Nanotech and Evolution - Best of Coast to Coast AM - 3/12/23

Guest Host Connie Willis and Charles Ostman discuss nanotechnology and the way it will be used in the future.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on
iHeart Radio. You are listening to Coast to Coast AM.
Connie willis here second half. Hopefully some of you or
all of you are on track with the time. By
the way, I know some of y'all are feeling it,
like what's going on? Daylight saving time always does that
to everybody, right, and yes it should be consistent across

(00:22):
the board, and any of those of you that follow
my career, you know that we attempted to do that
from w w k A out of Orlando. W DBO
is the AM which you would hear Coast to Coast on.
We worked it into I think it ended up turning
into a bill the you know, we were trying to

(00:43):
get it year round for the you know everybody, and
we I guess the people that could really make some
moves said they should do it. You know, they were
going to start out kind of regionally. They thought was
that was the better way. I don't know, you know
what to me? Take the big jump, well, baby steps,
you know what, people grow up anyway. I'm sorry, that's
just me. That's just me. Take the take the flying

(01:05):
elite man, become the Jack Lolanes and the Elane Lolanes
of the world. But the first person to ever sign
it was Sonny Bono. That's a that's always kind of
a neat little story to tell. But anyway, I hope
you guys are back in action. Your body's starting to
get used to it. Just you know, hey, come on,
get over it. Let's go. You lost an hour. Take

(01:25):
a nap somewhere. Um right, less see spring forward, fallback?
Right okay, yeah, free spring for Okay, thanks, So come on,
we should all be good, we should be insane anyway. Um,
I'm excited for our next guest, and I'm also a
little like whoa, So hang in there with me on this.
First of all, if you wanted to know about Elane's books,

(01:47):
you can, of course go to our website. You can
of course go to her website, and you can always
go to my website too at Connie Willis dot com.
I'll have her information up there too, as well as
past people's information, and we'll be putting all those people
on a podcast as well, so you'll always be able
to get more. So follow that so that you can go.

(02:08):
I want more of Elaine and I want to be
able to talk to her because so I'll set up
some of those live podcasts so that you can do that,
all right. So I'm just learning the developing of it
and all the technical parts of it. So anything you'd
like to do with me and join the shows and
just enjoy it because we have a good time. Please
go to Connie Willis dot com and thank you. Now.

(02:29):
A lot of times when we take callers, there's some
callers that you know that I guess me as a
broadcaster I listened to I'm like, hey man, this this
person is pretty cool, and you guys know that live
on the air, I'll say, all right, leave your information
with Donna or call screener, leave information right, and then

(02:50):
she'll get it back to me. And that's when I'm like, hmmm,
I think you should be you should have your own
show with me sometimes. So this is one of the
guys that's on next that I did that with, and
you know, lo and behold, he's been on with you know,
our Bell, He's been on with yours Nori, you know
a ton of bazillion times. He's been all over the place,
and it's great to know that he's listening to the

(03:12):
show and loves to listen to the show and and
we'll call in. It's just that's always a neat thing
that it's mutual. That mutual. Now, one of the things
I like is he's highly intelligent. He knows what he's
talking about, or at least he leads me to believe it.
He's really good at that. But I can say, well,
what's that you know, and he'll he'll do He's kind's

(03:36):
he understands it might go over your head, so he's
not going to laugh at you. He'll explain it to you.
And that is very important because there's a lot of people,
and you guys have heard him before where they will
just talk right over your head and you have no
clue what they just said, and you're like five paragraphs
back and they're so far ahead of you you know
you've already lost it. So as he talks, if there's

(03:59):
anything where I need to stop him, and it's just
because of me, maybe you're past that, but there's a
lot more people, probably like me, that are going to
go what and they are very thankful that I might
stop him and ask. That way we can stay in
line with them. So we'll do our best to follow him.
But he also knows, Hey, you got to dummy it
down for at least me for sure. And so this

(04:22):
is Charles Ostman. You've heard him on here before. No
doubt he's experienced, his experience and clues. I'm going to
give you a little bit here, and then I'll let
him do a lot of it too, because I'm sure
he will. He can name some things that I'll never
have mentioned. But his experience includes forty five plus years
in the fields of electronics, material science, computing, artificial intelligence,

(04:45):
starting with eight years at Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory at the
University of California, Berkeley, Cool and at Los Alamos National Laboratory.
Cool Cool, Cool, Cool Cool. He's been a senior fellow
at the Institute for Global Futures, a consulting grew that
provides strategic research services to private and government clientele. I

(05:06):
love this. Co founder of nanosig and organization with the
primary charter of facilitating investment in nanotechnology related ventures. And
in fact, basically tonight we're going to be talking about
nanotechnology as a core catalyst of accelerating next stage evolution.
What is it and what is it not yet? Now

(05:28):
wait a minute, Now you might go oh this sounds
so boring, man, you know, sorry, Connie going to sleep.
No no, no, no no, no, no, no no, no, no, We're
gonna not at all. In fact, I love saying nano
nano earlier, by the way, I thought that was kind
of cool. But really the biggest thing is and we're
gonna bring on Charles right now. Welcome once again, Charles.

(05:49):
And the question what we're gonna ask first is why
is nanotechnology relevant to us? That is probably the bigger question.
So Charles, yeay, you're here, Thanks so much. Well in
Hi Kanye, I've always listened to for a long time,
and here we are. This is amazing. I'm actually quite astonished,
I know, and we've made it. I'm very happy about it.

(06:11):
And what's cool is you have put together some graphics
so that people can follow on the website. Yeah, that's
the basic idea. And I wanted to make the point
that it's not now technology as a singular sort of
vertical storm of pipe topic development or technology. It's really
at the center, almost like an actual of a wheel

(06:32):
with all these different spokes kind of rating out of it.
And it's a core fundamental technology which actually allows many
other technologies to be more plausible or possible, I should say,
in the near future, even the present term. So if
I had to describe what nanotech actually is, the symbolist
sort of Akin's razor approach would be this the manipulation

(06:54):
of matter at the molecular or even atomic scale of pursuit.
So to me, it was always it's just really really
itty bitty, itty bitty tiny. Yeah, but is not that
relevant unless you can do something with it. It's very
predictable or specific to a cause. She said, I'm sorry,

(07:16):
I should not say that's funny. I best go. And
by the way, I've really impressed with your previous guest.
I mean yes, I mean I should never lived to
ninety seven and'll be that functional. I don't know. I
feel robot half the time, so I don't know. She
is amazing and she's like that all the time. She's

(07:39):
such a hoot. And you know, I was concerned of
you know, you're gonna be on lay? Is that cool?
And she said, you know, when Jack was alive, I
would get up early because he was the early bird.
But now that he's not here with us anymore, I
am back to my old self of being a night owl.
So she said, I'm good. I'm good to go. So
that was great, and thanks for being on standby just

(07:59):
in case. Absolutely. Well, you know, it's interesting my best
hours at like three to four o'clock in the morning.
I don't know why, it just turns out that way
and time. I really do wish that this day light
losing time. Alcohol it right, I'll get resolved. I almost
got thrown off because I didn't know exactly what time
it was and I was doing all my stuff here
and I've realized, I wait a second, I'm an hour off.

(08:20):
Now I want to make sure I didn't like miss
the show or something. So anyway, here we are. We
thank you for being responsible for that too. So so yeah,
so okay, nanotechnology were again? Why why why should I
care about it? What's the big deal with it with me?
Because whether or not you're looking at computing, medicine, any

(08:43):
form of telecommunications, any kind of manufacturing, just about all
the stuff that you've seen or daily life, and you,
yourself as a person, as a living thing, aren't going
to be or already are in some ways affected by nanotechnology.
You may not see it, I mean as hard as
you now skills anyway, but I mean the artifacts or

(09:06):
the consequences of nanotechnology is already present in a lot
of different materials and audito existing products. It may not
be like you wake up one morning somebody discovered nanotech everywhere.
It's more of a transition. But we're in that transition now, well,
I mean aren't we, because like these phones get smaller

(09:28):
or actually whether well sometimes you want them a little bigger,
but I like them smaller. But more and more and
more and more and more and more and more things
fit in them, and function comes from it. It's not
a nactor of science, unle a matter of complexity. In fact,
there's something called more in law, which talks about technologies
doubles every you know, so many months and so on. Well,
that's kind of an outdated way of looking at it.

(09:49):
They be used to measure by the number of transistors
you could fit into a specific area. But I'll sort
of go against that, and I would say it's more
to do with the amount of complexity you can sit
into a a certain amount of time space. That's probably
a better way of looking at it, especially now if
you look at quantum computing, which is on such a
radical different scale of computational resource that is trying to

(10:13):
measure the size that transistors completely irrelevant acshally in that context.
But even before we get to quantum computing, just to
get to other types of computing, of which there is
both biological and sort of inorganic mediums you can work with. Again,
it's not how small is a thing, but rather how
much functionality can you pack into a specific region of
space time. So looking at some of the bullet points

(10:37):
you and I put together, or you put together for me,
so that I can go through this, because this is
a whole another world for me. This is out of
your brain. So what about these smart materials and all
the self organizing and self assembling all that kind of thing. Sure,
so I'll start by saying this, we're surrounded by self organizing,

(10:57):
a self assembling downtech everywhere. Almost living things are just that.
If you look into a cell, if you look into
the nucleus of a cell, the organelles, the ribosomes, other protosomes, etc.
That's what they do. They literally take a part and
reassemble various molecules to accommodate the physiological requirements of that

(11:19):
particular cell. And more importantly, how that's organs. There were
functions with an a larger body. Now it's kind of
fascinating is in the current scheme of things in terms
of biolot what I might call nanobiology, one of the
main target goals right now is to use what I'll
call quasi viral components to target offending cells by cancer

(11:41):
cells and be able to nutilize them, or to target
other try of cells and affect their physiology in some
kind of hopefully proactive way. Viruses are really good at this,
and you may be scared flay a minute free or
people panic, there's actually a good side of this because
if you sort of break apart a virus, what really
does It has a proteomic sennature kind of like a

(12:04):
hand to above all cells are just most of it's
to say, have an outer sheath of proteins that stick
out like fingers almost. It's the RNA sennature of that
particular type of cell, and viruses will target whatever cell
that third external RNA features won't cling to. That's why
it has different viruses for specific organisms, even for specific organs.

(12:27):
That kind of thing. So in a virus encounters the
right kind of cell, that's supposed to mate for it
will then for enxonic action, kind of nibulous way to
the cell ball goes to the cytoplasm. And then and
then they'll target one of the riber zones are one
of the other proteosomes and force that protozome to make
more virus as opposed to making more of the molecular

(12:49):
structure stuff normally going to keeping that cell functioning. Now,
that second part we don't like, but the first part
is wonderful because that excuse me. Now we have a
way of targeting whatever kind of cell we're looking for,
cancer cells and doing something with it, hopefully killing it
or turning it into a type of cell. They'll then
go after other cancer cells that sort of thing. And

(13:10):
that's already being done. Oh like a double spy man,
turn them around, make them go the other way, use them. Well,
fantastic voyage. Yes, quite bad. It's sort of like that
in the way. We're not shrinking people now and putting
them to the submarine, but we are taking already existing

(13:32):
submarine of sorts of vir entity and using it for
our purposes. Is that Okay? Now, I've seen videos or
films or something where they would create like it's almost
like a let's just say an eighty by eighty bitty
little like submarine is drone. Yeah, and then you could
take it and go move it around and then kill

(13:53):
what you wanted to kill. Is that is that happening?
That's another we look a different way of looking at
it would be an artificial immune system. Excuse thing. I'm
so sorry for my voice. By the way, I've got
this horrible poll going on, so I promise I won't
die or anything, but if I sell, by the way,
before I forget, Um, I really want to thank Ryan

(14:14):
a lot. He didn't. He did an amazing job getting
all my stuff posted up there at the eleventh arm
forty nine minute. Um, he was freely patient let me
repost all my stuff and he was great. So for
anybody been checking it out, you want to thank ryanc.
He did a marvelous job. Just you want to make
that point. Yeah, go to Coast to Coast am dot

(14:34):
com and then look for I think it says I'm
I'm already on the page, so I think it says
like related feature. So this down below the carousel and
you'll see the pictures that I'm looking at myself just
go on, I still don't get it. Yeah, but well
but that's like, that's why Charles is, you know, gonna
explain it? Are you called chuck as well? I kept on, Chuck,

(14:59):
no chart, okay, okay, So anyway, so I'm sorry, seeing
of biological things in the nano world, this may be
sort of relevant, and it may be part of how
we go into discussion later. But there is a quite

(15:20):
an interest by the FDA to figure out how they're
going to classify this genre of development from a medical perspector.
And the reasoning is because in earlier times, there are
two major categories of regulatory protocols wonder, which covered chemistry,
that being drugs, the other which covered machines, mostly machines

(15:42):
that are outside the body. You know, we're revoked up
to various devices and scanners and that kind of thing,
and more recently going to implant that sort of thing.
But all these regulatory protocols were wrapped around machines. Now,
in the world of nanotex, it's not exactly a chemical,
but it's not affecting a machine either, not in a
traditional sense. So what do you kind of write it

(16:04):
as So in two thousand and six, I was fetched
upon by the FDA wapp to the Press of Maryland
along with other folks that came by. Weeks later. I
gave a nine even a presentation. I mean, if you
think these slides are a bit elaboration in one hundred
plus lights, I had for that. But after giving this
presentation and went to all these different details about denvermers
and different kinds of organic molecules and you know, different

(16:27):
using plugy or open fundations and materfact delivery system all
that kind of stuff. Are you like roaming around the house?
Are you on your lag? Are you like crawling around
like a marine? Or what's going on over there? Man,
I'm sitting here in a shaer Oh it sound like
you're going in and out of something. Oh no, I'm
so sorry. Now you sound good, You sound good? Okay, well,
I'm so sorry. I think I think probable breathing for

(16:49):
them to be part of it. No breathing during the show,
thank you very much. It up or no, no dying alone. Yeah,
trying to have a show here, Okay, Yeah, the show
go ahead and crop off. Okay, So anyway, getting back
to the more realistic role, perhaps after ninety minutes or
so of this presentation, a few of the folks, we're

(17:11):
asking all these questions like, well, how do we regulate this?
What do you suggest for regulatory protocol? How are we
going to enforce any kind of new legal definitions for
what these nanobiological systems should be? And I said, you know, frankly,
it's not going to matter. The United States is no
longer in a position to inflict its regulatory will upon

(17:31):
the rest of the role as it might once have been.
Very likely China is going to go ahead and do
whatever they want to do, as I'm sure many other
nations will as well. So rather than worry about regulatory
protocols and the limitations thereof, look more towards sort of
adapting to emotion, more global kind of way of assessing
these properties. Listen to more Coast to Coast AM every

(17:52):
weeknight at one am Eastern and go to Coast to
Coast am dot com for more