May 6, 2020 • 43 mins
These crunchy, oily seeds compliment many baked goods and other dishes – but they have a dangerous reputation. Anney and Lauren explore the history and science of poppy seeds and opium poppies.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
Hello, and welcome to Savor production of I Heart Radio.
I'm Annie Reese and I'm Lauren Vogelbaum. And today we're
talking about poppy seeds, and because of that, I wanted
to give just a quick like I guess content warning
here at the top. If opioid uh drugs are not
a subject that you are up for hearing anything about today, uh,
(00:27):
then you know, maybe maybe give a pass to this one,
because we get just a tiny bit into that here
and there. Yes, yes, And this was inspired by our
upcoming we are working on it, Alice in Wonderland episode.
Very excited about it, and also our recent Muffin episode
because I totally missed a Seinfeld referenced shame on me
(00:52):
in that episode, the poppy seed Muffin episode. Oh that's right,
because because Elaine tests of fall positive for opioid use
because of a poppy seed muffin. Right, Yeah, how could
I forget? I were all disappointed in you, Annie. I
can feel your disappointment through the Skype. That is a
(01:15):
strong disappointment. I will endeavor to never miss a Seinfeld
reference again. Will you better? Thank you? Well, thank you,
and yes I won't. I think I've maybe had one
poppy seed muffin in my whole life maybe, um, yeah, yeah,
(01:37):
I can't even remember, like I remember very specifically. I
was in Savannah, Georgia to march in the Big St.
Patrick's Say Parade when I was in high school. For
some reason, I just remember having this muffin that I've
never had before, and it was like kind of lemony,
and I think maybe that was a poppy seed muffin.
I don't know, but I've definitely gotten the panic text
(01:57):
from friends saying, oh my god, I've had poppy seas
and have a direct us. What do I do? Well,
I think you'll be okay, Yeah, I Um, I really
love lemon flavored baked goods, so I've had a lot
of poppy seed baked goods in my life. Um and yeah, yeah,
I I love them crunchy, there's a color contrast in
(02:19):
their nice Yeah yeah yeah. I mean I've certainly had
the Trader Joe's Everything bagel seasoning, which okay, which contains Yeah.
I'm to understand that it is a very popular seasoning
and we actually got that from a sponsor. I think
miss Bagel's from some bagel company. I apologize. Yeah, I
(02:44):
feel like it was Thomas. Oh gosh, we're terrible people. Um, yes,
we got a whole basket of stuff, um for like
for the in honor of the bagel emoji coming out.
That's right. Oh and that emoji pillow, that's where that
came from. I got pillow from that, That's right, Okay.
(03:04):
And I certainly had poppy seed bagels at some point.
And I know I've had a poppy seed hot dog
mine or just a hot dog bun with poppy seeds.
I guess. Yeah, so I get another warding. This one
is a tricky topic. And when I was in college,
I actually did a paper on the implications of poppy
(03:28):
growth in Afghanistan when the US intervened and tried to
put a stop to it, and all of those folks
lost their source of income and perhaps joined terrorist organizations
because of it because they pay. Yeah. Sure, yeah, so
we're a food show. We're not really going to go
too deep into that stuff, but we will touch on
(03:48):
it if you're curious. I'm not sure I've ever said
this on the show, but I actually went to college
to join the CIA potentially, and here I am. You
never know where life will go exactly, and you never
know where the research will take you exactly. There's there's
(04:12):
a great instance of that maxim in this very episode. Indeed,
But before we get to that, I guess we should
get to our question. Poppy seeds. What are they? Well,
poppy seeds are the seeds of the opium poppy plant
(04:33):
botanical name popaver Um snifer um or Papa wear cinifer um.
I'm not sure anyway, Moving on, these poppies are flowering herbs,
that is there. They're a soft stemmed plant that can
grow like two to five ft tall um just tall,
it's like a half a meter to a to a
meter and a half or so, and they produce at
the top of these stocks. These are these bright, beautiful
(04:55):
flowers and colors from white to pink, to purple, to
to red, to blue ish to a combination um. And
those flowers, when pollinated, develop into these bulbous green fruits
um that when they yellow and ripen, will produce these
oily wee, little round seeds in colors from white to
black to a sort of bluish black, tiny tiny things
(05:18):
think like a like a rough ground peppercorn or coffee
in size. And so if you drive these seeds out UM.
They are a crunchy and slightly fatty and sort of roasty,
warm flavored seed that that add like a pop of
texture and color to foods. They're often sprinkled on or
through UM both sweet and savory baked goods UH incorporated
(05:40):
into dressings and sauces and stews and puddings UM the
American sense of puddings like a not any dessert, but
a pudding dessert anyway, UM or or used as you
might use ground nuts or seeds to create like a
rich filling for a pastry. You can also process oil
from the seeds culinary or industrial use UM. The oil
(06:03):
is good for helping create emulsions, which is the fancy
word for like making oil and water plain ice together
like in salad dressing you know UM, and for creating
a drying effect in paints and varnishes because it's a
dry drying oil UM. After you extract the oil, the
cakes of these seeds might be used for animal feed.
And this plant is infamous not so much because of
(06:25):
the seeds, partially because of the seeds, but more because
in the process of living and growing, this plant produces
this type of latex like a like a milky, sappy
gummy substance that happens to contain a few compounds that
produce interesting effects in human bodies opiates. This latex gum
can be collected and processed into opioid drugs, which can
(06:48):
mimic the effects of compounds that our own bodies do
make and can produce in our bodies pain relieving and
feel good sorts of feelings. The species name sniffer um
roughly means sleep ringing in Latin because of those effects
and uh, those compounds can also produce a number of
negative effects um and furthermore, are physically and mentally addictive,
(07:10):
which means that we humans can come to depend on
using them and using increasingly more of them in order
to feel just okay bad times there Other species of
poppies will grow similar flowers, but not the edible seeds
and um fewer and less of those opiate compounds. Okay,
So so what about the nutrition? Okay? Al right, So
(07:36):
in a lot of cases, poppy seeds are used more
as a seasoning than like a let's seed, a whole
bunch of this sort of food, but even a tablespoon
contains like good punches of protein and dietary fiber um
mostly healthy unsaturated fats like good A Mega threes and sixes,
and just a wild amount of minerals like manganese and calcium.
So poppy seeds are a pretty great addition to your
(07:59):
diet in terms of how thing fill you up and
keep you going. I mean, if you mix them with
like an equal weight of sugar and put them in pastry,
that's a different issue, but right as with anything. Um.
But the question as it relates to drug tests and
I guess general curiosity, like the opium poppy produces these opioids,
(08:23):
and you can test positive on a drug test from
eating poppy seeds. So will poppy seeds get you high?
Will they? No? I mean, okay, like possibly if you
ate a lot of poppy seeds, maybe a little high,
but at that point you would mostly feel like just
really full of poppy seeds. Don't try this at home,
(08:45):
by the way, Like, just like if you ate a
lot of any other kind of seed, mostly your intestines
would feel away and not a good way. So probably
don't do that. Oh, definitely definitely don't do it. Avoid
that one. But okay, So the thing about poppy seeds
that the seeds themselves do not contain any of those
opiates when they're growing um or when they're finished, they
(09:08):
do not grow to contain them UM, but contamination can
occur during processing or or due to pest damage during
opium poppy growth, and that contamination is low enough to
be considered a non concern in terms of dietary intake. Like,
they will not get you high. But because of the
way that that we have classically tested for opioid drugs,
(09:32):
even the tiniest, tiniest bit of the compound morphine in
your urine will cause you to test positive. So if
you eat a totally normal amount of contaminated seeds, you
can come back with a false positive for opioid drug use.
So like, if you know you're gonna have to take
a drug test, probably avoid poppy seeds for a day
or so just to be safe. But also, yeah, like
(09:54):
there's UM there's discussion in the medical field UM and
the culinary industry about how to control for this in
both seed production and in drug testing. Like you can
wash the seeds to remove some of these opiates, that's
a normal part of production. UM, but the prior recommended
threshold for for years and years for drug testing, was
(10:15):
only three hundred nanograms of morphine per milli leader of
urine UM, which is it's such a small amount, it's
so tiny um in was recommended by the U. S
Department of Health and Human Services and by the medical
world in general to raise that to two thousand nanograms
per milli leader UM because of poppy seeds, just because
(10:38):
of poppy seeds, because so many people were false positive
testing that it was considered an issue. UM and it
was raised specifically to two thousand nanograms per milli leader
because having that much in your urine roughly corresponds to
having ingested the bare minimum amount of opioids that anyone
(10:58):
could possibly take to have any kind of therapeutic effect.
Even that's a crazy minium anyway. UM. As of two
thousand and eight, many labs were still using the lower
number though so still I will say doing the research
for this one, uh, I type in Google poppy seed
history eight pages later, it's still will I test positive?
(11:23):
What do I do? And I'm like, this is yeah,
it is UM. That is relatively recent and UH and
a very deep and interesting and horrifying topic that we
are not getting very deep into today. But yes, best
advice if you know you have drug test again day
(11:46):
or two out, don't eat any poppy seeds. You'll you'll
be fine. But um, but yeah, poppy seeds have been
used for just a wild range of folk medicinal purposes
over the millennia UM, but as of yet, no scientific
evidence of adicinal properties has been found UM other than
again from contamination from opium compounds. Right, and we do
(12:10):
have some culture stuff we want to touch on in
this one. In the United States, we primarily get our
poppy seeds for food from the Netherlands and Turkey. The
stuff you get at the store is most likely Dutch
poppy seeds, and here in the States we usually delegate
poppy seeds to the realm of baked goods like muffins, bagels,
(12:30):
pound cake, particularly lemon pound cake. Seems like this lemon
is a common flavor compliment thing happening, cookies, hot dog buns,
particularly in Chicago, probably due to Jewish baking traditions. Bagels, hamon,
tashi in breads, pastas in Indian curries, um, Trader Joe's Everything, bagels,
(12:50):
seasoning in sound dressing, poxied oil, POxy tea, which apparently
can be brewed in such a way to produce some
of these psychoactive effects. Yeah, do not make poppy seed
tea at home. Don't do it. You don't know how
contaminated the poppy seeds, maybe with opioids um and you
could overdose. Opioid overdoses are serious and they're a serious
(13:11):
problem because they make you stop breathing. So do not
make poppy seed tea at home. Don't do it. Do
not do it. Nope. The poppy seed roll is popular
in Eastern Europe, where poppy seeds in general see why
they're very popular ingredients poppy seed pudding, poppy seed dumplings
and dip soup salads. And in Poland there is a
(13:35):
poppy seed cake called Maco Yits, which cultured U. P.
L called possibly the quote most scame balless cake in
the world. Scandal cake cake, scandal. Even so, this sweet
shootle like yeast cake boasting of a filling of raisins, honey, butter,
walnut and ground poppy seas is one of the most
(13:57):
popular desserts in Poland. Again, why did I not try
this when I was in Poland? What was I doing?
Where were you gosh. Yeah, I did get very lost
in Poland. I was trying to go watch a while.
I was there for like a month, but I was
trying to go watch a soccer game, a football game,
and I wandered around the city for a long time.
(14:18):
I never see it. Oh no, but I did get
to try this amazing vodka. But anyway, okay, I see
you where your priorities were. Don't judge me, Lauren. Never
well sometimes just sometimes, all right, that's that's fair. That yeah, okay.
So there is a variety of this poppy seed roll
(14:39):
that is almost entirely made up of poppy seeds, and
it's traditionally eaten around Christmas and Easter, perhaps because of
stories that poppies bloomed from the spots where Jesus's blood
landed during his crucifixion. A Polish woman even wrote a
song about this type of poppy seed roll, which I
will not see, but I will recite for you. Okay,
(15:03):
there's no match fu lu bartov Maco yets. It's a roma,
it's flavor, curls of sweet poppy seeds. Yeah, beautiful, and
and they look like or at least in the pictures
I've seen of them. There are thick swirls in sort
of a bread. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A lot of
(15:26):
the time pastries with poppy seed filling will be um
rolled up like a like a Swiss roll or a
cinnamon roll. Um. But but yeah with with with really
thick like like equal like breading to poppy seed layer thickness. Yes,
they're quite pretty. So what's the scandal though? Yeah? Yeah,
(15:48):
the cake has a reputation for essentially, yes, introducing morphine
into your system. What's consumed, which it isn't true. Are
you're not getting high off of it? But yes, the
test might indicate that you have morphine in your system.
There has been so much writing about this because it
is a really popular food thing. There. Oh, man, I
(16:10):
and I found to something else we missed in our
bagel episode lurd Oh yeah, oh yeah, you're gonna like
this one. It's yes, the bagel rito bagel brito. Is
this what? Okay, bagel bagel margarita or bagel burrito bagel burrito.
(16:37):
Oh okay, I like my idea better bagel margarita. I
am intrigued by that. I have to say that gave
me pass um. Okay, so I love Marnie Shore's headline
about the Bagel Rito over at the takeout. The bagel
Rito is a literal hot mess, but it has a
(16:58):
confidence you can only dream of. Okay, here's the quote
she used in that article from the representative at this
event she was at. The bagel Rito is the latest
breakfast innovation from Einstein Bros. Bagels, Substantial in size and
high and flavor. It's loaded with two k tree eggs,
(17:20):
thick cut bacon, turkey sausage, three cheeses, hash brown sauca
and green chilies, and a flower tortilla, all hand wrapped
in an ostiago bagel dough and baked fresh. It's substantial size,
high flavor, and portability has earned it its slogan Big,
bold and easy to hold. Uh yeah, no, just that
(17:44):
doesn't fit with your bagel sensibilities. I'm shocked, Lauren, and
I'm genuinely shocked. Oh my gosh. Um. I mean, you know,
I like a Stromboli as much as the neck guy. Uh,
but I don't. I don't understand why bagel dough needs
(18:06):
to be involved in any of this. Specifically, it doesn't
seem like the optimal type of dough for this kind
of application. And furthermore, I'm really confused. Of all the
things I'm confused about about this, I am the most
confused about the fact that it is a literal burrito.
(18:26):
It's it's already in a flower tortilla and then you
wrap it in bagel dough. This is what's giving me pause,
the tortilla plus bagel situation. I always love your your
scientific breakdown of these things, these very important issues of
our time. Uh. I really appreciate it, you know. I
(18:48):
believe in treating everything with the seriousness that it deserves.
It's one of the things I love about Lauren. But
the bagel rito I think will be fine because again,
it has a confidence we can only dream of. Ye.
It is big, bold and easy to hold. So good,
good for it, Good for it. I I appreciate that
(19:10):
in a breakfast Good It's true and it's fun to
say in all seriousness. So it is it is. Yes, yes, okay.
So moving on from that and back to part we
do have some history, ah, we do. Um, But first
we've got a quick break for a word from our sponsor,
(19:36):
and we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you. So okay.
When it comes to the history, of poppy seeds as
a food. Not a lot of research has been done
on it, plenty on opium, not so much on the
food and drink uses. The opium poppy is thought to
have originated in the Mediterranean. Cultivation of the poppy is
(19:59):
theorized to have first taken place in Greece and Asia Minor,
which is pretty much modern day Turkey. Western European civilization
most likely began cultivating the opium poppy, or maybe it's
predecessor or relative, probably during the Neolithic Age, and researchers
know this from the remains of large numbers of seeds
(20:19):
found in Switzerland and Italy. It's hard to say for sure,
but historians think the seeds were used both as a
food and seasoning. How all this information is from one
research article I found super dense on this, and I
really appreciated slash. It really annoyed me. The author liked
(20:39):
to kind of like was misleading you, and then there
was a twist, Oh, so it had originated here, and
you're you're going along with that thought in your head,
and then all of a sudden, there's a paragraph where
the author says, that's what we thought, but it was
all InCred Oh my gosh, gosh, now and go back
(21:01):
and anyway at least with the correct thing. Then go
into the isn't it interesting that we used to think
this other thing? It was m Night Shamalan research paper.
There are more than one twist, all right, Yeah. The
(21:21):
ancient Egyptians and Greeks recommended poppy seeds as a form
of painkiller and sedative. The Hippocratic Corpus, which was a
collection of medical text primarily written during the fourth and
fifth century BC, detailed something called poppy juice. Homer mentioned
garden poppies. Kato the Elder wrote about poppy cultivation in Italy.
(21:43):
The first instance of differentiating between black and white seated
poppies is believed to have come from the Hippocratic dayda
at the during around the same time, where they were
described as strengthening and nourishing, and the work recommended a
mixture of white poppy c eats, meal and honey for
people recovering from disease. The first instance of describing a
(22:07):
species of poppy other than the Opium variety came to
us from THEO Frostis and later Das Karietes and Plenty
expanded the number of poppy varieties in their writings. Plenty
also documented using poppy seeds as a seasoning for bread,
and so did Galin, but only in small amounts, as
he believed it made you sleepy. In large quantities, once
(22:29):
the Egyptians figured out how to make atull poppy seed oil,
they might have mixed it with honey and put that
in bread, which sounds really good to me. Throughout ancient
times in the Mediterranean region, the opium poppy was pretty
much the only one that was used in any sort
of food or drink way. The rest were used almost
(22:50):
completely medicinally, and the absence of the poppy in certain
works during the time, certain works around cuisine UH seems
to suggest that it was perceived as more of a
food for commoners. Okay, UM, And yeah, those medicinal uses
of UM, primarily the opium poppy, but probably other types
(23:12):
of poppies over the course of history have been really
intense UM from various times throughout the world. UM. According
to Purdue University's Horticulture Department, um opium poppy has been
quote regarded as analgesic, anodyne, anti tuss of aphrodisiac, a
stringent bacterial sidle, calmative, carminative, demulcent, emollient, expectorant, heem static, hypotensive, hypnotic, narcotic, nervine, sedative, sudophoric, sure,
(23:48):
and tonic um and poppy has been used in folk
remedies for asthma, bladder bruises, cancer, cataract, qatar sure, cold
call it, conject of vitis, cough, diarrhea, this, enterried dysmanarrhea, enteritis,
in terrasia, fever, flux, headache, hemicrania, hypertension, hypochondria, hysteria, inflammation, insomnia, luke, correa, malaria, mania, melancholy, nausea,
(24:16):
neural gia, titus, uh, protestis, proleps rectitus, rheumatism, snake bites, spasm, spermatorrha, sprain,
stomach ache, swelling, toothache, tumor, ulcers, and wards and wards,
okay and warts. I love that so much, Lauren. It's
(24:39):
been a long time since we've had such a savor
list on the show, and I congratulate you for undertaking
such I would say, probably our most difficult list to date.
Oh gosh, I am sorry that I am so ignorant
about Latin in Greek, y'all, but I hope that some
(25:03):
some of those were understandable, and perhaps a couple were
even correct. I thought it was funny. I hope that
y'all agree. I loved it. I love you. Got to
see the faces I was making as I attempted to
say the words. It was very exciting. I felt like
I was on a roller coaster. Um. What I'm saying
(25:26):
is that people have known about opium related products for
a very long time and have thought any number of
things about them over the years. C. L. D. R. Yes. Yes.
Poppy seas were mentioned in the Edict of Diocletian, which
was written during the three hundred C. During the seventh
(25:47):
century Greek Encyclopedia's Palace, Janetta wrote of an ancient dessert
of roasted poppy seeds with honey. Both in Europe and
in Egypt, the ancient Indians might have done some thing similar.
Also in ancient times, the Slavs might have believed that
poppies enabled crossing between life and death, and maybe even
(26:10):
made dishes of poppy seeds for the dead, believing that
they came back to visit every now and then, why
not give them a treat? Or in the complete opposite, direction.
Perhaps they thought that poppy seas kept the unquiet from
returning unquiet dead. Um depends on the source, but I
(26:30):
suppose either way, possibly the ancient Slabs attached to spiritual
quality to poppy seeds. And this brings us to a
very important announcement. Oh okay, yes, yes, serious, Lauren, very serious.
I'm okay, yeah, I'm I'm so thrilled to say that
(26:53):
I got to go down Slavic beliefs rabbit hole around vampires,
uh for this poppy seed episode. Yeah, okay. Apparently one
method of defeating vampires was believed to be scattering poppy
seeds on their coffin so that when they awoke, they'd
(27:15):
be forced to count all of the poppy seeds. Oh yeah, yeah,
I love that. Of of all the ways of defeating vampires. Um,
they're like like anal retention, like like, yes, gosh, journat,
I guess I gotta count these poppy seeds. Yeah yeah,
counting affliction is by far my favorite. Yeah. That is pretty,
(27:40):
that's pretty great. That's pretty. We have to use that
in some story I write or something. I really hope
that that's where we got the count of sesame Street
fame rather than it just being a pun on Count Dracula.
Oh I hope so too. Sesame Street can get pretty deep.
I would believe it. Yeah, somebody called, somebody called the
(28:03):
Henson Studios. Let's figure this out, Yes, we've got to
And and I shared out uh final notes on this
vampire rabbit hole. I shot a picture that I found
with the Savor team Lauren, Andrew and Dylan Uh. And
it gave me such joy. And it was a book
cover of a vampire that I feel like was supposed
(28:24):
to be sexy, but it really didn't. It really fell flat,
but in a way that was wonderful and glorious, and
I pretty glorious. Yes, yes, yes, yes, all right, moving
on from vampires, legend goes that in King Yawn the Third,
Sobieski's royal baker whipped up this huge mac of yettes
(28:45):
complete somehow with the representation of the queen's likeness. I
call for a long time about how that could be true,
and I worked into the dough maybe or or a
design in poppy seeds. Sure, okay, sure. Another Polish King,
Sanaslav August Ponatowski, allegedly once received a huge one of
(29:07):
these things as a gift or this Again, according to
Cultured up Yale, I couldn't really verify that anywhere else,
and other places had similar stories but with different food items.
So mysteries history. Swiss physician Paracelsus, sometimes dubbed as the
father of toxicology, often gets credit for coming up with
(29:29):
a poppy seed beverage that was made up of alcohol,
water and opium in the sixteenth century. It was called laudanum,
and it was widespread throughout Europe and America up until
the nineteenth century, even ending up in several medicinal patents.
It wasn't until the early twentieth century when scientists started
to question the safety of opium and federal regulations were
enacted around the manufacture of it. That that went away.
(29:53):
During rampant opium trade during the eighteenth and nineteenth century,
British colonists demanded Bengali farmers use any suitable land for
cultivating poppies. The seeds were byproducts that were then added
into Bengalic cuisine. Ah. Yeah, and this persists in an
in curries and other dishes to this day. Um, and
I wanted to add a note in here. While we're
(30:15):
talking about it UM. That Yeah, the British UM in
British East India company UM forced cultivation of opium poppies
in India for the production of drugs for centuries and
then exported this drug to China primarily in the seventeen
and eighteen hundreds, specifically like to create addiction in the
Chinese population, and then based on that trade, made quite
(30:40):
a lot of money on the balance as they bought
up Chinese goods with their opium profits. UM. And this
was just an all around terrible thing UM that it
took over a century of really hard work from within
the Chinese government and culture to even begin to ameliorate UM.
And it also created a market for this exotic drug
(31:00):
back in England, especially towards the end of the eighteen hundreds,
which is where we get a lot of cultural references
from a to to opium and laudanum and products like
that in UM media like Sherlock Holmes and The Wizard
of Oz and arguably Lewis Carroll mm hmm. Okay. And
here's another non food related sidebar. The common poppy. A
(31:24):
red poppy became a symbol during World War One and
is to this day associated with that war, because red
poppies can survive buried in the earth for up to
eighty years and still bloom when exposed to sunlight. When
they do bloom, it can be the stunning beautiful display
uh and this happened to a Europe devastated by war.
(31:46):
The poppies would often grow near mass cemeteries where the
earth the dirt had been disturbed. After Canadian doctor John
McCrae witnessed this in nineteen fifteen, he wrote the poem
in Flanders Field. In Flanders Fields, the poppies blow between
the crosses row on row. This poem became the most
well known World War One poem in the UK and
(32:08):
the US. After its publication, the Allies adopted the red
poppy as a recruitment tool. It appeared on army posters
and on materials encouraging people to buy war bonds. They
were a part of ceremonies honoring the casualties of the war.
Lines from the poem were briefly printed on the Canadian
ten dollar bill in nineteen eighteen. Closely after the armistice,
(32:30):
an American woman named Moyna Michael promised she would wear
a red poppy every day for the rest of her life.
She also gave out red silk poppies, and these actions
inspired Allied organizations to sell red poppies to raise funds
for victims of the war. To this day, folks in
the Commonwealth might wear red poppies on Remembrance Day to
(32:52):
honor the casualties of both World War One and World
War Two. And I'm so glad that you that you
uh talked about that, because I've I've been wondering about
the red poppy thing forever. And there you go, Yeah,
there you go. In nineteen sixty one, the United Nations
Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs laid out the rules for
the legal cultivation of opium poppies, largely around securing and
(33:15):
monitoring operating poppy farms. Uh. Yeah, it's it's really discouraged
to grow opium poppies in the United States. Um. It's
part of what makes the international drug trade of opium
products such a powerful and dangerous thing. Um In Michael Pollen,
(33:36):
the food writer, you know, like eat food, mostly plants,
not too much that guy. Um, he wrote this whole
piece about the garden cultivation of opium poppies in the
United States and how the d e A, the Drug
Enforcement Agency, has quietly been trying to discourage garden companies
from selling opium poppy at all. The plant minus the
(33:57):
seeds is listed as a schedule to drug, which means
that they can technically the d e A can technically
press charges against anyone growing any amount of it. So
there you go. There you go. Wow, we really we
really covered some far reto topics in this one. Gosh.
(34:17):
Yeah yeah, um, I mean still a delicious component of
everything bagels, which are kind of the best kind. So
it's true. I have a very little amount of that
seasoning left. Oh yeah yeah, and I'm trying to figure
out what I'm going to do with it in honor
of this episode. Gosh, I like, I definitely was like,
(34:39):
you take that vial of that thing, because if I
have it at home, I will just like eat handfuls
of it and nobody needs that, I think. I when
I when we got that gift box, I took a
picture of it and posted it somewhere, and one of
my good friends immediately was like, oh my gosh, I
love that season. That's when I realized that maybe people
(35:03):
really dug the trader Joe's everything, bagel seasoning. It's an
it's an intense thing that people have a lot of
feelings about. Well, we appreciate that over on, we do.
If you guys have never noticed, we appreciate intense feelings. Yes, yes,
and particularly you when it comes to bagels. Yes, I
(35:24):
understand that is a that is a food fight I
would not want to get into. No, no, oh my goodness.
Although yeah, yeah, speaking of food fights, are are that
that we we mentioned? Oh gosh a number of weeks
(35:46):
and or months. I don't know what time means anymore. Ago, Um,
we mentioned that we had been on Richard Blaze's new podcast,
UM food Court with Richard Blaze, and um that we
battle old out the topic of cake versus Pie. Somehow
we're still friends. Yes, I think that battle will live
(36:09):
on an infamy. I think it's legends will be written about.
It is certainly living on in Uh you know whatever
your favorite podcast player is right now, because that episode
went live? Was it only last week? Again? Time doesn't
mean anything to me anymore? So uh so, yeah, but
it's it's out. If you search for Food Court with
(36:30):
Richard Blaze, UM, or for Cake versus Pie or look
on our social media channels you can you can find
that one. I still haven't listened to it because I'm terrified.
Oh it's really fine. That's good. That's good. Yeah. I
I can now say that Richard Blaze has said I
(36:51):
am perhaps a little too prepared, and I'm going to
wear that as a badge of honor for the rest
of my day. Can never be too prepared when it
comes to pie. I would also say that if someone
who's like famous because of his love for molecular astronomy,
(37:12):
if that dude says that you're too prepared, Um, it's
a it's a special honor. You should wear it as
a as a badge of of pride. Oh, I definitely will.
I'm gonna like get it printed on something or I
don't know, I'm gonna update my business cards. Uh. Yeah.
If there's ever a book written about you, I hope
that's one of the like the like quotes on the cover,
(37:34):
perhaps a little too prepared. I like it. I like it,
but yeah, totally check it out. It is really fun.
Um and Lauren and I got there. I think you
can see our particular because you went into the science
and I kind of went into the history. It was
very fun. Yeah, go check that out, um, and we
(37:56):
do have some more for you in this episode. We do,
but first we've got one more quick break for a
word for a sponsor, and we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes,
thank you, And we're back with its like pretty flowers,
(38:23):
they are very pretty. They are gorgeous, Molly wrote, I'm
writing in to share a bit about egg tapping, or
as my family calls it, egg smashing. We are of
German descent, but we have had smashing tournaments for as
long as I can remember. My mom's side of the
family participates in a March Madness level egg smashing tournament
(38:46):
each Okay, I love this. Yeah, there's an art to smashing,
because you want to be forceful enough to crack the
end of the opponent's egg, but gently enough not to
crack your own egg. Once your egg is cracked on
both ends, you're out of the running. When I was
about six or so, my oldest sister and my cousin
were in a dead heat to win, and we were
(39:08):
running out of hard boiled eggs fast as they are
immensely competitive even to this day. My cousin went on
the hunt. Yes, pun intended through my grandma's multiple fridges
to find more hard boiled eggs. He found what he
thought to be a green dyed egg in the second
fridge my grandma hardly ever used. My sister and cousin
(39:29):
wound up to smash and upon impact, a choking, rancid
odor emitted from the crash zone. Turns out my cousin
hadn't found a dyed egg, but our rotten egg. Oh no,
I will never forget the smell of that rotten egg.
Are the reddish colored ooze that tripped all over the carpet.
My grandma was less than impressed, as were the rest
(39:51):
of the family's noses. From then on, all eggs for
the tournaments were kept in a specifically marked cartons, and
my grandma finally cleaned out her fridge. Okay, so there's
so many things I love about this, the March madness bracket. Um. Also,
(40:12):
I didn't know rotten eggs were a real thing. This
was yeah, I've I've never I've never witnessed one that
was that far gone myself. But oh yeah, I know,
like all of those sulfur compounds that are in eggs
will really ramp up and it's it's a whole thing. Man. See,
(40:33):
I I feel like when I have eggs, I just
never around that long. But I do have a friend
who went on a pretty long trip and when he
came back he had some eggs in the fridge and
had them and I just got this like random text
from him and he said, so eggs can go bad,
and never question beyond that. What happened to that night
(40:58):
but wasn't good? Yeah, No, it's it's very um apparent
upon cracking open an egg that has gone off. That's
something poor has happened in your day? No, did okay? Yeah?
Uh yeah. In other news, Kelly wrote, I just listened
(41:21):
to your Easter egg episode and was chuckling at the
end during listener mail at the story from the person
who was trying to make knuffles or niffles. The reason
why a Google search didn't turn up a recipe is
because the actual spelling is even weirder um and I'm
going to spell it for you k n o E
p f l E. If you google that, you will
(41:42):
see that they are in fact a type of spa cel.
So both the writer and her friend, we're right, All
of these words are fantastic. Yeah, because that that looks
to me like nopeful. Um, it's like it's like what
Leslie Nope eats when she wants a waffle? Oh, nopeful.
(42:06):
See and there Parks and rec is coming back together
for reunion. Let's let's get in touch with them. I'm
sure they will run with this idea. Oh I hope
so that would be delightful. Um, yeah, this is well.
We'll keep an eye on this continually updating story about
(42:29):
the niffle and the Knuffles and the nope Fules. We will, yes, yes,
and please if you have any information, send it to
us and you can do that at our email, Hello
at savor pod dot com or via social media. You
can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at saver
(42:49):
pod and we do hope to hear from you. Savor
is production of I Heart Radio. For more podcasts to
my Heart Radio, you can visit the I Heart Radio
app or Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your
favorite show. Thanks us always to our super producers Dylan
Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and
we hope that lots more good things are coming your way.
(43:14):
H
Hello, and welcome to Savor production of I Heart Radio.
I'm Annie Reese and I'm Lauren Vogelbaum. And today we're
talking about poppy seeds, and because of that, I wanted
to give just a quick like I guess content warning
here at the top. If opioid uh drugs are not
a subject that you are up for hearing anything about today, uh,
(00:27):
then you know, maybe maybe give a pass to this one,
because we get just a tiny bit into that here
and there. Yes, yes, And this was inspired by our
upcoming we are working on it, Alice in Wonderland episode.
Very excited about it, and also our recent Muffin episode
because I totally missed a Seinfeld referenced shame on me
(00:52):
in that episode, the poppy seed Muffin episode. Oh that's right,
because because Elaine tests of fall positive for opioid use
because of a poppy seed muffin. Right, Yeah, how could
I forget? I were all disappointed in you, Annie. I
can feel your disappointment through the Skype. That is a
(01:15):
strong disappointment. I will endeavor to never miss a Seinfeld
reference again. Will you better? Thank you? Well, thank you,
and yes I won't. I think I've maybe had one
poppy seed muffin in my whole life maybe, um, yeah, yeah,
(01:37):
I can't even remember, like I remember very specifically. I
was in Savannah, Georgia to march in the Big St.
Patrick's Say Parade when I was in high school. For
some reason, I just remember having this muffin that I've
never had before, and it was like kind of lemony,
and I think maybe that was a poppy seed muffin.
I don't know, but I've definitely gotten the panic text
(01:57):
from friends saying, oh my god, I've had poppy seas
and have a direct us. What do I do? Well,
I think you'll be okay, Yeah, I Um, I really
love lemon flavored baked goods, so I've had a lot
of poppy seed baked goods in my life. Um and yeah, yeah,
I I love them crunchy, there's a color contrast in
(02:19):
their nice Yeah yeah yeah. I mean I've certainly had
the Trader Joe's Everything bagel seasoning, which okay, which contains Yeah.
I'm to understand that it is a very popular seasoning
and we actually got that from a sponsor. I think
miss Bagel's from some bagel company. I apologize. Yeah, I
(02:44):
feel like it was Thomas. Oh gosh, we're terrible people. Um, yes,
we got a whole basket of stuff, um for like
for the in honor of the bagel emoji coming out.
That's right. Oh and that emoji pillow, that's where that
came from. I got pillow from that, That's right, Okay.
(03:04):
And I certainly had poppy seed bagels at some point.
And I know I've had a poppy seed hot dog
mine or just a hot dog bun with poppy seeds.
I guess. Yeah, so I get another warding. This one
is a tricky topic. And when I was in college,
I actually did a paper on the implications of poppy
(03:28):
growth in Afghanistan when the US intervened and tried to
put a stop to it, and all of those folks
lost their source of income and perhaps joined terrorist organizations
because of it because they pay. Yeah. Sure, yeah, so
we're a food show. We're not really going to go
too deep into that stuff, but we will touch on
(03:48):
it if you're curious. I'm not sure I've ever said
this on the show, but I actually went to college
to join the CIA potentially, and here I am. You
never know where life will go exactly, and you never
know where the research will take you exactly. There's there's
(04:12):
a great instance of that maxim in this very episode. Indeed,
But before we get to that, I guess we should
get to our question. Poppy seeds. What are they? Well,
poppy seeds are the seeds of the opium poppy plant
(04:33):
botanical name popaver Um snifer um or Papa wear cinifer um.
I'm not sure anyway, Moving on, these poppies are flowering herbs,
that is there. They're a soft stemmed plant that can
grow like two to five ft tall um just tall,
it's like a half a meter to a to a
meter and a half or so, and they produce at
the top of these stocks. These are these bright, beautiful
(04:55):
flowers and colors from white to pink, to purple, to
to red, to blue ish to a combination um. And
those flowers, when pollinated, develop into these bulbous green fruits
um that when they yellow and ripen, will produce these
oily wee, little round seeds in colors from white to
black to a sort of bluish black, tiny tiny things
(05:18):
think like a like a rough ground peppercorn or coffee
in size. And so if you drive these seeds out UM.
They are a crunchy and slightly fatty and sort of roasty,
warm flavored seed that that add like a pop of
texture and color to foods. They're often sprinkled on or
through UM both sweet and savory baked goods UH incorporated
(05:40):
into dressings and sauces and stews and puddings UM the
American sense of puddings like a not any dessert, but
a pudding dessert anyway, UM or or used as you
might use ground nuts or seeds to create like a
rich filling for a pastry. You can also process oil
from the seeds culinary or industrial use UM. The oil
(06:03):
is good for helping create emulsions, which is the fancy
word for like making oil and water plain ice together
like in salad dressing you know UM, and for creating
a drying effect in paints and varnishes because it's a
dry drying oil UM. After you extract the oil, the
cakes of these seeds might be used for animal feed.
And this plant is infamous not so much because of
(06:25):
the seeds, partially because of the seeds, but more because
in the process of living and growing, this plant produces
this type of latex like a like a milky, sappy
gummy substance that happens to contain a few compounds that
produce interesting effects in human bodies opiates. This latex gum
can be collected and processed into opioid drugs, which can
(06:48):
mimic the effects of compounds that our own bodies do
make and can produce in our bodies pain relieving and
feel good sorts of feelings. The species name sniffer um
roughly means sleep ringing in Latin because of those effects
and uh, those compounds can also produce a number of
negative effects um and furthermore, are physically and mentally addictive,
(07:10):
which means that we humans can come to depend on
using them and using increasingly more of them in order
to feel just okay bad times there Other species of
poppies will grow similar flowers, but not the edible seeds
and um fewer and less of those opiate compounds. Okay,
So so what about the nutrition? Okay? Al right, So
(07:36):
in a lot of cases, poppy seeds are used more
as a seasoning than like a let's seed, a whole
bunch of this sort of food, but even a tablespoon
contains like good punches of protein and dietary fiber um
mostly healthy unsaturated fats like good A Mega threes and sixes,
and just a wild amount of minerals like manganese and calcium.
So poppy seeds are a pretty great addition to your
(07:59):
diet in terms of how thing fill you up and
keep you going. I mean, if you mix them with
like an equal weight of sugar and put them in pastry,
that's a different issue, but right as with anything. Um.
But the question as it relates to drug tests and
I guess general curiosity, like the opium poppy produces these opioids,
(08:23):
and you can test positive on a drug test from
eating poppy seeds. So will poppy seeds get you high?
Will they? No? I mean, okay, like possibly if you
ate a lot of poppy seeds, maybe a little high,
but at that point you would mostly feel like just
really full of poppy seeds. Don't try this at home,
(08:45):
by the way, Like, just like if you ate a
lot of any other kind of seed, mostly your intestines
would feel away and not a good way. So probably
don't do that. Oh, definitely definitely don't do it. Avoid
that one. But okay, So the thing about poppy seeds
that the seeds themselves do not contain any of those
opiates when they're growing um or when they're finished, they
(09:08):
do not grow to contain them UM, but contamination can
occur during processing or or due to pest damage during
opium poppy growth, and that contamination is low enough to
be considered a non concern in terms of dietary intake. Like,
they will not get you high. But because of the
way that that we have classically tested for opioid drugs,
(09:32):
even the tiniest, tiniest bit of the compound morphine in
your urine will cause you to test positive. So if
you eat a totally normal amount of contaminated seeds, you
can come back with a false positive for opioid drug use.
So like, if you know you're gonna have to take
a drug test, probably avoid poppy seeds for a day
or so just to be safe. But also, yeah, like
(09:54):
there's UM there's discussion in the medical field UM and
the culinary industry about how to control for this in
both seed production and in drug testing. Like you can
wash the seeds to remove some of these opiates, that's
a normal part of production. UM, but the prior recommended
threshold for for years and years for drug testing, was
(10:15):
only three hundred nanograms of morphine per milli leader of
urine UM, which is it's such a small amount, it's
so tiny um in was recommended by the U. S
Department of Health and Human Services and by the medical
world in general to raise that to two thousand nanograms
per milli leader UM because of poppy seeds, just because
(10:38):
of poppy seeds, because so many people were false positive
testing that it was considered an issue. UM and it
was raised specifically to two thousand nanograms per milli leader
because having that much in your urine roughly corresponds to
having ingested the bare minimum amount of opioids that anyone
(10:58):
could possibly take to have any kind of therapeutic effect.
Even that's a crazy minium anyway. UM. As of two
thousand and eight, many labs were still using the lower
number though so still I will say doing the research
for this one, uh, I type in Google poppy seed
history eight pages later, it's still will I test positive?
(11:23):
What do I do? And I'm like, this is yeah,
it is UM. That is relatively recent and UH and
a very deep and interesting and horrifying topic that we
are not getting very deep into today. But yes, best
advice if you know you have drug test again day
(11:46):
or two out, don't eat any poppy seeds. You'll you'll
be fine. But um, but yeah, poppy seeds have been
used for just a wild range of folk medicinal purposes
over the millennia UM, but as of yet, no scientific
evidence of adicinal properties has been found UM other than
again from contamination from opium compounds. Right, and we do
(12:10):
have some culture stuff we want to touch on in
this one. In the United States, we primarily get our
poppy seeds for food from the Netherlands and Turkey. The
stuff you get at the store is most likely Dutch
poppy seeds, and here in the States we usually delegate
poppy seeds to the realm of baked goods like muffins, bagels,
(12:30):
pound cake, particularly lemon pound cake. Seems like this lemon
is a common flavor compliment thing happening, cookies, hot dog buns,
particularly in Chicago, probably due to Jewish baking traditions. Bagels, hamon,
tashi in breads, pastas in Indian curries, um, Trader Joe's Everything, bagels,
(12:50):
seasoning in sound dressing, poxied oil, POxy tea, which apparently
can be brewed in such a way to produce some
of these psychoactive effects. Yeah, do not make poppy seed
tea at home. Don't do it. You don't know how
contaminated the poppy seeds, maybe with opioids um and you
could overdose. Opioid overdoses are serious and they're a serious
(13:11):
problem because they make you stop breathing. So do not
make poppy seed tea at home. Don't do it. Do
not do it. Nope. The poppy seed roll is popular
in Eastern Europe, where poppy seeds in general see why
they're very popular ingredients poppy seed pudding, poppy seed dumplings
and dip soup salads. And in Poland there is a
(13:35):
poppy seed cake called Maco Yits, which cultured U. P.
L called possibly the quote most scame balless cake in
the world. Scandal cake cake, scandal. Even so, this sweet
shootle like yeast cake boasting of a filling of raisins, honey, butter,
walnut and ground poppy seas is one of the most
(13:57):
popular desserts in Poland. Again, why did I not try
this when I was in Poland? What was I doing?
Where were you gosh. Yeah, I did get very lost
in Poland. I was trying to go watch a while.
I was there for like a month, but I was
trying to go watch a soccer game, a football game,
and I wandered around the city for a long time.
(14:18):
I never see it. Oh no, but I did get
to try this amazing vodka. But anyway, okay, I see
you where your priorities were. Don't judge me, Lauren. Never
well sometimes just sometimes, all right, that's that's fair. That yeah, okay.
So there is a variety of this poppy seed roll
(14:39):
that is almost entirely made up of poppy seeds, and
it's traditionally eaten around Christmas and Easter, perhaps because of
stories that poppies bloomed from the spots where Jesus's blood
landed during his crucifixion. A Polish woman even wrote a
song about this type of poppy seed roll, which I
will not see, but I will recite for you. Okay,
(15:03):
there's no match fu lu bartov Maco yets. It's a roma,
it's flavor, curls of sweet poppy seeds. Yeah, beautiful, and
and they look like or at least in the pictures
I've seen of them. There are thick swirls in sort
of a bread. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A lot of
(15:26):
the time pastries with poppy seed filling will be um
rolled up like a like a Swiss roll or a
cinnamon roll. Um. But but yeah with with with really
thick like like equal like breading to poppy seed layer thickness. Yes,
they're quite pretty. So what's the scandal though? Yeah? Yeah,
(15:48):
the cake has a reputation for essentially, yes, introducing morphine
into your system. What's consumed, which it isn't true. Are
you're not getting high off of it? But yes, the
test might indicate that you have morphine in your system.
There has been so much writing about this because it
is a really popular food thing. There. Oh, man, I
(16:10):
and I found to something else we missed in our
bagel episode lurd Oh yeah, oh yeah, you're gonna like
this one. It's yes, the bagel rito bagel brito. Is
this what? Okay, bagel bagel margarita or bagel burrito bagel burrito.
(16:37):
Oh okay, I like my idea better bagel margarita. I
am intrigued by that. I have to say that gave
me pass um. Okay, so I love Marnie Shore's headline
about the Bagel Rito over at the takeout. The bagel
Rito is a literal hot mess, but it has a
(16:58):
confidence you can only dream of. Okay, here's the quote
she used in that article from the representative at this
event she was at. The bagel Rito is the latest
breakfast innovation from Einstein Bros. Bagels, Substantial in size and
high and flavor. It's loaded with two k tree eggs,
(17:20):
thick cut bacon, turkey sausage, three cheeses, hash brown sauca
and green chilies, and a flower tortilla, all hand wrapped
in an ostiago bagel dough and baked fresh. It's substantial size,
high flavor, and portability has earned it its slogan Big,
bold and easy to hold. Uh yeah, no, just that
(17:44):
doesn't fit with your bagel sensibilities. I'm shocked, Lauren, and
I'm genuinely shocked. Oh my gosh. Um. I mean, you know,
I like a Stromboli as much as the neck guy. Uh,
but I don't. I don't understand why bagel dough needs
(18:06):
to be involved in any of this. Specifically, it doesn't
seem like the optimal type of dough for this kind
of application. And furthermore, I'm really confused. Of all the
things I'm confused about about this, I am the most
confused about the fact that it is a literal burrito.
(18:26):
It's it's already in a flower tortilla and then you
wrap it in bagel dough. This is what's giving me pause,
the tortilla plus bagel situation. I always love your your
scientific breakdown of these things, these very important issues of
our time. Uh. I really appreciate it, you know. I
(18:48):
believe in treating everything with the seriousness that it deserves.
It's one of the things I love about Lauren. But
the bagel rito I think will be fine because again,
it has a confidence we can only dream of. Ye.
It is big, bold and easy to hold. So good,
good for it, Good for it. I I appreciate that
(19:10):
in a breakfast Good It's true and it's fun to
say in all seriousness. So it is it is. Yes, yes, okay.
So moving on from that and back to part we
do have some history, ah, we do. Um, But first
we've got a quick break for a word from our sponsor,
(19:36):
and we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you. So okay.
When it comes to the history, of poppy seeds as
a food. Not a lot of research has been done
on it, plenty on opium, not so much on the
food and drink uses. The opium poppy is thought to
have originated in the Mediterranean. Cultivation of the poppy is
(19:59):
theorized to have first taken place in Greece and Asia Minor,
which is pretty much modern day Turkey. Western European civilization
most likely began cultivating the opium poppy, or maybe it's
predecessor or relative, probably during the Neolithic Age, and researchers
know this from the remains of large numbers of seeds
(20:19):
found in Switzerland and Italy. It's hard to say for sure,
but historians think the seeds were used both as a
food and seasoning. How all this information is from one
research article I found super dense on this, and I
really appreciated slash. It really annoyed me. The author liked
(20:39):
to kind of like was misleading you, and then there
was a twist, Oh, so it had originated here, and
you're you're going along with that thought in your head,
and then all of a sudden, there's a paragraph where
the author says, that's what we thought, but it was
all InCred Oh my gosh, gosh, now and go back
(21:01):
and anyway at least with the correct thing. Then go
into the isn't it interesting that we used to think
this other thing? It was m Night Shamalan research paper.
There are more than one twist, all right, Yeah. The
(21:21):
ancient Egyptians and Greeks recommended poppy seeds as a form
of painkiller and sedative. The Hippocratic Corpus, which was a
collection of medical text primarily written during the fourth and
fifth century BC, detailed something called poppy juice. Homer mentioned
garden poppies. Kato the Elder wrote about poppy cultivation in Italy.
(21:43):
The first instance of differentiating between black and white seated
poppies is believed to have come from the Hippocratic dayda
at the during around the same time, where they were
described as strengthening and nourishing, and the work recommended a
mixture of white poppy c eats, meal and honey for
people recovering from disease. The first instance of describing a
(22:07):
species of poppy other than the Opium variety came to
us from THEO Frostis and later Das Karietes and Plenty
expanded the number of poppy varieties in their writings. Plenty
also documented using poppy seeds as a seasoning for bread,
and so did Galin, but only in small amounts, as
he believed it made you sleepy. In large quantities, once
(22:29):
the Egyptians figured out how to make atull poppy seed oil,
they might have mixed it with honey and put that
in bread, which sounds really good to me. Throughout ancient
times in the Mediterranean region, the opium poppy was pretty
much the only one that was used in any sort
of food or drink way. The rest were used almost
(22:50):
completely medicinally, and the absence of the poppy in certain
works during the time, certain works around cuisine UH seems
to suggest that it was perceived as more of a
food for commoners. Okay, UM, And yeah, those medicinal uses
of UM, primarily the opium poppy, but probably other types
(23:12):
of poppies over the course of history have been really
intense UM from various times throughout the world. UM. According
to Purdue University's Horticulture Department, um opium poppy has been
quote regarded as analgesic, anodyne, anti tuss of aphrodisiac, a
stringent bacterial sidle, calmative, carminative, demulcent, emollient, expectorant, heem static, hypotensive, hypnotic, narcotic, nervine, sedative, sudophoric, sure,
(23:48):
and tonic um and poppy has been used in folk
remedies for asthma, bladder bruises, cancer, cataract, qatar sure, cold
call it, conject of vitis, cough, diarrhea, this, enterried dysmanarrhea, enteritis,
in terrasia, fever, flux, headache, hemicrania, hypertension, hypochondria, hysteria, inflammation, insomnia, luke, correa, malaria, mania, melancholy, nausea,
(24:16):
neural gia, titus, uh, protestis, proleps rectitus, rheumatism, snake bites, spasm, spermatorrha, sprain,
stomach ache, swelling, toothache, tumor, ulcers, and wards and wards,
okay and warts. I love that so much, Lauren. It's
(24:39):
been a long time since we've had such a savor
list on the show, and I congratulate you for undertaking
such I would say, probably our most difficult list to date.
Oh gosh, I am sorry that I am so ignorant
about Latin in Greek, y'all, but I hope that some
(25:03):
some of those were understandable, and perhaps a couple were
even correct. I thought it was funny. I hope that
y'all agree. I loved it. I love you. Got to
see the faces I was making as I attempted to
say the words. It was very exciting. I felt like
I was on a roller coaster. Um. What I'm saying
(25:26):
is that people have known about opium related products for
a very long time and have thought any number of
things about them over the years. C. L. D. R. Yes. Yes.
Poppy seas were mentioned in the Edict of Diocletian, which
was written during the three hundred C. During the seventh
(25:47):
century Greek Encyclopedia's Palace, Janetta wrote of an ancient dessert
of roasted poppy seeds with honey. Both in Europe and
in Egypt, the ancient Indians might have done some thing similar.
Also in ancient times, the Slavs might have believed that
poppies enabled crossing between life and death, and maybe even
(26:10):
made dishes of poppy seeds for the dead, believing that
they came back to visit every now and then, why
not give them a treat? Or in the complete opposite, direction.
Perhaps they thought that poppy seas kept the unquiet from
returning unquiet dead. Um depends on the source, but I
(26:30):
suppose either way, possibly the ancient Slabs attached to spiritual
quality to poppy seeds. And this brings us to a
very important announcement. Oh okay, yes, yes, serious, Lauren, very serious.
I'm okay, yeah, I'm I'm so thrilled to say that
(26:53):
I got to go down Slavic beliefs rabbit hole around vampires,
uh for this poppy seed episode. Yeah, okay. Apparently one
method of defeating vampires was believed to be scattering poppy
seeds on their coffin so that when they awoke, they'd
(27:15):
be forced to count all of the poppy seeds. Oh yeah, yeah,
I love that. Of of all the ways of defeating vampires. Um,
they're like like anal retention, like like, yes, gosh, journat,
I guess I gotta count these poppy seeds. Yeah yeah,
counting affliction is by far my favorite. Yeah. That is pretty,
(27:40):
that's pretty great. That's pretty. We have to use that
in some story I write or something. I really hope
that that's where we got the count of sesame Street
fame rather than it just being a pun on Count Dracula.
Oh I hope so too. Sesame Street can get pretty deep.
I would believe it. Yeah, somebody called, somebody called the
(28:03):
Henson Studios. Let's figure this out, Yes, we've got to
And and I shared out uh final notes on this
vampire rabbit hole. I shot a picture that I found
with the Savor team Lauren, Andrew and Dylan Uh. And
it gave me such joy. And it was a book
cover of a vampire that I feel like was supposed
(28:24):
to be sexy, but it really didn't. It really fell flat,
but in a way that was wonderful and glorious, and
I pretty glorious. Yes, yes, yes, yes, all right, moving
on from vampires, legend goes that in King Yawn the Third,
Sobieski's royal baker whipped up this huge mac of yettes
(28:45):
complete somehow with the representation of the queen's likeness. I
call for a long time about how that could be true,
and I worked into the dough maybe or or a
design in poppy seeds. Sure, okay, sure. Another Polish King,
Sanaslav August Ponatowski, allegedly once received a huge one of
(29:07):
these things as a gift or this Again, according to
Cultured up Yale, I couldn't really verify that anywhere else,
and other places had similar stories but with different food items.
So mysteries history. Swiss physician Paracelsus, sometimes dubbed as the
father of toxicology, often gets credit for coming up with
(29:29):
a poppy seed beverage that was made up of alcohol,
water and opium in the sixteenth century. It was called laudanum,
and it was widespread throughout Europe and America up until
the nineteenth century, even ending up in several medicinal patents.
It wasn't until the early twentieth century when scientists started
to question the safety of opium and federal regulations were
enacted around the manufacture of it. That that went away.
(29:53):
During rampant opium trade during the eighteenth and nineteenth century,
British colonists demanded Bengali farmers use any suitable land for
cultivating poppies. The seeds were byproducts that were then added
into Bengalic cuisine. Ah. Yeah, and this persists in an
in curries and other dishes to this day. Um, and
I wanted to add a note in here. While we're
(30:15):
talking about it UM. That Yeah, the British UM in
British East India company UM forced cultivation of opium poppies
in India for the production of drugs for centuries and
then exported this drug to China primarily in the seventeen
and eighteen hundreds, specifically like to create addiction in the
Chinese population, and then based on that trade, made quite
(30:40):
a lot of money on the balance as they bought
up Chinese goods with their opium profits. UM. And this
was just an all around terrible thing UM that it
took over a century of really hard work from within
the Chinese government and culture to even begin to ameliorate UM.
And it also created a market for this exotic drug
(31:00):
back in England, especially towards the end of the eighteen hundreds,
which is where we get a lot of cultural references
from a to to opium and laudanum and products like
that in UM media like Sherlock Holmes and The Wizard
of Oz and arguably Lewis Carroll mm hmm. Okay. And
here's another non food related sidebar. The common poppy. A
(31:24):
red poppy became a symbol during World War One and
is to this day associated with that war, because red
poppies can survive buried in the earth for up to
eighty years and still bloom when exposed to sunlight. When
they do bloom, it can be the stunning beautiful display
uh and this happened to a Europe devastated by war.
(31:46):
The poppies would often grow near mass cemeteries where the
earth the dirt had been disturbed. After Canadian doctor John
McCrae witnessed this in nineteen fifteen, he wrote the poem
in Flanders Field. In Flanders Fields, the poppies blow between
the crosses row on row. This poem became the most
well known World War One poem in the UK and
(32:08):
the US. After its publication, the Allies adopted the red
poppy as a recruitment tool. It appeared on army posters
and on materials encouraging people to buy war bonds. They
were a part of ceremonies honoring the casualties of the war.
Lines from the poem were briefly printed on the Canadian
ten dollar bill in nineteen eighteen. Closely after the armistice,
(32:30):
an American woman named Moyna Michael promised she would wear
a red poppy every day for the rest of her life.
She also gave out red silk poppies, and these actions
inspired Allied organizations to sell red poppies to raise funds
for victims of the war. To this day, folks in
the Commonwealth might wear red poppies on Remembrance Day to
(32:52):
honor the casualties of both World War One and World
War Two. And I'm so glad that you that you
uh talked about that, because I've I've been wondering about
the red poppy thing forever. And there you go, Yeah,
there you go. In nineteen sixty one, the United Nations
Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs laid out the rules for
the legal cultivation of opium poppies, largely around securing and
(33:15):
monitoring operating poppy farms. Uh. Yeah, it's it's really discouraged
to grow opium poppies in the United States. Um. It's
part of what makes the international drug trade of opium
products such a powerful and dangerous thing. Um In Michael Pollen,
(33:36):
the food writer, you know, like eat food, mostly plants,
not too much that guy. Um, he wrote this whole
piece about the garden cultivation of opium poppies in the
United States and how the d e A, the Drug
Enforcement Agency, has quietly been trying to discourage garden companies
from selling opium poppy at all. The plant minus the
(33:57):
seeds is listed as a schedule to drug, which means
that they can technically the d e A can technically
press charges against anyone growing any amount of it. So
there you go. There you go. Wow, we really we
really covered some far reto topics in this one. Gosh.
(34:17):
Yeah yeah, um, I mean still a delicious component of
everything bagels, which are kind of the best kind. So
it's true. I have a very little amount of that
seasoning left. Oh yeah yeah, and I'm trying to figure
out what I'm going to do with it in honor
of this episode. Gosh, I like, I definitely was like,
(34:39):
you take that vial of that thing, because if I
have it at home, I will just like eat handfuls
of it and nobody needs that, I think. I when
I when we got that gift box, I took a
picture of it and posted it somewhere, and one of
my good friends immediately was like, oh my gosh, I
love that season. That's when I realized that maybe people
(35:03):
really dug the trader Joe's everything, bagel seasoning. It's an
it's an intense thing that people have a lot of
feelings about. Well, we appreciate that over on, we do.
If you guys have never noticed, we appreciate intense feelings. Yes, yes,
and particularly you when it comes to bagels. Yes, I
(35:24):
understand that is a that is a food fight I
would not want to get into. No, no, oh my goodness.
Although yeah, yeah, speaking of food fights, are are that
that we we mentioned? Oh gosh a number of weeks
(35:46):
and or months. I don't know what time means anymore. Ago, Um,
we mentioned that we had been on Richard Blaze's new podcast,
UM food Court with Richard Blaze, and um that we
battle old out the topic of cake versus Pie. Somehow
we're still friends. Yes, I think that battle will live
(36:09):
on an infamy. I think it's legends will be written about.
It is certainly living on in Uh you know whatever
your favorite podcast player is right now, because that episode
went live? Was it only last week? Again? Time doesn't
mean anything to me anymore? So uh so, yeah, but
it's it's out. If you search for Food Court with
(36:30):
Richard Blaze, UM, or for Cake versus Pie or look
on our social media channels you can you can find
that one. I still haven't listened to it because I'm terrified.
Oh it's really fine. That's good. That's good. Yeah. I
I can now say that Richard Blaze has said I
(36:51):
am perhaps a little too prepared, and I'm going to
wear that as a badge of honor for the rest
of my day. Can never be too prepared when it
comes to pie. I would also say that if someone
who's like famous because of his love for molecular astronomy,
(37:12):
if that dude says that you're too prepared, Um, it's
a it's a special honor. You should wear it as
a as a badge of of pride. Oh, I definitely will.
I'm gonna like get it printed on something or I
don't know, I'm gonna update my business cards. Uh. Yeah.
If there's ever a book written about you, I hope
that's one of the like the like quotes on the cover,
(37:34):
perhaps a little too prepared. I like it. I like it,
but yeah, totally check it out. It is really fun.
Um and Lauren and I got there. I think you
can see our particular because you went into the science
and I kind of went into the history. It was
very fun. Yeah, go check that out, um, and we
(37:56):
do have some more for you in this episode. We do,
but first we've got one more quick break for a
word for a sponsor, and we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes,
thank you, And we're back with its like pretty flowers,
(38:23):
they are very pretty. They are gorgeous, Molly wrote, I'm
writing in to share a bit about egg tapping, or
as my family calls it, egg smashing. We are of
German descent, but we have had smashing tournaments for as
long as I can remember. My mom's side of the
family participates in a March Madness level egg smashing tournament
(38:46):
each Okay, I love this. Yeah, there's an art to smashing,
because you want to be forceful enough to crack the
end of the opponent's egg, but gently enough not to
crack your own egg. Once your egg is cracked on
both ends, you're out of the running. When I was
about six or so, my oldest sister and my cousin
were in a dead heat to win, and we were
(39:08):
running out of hard boiled eggs fast as they are
immensely competitive even to this day. My cousin went on
the hunt. Yes, pun intended through my grandma's multiple fridges
to find more hard boiled eggs. He found what he
thought to be a green dyed egg in the second
fridge my grandma hardly ever used. My sister and cousin
(39:29):
wound up to smash and upon impact, a choking, rancid
odor emitted from the crash zone. Turns out my cousin
hadn't found a dyed egg, but our rotten egg. Oh no,
I will never forget the smell of that rotten egg.
Are the reddish colored ooze that tripped all over the carpet.
My grandma was less than impressed, as were the rest
(39:51):
of the family's noses. From then on, all eggs for
the tournaments were kept in a specifically marked cartons, and
my grandma finally cleaned out her fridge. Okay, so there's
so many things I love about this, the March madness bracket. Um. Also,
(40:12):
I didn't know rotten eggs were a real thing. This
was yeah, I've I've never I've never witnessed one that
was that far gone myself. But oh yeah, I know,
like all of those sulfur compounds that are in eggs
will really ramp up and it's it's a whole thing. Man. See,
(40:33):
I I feel like when I have eggs, I just
never around that long. But I do have a friend
who went on a pretty long trip and when he
came back he had some eggs in the fridge and
had them and I just got this like random text
from him and he said, so eggs can go bad,
and never question beyond that. What happened to that night
(40:58):
but wasn't good? Yeah, No, it's it's very um apparent
upon cracking open an egg that has gone off. That's
something poor has happened in your day? No, did okay? Yeah?
Uh yeah. In other news, Kelly wrote, I just listened
(41:21):
to your Easter egg episode and was chuckling at the
end during listener mail at the story from the person
who was trying to make knuffles or niffles. The reason
why a Google search didn't turn up a recipe is
because the actual spelling is even weirder um and I'm
going to spell it for you k n o E
p f l E. If you google that, you will
(41:42):
see that they are in fact a type of spa cel.
So both the writer and her friend, we're right, All
of these words are fantastic. Yeah, because that that looks
to me like nopeful. Um, it's like it's like what
Leslie Nope eats when she wants a waffle? Oh, nopeful.
(42:06):
See and there Parks and rec is coming back together
for reunion. Let's let's get in touch with them. I'm
sure they will run with this idea. Oh I hope
so that would be delightful. Um, yeah, this is well.
We'll keep an eye on this continually updating story about
(42:29):
the niffle and the Knuffles and the nope Fules. We will, yes, yes,
and please if you have any information, send it to
us and you can do that at our email, Hello
at savor pod dot com or via social media. You
can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at saver
(42:49):
pod and we do hope to hear from you. Savor
is production of I Heart Radio. For more podcasts to
my Heart Radio, you can visit the I Heart Radio
app or Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your
favorite show. Thanks us always to our super producers Dylan
Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and
we hope that lots more good things are coming your way.
(43:14):
H
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