September 27, 2010 • 27 mins
In this episode, Molly and Cristen take a nostalgic trip down memory lane as they pay tribute to three beloved (non-Barbie) dolls from their childhoods.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray.
It's ready. Are you welcome to stump Mom never told you?
From house Stop works dot com. Hello, and welcome to
the podcast. I'm Kristen, I'm Molly. Molly. I feel like
(00:20):
I have told the story before, so always had a
good way to start story, I know, right, So if
I have you know, guys, just zone out for like
the next minute while I gab on. All right, we're
talking about dolls today, Okay, the non Barbie addition. And
this is perfect for me, Molly, because as a child,
(00:41):
as a young Kristen, I was not allowed to have
Barbies my mother because my mother thought that they u
and here, Mom, if you're listening, sorry about us spill
the beans. Because my mother thought that that she promoted
Barbie promoted an unhealthy and unrealistic body image. And you know,
I'm sure your mother was not alone in that. Yeah,
(01:01):
you know she she had all these brunette little girls
running around and uh, you know, why would she buy
us a bunch of blonde, big breasted dolls. She was
not a Barbie fan. So for that reason, I had
a cabfge pachetl Oh, well, I had Barbie's hand a
cabbage pachetl we weren't she my mother so really love
(01:23):
to me and not been concerned about my butt? They image,
you know, tell me about your coach. Well, uh, my
cabbage pasch doll was named Jane, and I can't remember
if that was her name on her birth certificate or not. Nevertheless,
her name was Jane, and I would call her plane
Jane because Jane had really short hair that I couldn't
play with, unlike my sister's scabbage basche doll that had
(01:46):
long flowing brown yarn hair that she could braid and
do cool things like that with. Whereas Jane could just
I could put like a hat on her head and
that was it. So I was kind of displeased. Sound
kind of resemble about it. We other person I know
has fond memories of playing with their cat. Don't get
me wrong, I loved playing with plane Jane, but I
(02:08):
just wish I could have gotten like a cabbage patched
doll wig where that was my thing when I was
a kid. I really I just loved playing with dolls hair.
So a lot of my dolls had like crazy frazzled
messed up hair because I would I placed the lawn
all the time. I think that's a pretty common thing
to do with their dolls, which is reflected in you
(02:29):
Know my Lovely hairstyle today. It is currently up in dun.
Do you guys want to have a fun fact about Kristin?
Her power comes from her bun. She puts it up
whenever we start podcasting. This is related to nothing. It's
true though, I do feel like I think clearer when
my when my um. I have long hair, as you
guys might see on our Facebook page. But this has
(02:49):
absolutely nothing to do with dolls. Molly, why are we
talking about my hair? Let's get back to dolls. Yeah,
today is a tribute to three famous dolls that we're
common in our childhoods. And of course we're gonna want
to hear about the dolls that are comment in your childhoods, um,
but these are three that meant something to us that
aren't Barbie, that are not Barbie dolls. Now, I will say, Molly,
(03:12):
I don't want to put words in our listeners mouths
or thoughts in their heads, but I'm banking on at
least a few people out there might be surprised that
we haven't brought up, you know, the gender implications of
girls playing with dolls. You know, because we have talked
about how toys are kind of gender segregated, where you know,
(03:33):
girls are taught to play with dollies and boys are
taught to play with trucks. Because you know, of our
because it feeds into our the social constructs of gender,
and isn't that so heteronormative and blah blah blah. Are
we just teaching girls become moms? Exactly? We're not going
to do that. We're not doing that today. We love
dolls so much. Well you know, yes, as a child,
(03:56):
I did love my dolls. But you know, um one,
I think that Lee this into our first doll because
when we were doing our research about dolls, that message
to us. I really I found this quote from Madame
Alexander Fame Dollmaker, and she said that dolls should contribute
to a child's understanding of people other times, in other places,
dolls should develop an appreciation of art and literature, and
(04:18):
a child. Yeah, and I and I like to think
of dolls that way because while yes, we can, we
can argue all day long about whether or not it
is healthy to give a little girl a doll? What
kind of message that sends to her? However, from my
own childhood experience, and I think from a lot of
people's childhood experiences, playing with dolls fostered imagination and fostered
(04:40):
you know, play and fantasy and all of those things
that are really healthy for kids too. So let's go
into the stories behind these dolls that we still love.
We said, we mentioned that Madame Alexander quote, So why
don't we start with her, Kristen, Now, when Molly asked
me what dolls we should talk about, I immediately said
Madame Alexander, because well, I did have Barbie's people, I
(05:01):
did have lots of Madame Alexander dolls. I had the
big ones that you could kind of you could play
with more. They were more like bigger, heavier baby dolls.
And then I also had the collectible Madame Alexander dolls
as well. The story about characters and the little women
characters loved them and they were very fun to dress up.
(05:22):
And she Madame Alexander was known for using characters from
literature and using characters from from real life and making
these glorious clothes for them. In fact, she made some
of the first dolls that were actually based on already
existing characters. Yeah, and Madame Alexander maybe we should call
her by her real name, Beatrice, Beatrice Alexander. She was
a child of first generation Americans. Yeah, and she grew
(05:45):
up above her father's um store, which was a it
was essentially a doll hospital. It was the first doll
hospital in this country. And so she would play with
the dolls while they were waiting to be repaired with
the little broken dolls. And you know, most of these
really fine dolls were coming from Europe. Um. Strangely America,
(06:05):
despite the fact that we're talking talking about three American dolls.
UM not known for its doll no artist try. Yeah,
it took a while. I was surprised. It took a
while for the doll industry in the States to really
pick up. No. Why Um, but that's key because Um,
(06:25):
when World War One broke out, obviously we weren't weren't
begging for them to send us their dolls. So um,
the doll hospital was actually threatened. And so one of
the first dolls that Beatrice Alexander made was a Red
Cross doll to UM sort of rally the troops here
at home, and also to keep the doll hospital in
the doll business um going so that she could make
(06:47):
some money creating dolls. And the success of the Red
Cross doll started her career in es when she gets
going with the Alexander Doll Company. Yes, and by nineteen
eight she has adopted the title of Madame Alexander and
Beatrice Alexander was quite a savvy businesswoman. I mean she
(07:08):
built herself a doll empire. For instance, she forged a
relationship with Disney where she created specific dolls to go
with certain characters, for instance Aree. She came out with
dolls to go along with Walt Disney's The Three Little Pigs,
and then from there the partnership picked up. She also
(07:32):
created the very popular Scarlett O'Hara doll to go along
with Gone with the Wind, the book. She made the
first Scarlett doll before she'd even seen a movie and
seen any sort of um vision of Scarlett as conceived
by another person. Yeah, so of course once the movie
comes out they become highly popular. The U. S. Government
even got in on the Madame Alexander doll train during
(07:55):
World War Two because they considered dolls to be morale boosters,
and so they wanted her to um to create dolls
who essentially lift up American spirits. And she came out
with this Margaret O'Brien doll in the nineteen forties and
it was one of the most most successful dolls to date.
(08:17):
And uh, it was billed as quote everyone's ideal of
a dear little girl. And you know the thing I
love when I was researching Madame Alexander sizes the fact
that she's this really pioneering businesswoman, one of the really
first successful businesswomen. Um, it's just that she's constantly innovating.
I mean basically, you know, not to diss them, but barbies,
(08:37):
they found a formula they liked and they kind of
just keep repeating it, their variations in you know, skin
tone and clothes and all that. But when you start
looking at the amazing variety of dolls that Madame Alexander created,
she was constantly experimenting with fabrics, with materials that she
can make dolls out of. You know. Shortly after the
(08:58):
Margaret or bind all, she wants to make an un
breakable doll because she wanted kids to get down and
dirty with them and says she's pioneering the use of plastic. Yeah,
she actually partnered up with DuPont to create the first
plastic doll, and she also innovated UM the closing eyelids
on on dolls. I remember that distinctly about my Madam
mollis inner baby dolls because when you would lay them
(09:18):
down in the crib, their eyes would close and so
it looked like they were sleeping. So, I mean, she's
got dolls that can walk, dolls that can crawl. Um.
The nineteen fifties are considered the golden age of Madame
Alexander Dolls. UM. That's where she had a lot of
her story book characters come out, and also the international
dolls with all the costumes from around the world, and
(09:38):
that earned her um A some kudos from the United Nations.
I mean, that's impressive. We think, oh, it's just a
just a doll, baby. And the coolest, the coolest creation,
in my opinion, is the thirties six custom made dolls
that she made when Queen Elizabeth the Second was coronated
(10:00):
as Queen Um. It was just these to the to
the pinpoint of detail accurate dolls, so accurate that CBS
used them to re enact the coronation on television. Can
you imagine, like that's if you're a kid in America
watching TV and seeing dolls reenact the Coronation of Elizabeth,
I think my mind would be blown. It's really cool.
(10:22):
So right around the same time that Beatrice Alexander is
starting to build her doll empire, We've got a guy
who is building a doll empire as well, but very
different type of doll. Yeah. If if Madame Alexander represents
top of the line finery for dolls, then Johnny Grewell
(10:44):
and his creation of Raggedy Ann is sort of the
the homemade, um but no less loved version of of
a doll. The rag doll and Raggedy Ann was actually
um a bit of an inspiration in doing this podcast
at all, Kristen, because there were quite a few news
story is a few weeks ago about Raggedy Ann's ninety
fifth birthday. Wow, that's how long she's been around. So
(11:05):
let's talk a little bit about Johnny Grille and the
myths and legends are surrounding Raggedy Yeah, Raggedy Ann has
a much more mysterious background than Madame Alexander. Dolls and
Alexander dolls are pretty pretty straightforward, but there has been
some misconception about how Johnny Grille came up with the
Raggedy Ann doll. Now, the most popular tale about Raggedy
(11:26):
Ann is that Johnny's daughter Marcella was wandering around in
the attic one day, rummaging through things with little girls
are prone to do when they don't have dolls, when
they don't have dolls, and uh, she was actually in
her supposedly in her grandmother's attic, and she comes down
holding this tattered and faceless rag doll and she she
(11:47):
takes it to her dad says, Dad, look at this doll,
and I just found it's kind of face on it.
And uh and Johnny says, a little Mosella with is
that dollar for you? And he paint the face on
the doll, and Raggedy Anna is born. Christ And I
think we're seeing how you played with your dolls when
(12:08):
you were a little kid. Lots of lots of fun voices.
That's where it's coming from. Very realistic play. Um. Now,
that's one story, and that's, like Christen said, the most
popular it's on Wikipedia, but according to one um site,
doll kind dot Com bookmarked it. It's a really great site.
You think Christen's joking, um, according to one. According to
(12:28):
another account, Johnny was in the attic and found the
doll himself and was just like, oh, I'm a writer
and an illustrator, this would be good to using some
of my pieces. Um. But the the doll will be
linked with Marcella forever because of the fact that a
he did tell her stories about this character, you know,
no matter who found it him or her. But also
(12:49):
she died very shortly after she was given this doll,
and the death obviously of his young child affected Johnny
Grille immensely, and he basically wanted to write down these
stories and illustrations to keep the memory of her alive.
In fact, in in one of the later books there
you know dozens of books about Raggedy Ann and Andy
(13:09):
who comes along five years later. Um, there is a
character named after his daughter. Now another myth that surrounded
her though, Raggedy Ann and the and the daughter, and
this might this might change your perception of Raggedy Ann
once you hear this. I don't know many people know this,
but I had certainly never heard of it, and heard
of it either. But the reason Marcella died at the
(13:30):
age of thirteen is because she was given a vaccine
for smallpox. It was mandatory, and the doctor said that
that's not what caused her death, but the parents became
convinced that that's what caused her death. And so Johnny
garrill in Uh in his life became this leading proponent
of the anti vaccine movement. And there was rumors and
(13:52):
gossips that he made Raggedy ann as a metaphor for
what happened when children got vaccinated for all him and
they couldn't they couldn't do anything, they were just there. Yeah,
he has supposedly made Raggedy ann Um intentionally lifeless, looking
to symbolize his daughter's death. There really is no concrete
(14:17):
evidence that that's the case. Well, they seemed to think
that based on when he patented the doll, that he
had been working on this doll and her back story
and her look before she died. So I don't think
he could have all of a sudden been like, yes,
this limp like creature now represents my daughter. But that
hasn't stopped anti vaccination groups from using her as a symbol.
(14:39):
From this story, kind of getting going. But here's a
fun fact though about Raggedy ann. Uh. Most of the
time we think of Raggedy Ann as you know, red
haired rag doll, right, all right, and then in the
early years she became a redhead. And now you know,
you can kind of design a Raggedy Ann as you
as you like. There is no really set Raggedy ann prototype.
(15:03):
And because she's in the public domain, any toy company
can make their own version of her. So that's why
no two raggedy Ans. Maybe, like I can think of
several in my home that look different from one another. Yeah, yeah,
different reggedy Ans look look different, It's true. So let's
go to another doll that has been mentioned already. But
another example of how two dolls do not look alike,
(15:24):
and that is the Cabbage Patch Kids. Cabbage Patch dolls. Yeah,
cabbage Patch dolls were so hot when you and I
were growing up. Yes, and I can I can see
in my head vividly the year I was given a
cabbage Patch doll. It would have been at the height
of that mania. And I got at the same birthday
that I got the Baron's Team Bears book, Little Brother.
(15:49):
That's because I had a little brother coming. Um. Yeah,
I I did not realize until we started researching this
just what a sensation cabbage patch dolls were. Apparently in
the mid eighties when when cabbage patch dolls were such
hot items, parents around the holidays would just flood the
(16:10):
toy stores trying to get their hands on a cabbage
patch doll. Fights broke out, fights broke out, people were injured. Um,
in the first year that they were on the market,
all right, this is more than two point five million
cabbage patch dolls were sold, which was an industry record.
(16:31):
Who knew Probably our parents knew Kristen because they were
the ones trying to find it for us. And yeah,
we were luckily oblivious. I knew their battles. I don't
I don't remember. Um, I don't remember wanting a cabbage
patched doll or going crazy over cabbage patch doll. But like,
like you remember, you got the Bear and Seeing Bears
book around the same time, same year I got my
(16:52):
cabbage patch doll or playing Jane, I also received my
most beloved stuffed animal of all time, a puffal up.
Do you ever have a puffle up? Are they related
to popples? I don't know, but I got a puffle
up named Duckie and it was the best. All right,
Stuffed animals are another podcast. Get back to your dolls.
That's what we're always saying to little girls. Um, but
(17:15):
you were upset about playing Jane's hair. The fact the
matter is the no two dolls were alike. There was
a computer system set up just to give each kid
different eye color, different hair. And of course, I think
one of the most distinguishing things about cabbage patch kids
their adoption papers and name. Yes, And sometimes when I
just want like a good laugh when I'm shopping, I'll
(17:38):
go into a toy store and just read the birth
certificates of cabbage patch dolls because they have some wacky names.
I only remember what mine was called for real, or
what I named her after that, but you know, they've
always got some off off kilter names. Yeah. And the
the guy who came up with with cabbage patch dolls
actually invented them not too far from where we are
(17:59):
sitting right now, Molly. They are cabbage Pasch dolls are
grown in Georgia, Georgia by a man named Xavier Roberts. Yeah,
he was an art student and he was working UM
in Helen, Georgia at the time and to put himself
through art school, and he came up with cabbage patch
dolls and next thing you know, he has the most
(18:19):
popular doll on the market. And before before the cabbage
patch dolls came out with their you know, the plastic
heads that they have today, um Xavier actually invented them
as soft headed dolls. Okay, and those original dolls are
incredibly valuable. Just as an example, Old Chuck from the
(18:43):
podcast Stuff You Should Know told us that his sister
actually has one of the original cabbage patch dolls that
has been estimated to be worth twenty five thousand dollars
and they were originally sold for forty dollars forty bucks,
original little people with the soft heads. And that's just
how just how popular these dolls became. And so basically
(19:05):
he was made. He was doing just fine as a
businessman selling them the fabric sculpted dolls, and uh in
two he makes the deal with the toy company to
mass produce the ones with the vinyl heads so that
they can sell more, put them out faster, and like
Kristen said, that's the year that everything exploded. They put
(19:26):
a cabbage Patch kid in space and uh, you know,
it just keeps. They kind of do fall out of
fashion at the end of the eighties and the company
does go bankrupt that was originally making the first cabbage
patch dolls. But they come back like throughout the nineties
and you can still, like I said, go into toy
stores and see them today. They've been mascots for the
(19:47):
Olympic team. There have been a lot of rumors about
cabbage patch dolls, like weird urban legends. Yeah, there are
so many articles on Snopes just about the cabbage Patch kids,
Like for example, the whole reason that they were made
was not because Xavier Roberts had discovered a cool new
way to sew a doll's head. It was because Ronald
Reagan wanted to teach America what the world would be like,
(20:09):
uh if if the bomb went off, Yeah, if what
we would look like, We'd all look like cabbage patched. Yeah.
It was to get us accustomed to a mutant race
of humans. And there was also the which isn't which
is a rumor I'm just gonna say after and then
there is also the rumor that, um, if you sent
off your cabbage Patch doll to get repaired. You wouldn't
(20:30):
get it back. Instead, they would mail you a death
certificate because you know, um, they come with these adoption
birth certificates and supposedly you would get a death certificate.
Not true. But you know what is not a rumor
is that cabbage patch dolls are quote unquote born in
a hospital in Georgia and given a magical formula called
(20:52):
a magic sillan that brings them to life. Kristen, have
you ever been to the Baby Land Hospital. I have
not been a big we laand hospital that ally you have,
and I want to hear about it. It is maybe
my favorite attraction all of Georgia. Whoa you go to Cleveland, George.
It's an hour outside of Atlanta and I went just
a few years ago, not as a child. I can
(21:13):
only imagine the glory that would have been to go
as a child. And they take the fact that it's
a hospital for these babies very seriously because the nurse
greets you at the door and you and it's free.
That's what's so great about it. It's just a slice
of your childhood. Just they're waiting for you. And first
you go through and you kind of see how the
cabbage patch dolls evolved. You see that original uh sown
(21:36):
face made out of all fabric, and then you just
see more cabbage patch dolls, and you could even imagine
exists like just in all sorts of scenes of play,
Like they're on a boat, they're like having picnics together
there in school, they're on busses going on field trips.
It's just if you can't imagine a cabbage patch doll
doing something, it's doing it at that place. But yeah,
(21:59):
that's not the main at action. Yeah, this is what
I want to know about mother Cabbage. So in the
middle of the whole place is a mother Cabbage about
every half hour on the dot, which is a little
suspicious to me. She is ready to give us a
new cabbage patch kid, because the cabbage patch kids are
like they come from the leaves and they're pollinated by crystals,
(22:22):
and there's an entire backstory to basically everyone gathers around
the crystals start to light up on the cabbage patch.
A doctor comes out and like you said, administers and
magic sillin so that the baby's form healthy. They can
do a sonogram and they tell you if it's a
boy or a girl, which means which essentially involves just
like putting a tool on a tree and the tree
lights up pink or blue. They cut the cabbage leaves out,
(22:43):
and all of a sudden there's a new cabbage patch kid. Well,
your eyes are lighting up. I if you have been there,
then you know the magic that this is. I might
have to go to baby land. It is fun for
children and adults alike, probably not for the same reasons.
It can be a bit of a campy and field
trip if you will. Yeah, I gotta stay of all
of all the doll back stories. Cabbage Patch takes the cake.
(23:06):
But you know that that's not really why I never
played with it, like, oh, come here, cabbage patch doll,
I'll take care of you. Now that you're not in
your leaf of cabbage anymore. I would give you a majestin.
And you know it's I don't remember using that part
of the backstory to make my fun with her, which
I think speaks to why dolls are so beloved among
girls and boys everywhere is because you make your own
(23:28):
backstory for them, make your own backstory. You can treat them.
As I was telling Kristen Um in the gift shop.
You can buy like really boring crap for your dolls,
like you buy like the scale to weigh them on,
like have all the access rates to buy for a doll.
That sounds like the most boring. But um, but I'm
sure there are kids who love to do that, play
doctor and wag your cabbage patch kid. But I think
(23:50):
that is why they're still appealing. As you can. You
can treat them like kids. I never did. I treated
them as my students in my pretend school that my
brothers should not go to once I gave them yes.
And I know that you pretended you were a band
of orphans with your dolls. Kristen, Yes, box cards, children,
Oh way too many, way too many personal effects. We're
(24:10):
sharing about our childhood in this podcast, which is why
I think it's time to ask for listeners stories. What
kind of did you guys play with dolls? What kind
of dolls did you play with? Don't be mad at
me and Molly for a for talking for twenty minutes
about dolls and and and not bringing up the the
(24:30):
potentially negative gender applications of dolls, because you know what,
they are a part of our collective childhoods. Well, and
I think that you know, I I agree with Madame
Alexander that they foster imagination in ways that we're also
foster when I played with blocks, But I played with
both of them exactly to worry about gender, Kristen, worry
(24:52):
about fun. Fun. Let's have fun and read some emails. Well,
I've got an email here from Kelly, and this is
in response to perhaps your favorite podcast of all time,
Molly and Women Magic. She said, I want to mention
an area of female magic that you may have overlooked.
It seems to be much more acceptable socially for women
(25:14):
to perform elaborate magic tricks so long as they are
dressed up as clowns. I wonder if that's because they're
not presenting themselves as traditionally feminine but instead look childish
or buffoonish. Interesting theory, theory, there might be something to
that they might want to look into that, Molly. I've
got one here from Katie about musical instruments in gender,
(25:37):
and she writes, in some matriarchal Native American tribes, only
men are allowed to play ceremonial drums for one pretty
cool reason. These traditional drums are played on the ground
and the Earth being a mother figure has immense power.
If women were to play the drums, the power that
comes from their connection with Mother Earth, but just be
far too great. Men here, being the weaker sex and
not having that connection, need to play the drums so
(25:58):
that the only powers from the drum beat and not
from women and Mother Earth. I've always found this pretty
interesting because it's the opposite of what we find sometimes
in our culture, where a woman might not be able
to handle certain instruments because of the size or what
have you. In this case, the woman is too strong
to even touch it. Very cool fun fact, Very cool
fun facts. Keep sending us fun facts and um please
(26:18):
please send us and share your your childhood doll stories
um to balance out all of the all the childhood
stories of Molly and I just shared with you all,
and I hope that you enjoyed it. Uh, send us
an email. It's mom Stuff at how stuff works dot com.
You can also right right all over our Facebook wall.
We're on there, and uh you can finally Twitter follow
(26:41):
us or mom stuff podcasts. And then the last but
not least, you can head over to our blog stuff
Mom Never Told You at the u r L. How
Stuff works dot Com for more on this and thousands
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Want more house staff works, check out our blogs on
(27:03):
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are you
Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray.
It's ready. Are you welcome to stump Mom never told you?
From house Stop works dot com. Hello, and welcome to
the podcast. I'm Kristen, I'm Molly. Molly. I feel like
(00:20):
I have told the story before, so always had a
good way to start story, I know, right, So if
I have you know, guys, just zone out for like
the next minute while I gab on. All right, we're
talking about dolls today, Okay, the non Barbie addition. And
this is perfect for me, Molly, because as a child,
(00:41):
as a young Kristen, I was not allowed to have
Barbies my mother because my mother thought that they u
and here, Mom, if you're listening, sorry about us spill
the beans. Because my mother thought that that she promoted
Barbie promoted an unhealthy and unrealistic body image. And you know,
I'm sure your mother was not alone in that. Yeah,
(01:01):
you know she she had all these brunette little girls
running around and uh, you know, why would she buy
us a bunch of blonde, big breasted dolls. She was
not a Barbie fan. So for that reason, I had
a cabfge pachetl Oh, well, I had Barbie's hand a
cabbage pachetl we weren't she my mother so really love
(01:23):
to me and not been concerned about my butt? They image,
you know, tell me about your coach. Well, uh, my
cabbage pasch doll was named Jane, and I can't remember
if that was her name on her birth certificate or not. Nevertheless,
her name was Jane, and I would call her plane
Jane because Jane had really short hair that I couldn't
play with, unlike my sister's scabbage basche doll that had
(01:46):
long flowing brown yarn hair that she could braid and
do cool things like that with. Whereas Jane could just
I could put like a hat on her head and
that was it. So I was kind of displeased. Sound
kind of resemble about it. We other person I know
has fond memories of playing with their cat. Don't get
me wrong, I loved playing with plane Jane, but I
(02:08):
just wish I could have gotten like a cabbage patched
doll wig where that was my thing when I was
a kid. I really I just loved playing with dolls hair.
So a lot of my dolls had like crazy frazzled
messed up hair because I would I placed the lawn
all the time. I think that's a pretty common thing
to do with their dolls, which is reflected in you
(02:29):
Know my Lovely hairstyle today. It is currently up in dun.
Do you guys want to have a fun fact about Kristin?
Her power comes from her bun. She puts it up
whenever we start podcasting. This is related to nothing. It's
true though, I do feel like I think clearer when
my when my um. I have long hair, as you
guys might see on our Facebook page. But this has
(02:49):
absolutely nothing to do with dolls. Molly, why are we
talking about my hair? Let's get back to dolls. Yeah,
today is a tribute to three famous dolls that we're
common in our childhoods. And of course we're gonna want
to hear about the dolls that are comment in your childhoods, um,
but these are three that meant something to us that
aren't Barbie, that are not Barbie dolls. Now, I will say, Molly,
(03:12):
I don't want to put words in our listeners mouths
or thoughts in their heads, but I'm banking on at
least a few people out there might be surprised that
we haven't brought up, you know, the gender implications of
girls playing with dolls. You know, because we have talked
about how toys are kind of gender segregated, where you know,
(03:33):
girls are taught to play with dollies and boys are
taught to play with trucks. Because you know, of our
because it feeds into our the social constructs of gender,
and isn't that so heteronormative and blah blah blah. Are
we just teaching girls become moms? Exactly? We're not going
to do that. We're not doing that today. We love
dolls so much. Well you know, yes, as a child,
(03:56):
I did love my dolls. But you know, um one,
I think that Lee this into our first doll because
when we were doing our research about dolls, that message
to us. I really I found this quote from Madame
Alexander Fame Dollmaker, and she said that dolls should contribute
to a child's understanding of people other times, in other places,
dolls should develop an appreciation of art and literature, and
(04:18):
a child. Yeah, and I and I like to think
of dolls that way because while yes, we can, we
can argue all day long about whether or not it
is healthy to give a little girl a doll? What
kind of message that sends to her? However, from my
own childhood experience, and I think from a lot of
people's childhood experiences, playing with dolls fostered imagination and fostered
(04:40):
you know, play and fantasy and all of those things
that are really healthy for kids too. So let's go
into the stories behind these dolls that we still love.
We said, we mentioned that Madame Alexander quote, So why
don't we start with her, Kristen, Now, when Molly asked
me what dolls we should talk about, I immediately said
Madame Alexander, because well, I did have Barbie's people, I
(05:01):
did have lots of Madame Alexander dolls. I had the
big ones that you could kind of you could play
with more. They were more like bigger, heavier baby dolls.
And then I also had the collectible Madame Alexander dolls
as well. The story about characters and the little women
characters loved them and they were very fun to dress up.
(05:22):
And she Madame Alexander was known for using characters from
literature and using characters from from real life and making
these glorious clothes for them. In fact, she made some
of the first dolls that were actually based on already
existing characters. Yeah, and Madame Alexander maybe we should call
her by her real name, Beatrice, Beatrice Alexander. She was
a child of first generation Americans. Yeah, and she grew
(05:45):
up above her father's um store, which was a it
was essentially a doll hospital. It was the first doll
hospital in this country. And so she would play with
the dolls while they were waiting to be repaired with
the little broken dolls. And you know, most of these
really fine dolls were coming from Europe. Um. Strangely America,
(06:05):
despite the fact that we're talking talking about three American dolls.
UM not known for its doll no artist try. Yeah,
it took a while. I was surprised. It took a
while for the doll industry in the States to really
pick up. No. Why Um, but that's key because Um,
(06:25):
when World War One broke out, obviously we weren't weren't
begging for them to send us their dolls. So um,
the doll hospital was actually threatened. And so one of
the first dolls that Beatrice Alexander made was a Red
Cross doll to UM sort of rally the troops here
at home, and also to keep the doll hospital in
the doll business um going so that she could make
(06:47):
some money creating dolls. And the success of the Red
Cross doll started her career in es when she gets
going with the Alexander Doll Company. Yes, and by nineteen
eight she has adopted the title of Madame Alexander and
Beatrice Alexander was quite a savvy businesswoman. I mean she
(07:08):
built herself a doll empire. For instance, she forged a
relationship with Disney where she created specific dolls to go
with certain characters, for instance Aree. She came out with
dolls to go along with Walt Disney's The Three Little Pigs,
and then from there the partnership picked up. She also
(07:32):
created the very popular Scarlett O'Hara doll to go along
with Gone with the Wind, the book. She made the
first Scarlett doll before she'd even seen a movie and
seen any sort of um vision of Scarlett as conceived
by another person. Yeah, so of course once the movie
comes out they become highly popular. The U. S. Government
even got in on the Madame Alexander doll train during
(07:55):
World War Two because they considered dolls to be morale boosters,
and so they wanted her to um to create dolls
who essentially lift up American spirits. And she came out
with this Margaret O'Brien doll in the nineteen forties and
it was one of the most most successful dolls to date.
(08:17):
And uh, it was billed as quote everyone's ideal of
a dear little girl. And you know the thing I
love when I was researching Madame Alexander sizes the fact
that she's this really pioneering businesswoman, one of the really
first successful businesswomen. Um, it's just that she's constantly innovating.
I mean basically, you know, not to diss them, but barbies,
(08:37):
they found a formula they liked and they kind of
just keep repeating it, their variations in you know, skin
tone and clothes and all that. But when you start
looking at the amazing variety of dolls that Madame Alexander created,
she was constantly experimenting with fabrics, with materials that she
can make dolls out of. You know. Shortly after the
(08:58):
Margaret or bind all, she wants to make an un
breakable doll because she wanted kids to get down and
dirty with them and says she's pioneering the use of plastic. Yeah,
she actually partnered up with DuPont to create the first
plastic doll, and she also innovated UM the closing eyelids
on on dolls. I remember that distinctly about my Madam
mollis inner baby dolls because when you would lay them
(09:18):
down in the crib, their eyes would close and so
it looked like they were sleeping. So, I mean, she's
got dolls that can walk, dolls that can crawl. Um.
The nineteen fifties are considered the golden age of Madame
Alexander Dolls. UM. That's where she had a lot of
her story book characters come out, and also the international
dolls with all the costumes from around the world, and
(09:38):
that earned her um A some kudos from the United Nations.
I mean, that's impressive. We think, oh, it's just a
just a doll, baby. And the coolest, the coolest creation,
in my opinion, is the thirties six custom made dolls
that she made when Queen Elizabeth the Second was coronated
(10:00):
as Queen Um. It was just these to the to
the pinpoint of detail accurate dolls, so accurate that CBS
used them to re enact the coronation on television. Can
you imagine, like that's if you're a kid in America
watching TV and seeing dolls reenact the Coronation of Elizabeth,
I think my mind would be blown. It's really cool.
(10:22):
So right around the same time that Beatrice Alexander is
starting to build her doll empire, We've got a guy
who is building a doll empire as well, but very
different type of doll. Yeah. If if Madame Alexander represents
top of the line finery for dolls, then Johnny Grewell
(10:44):
and his creation of Raggedy Ann is sort of the
the homemade, um but no less loved version of of
a doll. The rag doll and Raggedy Ann was actually
um a bit of an inspiration in doing this podcast
at all, Kristen, because there were quite a few news
story is a few weeks ago about Raggedy Ann's ninety
fifth birthday. Wow, that's how long she's been around. So
(11:05):
let's talk a little bit about Johnny Grille and the
myths and legends are surrounding Raggedy Yeah, Raggedy Ann has
a much more mysterious background than Madame Alexander. Dolls and
Alexander dolls are pretty pretty straightforward, but there has been
some misconception about how Johnny Grille came up with the
Raggedy Ann doll. Now, the most popular tale about Raggedy
(11:26):
Ann is that Johnny's daughter Marcella was wandering around in
the attic one day, rummaging through things with little girls
are prone to do when they don't have dolls, when
they don't have dolls, and uh, she was actually in
her supposedly in her grandmother's attic, and she comes down
holding this tattered and faceless rag doll and she she
(11:47):
takes it to her dad says, Dad, look at this doll,
and I just found it's kind of face on it.
And uh and Johnny says, a little Mosella with is
that dollar for you? And he paint the face on
the doll, and Raggedy Anna is born. Christ And I
think we're seeing how you played with your dolls when
(12:08):
you were a little kid. Lots of lots of fun voices.
That's where it's coming from. Very realistic play. Um. Now,
that's one story, and that's, like Christen said, the most
popular it's on Wikipedia, but according to one um site,
doll kind dot Com bookmarked it. It's a really great site.
You think Christen's joking, um, according to one. According to
(12:28):
another account, Johnny was in the attic and found the
doll himself and was just like, oh, I'm a writer
and an illustrator, this would be good to using some
of my pieces. Um. But the the doll will be
linked with Marcella forever because of the fact that a
he did tell her stories about this character, you know,
no matter who found it him or her. But also
(12:49):
she died very shortly after she was given this doll,
and the death obviously of his young child affected Johnny
Grille immensely, and he basically wanted to write down these
stories and illustrations to keep the memory of her alive.
In fact, in in one of the later books there
you know dozens of books about Raggedy Ann and Andy
(13:09):
who comes along five years later. Um, there is a
character named after his daughter. Now another myth that surrounded
her though, Raggedy Ann and the and the daughter, and
this might this might change your perception of Raggedy Ann
once you hear this. I don't know many people know this,
but I had certainly never heard of it, and heard
of it either. But the reason Marcella died at the
(13:30):
age of thirteen is because she was given a vaccine
for smallpox. It was mandatory, and the doctor said that
that's not what caused her death, but the parents became
convinced that that's what caused her death. And so Johnny
garrill in Uh in his life became this leading proponent
of the anti vaccine movement. And there was rumors and
(13:52):
gossips that he made Raggedy ann as a metaphor for
what happened when children got vaccinated for all him and
they couldn't they couldn't do anything, they were just there. Yeah,
he has supposedly made Raggedy ann Um intentionally lifeless, looking
to symbolize his daughter's death. There really is no concrete
(14:17):
evidence that that's the case. Well, they seemed to think
that based on when he patented the doll, that he
had been working on this doll and her back story
and her look before she died. So I don't think
he could have all of a sudden been like, yes,
this limp like creature now represents my daughter. But that
hasn't stopped anti vaccination groups from using her as a symbol.
(14:39):
From this story, kind of getting going. But here's a
fun fact though about Raggedy ann. Uh. Most of the
time we think of Raggedy Ann as you know, red
haired rag doll, right, all right, and then in the
early years she became a redhead. And now you know,
you can kind of design a Raggedy Ann as you
as you like. There is no really set Raggedy ann prototype.
(15:03):
And because she's in the public domain, any toy company
can make their own version of her. So that's why
no two raggedy Ans. Maybe, like I can think of
several in my home that look different from one another. Yeah, yeah,
different reggedy Ans look look different, It's true. So let's
go to another doll that has been mentioned already. But
another example of how two dolls do not look alike,
(15:24):
and that is the Cabbage Patch Kids. Cabbage Patch dolls. Yeah,
cabbage Patch dolls were so hot when you and I
were growing up. Yes, and I can I can see
in my head vividly the year I was given a
cabbage Patch doll. It would have been at the height
of that mania. And I got at the same birthday
that I got the Baron's Team Bears book, Little Brother.
(15:49):
That's because I had a little brother coming. Um. Yeah,
I I did not realize until we started researching this
just what a sensation cabbage patch dolls were. Apparently in
the mid eighties when when cabbage patch dolls were such
hot items, parents around the holidays would just flood the
(16:10):
toy stores trying to get their hands on a cabbage
patch doll. Fights broke out, fights broke out, people were injured. Um,
in the first year that they were on the market,
all right, this is more than two point five million
cabbage patch dolls were sold, which was an industry record.
(16:31):
Who knew Probably our parents knew Kristen because they were
the ones trying to find it for us. And yeah,
we were luckily oblivious. I knew their battles. I don't
I don't remember. Um, I don't remember wanting a cabbage
patched doll or going crazy over cabbage patch doll. But like,
like you remember, you got the Bear and Seeing Bears
book around the same time, same year I got my
(16:52):
cabbage patch doll or playing Jane, I also received my
most beloved stuffed animal of all time, a puffal up.
Do you ever have a puffle up? Are they related
to popples? I don't know, but I got a puffle
up named Duckie and it was the best. All right,
Stuffed animals are another podcast. Get back to your dolls.
That's what we're always saying to little girls. Um, but
(17:15):
you were upset about playing Jane's hair. The fact the
matter is the no two dolls were alike. There was
a computer system set up just to give each kid
different eye color, different hair. And of course, I think
one of the most distinguishing things about cabbage patch kids
their adoption papers and name. Yes, And sometimes when I
just want like a good laugh when I'm shopping, I'll
(17:38):
go into a toy store and just read the birth
certificates of cabbage patch dolls because they have some wacky names.
I only remember what mine was called for real, or
what I named her after that, but you know, they've
always got some off off kilter names. Yeah. And the
the guy who came up with with cabbage patch dolls
actually invented them not too far from where we are
(17:59):
sitting right now, Molly. They are cabbage Pasch dolls are
grown in Georgia, Georgia by a man named Xavier Roberts. Yeah,
he was an art student and he was working UM
in Helen, Georgia at the time and to put himself
through art school, and he came up with cabbage patch
dolls and next thing you know, he has the most
(18:19):
popular doll on the market. And before before the cabbage
patch dolls came out with their you know, the plastic
heads that they have today, um Xavier actually invented them
as soft headed dolls. Okay, and those original dolls are
incredibly valuable. Just as an example, Old Chuck from the
(18:43):
podcast Stuff You Should Know told us that his sister
actually has one of the original cabbage patch dolls that
has been estimated to be worth twenty five thousand dollars
and they were originally sold for forty dollars forty bucks,
original little people with the soft heads. And that's just
how just how popular these dolls became. And so basically
(19:05):
he was made. He was doing just fine as a
businessman selling them the fabric sculpted dolls, and uh in
two he makes the deal with the toy company to
mass produce the ones with the vinyl heads so that
they can sell more, put them out faster, and like
Kristen said, that's the year that everything exploded. They put
(19:26):
a cabbage Patch kid in space and uh, you know,
it just keeps. They kind of do fall out of
fashion at the end of the eighties and the company
does go bankrupt that was originally making the first cabbage
patch dolls. But they come back like throughout the nineties
and you can still, like I said, go into toy
stores and see them today. They've been mascots for the
(19:47):
Olympic team. There have been a lot of rumors about
cabbage patch dolls, like weird urban legends. Yeah, there are
so many articles on Snopes just about the cabbage Patch kids,
Like for example, the whole reason that they were made
was not because Xavier Roberts had discovered a cool new
way to sew a doll's head. It was because Ronald
Reagan wanted to teach America what the world would be like,
(20:09):
uh if if the bomb went off, Yeah, if what
we would look like, We'd all look like cabbage patched. Yeah.
It was to get us accustomed to a mutant race
of humans. And there was also the which isn't which
is a rumor I'm just gonna say after and then
there is also the rumor that, um, if you sent
off your cabbage Patch doll to get repaired. You wouldn't
(20:30):
get it back. Instead, they would mail you a death
certificate because you know, um, they come with these adoption
birth certificates and supposedly you would get a death certificate.
Not true. But you know what is not a rumor
is that cabbage patch dolls are quote unquote born in
a hospital in Georgia and given a magical formula called
(20:52):
a magic sillan that brings them to life. Kristen, have
you ever been to the Baby Land Hospital. I have
not been a big we laand hospital that ally you have,
and I want to hear about it. It is maybe
my favorite attraction all of Georgia. Whoa you go to Cleveland, George.
It's an hour outside of Atlanta and I went just
a few years ago, not as a child. I can
(21:13):
only imagine the glory that would have been to go
as a child. And they take the fact that it's
a hospital for these babies very seriously because the nurse
greets you at the door and you and it's free.
That's what's so great about it. It's just a slice
of your childhood. Just they're waiting for you. And first
you go through and you kind of see how the
cabbage patch dolls evolved. You see that original uh sown
(21:36):
face made out of all fabric, and then you just
see more cabbage patch dolls, and you could even imagine
exists like just in all sorts of scenes of play,
Like they're on a boat, they're like having picnics together
there in school, they're on busses going on field trips.
It's just if you can't imagine a cabbage patch doll
doing something, it's doing it at that place. But yeah,
(21:59):
that's not the main at action. Yeah, this is what
I want to know about mother Cabbage. So in the
middle of the whole place is a mother Cabbage about
every half hour on the dot, which is a little
suspicious to me. She is ready to give us a
new cabbage patch kid, because the cabbage patch kids are
like they come from the leaves and they're pollinated by crystals,
(22:22):
and there's an entire backstory to basically everyone gathers around
the crystals start to light up on the cabbage patch.
A doctor comes out and like you said, administers and
magic sillin so that the baby's form healthy. They can
do a sonogram and they tell you if it's a
boy or a girl, which means which essentially involves just
like putting a tool on a tree and the tree
lights up pink or blue. They cut the cabbage leaves out,
(22:43):
and all of a sudden there's a new cabbage patch kid. Well,
your eyes are lighting up. I if you have been there,
then you know the magic that this is. I might
have to go to baby land. It is fun for
children and adults alike, probably not for the same reasons.
It can be a bit of a campy and field
trip if you will. Yeah, I gotta stay of all
of all the doll back stories. Cabbage Patch takes the cake.
(23:06):
But you know that that's not really why I never
played with it, like, oh, come here, cabbage patch doll,
I'll take care of you. Now that you're not in
your leaf of cabbage anymore. I would give you a majestin.
And you know it's I don't remember using that part
of the backstory to make my fun with her, which
I think speaks to why dolls are so beloved among
girls and boys everywhere is because you make your own
(23:28):
backstory for them, make your own backstory. You can treat them.
As I was telling Kristen Um in the gift shop.
You can buy like really boring crap for your dolls,
like you buy like the scale to weigh them on,
like have all the access rates to buy for a doll.
That sounds like the most boring. But um, but I'm
sure there are kids who love to do that, play
doctor and wag your cabbage patch kid. But I think
(23:50):
that is why they're still appealing. As you can. You
can treat them like kids. I never did. I treated
them as my students in my pretend school that my
brothers should not go to once I gave them yes.
And I know that you pretended you were a band
of orphans with your dolls. Kristen, Yes, box cards, children,
Oh way too many, way too many personal effects. We're
(24:10):
sharing about our childhood in this podcast, which is why
I think it's time to ask for listeners stories. What
kind of did you guys play with dolls? What kind
of dolls did you play with? Don't be mad at
me and Molly for a for talking for twenty minutes
about dolls and and and not bringing up the the
(24:30):
potentially negative gender applications of dolls, because you know what,
they are a part of our collective childhoods. Well, and
I think that you know, I I agree with Madame
Alexander that they foster imagination in ways that we're also
foster when I played with blocks, But I played with
both of them exactly to worry about gender, Kristen, worry
(24:52):
about fun. Fun. Let's have fun and read some emails. Well,
I've got an email here from Kelly, and this is
in response to perhaps your favorite podcast of all time,
Molly and Women Magic. She said, I want to mention
an area of female magic that you may have overlooked.
It seems to be much more acceptable socially for women
(25:14):
to perform elaborate magic tricks so long as they are
dressed up as clowns. I wonder if that's because they're
not presenting themselves as traditionally feminine but instead look childish
or buffoonish. Interesting theory, theory, there might be something to
that they might want to look into that, Molly. I've
got one here from Katie about musical instruments in gender,
(25:37):
and she writes, in some matriarchal Native American tribes, only
men are allowed to play ceremonial drums for one pretty
cool reason. These traditional drums are played on the ground
and the Earth being a mother figure has immense power.
If women were to play the drums, the power that
comes from their connection with Mother Earth, but just be
far too great. Men here, being the weaker sex and
not having that connection, need to play the drums so
(25:58):
that the only powers from the drum beat and not
from women and Mother Earth. I've always found this pretty
interesting because it's the opposite of what we find sometimes
in our culture, where a woman might not be able
to handle certain instruments because of the size or what
have you. In this case, the woman is too strong
to even touch it. Very cool fun fact, Very cool
fun facts. Keep sending us fun facts and um please
(26:18):
please send us and share your your childhood doll stories
um to balance out all of the all the childhood
stories of Molly and I just shared with you all,
and I hope that you enjoyed it. Uh, send us
an email. It's mom Stuff at how stuff works dot com.
You can also right right all over our Facebook wall.
We're on there, and uh you can finally Twitter follow
(26:41):
us or mom stuff podcasts. And then the last but
not least, you can head over to our blog stuff
Mom Never Told You at the u r L. How
Stuff works dot Com for more on this and thousands
of other topics because at how stuff works dot Com.
Want more house staff works, check out our blogs on
(27:03):
the house stuff works dot Com home page. Brought to
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