THE VISIONS VISION or WWE NEEDS MANAGERS (Wrestling Soup 11.18.25)

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I gotta ask your charge of creative now, how is
the product going to be different underneath you? As opposed
to invincednick Man had the book Gotta watch the show
come on?

Speaker 2 (00:10):
Answer?

Speaker 3 (00:11):
That is an answer if you asked the question and
I answered you as an answer, right, yeah, no, I
know it is.

Speaker 1 (00:17):
That's how it works.

Speaker 3 (00:19):
Continue the legacy of what has been going on, what
made me fall in love with this business and he created,
and to take it to new levels, to take it
beyond where it is now. The only way we're gonna
do that is with a team. That's with step that's
with Nick con that's with myself, that's with Kevin Dunn,
that's with everybody that is here.

Speaker 1 (00:37):
I have no doubt, no doubt in my mind.

Speaker 2 (00:39):
But we're hell bent on doing it. Heys, one, guys,
we saw.

Speaker 1 (00:44):
Feel quite viral the other day. When doesn't Paul Hayman
go viral?

Speaker 3 (00:50):
Big history with creative and developmental experience with him to
see someone that you'll be we'll be reading the way forwards.
I want ideas from everybody. I want thoughts from everybody
to me. This is inclusive. And when I when I
say you know that goes for the talent. When I
say it's gonna take off, is it's gonna take all
of us? And I want that. I want Like, look,
Paul's one of the best promos in the history of
his business.

Speaker 2 (01:10):
So who better? When I asked him to be a
part of this, he was thrilled.

Speaker 3 (01:14):
Right. We both joke about the fountain of youth at
these things. Paul always does this, rub it all over me.
Is the fountain of youth?

Speaker 1 (01:19):
Right?

Speaker 3 (01:21):
Who better to come here and talk about that skill?
The Bauls has the gift to gab always has, and
you know who better to come here and motivate these kids?
And when I talk about that, you know the fifty
plus athletes that are all amazing athletes, why they were
selected to be here from the best of the best collegiately,

(01:44):
that's a massive pool. We whittled this down from hundreds
to the fifty that you saw here. The difficult part
for them is picking up a microphone and standing in
front of all these people and.

Speaker 1 (01:55):
Trying to do what we do.

Speaker 3 (01:57):
The difference from day one to what they are here today,
what you just saw here today is amazing. It really
truly is. And it's a testament to what we can
do in this system and what it can do. You
look at NXT now and the crew that is performing there.
Some of those people have like ten matches under their
belt and and it's been you know, literally single digit

(02:21):
months since the first time they ever stepped through those ropes.
That's amazing. It's incredible. It's a crazy level of success
that I'm incredibly proud of this team, you know, Matt Bloom,
the whole crew here, the talent development team, James Kimball across,
you know, Sean Hayes with strength and condition, just all

(02:43):
of it. What they do here is amazing. And then
and then Shawn and team getting into NXT and taking
that to the next level.

Speaker 2 (02:52):
Is amazing.

Speaker 3 (02:53):
And then even that that stepping in as I had
to step out and just never missing a beat and
running with it incredible. And I'm so proud of all
of it and all of them, so talk about hey man,
I want everybody that anybody that wants to be involved.
When I when I look at people who've been through
this process and what it takes to get here, I

(03:13):
look at Biggie.

Speaker 2 (03:14):
And I look at Bianca.

Speaker 3 (03:15):
Right, Bianca and I were talking about it backstage, She
was remembering her first time stepping through those ropes to
try this same process for us. Who better than those
people to see what that that moment and that falling
in love with this business can do for them and
where it can lead them in their life? Who better
to help guide this next gen? Who better to look

(03:36):
for that future? Who better to stand in this group
and say, look, I can tell you from my point
of view, that's something special. Right.

Speaker 2 (03:43):
I want all that involvement, and I want it.

Speaker 3 (03:46):
I want to be as open and collaborative as everybody.

Speaker 2 (03:54):
Wrestling. It's only Tuesday and it's already what a week?

Speaker 1 (03:59):
Yeah? Yeah, well, it's wrestling has been really fucking boring,
hasn't it. I Mean, I hate to sound like such
a fucking asshole, because they're really trying with the scene
of thing Friday.

Speaker 2 (04:14):
They did this Friday Friday, w W E done good.
I know, we usually don't do the fucking recap for
SmackDown and right police, so SmackDown has been kind of lately.
So yeah, but it's.

Speaker 1 (04:29):
Been like Friday has been like Friday Night heat. Yeah,
that's where they've been with SMACKDW.

Speaker 2 (04:35):
Main event was important though main event was very important.
Because you had, uh, you finally had something really great happened, Joe,
because it looks like we finally have the vision for
the vision and the uh, the vision for the Vision
is going to be Drew McIntyre, Drew, and Tyre is

(04:55):
going to be the guy to fill in for Seth.

Speaker 1 (04:57):
Oh.

Speaker 2 (04:58):
I'm okay with that. I you know what, they just
edged Seth out of the vision.

Speaker 1 (05:05):
I know, I get obviously anything is a better option
than set at this point.

Speaker 2 (05:12):
Yeah, but Drew, we like Drew. Drew is fun, Drew
is talented, and you know what, Drew can be put
in a position where he doesn't have to be the
main guy, but we get to see him every week.

Speaker 1 (05:23):
Do you think Drew actually wins matches? Though, now that
he's in the Hayman thing.

Speaker 2 (05:28):
I still think bron Breaker is the highlight.

Speaker 1 (05:31):
I know, but it's like that there is this point
where I'm looking at it, though, and it's like, look,
we've aligned Drew with this group, and I'm like, yeah,
but you've had Drew lose ninety percent of his matches
for the past two years.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
But now he's gonna be under Hayman's chicken wing. He's
gonna have Logan Paul as his personal suck wee, and
then he's got bron Breaker and Bronson read Bronson, Reid
looking fucking great on Friday, coming out with the Demolition
Vest taking on Cody for the title. I'm like, I'll
look at this. They're not treating him as a second

(06:05):
class character. He's no longer an NPC. They really like
Bronze and Reed, and I'm I'm all for that. Like
I said Friday, I fucking enjoyed it. It was fine.

Speaker 1 (06:15):
Well, he's he's starting to step up because I think
he's realizing it's like, Okay, I don't have Seth around
to try to suck up all the fucking spotlight. Yeah,
and obviously State State Cop needs some time. Stray Cop
doesn't need time. They're gonna they're gonna fight valiantly to
make State Cop into the next big thing. He's he

(06:37):
needs a little bit more time to cook. So if
Reid turns up the intensity, you know, works on his look,
looks like a serious competitor.

Speaker 2 (06:46):
He could.

Speaker 1 (06:46):
I'm not gonna say he's gonna blow past him, but
he has the opportunity to be a much bigger player
than uh than he was expecting. To be.

Speaker 2 (06:54):
I agree. I think there's a lot of upside. There's
a lot of upside to Brons and Reed, and you're
right about State Cop about Brown Breaker, but I think
Drew really does fit that niche because obviously Brock came out,
so here's the big thing, wrestling Soup Anthony Joe, so
the main event. Obviously we saw the return of Brock

(07:16):
Lesner to join up with the Vision for war Games.
But I don't think, based upon Brock's schedule, that this
is going to be anything long term. It's a short term.
Paul called in a favorite kind of deal. But Drew,
I could see Drew as being a hanger on. I
would like to see Drew as a more permanent piece
of the new Vision. I would rather him than sath Well.

Speaker 1 (07:42):
Drew would, in a weird sort of way, make more
sense as an elder statesman in that group. But the
problem is, once again, you've made the guy look like
a fucking bum for two years.

Speaker 2 (07:54):
I know that he's with the Vision now, now all
his problems go away. Every time Drew runs into problem,
here comes Logan, Paul, here comes Bronson, Reed, here comes
State Cop.

Speaker 1 (08:04):
You know he's also so much bigger than them. That
making him the henchman that eats pins feels crazy, like.

Speaker 2 (08:11):
They made it a henchman of three man band.

Speaker 1 (08:15):
Well, I mean mish that was long before there was
any expectation for whatsoever. But like that, this is where
planning matters, because I know, obviously sometimes you gotta you
gotta feer off the path. Shit happens, people get hurt,
you know, things change, right, But this is where when

(08:35):
you're sitting there going, well, me, well, I guess maybe
we shouldn't have made Drew look pathetic for the last
like twelve to eighteen months or so and lose to everybody,
because had you even done something to heat the guy
up for the past, you know, four to six months,
let's say, then he could step in into that role
and be like, you know, guess what, you know, Seth's gone,

(08:57):
but now you got to you got the better version.
Seth's truthfully, bigger, badder.

Speaker 2 (09:02):
Yeah, couldn't you arguably use the stable as the catalyst
to bringing him back to form? Right? So Drew has
been a complete fucking choed and a loser and he
doesn't win and he looks like an asshole out there.
But Paul Hayman and all of his Paul Hayman's spirit says,
you know what I know how to fix you, Drew.

(09:23):
I know all of your flaws that you're overlooking and
why you're losing your matches. And now all of a
sudden you give Drew a hot streak. All of a sudden,
now that he's with the vision, he goes out there
and he becomes a killer instead of the guy that
eats pins all the time, Like, couldn't you variably tell
that kind of a story that oh, once again, it's
the genius of Paul Hayman that these guys came together

(09:46):
to make this great stable, you know, the New Dangerous
Alliance or something.

Speaker 1 (09:50):
I don't know. Well, I think one of the biggest
problems that WWE has and has had for a very
long time is they forget that the stove has four earners,
so yah cooking one thing at a time, maybe two
if you're lucky. So and their minds are like, well,
I mean, we could do something we Drew again, but
what about State cop We got to make sure we

(10:11):
focus all of our energy on old State Coup. And
it's like, well, no, no, you can make all of
these guys, or at least three of these guys important.

Speaker 2 (10:20):
I don't think that's fair because they did okay with
the Bloodline when it was hot, they did okay with
Judgment Day when it was hot. I can't sit there
and fault them on. You're right, the four burner thing
is a great analogy, but I think WWE has proven
when it comes pushed to shove, they know how to
juggle for things at once.

Speaker 1 (10:36):
But I also feel like that was a happy accident
in many respects because even with the Bloodline thing like
people's you know, they look back on that fondly. Sure,
but if you don't have Sammy interject and make himself
such a personality and an interesting character in there, you
got fucking Dullard mcrain's and his SAMO and bros. Making

(11:01):
faces right now, that's what it is.

Speaker 2 (11:05):
You're one hundred percent right about that. Sammy was absolutely
a catalyst to drive you know, the Bloodline to the
next level. And then you had Solo in there who
was just still kind of cutting his teeth. And obviously
Kevin Owens added much needed spice in my personal opinion,
to the Bloodline storyline. But they did really well for it,
so happy accident or not. The bloodline when it came

(11:26):
pushed to shove, everybody had an integral part. You're talking
about five six people that were involved with that. Everybody
had an integral part, and people were interested in every
single member of that group's story. It was phenomenal for
the time that it was, regardless of Roman reigns as
forty five minute entrances. For what it was, there was

(11:46):
a purpose to every single person in there, and they
were all different playing pieces on the chessboard, and I
really enjoyed it. And same with the Judgment Day. When
the Judgment Day he fucking edged out edge, you know,
all all of a sudden, the pieces started to fit.
Dominic fit, forehead fit, finn balor fit, live fit, real fit,

(12:07):
like every Carlito even fit for the short time that
he was there. Like there was a point where Judgment
Day could do no wrong, and it was they were
entertaining and funny and they were out there having killer
heel matches, and it's like, I still want to believe,
I still want to believe that these aren't just like,
holy shit, can you believe that worked? And more along

(12:29):
the lines of this is what we want planned and
if Paul Hayman, if anybody, if anybody can revitalize a career,
it's Paul Hayman, and I dare say that, you know,
the idea of Drew McIntyre kind of being the backbone
to the vision without seth rollins is a lot more interesting.

(12:50):
It's a lot more appeasing them. Yeah, then them's just
being two dudes out there and Logan Paul, you know.

Speaker 1 (12:59):
And obviously beham In which by the way, I mean
I like I said, wrestling has not been as exciting
as it has been in the last year prior to
right now. I know people with the scene of tour
and we get it, like this is a great way
to promote the show. We're getting towards the holiday season.
We're selling t shirts, we're selling tickets. People are happy

(13:20):
to go to it. So I'm not trying to poot
poo on it in that way. I'm saying strictly, is
somebody just sitting there watching from their house. That's what
I'm talking too. That's what I'm speaking to, and to
the effect of like, how is this going to go
creatively forward for the next six months to or whatever
it's going.

Speaker 2 (13:37):
No fucking clue. I think, honestly, you'll get a better
gauge if this is something more permanent by the time
we get away from war games. I really do. I
think once you see what happens at Survivor series win
or lose, you'll have a better understanding. And I mean
you as ne collective we of the audience, right, you'll
have a better understanding of what they want to do
with this vision. And honestly, I'm okay with the jacket too.

(14:00):
Want to come out there wearing demolition jackets with the
versace V or whatever. That's all right, that's fine, it
looks okay.

Speaker 1 (14:08):
Honestly. The thing that I think probably drives me the
craziest about this whole situation with those guys is they're
going to try to make a dollar out of ten
cents too quickly. Where even if you'd have brought these
two in, I mean brought them in bronze and had
been there before. But you know what I'm saying, even
if it was like here's a tag team, here's Hayman,

(14:30):
you'd avoided all the set situation, right, and you just
said these guys are killers. They're here to beat everybody.
You give them the tag team titles. In the first
month they're on the show, you have them hold on
to the tag team championships for a year. You have
them just eviscerate fucking everybody. But you know that's not

(14:50):
what they're going to be. There was no patience for that,
So obviously they put them with sets and made them
the butt boys, and they're going to start trying to
push them towards singles matches and singles titles. So the
evolution of the characters in the story is already starting
on like square five instead of like if we started

(15:11):
them with square one and kind of went from there
and let them build, we might.

Speaker 2 (15:15):
Be But I think I think you're right when you
were saying earlier that this is one of those scenarios
where like, look, they have to do something that Seth's
out WWE TRIPLEH didn't expect Seth to get injured for
reels this time, so it's kind of like one of
those Okay, well, let's make the best of a bad situation.
So you're right in the sense that this was never

(15:37):
the plan all along. Totally agree with that. I think
most people would. I think this is the best of
a bad situation, and I do mean the absolute best.
Drew McIntyre is in dire need of a direction logan Paul,
who's younger and obviously pissing off people online when people
bring them up like like a Stephen Richards or whatever
saying that he's, you know, better than most of the

(15:58):
aw roster. But I mean at that same point, if
the vision is supposed to be in a way Paul
Hayman's vision instead of Seth's, I can see this making
a lot of sense because he can easily just write
off Seth and say, hey, Seth's version of the vision
was dated, it didn't come from a mind like Paul Hayman's.

(16:19):
Paul Hayman has been managed he was older but still ye,
but that's what you use. You're like, Paul Hayman has
been managing people for forty fucking years. If he doesn't
know who's got it, then nobody has it. And it's
like simple as that. Like Paul Hayman at this point,
especially at this stage of his career, is kind of
seen as more of a visionary than anybody would see

(16:41):
Seth being like he would be the guy who has
the background for it.

Speaker 1 (16:44):
If anything, I almost wish in a way, and trust me,
I don't like to try to write set into any
sort of positive light, if you want to call it.
That what I'd almost prefer if they didn't go the
route of jumping Seth out and simply he had gotten
hurt and they had to take the title off of him,

(17:05):
and Seth sort of said to them in my absence,
go beco like, go be a tag team when the
titles hold on to it. You put these pricks on notice,
let them know that Seth Rawlins is coming back for everything.
And in the meantime, you guys go kill everybody, you
go run rough shot.

Speaker 2 (17:25):
And I don't want to Seth's blessing.

Speaker 1 (17:28):
Oh I no, no, no, but this is why. But
miss this is why you want that's blessing. It's gross
as it is to say it that way, but it is.
This is why you do that. Over time, you have
them with these tag titles and they're going and set
this healing or whatever the fuck it's going to be.
And then you know one of the guys, hey, you
know there's an opening in the title tournament, or you
know there's an opening for me to go when the

(17:49):
interne and Paul Hamn goes, that's not in the vision,
that's not in the plan, Seth. You know right now
we're here to punish people. We're here to do this
for Seth. And then you commit to the babyface turn
of these two guys by going, why the fuck we
could kick the shit out of all these people? Why

(18:11):
am I this dickhead sitting at home waiting for his
shoulder to get better? And we got to play second
fiddle to him? So that way, when the time that
Seth does come back and he's face to face with him,
then you got the fucking steak cop looking at him
like you motherfucker. You held me back, and you have
a legitimate ground you held. You know, you told me

(18:31):
I wasn't supposed to do this shit. Now you're gonna
step in here and then you have big Bronze and Reid,
You motherfucker you think you're gonna and then you can
turn both of these guys or one of these guys
face even and you have something. But instead now it's
like once again, like I said, they don't know how
to cook four plates on the same fucking stop.

Speaker 2 (18:49):
I also think that they're trying to sell fucking shirts
though I think you brought the other point, it's Christmas time.
They want to sell merch. The vision who they've been
working on now for at least about a year now,
trying to develop it into something, obviously using Seth's character
to develop something. Now Seth has gone, what are you
going to do with all that merch? What are you

(19:10):
gonna do with this giant push? You have this stable,
this faction behind Paul Hayman, the biggest characters on the screen,
dealing with the main events on smackdowns and on Raw,
and they have no merch. They have nothing, Like, ah,
you gotta do something.

Speaker 1 (19:25):
But also, you know what the name is ass I
mean division, Like you want to be a grown man
wearing around a shirt that's his division. It doesn't It
just has a giant sounds like a makeup brand, dude,
It's yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:35):
It's a sasci think. It's just a giant V gold
V with the gold circle around it. It honestly for
his weird as Becky and Seth's fashion tastes are, it's
probably the most fashion looking thing that WWE could have
come up with for this group, like legitimate fashion, Like
if you saw somebody walking down the street with like

(19:57):
the Bronson reed jacket and the giant V and the
O around the V. You would never have guessed that
was a wrestling thing. Never Well, yeah, it's probably the
most publicly acceptable.

Speaker 1 (20:09):
Well, we also end up then we have this weird
situation where it's like, yes, you know the bullet club shirt, right,
everyone likes guns, and we get the gun shirt. Look
at that, It's got nothing to do with rest.

Speaker 2 (20:20):
For people were wearing that ironically around Chicago. I'm just
gonna say that.

Speaker 1 (20:24):
But of course, well yeah, I mean only more ridiculous
because you're clearly than making yourself a target. You know,
put bullet here, you know, like insert here. But no,
like I get it. There is obviously there's a mass
appeal to that, but that also fat into people's very
like basic need of just dumb fucking whatever it would be.

(20:47):
You know, scull shirt would scull I like skull you know,
like that works that that always is going to have
its place, right, But I don't know with these guys,
I'm not sure, like I said, they're not going to
be particularly great at pushing all of these people at
the same time, and truthfully, looking at it, I'm thinking

(21:08):
to myself, you got about six months. If that, obviously
Dom is heading the trajectory of being a baby face.
There's no stop in that train. I think all the
Judgment people, I think pretty much everybody in Judgment Day
is going to end up a baby face within the
next year.

Speaker 2 (21:23):
I think they're going to foil the vision. I think
there's going to be a point where they cross swords.
Uh huh and uh yeah. That's that's how you make
the Judgment Day face, is that the visions start running
rough shot over everybody post war games, and they start
stepping on toes and they start stepping and I don't
think they're going to be like championing the American flag

(21:44):
Mom's apple, I kind of baby faces. But I think
they'll be babyfaces in the sense of renegades, like, look,
you know.

Speaker 1 (21:51):
The nerve, the nerve you guys, Yeah, that's you know this.
This has been our show longer than yours, right, right,
And in many respects they would also be right, and
they're not. They have been one of the focal points
of the show. Like I said, to the effect of
they're gonna have no choice but to turn these people right.
I mean, the forehead is gonna be a babyface, it's

(22:13):
going to have Oh.

Speaker 2 (22:14):
My god, how happy was he that John Cena had
his last match at Madison Square Garden and pinned forehead.
I'm sorry, Like I watched that and I was really
happy for jad mcdonald', like, holy shit, what a fucking
feather in your cap?

Speaker 1 (22:30):
Do He's actually, yeah, he's not upset about it in
the least. No, he's like, yeah, sure, cool, I'll take that.

Speaker 2 (22:36):
He's not gonna walk out of the company and say,
Jesus Christ, they had me lose to John Cena.

Speaker 1 (22:41):
Yeah, Oh that's what That's what Mark's do, you know,
like not even trying to be a dick. That's literally
like that's what Mark wrestlers do. Like a fucking certain
female wrestler that you know, y losing I lose matches.
That's wrong. Oh I should always win. It's fucking fit.
It doesn't murder.

Speaker 2 (23:01):
But I really want, I really want happy for the dude.
Like I was like, I'm like, I know, we can't
see his face because they weren't focusing on him, but
I'm like, he's gotta be fucking happy all the way.

Speaker 1 (23:12):
And there's and let's be real, nobody was pushing their
chips on the JD mcdonna fucking.

Speaker 2 (23:19):
You know, I thought he was gonna pin I thought
he was gonna pin Dominic, That's what I thought. I
thought it was gonna be a two fer. But now
they give it.

Speaker 1 (23:25):
To Oh dude, I gotta give it like he's one
of those people where when he initially showed up on television,
I knew it was a favorite gig to Finn. We
all knew that that it were in the know whatsoever.
And it's like, aesthetically, You're going, this guy looks so
fucking weird and he's small, and I don't know if

(23:46):
if this ship's gonna go. We already saw Pete Dunn,
you know, we saw this goofy undersize.

Speaker 2 (23:53):
Who was the other one, the caveman on NXT, the
one with the brow made of bone, the big guy
Von Wagner. Yes, thank you chocolate.

Speaker 1 (24:03):
Remember when they were like Von Wagner's gonna be w
W a champion one day. All right, calm down.

Speaker 2 (24:10):
Those your gender ma hall Maniacs. Yeah, I love that.

Speaker 1 (24:14):
I was like, oh no, no, that was the company.
I remember the company being that high on him. That
was all the news coming out of the company. Listen,
this kid has got upper the harder with strange shirt.
I was like, you, guys, whoever the fuck's feeding you
that information? First of all, either they're lying to you.
The dirt sheet is either lying, or whoever came up

(24:34):
with that idea should immediately be fucking fight.

Speaker 2 (24:36):
I always thought they should have leaned into it. I'm like,
the dude looks like our chromagnet, Like why not just
have him just go out there and go me belt
like shiny thing, Me wants belt and that's it. And
now he just talks and broken English. It would have
been great.

Speaker 1 (24:52):
Well he was. He was literally of the snitsky ilk. Yes, yeah,
you saw that with no personality by the way too, like,
but I.

Speaker 2 (25:01):
Didn't lean into it.

Speaker 1 (25:02):
That was the problem.

Speaker 2 (25:03):
It was like, but it wasn't. There's some kind of interview, man,
somebody would have to refresh me on this. There was
like some kind of an interview that he did or
something where they they tried making him proper, like he
was the cave guy in the Geicos commercials or something.
All of a sudden like, oh, I wouldn't do that.
I get my insurance from Geico. Like it's just I

(25:24):
I don't know why they didn't lean into it. I
think the guy could have been an absolutely fun baby
face or even a heel if you just made him
or kept him a cave man and just leaned into it,
had him come out with like a bam bam.

Speaker 1 (25:38):
You know what I mean, like, well, well there is
something to like believe what we tell you and not
what your ey see, and eventually that does where you
know what, it's just like the thing that you know
in stories where it's the beauty and the beast. You know,
why is why does she end up with this guy? Well,
you don't know what he's like. You don't know. He's

(25:58):
fucking confident, cool guy. Maybe he's got himself a good career,
he's trustworthy. It's like that's kind of what happened with Forehead.
You know, you first see it, You saw him and
you go, oh god, this what the fuck?

Speaker 2 (26:10):
They should have made him in Sino Man and found
somebody to be Polly sure like claw.

Speaker 1 (26:18):
Just even the stell of him and the cutoff white
jean vest, it's like he looks like someone to Patrick Swayze,
he should have been beaten the fuck out of with
a pool stick. And in Roadhouse thirty five years ago,
him and Terry Funk next to each other as Henchman,
you know, beating the shit out of uh, the guy
from uh what's is Sam Elliott? H Yeah, that cool motherfucker.

(26:41):
That guy rocks. But yeah, there's no there's no way
they're not gonna all into babyface the whole job.

Speaker 2 (26:48):
Oh yeah, No. I really think it's gonna be one
of those circumstance things too, where they just cross each
other and they step on some toes and now all
of a sudden you have two heel factions fighting. But
the fans are obviously gonna back the judgment day, and
I think that's how you do it. I don't think
they turn into like, yeah, I just don't think they
become like, you know, clear cut baby faces.

Speaker 1 (27:08):
Well, I have two I have two small points, or
should I say, one small point and one big point
that I have to kind of get to, and especially
with that six Man and how it played out, I'll
start out with the smaller one. The whole thing with
Sheltz and.

Speaker 2 (27:22):
Oh that was after that was after the the six.

Speaker 1 (27:26):
Man, Yes, yeah, and then Skate Skati Bop or whatever
his name is, the guy that plays for the for
the fucking no no, for the giants. Yeah, he got
all heard. He blasted his leg a uh first of
all shells. I see him and I'm just like, I'm.

Speaker 2 (27:44):
Like, na, oh, man, it's got such great comedy in
his podcast.

Speaker 1 (27:48):
Is it's really knocking it out of the park right now.
I gotta say, by the way, like I'm not usually
one to buy into any like the the dudes that
do the fucking man, the red Pill guys or whatever
the fuck, but uh, the little I almost called the
disease and sorry, boy, that makes me look horrible. Uh.

(28:10):
The guy that's with him, that's always with ChEls, No, no,
the little Indian guy. What's a man?

Speaker 3 (28:18):
God?

Speaker 2 (28:18):
I feel I always like when Shy has a podcast
and they'd make it a point to rub your shoulders
and touch you a lot during it. It seems very.

Speaker 1 (28:27):
Yeah, it's you gotta be as sexual as humanly poss
I don't know if it's.

Speaker 2 (28:31):
Sexual, it's just uncomfortable for the sake of being uncomfortable, right.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
Oh, all right, So the guy in Gosh, thank you.
He there was some sort of feud he had with
one of the Red Pill guys where it was like
a back and forth, like you said this about me,
and then he was like, so the the guy uncovered
a bunch of the wifes to Wakasha's social media and
like how she's trying to be an influencer. Mish When

(28:59):
I tell you, this has got to be one of
the most unlikable human beings I've ever heard on the
Internet by a lot. It's daunting, like daunting in a
way that I could never take him seriously ever again.
And to some extent that made me even think less
of Schultz, because like, you got this guy on your

(29:21):
show and you're like, this is such a he's so
sheutz himself as a complete fucking like code switching weirdo,
fucking cringe lord. You know, like he's he's the definition
of like your middle upper class white guy that grows
up in New York City and he's like, yo, that
means a culture g I have my one dollar slice
of pizza. Yo, I got my tims on. And it's like, no, dude,

(29:42):
you're still just a rich white kid. Shut the fuck up.
You're not special. But he's in the front row, I
guess going back to it, and he's next to the
guy from fucking the Giants and they have the little
confrontation or whatever. Then they do a merch drop of
the guys from the Giant. Yes, and I don't know
if you saw the but one of the shirts I
believe says Skeet Squad or something like that, and I'm like, nobody,

(30:09):
nobody has saw that and thought that might have been
a poor choice for WWE merchandise, because somebody, please, somebody
quickly if they could pull up the whatever. His name is,
the kid that plays for the Giants that showed up
last night at MSG, and so of course w w
WE has shifted for them. Thank you Chocolate. That was

(30:29):
my initial thought. I was like, that's the submission sisters thing, Like,
nobody thought that that was weird for him to be good. Yeah, somebody,
I don't know. I'm trying to.

Speaker 2 (30:41):
Find set squad thing because I'm watching the Netflix as
we're talking.

Speaker 1 (30:44):
About Okay, there we go, thank you, Yeah, yeah, Cam
Scatu scat yes, Oh no, I'm not Skeet. I'm sorry
scat pack. Oh jesus, it's worse than skeet almost the Scots. Sorry, guys,
it wasn't a jiz joke. It was a shit joke

(31:06):
even better, my I misquoted the jiz joke. It was
just shit. It's just shit. Yeah, that's all so so bad.
As if you go, if you go to WWE's shop,
I'm sure it will be on sale very soon. Even
if you're a fan of the Giants, which God bless you,
you can get as sure. There's this scat pack on

(31:27):
it around.

Speaker 2 (31:28):
Thirty five dollars.

Speaker 1 (31:29):
Jesus, come on, now, that's a stat that's a steal.

Speaker 2 (31:32):
That's a steal for all that scat.

Speaker 1 (31:34):
Yeah, I mean the positive interpretation of scat pack would
be like scat like scat music almost. Oh yeah, of
course that's the good one. Like it's like they're all
sitting around going, yeah to disc get it into the
boo boo?

Speaker 2 (31:54):
Does it that they spell scat with a K? Or no?
Does that not?

Speaker 1 (31:58):
Just no? It's still pretty bad. And that's yes, that
is his name. It's like scatty, scattered.

Speaker 2 (32:02):
Gotta bro or whatever bo he.

Speaker 1 (32:07):
I mean, I get it. He's like a he's of
like the Gronkowski elk where he's just like the dumb bro,
but he already is hurt because he's a dumb bro.

Speaker 2 (32:17):
I liked that he was wearing a grill though. That
was like, oh shit, he's really cool. Grills twenty five.

Speaker 1 (32:24):
Well, everything, you know what, it all comes full circle, dude, Yeah,
everything comes back again. There's mullets, Dude, mullets. There's people
getting getting pussy with mullets.

Speaker 2 (32:35):
I yeah, I'm sure Dominic gets late.

Speaker 1 (32:37):
Come on now, oh he's Yeah. By the way, imagine
you're Dominic and do you get a mullet and you're like, yeah,
I'm going to be ironic and have like this ironic he.

Speaker 2 (32:47):
Did it to be a heel. People are doing it, yeah,
because now they're like cool.

Speaker 1 (32:53):
And and there's people that will have sex with you
that agree that that looks cool. Yeah he hot.

Speaker 2 (33:00):
Oh no, scullet, the mullet, I'll just go the way
of the Dodo Jesus.

Speaker 1 (33:05):
It's always there and that's well so so scat pack
was my small little notice, but my big one is
that I'm at this point. We talked about Hayman a lot,
but uh, this show desperately needs to bring back managers
Raw SmackDown WWE in general.

Speaker 2 (33:23):
I mean, I know you didn't see Jake Krgles match
versus what is her name borrific. No, it was not.
It was it was not good. Jade is just coming in.

Speaker 1 (33:37):
She's not good. I mean there, I get it, like
they they want her to become something because the aesthetic
is so fucking on point, but god, she is not good.

Speaker 2 (33:49):
Yeah, they had it was b fab Yeah, it was
it was them versus each other trying to have a
good match, and I was like, wow, this is this
is the low point of SmackDown. I am. I was
impressed that they allowed that match to happen. It did
not look good in the end. It's just very slow,

(34:09):
very plotting, very weak, and it's just I don't know,
it's do you.

Speaker 1 (34:15):
Think they're sending her out there with a wrestler the
caliber of beefab because in their minds, they're going, listen, Jay,
it's not going to have a good match with whoever
the fuck we give her to, and if she's going
to fuck up and hurt somebody, it might as well
be somebody that doesn't cost as a nickel.

Speaker 2 (34:30):
Oh shit, I hope not. That's awful mean, but a dude,
am I wrong?

Speaker 1 (34:36):
Would you want to send you okay, would you want
to send.

Speaker 2 (34:38):
Me your souls? Automatons? To the sacrificial altar.

Speaker 1 (34:42):
Notice, Jade Cargu, please send out a wrestling humunculus. We
need that, which, by the way, I gotta say I
I have recently fallen into the words humunculous, and nothing
makes me harder than it. I don't know why, Like,

(35:03):
just like it just a little a little man that
is an empty show that has no has no feelings
or soul. I'm like, I kinda, I kind of love it.
And the name's so silly. It's just such a goofy word.
But yeah, dude, there is no fucking way that there's
not a part of them that is thinking, Yeah, if Jade,

(35:23):
like I said, embarrasses herself with BFAB or punches b
Fab square in the fucking face, we're not losing any money, right,
you know, Like if they if they send her out
there against even dare I say, bird Girl and she
hurts bird Girl, it's like, well, we're derailing some stories.
And bird Girl actually contributes more to the show than Befab,

(35:46):
which is fucking hilarious when you think about it. But
like now they're probably at that point where they go, Okay,
Jade's gonna do this, but it is what the fuck
it is now. I'm just trying to think of how
they're going to tell the story of whomever is gonna
get that belt off her. I don't know, but it
can't be. She's not long for that title, dude, she

(36:08):
can't be.

Speaker 2 (36:09):
Yeah, I mean, there's enough big pay per views coming
up pl e's coming up that that's gonna be how
they slide it off of her too, you know. And
I wouldn't be surprised if maybe Charlotte takes it back,
because they've already kind of pulled Charlotte away a little
bit from Alexa Bliss. Obviously they still have their friendship
on Monday, but on Friday, you know, uh, Bliss and

(36:31):
Ripley and EO are out there and Charlotte's like, ah,
I can't. I can't with this bitch. I hate Rio, Ripley,
Rhea hates me. I'm not gonna fucking deal with you.
And they're like, and Riel's like, but I can get
over it, and She's like, yeah, that's nice. I fucking can't.

Speaker 1 (36:44):
So Dode kind of like that.

Speaker 2 (36:48):
I like Charlotte I and even as a face, she's
a better heel, you know.

Speaker 4 (36:52):
What I mean.

Speaker 2 (36:53):
Like it's like look, lady, this is what you're meant
to be. You're just a great antagonist no matter what.
And so she kind of walked off on Friday. But
that was a good vibe too.

Speaker 1 (37:03):
I like the way that, well, people get very angry
when we compliment Charlotte for some reason.

Speaker 2 (37:07):
Oh they think we hate Charlotte now too, because I
think we were critical of one of her matches or something.

Speaker 1 (37:12):
So oh, yeah, well, I can tell you this much.
I trust her to do a lot more than the
majority of people still, even to this day, a male
or female wrestlers on the show, I trust her to
do a better job than most of them. But yeah, dude,
this company desperately needs managers to the point that I'm

(37:33):
starting to almost look at it. And dare I even
say this, because it's not going to go over well.

Speaker 3 (37:38):
But.

Speaker 1 (37:40):
Maybe Hayman needs to either start winding down or loosen
up his stranglehold as the only manager in the company
me because.

Speaker 2 (37:49):
Let me throw this out at you too, because and
you're talking about managers, but I really saw something happen.
Is there a potential that aj Lee might end up
being Maxie means manager, especially after she got the win
because of AJ's interference over Becky Lynch, and obviously Becky
Lynch and AJ have a history there too, but even

(38:10):
the way that Maxine immediately ran out of the ring
to hug AJ, and even AJ's face lit up for
like that split second before they changed the camera for
whatever reason. But I don't know, I kind of liked
that idea. It gives us a little bit of AJ
every week. AJ is obviously a veteran and given a
lot of respect. However, there is a bump in the

(38:33):
road of Aj Lee being a manager or strictly being
a manager, and I dare say that that bump in
the road is the eventual AJ Lee Nicky Bella crossover.

Speaker 1 (38:43):
Ooh.

Speaker 2 (38:45):
And the only reason I say that is because later
on in the evening, Stephanie tried walking out and Nicky
Bella whacked her in the fog and stood over there,
stood over her to absolutely almost no just no reaction
from anyone, declaring herself the reason that the women's division

(39:07):
even exists, and she's come back to claim it. Blah
blah blah.

Speaker 1 (39:12):
What. Yeah, I know she has the California accent, but.

Speaker 2 (39:18):
Ma'am Messita, ma'am messda. I love that I love that.

Speaker 1 (39:24):
What what are her speech patterns? I mean, truly, I know,
I know I have an accent. I know a third
of the country could listen to me and have no
fucking idea what I'm saying. If I'm speaking faster than
I am right now, I get it. But what the
fuck are her actual speech patterns where she'll she'll be

(39:48):
talking and it will just be like, I don't know
what you're doing going to happen? Did something? Did you
have a did she have a TBI?

Speaker 2 (40:01):
I think it's just years of alcohol abuse, Joseph, That's
all it is.

Speaker 1 (40:05):
I'd almost hope like that would at least be a reason. Yes,
you know, like when you see like over the weekend,
not to brag or nothing, but I went to an event.
It was free, so I'm, you know, big spender up
at a fucking casino in New Hampshire and a couple
of the old Patriots guys were there, right, and they're

(40:26):
walking around and Vince Wilfork, who I fucking love. I
want him and Mark Henry to do a show together.
They would be like dream guys, Like they're both like
around the same age. Giant fucking Southern black dudes. Who
are like super fucking affable and likable. But he was there,
right and you know, he was talking and sign and

(40:48):
shift for people, blah blah blah. And he gets up
and he starts walking, and I'm looking at him. I go, God, damn,
I go, I haven't seen an old NFL player in person.
They walk like wrestlers. They got that, they got that
wrestler fucking they get that. Yeah, they got the Mick
Foley gate, you know, yeah. And I was like, God, damn,
that's fucking crazy. But like at the same time, like

(41:09):
like with Nicky Bella, I'm like, well, listen, I know
why Ben's will forks having a hard time moving around.
I know exactly why he's moving around like that. But
why the fuck does Nicky Bella sound like she's been
punched a hundred times in the fucking head?

Speaker 2 (41:23):
Why the why? I have no clue the why, I
really have no clue. But I'm just I just have
this vibe. This uh, mister domis type prediction where you're
going to have aj Lee and Nicki Bella eventually face
off at some point. Maybe aj Lee even goes to
try and save Stephanie. But I like the idea of

(41:46):
expanding managers, and I don't think you have to stick
with just the guys. I do agree a thousandfold that
there should be more managers. We've talked about this ad
nauseum over the years. I mean, we liked MVP when
he was around for what was it, the Hustle Squad,
and then we also liked.

Speaker 1 (42:02):
Yeah, right, I know, it just sounds like so fun,
It sounds like such a generic name, but yeah, hustle
squad just but they're not like hustling.

Speaker 2 (42:11):
And there's there's been a few there's been a few
managers here and there, and you don't have to even
go back as far as Datchy. I mean, you don't
even have to go back that far. It's like there's
small attempts. But for the women. I think the women
absolutely could use or definitely could benefit from having a
female manager. And somebody like an aj Lee makes a
lot of sense. And I'd rather see somebody like an

(42:33):
aj Lee be a manager than a Nicki Bella.

Speaker 1 (42:37):
Oh shoot god, Nicky isn't no. I'm just laughing like
she was called so I had to.

Speaker 2 (42:45):
I had to. I'm like, Nicky, look, I can't take
the call right now.

Speaker 1 (42:48):
So yeah, she heard she heard you say she shouldn't
be a manager, of course, I kind of you know what,
maybe she could be like mister Fuji.

Speaker 2 (42:56):
Yeah, yeah, a little bit.

Speaker 1 (42:59):
I yeah, Like she doesn't say much she comes out
to the ring.

Speaker 2 (43:03):
She could be more like Kimchi.

Speaker 1 (43:07):
I love chess. Yeah no, that God, there's so many people,
and like, I keep thinking to myself at the lack
of managers, with the people that have no personalities, can't
talk and can't tell fucking stories, fucking have good matches,
like a like a Dragonov. Yeah right, Dragonov is not
going to resonate with people until they find some way

(43:29):
to give him a personality, a manager, some way to
connect with the audience, no matter how good his matches
are or how much crying.

Speaker 2 (43:36):
They had a little back and forth with him on
Friday too. We had a good match with Axiom. But yeah,
you can definitely see that they're trying to hollywood him
up a little bit. Starting to look a little sleek
out there. Yeah, they're trying to get that European stink
off of them and make them a little more mainstream.

Speaker 1 (43:53):
So well, do you know what I think it is
that frustrates me even more with the them just being like, yeah,
no managers, nothing, you guys all figure it out one
you know, it's just cheap. It's just being cheap. It's
a cost cutting measure. But right now, more than ever
they've been. Right now, it's like the last two generations
have been trained in fucking pr and speech per the Internet.

(44:16):
How many influencers and people that do podcasts and streaming
and all of this content creation. You can't find a
few people to go and just sell these matches and
be a good manager and.

Speaker 2 (44:29):
Talk like I imagine that Logan Paul's job.

Speaker 1 (44:33):
I guess. But Logan Paul now is still young and
jacked and looks good and can have decent matches, so
he should be doing that.

Speaker 2 (44:39):
Maybe it's Andrew Schultz's job.

Speaker 1 (44:41):
Oh, that'd be good.

Speaker 2 (44:43):
I mean they tried a couple of years ago with
Johnny Knoxville's podcast.

Speaker 1 (44:46):
Huh yeah, gee, I'm a homie, I'm from New York.

Speaker 2 (44:51):
And what about old boy old colts Kicker. He's still around.
Pat McAfee is still doing oh gounds, right, But it's like,
you're not wrong, but I think they are making steps
towards that by trying to integrate people, but I'm obviously
wwe still marches to their own drum.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
I suppose, but I think it's a bad call. And honestly,
at this point, I'm just putting this out there into
the ether, and I know.

Speaker 2 (45:17):
Oh god, I did the other podcast too. Shit, I'm sorry,
the one that they did at WrestleMania and just recently
that they got in trouble.

Speaker 1 (45:24):
For ah Bert Kreischer.

Speaker 2 (45:28):
No, no, no, no, Hinecliff kill Tony.

Speaker 1 (45:32):
Oh that guy.

Speaker 2 (45:33):
That guy's fucking I know, but that again, just kind
of hammering to your point, like they are doing this.
It's not landing very well, but they are doing that.

Speaker 1 (45:43):
So Hinch, you know what, Hingecliff would probably be a
good annoying manager because he's just fucking obnoxious anyways. Right,
So just him being there and being like, you think
you're gonna win the title and you're not gonna win it.
You think you're better than me or not, you think
you're better than my talent, None of you are.

Speaker 2 (46:03):
They need, you know who they need? They need the
Opie podcast. That's what they need.

Speaker 1 (46:10):
No, honestly, at this point, and you know, you don't
like to say it because you know, I'm a die
in the war. I'm a strong style wrestler, a W two,
I fucking die. But like once Eddie Kingston's legs finally
completely give out, I'm looking at him and I'm saying,
three hundred thousand dollars a year coming and be a manager.

Speaker 2 (46:30):
Three hundred thousand. I mean, according to GG, they can
barely afford thirty so.

Speaker 1 (46:34):
I know it would be homeless. You won't be able
to afford it, be starving to death at that point.

Speaker 2 (46:38):
Can we talk about that for a second too. I
know it's a segue topic, but people losing their minds
that apparently they're pissed off at WWE, or they're pissed
off at GG Dolan for even mentioning it. But she
mentioned on some kind of like an interview or whatever
where she said that NXT contracts are as low as

(46:59):
thirty thousand year and they don't go as high as
you think, and so she kind of got like lit
up for that.

Speaker 1 (47:06):
But there's also you have to take into account and
by the way, like, is that complete garbage money in
twenty twenty five?

Speaker 2 (47:13):
Absolutely, Oh my god, it's less than fucking McDonald's.

Speaker 1 (47:16):
That's that is absolutely fucking abysmal, but I'm also taking
into account what level is she speaking to in this moment.

Speaker 2 (47:24):
Okay, so here we go. Brian Alvarez is the one
that mentioned his side. He said she mentioned that the
people make as little as thirty thousand, and man people
in WWE were not happy with that interview because nobody's
making thirty thousand NXT. Brian says, the NXT deals start
at seventy five k. So if you're on TV wrestling
on NXTTV as a contracted performer, you're making a minimum

(47:48):
of seventy five thousand. Now, if you're a Jordan Grace
or Ricky Saints or whoever, you're obviously going to be
making even more than that. Nobody is making thirty thousand.
But at the same time, the WWEID talent, nobody is
making close to thirty thousand. They're making significantly less because
essentially the contracts are that they have the rights to

(48:08):
match any offer. And then she responded, of course because
she should, and she said, you know me, just clarify.
Never did I say that there was anything wrong with
this salary, nor was I complaining about it, which she
kind of was. But especially considering that this is starting out.
When I started wrestling, I was lucky to get twenty
dollars in a fucking cap bowl of tuna, driving all night,

(48:30):
first spot on a show. I was simply making a
point that contracts and salaries can vary greatly depending on
where you are and who you are, and with TV
living expenses, it can be tough. A lot of this,
a lot of you have took this and made it
into something it's not. I mean, I guess my point was,
is is it realistic to understand or believe that WWE

(48:54):
is paying any of their talent thirty thousand? But I
guess the ID talent is making less than that.

Speaker 1 (49:00):
Well yeah, I mean, but also the ID talent, I
don't know. I saw one of them at the fucking
gym the other day. Their kids, right, they live at home.
They're not like half of them are in their early twenties,
if not more than half of them. They're young people.
They're not being asked to leave the state. They're not

(49:20):
uprooting their lives. They're in town, they go to college.
They could have a fucking full time job pretty much
if they wanted to. So that's kind of its own thing.
As far as paying like a college kid that's just
learning to wrestle thirty thousand dollars a year to cover
their basic living expenses. It's better than the fucking zero

(49:43):
that most people got to get into the wrestling business.
Like she's making that point. She is making that point.
But the problem is is like you're putting that out
into the ether without all these caveats, and the wrestling
world is not very great at deciphering that kind of shit.
You know, I was just not very good at that.

Speaker 2 (50:02):
It's just one of those things that popped off over
the weekend.

Speaker 1 (50:04):
So by the way, seventy five grand a year, like say,
some of the NXT talent is making that to be
on TV, that's pretty fucking decent. I mean, living in Florida,
living in Orlando, being a younger person, presumably no debt.
Let's say maybe you got some maybe students besides that college.

(50:25):
I was going to say, just you know, a little
student loans, right, well, but also you know what though,
and this is where it's like, obviously I'm like one
of the first people to say the student loan thing.
It's a fucking con. I've said it for fifteen years
to the point where people get pissed at me for
pointing out the obvious, but you know, the student loan thing,
a lot of them are college athletes. Therefore no oats, right,

(50:47):
you know, they had that shit taken care of for them,
so at least they got that. You know, at this point,
that's like, you know, you're you're starting at zero instead
of negative one hundred thousand in a video game of life.
You know, like you have to remember that to some extent.
But no, I mean, even if you're making seventy five
thousand dollars a year to wrestle on an XT television

(51:11):
with the potentiality of it jumping up to three to
five to seven hundred thousand dollars a year, it's really
nothing to fucking piss and moment about, that's for sure.
You know.

Speaker 2 (51:19):
I wanted to finish off talking about the original match
with John Cena and Raymond Seio and Seamus against Dominic,
JD McDonough and Finn Balor. Basically it was set up
where John Cena came out thank New York. Obviously, this
is his last appearance in or supposedly going to be
his last appearance in Madison Square Garden at least in

(51:40):
a match format, and Dominic came out there to talk shit,
kick a little dirt on his shoes and basically say
I want my belt back, and they set up a
time and place, but for tonight they were going to
have a six man tag because Dominic brought out the
rest of Judgment Day who were threatening to kick John
Cena's ass. And then Seamus with a fucking bolt runs

(52:03):
down to the ring and hits the ring and then
starts taking the offense. And then Seamus is almost down
and here comes Mysterio gingerly running, gingerly skipping to the ring,
and I'm just and it was just one of those things.
It's like, obviously the old man can't sprint to the

(52:24):
ring like he was in WC, but it was just
it was such a fast like it was like he
was fast walking, like speed walking.

Speaker 1 (52:33):
He's he's little Vince wilforking.

Speaker 2 (52:35):
Yeah. But there was some fun moments in there with
the everybody hitting their finisher at the same time. The
triple five knuckles shuffle was fun like, it was totally
an homage for the audience. They hit all the cues,
everybody had a good time and it ended up with JD.
McDonald taking the pin for the fun. And that's that's
how you started off.

Speaker 1 (52:55):
Raw and honestly that's almost how he ended it too,
because that was this is this is the problem, and
I get it, like it's almost over, you think, with
Sina being on his retirement tour. But you start the
shows off with forty five minutes or an hour a
John Cena, what do you do afterwards?

Speaker 2 (53:14):
Well, that's when you bring out to Stephanie Va Kerr
getting beaten up by Nicky Bella.

Speaker 1 (53:18):
I know you're like, hey, guys, look at this hot
girl and she get beat up.

Speaker 2 (53:21):
We've got to cool this down real quick. You guys,
are they too fucking excited for this first thirty five minutes? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (53:27):
Right, hey guys, you know, how about we get you
want to see this good looking girl after all that? No,
never mind, nah, let's take that away from you instantly.

Speaker 2 (53:37):
Yeah, the best shots of Stephanie Va Kerr were obviously
covered up by all the smoke and fog. Anyways, so.

Speaker 1 (53:43):
Yeah, yeah, not a great not a but once again,
I mean like when you have seen it, be the
first hour, it's like if you went to fucking you
go to Texas Roadhouse, they bring the stake out first,
and they're like, hey, you want rolls. You're like, no, right,
fucking your roles for it. You want peanuts now, it's
like yeah, I know. You fill up on the peanuts, right,

(54:04):
and then the steak comes and you go, shit, I
got to bring half of this home.

Speaker 2 (54:06):
Yeah, that's a European show at Madison Square Garden, So
it makes sense. You start off hot and then you
get to the cold food later. You know, it's just.

Speaker 1 (54:14):
That's a good point. You eat some cigarettes, yea, yeah,
then you get ice cream and then you work on
the steak and ok, and then you go drink a
little red wine and then you pass out somewhere. I
don't know.

Speaker 2 (54:30):
It wasn't great, I think so, I don't know. They're
really pushing the idea of Nikki Bella being the cornerstone
of women's wrestling, which is why it keeps leading me
back to Okay, aj Lee and Nikki Bella at some point, right,
because that was the big contention for the longest time,
was everybody believed that aj Lee and Page, arguably Page
back in the day, were the reasons why the women's

(54:51):
division turned around from the butterfly belt stuff. To becoming
taken least a little bit more seriously as far as
WWE is concerned. And then after that, obviously you know,
she was ejected from the company, her husband left, et cetera,
et cetera. And then Niki Bella kind of said, Yep,
that was my mantle. I did that. I was the cornerstone,
and people just kind of went, no. Charlotte probably added one, No,

(55:14):
it was me.

Speaker 1 (55:15):
I was the greatest, all right, whatever, No, No, I'm
pretty sure it was like, you know, Becky and Bailey.

Speaker 2 (55:21):
You know what, it always felt like. It's like, guys,
just just give it to her. She doesn't have what
she got a reality, she just just let her have it.

Speaker 1 (55:28):
Whatever, You're right, that is That is almost like a
good a good point. She gets to be like fuckable
ol Bundy, Yeah, I a touchdowns. That's great.

Speaker 2 (55:42):
Al just standing outside a raw with a with a
sign that says shoot me six dollars, you know.

Speaker 1 (55:52):
Ah, gosh, Peggy, by the way, I'm just fuckable. Gee's big,
you know, Like why I guess, but you know what,
I guess it's a heel that's more acceptable. The problem.
The problem is she says the same thing as a
heel as she does has a face I know, and

(56:13):
isn't that kind of a problem, Like shouldn't she be
like humble bumble, nothing may changed and even the reasoning
doesn't make sense.

Speaker 2 (56:22):
Like so this big reveal, this big attack was so
that she could finally reveal why she attacked her the
first time, and it was because I don't want to
sit on the sidelines. I want to be the cornerstone
of women's wrestling and.

Speaker 1 (56:37):
I'm just and people are like, yeah, sure.

Speaker 2 (56:40):
Yeah, nobody gave a ship. Nobody gave a ship.

Speaker 1 (56:45):
And honest to god, miss why what they.

Speaker 2 (56:49):
Shouldn't they shouldn't. It's just it's not even a good
heel because nobody even believes it as a heel. They're
just like they just pat her on the head, you know, Like,
what am I gonna do with a gun? Rack? Let alone? Ag,
I don't own agg gun, let alone many guns that
would necessitate an entire fucking rack. That's that's who Nikki

(57:10):
Bella is, but more so just rack. Yeah, well lots
of rack triple ah uh Yeah, So that happened. Then
after that, we get a little backstage with Bailey and
bird Girl and they're kind of doing the camaraderie thing,
and then they're trying Bailey tells bird Girl to fuck

(57:32):
off for a second while she talks to Osca and
Oscar in her crazy form, is like, you all, Bailey,
I know you're kind of a bitch and we have
some history, but I need a fifth member for my team,
and I thought, why not throw this dog a bone?
Why don't you join us? And Bailey starts laughing with

(57:53):
them and that weird Calkuli voice that she does and says,
all the ship you did to me, maybe turn on
my friend. Uh no, that's a hard no, fuck off,
And so Osca pretty much tells her something horrible and
Japanese and walks off. And Kyrie does that you can't
see me shit for some fucking reason, because.

Speaker 1 (58:14):
Because that's supposed to be funny. Dude, you didn't you
get a big laugh at I mean.

Speaker 2 (58:17):
She doesn't even know what she is anymore. She is
literally like she's human vertigo. I just feel like puking
every time she's on the screen, Like I lose my balance,
I fall out of my chair, I'm looking for a bag.
It's just I can't deal with Kyrie, man.

Speaker 1 (58:33):
I mean, I gotta also say, I mean big outch
to Bailey too. Clearly she got her medication right, she
stopped hearing voices, you know.

Speaker 2 (58:40):
Yeah, yeah, well hearing voices again afterwards, because then bird
Girl came back in and Bird Girl's like, I'm so
proud of you. You did the right thing, Captain Planet,
and Bailey's like, what are you five? Shut the fuck up,
let's go, and it's like, all right.

Speaker 1 (58:59):
By the way, I think that's supposed to be funny,
but not in the way that we find it funny.
Yeah right, you know, like that's supposed to be funny,
and they're like, hey, get it. Bailey was she was
crazy and she was doing all that positive shit and
bird Girl wasn't buying into it. But now burg Girl's
buying it with Bailey's all that overm Just like, guys,

(59:19):
they're fine as a tag you know what, They're fine
as a tag team, right, It's okay. Just don't don't
try the comedy shit with people that aren't funny, they're
not right. Just don't don't do that.

Speaker 2 (59:34):
You know who? That would work well with Chelsea Green.
Chelsea Green would be able to take this somewhere like
it would be a comedy act. If I would even
say Chelsea Green could probably elevate Bird Girl more than
Bailey could. And not that Bailey doesn't do fantastic in
the Ring, of course she does. Nobody's taken away her
veteran badge. But if you're talking about the comedic element

(59:57):
Bailey's tried over the years, man, I'm sorry, I've never
really been aboard the Bailey haha train.

Speaker 1 (01:00:02):
It was just well, I kind of like, I would
really think that they could pull off the whole Chelsea
with Bird Girls sing if you went with and nobody's
calling her ugly, but like you could do the ugly
duckling thing with her where Chelsea's like, you got to
wear big heels and she's just like, I'm an Irish girl.
I like to drink beer and I'm a fucking bird

(01:00:24):
And Chelsea's like, you right, that's not what we do.
We're pretty, Like you got to be pretty and if
you kind of went in that direction, which, by the way,
I think they should have done that with what's her
face there? The fucking yeah. Well I almost called a
roly polio ry. Well she's I mean, I've said before, dude,

(01:00:48):
she's she let herself go to the effect of like
she can't lower her arms, and that's not even a
matter of any point where you're just like, oh, I'm
just beating dick and sexist. It's just like, Jude, I
literally look at you and I feel hurt and I
feel the physical pain looking at you. There's no way
you're comfortable like that right at all, Like you're not

(01:01:08):
living a life of remote comfort when you're that fucking big.
But like, yeah, with the bird girl, that would have
been a funny thing. I'm just a little Irish girl
and never know. And she's just like, you're getting rid
of these weird extensions. We're not doing this. They're gonna
be cute. Yeah, we're gonna make you cute and pretty,
and like maybe they could have pulled that off, but

(01:01:28):
I don't know. Bailey's a schizophren he is under control.
And that was the whole meat of the segment. Apparently
Kyrie's not funny. Osca is a cuckoo crazy lady.

Speaker 3 (01:01:38):
I love.

Speaker 2 (01:01:39):
Osca is not going to disappoint me no matter what.
I've even watched some of her kna chan stuff, late
chan ConA Chan stuff lately. It's she's she's keeping in character,
which is a lot of fun. Like she's she's doing
less of her and more of the character, and she's
kind of leading into it and obviously the people on
her videos are leading into it too, So good for her,
you know, and I know she has are you there

(01:02:00):
here and there? So Uh. The next matchup that we
had was the uh the last time is now but
it's actually you know, in a couple of weeks or
whatever next week. But the tournament with Dolf Dolf Ziggler
returning up against Solo so CoA, the US champion, Solo
Socoa in a uh, it was it was a fine,

(01:02:22):
it was a match.

Speaker 1 (01:02:25):
Well what a reminder of the guys like Solo aren't
close to Dolph yet.

Speaker 2 (01:02:29):
Yeah, I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
Really as Dolph Ziggler at this point is like forty
seven years old.

Speaker 2 (01:02:35):
And yah, he's forty seven years young, Joseph.

Speaker 1 (01:02:38):
I'm a spry forty seven, you know. But like you're
watching Dolph and you're going, he's still bumping, like he's
getting fucking hit with a shotgun. Like this guy is
still working his absolute ass off. Yeah, And I mean,
I know it's New York. It's one of those you know,
smart towns. I mean, if you want to call it that,

(01:03:00):
they are reacting to Dolph in a way where you're like,
oh the fuck they remember Not only do they remember him,
they like what he does, they like what he's doing.
And then they have Solo go over him. I mean,
spoiler alert, we all kind of fucking knew where that
was going. And he takes that fucking thumb like once again,
like he got fucking hit with a missile, and you go,

(01:03:21):
and then Solo goes home, Do Home, Home, Do Home,
and rolls on him when you go. Jesus, these guys
are not right over this Samoan fucking s squad. These
guys are not over. And Solo as a person seems
like the fucking man. He seems cool as hell, But
it ain't translating onto television. It's not working to where

(01:03:43):
Dolf Ziggler, who disappeared for five years, they comes back.

Speaker 2 (01:03:46):
They killed him with that new bloodline shit with fucking
corn on the cob and all that. It's just they
did him no favors with that. He didn't come out
looking good from that. And you're right, as much fun
of a person that he could be, as far as
the TV stuff, it's just not enjoyable. It's just I
don't know this. This can we.

Speaker 1 (01:04:05):
Agree that Solo should be his day, should lean into
being like his dad.

Speaker 2 (01:04:10):
What do you mean by that getting a bigger Yes,
he is being fat and fun being fat. Just start
putting out some dance moves and ship.

Speaker 1 (01:04:18):
Yeah yeah, I mean Solo over the last couple of
years looks like he's been eating for trio. But like
he's bigger, he's got his dad's he's kind of affable,
he's got it like he's a I hate to use
a kid. He chill due, he comes off. Is that
like him is like the Mafia Simo and Boss. People
are like, fucking shut up, dude. Nobody buys that. Nobody's

(01:04:41):
buying into Samoa.

Speaker 2 (01:04:45):
Roman reigns. That's what still feels that ain't gonna.

Speaker 1 (01:04:48):
Happen, because Roman reigns is barely fucking Roman. The only reason,
the only reason that Roman reigns were worked in general,
is because he had eleven people around him who were
more interesting. Right, he won constantly and looks like Aquaman.
It sounds like once again being a dick, But that's
what happened. Roman was not over for eight years then

(01:05:09):
he surrounded himself with the usso's who got more interesting
somewhat Sammy who had a personality, Paul Hayman, who was
the only manager in the company and one of the
people that can talk circles around anybody, and that helped
elevate Roman. Then they had Solo who worked god as
a henchman, and they said, hey, henchman, what if we
make you talk all the time now? And he shited

(01:05:32):
his pants and like, well, well, I said he should
be in TNA. If anything, what I took away from
that match is Dolph Ziggler should be on WWTV. It's
almost the Cowa should be in TNA. That's what I
took away.

Speaker 2 (01:05:44):
But I think that was the plans that we've talked
about before though, too, is that Dolph Zigler being in
TNA was just going to be a temporary thing. He's
going to go down there, kind of teaches Kraft to
the people that need it with TNA, and eventually come back,
eventually come back hot, hungry and people hungry for him.
And maybe this is it, Maybe this is the sprinkling

(01:06:05):
of seeing more Dolph Zigler back in WWE. At this point,
I wouldn't be surprised if he shows up at the
Royal Rumble.

Speaker 1 (01:06:13):
I'll tell you I ain't showing up in WWE again
anytime soon. That fucking Cardona.

Speaker 2 (01:06:18):
Oh that's Zach Ryder.

Speaker 1 (01:06:19):
You mean, yeah, that's done. I'm telling they're not. They're
not offering him a contract. It's apparently i've heard no,
which I don't know. I mean, they've already got enough guys,
like even though I said, Zigler, they got enough guys
who are three years out from retirement. But I don't
know who he I don't know whose feathers he ruffled.

(01:06:40):
But the fact that they're not even going to pay
him to come in and be like Chelsea's fucking so
But boy, you know, finding.

Speaker 2 (01:06:48):
Out that brock Lesner was on RAW, I was like, man,
if we could have only had him kick Zach Ryder
down the stairs again, just again, just one more, just
one more time, and I'll pay to see that. Guys,
just one more time. Bring Zach Ryder back and just
have Brock throw him down the stairs. And remember remember
the stairs, Zach, No, not these stairs, Yeah, remember the stairs,

(01:07:11):
down the fucking stairs.

Speaker 1 (01:07:13):
Well, I mean, I'm like I said, I'm sure that
they've they've already gotten a hold of the green Day
Time of Your Life song for a month. You know, yes,
you're taking ass and just him rolling down the stairs's
hill him and you.

Speaker 2 (01:07:28):
Oh that was Zach Collin. Oh you know what, I'm sorry.

Speaker 1 (01:07:32):
Maybe maybe I was just misremembered that's how we priced.

Speaker 2 (01:07:38):
Yes, you're right, I did.

Speaker 1 (01:07:40):
I totally Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:07:43):
Well then you know what, I want to see it
happen for the first time. I want to see it
happen for the first time from Brock last.

Speaker 1 (01:07:51):
What if we just what if we just zoom out
and Caine's got one hand on the wheelchair and Brock's
got the other hand.

Speaker 2 (01:07:59):
They just like together, they're like blood brothers. They do
like one of those weird like eighties action hero things
where they throw their hands together like the high five,
and then they just throw Zach Ryder down some stairs.

Speaker 1 (01:08:13):
They just push him off in it. Then Kane turns
an iron just that's kissing brocklesses. Why do I think
it was Zach Ryder because it's this guy I don't know.
I guess the ship they all suck. No, no, he's
but the fact that he's not gonna get apparently paid
to even be like, that's to me that you're not
gonna get a Mike Bennett run with how over your

(01:08:34):
wife is, well, he's got to get him or get
him in a read, I like that's your plan, Like
maybe that's what they thought. They're like, well maybe if
we signed him, then he show get pregnant. They'll both yeah.

(01:08:55):
And then and then Zach Ryder go on the internet
and be like I've been wronged, right, how mistreated I've been? Yeah,
no this' but whatever. Dolph did a great job here.
But like I said, Solo Sokoa and the and the
Goofballs of destiny uh dot dot dot TNA bound and
put Dolph Stickler back on WWE television.

Speaker 2 (01:09:14):
Then we had Maxine depri versus Becky Lynch the IC Belt.
It was okay match again.

Speaker 1 (01:09:21):
You know, it's exactly what you thought it would be.

Speaker 2 (01:09:23):
Maxine going through the basics, which is fine. Nothing looks
inherently bad. There was a couple of slip ups there,
and but aj Lee was the highlight of the match,
obviously coming down there to fuck with Becky a little
bit and obviously lends support to Maxine. And I think
it actually adds a story because I think Maxine desperately
needs and even though she has all of this background,

(01:09:46):
like you've pointed out before that you say that benefits her.
I think having somebody like an aj Lee in her corner,
as her trainer, as her veteran, as somebody who's taken
her under the wing, I think you could do a
lot more with Maxine that way. I think actually adds
a lot of credibility if they want this girl to
become something big.

Speaker 1 (01:10:05):
Well, this is also another thing that I was thinking
of too. So the mids they gave her basically, you know,
the mid card title right for you know, for raw
you know. So are the women's mid card titles that
they have now going to be specifically given to really
green women who are esthetically pleasing? Is that they're going

(01:10:27):
to be the thought process or are these just going
to be like because that's it, Like Jade sucks, Jay's
horrible in the fucking ring, but looks great. Maxine sucks,
but she looks great and you know, you have some
story that you can tell with her. So we're going
to work towards getting the title of both of these
two right in the next month.

Speaker 2 (01:10:47):
Well, she both of them, She she won the belt.
But I, yeah, maybe that's what it is. Maybe it's
an interim title. The intercontinental title is more like the
female interim title. I don't Yeah, maybe that's the best
way to look at it, because it didn't make sense
to being on Becky Lynch's waist.

Speaker 4 (01:11:07):
No no.

Speaker 1 (01:11:08):
But at the same time, it's like, once again, you've
aligned it with two people. You have two women's mid
card titles basically, right, and both of them belong to
people who can barely do ship at all. And once again, like,
I get it. I get the T shirt sales, I

(01:11:29):
get the putting people on a poster, I get the they.

Speaker 2 (01:11:33):
Want to tag team Maxine and Jade.

Speaker 1 (01:11:36):
Oh the Green Machine. A storm is coming, a green storm,
a green storm, and then the hurricane can manage him.
They'd be great, Oh my god, then yeah he's the manager. Fuck, honestly,
he do a better shot. Isn't it crazy to think

(01:12:01):
of that? If I if they said to me, hey, listen,
we're just gonna take Shane Helmes is in the back
doing whatever. I'm pretty sure just be like, yeah, he's
going to manage two girls, I'd be like, you do
a better fucking job. Probably, alb them.

Speaker 2 (01:12:14):
Jade's the actual women's champ, but I'm sorry when I
think of Green, that's that's the first one.

Speaker 1 (01:12:18):
Oh, I forgot.

Speaker 2 (01:12:22):
What's her name, Julia or whatever has the.

Speaker 1 (01:12:24):
No Julia lost it to This is what happens when
you don't want Chelsea.

Speaker 2 (01:12:30):
That's right, Chelsea is the chance. Thank you?

Speaker 1 (01:12:32):
Well, I mean, you know it's I just saw Friday.

Speaker 2 (01:12:35):
With the fucking thing too. You think i'd remember, Well.

Speaker 1 (01:12:38):
Think about it this way, all right, So you got
two women's titles, uh, two main women's titles, and then
you have two secondary women's titles. Yes, and your best
obviously as far as a performer in ring is the core.
Chelsea's like your most just kind of charismatic and over one,

(01:12:59):
and then you got to kind of.

Speaker 2 (01:13:01):
Just let's just be honest that that title, if anything,
is holding her back. Have her and Jade just switched
titles and we're okay.

Speaker 1 (01:13:10):
Yeah, I know. But but also with Chelsea, like Jared,
everybody's well aware of the fact that she's not the
most amazing and ring performer. When she gets there, I know,
That's what I'm saying. She gets by she's she's good
at what she needs to do. I still think that
if anybody is destined for the commentary table, for being

(01:13:32):
someone who's going to be a spoke, like I know
they all.

Speaker 2 (01:13:35):
Love j car, she can be the whole table and
then they can just like write note Michael Cole can
write notes on her belly. Crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:13:46):
Yeah. She just lifts them up with one arm, just
like two arms. They just use her back. She widens
her back like Rakel used to. Uh no, it's I
mean that's chel personality. Is Wade married yet Wade Barrett?

Speaker 2 (01:14:01):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:14:02):
I was thinking of other way, like Wade Bucks.

Speaker 2 (01:14:04):
No, no, wait, I think Wade Barrett would like uh
like Jade.

Speaker 1 (01:14:08):
Huh, Jade Barrett. There you go, it's like your benefit. Honestly,
fucking I'll take Wade Bear as a goddamn manager at
this point, even though he's taller than everybody. It's just
like they need they need people with personalities on the
show that can talk.

Speaker 2 (01:14:23):
Did you guess you know, speaking of Wade Barrett, did
you see that the commentary from Otanga, I guess he
was on CVV talk about how John Cena isn't a
nice guy and he's kind of like he held everybody
back and the Nexus and all this and that.

Speaker 1 (01:14:38):
Yeah, he's got nothing to complain about.

Speaker 2 (01:14:42):
Man, come on, well he had a shitty wife. Let's
be honest.

Speaker 1 (01:14:45):
That was well. I mean as far as the WW yeah,
the wife. The wife, he could complain about, the wife
being horrible, rotten human to him. Uh dude, David, o'tanga
come on, buddy, I know you were you were lucky
to even have the fucking dime you had. Man.

Speaker 2 (01:15:02):
Yeah, he was not good, he said. Uh so CVV
asked him, He's like, do you think Johnson to bury
the Nexus? And a time said yeah, it's one hundred
percent accurate. I mean, that's what happened. And that's what happened.

Speaker 1 (01:15:15):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:15:16):
CVV said, is it because he wanted to go over
the match? And he's like yeah, And I don't know
why he wanted it to go over, but we all
knew that we were supposed to go over, and then
things started getting weird and then they tell us no,
the finish change, and it's because John wanted to go
over and we weren't happy about that. Other guys in
the match weren't happy about that. And if I'm being honest,
I think that John probably knows that that wasn't the

(01:15:37):
right idea. I mean maybe obviously at the time he
thought that that was the right call, but in retrospect,
I don't even think he would agree that that was
the right thing to do. So you spend six months
or however long it was building up this faction and
where the strongest thing, which they were. To be fair,
that initial Nexus run was pretty fucking hot. But uh,
and then why would you have us lose that? That

(01:15:58):
is the main event to really build these new stars
and want to keep it going. We could have rode
this all the way to Mania, but that after that
we lost, and it took us down a few pegs.
After that, we never regained the steam. They ended up
separating us. And even then they started to have a
good storyline where we were going to oust Wade Barrett
and I was going to take over, and then he said,
we got a new leader for you to see him punk.

(01:16:19):
Well wait, what how does he fit in? And I
guess they needed a faction. Straight Edge Society was done
and he needed a new faction. So I don't know
why they decided to give him Nexus, but yeah, So
basically he runs down the story of what happened with
the Nexus, and I wonder in retrospect, do you think
he was right? Do you think that John Cena made
a mistake by pushing the fact that I guess he

(01:16:44):
needed to go over the next And I don't even
know what the mindset is there, Like did John Cena
think that he's.

Speaker 1 (01:16:49):
Going I don't even Honestly, I'm not even going to
put that onto Scena. This was the absolute worst time
creatively wwe may have ever been having around this around
this time wrestling, right, so it could have been just
about any jackass other than Sena, and who only knows
who could have They could have said to him, what
are you gonna go out there and lose to fucking

(01:17:10):
drag redheaded guy? Like they're not. I'm not going to
solely put that on Sena because we know what was
going on, and obviously the whole company was revolving around
house shows and selling John Cena shirts. Right. Oh so yeah,
I It's it's another one of those into why would
we even done that?

Speaker 2 (01:17:30):
Honestly, that's the weirdest thing, because they sacrificed Sina in
the beginning there they wanted to make the big splash.
Why would you go through all that using Sena and
then never pull the trigger.

Speaker 1 (01:17:41):
Just having a big bad for a period of time.
That was my guess. That's probably all they thought. It
was like, well, just make some big bads and then
Sina will beat all the big bads, and that's what
Sina did for a fucking decade. Yeah, and I'm not
even short like like at this point. Yes, it's very
easy at the time living through it, being like fucking,

(01:18:01):
what the fuck? Why doesn't this asshole put anybody over?
But then you realize eventually you go, oh, look at
what the business model was at that time. Nothing else
mattered other than John Cena selling T shirts and showing
up at house shows. They gave no fucks about quite
literally anything else. So was that his fault?

Speaker 2 (01:18:26):
I don't no, not really. I mean, was he gonna
look at it a last minute change though? Do you
think it was Seena playing some kind of a politic
thing or do you think that really was just because
So that was the part that bothered me in reading
that interview, right was And I didn't get to see
his facial structures or anything else like that, so I

(01:18:47):
couldn't take any you know, cues on if he was
being sarcastic or how serious he was being, but gauging
from what he was saying, it almost sounded like everything
was a lock. The day of. Everybody was like, Okay,
this is what we're doing. And then somebody ran to
them with like a note sheet and said, yeah, by
the way, finished change. Johnson's going over and they're all like,

(01:19:08):
what the fuck?

Speaker 3 (01:19:10):
You know?

Speaker 1 (01:19:10):
So and and by the way, let's let's be real
with how Vince operates and how wwe operated at that time.
There's a very good chance I knew they were gonna
put you on scene over the whole time. They just
didn't tell them what the That's a very good chance
that they already knew that was gonna happen. They just
weren't gonna tell them all that. Hey, guys, guess what.
You're gonna all get bitched out.

Speaker 2 (01:19:31):
You know. Oh you think you think it's a moral issue, then.

Speaker 1 (01:19:36):
Well yeah, I mean if you if you look at
all these guys and say, I'm gonna bring you all
up with the television, Oh hell yeah, that sounds great.
What are you gonna do? Yeah, you're gonna all get
queefs on by Scena in three months and it doesn't
even matter. Then you're not gonna get anything out of them,
you know. I mean realistically, you know, a job is
a job is a job. You know, get in there,

(01:19:58):
do your thing. Oh loose to the star. But when
you're taking a half a dozen guys or so that
are young green guys, and you're saying to him, yeah,
we're actually just bringing you up here to just put
you through the tron scene of humili agent ritual. Yeah,
but they were all like they should have been happy.

Speaker 4 (01:20:17):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:20:17):
I guess because they were brought up from NXT. You
would have thought, oh, wow, look they're bringing us up
as a group. Hey, look you're gonna kill John Cena.
But in the end he's gonna come up. Like that
story sells itself too. You're gonna kill John Cena, but
eventually he's gonna come up and he's gonna get his
revenge and win this match.

Speaker 1 (01:20:36):
Well, I think that would be their starting point, right,
I think that they would sell it to them as that.

Speaker 2 (01:20:40):
They're gonna be like, no, you're gonna kill them forever,
and then it's oh, by the way, sorry, we fucked up.
Like I it's just so weird, and I know you're
right about creatively. WWE in twenty ten was fucking stiflingly bad.
It really was. But it's just weird to bait and
switch that at the last minute just to keep up morale,

(01:21:01):
except five minutes before the match, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:21:04):
Like, I can't say I'm particularly surprised one way or
the other, but I, like I said, over time, I
have softened my stance on blaming Sina for a lot
of this, just because of the fact that I don't
even believe that, you know, similarly to the He's just
like Hogan and it's like, well, no, Hogan was telling

(01:21:24):
people to fuck off. Yeah, he was telling people to
fuck off for decades when he could have actually helped people.
But what I know.

Speaker 2 (01:21:32):
My final point on this, though, is David o'tanga has
no dog in this fight anymore. It's not like David
O'tonga's coming back to WWE, you know what I mean. Like,
so this is a very wild interview to listen to
or read because it's kind of like, well, what's the
point of Davida Tongue even saying this, they're no law.

Speaker 1 (01:21:51):
You could have been in the NFL if if that
Danne didn't give out on him. It's just this is
how humans are. Man Like, you know, you could have
fucked the prom Quinn and if only you did sit
ups in high school instead of played video games. Like
everybody has their own cope, I guess, you know. Like
and for Otanga, like once again, for the Life Return,

(01:22:11):
I would need some fucking copium too. Yeah, I'd need
to tell myself some other Goose stories if need be.
Or maybe he's right. I don't know. I went there right, No, no, fair.

Speaker 2 (01:22:21):
Enough, I just yeah. Then we get up to Javon
Evans versus Gunther, which was the the second last time
is now tournament matches. Gump there looking like he's losing
a little more weight. Did you notice that?

Speaker 1 (01:22:37):
Well, he's he's probably he's probably taken care of himself
because I think he I'm not gonna say he put
on pounds, but at one point you could tell he was,
you know, he's got a little bit more relax. Maybe
he was having injuries and they were catching up with them,
so he took his time off, probably got himself back,
and it's got to shape as he could be. I mean, honestly,

(01:22:58):
gun there is what he is. It's gonna be fucking great.
He's gonna be solid, it's gonna be consistent performances.

Speaker 2 (01:23:04):
Uh oh, charts. It was a great match, like for
what it was, it was a fantastic match. It was
just I immediately noticed, I'm like, wow, Gunther looks a
little more gaunt in the face.

Speaker 1 (01:23:14):
You know, Well, that's it. I think he's just he's
gonna be that guy. I think because he struggled with
his weight for a lot of his life, he's gonna
be on that fucking yo yo. But uh dude, if
I'm wwa, I am finding a way. I am finding
a will in a way to where Sammy Zine is
driving with Javan for a fucking year because that he's it. Yeah,

(01:23:43):
that kid is it. He's young as hell, but like
when he puts on size, his his matches is selling
what he does and what he doesn't do. It reminds
me of Sammy when he was younger.

Speaker 2 (01:23:57):
Oh wow, it really is.

Speaker 1 (01:24:00):
He has the sense for it. I just think, like
I'm not saying that he's like not good now, I
mean twenty one year old.

Speaker 2 (01:24:08):
Oh oh you're still young though, But I mean seeing
a blue Shipper is always a good thing.

Speaker 1 (01:24:12):
Yeah, I mean my god, don't and boy, oh boy,
the thing I said earlier about hey man, this will
also be a fucking thing that could piss people to
fuck off. I'll take Javon Evans over pretty much anyone
with a dick in ae W at this point.

Speaker 2 (01:24:29):
Oh my gosh, you're gonna piss off Fletcher so badly
he's gonna.

Speaker 1 (01:24:33):
Be Oh, I know, imagine a fucking Kyle Fletcher. I mean,
I'm sorry, we get three of those fucking guys. Well,
you mean a guy that's sixty tall, maybe not even
with the boys regular haircut, that does flips. Where am
I going to find another one of those?

Speaker 2 (01:24:47):
But Kyle everyone says that, you know, he's greatest champion
of all time, surpassing Cody, So good for him.

Speaker 1 (01:24:54):
Maybe when he gets more people to watch him have
a match than to watch right back, he perogi's will
have a fucking conversation about how good he is. But
for right now, I will take the potential of Javon
Evans over basically Job Evans.

Speaker 2 (01:25:08):
That's a bad faux PA.

Speaker 1 (01:25:11):
Did I say job Evans?

Speaker 2 (01:25:13):
No, it sounded like you were gonna say job Evans.

Speaker 1 (01:25:15):
But oh, maybe I'm gonna said Bob Evans.

Speaker 2 (01:25:17):
Ah, yeah, so that's a very delicious sausage. But unlike
the oh.

Speaker 1 (01:25:22):
Pause pause, No, he fucking the kid is great. He
is fucking he has it. Like I said, size, He's
got to put on personality. I'm hooking him up with
the guy like Sammy and saying, you guys, drive around,
you listen to you, take everything this motherfucker says to you.

(01:25:44):
I'm saying to him, you are hanging out with Sammy's
ain and you are watching Too Cold Scorpio because that
is that is the money lane for you. You know
that personality that work, that's selling. He's a fucking beast dude,
he could be bro goddamn.

Speaker 2 (01:25:59):
Good Ninos and Chad says, they killed the crowd with
the finish of this match. Yeah, the sleeper.

Speaker 1 (01:26:04):
Huh.

Speaker 2 (01:26:04):
They really did not get into the sleeper Madison Square Garden,
And it's kind of like, that's really weird considering that's
that's a very common finisher for Gunther.

Speaker 1 (01:26:17):
But I also think for Madison Square Garden once again,
when you give him an hour long seene a match
to start, it's right, it's tough to recover from that
and not sitting there I mean also being being followed
by Nikki Bella and all this other shit. It's tough,

(01:26:39):
but I'm not trying to write him a complete pass.
But no, Javon has a fucking hell of the future
and Gunter's awesome, and I kind of love what they're
going to Gunter, which it seems like he's going to
have a couple of dare I say, lighter weight opponents
for those first two rounds, so it almost makes him

(01:27:00):
seem like an even bigger shithead, right, you know, like, oh,
who are you beating to get to Sina in the tournament?
You're beating the kid from NXT, this twenty one year
old kid that weighs like one hundred and sixty pounds.
Who else? Who is he facing Carmelo? But they're like,
I always gonna go against Carmelo, who had the surprise
When I thought about that, it's like, yeah, he's going
to be beating these guys who are smaller than him.

(01:27:23):
It's like, yeah, no, shit, dude.

Speaker 2 (01:27:25):
Like you we get ready to getting into the main event,
I guess we have the the face down with Logan
and Drew and bron Breaker and Bronson Reid and obviously
earlier in the night. Paul Hayman came out there to
tease Adam Pearce and Nick all this a little bit

(01:27:46):
and gave him his fifth choice, which ended up being
brock Lesnar and then Shenanigans and then see him Punk
coming out stalking to the ring, et cetera, et cetera.
But we got a big cluster fuck of everybody coming
out there and Roman Reigns came out there and yeah,
and that was the match. That was the end of this,

(01:28:07):
and that was it.

Speaker 1 (01:28:08):
I mean Roman got his big MSG pop, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:28:11):
Yeah, he got Bronson Reid out there, bron Breaker out there,
Cody Rhodes out there, every everybody was out there. That
was the big push. That was a big final, uh,
the final stamp of Monday Night Raw, which I kind
of felt it was slightly a letdown because I think
we all figured it was going to be brock Lesnar

(01:28:32):
to be the fifth man, considering it's Paul Hayman, Like,
at no point that I think, oh, Who's going to
be the fifth man. It was the fourth man, Drew McIntyre,
which I thought was very interesting. But this is what
we have for war games. This is the preface for
what's most likely the I don't know if it's going
to be the main event, but probably should be for
war games.

Speaker 1 (01:28:52):
But you would think that there we are. It was,
honest to god, they should where the show kind of
is where for when you're talking about what's going on
with RAW, it's a lot more of the minutia and
the what they're doing wrong and what they should probably

(01:29:12):
be doing better than what's actually on the show because
some of it's just which.

Speaker 2 (01:29:19):
By the way, the tournament though too. I mean even
lou Fisto, uh, when she was talking with us on Monday,
it was kind of like, you know, she just wasn't
really into the idea of the tournament and stuff. And
I understood that too, because I'm this last time is
now tournament really doesn't feel authentic anyway, right, it absolutely is.
It's plug and play, so we're basically given a handful

(01:29:41):
of exhibition matches that we're supposed to try and get
ramped up for to see who Johnson's last opponent is.
But there's no rhyme or reason. I mean, they had
the Miz do a fucking fantastic job with Jay Usso
on Friday, and I mean fantastic, Miz came out there
looking amazing. Why isn't miss really involved with this? Like

(01:30:02):
he should be involved with Johnsena directly. There shouldn't be
some kind of weird tournament going on, and like no
MS has a right to get in John Cena's face
and say, fuck all these people, it's me. You should
be fighting, you know what I mean? Like, even if
he doesn't, it feels like there's some things that they're
doing right now that are incredibly right, and there's a

(01:30:26):
lot that just feels like it's either very laxadaisical or
very unfinished. And it's just wild to me that they're
demanding higher and higher prices from people, and the show
feels more and more chaotic. I mean, they attacked on
the ESPN stuff. Ticket prices are going up hundreds of dollars.
Merchandise is now averaging forty to fifty bucks for a

(01:30:47):
SCAT T shirt. Like, ah, I just it's not hitting
me right. And I want to speak highly of WWE.
As people know, I often play Devil's Advocates to your
opinions on a lot of things, and not for the
sense of argument, but just for the sense of debate.
But it's very difficult to debate that raw and SmackDown
overall haven't been lighting the world on fire. And we're

(01:31:09):
coming across the most important time for WWE, and we're
going into warm water, I mean tepid water really, So.

Speaker 1 (01:31:19):
That's and that's being generous. And then you know, like
I said, we completely even forgot that. That was like
the New Day did a promo on the show with
Grayson Waller. It's like, who gives a fuck? Yeah, there's
just some shit on this. It's so it's so dead
in the water. Yeahugh, they just got to do better,
Like you said, if you're going to quadruple the price

(01:31:41):
of everything, you have to at least not give us
half the quality of the product, right, you gotta do
you gotta do better, like I said, even going back
to the twenty ten shit right, Yeah, sure it was
the John Zena Show and a lot of it sucked balls,
but it was thirty dollars to get into building, right. Yeah,
if you want to take your kids to go see

(01:32:01):
John Cena, you weren't spending your fucking mortgage to do it, right,
you know, Like it's like you can't you can't have
both a mediocre ass show and charge premium prices. And
I understand that's like apparently the plan of every business now,
which is how much can we build you and how
little can we give you? But at some point people

(01:32:21):
start to notice, they just do they're not well.

Speaker 2 (01:32:26):
I don't even think it's at some point. I think
they noticed the first time they buy a ticket and
go Jesus Christ. I think with this one. It's not
a sneaker. It's not like, oh did they raise the
price is ten dollars?

Speaker 3 (01:32:39):
No?

Speaker 2 (01:32:39):
No, Yeah, you go buy a ticket and all of
a sudden you're looking at your mortgage going, I'd like
to have a house instead, please, thanks?

Speaker 1 (01:32:47):
So right right, you're showing up to the grocery store
with a wheelbarrel of ones for a loaf of bread.

Speaker 2 (01:32:53):
Yeah, pretty much?

Speaker 1 (01:32:54):
Not good?

Speaker 2 (01:32:56):
All right? So much love to everybody listening to us
Live in the chap much loves the people supporting us
on Patreon, Patreon, dot com, Forward Slash Wrestling Soup. Make
sure you tune into Tony Talk Wrestling tonight. Much love
to Jeff lippin the shows that he's got over there.
Much love to dose some chocolate. Make sure to check
them out and Joe and myself will be back Thursday
for Wrestling Soup.

Speaker 1 (01:33:16):
Yeah see.

Speaker 4 (01:33:17):
You follow wrestlings Nek on Twilt at Wrestling Soup, Like
and subscribe vision to Wrestling Soup on YouTube, Apple, Amazon,

(01:33:41):
I heart really spotify this neel soap

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know

Ruthie's Table 4

Dateline NBC

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}THE VISIONS VISION or WWE NEEDS MANAGERS (Wrestling Soup 11.18.25)

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}Stuff You Should Know

Ruthie's Table 4

Dateline NBC

All Episodes

THE VISIONS VISION or WWE NEEDS MANAGERS (Wrestling Soup 11.18.25)

Stuff You Should Know