August 19, 2022 • 48 mins
These cream-filled snack cakes may not be eternal, but they do have a long and storied past. Anney and Lauren explore the science and sticky history of the Twinkie brand.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hello, and welcome to Savor Protiction of I Heart Radio.
I'm Annie Reese and I'm Lauren voc Obama, and today
we have an episode for you about Twinkies, specifically Twinkies. Yes,
and I am so excited. I am so excited to
talk about this. As Lauren and I were discussing before
(00:29):
we hit record, this one goes places, yes, because people
are intense about Twinkies, like this is one of those
brands that has this this pervasive deep cultural love and
or confusion surrounding it. It does, and in fact, I
(00:51):
mean this is one that I had to really cut
my losses at a certain point because I was like, well,
we can't talk about all of this. There's so much it.
We can't hit everything about donkies because there is just
a universe, a mult diverse of Twinkies. It is a
genuine American cultural icon. It really is. It really is.
(01:16):
And it's fascinating, um how it became to how it
became that, and how many people are still I still
love them so much. Um. And speaking of I have
actually never had one. What how have you avoided it?
I don't know if they just never came up, They
(01:38):
never came up in my life. I don't think it
was ever like I don't want one. It just wasn't
an option, and I didn't know to ask for one.
Similar like hostess um confections before, and I think they
just weren't my favorite. So I was if a Twinkie
is involved in that, then I'm alright without it. But
(02:01):
a couple of years ago before the pandemic, um our
good friend and co worker here Ramsey Um, who has
been on the show. He was on our episode about
chicken wings. He found out I had never had a Twinkie,
and he flipped out and he was like, we have
to do a video. We have to do a video.
(02:22):
We're you're gonna try it. And then he said, and
this is gonna come up. This is a topic that's
gonna come up throughout this episode. He was like, We're
gonna like do a slow motion of Twinkie decade and
we're gonna speed it up and it's gonna be really cool.
And I was like, yeah, sure, okay. In alas it
(02:43):
never came to fruition. He was very excited about it. Yeah, well,
I guess I guess we'll still have to I mean,
there's nothing stopping us. There is nothing stopping us. Um
the perhaps we'll have to be careful with the battery
power and we're going to discuss this okay later, but yeah,
(03:03):
there's nothing stopping as in it. We can add twinkies
to our our feast are ever growing feasts that were playing? Yeah, yeah,
I have had Twinkies, like I wasn't allowed to have,
Like my household was like a like a no twinkie household.
It wasn't just twinkies, but like other similar snack cakes
(03:25):
were not something that my father tolerated, um the existence
of and so certainly not in his house. So so
I don't think I had a Twinkie until I was
in college or maybe after college, and it was like
one of my little like I'm a grown up and
you can't tell me what to do. Like rebellions that
I like went out. How did it feel? Did you
(03:49):
feel rebellious? Yeah? Okay, yeah, and yeah it's fine. It's
I can't say that I'm super passionate about it. Of
the hostess like type snack cakes, oh now, I think
the my favorite the Little Debbie oatmeal cream guys. Yeah,
(04:09):
they're solid, Yeah, interesting texture, interesting can mean a lot
of things, but in a good way in this case.
UM yeah, I UM, I do think a lot of
the twinkie love has to do with nostalgia, which are
also going to talk about. I'm sure they're I'm sure
if I tried one would be fine. Um. And there's
(04:30):
a million ways you can use them apparently, So that's
that's something, that's the thing that I could look into.
I do want to say this, and it might not
make sense right now, but it will make sense later. Um.
But one of my best friends growing up and still
one of my best friends to day, Katie Uh, on
(04:53):
her like sixty birthday, we went to a skating rink
and her dad was like a really rough, outdoorsy fellow
who always wore these like big leather jackets and warrang
jeans and cowboy boots. And he he swore up and
down like he was the best ice skatered ever seen
(05:13):
in Georgia. UM. And I couldn't figure out if he
was serious or not. Um. He said so confidently before
he got in the ice they called me twinkled Toes.
And he skated off and he was pretty good. He
was pretty good, but he got a little overconfident and
(05:34):
he tried to execute this move where he like, I
can't even I would call it star fishing on ice,
like your arms are out, your legs are out, and
he tried to spin the most epic fall, and I
just twinkle toes every time. I love that. Yeah, it
(05:55):
was fun, it was I remember it. Yeah. Uh okay, alright,
filing that one away. It'll make for SIS and I
promise it will it will. Yeah. Uh, Well, April six
is apparently National Twinkies Day, April six. I mean sure,
(06:18):
but I'm always like, what's the secret meaning? No, I'm
not sure. I didn't to be honest, I didn't look
that deeply into it. It could be like a brand
anniversary maybe, I'm sure, something like that. I don't know. Um,
but yeah, but yeah, we're we're pretty far away from that,
just about as far away as you can get. So
(06:40):
good on us. Another wind for Saver. All we do
is wind. Well. I guess this brings us to our question, Sure, twinkies,
what are they? Well? Twinkies are type of industrially produced
(07:01):
handheld snack cake that consists of a fluffy yellow cake
molded into this like rounded oblong shape with a with
a flat base and filled with also fluffy vanilla flavored cream,
fake vanilla, fake cream. Yeah, that they are shelf stable. Um.
Each twinkie is about four inches long, like an inch
(07:25):
and a half wide, that's about ten by four cimeters.
And they're just really light and tender and airy and
really sweet and and they hit you with that creamy filling.
It's just very pleasurable in this completely banal way, like
(07:46):
entirely unchallenging. It's the snack cake of least resistance. It
it gives me these like two thousand one of space
Odyssey vibes, like like it is the coming to they're
of human science and industry, and it is beautiful in
(08:07):
its utter lack of substance. I think you could write
a book on this, Lauren. I think that was pretty deep.
And you've touched on something. The twinkie represents it. It does. Um. Okay,
I also have to share this with you. Um. The
(08:29):
official Twinkies page on the Hostess website says, and I'm
and I'm gonna I'm gonna read this dramatically, but I'm
I'm telling you, I don't know how else to to
read this. Okay, this is how it sounds when I
read it in my head. It says, you don't need
(08:51):
a description, this is why you're here. Yes, so good,
I love it. Um. Yeah, I mean they they understand,
(09:12):
they're they're consumers. I laughed so hard when I read that,
and it was after I had already written that thing
about it anyway, so right, I was like, well, its
own brand agrees with me. Um. Yeah right. So so
(09:35):
the classic flavor um at this at this day and age,
is is right that that golden yellow cake with vanilla cream. Um.
But it also comes in uh in a golden cake
filled with banana cream, which is more traditional as it
turns out. Um. And also seasonal varieties including the cake
kind of studded with red, white and blue sprinkles for summer,
(09:58):
Independence Day, kind of stuff filled with pumpkin spice cream
for fall, filled with mixed berry cream for I'm not sure,
like Christmas and or Valentine's Day it's like December through February,
so sure, red festive I don't know, um, or filled
with cotton candy cream for spring. In order to make them.
(10:23):
I the face that you're making is exactly how I
feel about that, yes, And yeah it's not it's not
textured like cotton candy. It's not cotton candy. It's a
cotton candy flavored cream. And as I think we discussed
in our cotton candy episode, the cotton candy flavor is
not really a flavor. So anyway, um uh, to make
(10:49):
a twinkie, Um, they're they're made in large batches, as
I'm sure you can imagine. Um. The dough is piped
into molds and baked flat side up, and then three
little injectors come down and pierce what will be that
that flat bottom and pipe in the cream. And despite
urban legends about twinkies being eternal, um, their shelf life
(11:12):
is officially. I've read a couple of different numbers. I've
read forty five days and sixty five days. I think
sixty five might be the new modern upper limit. Um.
I think forty five is probably a safer bet for
like best use. Um. But right, like microbes can and
(11:32):
will eat twinkies. Um, you know, all that sugar and
them can keep Mike Grobes at bay in some circumstances. Um.
There's apparently a Twinkie at the George Stephens Academy in
Maine that is from nine six and looks just fine, yes,
(11:53):
and this has been a prevalent urban legend. Uh. And
that's a referenced to at the beginning. And there are
at least two, maybe three other points in the history
that they came from, this idea that they'll last forever. Yeah, yeah, right,
I mean, you know, like like very Originally when they
(12:15):
were created, they were made with you know, like like
butter and cream and vanilla and stuff like that. But
over the years, as the idea of them being shelf
stable became so desirable, um, those uh quote unquote real ingredients,
not that science ingredients are imaginary, but they're just made
(12:35):
with more so they were replaced with science ingredients and
so so yeah, there's there's this pervasive concept. I both
humans who I told today that I was reading for
a Twinkie episode like made jokes about twinkies being eternal.
Mm hmmm mmm. I can't even remember where I first
(12:57):
heard it, but I've heard it. Yeah, yeah, right, It's
just it's just an InterCollective subconscious it is true. Well,
I guess that brings us through then. Uh, Twinkies are
a calorically dense food. Lots of sugar and saturated fats
(13:18):
go into making them, so moist and creamy while still
feeling light and right, being kind of shelf stable. Um, Like,
two cakes contain a fifth of your daily allotment of
saturated fats and sixty of your allotment of added sugars um,
which is a lot um. But treats are nice. Treats
(13:42):
are nice. Treats are nice. That's why they're treats exactly. There.
There is, though, a whole book that was written about
the ingredients that go into Twinkies and how they work.
It's called Twinkie Deconstructed. It was published in two thousand seven,
written by one Um Steve of at Linger, and it
sounds it sounds great. It sounds like really at my
(14:05):
alley in terms of just like really breaking down the
science of what all of these different ingredients do and
like what makes them formed together to create this like
hypothetically food. I I was I was telling I was
telling Led about this and they were like, I was like, yeah,
(14:26):
we're doing a Twinkie episode. And they were like, I
thought you did a food show twinky Bird. Right? Pretty good?
Pretty good? Yeah. Yeah, Anyway, we do have some numbers
(14:46):
for you. We do um and there are a plethora
of numbers. We're only going to include a few, but
if you want to find them, they are out there. Um. So,
almost one point one million Twinkies are consumed every day
around the world, and that's about four million or more
a year. According to today dot Com, somewhere around one thousand,
(15:08):
one twenty three Twinkies are produced per minute. Uh apparently. Uh,
Twinkies are sixty eight percent air by volume. Oh yeah,
they're pretty light. Yeah. The record for the most Twinkies
eaten in six minutes was set in by Joey Chestnut.
(15:34):
He consumed a hundred and twenty one Twinkies in those
six minutes. Oh that hurts my stomach, That hurts my everything.
Oh no, yeah. UM. I'm not sure whether this is
still an annual thing, but um Emporia, Kansas, the current
(15:56):
home of the main Twinkie factory, has held a Twinkies
sta all that that has in past years included a
five K run, a box car derby and eating competition, yes, um,
and a costume contest. Costume contest. Oh nry diametrig Oh
(16:17):
my gosh. Alright, well, listeners, you know the drill let
us know right in send pictures please, um and then,
Twinkies have been involved in a lot of promotional brand
ties throughout their time, but one of them does come
with a specific number um to coinside with the two
(16:39):
thousand seven or at least of King Kong, Hostess brought
back the original and popular flavor of banana for the
cream and sales shot up over Yeah. Yeah, people are
into it, I guess. But yeah, yeah, that's we're going
to talk about that. But I'm seeing out of numbers.
(17:00):
Around two thousand six seven, it was a big time
for Twinkies. It was, it was. And yeah also, uh right,
banana was the original Twinkie flavor and we are going
to get into that and lots more as soon as
we get back from a quick break for a word
from our sponsors, and we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes,
(17:31):
thank you. So okay, before we get to the Twinkie, um,
we have to go back to eighteen forty nine, which
is when this bakery called the Ward Baking Company opened
up shop in Manhattan. Over the course of a few decades,
they grew and acquired other regional bakeries and by n
(17:52):
had become known as Continental Baking. And we're operating out
of Kansas City, Missouri. Um. They started a brand of
snack cakes called Hostess with a chocolate cupcake in nineteen nineteen. Yes, yes, yes, yes, Um.
It can get complicated with all the company names that get.
Oh yeah, I tried to tried to explain, but right,
(18:16):
m Um. Also, I feel like it goes without saying.
But we got to say it every time that you're
not currently a sponsor. Oh no, we're here. But yeah,
they have not reached out to us, Hostess, reach out,
what is wrong with you? So most credit the invention
(18:37):
of the actual twinkie to Jimmy or James Doer, who
worked at Continental Baking UM. And as the story goes,
he invented this treat in nineteen thirty filling a shortcake
with a mixture of sugar and cream and yes, specifically
a banana cream filling. Although I've seen that kind of
get people keep saying original and then I'm like, but
(18:58):
it wasn't the strawberry original. I think that's okay, I'll
unpack that in a second. And he allegedly named it
on the way to a meeting with Hostess after a billboard.
So he saw this billboard for shoes UM called twinkletoe shoes.
And he was like that that's it, Twinkie. So there
you go. Now you understand what I was talking about
(19:18):
at the top. I hope the payoff was worth it. Um.
And yes, by most accounts, the original Twinkie flavor was banana.
I think this just might be how our interpret things,
but okay, UM, this wasn't part because of the short
season of strawberries, which directly impacted the production of strawberry
(19:38):
shortcakes which the company made. I think they were called
strawberry short fingers or something. Because of this, do Or
may have decided on the banana filling. Um. Because basically
what was happening was they had this specific machinery to
produce this strawberry short finger products um. And it wasn't
(19:59):
an you a lot of time because strawberries had such
a short season um. And so using banana and the
filling allowed them to use that equipment to produce treats
all year round instead of depending on when strawberries were
good when they could strawberries um. And also worth keeping
in mind, this was during the Great Depression, and do
Or knew that they needed an inexpensive treat and he
(20:21):
talked about that he was like, it had to be
you know this this price and at this level, and
so he was very cognizant of what he was doing.
In the early days, twinkies were filled by so called
twinkie stuffers who used a device that it was a
manual device that they pedaled with their feet. One such
(20:43):
stuffer once said you had to pump the pedal just
right or too much filling would shoot out. If I
over squirted, the twinkie would explode, but also said that
the workers would just eat the faulty ones. All right,
and twinkies were pretty quickly very popular in the United States. However,
(21:07):
as with most things, the World Wars really impacted the
manufacturing of these items, with things like rationing um with
sugar flour and bananas, and this necessitated retooling the recipe
and the filling, and so at the time they pivoted
to vanilla creams bananas. Yeah, yeah, because bananas became very
(21:31):
unavailable during World War Two. Yes, yes, uh. Twinkies were
advertised on the very popular children show Howdy Duty Show,
The how Do Duty Show in the nineteen fifties. By
Continental Baking was America's leading breadmaker and was purchased by
the International Telephone and Telegraph Corporation. Yeah, yep, yep, they
(21:57):
were Yeah, Continental Baking All so owned Wonder Bread, Yes,
which was originally in here, and I cut it. I
was one of the losses. I had to cut. But yes,
and we have to do an episode on Slice Bread,
which is a part of this story too, but that's
for future as current has gets to talk about this
(22:18):
because during the sies and eighties, this company launched an
ad campaign for d C and Marvel Comics with Twinkies,
and big names were involved to like a wonder Woman
at thor Yes, and at one point the Penguin seized
all the Twinkie delivery men and Gotham City. And I'm
(22:40):
telling you, why is this movie not exist? I know
we keep throwing ideas out there, but it's already here, right,
Like someone called Danny DeVito who has his number, and
Twinkie delivery men is so specific, and I'm not sure
(23:01):
it was ever a thing, but I love it. I
know I know that, like the Hostess brand had these
specific delivery trucks and drivers, and that that was part
of this whole thing that we're gonna kind of get
into later. Um or glance across later, I suppose, but
at any rate, yeah, I love it. Well, all right,
(23:27):
be on the lookout for that, I hope. But in
one the FTC served up a major hit for Hostess,
basically ruling that wonder Bread was pretty much enriched bread. Um.
And they had been saying, like wonder Bread, it was
all good for weight loss, good for your health, all
of these types of things. Um. And it was also
(23:49):
ruled that when it came to their snack cakes, sugar
was the main ingredients, so they couldn't make these sort
of big claims of them anymore. Um. Also in nine one,
the Hostess brand debut mascot for Twinkies called Twinkie the Kid. Yes,
if you haven't seen this mascot is basically a Twinkie
(24:11):
with a cowboy head, which I actually didn't pick up
on until I read a description of it. I was like, oh, yeah, obviously,
because I was trying to describe it, I was like,
it looks like a minion is like stretched out, um,
and it has a cowboy Obviously, it's a It's a Twinkie.
It's made its body is a Twinkie. Yes. Oh, and
(24:33):
we are going to talk more about that because it
was beloved, yes, yes, but pivoting in another cultural touch point.
In nine, Dan White was convicted of fatally shooting at
Mayor George Muscone of San Francisco and supervisor Harvey Milk.
And as a part of White's defense, Um, this is
(24:57):
kind of complicated, but okay, his lawyer argued that White
had a quote addiction to sweet snacks and sugary junk
food and that this worsened his depression. Um yeah, yeah,
And the press found up calling this the twinkie defense exactly. Um,
which the defense never actually argued that this consumption of
(25:21):
sugary snacks made White do it. Um, it was just
part of their It was just a piece of it. Yeah,
was like oh the snacks. Yeah yeah, Like like they
brought it up. They were like, yeah, his snack food
habits are evidence of his depression, not like a cause
of his depression or of his behavior. Rights. But the
(25:44):
press kind of ran the opposite direction. Yeah. Um, and
the term persists to this day. Uh. And White was
convicted of voluntary manslaughter as opposed to murder. So right,
so there was this like the twinkie defense worked like
kind of yeah, in corporate news in four um I
(26:07):
t T sold hostess to Ralston Purina, and then in
political news in night five, a candidate for city council
in Minneapolis had charges around him handing out an amount
of Twinkies and similar snacks and drinks to senior citizens
that amounted to I don't know thirty four dollars around UM.
(26:29):
He had these charges dropped after he was indicted for
bribery UM and as a result, Minnesota passed a campaign
finance law known as the Twinkies Law. Wow, I'm telling
this episode goes everywhere all over. That same year, Doer,
who famously claimed he ate one twinkie a day died.
(26:52):
This has nothing to do the twinkies, have nothing to
do with it. But he famously claimed he ate one
a day, and in fact, his obituary include this quote
from him. Some people say twinkies are the quintessential junk food,
but I believe in the things. I fed them to
my four kids and they feed them to my fifteen grandchildren.
My boy Jimmy played football for the Cleveland Browns. My
(27:13):
other son Bobby played quarterback for the University of Rochester.
Twinkies never hurt them and not that I doubted what
he would say in his obituary or anything, but I
did look at it. Yeah, his sons did play all right.
Well heck yeah, Jenny, heck yeah, Jimmy. Uh. Going back
(27:35):
to that mascot, okay, okay. So the company chose to
get rid of the mascot Twinkie the Kid, and this
did not please a lot of people, including a New
Jersey teenager named Judd Slivka, who sent a letter to
the company, complete with one and thirty five signatures, threatening
(27:55):
to boycott the company. Quote, as long as our hero
is kept away from the public, I love that, and
it works in company not only reintroduced Twinkie the Kid,
but they even invited Slifka to the mascot's birthday bash.
(28:15):
It's beautiful. Not as delightful, Oh my goodness. Yes. More
business news in rawlstin Peerina reached the deal that sold
the maker of Hostess Twinkies to the Interstate Bakeries Corporation.
And this was a big deal in two ways. Um. First,
(28:37):
Rawlston left the food business and second it made Interstate
America's the largest bakery company. And then also Hi this alright,
Houston's Rice University students George Gouge and Todd Stabler embarked
in the Twinkies Project UM, which they called with inorganic
(29:01):
noxious cakes with the K in extreme situations. And these
extreme situations included the rapid oxidation test, which is essentially
saying twinkies on fire, UM, the gravitational response test, which
was essentially dropping twinkies out of windows to determine if
they are affected by gravity, and a Turing test to
(29:23):
suss out the intelligence of a twinkie. Yeah fascinating, yeah yeah.
And then, in a continuing example of the cultural impact
of twinkies and the urban legend we mentioned at the top,
in President Bill Clinton included twinkies in the National Millennium
(29:45):
time Capsule. And this was along with I mean all
kinds of things that culturally significant, huge things, and then um,
the twinkie was later pulled out from the time capsule.
Do two can turns around? Mice getting into a house?
But to me that indicates even at the highest level,
(30:07):
people were like, yep, ye forever, it's gonna last forever. Um.
Deep fried Twinkies Okay, okay, they got their start in
the written record. I just feel like people fry anything
if they can. But one of the first instances that
we know of was in two thousand Christopher Cells, who
(30:31):
gets the credit for inventing deep fried twinkies, said, something
magical occurs when the pastry hits the hot oil, the
creamy white vegetable, shortening filling liquefies and pregnating the sponge
cake with its luscious vanilla flavor. Sure it's imitation, but
nevertheless potent. The cake itself softens and warms, nearly melting,
(30:51):
contrasting with the crisp deep fried crust in a buttery
and suave way. I mean, we've got a hand it
to him. I've never wanted to try one, but y'all
to that's poetry. It is and premating, yeah, with luscious
(31:13):
vanilla flavor. Um well, speaking of poetry. And two thousand four,
in order to co brand with DreamWorks for the release
of Shrek Too, Twinkies were available with an ogre green
colored filling. Oh my goodness, yeah, my goodness. Uh, but
this brings us to some financial woes. Yeah. Yeah. In
(31:36):
two thousand four, Interstate Bakery filed for Chapter eleven bankruptcy.
And this was for multitude of reasons, but one of
the most cited is changing health concerns people had. Yeah, sure,
sure they fewer fewer twinkies. Uh yeah, more what was
the big trend then, like like high protein Yeah, protein powders,
(31:59):
I think we're big. Yeah, smoothies yeah, um, I love
those things. But yes, they did a tint for the twinkie.
A few years later. In two thousand nine, Interstate Bakery
came out of bankruptcy and changed its name to host
His Brands. Hosts published a Twinkie cookbook called The Twinkies Cookbook,
(32:21):
an inventive and unexpected recipe collection from Hostess that included
fifty recipes for things like twinkie sushi. And I have
to say unexpected recipe collection like Chef's Kiss that is.
I love that, Yeah, genuinely, it's it's this close to
(32:43):
not meaning anything at all. Um, which like the Twinkie
I love it. Ah wow yeah yeah. The Hostess factory
in Toledo, Ohio is eventually turned into Zubo Books, Um,
but hints of Twinkies remained. In a two thousand seven
(33:07):
episode of No Reservations, host Anthony Bourdain tried liquefied twinkie
filling that was still in the building's pipes, and he said,
there's that Twinkie freshness. Yeah, yeah, yeah, apparently right, It's
just this like giant bookstore like like distribution situation. It's
(33:28):
got like a lot of like like like rare books
and stuff in there and is gigantic. And yeah, just
this old bakery section just still has these pipes that
are just still filled with like what would become Twinkie
filling if you like like pumped it out and like
whipped it with air. Apparent I saw it described as
(33:51):
like like a like a petroleum like like a like
a like an oil like a black sludge kind of situation.
I have not seen this episode. I don't think if
I have, I've put it out of my memory. Um yeah,
but yeah, but but Tony tony eight some because why not?
(34:12):
Because why not? I mean that feels like the Twinkie two. Yeah,
because why not? M m. But this wasn't the end
of the financial woes. In early twelve, the company filed
for Chapter eleven reorganization. A few months later, company workers
went on strike. In response to that, the company laid
off eighteen thousand five workers and closed their plans. A
(34:36):
year later, in Hostess brands sold Twinkies and Ding Dong's,
among other things, to two investment firms. So for eight
months during no Twinkies were produced and people were not happy.
They were panicking. I would say, yes, including celebrities, multiple celebrities,
but Wendy Williams often comes up because she hosted the
(34:57):
first twinkie eating competition and hopes of saving Yeah. Apparently
when they did come back, they came back slightly shorter
and less dense. I love that people know that. I
read that too, and yeah, I mean if you if
you're really familiar with the product, yeah, yeah, you know,
(35:20):
you know. Um well, uh well, like a recipe. UM
kind of facelift was involved with them coming back because Okay,
like the business side of this story is really pretty wild.
Um because like like the company that was holding the
brand had just been incredibly mismanaged. Um, Like they were
in so much debt, they had these intense pension costs. Um,
(35:43):
they had this trouble with the union and when it
liquidated its brands that just went away. UM. So so
they sold off I think the savory portions of things,
the Savory brands to one investment firm, and then this
other firm called Apollo Global bought up a bunch of
the snack cake brands and reopened under the Hostess name.
(36:06):
Like no one even bid against them when they made
their offer. Um. So they spent like like four hundred
million buying the brands, and then another few hundred million
updating the factories and the recipes and the distribution because apparently,
like it was really clunky and outdated and uh and
(36:28):
part of the problem was that Twinkies weren't shelf stable enough.
They were only shelf stable for like a recommended twenty
five days at this point. And so they like they
like more than doubled that um uh and and and
retooled the distribution um and Yeah, it was like immediately
(36:48):
extremely successful. People were so happy to see these brands
back on store shelves. Um and they are raking in
absolute billions. Wow. I mean, if I didn't know any better,
I haven't say that was a ploy, but I know
it wasn't. No, not that the company was genuinely in
so much trouble a terrifying amount. Like I this Forbes
(37:13):
article that I was reading is like, how did they
even get in that much trouble? We don't know it's impressive.
It's kind of impressive. Um at any rate. Okay, during
the early pandemic, a guy by the name of Colin
Parrington apparently an actual name Parrington. I love this, Okay,
(37:39):
it sounds like something from being Puppycats, so cool. Um. Okay.
He opened up this box of Twinkies that he had
purchased back in when there were those fears of Twinkies
going away forever, and because you know, he was like
out of snacks and he you know, he was like,
oh man, I bought those twinkies. I wonder how they're doing. Um.
They were not still good, uh, though interestingly different cakes
(38:03):
in there, like little individual single rappers showed all kinds
of different levels of mold growth and desiccation. Like some
looked fine but tasted awful. He did try them. Um Uh.
Some were like kind of shrunken and had some like
dark spotting, sort of like when a banana goes bad. Um,
(38:23):
and some were shriveled and gray like a like like
and like in like vacuum sucked in like a like
a weird moral mushroom kind of situation. So Mr Parrington
sent the twinkies to researchers to like see what was
growing on them um, and they honestly had nothing like
(38:45):
super interesting to report. They were like, oh, yeah, that's
pretty common mold. Um, but they couldn't get the really
mummified one to to grow uh anything else, so they
don't Yeah, they like couldn't figure out what kind of
mold it was because they couldn't get a sample to
to spore UM. And interestingly, UM, when they drilled into
(39:05):
that mummified one, um, they they used they used a tool,
they used a tool um that is normally used to
to take samples of bone marrow. Oh my goodness. And
and they in fact found that it still had a
liquid cream filling inside. Whoa, I know, right, Okay, get
(39:34):
a little I don't know, they're a little nervous. I
feel like I'm going to be playing a zombie video
game and I'm gonna get to the end. It's gonna
be like this twinkie. Yeah. Oh gosh, Well, speaking of zombies. Yeah,
we actually yes, speaking actually actually yes, we do have
(39:56):
a few more cultural notes that we wanted to touch on.
And this is just a few, because there are so many, um,
but just a few. A few of the greatest hits
of twinkies in her pop culture. Sure. Um so for one,
Archie Bunker got a twinkie every day in his lunch
on All in the Family. In the nine movie Greece,
(40:21):
the Young Women discussed twinkies and wine. The original Ghostbusters,
Egon uses a twinkie to basically describe how bad things
are due to ghost stuff. Yeah, yeah, um and this
is whenever I think about twinkies, I still think about
this line where, uh, I think Winston is like, tell
him about the twinkie, and Bankman is like, what about
(40:44):
the twinkie? Um, yes, but yeah. The line from Egan is,
let's say this twinkie represents the normal amount of psychokinetic
energy in the New York area. According to this morning sample,
it would be a twinkie thirty five ft long, weighing
approximately six pounds. And going off of this, my very
(41:05):
favorite food blogger, j Kenji Lopez Ault dutifully calculated how
much an actual thirty five ft long Twinkie would weigh,
and he came up with more like fifty three tons.
Yeah wow, Yeah, a six hundred pound twinky would only
be about six ft long, according to him, So like
(41:27):
twinky the kids sized. Uh. Yeah, it's a it's a
genuinely beautiful write up that he did. He went deep.
He went very deep, y'all. Um. He also did some
like brief calculations about how, um, how a six hundred
(41:48):
pound twinkie could possibly support its own weight. Um it
could not under the gravity structure of our current earth. Um.
So like he wrote, you know, like like calculation. It
is very twinkie in space, like it's a whole it
is a whole, glorious thing doing the good work. Yeah,
the good work, all right, excellent um in Twinkies were
(42:13):
mentioned in die Hard. Uh. On The Simpsons, a poo
once said you cannot hurt the twinkie when the twinkie
question reformed itself, right, yeah, and that was a twinkie
appeared in the two thousand and eight film Wall E
when a cockroach used it as like a bed. Sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
(42:35):
because because their eternal so right, it's their journal. I
have only seen that movie once because it made me
so sad. I don't remember. It's not like particularly sad.
I don't know something about it. So I was kind
of sad. I mean it is, but there it wasn't
like oh good, sobbing. But I think the whole feeling
of it just hurt my heart. I feel you. It's
(42:56):
a rough film. It it really goes there. It really does.
It really does. And then yes, zombies. The two thousand
nine film Zombie Lands included a whole plot where Woody
Harrelson's character was absolutely in love with twinkies. He was
always looking for twinkies, checking the hostess Chucks like I
gotta get these twinkies. Um. But the actual actor, Woody
(43:19):
Harrelson does not eat twinkies because he is vegan. So
I think they used you can find the recipe they used.
It was like, um, but yeah they used they made
a vegan twinkie for the production. Um. And so it's
been a minute since I've seen this movie, but I
do think the whole thing wasn't part in reference to
(43:40):
the urban legend that yet they never go bad, they
are internal. Um. But yeah, a big piece of that film,
I'm telling you, we went blazes. I do. I do
love these brand episodes. They get so weird they do.
You never know where they're gonna go. Now, Uh, well,
(44:04):
well that that is I think the places that we
are going to go about the Twinkie four now four now,
But we do have some listener email for you, and
we'll get into that after one more quick break for
a word from our sponsor, and we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes,
(44:27):
thank you, and we're back with that was good. We
got cut off at the same point. At least that's
what it sounded like I want. Sometimes we even impressed
(44:49):
me listener. Oh yes, our hardest critic, Oh yes, I'm
always like chucked that one up to a wind um,
Melissa wrote. I just finished the Jello episode and it
made me think of one of my stranger experiences in
(45:09):
med school. Our program had an outreach program to local
schools providing health education. I had volunteered for Brain Day
because I liked neurology and my friend was coordinating it.
I'm still not totally clear what we were trying to accomplish,
besides convincing a bunch of fifth graders that medicine and
neurology especially was cool for us. That meant demonstrating lesser
(45:32):
known reflexes on various kids. We also had access to
an anatomically correct silicon brain mold that our medical school owned.
For some reason, my friend was very stoked about this
and used it to make blue jello brains the closest
she could get to gray that she dutifully brought to
the elementary school as a surprise for the kids. So
(45:54):
in the end, we showed up at the school, hit
a bunch of kids with our reflex sammers, and invited
them to eat some jellow brains. I don't know if
we inspired anyone to become doctors afterwards, but I do
now know that ten year olds are pretty nonchalant about
eating what looks like a human brain given to them
by strangers. Make of that what you will? I mean important?
(46:18):
Oh yeah yeah, no, good to good to know, good data.
Wouldn't it be fantastic if somebody listening to this went
to that event and did go into neurology because of
this quite frankly amazing present. I would have loved this.
You get jello, you get to see weird reflexes. That is.
(46:42):
I would have remembered that, and I think I would
have been inspired. So that's a big thumbs up from me. Absolutely, heck,
let us know, hey, yes, yes, that would be so great.
Making connections okay, uh Matt wrote just a couple of
quick gags for you, oup me if you've heard these.
What does a Dollek say when he salts his food? Salinate?
(47:09):
All right? What did the Dalek vampires say? Exanguine eate? Yes? Yes?
And and then what does a Dalek do to remove
dead skin? Exfoliate? Eight? Yeah? All pretty good? All pretty good? Uh,
(47:34):
Matt continues. Anyway, for whatever it's worth, Tennant is my
favorite doctor, and my favorite episodes are the two parter
Silence in the Library and Forest of the Dead No
Shade on Blink. It's a masterpiece, but not my personal
m v P. Oh, those are good ones. Those are
very good ones. And also I love like again. If
(47:56):
you've never watched Dr Who, you have no idea what's
going on right now? Oh? Yeah, I'm so sorry. I'm
so sorry about that weird voice I just did, I
mean excellent. Never apolicize for that, Lauren. I won't hear it.
I won't stand for it. It's fantastic. Well, thank you
Annie again, our very harshest critic, so tough on each other.
(48:19):
But yes, thank you to both of these listeners for
writing to us. If you would like to write to us,
you can our email as Hello at savorpod dot com
and we're also on social media. You can find us
on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at savor pod and we
do hope to hear from you. Savor is production of
I Heart Radio. For more podcasts my Heart Radio, you
(48:40):
can visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or
wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Thanks as always
to our superproducers Dylan Fagin and Andrew Howard. Thanks to
you for listening, and we hope to lots more good
things are coming your way
Hello, and welcome to Savor Protiction of I Heart Radio.
I'm Annie Reese and I'm Lauren voc Obama, and today
we have an episode for you about Twinkies, specifically Twinkies. Yes,
and I am so excited. I am so excited to
talk about this. As Lauren and I were discussing before
(00:29):
we hit record, this one goes places, yes, because people
are intense about Twinkies, like this is one of those
brands that has this this pervasive deep cultural love and
or confusion surrounding it. It does, and in fact, I
(00:51):
mean this is one that I had to really cut
my losses at a certain point because I was like, well,
we can't talk about all of this. There's so much it.
We can't hit everything about donkies because there is just
a universe, a mult diverse of Twinkies. It is a
genuine American cultural icon. It really is. It really is.
(01:16):
And it's fascinating, um how it became to how it
became that, and how many people are still I still
love them so much. Um. And speaking of I have
actually never had one. What how have you avoided it?
I don't know if they just never came up, They
(01:38):
never came up in my life. I don't think it
was ever like I don't want one. It just wasn't
an option, and I didn't know to ask for one.
Similar like hostess um confections before, and I think they
just weren't my favorite. So I was if a Twinkie
is involved in that, then I'm alright without it. But
(02:01):
a couple of years ago before the pandemic, um our
good friend and co worker here Ramsey Um, who has
been on the show. He was on our episode about
chicken wings. He found out I had never had a Twinkie,
and he flipped out and he was like, we have
to do a video. We have to do a video.
(02:22):
We're you're gonna try it. And then he said, and
this is gonna come up. This is a topic that's
gonna come up throughout this episode. He was like, We're
gonna like do a slow motion of Twinkie decade and
we're gonna speed it up and it's gonna be really cool.
And I was like, yeah, sure, okay. In alas it
(02:43):
never came to fruition. He was very excited about it. Yeah, well,
I guess I guess we'll still have to I mean,
there's nothing stopping us. There is nothing stopping us. Um
the perhaps we'll have to be careful with the battery
power and we're going to discuss this okay later, but yeah,
(03:03):
there's nothing stopping as in it. We can add twinkies
to our our feast are ever growing feasts that were playing? Yeah, yeah,
I have had Twinkies, like I wasn't allowed to have,
Like my household was like a like a no twinkie household.
It wasn't just twinkies, but like other similar snack cakes
(03:25):
were not something that my father tolerated, um the existence
of and so certainly not in his house. So so
I don't think I had a Twinkie until I was
in college or maybe after college, and it was like
one of my little like I'm a grown up and
you can't tell me what to do. Like rebellions that
I like went out. How did it feel? Did you
(03:49):
feel rebellious? Yeah? Okay, yeah, and yeah it's fine. It's
I can't say that I'm super passionate about it. Of
the hostess like type snack cakes, oh now, I think
the my favorite the Little Debbie oatmeal cream guys. Yeah,
(04:09):
they're solid, Yeah, interesting texture, interesting can mean a lot
of things, but in a good way in this case.
UM yeah, I UM, I do think a lot of
the twinkie love has to do with nostalgia, which are
also going to talk about. I'm sure they're I'm sure
if I tried one would be fine. Um. And there's
(04:30):
a million ways you can use them apparently, So that's
that's something, that's the thing that I could look into.
I do want to say this, and it might not
make sense right now, but it will make sense later. Um.
But one of my best friends growing up and still
one of my best friends to day, Katie Uh, on
(04:53):
her like sixty birthday, we went to a skating rink
and her dad was like a really rough, outdoorsy fellow
who always wore these like big leather jackets and warrang
jeans and cowboy boots. And he he swore up and
down like he was the best ice skatered ever seen
(05:13):
in Georgia. UM. And I couldn't figure out if he
was serious or not. Um. He said so confidently before
he got in the ice they called me twinkled Toes.
And he skated off and he was pretty good. He
was pretty good, but he got a little overconfident and
(05:34):
he tried to execute this move where he like, I
can't even I would call it star fishing on ice,
like your arms are out, your legs are out, and
he tried to spin the most epic fall, and I
just twinkle toes every time. I love that. Yeah, it
(05:55):
was fun, it was I remember it. Yeah. Uh okay, alright,
filing that one away. It'll make for SIS and I
promise it will it will. Yeah. Uh, Well, April six
is apparently National Twinkies Day, April six. I mean sure,
(06:18):
but I'm always like, what's the secret meaning? No, I'm
not sure. I didn't to be honest, I didn't look
that deeply into it. It could be like a brand
anniversary maybe, I'm sure, something like that. I don't know. Um,
but yeah, but yeah, we're we're pretty far away from that,
just about as far away as you can get. So
(06:40):
good on us. Another wind for Saver. All we do
is wind. Well. I guess this brings us to our question, Sure, twinkies,
what are they? Well? Twinkies are type of industrially produced
(07:01):
handheld snack cake that consists of a fluffy yellow cake
molded into this like rounded oblong shape with a with
a flat base and filled with also fluffy vanilla flavored cream,
fake vanilla, fake cream. Yeah, that they are shelf stable. Um.
Each twinkie is about four inches long, like an inch
(07:25):
and a half wide, that's about ten by four cimeters.
And they're just really light and tender and airy and
really sweet and and they hit you with that creamy filling.
It's just very pleasurable in this completely banal way, like
(07:46):
entirely unchallenging. It's the snack cake of least resistance. It
it gives me these like two thousand one of space
Odyssey vibes, like like it is the coming to they're
of human science and industry, and it is beautiful in
(08:07):
its utter lack of substance. I think you could write
a book on this, Lauren. I think that was pretty deep.
And you've touched on something. The twinkie represents it. It does. Um. Okay,
I also have to share this with you. Um. The
(08:29):
official Twinkies page on the Hostess website says, and I'm
and I'm gonna I'm gonna read this dramatically, but I'm
I'm telling you, I don't know how else to to
read this. Okay, this is how it sounds when I
read it in my head. It says, you don't need
(08:51):
a description, this is why you're here. Yes, so good,
I love it. Um. Yeah, I mean they they understand,
(09:12):
they're they're consumers. I laughed so hard when I read that,
and it was after I had already written that thing
about it anyway, so right, I was like, well, its
own brand agrees with me. Um. Yeah right. So so
(09:35):
the classic flavor um at this at this day and age,
is is right that that golden yellow cake with vanilla cream. Um.
But it also comes in uh in a golden cake
filled with banana cream, which is more traditional as it
turns out. Um. And also seasonal varieties including the cake
kind of studded with red, white and blue sprinkles for summer,
(09:58):
Independence Day, kind of stuff filled with pumpkin spice cream
for fall, filled with mixed berry cream for I'm not sure,
like Christmas and or Valentine's Day it's like December through February,
so sure, red festive I don't know, um, or filled
with cotton candy cream for spring. In order to make them.
(10:23):
I the face that you're making is exactly how I
feel about that, yes, And yeah it's not it's not
textured like cotton candy. It's not cotton candy. It's a
cotton candy flavored cream. And as I think we discussed
in our cotton candy episode, the cotton candy flavor is
not really a flavor. So anyway, um uh, to make
(10:49):
a twinkie, Um, they're they're made in large batches, as
I'm sure you can imagine. Um. The dough is piped
into molds and baked flat side up, and then three
little injectors come down and pierce what will be that
that flat bottom and pipe in the cream. And despite
urban legends about twinkies being eternal, um, their shelf life
(11:12):
is officially. I've read a couple of different numbers. I've
read forty five days and sixty five days. I think
sixty five might be the new modern upper limit. Um.
I think forty five is probably a safer bet for
like best use. Um. But right, like microbes can and
(11:32):
will eat twinkies. Um, you know, all that sugar and
them can keep Mike Grobes at bay in some circumstances. Um.
There's apparently a Twinkie at the George Stephens Academy in
Maine that is from nine six and looks just fine, yes,
(11:53):
and this has been a prevalent urban legend. Uh. And
that's a referenced to at the beginning. And there are
at least two, maybe three other points in the history
that they came from, this idea that they'll last forever. Yeah, yeah, right,
I mean, you know, like like very Originally when they
(12:15):
were created, they were made with you know, like like
butter and cream and vanilla and stuff like that. But
over the years, as the idea of them being shelf
stable became so desirable, um, those uh quote unquote real ingredients,
not that science ingredients are imaginary, but they're just made
(12:35):
with more so they were replaced with science ingredients and
so so yeah, there's there's this pervasive concept. I both
humans who I told today that I was reading for
a Twinkie episode like made jokes about twinkies being eternal.
Mm hmmm mmm. I can't even remember where I first
(12:57):
heard it, but I've heard it. Yeah, yeah, right, It's
just it's just an InterCollective subconscious it is true. Well,
I guess that brings us through then. Uh, Twinkies are
a calorically dense food. Lots of sugar and saturated fats
(13:18):
go into making them, so moist and creamy while still
feeling light and right, being kind of shelf stable. Um, Like,
two cakes contain a fifth of your daily allotment of
saturated fats and sixty of your allotment of added sugars um,
which is a lot um. But treats are nice. Treats
(13:42):
are nice. Treats are nice. That's why they're treats exactly. There.
There is, though, a whole book that was written about
the ingredients that go into Twinkies and how they work.
It's called Twinkie Deconstructed. It was published in two thousand seven,
written by one Um Steve of at Linger, and it
sounds it sounds great. It sounds like really at my
(14:05):
alley in terms of just like really breaking down the
science of what all of these different ingredients do and
like what makes them formed together to create this like
hypothetically food. I I was I was telling I was
telling Led about this and they were like, I was like, yeah,
(14:26):
we're doing a Twinkie episode. And they were like, I
thought you did a food show twinky Bird. Right? Pretty good?
Pretty good? Yeah. Yeah, Anyway, we do have some numbers
(14:46):
for you. We do um and there are a plethora
of numbers. We're only going to include a few, but
if you want to find them, they are out there. Um. So,
almost one point one million Twinkies are consumed every day
around the world, and that's about four million or more
a year. According to today dot Com, somewhere around one thousand,
(15:08):
one twenty three Twinkies are produced per minute. Uh apparently. Uh,
Twinkies are sixty eight percent air by volume. Oh yeah,
they're pretty light. Yeah. The record for the most Twinkies
eaten in six minutes was set in by Joey Chestnut.
(15:34):
He consumed a hundred and twenty one Twinkies in those
six minutes. Oh that hurts my stomach, That hurts my everything.
Oh no, yeah. UM. I'm not sure whether this is
still an annual thing, but um Emporia, Kansas, the current
(15:56):
home of the main Twinkie factory, has held a Twinkies
sta all that that has in past years included a
five K run, a box car derby and eating competition, yes, um,
and a costume contest. Costume contest. Oh nry diametrig Oh
(16:17):
my gosh. Alright, well, listeners, you know the drill let
us know right in send pictures please, um and then,
Twinkies have been involved in a lot of promotional brand
ties throughout their time, but one of them does come
with a specific number um to coinside with the two
(16:39):
thousand seven or at least of King Kong, Hostess brought
back the original and popular flavor of banana for the
cream and sales shot up over Yeah. Yeah, people are
into it, I guess. But yeah, yeah, that's we're going
to talk about that. But I'm seeing out of numbers.
(17:00):
Around two thousand six seven, it was a big time
for Twinkies. It was, it was. And yeah also, uh right,
banana was the original Twinkie flavor and we are going
to get into that and lots more as soon as
we get back from a quick break for a word
from our sponsors, and we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes,
(17:31):
thank you. So okay, before we get to the Twinkie, um,
we have to go back to eighteen forty nine, which
is when this bakery called the Ward Baking Company opened
up shop in Manhattan. Over the course of a few decades,
they grew and acquired other regional bakeries and by n
(17:52):
had become known as Continental Baking. And we're operating out
of Kansas City, Missouri. Um. They started a brand of
snack cakes called Hostess with a chocolate cupcake in nineteen nineteen. Yes, yes, yes, yes, Um.
It can get complicated with all the company names that get.
Oh yeah, I tried to tried to explain, but right,
(18:16):
m Um. Also, I feel like it goes without saying.
But we got to say it every time that you're
not currently a sponsor. Oh no, we're here. But yeah,
they have not reached out to us, Hostess, reach out,
what is wrong with you? So most credit the invention
(18:37):
of the actual twinkie to Jimmy or James Doer, who
worked at Continental Baking UM. And as the story goes,
he invented this treat in nineteen thirty filling a shortcake
with a mixture of sugar and cream and yes, specifically
a banana cream filling. Although I've seen that kind of
get people keep saying original and then I'm like, but
(18:58):
it wasn't the strawberry original. I think that's okay, I'll
unpack that in a second. And he allegedly named it
on the way to a meeting with Hostess after a billboard.
So he saw this billboard for shoes UM called twinkletoe shoes.
And he was like that that's it, Twinkie. So there
you go. Now you understand what I was talking about
(19:18):
at the top. I hope the payoff was worth it. Um.
And yes, by most accounts, the original Twinkie flavor was banana.
I think this just might be how our interpret things,
but okay, UM, this wasn't part because of the short
season of strawberries, which directly impacted the production of strawberry
(19:38):
shortcakes which the company made. I think they were called
strawberry short fingers or something. Because of this, do Or
may have decided on the banana filling. Um. Because basically
what was happening was they had this specific machinery to
produce this strawberry short finger products um. And it wasn't
(19:59):
an you a lot of time because strawberries had such
a short season um. And so using banana and the
filling allowed them to use that equipment to produce treats
all year round instead of depending on when strawberries were
good when they could strawberries um. And also worth keeping
in mind, this was during the Great Depression, and do
Or knew that they needed an inexpensive treat and he
(20:21):
talked about that he was like, it had to be
you know this this price and at this level, and
so he was very cognizant of what he was doing.
In the early days, twinkies were filled by so called
twinkie stuffers who used a device that it was a
manual device that they pedaled with their feet. One such
(20:43):
stuffer once said you had to pump the pedal just
right or too much filling would shoot out. If I
over squirted, the twinkie would explode, but also said that
the workers would just eat the faulty ones. All right,
and twinkies were pretty quickly very popular in the United States. However,
(21:07):
as with most things, the World Wars really impacted the
manufacturing of these items, with things like rationing um with
sugar flour and bananas, and this necessitated retooling the recipe
and the filling, and so at the time they pivoted
to vanilla creams bananas. Yeah, yeah, because bananas became very
(21:31):
unavailable during World War Two. Yes, yes, uh. Twinkies were
advertised on the very popular children show Howdy Duty Show,
The how Do Duty Show in the nineteen fifties. By
Continental Baking was America's leading breadmaker and was purchased by
the International Telephone and Telegraph Corporation. Yeah, yep, yep, they
(21:57):
were Yeah, Continental Baking All so owned Wonder Bread, Yes,
which was originally in here, and I cut it. I
was one of the losses. I had to cut. But yes,
and we have to do an episode on Slice Bread,
which is a part of this story too, but that's
for future as current has gets to talk about this
(22:18):
because during the sies and eighties, this company launched an
ad campaign for d C and Marvel Comics with Twinkies,
and big names were involved to like a wonder Woman
at thor Yes, and at one point the Penguin seized
all the Twinkie delivery men and Gotham City. And I'm
(22:40):
telling you, why is this movie not exist? I know
we keep throwing ideas out there, but it's already here, right,
Like someone called Danny DeVito who has his number, and
Twinkie delivery men is so specific, and I'm not sure
(23:01):
it was ever a thing, but I love it. I
know I know that, like the Hostess brand had these
specific delivery trucks and drivers, and that that was part
of this whole thing that we're gonna kind of get
into later. Um or glance across later, I suppose, but
at any rate, yeah, I love it. Well, all right,
(23:27):
be on the lookout for that, I hope. But in
one the FTC served up a major hit for Hostess,
basically ruling that wonder Bread was pretty much enriched bread. Um.
And they had been saying, like wonder Bread, it was
all good for weight loss, good for your health, all
of these types of things. Um. And it was also
(23:49):
ruled that when it came to their snack cakes, sugar
was the main ingredients, so they couldn't make these sort
of big claims of them anymore. Um. Also in nine one,
the Hostess brand debut mascot for Twinkies called Twinkie the Kid. Yes,
if you haven't seen this mascot is basically a Twinkie
(24:11):
with a cowboy head, which I actually didn't pick up
on until I read a description of it. I was like, oh, yeah, obviously,
because I was trying to describe it, I was like,
it looks like a minion is like stretched out, um,
and it has a cowboy Obviously, it's a It's a Twinkie.
It's made its body is a Twinkie. Yes. Oh, and
(24:33):
we are going to talk more about that because it
was beloved, yes, yes, but pivoting in another cultural touch point.
In nine, Dan White was convicted of fatally shooting at
Mayor George Muscone of San Francisco and supervisor Harvey Milk.
And as a part of White's defense, Um, this is
(24:57):
kind of complicated, but okay, his lawyer argued that White
had a quote addiction to sweet snacks and sugary junk
food and that this worsened his depression. Um yeah, yeah,
And the press found up calling this the twinkie defense exactly. Um,
which the defense never actually argued that this consumption of
(25:21):
sugary snacks made White do it. Um, it was just
part of their It was just a piece of it. Yeah,
was like oh the snacks. Yeah yeah, Like like they
brought it up. They were like, yeah, his snack food
habits are evidence of his depression, not like a cause
of his depression or of his behavior. Rights. But the
(25:44):
press kind of ran the opposite direction. Yeah. Um, and
the term persists to this day. Uh. And White was
convicted of voluntary manslaughter as opposed to murder. So right,
so there was this like the twinkie defense worked like
kind of yeah, in corporate news in four um I
(26:07):
t T sold hostess to Ralston Purina, and then in
political news in night five, a candidate for city council
in Minneapolis had charges around him handing out an amount
of Twinkies and similar snacks and drinks to senior citizens
that amounted to I don't know thirty four dollars around UM.
(26:29):
He had these charges dropped after he was indicted for
bribery UM and as a result, Minnesota passed a campaign
finance law known as the Twinkies Law. Wow, I'm telling
this episode goes everywhere all over. That same year, Doer,
who famously claimed he ate one twinkie a day died.
(26:52):
This has nothing to do the twinkies, have nothing to
do with it. But he famously claimed he ate one
a day, and in fact, his obituary include this quote
from him. Some people say twinkies are the quintessential junk food,
but I believe in the things. I fed them to
my four kids and they feed them to my fifteen grandchildren.
My boy Jimmy played football for the Cleveland Browns. My
(27:13):
other son Bobby played quarterback for the University of Rochester.
Twinkies never hurt them and not that I doubted what
he would say in his obituary or anything, but I
did look at it. Yeah, his sons did play all right.
Well heck yeah, Jenny, heck yeah, Jimmy. Uh. Going back
(27:35):
to that mascot, okay, okay. So the company chose to
get rid of the mascot Twinkie the Kid, and this
did not please a lot of people, including a New
Jersey teenager named Judd Slivka, who sent a letter to
the company, complete with one and thirty five signatures, threatening
(27:55):
to boycott the company. Quote, as long as our hero
is kept away from the public, I love that, and
it works in company not only reintroduced Twinkie the Kid,
but they even invited Slifka to the mascot's birthday bash.
(28:15):
It's beautiful. Not as delightful, Oh my goodness. Yes. More
business news in rawlstin Peerina reached the deal that sold
the maker of Hostess Twinkies to the Interstate Bakeries Corporation.
And this was a big deal in two ways. Um. First,
(28:37):
Rawlston left the food business and second it made Interstate
America's the largest bakery company. And then also Hi this alright,
Houston's Rice University students George Gouge and Todd Stabler embarked
in the Twinkies Project UM, which they called with inorganic
(29:01):
noxious cakes with the K in extreme situations. And these
extreme situations included the rapid oxidation test, which is essentially
saying twinkies on fire, UM, the gravitational response test, which
was essentially dropping twinkies out of windows to determine if
they are affected by gravity, and a Turing test to
(29:23):
suss out the intelligence of a twinkie. Yeah fascinating, yeah yeah.
And then, in a continuing example of the cultural impact
of twinkies and the urban legend we mentioned at the top,
in President Bill Clinton included twinkies in the National Millennium
(29:45):
time Capsule. And this was along with I mean all
kinds of things that culturally significant, huge things, and then um,
the twinkie was later pulled out from the time capsule.
Do two can turns around? Mice getting into a house?
But to me that indicates even at the highest level,
(30:07):
people were like, yep, ye forever, it's gonna last forever. Um.
Deep fried Twinkies Okay, okay, they got their start in
the written record. I just feel like people fry anything
if they can. But one of the first instances that
we know of was in two thousand Christopher Cells, who
(30:31):
gets the credit for inventing deep fried twinkies, said, something
magical occurs when the pastry hits the hot oil, the
creamy white vegetable, shortening filling liquefies and pregnating the sponge
cake with its luscious vanilla flavor. Sure it's imitation, but
nevertheless potent. The cake itself softens and warms, nearly melting,
(30:51):
contrasting with the crisp deep fried crust in a buttery
and suave way. I mean, we've got a hand it
to him. I've never wanted to try one, but y'all
to that's poetry. It is and premating, yeah, with luscious
(31:13):
vanilla flavor. Um well, speaking of poetry. And two thousand four,
in order to co brand with DreamWorks for the release
of Shrek Too, Twinkies were available with an ogre green
colored filling. Oh my goodness, yeah, my goodness. Uh, but
this brings us to some financial woes. Yeah. Yeah. In
(31:36):
two thousand four, Interstate Bakery filed for Chapter eleven bankruptcy.
And this was for multitude of reasons, but one of
the most cited is changing health concerns people had. Yeah, sure,
sure they fewer fewer twinkies. Uh yeah, more what was
the big trend then, like like high protein Yeah, protein powders,
(31:59):
I think we're big. Yeah, smoothies yeah, um, I love
those things. But yes, they did a tint for the twinkie.
A few years later. In two thousand nine, Interstate Bakery
came out of bankruptcy and changed its name to host
His Brands. Hosts published a Twinkie cookbook called The Twinkies Cookbook,
(32:21):
an inventive and unexpected recipe collection from Hostess that included
fifty recipes for things like twinkie sushi. And I have
to say unexpected recipe collection like Chef's Kiss that is.
I love that, Yeah, genuinely, it's it's this close to
(32:43):
not meaning anything at all. Um, which like the Twinkie
I love it. Ah wow yeah yeah. The Hostess factory
in Toledo, Ohio is eventually turned into Zubo Books, Um,
but hints of Twinkies remained. In a two thousand seven
(33:07):
episode of No Reservations, host Anthony Bourdain tried liquefied twinkie
filling that was still in the building's pipes, and he said,
there's that Twinkie freshness. Yeah, yeah, yeah, apparently right, It's
just this like giant bookstore like like distribution situation. It's
(33:28):
got like a lot of like like like rare books
and stuff in there and is gigantic. And yeah, just
this old bakery section just still has these pipes that
are just still filled with like what would become Twinkie
filling if you like like pumped it out and like
whipped it with air. Apparent I saw it described as
(33:51):
like like a like a petroleum like like a like
a like an oil like a black sludge kind of situation.
I have not seen this episode. I don't think if
I have, I've put it out of my memory. Um yeah,
but yeah, but but Tony tony eight some because why not?
(34:12):
Because why not? I mean that feels like the Twinkie two. Yeah,
because why not? M m. But this wasn't the end
of the financial woes. In early twelve, the company filed
for Chapter eleven reorganization. A few months later, company workers
went on strike. In response to that, the company laid
off eighteen thousand five workers and closed their plans. A
(34:36):
year later, in Hostess brands sold Twinkies and Ding Dong's,
among other things, to two investment firms. So for eight
months during no Twinkies were produced and people were not happy.
They were panicking. I would say, yes, including celebrities, multiple celebrities,
but Wendy Williams often comes up because she hosted the
(34:57):
first twinkie eating competition and hopes of saving Yeah. Apparently
when they did come back, they came back slightly shorter
and less dense. I love that people know that. I
read that too, and yeah, I mean if you if
you're really familiar with the product, yeah, yeah, you know,
(35:20):
you know. Um well, uh well, like a recipe. UM
kind of facelift was involved with them coming back because Okay,
like the business side of this story is really pretty wild.
Um because like like the company that was holding the
brand had just been incredibly mismanaged. Um, Like they were
in so much debt, they had these intense pension costs. Um,
(35:43):
they had this trouble with the union and when it
liquidated its brands that just went away. UM. So so
they sold off I think the savory portions of things,
the Savory brands to one investment firm, and then this
other firm called Apollo Global bought up a bunch of
the snack cake brands and reopened under the Hostess name.
(36:06):
Like no one even bid against them when they made
their offer. Um. So they spent like like four hundred
million buying the brands, and then another few hundred million
updating the factories and the recipes and the distribution because apparently,
like it was really clunky and outdated and uh and
(36:28):
part of the problem was that Twinkies weren't shelf stable enough.
They were only shelf stable for like a recommended twenty
five days at this point. And so they like they
like more than doubled that um uh and and and
retooled the distribution um and Yeah, it was like immediately
(36:48):
extremely successful. People were so happy to see these brands
back on store shelves. Um and they are raking in
absolute billions. Wow. I mean, if I didn't know any better,
I haven't say that was a ploy, but I know
it wasn't. No, not that the company was genuinely in
so much trouble a terrifying amount. Like I this Forbes
(37:13):
article that I was reading is like, how did they
even get in that much trouble? We don't know it's impressive.
It's kind of impressive. Um at any rate. Okay, during
the early pandemic, a guy by the name of Colin
Parrington apparently an actual name Parrington. I love this, Okay,
(37:39):
it sounds like something from being Puppycats, so cool. Um. Okay.
He opened up this box of Twinkies that he had
purchased back in when there were those fears of Twinkies
going away forever, and because you know, he was like
out of snacks and he you know, he was like,
oh man, I bought those twinkies. I wonder how they're doing. Um.
They were not still good, uh, though interestingly different cakes
(38:03):
in there, like little individual single rappers showed all kinds
of different levels of mold growth and desiccation. Like some
looked fine but tasted awful. He did try them. Um Uh.
Some were like kind of shrunken and had some like
dark spotting, sort of like when a banana goes bad. Um,
(38:23):
and some were shriveled and gray like a like like
and like in like vacuum sucked in like a like
a weird moral mushroom kind of situation. So Mr Parrington
sent the twinkies to researchers to like see what was
growing on them um, and they honestly had nothing like
(38:45):
super interesting to report. They were like, oh, yeah, that's
pretty common mold. Um, but they couldn't get the really
mummified one to to grow uh anything else, so they
don't Yeah, they like couldn't figure out what kind of
mold it was because they couldn't get a sample to
to spore UM. And interestingly, UM, when they drilled into
(39:05):
that mummified one, um, they they used they used a tool,
they used a tool um that is normally used to
to take samples of bone marrow. Oh my goodness. And
and they in fact found that it still had a
liquid cream filling inside. Whoa, I know, right, Okay, get
(39:34):
a little I don't know, they're a little nervous. I
feel like I'm going to be playing a zombie video
game and I'm gonna get to the end. It's gonna
be like this twinkie. Yeah. Oh gosh, Well, speaking of zombies. Yeah,
we actually yes, speaking actually actually yes, we do have
(39:56):
a few more cultural notes that we wanted to touch on.
And this is just a few, because there are so many, um,
but just a few. A few of the greatest hits
of twinkies in her pop culture. Sure. Um so for one,
Archie Bunker got a twinkie every day in his lunch
on All in the Family. In the nine movie Greece,
(40:21):
the Young Women discussed twinkies and wine. The original Ghostbusters,
Egon uses a twinkie to basically describe how bad things
are due to ghost stuff. Yeah, yeah, um and this
is whenever I think about twinkies, I still think about
this line where, uh, I think Winston is like, tell
him about the twinkie, and Bankman is like, what about
(40:44):
the twinkie? Um, yes, but yeah. The line from Egan is,
let's say this twinkie represents the normal amount of psychokinetic
energy in the New York area. According to this morning sample,
it would be a twinkie thirty five ft long, weighing
approximately six pounds. And going off of this, my very
(41:05):
favorite food blogger, j Kenji Lopez Ault dutifully calculated how
much an actual thirty five ft long Twinkie would weigh,
and he came up with more like fifty three tons.
Yeah wow, Yeah, a six hundred pound twinky would only
be about six ft long, according to him, So like
(41:27):
twinky the kids sized. Uh. Yeah, it's a it's a
genuinely beautiful write up that he did. He went deep.
He went very deep, y'all. Um. He also did some
like brief calculations about how, um, how a six hundred
(41:48):
pound twinkie could possibly support its own weight. Um it
could not under the gravity structure of our current earth. Um.
So like he wrote, you know, like like calculation. It
is very twinkie in space, like it's a whole it
is a whole, glorious thing doing the good work. Yeah,
the good work, all right, excellent um in Twinkies were
(42:13):
mentioned in die Hard. Uh. On The Simpsons, a poo
once said you cannot hurt the twinkie when the twinkie
question reformed itself, right, yeah, and that was a twinkie
appeared in the two thousand and eight film Wall E
when a cockroach used it as like a bed. Sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
(42:35):
because because their eternal so right, it's their journal. I
have only seen that movie once because it made me
so sad. I don't remember. It's not like particularly sad.
I don't know something about it. So I was kind
of sad. I mean it is, but there it wasn't
like oh good, sobbing. But I think the whole feeling
of it just hurt my heart. I feel you. It's
(42:56):
a rough film. It it really goes there. It really does.
It really does. And then yes, zombies. The two thousand
nine film Zombie Lands included a whole plot where Woody
Harrelson's character was absolutely in love with twinkies. He was
always looking for twinkies, checking the hostess Chucks like I
gotta get these twinkies. Um. But the actual actor, Woody
(43:19):
Harrelson does not eat twinkies because he is vegan. So
I think they used you can find the recipe they used.
It was like, um, but yeah they used they made
a vegan twinkie for the production. Um. And so it's
been a minute since I've seen this movie, but I
do think the whole thing wasn't part in reference to
(43:40):
the urban legend that yet they never go bad, they
are internal. Um. But yeah, a big piece of that film,
I'm telling you, we went blazes. I do. I do
love these brand episodes. They get so weird they do.
You never know where they're gonna go. Now, Uh, well,
(44:04):
well that that is I think the places that we
are going to go about the Twinkie four now four now,
But we do have some listener email for you, and
we'll get into that after one more quick break for
a word from our sponsor, and we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes,
(44:27):
thank you, and we're back with that was good. We
got cut off at the same point. At least that's
what it sounded like I want. Sometimes we even impressed
(44:49):
me listener. Oh yes, our hardest critic, Oh yes, I'm
always like chucked that one up to a wind um,
Melissa wrote. I just finished the Jello episode and it
made me think of one of my stranger experiences in
(45:09):
med school. Our program had an outreach program to local
schools providing health education. I had volunteered for Brain Day
because I liked neurology and my friend was coordinating it.
I'm still not totally clear what we were trying to accomplish,
besides convincing a bunch of fifth graders that medicine and
neurology especially was cool for us. That meant demonstrating lesser
(45:32):
known reflexes on various kids. We also had access to
an anatomically correct silicon brain mold that our medical school owned.
For some reason, my friend was very stoked about this
and used it to make blue jello brains the closest
she could get to gray that she dutifully brought to
the elementary school as a surprise for the kids. So
(45:54):
in the end, we showed up at the school, hit
a bunch of kids with our reflex sammers, and invited
them to eat some jellow brains. I don't know if
we inspired anyone to become doctors afterwards, but I do
now know that ten year olds are pretty nonchalant about
eating what looks like a human brain given to them
by strangers. Make of that what you will? I mean important?
(46:18):
Oh yeah yeah, no, good to good to know, good data.
Wouldn't it be fantastic if somebody listening to this went
to that event and did go into neurology because of
this quite frankly amazing present. I would have loved this.
You get jello, you get to see weird reflexes. That is.
(46:42):
I would have remembered that, and I think I would
have been inspired. So that's a big thumbs up from me. Absolutely, heck,
let us know, hey, yes, yes, that would be so great.
Making connections okay, uh Matt wrote just a couple of
quick gags for you, oup me if you've heard these.
What does a Dollek say when he salts his food? Salinate?
(47:09):
All right? What did the Dalek vampires say? Exanguine eate? Yes? Yes?
And and then what does a Dalek do to remove
dead skin? Exfoliate? Eight? Yeah? All pretty good? All pretty good? Uh,
(47:34):
Matt continues. Anyway, for whatever it's worth, Tennant is my
favorite doctor, and my favorite episodes are the two parter
Silence in the Library and Forest of the Dead No
Shade on Blink. It's a masterpiece, but not my personal
m v P. Oh, those are good ones. Those are
very good ones. And also I love like again. If
(47:56):
you've never watched Dr Who, you have no idea what's
going on right now? Oh? Yeah, I'm so sorry. I'm
so sorry about that weird voice I just did, I
mean excellent. Never apolicize for that, Lauren. I won't hear it.
I won't stand for it. It's fantastic. Well, thank you
Annie again, our very harshest critic, so tough on each other.
(48:19):
But yes, thank you to both of these listeners for
writing to us. If you would like to write to us,
you can our email as Hello at savorpod dot com
and we're also on social media. You can find us
on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at savor pod and we
do hope to hear from you. Savor is production of
I Heart Radio. For more podcasts my Heart Radio, you
(48:40):
can visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or
wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Thanks as always
to our superproducers Dylan Fagin and Andrew Howard. Thanks to
you for listening, and we hope to lots more good
things are coming your way
Savor News
Hosts And Creators
Anney Reese
Lauren Vogelbaum
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