January 10, 2020 • 40 mins
Sure, it’s just salt-cured fish eggs, but caviar’s status as a luxury good has made it into something mythic. Anney and Lauren dive into the conflicting history and uncertain future of caviar.”
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
Hello, and welcome to Saber production of I Heart Radio
and Stuff Media. I'm Annes and I'm Lauren Vocalbam, and
today we're talking about caviar. Yes we are, which is
a very popular dish at Russian New Year, so sort
of timely. Yeah. Also, I was telling Lauren before we
started every now and then I make what I call
a grave miscalculation in episodes. And when we were talking
(00:30):
about this, because Lauren and I have some travel coming up,
so we were trying to pick kind of enclosed topics. Yeah,
something that would be easy to research, heavy scare quotes, right,
and we picked caviare because we thought, you know, this
is one specific type of product. Yeah, so easy to wrangle. No, nope,
(00:50):
no cold. Kept researching this for days, maybe weeks. Definitely,
it spent at least at least forty eight hours, like straight,
not straight, but like total maybe straight. I haven't slept
in a while. God show, Annie, Oh no, cave are
it is the one that didn't say it is. I
(01:11):
think Rice was the closest I've gotten. But you know,
I'm not sure I've ever had. I think I have.
But I was under the misconception that all fish row
is caveat. I've had it. I've had like a couple
pieces of it, like on top of something else, like
kind of kind of like the traditional like Bellini kind
of thing, like a little little fluffy pancake with like
(01:33):
maybe a little bit of sour cream or something, and
then a couple Yeah, I've had like that sort of thing,
but I haven't like had like a spoonful of cavia. No,
but I really want to now, and I think I
feel very guilty about doing so. So it's the opportunity
is not going to present itself unless unless something changes. Well, uh,
(01:53):
you know, you never know, you know, you never know exactly,
but we do know something. We kind of know some
things about caviar. This is the other like disclaimer that
we wanted to say, is that, uh, this is one
of those topics where it feels like everything that we
read about it, there was a different source that said
something different, and like a good source, yeah and all decent.
(02:18):
Yeah exactly. So yeah, I guess that brings us to
our question, brings us to many questions. It does start
with that one. Caviar. What is it? Well, caviar is
the unfertilized eggs of fish. Typically types of sturgeon prepared
and preserved by curing them in salt. Yes and sturgeon
(02:43):
are a family of these large bottom feeding, smooth skinned
fish no scales with these kind of big bony plates
running down their bodies, and the ones harvested for caviar
tend to range like five to sixteen feet long and
maturity and our cool water fish um. They live mostly
in fresh water like rivers, lakes, river deltas, that kind
of thing. About twenty different species of sturgeon may be
(03:05):
used to make caviare, but the most well known and
common are all originally from the Caspian Sea. Whoso whoso
better known as beluga, as a pencer sturry better known
as etcetera, and a spencer servu better known as sevruga.
Their eggs range in size and color. They're they're they're
real small, um but but yeah, and they can range
(03:26):
in size and color from grade green to gold to black.
Belugas are the biggest um et Cetera is the most
subtle and complex flavored, and Sevruga is the smallest and
considered the low end quality of the spectrum. Um as
with well any animal protein really UM. The fishes, environment
and feed will affect the flavor and quality of the
(03:46):
finished caviar. To create caviar, you you remove the eggs
as from a grown sturgeon, and kind of wash and
sieve away the eggs from the membranes of the those sacks.
You rinse the eggs, remove any bits from them that
are not tasty looking eggs, because you're probably gonna get
some other weird stuff in there, uh yeah, and then
(04:07):
fold in salt, and the salt will pretty much immediately
create a brine as as the salt seeps into the
eggs and water seeps out, you know, osmosis um. And
then you drain the brine and can the eggs for
curing a few weeks. Curing is common. Um. It's then
packaged and sold and the flavor will develop more over time,
getting stronger as the product ages from a few months
(04:28):
to about a year. Matter of taste, how long you
want to wait before you eat it. The result is
a briny, savory uh mildly fishy texture explosion um that
the smooth eggs pop in your mouth, releasing this kind
of silky liquid um. And if you've never had any
kind of fish row um, it's sort of like a
less violent pop rocks kind of situation, pop rocks of
(04:52):
the sea and can bubble tea. Yeah. Yeah. I love
reading people's descriptions of the texture specifically, and that is
my favorite part of fisher that I've had. Yeah, absolutely,
how kind of like, yeah, it's just a little burst
because it's just sort of smooth and flavorless, and then
there's a burst and then just this this wash flavor um.
(05:16):
Female surgeon grow these these big egg sacts that just
run all along the inside of their bellies, and mature
fish may have so many eggs that they can account
for a full quarter of its body weight, which is
typically like eight kilos around eighty pounds. But the fish
can grow a much bigger. The largest on record was
Bluga cott in seven, weighing over one thousand, five hundred
(05:40):
kilos um. She was over seven ms long. That's uh,
that's thirty pounds and over twenty three ft. Oh wow,
that is a heck and big fish. Yes, I recommend
looking at pictures of these because I didn't envision them
the way that they are. They're pretty big a lot
of them. Yeah, Yeah, they're like big, like like Dino
(06:01):
catfish like huge battle ready catfish. Oh, I kind of
love them. Sturgeon may have to be eight to twelve
years old or or even older, before they're mature enough
to create enough eggs to be considered worth harvesting for
this row. UM. Traditionally, you have to kill the fish
in order to harvest the row because you can't wait
(06:22):
for the fish to lay her eggs because once laid,
the membranes start to break down pretty fast, you know,
for easy fertilization. Great for creating baby fish, but um,
it would create less like pop and snap in the
finished caviar. So yeah, it's delicate timing because you if
you harvest too early, the eggs will be too small
and too fatty. UM farms do process when they kill
(06:43):
the fish. They do process the rest of the fish
for for sale, preventing waste, which is two points, but
this may may be changing. UM. A few processes are
being researched for harvesting row without killing or even cutting
open the fish. UM. One involves checking the eggs development
via ultrasound and then administering, like when they're ready, administering
(07:04):
this labor inducing protein that will cause the membranes to
release the eggs and will allow the producers to just
gently massage the eggs out of the fish. The futures
nowt sounds for sturgeon. I I will say that this
isn't I mean, I think a side effect that's great
is that it doesn't harm the fish. But I think
(07:27):
it's really more the fact that you're you're putting eight
to twelve years into growing one of these buddies, and
then if you kill it for a single harvest, it's
you know. Yeah, And as we're going to talk about
in a little bit, the numbers are pretty grim. Oh
they really are, because, yeah, we we've just about brought
sturgeon to extinction for for caviar um, and so these
(07:51):
days most to all caviare sturgeon, are farmed. Numbers are
getting better. We're kinda we're gonna We're gonna get to
it anyway, We're absolutely gonna get to it. According to you,
Alexandra Petrician of the Patrician Fine Food Company, when good
quality caviar is packed, the friction caused by the eggs
rubbing together replicates the sound of a cat purring. Cat purring. Yeah,
(08:11):
I just liked that. Yes, And historically caviar spoons were
made out of things like pearl or bone or wood,
since silver was believed to react with caviar in a
way that negatively impacted the taste. Yes, there's a lot
of debate about there. If that's actually true. I think
it depends on what it was stored at. The caviar
(08:31):
restored it at the specific type. Oh yeah, well of metal. Yeah,
there you go. Nutrition wise, Uh, you know, fish eggs
are little sax protein, you know, which if the eggs
were fertilized, would code for the growth of the baby fish. Um,
plus fats and a lot of itemins and minerals to
fuel that hypothetical fishes growth. Um. So you know, kind
(08:52):
of kind of fatty, kind of proteining. Not not bad
for you. Um. The added salt, though, is like a
lot of salt. Um. A single tablespoon of vavre contains
about a tenth of your daily recommended intake of sodium. Um.
Probably you're not eating more than that anyway, Probably you're
not even eating that much. Probably not. But from the
research I've done, some people are reading way more than that.
(09:12):
I have heard some stories, we have and we have
some numbers. The market for gaviar is growing. Analysts predict
that it will reach five hundred million dollars. China accounts
of the world's surgeon farms. By contrast, the US has
sixty total. Even so, the US is projected become the
(09:34):
third largest legal producer of caviare this year. And here's
one of those weird numbers things. I read a different
market research analysis that predicted the market to be worth
one point five billion by I did not buy either
of these research reports, which cost over a thousand dollars,
like to like two grand apiece um to see exactly
(09:55):
what they're talking about and how they got those numbers.
But we can suffice to say the market is worth
a little bit of money. Yes, I think we can
say that. And although yes, China has by far the
most production, and I think a full third, like quarter
to a third of global production is one company in China.
But um, but sturgeon are farmed for caviar all of
(10:17):
the world now, um Russia, I Ran, China, the US, France, Italy, Belgium, Germany, Israel, Moldova, Poland, Spain, Switzerland,
Saudi Arabia, the UK, Uruguay. There's probably more. Oh, definitely, yeah,
cavire did used to be largely served in one particular way,
the way you mentioned lauren um, at least in the
Russian preparation a top, puffy pancakes, bollini with cream. Fresh
(10:39):
purists argue you should eat the good stuff straight with
a spoon. I'm in nowadays, people, I put caviar on
just about anything you can imagine. I believe in our
Edible Gold episode, a lot of the food items we
mentioned that were the most expensive food items had caviar
because that's a real quick way to jump up the
price and make it funzy. Yes, but it's not so good.
(11:02):
Numbers two the Monterey Bay Aquarium Seafood Watch list a
handful of the twenty six, but I've read seven. I've
read twenty nine. So there's apparently argument about species is
the same thing. Yeah, the whole thing. But anyway, the
species listit of surgeon we get caviar from are all endangered,
and all of them are over fished for sustainable options
(11:24):
at the Monterey Bay recommend Us farmed white sturgeon and
paddlefish row due to its endangered status. Importing beluga caviare
from the Caspian and Black Sea was banned in the
United States in two thousand and five. At the time,
the US consumed six of the global exports of that product.
The U N had a similar band, but they lifted
(11:44):
it in two thousand seven, but updates in a Celler
in Florida was granted an exemption to the U S
band given that they helped restore the wild population and
didn't rely on product from the Caspian Sea. It took
this company through years, but as of twenty nineteen, they
met those requirements and were given the go ahead to
sell their product commercially. So this is happening right now.
(12:08):
It is. The Monterey Bay Aquarium also states Seafood Watch
no longer has recommendations for sturgeon or caviar that's imported
from the Casping or Black Seas because the legal harvest
of sturgeon is banned. Yeah, and it's generally a very
expensive product, like we were saying, depending on the variety,
although there has been a rise in more affordable options.
(12:30):
The most expensive caviarn record went for thirty five thousand
dollars per kilo, and that's about a thousand dollars per
out harvested from an Iranian beluga sturgeon, estimated between sixty
to one hundred years old. The Guinness Book of World
Records list this as the World's most expensive food, World's
most expensive food. And I was curious, and I looked
(12:51):
up a local Russian restaurant here in Atlanta, to Clive's Rufe,
to see if they had caviar. And they do one
ounce supplement a hundred and sixty five dollars, and then
another option a hundred and five dollars. So so thrifty,
let's put it on your company card. We might be
able to get away with it if no one checks
to because it's over a hundred dollars a meal, you're
(13:13):
supposed to specify. Why, Right, if we just get like
four people out and just get that, I think we
can get away with it. All right, Well, I'm in.
Because caviar is so expensive widely and so rare, it
has become closely associated with luxury, almost at the point
(13:33):
of being shorthand for it. Robin Leech's Lifestyles of the
Rich and Famous and American TV series that aired from
the mid eighties to the mid nineties, came with the
tag are Champagne Wishes and caviare dreams, which, by the way,
most experts do not recommend the pairing of champagne and caviar,
but instead of vodka, it's cleaner. It's cleaner. Yeah, I've
(13:53):
also heard suck is a really good one. Man. All
these things I want to sure James Beard once said
of caviare the row of the Russian mother Sturgeon has
probably been present at more important international affairs than have
all the Russian dignitaries of history combined. This seemingly simple
article of the diet has taken its place in the
(14:15):
world along with pearls, sables, old silver, and Selini cups.
Speaking of sables, Ludwig Mamelman's the author of the Madeline
but Um and also apparently a little bit of a gourmand,
once said, caviar is to dining what a sable coat
is to a girl in an evening dress. Are are
(14:37):
this quote from maguelon to sin Sma from a History
of Food. Every man and every woman reverently eating modern
ambrosia in the form of caviar can identify as they
indulge in the mad extravagance of swallowing it, even if
they do not happen to like it with what they
see as the last incarnation of the immortals. Wow, right,
(14:57):
heck right, that is very French, it is. I'm one
more kind of to hint at some of the things
to come from Nikita Krushchev from Enemy at the Gate.
We have the luxury of vodka. We have the luxury
of caviare time. It's luxury we do not have. Ah,
but caviar wasn't always such a luxury. Nope. And we
(15:21):
will get into that and the history of caviare once
we get back from a quick break for a word
from our sponsor, and we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes,
thank you. And as we said, lots of conflicting history
(15:42):
on this one, but we'll do our best. And as
part of that, shout out to INGA. Saffron's book Caviar,
The Strange History and Uncertain Future of the world's most
Coveted Delicacy for being a huge help fascinating read. And
it's really great if you want an illustration of just
how much the numbers have dropped, how much the industry
(16:04):
has changed. Yeah, yeah, but okay, yeah, history the sturgeon
goes back some fifty million years changed at that time, right.
Some call it a living fossil because of that. It
was consumed by Eastern Europeans and Middle Easterners pretty much
since the beginning of humanity, but it's harder to say
(16:24):
with certainty that they were eating caviare. I'm sure if
it was there, it got in, but the eggs wouldn't
have been salt here, so it's not technically caviare anyway.
Some sources do indicate that fish eggs were one of
our first delicacies, coveted by ancient Romans and Greeks, but
there isn't much to back that up, and it conflicts
(16:45):
with a lot of other historical records. Aristotle described caviare
as a feature at banquets, announced at the end of
feast with great fan trumpets and flowers. I love that.
Why don't we do that anymore? Here comes the I
don't know the pineapple? Okay, next party. Some sources suggest
(17:06):
that all the way back to two thousand, four undred BC,
Egyptians and Phoenicians salted and pickled fish eggs as a
food stuff to sustain them through famines, wars, and long journeys,
and not just reading. At varying points in history, it
was viewed as an antidepressant, a way to increase stamina,
and a cure for impotence. Sure. The twelfth century is
(17:28):
when caviar really became widespread in Russia, primarily as a
food for the working class. Workers and peasants would press
out the liquid and slice off pieces like like bread
for lunch. Yeah, yeah, there's a there's a method of
I think a bunch of kind of the damaged or
less good eggs still to this day can be pressed
into sort of like a cake, which I really want
(17:50):
to try. Oh, I'm very curious about it. It sounds
quite fishy and salty it, but yeah, they would eat
this um for their lunches. In twelve forty, the grandson
of Genghis Khan, Batu Khan, enjoyed caviarre paired with hot
apple preserves after he conquered Muscovie. The story goes that
his wife couldn't get over the smell and may or
(18:11):
may not have spit it out they or may not
have even tried it, but definitely walked away and was like, no, nope,
not for me. Some countries, though, had laws during the
Middle Ages dictating that high quality caviare had to be
reserved for their respective monarchies. One example came in when
King Edward the Second declared the sturgeon was the royal fish,
(18:33):
decreeing that the stock in England's waters belonged to the
Imperial Treasury. And this brings us to a modern thing
that had to include that I legitimately thought might have
been an onion article, but it's totally real. A BBC
story from two thousand four detailed a man being investigated
by the police after he caught a sturgeon allegedly without
the Queen's for mission, without the Queen's press right, so
(18:56):
it's still a thing. According to the story, the Queen
has to be consulted prior to any action regarding a
sturgeon after it is caught. Only around six are caught
in the UK a year. The fisherman in question didn't
even know that this was a thing, was exactly and
to consult people about it. A spokesperson from the Swansea
(19:17):
Coast Guard said a facts was sent to Buckingham Palace
and fairly quickly return facts came saying the fisherman was
free to dispose of it as he wished. I believe
that most of the time fishermen are allowed to keep
what they catch. Although this has never happened in eight years.
That worked here. Wow, they set up facts. Not only
did they send the facts about whether or not this guy,
the queen will allow this guy to do something with
(19:38):
a fish. It was a fact. It was fat and
and Buckingham Palace faxed him back quickly. And then I
found out that royal fish is the whole thing. It's
a category and we have to do an episode on it.
We have to, yes, like dolphins are one still still
a thing, that's beautiful. The Queen's probably like, oh, asked
(20:02):
me about this stainton shirt. In the fourteen hundreds, Venetians
returned from the Black Sea with barrels of caviar, introducing
it to parts of Europe that had previously not known
about it. It It possibly they had, but it had been forgotten. However,
it didn't really take off. Shakespeare even used caviar to
mean obscurity and Hamlet in the sixteenth century. Common Italian
(20:25):
saying at the time was whosoever edith of caviar, edith
of salt, dung and flies. I know, really some fishermen
of fed fish road to pigs as far as we know,
the English word caviar first appeared in print, possibly derived
from the Turkish word caviar or perhaps the Persian word chavjar.
(20:47):
These words mean cake of power or piece of power
they did, or perhaps it was derived from Italian or Greek.
Arguments about this as well mysteries histories. After the Cossack
rebellion failed in sixteen seventy one, its leader was hung,
the Cossacks presented the Czar with a bowl of caviare,
reminiscent of the act of peasants offering up salt and
bread to honored guest. In order to prevent a future uprising,
(21:09):
Czar Peter the Great gave the Cossacks control of the
sturgeon industry, as well as the power to collect taxes
on salt, both key and caviare. In fact, Peter advised
the Cossacks to export caviare, but it wasn't easy, and
while this meant that for many Europeans, Russian caviare was
beyond their reach, many heard tales of it. Some found
it almost mythic, while others found it flat out ridiculous,
(21:31):
including French writer Rabelais. He wrote about that ridiculously beyond
the whole thing. When Peter the Great offered up a
sample of caviare to French King Louis the fifteenth, the
king allegedly spit it out on the very fantasy carpet
at the very side Safari Dictionary do Commerce came with
this glowing review. It is beginning to be known in
(21:52):
France where it's not despised at the best tables. Oh,
becoming known where it's not despised, that's me. Caviar was
further popularized in Russia as an alternative to meet on
the days when the Church forbade eating meat in the
early eighteen hundreds. In eighteen sixty one, Elena Molokovitz cookbook
(22:15):
A Gift to young housewives, suggested garnishing sauerkraut with caviare as,
though it were quote strewn with poppy seeds. I mean share, yeah,
no arguments here. The Romanov, not the royal family. Romanov
Caviar Company was established in eighteen fifty nine. Two other
big names in the world of caviare to this day
got started around this time. German company Diekman and Hanson
(22:38):
in eighteen sixty one and Paris based Petro sian A
couple of years later in nine two, which I mentioned
at the top. Meanwhile, when the Ritz Hotel Paris opened
in eighteen nine one, it drew in a celebrity clientele
like Ernest Hemingway and f Scott Fitzgerald. I feel like
they were everywhere, was somewhere, They were there, and they
enjoyed caviar and champagne. Also, there are really wild stories
(23:02):
about this hotel, which I believe recently reopened after remodeling,
including that Hemmingway helped liberate it from the Nazis. Somehow,
I feel like we've talked about that before, But if
we haven't, maybe in a cocktail episode. Yeah, I think
it came up. But anyway, I guess you can get
caviare treatment for your face there, or you could at
(23:23):
one time I didn't like call and ask, But according
to their website, there is a Chanel Skincare Spa and
a proprietary Ritz spa, and I did not see any
caviar I mentioned. Doesn't mean that it's not there. Um. However,
while we're talking about the Ritz one, Matthew Fort, writing
about caviar for Esquire, related that around the Ritz, London's
(23:46):
Rivioli bar Um had these, uh, these these five pounds
sterling lunches that consisted of white bread sandwiches, crusts cut
off of course um stuffed with either foi gra or
caviar um plus half a bottle of champagne on the side. Um.
And I mean five pounds today sounds like, oh man,
that's a great deal, let's do it every day. At
the time it was like like thirty eight pounds in
(24:08):
today's money, um, which is about fifty bucks American. So not,
I mean, still a pretty good deal for comparatively. Yeah,
not as cheap as it sounds. No, and not as
cheap as it sounds. The Industrial Revolution made transport of
intact eggs far simpler, things like refrigeration railways huge helps,
and also allowed for the growth of a class of
(24:30):
folks that could afford them. A Greek sea captain by
the name of Jonas of oar Kiss helped elevate caviar
in Europe from a thing king spat out to a
much desired item among the European aristocracy. The Varkis tried
caviar in Russia in the seventeen eighties and wheels started
turning in his brain. He figured out how to preserve
and transport the eggs in the Mediterranean, and by the
(24:52):
time of his death he was a millionaire of cavier.
But not all caviar was expensive. As we discussed in
our bar Snacks episode. Yes the bar Snacks episode, salty
caviar was sometimes served as a complimentary lunch item at
saloons to encourage drinking in early nineteenth century America. Salt
(25:14):
makes you thirsty, drink morsh. This was largely possible because
there were so many sturgeons populating North American waters. The
flesh of sturgeon cop from the Hudson River was so
plentiful it was known as Albany beef. Yeah. German immigrants
are generally credited with introducing a taste for caviar to
(25:36):
the United States, particularly in the Midwest, but Native Americans
were eating caviar wall along before any immigrants arrived, and
in some cases fed it to their babies. Yeah. One.
Henry Shocked, an immigrant from Germany, took note of people
enjoying caviar and saw hey a business opportunity. In eighteen
seventy three, he started shipping caviart to Europe, priced at
(25:58):
a dollar a pound. Several others did the same in
the wake of his success, enough so that the US
became the world's largest exporter of caviar with the nineteen
centuries end. But twist, but twist, twist. Because European saw
business opportunity to some enterprising and perhaps less than scrupulous
(26:19):
individuals took that apported American caviar, relabeled it Russian caviare,
which was highly more expensive, and shifted it right back
to the US yep, and they were also very successful.
The state of Pennsylvania reported that up to nine of
European imported Russian caviare actually originated in the United States.
(26:44):
Around the end of the eight hundreds, yeah wild love it. Yeah.
In parallel, the numbers of North American sturgeon dropped dramatically,
nearly to extinction. This translated to an exorbitant increase in
price for caviare. By the eighteen nineties nineteen hundreds, caviar
had become much more high end in the United States,
(27:07):
and it also course corrected a little bit that um
in that most caviar labeled as Russian did legit come
from Russia. Russia's communist government took control of the Caspian
fishery where two thirds of Russian caviar originated. It's three
thousand times a year and nineteen hundred. This takeover was violent,
resulting in several executions. Um yeah. Following this, in the
(27:30):
nineteen thirties, the USSR started the very first sturgeon farming
operations in the world. Skipping ahead to the nineteen sixties,
China decided to get in on the caviar game. After all,
a species of sturgeon were plentiful in the Amoor River,
which is the boundary between Russia and China. And from
what I understand, it's sort of a story of like
(27:51):
of like hope for peace um or at least like
fortitude through financial gain. Anyway, because like this was the
height of the Cold War, right, and so China Russia
relations were strained to violent China US relations were super
strained as well. Um. But China pulled together the sturgeon
fishing and egg harvesting industry with help from American corporations
(28:12):
and Russian experts caviar. The power of the power of caviar.
Caviar prices reached such heights that people in the United
States started searching for domestic alternatives In the nineteen sixties. Yeah,
and they weren't the only ones. The Russian caviart companies
started selling cheaper options in the eighties like salmon row
(28:33):
red zammon caviar, lumpfish and whitefish are golden whitefish caviar.
But but yeah, surgeon caviare was still a big ticket
item in Russia. And in nine this is another one
where they're conflicting histories. Um, there was this big scandal.
It came out that a whole rang of employees within
the Soviet Unions Ministry of Fish Industry had been running
(28:55):
like a decade long scam. They had been purposefully mislabeling
these huge cans of caviare is smoked herring like a
different Different articles published in the American press say either
three to five kilo cans or three to five leader cans.
Either way, a lot of caviare mislabeling it as smoked herring,
shipping it out of the country for relabeling in sale
(29:17):
in the Europe and the US um and saving the
profits in Swiss bank accounts. But like huge scandal like
forced the resignation of the dude who had been in
charge since the nineteen forties, rumor had at the up
to two employees were arrested. Like the penalty for this
kind of like money involving scam was death by firing squad.
(29:41):
And supposedly the whole ring broke when um like mislabeled
cans would ocasionally link into the local market and give
some random shopper a big surprise, a very very very
pleasant surprise. But apparently the wrong man got the wrong can,
and a surprised police investigator pulled the whole thing down. Wow, dang, no,
(30:08):
I want to do a whole episode just on that.
Oh gosh. Um. Yeah, And I couldn't figure like the
story kind of disappeared, like I couldn't figure out what
happened in the wake of it, And I'm wondering if
it was all just like weird misinformation. Anyway, Throughout all
of this, you may have noticed that we haven't mentioned
the other major power that borders the Caspian Sea, what's
(30:29):
now Iran. It wasn't until after the Iranian Revolution sometimes
called the Islamic Revolution in nineteen seventy nine, following decades
of political and religious and economic turmoil, that Sturgeon was
reclassified as a scaled fish and thus okay for devout
Muslims to handle. And supposedly the change was made because
(30:51):
of the trade value of caviare in the early eighties,
they were like, we can export this if it's okay
for us to handle. So let's talk about that. We
just had a whole revolution. Let's yeah. But the collapse
of the Soviet Union in the nineteen nineties, caviar prices
plummeted in Russia. You could even buy it from peddler's
(31:11):
on the sidewalk in a large international black market in
parts supplied by caviar poachers flourished, severely, threatening the population
of Caspian surgeon. Several descriptions like in this Russian caviar
black market to the illegal drug market in the United States.
And I can't really overstate how devastating this was to sturgeon,
(31:33):
Like the collapse of the USSR was the worst possible
thing that could have happened for these fish. Um it
really led to the complete over fishing that has led
to the endangerment of these species today. Yeah, and again
the book we mentioned at the top of this segment,
go read it is so illustrative of that because she
(31:57):
the author interviews people who have been in the industry
for decades in some cases a long time, and they're
just so they have hope, keep thinking it's going to
bounce back, and it just hasn't and hasn't, hasn't, And
scientists are saying, no, it's not unless we change things.
We change a lot. Yeah, and some things are changing,
which we will get to in a second. But we
do have a little bit more of scandal. Scandal. In
(32:19):
the mid nineteen nineties, Arnold Hanson Sturn, president of Hans
and cavir Co, sold three thousand pounds of a legal
caveat for a total of around two million dollars YEP.
When he was caught. He only served eighteen months in jail,
and he and the company combined paid about twenty thousand
and finds that also differs depending on what you read.
(32:40):
I believe he's back in the basins. In The Convention
on International Trade and Endangered Species or c i t
e S put in place regulations around the global sturgeon
and caviart trade, and those regulations do help thanks to
to those and the Endangered Species Act. In the year
(33:02):
two thousand, the US Fish and Wildlife Service seized a
ton of illegally imported caviare and find the importers over
ten million dollars they destroyed. The caviare hurts, It does hurt.
Beginning in two thousand, Russia started implementing regulations to crackdown
on poaching and overfishing, and this led to a number
(33:26):
of bloody conflicts between poachers and officials. Apparently the local
Russian like caviar mafia used their wives and children as
human shields in this one attack on the coast Guard
to recover confiscated boats and equipment. Oh my gosh, hoof.
In two thousand, the United Nations Conservation Council and Caspian
(33:47):
Sea States banned the export of wild caviare to Europe,
followed in two five by that U s Beluga caviar Band.
This resulted in our rise of farmed caviare, especially from Italy,
Iran and here in the United States California. In two
thousand eight, researchers conducted an experiment with caviare and which
participants were asked to evaluate the taste of caviare labeled
rare versus some labeled as common, and as you can
(34:09):
probably guess, the caviare was actually the same but people
largely expressed a preference for the caviar labeled rare humans humans, funny,
what are you up to? Um? As of this thirty
year sturgeon research program in Japan finally came to fruition
(34:30):
and began selling caviare commercially, So we now have commercial
caveat coming out of Japan. And that's also around when
China's production of and market four caviare began booming to
where it is today. In even a Chinese company got
this contract with German airline I never know how to
say it, Leftonsa, thank you Leftanza. Um. Yeah, they got
(34:50):
this contract with Leftansa to provide caviare for its first
class cabins. And so that's when the global luxury market
kind of started taking Chinese happy are seriously. And as
of twenty nineteen, Atlantic sturgeon populations seem to be starting
to bounce back, um, thanks to thirty years of environmental
(35:12):
efforts to restore their habitats and prevent h fishing of them. Yeah,
and there's so much to read about this, and so
much of it it feels like you're reading a fiction book,
like this character can't possibly exist in this world of sturgeon. Yeah,
but it does. I'm thinking of one person in particular,
(35:35):
and if you you go look into the research you'll
know who I'm talking about. But yeah, the numbers got
so low in the situation, so bad. So this is
it's promising that we're starting to see some results from
the people who've been in this field and working on
it and trying so hard to be heard. Yeah, and
(35:56):
it's you know again, like it comes it comes down
to money so much, because there are so many other
species that have not had this amount of work put
into their health and welfare because they're not producing. Cave
are so most expensive food in the world, so screw them. Um. Yeah,
it's real nice that people are working on a solution
(36:18):
for this animal. I wish that more animals were being
given similar treatment. But yeay, surgeons, surgeons. I do. They
are cute in a weird way. I really am very
fond of catfish. I think they're adorable, so so yeah.
And these guys have a little like like whisker kind
(36:38):
of things too, so yeah, yeah, and I do. It
is fascinating to me when foods like this become the
cultural icon almost that they are, that it is fancy
and wealth and luxury, and that eating it somehow gives
you that imparts that to you, it's aspiration and all. Yeah, Undy,
(37:02):
do I have aspiration that we'll get to try some
one day. But in the meantime, we do have a
little bit more for you. But first we've got another
quick break for a word from our sponsor, and we're back.
Thank you, sponsor, Yes, thank you, we're back with listen.
(37:24):
I would do the trans Atlantic accent at any opportunity,
any opportunity. We were both also holding cigars and cigars
without really communicating, we just knew if you do the
Transatlantic you need something in your hand, either like Martini glass,
jimping glass, or a little cigarette. Oh yeah, what was
yours of Martini glass? Okay, okay, I think mine was
(37:47):
a cigar. Well, we were, We were on the same page.
Asha wrote, just listen to the Baileief episode and laughed
at the conspiracy section. I don't know how much they
truly affect the flavor of my meals, because I definitely
used the dry kind. I need to get fresh, and
I tend to use a lot of other spices as well.
But when I was a kid and was having dinner,
at a friend's house. The mom said, you know the tradition,
(38:09):
whoever gets the bay leaf in their bowl has to
kiss the cook. And I just thought this was the
cutest tradition ever. So now I always stick at least
one in my soup, sauces, etcetera, then make sure it
ends up in my fiance's bowl, so he has to
give me a kiss. He always rolls his eyes that
I did it on purpose, but kisses me anyway. That's love,
That's so sweet. Bailey Baileyaflow Robert wrote a couple of
(38:33):
years back, we found out about a somewhat local candy
company that has cane making demonstrations. In December, we packed
up our four year old niece and took her to
a candy store best aunt and uncle. They had a
huge glass window for people to watch as they made
candy canes and candy bowls, Yes, bowls made from candy
cane ropes, starting with that yellowish molten sugar. I had
(38:56):
no idea how they made the white color myself, so
color me shocked. And the worker took the yellow soft
candy and worked it on a hook on the wall
like taffy to turn it white. After twisting and thinning it.
They brought out straight links for all the kids to
form into their own shapes. After the demonstration, we then
tried to control ourselves and not buy everything we saw.
They had some interesting flavors of candy canes. One of
(39:18):
my favorite was sassafras. We also picked up some ribbon
candy I think the same material as candy canes, flattened
and twisted like a barber pole. Later that day, some
of those pieces were used as the chimney for our
Gingerbread house. Just to shout out to Purity Candy in
Central Pennsylvania. That sounds cool. That does sound cool. Anytime
there's a demonstration, I'm super in for it. I know.
(39:38):
I always love when I want by one of those
candy places as those demonstrations and it's all kids and
it's just me, and I'm equally pressed up and riveted
space against the glass looking at the other kids. You're
seeing this check it out, Gas being alone, I would
love to check this out. I mean, I'm not a
big fan of candy canes, but I would love to
(39:58):
see how they're made. Absolute Yes, thanks to both of
those listeners. Shore writing in if you would like to
write to us. You can Our email is hello at
favorit pod dot com. We're also on social media. You
can find us on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook at savor
pod and we do hope to hear from you. Savor
is production of I Heart Radio and Stuff Media. For
more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can visit the
(40:21):
I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen
to your favorite shows. Thanks as always, Toy superproducers Dylan
Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and
we hope that lots more good things are coming your
way
Hello, and welcome to Saber production of I Heart Radio
and Stuff Media. I'm Annes and I'm Lauren Vocalbam, and
today we're talking about caviar. Yes we are, which is
a very popular dish at Russian New Year, so sort
of timely. Yeah. Also, I was telling Lauren before we
started every now and then I make what I call
a grave miscalculation in episodes. And when we were talking
(00:30):
about this, because Lauren and I have some travel coming up,
so we were trying to pick kind of enclosed topics. Yeah,
something that would be easy to research, heavy scare quotes, right,
and we picked caviare because we thought, you know, this
is one specific type of product. Yeah, so easy to wrangle. No, nope,
(00:50):
no cold. Kept researching this for days, maybe weeks. Definitely,
it spent at least at least forty eight hours, like straight,
not straight, but like total maybe straight. I haven't slept
in a while. God show, Annie, Oh no, cave are
it is the one that didn't say it is. I
(01:11):
think Rice was the closest I've gotten. But you know,
I'm not sure I've ever had. I think I have.
But I was under the misconception that all fish row
is caveat. I've had it. I've had like a couple
pieces of it, like on top of something else, like
kind of kind of like the traditional like Bellini kind
of thing, like a little little fluffy pancake with like
(01:33):
maybe a little bit of sour cream or something, and
then a couple Yeah, I've had like that sort of thing,
but I haven't like had like a spoonful of cavia. No,
but I really want to now, and I think I
feel very guilty about doing so. So it's the opportunity
is not going to present itself unless unless something changes. Well, uh,
(01:53):
you know, you never know, you know, you never know exactly,
but we do know something. We kind of know some
things about caviar. This is the other like disclaimer that
we wanted to say, is that, uh, this is one
of those topics where it feels like everything that we
read about it, there was a different source that said
something different, and like a good source, yeah and all decent.
(02:18):
Yeah exactly. So yeah, I guess that brings us to
our question, brings us to many questions. It does start
with that one. Caviar. What is it? Well, caviar is
the unfertilized eggs of fish. Typically types of sturgeon prepared
and preserved by curing them in salt. Yes and sturgeon
(02:43):
are a family of these large bottom feeding, smooth skinned
fish no scales with these kind of big bony plates
running down their bodies, and the ones harvested for caviar
tend to range like five to sixteen feet long and
maturity and our cool water fish um. They live mostly
in fresh water like rivers, lakes, river deltas, that kind
of thing. About twenty different species of sturgeon may be
(03:05):
used to make caviare, but the most well known and
common are all originally from the Caspian Sea. Whoso whoso
better known as beluga, as a pencer sturry better known
as etcetera, and a spencer servu better known as sevruga.
Their eggs range in size and color. They're they're they're
real small, um but but yeah, and they can range
(03:26):
in size and color from grade green to gold to black.
Belugas are the biggest um et Cetera is the most
subtle and complex flavored, and Sevruga is the smallest and
considered the low end quality of the spectrum. Um as
with well any animal protein really UM. The fishes, environment
and feed will affect the flavor and quality of the
(03:46):
finished caviar. To create caviar, you you remove the eggs
as from a grown sturgeon, and kind of wash and
sieve away the eggs from the membranes of the those sacks.
You rinse the eggs, remove any bits from them that
are not tasty looking eggs, because you're probably gonna get
some other weird stuff in there, uh yeah, and then
(04:07):
fold in salt, and the salt will pretty much immediately
create a brine as as the salt seeps into the
eggs and water seeps out, you know, osmosis um. And
then you drain the brine and can the eggs for
curing a few weeks. Curing is common. Um. It's then
packaged and sold and the flavor will develop more over time,
getting stronger as the product ages from a few months
(04:28):
to about a year. Matter of taste, how long you
want to wait before you eat it. The result is
a briny, savory uh mildly fishy texture explosion um that
the smooth eggs pop in your mouth, releasing this kind
of silky liquid um. And if you've never had any
kind of fish row um, it's sort of like a
less violent pop rocks kind of situation, pop rocks of
(04:52):
the sea and can bubble tea. Yeah. Yeah. I love
reading people's descriptions of the texture specifically, and that is
my favorite part of fisher that I've had. Yeah, absolutely,
how kind of like, yeah, it's just a little burst
because it's just sort of smooth and flavorless, and then
there's a burst and then just this this wash flavor um.
(05:16):
Female surgeon grow these these big egg sacts that just
run all along the inside of their bellies, and mature
fish may have so many eggs that they can account
for a full quarter of its body weight, which is
typically like eight kilos around eighty pounds. But the fish
can grow a much bigger. The largest on record was
Bluga cott in seven, weighing over one thousand, five hundred
(05:40):
kilos um. She was over seven ms long. That's uh,
that's thirty pounds and over twenty three ft. Oh wow,
that is a heck and big fish. Yes, I recommend
looking at pictures of these because I didn't envision them
the way that they are. They're pretty big a lot
of them. Yeah, Yeah, they're like big, like like Dino
(06:01):
catfish like huge battle ready catfish. Oh, I kind of
love them. Sturgeon may have to be eight to twelve
years old or or even older, before they're mature enough
to create enough eggs to be considered worth harvesting for
this row. UM. Traditionally, you have to kill the fish
in order to harvest the row because you can't wait
(06:22):
for the fish to lay her eggs because once laid,
the membranes start to break down pretty fast, you know,
for easy fertilization. Great for creating baby fish, but um,
it would create less like pop and snap in the
finished caviar. So yeah, it's delicate timing because you if
you harvest too early, the eggs will be too small
and too fatty. UM farms do process when they kill
(06:43):
the fish. They do process the rest of the fish
for for sale, preventing waste, which is two points, but
this may may be changing. UM. A few processes are
being researched for harvesting row without killing or even cutting
open the fish. UM. One involves checking the eggs development
via ultrasound and then administering, like when they're ready, administering
(07:04):
this labor inducing protein that will cause the membranes to
release the eggs and will allow the producers to just
gently massage the eggs out of the fish. The futures
nowt sounds for sturgeon. I I will say that this
isn't I mean, I think a side effect that's great
is that it doesn't harm the fish. But I think
(07:27):
it's really more the fact that you're you're putting eight
to twelve years into growing one of these buddies, and
then if you kill it for a single harvest, it's
you know. Yeah, And as we're going to talk about
in a little bit, the numbers are pretty grim. Oh
they really are, because, yeah, we we've just about brought
sturgeon to extinction for for caviar um, and so these
(07:51):
days most to all caviare sturgeon, are farmed. Numbers are
getting better. We're kinda we're gonna We're gonna get to
it anyway, We're absolutely gonna get to it. According to you,
Alexandra Petrician of the Patrician Fine Food Company, when good
quality caviar is packed, the friction caused by the eggs
rubbing together replicates the sound of a cat purring. Cat purring. Yeah,
(08:11):
I just liked that. Yes, And historically caviar spoons were
made out of things like pearl or bone or wood,
since silver was believed to react with caviar in a
way that negatively impacted the taste. Yes, there's a lot
of debate about there. If that's actually true. I think
it depends on what it was stored at. The caviar
(08:31):
restored it at the specific type. Oh yeah, well of metal. Yeah,
there you go. Nutrition wise, Uh, you know, fish eggs
are little sax protein, you know, which if the eggs
were fertilized, would code for the growth of the baby fish. Um,
plus fats and a lot of itemins and minerals to
fuel that hypothetical fishes growth. Um. So you know, kind
(08:52):
of kind of fatty, kind of proteining. Not not bad
for you. Um. The added salt, though, is like a
lot of salt. Um. A single tablespoon of vavre contains
about a tenth of your daily recommended intake of sodium. Um.
Probably you're not eating more than that anyway, Probably you're
not even eating that much. Probably not. But from the
research I've done, some people are reading way more than that.
(09:12):
I have heard some stories, we have and we have
some numbers. The market for gaviar is growing. Analysts predict
that it will reach five hundred million dollars. China accounts
of the world's surgeon farms. By contrast, the US has
sixty total. Even so, the US is projected become the
(09:34):
third largest legal producer of caviare this year. And here's
one of those weird numbers things. I read a different
market research analysis that predicted the market to be worth
one point five billion by I did not buy either
of these research reports, which cost over a thousand dollars,
like to like two grand apiece um to see exactly
(09:55):
what they're talking about and how they got those numbers.
But we can suffice to say the market is worth
a little bit of money. Yes, I think we can
say that. And although yes, China has by far the
most production, and I think a full third, like quarter
to a third of global production is one company in China.
But um, but sturgeon are farmed for caviar all of
(10:17):
the world now, um Russia, I Ran, China, the US, France, Italy, Belgium, Germany, Israel, Moldova, Poland, Spain, Switzerland,
Saudi Arabia, the UK, Uruguay. There's probably more. Oh, definitely, yeah,
cavire did used to be largely served in one particular way,
the way you mentioned lauren um, at least in the
Russian preparation a top, puffy pancakes, bollini with cream. Fresh
(10:39):
purists argue you should eat the good stuff straight with
a spoon. I'm in nowadays, people, I put caviar on
just about anything you can imagine. I believe in our
Edible Gold episode, a lot of the food items we
mentioned that were the most expensive food items had caviar
because that's a real quick way to jump up the
price and make it funzy. Yes, but it's not so good.
(11:02):
Numbers two the Monterey Bay Aquarium Seafood Watch list a
handful of the twenty six, but I've read seven. I've
read twenty nine. So there's apparently argument about species is
the same thing. Yeah, the whole thing. But anyway, the
species listit of surgeon we get caviar from are all endangered,
and all of them are over fished for sustainable options
(11:24):
at the Monterey Bay recommend Us farmed white sturgeon and
paddlefish row due to its endangered status. Importing beluga caviare
from the Caspian and Black Sea was banned in the
United States in two thousand and five. At the time,
the US consumed six of the global exports of that product.
The U N had a similar band, but they lifted
(11:44):
it in two thousand seven, but updates in a Celler
in Florida was granted an exemption to the U S
band given that they helped restore the wild population and
didn't rely on product from the Caspian Sea. It took
this company through years, but as of twenty nineteen, they
met those requirements and were given the go ahead to
sell their product commercially. So this is happening right now.
(12:08):
It is. The Monterey Bay Aquarium also states Seafood Watch
no longer has recommendations for sturgeon or caviar that's imported
from the Casping or Black Seas because the legal harvest
of sturgeon is banned. Yeah, and it's generally a very
expensive product, like we were saying, depending on the variety,
although there has been a rise in more affordable options.
(12:30):
The most expensive caviarn record went for thirty five thousand
dollars per kilo, and that's about a thousand dollars per
out harvested from an Iranian beluga sturgeon, estimated between sixty
to one hundred years old. The Guinness Book of World
Records list this as the World's most expensive food, World's
most expensive food. And I was curious, and I looked
(12:51):
up a local Russian restaurant here in Atlanta, to Clive's Rufe,
to see if they had caviar. And they do one
ounce supplement a hundred and sixty five dollars, and then
another option a hundred and five dollars. So so thrifty,
let's put it on your company card. We might be
able to get away with it if no one checks
to because it's over a hundred dollars a meal, you're
(13:13):
supposed to specify. Why, Right, if we just get like
four people out and just get that, I think we
can get away with it. All right, Well, I'm in.
Because caviar is so expensive widely and so rare, it
has become closely associated with luxury, almost at the point
(13:33):
of being shorthand for it. Robin Leech's Lifestyles of the
Rich and Famous and American TV series that aired from
the mid eighties to the mid nineties, came with the
tag are Champagne Wishes and caviare dreams, which, by the way,
most experts do not recommend the pairing of champagne and caviar,
but instead of vodka, it's cleaner. It's cleaner. Yeah, I've
(13:53):
also heard suck is a really good one. Man. All
these things I want to sure James Beard once said
of caviare the row of the Russian mother Sturgeon has
probably been present at more important international affairs than have
all the Russian dignitaries of history combined. This seemingly simple
article of the diet has taken its place in the
(14:15):
world along with pearls, sables, old silver, and Selini cups.
Speaking of sables, Ludwig Mamelman's the author of the Madeline
but Um and also apparently a little bit of a gourmand,
once said, caviar is to dining what a sable coat
is to a girl in an evening dress. Are are
(14:37):
this quote from maguelon to sin Sma from a History
of Food. Every man and every woman reverently eating modern
ambrosia in the form of caviar can identify as they
indulge in the mad extravagance of swallowing it, even if
they do not happen to like it with what they
see as the last incarnation of the immortals. Wow, right,
(14:57):
heck right, that is very French, it is. I'm one
more kind of to hint at some of the things
to come from Nikita Krushchev from Enemy at the Gate.
We have the luxury of vodka. We have the luxury
of caviare time. It's luxury we do not have. Ah,
but caviar wasn't always such a luxury. Nope. And we
(15:21):
will get into that and the history of caviare once
we get back from a quick break for a word
from our sponsor, and we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes,
thank you. And as we said, lots of conflicting history
(15:42):
on this one, but we'll do our best. And as
part of that, shout out to INGA. Saffron's book Caviar,
The Strange History and Uncertain Future of the world's most
Coveted Delicacy for being a huge help fascinating read. And
it's really great if you want an illustration of just
how much the numbers have dropped, how much the industry
(16:04):
has changed. Yeah, yeah, but okay, yeah, history the sturgeon
goes back some fifty million years changed at that time, right.
Some call it a living fossil because of that. It
was consumed by Eastern Europeans and Middle Easterners pretty much
since the beginning of humanity, but it's harder to say
(16:24):
with certainty that they were eating caviare. I'm sure if
it was there, it got in, but the eggs wouldn't
have been salt here, so it's not technically caviare anyway.
Some sources do indicate that fish eggs were one of
our first delicacies, coveted by ancient Romans and Greeks, but
there isn't much to back that up, and it conflicts
(16:45):
with a lot of other historical records. Aristotle described caviare
as a feature at banquets, announced at the end of
feast with great fan trumpets and flowers. I love that.
Why don't we do that anymore? Here comes the I
don't know the pineapple? Okay, next party. Some sources suggest
(17:06):
that all the way back to two thousand, four undred BC,
Egyptians and Phoenicians salted and pickled fish eggs as a
food stuff to sustain them through famines, wars, and long journeys,
and not just reading. At varying points in history, it
was viewed as an antidepressant, a way to increase stamina,
and a cure for impotence. Sure. The twelfth century is
(17:28):
when caviar really became widespread in Russia, primarily as a
food for the working class. Workers and peasants would press
out the liquid and slice off pieces like like bread
for lunch. Yeah, yeah, there's a there's a method of
I think a bunch of kind of the damaged or
less good eggs still to this day can be pressed
into sort of like a cake, which I really want
(17:50):
to try. Oh, I'm very curious about it. It sounds
quite fishy and salty it, but yeah, they would eat
this um for their lunches. In twelve forty, the grandson
of Genghis Khan, Batu Khan, enjoyed caviarre paired with hot
apple preserves after he conquered Muscovie. The story goes that
his wife couldn't get over the smell and may or
(18:11):
may not have spit it out they or may not
have even tried it, but definitely walked away and was like, no, nope,
not for me. Some countries, though, had laws during the
Middle Ages dictating that high quality caviare had to be
reserved for their respective monarchies. One example came in when
King Edward the Second declared the sturgeon was the royal fish,
(18:33):
decreeing that the stock in England's waters belonged to the
Imperial Treasury. And this brings us to a modern thing
that had to include that I legitimately thought might have
been an onion article, but it's totally real. A BBC
story from two thousand four detailed a man being investigated
by the police after he caught a sturgeon allegedly without
the Queen's for mission, without the Queen's press right, so
(18:56):
it's still a thing. According to the story, the Queen
has to be consulted prior to any action regarding a
sturgeon after it is caught. Only around six are caught
in the UK a year. The fisherman in question didn't
even know that this was a thing, was exactly and
to consult people about it. A spokesperson from the Swansea
(19:17):
Coast Guard said a facts was sent to Buckingham Palace
and fairly quickly return facts came saying the fisherman was
free to dispose of it as he wished. I believe
that most of the time fishermen are allowed to keep
what they catch. Although this has never happened in eight years.
That worked here. Wow, they set up facts. Not only
did they send the facts about whether or not this guy,
the queen will allow this guy to do something with
(19:38):
a fish. It was a fact. It was fat and
and Buckingham Palace faxed him back quickly. And then I
found out that royal fish is the whole thing. It's
a category and we have to do an episode on it.
We have to, yes, like dolphins are one still still
a thing, that's beautiful. The Queen's probably like, oh, asked
(20:02):
me about this stainton shirt. In the fourteen hundreds, Venetians
returned from the Black Sea with barrels of caviar, introducing
it to parts of Europe that had previously not known
about it. It It possibly they had, but it had been forgotten. However,
it didn't really take off. Shakespeare even used caviar to
mean obscurity and Hamlet in the sixteenth century. Common Italian
(20:25):
saying at the time was whosoever edith of caviar, edith
of salt, dung and flies. I know, really some fishermen
of fed fish road to pigs as far as we know,
the English word caviar first appeared in print, possibly derived
from the Turkish word caviar or perhaps the Persian word chavjar.
(20:47):
These words mean cake of power or piece of power
they did, or perhaps it was derived from Italian or Greek.
Arguments about this as well mysteries histories. After the Cossack
rebellion failed in sixteen seventy one, its leader was hung,
the Cossacks presented the Czar with a bowl of caviare,
reminiscent of the act of peasants offering up salt and
bread to honored guest. In order to prevent a future uprising,
(21:09):
Czar Peter the Great gave the Cossacks control of the
sturgeon industry, as well as the power to collect taxes
on salt, both key and caviare. In fact, Peter advised
the Cossacks to export caviare, but it wasn't easy, and
while this meant that for many Europeans, Russian caviare was
beyond their reach, many heard tales of it. Some found
it almost mythic, while others found it flat out ridiculous,
(21:31):
including French writer Rabelais. He wrote about that ridiculously beyond
the whole thing. When Peter the Great offered up a
sample of caviare to French King Louis the fifteenth, the
king allegedly spit it out on the very fantasy carpet
at the very side Safari Dictionary do Commerce came with
this glowing review. It is beginning to be known in
(21:52):
France where it's not despised at the best tables. Oh,
becoming known where it's not despised, that's me. Caviar was
further popularized in Russia as an alternative to meet on
the days when the Church forbade eating meat in the
early eighteen hundreds. In eighteen sixty one, Elena Molokovitz cookbook
(22:15):
A Gift to young housewives, suggested garnishing sauerkraut with caviare as,
though it were quote strewn with poppy seeds. I mean share, yeah,
no arguments here. The Romanov, not the royal family. Romanov
Caviar Company was established in eighteen fifty nine. Two other
big names in the world of caviare to this day
got started around this time. German company Diekman and Hanson
(22:38):
in eighteen sixty one and Paris based Petro sian A
couple of years later in nine two, which I mentioned
at the top. Meanwhile, when the Ritz Hotel Paris opened
in eighteen nine one, it drew in a celebrity clientele
like Ernest Hemingway and f Scott Fitzgerald. I feel like
they were everywhere, was somewhere, They were there, and they
enjoyed caviar and champagne. Also, there are really wild stories
(23:02):
about this hotel, which I believe recently reopened after remodeling,
including that Hemmingway helped liberate it from the Nazis. Somehow,
I feel like we've talked about that before, But if
we haven't, maybe in a cocktail episode. Yeah, I think
it came up. But anyway, I guess you can get
caviare treatment for your face there, or you could at
(23:23):
one time I didn't like call and ask, But according
to their website, there is a Chanel Skincare Spa and
a proprietary Ritz spa, and I did not see any
caviar I mentioned. Doesn't mean that it's not there. Um. However,
while we're talking about the Ritz one, Matthew Fort, writing
about caviar for Esquire, related that around the Ritz, London's
(23:46):
Rivioli bar Um had these, uh, these these five pounds
sterling lunches that consisted of white bread sandwiches, crusts cut
off of course um stuffed with either foi gra or
caviar um plus half a bottle of champagne on the side. Um.
And I mean five pounds today sounds like, oh man,
that's a great deal, let's do it every day. At
the time it was like like thirty eight pounds in
(24:08):
today's money, um, which is about fifty bucks American. So not,
I mean, still a pretty good deal for comparatively. Yeah,
not as cheap as it sounds. No, and not as
cheap as it sounds. The Industrial Revolution made transport of
intact eggs far simpler, things like refrigeration railways huge helps,
and also allowed for the growth of a class of
(24:30):
folks that could afford them. A Greek sea captain by
the name of Jonas of oar Kiss helped elevate caviar
in Europe from a thing king spat out to a
much desired item among the European aristocracy. The Varkis tried
caviar in Russia in the seventeen eighties and wheels started
turning in his brain. He figured out how to preserve
and transport the eggs in the Mediterranean, and by the
(24:52):
time of his death he was a millionaire of cavier.
But not all caviar was expensive. As we discussed in
our bar Snacks episode. Yes the bar Snacks episode, salty
caviar was sometimes served as a complimentary lunch item at
saloons to encourage drinking in early nineteenth century America. Salt
(25:14):
makes you thirsty, drink morsh. This was largely possible because
there were so many sturgeons populating North American waters. The
flesh of sturgeon cop from the Hudson River was so
plentiful it was known as Albany beef. Yeah. German immigrants
are generally credited with introducing a taste for caviar to
(25:36):
the United States, particularly in the Midwest, but Native Americans
were eating caviar wall along before any immigrants arrived, and
in some cases fed it to their babies. Yeah. One.
Henry Shocked, an immigrant from Germany, took note of people
enjoying caviar and saw hey a business opportunity. In eighteen
seventy three, he started shipping caviart to Europe, priced at
(25:58):
a dollar a pound. Several others did the same in
the wake of his success, enough so that the US
became the world's largest exporter of caviar with the nineteen
centuries end. But twist, but twist, twist. Because European saw
business opportunity to some enterprising and perhaps less than scrupulous
(26:19):
individuals took that apported American caviar, relabeled it Russian caviare,
which was highly more expensive, and shifted it right back
to the US yep, and they were also very successful.
The state of Pennsylvania reported that up to nine of
European imported Russian caviare actually originated in the United States.
(26:44):
Around the end of the eight hundreds, yeah wild love it. Yeah.
In parallel, the numbers of North American sturgeon dropped dramatically,
nearly to extinction. This translated to an exorbitant increase in
price for caviare. By the eighteen nineties nineteen hundreds, caviar
had become much more high end in the United States,
(27:07):
and it also course corrected a little bit that um
in that most caviar labeled as Russian did legit come
from Russia. Russia's communist government took control of the Caspian
fishery where two thirds of Russian caviar originated. It's three
thousand times a year and nineteen hundred. This takeover was violent,
resulting in several executions. Um yeah. Following this, in the
(27:30):
nineteen thirties, the USSR started the very first sturgeon farming
operations in the world. Skipping ahead to the nineteen sixties,
China decided to get in on the caviar game. After all,
a species of sturgeon were plentiful in the Amoor River,
which is the boundary between Russia and China. And from
what I understand, it's sort of a story of like
(27:51):
of like hope for peace um or at least like
fortitude through financial gain. Anyway, because like this was the
height of the Cold War, right, and so China Russia
relations were strained to violent China US relations were super
strained as well. Um. But China pulled together the sturgeon
fishing and egg harvesting industry with help from American corporations
(28:12):
and Russian experts caviar. The power of the power of caviar.
Caviar prices reached such heights that people in the United
States started searching for domestic alternatives In the nineteen sixties. Yeah,
and they weren't the only ones. The Russian caviart companies
started selling cheaper options in the eighties like salmon row
(28:33):
red zammon caviar, lumpfish and whitefish are golden whitefish caviar.
But but yeah, surgeon caviare was still a big ticket
item in Russia. And in nine this is another one
where they're conflicting histories. Um, there was this big scandal.
It came out that a whole rang of employees within
the Soviet Unions Ministry of Fish Industry had been running
(28:55):
like a decade long scam. They had been purposefully mislabeling
these huge cans of caviare is smoked herring like a
different Different articles published in the American press say either
three to five kilo cans or three to five leader cans.
Either way, a lot of caviare mislabeling it as smoked herring,
shipping it out of the country for relabeling in sale
(29:17):
in the Europe and the US um and saving the
profits in Swiss bank accounts. But like huge scandal like
forced the resignation of the dude who had been in
charge since the nineteen forties, rumor had at the up
to two employees were arrested. Like the penalty for this
kind of like money involving scam was death by firing squad.
(29:41):
And supposedly the whole ring broke when um like mislabeled
cans would ocasionally link into the local market and give
some random shopper a big surprise, a very very very
pleasant surprise. But apparently the wrong man got the wrong can,
and a surprised police investigator pulled the whole thing down. Wow, dang, no,
(30:08):
I want to do a whole episode just on that.
Oh gosh. Um. Yeah, And I couldn't figure like the
story kind of disappeared, like I couldn't figure out what
happened in the wake of it, And I'm wondering if
it was all just like weird misinformation. Anyway, Throughout all
of this, you may have noticed that we haven't mentioned
the other major power that borders the Caspian Sea, what's
(30:29):
now Iran. It wasn't until after the Iranian Revolution sometimes
called the Islamic Revolution in nineteen seventy nine, following decades
of political and religious and economic turmoil, that Sturgeon was
reclassified as a scaled fish and thus okay for devout
Muslims to handle. And supposedly the change was made because
(30:51):
of the trade value of caviare in the early eighties,
they were like, we can export this if it's okay
for us to handle. So let's talk about that. We
just had a whole revolution. Let's yeah. But the collapse
of the Soviet Union in the nineteen nineties, caviar prices
plummeted in Russia. You could even buy it from peddler's
(31:11):
on the sidewalk in a large international black market in
parts supplied by caviar poachers flourished, severely, threatening the population
of Caspian surgeon. Several descriptions like in this Russian caviar
black market to the illegal drug market in the United States.
And I can't really overstate how devastating this was to sturgeon,
(31:33):
Like the collapse of the USSR was the worst possible
thing that could have happened for these fish. Um it
really led to the complete over fishing that has led
to the endangerment of these species today. Yeah, and again
the book we mentioned at the top of this segment,
go read it is so illustrative of that because she
(31:57):
the author interviews people who have been in the industry
for decades in some cases a long time, and they're
just so they have hope, keep thinking it's going to
bounce back, and it just hasn't and hasn't, hasn't, And
scientists are saying, no, it's not unless we change things.
We change a lot. Yeah, and some things are changing,
which we will get to in a second. But we
do have a little bit more of scandal. Scandal. In
(32:19):
the mid nineteen nineties, Arnold Hanson Sturn, president of Hans
and cavir Co, sold three thousand pounds of a legal
caveat for a total of around two million dollars YEP.
When he was caught. He only served eighteen months in jail,
and he and the company combined paid about twenty thousand
and finds that also differs depending on what you read.
(32:40):
I believe he's back in the basins. In The Convention
on International Trade and Endangered Species or c i t
e S put in place regulations around the global sturgeon
and caviart trade, and those regulations do help thanks to
to those and the Endangered Species Act. In the year
(33:02):
two thousand, the US Fish and Wildlife Service seized a
ton of illegally imported caviare and find the importers over
ten million dollars they destroyed. The caviare hurts, It does hurt.
Beginning in two thousand, Russia started implementing regulations to crackdown
on poaching and overfishing, and this led to a number
(33:26):
of bloody conflicts between poachers and officials. Apparently the local
Russian like caviar mafia used their wives and children as
human shields in this one attack on the coast Guard
to recover confiscated boats and equipment. Oh my gosh, hoof.
In two thousand, the United Nations Conservation Council and Caspian
(33:47):
Sea States banned the export of wild caviare to Europe,
followed in two five by that U s Beluga caviar Band.
This resulted in our rise of farmed caviare, especially from Italy,
Iran and here in the United States California. In two
thousand eight, researchers conducted an experiment with caviare and which
participants were asked to evaluate the taste of caviare labeled
rare versus some labeled as common, and as you can
(34:09):
probably guess, the caviare was actually the same but people
largely expressed a preference for the caviar labeled rare humans humans, funny,
what are you up to? Um? As of this thirty
year sturgeon research program in Japan finally came to fruition
(34:30):
and began selling caviare commercially, So we now have commercial
caveat coming out of Japan. And that's also around when
China's production of and market four caviare began booming to
where it is today. In even a Chinese company got
this contract with German airline I never know how to
say it, Leftonsa, thank you Leftanza. Um. Yeah, they got
(34:50):
this contract with Leftansa to provide caviare for its first
class cabins. And so that's when the global luxury market
kind of started taking Chinese happy are seriously. And as
of twenty nineteen, Atlantic sturgeon populations seem to be starting
to bounce back, um, thanks to thirty years of environmental
(35:12):
efforts to restore their habitats and prevent h fishing of them. Yeah,
and there's so much to read about this, and so
much of it it feels like you're reading a fiction book,
like this character can't possibly exist in this world of sturgeon. Yeah,
but it does. I'm thinking of one person in particular,
(35:35):
and if you you go look into the research you'll
know who I'm talking about. But yeah, the numbers got
so low in the situation, so bad. So this is
it's promising that we're starting to see some results from
the people who've been in this field and working on
it and trying so hard to be heard. Yeah, and
(35:56):
it's you know again, like it comes it comes down
to money so much, because there are so many other
species that have not had this amount of work put
into their health and welfare because they're not producing. Cave
are so most expensive food in the world, so screw them. Um. Yeah,
it's real nice that people are working on a solution
(36:18):
for this animal. I wish that more animals were being
given similar treatment. But yeay, surgeons, surgeons. I do. They
are cute in a weird way. I really am very
fond of catfish. I think they're adorable, so so yeah.
And these guys have a little like like whisker kind
(36:38):
of things too, so yeah, yeah, and I do. It
is fascinating to me when foods like this become the
cultural icon almost that they are, that it is fancy
and wealth and luxury, and that eating it somehow gives
you that imparts that to you, it's aspiration and all. Yeah, Undy,
(37:02):
do I have aspiration that we'll get to try some
one day. But in the meantime, we do have a
little bit more for you. But first we've got another
quick break for a word from our sponsor, and we're back.
Thank you, sponsor, Yes, thank you, we're back with listen.
(37:24):
I would do the trans Atlantic accent at any opportunity,
any opportunity. We were both also holding cigars and cigars
without really communicating, we just knew if you do the
Transatlantic you need something in your hand, either like Martini glass,
jimping glass, or a little cigarette. Oh yeah, what was
yours of Martini glass? Okay, okay, I think mine was
(37:47):
a cigar. Well, we were, We were on the same page.
Asha wrote, just listen to the Baileief episode and laughed
at the conspiracy section. I don't know how much they
truly affect the flavor of my meals, because I definitely
used the dry kind. I need to get fresh, and
I tend to use a lot of other spices as well.
But when I was a kid and was having dinner,
at a friend's house. The mom said, you know the tradition,
(38:09):
whoever gets the bay leaf in their bowl has to
kiss the cook. And I just thought this was the
cutest tradition ever. So now I always stick at least
one in my soup, sauces, etcetera, then make sure it
ends up in my fiance's bowl, so he has to
give me a kiss. He always rolls his eyes that
I did it on purpose, but kisses me anyway. That's love,
That's so sweet. Bailey Baileyaflow Robert wrote a couple of
(38:33):
years back, we found out about a somewhat local candy
company that has cane making demonstrations. In December, we packed
up our four year old niece and took her to
a candy store best aunt and uncle. They had a
huge glass window for people to watch as they made
candy canes and candy bowls, Yes, bowls made from candy
cane ropes, starting with that yellowish molten sugar. I had
(38:56):
no idea how they made the white color myself, so
color me shocked. And the worker took the yellow soft
candy and worked it on a hook on the wall
like taffy to turn it white. After twisting and thinning it.
They brought out straight links for all the kids to
form into their own shapes. After the demonstration, we then
tried to control ourselves and not buy everything we saw.
They had some interesting flavors of candy canes. One of
(39:18):
my favorite was sassafras. We also picked up some ribbon
candy I think the same material as candy canes, flattened
and twisted like a barber pole. Later that day, some
of those pieces were used as the chimney for our
Gingerbread house. Just to shout out to Purity Candy in
Central Pennsylvania. That sounds cool. That does sound cool. Anytime
there's a demonstration, I'm super in for it. I know.
(39:38):
I always love when I want by one of those
candy places as those demonstrations and it's all kids and
it's just me, and I'm equally pressed up and riveted
space against the glass looking at the other kids. You're
seeing this check it out, Gas being alone, I would
love to check this out. I mean, I'm not a
big fan of candy canes, but I would love to
(39:58):
see how they're made. Absolute Yes, thanks to both of
those listeners. Shore writing in if you would like to
write to us. You can Our email is hello at
favorit pod dot com. We're also on social media. You
can find us on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook at savor
pod and we do hope to hear from you. Savor
is production of I Heart Radio and Stuff Media. For
more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can visit the
(40:21):
I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen
to your favorite shows. Thanks as always, Toy superproducers Dylan
Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and
we hope that lots more good things are coming your
way
Savor News
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Anney Reese
Lauren Vogelbaum
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