December 29, 2023 • 41 mins
Once humans nailed down the spicy art of carbonation, they went absolutely bonkers with flavors and gimmicks. While Coca-Cola and Pepsi may be the world's most famous sodas, hundreds of other drinks came and went -- some with a bang of success, and others falling as flat as a day-old Josta. In part two of this series, Ben, Noel and Max continue their exploration of soda pop history along with shoutouts to some of their favorite discontinued sodas.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Ridiculous Histories, a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to the
(00:27):
show Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so much for
tuning in, Papa Top, grab a sip. Shout out to
our super producer, Uh mister Max the surge, Williams.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Indeed, Max, the way you do A good one later
the now, I can't remember. Let's let it happen organically.
It was so good you'd been I had a couple
of good ones. Thanks man. Yeah, this is so Noel.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
This is part two of our exploration soda and I
think we both knew going into it we'd have some nostalgia,
But this is like, this is the fun part, right,
or almost the fun part. Are we going to do
health concerns?
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Do we have to? Who knows results? To be fair,
it might have been on the tail end of the
previous episode, but you'll definitely hear some callbacks to all
of the things that we've talked about here. So let's
jump right into part two of the Ridiculous History of
Soda pop.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
As early as the nineteen forties, people were starting to
get concerned. The AMA American Medical Association released a public
statement in forty two, and they said look, guys, we
get it. We're the cool doctors. We like soda too,
But let's pump the brakes a little bit. You know,
you've got to watch out for all the sugar getting
(01:38):
added to various foods and beverages, and you gotta be
careful of soft drinks because they're giving you more sugar
than you might assume.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Well, and much like you know, the cigarette industry, it
takes a long time for these types of health concerns
to really take hold, you know, bla blah uh, hey
there you go. But like now, I think we are
living in a you know, an age where seltzer and
diet sodas are maybe more popular than full sugar soda.
But that doesn't mean that the full sugar sodas are
(02:10):
off the shelves. And I'm just conjecturing here. I haven't
seen any numbers, but I would bet my bottom dollar
that that fully sugared sodas are not selling quite as well.
And that's just indicated by how much these soda companies
have had to diversify, you know, and lean really heavily
into Like for example, I think Coke bought Topuchico, which
(02:31):
was a you know, a it's a wonderful highly carbonated
mineral water, you know, out of out of Mexico. And
they did it quietly without letting anybody know. And now
you'll see Topuchico at your regular grocery store or convenience spot. Yeah.
You if you live in Atlanta, you might know the
guy who.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Distributes all of it. It's Luis, Yeah, with Louise.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Well, they do such a I mean not not not
to get off top of too much, but like brilliant
marketing stuff that Topo Chico is doing. They have a
lot of these like you know, you know, kind of
art markets and thrift type places where Topo Chico has,
free of charge installed a branded Topo Chico refrigerator in
these places and just you can just take one for free. Yeah,
(03:15):
and it certainly makes you feel a sense of good
will towards the brand, and you're much more likely to
pay for one when you see them. And they are
a little pricier, but there it's a great quality product,
highly carbonated. I think it's the best mineral water out there.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
If you catch and if you catch our Pao Luise
on a good day, he'll just give you some exactly.
The guy rolls strapped with Topo Chico. It's amazing buttped
and Topo Chico. By the way, carbonated water in general
is going to tend to be healthier than SODA's. I
would say also full sugar sodas probably experience a bit
(03:49):
of a decline just because there's a feedback loop, right,
they want to diversify. In Diversification means that they're now
more alternative choices in the market. So you people are venturous, right,
You like what you're familiar with, but you also want
to try something new every so often. Well, we should
say that the industry did respond to your point, Noel.
(04:12):
Ten years after the AMA makes their statement, we see
the rise of the first low calorie, no calorie beverage,
a diet soft drink, a ginger ale called no col beverage.
They put beverage in the name, which is a weird flex.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
It's sort of like an ATM machine there. It is
yeah or ven number. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
It's maybe a company out of New York called KERSH.
And they pave the way for all the diet sodas
to come because the concerns are real. How many grams
of soda or how many grams is sugar? Do we say,
like forty grams, that's right.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Yeah, okay.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
The recommended consumption of grams of added sugar is between
twenty five and thirty eight grams per day, depending on
your body. And of course, there are multiple studies that
confirm different health risks that can be associated with overconsumption
of soda, Type two diabetes, cardiovascular disease, These diet soft drinks,
(05:19):
they're also not a panacea. They're not perfect. If you
consume two or more diet soft drinks, according to experts,
you can increase you can still increase your risk of
heart disease and stroke. But let's go on to one
other interesting thing here. This is the thing that maybe
originally pitch this idea back when we're doing pitch Betts.
(05:40):
Who is kersh What happened to that soda company? It
turns out history is absolutely littered with discontinued soda brands
and companies that either went bust or never reach the
global dominance of pepsi and coke. There are seriously tons
of these, so.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Many, in fact, we decided to make this on a
relatively preemptive two parttern.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
We'll give you the background before we get to our
auditable mentions our Hall of Fame or hall of shame.
We have to explain why the soda market came to
be increasingly dominated by a small number of companies to Leviathans,
in particular Pepsi and Coke. It's because of the nineteen sixties.
The nineteen sixties were the halcyon glory days of the
(06:24):
soda market. There were so many different choices, and Coke
and Pepsi were a little different from other companies because
they weren't just selling their regional soda or their invention.
They were aggressively buying up other brands, a process that
continues today. And they knew growth in television viewing was
huge in the sixties, so they also threw a bunch
(06:48):
of money into marketing campaign. Smaller companies tried to pull
their own marketing stunts, but they just didn't have the
cash to compete, and then another feedback loop gets created.
That's why coc is so popular today.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
But Coke they literally invented Santa Claus for all intents
and purposes, you know, I mean some of the marketing
you know. Again, it's the same deal we talked about
with kind of being first to market as an inventor
of something and still you know, staying the test of time.
Coke was so iconic and powerful that marketing things that
they created to sell a bubbly sweet drink have become
(07:24):
absolutely inseparable from just the idea of Americana, you know,
and just the culture of the United States.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
They helped increase the population of polar bears, all due
to those Christmas ads, Like people got involved in biodiversity
and saving polar bears.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
So weird.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
It's also this is also kind of our whole of
nostalgia part of the series. We've got to talk about
the sodas of yesteryear. We were texting each other about
this for a while now. One that I think all
of us brought up at some point is Josta. Know
how would you how would you depict a Josta Josta
(08:00):
with Guarana?
Speaker 2 (08:02):
It literally was in the name. Yeah, this was one
of the we were talking about Bernie Sanders whole perspective
on like marketing this poison to kids. They literally did
do that. You know. I distinctly remember we're about the
same age, Ben, When all of a sudden there were
the soda machines in my high school and they sold
(08:25):
Josta was one of the popular ones, and also another
one called Surge, which we're going to get to. But
Josta had this kind of like South American vibe. There
was like a panther I think, sort of like a
stylized panther on the label, and I couldn't tell you
what it tasted like, kind of Doctor Pepper adjacent. But
this guarana was like ginsing or something. It was meant
(08:47):
to be sort of a natural like booster, you know, yeah, stimulants. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
It was described as a high energy citrus soda. It's
around from ninety five to ninety nine, so not that
long in its first incarnation.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Because it was controversial, especially because of what we're talking
about with the marketing directly to the youth.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Yeah, and this uh Josta was to a lot of
the soda pop heads kind of ahead of its time
because add higher caffeine content, which will later see in
things like Jolter Surge or East Tennessee's infamous Doctor Enough.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
But it also had really doctor enough.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
Yeah, yeah, doctor Enough is asked our pal Dylan Fagan about.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
It, dude, But it's the East Tennessee thing. The warning
is there in the name itself.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
You know it's it's also spelled in a hurry, it's
spelled e n uf.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
But I never heard of this. I'm goant to look
it up. That's it. It's weird.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
I think probably got some at my dad's house, so
I'll bring some if I can find it. But the
Josta has a higher octane in the gas caffeine wise,
and it also was focused less on sweetness and more
on just a strong fruit flavor. This was a product
to Pepsi, and to this day people aren't exactly sure
(10:08):
why they discontinued it. I imagine it just wasn't sewing
that well, right.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Yeah, and also again kind of I believe the controversy
around marketing to kids probably left a bad taste in
some people's mouths literally and figuratively because it wasn't very good.
It had a bit of a bitter weirdness to it.
And this is also right around the era of the
era of fruitopia. Remember that. Oh yeah, it was like
(10:34):
it was a soda, but it was it was It
was not carbonated, but it just was like fake fruit
juice that was just pure sugar. And that was another
popular drink that they sold in schools.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
Yeah, it's a fruit toopia. And then I talked about this,
I think pinged in one of our group chats. But
with Serge, I had that same high school association or
middle school like remember. But the thing that Surge did
that was kind of sketchy was they sent everybody in
(11:07):
our school like a gift pack from Surge. And it
wasn't the soda, but it was like a T shirt
and a mixtape CD of all these not quite a
list bands of the nineties, and I thought it was
really neat. I definitely bought Surge at school as a result,
(11:28):
but with the benefit of retrospect, that seems kind of
crooked because I was, like, everybody in our school, how
did they get all those addresses? Who was working with whom?
Speaker 2 (11:38):
I honestly think it's a lot like pharmaceutical reps, you know, like, yeah,
you had these soda reps that were coming to the
school and making these deals. How else do you think
the machines got? You know, it was a total deal.
You know, obviously there was something in it for the schools.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
I mean to further on this point, and you know,
a couple of years younger than y'all, that only got
worse I remember my senior year of high school. I'm
like looking at him, like, man, there's way more vending
machines in this cafeteria than there were when I was
a freshman. It's continued getting it's probably so much worse now.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Well, there's social pressure to use the vending machines too,
because it makes you cool. Right, It's like, I'm gonna
have I'm gonna have a Pepsi.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
Crystal I'm kidding. I don't know if they ever sold
that stuff, but that was, you know, I released. I
guess it was Pepsi, Crystal Pepsi and clear coke, probably
when I was in fifth grade, maybe even fourth grade.
(12:41):
I do distinctly remember, though, because I think Crystal Pepsi
had a commercial that used that song right now, Hey,
no tomorrow, right now, come on, It's everything, And I
think that was a thing. It was Van Halen. It
was like Sammy Hagar Van Hagar Era, and that a
big promo. And of course both of those attempts, they
(13:04):
didn't taste like coke, they didn't taste like sprite. They
just tasted weird, and it was that sort of weird
psychological sensation where you're drinking something that looks one way
and then it tastes a different way. It was just
wrong something about it, so it did not take off
like they were hoping. It was also kind of a
matter for the customer.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
You would have to ask yourself, why don't I just
get like it answers. It solves a problem people didn't
have because if they wanted pepsi, they would get a pepsi.
If they wanted sparkling water, they would get sparkling water.
So ending up with a not quite pepsi that is
also not quite sparkling water. It's just a strange hybrid.
(13:47):
Maybe people didn't want it. You guys heard about the
New Coke conspiracy too, right, do you remember.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
A little bit? But I mean New Coke was just
they were like, hey, we're gonna tweak our formula a
little bit, you know, and it was just nobody liked it,
I think. But what's the conspiracies that they were trying
to do something underhandedly or what's that I do now?
Speaker 1 (14:04):
The pop culture conspiracy is that Coke knew they were
going to redo the flavor of original Coca Cola, so
they said, we're not going to throw people in the
deep water yet we're going to do a switch route.
We're going to come out with new Coke, which was
not popular by the way, didn't last long. And then
as though we are responding to people's demand, we'll roll
(14:27):
out Coca Cola Classic, which is different from the actual
classic Coca Cola. We've just sort of switched things that
the conspiracy would be. Whether this was on purpose or
with motive, but still it's one of my favorite pop
culture stories because I think as a kid, it was
my first encounter with feeling like an old man or
(14:50):
a very conservative person because I tried new Coke, and
even at a very young age, I was like, this
new stuff is garbage.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
You need to go back to the old ways for
the Hills phase exactly, which brings us to another one
of the kind of Oh, by the way, I don't
know if we mentioned that Josta did appear in Low
Key Yeah as sort of, you know, a nostalgic throwback
thing because it was of a very specific window of time,
so it was a fun little, you know, callback to that.
(15:22):
But really the sister drink to Jasta in many ways
was Surge, which was this citrus kind of extreme like
it looked like a Nickelodeon ad like, like the label
was very green and splatty kind of vibes. You know,
Surge really does occupy this very rarefied air of discontinued
sodas that some people really did dig. But there was
(15:46):
some kind of weirdness behind the way it was marketed. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
What they did is they figured out the demographic that
they wanted to be the Surge stands. They were like,
this is gonna be soda for teenagers, for suburban teenagers,
especially if they like skateboarding, right, And we're gonna go
airwalks exactly, vans, We're gonna associate ourselves with different cultural
(16:17):
things that we believe these children will be interested in.
And and just like Josta, it's a it's a citrus
based beverage. This is a Coca Cola product. Neon green
coloring did not look like a natural thing. Yeah, it
did toole cleaner or something, you know. And Josta was
kind of purplish, but it was really more just black,
(16:39):
like regular yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
Just darker.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
And and Surge is interesting because it's the subject of
a lot of different urban legends that were that were
coming out where that would either attempt to explain the
secret origin story of Surge, or there would be those
lurid campfire tales of people who drank Surge under the
wrong circumstances and something terrible happened, you know, like the
(17:05):
old idea of eating pop rocks and damaging your mouth
or something.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
You know, so it was holding off your stomach.
Speaker 3 (17:12):
I thought, yeah, yeah, there's a couple eating like coke
or something afterwards.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
Like Coca mentos, etc. We see a delightful subgenre of
YouTube U TikTok videos for people are just like, you know,
dropping ten mentos into a coke and then just shoving
their whole mouth on it so it like shoots out
of their eyeballs. You know, it's pretty wild. Ben. You
found something though, like speaking of like marketing type stuff
(17:40):
that I was not aware of from the Coca Cola company.
H very odd label for this thing called Okay Soda
looks like a Daniel Clues cartoon. Yeah, Like it's very weird, moody,
like some kind of alternative comic vibe. I do not
remember this at all.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
Yeah, yeah, I missed this one too. This was actually
new to me. Back in nineteen ninety three, Coca Cola
did a similar thing that they had done was that
they would do a surge.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Right.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
They said, all right, we're gonna find a demographic. We're
gonna make a soda just for them. And they looked
around the c suite or the boardroom, and some guy said,
has anybody heard about this grunge of music?
Speaker 2 (18:25):
And they went, grimy youths in their flannels and their
torn up jeans, and so they made this.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
They made like this soda that was just a pretty
much a regular soda, nothing to brag about. It's like
the Honda Civic of soda. I guess it gets the
job done. But their focus in this one was marketing, branding,
an image. So we've got here a we've got here
an image of the label that would wrap around a
(18:56):
can of Okay soda and it says stuff like it's
got the Daniel Lose kind of cartoons, and then at
the top it says Okay Soda says, don't be fooled
into thinking there has to be a reason for.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
Everything, Okay Corporation exactly. Yeah, don't conform. Drink Okay Soda exactly.
It reminds me a lot, though, like there are you know,
or there I think in the nineties as well, probably
sort of a craft soda kind of boom. You guys
might know. Jon's Soda is a popular one. They make
(19:29):
all kinds of weird one off flavors, like seasonally, like
there's one out right now it's like chocolate orange. And
they even had like Thanksgiving gravy flavored soda bacon really
really sugary. They were very popular when I lived in Birmingham,
and I'd never really heard of them, but that's often
the case with some of these things, like Jolt Cola
was regional or like Fago was regional and then it
(19:51):
kind of got more national. But yeah, Jon's Soda, it
almost feels like that's what they're attempting to do here,
is like it's sort of like the craft beer label
that is a secretly owned by bush Mills, but it's
like trying to trick you into thinking, no, no, no,
this is just for you. This is small batch craft stuff.
You know, it's so weird.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
Like okay, just one example, like an example, they would
put these little bits of flash fiction.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
On Okay soda. I appreciate it. I probably would have
bought one. Kind of cool looking, I mean, frankly, the
design is good. I don't know if I would drink it.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
I might just keep it and be like, look upon
my refrigerator works.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
He mighty and despair. I wonder if some of these
are collectible now if oh yeah, continue them? So, yeah,
yeah they are.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
And so just for an example of this, this label
that we're pulling has the following written on it. Coincidence fourteen.
The night he first tried Okay soda, Rick B. Of Aurora,
Colorado put a full cad under his pillow and went
to sleep. He dreamed he was crawling through an endless
gravel pit, parched with thirst. When he awoke his thirst,
(20:57):
it disappeared, and his hang on him turned. I had
to read this, and he felt strangely satisfied. Note the
cat of ok soda, still unopened, was empty.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
This is only a coincidence. See you mentioned earlier. It is,
but you mentioned earlier, Ben, The idea was actually very
top of the of the first episode. Uh, your vampire
dream doesn't just have the language of like an implanted
advertising advertisement masquerading as a dream inception. Yes, dude, it
really does, And I kid you not. We talked about
(21:30):
it on stuff that I want you to know. A lot.
I believe there was a beer company that did experiment
with some just as like an ad campaign. Goof experimented
with implanting ads into people's dreams. But it was like,
you know, by volunteer and it was literally the thing
itself was the ad. They're not truly talking about doing this,
you know, to the general public, but we're not that
(21:51):
far off, man, from this kind of stuff happened.
Speaker 4 (21:54):
Yeah, there's a reason we do stuff that I want
you to know as well as this show. Look, o
K soda was just okay. It was out for two
years ninety three to ninety five, and then Coca Cola
pulled it from its shells, which made it, to your point,
a collector's item. And there are so many other obscure soda.
Some are discontinued, some are still around. Some I think
(22:17):
are invented entirely because a person liked a pun. I'm
thinking of dra Cola of course.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
Yeah, well that hey, that that that would have been
the ad in your dream. I would have been that
would Yeah, it was made for Halloween, you know, seasonal
kind of Halloween stuff. But Transylvania Imports made this. We
got to wonder if this is somehow, you know, at
least at least a philosophically adjacent to those seasonal cereals
(22:45):
like Yummy Mummy and Barry.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
I gotta jump in and say that that's what this
feels like, because when I was researching cereal, whenever we
did that episode, there was so many just like terrible
Cereal that was built one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
Off of a pun. Yeah, what's a count I think,
yummy Mummy, Yummy mummy. Yeah. And then we've.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
Got we've got stuff that's a little more sexy. Soda
companies have tried every genre and demographic of appeal, so
Aphrodite had us. Their slogan was get some tonight.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
Okay, that's right, and I believe some of these it
contained quotes from like screen, Angeen news, like May West
and the like mm hmm. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
It was two thousand and two, only lasted a few years,
as we know of the United States was still attempting
to find its way as a nation.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
And they said no to the uh.
Speaker 1 (23:40):
They said no to the tempting allure of Aphrodite, a
cherry red soda with a fruit punch flavor.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
I think maybe we briefly mentioned tab. I think most
people just know Tab as a product of the eighties,
and I think it was just like kind of a
amorphous diet soda. And it was discontinued recently, is twenty twenty,
because I do remember they kind of had a little
bit of a resurgence again on that nostalgia tip. Now
Fresco's back in a big way. I've noticed that was
(24:08):
sort of it seemed like it had gone the way
of the Dodo for a while. But yeah, Tab is
something now you just really associate with, like kind of
eighties yuppie culture. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:18):
For when I first started at How Stuff Works, my
boss was the only person I had ever met who
drank Tab, and she loved it was the only soda
she drank.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
Roxanne, Yeah, I had.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
No idea it was still around. Roxanne Reed opened us
to the world of Tab, and I was tuning in,
we're thinking about you. I had no idea Tab was
still around until you told us, and had no idea
that it discontinued in twenty twenty. But Tab I never
quite I don't know, never quite.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
Got with it. It's such an innocuous name too. It's
just meaningless, you know, It's like tab, like what What
does that even mean? Was it like.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
They were proud of the bodily technology or they can't.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Well, that's just I guess that you know, a tab
the thing that you pop, But I don't know. It
just seems like it was made to be kind of
vanilla and just bland diet generic diet soda. What about
Let's see, we talked about Doctor Brown's. They had kind
of a fun one that was pretty popular. Cel Ray,
(25:26):
Did it taste like celery polka cola? Oh no, no, no,
I'm sorry, I'm skipping a. Yeah, yeah, cel Ray.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Yeah, it was celery based soda still around, And it
came about because celery was seen as a superfood at
the time in the mid eighteen hundreds. People would say,
it'll relaxs you, it'll cure headaches, it is the key
to what ails you. And so Doctor Brown's also made
(25:53):
cream soda, right.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Sure, And you know that that black cherry soda and
root beer and all of that other stuff, the classic
soda flavors.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
And it's weird because now that I think about it,
that medicinal association is the reason so many soda brands
have a fictional doctor at the head.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
It's funny. I can think about that. Now, You're totally right.
And ginger too is considered kind of a super food
or yeah, it still is. I mean, you put you
put ginger in your chicken soup. It does you know,
I don't know. Results may vary, but there is the
sense that it's good for you in some way. But
the Doctor Brown soda very popular in Jewish delicatessens as well.
And a lot of the reporting you found on this
(26:34):
came from really the Jewish Star and you know, specifically
referring to the history of some of these sodas, you know,
in the Jewish culture.
Speaker 1 (26:42):
Yeah, and you can still find Doctor browns. You can
still find cel ray in delis and in specific markets
across the country. We could probably find some in Atlanta.
I sort of want to try it. I'm not you know,
I'm not a big celery head.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Iet It kind of reminds me of like something having
a wisp of cucumber, you know what I mean. Oh yeah,
It's a similarly kind of earthy, kind of plant matter
flavor that I could see if it was paired with
the right other you know, ingredients being a little bit refreshing. Yeah, yeah,
(27:18):
I can see that. Do you guys know about Fago?
Of course, yeah, I mentioned that earlier about like how
you know Fago was very much a Detroit, you know,
Michigan thing, and then I think, largely because of the
insane clown Posse really kind of developed a reputation. But
like moon mist and what's some other popular flavors of Fago.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
Well, the red is the one that's always red roka
something right, Yeah, that is my dad's all time favorite,
you know, Detroit soda. So I would be remiss to
not bring it up, because I mean, missed. Papa Williams
is a very calm man, unless who don't talk about
his Fago.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
Rock and Rye is another one, rock and Rye, which
I believe what does it even taste like? It says
rock and Rye was a medicinal medley of rye, whiskey, rock, candy,
citrus and herbs. Now that was the original. Now it's
a light vanilla cream soda with a hint of semi
tart cherry flavor had nothing to do with anything from
(28:19):
the cocktail.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
And this is yeah, this is weird because we see
that the names are so fascinating in every case of
a soda we're talking about that's been discontinued. By the way,
there's probably gonna be a grassroots movement to save it.
Like you can go to save Josta online before Loki
you can you can see. I think the Saved Tap
Soda Committee took out billboards to try to get Coca
(28:42):
Cola to bring back tab for some reason.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
Do you guys remember High Sea Ecto cooler. Yeah, huge
glaciers item and they carbonated. There was a period. There
was a brief period where they were available again in
cans because originally they were in the little juice boxes.
But it was a tie in with Ghostbusters, I believe,
the real Ghostbusters cartoon. It wasn't necessarily the first Ghostbusters movie,
but it had Slimer on it. It was green, but
(29:12):
it tasted like orange. Yeah, that was the whole deal.
But I briefly when it was around, I bought a
case of it on Amazon, thinking that it was going
to be available now and again forever, and it wasn't.
And now you can go online and find those going
for a pretty penny. Nice Did you keep it?
Speaker 1 (29:28):
No?
Speaker 2 (29:28):
I drank them because I was like, yeah, Acto Cooler's back.
We're all good, not that I would needed to be
buying those on the regular, but yeah, nostalgia, you know,
and we should talk about that aspect, especially when it
comes to things like ginger ale, root beer coke. A
lot of this stuff capitalizes on nostalgia. Yeah, it's it's programming.
It's brilliant.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
The study of the history of modern soda is also
a study in social psychology. It's also a study in
good marketing. It's it's a study in accessing or incepting
people's memories.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
You know.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
It's it's quite effective too, and that's why they like,
they tried so much stuff. I mentioned Polka cola that
was made to promote polka music. Whoopy soda was woopy.
Speaker 2 (30:16):
Soda cushions making.
Speaker 1 (30:21):
They had they had a contest where they said, we
will give you up to five hundred dollars if you
write a letter talking about your saddus most injurious or
embarrassing experience trying to take off the bottle cap of
a whoopee soda that.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
Was really weird.
Speaker 1 (30:38):
That's that's kind of self deprecating to a dangerous level.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
And this so this.
Speaker 1 (30:46):
This concept, this nostalgic goes on what we're seeing. The
reason bringing up Polka soda is because that is just
one example of a soda company finding pre existing communities
and memories that people already share and then just sort
of inserting a soda in that situation, kind of like
(31:08):
when Wayne's World one or two, I can't remember, did
that amazing stuff about native advertising where they just started
drinking pepsi and talking about how they'd never sell out totally.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Yes, yeah, oh man, like it's a little yellow, different
new print exactly exactly.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
I do have to I do have to shout out
doctor enough. And it seems like you guys are interested
in learning.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
A little bit of that. Okay.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
So the East Tennessee, toward the northeast part of the
state is home to an area called the Tri Cities.
This is Bristol, Kingsport, and Johnson City. Bristol's in Virginia,
and in nineteen forty nine something called the Tri City
Beverage Corporation started bodiling a drink doctor Enough, invented by
(32:02):
a guide named Charles Gordon Enough Enough.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
It does not sound like a particularly attractive branding play.
I don't know he said this was this so weird? Right?
Speaker 1 (32:13):
Because it's nineteen forty nine, So the medicinal thing is
still kind of in the mix for people. You're not
just selling you know, liquid candy. And his advertising was
a little bit too hardcore's a little bit militant. Doctor
enough was supposed to relieve people's quote untold misery from
aches and paids, stomach disturbances and malaise. That okay, doesn't sound.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Fun, No, no it doesn't, but it.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
Tastes pretty good. It's like a lemon lime kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
Yeah, you know, well again that's the thing. We get
into a certain place where there's nothing new under the sun,
and when it comes to sodas and then now you'll
see Coke occasionally release these limited runs of like Starlight,
and they all taste like crap. They're not good, they're
too sugary. But they're banking on that thing that you said,
Ben about everyone maybe we'll try a thing once. And
(33:05):
that's why they don't stick around, because they're just you know,
capitalizing on everyone wanting to try it once. And I everyone,
I just mean, you know, enough people to warrant having
the thing come out. But they're you know, everything's a
lemon lime kind of thing, some sort of cola product
some sort of you know, mountain dew esque thing, uh,
and root beer and and of course ginger ale. But
(33:27):
then there's not like new soda. Well there's like it's
taken off. There's novelty soda. Has it taken off?
Speaker 1 (33:34):
And I gotta say for anybody who finds themselves in
East Tennessee, doctor enough is worth it. It's great.
Speaker 2 (33:40):
It's not.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
And also ran I think regional sodas have a great
appeal too, because they start people start associating them with
an area's identity, right like cheer wine or.
Speaker 2 (33:50):
Fago or fago. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
And I think burners burners of course. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
There's another one that gave rise to modern slang, which
is moxie. I didn't know when somebody says you've got moxie,
they're referencing a soda.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
No way, I would have been certain that it was
the other way around. Please tell us more so.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
Moxi soda is created as a medicine in eighteen seventy eight,
and the creator, Augustine Thompson, originally calls it moxie nerve food.
He says this medicine contains a proprietary, quite rare South
American plants. I refuse to name it in public. Now
we know what it is, Gentian root. And he said,
(34:35):
I've named this after a dear friend of mine, one
Lieutenant Moxie, who adventured in South America and who discovered
this rare plant that is the basis of my nerve food.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
Nerve food real Indiana Jones type figure. Huh. Yeah. And
apparently the term much more likely came from a Native
American word moxie, which means dark water. Which that's that
tracks for like a soda. You know, most cola type
or root beer type sodas. They're dark water with bubbles,
(35:07):
And that was used in the names of some of
the bodies of water near where Thompson was born.
Speaker 1 (35:13):
Yeah, so I think they embellished at least a little.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
Oh you thinks. What about the other claims made about
what this product could do for your health wise? Oh right,
right right, snake oil all the way right, Yeah, it's
patent medicine style.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Yeah, paralla, are you paralyzed? Get some moxie. Can't sleep,
Get some moxie. Need to wake up? Get some moxie. Uh,
you know, stuff shop and it's it's it becomes a
soft drink, right.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Yeah, and the syrup existed in eighteen seventy eight, but
it wasn't until eighteen eighty four that it was mixed up,
like you said, with carbonated water. So the earlier version
of it would have been much more like those snake
oil remedies that we talked about in the previous episode,
But it wasn't until eighteen eighty four that it was
mass produced and bottled and sold, you know, to the
like the Lowell Sun did an article on the drink
(36:03):
talking about how it became super popular in New England
but never got nearly as successful as Coca cola.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
Yeah, and the term moxie is actually more popular than
the soda because people started using it as slaying to
describe someone who seemed very determined or.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
Yeah. It makes me think of a really great I
Love Lucy episode where she's being a spokes person or
spokesmodel for this product on like you know, the Craft
whatever hour of television when ads were done live called
Vita meta vegimin. I bet a lot of yes, I
remember that one, and they had a slogan which she's like,
(36:45):
Vita meat a veggiemin spoon your way to health. But
the joke was that it had like a ton of
alcohol in it, and they kept making her drink it
as she did successive takes, and by the end of
it she's Vita mood of vision mood. It was a
whole bit very fun. I love Lucy holds up it does.
It does a comedic genius at work. There There are,
(37:06):
of course, novelty, weird sodas, like you can find black
garlic flavor, onion flavor, pumpkin pie flavor one maybe like
you're saying with Jones, Yeah, like Jones.
Speaker 1 (37:19):
One I think would be interesting to try the next
time when we finally travel across the Pacific together is
that Japan has a curry flavored soda. I don't think
it's going to be good, but I do think we
should try it.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
You know, there's a really cool bar that's keeps winning,
like best bar in America I'm not mistaken in New
York called Double Chicken Please. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
I haven't been, but it's hard to get into. But
they do like a cold soba noodle cocktail, and they
do one that's like leftover pizza and stuff. But apparently
they're all like they sound gimmicky, but they're actually really
(37:56):
good and like very Willy Wonka esque in their creations.
We didn't mention Sasparrella Sioux City sasparella. They call that
like a soft sasparella. That was one of the early
kind of root rootie drinks that were, you know, sold
as an alternative for those that maybe did not want
to imbibe the harder stuff. And it's kind of like
root beer. You can still get it. It very much
(38:18):
tastes like root beer, but you can get it like
Cracker Barrel where they have all the different vintage sodas.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
Uh huh and all the recordings you could ever want.
Speaker 3 (38:26):
The golden What is the falla New Vegas equivalent to that?
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Oh, I don't know. It's just it's just called Nuka Cola.
Speaker 3 (38:34):
Well, no, there's Nuca Cola by New Vegas. There's a Sasparillo.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
I don't remember the Yeah, I don't remember that.
Speaker 3 (38:41):
But that's that's the big joke, because it's the only
one where Nuca Cola does not run the whole show.
Speaker 2 (38:46):
Got it? Yeah? I do. I do love me some
New Vegas. I need to get back into that one too.
We got to get through Skyrim first, guys got to
get through Skyrim.
Speaker 5 (38:53):
I and I I love Sky. I turned through Sky.
You don't know I did last time. I went to
the Land of Dragons and was underpowered, and I kept
getting my ass handed to get.
Speaker 1 (39:06):
Buggy with the DLC to be fair and early official patch. Yeah, well,
we'll consider it.
Speaker 2 (39:12):
But then are were Have we reached the end of
our our carbonated adventure, our journey into the heart of soda?
Speaker 1 (39:22):
I believe we are with a brief epilogue or coda.
I think we'd safe for us to say, do what
makes you happy, be responsible, but try, don't be afraid
to try weird or new or unfamiliar with soda. And
we can't wait to hear about the weirdest ones you found.
There is one soda that I do think. I hope
you guys grow with me. No one should drink birds
(39:44):
nest soda. I don't think you should drink it because
birds nest like the fungus from it. It's problematic the
way they get it. So that's the only soda I
think you shouldn't drink.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
It's not the one made of virgin boys urine, is it? No?
Speaker 1 (39:58):
No, not the the eggs oh gosh.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
There was also what's that really gross? One from Italy?
They let you sample with the World of Coke. Oh god, Beverly,
Oh yeah, no way. Yeah. There are two sodas that
no one should try. Sunset That Sunset saspa fall in
New Vegas.
Speaker 3 (40:20):
That one person who's very mad at us for not
remembering that remember it now?
Speaker 1 (40:24):
Yea.
Speaker 2 (40:26):
Also chill out, don't be mad at a podcast Mellow Yellow,
quite right. I love that song.
Speaker 1 (40:32):
Thank you so much to our super producer, mister Max Williams.
This has been This has been a heck of a
soda week, and I gotta say, also, nol, thank you,
thank you for letting me do this as a therapy session.
I thought I end up missing soda more, but I
feel like now we kind of understand more of the
context and I'll be okay, just sticking to coffee and water.
Speaker 2 (40:55):
Got to exercise those soda demons. Thank you as well, Bam.
This is a nostalgia last to the cranium for me
as well. Huge thanks to super producer Max Williams Alex
Williams who composed this theme.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
Big big thanks to Jonathan Strickland aka the Quist as
he's known on the mean streets of the Ridiculous Universe.
Speaker 2 (41:15):
Big big thanks, of.
Speaker 1 (41:16):
Course to let's see who else, Chrispheros yotis.
Speaker 2 (41:20):
Aj Jacobs, the Puzzler, who is now kind of I
think he's accepted our invitation into the Ridiculous Universe. So
maybe we'll have to have the Puzzler and the Quiztor
have some sort of you know, puzzle off. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:34):
Fun, It'll be like when Hannibal Lecter meets another serial killer.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
Just so, we'll see you next time, folks. For more
podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or
wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Ridiculous Histories, a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to the
(00:27):
show Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so much for
tuning in, Papa Top, grab a sip. Shout out to
our super producer, Uh mister Max the surge, Williams.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Indeed, Max, the way you do A good one later
the now, I can't remember. Let's let it happen organically.
It was so good you'd been I had a couple
of good ones. Thanks man. Yeah, this is so Noel.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
This is part two of our exploration soda and I
think we both knew going into it we'd have some nostalgia,
But this is like, this is the fun part, right,
or almost the fun part. Are we going to do
health concerns?
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Do we have to? Who knows results? To be fair,
it might have been on the tail end of the
previous episode, but you'll definitely hear some callbacks to all
of the things that we've talked about here. So let's
jump right into part two of the Ridiculous History of
Soda pop.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
As early as the nineteen forties, people were starting to
get concerned. The AMA American Medical Association released a public
statement in forty two, and they said look, guys, we
get it. We're the cool doctors. We like soda too,
But let's pump the brakes a little bit. You know,
you've got to watch out for all the sugar getting
(01:38):
added to various foods and beverages, and you gotta be
careful of soft drinks because they're giving you more sugar
than you might assume.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Well, and much like you know, the cigarette industry, it
takes a long time for these types of health concerns
to really take hold, you know, bla blah uh, hey
there you go. But like now, I think we are
living in a you know, an age where seltzer and
diet sodas are maybe more popular than full sugar soda.
But that doesn't mean that the full sugar sodas are
(02:10):
off the shelves. And I'm just conjecturing here. I haven't
seen any numbers, but I would bet my bottom dollar
that that fully sugared sodas are not selling quite as well.
And that's just indicated by how much these soda companies
have had to diversify, you know, and lean really heavily
into Like for example, I think Coke bought Topuchico, which
(02:31):
was a you know, a it's a wonderful highly carbonated
mineral water, you know, out of out of Mexico. And
they did it quietly without letting anybody know. And now
you'll see Topuchico at your regular grocery store or convenience spot. Yeah.
You if you live in Atlanta, you might know the
guy who.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Distributes all of it. It's Luis, Yeah, with Louise.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Well, they do such a I mean not not not
to get off top of too much, but like brilliant
marketing stuff that Topo Chico is doing. They have a
lot of these like you know, you know, kind of
art markets and thrift type places where Topo Chico has,
free of charge installed a branded Topo Chico refrigerator in
these places and just you can just take one for free. Yeah,
(03:15):
and it certainly makes you feel a sense of good
will towards the brand, and you're much more likely to
pay for one when you see them. And they are
a little pricier, but there it's a great quality product,
highly carbonated. I think it's the best mineral water out there.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
If you catch and if you catch our Pao Luise
on a good day, he'll just give you some exactly.
The guy rolls strapped with Topo Chico. It's amazing buttped
and Topo Chico. By the way, carbonated water in general
is going to tend to be healthier than SODA's. I
would say also full sugar sodas probably experience a bit
(03:49):
of a decline just because there's a feedback loop, right,
they want to diversify. In Diversification means that they're now
more alternative choices in the market. So you people are venturous, right,
You like what you're familiar with, but you also want
to try something new every so often. Well, we should
say that the industry did respond to your point, Noel.
(04:12):
Ten years after the AMA makes their statement, we see
the rise of the first low calorie, no calorie beverage,
a diet soft drink, a ginger ale called no col beverage.
They put beverage in the name, which is a weird flex.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
It's sort of like an ATM machine there. It is
yeah or ven number. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
It's maybe a company out of New York called KERSH.
And they pave the way for all the diet sodas
to come because the concerns are real. How many grams
of soda or how many grams is sugar? Do we say,
like forty grams, that's right.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Yeah, okay.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
The recommended consumption of grams of added sugar is between
twenty five and thirty eight grams per day, depending on
your body. And of course, there are multiple studies that
confirm different health risks that can be associated with overconsumption
of soda, Type two diabetes, cardiovascular disease, These diet soft drinks,
(05:19):
they're also not a panacea. They're not perfect. If you
consume two or more diet soft drinks, according to experts,
you can increase you can still increase your risk of
heart disease and stroke. But let's go on to one
other interesting thing here. This is the thing that maybe
originally pitch this idea back when we're doing pitch Betts.
(05:40):
Who is kersh What happened to that soda company? It
turns out history is absolutely littered with discontinued soda brands
and companies that either went bust or never reach the
global dominance of pepsi and coke. There are seriously tons
of these, so.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Many, in fact, we decided to make this on a
relatively preemptive two parttern.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
We'll give you the background before we get to our
auditable mentions our Hall of Fame or hall of shame.
We have to explain why the soda market came to
be increasingly dominated by a small number of companies to Leviathans,
in particular Pepsi and Coke. It's because of the nineteen sixties.
The nineteen sixties were the halcyon glory days of the
(06:24):
soda market. There were so many different choices, and Coke
and Pepsi were a little different from other companies because
they weren't just selling their regional soda or their invention.
They were aggressively buying up other brands, a process that
continues today. And they knew growth in television viewing was
huge in the sixties, so they also threw a bunch
(06:48):
of money into marketing campaign. Smaller companies tried to pull
their own marketing stunts, but they just didn't have the
cash to compete, and then another feedback loop gets created.
That's why coc is so popular today.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
But Coke they literally invented Santa Claus for all intents
and purposes, you know, I mean some of the marketing
you know. Again, it's the same deal we talked about
with kind of being first to market as an inventor
of something and still you know, staying the test of time.
Coke was so iconic and powerful that marketing things that
they created to sell a bubbly sweet drink have become
(07:24):
absolutely inseparable from just the idea of Americana, you know,
and just the culture of the United States.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
They helped increase the population of polar bears, all due
to those Christmas ads, Like people got involved in biodiversity
and saving polar bears.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
So weird.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
It's also this is also kind of our whole of
nostalgia part of the series. We've got to talk about
the sodas of yesteryear. We were texting each other about
this for a while now. One that I think all
of us brought up at some point is Josta. Know
how would you how would you depict a Josta Josta
(08:00):
with Guarana?
Speaker 2 (08:02):
It literally was in the name. Yeah, this was one
of the we were talking about Bernie Sanders whole perspective
on like marketing this poison to kids. They literally did
do that. You know. I distinctly remember we're about the
same age, Ben, When all of a sudden there were
the soda machines in my high school and they sold
(08:25):
Josta was one of the popular ones, and also another
one called Surge, which we're going to get to. But
Josta had this kind of like South American vibe. There
was like a panther I think, sort of like a
stylized panther on the label, and I couldn't tell you
what it tasted like, kind of Doctor Pepper adjacent. But
this guarana was like ginsing or something. It was meant
(08:47):
to be sort of a natural like booster, you know, yeah, stimulants. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
It was described as a high energy citrus soda. It's
around from ninety five to ninety nine, so not that
long in its first incarnation.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Because it was controversial, especially because of what we're talking
about with the marketing directly to the youth.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Yeah, and this uh Josta was to a lot of
the soda pop heads kind of ahead of its time
because add higher caffeine content, which will later see in
things like Jolter Surge or East Tennessee's infamous Doctor Enough.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
But it also had really doctor enough.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
Yeah, yeah, doctor Enough is asked our pal Dylan Fagan about.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
It, dude, But it's the East Tennessee thing. The warning
is there in the name itself.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
You know it's it's also spelled in a hurry, it's
spelled e n uf.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
But I never heard of this. I'm goant to look
it up. That's it. It's weird.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
I think probably got some at my dad's house, so
I'll bring some if I can find it. But the
Josta has a higher octane in the gas caffeine wise,
and it also was focused less on sweetness and more
on just a strong fruit flavor. This was a product
to Pepsi, and to this day people aren't exactly sure
(10:08):
why they discontinued it. I imagine it just wasn't sewing
that well, right.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Yeah, and also again kind of I believe the controversy
around marketing to kids probably left a bad taste in
some people's mouths literally and figuratively because it wasn't very good.
It had a bit of a bitter weirdness to it.
And this is also right around the era of the
era of fruitopia. Remember that. Oh yeah, it was like
(10:34):
it was a soda, but it was it was It
was not carbonated, but it just was like fake fruit
juice that was just pure sugar. And that was another
popular drink that they sold in schools.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
Yeah, it's a fruit toopia. And then I talked about this,
I think pinged in one of our group chats. But
with Serge, I had that same high school association or
middle school like remember. But the thing that Surge did
that was kind of sketchy was they sent everybody in
(11:07):
our school like a gift pack from Surge. And it
wasn't the soda, but it was like a T shirt
and a mixtape CD of all these not quite a
list bands of the nineties, and I thought it was
really neat. I definitely bought Surge at school as a result,
(11:28):
but with the benefit of retrospect, that seems kind of
crooked because I was, like, everybody in our school, how
did they get all those addresses? Who was working with whom?
Speaker 2 (11:38):
I honestly think it's a lot like pharmaceutical reps, you know, like, yeah,
you had these soda reps that were coming to the
school and making these deals. How else do you think
the machines got? You know, it was a total deal.
You know, obviously there was something in it for the schools.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
I mean to further on this point, and you know,
a couple of years younger than y'all, that only got
worse I remember my senior year of high school. I'm
like looking at him, like, man, there's way more vending
machines in this cafeteria than there were when I was
a freshman. It's continued getting it's probably so much worse now.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Well, there's social pressure to use the vending machines too,
because it makes you cool. Right, It's like, I'm gonna
have I'm gonna have a Pepsi.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
Crystal I'm kidding. I don't know if they ever sold
that stuff, but that was, you know, I released. I
guess it was Pepsi, Crystal Pepsi and clear coke, probably
when I was in fifth grade, maybe even fourth grade.
(12:41):
I do distinctly remember, though, because I think Crystal Pepsi
had a commercial that used that song right now, Hey,
no tomorrow, right now, come on, It's everything, And I
think that was a thing. It was Van Halen. It
was like Sammy Hagar Van Hagar Era, and that a
big promo. And of course both of those attempts, they
(13:04):
didn't taste like coke, they didn't taste like sprite. They
just tasted weird, and it was that sort of weird
psychological sensation where you're drinking something that looks one way
and then it tastes a different way. It was just
wrong something about it, so it did not take off
like they were hoping. It was also kind of a
matter for the customer.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
You would have to ask yourself, why don't I just
get like it answers. It solves a problem people didn't
have because if they wanted pepsi, they would get a pepsi.
If they wanted sparkling water, they would get sparkling water.
So ending up with a not quite pepsi that is
also not quite sparkling water. It's just a strange hybrid.
(13:47):
Maybe people didn't want it. You guys heard about the
New Coke conspiracy too, right, do you remember.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
A little bit? But I mean New Coke was just
they were like, hey, we're gonna tweak our formula a
little bit, you know, and it was just nobody liked it,
I think. But what's the conspiracies that they were trying
to do something underhandedly or what's that I do now?
Speaker 1 (14:04):
The pop culture conspiracy is that Coke knew they were
going to redo the flavor of original Coca Cola, so
they said, we're not going to throw people in the
deep water yet we're going to do a switch route.
We're going to come out with new Coke, which was
not popular by the way, didn't last long. And then
as though we are responding to people's demand, we'll roll
(14:27):
out Coca Cola Classic, which is different from the actual
classic Coca Cola. We've just sort of switched things that
the conspiracy would be. Whether this was on purpose or
with motive, but still it's one of my favorite pop
culture stories because I think as a kid, it was
my first encounter with feeling like an old man or
(14:50):
a very conservative person because I tried new Coke, and
even at a very young age, I was like, this
new stuff is garbage.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
You need to go back to the old ways for
the Hills phase exactly, which brings us to another one
of the kind of Oh, by the way, I don't
know if we mentioned that Josta did appear in Low
Key Yeah as sort of, you know, a nostalgic throwback
thing because it was of a very specific window of time,
so it was a fun little, you know, callback to that.
(15:22):
But really the sister drink to Jasta in many ways
was Surge, which was this citrus kind of extreme like
it looked like a Nickelodeon ad like, like the label
was very green and splatty kind of vibes. You know,
Surge really does occupy this very rarefied air of discontinued
sodas that some people really did dig. But there was
(15:46):
some kind of weirdness behind the way it was marketed. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
What they did is they figured out the demographic that
they wanted to be the Surge stands. They were like,
this is gonna be soda for teenagers, for suburban teenagers,
especially if they like skateboarding, right, And we're gonna go
airwalks exactly, vans, We're gonna associate ourselves with different cultural
(16:17):
things that we believe these children will be interested in.
And and just like Josta, it's a it's a citrus
based beverage. This is a Coca Cola product. Neon green
coloring did not look like a natural thing. Yeah, it
did toole cleaner or something, you know. And Josta was
kind of purplish, but it was really more just black,
(16:39):
like regular yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
Just darker.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
And and Surge is interesting because it's the subject of
a lot of different urban legends that were that were
coming out where that would either attempt to explain the
secret origin story of Surge, or there would be those
lurid campfire tales of people who drank Surge under the
wrong circumstances and something terrible happened, you know, like the
(17:05):
old idea of eating pop rocks and damaging your mouth
or something.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
You know, so it was holding off your stomach.
Speaker 3 (17:12):
I thought, yeah, yeah, there's a couple eating like coke
or something afterwards.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
Like Coca mentos, etc. We see a delightful subgenre of
YouTube U TikTok videos for people are just like, you know,
dropping ten mentos into a coke and then just shoving
their whole mouth on it so it like shoots out
of their eyeballs. You know, it's pretty wild. Ben. You
found something though, like speaking of like marketing type stuff
(17:40):
that I was not aware of from the Coca Cola company.
H very odd label for this thing called Okay Soda
looks like a Daniel Clues cartoon. Yeah, Like it's very weird, moody,
like some kind of alternative comic vibe. I do not
remember this at all.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
Yeah, yeah, I missed this one too. This was actually
new to me. Back in nineteen ninety three, Coca Cola
did a similar thing that they had done was that
they would do a surge.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Right.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
They said, all right, we're gonna find a demographic. We're
gonna make a soda just for them. And they looked
around the c suite or the boardroom, and some guy said,
has anybody heard about this grunge of music?
Speaker 2 (18:25):
And they went, grimy youths in their flannels and their
torn up jeans, and so they made this.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
They made like this soda that was just a pretty
much a regular soda, nothing to brag about. It's like
the Honda Civic of soda. I guess it gets the
job done. But their focus in this one was marketing, branding,
an image. So we've got here a we've got here
an image of the label that would wrap around a
(18:56):
can of Okay soda and it says stuff like it's
got the Daniel Lose kind of cartoons, and then at
the top it says Okay Soda says, don't be fooled
into thinking there has to be a reason for.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
Everything, Okay Corporation exactly. Yeah, don't conform. Drink Okay Soda exactly.
It reminds me a lot, though, like there are you know,
or there I think in the nineties as well, probably
sort of a craft soda kind of boom. You guys
might know. Jon's Soda is a popular one. They make
(19:29):
all kinds of weird one off flavors, like seasonally, like
there's one out right now it's like chocolate orange. And
they even had like Thanksgiving gravy flavored soda bacon really
really sugary. They were very popular when I lived in Birmingham,
and I'd never really heard of them, but that's often
the case with some of these things, like Jolt Cola
was regional or like Fago was regional and then it
(19:51):
kind of got more national. But yeah, Jon's Soda, it
almost feels like that's what they're attempting to do here,
is like it's sort of like the craft beer label
that is a secretly owned by bush Mills, but it's
like trying to trick you into thinking, no, no, no,
this is just for you. This is small batch craft stuff.
You know, it's so weird.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
Like okay, just one example, like an example, they would
put these little bits of flash fiction.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
On Okay soda. I appreciate it. I probably would have
bought one. Kind of cool looking, I mean, frankly, the
design is good. I don't know if I would drink it.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
I might just keep it and be like, look upon
my refrigerator works.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
He mighty and despair. I wonder if some of these
are collectible now if oh yeah, continue them? So, yeah,
yeah they are.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
And so just for an example of this, this label
that we're pulling has the following written on it. Coincidence fourteen.
The night he first tried Okay soda, Rick B. Of Aurora,
Colorado put a full cad under his pillow and went
to sleep. He dreamed he was crawling through an endless
gravel pit, parched with thirst. When he awoke his thirst,
(20:57):
it disappeared, and his hang on him turned. I had
to read this, and he felt strangely satisfied. Note the
cat of ok soda, still unopened, was empty.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
This is only a coincidence. See you mentioned earlier. It is,
but you mentioned earlier, Ben, The idea was actually very
top of the of the first episode. Uh, your vampire
dream doesn't just have the language of like an implanted
advertising advertisement masquerading as a dream inception. Yes, dude, it
really does, And I kid you not. We talked about
(21:30):
it on stuff that I want you to know. A lot.
I believe there was a beer company that did experiment
with some just as like an ad campaign. Goof experimented
with implanting ads into people's dreams. But it was like,
you know, by volunteer and it was literally the thing
itself was the ad. They're not truly talking about doing this,
you know, to the general public, but we're not that
(21:51):
far off, man, from this kind of stuff happened.
Speaker 4 (21:54):
Yeah, there's a reason we do stuff that I want
you to know as well as this show. Look, o
K soda was just okay. It was out for two
years ninety three to ninety five, and then Coca Cola
pulled it from its shells, which made it, to your point,
a collector's item. And there are so many other obscure soda.
Some are discontinued, some are still around. Some I think
(22:17):
are invented entirely because a person liked a pun. I'm
thinking of dra Cola of course.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
Yeah, well that hey, that that that would have been
the ad in your dream. I would have been that
would Yeah, it was made for Halloween, you know, seasonal
kind of Halloween stuff. But Transylvania Imports made this. We
got to wonder if this is somehow, you know, at
least at least a philosophically adjacent to those seasonal cereals
(22:45):
like Yummy Mummy and Barry.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
I gotta jump in and say that that's what this
feels like, because when I was researching cereal, whenever we
did that episode, there was so many just like terrible
Cereal that was built one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
Off of a pun. Yeah, what's a count I think,
yummy Mummy, Yummy mummy. Yeah. And then we've.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
Got we've got stuff that's a little more sexy. Soda
companies have tried every genre and demographic of appeal, so
Aphrodite had us. Their slogan was get some tonight.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
Okay, that's right, and I believe some of these it
contained quotes from like screen, Angeen news, like May West
and the like mm hmm. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
It was two thousand and two, only lasted a few years,
as we know of the United States was still attempting
to find its way as a nation.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
And they said no to the uh.
Speaker 1 (23:40):
They said no to the tempting allure of Aphrodite, a
cherry red soda with a fruit punch flavor.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
I think maybe we briefly mentioned tab. I think most
people just know Tab as a product of the eighties,
and I think it was just like kind of a
amorphous diet soda. And it was discontinued recently, is twenty twenty,
because I do remember they kind of had a little
bit of a resurgence again on that nostalgia tip. Now
Fresco's back in a big way. I've noticed that was
(24:08):
sort of it seemed like it had gone the way
of the Dodo for a while. But yeah, Tab is
something now you just really associate with, like kind of
eighties yuppie culture. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:18):
For when I first started at How Stuff Works, my
boss was the only person I had ever met who
drank Tab, and she loved it was the only soda
she drank.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
Roxanne, Yeah, I had.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
No idea it was still around. Roxanne Reed opened us
to the world of Tab, and I was tuning in,
we're thinking about you. I had no idea Tab was
still around until you told us, and had no idea
that it discontinued in twenty twenty. But Tab I never
quite I don't know, never quite.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
Got with it. It's such an innocuous name too. It's
just meaningless, you know, It's like tab, like what What
does that even mean? Was it like.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
They were proud of the bodily technology or they can't.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Well, that's just I guess that you know, a tab
the thing that you pop, But I don't know. It
just seems like it was made to be kind of
vanilla and just bland diet generic diet soda. What about
Let's see, we talked about Doctor Brown's. They had kind
of a fun one that was pretty popular. Cel Ray,
(25:26):
Did it taste like celery polka cola? Oh no, no, no,
I'm sorry, I'm skipping a. Yeah, yeah, cel Ray.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Yeah, it was celery based soda still around, And it
came about because celery was seen as a superfood at
the time in the mid eighteen hundreds. People would say,
it'll relaxs you, it'll cure headaches, it is the key
to what ails you. And so Doctor Brown's also made
(25:53):
cream soda, right.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Sure, And you know that that black cherry soda and
root beer and all of that other stuff, the classic
soda flavors.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
And it's weird because now that I think about it,
that medicinal association is the reason so many soda brands
have a fictional doctor at the head.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
It's funny. I can think about that. Now, You're totally right.
And ginger too is considered kind of a super food
or yeah, it still is. I mean, you put you
put ginger in your chicken soup. It does you know,
I don't know. Results may vary, but there is the
sense that it's good for you in some way. But
the Doctor Brown soda very popular in Jewish delicatessens as well.
And a lot of the reporting you found on this
(26:34):
came from really the Jewish Star and you know, specifically
referring to the history of some of these sodas, you know,
in the Jewish culture.
Speaker 1 (26:42):
Yeah, and you can still find Doctor browns. You can
still find cel ray in delis and in specific markets
across the country. We could probably find some in Atlanta.
I sort of want to try it. I'm not you know,
I'm not a big celery head.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Iet It kind of reminds me of like something having
a wisp of cucumber, you know what I mean. Oh yeah,
It's a similarly kind of earthy, kind of plant matter
flavor that I could see if it was paired with
the right other you know, ingredients being a little bit refreshing. Yeah, yeah,
(27:18):
I can see that. Do you guys know about Fago?
Of course, yeah, I mentioned that earlier about like how
you know Fago was very much a Detroit, you know,
Michigan thing, and then I think, largely because of the
insane clown Posse really kind of developed a reputation. But
like moon mist and what's some other popular flavors of Fago.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
Well, the red is the one that's always red roka
something right, Yeah, that is my dad's all time favorite,
you know, Detroit soda. So I would be remiss to
not bring it up, because I mean, missed. Papa Williams
is a very calm man, unless who don't talk about
his Fago.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
Rock and Rye is another one, rock and Rye, which
I believe what does it even taste like? It says
rock and Rye was a medicinal medley of rye, whiskey, rock, candy,
citrus and herbs. Now that was the original. Now it's
a light vanilla cream soda with a hint of semi
tart cherry flavor had nothing to do with anything from
(28:19):
the cocktail.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
And this is yeah, this is weird because we see
that the names are so fascinating in every case of
a soda we're talking about that's been discontinued. By the way,
there's probably gonna be a grassroots movement to save it.
Like you can go to save Josta online before Loki
you can you can see. I think the Saved Tap
Soda Committee took out billboards to try to get Coca
(28:42):
Cola to bring back tab for some reason.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
Do you guys remember High Sea Ecto cooler. Yeah, huge
glaciers item and they carbonated. There was a period. There
was a brief period where they were available again in
cans because originally they were in the little juice boxes.
But it was a tie in with Ghostbusters, I believe,
the real Ghostbusters cartoon. It wasn't necessarily the first Ghostbusters movie,
but it had Slimer on it. It was green, but
(29:12):
it tasted like orange. Yeah, that was the whole deal.
But I briefly when it was around, I bought a
case of it on Amazon, thinking that it was going
to be available now and again forever, and it wasn't.
And now you can go online and find those going
for a pretty penny. Nice Did you keep it?
Speaker 1 (29:28):
No?
Speaker 2 (29:28):
I drank them because I was like, yeah, Acto Cooler's back.
We're all good, not that I would needed to be
buying those on the regular, but yeah, nostalgia, you know,
and we should talk about that aspect, especially when it
comes to things like ginger ale, root beer coke. A
lot of this stuff capitalizes on nostalgia. Yeah, it's it's programming.
It's brilliant.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
The study of the history of modern soda is also
a study in social psychology. It's also a study in
good marketing. It's it's a study in accessing or incepting
people's memories.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
You know.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
It's it's quite effective too, and that's why they like,
they tried so much stuff. I mentioned Polka cola that
was made to promote polka music. Whoopy soda was woopy.
Speaker 2 (30:16):
Soda cushions making.
Speaker 1 (30:21):
They had they had a contest where they said, we
will give you up to five hundred dollars if you
write a letter talking about your saddus most injurious or
embarrassing experience trying to take off the bottle cap of
a whoopee soda that.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
Was really weird.
Speaker 1 (30:38):
That's that's kind of self deprecating to a dangerous level.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
And this so this.
Speaker 1 (30:46):
This concept, this nostalgic goes on what we're seeing. The
reason bringing up Polka soda is because that is just
one example of a soda company finding pre existing communities
and memories that people already share and then just sort
of inserting a soda in that situation, kind of like
(31:08):
when Wayne's World one or two, I can't remember, did
that amazing stuff about native advertising where they just started
drinking pepsi and talking about how they'd never sell out totally.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Yes, yeah, oh man, like it's a little yellow, different
new print exactly exactly.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
I do have to I do have to shout out
doctor enough. And it seems like you guys are interested
in learning.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
A little bit of that. Okay.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
So the East Tennessee, toward the northeast part of the
state is home to an area called the Tri Cities.
This is Bristol, Kingsport, and Johnson City. Bristol's in Virginia,
and in nineteen forty nine something called the Tri City
Beverage Corporation started bodiling a drink doctor Enough, invented by
(32:02):
a guide named Charles Gordon Enough Enough.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
It does not sound like a particularly attractive branding play.
I don't know he said this was this so weird? Right?
Speaker 1 (32:13):
Because it's nineteen forty nine, So the medicinal thing is
still kind of in the mix for people. You're not
just selling you know, liquid candy. And his advertising was
a little bit too hardcore's a little bit militant. Doctor
enough was supposed to relieve people's quote untold misery from
aches and paids, stomach disturbances and malaise. That okay, doesn't sound.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Fun, No, no it doesn't, but it.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
Tastes pretty good. It's like a lemon lime kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
Yeah, you know, well again that's the thing. We get
into a certain place where there's nothing new under the sun,
and when it comes to sodas and then now you'll
see Coke occasionally release these limited runs of like Starlight,
and they all taste like crap. They're not good, they're
too sugary. But they're banking on that thing that you said,
Ben about everyone maybe we'll try a thing once. And
(33:05):
that's why they don't stick around, because they're just you know,
capitalizing on everyone wanting to try it once. And I everyone,
I just mean, you know, enough people to warrant having
the thing come out. But they're you know, everything's a
lemon lime kind of thing, some sort of cola product
some sort of you know, mountain dew esque thing, uh,
and root beer and and of course ginger ale. But
(33:27):
then there's not like new soda. Well there's like it's
taken off. There's novelty soda. Has it taken off?
Speaker 1 (33:34):
And I gotta say for anybody who finds themselves in
East Tennessee, doctor enough is worth it. It's great.
Speaker 2 (33:40):
It's not.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
And also ran I think regional sodas have a great
appeal too, because they start people start associating them with
an area's identity, right like cheer wine or.
Speaker 2 (33:50):
Fago or fago. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
And I think burners burners of course. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
There's another one that gave rise to modern slang, which
is moxie. I didn't know when somebody says you've got moxie,
they're referencing a soda.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
No way, I would have been certain that it was
the other way around. Please tell us more so.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
Moxi soda is created as a medicine in eighteen seventy eight,
and the creator, Augustine Thompson, originally calls it moxie nerve food.
He says this medicine contains a proprietary, quite rare South
American plants. I refuse to name it in public. Now
we know what it is, Gentian root. And he said,
(34:35):
I've named this after a dear friend of mine, one
Lieutenant Moxie, who adventured in South America and who discovered
this rare plant that is the basis of my nerve food.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
Nerve food real Indiana Jones type figure. Huh. Yeah. And
apparently the term much more likely came from a Native
American word moxie, which means dark water. Which that's that
tracks for like a soda. You know, most cola type
or root beer type sodas. They're dark water with bubbles,
(35:07):
And that was used in the names of some of
the bodies of water near where Thompson was born.
Speaker 1 (35:13):
Yeah, so I think they embellished at least a little.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
Oh you thinks. What about the other claims made about
what this product could do for your health wise? Oh right,
right right, snake oil all the way right, Yeah, it's
patent medicine style.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Yeah, paralla, are you paralyzed? Get some moxie. Can't sleep,
Get some moxie. Need to wake up? Get some moxie. Uh,
you know, stuff shop and it's it's it becomes a
soft drink, right.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Yeah, and the syrup existed in eighteen seventy eight, but
it wasn't until eighteen eighty four that it was mixed up,
like you said, with carbonated water. So the earlier version
of it would have been much more like those snake
oil remedies that we talked about in the previous episode,
But it wasn't until eighteen eighty four that it was
mass produced and bottled and sold, you know, to the
like the Lowell Sun did an article on the drink
(36:03):
talking about how it became super popular in New England
but never got nearly as successful as Coca cola.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
Yeah, and the term moxie is actually more popular than
the soda because people started using it as slaying to
describe someone who seemed very determined or.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
Yeah. It makes me think of a really great I
Love Lucy episode where she's being a spokes person or
spokesmodel for this product on like you know, the Craft
whatever hour of television when ads were done live called
Vita meta vegimin. I bet a lot of yes, I
remember that one, and they had a slogan which she's like,
(36:45):
Vita meat a veggiemin spoon your way to health. But
the joke was that it had like a ton of
alcohol in it, and they kept making her drink it
as she did successive takes, and by the end of
it she's Vita mood of vision mood. It was a
whole bit very fun. I love Lucy holds up it does.
It does a comedic genius at work. There There are,
(37:06):
of course, novelty, weird sodas, like you can find black
garlic flavor, onion flavor, pumpkin pie flavor one maybe like
you're saying with Jones, Yeah, like Jones.
Speaker 1 (37:19):
One I think would be interesting to try the next
time when we finally travel across the Pacific together is
that Japan has a curry flavored soda. I don't think
it's going to be good, but I do think we
should try it.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
You know, there's a really cool bar that's keeps winning,
like best bar in America I'm not mistaken in New
York called Double Chicken Please. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
I haven't been, but it's hard to get into. But
they do like a cold soba noodle cocktail, and they
do one that's like leftover pizza and stuff. But apparently
they're all like they sound gimmicky, but they're actually really
(37:56):
good and like very Willy Wonka esque in their creations.
We didn't mention Sasparrella Sioux City sasparella. They call that
like a soft sasparella. That was one of the early
kind of root rootie drinks that were, you know, sold
as an alternative for those that maybe did not want
to imbibe the harder stuff. And it's kind of like
root beer. You can still get it. It very much
(38:18):
tastes like root beer, but you can get it like
Cracker Barrel where they have all the different vintage sodas.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
Uh huh and all the recordings you could ever want.
Speaker 3 (38:26):
The golden What is the falla New Vegas equivalent to that?
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Oh, I don't know. It's just it's just called Nuka Cola.
Speaker 3 (38:34):
Well, no, there's Nuca Cola by New Vegas. There's a Sasparillo.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
I don't remember the Yeah, I don't remember that.
Speaker 3 (38:41):
But that's that's the big joke, because it's the only
one where Nuca Cola does not run the whole show.
Speaker 2 (38:46):
Got it? Yeah? I do. I do love me some
New Vegas. I need to get back into that one too.
We got to get through Skyrim first, guys got to
get through Skyrim.
Speaker 5 (38:53):
I and I I love Sky. I turned through Sky.
You don't know I did last time. I went to
the Land of Dragons and was underpowered, and I kept
getting my ass handed to get.
Speaker 1 (39:06):
Buggy with the DLC to be fair and early official patch. Yeah, well,
we'll consider it.
Speaker 2 (39:12):
But then are were Have we reached the end of
our our carbonated adventure, our journey into the heart of soda?
Speaker 1 (39:22):
I believe we are with a brief epilogue or coda.
I think we'd safe for us to say, do what
makes you happy, be responsible, but try, don't be afraid
to try weird or new or unfamiliar with soda. And
we can't wait to hear about the weirdest ones you found.
There is one soda that I do think. I hope
you guys grow with me. No one should drink birds
(39:44):
nest soda. I don't think you should drink it because
birds nest like the fungus from it. It's problematic the
way they get it. So that's the only soda I
think you shouldn't drink.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
It's not the one made of virgin boys urine, is it? No?
Speaker 1 (39:58):
No, not the the eggs oh gosh.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
There was also what's that really gross? One from Italy?
They let you sample with the World of Coke. Oh god, Beverly,
Oh yeah, no way. Yeah. There are two sodas that
no one should try. Sunset That Sunset saspa fall in
New Vegas.
Speaker 3 (40:20):
That one person who's very mad at us for not
remembering that remember it now?
Speaker 1 (40:24):
Yea.
Speaker 2 (40:26):
Also chill out, don't be mad at a podcast Mellow Yellow,
quite right. I love that song.
Speaker 1 (40:32):
Thank you so much to our super producer, mister Max Williams.
This has been This has been a heck of a
soda week, and I gotta say, also, nol, thank you,
thank you for letting me do this as a therapy session.
I thought I end up missing soda more, but I
feel like now we kind of understand more of the
context and I'll be okay, just sticking to coffee and water.
Speaker 2 (40:55):
Got to exercise those soda demons. Thank you as well, Bam.
This is a nostalgia last to the cranium for me
as well. Huge thanks to super producer Max Williams Alex
Williams who composed this theme.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
Big big thanks to Jonathan Strickland aka the Quist as
he's known on the mean streets of the Ridiculous Universe.
Speaker 2 (41:15):
Big big thanks, of.
Speaker 1 (41:16):
Course to let's see who else, Chrispheros yotis.
Speaker 2 (41:20):
Aj Jacobs, the Puzzler, who is now kind of I
think he's accepted our invitation into the Ridiculous Universe. So
maybe we'll have to have the Puzzler and the Quiztor
have some sort of you know, puzzle off. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:34):
Fun, It'll be like when Hannibal Lecter meets another serial killer.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
Just so, we'll see you next time, folks. For more
podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or
wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Ridiculous History News
Hosts And Creators
Ben Bowlin
Noel Brown
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