May 13, 2023 • 19 mins
In this classic episode, Anney and Samantha dig into the chaotic, queer, morally ambiguous Star Wars answer to Indiana Jones, Dr. Aphra.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to Stephan
Never Told You Production of iHeartRadio and welcome to you,
another classic from the Star Wars universe. For this one,
I want to bring back a Fictional Women around the World.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
We did.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
It was one of my earlier ones on Doctor Afra,
who I remember speculating about it. We speculated about it
in that episode. They have not cast, has not appeared
in live action yet. Yes, yes, but she is a
fan favorite character, and I saw some tweets about the
newest comic that she's in She's Got her Own series,
(00:51):
that it was one of the most queer comics that's
ever been produced, and so I really want to check
it out. Yes, yes, yes, yes, Well if anyone's read it,
oh my gosh, please let us know. But in the meantime,
please enjoy this classic episode. Hey, this is Annie and
(01:16):
Smantha and welcome to stuff I've Never Told You Production
of iHeartRadio and welcome to a very special edition of
Fictional Women Around the World. Our sub segment, segment, segment,
subsegment good enough.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Yes, and this is a special one because.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
As you're listening to it, it is May the fourth
our Star Wars Day, Happy Star Wars Day.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
May the fourth be with you? Annie's favorite. Oh yeah,
I get a lot of messages that day, which I
really enjoy.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
Yes, And I've never really seen it as a thing
until I started with iHeart Slash. At that point, still
house the forks and I came in and there was
cake and punch and decorations that I was like, what
is happening?
Speaker 2 (02:09):
What is today? And everybody's like, May the fourth be
with you.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
It was like nerds, but you still took home the
inflatable lightsaber and the cups.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
I saw them recently.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
It's true I did not knowing what I was getting
myself into because this was.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Pre inundated Star Wars times for me. Yeah. Yeah, that's true.
Office party also, what a long time ago? Oh that
was a thing, remember shared food and everything?
Speaker 1 (02:36):
I know.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Yeah, So I guess I'm not sure when you're listening
to this, so it might not be made the fourth,
but when it comes out it is. And so that
means we're going to talk about a Star Wars character,
perhaps one that you might not be as familiar with.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
I am not.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
Yeah, so I'm very excited to talk about this character.
We're talking about doctor Chelley Lana Afra or doctor Afra
Afra alias Joystick Chevron. Thoughts to that name, yes, as
you should have many thoughts. Hopefully by the end of
this you'll have a sense of her character and you'll
know kind of.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Why that saying.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
So. Before the pandemic, friends of mine kept telling me
to read the Star Wars comics and I was like, no,
I don't have time.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
I'm afraid what will.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
Happen that I'll be consumed because I am a completionist.
Once I start something, I want to finish all of it.
But then the pandemic happened and I was quarantined, and yes,
I have pretty much read all of them now, all
caught up. And one of the things people kept telling
me over and over right before I read them was
you'll really like doctor Afra, and they were right. Currently,
(03:47):
there is discussion of casting her for one of the
million Star Wars things coming out, but she has not
appeared in any of the cartoons or the TV show
or movies.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
If you're like, I don't know who this is, that's yes,
I know, Jessic. Quick question, who do you envision as doctor?
I don't know. If you experienced this, Samantha.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
There are some characters when I read things that I
have a really strong image for how they look and
it's not like anyone that I know. And for doctor Afra,
I have a really clear image of what she looks
like in my head, and I can't think of a
specific actor who fits that I've seen. There's somebody that
(04:36):
they're like, it's gonna be this person, and I was like, yeah,
I can see it, but no strong like okay, yeah, yeah,
I'm generally kind of bad at that stuff, though.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
I would ask you, but you don't know who.
Speaker 3 (04:52):
I have no idea, Like everything I'm about to read
off is because you wrote it. Yes, I mean this
is im reploit one of those things that I'm like,
I have no idea what's happening. I'm giving you free
ring this entire beginning of May because I know what
it's about to go down in preparation with the fact
that we did the prequels and as they will soon
(05:13):
find out, we did the original trilogy for this month
for our movies, and then we'll also be following it
up with the sequels sequel trilogy. Yes, because I planned
it around May knowing that this would bring you joy
and comfort.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
And it did, but also a lot of unnecessary research
on my part as I want to do.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Yeah, and I'm having to be like slow, slow, roll
back up back away from the computer.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
So in shorthand, when I'm describing doctor Afra, I usually
describe her as a cynical anti heroin version of Indiana
Jones twitch. As I was researching this, that was what
they were going for, so you succeeded that.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
That is what I picked up. She is a queer
human woman.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
I read in a few places she was of Asian descent,
which I'm always kind of.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Like, it's no Asian Star Wars. I guess I get
what you're saying. I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
And she is an archaeologist alongside her real dark and
messed up assassin joys. They're kind of like a really
dark humor version of C three PO and R two
D two. They delight in torturing people, they joke about it,
they kill people. She travels on her beloved ship, the
Archangel and later the Archangel two once the first one
gets destroyed, looking for artifacts, pulling off heist and helping
(06:37):
out Darth Vader, and where Indiana Jones would say it
belongs to the museum, AfOR would say, how much money
do you think I can get for that? She frequently
encounters rare Jedi artifacts. Yep, she often sells. She's smart, capable,
good with weapons and technology, quick on her feet, well
versed in history.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
She's creative.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
She's also selfish, reckless, greedy, unpredictable and sometimes straight up yeah,
kills folks if you see something she wants.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
I like her. So.
Speaker 3 (07:03):
Afra was created for Marvel Star Wars Darth Vader comics
by writer Karen Gillan and artist Salvador Lorooca in twenty fifteen,
a series that went on to spawn the Star Wars
Doctor Afra comics, which I guess I'm gonna have to
get my hands on these.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Now I can help you. I'm sure you can.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
She was the first character introduced into the comics to
get her own solo series, so I'm surprised I haven't
heard of her before now. Emily Zuela voiced her in
the twenty twenty Doctor Afra, an audiobook original by Sarah Coon.
Also in twenty twenty, Alissa Wong and Marika Cresta continued
Afra's story with Doctor Afra.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Yeah, I haven't checked out the audiobook yet. I didn't
know that was a thing, but now I'm like, I'm
kinda seek that one out. When Afra was a child,
her father poured all of his attention into scholarly pursuits
and including setting the Jedi, desiring to bring back their
light into the galaxy, as well as this extinct spiritual
group that may or may not be related to, like
(07:58):
maybe a different sect of the Jedi. Because of his obsession,
his relationship with his wife and daughter suffered, and they
ended up leaving him while.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Afra was a child.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
And yes, Afra is their last name, so I'm sorry
if that's confusing, but that's just what I call her,
and I'm not entirely sure how to pronounce her.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
First name, so Afra.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
Their new home was attacked by raiders in Afra's mom
told her to run and hide. When Afa returned, her
mom was dead. Afra eventually made her way back to
her father, just as the Empire was rising to power.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
However, their reunion.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Was not a happy one, and she attempted to set
his life work on fire, yelling at him about his
wife died while he tried to save all of his research,
and a psychologist diagnosed Afra with quote mental issues.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I don't think he's very helpful. Yeah, just lazy. Come on.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
She went to school for galactic history and acient civilizations,
and she excelled in her studies. However, she disagreed with
a higher up at the university about what constituted an archaeologist.
He took Afra under his wing despite the fact that
she got into a bunch of Shenanigans and regularly mocked him,
like regularly publicly mocked him. Afra was so confident in
the significance of her final project she wasn't concerned with
(09:16):
angering him.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
As it turns out, her.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Project really did not deliver at all, and also her
mentor was experimenting in illegal and horrifying mind control parasites,
something he revealed to her before telling her. The only
reason he took her under his wing was that he
hated her and wanted to make sure she never became
a doctor. When Afra threatened to black Melani, he told
her no one would take her ward for it over his.
(09:41):
With the helpless of friends, Afra stole the parasites, rigged
them so that they looked like they were ancient, returned
them to the underwhelming tomb that she'd chosen for her
final project, planting them there as though she discovered them,
and she was applauded for her discovery, and the parasites
were destroyed in accordance with imperial protocol. Her mentor was
forced to give her the doctorate or else reveal what
(10:03):
he had been up to.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
Oh, sneaky, sneak, Okay.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
While there are several instances Afra being morally ambiguous obviously
and betraying people, there are plenty of examples of doing
her best to spare lives.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
She kind of reminds me of Gomora a little bit.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
Yeah, I could see that, you know. She does a
lot of bad things, but she's also good. Yeah, maybe
the sister, maybe more the sister.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
Maybe she's like a mixture of the two. Yes, that's
in my head now.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
In one instance, while she was exploring the abandoned rebel
base on dant Wing, right after Alderwan was blown up
by the Death Stars, she allowed herself to be captured
by the Empire to save the lives of some stormtroopers,
and she ended up being sentenced to execution. She managed
to escape and her opinion on the Empire changed after
what they did to Alderon, but that happened for a
(10:54):
lot of those citizens.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
Oh yes, yes, she after does go back and forth
as she is wont to do. But this is one
of the cool things about the comics in general, is
Afra's kind of like one step behind. Like the story
we know of Luke and lan Hahn, and there's sort
of intersecting and interacting, but you know they don't know it.
(11:17):
After the Battle of Yeavin, when Luke blows up the
first Death Star, Afra is recruited to work for Darth
Vader to help him do things under the radar of
the Emperor, who is actively trying to replace Vader with
a new right hand, like to his face is telling
Vader like, yeah, I don't like you. I'm looking for
somebody better. So Vader had discovered some of Afra's accomplishments
and he was impressed with her talent and sought her out,
(11:40):
and some of the things he tasked her with included
things like going to Padme's home planet of Naboo and
Padme being Darth Vader's dead wife and Luke and Lea's mom,
and torturing the mortician who examined Padme's body until he
admitted he'd lied about the death of the child she
had been pregnant with, because when the funeral possession happened,
it was made to appear as though she was still pregnant.
(12:02):
She had never given birth, so he said that Padme
had given birth to a son who was taken by
two Jedi masters, Obi Wan and Yoda afas Droid Electric
you did the man to death after that, Yep Yep
Afer placed a lot of value on pleasing Darth Vader,
both because she wanted to live, but she appreciated the
(12:22):
challenge of meeting his incredibly high expectations, which she often
did quite creatively. There were times when she could have
left him for dead, but came back for him. She
was constantly trying to prove she was trustworthy to him.
She was tasked by Vader to locate Luke, and she
took it on herself to attempt to kidnap him herself
to please Vader, something she almost succeeded in quarter a
(12:44):
handful of times. On one occasion, after Luke had been
kidnapped and forced to fight in a gladiatorial battle as
the last Jedi she bet money on his death, but
of course Luke survived. One of my favorite sequences, she
manages to Gosha Luke by painting her protocol droid to
look like C three PO. But then Han Solo attacked
(13:05):
her and Luke got away, only to be captured by stormtroopers.
And then Luke got away only to be attacked by
an angry Wookie and briefly captured by Afra again.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Busy day Wow.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
That ends with Leah punching Afra in the face and
capturing her, and then Darth Vader putting a bounty on
Afra's head. Why A lot of things happened that day
to upset Vader, but it basically she knew too much
and thought like she'd been captured, get rid of her.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Gotcha?
Speaker 3 (13:35):
She failed times, so yeah, just her failure got it.
So Leah released Afra alongside Sauna. They rescued Han and Luke,
who had been captured by a bounty hunter. A lot
of capturing around here. Afa escaped, was captured by the Empire,
met the Emperor himself, and then Vader shot her on
an air lock into space, even after he'd promised her
(13:56):
he'd kill her with a lightsaber, knowing she would have
a fear of suffocating in space. Yeah it's pretty cool, yes,
but also he does give the chance for her to escape. Yep.
He believes her to be dead, but she anticipated this,
had a plan and faked her death just like any good.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
Yeah. Morley ambiguis character who betrays a lot of people
and works with people who betray you. Yes, her doctorate
was suspended too, and she threatened her father to get
him to reinstate it, but he called her bluff like.
She was like, I'll kill you and he was like nah,
and he said he would only help her if she
would travel with him and help him continue his research.
Speaker 2 (14:37):
Through this, she gets her.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
Hands on a crystal and becomes convinced that Luke can
reactivate it using the forest, so she forces him into
accompanying her to visit this Queen the Screaming Citadel, who
grants her quest if presented with the worthy gift. After
presents Luke as the last Jedi. Things go awry, of course,
and Luke and Affer have to make a run for it.
(14:59):
Luke say AFA's life, but they are recaptured. Luke is
strapped to a table and his life force is drained
from him for the Queen to slowly enjoy, like through
this kind of hookah looking device, and though Luke pleads
with Afra for help, she leaves him behind, but she
feels so guilty about it decides she can't leave him behind,
(15:19):
comes back to save him, or kind of give him
a chance to save himself. She offers him the crystal,
and Luke did his whole Luke thing and was like,
I thought, you know, I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed.
I feel like you could be better. And it really
rattled her. It doesn't mean she didn't continue to doing
things like backstabbing, his stealing and kidnapping like Harris and
(15:42):
Doula from the cartoon shows.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
Yeah, it did kind of stick with her. Oh I
know she lost him.
Speaker 3 (15:51):
Yes, I'm watching that one I have in season two,
So a bunch of stuff obviously happens.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Vader realizes she's alive.
Speaker 3 (16:00):
Prie surprise, she gets turned into the Empire again by
an ex lover, where she's tortured and eventually escapes. She's
worked for the Rebellion at times, the Empire, others helping
them track the Alliance, working.
Speaker 2 (16:11):
With Vader again.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Huge mistake saving the Emperor from an assassination plot, huge mistake,
witnessed the interrogation of her father captured by the Alliance,
and set the location of the rebels on Hawk to Vader.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Yeah, she's busy. Yeah, she's in high demand, and there's
a lot of like.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
I'll let you live this once happening, Like Kara is like, okay,
I'll let you live this one. You know, he's kind
of on NT level right. Relationships wise, Afro does not
(16:54):
have a great track record. That's probably no surprise. Like
I said, she is queer. She has a recurring romance
to interest and enemy Magna Tolven, very adversarial relationship, lots
of passionate kissing and then immediate betrayal.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
And like torture and capture.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
Then they're kissing again and then I'm like you twos,
this isn't healthy. She's also had a relationship with Sanastarus,
who we mentioned earlier, who was a black woman who
later claimed to be married to Hans Solo and then
attacked Afra in a rage when they reunited after Afro
left her, and then I think they kissed too, So
a lot of like really angry kiss relationships going on,
(17:33):
but all in all, Afra is an interesting, complex, fun,
chaotic character who is well loved. I read a lot
of things where they're like, it seems impossible that somebody
could really stand out against Vader, and that this could
be a woman in this kind of toxic fandom and
toxic entertainment medium.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
But she did, and she is pretty well loved.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
I remember reading the comics for the first time and
being immediately hooked and also surprised that they did not
shy away from the queer one.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
I think I read one.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
Where it started immediately and they were like in bed together,
half dressed and kissing, and I was like.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Whoa, go ahead. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
And also there is a passage in there that I
have included in this outline that is it encompasses the
cinnamon role and uh yeah, yeah, yeah, so it's canon,
is what I'm trying to say.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
I put it in here just to prove that I
was not making it up. She did. She put all
of it in there, with cinnamon roll at the top.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
Just in case you have questions, Yes, and some of
you probably have many, I'm always available to answer them.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
Yes she is, and she will gladly do. So you
know who I think she'd play this character, and she
might be a little older, but she doesn't look it.
Bianca Lawson. She is in Buffy. She plays the second Slayer.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Oh yeah, I could see it.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
I can see you're playing this character. Yeah yeah, Well, because.
Speaker 3 (19:03):
You've got that like I will kill you Marto you
phase but also mischievous phase.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
Yeah yeah, since it's balance, I am campaigning for Bianca Lawson.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Please okay, well, listeners, if you have any casting ideas
about who should play this character, please.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
Let us know.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
You can email us a step media mom Stuff at
iHeartMedia dot com. You can find us on Instagram at
stuff I Never Told You or on Twitter at mom
Stuff Podcast. Thanks as always to our super producer Christina.
Thanks Christina, and thanks to you for listening Stuff I
Never Told You the production of iHeartRadio. For more podcast
or iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you listen to your favorite shows.
Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to Stephan
Never Told You Production of iHeartRadio and welcome to you,
another classic from the Star Wars universe. For this one,
I want to bring back a Fictional Women around the World.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
We did.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
It was one of my earlier ones on Doctor Afra,
who I remember speculating about it. We speculated about it
in that episode. They have not cast, has not appeared
in live action yet. Yes, yes, but she is a
fan favorite character, and I saw some tweets about the
newest comic that she's in She's Got her Own series,
(00:51):
that it was one of the most queer comics that's
ever been produced, and so I really want to check
it out. Yes, yes, yes, yes, Well if anyone's read it,
oh my gosh, please let us know. But in the meantime,
please enjoy this classic episode. Hey, this is Annie and
(01:16):
Smantha and welcome to stuff I've Never Told You Production
of iHeartRadio and welcome to a very special edition of
Fictional Women Around the World. Our sub segment, segment, segment,
subsegment good enough.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Yes, and this is a special one because.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
As you're listening to it, it is May the fourth
our Star Wars Day, Happy Star Wars Day.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
May the fourth be with you? Annie's favorite. Oh yeah,
I get a lot of messages that day, which I
really enjoy.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
Yes, And I've never really seen it as a thing
until I started with iHeart Slash. At that point, still
house the forks and I came in and there was
cake and punch and decorations that I was like, what
is happening?
Speaker 2 (02:09):
What is today? And everybody's like, May the fourth be
with you.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
It was like nerds, but you still took home the
inflatable lightsaber and the cups.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
I saw them recently.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
It's true I did not knowing what I was getting
myself into because this was.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Pre inundated Star Wars times for me. Yeah. Yeah, that's true.
Office party also, what a long time ago? Oh that
was a thing, remember shared food and everything?
Speaker 1 (02:36):
I know.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Yeah, So I guess I'm not sure when you're listening
to this, so it might not be made the fourth,
but when it comes out it is. And so that
means we're going to talk about a Star Wars character,
perhaps one that you might not be as familiar with.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
I am not.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
Yeah, so I'm very excited to talk about this character.
We're talking about doctor Chelley Lana Afra or doctor Afra
Afra alias Joystick Chevron. Thoughts to that name, yes, as
you should have many thoughts. Hopefully by the end of
this you'll have a sense of her character and you'll
know kind of.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Why that saying.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
So. Before the pandemic, friends of mine kept telling me
to read the Star Wars comics and I was like, no,
I don't have time.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
I'm afraid what will.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
Happen that I'll be consumed because I am a completionist.
Once I start something, I want to finish all of it.
But then the pandemic happened and I was quarantined, and yes,
I have pretty much read all of them now, all
caught up. And one of the things people kept telling
me over and over right before I read them was
you'll really like doctor Afra, and they were right. Currently,
(03:47):
there is discussion of casting her for one of the
million Star Wars things coming out, but she has not
appeared in any of the cartoons or the TV show
or movies.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
If you're like, I don't know who this is, that's yes,
I know, Jessic. Quick question, who do you envision as doctor?
I don't know. If you experienced this, Samantha.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
There are some characters when I read things that I
have a really strong image for how they look and
it's not like anyone that I know. And for doctor Afra,
I have a really clear image of what she looks
like in my head, and I can't think of a
specific actor who fits that I've seen. There's somebody that
(04:36):
they're like, it's gonna be this person, and I was like, yeah,
I can see it, but no strong like okay, yeah, yeah,
I'm generally kind of bad at that stuff, though.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
I would ask you, but you don't know who.
Speaker 3 (04:52):
I have no idea, Like everything I'm about to read
off is because you wrote it. Yes, I mean this
is im reploit one of those things that I'm like,
I have no idea what's happening. I'm giving you free
ring this entire beginning of May because I know what
it's about to go down in preparation with the fact
that we did the prequels and as they will soon
(05:13):
find out, we did the original trilogy for this month
for our movies, and then we'll also be following it
up with the sequels sequel trilogy. Yes, because I planned
it around May knowing that this would bring you joy
and comfort.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
And it did, but also a lot of unnecessary research
on my part as I want to do.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Yeah, and I'm having to be like slow, slow, roll
back up back away from the computer.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
So in shorthand, when I'm describing doctor Afra, I usually
describe her as a cynical anti heroin version of Indiana
Jones twitch. As I was researching this, that was what
they were going for, so you succeeded that.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
That is what I picked up. She is a queer
human woman.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
I read in a few places she was of Asian descent,
which I'm always kind of.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Like, it's no Asian Star Wars. I guess I get
what you're saying. I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
And she is an archaeologist alongside her real dark and
messed up assassin joys. They're kind of like a really
dark humor version of C three PO and R two
D two. They delight in torturing people, they joke about it,
they kill people. She travels on her beloved ship, the
Archangel and later the Archangel two once the first one
gets destroyed, looking for artifacts, pulling off heist and helping
(06:37):
out Darth Vader, and where Indiana Jones would say it
belongs to the museum, AfOR would say, how much money
do you think I can get for that? She frequently
encounters rare Jedi artifacts. Yep, she often sells. She's smart, capable,
good with weapons and technology, quick on her feet, well
versed in history.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
She's creative.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
She's also selfish, reckless, greedy, unpredictable and sometimes straight up yeah,
kills folks if you see something she wants.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
I like her. So.
Speaker 3 (07:03):
Afra was created for Marvel Star Wars Darth Vader comics
by writer Karen Gillan and artist Salvador Lorooca in twenty fifteen,
a series that went on to spawn the Star Wars
Doctor Afra comics, which I guess I'm gonna have to
get my hands on these.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Now I can help you. I'm sure you can.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
She was the first character introduced into the comics to
get her own solo series, so I'm surprised I haven't
heard of her before now. Emily Zuela voiced her in
the twenty twenty Doctor Afra, an audiobook original by Sarah Coon.
Also in twenty twenty, Alissa Wong and Marika Cresta continued
Afra's story with Doctor Afra.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Yeah, I haven't checked out the audiobook yet. I didn't
know that was a thing, but now I'm like, I'm
kinda seek that one out. When Afra was a child,
her father poured all of his attention into scholarly pursuits
and including setting the Jedi, desiring to bring back their
light into the galaxy, as well as this extinct spiritual
group that may or may not be related to, like
(07:58):
maybe a different sect of the Jedi. Because of his obsession,
his relationship with his wife and daughter suffered, and they
ended up leaving him while.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Afra was a child.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
And yes, Afra is their last name, so I'm sorry
if that's confusing, but that's just what I call her,
and I'm not entirely sure how to pronounce her.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
First name, so Afra.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
Their new home was attacked by raiders in Afra's mom
told her to run and hide. When Afa returned, her
mom was dead. Afra eventually made her way back to
her father, just as the Empire was rising to power.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
However, their reunion.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Was not a happy one, and she attempted to set
his life work on fire, yelling at him about his
wife died while he tried to save all of his research,
and a psychologist diagnosed Afra with quote mental issues.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I don't think he's very helpful. Yeah, just lazy. Come on.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
She went to school for galactic history and acient civilizations,
and she excelled in her studies. However, she disagreed with
a higher up at the university about what constituted an archaeologist.
He took Afra under his wing despite the fact that
she got into a bunch of Shenanigans and regularly mocked him,
like regularly publicly mocked him. Afra was so confident in
the significance of her final project she wasn't concerned with
(09:16):
angering him.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
As it turns out, her.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Project really did not deliver at all, and also her
mentor was experimenting in illegal and horrifying mind control parasites,
something he revealed to her before telling her. The only
reason he took her under his wing was that he
hated her and wanted to make sure she never became
a doctor. When Afra threatened to black Melani, he told
her no one would take her ward for it over his.
(09:41):
With the helpless of friends, Afra stole the parasites, rigged
them so that they looked like they were ancient, returned
them to the underwhelming tomb that she'd chosen for her
final project, planting them there as though she discovered them,
and she was applauded for her discovery, and the parasites
were destroyed in accordance with imperial protocol. Her mentor was
forced to give her the doctorate or else reveal what
(10:03):
he had been up to.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
Oh, sneaky, sneak, Okay.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
While there are several instances Afra being morally ambiguous obviously
and betraying people, there are plenty of examples of doing
her best to spare lives.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
She kind of reminds me of Gomora a little bit.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
Yeah, I could see that, you know. She does a
lot of bad things, but she's also good. Yeah, maybe
the sister, maybe more the sister.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
Maybe she's like a mixture of the two. Yes, that's
in my head now.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
In one instance, while she was exploring the abandoned rebel
base on dant Wing, right after Alderwan was blown up
by the Death Stars, she allowed herself to be captured
by the Empire to save the lives of some stormtroopers,
and she ended up being sentenced to execution. She managed
to escape and her opinion on the Empire changed after
what they did to Alderon, but that happened for a
(10:54):
lot of those citizens.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
Oh yes, yes, she after does go back and forth
as she is wont to do. But this is one
of the cool things about the comics in general, is
Afra's kind of like one step behind. Like the story
we know of Luke and lan Hahn, and there's sort
of intersecting and interacting, but you know they don't know it.
(11:17):
After the Battle of Yeavin, when Luke blows up the
first Death Star, Afra is recruited to work for Darth
Vader to help him do things under the radar of
the Emperor, who is actively trying to replace Vader with
a new right hand, like to his face is telling
Vader like, yeah, I don't like you. I'm looking for
somebody better. So Vader had discovered some of Afra's accomplishments
and he was impressed with her talent and sought her out,
(11:40):
and some of the things he tasked her with included
things like going to Padme's home planet of Naboo and
Padme being Darth Vader's dead wife and Luke and Lea's mom,
and torturing the mortician who examined Padme's body until he
admitted he'd lied about the death of the child she
had been pregnant with, because when the funeral possession happened,
it was made to appear as though she was still pregnant.
(12:02):
She had never given birth, so he said that Padme
had given birth to a son who was taken by
two Jedi masters, Obi Wan and Yoda afas Droid Electric
you did the man to death after that, Yep Yep
Afer placed a lot of value on pleasing Darth Vader,
both because she wanted to live, but she appreciated the
(12:22):
challenge of meeting his incredibly high expectations, which she often
did quite creatively. There were times when she could have
left him for dead, but came back for him. She
was constantly trying to prove she was trustworthy to him.
She was tasked by Vader to locate Luke, and she
took it on herself to attempt to kidnap him herself
to please Vader, something she almost succeeded in quarter a
(12:44):
handful of times. On one occasion, after Luke had been
kidnapped and forced to fight in a gladiatorial battle as
the last Jedi she bet money on his death, but
of course Luke survived. One of my favorite sequences, she
manages to Gosha Luke by painting her protocol droid to
look like C three PO. But then Han Solo attacked
(13:05):
her and Luke got away, only to be captured by stormtroopers.
And then Luke got away only to be attacked by
an angry Wookie and briefly captured by Afra again.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Busy day Wow.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
That ends with Leah punching Afra in the face and
capturing her, and then Darth Vader putting a bounty on
Afra's head. Why A lot of things happened that day
to upset Vader, but it basically she knew too much
and thought like she'd been captured, get rid of her.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Gotcha?
Speaker 3 (13:35):
She failed times, so yeah, just her failure got it.
So Leah released Afra alongside Sauna. They rescued Han and Luke,
who had been captured by a bounty hunter. A lot
of capturing around here. Afa escaped, was captured by the Empire,
met the Emperor himself, and then Vader shot her on
an air lock into space, even after he'd promised her
(13:56):
he'd kill her with a lightsaber, knowing she would have
a fear of suffocating in space. Yeah it's pretty cool, yes,
but also he does give the chance for her to escape. Yep.
He believes her to be dead, but she anticipated this,
had a plan and faked her death just like any good.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
Yeah. Morley ambiguis character who betrays a lot of people
and works with people who betray you. Yes, her doctorate
was suspended too, and she threatened her father to get
him to reinstate it, but he called her bluff like.
She was like, I'll kill you and he was like nah,
and he said he would only help her if she
would travel with him and help him continue his research.
Speaker 2 (14:37):
Through this, she gets her.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
Hands on a crystal and becomes convinced that Luke can
reactivate it using the forest, so she forces him into
accompanying her to visit this Queen the Screaming Citadel, who
grants her quest if presented with the worthy gift. After
presents Luke as the last Jedi. Things go awry, of course,
and Luke and Affer have to make a run for it.
(14:59):
Luke say AFA's life, but they are recaptured. Luke is
strapped to a table and his life force is drained
from him for the Queen to slowly enjoy, like through
this kind of hookah looking device, and though Luke pleads
with Afra for help, she leaves him behind, but she
feels so guilty about it decides she can't leave him behind,
(15:19):
comes back to save him, or kind of give him
a chance to save himself. She offers him the crystal,
and Luke did his whole Luke thing and was like,
I thought, you know, I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed.
I feel like you could be better. And it really
rattled her. It doesn't mean she didn't continue to doing
things like backstabbing, his stealing and kidnapping like Harris and
(15:42):
Doula from the cartoon shows.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
Yeah, it did kind of stick with her. Oh I
know she lost him.
Speaker 3 (15:51):
Yes, I'm watching that one I have in season two,
So a bunch of stuff obviously happens.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Vader realizes she's alive.
Speaker 3 (16:00):
Prie surprise, she gets turned into the Empire again by
an ex lover, where she's tortured and eventually escapes. She's
worked for the Rebellion at times, the Empire, others helping
them track the Alliance, working.
Speaker 2 (16:11):
With Vader again.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Huge mistake saving the Emperor from an assassination plot, huge mistake,
witnessed the interrogation of her father captured by the Alliance,
and set the location of the rebels on Hawk to Vader.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Yeah, she's busy. Yeah, she's in high demand, and there's
a lot of like.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
I'll let you live this once happening, Like Kara is like, okay,
I'll let you live this one. You know, he's kind
of on NT level right. Relationships wise, Afro does not
(16:54):
have a great track record. That's probably no surprise. Like
I said, she is queer. She has a recurring romance
to interest and enemy Magna Tolven, very adversarial relationship, lots
of passionate kissing and then immediate betrayal.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
And like torture and capture.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
Then they're kissing again and then I'm like you twos,
this isn't healthy. She's also had a relationship with Sanastarus,
who we mentioned earlier, who was a black woman who
later claimed to be married to Hans Solo and then
attacked Afra in a rage when they reunited after Afro
left her, and then I think they kissed too, So
a lot of like really angry kiss relationships going on,
(17:33):
but all in all, Afra is an interesting, complex, fun,
chaotic character who is well loved. I read a lot
of things where they're like, it seems impossible that somebody
could really stand out against Vader, and that this could
be a woman in this kind of toxic fandom and
toxic entertainment medium.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
But she did, and she is pretty well loved.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
I remember reading the comics for the first time and
being immediately hooked and also surprised that they did not
shy away from the queer one.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
I think I read one.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
Where it started immediately and they were like in bed together,
half dressed and kissing, and I was like.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Whoa, go ahead. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
And also there is a passage in there that I
have included in this outline that is it encompasses the
cinnamon role and uh yeah, yeah, yeah, so it's canon,
is what I'm trying to say.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
I put it in here just to prove that I
was not making it up. She did. She put all
of it in there, with cinnamon roll at the top.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
Just in case you have questions, Yes, and some of
you probably have many, I'm always available to answer them.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
Yes she is, and she will gladly do. So you
know who I think she'd play this character, and she
might be a little older, but she doesn't look it.
Bianca Lawson. She is in Buffy. She plays the second Slayer.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Oh yeah, I could see it.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
I can see you're playing this character. Yeah yeah, Well, because.
Speaker 3 (19:03):
You've got that like I will kill you Marto you
phase but also mischievous phase.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
Yeah yeah, since it's balance, I am campaigning for Bianca Lawson.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Please okay, well, listeners, if you have any casting ideas
about who should play this character, please.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
Let us know.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
You can email us a step media mom Stuff at
iHeartMedia dot com. You can find us on Instagram at
stuff I Never Told You or on Twitter at mom
Stuff Podcast. Thanks as always to our super producer Christina.
Thanks Christina, and thanks to you for listening Stuff I
Never Told You the production of iHeartRadio. For more podcast
or iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you listen to your favorite shows.
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