Back in the Habit?

Humans are creatures of habit, but is habit a creativity killer? We talk about what routine looks like for women, and the benefits of breaking out of the same old thing every now and again.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hey, this is Annie, and welcome to stuff. I've never
told your protection of I Heart Radio's house. Stuff works.
And since I just got back from a trip that
I mentioned, I got back from Hawaii, don't. Yeah, that's

(00:30):
that's fair. And we're about to have some days off
for Independence Day here in the United States. We're doing
a lighter episode today on routine routine? Are you a
routine person, Samantha, I don't necessarily have routines, but more
like a list of habits. Yeah, I will say I'm

(00:50):
all about not making decisions of at all possible or
doing things. I just also don't want to do things.
Is that legitimate? I don't know. I mean, clearly it's happening,
So I guess it's more of like, not having a
routine is my routine. Oh, I have heard that as
a philosophy. So you might be onto somewhere just saying

(01:12):
is it working? Not quite sure. It's a fun adventure
every day. I have a lot of friends that would
relate to that, actually, and I actually I have a
group of friends who were all indecisive, and it's terrible
anytime we're like where should we eat? Two hours later? Man,
I'm really hungry. Where should we eat? We're angry now,

(01:34):
we're super angry. A lot of times we'll look through
Netflix for a movie to watch and just give up.
Oh my gosh. I think that's probably the reason I
rewatched so many things. I'm like, I don't want to.
I know this is gonna be safe. Let me watch
this again. Oh I do that all. And now I'm
gonna have to replace Office because Netflix and BC is
pulling it. Not for a couple of years. And a

(01:55):
lot of things are changing. A lot of things are changing.
Why do the things have to change? Um? And if
you're curious, what routine might have to do with women
and feminism, actually a lot, and we will get into that,
but as always, let's start with the definition definition time
a sequence of actions regularly followed a fixed program. That

(02:17):
is what dictionary dot com defines as a routine, or
more simply, a series of habits. In the words of
an article from Psychology Today's meg Selig, Um, Yeah, and
I feel the more I thought about it, the more
I was like, Yes, humans are creatures of habit. We
have routines, structures, schedules. Um. I that study. I love

(02:42):
that study where they looked into there's no assigned seats,
and yet people always sit in the same and they
get angry. It's kind of the whole church fatality, you know,
the old school ideas of like you're in my seat,
but like this is a church I don't understand, and
people really get upset about their one spot I've never

(03:02):
heard about. Oh yeah, don't don't mess with it. It's
also a sign of respect sometimes if you think on
like if there's a person who has been this charge
for twenty something years, I've set in this one spot,
and then you try to disrupt that. How dare you? I?
I guess because I went to my church maybe has
had twenty members. There was never a an occasion. I mean,

(03:26):
even like when new people came in, you always sit
in the back when you're new, right, right right, I
like to be remember the T zone Oh yeah, yeah,
yeah yeah, right now Annie is trying to act it
out for me because I'm doing it for you. Is
the front row and then the middle right and yeah,

(03:47):
you sat to like be in your teacher's best graces.
And I liked the back of the T zone. I
like being in the middle. I feel like it was
very inconspicuous, so you don't pay to the person in
the back, because automatically back people are going to this
trouble makers and fun people are are than know it
alls in the middle, so you are about the reputation
around it. Yeah. I'm like, I'm just gonna be silent

(04:09):
and hopefully I'll disappear. That's that's a lot, let's keep going. Um.
Routines do make things easier in theory that it's less
to think about every day. Um. And when I searched
women routine online, almost all all of the top results

(04:29):
were for makeup and then like three pages in working out,
which I think does say a lot. Yeah, so we
thought we'd we'd have a fun for us. I guess
thought experiment comparing our routines. Yeah, and I love once again.
We were just previously talking about how you had written

(04:50):
your thing out and I came behind like, holy crap,
I'm like an equivalent of the rat just running around
a tragicy like what can I find? Where's this one?
I'm like, Wow, great, Annie, thanks for looking so adult
like and seemingly put together while I'm over here just
hoping too not fall a bart. I think that might

(05:14):
be the first time since I've become an adult someone's
called me an adult. When I was a kid, I
got called an adult a lot. You are an adult.
Thank you, You're welcome. Thank you. Okay. So my weekends,
I will say, are all over the place their day.
But week days, the morning I wake up between six
and seven thirty, I do not send an alarm unless

(05:35):
I have something like way earlier than that, or I'm
really nervous about missing it because my body is just
like it just automatically wakes up that but point I mean,
I definitely have that timeframe too, but not that early. Yeah,
I don't like it, but that's how it is. Um.
I drink a glass of water, run four to eight
miles usually six. UM and I drink more water, do

(05:55):
some kind of like weightlifting, push up thing, eat breakfast,
fresh my tea, shower, get dressed, which can take a
while for me to decide what to wear because it's
mostly weather based. But I feel like I look so
frumpy every day. I'm basically wearing workout clothes at work
very often. That's not true. You had a nice little
jersey on yesterday, So that's an adult, very adult I am. Um,

(06:24):
I when I wear makeup. I do wear makeup every
day actually generally, but it's like tented lip gloss and
mask here and sometimes eyeliner sometimes. Um. And then I
walked to work, drink a cup coffee with a shot
of espresso, um, usually while watching YouTube videos. And then

(06:44):
at night when I get home, if I don't have
anywhere to be, which is a rare, beautiful thing. Um,
I'm probably out of my clothes in like less than
a minute in a long T shirt. And that's that's it.
I tried to write thirty minutes to day, and I
used to read thirty minute today, but that is not
a thing anymore. Um. And then I stretch most of

(07:06):
the time. I try to stretch. And then thirty minutes
before I go to sleep, I stopped taking my phone,
which has caused a lot of my friends to be
very confused because they know I stay up late and
I have the best of intentions of going to bed
at like ten thirty, right, and then I just that's
a great habit, though, to turn off your phone, especially
in this day and age and all the things that
you see and how it rolls you up. Yeah. Yeah,

(07:28):
And I have a lot of trouble sleeping. So I've
taken all of the tips, I've tried all the things,
and I'm not sure that this helps, but I like
to think that it probably does. Um and generally sleep
from eleven pm to one am. That is the time,
you know. That's it's super interesting because I think you're
like the fourth woman that I've spoken to about having

(07:50):
this very limited amount of sleep. Because for me, if
I don't have at least six hours and even then,
i'm I'm a very moody person. But typically I can
sleep till I don't know, eight to nine to ten
hours long. If I can. Of course, after a while
it gets really ugly anyway, but it's really fascinating to hear.
I'm like, how do you function? Yeah, that was another

(08:11):
thing that came up, and I think this is a
separate episode that I'd love to return to because one
of the when I was looking into like the health
benefits of routine versus not having a routine, a lot
of the articles were about how women are not getting
enough sleep and it was called like the new luxury tax,
like people who can afford to sleep? Right? It really

(08:33):
is because you don't people don't have enough time in
a day to accomplish everything they need to, they want to,
They're supposed to, its right, and I am not. I'm
just someone who has difficulty sleeping. They were they were
specifically talking about like if you have two jobs and
you don't on the car, so you have to wake
up so early to commute those kinds of things. Um,
children getting them to work, all those kinds of stuff.

(08:56):
So that's definitely something I would love to return to
sleep new episode idea. Yes, all the time. And this
is I will say, this is what I call a
good night. I not infrequently have bad nights where I
get what I call surprise drunk. That's a great title.
It's surprise drunk because you weren't intending to go out
that night and you did, and you got drunk, and

(09:17):
then you stay out till three am. Um, and I
have this it's been this many days since incident. Do
you for this specifically, I've never gotten past four. Yeah.
If I if I remember to brush my teeth and
wash my face and I don't fall asleep on the
floor or the couch, then that's the six Did you
just say the floor? Do you typically fall asleep on

(09:38):
the floor I often wake up on the floor after
a night like this. Oh yeah, that makes my body
heart just the thought of that. It's because I like
I'm stretching and then I just like lay back and
that the night. I guess that could be a worse
places that you could fall asleep up. It's not a

(09:58):
yoga mat. Well, you know you got a match. I
was kind of like one of the kindergarten that maps. Yeah, exactly.
It was exactly one of those. Um, if it's the
first of the month, I have a whole calendar filling
out thing, and if it's the first of the week,
I have a whole like cooking and preparing thing. But yeah,
that's that's kind of my routine. I mean, that's pretty impressive.

(10:20):
I do like that you have your weekends to be
open to do your thing. Like everybody needs to have
a non planned time that maybe I'm just too much
up an introvert to be like, oh god, I have
to plan every minute the day, I'm gonna lose my mind.
Like that makes me panic. Oh I don't want to
look at my calendar. Oh god, I can't. I can't.
It's also one of those things like my phone if
I see too many like notifications, I lose it. Like

(10:43):
one of my really good friends and co workers, she
always has it at them, like I can't look I can't.
I can't look at your phone. Yeah, I just can't.
That is stressful. But I use them as like to
do list, like I'm marking off. I can plead this notification,
I can pleave this note, and that's and that's for
her the same thing and or a reminder. Yes, well,
let's talk about I don't even I don't even like

(11:03):
I'm trying to avoid this. Dang it. Well. Obviously, as
I said before, my life is not so much about
routine but more so about habits. So essentially, I have
a bunch of things I typically do in a day,
but I don't have specific times necessarily. It's just kind
of estimated time frames. Everything is all about the round roundabouts.

(11:26):
But I was also thinking, like, I love that we
thought of this episode because people were able to relate
to the my step in home take braw off routine.
Everyone or honestly trying to get away during the whole
entire day, whether it's me going to my day job
officer here and be like, how can I get away
with not wearing a bra. It's amazing, much like orbits

(11:49):
how much, Oh my gosh. Sometimes I changed so many
outfits just so I don't have to wear a brab
But I love that that's where we are. And for me,
when I come home, only does the brock come off,
the pants come off. And I don't have roommates. I
will say that I wasn't able to be like I
remember having roommates and being like, you wouldn't need to
text me before you get home, and especially if you're

(12:11):
bringing your partner with you, because this is gonna be
really shocking for all of us. But my routine, like
I said before, it's a little bit more of a
lack of routine. I also do often say I'm a
mask and you know, like I said, I read you
through your stuff and I was like, well, great, great, Annie,
Who could I have in between as a buffer? So
they forget how put together you see and compare to me. Um,

(12:34):
So you know, coming back to thinking like maybe I
need to rethink my process. I don't know what this
is a comparison thing what works from home, but whatever,
but at the sametimes, you can like, maybe I should
try a little harder that was the other part. But
I think it's all has something to do with the
need to not have a plan, like for me, a
vacation is not making decisions and to try to shed

(12:57):
off that day so that I went to in and
uh when did I go? Not too long ago, I
think for my birthday. I went for my birthday and
they kept asking me because they were trying to play
great being a good hostess and trying to make sure
that I can get everything I want to be whatever
I want to do in that list, and I'm like, no, no, no,
you don't understand. The only two things I want is

(13:19):
I want to see a sheep. Actually, I said I
want to hug a sheep in England. I don't know why.
I just came to my head. And I want to
see a quaint area. I feel like you could do
both of those two virtual on stone things right right.
I never did get the hugg with a sheep. I
was very upset about that. I want you to know
that I kept screaming at people about why can't I

(13:40):
hug a sheep? Random people, We're not gonna go there,
And I'd like to yellow people a lot. You know this,
But I think this has a lot to do with
just my overall burnout with my day jobs I've talked
about often, and just the self care um and of course,
as we've talked about in our Trauma series, I am

(14:01):
a really big proponent of self care. I think it's
really important and to me, a lot of what I
do is very much based on a stress reliever or
shutting off the brain. But that's my my kind of handle,
that's kind of my is it everyday life. The not
social worker, not fixer, not talker portion of my life

(14:22):
is just to shut my brain down, and I think,
um and with that, I was just also thinking about
why routines or the lack of routines important, especially when
it comes to burnout. The research completed by Montreal University
states that women are more likely to experience burnout and
with that, the National Academy and Medicine did a specific
study with physicians which was noted that many of the

(14:44):
female physicians were more likely to experience burn out as well.
You know, so it within those types of fields. I thought,
this is part of my release from being burnt out,
um and and feeling like I had to put the
world on our shoulders, which is not true. I'm a
very small part of a bigger picture, of course, and
I'm not the only one working these things, just you know,

(15:05):
just having that as a daily thing. Um. And with
the female physicians, I feel like could be linked with
also social workers and nurses and obviously all of those
they're more likely to suffer burnout due to emotional exhaustion,
and I think that says a lot. That's where they
talked about men being more burned out because of cynicism,
and I think that exhaustion, that emotionally exhaustion, is what

(15:26):
makes me just want to shut down because it is freaking,
freaking taxing to feel like, oh God, us failed, you know,
or caring so much. And I think for me, I
have both the cynicism and the emotional exhaustion. And but
of course we know that cynism is a sign of burnout,

(15:47):
so kind of all links to together. So with that,
all of my routines, including self care, include self care.
But the ability to do nothing is probably what I
love and try to cling to the moss. So from
my routine, it literally is coming home from wherever it is,
whether it's from the house of worksplace or my day

(16:08):
job or traveling because I have to do a lot
of traveling to inspect different placements. As such, I walk in,
make sure, uh to talk to my dog Peaches, because
she's right there waiting for me, and of course we
have an intimate conversation about how much she missed me,
and she understands everything I say, obviously, And then immediately
throwing my stuff on the floor where and this is

(16:29):
where it's chaos, because I'm like, I don't care where
it goes, it's just it's just gonna land here. Uh,
And then take off my shoes, take off my bra
and most of the times, yeah, just take off the pants.
I'm like, yeah, and it doesn't matter what I'm wearing.
If yeah, it's like nope, that's it. That's all coming off. Um.
And then I usually sit, and for me, that might
include a nap that might include watching whatever we run

(16:52):
I want to watch. Where might include me playing Candy
Crush on my phone. That's been a thing people make
fun of me. And I also do word searches. I
love doing worst and I also I am a multitasker,
so after two often I'll be doing a two out
of three. So well, yeah, I may have the TV
on as I nap or how am I be doing
the worst such as I watch TV like it's kind

(17:14):
of that type of thing. It's just for me to
space out. Um. And then for me in the mornings, uh,
I'm definitely one of those set an alarm and then
put it on snooze six times, oh my goodness, at
least three or four times for sure, and I'm like, yeah, okay, okay,
I hear you, Okay, I hate you. Okay, this is
the worst day ever. The best attitude. I have the

(17:35):
best attitude when waking up, which also inevitably means I'm
scrambling around trying to get ready as fast as possible,
and that includes, you know, putting on some makeup. Usually
have shower the night before because I know I'm that
big of a mess that I can't but also because
I exercise in the evening, so I have to tower

(17:55):
for the fact obviously. Um. And then I grabbed some coffee.
I quickly let my dog out, come back, and then
leave and usually get ran about ten to five to
ten minutes late. I'm one of those people. Yeah, And
I think this is where I'm like hot as where
any wokes up at six thirty goes for three to

(18:15):
four to five, four to eight mile run. I don't
know exactly what happened, but I'm glad I put pants
on and ran out the door. That's usually the goal,
and I don't have to turn around. I like, I
don't know exactly what I happened. Essentially, I'm like, hey,
I made it. I'm alive, y'all. I'm alive. I did it. Um.

(18:36):
But yeah, I think all of those different things. This
is my routine. The lack of routine, it does seemed
bit chaotic. But I'm also one of those that I'm
a pretty mess Like. I have organization in my disorganization.
So if someone were to come in and try to
clean up and and and like organized for me, I
would lose it because I would not be able to
find anything. As for right now, I know exactly where

(18:59):
everything is. I'm absolutely one of those people. Yeah. Again,
I know a lot of friends like that. My older
brothers definitely like that. UM. And I think it is
interesting because I feel like you and I having nothing
terrifies me, And I think like my amount of planning
terrifies you. And it just is and and numbers. In science,

(19:22):
there has been research into this. It is how people
cope with things, right and what what gives them this
feeling of kind of safety or structure are like lack
of structure within the structure. Right. Um, So we do
have some stats around routine. Okay, here you go. According
to you Gov, most of us around spend somewhere between

(19:46):
eleven to thirty minutes getting ready. On the outlier end,
two percent spend less than five minutes, and three percent
take over an hour. There is some truth to the
stereotype that women in general take longer. And there were
two means, and that is largely because of make um
of men take over thirty minutes compared to thirty eight

(20:07):
percent of women. And over the course of the year
that amounts to almost eight days, which I actually thought
it would be higher than that. I was gonna say,
as we're reading this and talking about this, say a
little prayer for you. That song is going through my
head when I wake up, I put on makeup, say
a little preferc like she's okay, never mind, all right,

(20:29):
that is now that you don't you don't know that song?
Oh my god, all right, we're gonna have to stop
all together. I say a little prayer for you as
a song that begins with her having a routine and
that she's doing this routine, she's saying a prayer for
her her I guess man or her wish to be
man her crush anyway. But yeah, make up for sure,
I could like caress. I definitely have like a five

(20:51):
to ten minute makeup routine as well. You were talking
about what you wear, I'm very much like I like
the mineral blush for me or men roll foundation for
me because I don't like cape down face, um, just
my thing. I definitely put eyelighting on because as an
Asian woman with the whole like lit eyelid stigma, you know,

(21:13):
so you know, Asiang took out that eyelid like white
women essentially um as well as I don't have a
lot of eyelashes, so I wanna bring out that look.
And that's just the whole kind of obviously, uh insecurity
with my own ethnicity a little bit if we want
to really dig deeper, but I feel like I can't
go out without that. That's one of my I have

(21:34):
to wear that thing. Um, but typically it just takes
about five minutes. But for me trying to find as
we talked about earlier, fine clothes that I'm comfortable with
that day, not that I like, not that I you know,
once where I've picked out it's literally like, I don't
feel good in this, and that can be a whole
twenty minute process, which is a sad thing, and I
recognize that, but it's just such like, and it bothers

(21:56):
me that it's that level that we have to go to.
And I'm guessing a lot of women have to deal
with that as well, as well as the fact that
they don't feel good enough about themselves to get the
clothes that they want, or they you know, just thinking
that they don't they won't look at this. That in
itself is just heartbreaking. I'm part of that statistic. Yeah,
when I was growing up, I was too afraid to

(22:16):
buy clothes that fit because I hated my body some right,
and I would like, I couldn't look in the mirror
for long. I would like, just right. I think it
just took me to five, five, ten years ago to
be like, oh, I can look at myself naked and
not hate everything and want to stop crying. That reminds

(22:38):
me of that Scrubs quote. I can look at my
body for problems the full minute naked. That's more than
most women. And it's absolutely true. Yeah, I was nodding
my head when I was pretty young when that came out,
and you'll be like, yes, girl, good to have the
confidence because that's confident. But yeah, for a lot of women,

(22:58):
a large part of routine does involve of makeup. And
I found some statistics around this, but statistics around cosmetics
are infamously hard to rely on because they're usually conducted
by cosmetic companies. But anyway, U sixt of women wear
makeup every day and where it most days, although interestingly
to me never wear makeup and thirty report wearing it

(23:21):
only on special occasions. UM. And this is something we've
talked about before the Makeup tax UM. Basically, through our media,
we were taught from a very young age that a
woman looks like one that is wearing makeup. That is
the natural state. UM. I was watching a cartoon recently
and was impressed and annoyed that all of the female

(23:42):
characters had on point I make up. And I know,
it's like a easy way to differentiate this one, but
you internalize that stuff. UM. So if you don't wear makeup,
you automatically are breaking a norm in our society, and
we'll quite possibly be punished for that. People don't like
when you break norms. Generally, Um, we are expected to

(24:06):
wear that's the problem with the whole Well, just don't
wear makeup if you don't want to, We'll be punished
for it. Um. And also some of us like to
wear makeup, and that's okay. There's some days where I
like to wear it. Some days I don't. I be
berries for day day by day, but I don't like
the obligation that I have to write. Um. And women

(24:26):
report feeling more confident when they wear makeup, and I
definitely relate to that. And it's because they're more confident
because they it's some in some on some level know
that expectation right. Well, me, this all comes back to
the perception of what is pretty and what is not pretty.
And then even you look at TV and the ones

(24:47):
who are natural makeup or natural and you're like that
has mascara and all honor and red lips, Like, what
the hell are you talking about natural? You know, this
whole absurd idea of what natural looks like. As well
as if that doesn't freaking exist there's not one natural look. Okay,
some people have different types of scars, some people have

(25:08):
different problems with acne, some people have rosation, all of
those things and it's okay. They can embrass all of
those things. And I think also I love the the
male gaze and the whole in the like is their
assumption that they can dictate either way. You're wearing too
much makeup, you're not wearing enough makeup, if you would

(25:29):
fix yourself. Well, that's why they like the all natural thing,
because then they can pretend you're not wearing makeup, right,
because you should be pretty enough to not need it.
And I'm just like, what the hell. You don't get
to have an opinion unless you're a man who puts
on makeup for themselves, go for it. Unless you identify
as male that loves makeup. Hell, yeah, do it? You

(25:51):
look amazing. Teach me those things. Why are you having
outside of that? Wait? What are you talking? Also, I
do love when my mom says the phrase put face on. Yeah,
And that is a very old school thing. It is
old school, friend, it is. Well, that's related to I
was going to say, there's arrested development bit where she's
putting her face on and it's like a horror movie.

(26:13):
And that's every time I hear that phrase, I do
think like that sounds like a monster. And my mom
knows said that many of times I can't come out, Yeah,
you're not You're not fully dressed with that dream makeup right,
and kind of going off a years saying I'll never
forget the time I was doing a forty eight our
film thing which you have to like write and make
some edit this film in forty eight hours, like short film. Um,

(26:35):
and the director was like, all natural looks, that's what
I want for her because I was the only woman
in it. Um and uh. He asked how long that
will take and he clearly thought it was going to
take like a minute, um. And the answer was like
thirty minutes to an hour with a professional and um.
It is one of my first ever tweets is I
took a picture of the table of makeup for the

(26:56):
all Natural look And I was so annoyed because had
this big emotional monologue to memorize and I spent most
of the time in the makeup chair not able to
do it. And I was seeing the dudes that I
was acting with and they were just practicing their lives.
They didn't have to do the makeup thing. There was
like a little bit and some hair stuff, but they
were just done right. So frustrated like that, I would

(27:17):
consider that kind of a punishment that we have to
pay this time that I could have been spending something
like my looks as we mentioned, really like time tax
content exactly what that is and um. Study after study
has shown that women that wear a moderate amount of
makeup are seen as the evolusive, more likable, and more competent,

(27:42):
which directly impacts professional opportunities. One study found that one
given the same picture so it's the same woman, one
with makeup, one without, and the picture of her in
makeup was more likely to get the job. Another one
found so well these pictures were shown to hiring managers
clarify that. Another one found that male patrons of restaurants

(28:03):
are more likely to give female waitresses more tips if
they are wearing makeup. Oh yeah, um, so as a bartender,
I work at a brewery and sort of be here
every time. I make sure that I have that red
lipstick on, all of the makeup on, my hair is perfect,
all of that to the point where if I don't
wear that and come in, they're like, what happened to you? One? Right? Literally?

(28:28):
Oh you're not feeling good? Um or I have not
been recognized by people who have never seen me that
dressed up? They're like, what's wrong with you? Why are
you wearing makeup like that? I'm like, I'm trying to
get those tips? What are you talking about it? It's
such a cop out. I hate that I played into that,
but yeah, I'm like, I get that money. Yeah, I

(28:48):
got it. That's the reason I'm here for my third job. Essentially. Yeah,
I went into a whole deep dive on the and
I didn't include it in here because this episode was
never intended to be all about makeup, but like the
deep dive of science of makeup and why it's all
about contrast and like situating. Oh my gosh, I can't
do it, like I can't do it right. That's what
I figured out because as I'm watching all of the

(29:10):
different YouTube videos, and I love watching like the fourteen
year olds knowing how to do things, I'm going, what
did you learned that? What's that? What? First of all,
what product is that? Where did that come from? How
did that come to exist and where did you put it?
Um all? I mean also we should talk about the
cosmetics industry alone makes sixty million dollars a year and

(29:34):
that money largely comes from women. That average women will
shell out fifteen thousand dollars over their lifetime, and YouTube
and makeup to toials have become their buzz frounds. I'm sure. Um.
A study conducted by Marx and Spencer found that women
spend seventeen minutes on average picking out and outfit. As
I said, I don't remember the number, but a decent

(29:56):
percentage of men throw an outfit a week, like get
angry and throw it. I was gonna say, I definitely
know enough men or those who identifies as males to
stand and come back to me three or four different
times this is look, okay, what about this one? What
about this one? Is just just like a printed pant
or kind of shorts or something, and then the shoes,

(30:17):
and I'm like, yeah, oh yeah, yeah, okay, great. I
found I have one of my roommates in college had
this poster and it said, um, it took twelve weeks
to make a habit and only two weeks to break it.

(30:37):
And so I started to look into the truth of that,
and I found from a quick Google search it seems
like it's sixty six days somewhere and there to build
a have it on average, but up to two and
fifty four days um and breaking habits. It is much
more complicated because some people will do it like cold turkey.

(30:58):
Some people take a lot of time to do it it. Um.
So I have a I have a real anxiety about
running that I'll just stop doing it because I don't
if I take two all right in between. Oh yeah,
I did the same thing. So I worked out a lot.
I don't run anymore, um because I'm old in my
hip heards essentially, But I've been doing a lot of

(31:20):
cardio gam and all the dance classes and then I'll
do some running on the treadmill more so than anything else.
And I say this as we're about to run the
pastree next week. I'm gonna die, like I'm probably just
gonna quit halfway through and get an uber to end it.
Just let you know. But I I remember, I think
I was gone from my uh my birthday, and then

(31:41):
I got sick and then holidays and I had stopped
working out completely and it took me a little while
to get back into the routine because because of that,
maybe it was because I was spending more time with
other other things or just feeling like going out, um,
but trying to get back in my habit, I have
been over exerting myself to make sure I stay in
the habits. Or instead of just working out there four

(32:03):
times a week, I'm doing it like five, six, maybe
two in a day because because crazy though, I'm with
you on that. Yeah, And that actually is a good
segue into what we're going to talk about next, which
is our routine is good or bad? Yeah, but first
we're gonna pause for a quick breick for work from
our sponsor, and we're back, Thank you, Spenser. Routines do

(32:34):
create efficiency, and this gives our brain more room to
think about other things outside of that routine, like because
like we said earlier, it does save time or it
can um it can increase proficiency. It's less taxing on
your willpower and decision making brain space because you've already
done that thing. Um. It reduces procrastination. When I read that,

(32:55):
I was like, oh my god, because I cannot procrastinate.
It's actually like love procrastinate. I actually thrive on it sometimes.
I know a lot of people do, and I wish
I could at least a little And I wish I
could plan ahead sometimes because why do I have to
put stress on myself? This is to be able to
be accurate? Why we're like a transformer of one person.

(33:15):
We are good. Yeah, we're the perfect person together. Yes,
part we're on the outline. It can be useful when
it comes to self care. Routine can be It can
save you money, especially when it comes to food if
you plan rosting out. Um. It can really stress, but
it can also cause stress um and more on that
in a minute. And it can also give you a

(33:36):
way to develop goals and track your success in achieving
those goals. And routine is especially important for kids and
especially in the context of significant life changing events. Exactly
so the routines and toddlers and infants teaches security and
emotional stability. It also shows them that they have someone
who provides for them. And that's kind of one of

(33:57):
those things that that security that higher if needs and
they can trust that things are provided. Um, which makes
me wonder how traumatized. I'm just gonna go ahead and
get this down in this dark dark road, and I'm sorry,
but I can't help it. How trauma sized these toddlers
and adolescents and influence are as. We are detaining them

(34:21):
and pretty much taking them away from their families were
trying to become and trying to find refuge and in
the home. As we've seen more and more, I know
is getting bigger and bigger and bigger as all the
reports are coming out um that it's getting worse. The
conditions are getting way worse. There's some reports about having

(34:42):
which by the way, I've talked about before about traumatization,
about premunification. We're having adolescents take care of influtens. We're
having adolescents take care of toddlers because there's no one
else who can play that parent role, and we're quickly
damaging and disrupting their the nurturing of these kids. Any way, Okay, sorry,
See I have to bring it down a little bit

(35:03):
sometimes even on our easier episodes. Well, it is important,
and that's the thing is, like I feel like we
dismissed routine a lot. It's just stuck in the same
old routine, right, and it's easy to think of it
and are very privileged setting totally and about what routine
can be and it's fantastic or not choosing to not

(35:23):
have a routine, you know, as I'm talking about being
able to be lazy, not doing things. But for again,
like you were talking about a single parent trying to
figure out how to support their kids, can't afford daycare, um,
but has to have three jobs and all the only
two or three jobs, and the only option is stay
home with your grandma. Hopefully this will work. And sometimes okay,
you're a fourteen year old, You're gonna have to take

(35:44):
care of this eight year old like that. Stuff like
that is like again, routine is also a privilege. It
is it is um and that's one of the things
that when I was looking into why it is so
important for children, is this this formative time and if
it's all chaos and there's nothing you can count on
um that has lasting impact exactly, and which is why

(36:06):
we talked about the CDC even delves into the importance
of structure for these kids as well. And obviously off
the CDC is talking about we're talking about health crisis essentially,
and a routine can't disrupt a child's health. C DC
called me the other day they left a message. I
don't know if I'm going to return it. I will,

(36:28):
I don't want to know what that. The routine is
also really important for seniors, especially in the context of
increasing unknowns, and maybe that is decreased mental or physical
function both increased dependency. Um. I have to say, when
I think of my high school routine, I honestly am
not sure how I was functioning at all. And I

(36:50):
don't think that the current routine expect of our young
folks is healthy. And there's been a lot of research
into that, just about the amount of homework, the amount
of expected expectations placed on them. Um. Be course it
kind of goes back into again privilege and was over
the top and not teaching responsibility. But yeah, definitely, I

(37:11):
know for me, I think in college and I know
we were supposed to be somewhat adults, but being thrown
into good luck, Yeah, it was great difficult, it was
really difficult. It was. Yeah. Um. Routine is also, like
we kind of alluded to earlier, really important when it
comes to sleep, and for people like me who have

(37:32):
difficulties sleeping, a routine can improve that. So we've established
routine is important, but so is allowing yourself to break
it every now and then to get away from your routine.
Some studies have demonstrated that routine might be a creativity killer. UM.
One time article I found suggested that we are at

(37:53):
our most creative when we are groggy, and the reason
is that the processes that shut down UM relevant or
distracting thoughts are at their weakest, so those thoughts are
allowed to like live their best life. And with this
UM diffuse focus as it's called, our brain can be
more creative with our network of knowledge making connections we

(38:13):
might not otherwise have made. UM. And for morning people,
this might actually happen in the evening as you're kind
of unminding UM. I'm one of those weirdo combos and
I relate to this so much because I used to
live live for that twilight between being asleep and being awake,
because I would get the most exciting thoughts or ideas.

(38:35):
I used to have this ongoing dream UM, and it
was like a TV series, and it was almost a
lucid dream, but not quite and I never knew where
it was going to go, and I was constantly surprised
by where what happened in it UM it was like
musty TV, What's gonna happen next? Uh? And we went
on for years and eventually I wrote it all down. Um.
But it only happened in this in between states. So

(38:58):
sometimes I'd be too excited to get Okay, I gotta
know what happens that I was too excited to get
there right um. And I still let myself do it
every now and then do you do you do you
go back to the same dream? Um? Wow? For me,
like I won't necessarily have a connected dream. It's not
like it's a episode of series. It's more of I
get the same dream and like with new people or

(39:21):
a new place. So it's always the oh, the shooting
at me, but this person is here and I'm trying
to convince this person not to do it. Oh you're
telling me you're about to murder somebody? Yeah, I really.
I'm also the one that does um oh paralysis, sleep paralysis,
so I am. I am one of those, so I
can during usually those days what I'm trying to wake up,

(39:44):
those are the moments that I cannot freaking wake up.
I'm having an anxiety attack trying to wake myself up.
So for me, it's like constant nightmare of emotions like
please wake up, please up in your eyes, please open
your eyes. I can't open my eyes. Oh my god.
It's kind of like the Eternal Sunshine moment where he
gets the in his eyes for just a second and
go by to sleep. That's what usually happens. I don't

(40:04):
do it all the time, but that's usually at that
time frame that I will have it. Yeah, I've only
that experienced at a cool times, and it is terrifying.
Even if you don't know what it is, it's still scary. UM.
An embarrassing side note, how I once sent a drunk
fan letter to fellow podcast stuff to blow your mind
back when I was an intern and I was an

(40:24):
editor on the show, um about this whole dream thing,
and I signed it with my middle name because I
was like, oh, they'll never get it. But I totally forgot.
I had an auto say nature. So I get an
email and they're like, I'm just checking, what's this you.
I had to fast up and then they put it
on the air. They read it on the air and

(40:46):
I could have cut it out, but I was like, no,
I have to bear my shame. Oh my gosh, that's hilarious. Yeah,
I think you know, as we were talking about my
groggy state, once again was not necessarily the most comfortable level.
I also have those moments of stress or a lack
of sleep, and for me, I have to lay down immediately.
I um, and I've had many moments where I will

(41:08):
It's kind of I feel like I've asked, like, dude,
I have narcolepsy, because this is getting weird where I'm
if I'm really overly tired or really stressed out about something,
I get really stressed out in places like the mall,
any place with bright lighting, lots of people. It makes
me figure out that I have to physically sit. And
then if I'm driving home or if I'm with someone,
they had to drive me home because I'm afraid I'm

(41:28):
gonna fall asleep. And that's the level of exhaustion. But
like I've definitely had you were talking about your drunken
story of emailing, because You're had a brilliant idea for me.
As I said the sleep thing, I've definitely had to
sneak a nap in a crowded or weird situations like
I was at a dinner party with I think like
I was meeting new people with one of my best friends.

(41:49):
She just moved and I was coming to hang out
with her. Uh, and I decided I was really sleepy
and I needed a nap, so I just folded myself
underneath the table. It's still still sitting, so I was
kind of like just you know, as I was covering
my head type of moment, and slept for about a
good not that I'm sorry, like a minute five minutes,
to the point that people are like, where what is she? Okay, yeah, what,

(42:13):
what's what's going on? And then they still talk about
it to this day and it's been years, like probably
over a decade long. But that's the level of and
I get. I would probably still bring that up. Look,
it's just talent that I can just fold over into
my chair and it was like underneath the dining table
as everybody else is laughing and eating. I agree, I'm

(42:35):
kind of shocked and impressed. I fell asleep in the
elevator once. That's my claim to is sleeping. Um. Going
back to the whole night owl morning bird thing, science
now suggests that they are probably four chronotypes, that's what
they're called, and it also suggests that it's generally fruitless
to try and change which one you are. Um, we
do go through natural shifts. Children and seniors are more

(42:57):
likely to be morning birds, and teens are way more
likely to be nine owls. But trying to force yourself
to change can have negative results. UM. Subjects and studies
shifted off of their sleep schedules start to experience pre
diabetic symptoms within three weeks, and um They're metabolic rate
dropped eight percent, which could have resulted in a weight

(43:18):
gain of almost thirteen pounds in the space of a year.
And this is sometimes called social jet lag when your
clock is off of almost everyone else's around you. And
in many ways, our society punishes night owls. Um. We
think that they're they're lazy, We push them to be
mourning people. Our work schedules are designed around morning slash

(43:38):
afternoon people. Yeah, Annie, stop punishing me for not getting
out of I'm just playing. Wouldn't know. I that was
a really interesting read to to think about it in
that that context, because I've never really thought about that.
Dude kind of like ostracizes people who biologically are not
that type of person, and it's really not fair, right, UM,

(44:02):
And it is not getting enough sleep as a serious
health problem that impacts a lot of people, so for
sure probably will return to it. Um. The problem that
I have with routine is I do feel a lot
of guilt when I break it. Um. I go on
such a spiral if I don't run. I thought about
it several times a day, and why I like, I

(44:22):
could find some time to run. I could, I could Hawaii. Sorry,
I just had that. Uh, I'm gonna be better for
like the next five years until until I go to
a cool trip like Hawaii. Probably will just be better.
That's it just fits me. It's fine. But I think
for me, having to bind myself to a routine out

(44:42):
of the outside of my regular habits feels like a
chore um and can be feelt really self defeating because,
like you know, I try to be the adult who
had the list so I can check it off. But
for me, usually that list doesn't get checked off. And
that's kind of one of those big things. A part
of my job and a part of my just mentality

(45:04):
is being able to uh change and be flexible. And
so with that flexibility, it often means everything shifts very
very quickly. Different emergencies happen, different things happen. So when
I see I'm not accomplished according to this paper all
it is, it makes you just like, well, I'm just
gonna give up now we go to my corner. So
for me, like having that type of structure, it makes

(45:26):
me feel like I'm just setting myself up for failure.
Yeah yeah, I I have heard that from a lot
of people. And we are creating a pressure and an
expectation when we have routines, which can be good, but
it also can mean creating an unneeded extra stressor and
not to mention something unhealthy. I've said before, I call
running my coping mechanism gone wrong. Right. Um, stress can

(45:49):
harm the brains mile in sheath, which can lead to
less light bulb moments. So that is another instance in
which perhaps it does impact creativity. This was definitely something
to consider for those who are working parent because we
are a very female centric podcast, specifically to moms who
often feel the guilt of not being the perfect maternal
figure with the schedule perfectly in sync with the children

(46:11):
and partner, and just the pressures to have a perfect household.
And this is more like, of course, again the heater
heteronormative perspective of mom, partner, kids, just the matriarch, just
in general the matriarch. But as we know, this type
of household exists. I know, we things that are quickly changing,
and we're seeing the father figures step up. We have

(46:32):
the same sex couple who seem to get it right
more so than others. But there's also this unleveled expectation
sometimes as well. UM, And I know I think there
are moments where sometimes it's too dependent on the male.
I'm sure there is. But what we have seen on
a regular and what is sometimes still expected more of
like a religious tone, and not necessarily all the time.

(46:54):
But I've definitely had conversations not only with my family
but from my past friendships who are fairly religious and
that's all cool, I have no problem with that, but
also very southern. And again this is just what I
know and not necessarily research. Um, it's anecdotal that these
types of households exist, that women should maintain the home,

(47:18):
and these perfections are expected, even to the niche idea
of the mother in law judging the you know, future
future wife of whomember their child is. And it's a
huge stressor that we don't talk about enough. UM, I think,
and that the fact that it is unhealthy, very very
unhealthy for these individuals who are putting their own pressures

(47:41):
on yeah themselves. Yeah, well yeah, the expectations, right exactly.
It's a double whammy. And it's kind of like we
don't talk about that enough either. Where that still exists.
A lot of research shows that it has become more gaalitarian,
but women are still consistently doing more of the child hearing,

(48:03):
more of the cleaning, all that stuff. But I mean again, yeah,
head or a normative. But um, that is a part
of a routine. When you become apparent that you have
to not only have your home routine, you have to
make sure manage this child's routine. Um. So you just
pick the solution I picked have a dog live by

(48:24):
yourself in the story, that is one solution. Um, it's
a path. Well, it's one path you could take. Um.
It's also a good thing to allow space for routines
to evolve, to not let them become cages sometimes. Um,
Like for me, I've come to terms with one day

(48:45):
I will not run this much and that's just going
to be the thing. That's how it's gonna be. Um.
So that is not a bad thing. Um. John Tierney
over the New York Times prescribes a routine of no routine,
spontaneity all the time. That sounds super stressful to me,
but I understand that some people like it well as
the introvert my spot Navy is just saying no, right,

(49:08):
and when they're like, hey, you know, I have things
I have to you know, do the things that I
said I had to do the things of those things. Okay,
thanks for any of your friends listen to this and
they're gonna, Oh, they already are good. I've been there,
good friends. Um. Some advice from the Times article called
for waking up a little earlier and letting yourself stay

(49:29):
in bed and let your mind wander for a few minutes,
and or staying in the shower a little bit longer
and using that time to think of anything other than
task oriented thoughts. Um. I will say, if you're concerned
about water conservation, perhaps the bed one is better. But anyway,
watching upbeat videos instead of depressing news because negativity also

(49:50):
impacts creativity, right. I am all about the good videos,
especially like all the dog videos I have watched, probably
all of them at the time, and of none of
the sad ones, so just all the good ones where
they're rescued and they look amazing and or they're coming
to find their owners and or where they fall and
it's funny, you know. It's those things. And of course

(50:10):
I also love watching the kids doing hip hop who
can actually do hip hop dancing and have you seen these?
I have. I'm just surprised that love it. I love
it because it motivates me, like if they can do it,
I can't do this, shut yourself down, and I do.
I want to point out here there are certainly unhealthy routines,

(50:34):
and I find we often call these rituals and stuff routines,
but things around like drugs in particular, and also, as always,
people are complex and different. Some people prefer and or
need more routine others as you can tell you know
by the two of us. Um. So that's that's about
the end of our our talk on routine, which turned

(50:59):
into more than I ever imagined. Um. But we do
have a little bit more for you. But first we
have a quick break for words war sponsor. We're back,

(51:19):
Thank you sponsored, and we're back with an out show.
Very very little bit more, but we would love to
hear um from you? What is your routine? What does
that look like? Um? Do you think routines are good
or bad or both? Yeah? Do you do you think
similar to us? Or are you judging us? Blush me? Yeah?
How many people have? Many women out there in particular

(51:41):
to take their bra of like within a minute of
getting home. You can send me your your routines to
us at Stuff Media, mom Stuff at i heeart media
dot com. You can find us on Instagram at steff
Mom Never Told You and on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast.
Thanks as always for a superproducer, Andrew Howard. Thank you, Andrew.

(52:01):
Thanks to you for listening Stuff under told These prediction
of I Heart Radios has stuff Works. For more podcasts
from my Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app,
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