Kubrick Special Part I: The Shining

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Hey, everybody, Welcome to Movie Crush Charles W. Chuck Bryant
here in the home Studio, Pont City Market, Atlanta, Georgia.
And uh, here's what we're doing everyone. This is a
little special a dish uh and and part one of
a three part series that I have a feeling will expand.
Because Casey Pegram works here in the office and Casey

(00:46):
is I used to call him one of the video kids.
That was there was a group of people back when
we did video that shot stuff and edited stuff and
did all our video work. But since we have sort
of segued out of that, they they segued quite nicely
into audio engineering and editing. Uh. And they do a
great job producing a lot of our top podcast here

(01:07):
and Casey certainly is on that team. And the reason
I got Casey in here was because he is, uh,
he's the top centiphile here at work. He is a
movie nut and really a student of film in all
the best ways. And we had a great conversation just
now about Stanley Kubricks The Shining from nineteen eighty, the

(01:28):
classic classic Kubrick film, The Shining, and the conversation went
as great as I expected it to um, I made notes,
but we just ended up just having a really good
talk and I think you're going to really dig this.
And so what we decided to do was do a
three part Kubrick series with Casey uh and do like
one a month. And we decided, uh, well, I'll let

(01:49):
you just listen because we talked about what we're gonna
go with. But part one was a shining. So here
we go with the wonderful and charming and super knowledgeable
Casey Pegrum on the Shining. Have you been any movies lately? Gosh,
let me pull up my do you have my letterbox?

(02:11):
Stap and see what's that? Letterbox is like a kind
of like a social network for movies only. So you
make an account, you log the movies you see, like
what day you watched it. You can give it like
a five out of five star rating, and you can
write a review if you feel like it, can follow weather,
people see what they've been watching. People can comment on

(02:31):
your reviews. So it's just like a cool way to
kind of talk movies with like minded people. Well, I
made a show I didn't know I could just get
it happen, started a podcast. Yeah, So what we're doing
so everyone knows is Casey here at work is sort
of the leading cinephile. Is that fair to say? I'm

(02:55):
very modest, but okay, if you say so, I think
you're the leading sup and and the group full of centophiles.
But you take your ship seriously and I've always respected that.
Um like, you're you're you're voted most likely to own
the criterion of anything pretty much. Yeah, so I've always

(03:15):
appreciated that. So I thought, you know what, this show
is kind of just becoming whatever I wanted to be
as long as we put out two shows a week.
So I was like, why don't I get Casey in
here and let's do like, and this may go beyond
three parts, but let's do a three part tribute to Kubrick. Yeah.
I've been I've been racking my mind. What are those
three going to be? And yeah, yeah, I won't, I won't.

(03:36):
I do know. Yeah, I do know the three now,
but I don't know if we should announce it or
if we should Yeah, let's well, let's talk about it,
because uh, it's it's probably not the three you would expect. Okay,
this is gonna be fun. So you picked the shining first,
and that's what we're gonna cover today, and that's what
sprang this idea. Um is Barry Lyndon on the list.
Barry Lyndon is absolutely on the list. Yeah, Okay, I'm

(03:58):
really excited because I have not seen that movie, which
is I understand because of that movie is kind of
overlooked in a certain sense in his filmography, although it
has like a huge, huge surge of people who love
it now. I think it's yeah, yeah, there's always like
a ten or twenty year period where people kind of
like catch up to his stuff. Yeah, and that happened

(04:21):
in a big way with Barry lynd And I think, yeah,
I'm still waiting for Eyes Wade Shut to come around
because I really liked that movie and a lot of
people hated it. Well, that's the third one that I
want to yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, dude, Because what the
hell am I going to say about two thousand and one?
What don't we gonna say about Strange Love? Like I
feel like certain Kuber movies, as brilliant as they are,
they are well tried territory. It's very difficult to have

(04:42):
anything original to say about them. So but also I think,
I mean Eyes watch shut and Barry lynd and I
think still have. There's there's just so much more to
be said about them and to be you know, I
just saw his white shutting in like a month or
two ago, and yeah, just every time he gets better
for me, save it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, we'll keep it.

(05:02):
I'm glad you picked that too, because I've always defended
that movie. Um, the other one that I've never seen.
I mean, I was looking over his list. There's a
lot of stuff, believe it or not, that I need
to check out because I haven't seen Barry Lyndon. I've
never seen Paths of Glory. Oh, that one's incredible. Yeah,
so like that, that would probably be number four. Well
maybe we should just keep trotting these out. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah.

(05:24):
So we'll put out one of these a month and
just see how it goes. Yeah. But in this first episode,
I wanted to I didn't want to give you. I
didn't want to short change you on the normal movie
crush stuff. So we'll talk a little bit about your background, uh,
and then for the other stuff we'll just go all
Kubrick absolutely. Um, but what were you? Uh you grew

(05:45):
up in Georgia. Yeah, I grew up in I was
born in Marietta, but then we moved to Roswell when
I was like three or four. Okay, so I, you know,
mostly grew up in Roswell. Did you go to Roswell High?
I did to go to Roswell High. Oh. Nice, that's
where my nephew and niece, Well he's at Tech now,
but she's still at ro as well. Yeah. Good school,
good school, good school. And you know my you know
Chad Crowley who was on here for Chinatown for those

(06:08):
of you listening, his daughter goes there now. They moved
out there, Okay, okay, and it's just like one of
the great public schools. Yeah, supposedly it has. It has
a nice reputation. Yeah what did you, uh, when did
you first realize that you loved movies sort of more
than like your average whatever third grader. Well, this is

(06:30):
why I picked The Shining because it was I was.
I was really a Stephen King as a kid. Okay,
and I was, I was a precocious kid. I read
a lot of books early on. Probably we're not age appropriate,
so I was reading a lot of Stephen King and
what age I mean? I remember finishing The Shining on
like the last day of like fifth grade going into

(06:51):
sixth grade, Like it was like the end of the
fifth grade summer going into six that's great. Um. I
was reading Encyclopedia Brown, so um. Yeah, so I was.
I was reading a lot of Stephen King. I had
an aunt who was very into horror movies, my Debbie,
and she made me like a VHS dub of like
the Kubrick Shining, And so I remember they had like

(07:13):
a VHS collection at their house and I was looking
at their tapes and I saw the Shining. It was
next to like two thousand one, and I was kind
of looking at the back cover and I just saw
like Stanley Kubrick. Stanley Kubrick I had. I had not
seen two thousand one at that point, but I somehow
I understood, just through kind of like cultural osmosis that
it was like a big deal and it kind of

(07:35):
it just it just made an impression on me right
then and there, like the same person made these two
very different seeming movies. Um. So that was like the
kind of the beginning of that lightbulb going off in
my head, Like, oh, there's like a thing called a
director and like you know, they really good ones are
kind of leave their imprint on a movie. That was
kind of like my very very early kind of introduction

(07:58):
in a way into like The O Tourist. I ya, wow,
that's pretty impressive. I was geez. I don't know when
it occurred to me that there were directors and what
they did. H And I don't know, I'm not sure
when I sort of got clued into that. And I
love movies, but I was just sort of a dumb,
dumb kid watching movies. Yeah, yeah, you know, I mean

(08:20):
I was. I was that a lot of the time too.
I didn't get like serious right away. Um. We had
like a dollar theater in Roswell at the time, and
so I you know, I would go to see like
Who Framed Roger Rabbitt? Like over and over and over
and over again. So you were a child, and I
didn't know who Robert Zemeckis was, you know, that didn't
that didn't cross my mind. He would go on to
do very bad movies. Yeah, I don't know. The Less

(08:42):
Szemeckis movie I saw it might actually be Roger Abbitt.
I'm not sure. Um, yeah, but you know I was.
I was always going to movies as a kid, Um,
I love movies. We had that dollar theater. Like I said, no,
I'm an only child. Yeah, so a lot of like
in the playroom with the vhs. Absolutely, yes, absolutely, wearing

(09:03):
out the tapes and where you are your parents into
that kind of stuff like or were you sort of
just charting your own path? They were, I mean they
were in new movies. I remember them showing me like
Raiders of the Lost Ark at a really young age,
me being freaked out when the guy's face melted, you know.
I remember I have a distinct memory of like watching
you know, Raiders in particular, I think because the way

(09:24):
the credits were laid out. They showed the first part
of the movie in letterbox and you know, with the
black bars at the top and bottom. Uh. And so
I was like bothered by this. As a child, I
didn't understand about aspect ray shows, and so I was like, yeah, yeah,
I was like, Mom, Dad, when is when are those
black bars gonna go away? I hate this, you know,
And they're like, don't worry, don't work, Like, as soon

(09:45):
as the credit is over, it's gonna go to you know,
it's gonna fill the whole TV. It'll be fine, and
little did I know, of course, like you know, years
later you realized like, oh actually I want those to
stay there, Yes, yeah, you want those bars? Yeah yeah. Yeah.
Well your parents got it though, so they knew something
about because my Chad probably would have been like, I
don't know, something's wrong with the TV. Yeah yeah, yeah,
I think they knew enough to to kind of tell

(10:06):
me about that stuff. And I mean they were We
did go to movies a lot. We watched movies at
home a lot. We had a nice VHS collections, so yeah,
they were they were into movies. What did you have
any like often talk to people about older influences and
a lot of times to siblings, But did you have
anyone like that in your life that was sort of
feeding you stuff or were you really like out there

(10:27):
finding your own chip? I kind of yeah, I kind
of was just out there on my own. I didn't
really have like any older like relatives or you know,
like the cool older brother type um to really initiate
me into that. So that's cool though, a kind of
kind of found my own way, I guess. Yeah. And
were you reading, like, uh, I mean, were you when

(10:47):
did you start to become into the industry. I would
say I started getting Premier magazine. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
I was. I would say I was getting more like
Rolling Stones been. I was maybe more into the musics
out of things for a while. Um. I think I
subscribe to Film Comment maybe, and when I was like
fifteen or sixteen. It's a good start. And that was
a good start. Um. Yeah. We had in in high school,

(11:11):
we had like a direct what do they call it,
directed study program, which is like part of the tag
program kind of, but it's like you get us um
a period out of the day to just kind of
make up your own curriculum, do your own thing. And
so I did one on like the French New Wave,
and so I was doing like Trufeaux and Goodar and
in high school Romer and people like that. Yeah yeah,

(11:32):
in like ten or eleventh grade. Um, I think I
also watched like Modern Time. I don't know how Modern
Times fit into that. Chaplain is great. Yeah, man, So
that's that's pretty cool. That's certainly ahead of the curve
I think for most like goonies loving. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah,
you know, I mean I'm into all that stuff too,
but yeah, yeah, sure you're not you're not too highbrowp

(11:53):
for that. Come. No, No, you know I had a
I had a friend growing up who, um he had
those kind of parents. He was also an only child
who just like let him watch rated movies whenever, you know.
So they had like Predator and Commando and all the
great you know stuff. Yeah yeah, you know, um performance

(12:14):
yeah yeah yeah. Uh does it come up later? The
first art movie? Is that a thing that? Yeah? Yeah, okay, okay,
hold on to that, keep that in your pocket. When
did you first start because you're also a filmmaker, Uh,
when did you start playing around with cameras? That came
a little later? Surprisingly, Well, no, that's that's not true. Actually, um,

(12:34):
we had a cam quarter uh one of those big,
you know, heavy, heavy monstrosities that like will break your
shoulder to hold. Yeah, exactly exactly eat uh eat e
n G kind of camera. Um, and you know my
mom was primarily the person using it. Uh. And so,
but around like maybe thirteen, I wanted to make you know,

(12:57):
just like nothing serious whatsoever, like having fun with my
my friends and stuff, like just a little riff on.
Well like the movie we made it was it was
you know, it was a short. It was probably like
ten or fifteen minutes maybe twenty uh with my friend Ben.
We we were both like heavily into the shining at
that point, and so we made this kind of riff
on the shining called I think it's called the gun

(13:18):
Slinger um or the bank Robber or something like that.
And uh yeah, I was like said, in the West,
Uh it you know, begins in the West. This guy
tries to drop a bank, he gets killed, and then
like you know, fast forward a hundred fifth years later,
this guy's descendant is just living a normal life in
the modern world and he's like a grown man even

(13:39):
though it's my friend Been and he's like thirteen, um
and uh and like the spirit of this you know,
fallen bank robber comes back to haunt him and like
you know, tries to break into his house. And it's
very shining. And I think we were even like we
didn't you know, there was no editing whatsoever. Had to
edit all on camera and obvious, so you can't add

(14:00):
music to anything. So if you did have music, we
would just have like a CD player and like speakers
like in the room, like que it up. Um. So
we were you know, we were kind of tapping into
some of the classical music that's like in the Shining
and stuff like that. Yeah, yeah, which Kubrick did. Actually,
well we'll get to that, but yeah he would play
ship yeah yeah. Yeah. Did you watch the making of
the Vaping kubric Yeah yeah cool. I was hoping. Yeah,

(14:23):
I figured so yeah, yeah, you're like I own that
on Yeah it's yeah, what oh that is it's it's
one of the extras. Yeah, okay, but it was on
the DVD like way back in the day. I had
never heard of it. Yeah, it's fantastic. I mean there's
there's no there's no other footage like that really of
him working, and I wanted, yeah, I wanted it to
be an hour long. Oh I want those dailies. I

(14:45):
just want like all the row footage. Yeah, it's all
interesting to me. Yeah. Um, now when did uh so
you started making? Do you still have that movie? By
the way, the I was just thinking about that last night.
I remember at some point after long afterwards, maybe by
the time I was making like more kind of like
pro sort of films. Um. I think the VHS tape

(15:09):
is still around and I meant to dub it, uh
like into digital format and like burn it onto DV,
just back it up somewhere. So I think it's it's
floating around somewhere like my parents house. I really need
to find it. I hope the tape is still hasn't deteriorated. Yeah.
My brother and I made a I want to say
my brother and I was really my brother made a
Super eight movie with g I Joe's when I was

(15:33):
like I was probably like seven and he was ten
or and I still remember like it had a little
plot about we had this little shiny red button that
was you know, we it was some like important disc
that he had to take care of and transfer to somebody.
And it was stopped motion, you know, because they were
g I Joe Dolls and uh in real film super

(15:56):
eight camera. Yeah, and it and it looked okay, work
up a little kid, for sure. Yeah. But again I
was like total the little assistant schlipp uh and Scott
was the filmmaker. Yeah. Was like when I was making
my films, like my mom was the camera person. You know.
I had no thought whatsoever of composition or cinematography or
lighting or any of that. It was just like Mom,
like here's here's the scene, you know, and I remember

(16:19):
we even had a scene where uh uh, somebody gets
a like a bag put over them, and then we
were going to cut very quickly and you know, take
the person out of the bag, put some like pillows
in and then throw that bag down the stairs. Cut again,
get the person back in the bag, and have them
crawl out like dazed and and uh. And my mom
deliberately like kept rolling longer on the getting in and

(16:40):
out falling part to make it clear to anybody who
watched that no child was actually harmed in the process
of making this film. And I was like, yeah, it's like, Mom,
the whole point is to make it believable. You know.
That's really sweet. Yeah, that's funny. Yeah, that's so valuable
to a kid though, just even though you're not like
you don't know what you're doing yet, like just getting

(17:01):
that camera in your hands, yeah, and sucking around with it.
Your imagination just like on you know, supercharged at that age. Yeah,
and and then you learn as you go, like composition,
and but that when you're thinking of in camera editing
and for those of you who don't know what that means,
it means you're just shooting it as it is. And

(17:22):
like you're not editing anything after, so you have to
really think about how shot to match up in line up,
in sequence to tell the story if you're thinking about that,
if you're not just thinking from scene to scene in
location location, which is definitely more where we were at.
We were not that slick yet, sure, but it's it's
a good like, uh, what's like Paul Thomas and making

(17:43):
the Dirk Deagler story and he shot that on VHS
or beta or whatever and he had to edit that,
you know, uh, deck to deck and get the cuts
just right. You can find that on youtubeating and he
obviously had way more of a director's mentality, you know,
even at like whatever it was, sixteen seventeen years old. Well,

(18:04):
those are the people that become Paul Thomas. Yeah, you know. Yeah,
it's like seeing you know, an Olympic sprinter and like
even when he was tinned, really good form and its
super fast. Um. So you one thing I did want
to talk about two before we get to the shining
is you are a a um Francophile as well, yes,

(18:27):
and that is to say you love Paris and France
of the people, the language, the food, the city, and
you go and spend quite a bit of time there
each year usually yes, uh, And I know one of
your favorite things to do is go see movies, So
tell me a bit about why you like going to
see movies in France and what that's like and what

(18:47):
that means to you. So that had there's a really interesting,
kind of weird progression there because I picked French just
arbitrarily as my language when you stopped to start taking
these classes and like six or seventh grade, and I
always struggled with it. I didn't like it. It was
like my worst subject. Interesting. I even had to get
like a private tutor, uh to kind of just keep

(19:09):
my head above water. I just really resented it. I
felt like, I'll never use this, I'll never want to
use this. Why are they making me do this? And yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
I know, I know. Well I feel like, yeah, a
lot of education is like that. It's like you wish
you could have the mentality of like an adult, you know,
so you could actually appreciate all that stuff at the time.
But um, yeah, I mean I took took French classes

(19:32):
all throughout like middle school, high school, a few semesters
in college and throughout none of it was I like
a Francophile in the least. And uh, it wasn't until
maybe like studying film a little more seriously in college.
I had done the new wave thing in high school
and then I got really, really really into good Ard.
I'm still really really into good Ard um. But you know,

(19:52):
in college I was watching a lot of his films
and that yeah, yeah, well, and especially at that time,
once you had gotten past like everything that was on
DVD in the US, there was just like he's made
so many films that a lot of them had DVDs,
and other parts of the world, especially France, that didn't
have subtitles. There were you know, just tons of interviews

(20:15):
with him that had never been translated into English. Um.
Some of the other filmmakers that I learned about through
him had maybe never had even a US release. And
so very quickly I kind of realized, like there's this
whole other world of cinema that is kind of removed
from like the Anglo sphere and um. And you know,

(20:37):
rather than like wait around for somebody to translate it
all or or to make subs, I just decided, because
already had this basis of French anyway, I could kind
of like stumble my way through, reading a few interviews
here and there, and it just kind of snowballed from there.
And then the other the other big part of that
was actually going to Paris for the first time in

(21:00):
um I was originally supposed to do. It was gonna
be like it was my first time in Europe, as,
my first time overseas, first time like you know, traveling solo.
It was incredible, and you know, I was supposed to
do like five or six cities in a month, and
you know, I did London first, and I came to Paris.
I had like five days in Paris. It blew my
mind completely, and then I moved on to like Munich

(21:23):
in Germany, and I just was not feeling it anymore,
you know, and I was like, I want to go
back to Paris. So I like, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Well I did later. I love Berlin um, but at
the time Munich, you know, it just was not Paris.
And so so I ended up kind of rearranging my
whole trip and you know, canceled a bunch of reservations
at great expense and just you know double double back

(21:45):
to Paris and I stayed there for another like week
or so before I eventually did move on to Italy,
which was fantastic as well. But you know, my my
takeaway from that whole trip was like I want to
go back to Paris and I remember that trip to
yea changed changed man. Yes, yes, yeah, yeah, no, that's
that's there's that is a very like before and after

(22:07):
kind of inflection point in my life. Yeah, big time,
and so um since then, you know that that city
and French culture in general, it just has such a
historical relationship to cinema, even the idea of the directors,
like the artist that originated with the French that originated
with people like Andre Bazan and the Cayju cinema group,

(22:28):
Tours of French word or true theory. Yeah, author and um,
you know this is kind of a digression, but like
the whole idea of the author, like when they were
deploying it, it almost meant the opposite of what it
means now. They were talking about like a John Ford
or an Alfred Hitchcock or something somebody that was working
within the studio system, that was working within constraints, that

(22:51):
had like a certain staple of actors that they're probably
having to pick from that had, you know, finished one
movie on a Friday, start shooting the next one the
next Monday kind of thing. And the idea was that
even though they're in this very like mechanized factory kind
of assembly line system, the what they call a genius
of the system that produces these great works, even though

(23:14):
there's not necessarily like the most artistic mindset about doing it. Um,
they were, they were still you could tell a john
Ford movie when you looked at it, coun tell an
offered Hitchcock movie. You could tell, you know, there's something
about these filmmakers that left their personal stamp on material
that may not have been at first glance like personal
to them. Yeah, And so because the whole studio system

(23:36):
was set up to combat that exactly exactly, and so
you know this this so tour theory starts to happen.
And then now when you when you think of like
the American cinema in the seventies or something, or you
think of like sixties European cinema, you think of like
Antonioni or something like, he's not working in any studio system.
He's not working, you know, he's making exactly the film
he wants to and doing it in this style that

(23:58):
is entirely his own. And that's what we call a
no tour. Now it's like somebody who kind of gets
their way about everything, um, which is in a weird way. Um.
It's like, uh, there's this critic, Manny Farber. He talks about, um,
white elephant art and termite art, and white elephant art
is this idea of like, um, prestige pictures. It's like

(24:20):
the stuff that comes out every December. It's like, you know,
the Oscar Bay exactly. That's kind of like white elephant art.
It like announces itself as great art and it's you know,
it's trying to be capital G great, whereas with termite
art it could be some some kind of like B
movie genre picture that is just fantastic from start to finish.

(24:41):
And he much preferred the termite art, the stuff that
was not pretentious, that was not just like, you know,
it was not trying to announce itself as you know,
high art. It just did what it did incredibly well
and was like the best thing you've ever seen. So yeah,
it's it's just interesting how our hard notion has changed.
Like today every tis a no tour, right, everybody has

(25:01):
to have like their signature shot or they're kind of
like thematic thing that they keep coming back to UM.
But it's but it's almost yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly exactly
like I said, everybody everybody now does. Yeah. That always
bugs me now that you mentioned that. When UM November
and December roll around and all the studios, they're basically

(25:22):
like the subtext is, we've given you garbage all year,
but now time for vegetables. Here here some really good movies,
whereas in the seventies and eighties they were and I
talked about this, Sure people sick of hearing it, but
you look up the movies of two or three and
they're just fucking across the board like quality film wall.

(25:45):
It's like garbage. But it's like, you know, a movie
that would come out on any given Friday would be like, um,
Paul Newman's uh The Verdict or something. Yeah, And I
always call them adults, like movies for adults, and they
just don't make those anymore unless it's Oscar season grown
ups in her room talking. Yeah, it's really interesting. I

(26:06):
want to see more of that stuff. That's why movies
like Michael Clayton resonates so much with me and sort
of these movies that feel like they're throwback to like
the seventies or something. Yeah. Um, so what about seeing
movies in Paris? Like, what are some of your great experiences? Oh? Man,
I've had so many. I Mean, one thing that's amazing
about Paris is that so many filmmakers live there that

(26:29):
very often they will do what they call avant premier.
It's just like early previous sneak preview basically, and the
filmmakers will often be there in person, and so you
can just go on like a Friday night, Like last
time I was in Paris, I saw on a Karina
who's in you know, all the Goodard movies in the sixties,
and she was there presenting a film that by a

(26:50):
Jacques Gravette La rigu Is The nun Um, which had
been banned by the French government in the sixties and
has just now recently been like restored and released, Um,
you know, forty something years later, fifties something years later,
and um. Yeah. So I mean that that alone is
pretty impressive that they have. They have just such a

(27:11):
culture of loving film. Um. There's there's a street in
Paris rue days a cole like the Street of Schools
um where within like five minutes walking distance you have
like five amazing repertory cinemas. And if you read about
the history of these cinemas, these are like the same
cinemas that all the new wave directors were going to

(27:34):
in the fifties and like kind of getting obsessed with film.
So the cinemas themselves have like a history and a
kind of tradition and um. And then of course the
films they show, they have a great affection for a
certain kind of American cinema. They're they're not showing like
the big blockbusters in these theaters, but they are showing

(27:54):
like I remember going to see like Vanishing Point for instance,
which was you know, I had never seen that I
had heard about it. Like Steven Soderberg I think, talks
about it a lot in reference to like the Lime.
But um, the line is incredible. That's that's another one
that would be great to do. Um. But yeah, they
there's just there's a sense of like you're you're you

(28:17):
feel embedded within like the history of cinema from the
room that you're sitting in where maybe some other great
filmmakers sat and watched the movie and it made some
impression on them, um, to the films that they're showing,
to just the care that they bring to curating these
like retrospectives that will just run for weeks and weeks
where you they play like every movie by a director.

(28:37):
Like when I was there most recently it was Bergman.
They were showing like thirty three Bergman films because that
criterions that just came out, So they have all these
restorations and they're just handgun Yeah, oh god, I know,
like that was that was intense seeing like five Bergman
movies in a week. Yeah, that's that's uh, that's tough,
but um yeah so um. And then of course, you

(29:00):
know you walk out of the theater and you're in
Paris and again it's like that's the cafe where Jean
le Guddard met on a Karina for the first time,
or that's that street corners and Breathless or like whatever.
Like it's just kind of like you are just like
completely immersed and uh. And it's also an amazing cities
for like international cinema, um, not just French cinema or

(29:22):
American cinema, but films from all over the World, come
and play in Paris again with like the utmost kind
of respect and um, the audiences are fantastic. I've never
had a bad experience with somebody on their phone, people talking,
or people eating loudly or um. It's like even even before,
you know, even while the trailers are going on, if

(29:44):
anybody talks, it's in like an absolute whisper, And as
soon as the film begins, it's just like lights out,
Like everybody is just dead silent, you know. So you
have to go to like and Atlanta doesn't even have one,
but in l A if you go to like the
Arc Lives. Yeah, the as are you know, generally very
well respected film lovers, higher ticket price, reserve seating. It's

(30:05):
just like at the Arth, Yeah they do. Yeah yeah,
so it's yeah, and like zero tolerance policy for anything
like that will kick you out. Yeah, man, that's great.
Like even the even the babies and France don't cry
during the movie. Yeah, yeah, I've never never had I God,
I remember going to see The Ring here at the
Landmark and there's a baby in the audience. It's like,

(30:28):
what are you even doing? What? Why are you here
to see the Ring with it like an intent and yeah,
the baby started crying and the whole audience rioted and
kicked them out, just like what are you doing? It's
Friday night? Like here, I know what you're talking about, though,
like leaving the movie in Paris and like you're on
that like the biggest back lot in the world. Like
I think you, like myself, get a lot of get

(30:50):
a lot out of being in the place where something happened.
Like there's an and not to be too hippie dippy,
but the energy of whether it's standing where Elvis stood
in Sun Studio, like these places that I've toured where
some people are like, oh cool, there's Sun Records and

(31:10):
like that's that's small. Yeah yeah, yeah, whereas I and
not just me or you, but a lot of people
really get a lot out of going in there and
just being like, man, this is where that ship happened
about Like I'm standing in in the place where greatness
was achieved. Yeah, and that's just such a cool thing
I think. I mean, the smallness is what's amazing about it,

(31:32):
the way the humble surroundings, the kind of like you realize,
like a normal human being did this, you know, a
very talented brilliant one, but still like immortal, you know
a person. I like that feeling. Yeah, oh absolutely, it's
it's inspiring. It's a reminder that, like, you may put
these people on some kind of pedestal now, but they

(31:52):
were just human beings and you know, they had their
flaws and they were just doing the best they could. Yeah. Well,
that's what was so interesting to me about watching UM
the Kubrick behind the scenes, and for those of you listening,
Kubrick's daughter Vivian uh did a U. I mean it's only,
unfortunately about twenty five minutes long, but some like just

(32:15):
to see Stanley Kubrick on set working and apparently he
didn't like he wanted final cut of this of course,
didn't want himself in it very much, so I'm sure
there's more footage out there, just to see him talking
about lenses and saying check the gate and like all
these normal things. Uh, because he's someone that I sort

(32:36):
of dafy and to see him at work thinking he's
just a director. Yes, there's a great moment on there's
a commentary track for Steven Soderbergh's UM Sex Lives and Videotape.
It's from like one of my favorites. You know, it's
from when the dv first came out, which is probably
like and uh, it's Soderberg and Neil LaBute, who had
no involvement in Sex Lives but was just you know,

(33:00):
for some reason, he was there on the commentary to
talk about it, and they're they're both talking on the
commentary about having recently seen the making of the Shining
because the first Kuber DVDs had just come out like
the year before, and you know, they had never heard
Kubrick's voice, right, so they're like they're like, it's like
hearing the voice of God. You know, It's like it's unbelievable,
like just just you know, watching this legendary figure just

(33:22):
like amble around and like you like you see him
come up with that shot underneath Jack Nicholson was holding
the director's viewfinder and you know he's like looking at Yeah,
let's just do it from down here. You know, just
something that iconic that kind of like burns itself into
your mind, you know, but then you're you're just seeing
somebody kind of casually come up with something like that. Yeah,

(33:42):
And that's one thing that surprised me, and like I
did a bunch of article reading about Kubrick over the
last couple of days. And Um, one of the guys
I'll talk about a few times in this is Uh.
He was an actor in one of his earlier movies
and they bonded um big time and he became Leon Vitali. Yes,
and he became his personal assistant for like the remainder
of twenty years working and he has so much great insight.

(34:06):
But he was like, yeah, he always gets this um
rap as a control freak, and you would think that
he had everything like so meticulously planned and everything story boarded,
and that was the kind of control freak he was,
he said. But he would go in there and then
you see it in this documentary and be like, well,
all right, let's figure this out, let's reblock it, let's

(34:27):
let's get like two or three lenses to have on hand.
And it all sort of built out from that moment.
And then and the shining of course, and very famously,
um the rewrites you know where Jack is even in
that documentary, Uh, that one part where they have Nicholson
and the the woman uh comes up. I don't know

(34:48):
if it's a script supervisor who but hands him the sides,
and she says he's kind of given her a hard time.
He's like, yeah, I had nothing to do between midnight
and two am. And she said, well, this isn't the
fine script, you know, and right he said, it's just
something to consider. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and then he looks
at the camera and he said, I quit using my script.
I just take the ones they type up each day. Yeah,

(35:10):
And that was the very famous story that there were
so many changes. And like you just said, off, Mike,
that Kubrick, you see him in the background while they're
doing this is bangery banging away at the typewriter in
a way pages. Yeah. Yeah, So he would learn his
lines minutes before shooting sometimes, And uh, I mean for
a control freak, that's a very loose way to work. Yeah, well,

(35:30):
I think I think it's it's sort of like you
have to you have to prepare, at least Kubrick the
way Kubrick saw it. By doing this like incredible amount
of work up front, it gives you the solid framework
that you can then be very loose within and still
be very very on on, very very solid footing that

(35:52):
like the film's not going to drift completely in terms
of tone, or in terms of team, it's like you
have to kind of establish like a very strong base
line framework and then within that you can kind of
just like, yeah, go crazy. Well and that's what they say,
actors say the best um or a lot of actors
say that the best thing they do is to prepare

(36:12):
and then forget it all. Yeah, and then that way
you can just go on instinct and all that ship
is just part of your DNA exactly. It's like a
reflex or something. Yeah. Yeah, it's really interesting. Yeah. So
should we talk about the shining or Kubrick in general
or or uh do that do Kubrick second? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah,

(36:36):
let's get into get into the shining all right. Well,
first of all, I saw this, um well, I saw
it on my flight to Australia for the stuff you
should not to her, So I was it was at
whatever three in the morning, however, many thousands of feet
in the air, which was a really creepy way to

(36:58):
see it. In a cool way to see it because
the good headphones and like you're really getting getting everything,
no interruptions, no phones. Um. But I did watch it
again last night, of course, was it which was six
weeks later. Was on the plane. That wasn't your first
time seeing it was no, okay, okay, but like semi recently, Yeah,
because I've watched the plane before too. Yeah, but it

(37:19):
was just cool on the plane in the middle of
the night. Yeah, just a good way to Um. But
last night was really cool too, and I was able
to make make my notes. But, um, I knew nothing
and I still know nothing much, even though I did
read a little bit about the book. Um, you had
read that before the movie. Yeah, it's been a very
very long time since I read that book, and I

(37:41):
do know that. Like this is kind of getting into
deepen quickly. But you know, people people say that the
reason that people are so um willing to read so
much into kubricks films is because he was so detail oriented,
because he was so controlling and precise. Um. So a
lot of people have kind of worked backwards from Stephen

(38:02):
King's novel and then look at everything that Cooper changed
about it. And Diane Johnson is a screenwriter collaborator, Um,
everything that they changed about the novel in making it
into the film. And it's like, well, if he changed that,
it was for a reason. What was he trying to do?
By changing that, What does that tell us about what
he was doing? Absolutely? Absolutely, Yeah, yeah, that's interesting. Yeah.

(38:23):
Well and of course, for those of you don't know,
King has very famously for years poo pooed the movie
in general. Um, and still does I think for he
made that really bad TV version and then I see that. Yeah,
I watched it when it when it came out. Was
it any good? No, it's the guy from Wings uh,

(38:44):
Stephen Webber. Uh, he plays Jack Torrents And um, the
casting was you know, they have like the novel has.
One of the kind of the set pieces of the
novel is that they are these hedge animals that come
to life. Heard of that, and there's no hedge maze
in the novel, So that's a huge addition to the
movie of course. Um, but yeah, that's you know, it's

(39:04):
it's a typical nineties mini series. Like the effects are
not good. Um, the production design obviously cannot even begin
to compete with what Cooper achieved. And and King had
a heavy hand in that, Yeah, he did. He was
It was like, here's my chance to like make it
the way I want to make it, and it's everybody's
like no, thanks, Steven you know, oh, man, i'd feel

(39:24):
bad for him in a way. Yeah, um yeah, I
mean we won't. Uh. I don't think we need to
go down that rabbit hole. But he suffice to say
King has is still sort of down on and and
I think he's in later years at least acknowledged that
it is a classic and that it was unsettling for him,

(39:45):
like an effective in a way. But he clearly was
not too happy, and especially with Shelley Duvall's performance. He thought, Um,
I think he called it the definition of misogyny. Um
because he said her. I think he said her main
her only objective was to be dumb and to like scream.
You know, there has been a lot of writing discussion

(40:07):
in recent years about Shelley duval because I think her
mental health is not great these days from what I understand, Yeah,
very sad and uh. And there has been some discussion
of whether it was that experience on the Shiny It
might have like kind of you know, not caused it,
but but did not do it any favors anyway. Perhaps,
But if she has a genuine mental illness, it's it

(40:29):
didn't it wasn't caused by Stanley Kuber, but she very
famously went through hell and back and he was not
kind to her. You can see that in the documentary. Yeah,
it's pretty disturbing, especially when compared to the bromance he
had with Nicholson Um and it seems like he was
just and you know, we might as well talk about it.

(40:51):
Kubrick Um made a career out of treating actors like
garbage and putting them through hell. And I wanted to
get your take on that, Like, when you do a
take hundred and twenty seven times, is it merely is
it perfectionism or is it he's trying to get an
actor into such a state of fun in the head

(41:16):
that he gets what he wants. Ah, it's hard to say.
You would almost have to see what take one look
like and then look at what Take on seven looked like,
and then but I do know. I will say that
there's something about the acting across all of Kubrick's films
that is very off putting for some people because it's

(41:36):
very it's it's rarely is it very naturalistic. It's not
really what we think of as like good acting in
a certain way. There's there's a very like theatrical kind
of quality to it. There's a very kind of stylization.
There's it's just kind of like this weird aesthetic quality
that he works with that in some ways maybe distances

(41:59):
us emotion only a little bit from what we're watching.
I mean I felt that last night watching The Shining
Like Jack Nicholson's performance, people have pointed out this he
seems kind of over the top, like right from the beginning,
there's there's not much of an arc there. Um. He's
he's sarcastic. He's kind of doing things with his eyebrows,
like he has a smirk a lot of the time.

(42:19):
He's making all these kind of like snarky comments, like
when they're driving up the mountain and they're talking about
it's okay, I saw a television set all that the
Donner Party. Yeah yeah, yeah, Like it's so I mean,
you look at other Jack Nicholson performances from like the seventies,
and he's so good and you can be so like
human and believable that you have to figure that it's that.

(42:41):
It's something Kuber wanted obviously, with the number of takes
he did, with the way he directed the actors. Um,
I mean, you know they're there are other directors who
have done this and continue to do this, like David
Fincher is also pre notorious for doing many many takes.
I think the the opening shot of Social Network, that
that long back and forth like two hand or shot,

(43:02):
I think they did like ninety eight or nine times,
and they were they were, you know, on set, they're
joking about, David, don't you want to do one more
to get the triple digits? He's like, no, ninety nine
was good whatever, and uh, but you know it. Also,
you can go back before Kubrick in cinema, somebody like um,
Robert Bresson, another French filmmaker who I think is incredible. Um,

(43:24):
he would also do you know, shots many many times,
and he wanted the actors to just not act whatsoever,
to be so uh unassuming and unaware and unconscious and
just it was like pure behavior and pure instinct and
like no real emoting, no real projecting, just kind of
like exist in the moment and do the thing in

(43:47):
the most kind of dispassionate way possible. And when you
contrast that with like the kind of emotional character of
what is going on, Um he he thinks that this
leads to a kind of transcendence and that you see
something beautiful that like only cinema can achieve. And so
you know, you can't do it in theater because you're

(44:07):
not close enough in theater to see that kind of
you know, close up performance. So I don't know. I
I think for Kubrick, maybe, you know, maybe he just
knows that ultimately he's going to be stuck in the
editing room, he's going to have to ultimately decide which
take to use. But maybe he wants, Yeah, maybe he

(44:29):
just wants to be able to have that that granularity,
that level of being able to modulate it up or
down just one or two. You know. Yeah, that's a
good way to put it. Um. You know, the the
baseball bat scene is the one that they did a
hundred and twenty seven times, her walking backwards up the
stairs and all that. Yeah, man, and she's so uh

(44:51):
and and Shelley daval is not someone I would ever
have called a great actor, but I was really keyed
in on her last night watching this, and she's fun,
Outstanding's great. I think she's I mean, she's great. You know,
have you ever seen like Robert Altman's Three Women? Yeah,
she's in Nashville. Um, but in this role, it's like

(45:11):
there's there's a couple of Windy's. There's sort of the
dopey I guess it's a sort of a Southern exit
she's doing. Ye um, that's sort of loping around and uh,
sort of annoying. But then like the the scenes where
she's breaking down in the Terror are so good, so

(45:31):
human and relatable, and you wonder, is it like and
I feel for her in real life because I know
that she was literally breaking down, but like he captured that.
And she says, you know, whether or not it was
just retrospective, uh, you know, with the benefit of hindsight
or not. She is on film and interview saying, like

(45:54):
I learned more with him than anyone else. He got
me to do things I never thought I could do.
And I really admire him as a man and as
a filmmaker now, but I hated him at the time. Yeah. Yeah, yeah,
So it's really interesting too. I don't know how to
feel about it, you know. I mean, it's it's like
he's punishing her. It's like that boot camp mentality, you know,
it's like the beating a full male jacket or something.

(46:15):
It's like you know, Um, you're putting me through hell,
and maybe you're crossing the line, maybe you are like
getting over into abusive and being somewhat sadistic and so on,
but like at the end, you turn me into this
other thing, and you know, it's I don't know, it's
hard to say whether that is at at all at
all defensible or if it's just like almost like a

(46:35):
Stockholm syndrome kind of mentality, where like everybody just wants
to find a way to justify it afterwards so that
they can be at peace with it, you know, yeah,
to basically say this year plus of my life was
worth it. And yeah, yeah, yeah, I don't know, I
don't know. I mean, I'm I'm very you know, I
do have probably a higher disposition towards like almost saying

(47:00):
that art exists in this almost kind of a moral
like ends do justify the means a little bit kind
of thing. I mean, what happens on the film set,
on the film set? It used to anyway, Yeah yeah, um,
And of course I don't I'm not justifying wh Yeah, yeah, yeah,
you don't want to justify like creditor, right right right,
you know, But like for instance, when um, when that

(47:21):
footage from the iHeart Huckabees set came out, David Russell like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
there was a part of me that, you know, understood
this looks horrible to anybody that's not from this world,
you know, and it is horrible just on its face.
But at the same time you have to I think
sometimes people don't understand that, like, emotions run high, that's

(47:43):
part of the work of creativity, part of the work
of being an actor. Yeah. Yeah, it's acceptable to scream, exactly.
It's this other thing you're you're in this heightened state
of emotion, and if you're going to really give it
of everything that's within you, you have to be willing
to go to these extreme places, and sometimes that that
can flare up. You know, conflict is gonna flare up.

(48:04):
You're gonna say things that are very hurtful or you know,
behave and and kind of immature in childish ways. But ultimately,
like I think, I think, so long as everybody that
was on set is okay with it afterwards anyway, then
you kind of just have to say it is what
it is. Like, that's that's a little bit you almost
can't judge, you know, it's just it just kind of

(48:26):
it's it's too personal and too kind of like internal
to really look at it from the outside and judge
it in that way. Well, since we're talking about that,
I might as well read this one quote from from Vitality,
his assistant, Uh. He said, when I think of him,
when I think of Stanley, I think of the most
complete picture of humanity and one single person. Because you know,

(48:48):
if you think you can get mad, he got mad,
but by the power of a thousand that we normal
people can get mad. If he was being generous, though,
he could be embarrassingly generous, and you'd say, no, just
stop that, please stop. You know you're being too generous.
Whatever he did, whatever anybody was or is, he was
all of those things to the power of a gazillion, uh,

(49:11):
which is interesting. You know. He says he'd never yelled.
He would get angry, but he wouldn't scream at actors.
He always kept in fincher for better or for worse,
as sort of a legendary screamer. And I have new
people that worked on his movies, and he would fucking
throw cameras and break them, like thousands of dollars worth
of equipment just smash it, and uh, you just think,

(49:33):
what an asshole. But he's David Fincher, yet results to
kind of speak for themselves. Yeah, the story I remember
about Fincher is on Zodiac working with Jake Jillen Hall,
and you know, by that point they're shooting on digital
and uh, you know, they're they're up in the nineties
on the take count, and Jake Jillen Hall, you know,

(49:55):
does take number and Fincher, you know, quietly discreetly turned
around to the camera Oprader and just says to him, Okay,
de lete all those takes and Jake, let's go again.
And you know, made sure Jay could hear it. And
it's like the last nine takes are just gone. There,
they're done. You know, everything you've put out there's a

(50:17):
different and uh and we're gonna start from scratch. So
so now let's let's see what you can give me,
you know. And uh, you know, I don't know. I
I think people I think, at least Jake Joe Hall,
you know, in interviews, has has had that same kind
of you know, I hated his guts, but I'm happy
with the movie. So what can you say? Well, I
mean not a lot of people worked with Kubrick multiple times. Um,

(50:40):
I don't know their choice or his choice, probably a
little bit of both. But you know, he and Peter
Seller's very famously did not speak like maybe ever again.
Yeah after Strange, Yeah that was early on. Yeah, you
know there's there's some people like um from Clockwork Orange.
Why am I blanking on his name? Yeah, Malcolm McDowell. Um,

(51:01):
he was very very friendly with Kubrick after the film,
although they did also I think have a falling out
because I think McDowell wanted to do another film with Kubrick,
and you know, it never happened, and there was some
kind of friction there. Um. There is actually in The Shining,
the guy who plays Lloyd the Bartender, he's in Paths
of Glory and he's also in The Killing. The killing

(51:24):
is so good and then like you know, twenty something
years went by and and suddenly he's back in The
Shining Kubrick, did you know? And then of course, you
know we already talked about Leon vitally, but he was
so kind of taken with Kubrick after Barry Lindon that
he just became the guy's like personal assistant for the
rest of his life. Yeah, they really like uh he
said they had the same work ethic. Yeah, and just

(51:44):
sort of the same mentality about life. Yeah, and so
just bonded. Yeah. So I mean, you know, I think, um,
I don't know, it kind of goes both ways. With
Kubrick Cuber also he would he would collaborate, um like
Wendy Carlos. You know, he worked with on both The
Shining and um gosh, Clockwork Orange. Right. Yeah, so you

(52:06):
know he did have some collaborators that that we're recurring.
But then also yes, it was sort of that thing
of um, we had this very intense nine month experience,
you know, and let's never repeat that. Let's never try
to catch lightning in the ball again, you know. Interesting.
Uh so that very first famous shot of the of

(52:26):
them driving in the Beatle on the going to the
Sun road and uh big, it's in Glacier National Park.
It's just so iconic. Um And the one thing I
noticed last night that it never occurred to me was
the the titles the chirons on the screen, you know,
the interview. Yeah. Yeah, there's not really a rhymer reason, no,
there it's almost humorous, arbitrary. It is the interview, and

(52:49):
then like a month later and then like four pm,
yeah or Tuesday. Yeah, there's no like set pattern to
sort of what's going on. Yeah, and it makes me
kind of wonder why what was going on there? Yeah,
for such a meticulous guy like you know, that's for
a reason. Yeah, I I that they that does baffle me.
Other than that, rhythmically, it's really nice when one of

(53:11):
them pops up because it's like a little bit of
a breather two second yeah, yeah, yeah, because oftentimes it'll
be it'll be tight in like, for instance, the scene
where Danny comes in and he's trying to sneak into
the room while Jack is supposed to be sleeping and
get a toy from his room and Jack's awake, and
they had this very creepy, you know, conversation about I
want you to have a good time. I've never heard of.

(53:32):
That scene is so unsettling. Yeah, and uh, and the
music is swelling and swelling and swelling, and then when
it gets to that punctuation that done, it like cuts
to the black white title on the screen and it
kind of sustains for a second and then comes back in. Yeah.
So on that scene, the next thing that happens, I
think there's a scene in between or something. And then

(53:52):
the next thing that happens in real time from where
they were is Danny has the marks on his neck. Yes,
and his sweater is ripped. Um, which, by the way,
the Apollo sweater. Uh, you'll appreciate this. Lee On Crick,
the director of Coco, and and I think some of
the toy stories he owns that sweater like the real one.

(54:14):
He's a shining nut. I'm not like a movie memorabilia person,
but I would freak out if I saw that. That
would that would get to me. I think Josh actually
has a does I've seen him? Yeah, I've seen him
where it? Yeah? Um, it's a good for you, That's
what I say. But who how did how did what
happened to Danny? What's your take? Yeah, it's never explained.

(54:34):
That's a tough one. Um, it depends on I mean,
this is what's so fascinating about the shining and and
it's something that that the novel touches on as well.
You can almost read it different way. I mean, of course,
you can read it many different ways in terms of
whether this stuff is actually happening or whether it's all
happening just internally in somebody's mind of of somebody who's

(54:55):
losing their mind. There's there's another thing that happens in
the movie where when Grady walks up and stumbles into
him and spills the avocado on on his jacket and
then takes him into the bathroom. Jack pass him on
the back as they're walking in, and you can see
this handprint of the avocado, and then that even continues
into the next scene. So I mean, obviously that could
all still be within Jack's mind, but to me, it

(55:17):
seems like a deliberate thing Kubrick did to make it
very like material like real world. And of course the
biggest example besides Danny's neck is how does Jack get
out of the Yeah, the food the pantry, Yeah, because
he has the how does that door unlock? Yeah, Grady's
on the other side and he has the conversation, and

(55:38):
that's when it has uh for some reason. I mean,
it's a very Kubrickian thing, but it felt like eyes
wide shut to me at times, and that Grady and
Lloyd it was almost like this cabal of ghosts. Yeah,
that we're all like because he says he talks about
the weed. Grady, does we think that you blah blah blah,
and like there's a secret. I'm even getting like chills

(55:58):
right now, this cabal of ghosts that are saying, you know,
we we killed our families. Yeah, perhaps, yeah, Grady, for sure.
Grady owns up to it. Ultimately, he denies that at first,
and then of course he says, you know, his daughter
tried to burn the building down, and you know I
corrected her. So then when you know my wife had
a problem with that, I corrected her. Yeah it's so effective.

(56:22):
But um so Grady's on the other side of the pantry,
and they basically said we we are letting you out, essentially,
and you hear the little uh, the little bolt slide out.
So who like, how'd that happened? Yeah? Yeah, And of
course the picture at the end is the final little piece,
yes ly four by the way, Yeah, of course, yeah,
which plays into we'll get a Native American appres But

(56:45):
um yeah, I mean so I think you could either
look at it as Danny somehow did this to himself.
You know, he's he's having this this vision of this
woman trying to strangle him, but in reality he has
his own hand around his neck or some thing, um,
or there is something supernatural about the hotel. You know

(57:06):
that that's something that Kubrick, you know, in his very
kind of distinctly Kubrick weird sensibility, talks about and interviews
that he thought of The Shining as like an optimistic movie,
because to have ghosts implies that there is a beyond,
there's something more than just the physical immediate world, and
that when you die, there's something more. And so any

(57:27):
ghost story is inherently optimistic because it suggests an afterlife
of some kind, like we're not just warm dirt. Yeah, exactly, exactly,
well there and you probably know this, but there was
um after the first screening, there was a scene that
he cut out where they in the hospital they say
that they didn't find his body. Yeah, um, oldman I
think goes to visit them, which he excised from the film. Yeah,

(57:49):
after it was in theaters. So if you went to
see it like that first week, um, you saw that scene,
and then and then if you saw it like the
next week, I guess Cooper sent out an instruction INSTI
like every theater and every projectionist cut cut this frame
and just let the film end after that. Yeah, I
mean it's what what that scene would have implied was
they didn't find the body, when in fact, that very

(58:11):
famous last shot frozen, um best smash cut of all
time probably yea um, So they clearly would have found
the body. So that implies that he has been absorbed
into the hotel or something back into that picture that photo. Yeah,
there's there's a sort of circularity to it because Grady
does say, you've been You've always been. I've always been

(58:33):
here too, Yeah, So I mean I love the ambiguity. Um.
And I was curious if in in uh Hallerin you know,
scat Man Crothers does say when he's explaining what the
shine is that the the hotel like some he says,
not only people, but some places shine and some don't.
So he implies that there is something supernatural going on.

(58:53):
Absolutely Yeah. But he can he can have conversations with
his grandmother who also had it entirely in their heads.
Uh um. And but you know, for for hallar And
I think he he maybe underestimates a little bit because
he says they're just visions, they're just it's like this
residue of things have happened before. Negative things have happened.
It's like when somebody burns toast and you smell it afterwards,

(59:15):
like it lingers in the air. Yeah, but it's but
it's not. It's not a threat, right, although he does
tell him, you know, stay the hell out of room
two three seven, so he does some understanding that something
is up and there is something dangerous that you may
actually encounter some kind of physical harm maybe, but you know, overall,
it seems like he's kind of like, it's just you're

(59:37):
you're more sensitive to these things. You can perceive them,
you can you can pick up on horrible things that
have happened in the past, but they they're not maybe
as present as um as they end up in reality
being in the film. Now is that in the book?
Is the shine explained further or is it? Do you
remember a good question? It's been so long since I've

(59:58):
read it, I mean as far as like and remember
it's basically the same way in the book that. Yeah,
but I could be wrong with that. It's I've not
read it in many, many years. It's interesting that that's
the title, um, because I mean it's a part of
the film. Yeah, it's not really the it's not about
the shining. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that the shining is just

(01:00:18):
kind of like a supernatural element. But I mean, I
think Stephen King has talked a lot about how ultimately
the book is about like an alcoholic and it's about
you know, and it's it's it's about a family and
an abusive father and um, it's much more you know,
it's like a family drama kind of, whereas in the movie,

(01:00:40):
I think Kuber leans more on the supernatural element and
he underplays the drama just because Jack seems completely out
of his gourd from like frame number one, you know,
so it's less that you're seeing. There's like there's one
moment in the film, I think where you do see
Jack's humanity trying to break through. It's when he has
the nightmare about killing Wendy and Danny and um, and

(01:01:02):
he says it's the most horrible dream he's ever had,
and he says, I must be losing my mind. And
he seems like he's almost on the verge of tears
when he says it, and it does seem like in
that scene he is filling some genuine remorse and revulsion,
and it's like that the two sides of him are fighting,
and part of him realizes that this horrible thing is
growing inside of him, and he realizes it and he

(01:01:24):
feels awful about it, and he doesn't want it to
completely manifest, but because he knows. I mean, in that
very first scene in the interview, Alman basically says like
this happened, and this what he's really saying is this
will happen to you. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It doesn't
present it quite that way. He's saying sort of like
be careful. Yeah. Yeah. As an audience member, you're knowing, like, dude,

(01:01:45):
he's telling you that you run a very real risk
of axing your family. Yeah yeah, and like we'll leave
an ax here too, Yeah yeah yeah, right just in case.
Really interesting scene. Yeah, um, I guess we should talk
about the Impossible Room real quick too. Yes. Um. For
those of you who don't know, the Bullman's office where
they shoot the scene has a window behind the desk

(01:02:06):
where there's sunlight coming in, and nerds over the years
have have charted out charted out the layout of the
Overlook Hotel and are like that is an interior room. Uh,
And it's been dubbed the impossible room. It's yeah, it's
very obvious once you're clued into it, because you're looking
at him. Walk down the interior of the front of
the hotel, past the check in desk and so on,

(01:02:28):
and you can see that there's a hallway that just
goes straight behind Bullman's office and then you know, you
make a little diversion to left and you're in Aleman's
office and there's this window back there, and yeah, I
mean on purpose, Yeah, yeah, it has to be on purpose.
Because again, this is why I think so many theories
have have you know, propagated about this film, um, because

(01:02:51):
something like that would not have gotten past Kubrick, but
would not have you know, there's there's no goofs. You know,
it's all deliberate on some level. At least that's what
people you know, uh tend to think. Well, it was confirmed.
I read one article. It wasn't the set designer, but
it was someone involved in the production, a woman who said,
you know, yes, like Stanley uh wanted a sense of disorientation. Um.

(01:03:16):
And you know, I doubt if that was retroactive. Yeah, yeah, sure. Again,
a filmmaker like Kubrick isn't like, oh ship was there
a continuity mistake there? Yeah? Yeah, yeah. If there was,
then it was there on purpose. We know, the thing
I was noticing last night. And maybe it's just because
of the layout of the hotel, but when you see
that helicopter shot of the front of the hotel and

(01:03:37):
the being of the film, there's no hedge maze there.
I don't know. I don't know if maybe the hedge
maze is in the back of the hotel, but there was, yeah,
And so it's just it's very strange. You know. I
don't think in any of his other films are there
that many kind of quote unquote glaring errors, you know,
uh that that just pop up over and over and

(01:03:59):
over again. I mean, uh, like another weird one is
when Jack is acting down the door, and which, by
the way, yeah they did that that many times. But
it's so strange because you know, he breaks through that
first panel, he sticks his hand in, she slices it
with a knife. Then it cuts two back outside. Uh

(01:04:19):
you know, hallerin beginning to arrive. When it cuts back inside,
there's a whole other second panel that's been acts through,
and and when it cuts in, you know, to the
interior with Shelley Duval that that second panel has gone
as well, so you kind of figure, okay, well did
he just like he just knocked down the second one.
We weren't there to see it. It just has a

(01:04:39):
weird quality to it because something like that, you figure
would be on screen that she's you know, she sliced
his hand, but he's still going to try to break
through until he hears the snow cat outside and then
leaves to go kill Halleran. It's just very strange. There's
there's things like that throughout the film that you know,
again like in retrospect, do seem deliberate, but you know,

(01:05:02):
at first glance might seem like continuity errors or something. Yeah,
the that scene too, you know because his name was
Jack in the movie, uh supposedly like during that one
of the sixty different takes that Shelley Duval was so
fucking freaked out when she's screaming stop Jack stop, like
she was talking to Jack is what is said is

(01:05:26):
that she was losing it. She looks horrified, and that
the where the axe first breaks through the door and
she sees what he's got, Well, they didn't tell her
when it was coming in her eyes are just like, yeah,
just it's the most frightened you've ever seen anybody look
on film. And she is just absolutely horror Yeah. I
mean the screens in that scene are just haunting. Yeah.
Well apparently that's why and got that documentary. When he

(01:05:49):
saw Jack getting ready, he's like shake, he's he's jumping
and he's kind of making these yeah yeah yeah, because
you think about getting up for a scene like that
and like you can't just waltzon and say actually yeah yeah, yeah,
like you have to get physically you gotta be there yet, yes,
and uh. And then the other thing about that shot
is the the great choice and weird choice for the camera.

(01:06:12):
It's like a geared head. Yeah camera to follow that, yeah,
in such an abrupt manner. Yeah, Like I've never seen
anything like that. Yeah, do you know do you know
about this like geared head Trump? So geared head was
like the the old school way of operating a camera
back when cameras were much heavier. You couldn't just necessarily,
you know, turn it with just like little wheels. Yes,
they had these wheels, and so you have one wheel

(01:06:33):
for like the horizontal axis and one wheel for the
vertical axis and what's amazing about these is that they
can kind of stop on a dime, and if you're
really good with them, moves are kind of repeatable and
you can there's just a quality to the movement that
is unlike what you would get with a fluid head
that you're just operating with your hand, because it is
so mechanical and so kind of precise. That's pre uh

(01:06:56):
motion control. Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Today you
would probably just program that movie right, although you couldn't
really program it because it has the track just perfectly
with the acts. Yeah, and motion control is such a
big rig too. Yeah yeah, but it's um it does
just have this horrible kind of you know, uh like
omniscient kind of quality to it, like it's glued to

(01:07:17):
the acts, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's that's something
that comes up a lot. There's a great video on YouTube.
I forget the channel, but they're looking at all of
David Fincher's films and they talk about how the camera
often stays glued to people so that when they sit down,
stand up, move left to right and seen cameras, cameras
just like completely locked onto them, and that this is

(01:07:40):
partly how Fincher achieves this kind of eerie, almost um
god's eye view of everything that's happening in his films.
Yeah yeah, well, I mean since we're on camera that,
um obviously we gotta talk a little bit about steadicam. Brown. Yeah, yeah,
this is one of the first like five or six
movies that used the steadicam and the inventor, Garrett Brown

(01:08:02):
was the operator. I think most of those first films absolutely, yeah,
Like I'm trying to remember the I think Bound for
Glory was like the very maybe the very first one
that uses it, and it's like it has this really
elaborate like where the where the steadicam steps onto a
crane like flies through the air and the operator steps
back down off the crane and keeps following the action,

(01:08:22):
and right these days to call that a drone shot,
right yeah, yeah, yeah, But I think most like for
those first five or six films, maybe the Rocky running
up the steps scene aside, like probably the most effective
use of steadicam was definitely the Shining Oh yeah, and
I think, if I'm not mistaken, they they call it,

(01:08:42):
I know you know this, but low mode is when
they flip it basically, yeah, slow to the ground is
like you know, six inches off the ground, which is
like Danny writing his tricycle around. Yeah. I think it's
the first time they use low mode and they were
just figuring out like how to do all this stuff
so inventive and cool. Well, so I just I was
just watching Garrett Brown video on YouTube the other day
where he's telling the story of like testing out his

(01:09:03):
first really successful like steadicam prototype and he actually he
lived in Philadelphia and he and his girlfriend went out
to shoot some test footage that stuff, and he you know,
he just happen they happened to be at the Art
Museum and so he filmed her running up and down
the steps and like that's the shot from Rocky but
like they were just fooling around. Um. So yeah, there's
there's this real sense of like discovery and just like

(01:09:24):
what can we do with this new tool? And um
but it didn't seem like a gimmick, like no, no,
that's that shot when these on the big wheel or whatever.
And not only I know that the visual always gets
all the all the press, but the sound the hardwood
floor and that is just the best thing ever. Yeah,
especially on headphones. So like striking the contrast between the

(01:09:45):
loud and silent and even the floor has it sounds
like a tempani or something. It sounds like it's kind
of darker, you know. Um, and then when he's on
the carpasis, Yeah, it's so cool. It's it's amazing. Yeah, yeah,
and it's and it's like fifty minutes in before you
like you get the blood wave from the elevator, but
aside from that, it's like fifteen minutes in before you

(01:10:08):
get your first real sort of horror movie shot, which wins. Yeah,
the Twins in the hallway, which is a long time
for a quote unquote horror film. I was thinking about
this last night, like there's so much build up, particularly
if if you know, if you've seen the film a
lot of times, that build up is important, but it

(01:10:28):
also does make the film a bit laborious to like
sit through again because you are kind of waiting for me.
It does film like if it feels like the film
definitely like kicks into high gear once kind of things
start going haywire and everything leading up to it. I mean, yeah,
you just think like if that film were made today
by somebody who's not Kubrick. The notes from the studio

(01:10:51):
like oh my god, like you had to kill something happens.
Yeah yeah, yeah exactly, Like there's no way to get
away with that much build until you know what it
starts to. What it probably would that if that film
were made today, it would probably start with a flashback
of the first gradey murder. Yeah yeah, yeah, and it
would show that in all like a lurid detail, right right,
But it's so much more effective to get because even

(01:11:13):
when it shows the girls murdered, it's just really quick
little blinks, um, and then like that's all you're getting. That.
That image too, is just like you you know, if
you if you like freeze frame on it, like just
like the care that's been taken to, like the art
direction of like where the blood is splattered and how
they're placed within the frame. It's like it has the

(01:11:34):
quality of like a photograph or like an art installation
or something. It's like it's it's it's I mean, it
is messy, but it's not messy the way an actual
murder scene would probably be. It's like it's like all
arranged perfectly for the camera. There's very symmetrical, very nicely composed,
you know, um yeah, it just has this like incredibly

(01:11:55):
uncanny feeling to it, the way the way it's all
laid out. Yeah yeah, and he of course goes full
on like uh, of course Sam Ramy was after but
like Sam Raymie horror with Room two three seven when
when Jack finally goes in there and that whole sequence
where I mean that's kind of the only only part
in the movie where it goes full horror like that.

(01:12:17):
I mean, I mean the last thirty minutes. Of course
what the act is terrifying. Well, there's you know, there's
like the silly kind of stuff where like it's the
it's the ballroom full of skeletons, and uh, some of
that stuff feels a little bit I don't know, like
I feel like that's some of the weaker stuff in
the movie maybe where it's kind of it just feels
like he's he's the kitchen sink kind of portion of

(01:12:38):
the movie where it's like every horror trope, every kind
of like yeah, you know, but he I mean, he
does have the brilliant the dog Man costume. It's just
oh yeah, yeah, yeah, very very unsettling and strange and
disorienting when you see that what is that all about Well,
they talk about it more in the book that you know,
it's these you know, it's two men and um and

(01:12:59):
it's they have sort of like a right yeah, yeah, yeah,
that kind of proto ferries or something like there. It's
a fetish for them. Yeah, and uh, I think there's
a there's a very creepy scene in the novel. I
still remember this where Danny's at the top of a
staircase and the dog man is like at the bottom
of the staircase and he's kind of hurling these threats
at him, but he doesn't come up the stairs. But um,

(01:13:20):
I don't know if that shot was in the version
I saw last night. Really, it goes by so quickly.
It's when Wendy is um, she's running around and um,
I remember it on the plane. Yeah, yeah, I might
have been typing something. Yeah, it goes by really quickly.
It's just like one of the quick cuts when it's
going back and forth between Jack chasing Danny and when

(01:13:41):
he kind of like she sees the bloody elevator. She
sees the guy with his cut down the middle of
his head saying great party, isn't it. She sees the
ballroom full of of the skeletons with the cobwebs. Yeah yeah, yeah,
um yeah it's and that last like thirty minutes is
just like, oh it's it's relentless, relentless. And the pacing

(01:14:02):
and I was I made a note to just about
the pacing of the film in general. It is I guess,
like I hate to call it slow because that sounds
like a knock on it, but it's very deliberate it is.
And how it's paced, Yeah, and I think kind of
perfectly pace and how it plays out the madness and
builds up to that bat ship. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah,

(01:14:22):
you know, yeah, absolutely yeah. I mean it works better
because there is so much bill to it, for sure,
so before we get off of it. The steadicam as well.
I mean, I feel like The Shining has had such
a lasting visual influence on so much cinema that's come
after it. If you think about films that have come
out in recent years, something like The Witch for instance,

(01:14:44):
has a lot of kind of kubrick isms in it,
these slow creep ends. Um, maybe not so much steadicam
on that film, but definitely where you kind of have
these wide angle shots that push in very very slowly. Yeah,
the kind of symmetrical framing. Um, if you think about
a film, did you see The Killing of a Secret Deer? Yeah,

(01:15:06):
that that's that movie is like just you know, full
of Again these kind of Kubrick visual touches, it almost
feels like an homage to Kubrick or something, the way
I think he is one of the more oft homaged Yeah,
absolutely he is. Um. It's interesting too because I feel
like partly Kubrick is a little bit easier to imitate

(01:15:27):
for people because it's it is possible to set up
these symmetrical shots, it is possible to kind of do
these like slow, slow creeping zooms and so on. That's
that's something that is in the wheelhouse of most filmmakers
to achieve. And yet the way that Kubrick deploys it
his control, his you like, his sense of when to

(01:15:48):
use that and when to not use it and so on,
to like build the atmosphere, to build the tension. Well,
it's interesting because he uh the shot where it shows
scat or DICKO. Dick Halleran said ollerin Irish. Yeah, Dick
Halleron is in his I guess house or apartment in Florida.
Oh yeah, the two zoom outs with the it could

(01:16:11):
have been, by all accounts, should have been just a
shot of him in his apartment watching the news. But
it starts, as you know, hard on the television and
pulls back so slowly from the TV to reveal to
reveal his feet and the nude portrait, the portrait over
the TV. Then the reverse of that with the same
the other nude portrait of his bed. H and there

(01:16:33):
was no like when you said when to deploy it, Like,
I wonder why they're I think it's I think it's
because it's it's starting to dawn on him, like he's
just he's he's on vacation, he's on holiday, he's he's
having a good time. He's in his own world, and
it's it's like the beginning of that feeling stirring in
him that yeah, he's getting a sense that something is wrong,

(01:16:54):
something he's having that premonition kind So that's why he
just played it with a creepy sort of thing. So yeah, yeah, yeah,
I think to give it this the sense of dread
and you don't even understand really why it's happening, but
it is making you uneasy in that way yeah, well,
I mean Halleran's uh Holleran's call to action sort of
directly mirrors the ramping up of what's going on in

(01:17:18):
the hotel, like when he first gets that like oh shit,
I gotta go get on a plane. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
because he's getting Danny's messages like that is when the
movie that that's when the story really sorts to kind
of shift into third or fourth gear. Yeah. I feel like, well,
it's like I was thinking about, you know, those zoom
out shots. There's a very similar one that happens with

(01:17:39):
Danny when he's playing with his toys on that orange carpet,
and it starts very close up on Danny and that
ball rolls into shot and camera very slowly zooms back
out again. It's like Kubrick, I mean he he used
that shot on many many of his films when he
would start in like an extreme close up and then
zoom back out so you see the like the entire

(01:18:00):
your world around the character. I feel like that that's
just like his way of underlining something of kind of
cueuing you as a viewer, like hey, pay attention, something's
about to happen. You know, we're we're we're going, we're
shifting into another gear. You need to really pay close
attention because it's about to get you know, crazy. Yeah. Yeah,
his use of lighting to um, we'll get into this

(01:18:22):
eyes wide shut for sure. But he was very famous
for I mean, he obviously used movie camera lights, but
he used the practicals that. Yeah, but he real used
practicals and it creates this like it just creates a
mood like this. The bar scene is the one that
specifically comes to mind when he first meets Lloyd and

(01:18:45):
the bar, all that white light is just blown out,
and it feels and it probably is. It feels like
that's what's really lighting them. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, and
it's it's so strongly backlit on that on that angle
of Lloyd. Um. Yeah, I was watching it on my
TV last night. I have this uh l g oh
lad TV familiar with this where it basically has like yeah, yeah, yeah,

(01:19:08):
and um, I don't want to go down a rabbit
hole about all that, but but basically just it can
it can pump out a lot of light. It's way
brighter than your average like LED display or and um,
and so you get the you get the contrast between
the really bright parts of the frame and the dark
parts of the frame because the individual pixels are are
completely independent of each other, so you can have a

(01:19:30):
full brightness pixel next to a full complete black pixels
without any bleed over. And so yeah, it almost like
hurts to look at those shots like uh, like you
know Lloyd by the bar, or like the red bathroom
with Grady um so beautiful. Yeah, it just it just
kind of it draws you into the film that much

(01:19:52):
more and you become conscious of all these things Cooper
is doing that are not quote unquote traditionally good cinematography, um,
but are of course gorgeous and absolutely you know, stunning.
Yeah yeah that uh by the way, that carpet um.
You know, we're we're renovating our house right now and
I'm finally getting a home office auto myself. Yeah, I'm

(01:20:14):
wallpaper in one of the walls with because this company
in England makes it. It's not those colors, which makes
me really sad, but it's the same pattern kind of honeycomb.
Yeah yeah, yeah, it would might in those colors. It
might be a little too much for a wall. Yeah yeah. Yeah,
you say, you know, like certain colors don't paint your room.
Those colors have a bad effect on you. I like

(01:20:36):
those colors. So it's kind of like that brown and
burnt or yeah yeah, yeah, has a very seventies kind
of quality to it. And the other carpet. And I
know this is kidding, so like in the Weeds, but
that carpet and then the carpet, the green and black
carpet in the is it two three seven? Yeah, it's
very psychedelic, like very tricky. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was
looking at it last night too. I was thinking about this,

(01:20:58):
like when when I watched The Shy. Now, because I've
seen it so many times, it's very difficult for me
to watch it just as a movie. Like I I
really do miss being able to just look at it
and take it into as if it were a movie,
instead of noticing the carpet, instead of noticing like, oh,
there's a lamp in the background. He's letting it blow

(01:21:19):
out or like whatever. You know. Yeah, but you've seen
that so many times, you know, it's kind of that
each time. But it's almost like flipping through like a
photography book or something, or like you know, just just
like looking at like a gallery piece or something like
it has I'm way more keyed into like the cinematography,
the production design, just how how how brilliant and how

(01:21:41):
singular and how like he he just has this knack
for creating these images that just sear themselves into your
brain and they're like instantly recognizable, like like the wallpaper
you're getting, Like there's just it just you know, it
really like gets down to like the core of something
very like primitive almost that that is just like it
leaves an impression you don't even understand why. It's almost

(01:22:02):
subconscious somehow. Yeah, and he can set a mood with
a a picture, uh, and a score and a sound
like no one else, you know. Um. I was trying
to watch it last night because I've seen it so
many times and I've fallen to that same trap as
you do, of trying of thinking, kuber kuber, let me
look at everything, let me look at the composition, composition, composition, lighting, lighting, lighting. Um.

(01:22:25):
I tried to really key in on the acting and
the performances more than I had before, and that's where
Shelley Duval really just sort of floored me. Uh. And
Scattman Cruthers that scene with he and Danny is really
fucking great with that it's really really good, especially from
a kid, because kid actors are notoriously bad and to act. Um, yeah,

(01:22:49):
Danny is supernatural, super natural, supernatural. Um, yeah, it's it's
it's a one of a kind kind of yeah. I mean,
just a perfect, perfect kid. That part, there's a there's
one bit I'll read you here about Scatman Cruthers. Um.
And this is from Leon Vitali again. He said, you
take someone like scat Man Cruthers in the shining, that

(01:23:11):
scene in the kitchen with Danny, the whole monologue that
he does. He sort of fluffed his lines because Stanley
wanted him to do it in just one take. He
was sixty eight years old at this time, so you know,
it wasn't surprising that it became difficult for him. We
got quite high up in the takes, I would say,
so the assistant directors were saying we should send him
home because he's starting to feel terrible, and Stanley said, no,

(01:23:35):
this is so brilliant. He said no, he'll feel even
more terrible if he goes home and understands that we
started something and he wasn't able to finish it. And
I was like, man, that is like he saw beyond
like this old man is like literally sort of physically
fault failing, but he would feel even worse if you
home knowing he didn't get it. That's a real empathy there,

(01:23:55):
that's a real understanding of human psychology and totally man,
so he says, So we kept him there, and we
did dozens and dozens more takes. I think when you
look at the finished movies, Scatman had these little inflections
and moments where you think he's Lawrence Olivier and it
was so natural and beautifully done in time. But some
actors with Stanley could never get past that. Um it

(01:24:17):
was you had to really like bring your a game,
you know, just like as an actor, but endurance wise. Yeah,
you know what's so funny to you just the idea
of like starting something about finishing it, because that's also
what Jack is so worried about. Like, yeah, you know
when he's making that big speech to Wendy and he's
talking about I signed a contract agreement between me and

(01:24:39):
my employer. Yeah, I have responsibilities. And yeah, that was
Have you ever had in a responsibility in your whole life? Yeah?
My one kind of knock on the movie that I
noticed last night that. I guess it always sort of
bothered me that I never quite knew what it was is.
I don't believe that they were married or ever in love.

(01:24:59):
They don't to have like a relationship. They don't seem
to have any connection. Yeah, and maybe that's the point.
Is there there past that? But like, yeah, they're just
they're just staying together for the kid kind of Yeah,
and Jack is there is no arc, you know, he's
from the beginning. Yeah, Yeah, which I love. I've talked
about Jack before with the China's Own one, but he's

(01:25:21):
one of those rare actors that can disappear in a
role but also still be Jack. Yes, Like there's that
Jack absolutely, absolutely just a bit of a magic trick.
I think there is that one moment. I think the
only glimpse you get of them having any kind of
relationship is when he calls her from the hotel after
he's gotten the job, and he's saying he's going to
be home later, and there's like a casual way where

(01:25:42):
he's like, hey, babe, you know where you know, it's
a little term of endearment. Stands out. Yeah, it does
stand out because it's like the only time there's any
like evidence of affection whatsoever between them, and maybe maybe
when uh well but no, I was gonna say when
he's introducing her to Haller and he calls her Winifred, right,
which is just that's a weird thing anyway, Like I

(01:26:03):
don't know why that was in the movie, or like
why that is Windy short for Winnifred. Yeah, yeah, maybe,
I guess, I don't know. I've never heard that, Like
the Shiny is the only place I've ever heard of
Winnifred before. Um, but it's just you know, but it's
a pet name. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it is a pet name.
So it does suggest in some way the same way
they call Danny dock or something. Right. And uh gotta
love that scene too, when Scatman Cruthers is like, well

(01:26:25):
maybe I just heard you call Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's
such a beloved character in this movie. Yeah, it's so
painful like that that makes it so painful when he well,
it's so I mean, there's something very darkly humorous about
showing him step by step for this lengthy journey that
he goes to on the airplane, rending the snow cat,
going up the mountain, going past the car crash, you know,

(01:26:47):
and then and then walking slowly throughout the hotel, Hello,
isn't about here? And then yeah, and all just to
get axed like immediately, Yeah, just unceremoniously taken out by Jack. Yeah. Um.
Another scene that really jumped out at me last night. Uh,
that I always love, but I didn't know why is
the gold room scene when it's in full swing? Yes, um,

(01:27:08):
and great production design well you know, yeah, and like
I always appreciate it for just the visual of like
pulling off all those extras and and it looks so
great and yeah, but I think it hit me last
night that, like the audience, like it was almost a
relief to see more people. Yeah. Yeah, you're starting to
lose it a little bit. And that's part of the
effect of the film that intended, I think, is that

(01:27:30):
you're in this place with them. You see the seductive
quality this has on Jack. It would be very very
easy to kind of give in to this kind and
not question it and not be freaked out by it,
but just be, like like you said, relieved, like you
want to see someone else in that goddam hotel. Yeah yeah, yeah,
and then you see it and it's in all its
full glory and all these people like dancing and you know,

(01:27:52):
whining and dining, and it's kind of think, you know,
I'm just glad to see someone else on the screen.
It's like a little bit of breathing because do offered
any comfort there? No, um like, those are characters that
exists only in Stanley Kubrick Field. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah,
they're very Kubrickian constructs. Yeah yeah, Kubrickian constructs. Yeah, it's

(01:28:12):
a good band name. Um did you see the did
you see the Room two three seven? That? Of course? Yeah?
What was your take on that? Making fun of those people?
That's kind of the point of the movie. Did seem
like that, Yeah, it did seem like kind of um
like the director was mocking for the most part, these people.

(01:28:34):
It's been a while since I've seen it. I saw
it whenever when it was first released, so it's not
super fresh in my mind. Yeah, I didn't see it again, Um,
but I do remember. I mean, obviously some of that
stuff is kind of silly. I think, like the moon landing,
Kubrick is guilty for having faked it. That's why Danny's
wearing the Apollo eleven shirt. And yeah, you know, the

(01:28:54):
Overlook is like a metaphor for Kubrick's agreement with the
US government. That that's bogus to me. Um, the whole
like minotaur theory, where like the one of the main
supports is that the ski poster kind of looks like
a minotaur. Yeah. I don't don't really b into that,
but I will say, and I was familiar with this
with this reading of the film before that documentary came out.

(01:29:17):
But the Native American genocide angle. Yeah, so let's give
everyone a quick summation of what this is all about. Yeah.
So there's this article from I want to say the eighties. Uh, well,
obviously from the eighties, because that's the film came out
UM called The Family of Man where he talks about

(01:29:38):
the Overlook Hotel as standing in in a way for
the United States. And if you start to look for red, white,
and blue, those three colors in the film, it's all
over the beginning of the movie. Once you know to
look for it, you'll notice it's how Wendy is dressed.
Is how Danny is dressed. Um, when he's in the
meeting at the office, there's a little American flag and

(01:30:00):
like a coffee cup on the table. Um, there's you know,
there's there's just this kind of like Americana color, like
quite quite um prominent, and in the beginning of the film, Um,
there's also numerous references that Oleman makes about having to
repel Indian attacks and it's built on an Indian burial ground. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

(01:30:23):
he talks about it when when they're giving the tour. Um.
And so there's also this this famous kind of um
interpretation of the shot where it's Hallerin and he's giving
the tour of the pantry and behind Hollerin, you know,
very prominent and shot is this calumet like baking big

(01:30:44):
powder can uh with like a Native American kind of profile, uh,
with a traditional headdress and stuff. And it's in profile
and it's kind of an exact profile with Hallerin himself.
And so if you buy into this theory that the
Overlook Hotel is United States in some way and that,
you know, when Halleran says things like a lot of

(01:31:06):
good things happened here, but a lot of bad things
happened too, When when Olman says it's it's still hard
to believe it happened here, but it did. You know, um,
I think there's there's a real sense that, like you know,
the film at a deeper level is talking about things
happen in history, and they are in the past, but
they are also somehow still present with us today, and

(01:31:30):
that events have kind of like burnt toast, it has
like it lingers for a long time when these terrible
things happen, when atrocities are committed, not just in the
more literal sense in the lives of the people directly
affected and the survivors and so on, but it just
it's history has echoes and it continues into the present

(01:31:50):
and it continues to so shining in a way, the
shining is a way of it's like a metaphor for history.
It's like a metaphor for looking into the past and
understanding that which you know, where you're standing now, how
how it got to be that way. There's there's a
lot of blood there and that if you were able

(01:32:11):
to experience it more directly or see it more directly,
like you know, the Twins or something, it would be
this incredibly upsetting thing. Um So I was talking about
the the calimet can in Hallerin you know, the the
suggestion has been that Hallerin is in profile the calimet
can with the Indians in profile. Uh, that is sort
of drawing parallels again between the African and American experience

(01:32:34):
in the United States. Um. Yeah. And you know, of course,
the one of the pieces of music that kubric uses
in the film that's that's very distinct is this Christoph
Ponderreski piece called Trinity for the Victims of Hiroshima. So
I mean you have again it's something horrible that happened.

(01:32:54):
And um, you know, uh, Kubrick later on wanted to
make a film about the hall cost Um. He was
somebody that was, you know, deeply interested in that for
a very long time. In sort of Kubrick, you know,
like you could also say like a clockwork orange, he's
asking these questions about what is human nature? What does

(01:33:16):
it mean to be good? What does it mean to
have free will? Um, He's asking these very very deep,
fundamental questions about like is mankind on the balance of
force for good or a force for bad in the world.
And I think these I think these kind of themes
resonate um within you know, the shining So do you

(01:33:36):
think I mean this is one of those things. It's
like every piece of art ever, like is it author
intended or is it just one of these things where
I think you can read into and make it your
own metaphor. But like, do you think Kubrick was doing that?
Do you think it's a metaphor for the Native American? Yeah,
I mean Native Americans in in particular and then just

(01:33:59):
America in general. And then I think you can also
say because for instance, it is very, um, very prominent
that Grady seems to be like British, you know, and uh,
and there's this scene that that with every passing year
is is all the more noticeable and kind of stands out,
and it's very very um, I don't know, just um,

(01:34:24):
it's bothersome. It's it's upsetting when they're in that red bathroom. Yeah. Yeah.
And also when Jack is talking about Windy and he
refers to her as the old sperm bank upstairs. Um,
Like I said, I mean, I'm sure those those lines
didn't land particularly well in nineteen eighty, but in two

(01:34:45):
and eighteen, it's like holy shit, Like you know, I
don't think Kubrick included those in in a casual way whatsoever. Yeah,
I think it's something very very deliberate he's doing there,
and you know, Grady being from England and is a
way of sort of tying the atrocities that happened here
in the United States with you know, the history of

(01:35:07):
Europe and colonialism in the British Empire and all of
that too. So so he's I think he really is
tapping into something that runs deep in in the history
of mankind um and that you know, I just don't
think Kubrick would casually decide to make like a horror
film and just leave it at face value like that,

(01:35:28):
you know, and like I was saying about, you know,
his his thoughts on ghost stories being inherently like optimistic
in a way, He's somebody that thought very very deeply
about what he was doing, and he's somebody that love
to have layer upon layer upon layer of subtext in
all his films. So I think. So, you know that

(01:35:48):
scene in the in the red bathroom, uh, like I
said once, you're looking for red, white, and blue in
the production design, especially in the beginning of the film,
and then also all the Native American kind of symbology
throughout the hotel. You know, even even at the level
of like when we see Jack throwing the ball against
the wall. He's he's throwing it against this this Native
American like you know, art piece that's hanging on the wall. Um. Yeah,

(01:36:12):
I think there's I think there's very much something to it.
And also I want to say, uh, the ending of
the film and the in the in the Hedge maze,
when Danny retraces his footsteps backwards, that I believe I've
read is something that you know, Native Americans would do.
It's it's like an old kind of trick. And if
you think also of uh, the idea of like history,

(01:36:34):
when Jack is running after Danny and he's saying, you know, Danny,
I'm right behind you. You can't get away from me.
It's like history is is pursuing us and we can't
escape it. But the way Danny does ultimately escape it
is to retrace his footsteps. That is to say, to
kind of acknowledge the history and to actually reverse that trend,
to double back on itself, to not just continue unawares,

(01:36:58):
you know, into the present. He's able to kind of
recuse that will only lead to your own dis Yeah,
so he's able to actually kind of break that that
circular kind of eternal recurrence kind of thing and to
chart like a new pathway out of that maze, you know.
And again, the hedge maze is something that Kubrick introduced
into the film that was not in the novel. So

(01:37:19):
and it's it's not a hedgemates by accident, and not
just because like, oh this will be cool because they
can get lost in and like there was a deeper
meaning there, I think, And there's this is you know,
maybe this is reading like way too much into things,
but I noticed this for the first time last night.
When Jack is at the interview in the beanning of
the film, he's wearing a green tie, and maybe just
because of the better resolution on the blu ray and
so on, and seeing it on like a larger size screen.

(01:37:42):
If you look at that tie, it's not like a
solid green tie. It's a tie with like all these
ridges and divots and stuff, and it looks very much
like the hedge maze. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It has this
kind of like winding pattern to it, which I, again
I do not think because it's Kubrick, I don't think
that's by accident. Man, So dude, do we do it? Casey? Wow?

(01:38:04):
I guess So, I guess we did it. Yeah, there's
there's still like a million things to talk about. But
I know, unfortunately we'll we'll have other kuber Key episodes.
I guess kuber Key. Yeah. I got a couple of
more things on Kubrick here. So I looked up some

(01:38:25):
of the um things that people had to say about
him that that worked with him. Just this is from
Jack Jack Nicholson. He said, the guy was meticulous. I mean,
he just had an impeccable eye for detail. I remember
one time we were walking back to the set after
lunch and he saw a slug laying on the ground.
Suddenly Stanley picks this thing up and shakes his head

(01:38:45):
and said, this should be in Boston, he says, And
he gets some intern to take this slug to Boston
and put it on a patch of grass on the common.
He thought it looked better there, And he was right,
the slug looked better in Boston. Wow, Like, is that true?
That sounds like something jets pretty Yeah that I don't know.
I'm I'm really fifty on that one. Vincent Dinafrio during

(01:39:07):
Full Metal Jacket, he said when they were doing I
think he says that scene. So the only thing I
can think of is maybe the confrontation with but he
said that he came back to him between each take
and was telling him that the president was shot, and
that he came back up to the second take and
he was like he he actually was shot two or

(01:39:28):
three times, and he the story just got worse and worse,
and he said, my acting got better and better, and
he was just totally fucking with him. Yeah, I was
trying to I was trying to remember when did h
Hinckley shoot Reagan? Like what was that? When he was
under the president would have been well, yeah, full mel
Jacko would have been the eighties and Reagan and Reagan
did have an assassination attempt, but I don't remember what

(01:39:50):
year that happened. If that wastazing these two things coincided
because they also are lie. Armie even has that line
about uh marines in famous assassination attempts. Yeah, when he's
lauding the shooting gun. Yeah yeah, yeah yeah, well yeah
um Oswald yeah yeah yeah uh. And then finally Batally

(01:40:13):
again his old pal talking about um the sound. He
said Stanley only used stereo sound on two films, two
thousand one and Eyes Wide Shut. The others were all
in mono, and when asked why a noted innovator resisted
mixing in stereo, he explained, we used to send people
to all the key cities to check the projection, and

(01:40:34):
what they found was nearly all the sound systems hadn't
been looked at for years or even decades. Often one
or more channels weren't working. So Stanley decided it was
better to record it in mono and mix it meticulously
there so the sound, even in theaters where the speakers
weren't working right, would sound correct. Yeah, fucking a man,
Koprick was yeah. And and on the same kind of

(01:40:55):
uh level he would send out. He had like an
army of people that would go out to different theaters
that we're playing as films, and they would go to
see other movies in the in the same theater and
just measure like the brightness of the bulb and the
projecture in the screen and make sure like it was
always nuts about the bulb quality. Well, it's like, um,
because it's often wrong. Yeah, yea yeah. And like Scorsese

(01:41:17):
and like last Waltz, he has that card up at
the front and says, this film is made to be
played loud. Yes, um, but yeah, Kubrick would um, he
was very very There were often instructions sent along with
the films to projectionists, you know, please do it exactly
this way, and if we find you, you know, projecting
the film poorly when you pull it from your cinema

(01:41:38):
and all that. Well, I mean, I've made short films
back in the day, and we used to have little
guerilla screenings all around Atlanta and warehouses and stuff, and
there's nothing and you've done this. I'm sure there's nothing
more frustrating than bad sound or bad picture when you
put all this work into something and you only have
this one chance to show you a little four minute
film and someone fux it up, and it's just my

(01:42:00):
heart starts beating, I starts sweating. Terrible. It's the worst
when you're when you're in that screening situation and you
realize something's wrong and you're powerless to fix it because
like the train has left the station, you know, and
I yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, this this, this leads me
to a quick digression, just that Kubrick's last three films,
those being The Shining Full Metal Jack and Eye White

(01:42:21):
Shut he famously well famously to Kuber nerds. UH shot
with you know, he shot with wide screen theatrical projection
in mind, but he protected for full frame video presentation.
So if you bought you know, The Shining on DVD
or VHS back in the day before wide screen TVs

(01:42:41):
were a popular thing, UH, you would see the full
frame expose negative for the Shining, which is to say,
if you look at the wide screen version of The Shining,
there's more information on the top and the bottom that
you would see on the initial VHS or DVD release
of the film. Then by the time they got around
to kind of like doing the more recent HD remasters,

(01:43:02):
they switched back over to sixteen by nine because by
now most TVs look at are going to have that
that widescreen presentation. But for me growing up, I saw
The Shining mostly on VHS for a long time and
then the first DVD that came out, so I'm really
used to seeing the film in full frame. And there's
there's a little bit of a of a recurrence these

(01:43:24):
days of full frame in certain filmmakers, like somebody like
Gus van stant for instance, was using full frame for
his trilogy on Death, Jerry Elephant in Last Days Elephant
and particularly has a lot of visual similarities to the
Shining even has kind of like a hollerin like character
this kid, I think his name is like Benny or

(01:43:46):
something who it's sort of the holler, and he wanders
back into the school during the shooting, and the camera
tracks behind him for a long time, and then as
soon as he encounters one of the kids, they shoot
him debt like immediately. Um. But there's something very interesting
about seeing these full frame images of these Kubrick films,

(01:44:06):
where again by protecting, he's making sure there's no boom
in the shot, there's no track visible on the floor,
things that filmmakers might leave in because they know there's
going to be a crop later on. Um. There's something
really really compelling about that, And in a way, I
wish those versions of the films were still a little
bit more widely available to watch, because there's something about

(01:44:30):
leaving that extra space around the character and the frame
that makes the character a little bit more part of
their environment and a little bit less shot tightly just
on them that it adds to the sense of unease,
It adds to the sense of them being kind of
trapped within these symmetrical compositions. Kubrick over and over does

(01:44:53):
these things where the shot has like a very clear
vanishing point in dead center of the frame, and uh
and and and again. The symmetry, it's all kind of
there's there's a feeling of like inevitability and like you're
being trapped and that these characters are just kind of
playing out the hand they've been dealt, but they're not
necessarily free to change things. And uh yeah, and in

(01:45:15):
the full frame presentation of those films, you know, for
for anybody that's really interested in Kubrick, I would I
would seek those out, get the old DVD copy and
check it out. It obviously he did intend it to
be seen theatrically in the wide screen, and that is
probably the historical definitive version of the film, but the
full frame versions are very very interesting. Yeah, dude, this

(01:45:37):
is everything I thought it would be. Casey, I'm glad.
This is great. All right, we'll finish up. I didn't
pull an Eber quote, but he did give the movie
four stars, but his review was nothing really jumped out. Yeah,
I was. I saw one that he had written in
like two thousand six or something. It was like a retrospective,
like maybe it was part of his Great Movie Series
or something. Yeah, I don't think he reviewed it at
the time. That's strange. How would he not review in

(01:45:59):
new Kubrick's yea um. But we'll finish with five questions
in this edition because I want to give you full
full shrift. Sure? Sure? Can you say full shrift only
opposite a short? Yeah? What's the first movie you remember
seeing the theater? Casey? So I have a good story
about this. So the first movie I can really remember

(01:46:21):
seeing was Licensed to Kill. James Bond film came out.
I would have been five, just about to turn six,
and my parents took me to see it in the theater,
probably like a Friday night, and I think I had
seen some other James Bond films and they assumed this
would be on a similar level violence wise, content wise.

(01:46:43):
And there's a scene where a guy gets fed to
a shark that I haven't rewatched it. I don't know
if it's particularly bloody or gory or upsetting. But for
whatever reason, when we were sitting there in the theater,
they thought it was a little bit too much for me,
and so my dad stayed to watch the rest of
License to Kill my and I walked out of the theater,
walked across the aisle, and walked into something called Weekend

(01:47:04):
at Bernie's, which was obviously a wonderful thing to see
at that age, and I greatly enjoyed that movie. Um
so your first movie was both Yeah? Yeah, yeah, it
was like the first fifteen minutes of License to Kill
transitioning into Weekend at Bernie's. Yeah, License to Kill Bernie. Yeah.
Uh do you remember the first R rated movie you saw?

(01:47:25):
What that was? Well? You know, I had, like I said,
I had that friend who had access to like all
the eighties R rated stuff. I remember the first one
I saw in a theater that my parents again took
me and my friend Ben to see was Get Shorty
And uh, yeah, that was wonderful and I think I
think to this day it might hold the record for
the most dense amount of F words, Like you know,

(01:47:47):
it's right up there with like Casino and and and
some of the other heavy hitters, Big Lebowski too. Probably, Yeah,
that's awesome. Uh will you walk out of a bad movie? No?
I Uh, that didn't surprise me. I know if I'm
if I'm there to see something, I will just commit
to it. And I rarely find myself, uh, in in
a position of watching something I really do not like.

(01:48:09):
It rarely happens because I just have a very good
sense at this point of what I'm going to be into,
what I'm not gonna be into. So it's only in
kind of like social situations where I'm with like a
bunch of other people. Yeah. Yeah, and I end up
seeing something that I'm not into, And though that can
be unpleasant, but I'm I'm not the type of walk
out now, all right, I taylored this one to the guest. Uh,

(01:48:31):
and I have something here, but I'm gonna change it
on the fly. Uh. He's your favorite filmmaker. Oh jeez,
I think everybody he's sweating. He just broke out in
a gold sweat. Yeah, I think. I think probably at
Jean Ecodard at this point, I think I've spent the
most time watching his films, reading his interviews, reading people

(01:48:53):
writing about him. He's He's introduced me to so many
philosophers and writers and other filmmakers thinkers. I mean, his
filmography and his his whole project is so deep and
so just there's so much there that it it's like
a lifetime project to go through his films. There's just
so much there. He's more than a filmmaker, absolutely, he's

(01:49:15):
he's just like a complete artist. He's a visual artist,
he's a he's a thinker. He has a tremendous uh
influence in some ways on the use of sound and films.
There was there was even one of his films from
the nineties called Nouvelle vague um was released by this
German label e c m uh. It's it's it's the soundtrack,
not not as in, here's all the music from the movie.

(01:49:37):
It's the audio track from the movie released as a
as a as a double CD album, and it it
actually holds up in that environment because his use of
sound and music, the way he cuts things in and out,
and the way the whole film anyway is made up
of largely like quotations from different books and so on. Um,
it just it just works as like an audio tap

(01:50:00):
street without the picture track. So him, for me, like
his movies are in a way they're hard to love
the way you would love like I don't know, like
a John Hughes movie or something. You know, there's that
kind of like it reaches into like your emotions more.
He's much more the intellectual side, but just there. There's

(01:50:20):
nobody that has influenced, you know, my way of thinking
and interfacing with movies than him, So it's I think
it's got to be him, dude, that's great. And then finally,
movie going one on one, how do you do it?
At the theaters? I usually go maybe four or five
rows back dead center. I like to be close. I
like to see if the off the focus puller like

(01:50:42):
messed up or you know, I like to really see, um,
you know, I like to see a warts and all
kinds of and I like for my uh, you know,
my my vision to be largely filled up by the film,
to not have too much in the peripheral that's not
the movie. So sometimes I'll go, uh, like Paul also
works here, we got to see a movie. He prefers

(01:51:03):
to sit much further back in the theater, so if
he's the one picking seats, I will sit where he sits.
You guys, don't split up, no, no, no, no no, but
um yeah, I large, you know, I much prefer to
kind of be immersed in the movie in that way.
But the key for me is dead center. I hate
sitting off access. I want to I want to be
kind of like in the center of the frame, in

(01:51:24):
the center of the film, so that things are landing
kind of where I think the film Marror wanted them
to land. Yeah. Yeah, sure. And as far as you know,
snacks and that kind of thing, I'll get like a
cup of water, if I get a snack from the
from the concession stand, I will finish it during the previews,
during the trailers, and then once the movie starts, it's like,
no fidgeting, it's go time. Just like lock into your

(01:51:47):
seat and you know, no no bathroom trips, nothing, you know. Awesome, Yeah,
that's how you do it people. Yeah, all right, man,
this is great. I really I love doing this. It's great.
I can't wait Kubrick Part two. Look for Barry Lyndon
coming in about a month, and then we'll finish with
eyes Wide shut. But I have a feeling people are
gonna be like, more Casey, let's keep it going. Yeah,

(01:52:07):
and well I need to dive into some good darts,
so maybe we'll just sort of tackle some of the
all time classics. Awesome, thanks brother Chuck. All right, everybody,
I hope you enjoyed that. If you're a fan of

(01:52:27):
The Shining or Stanley Kubrick. I can't imagine that you
would have wanted anything more than that great, great conversation
that we just had. It was a lot of fun
digging in with Casey. UM. We have a good rapport
and it's always fun talking to him. He's he's one
of my favorite people here at work and UH and
I just have a lot of respect for his UM,
his love of film, his philosophy on film, UH and

(01:52:52):
life and UM kind of what it means to him
really dig it. He takes it seriously. But also that's
fun at the movie movies. UM. He's he's proof that
you can be both uh sort of academic about it
as well as just being a good movie fan at
the end of the day. So I think all of
that came through here. We had a really great conversation

(01:53:13):
about The Shining. Uh. It was a true pleasure. So
big thanks to Casey. Can't wait to get him in
here next to talk about Barry Lyndon movie I have
yet to see. Uh. And as we continue our our
Kubrick trilogy and UH and again, as you heard there
at the end, we might just keep this up. Everyone
Casey's such a great cinephile and a great lover film,
we might just dive into some of the great all

(01:53:34):
time classical tours and maybe uh and dive into their
works as well. They'd be fun to get him in
here on on Good Dard and Cura Sawa. Maybe because
a lot of these films I haven't seen, so Casey
sort of introducing me to all these films that have
been on my long list that that I'm starting to
tick off in the old watched column. So I hope
you enjoyed it as much as I did, and until

(01:53:56):
next week, don't grab that axe. Movie. Crush is produced, engineered, edited,
and soundtracked by Noel Brown and Ramsay Hunt at How

(01:54:19):
Stuff Work Studios, Pont City Market, Atlanta, Georgia,

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

Movie Crush News

Follow Us On

Host

Chuck Bryant

Show Links

Popular Podcasts

Dateline NBC

Stuff You Should Know

The Nikki Glaser Podcast

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Kubrick Special Part I: The Shining