:31):
And there's nothing like being at a conference and actually
getting to sit down and talk to people who are
like minded, discuss things with people, get to.

Speaker 7 (01:17:42):
Meet people you know face to face. It really makes
it's very.

Speaker 3 (01:17:47):
Interesting and it's a lot of fun.

Speaker 19 (01:17:49):
I know, you know, the ass the idea of an
assassination is not fun, but the idea of the camaraderie
and the investigation and the access to getting people's books
and meeting people is really the wonderful experience if you
can do it.

Speaker 7 (01:18:04):
So I hope we get to see a lot of
you there.

Speaker 2 (01:18:06):
Yes, it looks same here.

Speaker 1 (01:18:08):
I look forward to it and uh, you know, I'm
grateful that I'm able to do it again this year.
And certainly you know, one of my one of my
favorite pictures, I've only taken a picture with a couple
of guys in the JFK research community, and I had
to get one with Bob Grodin when we were standing
online for something and it was like I'm sitting there

(01:18:29):
in my T shirt and I got I don't know,
I looked like a mess. But Bob's sitting there in
a nice suit, which he's usually dressed nice the whole time.
And I'm just like, can I get a picture with you?

Speaker 2 (01:18:38):
Bob? And I don't know, you probably did get Yeah,
let's get another one. We'll get the three of us
this time, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:18:48):
And I definitely I want to get another picture with you.
And I'm looking forward to this. And again I thank
both of you for taking the time. Again, like I said,
you guys are on the road right now and you know,
be safe in your try and I look forward to
seeing you in just about well two weeks from now.

Speaker 7 (01:19:06):
Yeah, thank you, thank you. Check all the best to you.

Speaker 1 (01:19:09):
Absolutely, and again I highly recommend you know Bob Groden's books,
all of them and all that, and I what can
I say, You know you should if you can attend
in person, attend in person and if not, attend virtually
at Assassination Conference dot com and one last time, O'Kelly
ten you get ten percent off, so it is definitely

(01:19:31):
well worth it if you're serious about the study of
the events of November twenty second, nineteen sixty three and
the ensuing events all around it.

Speaker 2 (01:19:41):
Okay, not just the assassination of John F.

Speaker 1 (01:19:43):
Kennedy, but as Janet was just talking about, you know,
we're gonna go into the typic killing. I know that
there's a presentation by Paul Abbott going to be about
what happened to Oswald on Sunday, which, of course he
dies on Sunday.

Speaker 2 (01:19:55):
Don't forget.

Speaker 1 (01:19:57):
You know, Kennedy's killed on a Friday, Oswald on a Sunday.
And man, the country changed after that. And that's been
the discussion on this show for a long time.

Speaker 2 (01:20:07):
And uh, you guys know what I think of that.

Speaker 11 (01:20:09):
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Speaker 11 (01:22:42):
Go ahead, callin the truth about the day of Assas Station.

Speaker 2 (01:22:46):
Right, Well, what do you want to know?

Speaker 11 (01:22:47):
Dy Baker's wild claim Oswald girlfriends he knew Ruby and
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Speaker 4 (01:22:52):
Really?

Speaker 2 (01:22:52):
I imagine I could claim I have four wheels. It
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Thank you for all the great in the revelation through conversation.

Speaker 1 (01:23:58):
So the final segment of the JFK Lancer Special promotional
podcast here on O'Kelly effect and Ken is back with me.
Ken Zendeker, who is going to join me on the
Myths discussion for my presentation and looking forward to that,
but figured i'll give him sort of a final word here.

(01:24:18):
We had Bob Grodin with us, we had Joe Barelli
with us, we had Jimmy Carnes, we had Larry Hancock,
and I think that's a pretty interesting diverse lineup to
give you an idea the people involved in the Lancer
conference once again from the twenty first to the twenty
third in Dallas, Texas, and you can sign up and
get your tickets at Assassination Conference dot com once again.

(01:24:43):
Go there and use the code o'celly ten which is
my name and one zero ten percent off that way.

Speaker 2 (01:24:49):
Anyways, Ken, what do you got to say? Let's close
it out here for the two and plus hours of
the show before I do my regular show.

Speaker 3 (01:24:58):
Ken.

Speaker 10 (01:25:01):
All right, well, if I may, I would like to
state my viewpoint on the research and community and the
importance of what on Lancer and having a conference does.
The research community is basically splinstered within three factions. We

(01:25:23):
have both a fast and spirts, those who believe it's
a logical conspiracy, and then we have those on the
fringe the everything is altered and all these buyers are
inserting themselves into history. So the two two ones there,

(01:25:46):
I want JFK Plancer to have a positive stape on
the research community.

Speaker 3 (01:25:56):
Ah.

Speaker 10 (01:25:57):
I feel that the issues that we have is on
the conspiracy side, involving the tutube ones, the ones that
say everything is older than.

Speaker 2 (01:26:09):
And still on.

Speaker 10 (01:26:11):
We have a lot of cleaning up to do on
our side. And I hope that answer with other people
because I don't. I don't. I'm not a gate keeper.
I disagree with certain speakers that are at the conference.
I won't say who. But there needs to be a

(01:26:34):
single platform. They're not a single platform, but a conference
that has the best the best people with constant actual documentation,
testing of theories, and sport through what did happen and

(01:26:57):
did not happen. Let's start to close the gap on
the conspiracy side to more of a single consensus of
a smaller and logical conspiracy.

Speaker 1 (01:27:13):
You know what, Ken? I, So you know what, Ken,
I'm in complete agreement with you, and I would say
it in a slightly different way, but I think you
and I are on the same page here, and we're
going to take the road trip together from from here
to Dallas anyway in a couple of weeks, so.

Speaker 2 (01:27:31):
We're going to get to know each other even better.
But during this time I'm looking forward to that.

Speaker 1 (01:27:38):
But during this time, I think you and I are
going to understand that what we're both interested in is
creating a singular sort of space where the more legitimate
exploration is going to emerge from Okay, And look, I
never wanted to get involved in any of the conferences

(01:27:59):
or any of the politics. I stayed away from it
for twenty something years because I just I didn't want
any part of it.

Speaker 2 (01:28:07):
It was just it seemed ridiculous to me.

Speaker 1 (01:28:09):
And back then it was the battle between you know,
COPA and Lancer. Not initially when I started, it was
you know, the ass conferences and stuff like that. But
there was this thing where it was like this battle
back and forth, and I said, I don't want any
part of it. You know, I'll contribute stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:28:27):
I even sent a few things in I gave away.

Speaker 1 (01:28:31):
I had people give away stuff at the conference to
try and you know, hey, here's some of my work.
Give it away since you're going. You know, I gave
it to friends. And the deal is, I think that
we need to finally get away from I mean, we've
had the wild West of the Internet, so anybody could
have slapped up any idea anywhere.

Speaker 2 (01:28:52):
We had, you know, the early days of various.

Speaker 1 (01:28:55):
Fringes, and I think it's time to trim some of
those fringes and get down to real bits business here,
because at the end of the day, you know, Look,
if you're interested in the crazy conspiracy story, you can
get that from anywhere.

Speaker 2 (01:29:07):
But if you want to get it, you.

Speaker 1 (01:29:09):
Know the historical reality and you know that the official
story doesn't work. We should all be able to come
to a consensus about what is realistic and what is
not realistic in the pursuit of that truth. And that's
the thing that has a loaded this community for a

(01:29:29):
long time, you know. It keeps breaking down into different
factions and clicks, and God help us.

Speaker 2 (01:29:35):
All, it's not getting us anywhere.

Speaker 1 (01:29:38):
We need to advance and not just rely on a
couple of people, you know, to finally bring consensus to us.

Speaker 2 (01:29:46):
We need to work together to do it.

Speaker 1 (01:29:48):
And I think, you know, just like with any other
heavy lifting project, multiple hands will make for a lighter
weight if we are all lifting together and we're all
trying to lift the same stuff together, and diverging into
these different off road adventures, you know, and adding on
extra elements and extra scenarios to the existing conspiracy is unnecessary, okay,

(01:30:15):
And yeah, we do need to sort there have been
people that have taken advantage, honestly of people's interest and
have you know, done for whatever reason. I don't even
want to speak to their motivations, but for whatever reason,
have inserted themselves into the research community and tried to
claim legitimacy as witnesses, as sources, as you know, people

(01:30:39):
that had you know, oh, I know all about this
particular area, whatever expertise, and we do need to sort it.
We need to do that through peer review and through
proper examination and test everything. And I think it is
time for us to sort out a way to come
to a better consensus and yeah, rate ourselves from that fringe.

Speaker 2 (01:31:02):
So I agree with you one hundred percent. Ken. Is
there anything else though that you want to add?

Speaker 1 (01:31:06):
As we get you know, within two weeks now of
the Lancer conference again the twenty first to the twenty
third of this month, all right in Dallas, Texas and
Assassination Conference dot com. Go there and sign up. I'm
not going to tell you my coupon code again because
you meet it and hear it already, then I guess
you're not going to hear it. So Ken, anything else

(01:31:27):
you want to throw in at the end or what?

Speaker 4 (01:31:29):
Uh?

Speaker 10 (01:31:30):
Just much like if you're going to a conference, you
have to precide do you want one where they are
claiming that body is alscred that the the Prouder film
is all third, that these documents are a third, or
do you want to go to ate them conference where

(01:31:51):
the truth isn't as fancy, we don't tell stories as good,
but at least I'm with us. You you get honesty,
you you get common sense. So if you're interested, you
can attend, either in person or virtually by going to

(01:32:12):
Assassination Conference dot com and say it, but I'll say it,
U's o'atelly ten or ten percent off.

Speaker 2 (01:32:22):
I appreciate it. And yeah, that's that's what it boils
down to.

Speaker 1 (01:32:26):
Is look, either either you want to go and see
the fantastic story or you want to get at the reality.
And uh sorry, but Lancer is the only place. And
by the way, I don't one hundred percent agree with
everybody that's presenting either, but that's not what it's about.
It's not about agreement. It's about consensus at least sanity.

(01:32:48):
Uh and and and that's where we're at on our
side of things, and that's why I'm doing this.

Speaker 2 (01:32:53):
So there you go.

Speaker 1 (01:32:55):
And again I want to thank everybody for joining us
tonight and hopefully you got something new out of this
and you'll join us one way or another for the
conference in Dallas by going to Assassination Conference dot com.

Speaker 2 (01:33:07):
There you go.

Speaker 6 (01:33:08):
Can you express my callers? Though there anyone else who
happens to get on the air of jelly dot com.
You've not necessarily reflected he uses jelly dot com or
jumbo jelly, and we are not responsible for any.

Speaker 2 (01:33:17):
Stupidity which you might issue. Thank you, h

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Ochelli Effect 11-7-2025 Lancer Special with Bob and Janet Groden - Ken Zendiker - Alex Harris - Joe Scooter Borelli

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Ochelli Effect 11-7-2025 Lancer Special with Bob and Janet Groden - Ken Zendiker - Alex Harris - Joe Scooter Borelli