November 24, 2021 • 31 mins
This North American grain is technically neither rice nor truly wild, but has been cared for and harvested by indigenous peoples for thousands of years. Anney and Lauren dip into the history and science behind wild rice.
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Speaker 1 (00:08):
Hello, and welcome to Savor production of iHeart Radio. I'm
Any Reese and I'm Lauren Vogelbaum, and today we have
an episode for you about wild rice. Yes, UM, and
this was a really fascinating one to learn about. And
Lauren and I were discussing it earlier. And I don't
think I've ever had true wild rice. I've had something
(00:29):
labeled as wild rice, but I don't think it was
wild rice. Yeah, I'm questioning now, and I'm honestly not sure.
I know that certainly, UM, in the late eighties, early nineties,
I ate a number of products that were labeled wild
(00:49):
rice UM. One or two of them might have been
like traditional actual wild rice. I suspect a lot of
it is cultivated UM, and maybe not even the same
species that we're talking about. So who knows, who knows? UM. Well,
(01:12):
some of you do not necessarily about what we've had.
If you did, be impressed, I mean a little bit,
a little but yeah, yeah, let us know about that.
Several of you have written in about wild rice UM.
We previously read a note from Cecilia about it, and
(01:33):
Kelly wrote it's an important part of indigenous foodways, especially
around the Great lakes and it's a good holiday season topic.
Sean Sherman is a native chef who goes by the
Sioux Chef working in the Twin Cities to promote indigenous
ingredients and recipes. He'd be a great person to talk
to you about wild rice, which thank you as always
for resources. We love that, yes, yes, yes, um, and
(01:53):
we did check it out and it was very informative
and and a lot of cool stuff. Oh yeah, yeah,
and right Sean Sherman, um the Sioux Chef, Yes, s
i o u X chef. Yeah. A great, great human person,
very knowledgeable, very um personable in his videos. Um, oh gosh.
And I would love to get back to what interviewing
(02:16):
humans I know someday someday, someday. Um. In the meantime,
you can see our past episode on rice, the one
that nearly broke my brain. Yep. But but that is
not what we're talking about today. And uh, speaking of
does this bring us to our question? Why, yes, I
(02:38):
think it does? Wild rice? What is it? Well? Wild
rice is the common English language term for a few
species of a of a type of grain that looks
a bit like other grains that are called rice. But um,
but usually longer and skinnier UM, and their skin still
(03:00):
attached green to tan to brown when raw. Generally when
cooked dark brown, with the skin split to reveal the
creamy grain inside. Um. The skin is a little bit chewy,
the grain is soft. The flavor tends to be nuttier
and a little savory. Can be somewhat smoky depending on
how it's produced. Uh, it sounds to me, and I'm
(03:22):
like craving this thing that I'm not sure I've ever had.
But it just sounds like like like fall in a bowl. Yes, yeah,
I love it. Texture sounds so interesting to me too.
I I want it. I wanted Yeah, I I think
I'm going to go order some wild rice, like after
we finish this episode anyway. Um. Yeah. The term wild
(03:44):
rice is a bit of a misnomer, though it's not
closely related to other grains that we call rice, which
are in the genus ariza Um. Wild rice species are
in the genus Zizania, which is more closely related to
corn Um. All our members of the grass family Um
poossier though, and I would also argue that that wild
(04:06):
rice isn't truly wild as such. Um, although it is
traditionally allowed to grow naturally. It's been carefully tended and
kept for thousands of years, though that's not the same
thing as cultivation. It's more like more like cooperation, i'd say,
and it is also now cultivated in some places. More
(04:27):
about all of that um uh throughout most of this episode,
but for now um Three species of Zazania are native
to North America. Um one is from the Great Lakes region,
one from the Atlantic and Gulf coasts, and one from
Central Texas. All are tall semi aquatic grasses that that
route down into the shallow shore beds of slow flowing
(04:47):
rivers and lakes and other bodies of fresh water, including
artificial agricultural patties, and then these plants will grow tall
stocks some two meters or six plus feet above the waterline,
with these a long narrow leaves and and and loose
clusters of little white to purple flowers that, when pollinated,
will develop long narrow seeds with dark skins and fibrous holes.
(05:12):
UM Euroastum dry whole the seeds and then can keep
them and reconstitute them by cooking in liquid until they
are soft and fluffy. At that point they are used
in all the tasty ways that grains are used to
make sweet or savory porridges or puddings, to thicken soups
and stews, to make pull offs um puffed out into
(05:33):
crunchy snacks, or to make flour that can be cooked
up in cakes or other pastries. In some cultures, like
the a Jibway people around the Great Lakes, it's also
used medicinally um as a part of poultices, for example,
and ceremonially um as an offering in things like funerals.
One species in the genus is now native to China. UM.
(05:55):
It's grown in South China and used there more for
its stem um peeled a vegetable, which is I've heard
crisp and a little bit sweet, sort of like bamboo shoots.
Um more more than a vegetable as a grain. Um.
But you can also eat other species this way, but
I don't think that that's common particularly. Huh yeah right, interesting? Yes,
(06:17):
Well what about the nutrition? It can range a little bit,
but wild rice is a good source of carbohydrates and protein,
much more protein than brown rice, for example. UM, it's
got a good smattering of micronutrients. It's low in fat um,
so it will fill you up and help keep you going.
But you should probably pair it with like a little
bit more fat and you know, like eat a vegetable always, always, always, always, Yes,
(06:42):
we do have some numbers for you. California and Minnesota
are the top growers of wild rice in seven. Minnesota
named wild rice their official state grain. UM and it
has grown in a few other places around the world
I think Hungry Australia and New Zealand, and apparently it's invasive.
(07:03):
In New Zealand, about four to five thousand people participate
in the hand harvesting of wild rice each year. In Minnesota,
there are some sixty four thousand acres of wild rice
growing naturally in some two thousand lakes and rivers and
UM on a good day, with a good pair of
harvesters or or ricers working together, you can harvest some
(07:27):
two and fifty kilos or fifty pounds. However, UM, today
about of what's produced is from cultivated fields. Yes, and
there is quite a bit of history about how we
have arrived at this point, absolutely, and we are going
(07:48):
to get into that history as soon as we get
back from a quick break. For word from our sponsor,
and we're back, Thank you sponsored, Yes, thank you. So.
Wild rice is native to North America, where it mainly
grows in the Great Lakes region and has been eaten
(08:10):
by people there since prehistoric times. Yeah, and the plant
is thought to have been there before the people by
about a millennium or so. It's actually really interesting ongoing
research because apparently the pollen from wild rice species has
not kept up in the fossil record the same way
that other types of pollen has, so they've had to
(08:30):
like like create new ways of detecting it. Really cool stuff.
Um anyway, Yes, uh, it's also thought that the species
now found in China propagated there from North America. Oh
that is fascinating. Yeah, I love it. Wild rice was
a staple for several Native American tribes, especially the Ojibwe, Nominee,
and Cree, where it was frequently eaten with squash, corn beans,
(08:53):
maybe some meat, maybe some maple sugar, or also used
as a soup thickener. When European fur traders arrived in
this area, indigenous peoples introduced them to wild rice, and
it was called all kinds of things. The wild rice
is the name that stuck. The harvesting wild rice was
labor intensive, so while some indigenous folks traded it with Europeans.
(09:17):
Most harvested just enough for their families or traded it
with other tribes UM. Before the Europeans arrived, women typically
harvested the rice, but men became fully involved in the
nineteen thirties. UH. The traditional process is now encoded in
law in Minnesota UM and it involves canoeing out through
(09:37):
the grasses in pairs, one person doing the polling and
one the threshing, gently using using these two poles to
to just knock the seeds off the stalks into the canoe.
Um And the preservation process of drying and hauling is
also labor intensive, involving low and slow roasting and hand hauling.
(09:58):
And wild rice is so cultur really important to the
ojibway that it is involved in the story of how
they arrived in Minnesota in the sixteen hundreds. As the
story goes that they followed a vision telling them to
search for her home quote where the food floats on water.
When they found the wild rice growing in Minnesota, they
knew they'd found the place to settle. They named wild
(10:19):
rice a word that meant good berry, harvesting berry or
one drous grain and it is grammatically referred to as
him or her rather than it in the language. Their
word for it is Monoman. And there's also a story
in an Ashnabeg oral history um uh the Addastiona Beg
being a larger group of people, including the ajibway that
(10:40):
tells of a hunter coming home empty handed one day
and discovering a duck sitting on the edge of his kettle.
And the duck flies away, but the soup of wild
rice that the hunter finds in the kettle was the
best food he'd ever had, so um so, so after
he ate, he followed after the duck and found a
lake growing with wild rice. Um and uh. The duck
(11:04):
is not a random duck. A duck's another waterfowl do
also eat wild rice, so it all fits together. Oh,
I love that random duck or not random duck. Between
the seven years were and the end of the Napoleonic era,
wild rice became the subject of study and investigation in
(11:24):
North America and Europe. Europeans believed that it might be
the next big thing for them due to a variety
of conflicts, natural disasters, and loss of US exports. However,
the Europeans could never quite figure out how to domesticate
it and eventually gave up. But there are several research
papers on this alone um which I found really interesting.
(11:46):
In eighteen thirty seven, the Treaty of Mendota claimed Ojibway
land for the US government, and this began a long
history of disrupting their food ways and culture. In eighteen
fifty four, the first reservations were established with the promise
of food rations, and traditional food systems were restricted up
until nineteen sixty five. In the US, most wild rice
(12:09):
was produced naturally, though there had been a few efforts
prior to grow it as a field crop. According to
the written record, the first instance of this took place
in eighteen fifty two with Joseph Bowen from Wisconsin, and
he suggested giving giving this idea shot UM. Minnesota man
Oliver H. Kelly suggested the same a year later in
eighteen fifty three. Despite this, people didn't seriously attempt growing
(12:32):
wild rice as a field crop here in the US
until nineteen fifty. And I know it's mostly in the US,
but you never know. I didn't run across any other instance,
but yeah, yeah, yeah, they're Canada can be involved as well,
so yeah, yes, James and Gerald Godward out of Minnesota
were some of the first to give growing wild rice
(12:53):
a go um that year in nineteen fifty, and by
ninety eight they had on twenty acres of patties dedicated
to growing wild rice. Others got in the business to
including Uncle Ben in the nineteen sixties that they offered
their first wild rice products in nineteen sixty one. The
industry grew even further in the sixties and seventies with
(13:13):
the development of shatter resistant varieties. For example, production acreage
dedicated to wild rice in Minnesota was nine hundred in
nineteen sixty eight. In nineteen seventy three, the number was
eighteen thousand acres. Yeah. California started commercially growing wild rice
in nineteen seventy seven UM. And Yeah, before all of this,
(13:36):
wild rice was traditionally harvested by hand. The mechanical harvesting
on private lands was first documented in Canada in nineteen
seventeen UM, and these shadow resistant varieties allowed for more
mechanical harvesting. Yeah. The the University of Minnesota's Agricultural Extension
was working on all of this. UM. They would release
(13:57):
nine different strains for cultivation from nineteen sixty eight through
the year two thousand, UM all bred too in varying
conditions UM ripe and simultaneously and withstand mechanical combine harvesting UM.
So by the mid nineteen eighties, most of the supply
of wild rice was in fact cultivated and commercial. Yes,
(14:23):
and as more and more non native people started selling
wild rice, it was appropriated and the meeting was muddied.
A lot of stuff sold under the name wild rice
UM was not and is not in fact wild rice UM.
A white owned Patti rice companies centered in California were
largely behind making wild rice a marketable product in the seventies. Yeah,
(14:44):
and by the eighties UM California was producing three times
as much as Minnesota, and this drove up the price.
Because of this, native people's and non native people's flocked
to harvest it, often too early or taking too much
before the rice could receive itself. Yeah. Most species are annuals,
not perennials, so they need to um to recede to
(15:05):
replant themselves every year. And part of the traditional harvesting method,
the threshing, allows for a certain number of seeds, a
good number of seeds to fall down into the water
where they can um uh later germanate rights. And another
issue was that sometimes seed varieties from other waterways were
planted in their place, racing historic strains. The University of
(15:28):
Minnesota created a strain with a thicker stem that could
withstand mechanical harvesting, and this strain cross pollinated with native
ones as well. Furthermore, the changes made to the land
in order to cultivate wild rice in patties, you know,
the the dams and version of waterways, the agricultural runoff
(15:48):
harmed the local ecosystems, making traditional harvests more difficult. The
decimation of the crop had a huge impact on this
source of income for local try and going back even further,
colonial forces fundamentally changed traditional Native American food ways, including
how wild rice was harvested. When it comes to things
(16:10):
like yes land loss, establishment of reservations, dependence on government
food and payments, and poverty. Tribes like the Ojibwe still
do traditional wild rice harvest in the phase of all
of this as part of the fight to preserve their
cultural heritage and food ways. In the words of Logan Cloud,
a member of the Jibwi tribe, when we began to
(16:30):
mechanize the parching. We started thinking in a colonized way.
Processing rice became easier, but our lives did not get easier.
If it weren't for the rice, Ojibwi culture wouldn't be
here today, and if we lose it, we won't exist
as a people for long. Will be done too. In
the Minnesota legislature outlawed mechanical harvest and placed the limits
(16:50):
around when and how wild rice could be harvested. Later,
they added to these laws limiting the size of canoe
and hours for ricing. Still, it was identified as an
in dangered food in the nineteen nineties. On top of
over harvesting and lack of care win harvesting, things like
climate change, dams, construction, and pollution have also had an
impact on wild rice. And I did want to just
(17:13):
put a note in here because I feel like we've
talked about this a lot where um, it's always good
to look at who the impetus behind making laws and
who was involved. Not saying that these were wrong or bad,
but sometimes something sounds really good. Yeah yeah, it's like, oh, hey,
protect this natural resource. But I mean it depends on
how you go about that, right exactly. So just like
(17:35):
a little yeah. Yeah, if you if you don't, if
you don't involve, um, the people who know about that
natural resource and whose lives it's loss will affect, then um,
you're you're not You're not doing the right work right,
especially if you're you, as someone from the outside, are
(17:55):
kind of the calls of the cause of the problem. Exactly, yeah, exactly.
So just a little note about that. Native peoples have
come together to combat all of this. In the Fon
du Lac and Bois Fort bands came together to form
the Wild Rice Restoration Plan for the St. Louis River
Watershed with the goal of restoring and managing wild rice.
(18:19):
Committees were formed to manage harvest, and the White Earth
Land Recovery Project, founded in nine by political activists and
White Earth Tribe member Winona La Duke, started selling hand
harvested rice. They've organized rice in camps to teach traditional
ricing methods, collaborated on things like native food sovereignty, and
come together to protest the in Bridge Line three oil
(18:41):
pipeline replacement project and Line five oil pipeline that could
impact lands where wild rice is grown. Yeah, there is
now a consortium of representatives from the Jibwe and from
the University of Minnesota that meets regularly to talk about
ethics and sensitivity regarding the research and the commerce and
(19:02):
uh tribal culture and resources. And according to the University
of Minnesota anyway, UM, the indigenous people and traditions are
are really leading the conversations UM and dictating the type
and directions of research here. So that's that's good finally. Yeah. Um. However, UM,
(19:22):
as with many edible plants, UM, climate change is a
threat to naturally growing wild rice. UM. Winters in the
region are warming UM, which is a problem because the
seeds need freezing temperatures in order to germinate. Also, water
levels being steady are important. If they're either too high
or too shallow, the crop that year will fail um. Uh.
(19:46):
And it is concerning. On one reservation, yields have dropped
from about two hundred pounds of rice per family per
year in the nineteen twenties to less than eighty pounds
UM today. Uh that's like nine kilos down to klos
So yeah, yeah, it's very concerning. Um. It's hardening to
(20:10):
see these conversations happening also forever. Yeah, but yeah, there's
still so much Um, so much work that needs to
be done. And I'm glad that you know, these we're
finally listening to these two who who have so much
(20:32):
tradition and information and knowledge. Yeah. Yeah, and and again,
like I mean I kind of said this towards the top,
but like it's just such an important lesson. I think that, um,
what Europeans, what like white Europeans traditionally considered to be cultivation,
is not the way that all of the people in
(20:54):
the world, um, grow their crops, and that you know,
these these food ways, these traditions are really amazing and
really important and just because they don't look like the
way that that you know, white people chose to raise
their crops doesn't mean that it's not valid and maybe
you should just let people do what they're doing, right, Yes, Um,
(21:18):
And there there really is so many um, there really
are so many resources out there about this, which is great.
So if you if you want to learn more, uh,
there's there's more out there for you, and it's all
interesting and definitely worth looking up. Yeah. Oh absolutely, And
um and a lot of a lot of places that
um that you can go online and support these people
(21:42):
in these cultures who are still producing in the traditional method,
and uh, I yeah, I like really want to do
this because I really I have such a craving Yeah,
I know for this food. I don't know if I've
ever had, and I want it right now. I too,
I too. Let's see if we can make it happen.
Lore okay, okay um. In the meantime, wish as luck listeners.
(22:04):
But that's what we have to say about wild rice
for now. It is. We do have some listener mail
for you, but first we've got one more quick break
for a word from our sponsor, and we're back. Thank you, yes,
thank you, And we're back with listener man like floating
(22:33):
to the ground, fall in a bowl. It's sorry to
capture s hard to capture via short Skype interface, but
you know, I think something happened there. I was like,
maybe it's the waving of the grass. I'm not sure
(22:55):
it could have been anything to I was going. I was,
I was going with you a little bit, okay, near you.
That's good enough, that's good enough. Um Keyanna or maybe
Kyana wrote so, I'm from Western Canada and I think
poutine culture is way different on this side of the
country than the east side. A ka Quebec, Ontario and Alberta.
(23:17):
If you were to call it poutin, most people would
look at you as if you had grown an extra head.
It's only ever said as poutine here. That being said,
my best friend's husband is from Ontario. He was horrified
when we called it poutine as opposed to the correct
way of putin. Also, if you order poutine from Burger
(23:38):
King you are very desperate. It barely counts as poutine
in my opinion anyways. Poutine aside Halloween food, I had
my Halloween party this year, as I do every year,
although there were some COVID restrictions, but there is no
way a little COVID could stop me. Don't worry. All
my restrictions were followed and things were stood accordingly. For
(24:02):
this year's food adventure, I had several things on the menu.
I had deviled eggs piped to look like brains, hot
dogs cut to look like fingers and cooked in cayenne
brown sugar glaze, peanut butter balls in the shape of ghost,
a spider egg nest made of black crookam bush and
spun sugar webs, squares of sugar cookie dough topped with cinnamon,
toast crunch, cereal marshallows, peanut butter and candy corn soule
(24:26):
pies made of mulberries, gojiberries and local Saskatoon berries cooked
in black tea, brown sugar and cardamom butter beer to drink.
And pumpkin chocolate chipcake filled with punkin pipe filling, iced
with brown butter butter cream and decorated to look like
a jack O lantern with homemade modeling chocolate. Yes, I've
also attached a picture of my handmade costume for this year.
(24:48):
I was a forest ferry and my four cats were
my mini fairy meals in an entertaining series of events.
I was also gifted a party hosting gift. It was
a pineapple. My guests have heard my rant about pineapple
facts courtesy of you from an early podcast episode, and
(25:09):
one of them but a reminder in their phone to
bring me a pineapple. This year, I carried it all
night long to show my wealthy status. One of my
kittens also enjoyed it. Oh my heck, that is a
so much more kitchen work than I think I've ever
done in my life. Yes, sounds amazing, but yes, right
(25:35):
heck that that all sounds really really really beautiful. Yes, um,
and pictures are sent looked amazing. I bet it was
so so fun, so delicious. I love that your friends
gave you a pineapple that is top notch, that you
carried it around all night as is appropriate, is only appropriate? Yes, yes,
(25:56):
And just a thank you to everyone who wrote it
in about poutine. Uh, we got another letter coming up,
but I'm loving all of these notes about poutine. In
the pronunciation of poutine, it's so good. Yeah, yes, it's definitely,
it's it's it's amazing. And also like a little slice
(26:17):
of of exactly why we stress out about pronunciations all
the time, because we're like, oh man, we're just not
going to get it. We're just never going to get
it right. Um, because there's regional pronunciations for things, exactly
and regional and yes, yes, goodness um yes, speaking of
(26:39):
Adam wrote, I just listened to your episode on poutine
and thought you might appreciate some insight and clarification from
a born and bread Canadian. Full disclosure, I am not
ka clase, but I promise I know my putine. Firstly,
on pronunciation, put in is correct. Putaine is French Canadian
slang for prostitute and used in the same way an
(27:01):
English speaker would use the S or F words. Um,
you'll be met with anything from giggles to death stairs
if you pronounce it that way, especially in Quebec. Poutine
is also widely accepted outside of Quebec. They're real purists, uh.
Though You'll have to be careful with this tube as
it can be construed in Spanish as small gay man
and maybe again met with giggles. On the subject of
(27:23):
disco fries. While I have never heard this term before,
every Canadian will definitely agree that it is not poutine.
I cannot begin to describe the feeling of disappointment when
I order a poutine at a new restaurant only to
be given a plate of fries and gravy with shredded cheese.
The absolute horror. Will I eat it anyway, Absolutely, but
(27:45):
it is not poutine. Some people, though, are not as
easy going as I am. I'll never forget one of
my first ships working at Salisbury House, a local chain
of greasy spoon diners in Winnipeg. UM. I had barely
been serving there a week and word came down that
we were switching from using cheese cards for our poutine
to the more affordable shredded cheese. I was young and stupid.
(28:08):
This was way more years ago than I cared to admit,
so I did not think it necessary to warn customers
of the change. If they ordered one. A table of
six ordered three to share. When I brought them out,
they said what the f is this, before refusing to
pay and walking out. This is an extreme example, but
the fact remains that people were upset. Over the next
(28:30):
few weeks, we received many letters and emails demanding that
we switched back to Kurds, but we never did. Some
people just don't respect the sanctity of the poutine. To close,
here's my ranking of all of the fast food chain poutines,
and yes, every fast food joint up here serves it. One.
Wendy's the best, especially with bacon. Two Pope Eyes, Popeyes
(28:54):
has poutine okay, that's great. H three A and W four,
Burger King, five, KFC, and six McDonald's trash but scratches
the itch. I love this, Oh, I love it. I
love it. We have so many more letters to read.
I kid you not. Someone else did like a very
(29:17):
similar ranking. That's wonderful. I'm so delighted by all of this.
I you know, I mean, I mean to be fair,
Like I have a personal ranking of like french fries
at fast food places, So there's no reason why you
shouldn't have a ranking for poutine at fast food places.
Absolutely absolutely, um. And we love hearing these rankings and
(29:37):
they're very delightful. Um. Also, people have written in about
disco friers, which were good, good, important, Yes, but people
they are the shredded cheese used to call some consternation.
If I were expecting cheese cards and I got shredded cheese,
(29:58):
I would also be like, yeah, like what no, what right? No?
Just so uh yeah, yeah, I'm I'm surprised they didn't
change back. That's yeah right. It sounds like there was
(30:21):
like a lot of public pressure. It does, it does? Uh?
And also yeah, thanks for the pronunciation notes, um and
giving us more reasons to fear miss pronouncing it. Do
you appreciate it? But now I'm even more nervous than before. Yeah,
(30:42):
we're learning, we're learning to fear. Yeah. We like horror
movies stuff like to Live on the edge over here. Yes, well,
thanks to both of those listeners are writing in. If
you would like to write to us, you can or
email us hello at savor pod dot com. And we're
(31:03):
also on social media. You can find us on Twitter, Facebook,
and Instagram at savor pod and we do hope to
hear from you. Savor is production of I Heart Radio.
For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can visit
the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you
listen to your favorite shows. Thanks as always to our
superproducers Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening,
(31:23):
and we hope that lots more good things are coming
your way
Hello, and welcome to Savor production of iHeart Radio. I'm
Any Reese and I'm Lauren Vogelbaum, and today we have
an episode for you about wild rice. Yes, UM, and
this was a really fascinating one to learn about. And
Lauren and I were discussing it earlier. And I don't
think I've ever had true wild rice. I've had something
(00:29):
labeled as wild rice, but I don't think it was
wild rice. Yeah, I'm questioning now, and I'm honestly not sure.
I know that certainly, UM, in the late eighties, early nineties,
I ate a number of products that were labeled wild
(00:49):
rice UM. One or two of them might have been
like traditional actual wild rice. I suspect a lot of
it is cultivated UM, and maybe not even the same
species that we're talking about. So who knows, who knows? UM. Well,
(01:12):
some of you do not necessarily about what we've had.
If you did, be impressed, I mean a little bit,
a little but yeah, yeah, let us know about that.
Several of you have written in about wild rice UM.
We previously read a note from Cecilia about it, and
(01:33):
Kelly wrote it's an important part of indigenous foodways, especially
around the Great lakes and it's a good holiday season topic.
Sean Sherman is a native chef who goes by the
Sioux Chef working in the Twin Cities to promote indigenous
ingredients and recipes. He'd be a great person to talk
to you about wild rice, which thank you as always
for resources. We love that, yes, yes, yes, um, and
(01:53):
we did check it out and it was very informative
and and a lot of cool stuff. Oh yeah, yeah,
and right Sean Sherman, um the Sioux Chef, Yes, s
i o u X chef. Yeah. A great, great human person,
very knowledgeable, very um personable in his videos. Um, oh gosh.
And I would love to get back to what interviewing
(02:16):
humans I know someday someday, someday. Um. In the meantime,
you can see our past episode on rice, the one
that nearly broke my brain. Yep. But but that is
not what we're talking about today. And uh, speaking of
does this bring us to our question? Why, yes, I
(02:38):
think it does? Wild rice? What is it? Well? Wild
rice is the common English language term for a few
species of a of a type of grain that looks
a bit like other grains that are called rice. But um,
but usually longer and skinnier UM, and their skin still
(03:00):
attached green to tan to brown when raw. Generally when
cooked dark brown, with the skin split to reveal the
creamy grain inside. Um. The skin is a little bit chewy,
the grain is soft. The flavor tends to be nuttier
and a little savory. Can be somewhat smoky depending on
how it's produced. Uh, it sounds to me, and I'm
(03:22):
like craving this thing that I'm not sure I've ever had.
But it just sounds like like like fall in a bowl. Yes, yeah,
I love it. Texture sounds so interesting to me too.
I I want it. I wanted Yeah, I I think
I'm going to go order some wild rice, like after
we finish this episode anyway. Um. Yeah. The term wild
(03:44):
rice is a bit of a misnomer, though it's not
closely related to other grains that we call rice, which
are in the genus ariza Um. Wild rice species are
in the genus Zizania, which is more closely related to
corn Um. All our members of the grass family Um
poossier though, and I would also argue that that wild
(04:06):
rice isn't truly wild as such. Um, although it is
traditionally allowed to grow naturally. It's been carefully tended and
kept for thousands of years, though that's not the same
thing as cultivation. It's more like more like cooperation, i'd say,
and it is also now cultivated in some places. More
(04:27):
about all of that um uh throughout most of this episode,
but for now um Three species of Zazania are native
to North America. Um one is from the Great Lakes region,
one from the Atlantic and Gulf coasts, and one from
Central Texas. All are tall semi aquatic grasses that that
route down into the shallow shore beds of slow flowing
(04:47):
rivers and lakes and other bodies of fresh water, including
artificial agricultural patties, and then these plants will grow tall
stocks some two meters or six plus feet above the waterline,
with these a long narrow leaves and and and loose
clusters of little white to purple flowers that, when pollinated,
will develop long narrow seeds with dark skins and fibrous holes.
(05:12):
UM Euroastum dry whole the seeds and then can keep
them and reconstitute them by cooking in liquid until they
are soft and fluffy. At that point they are used
in all the tasty ways that grains are used to
make sweet or savory porridges or puddings, to thicken soups
and stews, to make pull offs um puffed out into
(05:33):
crunchy snacks, or to make flour that can be cooked
up in cakes or other pastries. In some cultures, like
the a Jibway people around the Great Lakes, it's also
used medicinally um as a part of poultices, for example,
and ceremonially um as an offering in things like funerals.
One species in the genus is now native to China. UM.
(05:55):
It's grown in South China and used there more for
its stem um peeled a vegetable, which is I've heard
crisp and a little bit sweet, sort of like bamboo shoots.
Um more more than a vegetable as a grain. Um.
But you can also eat other species this way, but
I don't think that that's common particularly. Huh yeah right, interesting? Yes,
(06:17):
Well what about the nutrition? It can range a little bit,
but wild rice is a good source of carbohydrates and protein,
much more protein than brown rice, for example. UM, it's
got a good smattering of micronutrients. It's low in fat um,
so it will fill you up and help keep you going.
But you should probably pair it with like a little
bit more fat and you know, like eat a vegetable always, always, always, always, Yes,
(06:42):
we do have some numbers for you. California and Minnesota
are the top growers of wild rice in seven. Minnesota
named wild rice their official state grain. UM and it
has grown in a few other places around the world
I think Hungry Australia and New Zealand, and apparently it's invasive.
(07:03):
In New Zealand, about four to five thousand people participate
in the hand harvesting of wild rice each year. In Minnesota,
there are some sixty four thousand acres of wild rice
growing naturally in some two thousand lakes and rivers and
UM on a good day, with a good pair of
harvesters or or ricers working together, you can harvest some
(07:27):
two and fifty kilos or fifty pounds. However, UM, today
about of what's produced is from cultivated fields. Yes, and
there is quite a bit of history about how we
have arrived at this point, absolutely, and we are going
(07:48):
to get into that history as soon as we get
back from a quick break. For word from our sponsor,
and we're back, Thank you sponsored, Yes, thank you. So.
Wild rice is native to North America, where it mainly
grows in the Great Lakes region and has been eaten
(08:10):
by people there since prehistoric times. Yeah, and the plant
is thought to have been there before the people by
about a millennium or so. It's actually really interesting ongoing
research because apparently the pollen from wild rice species has
not kept up in the fossil record the same way
that other types of pollen has, so they've had to
(08:30):
like like create new ways of detecting it. Really cool stuff.
Um anyway, Yes, uh, it's also thought that the species
now found in China propagated there from North America. Oh
that is fascinating. Yeah, I love it. Wild rice was
a staple for several Native American tribes, especially the Ojibwe, Nominee,
and Cree, where it was frequently eaten with squash, corn beans,
(08:53):
maybe some meat, maybe some maple sugar, or also used
as a soup thickener. When European fur traders arrived in
this area, indigenous peoples introduced them to wild rice, and
it was called all kinds of things. The wild rice
is the name that stuck. The harvesting wild rice was
labor intensive, so while some indigenous folks traded it with Europeans.
(09:17):
Most harvested just enough for their families or traded it
with other tribes UM. Before the Europeans arrived, women typically
harvested the rice, but men became fully involved in the
nineteen thirties. UH. The traditional process is now encoded in
law in Minnesota UM and it involves canoeing out through
(09:37):
the grasses in pairs, one person doing the polling and
one the threshing, gently using using these two poles to
to just knock the seeds off the stalks into the canoe.
Um And the preservation process of drying and hauling is
also labor intensive, involving low and slow roasting and hand hauling.
(09:58):
And wild rice is so cultur really important to the
ojibway that it is involved in the story of how
they arrived in Minnesota in the sixteen hundreds. As the
story goes that they followed a vision telling them to
search for her home quote where the food floats on water.
When they found the wild rice growing in Minnesota, they
knew they'd found the place to settle. They named wild
(10:19):
rice a word that meant good berry, harvesting berry or
one drous grain and it is grammatically referred to as
him or her rather than it in the language. Their
word for it is Monoman. And there's also a story
in an Ashnabeg oral history um uh the Addastiona Beg
being a larger group of people, including the ajibway that
(10:40):
tells of a hunter coming home empty handed one day
and discovering a duck sitting on the edge of his kettle.
And the duck flies away, but the soup of wild
rice that the hunter finds in the kettle was the
best food he'd ever had, so um so, so after
he ate, he followed after the duck and found a
lake growing with wild rice. Um and uh. The duck
(11:04):
is not a random duck. A duck's another waterfowl do
also eat wild rice, so it all fits together. Oh,
I love that random duck or not random duck. Between
the seven years were and the end of the Napoleonic era,
wild rice became the subject of study and investigation in
(11:24):
North America and Europe. Europeans believed that it might be
the next big thing for them due to a variety
of conflicts, natural disasters, and loss of US exports. However,
the Europeans could never quite figure out how to domesticate
it and eventually gave up. But there are several research
papers on this alone um which I found really interesting.
(11:46):
In eighteen thirty seven, the Treaty of Mendota claimed Ojibway
land for the US government, and this began a long
history of disrupting their food ways and culture. In eighteen
fifty four, the first reservations were established with the promise
of food rations, and traditional food systems were restricted up
until nineteen sixty five. In the US, most wild rice
(12:09):
was produced naturally, though there had been a few efforts
prior to grow it as a field crop. According to
the written record, the first instance of this took place
in eighteen fifty two with Joseph Bowen from Wisconsin, and
he suggested giving giving this idea shot UM. Minnesota man
Oliver H. Kelly suggested the same a year later in
eighteen fifty three. Despite this, people didn't seriously attempt growing
(12:32):
wild rice as a field crop here in the US
until nineteen fifty. And I know it's mostly in the US,
but you never know. I didn't run across any other instance,
but yeah, yeah, yeah, they're Canada can be involved as well,
so yeah, yes, James and Gerald Godward out of Minnesota
were some of the first to give growing wild rice
(12:53):
a go um that year in nineteen fifty, and by
ninety eight they had on twenty acres of patties dedicated
to growing wild rice. Others got in the business to
including Uncle Ben in the nineteen sixties that they offered
their first wild rice products in nineteen sixty one. The
industry grew even further in the sixties and seventies with
(13:13):
the development of shatter resistant varieties. For example, production acreage
dedicated to wild rice in Minnesota was nine hundred in
nineteen sixty eight. In nineteen seventy three, the number was
eighteen thousand acres. Yeah. California started commercially growing wild rice
in nineteen seventy seven UM. And Yeah, before all of this,
(13:36):
wild rice was traditionally harvested by hand. The mechanical harvesting
on private lands was first documented in Canada in nineteen
seventeen UM, and these shadow resistant varieties allowed for more
mechanical harvesting. Yeah. The the University of Minnesota's Agricultural Extension
was working on all of this. UM. They would release
(13:57):
nine different strains for cultivation from nineteen sixty eight through
the year two thousand, UM all bred too in varying
conditions UM ripe and simultaneously and withstand mechanical combine harvesting UM.
So by the mid nineteen eighties, most of the supply
of wild rice was in fact cultivated and commercial. Yes,
(14:23):
and as more and more non native people started selling
wild rice, it was appropriated and the meeting was muddied.
A lot of stuff sold under the name wild rice
UM was not and is not in fact wild rice UM.
A white owned Patti rice companies centered in California were
largely behind making wild rice a marketable product in the seventies. Yeah,
(14:44):
and by the eighties UM California was producing three times
as much as Minnesota, and this drove up the price.
Because of this, native people's and non native people's flocked
to harvest it, often too early or taking too much
before the rice could receive itself. Yeah. Most species are annuals,
not perennials, so they need to um to recede to
(15:05):
replant themselves every year. And part of the traditional harvesting method,
the threshing, allows for a certain number of seeds, a
good number of seeds to fall down into the water
where they can um uh later germanate rights. And another
issue was that sometimes seed varieties from other waterways were
planted in their place, racing historic strains. The University of
(15:28):
Minnesota created a strain with a thicker stem that could
withstand mechanical harvesting, and this strain cross pollinated with native
ones as well. Furthermore, the changes made to the land
in order to cultivate wild rice in patties, you know,
the the dams and version of waterways, the agricultural runoff
(15:48):
harmed the local ecosystems, making traditional harvests more difficult. The
decimation of the crop had a huge impact on this
source of income for local try and going back even further,
colonial forces fundamentally changed traditional Native American food ways, including
how wild rice was harvested. When it comes to things
(16:10):
like yes land loss, establishment of reservations, dependence on government
food and payments, and poverty. Tribes like the Ojibwe still
do traditional wild rice harvest in the phase of all
of this as part of the fight to preserve their
cultural heritage and food ways. In the words of Logan Cloud,
a member of the Jibwi tribe, when we began to
(16:30):
mechanize the parching. We started thinking in a colonized way.
Processing rice became easier, but our lives did not get easier.
If it weren't for the rice, Ojibwi culture wouldn't be
here today, and if we lose it, we won't exist
as a people for long. Will be done too. In
the Minnesota legislature outlawed mechanical harvest and placed the limits
(16:50):
around when and how wild rice could be harvested. Later,
they added to these laws limiting the size of canoe
and hours for ricing. Still, it was identified as an
in dangered food in the nineteen nineties. On top of
over harvesting and lack of care win harvesting, things like
climate change, dams, construction, and pollution have also had an
impact on wild rice. And I did want to just
(17:13):
put a note in here because I feel like we've
talked about this a lot where um, it's always good
to look at who the impetus behind making laws and
who was involved. Not saying that these were wrong or bad,
but sometimes something sounds really good. Yeah yeah, it's like, oh, hey,
protect this natural resource. But I mean it depends on
how you go about that, right exactly. So just like
(17:35):
a little yeah. Yeah, if you if you don't, if
you don't involve, um, the people who know about that
natural resource and whose lives it's loss will affect, then um,
you're you're not You're not doing the right work right,
especially if you're you, as someone from the outside, are
(17:55):
kind of the calls of the cause of the problem. Exactly, yeah, exactly.
So just a little note about that. Native peoples have
come together to combat all of this. In the Fon
du Lac and Bois Fort bands came together to form
the Wild Rice Restoration Plan for the St. Louis River
Watershed with the goal of restoring and managing wild rice.
(18:19):
Committees were formed to manage harvest, and the White Earth
Land Recovery Project, founded in nine by political activists and
White Earth Tribe member Winona La Duke, started selling hand
harvested rice. They've organized rice in camps to teach traditional
ricing methods, collaborated on things like native food sovereignty, and
come together to protest the in Bridge Line three oil
(18:41):
pipeline replacement project and Line five oil pipeline that could
impact lands where wild rice is grown. Yeah, there is
now a consortium of representatives from the Jibwe and from
the University of Minnesota that meets regularly to talk about
ethics and sensitivity regarding the research and the commerce and
(19:02):
uh tribal culture and resources. And according to the University
of Minnesota anyway, UM, the indigenous people and traditions are
are really leading the conversations UM and dictating the type
and directions of research here. So that's that's good finally. Yeah. Um. However, UM,
(19:22):
as with many edible plants, UM, climate change is a
threat to naturally growing wild rice. UM. Winters in the
region are warming UM, which is a problem because the
seeds need freezing temperatures in order to germinate. Also, water
levels being steady are important. If they're either too high
or too shallow, the crop that year will fail um. Uh.
(19:46):
And it is concerning. On one reservation, yields have dropped
from about two hundred pounds of rice per family per
year in the nineteen twenties to less than eighty pounds
UM today. Uh that's like nine kilos down to klos
So yeah, yeah, it's very concerning. Um. It's hardening to
(20:10):
see these conversations happening also forever. Yeah, but yeah, there's
still so much Um, so much work that needs to
be done. And I'm glad that you know, these we're
finally listening to these two who who have so much
(20:32):
tradition and information and knowledge. Yeah. Yeah, and and again,
like I mean I kind of said this towards the top,
but like it's just such an important lesson. I think that, um,
what Europeans, what like white Europeans traditionally considered to be cultivation,
is not the way that all of the people in
(20:54):
the world, um, grow their crops, and that you know,
these these food ways, these traditions are really amazing and
really important and just because they don't look like the
way that that you know, white people chose to raise
their crops doesn't mean that it's not valid and maybe
you should just let people do what they're doing, right, Yes, Um,
(21:18):
And there there really is so many um, there really
are so many resources out there about this, which is great.
So if you if you want to learn more, uh,
there's there's more out there for you, and it's all
interesting and definitely worth looking up. Yeah. Oh absolutely, And
um and a lot of a lot of places that
um that you can go online and support these people
(21:42):
in these cultures who are still producing in the traditional method,
and uh, I yeah, I like really want to do
this because I really I have such a craving Yeah,
I know for this food. I don't know if I've
ever had, and I want it right now. I too,
I too. Let's see if we can make it happen.
Lore okay, okay um. In the meantime, wish as luck listeners.
(22:04):
But that's what we have to say about wild rice
for now. It is. We do have some listener mail
for you, but first we've got one more quick break
for a word from our sponsor, and we're back. Thank you, yes,
thank you, And we're back with listener man like floating
(22:33):
to the ground, fall in a bowl. It's sorry to
capture s hard to capture via short Skype interface, but
you know, I think something happened there. I was like,
maybe it's the waving of the grass. I'm not sure
(22:55):
it could have been anything to I was going. I was,
I was going with you a little bit, okay, near you.
That's good enough, that's good enough. Um Keyanna or maybe
Kyana wrote so, I'm from Western Canada and I think
poutine culture is way different on this side of the
country than the east side. A ka Quebec, Ontario and Alberta.
(23:17):
If you were to call it poutin, most people would
look at you as if you had grown an extra head.
It's only ever said as poutine here. That being said,
my best friend's husband is from Ontario. He was horrified
when we called it poutine as opposed to the correct
way of putin. Also, if you order poutine from Burger
(23:38):
King you are very desperate. It barely counts as poutine
in my opinion anyways. Poutine aside Halloween food, I had
my Halloween party this year, as I do every year,
although there were some COVID restrictions, but there is no
way a little COVID could stop me. Don't worry. All
my restrictions were followed and things were stood accordingly. For
(24:02):
this year's food adventure, I had several things on the menu.
I had deviled eggs piped to look like brains, hot
dogs cut to look like fingers and cooked in cayenne
brown sugar glaze, peanut butter balls in the shape of ghost,
a spider egg nest made of black crookam bush and
spun sugar webs, squares of sugar cookie dough topped with cinnamon,
toast crunch, cereal marshallows, peanut butter and candy corn soule
(24:26):
pies made of mulberries, gojiberries and local Saskatoon berries cooked
in black tea, brown sugar and cardamom butter beer to drink.
And pumpkin chocolate chipcake filled with punkin pipe filling, iced
with brown butter butter cream and decorated to look like
a jack O lantern with homemade modeling chocolate. Yes, I've
also attached a picture of my handmade costume for this year.
(24:48):
I was a forest ferry and my four cats were
my mini fairy meals in an entertaining series of events.
I was also gifted a party hosting gift. It was
a pineapple. My guests have heard my rant about pineapple
facts courtesy of you from an early podcast episode, and
(25:09):
one of them but a reminder in their phone to
bring me a pineapple. This year, I carried it all
night long to show my wealthy status. One of my
kittens also enjoyed it. Oh my heck, that is a
so much more kitchen work than I think I've ever
done in my life. Yes, sounds amazing, but yes, right
(25:35):
heck that that all sounds really really really beautiful. Yes, um,
and pictures are sent looked amazing. I bet it was
so so fun, so delicious. I love that your friends
gave you a pineapple that is top notch, that you
carried it around all night as is appropriate, is only appropriate? Yes, yes,
(25:56):
And just a thank you to everyone who wrote it
in about poutine. Uh, we got another letter coming up,
but I'm loving all of these notes about poutine. In
the pronunciation of poutine, it's so good. Yeah, yes, it's definitely,
it's it's it's amazing. And also like a little slice
(26:17):
of of exactly why we stress out about pronunciations all
the time, because we're like, oh man, we're just not
going to get it. We're just never going to get
it right. Um, because there's regional pronunciations for things, exactly
and regional and yes, yes, goodness um yes, speaking of
(26:39):
Adam wrote, I just listened to your episode on poutine
and thought you might appreciate some insight and clarification from
a born and bread Canadian. Full disclosure, I am not
ka clase, but I promise I know my putine. Firstly,
on pronunciation, put in is correct. Putaine is French Canadian
slang for prostitute and used in the same way an
(27:01):
English speaker would use the S or F words. Um,
you'll be met with anything from giggles to death stairs
if you pronounce it that way, especially in Quebec. Poutine
is also widely accepted outside of Quebec. They're real purists, uh.
Though You'll have to be careful with this tube as
it can be construed in Spanish as small gay man
and maybe again met with giggles. On the subject of
(27:23):
disco fries. While I have never heard this term before,
every Canadian will definitely agree that it is not poutine.
I cannot begin to describe the feeling of disappointment when
I order a poutine at a new restaurant only to
be given a plate of fries and gravy with shredded cheese.
The absolute horror. Will I eat it anyway, Absolutely, but
(27:45):
it is not poutine. Some people, though, are not as
easy going as I am. I'll never forget one of
my first ships working at Salisbury House, a local chain
of greasy spoon diners in Winnipeg. UM. I had barely
been serving there a week and word came down that
we were switching from using cheese cards for our poutine
to the more affordable shredded cheese. I was young and stupid.
(28:08):
This was way more years ago than I cared to admit,
so I did not think it necessary to warn customers
of the change. If they ordered one. A table of
six ordered three to share. When I brought them out,
they said what the f is this, before refusing to
pay and walking out. This is an extreme example, but
the fact remains that people were upset. Over the next
(28:30):
few weeks, we received many letters and emails demanding that
we switched back to Kurds, but we never did. Some
people just don't respect the sanctity of the poutine. To close,
here's my ranking of all of the fast food chain poutines,
and yes, every fast food joint up here serves it. One.
Wendy's the best, especially with bacon. Two Pope Eyes, Popeyes
(28:54):
has poutine okay, that's great. H three A and W four,
Burger King, five, KFC, and six McDonald's trash but scratches
the itch. I love this, Oh, I love it. I
love it. We have so many more letters to read.
I kid you not. Someone else did like a very
(29:17):
similar ranking. That's wonderful. I'm so delighted by all of this.
I you know, I mean, I mean to be fair,
Like I have a personal ranking of like french fries
at fast food places, So there's no reason why you
shouldn't have a ranking for poutine at fast food places.
Absolutely absolutely, um. And we love hearing these rankings and
(29:37):
they're very delightful. Um. Also, people have written in about
disco friers, which were good, good, important, Yes, but people
they are the shredded cheese used to call some consternation.
If I were expecting cheese cards and I got shredded cheese,
(29:58):
I would also be like, yeah, like what no, what right? No?
Just so uh yeah, yeah, I'm I'm surprised they didn't
change back. That's yeah right. It sounds like there was
(30:21):
like a lot of public pressure. It does, it does? Uh?
And also yeah, thanks for the pronunciation notes, um and
giving us more reasons to fear miss pronouncing it. Do
you appreciate it? But now I'm even more nervous than before. Yeah,
(30:42):
we're learning, we're learning to fear. Yeah. We like horror
movies stuff like to Live on the edge over here. Yes, well,
thanks to both of those listeners are writing in. If
you would like to write to us, you can or
email us hello at savor pod dot com. And we're
(31:03):
also on social media. You can find us on Twitter, Facebook,
and Instagram at savor pod and we do hope to
hear from you. Savor is production of I Heart Radio.
For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can visit
the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you
listen to your favorite shows. Thanks as always to our
superproducers Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening,
(31:23):
and we hope that lots more good things are coming
your way
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Anney Reese
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