Ochelli Effect 19-24-2025 Friday Night Call-in with B Pete Part 1

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Ready four tell me that, as the blind man yells
at his computer, it is October twenty four, twenty twenty five,
allegedly according to that thing we call a calendar, and
I'm finally back to being live. Of course, most of
you catch the podcast, whether you like it or not.

(00:27):
That's how anybody listens to me anymore. Most of the
time the live show is not so popular. But if
you're hearing me, let's see, it's almost twenty three minutes
after eight God help me, eight pm Eastern here on
the twenty fourth day of October twenty twenty five. Right,
if you're hearing me live right then and there in
the Eastern time zone, you can call in and become

(00:50):
part of this whatever it becomes. Okay, three one nine
five two seven five zero one six three one nine
five two seven five zero one. I even put out
announcements about this ahead of time, and went live at
seven thirty, ready to roll, and did a short podcast,
and I was ready to go. I was signing off

(01:10):
two minutes before my time, and I thought I was
all said. All I had to do was make a
new link for be Pete to join me, and then
turn on the phones and We're good to go. Nope, anyway,
That's that kind of sums up my week, though. Every
time I try and do something, complications getting away, delay it,
destroy it, or absolutely cancel it. And that just seems

(01:33):
to be the way things are going, whether it's a
piece of work, whether it's money I'm supposed to get,
whether it's you know, the things that are supposed to
go my way, a piece of technology. Hell, yesterday and
my son comes to me and says, I can't get
my TV screen on because we don't have TV, but
he does have a PlayStation, and lo and behold the
big TV that we hardly ever use. That he pretty

(01:53):
much just has to himself out there in the living
room is no longer working. So I don't know what
to tell you. Technology turning against me, the software turning
against me? Am I paranoid? Or does the world really
hate me? Perhaps it's just God who hates me. I
don't know. I'm thinking out loud about all these things
at the moment, and I'm trying to do some good

(02:14):
and get ready cause a month from today I'm going
to be on my way home, hopefully, you know, in
one piece and everything from Dallas, Okay, and I don't
even know how I'm going to handle buying a razor
and even to have a couple of packs of cigarettes
while I go away. I don't even know how I'm
doing that. So you know, I do have a ride there,

(02:35):
and I've got a room to crash in, but everything
else is going to be on the hustle that weekend,
got to tell you, and I'm looking forward to it
in a way. But also I'm going to be working
my ass off and I'll keep to myself until afterwards
how I think things are going to go. But I
swear I should write it in a sealed envelope so
that I can, you know, show people that I'm able

(02:55):
to predict the future. Oh. Also, next week on Friday,
before we go live, okay, on this show. On Friday Night,
we're going to do a special and there should be
a lot of JFK people calling in next Friday night
before I do this show, and we're gonna, you know,
like say, starting at about five pm Eastern. It's the

(03:16):
plan right now, We're gonna have all the presenters that
we can gather call in and on Halloween tell you
what it is they're going to be talking about. At
the Lancer conference, and also, god knows this, a couple
other things we might schedule along the way. So between
five pm and eight pm Eastern next Friday, that's what
we'll be doing on here, and I've got some other

(03:36):
interesting live plans for next week. We'll definitely hear from
Larry Hancock again. I'm hoping to hear from Mike Swanson and
maybe some first time guests. I don't know how it's
gonna go for this young man who is eighteen and
wanted to come on and begin a retro radio kind
of thing with us. We might have that announcement coming
up soon and perhaps a nervous breakdown or two for

(04:00):
me along the way. I don't know, so, b Pete,
how has your week been? Before I get into any
other housekeeping duties and updating people on anything else, how's
things going your neck of the woods.

Speaker 2 (04:15):
I've been busy all week. I've had contractors.

Speaker 3 (04:17):
And give me quotes on getting some power run out
to the garage and some other things I.

Speaker 2 (04:23):
Need to get done. So it's been busy.

Speaker 1 (04:26):
Yeah, you're still improving that house, huh.

Speaker 3 (04:30):
Other than that, trying to get study working on this
thing till I die.

Speaker 1 (04:36):
Yeah, you're still upgrading and improving that house. Renovations and such.

Speaker 3 (04:40):
Yeah, Yeah, it's been It's been kind of hard because
contractors trying to get them.

Speaker 2 (04:48):
In and get quotes from.

Speaker 3 (04:49):
You know, one guy takes a week and a half
to get you a price together. It's apparently you know
there's work to be done, but these guys are so
busy that they I just can't get to it. Give
you a price and get on down the road.

Speaker 2 (05:02):
Let you make a decision.

Speaker 3 (05:03):
But I finally settled with one guy. It's gonna cost
me probably about six hundred bucks to run power out
and get my whole garage done, and then I'm completely
renovated and then move inside over the wintertime. I still
got a fireplace to convert from gas logs over to
just back to a regular fireplace.

Speaker 2 (05:24):
I get all that done for it gets cold.

Speaker 1 (05:26):
Sounds like you're putting your quote retirement end quote to
good use, because you're supposed to be sort of retired
now and you're upgrading the home. I mean, that's what
a lot of people decide to do, right when they
stop doing their steady day job. Right.

Speaker 3 (05:45):
Well, I'm hoping that when I need it, I can
flip this thing and get into something smaller.

Speaker 2 (05:49):
I don't need this big of a house.

Speaker 3 (05:52):
I just go buy one of those tiny houses and
put it on a little quarter acre lots somewhere.

Speaker 1 (05:58):
Or maybe you can hang on to it as a
rental property, you know, and utilize it as a piece
of income. I mean that's possibility too, right now.

Speaker 3 (06:06):
Okay, well I could, I could, and it would help
on time, he says. But if I go ahead and
sell it, then I can do something else, get something
one level, much smaller, much more.

Speaker 2 (06:20):
That's the problem.

Speaker 3 (06:21):
I'm hoping to get this thing flipped before I have
to replace a central heating unit or something major. So,
I mean, I've got enough to do ripping out the
floor in a kitchen. We're going to open that thing
up this fall and get all that done, so I
don't I'm scared of a new heat pump. I'm looking at,
you know, twenty thousand dollars.

Speaker 1 (06:38):
Oh, twenty grand for a heat pump. Huh wow, Well
that's you know, but it's a good thing to have
something though, you know.

Speaker 2 (06:46):
So we do heat pump and then have to.

Speaker 3 (06:52):
Well it's they told me when I first got in here,
when I had to get a bunch of duck work
to replace that. Replacing the ductwork in this old house
would cost.

Speaker 2 (07:00):
As much as a new unit.

Speaker 3 (07:02):
So if I have to put in a new unit,
you know, I'm thinking, Abou'm going with a split system
and just own this thing off, and it'd be a
lot cheaper, a lot easier.

Speaker 2 (07:11):
Uh. I don't know. As down the road, that's cool.

Speaker 1 (07:14):
We already have one caller. Looks like we got Jimmy
waiting on the line, so definitely want to hear what
he has to say. I don't know, maybe he's got
things on his mind from the week's worth of news
that is, or was, or maybe was because it's getting
weird out there.

Speaker 2 (07:30):
Man.

Speaker 1 (07:30):
Yeah, Jimmy, he was the earlier, Oh he was, Okay,
I was earlier.

Speaker 2 (07:34):
I figured he'd be calling right in.

Speaker 1 (07:36):
I barely had time to look at the room because
I was doing I did the news thing and it
was fine, you know, I was just doing my quick
little rundown. I was going to tell a story. I
ran out of time, and like I said, I was
going to go straight ahead. But you don't know the
frustration I just went through trying to let the damn
there's an application on my desktop now right to run
the phones and this thing is you know, the change.

(08:00):
It allowed us to keep doing the phone calls. But
it's worked fine, of course, and it was an hour
ahead of time I was set up. I looked at it,
it was fine, everything was cool, and then it logged
me out for no reason. It hasn't logged me out
for like the past month and a half, and it
logged me out, and I'm like, okay, I try to
sign back in. And I don't know about you, but
I've been having trouble with like all of a sudden,

(08:21):
things don't accept my passwords and I've been using the
same passwords on some of these things for years. I
don't know. Is it just me or you know what?
What do you think.

Speaker 2 (08:36):
I've had something? I've had some issues with some sites.

Speaker 3 (08:38):
Not In fact, I was in an ATM about a
week and a half ago and it kept telling me I.

Speaker 2 (08:45):
Was putting in the wrong pin.

Speaker 3 (08:47):
So I had to get my phone out, use my
app to go in, change my pin number to what
it originally was, and then my card worked.

Speaker 1 (08:56):
Weird. See, I don't know stuff stuff gets. It's a
weird world because stuff gets hijacked by these you know,
different hackers now and they turn around and even they
do little fishing things where they get you to change
your password on a fake site and now they have
your password, right Like, they get you to enter your
old password and your new one, and so they've got

(09:20):
it covered. They get into your account while you're sitting
there struggling with it still, and they empty things or
change things or destroy things. It's crazy. Somebody logged into
my Pinterest account weirdly this week from South Carolina for
no reason. Yeah, and I'm like, why are you in
my Pinterest account? Yeah? Like, what good is that going

(09:40):
to do? I don't do any business through there. I mean,
do you even do business on Pinterest? Is that a thing?
I don't even know?

Speaker 3 (09:46):
You know, I didn't think you could unless you're selling
prints of something of your own, maybe for something maybe.

Speaker 1 (09:55):
But I put up like the conferences on there, and
I used to put up stuff from the podcast just
when I had the YouTube channel, because they sort of
encouraged you to share everything across platforms and they gave
you easy buttons. So I mean that's literally why I
created the Pinterest account, because it was like a simple Hey,
you can sign up for nothing and it'll be just
another place where we promote you know, your podcast or whatever. Which,

(10:19):
by the way, I've got some kind of crazy. Can
you hear the sirens and stuff in the background.

Speaker 3 (10:25):
No, but I'm on an earphone too, on my phone,
so kicking up everything.

Speaker 1 (10:30):
Well outside in my neighborhood. Apparently there is I don't know,
fire rescue, ambulance, cops. There's all kinds of crazy out
there right now. So all right, anyways, enough of all
that and enough of the local traumas. Uh. Maybe I'll
get into an interesting story later on about my days
as a convenience store worker that I thought were relevant
and I was going to tell in the pre show

(10:51):
but didn't get to it. It's like that this has
been my motif all week. I'm trying to do stuff
and it doesn't get done. Complications keep coming up and
changing it on me. But anyway, let's see what Jimmy
James has on his mind. Uh, and anybody else who
wants to join us here for this tonight. You become
the show, right You tell us what you want to
talk about, and that's where we'll go best we can. Anyway.

(11:13):
Three one nine five two seven, five zero one six
call in to talk to me, or Bet Pete or
hey one of the other callers if you feel like it.
Three one nine five two seven five zero one six.
And I think I got I should have. I clicked
on it. I clicked on Jimmy, let's see, come on,

(11:36):
what is It's the Uncooperative app Day. There we go, Jimmy.
You should be on now.

Speaker 4 (11:48):
Kyle Watson, Hey.

Speaker 1 (11:50):
How's it going? Man? What's what's on your mind this week? Hu?

Speaker 4 (12:00):
Where am I test one two series?

Speaker 2 (12:10):
Are you hearing him?

Speaker 1 (12:11):
I heard part of what he said and then it
went away, But now he seems to be back when
he said one two three, So I was just waiting
go ahead, Jimmy, yeah, but after I said, can you
now yes? Kind of go ahead?

Speaker 4 (12:30):
All right?

Speaker 1 (12:32):
All right?

Speaker 4 (12:33):
Well I just got that's good that you have and
you all get What is all that background noise going on?

Speaker 1 (12:41):
I only hear you and a little feedback from you.
That's it. So I don't hear background noise. Are you
hearing the sirens in the neighborhood? Are you hearing my sirens?

Speaker 2 (12:53):
Now?

Speaker 4 (12:53):
It sounds like a television.

Speaker 1 (12:55):
Oh no, no, television here you hear TV.

Speaker 2 (12:59):
B No, I've got the game on, but the sound
is off.

Speaker 1 (13:05):
Yeah, no, no TV sounds on our end. Man, Go ahead, huh.

Speaker 2 (13:14):
Let's see.

Speaker 4 (13:15):
Here's some interesting JFK tidbits that heard from secular sources,
which I'm finding to be more reliable than so called
our community.

Speaker 1 (13:29):
Mm hmm, goo ahead.

Speaker 4 (13:34):
It's one thing, I heard the old Mary Myers tale.
We all know the Mary Myers tale, don't we.

Speaker 1 (13:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (13:47):
One of JFK's means squeezes.

Speaker 1 (13:50):
Right, yeah, supposedly at an affair with her. It's cord
Meyer's wife. Blah blah. They smoke weed together, maybe drop
acid together, you know, maybe Cordmeyer. According to what I
Howard Hunt was in on the assassination partially because he
was pissed the JFK was banging his wife, that Mary
pincher Meyer. Right, yeah, that's the okay.

Speaker 4 (14:18):
What about Yeah, you both putted up a lot of stuff.

Speaker 1 (14:22):
They say.

Speaker 4 (14:23):
It's fascinating. I heard the exact same tale from a
totally secular crime podcast. Just interesting.

Speaker 5 (14:33):
I like that, Robb.

Speaker 4 (14:35):
These things I find more interesting hearing from what I
call secular sources. One thing, this is some of the
differences I heard from this pod from that podcast versus
any JFK source which I've heard this story from. I
don't know three researchers. I would suppose o gee now

(15:00):
then thought it would be of interest to mention the
Cordmers was of highly being investigated by Angleton because he
thought he was a Soviet mole.

Speaker 6 (15:13):
Gee.

Speaker 4 (15:14):
None of the researchers thought to put that in their
little bookie poos, did they? What else did I find out?
All the James Angleton was just in the town looking
for a place to burgle. Now ball try again.

Speaker 5 (15:33):
Ben Bradley and the woman's Zonne sister called Angleton because
apparently they were all.

Speaker 4 (15:41):
Sit good and that's how Ingleton had got involved.

Speaker 5 (15:45):
That Bradley's a liar, he's full of craft. So that's
one another.

Speaker 4 (15:55):
One guy thoughts on this, Well, there's ben't a different story.

Speaker 1 (16:00):
There's been a couple of people that have written about
this in books that focused on her some years ago,
and there was a documentary which was was planned. Well,
let me finish answer and then you go ahead, because
I don't have a lot to say on this. But
there was a documentary that was planned and never completed

(16:21):
that that was shot partially about this and sort of disappeared,
and it was weird because it had good funding and everything.
And some people claim that it was shut down because
of the the press is connection to the CIA is
what it was. And it would be like way too
obvious that they had, you know, too many inside sources.

(16:42):
You know, after a while you say, oh gee, look
at all these inside sources. You got to say, is
your organization possibly inside of that organization? And that's part
of the problem there. And the Mary Meyer thing is
like some people have made it into a major, huge deal.
I said it was also part of the I Howard
Hunt deal, right, because it was like, oh, this was

(17:04):
part of the big motivation. They easily got Corden Meyer
because he was pissed, you know, about this relationship that
they were carrying on with. And you know, the sources,
the beginning sources for this are messy, is what the
problem is. And then yeah, you got Ben Bradley, who's
told this story about going and collecting stuff. Right, He's
been in a couple of key places, you know, collecting

(17:26):
people's notes. Ben Bradley, by the way, and yeah, I
think it's suspicious. I don't know what to make of
all of it, because at the end of the day,
I don't see cord Meyer being involved in this, but
Angleton having gone after him and all that. Yeah, that
was kind of one of those things I think, was
it the was it the guy who wrote the biography

(17:48):
on Angleton, like what was it called like the Paranoid
Guy or something about him being paranoid? Right was he
wrote a whole thing about it, and it featured a
picture of like the urn being carried, you know, in
a funeral procession on the front cover. You know which
book I'm talking about, Jimmy.

Speaker 4 (18:13):
Also like the Man that the Secrets.

Speaker 1 (18:16):
Something like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, And they talked about
it extensively in there, But I don't know, It's just
one of those It's one of those places I never
dug much. And some people have sworn by it, I mean,
sort of like they do with the you know, Dorothy
Kilgallon's coming up again right as as something that needs
to be talked about and looked at right away again

(18:38):
and again, you know, because she supposedly had you know,
that last interview with Jack Ruby and all this, But
even in the you you ought to visit those zoom
calls on Thursday nights. Sometimes you know that Jimmy the
JFK Zoom calls. You ought to just listen to the
cross talk between certain people that are not necessarily big names,

(19:00):
but they go in a lot of wild directions. Boy.
And I mean they were really in a lot of
crazy directions last night. It was it was kind of strange.
I mean I was going to talk and decided not to,
uh because they were all on Zubruder, film alteration and
all kinds of things. And I'm like, wow, uh yeah, yes,

(19:27):
this is where it's because Mantic.

Speaker 4 (19:29):
Where their talk processes.

Speaker 1 (19:31):
Well part of them.

Speaker 4 (19:33):
Let's move it ahead about sixteen.

Speaker 1 (19:36):
Well that's what I keep saying. But the thing is,
nobody listens to me. Number one. Number two Mantic has
now come back out, and that's why I invited him
on the show. He was on black Op Radio I
think last night, uh, talking about his new discoveries regarding
you know, film alterations and picture alterations and uh and
all this and this is the new thing. And I'm like,

(20:00):
as in the X raise, well no, he's going after.

Speaker 4 (20:05):
Doctors immudical stuff.

Speaker 1 (20:10):
Well, he did a whole book covering the medical evidence.
It's a pretty expensive, like very nice looking book actually,
and uh you know, hardcover and all that, Like it
looks like a textbook the way it's set up and everything. Uh,
you know, like a like something you would educate people with.
And his main contention started with the X rays, right,

(20:30):
and and the autopsy photos. But now he's moved on
to you know really uh, I guess you know, being
the the Zabruder film alteration camp guy uh mantic is
now And I was going to invite him on here,
even though I disagree with that. Yeah, go ahead.

Speaker 3 (20:48):
I remember his h his stuff in Fetcher's Assassination Science
about the X rays and that. So he's coming out
with the alterations in the Zabruder film is his new gig, but.

Speaker 1 (21:01):
It's not new. He's been building up to this, and
he's been on the images for quite a while. Like
you said, that thing with Fetzer was probably what thirty
years ago, But he's published books on his own sense.
He's been involved with people since Doug Horn since I
mean a lot of I had him on what a
couple of years ago, I think, right, And apparently he's

(21:23):
got a brand new information. He said, if you had
a question, good.

Speaker 4 (21:29):
You had a question for me about the your stuff.

Speaker 3 (21:36):
Yeah, Ben Bradley, how did he find out about her death?
Because didn't he make it to her house before anybody
else did and rummage through it.

Speaker 2 (21:50):
After she was found dead?

Speaker 1 (21:52):
Well bred?

Speaker 4 (21:57):
And Bradley was her brother in law? Uh he was
a Meyer's sister, right, But I mean how And as
soon I knew they were related by marriage, the sister
called Ben.

Speaker 3 (22:16):
Brad go ahead, Jimmy, I didn't know touching Ben Bradingleton.

Speaker 2 (22:21):
Okay, So the okay? So the sister called, okay, Well.

Speaker 3 (22:26):
Didn't they The cord Courd.

Speaker 2 (22:30):
Myners was out of town, wasn't he?

Speaker 1 (22:36):
Yes, they bla stood.

Speaker 4 (22:40):
On a black day and then he got off and
then he did the exact same thing again. So I
tend to think that he did do it. I'll think
there's anything beyond that murder. But I just found it
in testing out different story. So you know, I learned

(23:02):
these interesting points not from people i'd like to like.

Speaker 1 (23:07):
I'm listening to.

Speaker 5 (23:08):
Conan O'Brien interview Andy Rickner, and I learned something very interesting.

Speaker 4 (23:16):
Andy Rickner's dad was in the OSS in World War
two and he was good with languages, so they sent
him to the Monterey Language Institute, which was a one
year course, not six months.

Speaker 2 (23:34):
One year.

Speaker 4 (23:35):
Chinese and Russian takes a whole year, everything else six months, Right,
Paul didn't have that time, Oopsy.

Speaker 1 (23:46):
No you didn't. Well, that's the thing, I don't. He
gets really weird when you get into what Oswald was
capable of writing and what he wasn't. Because even his
good friend, you know, Titibitz, when he would write to him,
you know, he wrote letters back here once him and

(24:06):
Marina came to the US, right, he would write in
Russian to Marina and in English to Lee. You know
what I mean, Because Lee's command of the language was
not great. I know, some people have like made it
in this big legend like he had this, you know,
wonderful command of the language, and I don't think he
was that great about it. It seems to me as

(24:26):
though he had a very rudimentary sort of grip on it,
even after living there. That's what it appears to me,
you know. But again I wasn't in his presence, so
it's difficult to know. But Marina kind of supported that
idea when at last I spoke to her many years
ago that his Russian wasn't that great. You know, if
you were patient with him, you could understand what he

(24:48):
was trying to get at. But it wasn't you know, precise,
let's say his Russian. But anyway, and that's the whole
thing too, with the whole you know, translation and what's
going on, and people are going after more. The community
is getting weirder and weirder by the by the minute.
I got to tell you too, I'm gonna hold my

(25:12):
comments until after the conference really about this whole thing,
because man, I got I got some things to say,
and I'm really just trying to be diplomatic at this point,
but it ain't easy. By the way, Jimmy, did you
happen to catch that what do they call it? The
Seiphered History podcast? That I did?

Speaker 6 (25:34):
No?

Speaker 4 (25:35):
Na yet?

Speaker 1 (25:36):
Okay, they finally got it up on you. They finally
got it up on YouTube. But I spent five and
a half hours with these guys because they lost the
first three hours of the of a conversation. I kind
of had to redo it and uh, and finally they
got it out there. But it's kind of kind of interesting.
I'm probably gonna put out the audio on my podcast feed,

(25:58):
but I wanted to give them a chance to get
it out there first, but it's up on YouTube, so
may maybe I'll figure out a way to drop a
link in the room. But they started, you know, really
to grill me on the films. Was that.

Speaker 7 (26:15):
The films in the Plaza?

Speaker 1 (26:17):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (26:23):
Really, yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:24):
I'm not sure which ones made it to I'm not
sure which ones made it to the podcast, but we
discussed several films from the Plaza. You know, obviously we
had to touch on Suppruiter. I did a long thing
on Nicks. I don't think he's in there, which sucks
because I'm very sure the Gale would have been happy
with it. But they were asking for explanations and you know,

(26:46):
in certain really badly badly assembled conspiracy theories people have
made out of some of the films, where I'm like, yeah,
that's that's no good. You know, what people are talking
about here and this, and that they're looking at a
bad cop I mean, come on, you know, stuff like that,
And and I gave them the context, you know, for
what we actually have in our possession and what we're

(27:08):
looking at. Literally, you know, here's the best copy of it.
But these are copies. They're not the original, you know,
and stuff like that, and even asked me about the
Patsy Pascal film, which is a rare question from these guys.
Nobody ever asked about that film. But it is one
of the ones that wasn't, you know, part of the
Groden collection for the longest time. It wasn't part of

(27:29):
it at all, So a lot of people never saw
it because you know, you got to give credit where
credits due. Grodin his release of that bulk of films
has now been like the place where everybody lifts them
and uses them online and everything. They pretty much you've
got to trace it back to him as to where
they got these films that they're studying most of them,

(27:51):
you know, even Sipruder. If you're looking at a stabilized
the Pruder film, you know, Dimes to Donuts. I'm telling
you right now, it's probably something that originated with Groden,
you know. So you got to consider that when you're
looking at how many generations away from the original copy
and everything else. It's just remarkable the way that people

(28:12):
misunderstand and take and read these things like they find
what they want to find in the films, you know,
so spent a couple a couple of hours. I think
that podcast might ended up being an hour and a
half or two hours, but there was a good five
and a half six hours worth of stuff that should
have been recorded when we're going over to films.

Speaker 4 (28:31):
So, now, what about Groden Groen? Has Groden showed us
up lately?

Speaker 1 (28:38):
Yeah, of course yes, because.

Speaker 4 (28:39):
He usually pops up about.

Speaker 1 (28:43):
Yeah, of course.

Speaker 4 (28:44):
Well what's what that guy suppose?

Speaker 6 (28:47):
I sick?

Speaker 7 (28:48):
Yeah, I want to know what I mean market film
And it's a stiff for because I'm guessing that he
stole the cow from Wiesburg, which Wiseberg got to find
the damn?

Speaker 1 (29:07):
Okay? So the which Martin film? Are we talking about? Jack?
Or the other one?

Speaker 4 (29:15):
Shoddy Martin the Minace?

Speaker 1 (29:18):
So okay, okay, So you think that Weissberg probably had
the original or a copy from the original.

Speaker 4 (29:31):
We got a copy of them from the FBI. Correct.

Speaker 1 (29:37):
Yeah, see, now the FBI's the FBI's possessions of these films.
Is another weird point of contention, because that that was
one of the things they were arguing about last night,
and it's like, oh, we don't know the providence.

Speaker 4 (29:52):
Of this weird period Chef sixty four sixty eight evidence
and then once scars just started as crap, that's when
they clamped down, just saying.

Speaker 1 (30:12):
Well, yeah, but all that stuff from sixty four on
is almost irrelevant because the original handling of it is
where the problems begin. So that weekend on is where
you got to look for where these things were first
deposited and sent and sold to et cetera and collected,

(30:33):
because everything else pretty much becomes, you know, a follow
to the copy trail after that, even Garrison's copies. I
had one of the ones that was made from Garrison's copies.
I had literally had a physical possessional one, and they
were rough, really bad copies. You know, there was practically

(30:54):
no color in them, so all the color was gone,
even though it was a color print, you know, which
tells you that this is, you know, not not a
solid job. They didn't they didn't take the time to
you know, reproduce this thing well. And I don't know
where it was done, but there was a mass of

(31:15):
them done, and then they were distributed on the college
campuses after that, and I don't know if copies were
made of those copies, but by the time I got mine,
I mean literally, it was like almost like no color
was being projected anymore, Like you couldn't You could see
it on the film, but it was vague, you know,
the color and everything. So it was And it's funny

(31:38):
if you take a look at that and you overlay
it on you know, good color like slide from say
the McMillan version of it, which was put on the
CD rom Did you ever see that, by the way, Jimmy,
the McMillan version of the film.

Speaker 4 (31:56):
No, But the minute you say that name, all I
could think of is that crazy woman McMillan.

Speaker 1 (32:01):
Yeah, but well, I don't know if they're related. But
there used to be a media or a publishing company,
let's say McMillan who ended up really dominating, like say
the school age textbook industry in the country. You've heard
of them, right, the McMillan publishers.

Speaker 4 (32:25):
Yes, well so mclovin.

Speaker 1 (32:30):
No, that can't be right. No, McMillan, it's McMillan. Yeah,
it's McMillan. And they produced probably the majority of us
that that went to public schools, say in the you know,
in the sixties, seventies, eighties. It's a guarantee that the
majority of our textbooks were likely, you know, McMillan books

(32:54):
the majority of what we had to handle almost anywhere
in the sixties, seventies, eighties. So, but they were they
were a publisher, and they did a CD ROM on
the Zubruter film. Have you ever been aware of that
that there was like a CD ROMs study of the
Subruter film for computers like in the nineties.

Speaker 4 (33:20):
Well, I'm sure it happened. I mean, I never fooled
with those things.

Speaker 1 (33:25):
Okay, Well, it's just that it gave you a good,
a good something to study, you know, good digital reproduction
of the film, especially for its time period. It was
it was, you know, the best you were going to
get for sure to be able to see the film right,
and you had to be in the TV industry to
do better. They made a few mistakes, but if you

(33:47):
look at the McMillan version and you're able to take
like say one of those a slide even from that
one of the crappy Garrison versions, you know, you can
overlay it and you can see that it definitely hasn't
been altered in between then and then. So what I'm
saying is that the film that you know was gotten
from time Life and then bootlegged is the same film

(34:12):
that they produced. You know, maybe they did it at
the end of the eighties, but they definitely distributed in
the nineties. The McMillan maybe you could look that up
real quick, b PTE. The DVD ROM or CD ROM
of the Zapruder film. It was kind of a unique
thing and I'm pretty sure it was. Yeah, it was
released by McMillan. I know that, and somewhere in my

(34:35):
archive of crap. I definitely have one still, you know,
because it is a solid study aid still even I
would say, if you can get a computer that will
run as.

Speaker 4 (34:50):
That would be the first that's the first digital version.

Speaker 1 (34:52):
Then well there's two. There's two things that I would
say contend for the first digital version. One is the
MPI home video, which they did a VHS release of,
like the Zubruder film.

Speaker 3 (35:08):
Is this the one called Is this the one called
the Image of an Assassination?

Speaker 1 (35:13):
No, that's that's the one that I'm talking about now.
The CD ROM is different. Yeah, The Image of an
Assassination is a basically just a home video showing you
the Zubruder film and slow motion blown up everything, and
they created uh, you know. They they created a frame

(35:33):
by frame scan in order to create image of an assassination,
the same way that McMillan did. Now the mp I want, Yeah,
that's that.

Speaker 4 (35:44):
That's the one that I read from HOFDW foot Hollywood
video cap.

Speaker 1 (35:49):
Yeah. Probably, yeah, And if you were real lucky, you
might have found it on DVD because there was a
short run on DVD as well. Today there are many
bootlegs of that dv day like they made for them,
but they're made from the VHS, which is funny. So
if you were to get something even better than you know,
or even like a digital reproduction, they digitally reproduced it

(36:12):
but then ended up putting it on a VHS tape,
so you know VHS. You know what the resolution was
like on that.

Speaker 7 (36:19):
Well, this was before BD.

Speaker 4 (36:22):
This was the glory days. Yes, when VHS was keen man.
The left coast used to be cool back then. Dude,
Oh yeah, the whole bottom floor was a Hollywood visit.
Well no, maybe a million titles and then the whole
second storically I had Shop.

Speaker 1 (36:48):
La Ahead shop. Uh all right, well look I'm gonna
put you on hold, Jimmy because we got other callers,
but stick around and we'll continue the conversation. But the
the film thing is he's getting weird. I got to
tell you in Mantic is going to present. I don't
want to promote this, but Mantic, I think, is going
to present at the Baker Conference. So you know, make

(37:10):
of it what you will. And he did an appearance
on Black Op Radio last night, and I'm not here
to do his pr but he might be on this
show next week. We'll see if I can arrange that.
He wanted to come on this week, but like, he
wanted to do it at an odd time of day,
and I was not ready for him immediately, so because

(37:30):
we would have done it in the morning, and anybody
who knows me knows morning is not my time of day.
And it just I was like, yeah, maybe we're better
off doing it next week. And he's like, you know what, yes,
because I'm not as busy and I want to come
on next week. So we'll see if we can get
mantic on to explain.

Speaker 4 (37:49):
Sorry, Charles with seven am be okay, yeah.

Speaker 1 (37:53):
That's a little rough.

Speaker 4 (37:54):
Farls with seven am ok be a little a.

Speaker 1 (37:58):
Little rough, a little rough for me anyway, hold on,
so let's put Jimmy on hold, and uh, I have
another call here. I'm not sure who we got, but
let's see and uh, there we go. You're alive and
uh tracked some Ken. Hey Ken, how's it going, man?

Speaker 8 (38:20):
I'm the one little girl I was listening in and
I actually have a few things to stay with many.

Speaker 1 (38:29):
Yeah, sure, Ken, Let's first identify who you are, okay,
Uh sure, because I've been back and forth quite a
bit with Ken recently, and also we're working together him,
his wife, myself. Uh you know, Ken, I'm always afraid
to pronounce your last name. Uh so, you know, but

(38:52):
it's it looks like Zenda Car. It looks like Zenda Car. Okay,
but I don't know if I did that right, I
probably butchered it. Yeah that's not close fair enough, thank you.
I'm sensitive to that because, believe me, o'celly gets put
your eighty different ways. But here's one of the guys that, Yeah,
I'm sure, we're literally working with on the Lancer conference

(39:15):
and we're actually due for a conference call.

Speaker 6 (39:18):
Ken.

Speaker 1 (39:19):
Uh so, I didn't know you were calling in tonight,
but anyway, sure, say what you like. I was talking
about the films and Mantic just now, but yes, I
was on this. Oh okay, so I'll just shut up then,
unless be Pete, you got something you want to talk
to Ken about real quick or ask him or anything
before we let him get into it.

Speaker 3 (39:41):
No, I'm still trying to find your CD ROM version
of the suppruve or film and it having a weak
through a bunch of crap.

Speaker 1 (39:49):
But I'm sorry, Well, it's not something that there's a
lot of them out there anymore. It's probably a collector's
item at this point, Ken, the you know the McMillan. Yeah,
I'm not. Yeah, I think I have one as well.
That is one of the old tools that I might
still actually have. I'm looking to maybe collect a few

(40:09):
new ones. But I'm gonna have no cash at the conference,
I was saying to people earlier, so you might want
to make contributions guys to help me. You know, eat,
have a razor, buy cigarettes throughout the weekend if you can. Coffee.
Coffee is something I'm gonna need, just saying, because I
plan to be working all weekend on the Lancer conference,
which again is the twenty first to the twenty third

(40:32):
next month and less than a month from now, I
expect to be on my way home. So you know,
we're ticking right on up to it, and I'm a
little nervous. Ken, I gotta be honest with you, because
I got no funds. I'm kind of going there like
on a shoe string, and I'm taking a ride. And
full disclosure, Ken is supposed to be giving me a

(40:52):
ride there. I hope that plan is still in place
because I don't have an alternative to get in there. Okay,
So Ken and I are going on a road trip
to Lancer, probably what on the twentieth or something, a
day or two before the conference, because we'll have to
start get there twelve hours, right, Yeah, it's that area, right, Yeah,

(41:17):
So latest will leave probably is like Thursday morning or something.
If we're gonna leave early, you know, I mean, if
we're gonna leave early on Thursday with that, yeah, right,
that would be the latest time we'd leave is Thursday morning.
So we'd probably leave on the twentieth that latest, and
then yeah, on the twenty fourth here, I expect to

(41:37):
be either home or on the way back, so you know,
and you're you're also bringing me home, right, I didn't
even ask yes, Okay, yes, thank god? Because the blind
guy can't rent a car and get here no matter
how much money I have, even if I had money,
So I'm kind of depending on you Ken, you know,

(41:58):
don't strand me. Okay, anyways, all jokes aside. Uh, yeah,
Mantic is definitely making waves and being mentioned in a
lot of places. And like I said, uh, you know,
has continued to publish on the Sabbruder film now And
I heard a lot of conversation about it last night,
and I was kind of like, oh, man, are we

(42:20):
still doing this? But anyway, go ahead and say what
you got to say about it or want to say
about anything. Go ahead, Okay, Well, so.

Speaker 8 (42:33):
Is making small waves in a kitty hoole of neronic ideas,
and and they're there.

Speaker 1 (42:43):
Uh and.

Speaker 8 (42:46):
Yeah, I would probably also throw in, uh, that's as well.

Speaker 6 (42:53):
People who.

Speaker 9 (42:56):
Are trying to state that these Prudis film was altered, Okay,
it literally couldnot be done.

Speaker 6 (43:06):
During that optical printers could not capture the images.

Speaker 10 (43:12):
Between these brockels, And even if they could, you would
have to basically reform that be ask doact ratio and
then put it onto a film, and you would have
to alter the entire thing prior.

Speaker 1 (43:26):
To the.

Speaker 9 (43:29):
The inpertinent issue by being where they printed very important frames.

Speaker 6 (43:37):
So his pause right there, You're like, what are they
trying to say?

Speaker 1 (43:40):
Can is altered? Can pause right there, because I guarantee
a lot of people are already lost. Right you're talking
about optical printers and all this other stuff. Let's bring
it down to the very most simple elements, okay, which look,
this is this is what I think I'm good at.
Maybe I'm not. You know, your your judgment, even to

(44:00):
all of you. But the thing is this you have
to you are well. I appreciate that. But even if
I'm stupid, let's try and bring it down to stupid
levels so we can understand this. Okay, Okay, November twenty
nine is the date right of the Life magazine where
they print Depending on which version you have, they print

(44:22):
what between four and six I think, like frames from
the Subbruder film. I don't have it in front of me,
but I know I have copies behind me, big colored.

Speaker 6 (44:34):
I have it on my belt, but I have like
a hundred of them, so yeah, I know I have.

Speaker 1 (44:39):
I have more than one version of it too. That's
the other thing, which by the way, is weird. But okay,
The thing is this, these things a big giant life
magazine from that era is not even like magazine size
of recent years where it had a standard It was
the larger standard size magazine of the era. So that's
the first thing. And these are the bruter frames were

(45:02):
literally half a page apiece, okay, on the magazine in color,
very nicely printed really, And they have one version where
you have frame three thirteen that got out, and one
version that doesn't contain frame three thirteen, okay, which is
the head explosion frame, to put it in layman's terms,

(45:23):
all right, And those numbers come from the FBI, the
number of frames, et cetera. Okay, So again without getting
lost in the details, that thing has a publication date
of the twenty ninth, sure of November, right, So if
it was published on the twenty ninth, that means that
it was printed ahead of the twenty ninth. It was

(45:43):
shipped okay to subscribers and everything else. Usually, you know,
a normal magazine, they ship it a little bit ahead
of the date that it says on the cover. So
what you're saying is that in a week's time, okay,
from the twenty second, when the event occurs, to the
twenty ninth. This would be the maximum amount of time

(46:07):
you have to release this magazine fully printed, ready to go,
so that means retrieve it, get the film, reproduce it
so that it's usable transfer it over. And this is
not in the age of digital any damn thing. So
you have to deep in mind that there was a
very small window, okay where this could have been done.

(46:30):
So you have a film that has to be in
the possession obviously of Time Life and their various agents,
which then inserts Robert Groden into the equation retroactively, because
later on he gets hold of a mechanics copy okay,
from one of the places that was hired to do
some of the work for Life magazine. Okay, just let

(46:51):
me know when I make a mistake, can I appreciate it?
So here's the thing. You have one week where it's
even possible for them to take and start putting frames out.
That's one two all of this.

Speaker 6 (47:05):
Obviously, I would say, it's not even a week.

Speaker 1 (47:08):
Sorry, I.

Speaker 6 (47:11):
I'm just cutting here.

Speaker 1 (47:12):
Uh.

Speaker 6 (47:13):
They have to counter it when by nine woman flew
it all the way to your city.

Speaker 1 (47:21):
Well, if you don't mind, I want to add that
punchline if you don't mind, Ken, I want to add
that punchline at the end, if you don't mind, because
that week is now going to is gonna get worse
later on when I explain what we got to cut
off of that week, because there's a bunch of things.
But let's just leave it at They have a week
before they have to, you know, publicize portions of the film. Okay,

(47:42):
so we'll put that aside for now, and understand this.
The other major contention that I keep hearing from like everybody, is, oh,
they removed frames. Okay, this concept of removing frames to
change the speed, to change the direction of the head, snap,
to do all these different things. Okay, forget about their
goals and what it is they were trying to achieve,

(48:04):
all right, because here's the bottom line. The public doesn't
necessarily understand film to begin with, and certainly there is
now an even bigger problem because of the difference in
technology from then to now and even all of the
in betweens. Okay, here's the problem, though, If you literally

(48:26):
pluck frames from a film of that time period, you
do not get the expected effects that people think. It's
not like pulling pages out of a flip book and
rearranging them. It doesn't work that way. So this is
why they need to introduce all of these other intricacies
of the optical printer and how state of the art

(48:49):
cutting edge stuff. And here's the thing. I will concede
that there was cutting edge technology in the hands of
many people, whether it's in Hollywood or at the CIA
or whatever else. But I promise we're generations ahead of
what the general public knew about. So I don't even
want to, you know, get into the muck on that argument.
Here's the thing, though, if you just pull frames out

(49:10):
of that film as quickly as you would have to
before it was viewed by many people, uh who before
it was viewed by people in the government uh and
outside of the government. Because remember, the FBI walked away
with a copy. According to the story that I know,
the FBI walked away with a copy. Okay, the time

(49:30):
Life people walked away with a copy, and then there
was a third copy at least that it's a little confusing,
but I think, yeah, go ahead.

Speaker 6 (49:41):
Yeah, slightly wrong, Go ahead. So in one of the
copies there was a thrifmaide on that day. The other
two when Cheo.

Speaker 10 (49:55):
The Secrets did this, and the FBI actually requested a
I'm copy.

Speaker 6 (50:02):
From one of these Chris Wares, but they had on
two of them.

Speaker 1 (50:05):
Yeah, okay. The Secret Service ended up loaning one of
their copies to the FBI, if I remember right, that's
where their copy comes from, and that's what they wind
up using as a training aid and also used in
the production of that WFAA TV thing that I posted online,
which was this whole production which showed you pieces of

(50:27):
nix Zupruter and much more. Okay, which coincidentally, yes, we're
also printed frame by frame in the Warren Commission volumes.
I think it's eighteen if I'm not mistaken. Volume eighteen
I think contains the Prince of the film.

Speaker 6 (50:44):
Of course, yes eight beam Exhibit eighty.

Speaker 1 (50:50):
Thank you, Exhibit eight eighty five is supruiter, but much
more in Knicks are in there. They're like right after
it in the same volume, right, Sorry, Ken, you kind
of like went funny there for a second. I didn't
hear you.

Speaker 6 (51:09):
Oh sorry, I said, I think it's in the same song,
but I would have to couple watch out.

Speaker 1 (51:17):
Yeah, no problem, but either way, there's black and white
prints of that in the Warren Commission volumes. All right,
either way, all of these things would now have to
match once again afterwards. And this idea of just plucking
frames out is ludicrous if you actually did it, It
makes no sense with the things that they're trying to
say they would have accomplished now if you turn around

(51:38):
and you pull the elements apart and literally do which. Yes, indeed,
there was a lot of like Hollywood magic where people
did some wild things with films before the days of photoshop,
et cetera. Okay, before George Lucas had to invent editing programs, okay,
which he did. He invented stuff in order to shoot
Star Wars, Okay, long before those days, they had lots

(52:01):
of wild magic. Some stuff they did literally with like
razor blades and clear tape I'm not kidding, where they
literally would take somebody and cut them carefully out of
a frame and place them in a place where they
couldn't possibly be and stuff like that. Okay. They used
to do some of that stuff by hand.

Speaker 6 (52:18):
Yeah, it's called.

Speaker 1 (52:20):
Yeah, superimposing, right, okay, And that was the very physical
version of doing it, which was one way, and there
were other magical ways that they reshot stuff. They created
different methodologies for literally like shooting a film onto a
film so that you could put something in between. And
there's a lot of stuff to it. There's whole, probably

(52:42):
whole college curriculum that could be run on the different
techniques and magic that was used in order to accomplish
certain things from an audio and video perspective in Hollywood alone,
not to mention that there were independent technologies developed in
some other places that didn't necessarily make it to be screens.
But either way, all of these things did end up

(53:03):
coming together and where do you bring the best ideas
to where the most money can be made. So that
of course means Hollywood attracted and collected these methodologies, but
it also means that when it came time to make
propaganda as opposed to doing what they had to do
in early newsreels, which by the way, we know now
that certain historical events, okay that were supposedly captured on

(53:26):
camera are recreations and productions that were created by news
corporation people in order to show a film. I mean, coincidentally,
you got a guy that's there on the particular day
that the Americans invaded an island, and they've got a
perfectly clear picture of exactly how they invaded an island. Okay, yeah, yeah, no,

(53:48):
that's not what happened. They didn't happen to have three
cameras set up before the surprise attack occurred. Okay, use
your head about that stuff. But at the time people
saw it and it was like here's news were actually
showing you news. So there is stuff that was done
in the news media, so to speak, of the time.
Even though there wasn't TV, there was newsreels, you know,

(54:10):
before that, And so in movie theaters people saw movie
magic presented to them as historical footage, as things happening
in real life. You know, sometimes they did actually shoot
historical events, you know, a speech somewhere, something that occurred,
the aftermath of a riot, whatever. They did get those
things sometimes, but a bunch of them, we find out

(54:33):
later were fabricated. So the idea that somebody could create
historical footage is also plausible, but when you try to
assemble this thing, it becomes problematic. So on the simplest
of levels, a lot of the techniques that are being
discussed about how alteration occurred have problems with who has

(54:57):
possession of the film, how they rounded it all back up,
with none of the odd copies really getting out anywhere
except what three guys on the planet have said they've
seen the completely altered version. I've seen some unusual versions
of the film myself, which contained more stuff than what
we usually get shown. But just like I told you know,

(55:20):
what do you call it? My goodness, Gail, you know,
Gail nick Jackson, just like I told her about who
the hell was the cheerleader on your grandfather's film. She
almost fell over because she was like, hardly anybody knows
about that. I'm like, yeah, I've actually seen something that
was closer to the original than most people, because we
had to go find these things down, and indeed people

(55:41):
have had them at certain points, and now they seem
to have vanished. So there is a hall of mirrors
here regarding providence, regarding who had possession, regarding who got copies,
regarding where the originals may or may not be. Even
there is a good question, a good solid question about
the original that is in the hands of the National Archives. Ken,

(56:03):
because you know the indicators on the film, they tell
you where something was printed, where it was developed. Okay,
things like this and according to my understanding, we've got
problems with the numbers on the sprocket holes there when
it comes to the supposed Zubruter film. Okay, so I
find it questionable, and I think we should clarify these things,

(56:27):
But to go all the way into the land of
it's been reproduced, the back of his head's blacked out,
and all these other things, I think this is all
based on fundamental misunderstandings of a few things. One, the
way that film works, Okay, the way that film actually
works to begin with, if you're not trying to tamper
with it and how it works. I think these people

(56:48):
don't understand any of that in most cases, and if
they do have a rudimentary understanding of that, they're lacking
a knowledge in what I'll just call opkins. There are
certain things that are ocur optically when photographing that don't
necessarily look exactly like real life, but are artifacts of

(57:09):
various effects. Different light that comes in, reflections that come
from a source you don't even see on the camera.
Various things happen. The darkening of the back of JFK's head,
for instance, big thing they wave about is problematic because
it does to the naked eye look pretty strange and suspicious.

(57:31):
But having familiarized myself with the anomalies in many different films,
when you have organic light and various things that can
redirect it, refract it, and reflect it that are being photographed, okay,
you can come up with a great many explanations for that.
I mean even the backyard photos which somebody got very

(57:53):
angry at me about recently, where they said, well, those
shadows are impossible. I said, well, it so happens. I
have a friend who went to that address on that
calendar day, okay, because if you go there on the
same calendar day, you should ostensibly have the sun in
the same position, which helps with half shadows wind up falling.

(58:13):
By the way, right, I've had somebody go there and
stand on the exact correct spot when they were, you know,
remodeling and ripping down the steps. In fact, that person
took one of the steps home as a souvenir that
you see. You see a pair of set of steps
on the left hand side of the photo. Right anyway,

(58:34):
stood in the spot where Oswald is and stood there
not with a gun, but stood there with the club
from their car there used to be this thing called
a club you put on your steering wheel. It's supposed
to prevent theft anyway. Oh right, he stood there with
the club in his hands, holding it in an orientation
similar to the gun, just to see if the shadows

(58:54):
off of the head and this and that, and he
was of a similar height, let's say, to Oswald, similar
not exact, And you get a general idea that those
seemingly insanely differential shadows that had to be from different
sources and all that. Guess what, they for the most part,
can be reproduced in that position at the right time

(59:17):
of day. Okay, on the right day, you can reproduce
all those The shadow argument is gone if you do that,
and he did it. Yeah, So I'm just saying that
there are ways to go about this to be precise
and attract certain things down the back of the head thing.
I believe it's an anomaly, and I believe there's an

(59:39):
explanation for it. I don't have confidence enough to tell
you exactly how it goes step by step, but I've
found plausible explanations from people who understand the optics, who
understands how the lens in that camera works. Okay, et cetera,
et cetera. And they also understand how light sources shift

(01:00:03):
around and change things and create things. With those understandings
in hand, I've had people walk me through and I
see an explanation that is reasonable for the back of
the head being blacked out. Now, I know that sounds
crazy to some people, but it is what I see. Now.
Do I say we shouldn't explore this, No, but here

(01:00:24):
we go. It's one of these things where you were saying, Ken,
I wanted to lay that out as simply as possible.
Though the two big things, the back of the head
thing where it's blacked out, where people scream about it
and they remove frames to take out this or that,
or to change the speed or change the direction. Almost
every single thing they're saying you could accomplish by taking
out frames cannot even be accomplished. By taking out frames,

(01:00:48):
you would get a wholly different looking thing, right. And also,
these are people who have also not seen an unstabilized
version of that film, which is another issue. The stabilization
creates certain effects in the film, and it's you know,
it's a benefit, but it does change the way the

(01:01:08):
film was actually originally shot. Just a bit, and I've
seen a shaky version. It really does change what it
is you're seeing on the screen. And I know I'm
not one hundred percent qualified there because of my bad eyesight,
but here's the thing. I pay a lot of attention
to what little eyesight I have. So I'm telling you
now that there is a perspective shift here that is

(01:01:30):
also something that you know, ninety nine percent of the
public has I guaranteed never even seen. So none of
us have actually seen the original first of all, and

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