January 29, 2024 • 38 mins
Robert, James, and Mia discuss Greg Abbott's confrontation with the federal government, the real humanitarian crisis at the border, and how the whole situation is being exploited by right wing grifters.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Al Zone Media, welcome back to It Could Happen Here,
a podcast about it happening here. And in the original
cadence of this website or website, in the original cadence
of the show, that was a reference to a civil war, right,
a new civil war, It could happen here. That's what
(00:22):
Season one was made a big splash. Now, we kind
of covered the dystopia beat in general, but today we're
getting back to our mother fucking roots because the state
of Texas has recently declared a big old fuck you
to the federal government r having its National guardsmen deploy
razor wire at the border and stop border patrol people from,
(00:45):
for example, performing rescues of people who are trapped in
the water drowning. It's a whole thing. At least three
migrants have already died as a result of this fuckery
by Texas Governor Greg Abbott, and now, like, I don't know,
twenty states something near to that have There may be
more by the time you hear this, but something like
twenty states have declared that they're in support of Governor
(01:08):
Abbott's refusal to let the Feds in and insistence that
he's dealing with an invasion and must take on the
border texas'self, and some of those states are now sending
or at least claim they're going to send national guardsmen.
So when this all started happening, we all got a
lot of messages. I got about a billion from people
being like, is this it? Is this the civil war?
(01:30):
And obviously a big chuck of that comes from right
wing memes because they are all talking about like, yeah,
let's do it, Let's have us a civil war. We're
all going to start fighting over some guy posted his
handgun collection like we're ready.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
A bunch of revolvers.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Yeah, stupid shit, It's stupid shit, But you know, it's
not unreasonable to be like, this seems like a massive
constitutional crisis that's potentially in line with some of the
crises that precipitated the original Civil War. You've got a
governor completely defying not now not just you know, the
president and the federal government, but the Supreme Court who
(02:06):
ruled that you can't just have your fucking Texas goons
stop a federal law enforcement agency from doing its job
on the border. So you know, how serious is this
and is this the kind of thing that's going to
lead to a twenty four's New Civil War movie, and
my quick take on this is no, probably not. I
(02:27):
think what this is is in fact, a governor stretching
out his authority and testing how much he can get
away with against the overall federal government, because he and
a lot of other conservative governors want to do things
that are directly in contravention of the Civil Rights Act,
of the Bill of Rights, of numerous federal protections for
(02:49):
their citizens. And this is kind of a way of
being like, well, if they won't fuck with us over this,
then we can probably start imprisoning journalists and you know,
killing people that or at least imprisoning people that otherwise
we would not be able to write like this is
a right wing power grab, and it's an attempt to
see is the central government weak enough that we can
(03:09):
get away with this stuff. I don't think they're all
going to start shooting at each other. I don't think
Greg abbott is wants to get in the shooting war
with the federal government over Mostly the dimensions of the
crisis are gend up and fake in terms of what
he is claiming it is. There is, in fact the
humanitarian crisis at our border, but that's not what his
issue is. So that's my quick take. We're going to
(03:30):
get into more of all of that. But James, you
are our resident border correspondent correspondent, and you have some
very strong feelings on how all of this has been
interpreted in the media. So I wanted to pull to
you first and then we'll get to Mia and we'll
just kind of roundtable after that.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
I do, in a rare instance for me, I have
strong feelings about the way this has been covered, and
strong feelings about the coverage of the border, which I
know is a thing I talk about all the time,
but I am beyond frustrated with the way this has
been covered. It's hugely a respond table and it's completely
context free. Like there are people, as there always are
with the border, and there always are with the right,
(04:06):
who just tourists outside things that they understand and try
and generate clicks by geeing up the fear of a
civil war. And yes, I've seen dozens of people sharing
headlines about national Guard deployments. So happened years ago. The
National Guard have been deployed to our border for years.
I see national Guard troops every day. I had a
(04:28):
National Guard guy shooting me and shoot at me, shout
at me.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
A friend of ours took one of their rifles.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
Yes, yes, the National Guard have been extremely based in
arming the Butterfly Center. Yeah, they they're there. There's a
federal deployment. Texas also has a state deployment. These are
different things, and.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Other states have also sent National guardsmen to the border before.
By the correct that is not the first time this
has happened.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Yeah. Yeah, So there's a federal deployment and then there
are state deployments, both of those distinct things. Something to
know about the state deployment that is missing in the
context free reporting that you're seeing is that these guys
aren't getting any of their federal deployment benefits. So they
won't be getting the tricare, they won't be getting the
time towards their retirement, they won't be getting their GI bill, etc. So,
(05:16):
like the Texas guys who are deployed on state orders
are really the National Guard are getting barked by Greg
Abbott like it's laughable that that, like, you know, he's
pretending that he cares about Texas while actively screwing over
and Rober and I have spoken to some of those
Texas National Guard folks last time we were in Texas
(05:37):
did not seem to be super motivated to be They're
the only military unit i've seen tried to form a
union because they're not in a federal they're not in
a federal orders, so they're going to attempt to form
a union.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Get Billy bragged down to the border. We got to
do this. Yeah, let's get Billy back. I'll get him
going over.
Speaker 3 (05:55):
The Rio Grande and Billy Bragg and they'll fix it.
And it has been the most dangerous deployment that they've had,
including deployment to a rug They they have, unfortunately a
habit of drinking and driving, which has not proven healthy
for them. They also there's a quirk of Texas law
that means that they can't stop National Guard soldiers from
(06:16):
bringing their own firearms.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
Yeah, which is great. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:20):
Yeah, and the US they can't stop them accidentally killing
each other with their own firearms. Also, Yeah, it's good stuff.
A TNG soldier did die trying to save a migrant
from the river. Yes, he drowned. So like it has
not like it is very boring, but also quite dangerous
deployment that you know, they have really high. They wrote
(06:40):
a manifesto a couple of years ago about how bullshit
their deployment was.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
You know which is which is really great? To death? Yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:48):
So much of this has been reported without any context, right, Like,
I think genuinely a lot of the people reporting on
this are not aware there have been national their National
Guard here in California. Like I say, I see them
all the time. They're not supposed to interdict migrants, but
I see them doing surveillance, and I see them guarding
open air prisons in Hiccumba almost every day. And I
think that seems to have been missed by the majority
(07:11):
of people covering this.
Speaker 4 (07:12):
We should talk more about the open air prison part,
because I think there's a lot of people who seem
to be getting the impression that the Biden administration is
like actually substantively trying to do something to help immigrants,
and like they're like this fight is like between like
pro and anti immigration. It's like, no, there is a
fight between whether you think these people should be killed
(07:33):
incredibly quickly by a combination of razor wire and rivers,
or whether you think they should starve the death.
Speaker 3 (07:39):
Yeah or die of dehydrat should walk through the desert
would die of hypothermia walking through the mountains. Like I
I think I've said some in the podcast before, but
I was helping a three year old girl who is
hypothermic last week, and like, that is what Joe Biden
is doing. That is a Joe Biden policy being enacted
by Joe Biden as Joe Biden wants it to be
an acted, or at very least. Yeah, I'm sure his
personal like complicity or even understanding is relatively low. Given
(08:03):
his understanding, it seems of a lot of things. But
the Biden administration's policy is to deter people by making
crossing more difficult and more dangerous, which de facto makes
it more deadly. What Abbot is doing with his razor
wire and his floating fence is a version of the
same thing. Like they are not distinctly different. When everyone
was up and now it's about the three people drowning.
(08:25):
That's a tragedy. At eight hundred and fifty people died
crossing the border in twenty twenty two, that was a
normal day. Like the distinction is maybe in degree, but
really it's an aesthetic between Abbott and Biden on this,
and it's just two dudes chest stump each other trying
to not look weak. There is not an option in
(08:48):
the US system which allows you to vote for the
party that doesn't want migrants to die like that. Both
of the parties are completely in lockstep on that.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
And let's let's be very clear about something. Part of
why that is is because an overwhelming number of Americans
are indifferent or actively hostile to the survival of migrants. Yes, like,
this is an It is incredibly unpopular in this country
to think these people are human beings who deserve decent
treatment in decent lives. This is a fight that the
(09:18):
left has lost comprehensively, mostly in large part because the
left has completely given up on it, which is why
you've got fucking a lot of these nasbol assholes saying
shit like you know this is we have like saying
basically protectionist, nativist kind of shit these yes, right, because.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
I think that like leftist media has also and to
include I guess liberal media also has completely oh yeah,
like being complicit in this, right, Like, the amount of
stories that you will read about migrants that don't talk
two migrants in the next few weeks will be a lot.
If you care to read them, right, And that's because
people don't want to come here. They're either afraid of
(09:56):
coming here or they don't want to take the time,
they don't have the language skills. There are people who
have the language skills who don't who don't get these jobs,
and are people who don't have the language skills and
who don't have the understanding of how the border on
the ground works as opposed to immigration policy in DC works.
And you're going to see a lot of people who
don't live at the border, who don't come to the border,
writing about the border and yeah, that's how we got here,
(10:19):
and that's how we're getting to this largely like a
giant panic about a nothing burger. But yeah, it's the
reporting has been in continued to be responsible, and that
is in some degree complicit.
Speaker 4 (10:31):
Yeah, and I think this is also the explanation for
why there's a lot of people going like, why is
Biden not like setting the troops, why is Biden not
cracking out? Because it doesn't fucking give a shit. It's
the same policy. He doesn't care, right, Like, there's not
actually substantive disagreements except over like whether it should be
like some like a really super political stunt over whether
it should be like federal troops like on or like
(10:54):
federal agents like on the border, or whether it should
be the razor wire like he doesn't care.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Yeah, you know. And to be fair, I will say,
I don't think this is the start. This right here,
I don't think is the start of a civil war.
We may if we have one. We may someday see
this on like the list of factors contributing to in
the years leading up to it. But I will say,
if we do ever have a shooting civil war, it
will be something this dumb that I feel absolutely certain
(11:20):
of it will. It will be a thing where no
one involved really cares about the issue that starts it.
It's just a dick measuring contest that goes too far.
I just don't think this is the dick measuring contest.
But to be fair, it will be something this dumb.
Don't worry, folks, don't worry. If we do start shooting
each other, it will be just as stupid as this.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
I do think that, Like I think we're extremely likely
to start a shooting civil war over this or in
the next few years. Generally, I do think the chance
of shooting my context without a civil war. It's shooting
specifically of migrants, especially in places where they're not safe,
like open aduitencure centers is going up. And yes, that
scares the shit out of me as someone who spends
(12:01):
a lot of his life there. And I do think that.
I mean, we saw in twenty eighteen, right, and we've
covered this extensively, the Tree of Life shooting was in
large part motivated by right wing rhetoric about a caravan
of migrants. I was in Tijuana in twenty eighteen. I
spent months of my life helping people down there. Like
anyone who's scared of those people is paranoid to say,
(12:24):
at least right that they were mostly fine, wonderful, very
friendly people. I spent Christmas with them. But yeah, the
twenty eighteen Tree of Life shooting came from paranoia about
the border. We're seeing that same paranoia from right wing
media and from liberal media now, and I think that
it would not be unreasonable to have that fear of
(12:45):
individual acts of violence and terrorism along the border.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
Yeah. I think one of the things we're going to
have to do in the near future is get better
at understanding kind of the media dimensions of conflicts like this,
and what is an irresponsible way to respond to them?
And I think treating this like it is a civil
(13:11):
war type deal is kind of feeding into the right's
image of itself and their desire to treat this like
their revolutionaries. Now that said, what is the right thing
to do, because like the the what the Biden administrations
seems to be doing right now is largely kind of
(13:31):
ignoring it. I think at some point they will probably
try to nationalize the Guard and we'll see what happens. Then.
One thing that's kind of worth noting is that this
has primarily gone viral on right wing media. I'm seeing
very little of this on like mainstream centrist like liberal
media sources. And I'm seeing little on this because like
(13:52):
most of those sources don't really care about the border.
Unless there's some way to like drum up fear against
migrants like that, they'll do a caravans story. But this
just this just simply doesn't sell. I think when it
comes to like what is a responsible way to report
on this, I think you have to start by centering
what's actually happening to the migrants, what's being done to them,
(14:15):
as opposed to focusing on this Dick measuring, because that's
the actual harm here. The harm here is not that
Abbott has been mean to the border patrol, and it's
not that Texas and these other states, these rebel states,
are raising an army to fight the federal government. It's
that there's this argument between the people in power and
(14:37):
our country about like how bad should things be for
people who are already desperate? And I think that's where
you should center your focus. Also, I've just noticed this
on my other screen. This is a bit off topic,
but you know that movie Rebel Moon by Zack Snyder.
Oh god, An, there's an ad for the canned water
(14:59):
company Liquid Death that just is showing a bunch of
like Imperial troops from that movie beating a man and
then drinking Liquid Death water as they relax afterwards. And
it's the most unhinged ad I've ever seen. It's like
running aside a box article. I've never seen anything like
this before. It's just like, what the wait a second, what,
(15:20):
Zack Snyder? Come on, you can't do Zach's no, that
fucking guy, Jesus talking of advertising, Buy some Liquid Death.
(15:42):
We're back.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Yeah, So I want to talk about Grift because we
talked about advertising. I don't know if you guys have
seen the number of like right wing influences. Okay, so
I'm looking at friends of the podcast Tim Pool's Twitter here.
Speaker 1 (15:55):
Oh, Tim, there's a guy who is excited to have
a civil war where he will be murked imediately by
one of his bodyguards.
Speaker 3 (16:03):
Yeah, there is a man who's seen combat and knows
what it is to hear rounds cracking off over your head. Okay, Timple,
I'm just going to quote here at ha ha ha
ha ha ha, et cetera, Fuck me, dude, and then
Safe and Ready Meals dot com. Paul is not the
only one on the buckets of food grift right. Alex
(16:24):
Jones has been on this too.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Oh yeah a million years.
Speaker 3 (16:27):
Yeah yeah, yeah, he's been long time, long time food
story guy at Alex Jones. A lot of these guys
are like very clearly geing up fears of civil war
on the right so that they can sell people powder
dried eggs. Like it's it's so transparent, Like it's in
the same tweet. Yeah, Sobiak Trump calls for all willing
states to deploy National Guard to Texas border and start
(16:49):
the deportations and then there's a special partner offer for
my patriots supply dot com god, which is the way
to fuel your bigotry.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
I guess, guys, two things. First off, if you buy
your storable food from some right wing media grifters deal site,
you will spend the apocalypse shitting yourself to death like
it's all horrible. If you are going to buy, if
you are going to throw a bunch of money on store.
If you are a sane and reasonable person who wants
to store food, learn how to make your own jerky.
(17:19):
Learn how to can food. You can do it very cheaply.
It is not expensive to can your own food. If
you know what you're doing. You can can stuff that
is in season and get it really cheap from the
grocery store. And you can pickle and do other kinds
of can't pressure canning. It's really economical and it will
last a long time. If you are going to spend
a shitload of money on storable freeze dried food, you're
(17:41):
going to be spending a bunch of money anyway. Just
go buy Mountain House. Buy Mountain House. It's the good stuff.
It's tasty. As far as I know, no right winger
advertises on them and it's actually pretty good food. Yeah,
that's what I keep in my car for emergencies. You
will not shit ever ever again. Yeah, you may never
poop again, but the fucking biscuits and gravy breakfast selection there. Man,
(18:06):
when you're alone in the mountains, that ship is fucking fire.
Oh my god. Yeah, that will.
Speaker 3 (18:12):
It is like a bun for the digestive system.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (18:15):
I just want to plug Lentils dot org, which I
checked is a website.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
Yeah, Lentils the ship forever.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
Yeah, find balance between the yin and the yang in
your in your post avocalypse life with man House and
Lentils do org you today? You know what's not running
on lentils guys. Unfortunately, this is not an ad pivot.
I've just I've done theil Bate switch. It's this fucking
convoy that's going to the border and we talk about this, Yeah,
(18:46):
let's do that. They're like, this is where I'm really
done with irresponsible reporting, like being like oh no, January sixth,
Part two. Here's a link if you want to take part, Like,
what the fuck is wrong with you?
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Stop it?
Speaker 3 (19:01):
But I look, right wing groups have tried to run
convoys probably a dozen times since twenty twenty. Right, I
think we can all think of a different convoy that's
got stuck under a bridge.
Speaker 4 (19:13):
When drove by my house and then basically didn't get
any further than that.
Speaker 3 (19:18):
Yep, Yet they get lost, they disagree about directions a
lot of What a lot.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
Of people are going to realize is that the Texas
border is twelve hours from anywhere in Texas when you
are in Dallas. I believe this is accurate. When you
are in Dallas, it is faster to drive to Chicago
than it is to direct to the border. It is
so fucking far away from anything you could cross Europe
(19:44):
in the time it will take you to get down there. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (19:48):
I love the idea of a convoy of like, you know,
like completely c pilled lunatics, just like you're sending on
the town of Moth.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Yeah yeah, yeah, fucking passing Marathon and going where the
christ are we.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
Like, Yeah, it is a really really beautiful bike ride
from MafA to the border. There's from dirt roads you
can take.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
Oh and Marfa by the way, folks, if you're looking
to go down to the border, very fun town. You'll
have a good time in Marfa.
Speaker 3 (20:16):
Yeah, do love a bit of Marfa. Really, I'm not
going to tell my Martha story. I'll tell you guys
when we're done. But yeah, yeah, it is not Liken salacious,
it's just done. Yeah, Marfa is near the border. Lots
of things are not. It is a very long way
from I guess like maybe people could fly to our
passer that's near the border. But yeah, it's this idea.
(20:38):
So there's three convoys, right, One I think is supposed
to go from Virginia Beach.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
To Texas Shares the way guys enjoy spending seven thousand
dollars in Gussie.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
Yes, exactly where if they not look at the cost
of fuel, you fucking idiots.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Have fun homies.
Speaker 3 (20:58):
Yeah. Another one is going from I think last Cruis says,
to Yuma. And the one is going from here at
Santa Sedro to Yuma. Yes, the drive from Santa Sedro
to Humor is boring af but good luck, I guess,
like good luck spending that Californa. Hopefully they get pull
off at some of the gas stations like east of
San Diego where it's still like six or seven dollars
(21:20):
a gallon, Because you're fucked if you need fuel there
and you can't buy from anyone else. But yeah, the
idea that people are going to spend all their money
like driving across the country. It is also just very
like there's the meme right of the like the old
white guy wearing Oakley wrap around or fake Oakley wrap
around sunglasses doing a selfie video in his car to
rent about like anything and everything. But like, I think
(21:43):
it's very illustrative of how many of these people don't
feel safe outside their vehicles and like need the activism
to involve their their.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
F two fifty. Yeah. Well, in part because most of
them are, like like most Americans, in great shape, not
physically imposing, So if you're sitting in an F two fifty,
you feel big and powerful. Like James, you and I
both have trucks. One of the things about trucks that
is nice is that being in a truck, you're elevated
above the rest of the road, right, oh yeah, And
(22:15):
that that gets to a lot of people's heads, especially
if they have absolutely nothing else going on in their lives,
which nobody participating in this fucking caravan does, so they
this is like it's it's it's there, it's emotional support. Right,
They're sitting in their truck, They've got their gun. They're
not breathing hard because they have to like walk around
the world, and they they would desperately prefer that they can.
(22:39):
That's where how their activism, that's how their participation in
the Second Civil War will occur. Yeah, truck A bunch
of bunch of fucking wankers. Yeah, So I do want
to get into kind of like what we do feel
is the actual threats of this. Again, I think the
(23:00):
danger here is you've got a lot of kind of
fights going down about like how far can governments take
their anti trans legislation, How mean can they be to
undocumented immigrants, Like how much violence can they deploy in
deporting people? What can they do to journalists? What can
they do to people speaking out or engaging in protests
(23:21):
without violating the Bill of Rights? You know? What can
they do to marginalized communities about virrelating the Civil Rights Act?
I think this is an attempt to set a precedent
for ignoring federal control so that they can be crueler
to large groups of people within their purview. And I
(23:41):
think a lot of this is a reaction to this
is kind of there, what if we lose this election? Right?
I think there is a fear, and I don't necessarily
think this fear is actually like born out. I don't
think the rights national hopes in terms of its ability
to get elected again after Trump are as poor as
people want them to be, as I might want them
to be. Yeah, but I think there is real fear
(24:02):
among the right that if Trump doesn't win this, they're
not going to win the presidency again, right, And I
think part of what they are doing is setting up all, right,
then we will just take over and take increasing autonomy
in our red states, and we will effectively govern them
very differently and govern them in contravention of how the
rest of the country and how the federal government how
(24:23):
the Supreme Court says that they can be governed because
we can't be cruel enough without that, And I think
that is what they are stepping up to be able
to do. If you're asking what do I think will
be sort of like line crossings that could lead to
mass social violence in this country? One thing, I don't
think they're going to take that leap. While a Democrat
(24:46):
is in control of the federal government and the defense Department.
I think they will push for a violent crackdown on
everything left of the far right if they win power again,
because they talk about that repeatedly, because they promised to
do that. Yeah, and I think that if they lose,
there's an off chance. I don't think this is likely,
but it's not impossible that protests and violence as acts
(25:09):
of protest against Biden winning a second term could snowball
into something that resembles an insurgency. Not impossible. I don't
think that's the likeliest outcome. But I don't see them
starting to shoot at federal troops now while Biden is
in the White House for one thing. I feel like
that's the thing that would really clinch it for Biden.
(25:29):
If Texas National Guard trying to secede, well, you've made
his reelection campaign easier, right because now none of the
red states, like none of the states that secede, You
can't also have an election where those states get to vote, right, Like,
that's just not the way it works. Yeah, So I
don't feel like that's the likeliest thing. I think this is. Yeah,
(25:50):
I think I've made it clear what I think, and
I think it's really clear that it's time for our
second ad break.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (25:57):
Hopefully it's an ad for then new transpried oreos. If
you guys those.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Yeah, no, I've not seen those.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
What wait, trans fried or well, yeah, maybe it's just me.
Speaker 3 (26:08):
I was just reading a story earlier.
Speaker 1 (26:10):
And I just trans fat or No, they have like
a blue transflag. Ooah, well okay they have.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
Two years ago.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Hold on, this is okay, okay, okay, let's say I
don't definitely haven't.
Speaker 3 (26:25):
I just put a link in that woke, woke biscuit.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
That's good, I have. I have no opinion on this.
I guess it's good. Oreos aren't bigoted.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
Yeah, well, don't give your money to me instead.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Yeah, I don't think it really matters that. There. Ah,
we're back.
Speaker 4 (26:56):
You know, one thing I think about, like part of
what this is going viral, and I think part of
what's an issue about this with the way it's being
talked about on the left, but also you know, the
way the way it's marketable to the right is that
the thing about this confrontation is that it looks like
a civil war, but it looks like it's it's it's
(27:17):
exactly perfectly engineered to look like the lead of Civil
War one, and that is incredibly misleading. It's it's it's
it's basically it's like a marketing thing, right because like,
and this is only thing we've talked about on this
show for like literally since day one, is that like
a civil war in the United States is not going
to look like a bunch of states like form an
(27:39):
alliance and then all in they're fighting all of the
other states. Like it's it's not going to look like that.
It's going to look closer to Syria than it is
going to look like like the first Civil War. But
people haven't shaken like the sort of like brain worms
of a civil war is like sixteen states fight sixteen states,
even though every single civil war that we've had, like
(28:03):
in the intervening like one hundred, like two hundred years,
has not been that.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
And here's here's how wrong. Here's how people are comprehensively
wrong about this. Right on the left side, you have LMAO,
you guys are going to fight the federal government with
your AR fifteen's. They got bombs and planes, and like, well,
we've seen how well our bombs and planes work against insurgencies.
We're not good at winning those if there were an
real insurgency, and there's certainly ingredients to it, it would
(28:27):
actually be a problem for the US. However, that does
not look like sixteen states declaring themselves seceded and going
to because that's a conventional war. And you know what
happened if Greg Abbott started a conventional war against the US.
Greg Abbott doesn't have a fucking bunker, right like we
could we could, he could be he could be blown up.
He is again nothing against being in a wheelchair, but
(28:48):
this is not a man who is capable of like
living underground and hiding from federal bombers. Like that's just
not the kind of conflict that you need to be
concerned about.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
Yeah, this, this man does not have been Loden dog
in him.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
He just does not know. He's sure, he sure doesn't.
Speaker 3 (29:06):
He the idea of Greg Abbott taking to a hate
system in.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Doing a Tora Bora Texas. He's hanging out and fucking.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
Yeah, fucking big bend or whatever.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
Yeah, yeah, Torah boring big bend es Christ, Yeah, will
be outstanding. We would love to see it.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
Fortunately, grainy photos of Greg Abbott and like the mountains
of Southern Texas shaking hands with Mexican revolutionaries as they
smile rifles to him, rifles that they also got from
the United States. That is what we call the circle
of life.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
Oh god, God, we can we can dream, but it
does seem unfortunately unlikely. Yeah, it would be very funny. Yeah,
see Sealed Team go off to Greg Abbott.
Speaker 1 (29:54):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely Sealed Team fighting the Texas Rangers of
if only.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
Just a bunch of dudes each with a revolver because
they thought it looked cool until the very first time
someone was shooting back in them.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
Yeah. It's it's a real like who is on the
most HGH competition? Whoever whoever can stop the steroids from
flooding in is going to win. That's the spice in
this particular conflict. Yeah, we would love to see Joe
Rogan's the baron harkone and of making sure everybody speck.
Speaker 3 (30:28):
Ups guys have enough gear floating above a fucking table. Great,
it would be wonderful in term senses. But yeah, I
don't think we're going to see a shoot. It will
be interesting to see how like Biden has screwed the
pooch in terms of like his media management of this,
(30:50):
I would say, and it will be interesting to see
how hard he goes in response. Like if he goes
in response.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
I think the smart answer would be nationalize the Guard.
If there's things that you can actually prosecute people over,
prosecute them and continue to not deal with it in
the media. Like his instinct isn't bad in terms of
not wanting to feed in directly to the right wing
outrage loop, but you still have to. You still have
(31:18):
to go after them for this, right, And it's the
kind of thing it's probably like too much to hope
for any real action being taken, But I would say
that's probably the smarter option, right, not to say anything
of what the most moral thing to do is, but
the smart option is don't feed into the fundraising loop,
because we should probably get in on that this is
all a fundraising thing, right in addition to them testing
(31:39):
the waters. That's the biggest dimension of this is and
that's why we talked earlier. All of these guys Timpoole
and Jack Pisoviec and I'm sure the Daily Wire guys
are in now are like advertising your storable foods companies
and shit. The point of all this all right wing messaging.
All far right messaging starts as a grift. It all
(32:00):
starts with a product to sell. That's, by the way,
how guns became so enmeshed with the far right right.
A lot of gun companies realized that, like Americans only
need so many guns for like reasonable self defense and
hunting and even even recreational purposes. There's only so many
guns a man could shoot at a time. But you
can really get people to stockpiles shit like crazy if
(32:22):
you convince them they're like preparing to be guerrilla fighters
in a future civil war. And so and a lot
of these like gun tuber influencers, that's kind of where
they increasingly went because that's where the money was. And
so this becomes more and more of a part of
right wing politics because a lot of people on the
right have a lot of money to be made in
messaging this kind of stuff and selling this kind of stuff.
(32:43):
The same thing is true with the civil warshit it's
true with these like fears that the government. You know,
we can sell you storable food, we can sell you
fucking bunkers. All of this stuff comes out of some
sort of financial grift. And the biggest thing that most
of the people involved and this are hoping for Fucking
Jack Pisobiec doesn't want to be fucking hiding underground getting
(33:06):
bombed by the US Air Force. Jack Pisobiec wants to
make another million dollars off of affiliate sales of bullshit. Right, Yeah,
that's what And a lot of these people, these guys
doing this caravans to the borders, they're not planning on
spending their own money on gas. They're hoping that they
can crowdfund a shitload of money and I'm sure one
of them will steal all of it and run away, right,
That's what usually happens with this kind of shit. But
(33:28):
that's what they're all hoping to do. And so that's
kind of the over if you want to actually hurt them,
if you're looking at where do we how do we
draw a strategic victory out of this, find a way
to damage their ability to profit off of this shit?
And I do think part of it is not making
this as big a story as that otherwise might be.
But that's not simply enough, because the Right is large
(33:50):
enough that just through their media hyping this up, they
can make a decent amount of money off this stuff,
so more complex solutions are needed.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Yeah, I do think think we should probably discuss like
the potential of Abbot using this in a personal or
like later a presidential run, right, Like, yeah, he's in
New Delhi at the moment.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Have you seen he's a New Delhi hanging out with
everybody's favorite pseudo dictator of India Modi.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
Yeah, like Abbott trying to build this kind of like
electoral alliance and international alliance for like fascist like Wolfenstein
America is is. I think like it's concerning because like
Trump has a lot of baggage and I think obviously
he has a great degree of personal support swishing in
the primaries. But if they don't make if they don't
(34:37):
stick the landing with Trump, I think Abbott is waiting
in the wings to make perhaps a more competent fascists
than Trump and make an attempt at running for the presidency.
Speaker 1 (34:48):
Not good anything else to say, fuck all of them?
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Yeah that's sure.
Speaker 4 (34:54):
But okay, So the other thing that you actually can
do about this is that look, this bullshit, all of
this stuff is going to continue until there's actually some
kind of sustained attack by the left on like politically
on the border regime. Right, that was a thing that
when I when I was like, you know, when I
(35:16):
was like like coming up by twenty sixteen, twenty seventeen,
twenty eight, and we were doing right, there was occupy Ice.
There was like, there were mass demonstrations, there was like
critical pleasure being applied, and we didn't go far enough.
Part of the reason we didn't go far enough is
a lot of people fucking a lot of very optimistic
political groups, like including like PSL et cetera, et cetera,
like hijacked a lot of these things and pulled people
(35:37):
off of occupations. But you know, there was actually there
were there have been periods in my lifetime, like not
that long ago where there was actually forward progress being
made about this shit, to the point where like even
that we're like the Democrats were trying to co opt it.
And it doesn't fucking have to be like this, Like
we don't We don't have to have hundreds of people
fucking dying at the border every year. We don't have
(35:58):
to have people in open air fuck prisons. It doesn't
have to be like this. We can fight them and
we can win, but it requires actually, like it requires
actually going and fighting and you know you have you
have to act. You have to actually be willing to
do this. You have to be willing to commit to
the organizing.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
But if we don't, if we just keep leaving all
of this ship to like just the literal howling fascists
and then Biden who is like it like on on
the border doing the same thing but not being but
not like howling about it. Yeah, yeah, you know, like
this this, this, this country is going to go into
fucking oblivion and we are we are going, like you're
(36:36):
you're going to see in your lifetime the US government
shooting people on the border, like with machine guns, right
if you if we don't stop this fucking now, that
is that is what you are going to live to see.
And it does not We don't. We don't have to,
We don't have.
Speaker 1 (36:48):
To live in that world. But you have to act now.
Speaker 3 (36:52):
Yeah, I think that's a great Like it's also within
our power to like there is not a voting option,
but there is always a mutual adoption at the border.
And I know it bang on about this, but like,
if you are within range of the border, you can
go and help. If you're not, there are migrant communities
in your city, in your town, who.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
Need your help.
Speaker 3 (37:13):
And like, the way we get through to our boomer
uncles and Facebook ants and stuff is by showing them
that migrants are people with stories who are just the
same as you, and they just want a chance to
raise their kids someone where they're not going to get
fucking killed by a carb bomb.
Speaker 1 (37:30):
And that the more.
Speaker 3 (37:32):
Human interactions more people going to have with migrants, and
the more stories we can tell that's center migrants as people,
not as numbers or a tsunami or any of this
dehumanizing rhetoric, like, the more likely we are to take
the teeth out of this. And that's something that all
of us can do.
Speaker 1 (37:49):
Yes, all right, so that's a good thing to end on.
And obviously by our storable foods. Go to pissing my
Pants dry foods dot net and use promo code Robert
Evans says, the apocalypse is coming. It's a very long
promo code, but you will get Actually it increases the
price by fifteen percent, but please do it anyway. Yeah,
(38:13):
well we get more money. That's going to be it
for us here and it could happen here until next time.
I don't know. Go to sleep with dreams of a
Jdam taking out Greg Abbott right in the Austin Capitol
Building just bam baby. It won't happen, but it is
a funny thing to think about.
Speaker 5 (38:40):
It could Happen here as a production of cool Zone Media.
For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website
cool zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.
You can find sources for It could Happen Here, updated
monthly at cool zonemedia dot com slash sources. Thanks for listening,
Al Zone Media, welcome back to It Could Happen Here,
a podcast about it happening here. And in the original
cadence of this website or website, in the original cadence
of the show, that was a reference to a civil war, right,
a new civil war, It could happen here. That's what
(00:22):
Season one was made a big splash. Now, we kind
of covered the dystopia beat in general, but today we're
getting back to our mother fucking roots because the state
of Texas has recently declared a big old fuck you
to the federal government r having its National guardsmen deploy
razor wire at the border and stop border patrol people from,
(00:45):
for example, performing rescues of people who are trapped in
the water drowning. It's a whole thing. At least three
migrants have already died as a result of this fuckery
by Texas Governor Greg Abbott, and now, like, I don't know,
twenty states something near to that have There may be
more by the time you hear this, but something like
twenty states have declared that they're in support of Governor
(01:08):
Abbott's refusal to let the Feds in and insistence that
he's dealing with an invasion and must take on the
border texas'self, and some of those states are now sending
or at least claim they're going to send national guardsmen.
So when this all started happening, we all got a
lot of messages. I got about a billion from people
being like, is this it? Is this the civil war?
(01:30):
And obviously a big chuck of that comes from right
wing memes because they are all talking about like, yeah,
let's do it, Let's have us a civil war. We're
all going to start fighting over some guy posted his
handgun collection like we're ready.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
A bunch of revolvers.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Yeah, stupid shit, It's stupid shit, But you know, it's
not unreasonable to be like, this seems like a massive
constitutional crisis that's potentially in line with some of the
crises that precipitated the original Civil War. You've got a
governor completely defying not now not just you know, the
president and the federal government, but the Supreme Court who
(02:06):
ruled that you can't just have your fucking Texas goons
stop a federal law enforcement agency from doing its job
on the border. So you know, how serious is this
and is this the kind of thing that's going to
lead to a twenty four's New Civil War movie, and
my quick take on this is no, probably not. I
(02:27):
think what this is is in fact, a governor stretching
out his authority and testing how much he can get
away with against the overall federal government, because he and
a lot of other conservative governors want to do things
that are directly in contravention of the Civil Rights Act,
of the Bill of Rights, of numerous federal protections for
(02:49):
their citizens. And this is kind of a way of
being like, well, if they won't fuck with us over this,
then we can probably start imprisoning journalists and you know,
killing people that or at least imprisoning people that otherwise
we would not be able to write like this is
a right wing power grab, and it's an attempt to
see is the central government weak enough that we can
(03:09):
get away with this stuff. I don't think they're all
going to start shooting at each other. I don't think
Greg abbott is wants to get in the shooting war
with the federal government over Mostly the dimensions of the
crisis are gend up and fake in terms of what
he is claiming it is. There is, in fact the
humanitarian crisis at our border, but that's not what his
issue is. So that's my quick take. We're going to
(03:30):
get into more of all of that. But James, you
are our resident border correspondent correspondent, and you have some
very strong feelings on how all of this has been
interpreted in the media. So I wanted to pull to
you first and then we'll get to Mia and we'll
just kind of roundtable after that.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
I do, in a rare instance for me, I have
strong feelings about the way this has been covered, and
strong feelings about the coverage of the border, which I
know is a thing I talk about all the time,
but I am beyond frustrated with the way this has
been covered. It's hugely a respond table and it's completely
context free. Like there are people, as there always are
with the border, and there always are with the right,
(04:06):
who just tourists outside things that they understand and try
and generate clicks by geeing up the fear of a
civil war. And yes, I've seen dozens of people sharing
headlines about national Guard deployments. So happened years ago. The
National Guard have been deployed to our border for years.
I see national Guard troops every day. I had a
(04:28):
National Guard guy shooting me and shoot at me, shout
at me.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
A friend of ours took one of their rifles.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
Yes, yes, the National Guard have been extremely based in
arming the Butterfly Center. Yeah, they they're there. There's a
federal deployment. Texas also has a state deployment. These are
different things, and.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Other states have also sent National guardsmen to the border before.
By the correct that is not the first time this
has happened.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Yeah. Yeah, So there's a federal deployment and then there
are state deployments, both of those distinct things. Something to
know about the state deployment that is missing in the
context free reporting that you're seeing is that these guys
aren't getting any of their federal deployment benefits. So they
won't be getting the tricare, they won't be getting the
time towards their retirement, they won't be getting their GI bill, etc. So,
(05:16):
like the Texas guys who are deployed on state orders
are really the National Guard are getting barked by Greg
Abbott like it's laughable that that, like, you know, he's
pretending that he cares about Texas while actively screwing over
and Rober and I have spoken to some of those
Texas National Guard folks last time we were in Texas
(05:37):
did not seem to be super motivated to be They're
the only military unit i've seen tried to form a
union because they're not in a federal they're not in
a federal orders, so they're going to attempt to form
a union.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Get Billy bragged down to the border. We got to
do this. Yeah, let's get Billy back. I'll get him
going over.
Speaker 3 (05:55):
The Rio Grande and Billy Bragg and they'll fix it.
And it has been the most dangerous deployment that they've had,
including deployment to a rug They they have, unfortunately a
habit of drinking and driving, which has not proven healthy
for them. They also there's a quirk of Texas law
that means that they can't stop National Guard soldiers from
(06:16):
bringing their own firearms.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
Yeah, which is great. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:20):
Yeah, and the US they can't stop them accidentally killing
each other with their own firearms. Also, Yeah, it's good stuff.
A TNG soldier did die trying to save a migrant
from the river. Yes, he drowned. So like it has
not like it is very boring, but also quite dangerous
deployment that you know, they have really high. They wrote
(06:40):
a manifesto a couple of years ago about how bullshit
their deployment was.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
You know which is which is really great? To death? Yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:48):
So much of this has been reported without any context, right, Like,
I think genuinely a lot of the people reporting on
this are not aware there have been national their National
Guard here in California. Like I say, I see them
all the time. They're not supposed to interdict migrants, but
I see them doing surveillance, and I see them guarding
open air prisons in Hiccumba almost every day. And I
think that seems to have been missed by the majority
(07:11):
of people covering this.
Speaker 4 (07:12):
We should talk more about the open air prison part,
because I think there's a lot of people who seem
to be getting the impression that the Biden administration is
like actually substantively trying to do something to help immigrants,
and like they're like this fight is like between like
pro and anti immigration. It's like, no, there is a
fight between whether you think these people should be killed
(07:33):
incredibly quickly by a combination of razor wire and rivers,
or whether you think they should starve the death.
Speaker 3 (07:39):
Yeah or die of dehydrat should walk through the desert
would die of hypothermia walking through the mountains. Like I
I think I've said some in the podcast before, but
I was helping a three year old girl who is
hypothermic last week, and like, that is what Joe Biden
is doing. That is a Joe Biden policy being enacted
by Joe Biden as Joe Biden wants it to be
an acted, or at very least. Yeah, I'm sure his
personal like complicity or even understanding is relatively low. Given
(08:03):
his understanding, it seems of a lot of things. But
the Biden administration's policy is to deter people by making
crossing more difficult and more dangerous, which de facto makes
it more deadly. What Abbot is doing with his razor
wire and his floating fence is a version of the
same thing. Like they are not distinctly different. When everyone
was up and now it's about the three people drowning.
(08:25):
That's a tragedy. At eight hundred and fifty people died
crossing the border in twenty twenty two, that was a
normal day. Like the distinction is maybe in degree, but
really it's an aesthetic between Abbott and Biden on this,
and it's just two dudes chest stump each other trying
to not look weak. There is not an option in
(08:48):
the US system which allows you to vote for the
party that doesn't want migrants to die like that. Both
of the parties are completely in lockstep on that.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
And let's let's be very clear about something. Part of
why that is is because an overwhelming number of Americans
are indifferent or actively hostile to the survival of migrants. Yes, like,
this is an It is incredibly unpopular in this country
to think these people are human beings who deserve decent
treatment in decent lives. This is a fight that the
(09:18):
left has lost comprehensively, mostly in large part because the
left has completely given up on it, which is why
you've got fucking a lot of these nasbol assholes saying
shit like you know this is we have like saying
basically protectionist, nativist kind of shit these yes, right, because.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
I think that like leftist media has also and to
include I guess liberal media also has completely oh yeah,
like being complicit in this, right, Like, the amount of
stories that you will read about migrants that don't talk
two migrants in the next few weeks will be a lot.
If you care to read them, right, And that's because
people don't want to come here. They're either afraid of
(09:56):
coming here or they don't want to take the time,
they don't have the language skills. There are people who
have the language skills who don't who don't get these jobs,
and are people who don't have the language skills and
who don't have the understanding of how the border on
the ground works as opposed to immigration policy in DC works.
And you're going to see a lot of people who
don't live at the border, who don't come to the border,
writing about the border and yeah, that's how we got here,
(10:19):
and that's how we're getting to this largely like a
giant panic about a nothing burger. But yeah, it's the
reporting has been in continued to be responsible, and that
is in some degree complicit.
Speaker 4 (10:31):
Yeah, and I think this is also the explanation for
why there's a lot of people going like, why is
Biden not like setting the troops, why is Biden not
cracking out? Because it doesn't fucking give a shit. It's
the same policy. He doesn't care, right, Like, there's not
actually substantive disagreements except over like whether it should be
like some like a really super political stunt over whether
it should be like federal troops like on or like
(10:54):
federal agents like on the border, or whether it should
be the razor wire like he doesn't care.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Yeah, you know. And to be fair, I will say,
I don't think this is the start. This right here,
I don't think is the start of a civil war.
We may if we have one. We may someday see
this on like the list of factors contributing to in
the years leading up to it. But I will say,
if we do ever have a shooting civil war, it
will be something this dumb that I feel absolutely certain
(11:20):
of it will. It will be a thing where no
one involved really cares about the issue that starts it.
It's just a dick measuring contest that goes too far.
I just don't think this is the dick measuring contest.
But to be fair, it will be something this dumb.
Don't worry, folks, don't worry. If we do start shooting
each other, it will be just as stupid as this.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
I do think that, Like I think we're extremely likely
to start a shooting civil war over this or in
the next few years. Generally, I do think the chance
of shooting my context without a civil war. It's shooting
specifically of migrants, especially in places where they're not safe,
like open aduitencure centers is going up. And yes, that
scares the shit out of me as someone who spends
(12:01):
a lot of his life there. And I do think that.
I mean, we saw in twenty eighteen, right, and we've
covered this extensively, the Tree of Life shooting was in
large part motivated by right wing rhetoric about a caravan
of migrants. I was in Tijuana in twenty eighteen. I
spent months of my life helping people down there. Like
anyone who's scared of those people is paranoid to say,
(12:24):
at least right that they were mostly fine, wonderful, very
friendly people. I spent Christmas with them. But yeah, the
twenty eighteen Tree of Life shooting came from paranoia about
the border. We're seeing that same paranoia from right wing
media and from liberal media now, and I think that
it would not be unreasonable to have that fear of
(12:45):
individual acts of violence and terrorism along the border.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
Yeah. I think one of the things we're going to
have to do in the near future is get better
at understanding kind of the media dimensions of conflicts like this,
and what is an irresponsible way to respond to them?
And I think treating this like it is a civil
(13:11):
war type deal is kind of feeding into the right's
image of itself and their desire to treat this like
their revolutionaries. Now that said, what is the right thing
to do, because like the the what the Biden administrations
seems to be doing right now is largely kind of
(13:31):
ignoring it. I think at some point they will probably
try to nationalize the Guard and we'll see what happens. Then.
One thing that's kind of worth noting is that this
has primarily gone viral on right wing media. I'm seeing
very little of this on like mainstream centrist like liberal
media sources. And I'm seeing little on this because like
(13:52):
most of those sources don't really care about the border.
Unless there's some way to like drum up fear against
migrants like that, they'll do a caravans story. But this
just this just simply doesn't sell. I think when it
comes to like what is a responsible way to report
on this, I think you have to start by centering
what's actually happening to the migrants, what's being done to them,
(14:15):
as opposed to focusing on this Dick measuring, because that's
the actual harm here. The harm here is not that
Abbott has been mean to the border patrol, and it's
not that Texas and these other states, these rebel states,
are raising an army to fight the federal government. It's
that there's this argument between the people in power and
(14:37):
our country about like how bad should things be for
people who are already desperate? And I think that's where
you should center your focus. Also, I've just noticed this
on my other screen. This is a bit off topic,
but you know that movie Rebel Moon by Zack Snyder.
Oh god, An, there's an ad for the canned water
(14:59):
company Liquid Death that just is showing a bunch of
like Imperial troops from that movie beating a man and
then drinking Liquid Death water as they relax afterwards. And
it's the most unhinged ad I've ever seen. It's like
running aside a box article. I've never seen anything like
this before. It's just like, what the wait a second, what,
(15:20):
Zack Snyder? Come on, you can't do Zach's no, that
fucking guy, Jesus talking of advertising, Buy some Liquid Death.
(15:42):
We're back.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Yeah, So I want to talk about Grift because we
talked about advertising. I don't know if you guys have
seen the number of like right wing influences. Okay, so
I'm looking at friends of the podcast Tim Pool's Twitter here.
Speaker 1 (15:55):
Oh, Tim, there's a guy who is excited to have
a civil war where he will be murked imediately by
one of his bodyguards.
Speaker 3 (16:03):
Yeah, there is a man who's seen combat and knows
what it is to hear rounds cracking off over your head. Okay, Timple,
I'm just going to quote here at ha ha ha
ha ha ha, et cetera, Fuck me, dude, and then
Safe and Ready Meals dot com. Paul is not the
only one on the buckets of food grift right. Alex
(16:24):
Jones has been on this too.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Oh yeah a million years.
Speaker 3 (16:27):
Yeah yeah, yeah, he's been long time, long time food
story guy at Alex Jones. A lot of these guys
are like very clearly geing up fears of civil war
on the right so that they can sell people powder
dried eggs. Like it's it's so transparent, Like it's in
the same tweet. Yeah, Sobiak Trump calls for all willing
states to deploy National Guard to Texas border and start
(16:49):
the deportations and then there's a special partner offer for
my patriots supply dot com god, which is the way
to fuel your bigotry.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
I guess, guys, two things. First off, if you buy
your storable food from some right wing media grifters deal site,
you will spend the apocalypse shitting yourself to death like
it's all horrible. If you are going to buy, if
you are going to throw a bunch of money on store.
If you are a sane and reasonable person who wants
to store food, learn how to make your own jerky.
(17:19):
Learn how to can food. You can do it very cheaply.
It is not expensive to can your own food. If
you know what you're doing. You can can stuff that
is in season and get it really cheap from the
grocery store. And you can pickle and do other kinds
of can't pressure canning. It's really economical and it will
last a long time. If you are going to spend
a shitload of money on storable freeze dried food, you're
(17:41):
going to be spending a bunch of money anyway. Just
go buy Mountain House. Buy Mountain House. It's the good stuff.
It's tasty. As far as I know, no right winger
advertises on them and it's actually pretty good food. Yeah,
that's what I keep in my car for emergencies. You
will not shit ever ever again. Yeah, you may never
poop again, but the fucking biscuits and gravy breakfast selection there. Man,
(18:06):
when you're alone in the mountains, that ship is fucking fire.
Oh my god. Yeah, that will.
Speaker 3 (18:12):
It is like a bun for the digestive system.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (18:15):
I just want to plug Lentils dot org, which I
checked is a website.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
Yeah, Lentils the ship forever.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
Yeah, find balance between the yin and the yang in
your in your post avocalypse life with man House and
Lentils do org you today? You know what's not running
on lentils guys. Unfortunately, this is not an ad pivot.
I've just I've done theil Bate switch. It's this fucking
convoy that's going to the border and we talk about this, Yeah,
(18:46):
let's do that. They're like, this is where I'm really
done with irresponsible reporting, like being like oh no, January sixth,
Part two. Here's a link if you want to take part, Like,
what the fuck is wrong with you?
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Stop it?
Speaker 3 (19:01):
But I look, right wing groups have tried to run
convoys probably a dozen times since twenty twenty. Right, I
think we can all think of a different convoy that's
got stuck under a bridge.
Speaker 4 (19:13):
When drove by my house and then basically didn't get
any further than that.
Speaker 3 (19:18):
Yep, Yet they get lost, they disagree about directions a
lot of What a lot.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
Of people are going to realize is that the Texas
border is twelve hours from anywhere in Texas when you
are in Dallas. I believe this is accurate. When you
are in Dallas, it is faster to drive to Chicago
than it is to direct to the border. It is
so fucking far away from anything you could cross Europe
(19:44):
in the time it will take you to get down there. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (19:48):
I love the idea of a convoy of like, you know,
like completely c pilled lunatics, just like you're sending on
the town of Moth.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Yeah yeah, yeah, fucking passing Marathon and going where the
christ are we.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
Like, Yeah, it is a really really beautiful bike ride
from MafA to the border. There's from dirt roads you
can take.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
Oh and Marfa by the way, folks, if you're looking
to go down to the border, very fun town. You'll
have a good time in Marfa.
Speaker 3 (20:16):
Yeah, do love a bit of Marfa. Really, I'm not
going to tell my Martha story. I'll tell you guys
when we're done. But yeah, yeah, it is not Liken salacious,
it's just done. Yeah, Marfa is near the border. Lots
of things are not. It is a very long way
from I guess like maybe people could fly to our
passer that's near the border. But yeah, it's this idea.
(20:38):
So there's three convoys, right, One I think is supposed
to go from Virginia Beach.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
To Texas Shares the way guys enjoy spending seven thousand
dollars in Gussie.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
Yes, exactly where if they not look at the cost
of fuel, you fucking idiots.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Have fun homies.
Speaker 3 (20:58):
Yeah. Another one is going from I think last Cruis says,
to Yuma. And the one is going from here at
Santa Sedro to Yuma. Yes, the drive from Santa Sedro
to Humor is boring af but good luck, I guess,
like good luck spending that Californa. Hopefully they get pull
off at some of the gas stations like east of
San Diego where it's still like six or seven dollars
(21:20):
a gallon, Because you're fucked if you need fuel there
and you can't buy from anyone else. But yeah, the
idea that people are going to spend all their money
like driving across the country. It is also just very
like there's the meme right of the like the old
white guy wearing Oakley wrap around or fake Oakley wrap
around sunglasses doing a selfie video in his car to
rent about like anything and everything. But like, I think
(21:43):
it's very illustrative of how many of these people don't
feel safe outside their vehicles and like need the activism
to involve their their.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
F two fifty. Yeah. Well, in part because most of
them are, like like most Americans, in great shape, not
physically imposing, So if you're sitting in an F two fifty,
you feel big and powerful. Like James, you and I
both have trucks. One of the things about trucks that
is nice is that being in a truck, you're elevated
above the rest of the road, right, oh yeah, And
(22:15):
that that gets to a lot of people's heads, especially
if they have absolutely nothing else going on in their lives,
which nobody participating in this fucking caravan does, so they
this is like it's it's it's there, it's emotional support. Right,
They're sitting in their truck, They've got their gun. They're
not breathing hard because they have to like walk around
the world, and they they would desperately prefer that they can.
(22:39):
That's where how their activism, that's how their participation in
the Second Civil War will occur. Yeah, truck A bunch
of bunch of fucking wankers. Yeah, So I do want
to get into kind of like what we do feel
is the actual threats of this. Again, I think the
(23:00):
danger here is you've got a lot of kind of
fights going down about like how far can governments take
their anti trans legislation, How mean can they be to
undocumented immigrants, Like how much violence can they deploy in
deporting people? What can they do to journalists? What can
they do to people speaking out or engaging in protests
(23:21):
without violating the Bill of Rights? You know? What can
they do to marginalized communities about virrelating the Civil Rights Act?
I think this is an attempt to set a precedent
for ignoring federal control so that they can be crueler
to large groups of people within their purview. And I
(23:41):
think a lot of this is a reaction to this
is kind of there, what if we lose this election? Right?
I think there is a fear, and I don't necessarily
think this fear is actually like born out. I don't
think the rights national hopes in terms of its ability
to get elected again after Trump are as poor as
people want them to be, as I might want them
to be. Yeah, but I think there is real fear
(24:02):
among the right that if Trump doesn't win this, they're
not going to win the presidency again, right, And I
think part of what they are doing is setting up all, right,
then we will just take over and take increasing autonomy
in our red states, and we will effectively govern them
very differently and govern them in contravention of how the
rest of the country and how the federal government how
(24:23):
the Supreme Court says that they can be governed because
we can't be cruel enough without that, And I think
that is what they are stepping up to be able
to do. If you're asking what do I think will
be sort of like line crossings that could lead to
mass social violence in this country? One thing, I don't
think they're going to take that leap. While a Democrat
(24:46):
is in control of the federal government and the defense Department.
I think they will push for a violent crackdown on
everything left of the far right if they win power again,
because they talk about that repeatedly, because they promised to
do that. Yeah, and I think that if they lose,
there's an off chance. I don't think this is likely,
but it's not impossible that protests and violence as acts
(25:09):
of protest against Biden winning a second term could snowball
into something that resembles an insurgency. Not impossible. I don't
think that's the likeliest outcome. But I don't see them
starting to shoot at federal troops now while Biden is
in the White House for one thing. I feel like
that's the thing that would really clinch it for Biden.
(25:29):
If Texas National Guard trying to secede, well, you've made
his reelection campaign easier, right because now none of the
red states, like none of the states that secede, You
can't also have an election where those states get to vote, right, Like,
that's just not the way it works. Yeah, So I
don't feel like that's the likeliest thing. I think this is. Yeah,
(25:50):
I think I've made it clear what I think, and
I think it's really clear that it's time for our
second ad break.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
That's right.
Speaker 3 (25:57):
Hopefully it's an ad for then new transpried oreos. If
you guys those.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Yeah, no, I've not seen those.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
What wait, trans fried or well, yeah, maybe it's just me.
Speaker 3 (26:08):
I was just reading a story earlier.
Speaker 1 (26:10):
And I just trans fat or No, they have like
a blue transflag. Ooah, well okay they have.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
Two years ago.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Hold on, this is okay, okay, okay, let's say I
don't definitely haven't.
Speaker 3 (26:25):
I just put a link in that woke, woke biscuit.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
That's good, I have. I have no opinion on this.
I guess it's good. Oreos aren't bigoted.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
Yeah, well, don't give your money to me instead.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Yeah, I don't think it really matters that. There. Ah,
we're back.
Speaker 4 (26:56):
You know, one thing I think about, like part of
what this is going viral, and I think part of
what's an issue about this with the way it's being
talked about on the left, but also you know, the
way the way it's marketable to the right is that
the thing about this confrontation is that it looks like
a civil war, but it looks like it's it's it's
(27:17):
exactly perfectly engineered to look like the lead of Civil
War one, and that is incredibly misleading. It's it's it's
it's basically it's like a marketing thing, right because like,
and this is only thing we've talked about on this
show for like literally since day one, is that like
a civil war in the United States is not going
to look like a bunch of states like form an
(27:39):
alliance and then all in they're fighting all of the
other states. Like it's it's not going to look like that.
It's going to look closer to Syria than it is
going to look like like the first Civil War. But
people haven't shaken like the sort of like brain worms
of a civil war is like sixteen states fight sixteen states,
even though every single civil war that we've had, like
(28:03):
in the intervening like one hundred, like two hundred years,
has not been that.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
And here's here's how wrong. Here's how people are comprehensively
wrong about this. Right on the left side, you have LMAO,
you guys are going to fight the federal government with
your AR fifteen's. They got bombs and planes, and like, well,
we've seen how well our bombs and planes work against insurgencies.
We're not good at winning those if there were an
real insurgency, and there's certainly ingredients to it, it would
(28:27):
actually be a problem for the US. However, that does
not look like sixteen states declaring themselves seceded and going
to because that's a conventional war. And you know what
happened if Greg Abbott started a conventional war against the US.
Greg Abbott doesn't have a fucking bunker, right like we
could we could, he could be he could be blown up.
He is again nothing against being in a wheelchair, but
(28:48):
this is not a man who is capable of like
living underground and hiding from federal bombers. Like that's just
not the kind of conflict that you need to be
concerned about.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
Yeah, this, this man does not have been Loden dog
in him.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
He just does not know. He's sure, he sure doesn't.
Speaker 3 (29:06):
He the idea of Greg Abbott taking to a hate
system in.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Doing a Tora Bora Texas. He's hanging out and fucking.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
Yeah, fucking big bend or whatever.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
Yeah, yeah, Torah boring big bend es Christ, Yeah, will
be outstanding. We would love to see it.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
Fortunately, grainy photos of Greg Abbott and like the mountains
of Southern Texas shaking hands with Mexican revolutionaries as they
smile rifles to him, rifles that they also got from
the United States. That is what we call the circle
of life.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
Oh god, God, we can we can dream, but it
does seem unfortunately unlikely. Yeah, it would be very funny. Yeah,
see Sealed Team go off to Greg Abbott.
Speaker 1 (29:54):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely Sealed Team fighting the Texas Rangers of
if only.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
Just a bunch of dudes each with a revolver because
they thought it looked cool until the very first time
someone was shooting back in them.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
Yeah. It's it's a real like who is on the
most HGH competition? Whoever whoever can stop the steroids from
flooding in is going to win. That's the spice in
this particular conflict. Yeah, we would love to see Joe
Rogan's the baron harkone and of making sure everybody speck.
Speaker 3 (30:28):
Ups guys have enough gear floating above a fucking table. Great,
it would be wonderful in term senses. But yeah, I
don't think we're going to see a shoot. It will
be interesting to see how like Biden has screwed the
pooch in terms of like his media management of this,
(30:50):
I would say, and it will be interesting to see
how hard he goes in response. Like if he goes
in response.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
I think the smart answer would be nationalize the Guard.
If there's things that you can actually prosecute people over,
prosecute them and continue to not deal with it in
the media. Like his instinct isn't bad in terms of
not wanting to feed in directly to the right wing
outrage loop, but you still have to. You still have
(31:18):
to go after them for this, right, And it's the
kind of thing it's probably like too much to hope
for any real action being taken, But I would say
that's probably the smarter option, right, not to say anything
of what the most moral thing to do is, but
the smart option is don't feed into the fundraising loop,
because we should probably get in on that this is
all a fundraising thing, right in addition to them testing
(31:39):
the waters. That's the biggest dimension of this is and
that's why we talked earlier. All of these guys Timpoole
and Jack Pisoviec and I'm sure the Daily Wire guys
are in now are like advertising your storable foods companies
and shit. The point of all this all right wing messaging.
All far right messaging starts as a grift. It all
(32:00):
starts with a product to sell. That's, by the way,
how guns became so enmeshed with the far right right.
A lot of gun companies realized that, like Americans only
need so many guns for like reasonable self defense and
hunting and even even recreational purposes. There's only so many
guns a man could shoot at a time. But you
can really get people to stockpiles shit like crazy if
(32:22):
you convince them they're like preparing to be guerrilla fighters
in a future civil war. And so and a lot
of these like gun tuber influencers, that's kind of where
they increasingly went because that's where the money was. And
so this becomes more and more of a part of
right wing politics because a lot of people on the
right have a lot of money to be made in
messaging this kind of stuff and selling this kind of stuff.
(32:43):
The same thing is true with the civil warshit it's
true with these like fears that the government. You know,
we can sell you storable food, we can sell you
fucking bunkers. All of this stuff comes out of some
sort of financial grift. And the biggest thing that most
of the people involved and this are hoping for Fucking
Jack Pisobiec doesn't want to be fucking hiding underground getting
(33:06):
bombed by the US Air Force. Jack Pisobiec wants to
make another million dollars off of affiliate sales of bullshit. Right, Yeah,
that's what And a lot of these people, these guys
doing this caravans to the borders, they're not planning on
spending their own money on gas. They're hoping that they
can crowdfund a shitload of money and I'm sure one
of them will steal all of it and run away, right,
That's what usually happens with this kind of shit. But
(33:28):
that's what they're all hoping to do. And so that's
kind of the over if you want to actually hurt them,
if you're looking at where do we how do we
draw a strategic victory out of this, find a way
to damage their ability to profit off of this shit?
And I do think part of it is not making
this as big a story as that otherwise might be.
But that's not simply enough, because the Right is large
(33:50):
enough that just through their media hyping this up, they
can make a decent amount of money off this stuff,
so more complex solutions are needed.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Yeah, I do think think we should probably discuss like
the potential of Abbot using this in a personal or
like later a presidential run, right, Like, yeah, he's in
New Delhi at the moment.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Have you seen he's a New Delhi hanging out with
everybody's favorite pseudo dictator of India Modi.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
Yeah, like Abbott trying to build this kind of like
electoral alliance and international alliance for like fascist like Wolfenstein
America is is. I think like it's concerning because like
Trump has a lot of baggage and I think obviously
he has a great degree of personal support swishing in
the primaries. But if they don't make if they don't
(34:37):
stick the landing with Trump, I think Abbott is waiting
in the wings to make perhaps a more competent fascists
than Trump and make an attempt at running for the presidency.
Speaker 1 (34:48):
Not good anything else to say, fuck all of them?
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Yeah that's sure.
Speaker 4 (34:54):
But okay, So the other thing that you actually can
do about this is that look, this bullshit, all of
this stuff is going to continue until there's actually some
kind of sustained attack by the left on like politically
on the border regime. Right, that was a thing that
when I when I was like, you know, when I
(35:16):
was like like coming up by twenty sixteen, twenty seventeen,
twenty eight, and we were doing right, there was occupy Ice.
There was like, there were mass demonstrations, there was like
critical pleasure being applied, and we didn't go far enough.
Part of the reason we didn't go far enough is
a lot of people fucking a lot of very optimistic
political groups, like including like PSL et cetera, et cetera,
like hijacked a lot of these things and pulled people
(35:37):
off of occupations. But you know, there was actually there
were there have been periods in my lifetime, like not
that long ago where there was actually forward progress being
made about this shit, to the point where like even
that we're like the Democrats were trying to co opt it.
And it doesn't fucking have to be like this, Like
we don't We don't have to have hundreds of people
fucking dying at the border every year. We don't have
(35:58):
to have people in open air fuck prisons. It doesn't
have to be like this. We can fight them and
we can win, but it requires actually, like it requires
actually going and fighting and you know you have you
have to act. You have to actually be willing to
do this. You have to be willing to commit to
the organizing.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
But if we don't, if we just keep leaving all
of this ship to like just the literal howling fascists
and then Biden who is like it like on on
the border doing the same thing but not being but
not like howling about it. Yeah, yeah, you know, like
this this, this, this country is going to go into
fucking oblivion and we are we are going, like you're
(36:36):
you're going to see in your lifetime the US government
shooting people on the border, like with machine guns, right
if you if we don't stop this fucking now, that
is that is what you are going to live to see.
And it does not We don't. We don't have to,
We don't have.
Speaker 1 (36:48):
To live in that world. But you have to act now.
Speaker 3 (36:52):
Yeah, I think that's a great Like it's also within
our power to like there is not a voting option,
but there is always a mutual adoption at the border.
And I know it bang on about this, but like,
if you are within range of the border, you can
go and help. If you're not, there are migrant communities
in your city, in your town, who.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
Need your help.
Speaker 3 (37:13):
And like, the way we get through to our boomer
uncles and Facebook ants and stuff is by showing them
that migrants are people with stories who are just the
same as you, and they just want a chance to
raise their kids someone where they're not going to get
fucking killed by a carb bomb.
Speaker 1 (37:30):
And that the more.
Speaker 3 (37:32):
Human interactions more people going to have with migrants, and
the more stories we can tell that's center migrants as people,
not as numbers or a tsunami or any of this
dehumanizing rhetoric, like, the more likely we are to take
the teeth out of this. And that's something that all
of us can do.
Speaker 1 (37:49):
Yes, all right, so that's a good thing to end on.
And obviously by our storable foods. Go to pissing my
Pants dry foods dot net and use promo code Robert
Evans says, the apocalypse is coming. It's a very long
promo code, but you will get Actually it increases the
price by fifteen percent, but please do it anyway. Yeah,
(38:13):
well we get more money. That's going to be it
for us here and it could happen here until next time.
I don't know. Go to sleep with dreams of a
Jdam taking out Greg Abbott right in the Austin Capitol
Building just bam baby. It won't happen, but it is
a funny thing to think about.
Speaker 5 (38:40):
It could Happen here as a production of cool Zone Media.
For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website
cool zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.
You can find sources for It could Happen Here, updated
monthly at cool zonemedia dot com slash sources. Thanks for listening,
It Could Happen Here News
Host
Robert Evans
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