3 & Out - Giants sign Jameis, Bengals claim they aren't cheap, George Foreman passes away - The Herd with Colin Cowherd

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume.

Speaker 2 (00:15):
What is going on everybody? How are we doing? John
Middlecock three and out podcast recording Sunday night, watch the
LENCAA tournament this weekend, play a little golf, and said,
you know what, let's record a podcast for Monday morning.
I didn't record along with Colin. It's like, I'm kind

(00:37):
of juicing to get some takes out there and some
stuff happened. Do you want to dive into some of
the dominoes that are falling with the quarterbacks and the
draft picks at the top, So we will dive into that.
The Bengals signing their guys claim they're not cheap, but
let's dive into the numbers. And then George Foreman passed away.

(00:57):
I didn't want to dive in because some of you
a lot of cheeseburgers over the years. The George Foreman
grill was a huge part of my life, and I
kind of did a deep dive this weekend. What an
incredible entrepreneur George Foreman was. And then of course the
little Middlecoff mailbag at John Middlecoff is the Instagram fire
in those dms. We will yeah, I guess the game

(01:19):
plan this week will just be shows and we'll just
fire out. So look for podcasts. Make sure you subscribe
to wherever you may listen to this podcast, Spotify, Apple,
you name it. We got you covered audio. Video wise,
we got a YouTube channel, make sure you subscribe to
that as well, a lot of content up there. And
let's talk a little football. But before we dive in

(01:40):
to Jamis Winston, I do need to tell you about
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(02:45):
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last minute tickets, lowest prices guaranteed. Before we dive into
those Bengals who day, I did want to talk about
the signing of Jameis Winston to the Giants and what

(03:07):
I think that's signals, And I think part of the
I would say the setup of the NFL. You know,
in basketball, the draft comes before free agency. Now, because
free agency is so much more powerful with their names,
the draft usually doesn't impact you. In football, it has
a big impact now. Every once in a while you

(03:29):
see a team sign Kirk Cousins and give him a
hundred million dollars and then draft a quarterback with the
eighth pick and everyone is shell shock. But for the
most part, you can kind of, you know, put the
pieces of the puzzle together. And there are some major
question marks with some teams. What are you going to do?
Ed quarterback? And on Friday it was reported Aaron Rodgers

(03:50):
was in Pittsburgh spent all day, which I would imagine
with guys like Mike Tomlin, Arthur Smith and other Pittsburgh
Steeler brass. I think it's pretty clear that if Aaron
Rodgers he has two options. He is going to retire
or he's gonna be a Pittsburgh Steeler. Now the pie chart,
I would say that feels like eighty percent Pittsburgh Steeler,

(04:14):
twenty percent retirement and maybe even just eighteen percent retirement
and then holding out hope some in OTA's they freak
out about J. J. McCarthy and give Aaron Rodgers a call.
I still think that's pretty unlikely at this point. Well,
if Aaron Rodgers isn't going to the Giants, what are
the Giants gonna do? And over the weekend, the betting
favorite for the number two overall pick, it's pretty clear
the Tennessee Titans are taking cam Ward Like that's period,

(04:37):
point blank, end of story. They are taking that quarterback,
and you could look at the free agent moves that
they did not make to go, yeah, that's gonna happen.
Then you look at number two, you're like, well, the
Browns the Deshaun Watson situation as a disaster. He's got
a torn achilles. They got Kenny Pickett somehow now on
their team. What are the miles Garrett goes, I feel
comfortable with what we're gonna do. No, Miles, they gave
you one hundred and forty million dollars guaranteed and he

(04:59):
took get Don't blame you, but it doesn't matter who's
playing quarterback. When they threw that type of money at
you because you had just demanded a trade. I do
think it's my educated guess. Well, Kirk Cousins will end
up being on the Cleveland Browns, but based on the
betting odds, Abdul Carter looks like he's going to be
the number two overall pick. So the Giants are sitting
there at number three, and now they signed Jamis Winston.

(05:21):
Pretty clear Aaron Rodgers is not coming their way. And
I think when you look at John Morrow last year
in that GM off season hard knocks like, he's no dummy.
He knows from a business standpoint, it's not good to
lose your best players. It's why he was adamant, like, listen,
Saquan's our most popular player by far. And I've been
in this operation long enough to know that kind of

(05:42):
fucking matters. We've had some pretty popular players over the years,
while we've won and while we've lost, and they helped
drive this business because you know what, no one likes
when the team sucks and you don't have any popular
players and you look at you door Sanders like, one,
they're desperate, they don't their quarterback situation and since Eli
Bleft has not been good, and two like it would

(06:05):
be good for business. And if I'm John, if I'm
the owner, I'm like, hey, guys, we're taking Shador Sanders
if he's there at three and based on the gambling odds,
and I feel pretty confident that he's gonna be there.
And I saw Albert Breer say this, you know the
most unique thing about Shador Sanders is like he'd go

(06:26):
third or fourth overall, or he could just plummet in
the draft. I think when the dust settles, he'll end
up being the third overall pick and be a New
York Giant. And I think Jameis Winston, who has done
one of the great turnarounds in the history of American sports,
is just like the guy you kind of want in
your locker room. He's positive, uplifting, just solid backup quarterback. Now,

(06:50):
if you have to start him every game, you're gonna
have problems. A lot of jokes on the internet that
look for Malik Neighbors to have like seven thousand yards.
But I think the best part of signing a guy
like Jameis Winston. If you're the Giants and you draft
Shador Sanders number three overall, you literally can do anything
you want. You can start Jamis Winston week one and
just kind of let it play out. You can just

(07:11):
say there's an open competition. You can immediately name Shadoor
Sanders the starting quarterback in training camp. Nothing matters in
terms of his standing of anything being weird. So I
also think this, you know where I stand on skill
guys really high in the draft relative to lineman. But

(07:31):
because this draft does not have any sure things. Besides,
most people think Abdul Carter is just at worse going
to be a solid pass rusher. There are a ton
of question marks with the offensive linemen in this draft.
It's pretty clear if you watch football the New England
Patriots are desperate for some tackles. But you look around
this draft and you go, I don't see many Lane

(07:52):
Johnson's and Trent Williams, So I think you would have
to take Travis hunterd F. So where I sit here
on Sunday afternoon, if I was a betting man on
the draft, I would go cam Ward one. I would
go Abdul Carter two. I would go Shador Sanders three
and Travis Hunter being four. Let's dive into the Cincinnati
Bengals because I saw this tweet from my buddy Jake Rosenberg,

(08:15):
who used to be Howie Roseman's right hand contract negotiator
for well over a decade. At the end of my
time there, he came in and up until last draft,
so a little under a year ago, he worked with
Ali Rosmen and he had worked in finance before and
then he got into contract negotiation and he was running

(08:36):
point on all this stuff for a decade plus. And
he had a tweet yesterday that, let me pull it
up right now, that got my brain moving so we
started Texan. Here was the tweet. Reducing current cap numbers
through extensive use of pro ration to pro rate the
numbers provides a team free options with literally no downside.

(09:02):
To purposely decide to not pro rate is indefensible. Help
me understand the other side to this if I'm missing something.
He's essentially saying, when you sign a big contract and
you take the signing bonus, the guaranteed money, it makes
no sense to not take that fifty million, eighty million,

(09:23):
one hundred plus million. Obviously with the quarterbacks and pro
rated over the life of the deal. So early on
in those contracts, the cap number like a Justin Jefferson
or Ceedee Lamb last year is actually much smaller than
it would have been if they just would have played
on their fifth year option. That's the benefit you have

(09:43):
of signing these massive contracts is you can push it
all down. The forty nine Ers and Eagles and Browns
and these teams paying massive cash for these contracts over
the last couple of years have made a living on
doing that because it enables you to have high priced players,
but you'll have wiggle room to compete and sign other guys.

(10:04):
But the Cincinnati Bengals. Because I didn't quite know what
he meant, so he started texting about it. He said, well,
look at Jamar Chase Anti Higgins contracts. Their cap number
in the first year is not very low. And I
don't pretend to be some capologists, so I had to
do some digging. I went to guys like Justin Jefferson
and C. D. Lamb, who signed enormous contracts a lot

(10:28):
like Jamar Chase last season. Here were their cap numbers,
not their actual contracts, but the way it impacts the
cap to enable you to pick up five percent, ten percent, whatever,
more space to do more business with other people, and
you never know, doesn't mean you have to sign someone
right now, but something happens in the season, maybe a

(10:50):
trade plays itself out, maybe over the course of the
next year. Because you can roll over cap space, you
can make an aggressive deal. Because the Cincinnati Bengals when
they nine two players and took this victory lap on
social media like it's some novel concept to pay one
one of the best players in the league and another
guy who's obviously really good is some crowning achievement. The

(11:14):
more and more that I thought about it was kind
of fucking embarrassing. This is not money that you've had
to like put in hard work to generate. You're part
of a partnership that generates billions of dollars. And whether
you know what you're doing or not, in the business
of the NFL, if you own the team, you get
a free four four hundred and fifty million dollars every year.
And I don't know the last time you checked, but

(11:35):
the salary cap has never sniffed the amount of money
that they're getting from these television partners And that doesn't
even factor in anything game day tickets, all that other stuff,
which the Bengals aren't gonna be the highest team in
the league. But that's just free money. And the other
thing is that when you factor in the Bengals who
always push back, we're cheap, We're cheap. That's bullshit, that's bullshit.

(11:57):
We paid Joe Burrow again, the this his money, whether
you win one game or fifteen games every year, is
coming to you no matter what. And because of the
partnership agreement that you're in with the players, you have
to split. I forget the exact number, forty nine fifty
to fifty one percent has to go to them. So
like you are in a partnership not only with the

(12:18):
other teams in the league, but then with the players Association.
So like money comes in, then you got to give
half of it away. Right now, you can control how
much of that cash is given to certain players. It's
why the crazy part about the business of the NFL
is like the money has to be paid out, yet
as a player and your agent, you have to fight
for those dollars. But I think with the Cincinnati Bengals,

(12:40):
you go, well, listen, you give them all this money.
You're in this win now mode. You can get their
cap numbers really small. You can spend, extend. Trey Hendrickson
how you could trade your first round pick for some
sweet player, right, you could be really aggressive. But last year,
Justin Jefferson, so I did some digging. I did a
little typed in some names chat GPT contracts by track,
and I looked at Justin Jefferson last year signed a massive,

(13:03):
the biggest deal ever. His cap number in twenty twenty
four was eight point six million dollars. His cap number
in this upcoming season is fifteen million dollars. Ceedee Lamb
basically the exact same eight point seven million dollars last
year and this year fifteen point three million dollars. Now,
look at the Minnesota Vikings, for example, they had all

(13:25):
that cap space, even though they're paying this guy all
that money. They rolled over this year and they're super
aggressive and they start buying players. Then I look at
Jamar Chase's number. So those guys in their first year
of their big contract eight million dollars eight point six
and eight point seven. Jamar Chase is twenty three point
five and in their second year, both those guys are
fifteen million. Jamar Chase is twenty six million dollars. So

(13:49):
instead of pro rating it out, they've had bigger cap numbers.
Why Because the faster you get to that one hundred percent,
you'd be like, we don't have any more cash to spend,
We don't have any more cap space to sign any players.
Because ultimately the cap space, it's less about that and
more about Mike Brown just giving out more signing bonuses
to people. And again it's why it's so embarrassing about

(14:12):
that victory lap that they took on social media. It's like, yeah, guys,
you signed one of the best players you've ever drafted
in Jamar Chase, and you gave him a lot of money,
but then you didn't manipulate the cap like every fucking
team worth their salt, because you tried to like have
your cake and eat it too, like hey, we want credit,
We're not gonna sign anyone else. And then T Higgins.

(14:34):
T higgins cap number in twenty twenty five this upcoming
season is actually bigger than Jamar Chase. Now, T Higgins
didn't sign a contract like Chase, like Jefferson or Ceede Lamb.
You could compare his contract much more like Brandon Ayuk. Well,
last year, Brandon Ayuk who was gonna have to play
in his fifth year option the moment they extended him.

(14:54):
His cap number last year was five point seven million dollars.
And Brandon Ayuk, who's driving the Niners nuts because they
think he got over on them and they would trade them,
but they can't get any value back. His cap number
in twenty twenty five is eleven million dollars. So Higgins,
while his cap number does go down in this fall,

(15:15):
this next season, it's still almost twenty million dollars. So
what they have done is they did pay these two guys,
but they've also kept their cap numbers high, so it's
like okay, Joe, like, yeah, you've got enough juice, you
can boss us around and we'll take care of your
two guys. But we're not going like Eagles, Niners, Vikings.
We're just gonna give out all this cash to all

(15:36):
these other players because at the end of the day,
we are cheap. It's in our blood. I've said this forever.
Super rich people that are really frugal, and I got
no problem. If it's the patriarch Sam Walton, I just
listen to Maid in America. It's like the story of Walmart.
Notoriously cheap, right, but like that's his baby, he started
from scratch. He can still relate to the times when

(15:59):
they had no money. Like I'm sorry, Mike Brown, this
is a family fucking business. You didn't buy this team,
and now you guys have more money than you know
what to do with, so still doing stuff like this.
You're an unseerious franchise. You really are. You're an unseerious
franchise that drafts pretty well. Obviously Burrow fell in your
lap nailed that one. Jamar Chase, you get credit on

(16:21):
that one because you could have taken Pine soool. Good
pick to Higgins, excellent second round pick, But you want
to have like milk and cookies because gave out some
money that gets handed you through the league partners, Like
I'm sorry not doing that, and when you factor in
the numbers, like you don't need to be Howie Roseman
here to go. They're kind of manipulating the books here,

(16:43):
not in a way to take advantage of the situation
like the Eagles have done forever. Why because they're owners
willing to give out big cash, which the Niners have
done the last couple of years, which they went six
and eleven. They're own a freaked out. The Bengals ain't
doing that and they'll never do that because as long
as the Brown family owns the team, they will do
stuff like this. Honestly, kind of embarrassing perhaps those two

(17:05):
guys forgetting what they deserve. But and listen, the other
thing with Higgins is like I like the guy, but
like you want all this credit. I think a lot
of people would go, is this the right business move?
Or you're kind of getting you know, bitched around by
Joe Burrow, which I totally understand you don't want to
piss him off, but then you do it, and then
you do it in a way where your team the
best case scenario of the next couple of years can't

(17:26):
be as good as they should because you just refuse,
I don't know, to pro rate the contracts. Man, it's
a disease. Man. Frugality with the super rich who did
not earn the money is just it's just deep in
their soul. Nothing you can do to fix that disease. Okay,
let's end on this. George Foreman passed away. And I

(17:50):
think there are certain people with every generation that you
know not for what actually made them famous, right, Like
John Madden. I don't remember when I learned that he
was actually a coach, but it was well after I
knew John Madden as being the guy with the video
game and that called you know, forty nine Er games

(18:13):
and Packer games and Cowboy games. That was a superstar
on Fox. Then you're like, as you get older, honestly,
it might have been a decade. It might have been
until I was after high school that you're like, no,
this guy used to coach with the Raiders, right, this
guy was a legendary Raider coach in the seventies. But
when you're coming up in the nineties. All you know
is like, this is one of the most unique individuals

(18:35):
ever on my television and my favorite video game. And
I think George Foreman, for people in my generation, is
known as the guy with the grill, not as the
guy that was part of what many would consider I
don't know where you would rank it, but probably the
most famous fight of all time, definitely one of the
biggest fights in the history of the sport, the Rumble

(18:59):
in the Jungle against ma I'm and Ali, and George
Foreman then parlayed that to become one of the great businessmen.
I would say definitely in the nineties, but you could
argue in the history of former athletes, and I just
want to read you that really quick. I've always still
had this theory because I'm a good example of I

(19:20):
make my money with the modern day technology internet. Because
of the cell phone, I'm able to monitorize my profession.
If that twenty years ago this didn't even exist, I
couldn't have and make a living off what I do now.
It would have been in radio and I would have
had to move city to city or figure out a way, right.

(19:41):
But because of technology, which I'm very grateful for and
it has its downfall social media, you name it. But
without social media, the phone and those things, I would
not be sitting here today being able to do this.
I've always thought that, and listen, I think the Internet
and everything that's going on, like I try to be

(20:02):
a glass at full guy and be positive with everything
that's associated with and be optimistic about his future even
though it can drive us all nuts. If you were
famous now because of the Internet, doesn't mean you're not famous.
You could have millions of people follow you on social
media and you can make a ton of money quote
unquote being an influencer. But you could be a person

(20:25):
making millions of dollars that me that you have no
clue even exists. I do think that was really hard
to do pre internet, and the fame of people pre
internet was just dramatically bigger than what it is now.
Because if you were famous in the fifties of the sixties,
Elvis Presley, John Wayne, Frank Sinatra, everyone knew who you were.

(20:50):
When I was a kid, people like Michael Jackson, Michael Jordan, whoever, right,
obviously athletes, but musicians, the Kennedy, you name it. You
can go and do any walk of life. Every single
I could knock on every single door walking down the street,
and every person that opened their door on my block,
on the block down the street would know exactly who

(21:13):
Michael Jackson was, or Robert F. Kennedy was, or Elvis
Presley was. Now there are people you'd be like, Hey,
this person's making twenty million dollars, They're a Bravo star.
You and me couldn't point them out of a lineup.
And honestly, some of these I could now because Marias
wrote me in. But there are these people in all
these different walks of life because of the Internet. That

(21:33):
has changed the world. And George Foreman's fame in the
nineties is something that we don't really see anymore, and
sometimes I miss it. It's like we hear about shows,
and there are some shows that I would say crossover,
but like for the most part in the eighties or
the nineties, everyone watched the same shows and we all
had opinions on the same thing that we were all watching.

(21:54):
It's what makes football so unique. It's the only thing
in America now that can consistently get fifteen twenty thirty
million people all sitting down at the same time and
consuming that doesn't happen anymore, which is just part of
modern day society. But I saw what's funny is I
don't know when it was, but maybe a week ago.

(22:14):
I saw something on George Foreman on Instagram and it
was an interview series that he did with that gram
guy that has like the Internet. He's also I think,
I forget what channel he's on, but he interviews a
bunch of famous former athletes and they were breaking down
how much money George Foreman was making off the grill,

(22:37):
and I was blown away. I knew the grill was
a really big deal. And then over the last twenty
four hours, once he passed away, I kind of just
did some deep diving. One stat I saw on the
George Foreman grill is that it was estimated between twelve
to fifteen percent of America had the George Foreman grill.

(22:58):
And this this is just from wikiped but it's pretty
crazy how big George Foreman turned this grill into And
if you are I would say twenty five or under
you have, it's hard for you to comprehend how universally
agreed upon every person just had a George Foreman grill.
In their house. I don't remember many people that I

(23:20):
grew up around not having it, and definitely as you
got to college in the early to mid two thousands,
it was a staple of every house, mainly because it
just worked and it was really easy. I mean, it's
actually one of the more practical inventions in recent memory.
And then doing the deep dive, you realize that, like
all these other celebrities tried to copy it. Evander Holyfield

(23:43):
had this thing like the lean mean grilling machine. Clearly
that didn't work. Jackie Chan tried one, A bunch of
famous people tried it, but nothing was like this. And
the worldwide popularity of the George Foreman grill has resulted
in sales this from wiki of over one hundred million
units since at first launch. I chat gpted it because
I couldn't remember and it's a long time ago how

(24:07):
much George Foreman grills were going for, and there were
different models, but basically forty nine ninety nine to eighty
nine ninety nine selling over one hundred million units. Although
Foreman never confirmed exactly how much he earned from his endorsement,
Salton Inc. Paid him one hundred and thirty eight million

(24:30):
in nineteen ninety nine in order to buy out the
right to use his name. So in nineteen ninety nine.
This invention started in the early I think ninety three
or ninety four, and he had become he had gotten
royalties of it over those six or seven years, and
then in nineteen ninety nine he was paid one hundred
and thirty eight million dollars. I mean, it's a big

(24:50):
deal now when Miles Garrett gets one hundred and thirty
million dollars, one hundred and thirty eight million dollars in
nineteen ninety nine. But here's the thing. Previous to that,
he was being paid about forty percent of the profits
of each grill sold, earning him about four point five
million dollars a month at its peak. So there was

(25:12):
a period of time, whether it was a year, a
couple of years, he was making four to five and
he said on the Instagram thing, He's like, I was
making five million dollars a month. And then he eventually
bought out for one hundred and forty million dollars. So
it's estimated he made well over two hundred million dollars
from his endorsement, a sum that is substantially more than
he earned as a boxer. Obviously, he didn't earn that

(25:34):
much as a boxer because in the seventies they weren't
paying big freights. But and you know, George Foreman was
a guy he lost to Ali and he never got
a rematch. Was kind of crazy, but beat Joe Frazier,
who obviously had some legendary fights with Muhammad Ali as well.
But I think when we talk about influencers, and that's
just a trendy term because it's real. I mean that

(25:55):
there are people that push a lot of product as
just quote unquote influence concers on YouTube, on Instagram, on TikTok.
I mean, there's part of our show that you know
there's an influencer element, but that's that's just the nature
of the business. In as a podcaster, which used to
be radio of the audio medium, but just someone who

(26:17):
doesn't have a podcast or take TV star or whatever,
I'm just I'm just a human and I'm just pushing
a product. You could argue George Furman's one of the
greatest salesmen in the history of America and the business
deal that you know, whether he decided it, whether his
manager did it. To originally get that forty percent of
the profits to then parlay that into the power of

(26:40):
his name. But like, this product not only worked, everyone
had it. Honestly, fifteen percent feels a little low at
least in my life, whether it be growing up or
whether it be in college. And the other thing that
the Grill had is it like crossed all demos, Like
some items in life right are for either higher income households,

(27:05):
lower income households, like whether you were rich, whether you're
a middle class, whether you're a poor Like this fucking
thing was a must have and our rip to a champion,
you know that back it was before my time. But
heavyweight boxing, I mean, how badass, how famous these guys

(27:26):
that were just massive throwing blows. It's just kind of
it's dead, but one of the greatest entrepreneurs in the
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Speaker 2 (29:15):
Okay, let's do a little thing we like to call
the Middlecoff mail bag at John Middlecoff. At John Middlecoff
is the Instagram. Fire in those dms and get your
questions answered here on the show. I got a lot
of them. So again I say it all the time.
If you have DM me and I have missed your

(29:36):
your question, sometimes you got to reping me, you know,
getting married? I got so many dms, and it's just
all it's not as fluid as it usually is in Instagram. Naturally,
isn't exactly. I can excel spreadsheet where it's easy to
kind of sort, so it's I kind of got to
do it manually, which you know that's the toughest thing

(29:57):
you gotta do all day. I don't I don't get
to complain, but I know a lot of you guys.
If you're gonna spend effort or energy to shoot me
a DM with a question, I do want to try
to answer it. So just sometimes reping me. We will
start with with Lauren. Am I the only one who
thinks the conversation around Dion becoming a coach in the
NFL is a bit ridiculous. All the credit in the

(30:20):
world for turning around an embarrassing program in just one season,
but two first season didn't go that well. But I
hear you, No, Sean, I enjoyed watching Colorado, but the
idea of him taking over an NFL head coaching job
seems kind of nuts. Schematically, he doesn't bring much to
the table, and I think most of his success in

(30:40):
college comes from his ability to recruit top talent though
his fame and notoriety, plus I find it hard to
imagine NFL players responding well to his leadership style. Do
you think this is just immediate driven conversation or do
you actually see real value in hiring him as a
head coach? Also, could that affect Shador's draft status? No, uh,

(31:03):
I don't think Dion's impact store people geta draft because
I think he can play, you know, I think the
Dion impacts a little overrated unless he like you know,
pulled an Archie Manning, but just like him around, I
don't think has much, if any impact. Uh. I would
say that Dion shot that downon I mean, Dian I
had to talk with Jerry Jones, who he's known for

(31:26):
thirty plus years, right when he signed there in whatever
ninety five ninety six. Dion says he has no desires
to coach in the NFL. He does not want to
do that, and and I forget you know exactly what
he said, but like part of it, like what he
brings the table is the impact if you watch, you know,

(31:49):
I fall Colorado on social media and stuff like his
His impact and the stuff he likes talking about is
much closer to I don't know, the Sabans and the
you know, he played for Bobby Bowden. I envisioned him
being a college head coach for a long time and
I actually think they were one of the more fascinating
teams to watch this season now with Shador and Travis gone,

(32:12):
Like if they are good, honestly, they go seven and five,
they win eight games. I think he is getting a
job in the SEC. I mean, I would guess unless
Colorado just implodes, which I don't think they're gonna do.
You know, he brought a Marshall Fulkes now his running
back coach. Their d line was way better, while he
hired Warren Sapp. My guess is he's in the SEC

(32:35):
in a couple of years. So yeah, I just he
pushed back against that what's he supposed to do now?
Pick up Jerry's call, you know. I mean, but I
I envisioned him. I mean, he could he get a
job at Florida or Florida State or LSU or something
the next couple of years pays him fourteen million dollars
a year and he can pay all his buddies on

(32:57):
his staff huge cash. So I I envision him as
a college coach for a while, which I give him
a lot of credit for doing this. It's one thing,
the power of coaching your sons, which essentially I would
put Travis Hunter under that umbrella too, And that's the
way they talk about it. So Travis Chador's his sons,
quarterback Shiloh now that they're gone, I mean they're all

(33:22):
gone for him still to have the passion and if
he's gonna do this, and if he does it for
a long time, he does not need to be doing this,
like he's pretty rich, get So I give him a
lot of credit if he just does this for a
long time, because he's giving back to a game that
let's face it, a lot of super famous rich people
don't necessarily do it. I don't blame anyone if they
just want to retire and hang out. But a lot

(33:44):
of people could bring a lot of value and they
just refuse any of these Hall of Fame, super rich
players that either go into front offices or coaching in
college or the pros. Like that's like their love of
the sport runs deep. Your podcast is a lifeline while trucking.
My question for the pod is how long do bus

(34:07):
quarterbacks bounce around the league until they just disappear. I
feel like the dust has settled and only people who
are gonna have a decent career is Sam Darnold and
Baker Mayfield. You know, there's always a curve ball. There's
always a guy that's been a backup for a while
that gets an opportunity that excels, right. I mean, it's

(34:29):
happened historically. Kurt Warner is the best example who was
like a fringe nobody and then got his chance in
his late twenties. Rich Gannon going back to the to
the late nineties is another guy that bounced around. Jim
Plunkett was a guy who bounced around forever and then
won a Super Bowl with the Raiders. So I think

(34:50):
you just never know, Like could Zack Wilson or I
almost said Mac Jones, I don't even believe that. But
Zach Wilson's probably a bad exam who else I you know,
he's getting backup jobs now, I'm trying to think. Yeah,
I mean it's it's very unlikely, so we could go

(35:10):
through a period of time where it does not happen.
But I would agree that where we sit here right
now and Sam Donald like has to play well to
sustain this, Like Baker Mayfield is starting quarterback for the
foreseeable future. Beaker Mayfield is a really good player, Like
he's done this a couple of years now, and he
had one really good year in Cleveland, Like Baker Mayfield
is just a good player. Like you can't even argue Donald.

(35:32):
I'm pro Donald, but it's if he has a bad
year this year, I mean, we could look back and
it happened sometimes in sports like outlier used to happen
a lot in the steroid era, Like there'd be a
random dude that would hit like fifty eight bombs, Like
where'd that come from? It's like Mexico Horse steroids, Humble
Chiefs fan, It's clear the Eagles are on a whole

(35:55):
other level with that ass whooping served up in the
Super Bowl. My question is how long do you think
the Eagles can keep this train rolling. We saw them
offload some older defensive players Sleigh Brandon Graham retired, but
have seemingly already drafted their replacements that are playing out
of their minds year one. As we saw on top

(36:17):
of Vic seemingly unlocking Jalen Carter, they locked up Barkley
and have all the other notable offensive pieces under contract
for the foreseeable future. I think the limit of this
Eagles dynasty window is completely dependent on how long the
Eagles front office is willing to keep the game together. Yeah.
I mean, they're gonna be They're gonna be really, really good.

(36:40):
I actually think the only question mark this upcoming season
is just the guy calling place. You know, I don't
know exactly Kevin Potolo. If I'm saying his name wrong
and he's listening, I apologize, Kevin, but listen, that's a
pretty big transition. Felt like Callen had a pretty good
feel for running the ball and Jalen and just managing

(37:02):
those personalities with Nick. But like the offense, I mean,
there's just a lot of pressure in that city, and
it's like it's one of the places where there's not
like a huge celebratory You don't just get a free year,
Like if they start one and two, people would be
freaking out. So it's a it's a unique place with
the pressure, but there's no The talent on their roster

(37:25):
is just immense. And like you said, well they lost
some depth. You know, Darius Slay is still a solid player,
but you you weren't gonna pay him whatever fifteen million dollars.
So I would imagine they drafted another corner right that
they will need to. They'll draft defensive lineman. But like
that's Vicks kind of his go to thing, the ability

(37:46):
to coach those guys up and offensively, even if the
OC is a little bumpy. Their team is just so stacked.
And here's the thing. When Jalen gets a little off kilter,
which he's been known to do, just hand the ball
to twenty. It's like, well, who's blocking for him, I
don't know, probably the best offensive line in the league.
It's like, that's what they have in their back pocket.

(38:08):
When the passing game gets weird, hand the ball off
and then hand the ball off again, and then hand
it off again. So my guess is the Eagles will
draft defensive lineman. Wouldn't shock me if they drafted a
running back at all, not super high, but like in
the third round, just to give Barkley some blows and

(38:29):
have like, get that young run. This running back class
is so deep. Have him around Saquon Barkley, let him
teach him. So yeah, I mean, I think Eagles are
gonna be good, man, I do. I think the Lions,
when they're fully healthy, you're gonna be good, you know.
I think the Vikings are just one of the great
wild cards just because we the quarterback. I don't I
don't feel comfortable saying like, yeah, they're just right there.

(38:51):
Like JJ McCarthy, can he just go toe to toe
with the Lions and the Eagles and the Rams. I
don't think. I wouldn't right up the Niners just yet. Uh,
Packers too. I mean the NFC's it's not as star
studded as the AFC with Mahomes and Josh and Lamar,

(39:12):
but the teams are good. I mean the teams, let's
face it, The teams in the NFC, I feel like,
are better than the teams in the a FC depth wise.
I mean, the Steelers made the playoffs. I think the
Packers are better than the Steelers, right, and that Bronco team, Like,
I like, now those teams are gonna be better. But like,

(39:32):
the Vikings were the fifth seed, the Rams were the six.
I mean the Rams were the fourth seed. Who was
the it was the Who? Am I missing? Packers? The Vikings?
And am I missing a team? Tampa? My brain's not working.
It's crazy. You just start some of your details. You're like, well,

(39:54):
who Tampa played? Yeah, they played them, they played the Rams.
I am missing the team though, because the Rams played
the Eagles, So that's the two seven. The Vikings played
the Rams. That was the four to five, and I
guess the Rams the Packers. It's crazy. I feel like,

(40:16):
like do I even follow this league? Let's do a
quick check. Who I miss? Oh? The Commanders Tampa? Yeah,
the Commanders. I forgot about the Commanders. My bad. It's
funny when you haven't been in the mix, you forgot about.
They won't be forgotten about because they're gonna be good again.
The older I get, the more practical I become. I

(40:39):
don't have that third beer. I gravitate to my briefs
instead of boxer briefs. I don't want my team to
always make the sexy draft pick or free agent pickup.
How do teams decide whether they swing for the fences first,
the safe depth pick? Thanks, John, Uh, that's a good question.

(41:01):
I don't think there's a right or wrong answer on that,
you know, I think you allocate resources, whether it's free agency,
it's like, would we be willing to go in on this,
and then sometimes there's a bidding war and you just
pull out. I think I saw, you know, the Panthers
were all in on Milton Williams and then they got
to a number and they're just like, yeah, we're out.

(41:22):
And the Patriots went to a place that they weren't
willing to go. And I gotta be honest, like if
I was the Panthers, like, I'm not paying Milton Williams
twenty six million dollars. I'm just not doing it. The Patriots,
you could argue that, and I like Milton Williams. That
contract's crazy. You're giving a guy. I think they gave
him fifty million dollars guaranteed. He's never played more than

(41:43):
fifty percent of the staffs. He's like one big breakout year,
like that's sometimes you get money, Like I'll go back
to this guy mcglinchy. I remember when the Broncos a
couple years ago gave h mclinchy fifty million dollars guaranteed.
I'm like, that's insane. But no one's ever said, you
know what, but Glinchy only plays fifty percents of snaps. No,
Glinchy was a full time starter for five years on

(42:04):
the San Fransco forty nine ers on a teams that
were winning. So it's like, yeah, I wouldn't want to
pay him that much money to be my starting right tackle. Hell,
I wouldn't even want to starting right tackle. But like
I get it, Mounton Williams like, well, can you carry us?
Can you get nine sacks in a year? Can you
be a pro bowler? These aren't just unknowns, they're like unlikely.

(42:27):
So yeah, I think there's probably a balance between like
drawing a line in the sand in terms of free
agency or trades, like there are probably other teams. I
heard of a really good team in the AFC, a
really good team that was talking about Laramie Tunzel. But

(42:48):
guess what Houston told them. They had to pay way
more than Washington had to pay for Laramie Tunzel, which
I totally understand why because we'll probably see in the playoffs. Hell,
we might play in the regular season, we play you
every year, right, we'd have to go through you, So

(43:09):
that team's like, well, we can't do this. It was
much easier for the Commanders, right, who probably paid I
don't know, thirty percent less to pull the trigger. Easy
move for them. For the other teams like we really
need this guy, but holy shit, that's a lot to ask.
So I think the more confident you are with your operation,

(43:31):
I think the more patient you are in some of
these situations. But there's not a right or wrong way
to do things, because sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
I bet there were people thinking that how he gave you, Well,
you're gonna give Saquon a multi year deal last year.
I bet there are people around the league that were like,
that's a stupid deal. That's not gonna work out. Hey,
John got a mailback question about players injuries and their recovery.

(43:55):
It always amazes me how quickly guys in the NFL
can recover well. I was at College University in the UK.
I played D line and linebacker, for the team. God,
you guys had a little u uni as we call
it in the UK. I didn't know you guys. You
guys play American football in Europe in college even though

(44:15):
it's probably the least competitive level of American football. You
can play anywhere in the world, and guys are nowhere
near NFL size. Injuries are still a huge problem. After
I got a pick, I got tackled by one of
my own alignment and I fractured my kneecap and completely
tore my MCL. This took me out about a year
to recover from, and then I re injured it when

(44:37):
I came back for my final year. Yet NFL guys
will have similar injuries and recover in half the time.
Is it purely that NFL guys have insane genetics which
allow them to recover or is it because the top
level medical treatment they receive. Would love to hear your thoughts. Well,
I would say genetically pro athletes are the cream of

(45:02):
the crop right in terms of athletic genes. So I've
always been blown away by guys in college basketball, and
definitely the NBA that have these ankle sprains where it
looks like it blow out their ankle. I mean, Lebron's
king of this, and then we'll just come back so
their body can contort in levels in ways that ninety

(45:24):
nine percent of humans cannot by far their medical treatment.
When I hear of friends that tore an achilles skiing
or tore their acl playing pick up soft you know,
softball or pick up basketball or whatever, they go to
treatment like a quote unquote rehab maybe once or twice

(45:47):
a week. I remember my dad tore his patell attendant
when I was like, I was probably thirteen fourteen years old,
and I remember he like his you'd go to rehab
a couple of times a week. I mean it was bad.
And this was you know, mid nineties, the recovery on

(46:11):
bad knee injuries. And this guy is just you know,
my dad was a farmer, used to like play a
little golf and tennis, you know, in his older age.
But after this happened, he kind of set him back,
and he definitely was never the same. And as he
got older, his knee was really bad. He probably needed
a knee replacement. But like I remember him going to
just being a kid and he'd like take me to

(46:31):
practice or whatever. I'd just drive around with him, and
he'd go to do the rehab and I remember going
with a couple of times, but it was like once
or twice a week. When you get injured in the NFL,
you go do treatment, and you hear coaches use that
word treatment every single day, multiple times a day, and
you bring it home to you. So I think the

(46:52):
rehabilitation process of an injury of a normal human, let's
just pick a number, is it. Let's just say it's
at ten. The rehabilitation process for a professional athlete in
the NFL is like one thousand in terms of how meticulous. Now,
it doesn't mean everyone follows it, but like the serious

(47:13):
people that take their job seriously and want to get back,
and sometimes younger athletes recover faster, but like an older
guy who's it could make or break his career, I
mean probably will lose sleep over it. I mean, look
at Rogers last year for his achilles, Like, you took
it really, really seriously. If I tore my achilles, like,

(47:35):
I'm not getting up at four am and you know,
middle of the night to get treatment at my house.
So I think that's a huge, huge part of it. Obviously,
their bodies are better and The other thing is if
you if you get injured. Let's just say you're a
thirty eight year old playing pickup hoops and you tear
your achilles or have a bad knee injury. Like what's

(47:57):
your body type? Like you got a couple of kids,
you gotta dad bod. You're in decent shape, Like when
you get hurt as an NFL player, like you do
have a body of armor that you've built up training, right,
so it's like you are more physically your ability to
take you know, a hit that might have actually been

(48:18):
way worse. Like sometimes whenever you play that game with
like your buddies, if the whole parted like the Red Sea,
could you gain five yards? It's like, yeah, well some
people could. But what happens when Dre Greenlaw meets you
in the hole? What happens when Jalen Carter picks you
up and throws you to the ground. Because when that

(48:39):
happens to Alvin Kamara or Saquon Barkley or whoever, like
they just get back up. But if that happened to
you or me or just normal humans, you would probably
shatter bones. So I mean there are probably a lot
of hits these guys take that would cut injuries for

(49:01):
people that aren't training at their level. I mean the
physicality of the NFL is I've only been on the
field of an actual Sunday game a couple times in
my life, and I've spent obviously a lot of time
before that at practices, I mean seeing live drills. I

(49:22):
was on the field in college at Fresnel State, but
the NFL is a different animal, and I remember thinking
like this is it's crazy more people don't get injured.
To be honest with you, with the speed and violence
of these guys. Do you see Spy Tech and Carroll

(49:48):
going genty? Since Carol loves running ball backs, I prefer
Will Campbell or defensive line. Like I said, someone hit
me up recently because they you know, not critical, but
but I'm just acknowledging he's five foot eight. So how
often does a five foot eight player go in the
top ten? And someone said, well, you know, there was

(50:09):
once a guy that people questioned his body and it
turned out he was a Hall of Famer and it
was Derrick Henry. Was he too tall? I said, well, uh,
I think teams would rather lean is the guy too
big than too small? Now, I do think Derrick Henry
was a fair comparison, or excuse me, a fair like

(50:34):
the scouting community, because he was so tall and upright,
and he played at such a power program. It was
a very unique evaluation, right. I don't think Genty is
that complicated. He's a really good player, but he did
play a smaller school and he is small, so I
do think there were just questions that there are questions

(50:55):
with basically like every prospect. Ever, if I was the Raiders,
I one not pick him because I would just use
my second or third round pick on a running back.
I would pick the best player on the board, whether
that's Mason Graham, whether that's whoever that is, assuming that
some of the you know, Travis Hunter's off the board,
a duel, Carter's off the board. The Rams running back

(51:17):
has been third in rushing, behind only Saquon and Derrick Henry.
He seems to have a fumbling issue. Do you think
the Rams should entertain moving on from him? Seeing as
they seem to be going all in? Some of you
younger folk won't remember this, but there was once a
running back with the New York Giants named Tiki Barber,
and he had a fumbling problem. And I forget exactly

(51:40):
what they did. Older giants fans would know this, but
they like emphasized it hardcore, and he felt like he
turned it around and he stopped fumbling as much. And
I think that it is a teachable unless he like
lacks grip pressure that you can do some sort of
like measuring you some device to measure that, like he'll

(52:03):
never be able to hold onto the ball at whatever
the average level is to sustain decent ball security. I
do think it's a teachable thing. I would just have him,
you know, in some of it's not the jugs machine,
but it's that device where the where the things like
hit bounce off you. I would constantly be hitting it.

(52:24):
Anyone that watched the program, you know you can basically
just you carry football everywhere you go. You know. Obviously
the program, he carried it to class. But there's a
famous scene where they hit it out when he's falling
asleep in the lecture hall, which is a great scene.
And then all they're all falling down the lecture hall

(52:44):
stairs and then somehow he ends up under the the
table where the professor is and he comes out with
the ball. But I would not get rid of Kerwin
Williams just because I would coach it up. Why am
I paying Sean mcvag twenty million dollars in his assistance
seven figures? This coordinator's a lot of money. Let's let's

(53:05):
coach these guys up. Baby. With the Cooper Cup situation,
they couldn't restructure his contract and just let him get
some and let him get some money back. Sometimes human
beings want out of business with whoever they're in business with.
Why do people break up? They didn't want to be

(53:27):
in the Cooper Cup business anymore. Obviously the money factored in,
but they just were over it. They were over depending
on an older player who was breaking down. Basically, I
think the easiest way to look at it is they
looked at him like a stock and they just went,
we're selling our stock, we're selling our shares, We're out.

(53:48):
Obviously there's a human element to this. They like the guy, clearly,
he meant a lot to them turning around the franchise.
When Sean got there, didn't win the Super Bowl, MVP,
high level guy in his peak, was incredibly productive, won
the Triple Crown. But sometimes you have to make decisions
where you go, We're just out. We're just out. Would

(54:13):
they have had him back for five million dollars probably,
but we just saw like he got more than that.
So you just it's a tough part of the business.
You know. It's weird. It became so emotional. But Andy
Reid won a ton of Super Bowls with Joe Toney.
Joe Toney has been one of the more consistent players

(54:34):
in the NFL, and they just traded him and no
one said anything. And then Andy Reid comes out and
been like, this sucks. We didn't want to do this,
but we got a cap And it's a shitty part
about the business. And it doesn't become one thing with McVeigh,
which listen, I appreciate it. It becomes and he's so
emotional in the rams. He's such good friends with media

(54:55):
people Mike Silver and Schreeger and they're all talking. It
becomes like this big hooplaw. So yeah, they just fucking
cut him. He didn't want him on the team. Andy
Reid's been doing it for twenty five years and we
don't make that big a deal with these things, So yeah,
we just couldn't pay him anymore. We think I love
the guy. Sean mcvacon just never do that. Like love
the guy who's not paying him anymore becomes like, Wow,

(55:17):
this isn't that. It's the NFL. Happens all the time.
Eagles just won a Super Bowl, Darius Lazer starting corner.
They're like, yeah, we're out. Been married myself of fifteen
years and it's been great. Congrats on the wedding. When
an NFL player retires at the end of a season

(55:37):
with years remaining and guaranteed money on his contract, what
happens to that money? Does he still get paid? Does
that money still count against the team's salary cap in
the next season. Just curious how it works and how
gms might manage that situation. Well, if the money's already
been paid out, remember Tony Romo when he had the
back injury. Then he ended up retiring, his contract was

(56:00):
still on the books for the Dallas Cowboys the following season.
Because it's like a trade or cutting a player, all
the money that you would owe them accelerates. Mike Brown's like, well,
you do contracts like us, you don't have to worry
about it. But Andrew luck Is a good example, retires
out of the blue. The Colts could have asked for

(56:24):
money back from the signing bonus, and I think would
have manipulated the salary cap a little bit with getting
money back, but they let him keep. I forget the
numbers like twenty million dollars and they just they took
a salary cap dead money hit. So just because you
retire Drew Brees same thing, doesn't mean the money just
goes away. It is the equivalent if you have set

(56:46):
up their contract. If a guy retires and he's just
like a free agent, you know in his contract could
just run out and they had all been accounted for
in the contract or the cap, no issue. But I
think it happens a lot where a guy retires and
his having a Brady Brady's impact was still on the books.
So yeah, it just gets accelerated, like cutting a player

(57:06):
or trading a player. Question for the bang, if you
were a coordinator in the NFL, which side of the
ball would you coach? Let me say this, I any
coaches listening to this, what they do and their knowledge
of football, I could never do, never thought I could

(57:28):
never desired to. But in a lot of respect for
the effort, the hours, and just the intensity of that profession,
it is. It is hard, at least for the people
that are solid and good at it. A lot of
people faking their way through, making a lot of money stealing.
But if I was coaching inside of the ball at
one offense, to be a defensive coach, I think you

(57:51):
got to be like if life would have gone a
different path, like you could have been like a UFC fighter,
you know, you could have been like a bouncer at
a bar. You could have been something that just violence ensues.
Offense is a little more, there's a little more art

(58:12):
to it. It's a little chiller. I think, maybe not
the line of scrimmage of the offensive lines offensive line coaches,
but I think there's more of an artistic side to
the offense. It's just a different, different vibe you go
into the defense. Google if you forgot about this, kill
the head, the body will die. That one pretty viral

(58:34):
and obviously the Saints got in big trouble. But how
do you think, what do you think these guys talk
about in these meetings and defensive meetings. It's not usually
the way offensive meetings goes as much. Not saying that
they're not crazy guys on offensive side of the ball
as well, but my personality, I'm just not angry enough
and I'm not violent crazy enough like to be a
great like Vic Fangio, Like he's just an angry old

(58:57):
school sob just belong on defense. You know. Jim Johnson
was dick Lebou like you gotta be Monti Kiffin, like
you gotta be fucking nuts on that side of the ball.
Offense is a little more like drawn plays and scoring
touchdowns and high five And I always gravitated more towards
the offense, though I probably like watching defense more. Just

(59:23):
listen to the last podcast. How important are tangible intangibles
like leadership, mentality and work ethic and evaluating players, particularly
when stats might not tell the full story. I think
it makes makes or breaks guys in the draft, the
all the stuff that you cannot measure, how much you

(59:44):
like football, how hard you study football, how tough you are,
how smart you are, And when I say smart, I
don't mean like academically, how good of grades you have,
how your football i Q is really high? It is.
I would say people do not fail in the NFL
that meet the physical requirements, that have a high football

(01:00:05):
IQ and are tough, they're lazy people. Make it. But
if your football IQ's high and your talent is high,
like you can make it, it's really hard. I remember Jim
Washburn taught me this. He's like, you can be lazy,
you can be dumb, but if you're both, we got
no shot. So I just think, no matter what you do,

(01:00:29):
certain positions factor in. Like it's impossible to play middle
linebacker if you don't know what's going on. It's impossible
to play quarterback if you don't know what's going on. Safety,
there's some positions you don't need to be like brilliant
football IQ, like a guard, but you cannot excel at
guard assuming that you have the proper strength, athleticism, arm length,
all that stuff. If you're soft, like you just you

(01:00:52):
have no shot. You will get fucking ruined and soft.
There's a big difference like soft into society and like
football soft, Like you could be like tougher than most people,
but if you're like not like your toughness, I think
it's borderline impossible to not be like a nine out

(01:01:12):
of ten. You don't have to be that a wide receiver. Say,
every position's a little different. I guess the more I
think about it, But the intangible Stuff's really really important
question for the mailbag. When looking at running backs available
in this year's draft, what's the difference in the value

(01:01:33):
you see with the top five prospects. I want the
Bears to take a back, but in the second or
third round, is jent really that much better than the
prospects like Caleb Johnson or Hampton? I would say, over
the next month, I'm gonna look a little into that.
I've watched some cutups on Hampton. He's clearly really good.
He's the North Carolina running back. Ohio State's running back

(01:01:55):
is really really good. I think a lot of people
would say, like the dude from Iowa. There are a
lot of guys that you're just gonna be able to
get a pick like sixty or seventy or eighty, they
like are gonna start in the NFL. I just think
you look at it historically. You know JENTI, I don't
think he can be viewed as the same level prospect
some guys got drafted really high recently at five eight

(01:02:16):
in coming from Boise State. You know Bijon Robinson, Saquon Barkley,
or Christian McCaffrey. Let's chuse those three guys. An example,
if you were the Bears or even the Raiders, and
you told me that Raiders took Saquon Barkley or Bijon
Robinson or Christian McCaffrey, be like, I get it. I
wouldn't love it, but I get it. This guy is

(01:02:36):
not on that tier. And it feels like I'm hating
on the guy. I fucking love the player. I just
don't think you can take him really high. And what
are the Bears drafting ten? I do not think you
can do that, and I don't think they will. I
really don't. If I had to guess right now March
twenty third, things can change, I would guess he goes

(01:02:59):
after pick fifteen. Maye I'm wrong, but I would guess
when the dust settles. I have a hard time seeing
someone pull the trigger on a five eight running back
in the top fifteen. Every year, before the start of
the season, it seems like a majority of the media
covering the NFL picks the Raiders to be the worst
team in the AFC West. The Chiefs obviously rule a division,
but since fifteen, the Raiders are five hundred, ten and

(01:03:21):
ten against the Chargers and the Broncos. They're thirteen and seven.
The criticism we receive is well deserved, But why do
we seem to take more shit than the other teams
when they haven't done any better than us? With spy
tech and Carol in the building, proven coordinators in Chip
Kelly and Patrick Graham and Tom Brady now having skin

(01:03:41):
in the game, who's to say that Vegas doesn't have
as good, if not better shot at getting closer to
Kansas City than Denver, LA. Well, that's fair like Brandon
Staley era and some of the previous erows with Denver
that I think there were people arguing that the Raiders

(01:04:02):
were better than people thought, you know, going into seasons.
I think now it's pretty hard. Listen, Pete Carroll's resume
speaks for herself. At seventy three, he's going all in
on Geno Smith against Harbaugh and Herbert, which are better,
and we're just the fifth seed in the In the AFC,
they were the fifth seed and the Broncos who now

(01:04:23):
have Sean Payton and a quarterback. So I think that's
that factors in now, I hear if you want to argue,
like when some of the previous coaches were running the
Broncos like the Vic Fangio era, Sean Payton and Jim Harbaugh.
The Raiders team just isn't that good, Like those teams

(01:04:46):
were playoff teams last year. I just think Gino tough spot.
But I hear you like, I actually think you guys
got dramatically more. I don't think anyone's kicking the Raiders
like they were four or five years ago. I actually
think they're talked about pretty highly, myself included, Like I
know spy tech a little bit, stud I've watched Pete

(01:05:08):
Carroll's career for twenty plus years. Like no one's acting
Tom Brady's best football player of all time, clearly just
a high level guy. I think most people go, yeah,
the Raiders feel a little more normal now, but they
felt like that at different times, Like Mark Davis still
owns a team and shit just gets weird there a lot.
You can say the same thing with the Chargers, and

(01:05:29):
it usually does, and then Jim Harbaugh comes in, and
then just all Jim Harbad does is ever he just
wins Chargers year one, fifth seed boom. Just like that
question for the bag. You know, Veitch and Andy, they've
invested multiple picks on the tackle position and flamed out
every time? Why do teams struggle to evaluate the position?

(01:05:52):
I'm gonna feel like a Homer here. Even though I'm
bet against the Chiefs. I think like three of the
last four or five big games bet against them in AFC,
in the Super Bowl, with the Ravens and the Niners,
and the Bills this year. So I probably need to
stop betting against I don't know, guy, pretty good coach

(01:06:16):
Andy Reid and bred veach, pretty good GM and a
team that just wins a lot. So I apologize to
a Chiefs kingdom for constantly betting against them and just
losing money because they always win. Here's the thing with
the Chiefs. They draft at the end of the first round,
and they have not been flushed with cap space. And
even if they were, like who are you signing? Like

(01:06:38):
what are they? I just don't know what they're supposed
to do. Like it is very, very difficult to find
a starting left tackle at pick thirty two or pick
sixty four. It's just that's usually not where these guys
are going. Look around the around the league. Tristan Wurf's
you know, I go back to these guys because they're
the two best players when healthy at their position, like

(01:07:00):
Trent Williams, Lane Johnson, like most high level tackles go
really really high in the draft, Tyron Smith Forever. It's
you know, you have some outliers. Yeah, Jordan my Lotta
from Australia who never played football in his life, right,
I mean I remember the forty nine ers Forever Joe
Staley was an incredible pick, and he was a pick

(01:07:23):
like twenty seven I think, but he was like a
former two. He was kind of like JJ Watt of tackles.
He was picked twenty eight. That's like unheard of to
find a guy that's like going to Pro Bowls that
picked twenty eight. Usually you got a draft him pretty high.
So I just think it's difficult. They're in a tough spot.

(01:07:44):
They could have traded for the Laramy Tunzel, the Texans
would have wonted their first round pick. It's like, wait,
why are you trading this guy? Why? Why? Wait? We'll
give our first round pick for a player, but you're
trading your left tackle when you're old line sucks. I
do get like Washington, It's like we'll give you third now,
second later, and it's hard. But it's like Hey, yeah,

(01:08:05):
we want your first round pick. That's the only way
we will trade this player to you. Like, h it
feels a little weird. We're desperate here kind of. I mean,
we're just in the super Bowl, but it's like, you're
gonna make us trade a first round pick. Because the
Texans could not have done that deal with the Chiefs
right that they did to Washington, I think it's fair
to assume that they wanted their first round pick. If

(01:08:27):
you're the chief You're like, what do you do our second,
our first for a guy you're trading who's gonna want
thirty million dollars a year? And like, again, why are
you trading them? A couple of days after DK was
traded to the Steelers, I read a headline along the
lines of Pickings was not among the players to welcome
DK at the Steeler facility. A day later, another article saying,

(01:08:50):
George Pickens traded. Rumors are picking up. My questions is,
if this is true, what would you trade.

Speaker 1 (01:08:57):
For I I'm probably the wrong guy to ask because.

Speaker 2 (01:09:09):
He was a second round pick, so twenty two, twenty three,
twenty four, he's in a contract year. I'm not in
the business of George Pickens. Now, I clearly there are
teams desperate enough and for the right price, I would
definitely dabble, But like, I couldn't trade anything a value

(01:09:32):
zero chance. Like there's a reason the guy that was
that talented was pick fifty second overall. Now you watch him,
he's got a lot of talent. But when the Steelers
can't handle a wide receiver, no pretty glaring sign, and
I think a lot of people go, well, you had
dk to George Pickens. This is probably George pickens last

(01:09:53):
season on the Pittsburgh Steelers, unless he becomes a dramatically
different human being. Look at the last couple guys that
they'd be like, Eh, we're not that into Chase Claypool. Yeah,
we're kind of out Antonio Brown, who had like the
greatest six year stretch of all time. Like, yeah, we're
out George Pickens. Trade block. I'm not. Like there's certain
people I'm just not doing business with. Like Howie Roseman

(01:10:14):
calls me, It's like, yeah, how I'm not doing that
trade Billy Bean forever in baseball, Billy, I'm not that
interested in Billy. Wait, you don't want our number one prospect,
you want the seventh ninth and fifteenth guy, and then
two of the three become All Stars. They're like, yeah,
probably shouldn't trade the guy Billy wants. And that's how
I feel about George Pickens. I'm just like, there are

(01:10:35):
certain people in a draft, and I think the good
teams do this. There are players you're like, this guy
is gonna be in the NFL. More likely he's gonna
be a good player. I don't want him on our team.
And usually that revolves around off the field intangible you know,
stuff you can't quantify, the character, personality, like I don't
want to be in business with him. Belichick made a long,

(01:10:57):
long standing of doing that. Now, sometimes you did some
weird draft picks because like, who'd you just taking a
second round like characters through the roof. It's like Bill, like,
guy's a fucking undrafted free agent. So there's a balance.
But there are people on every team's draft board or
any team worth their salt. They're like, listen, clearly, this

(01:11:18):
guy's an NFL player. This guy could make a Pro Bowl.
But we're not in the business of these type guys.
And I think the good teams are like not. Now,
the Steelers, they've always kind of like done a good
job of reclamation project projects. Sometimes it works. I think
the problem is sometimes it's like a stock. You ever
like strike gold and you like ten X your money,

(01:11:40):
you kind of chase that forever. Listen, I'm guilty of it,
and I've never had a ten X stock, But the
moment you hit you know, two or three, actually like, damn,
I want to do that again. It's like, now, just
invest in Costco, just just buy some Apple. But by
something that you know is gonna work. It's like no,
I'm swinging for the fences. Then all of a sudden
it goes the other way. I think Dave's done that sometimes.

(01:12:02):
But like that's kind of why they've maintained because their
talent is always better than where they're drafting, because they
will take flyers, and I think the teams that stay
away from that, like the like the Buffalo Bills, Like
you think Brandon bean And and Sean McDermott would mess

(01:12:23):
with George Pickens's no chance, none, like Andy Reid might,
but again, like they'll pivot fast. And it's the difference
is if I buy George Pickens from you for a
fourth round pick, I'm not invested anymore. So, it's like
if he starts acting where I can just cut him
like I'm out, And I think it's really risky for

(01:12:44):
the bad teams like Carolina, you know, think of some
of the bad teams that could use his talent. It's like,
you want to risk this because George Pickens walks in
like he's Randy freaking Moss. He thinks he's the best
player in your team. Immediately, I would love to like
have a cocktail with like TJ and Minka and Cam.

(01:13:06):
What do you think of this dude? Really? No, really,
like what do you think of this guy? Probably give
you everything you need to know why you should not
trade for him.

Speaker 1 (01:13:18):
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