Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
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Speaker 2 (00:37):
Should be do do doot doot do do do do do.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
So?
Speaker 1 (00:47):
I guess before we get to buyer's remorse, I guess
we do have to talk about this, right, which is, uh,
what do we do with some of the discussion over
race and quarterback play? And obviously Ryan Clark is probably
(01:11):
at the center of it, and I'm not trying to
do to him what others have done to me and
take things out of context.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
But this is a show where.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
We've never gotten caught up in the unreasonable, the the
fringe stuff, the race baiting stuff, and not to the
point where we push back.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Directly at it.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
It's like the it's like the Marcus Freeman being the
first black coach to coach the National Championship Game. I
actually think I understood what he said and he sort
of downplayed it and how we shouldn't be judged, you know,
we shouldn't talk about how he's black, but he was
the first black man to coach a team in the
National Championship Game. That's a historical marker. That is a
(01:57):
big thing. Let's not let's be so obtuse to history
that we don't go like, yeah, that's kind of a
big thing and give him his due. But I just
I'll be honest with you, I don't and maybe this
is you can't ever tell how somebody feels. Any of
(02:18):
my thoughts about about Lamar Jackson have never had anything
to do with his race. It's always been about, Hey,
in order to win a Super Bowl, you have to
be able to lead your team throwing the football, specifically
from the pocket. And this weekend was the first playoff
game of substance, right, I know he'd won two previous
(02:40):
playoff games in the first round.
Speaker 2 (02:41):
Last week and then going back, was.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
It last year or the year before, but he hadn't
done it in the fashion that he did it this week,
which was come from behind eighty in this case, I
think eighty eight yards to lead your team to a
touchdown to potentially tie the game. And then Mark Andswers
dropped a two point conversion. I can't discount the turnovers
(03:06):
earlier in the game, but I have to give him
credit for when it mattered. The big question had been
can you come from behind? And to come from behind
you generally have to throw the football, and this time
on the road and in elements, and he did so.
On the other hand, if he wins the MVP and
he's never even gotten to his Super Bowl, we're left
(03:28):
sitting there going, Hey, in his first five or so years,
he had an elite defense, And realistically, this defense in
that game was good enough. They got two straight stops
to start the second half against the Buffalo Bills on
the road, like he had enough. And it wasn't his
fault Mark Answers turned the ball over on a beautiful pass.
(03:51):
It wasn't his fault that Mark Andrews dropped the ball
in the end zone. I just there's no way in
which I can view him in a quarterback driven league,
Like just last week we killed people killed Justin Herbert
who does not have Derrick Henry, who does not have
(04:12):
you know, and you know you don't have his eight Flowers,
but he's had and they've drafted talent about if he
doesn't have Mark Andrews. And because of his playoff shortcomings,
we completely wipe out what he's done the regular season.
Same thing for Sam Darnold, we will wipe it out.
We don't do that for Lamar Jackson. Buyer, where are you?
Speaker 2 (04:34):
How do you? How do you handle this conversation?
Speaker 4 (04:37):
Yeah, this is interesting because there's there are a lot
of different levels to it. But for some for some reason,
I think that there's this group of football fans that
feel like Lamar Jackson just can't throw the football, and
it's absurd. It tells on yourself, it tells on yourself
that you are someone who doesn't watch football or pay
(05:01):
attention to football. Because his passer rating this past season
was one of the highest that we have seen in
NFL history. And I feel like that the last drive
Doug that you talk about, like, if that group of
people can't see it, then then there's no helping them,
but it doesn't take away from the fact. And I
think that Mike Sando, who is friend of the show,
(05:23):
has been on the show. The graphic that he had
in his athletic article on players who play better in
the postseason as opposed to the regular season and vice versa.
That that is Lamar Jackson and Mitchell Schwartz, former lineman
from the Chiefs and Browns, gotten in on the conversation
and said, basically, you have two turnovers in that game
(05:47):
against Buffalo that put your team in awful situations. The
fumble was probably the worst of the two, but the
past wasn't much better, but the fumble was just doing
too much. Oh that's how I look at it that way,
Like Lamar has sold me on who he is as
a quarterback. You just have to be better in the playoffs,
(06:09):
and that means taking care of the football, something he
didn't do against the Buffalo Bills. He has to be
better in those playoff situations. And I think he even
admitted it in his postgame you know comments talking about
Mark Andrews, is I turned it over twice.
Speaker 5 (06:24):
I can't do that, Yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
Thought, Look, I think he's really matured he's accountable, he's matured.
I do think they threw the ball too much, but
some of that was out of necessity. They were stacking
the box, right, And but I thought in the first half,
especially when they just could have been, you know, just
feeding Derrick Henry and bringing in Justice Hill, like I thought,
there should have been a greater volume of it, and
(06:46):
and also a volume of Lamar Jackson running like you
have two great options run the football on any play.
Speaker 4 (06:53):
I think now you eliminate yourself from having any credibility.
If you're still questioned whether he can throw the ball period,
well I think you all.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
I think you always did, okay, because what happens is
when people say he's not an e leade thrower previously
have said he's not an the lead thrower. Like that's
different than saying a guy can't throw a football like
Tim Tebow couldn't throw football, sure right, like legit for
NFL quarterbacks. And again, this is the top one percent
of people who throw a football. He wasn't on that chart.
(07:27):
Now for Lamar Jackson, you're we're holding you up against
Pat Mahomes, Josh Allen, Justin Herbert Jalen Hurts Joe Burrow,
Joe Burrow, Jared Goff, etcetera. Et Like, you got to
be judged among your peers, and amongst these peers. He
is not the thrower of Joe Burrow. He is not
(07:49):
the thrower of Josh Allen. He is not the thrower
of Pat Mahomes. On the other hand, they are nowhere
near him. As an athlete. Pat Mahomes has great est capability,
and he's somewhere in between. Josh Allen's a great runner.
He's much more John Elway, but like he is. Okay,
so it's all a balance, right.
Speaker 4 (08:10):
Yeah, but I would push back, like his passer rating
again was one nineteen this past year, best in the NFL,
and in fact rates all time in the National Football League.
Maybe not top four, top five, but at one point
you was so even that point I think is no,
he's proven it. He had a better passer rating than
(08:31):
Joe Burrow, and Joe Burrow threw forty three touchdowns and
nine interceptions this year.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
So, but if I asked you, and I would say
you'd watch more full Raven games than I have. If
you had eighty yards to go and you had to
simply throw a football, would you take Lamar Jackson to
take him?
Speaker 2 (08:50):
But no, no, no, no, I don't.
Speaker 4 (08:52):
Understand that's not the NFL though anymore, that is not
the NFL. You have to be mobile, like there's so
few non mobile quarterbacks.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Well, there's a difference, don Okay, again this is there's
a differencene non mobile. And again, so like pick any
of these other guys, Joe Burrow is not non mobile.
Joe Burrow's not of those guys that I mentioned. He's
the least mobile because of injury, but he's not non mobile.
He's not Tom Brady. Okay, and Tom, and he's not
(09:21):
Tom Brady.
Speaker 2 (09:22):
So he moves more.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Yes, I'm just gonna ask you if you have eighty yards,
here's the here's the only question. If you have eighty
yards first and ten, you're down seven or eight in
the playoffs, okay, Josh Allen, Pat Mahomes, Joe Burrow, Lamar Jackson,
Jalen Hurts over Hurts. In a second, I would take
(09:45):
him over Hurt. Second, I would take him over Hurts.
But I've never been the big hurt Sky, never been
a big hurt Sky. But again, okay, so you take
him over Hurts. We take more Josh Allen, we take
more Pat Mahomes, we take him over. Would you take
him over Matt Stafford.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
In a dome? You're faster in a dome.
Speaker 5 (10:14):
I think it's I think it's close. I think that.
Speaker 4 (10:18):
I mean Stafford Wiley veteran eighty yards. You feel like
he's going to be able to get it done, but
do it in a different way.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
And he did in the super Bowl. He did in
the Super Bowl with one wide receiver. Yeah, like, listen again,
I can I agree with you. Look, Lamar Jackson, here's
what Lamar Jackson has done that I don't think.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
We give him enough credit for.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
Okay, we do this thing, and I think Josh Allen
has gotten credit for it, and I think Lamar has
gotten some credit for it, but not enough. Many times,
we think the guy who comes into the NFL and
what how we view him the NFL.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
That's who he is.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
And we were told, and you and I are in
our forties, right, we've been told our entire lives that
you know, the hard to say, like can't really improve accuracy, right,
And we've been told that Lamar Jackson and Josh Allen
have defeated that narrative right, like he's become a really
good thrower the football. I don't believe he's in the
(11:14):
solar system yet, I understand the numbers. I don't believe
he's in the solar system of Stafford or or Burrow.
And Burrow doesn't have a great arm, but Burrow it's
he usually puts it where it's supposed to be right
and doesn't have a great offensive line or whatever. But
I think he has massively improved, and he's even improved
(11:35):
in his accountability, leadership, all these other little things, like
he keeps getting better and better and better. It just
didn't play out as such in the playoffs this year.
I still wouldn't take him ahead of Josh Allen. I
wouldn't take him ahead of Pat Mahomes. I wouldn't takehim
ahead of Stafford, honestly, because Stafford did that exact thing
we're talking about, the exact thing that Lamar Jackson just
(11:57):
did in the playoffs.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Sure, only he did it in the Super Bowl to
win A.
Speaker 4 (12:00):
Would I would probably take him over Josh Allen. To
be honest with you, I think that what Josh Allen
like does on a whole for his team, especially this
year is now a little bit different. But I'd probably
take Lamar in that situation because Josh.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Alln's made so many bonehead mistakes in the past.
Speaker 4 (12:17):
Just that, but I also think that Lamar is really
really good. And the mobility aspect of it is because
you have to worry about him so much, and not
that you don't have to worry about Josh Allen, but
Lamar is just a different sort of guy. When he
gets out into the open field, he's just he's more dynamic,
and even on the past to Wallace on the scramble,
(12:41):
it's not that Josh Allen can't make that play, because
Josh Allen can make that play, it's just that Lamar
makes it look easier. I'd take Mahomes first. I'd take
probably Burrow second, because I've seen those guys do it
in those money situations.
Speaker 1 (12:57):
Josh Allen did basically throw a perfect game in Kansas
City thirteen.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
You know he did.
Speaker 5 (13:02):
He's yeah, and.
Speaker 1 (13:03):
Again he'll get a chance to add to that lore
or to come back to the pack based upon what
he does this weekend. And we are we are definitely
prisoners of the moment. But I'll say this, when they
came out. I watched a ton of Lamar Jackson College
a ton, and I always felt like when they played
(13:24):
the better teams and they made him throw man, he struggled,
and somebody was he wasn't surrounded by the greatest roster.
But his last Bowl game, I think they played Mississippi State,
was bad, bad, And I just you know, I've seen
him at times and he has really really improved, really improved,
and I think that that's a testament to not just working,
(13:47):
but working on the right things, on being accountable for
your own flaws. And he is not the guy who
he was billed to be when he came into the NFL,
and that's the thing that he and Josh Allen have
absolutely flipped in terms of narrative and things you can
and can't approve.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
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Speaker 1 (14:15):
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I here's what I think, Dan, I think it's interesting.
(14:37):
And obviously Lamar Jackson, he has two turnovers, right, two turnovers,
and I thought he did play well down the stretch.
He played well enough in the fourth quarter to win
that game, but by his own estimation, set them back
with the two turnovers earlier in the game. And I
just think the juxtaposition of it with the previous week
(15:01):
and the justin Herbert pushed back and the Sam Donald
pushed back grant. Sam Donald played poorly, but he was
also holding the ball because he was under duress and
started seeing ghosts. But the point is that for others,
we do have a tendency to completely dismiss the regular season,
and now we're not doing that. For Lamar, we're not
(15:25):
dismissing it when there are turnovers. And I think Lamar,
without any question, is above the level of Donald. I mean,
I think that's obvious that I'm not a magna cum
latti for mentioning that. But I you know, you look
at the Herbert thing, and Herbert's owing two in the playoffs,
and he's what two in six in the playoffs, right,
And it's not totally a quarterback stat but the point
(15:46):
is that we have a tendency to latch onto I
don't even understand the reason behind it. I think Herbert
is in that top ten conversation, he's going to have
to get back to the playoffs and play better in
order to be in the top five esh, which I
think he has all the talent to be there. It's
just hard to judge with the group that he has now.
I think for Lamar he's right there in that five area.
(16:10):
And the only way that he gets higher on that list,
well he gets to the All right, this is one
of the best to do it, the best to ever
do it is you got to do it deeper in
the playoffs and you've got to get to a super Bowl.
Just do Let's welcome him in. He's Joe Thomas. He
joins us here on the Doug Gottlieb Show on Fox
(16:31):
Sports Radio, and I want to get to you and
your thoughts on the playoffs thus far. But what is
this Safety Impact Award that.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
You think you're part of.
Speaker 6 (16:44):
Yeah, thanks for having me on. The Safety Impact Award
is something that Cole has launched to encourage safe and
responsible fire and ownership, myself, Clay Matthews, Adam and a
Jierry Fletcher Cox. You may have heard of those guys. Yes,
we all have selected charity nonprofit organization in minds Ducks Unlimited,
which protects America's wetlands for clean drinking water, clean the
(17:05):
air to breeze. And if you're able to go to Safety.
Speaker 7 (17:09):
Impact Award dot com, you can.
Speaker 6 (17:11):
Vote for one of those nonprofit. COLT is going to
donate one dollar for the winning nonprofit for every vote
that gets cast, which obviously will be Ducks Unlimited. So
you're going to want to do that and vote for
Ducks Unlimited. And if you're watching the Super Bowl and
there's a safety, which is my wife's favorite play in football,
it's everybody's favorite prop that if there's a safety and
(17:32):
you're one of those people that voted for the winning nonprofit,
you get an opportunity to win a portion of one
hundred thousand dollars from Coridova.
Speaker 7 (17:40):
So it's an all round win for everybody.
Speaker 6 (17:42):
It's something that I'm really passionate about encouraging safe and
responsible fire and ownership and Ducks Unlimited as an organization
I've supported for a long time because of all the
great work that they do throughout North America.
Speaker 7 (17:54):
And it gives you a reason to kind of peer
name and watch the.
Speaker 6 (17:57):
Big game and vote in cheer for a prop bet
that you don't actually have to put your cold.
Speaker 7 (18:02):
Hard earned cash down for.
Speaker 6 (18:05):
So I think it's something that's awesome. You can also
go to my social media Joe Thomas seventy three, Twitter, Instagram,
and you can find a link there.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
Joe, I'm looking out at Green Bay. It is frozen over,
it is minus twenty five windshield And obviously you're Wisconsin,
Wisconsin native. I know you like all things outdoors, all
things wetland especially. You know you most famously when you
were drafted. You were on a boat out in a
(18:32):
lake when you got drafted. How did you deal with
Wisconsin winners?
Speaker 6 (18:39):
Well, I'm in Madison right now. Hopefully you're seeing some
ducks flying over the bay there. But it's never fun.
When you were a kid, you feel like the cold
doesn't bother you. I remember when I was in high school,
I actually made it a pride thing that I was
never gonna wear a winter jacket to school. One time
just to see if I could do it. You know,
I remember Brett Farr when I was a kid. You
always work shorts into the facility when you go to
(19:02):
into the facility there in Green Bay. And so I
think there's like a little pride level of you know what,
the cold is not going to affect me. However, now
that I've reached forty, I feel like that pride is
all dried up, and I am not loving this cold anymore.
Because I tried to go outside today and slid some
firewood and it was so cold that I thought I
was going to sweat, but instead snowflakes just popped out
(19:24):
of my pores. So I am already looking forward to
the warm, balmy, eighty degree summer days we have here
in Wisconsin.
Speaker 1 (19:32):
I agree, the summer is amazing. I don't know if
it makes up for the winter. It hasn't been that bad.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
This is this is this is a rough day.
Speaker 1 (19:40):
So your wife was excited about the safety in the
Eagles Eagles Rams game. But I guess the question becomes,
you know you have these three of them were terrible
weather games, terrible weather games, and we had this discussion
on are yesterday. I just wondered your opinion. Are you
a a football purist from I like the games outside
(20:02):
in the elements, or is like, hey, let's really play
this thing in a dome, so the best of the best,
the skill truly comes out in the best athletes in
the world in the NFL.
Speaker 6 (20:13):
I grew up in Wisconsin, like you mentioned, in Milwaukee
cheering for the Green Bay Packers, and weather was always
a huge part of the game. It was a huge
part of the home field advantage that the Packers had,
and I always enjoyed watching football outside. You know, when
I was a kid, we'd go out on New Year's
Day when we were off of school and we'd have
a snow bowl.
Speaker 7 (20:30):
We'd recreate the ice Bowl.
Speaker 6 (20:32):
And so for me, football has always been a part
of the elements. I know that there's plenty of people
that don't like it because sometimes you know, the underdog
has a chance to sneak one out, and there's a
little bit more of a leveling of the playing field
when you do play in those elements.
Speaker 3 (20:47):
But I like that.
Speaker 6 (20:47):
I like that unpredictability. I like that when there is weather,
it gives you an extra reason to sort of tune
in and watch. Obviously, it makes the telecap more exciting
when the snowflakes are flying. But also there's a little
bit more predictability because we've seen these teams.
Speaker 7 (21:02):
All season long.
Speaker 6 (21:02):
You kind of know them, but then all of a sudden, no,
the weather is a factor, right, Who's going to be
able to handle the football? Who can be that best
mutter the best cold weather team. And I think the
teams that are the best that are the ones that
don't let it affect them. They don't think about it
so much, but they practice in it all the time.
And you look back to New England Patriots. They were
one of the best mutter teams of all time and
(21:23):
they had a great team, but they just practiced with
wet balls. They practiced in the elements and they got
used to it and then they were able to block
it out on game day. So I think that's the key.
And if you're one of these teams that either are
down south and you think about it a bunch going
into the game, or you've never practiced in it and
you make it a big deal when it is cold
or it is snowy, then it's going to affect you
because your brain is like a bucket and it's like
(21:45):
a five gallon tail. You only got so much space
to fill it up with water. And if you're worrying
about what the snow is doing or all these other
different elements from the weather, like, you're taking away some
of that brain space that could be thinking about how
I'm going to beat my man and win this game.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Joe the Kansas City Chiefs.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
There is the prevailing thought of most of it is
a fan driven, but you do see other players tweeting
about it, mentioning it. There's this thought that it's like
the Grand Conspiracy. The league wants Pat Mahomes to keep
getting shots at the Super Bowl. As a guy that
played as long as you did and has covered it,
(22:26):
what are your thoughts on this idea that the Chiefs
get away with holding, the Chiefs get away with a
little other things that other teams don't get away with.
Speaker 6 (22:35):
Well, Refereeing is always going to be part of every sport,
and actually the NFL has the least amount of officiating
that impacts the game. I mean, you're a basketball guy,
there's a whipth almost every time you come down the court,
and so in football you've got ten or twelve flags
in a game. It's really not making a huge impact.
Of course, games come down to a few plays. It's
(22:56):
here and there, and so it's easy for fans, especially
the losing thing to point out, Oh is the officials,
they screwed us. But that's just not the case, right.
I think one thing that is true, however, is that
Patrick Mahomes is incredibly savvy and smart, and he utilizes
the roughing the pass or rules that the quarterbacks have
to his advantage. And I think that's one of the
things the NFL really needs to take a hard look
(23:18):
at this offseason, because he has proven, along with Josh
Allen and some of the other quarterbacks over and over again,
that the rules are so minute and so detailed about
how you can hit the quarterback that when three hundred
and thirty pounds humans are running at full speed at
a quarterback that's running a four to six, it's happening
(23:39):
so quickly that the human eye can't fully process and
get the call correctly time in and time out of
when the quarterback slides, how you're allowed to hit him.
And so I think because of that, Patrick has done
a great job of sort of utilizing the rules by
sliding late, acting like he's going to go out of
bounds and then saying in bounds or doing a great
(24:01):
job of eliciting those fifteen yard penalty flags from the officials,
Whereas if you just had somebody that was watching in
New York that was able to see those things in
a quick replay and be able to call down to
the official that's on the field without any wasted time,
no formal challenge flag, none of this, and just be
able to help the officials in real time to be
(24:24):
able to officiate things that are happening too quickly because
of the rules, to be able to effectively officiate.
Speaker 7 (24:31):
And so I think one of the things the NFL
really needs to do in the off season.
Speaker 6 (24:34):
Is take a big look at the sliding rule from
the quarterbacks.
Speaker 7 (24:37):
And I've tweeted about this a little bit at Joe
Thomas seventy three this.
Speaker 6 (24:40):
Season already that the slide was initially a way for
the quarterback to give up way before he even got
close to anybody, and the rule says as soon as
he starts to slide, that's where the ball should be down.
But for whatever reason, officials have started placing the ball
like halfway in the quarterback slide as the place where
the quarterback was down, and also giving quarterbacks credit for sliding.
Speaker 7 (25:04):
At the last second, like we thought last weekend.
Speaker 6 (25:07):
With Patrick Mahomes, he was running into a crowd of
three defenders and when he's less than a half a
yard from these guys who are already about to tackle him,
he just slides feed first and gets a fifteen yard penalty.
So they need to really reevaluate and maybe think about
something like they have in the NBA, where hey, you're
not allowed to fake slide and if you slide late,
it's on you. As a quarterback. You don't have those
protections because the slide is not meant to be weaponized.
(25:28):
The slide is meant to be a protection for the quarterback.
Speaker 7 (25:30):
And that's it.
Speaker 1 (25:33):
I actually I'm gonna push back on two parts of
it if you don't mind. Okay, The first part is
I completely agree with you on the late slide. The
issue with the defense is those defenders they go like headshots.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
I don't know what would be the knee area or
thigh area, like if.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
They were simply in a tackling position, you know where
they get kind of head up.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
See what you hit? Old school like we're all taught
to tackle. Wouldn't that change it? Right?
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Because if you look at the Texans, yes, I agree
it was a late slide. But the point is that
if you weren't trying to take a guy's head out,
you wouldn't you wouldn't be diving at Pat Mahomes running
down the field. That makes am I making sense of
what I'm saying? Like you look at the way in
which they're trying to tackle, they're all just kind of
(26:23):
diving at knees with their heads and like, you can't
say I was going to tackle him and then he
went and slid. If you're going kind of head first
at diving at what would be their knees or their feet, well, I.
Speaker 6 (26:37):
Think the challenge for defenders is when you're running full speed,
you're expecting the ball carrier in a normal situation to
lower his shoulder to get low, to try to run
through and split the defenders. And so you're getting your
body low, you're running full speed, and so you're already
in that crouch position, and when you do make that commitment,
you're expecting that quarterback or that ball carrier to lower
(26:59):
himself as well. But all of a sudden when he
throws his feet first, you're already down in that crouch position,
and that's why it makes it look like they're diving
at his legs. But I think the broader issue is, Hey,
if there was no late slide, we would never have
defenders in this situation anyway, because the quarterback would slide,
The players would have plenty of time to pull off,
to stop, to be able to get away from the quarterback,
(27:21):
and then you wouldn't put defenders in such a bind
with is he going to slide? Is he not going
to slide? Because how many times have we seen players
think that somebody's going to slide, or think they're going
to go out of bounds, or think that they've got
him in the grasp, I mean in the pocket.
Speaker 7 (27:33):
Think about how many times we've seen that where.
Speaker 6 (27:35):
Guys have the quarterback in the grass, they're expecting the
whistle to be blown and the sack to be had,
and then all of a sudden they let him go
and the quarterback runs around.
Speaker 7 (27:44):
And so I think it just puts defenders in too much.
Speaker 6 (27:47):
Of a bind and too much of a bad situation
that now you're in the playoffs, everything's on the line,
you're playing faster and we're putting ourselves. We're setting ourselves
up for situations where a either quarterbacks do get hurt
like we saw with Trevor Lawrence getting hit in the
head earlier in the season, or guys let up and
then quarterbacks are able to take advantage of it and
(28:07):
then the defender looks like a bozo because he stopped,
and then everybody pits off of the defender. Why would
you stop on that play? So I think it just
makes it too difficult and confusing and complex, and it
really allows the quarterbacks to use the rule to weaponize
in their own favor, which is not the original tent
of the rule.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Yeah, the only other pushback I would have would be again,
I know you're talking about process. The result is all
of those big name quarterbacks Lamar, Josh Allen, Pat Mahomes.
Obviously Jalen Hurts had a concussion, but he was back
like you go through and they were all playing in
(28:47):
the playoffs, which is the most important thing for the
league because the league builds around the names of these quarterbacks, right,
and it's like, hey, look, I get it. I understand
the league feels like it's gotten soft and everybody makes
But the fact is that everybody wants to see those
quarterbacks play in January, and they all played in January.
So maybe those rules, which feel like they're not football,
(29:09):
are helping us with the endgame.
Speaker 6 (29:11):
No, I totally agree with what you're saying, and I
am all horror having these rules that protect the quarterback because,
like you said, if all of a sudden, Josh Allen,
Patrick Mahomes weren't playing this weekend, how many people would
watch Probably half the amount of people who would watch
the game, you know, then they wouldn't have this national,
worldwide interest that it does because those guys are the
celebrities in our game. I think even further reinforces my point.
(29:34):
Right now, we're incentivizing quarterbacks to go to the absolute
last second up to the defender before they slide and
give themselves up, which is putting defenders and themselves in
risky positions and situations where, yeah, they might get a
fifteen yarder. I'll reflect back on Trevor Lawrence earlier in
the season. His wasn't as late as Patrick Mahomes, but
because of the reoccurrence of these quarterbacks sliding late and
(29:57):
being deceptive with are they sliding, are they going on
a bounds or not.
Speaker 7 (30:00):
Now you're putting defenders in a bund where do.
Speaker 6 (30:03):
They make a decision to go hit them or do
they not? And I think more times than not, especially
late in the season, they're going to try to hit
them because they don't want to be the dinguses that
are social media memes for just standing there as the
quarterback runs by them. Whereas if we would discourage the
late slide and allow it to be the rule which
which it was originally intended for, which was a way
(30:24):
for the quarterback to be running an open space and
to give himself up before he gets hit, you wouldn't
incentivize the late slide, the fake slide, all those things,
and you would keep quarterbacks much further away from defenders,
thus allowing them to be safe and on the field
for all of us to enjoy the great battles and
matchups like we're going to see this weekend.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Does the Cleveland brown in you root for the Bills
this weekend?
Speaker 5 (30:49):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (30:51):
Funny you said that, because I was thinking the whole playoffs, like,
what a perfect playoff it was Detroit and Buffalo in
the Super Bowl. You know, two rough Spelt teams, two
teams that have these loyal fan bases, just like Cleveland,
from the Midwest, from the Rough Belt, that have never
won a Super Bowl. An opportunity for them to play
like that was what I was dreaming of, because I
(31:12):
do have a definite piece of my heart in Buffalo,
in Detroit, in those other fan bases that have suffered
similarly like Cleveland with lots of losing cities that have
gone through some tough times, blue collar chip on our
shoulder mentality in the fan base. And I like to
see those fans that have been loyal their whole life
(31:34):
but never seen the championship get an opportunity to feel
and taste what it's like to win a championship.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Joe, listen, your post career is as interesting to me
as your career. But listen, in the off season, you
want to come up and get out on this lake
or throw reel in the throw reel in any of
these lakes in Wisconsin, you let me know. I'll get
in the car and I'll dry to meet you. But
I truly appreciate joining us. It's a good cause and
(32:02):
encourage people to go to all your social media sites
as just a way to get into it.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
Thanks so much for joining us on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 7 (32:09):
Hey, I appreciate it. Thank you for having me on.
Speaker 6 (32:10):
And I'll absolutely take you up on that Green Bay,
one of the most underrated fishing destinations in the country.
Muskie Walleye, Small maull sass. But don't tell anybody. We
want the fishing spots to ourselves.
Speaker 1 (32:21):
I just just you know, like literally, I'm looking at
My house is on the bay, so I have my
players come over.
Speaker 2 (32:28):
They fish off my dock.
Speaker 1 (32:29):
But we'll get on a boat and you'll teach You'll
teach me how to reel them in this summer.
Speaker 6 (32:32):
Okay, I'm ready. Thanks Doug.
Speaker 2 (32:34):
Be sure to.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
Catch the live edition of The Doug Gottlieb Show weekdays
at three pm Eastern noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (32:45):
It's the Doug Gottlieb Show, Fox Sports Radio. Surely after
the show, our podcast will be going up. You've missed
any of today's show, be sure you got the podcast
and just search Doug Gottlib wherever you get the podcast,
follow rate review, put that thing in your cue again.
Just search Doug Gotlabe every Year podcast. Here's Dan Meyer
with the Press The Press, Danny b what you got.
Speaker 4 (33:07):
Dougie teased that the Minnesota Vikings made a big decision.
It's not about the quarterback position, but it's a big one.
Kevin O'Connell, they're head coach, gets a multi year contract
extension from the team. Maybe not much of a surprise,
but it wasn't week eighteen that Fox Sports nfln center
Jay Glazer said some teams had reached out to Minnesota,
possibly looking to trade for O'Connell, who would have entered
(33:29):
twenty twenty five in the final season of his deal. Instead,
Kevin O'Connell, sticking around the Twin Cities for quite a while,
gets a multi year extension from the Vikings.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
Well, he's a fabulous coach, fabulous and I get it.
You know, you got all those wins and postseason. They
can't protect he is a former quarterback and an offensive guru.
Some of that his injuries take your toll when you
lose your best offensive lineman. But I don't think I mean,
Kirk Cousins was having a great year before he got hurt,
and Sam Donald had a tremendous year. I think the
(34:04):
Vikings are in good shape long term.
Speaker 4 (34:07):
Quick recall to the last night's National Championship game. Did
you have a problem with the field goal attempt from Notre.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
Dame to take it from sixteen to thirteen?
Speaker 5 (34:16):
Yes?
Speaker 4 (34:17):
No, I didn't either, and I think there was a
lot of pushback on social media. I think Jason Stewart
thought maybe they should have gone forward on fourth and goal.
Speaker 8 (34:25):
It just kind of seemed weird right within the context
of the game, which is Notre Dame couldn't stop Ahilo
State's offense, so like get in a three just to
likely give up another touchdown. It just it seemed like
if you got a shot to get a touchdown, get.
Speaker 5 (34:39):
A touchdown, they ended up missing the field goal.
Speaker 4 (34:43):
If they make it, they're only down five, and that
third down play would have been even more important.
Speaker 1 (34:50):
No no, no, no, no, no, no, no no. They
were sixteen to thirteen. Then they came back and scored
a touchdown, got the two point conversion. Did they make it?
Then they scored the touchdown, get the two, then they
be five? Right, it wasn't eight when they tried the
field goal. It was sixteen when they tried that.
Speaker 5 (35:03):
Yeah, correct, okay, yeah, correct here Jason or.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
Well you said if they make it there down five,
If they make it and then they score the touchdown, right,
if everything continues as planned. Yeah, this actually goes counter
to what Jason said. They did stop him on the
next possession and then they got down to the field
goal and scored a touchdown.
Speaker 4 (35:21):
Yeah yeah my point. I fast forwarded through it like
I did. YadA YadA YadA. Make it that last possession.
They're down five instead of eight with that third down,
then Ohio State needs to convert. Otherwise noor name gets
the football with a chance to win the game, not
just go down and possibly tie it with a touchdown.
Speaker 1 (35:38):
Well, I mean the big thing is like, like they
had a great play for the two point conversion. That
was great, right, a reverse pass, and but you know,
like the likellyo to completing two point conversions. I guess
the problem is they're a terrible field goal. The fee
goal percentage all year was the lowest in power for football,
(36:00):
so it was obviously not a gimme of a putt.
Speaker 4 (36:04):
If you will, coming up at six o'clock Eastern time,
the twenty twenty five Hall of Fame class will be announced.
I mentioned it earlier in the updates but each Ro
Suzuki a first time member on this ballot, while the
opposite end of the spectrum is Billy Wagner's in for
the final time. Wagner was five votes shy last year.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
Last year, not a Hall of Famer. This year hall
of Famer.
Speaker 5 (36:30):
He made up. He had two eighty four last year.
Speaker 4 (36:34):
The year prior, Wagner had two sixty five, So he
made up nineteen votes from the eighth year to the
ninth All he needs to make up is five this
time around.
Speaker 8 (36:43):
Who It's just like each row is one of the
most special talents the game has ever seen, no doubt
or Hall of Famer.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
Yes, and we're going to.
Speaker 8 (36:51):
Put him with a guy that it took six tries
or whatever and he had some maybe one impactful save
in his entire career.
Speaker 4 (37:00):
Yeah, he's the only player on the ballot for the
final time. Manny Ramirez is on for the ninth time,
but other first timers include C. C. Sabathia. You mentioned
Dustin Pedroia earlier, Troy t Lwitzki, Felix Hernandez Hanley, Ramirez, Cargo.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Listen, I think it's the same with the steroid guys
when they're percentage to Strow Like last year, you weren't
going to get him in. I don't think the steroid
guys Alex Frodriez that not belong in the Hall of Fame.
But more people do vote for these guys on the
yearly basis, Like, well, what every year you feel less.
Speaker 2 (37:32):
Less strongly about your steroids, tans. I don't get that.
Speaker 4 (37:34):
What's interesting is a Rod's numbers dropped from twenty twenty
three to twenty twenty four. He actually got five less
votes last year. Well, he only had thirty four percent.
He's way off the mark. We'll see if he gets
even fewer this time.
Speaker 8 (37:46):
Or failed marriages. He has the less votes of goods.
Speaker 5 (37:50):
And that is the press.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
Get out there and pressed.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
That was the press.
Speaker 1 (37:55):
That's the voice of Jason Stewart. It's Doug Gottlieb Show
here on Fox Sports. Trick congratulations Dad, Ohio state and
my late father. He's an Ohio state alone. This is
the Doug Gottlieb Show.