Interview: OBSCURUM, with Gabe Lenners

Beginning in 2019, locals in rural areas of Nebraska and Colorado were astonished to witness multiple mysterious lights and objects in the sky. Everyone agreed something was up there, but no one seemed to know what this stuff could be. In this interview segment, Ben, Matt and Noel welcome Gabe Lenners, the creator of OBSCURUM, to learn more about his continuing investigation into a "circus in the sky."

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A
production of iHeartRadio.

Speaker 2 (00:25):
Welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my
name is known.

Speaker 3 (00:28):
They call me Bed.

Speaker 4 (00:29):
We're joined as always with our super producer Andrew the
try Force Howard. Most importantly, you are you. You are here.
That makes this the stuff they don't want you to know.
We couldn't be more excited for this and a little
bit disturbed, to be honest with you, folks, if you
are a longtime conspiracy realist, you've doubtlessly noticed the same thing.

(00:51):
We all have a strident uptick in reports of mysterious
things happening in the sky, unidentified light, mysterious objects, drones
that appear to come from somewhere unknown and return to
an unknown place.

Speaker 3 (01:08):
And you know, I was thinking about it.

Speaker 4 (01:10):
For a lot of us, it's kind of like a headline, right,
or a sound bite you read and maybe forget.

Speaker 2 (01:18):
But well, and for others it becomes a full on obsession.

Speaker 3 (01:22):
Right right, yes, exactly.

Speaker 4 (01:24):
You know, for many of us in the audience tonight,
there's a story, an incident you witness that you can't explain.
You check with friends and neighbors. As the years go on,
you may make theories of your own, but every so
often an intrepid observer goes a step further, taking on
a quest to figure out what on or off Earth

(01:46):
is actually happening up there in the sky. And you, guys,
in today's interview, we are joined with an investigator who
did just that, the one and only Gabe Leonards, the
creator and host of Obscurum Invasion of the Drones. Gabe,
thank you so much for joining us.

Speaker 5 (02:04):
Guys, it's so great to be here. This has been
a long time coming and I can't wait to dive
in with you.

Speaker 6 (02:10):
Can I just say, Gabe that when I was listening
to the first episode of Invasion of the Drones as
a synthesizer nerd, I thought it was really appropriate. The
first time you hear is a synth drone and I
was like, that was very appropriate. So well done on
the music portion as well.

Speaker 5 (02:24):
Hey, we did it for you one.

Speaker 2 (02:26):
Hi.

Speaker 3 (02:26):
Thanks you.

Speaker 2 (02:27):
I appreciate it your ol msnic drone.

Speaker 6 (02:29):
I felt seen or heard.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
All right, guys, let's set this scene because on this show,
we have discussed multiple drone sightings in multiple parts of
the world and at multiple times, but in obscurum we
start pretty clearly in late twenty nineteen, right around Christmas time,
in a place called Phillips County, Colorado. Gabe, take us
to that place. What you're doing at that time? Why

(03:02):
this even pings on your radar?

Speaker 5 (03:05):
Yeah? So, I originally grew up in this small town
in Nebraska, which consequently is about thirty miles away from
where these sightings first began. I live in Los Angeles,
but I was going home for the holidays, and I
was sitting there with my family and we were getting
ready for dinner when we get this knock at the door,
and it is this police officer who we were talking earlier.

(03:27):
I used to chase storms and go out with him
and actually spot severe weather in the area. But this
time he came and he said, Gabe, you know what,
there's some weird things happening over people's farms, not only
in our county in Nebraska, but out there in Phillips County.
There are all of these flashing lights just hovering all
over the prairie, and no one knows who they are

(03:48):
or who they belong to, and I think maybe this
is something you should look into, and from that moment
an obscure them invasion of the drums that you guys heard,
I just started asking questions to try to get to
the bottom of what was going on. But more importantly,
you know, we've all seen flashing lights in the sky
and it's very hard to justify what something is when

(04:09):
you look up into the sky and see it. And
I thought, why would these things actually be flying? And
that's what I wanted to look into, the different theories
as to the why more than the what, especially at
the beginning game.

Speaker 6 (04:20):
I love how you just kind of casually dropped they
used to be a storm chaser back in the day.

Speaker 2 (04:25):
Yeah, you know.

Speaker 3 (04:27):
Situation.

Speaker 4 (04:28):
Yeah, this is this is one of the first off
I've got to say. I love how you chat with
your mom in the show because there's this, there's this.
This is a a genuine, thorough investigation into unexplained phenomena.
It's also, I would say, an exploration of how people

(04:52):
react to the unexplained, and that's the crucial piece of this.

Speaker 3 (04:57):
This is a.

Speaker 4 (04:58):
Hometown area for you, and I am so excited from
the jump where this guy you know, shows up at
your house and I think it's kind of late at night.
It says, Okay, I I thought you might dig into this.
Did you immediately go chasing the lights or how did
you process this story?

Speaker 5 (05:19):
I thought he was crazy at first. I thought I've
grown up in this area, you know, I've seen pretty
much everything there is to see. I feel like in
this part of the world growing up, because I would
be out there on those back roads, chasing storms, you know,
and running track out out there in high school and
different things. And I thought, what could possibly be in
the sky, because you got a picture this area. It's

(05:40):
a remote area northeast Colorado, southwest Nebraska town of about
two thousand people, and you look up into the sky
and it's about ten or eleven at night, and you
see all of these, you know. I mean, I saw
myself SUV sized drones and then smaller ones surrounding them.
It's just something that's straight out of a sci fi movie, honestly,

(06:02):
and not something I would ever expect. And yeah, I
thought someone has to be flying something or this is
just a crazy coincidence. I really didn't know what to
expect until I drove out there and looked up and
saw these for myself.

Speaker 2 (06:16):
So you, Gabe, you actually saw like the smaller drones
and mother drone kind of situation in the sky.

Speaker 6 (06:22):
And there's a great scene where you're kind of experiencing
it in real time and you describe it beautifully. But yeah,
I think that's about right.

Speaker 5 (06:29):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean I'm about the biggest realist
you're going to get. I'm a journalist and a producer,
and you know, I always go where the evidence is
to ask the questions to get answers, and yeah, I
went out there and looked up into the sky and saw,
you know, what appeared to be some type of mothership
drone if you will, about two to three hundred yards
off the ground. And then you have all of these

(06:50):
kind of smaller red and white flashing lights surrounding this
large kind of or black light which is literally just
hovering about the prairie for hours.

Speaker 4 (07:00):
It seemed on end and unlike unlike a lot of
people who may have and no judgment here, but there
are a lot of people who might see something strange
in the sky and just file it away as you know,
a campfire story or something to talk about on Thanksgiving,
but you also learned this is not some sort of

(07:23):
one off siding with say a single witness. There are
multiple witnesses, not just around town in Imperial but also
in nearby Phillips County, Colorado. And you start talking to
locals right start checking in with other people. Could you
describe those initial conversations and what the townsfolk were saying

(07:45):
when you ask them.

Speaker 5 (07:46):
Absolutely, this was something where, you know, this whole event
was referred to as the Colorado Nebraska Drawn Mystery, and
people were seeing all of these drones over such a
large area at the same time, they weren't just seeing
a couple in their backyard. I mean when I went
out there that first night, just to give you some perspective,
I mean, the very first time I looked up and

(08:08):
saw this, I saw like fifteen to twenty of these things.
There were at least a couple mother ships or if
that's what you want to call them, sitting there, and
then you have, you know, I would say fifteen at
least of these other flashing lights surrounding it. I mean,
this isn't something you could just shake off because it
was there, and you have not a lot of self
service it's dark, it's in the middle of the night,

(08:28):
you're in the pasture, and this just isn't something you
normally see. And yeah, when I talked to locals, that's
one of the first things I did in the you know,
the first couple episodes of the podcast, because you know,
I'd grown up with these people and I knew they
wouldn't be just making stuff up for their health for
lack of a better word, and telling me stories you
know that weren't true because I've known these people forever,

(08:51):
and not just those people, but people in the surrounding counties.
And one of the things that really stood out to
me early was how similar these accounts were in a
large area. We're talking, you know, hundreds of miles in
north central Nebraska all the way down to northwestern Kansas
and eastern Colorado, and you know, these people aren't talking
to each other every day, but yet they're experiencing something

(09:14):
very very strange in the night sky. Man.

Speaker 6 (09:19):
You know, I'm mentioning the storm chasing stuff. You did
actually go to college for a meteorology correct, Yeah.

Speaker 5 (09:25):
So I originally went to the University of Oklahoma to
study weather. I actually ended up getting a broadcast journalism degree,
but I've always had this very strong fascination with weather
and studying the science behind it. And that was one
of the things too. If you think about these drones
in the winter time, and you know in that area

(09:45):
you have strong winds, just to geek out for a second, and.

Speaker 3 (09:49):
The upper levels of the app exactly.

Speaker 5 (09:51):
Right, you have really strong winds with low pressure systems
that kind of moved through with heavy snow blizzards, and
these drones would be out there and sub zero temperatures,
flying around for hours on end. And that was one
of the things. One of the police officers, I think
it was an episode four that I was talking to,

(10:11):
saw the winds were very strong that night and the
temperatures very cold, and these drones were up for you know,
six to eight hours plus at a time and wouldn't
have to come down even because of the cold weather.

Speaker 4 (10:23):
And you also, you're speaking to just a dovetail on
that point. You also speak to professional business owners who
work with drones and you ask them at a couple
of points, you know, would you guys fly a drone
out in these conditions? And if so, why, And I

(10:45):
love the link. There's this honest tone. You know, you're
talking to the experts, and I believe upon relistening multiple
times people say, at least for their business, it would
be a bad idea to fly a drone, you know,
with snow cover and what these treacherous winds and so on.

Speaker 6 (11:02):
And also it seems like another example of when there
are sightings like this, it just seems to be presenting
technology that isn't available, you know, widely, And I wonder
if the drone experts spoke to that, like even the
logistics of them being able to be out in these
conditions for so long.

Speaker 5 (11:21):
Yeah, one of the ones that I talked to had
to do with agriculture and when you have drones, it's
becoming more and more common to spray different fields instead
of having a spray plane do it with drones. You know,
a technology is evolving so fast. But one of the
interesting things I learned was that you know, if someone
was to do this, they would only stay up for

(11:43):
a very short period of time, and they can put
these long arms on these drones to extend while they're
flying over the fields. And this wouldn't be something that
would a be on a large scale too likely be
taking it happening at night in three definitely not during
the winter. Yes, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 (12:03):
Well, okay, let alone just the how these drones take flight. Right,
The drones we're aware of that we see most often
that you can go out and buy right now as
a consumer are copter type. Right. They use multiple blades,
often for or more to go up, and then they
can use those blades as they turn and tilt to

(12:27):
move left and right basically as they're flying. The other
type we know about are the more military style ones
that you know, we saw during the Second Iraq War
that are almost like a plane or a prop plane
that have instead of a helicopter style, a rotor blade.
It's turned, you know, horizontally and allows flight by going

(12:48):
forward using wings these things. Did you notice anything like
that when you physically saw the drones in the sky,
like any type of how they were actually flying.

Speaker 5 (13:01):
So the show is called Invasion of the Drones because
that's what everyone has referred to as what these aircraft are.
But I mean I can say seeing them, I could
never see anything that would allude to the fact that
it wasn't, you know, was actually a drone. Specifically, I
never saw things flying because they were at night, and

(13:21):
a lot of the people I interviewed would say, oh, yeah,
the drones, the drones, the drones and what people started
calling them. But you could never in my opinion, outside
of their movement. You know, we've seen videos of you know,
UAPs that have been captured over the ocean by Air
Force pilots and everything else. They didn't move in that
type of manner, but you couldn't tell they were specifically
drones outside of the way they kind of moved. The

(13:44):
only thing that I could really justify, and a lot
of the people I talked to, was that these were
lights in the sky moving in weird type of patterns
that weren't consistent with airplanes, helicopters, anything of the sort.

Speaker 4 (13:57):
I love that too, because there is this is not
a spoiler to the narrative here, but there is a
moment that really stood out to me where you're you're
speaking with someone who has an interest in figuring out
what's going on, and they straight up tell you, they
say something like, Gabe, we're calling them drones so that

(14:23):
we don't sound crazy, right, So maybe drone is a
word they put on a thing.

Speaker 6 (14:28):
Well, you have an interview with somebody I believe in
the first episode, or maybe it was a SoundBite in
one of your trailers talking about the origin of the
use of the term drone. I think I was actually
in the last episode, the most recent one. How it
even that as a concept was for the purpose of
kind of like calling these things, this technology, something that
didn't sound too scary or too terrifying. I don't know,

(14:52):
I think drone is kind of ominous personally, but I
wonder if you speak to that as well, what you
learned about kind of the history of the idea of drones.

Speaker 5 (15:00):
Yeah, I mean as far as my my learning about
like drones and stuff for this podcast. The term kind
of drone started to be used a lot during the
First Gulf War, which we kind of get into, and
I think it's the first or second episode just a bit,
but that kind of became synonymous, and you know, like
you said, it is drone the new and more casual

(15:23):
term for UFO. I don't know, I would be willing
to say maybe based on all these drone sightings that
people see, because it does make you not sound crazy.

Speaker 3 (15:32):
For lack of a lack of a better words, if
you're like.

Speaker 5 (15:35):
That, drone out there. You know, I saw I saw
some drones. Really what what did you see? Was at
a plane? Was it a helicopter?

Speaker 3 (15:41):
Was it lights?

Speaker 4 (15:43):
Yeah? Right right, that's not to stick on that moment too.
About the past, you do something that I think we
all found incredibly impressive, which is you say, well, let's
step back, right, let's scoop out through time, because nothing,
you know, occurs in a vacuum, so you start looking

(16:05):
into any possible precedents or earlier reports in the area.
Could you tell us a little bit about what you
found or the people you spoke to regarding that.

Speaker 5 (16:18):
Yeah, that was one of the most interesting things that
I again had no clue what I would find out
when I started talking to people. But if you go
back in history in southwest Nebraska, it is one of
the areas with one of the first recorded UFO sidings
in modern history. And there's even a lot of press
from the eighteen hundreds. Now how factual it actually is

(16:42):
remains to be seen, but the story goes there, you know,
were there there were some cowboys that were out on
a ranch and they're sitting there watching over the cattle,
and this blazing ball falls to the earth and they
all turn and go see what it is, and you know,
they see this cylinder shape craft. And a couple of
days later, if I remember the story correctly, it rained

(17:05):
and it started to kind of like dissipate and go away.
But all of these news outlets in the area reported
on this. Now, some people say it's a hoax, some
people don't, but there's enough recordings in different areas that
something did happen there. Now, the specifics of it were
not quite sure. It's out was a long time ago.
But then also in the podcast, there are a couple

(17:26):
people who I know personally who had seen, you know,
strange things in the sky and the same location where
these drones were being seen. And in one of the
cases actually he described his grandparents being out there on
the prairie and seeing these spherical balls of light, which
a lot of people referred to as the drones hovering

(17:46):
over their farm. And that was, you know, decades earlier,
and so weird things have definitely been seen in the area,
and this was not the first time.

Speaker 3 (17:57):
Jeez.

Speaker 2 (18:00):
Around this time, when you're looking, when you're talking to
people and you're finding these earlier reports, you're also talking
to people who are reporting some pretty strange things in
real time, Like in twenty nineteen, you know, twenty twenty one,
there's one report and I guess a photo this related
to it of some kind of green substance associated with

(18:23):
some of these sightings. Did you did anything ever come
of that?

Speaker 5 (18:27):
Nothing came of that, but it was one of the
really interesting things that transpired in the first couple of
days of this drone mystery, because how the story goes
is there were these weird green blobs that were showing
up out on county roads and.

Speaker 6 (18:43):
It was the ooze.

Speaker 5 (18:44):
It was the ooze. It was it was the ooze,
and people, you know, were convinced that these drones were
dropping these things and they were related. And I mean,
I'll just go ahead and tell you about it. It's
a track log. It's a soil pam track log. And
these are what a lot of people use in agriculture
and hang on their pivots, and it, I guess provides

(19:06):
some type of nutrients. I mean, it looks like it
came from another world. If you see one of these things,
it's green and mesh wrapped and it has this green
you know, ooze that's like frozen and I mean, it
looks weird. It's it's very weird looking.

Speaker 3 (19:19):
But yeah, yeah, yeah, so much. I've got to say,
it does look weird.

Speaker 5 (19:23):
It looks weird if you google it. Yeah, but but yeah,
the the Sheriff's department was you know, perplexed by this
so much so that they tested it for meth amphetamines
and weren't quite sure what it was and thought it
it's got to be to be related to the drones.
So but it ended up being that, you know, in

(19:45):
that specific case, we were able to you know, figure
out that it wasn't.

Speaker 4 (19:49):
So we're going to pause here to let the sponsors
drone on for a second.

Speaker 3 (19:54):
Kidding, We'll be right back.

Speaker 6 (20:03):
And we've returned. Let's jump right back into our conversation
with Gabe.

Speaker 4 (20:09):
Now the story is escalating now there there are going
to be reports that the drones are not just you know,
flitting around having a light show, but may also be
dropping physical objects. And one thing you do consistently is
speak to law enforcement and authorities at multiple you know, local, regional,

(20:32):
even federal level, and at every turn you encounter something
that is so common in stories of this nature or
in experiences like this, wherein people will say, Okay, I
saw a thing, but I want to be really careful
about how I describe it and how I you know,

(20:54):
how I will be perceived in society based on, you know,
the way I articulate my experience. And then you come
to a point where you start logically asking, you know, well,
where could where could an aircraft come from? And it
brings us to one of our favorite returning characters on

(21:16):
this show, the Denver International Airport.

Speaker 6 (21:19):
Yeah, best mural game in the airport world, no question
about it. Nothing weird in any of those murals.

Speaker 5 (21:27):
Now, I mean that there's so much. You hear so
much about that place. I you know, when I hear
the airport, I just think of ongoing construction because every
time I'm in there, they're always like fixing something, and
there's always a line and it always you always have
to walk like so far to get to your your
check in point because they're always fixing something. Something is
always being built at that airport.

Speaker 2 (21:48):
Like we hear a lot about that airport, Atlanta Airport
and what was there's like one or two other ones
that are always under construction. I think the Guardians.

Speaker 6 (21:55):
The Guardian is finally done, though, La Guardian is really nice.
Now finally is it's nice?

Speaker 5 (22:00):
It is man.

Speaker 6 (22:01):
Whenever I hear Denver Airport, I picture that one mural
where there's this big, creepy, hulking dude in like a
green rubber suit with a gas mask, swinging a saber
that acts as sort of the like dividing line in
this mural composition. And then there are all these like
starving African children kind of like they're being sliced that

(22:21):
by this it's very weird. It's like something out of
Pink Floyd's the Wall.

Speaker 3 (22:25):
Yeah, because it's on a wall.

Speaker 5 (22:28):
It's the wall.

Speaker 3 (22:29):
I did hear they may have taken that mural down.

Speaker 6 (22:33):
It's a good one.

Speaker 3 (22:34):
Maybe maybe you sent the right email, NOL, but.

Speaker 6 (22:39):
About the right comment card.

Speaker 4 (22:41):
The reason we're bringing this up here, Gabe, is because
with that logical step, you're also in your investigation, you're
kind of opening a door, right, and you're not telling
You're never telling people what you think is happening, like
what they should believe, but you are asking people and

(23:01):
with that we have to we have to get the takes.
Because you've talked to people from so many demographics, what
are some of the theories that you heard.

Speaker 5 (23:14):
I mean I heard a lot of theories. I mean,
you know, there's and that's one of the most interesting
things as you hit on earlier, and it's a case
study into how people do react to the unknown and
how they perceive what's going on in the world around
them and more importantly, what you know, what they want
to believe about that in the future. As far as like,

(23:36):
you know, some of the some of the craziest theories obviously,
like a lot of people are saying, oh, this is
the government, this is this is the government doing this,
you know, and I can say, you know, I think
the government has a job to serve and protect, and
you know, there's things we shouldn't know or be aware of.
One of the most interesting things early on, and you

(23:57):
hear this in episode for you know, with that theory
is and I talked to a lot of people as
this thing was really kind of unfolding in the first
in the first few days. So I would say that
with that type of theory, I think more than you know,
people are like, oh, stuff is being hidden. I think
there was just a lot of confusion. I don't really

(24:18):
think anyone really knew what was actually happening here, because
you know, some of those people wouldn't have agreed to
probably talk to me if they were like, oh, there's
nothing to see here. And a lot of times when
and you guys are probably experts on this a lot
more than me, but a lot of times when the
military seems to be testing something or doing something new,

(24:39):
it's kind of a wink and a nod like, oh,
that may be us over there, and like there's not
a lot of you know, there's not a lot of
questions about it, and it's just kind of like, Okay,
it happened, it's over. You know, we may have been
doing something there, but you can't say for sure. But
one of the things that you know with this is
people went on the record early to say this is
not us, we are not doing this, we are not

(25:00):
involved with this, and they didn't have to release, you know,
statements and just say that. And could it be someone
or some you know, groups or groups that we're not
even aware of. Of course it could be, but you know,
for the most part, you just don't really see that.
And you saw that a lot in New Jersey as well,
where people would go on the record and say, hey,
it's not us. We're not doing this, these aren't us.

(25:21):
Let's get to the bottom of this mystery together. So
that was one of the big, you know theories specifically
that people thought early. And then of course you had
the you know, the whole kind of alien UFO theory
where there and there were strange things happening around where
people live, like out in the country. You know, you
can't you can you can't discount what some of those

(25:43):
people people said, but I mean it, yeah, just a
very It's kind of just like the real upside down,
real life stranger things type of scenario where a whole
bunch of weird things were going on at the same
at the same time. And you heard that that officer say,
you know, ten miles to Denver International Airport. I mean,
that's not some guy. I mean, that's a police officer

(26:05):
who's in a big county in Colorado. And I can't
remember his title, but he may have even been I
can't remember, but he was fairly high up, and I
mean he's telling you this. This isn't like some random
person on the street, you know.

Speaker 6 (26:18):
So yeah, well, I think one thing that you mentioned
early on in the in the series is that the
drone sightings in New Jersey recently have kind of brought
this whole drone spotting thing maybe back into the zeitgeist.
And one thing that I thought was interesting when that
was being reported on was this idea that like drones,

(26:41):
beget more drones, Like you have a handful of drone sightings,
and all of a sudden, every Tom, Dick and Harry
are sending their you know, consumer drones up to check
it out, which may well have led to the kind
of saturation point of all of those drones, not just
a couple. And I'm wondering if you saw anything like
that with this story that you're that you're exploring.

Speaker 5 (27:04):
Yeah, I mean there, you know, there were people who
were talking about taking their own drones up. I mean
there weren't the sheer number of people obviously that live
on the East coast is in the middle part of Nebraska,
and so you didn't see this on a big on
a big scale, just because people weren't living there. And
you can drive anywhere and still see the drones, the

(27:25):
mysterious drones, if you will, and there would be no
one within like you know, fifteen to twenty miles in
any direction, and so it wasn't like their drones were
getting you know, caught up with the other ones. Now,
I was on the ground in New Jersey at the
height of all that craziness. I found myself there, and
you know that that was a little different situation where,

(27:47):
you know, it did seem like there are all these
reports of drones early and then you know, with the
flight paths of JFK and LaGuardia and people taking hobbyist
drones out and probably you know, the military and local
law enforcement having their drones up at the same time,
it kind of created this circus in the sky, if
you will, and you don't really know what was actually

(28:08):
happening there.

Speaker 4 (28:10):
Oh I love that circus in the sky.

Speaker 3 (28:12):
Yeah, right, that was doubt I've got.

Speaker 4 (28:15):
If we can talk about this, just to stick on
this for a moment longer. You are speaking with law enforcement,
you're speaking with aviation professionals as well, we're talking with
the FAA and so on. All right, so everybody seems
to agree that there's something up there, right, there's something happening.

(28:36):
There's no one who says, you know, Gabe, you're crazy,
this interview is over or anything like that. But could
you tell us a little bit more about just the
basic legality of drones for anybody who hasn't operated one before.
How do drone enthusiast in general comply with the law.

(28:59):
What's the nature of say a no fly zone? How
close can these get to the airport? Where can they go?

Speaker 6 (29:05):
What happens altitude restrictions as well, if I'm not mistaken, But.

Speaker 5 (29:09):
Yeah, yeah, you know, this is something that continues to
get fine tuned. You know, the FAA has had these
this feature, if you will, And there's a lot of
gray area of like you know, having it tagged and
having to register your drone and what do you need
to do Do you have to do that to fly
a drone? Do you not to be able to track them?
No one, in my opinion, no one really knows what's

(29:32):
happening with those. But typically with a drone, like in
the middle part of the country, the drones are supposed
to be below four hundred feet. When you get above that, uh,
that's where that's where you run into problems. And these
were and these were low, you know, many times two
to three hundred feet off the ground, and when you

(29:52):
get into the area of an airport, they are no
fly zones, and some of the people that I reviewed
said that if they flew hobbyist drones near like a
small airport in southwest Nebraska, northeast Colorado, northwest Kansas, their
drone would come down if they entered that airspace, because
it was like, especially if it was a consumer drone.

(30:13):
But then I also talk to other people who's you know,
their drones weren't impacted by that. But you're generally not
supposed to fly obviously within an airport anywhere, even if
it's you know, even if it's a smaller one. But
you know, the restrictions are lax, and it's very clear
that technology is outpacing what's happening with with drone development

(30:34):
in all areas of the world essentially, and it's very
hard to regulate from the people who I've talked to
who's flying these drones, and what you can actually do
about them once they're in the sky if they do
appear to be doing something that is nefarious or is skeptical.

Speaker 4 (30:51):
Yeah, I keep remembering that line, just to add this in.
I keep remembering that line about the FAA not having
an enforcement arm.

Speaker 3 (31:00):
Yeah, I mean, that's the real thing.

Speaker 5 (31:02):
That's well I mean ask yourself the question when you
were listening. I'm not sure how far you got through.
But there are all these reports of things flying around
during the Colorado Drum mystery. Say a local law enforcement
official calls and reports it and say it gets to
the FAA. You know, what would they tangibly do in

(31:22):
that moment, because by that time the report's been called in,
the things probably not at that specific point, and they
aren't there. I mean, you can't fault them because well,
I mean, what are they physically going to do unless
they can, you know, unless they know where that drune
is originating from and they could take it down remotely.
I mean, it's kind of just a weird, tricky situation

(31:44):
all around, I feel like for sure.

Speaker 2 (31:46):
So let's get let's get back to some of the
sightings that specifically the Navy has been seeing and finally
reporting on and telling the public about. So back in
twenty twenty two, I think it was, there's a former
naval pilot named Ryan Graves who testified before Congress and
he describes basically from twenty thirteen on, he and other

(32:10):
Navy fighter pilots who would fly things, fly machines like
f eighteen's they would encounter specific UAP what they described
as uap as, these black or dark gray cubes inside
translucent spheres, and they would see these in the sky
as they're flying, you know, really fast in F eighteen

(32:31):
and other even more advanced craft. Then in Obscure we
hear a story from a hunter, a man named Alex Peterson,
who he has his weapons, a rifle that has a
thermal scope on it, and he's looking through that thermal
scope and he describes something really similar down by the water.
Can you tell us about that?

Speaker 5 (32:51):
Yeah, that was one of the things I didn't think
I would encounter, but I actually, you know, I've talked
to him multiple times throughout you know, putting a story together,
and he in the trailer and some of the different
things you've seen in video, I'm sure online that's actually
raw video from his scope of his gun as this

(33:12):
thing is approaching him. So it's not like, you know,
everyone's like, where's the video, show us the video, but
this thing was, Yeah, it was approaching and if I
remember correctly, yeah, he described it as a is a
box with like orange in the middle of it, and
it was yeah, and this was a you know, this

(33:34):
was approaching him and he had to make the decision
of what he was going to do, and he obviously
didn't do it because that's illegal. You never want to
do that.

Speaker 6 (33:42):
But to actually shoot down the drone from the grounds, right, Yeah, yeah,
bad idea, not even for social media, Like no, well,
you know.

Speaker 2 (33:50):
Results again, we're using layers. We're calling it a drone,
but that doesn't sound like a dang drone.

Speaker 6 (33:57):
Ghost lights, you know, like swamp gas there, one of those.

Speaker 5 (34:02):
That's my favorite. Everyone's like, oh, it's.

Speaker 2 (34:04):
Swamp gas, swamp gas.

Speaker 5 (34:07):
I need to look at what the meteorological you know,
set up for swamp gases specifically, so I can I
can debunk that one in real time.

Speaker 4 (34:15):
Yeah, we're we're happy to throw our hats in the
ring on that one, Gabe, Yeah, tell me, yeah, We're
we're super pro swamp gas over here as well.

Speaker 5 (34:24):
Well.

Speaker 2 (34:24):
The theory with that is that it's it's some kind
of gases that could theoretically ignite and cause fire in
the sky.

Speaker 4 (34:32):
But then you have to think about the altitude, right
or the origin of the gas and the mix. I mean,
that's that's the thing that I think is very fair
about this investigation. We're hearing different voices with different perspectives
that sometimes conflict. Will pause here for a word from
our sponsors, and we'll be back with Gabe, and we're back.

(35:02):
Everybody is trying to do their level best, right from
civilian witnesses who are saying, look, let me tell you
what I saw as accurately as I recall seeing it.
Here's any evidence I have all the way up to
you know, a really interesting meeting in Brush, Colorado that

(35:23):
you share.

Speaker 3 (35:24):
You share some accounts of this.

Speaker 4 (35:27):
It's a strategy meeting right with multiple stakeholders, we could
call them. Whatever people are seeing out there in this area.
It has risen to a level, or risen to a
threshold such that federal and local law enforcement are getting
together to figure out what's going on. Could you tell

(35:49):
us a little bit about their interactions and about this
meeting in Colorado.

Speaker 5 (35:56):
Yeah, I tried to get into this meeting, and this
meeting happened a few weeks after majority of these sidings
really started, you know, ramping up, and I you know,
when I started talking to people, I wasn't even sure
this meeting happened or was going to happen, But it did.
In fact happen, and basically all of these sidings in
northeast Colorado, people were on the brink because no one

(36:19):
was doing anything. And so the FAA supposedly came to
this meeting and set it up. The Colorado Division of
Homeland Security and Emergency Management was there, the Air Force
was there, all these local law enforcement officers from different
areas and all these different states had a big pow
wow and brush Colorado to try to figure out what

(36:39):
they were going to do and form a task force. Now,
as we later learn from people at the meeting and
one of the guys who was going to actually lead
the task force formation, it never really happened. So there
was a whole bunch of talk at this meeting and
no one really took it to the next step. And
it kind of goes back and forth. Was it the
FA's job to do this or was it the local

(37:02):
officials job to do this? And you know, if you
talk to the FAA people, they'll say, well, the reports
just kind of stopped. And if you talk to the
local people, they'll say the FAA dropped the ball and
didn't really push this forward to get it going. But
for lack of a better term, it never really got
off the ground, and there weren't a lot of yeah,
answers following the meeting in fact, and so you know

(37:25):
a lot of people say the reports just dropped off.
But did people become desensitized to just seeing them and
not report them as much? Because I still talk to
people who see these things out there, though not on
a big scale as they were before. And so there's
just a lot of questions surrounding that whole meeting, and
I'm still you know, I hope through this podcast, like
I get more more clarity on that. But I did

(37:48):
talk to a lot of people who were there, and
it's just, yeah, it seems like everyone came together and
nothing happened really.

Speaker 6 (37:55):
Well, Matt, I mean, you had a buddy, I think
in North Georgia maybe who was in some strange lights
in the sky. And we have, you know, historical reports
of very similar things, I mean probably further back, but
like the Phoenix lights, like back in ninety seven or whatever,
very similar reports that usually seem to get traced back
to some sort of experimental aircraft. But Matt, what was

(38:17):
the deal with your friend?

Speaker 2 (38:21):
We can talk about it. I had a friend who
is down near Augusta, Georgia, near Fort Eyes an hour
and they this friend was seeing you know, orbs as
they're described, of light in the sky doing kind of
weird stuff and it's very similar and it actually the
reason why I wanted to talk to you about this
is because he started a social media account to you know,

(38:43):
share videos what he's seeing. And what he found is
that once he started sharing stuff, the conversation about what
this could be, the possibilities, and then the stronger voices
as they come in the opinions of what this potentially
got weirder and weirder, and then again those opinions got

(39:04):
stronger and stronger. And you learn a little bit about
this in the podcast right about what that happens with
a couple of different groups, Like I think it's the
drone intelligence center that you speak with someone about just
where once those ideas start being discussed openly, you can
believe stranger things, let's say, than what you might.

Speaker 5 (39:23):
Normally absolutely and that was one of the you know,
in this in the podcast, there were so many people
who had different perspectives and more than like you know,
at the same time of getting to the bottom of
this mystery, I really just wanted to document what was
actually happening with all these different people and get their
perspectives and put it somewhere because it was just such

(39:45):
a weird, a weird thing. But yes, I mean, when
people don't have answers about the unknown, it's very clear
that they start, you know, they can take that perception
and make it into something that it may or may
not be. Maybe they're right, maybe they're not. But you know,
especially when people are in kind of siphon groups and
in remote areas, if you're around a group of people

(40:08):
and we get into this in one of the episodes
with a psychologist or a sociologist from Stanford, but if
you get into the group think mentality, and you know,
you see something in the sky and the group of
people validates what you saw in the sky. Even if
what you saw in the sky is not at all
what you saw in the sky, and you have everyone
else telling you that's what you saw, then you know,

(40:30):
you're probably likely going to believe what that group of people,
for lack of a better term, says over time, and
so yeah, kind of what you said.

Speaker 4 (40:38):
Is true, especially with the you know, the social dynamics
come into play, right I believe. Our sociologist also points
out it's not just a group consensus building. It's also
guided by perceptions of authority, right, and guided by perceptions

(40:59):
of you know, this is a person I trust for
some other reason. Therefore, what they're saying here, even if
I didn't originally think that it's going to have it's
going to inspire me to reassess my initial experience.

Speaker 6 (41:16):
Yeah, I mean, and so many people just don't have
a strong enough perspective that it's really easy for the
loudest or most confident voice in the room or in
one of these discussions to steer them, you know, to
to allow people to kind of like have their perspective
shifted because they need that, you know. And sometimes even
if someone is coming at it with authority, it doesn't

(41:38):
mean they actually have the background or the expertise to
make those kinds of claims. And I think we see
that all the time in the echo chamber that is
sort of online conspiracy chatter.

Speaker 5 (41:48):
Yeah, I mean, I couldn't I couldn't agree more. I mean,
I'm not I'm not in that space as much as
you know, you guys are and stuff. But based on
the limit, you know, you can kind of see that
as well with with the new Jersey, the sightings and
other similar events of that.

Speaker 4 (42:03):
You know, oh Chinese weather blued shout out, you know
to our boy from a few years back.

Speaker 3 (42:09):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (42:10):
Yeah, but then you've got you've got stories. And forgive me,
I can't remember the gentleman's name, but the person who
has an inquisitive mind, who is going out there on
social media trying to you know, have other people vet
his work. Basically as he's taking videos and making recordings
and saying, hey, I noticed that when I play certain music,

(42:30):
these lights turn blue, and then when I play other music,
they flashed o their lights' Like what do you guys think? Like,
that's a really inquisitive mind trying to test variables. And
so I just imagine somebody like that and I wanting
so hard to prove scientifically something.

Speaker 6 (42:49):
Isn't that just a regular dude or was that an expert?
I'm remembering the soundby but not the identity of this person.

Speaker 5 (42:55):
So that's the leader of this group called the drone Hunters.
Basically like formed it was group this you know, this
social media group and they would go out and they
would you know, band together and really try to study
these They were concerned locals. But with that story, I
thought to myself, just like you, I mean, I'm I'm
skeptical at the beginning. And so I called the sheriff's

(43:17):
department in that specific county. And it was very interesting
in that interaction because the guy told me he would
go out there regardless of you know, the the lights
and like the music and everything else. I was like,
could I verify that someone else who lived in the
area was seeing the same type of things at the
time or and continues to see these things? So I
called the sheriff in that specific county in western or

(43:42):
in eastern Colorado. And you know, it was very interesting
because I got this assistant at the sheriff's office and
she was like, oh, let me go ask because I said, hey,
you know, I'm looking into some of those mysterious drone
sightings that had been reported by people who live in
your area. Would I be able to talk to the
sheriff for people still seeing these She waited, she put
me on hold, and she came back and she's like,

(44:03):
there's nothing that's been seen here lately, and the sheriff
doesn't want to talk about it, and I was like okay.
I was like I was like, I was like okay.
And so then I, you know, I found people who
kind of lived outside of that town or the sheriff
lit and called them and they're like, oh, yeah, we
see these or black lights, you know, multiple nights a

(44:25):
week still ever since like the you know, the drone
the drone mystery really kicked off, and my son was
out and he was he was getting the mail. He
saw him the other night, and so then the guy's
story is like, oh, someone else who lives where he
does is seeing these at the same time, not saying,
you know, the weird nature of them, but they are
seeing something in the sky at the same time. And

(44:46):
so take that information however you want. But it's very
it's very curious.

Speaker 3 (44:51):
That's the thing that gets me too.

Speaker 4 (44:53):
In the absence of transparency, speculation naturally thrives, right, And
there's not anybody, it seems in the story. There are
people who have strident beliefs of their perspective of what
they've seen, but we don't see anybody pulling a cynical grift,
you know what I mean. We don't see anybody starting

(45:16):
a UFO based cult or anything.

Speaker 7 (45:19):
People are hopefully people are trying to that we know
of that we know of right, right, people are trying
to figure this out together, and in doing so, you know,
we could make an argument that perhaps beliefs become more
extreme when you have people kind of bubbled in one space.

Speaker 4 (45:42):
Did you run into anybody who had serious contradictions about
another person's perspective regarding the drone mystery.

Speaker 5 (45:53):
That's a great question. I honestly, I honestly didn't, because
because it was such a widespread thing. It's not like
someone saw something once and then the other person's like,
well I didn't see it. I don't believe that, because
so many, so many people were seeing things at the
same time. I mean one, you know, one group of
people who you know, my family is friends with even

(46:15):
rented a party bus and went had a party and
went and had like a drone watching party and was
driving around you know, during the time, just for just
for just for fun, for sheer fun. And so it
wasn't like it was a thing where people were just
seeing one or two here there. I mean, they were
seeing them all over the place. And the thing, you know,

(46:38):
I looked back at, you know, some of my notes
and stuff. And one of the first reports that came
in outside of Phillips County was actually in my county,
uh a Chase County, and it was the it was
the it was the sheriff's apartment there that reported seeing
fifty of these things, you know, before people were even

(46:59):
calling him, you know, calling them in and so I mean,
and that was they sent that to to everyone, and
so it wasn't even the people who were leading the
sightings at the very beginning.

Speaker 2 (47:09):
So, yeah, can you tell us who this Matthew Spencer
guy is? It sounds like a voice actor when you
hear it in the in the episode, You're like, there's
no way this guy talks like that.

Speaker 4 (47:19):
Also, can we can we hang out with him on
the party bus?

Speaker 5 (47:25):
So I will say, I will say to protect his privacy,
he was so his part was reread because but this
is a real guy. He did go on the record.
We had to we had to protect him. So yes,
there was a voiceover or a voiceover artist reading that
specific part. But this he is, you know, one real person.

(47:48):
He was, according to all of my research, being looked
at by the FAA during that time, and was reaching
out to different newspapers in the area, claiming responsibility for
these sightings, and so, yeah, I tracked him down and yeah,
you know, it'd been so such a long kind of

(48:08):
time that had passed. I didn't want to put him
on full blast. But but yeah, but this is a
guy and he was being looked at by the FAA
for being behind these sidings and so that it's all,
it's all one part of the weird, wacky story that
is the drones.

Speaker 2 (48:24):
Well does he ever say what it could be like the.

Speaker 5 (48:31):
Yeah, so his so, I mean, I don't know how
far you've listened, but basically he so his thinking was
that the specific guy that there was a u a
P in the area, and his life's mission was to
study UAP, and he had his own drones that he
was like taking them and studying the UAP, and he

(48:51):
had reason to believe that there was a UAP in
the vicinity of the drones, and that was why the
drones were there, because typically in his experience, if there
would be a UAP, drones followed to kind of study
it or study what happened in the area, and that
was kind of his assumption and why he was flying
his own drunes there at the time.

Speaker 6 (49:13):
Well, yeah, and well that's sort of the point that
came up around the New Jersey stuff, where it's like
a lot of the clutter of it all were maybe
hobbyists or other people who were curious who own their
own drones kind of going to check out the initial
sightings and then kind of adding to the traffic.

Speaker 5 (49:31):
Yeah. Absolutely, and so that's where he, you know, he said,
said he was there, and I yeah, and obviously other
people did too. Called he called one of the sheriff's
offices in eastern Colorado and they alerted the FAA. From
what I found out in the FAA, you know, it
appears looked into looked into him and thought he could be,

(49:55):
you know, be involved in some of these so a
person of interest persons of interest which I had to
listen to see what happens. But yeah, but he's very
But but I but I will say that you know
the voiceover actor who read that does he is very
It's a very similar portrayal of the actual guy.

Speaker 2 (50:17):
Interesting.

Speaker 3 (50:18):
That's it.

Speaker 4 (50:19):
There's a there is an importance there right to protecting
someone's anonymity and what their comfort level may be. And
I think it returns again and again to this idea
of comfort level, right, how comfortable are we sharing this
story or how comfortable are we as you know, law

(50:39):
enforcement professionals talking talking to Gabe and saying, all right,
here's what I can say, here's what I like there.
There's at least one time where someone tells you they're
not going to speak with you unless they get some
paperwork behind it, right, like a public disclosure request or
something of that nature.

Speaker 5 (51:01):
Yeah, I mean there was a lot of people you
know that are weary at first, but it you know,
people who live in that area like, they don't they
don't really care about the perception of what people think
in this capacity. They'll just say it how it is
because you know, they they got to go back to
the farm and work and really don't give a crap what,
you know. They they don't care. They'll just say, oh, yeah,

(51:21):
I saw this weird thing you know happen. I'm not
exactly sure where, you know. Yeah, it is kind of
a taboo subject where some people you know wouldn't want
to talk. But like I said, I mean if the
New Jersey thing doesn't you know, shed enough light on that.
I mean, everyone was talking about it. It's become so
mainstream now with these sightings, especially at Air Force bases

(51:41):
in the UK and Langley and New Mexico and California
in different places, that that it is becoming, you know,
a topic of you know, a topic of conversation.

Speaker 4 (51:54):
I do have, I do have on that on that
note about the locals and the rich picture that you paint. Uh,
we in the region, in the town. We're really in
the atmosphere here. Just on a personal note, man, how's
everybody doing interview?

Speaker 5 (52:12):
Yeah, everyone's doing well. Uh. People are pretty excited about
the podcast. They've they've really enjoyed, They've really enjoyed listening
to it because it was such a weird thing and
they all they all experienced it, you know together, and
so to be able to you know, put this, put
this together and kind of document They're always every time

(52:32):
I would go home, they're like, how's the podcast? How's
the thing coming along. It's taken a while to to
get this off the ground because I do, you know,
I do a few other things in LA and I
wanted to kind of see how it would evolve over
time too, because I talked to the same people, you know,
different times, multiple times throughout the throughout the story, and

(52:53):
so they're they're excited about it. Everyone's everyone's doing well.
And you know, some people are still seeing seeing drones
at there, or what they describe as drone. So it's interesting.

Speaker 6 (53:03):
I've said this on the podcast multiple times, but many
many years ago, when I was in a band and
traveling through Nebraska, I very much saw a triangular kind
of kite shaped like an architectural measuring tool, hovering in
the distance. And I had a little camquarder at the time,
and I got video of it on like a mini

(53:24):
DV tape, which I have lost. I have a bunch
of mini DV tapes in a bag somewhere hopefully one
day find. But it was very, very striking and I
will never forget it. And I couldn't tell you what
it was, and I haven't really seen anything since that
fully explains it. In my kind of rational brain, I
like to think maybe I did catch a glimpse of
some kind of experimental aircraft, but it was very odd

(53:47):
and very similar to the way some of the sightings
in Phoenix were described, you know, for the Phoenix Lights scenario,
like in the late nineties. But I understand this idea
I think we all do of seeing something that you
can't fully explain, feeling like you're sort of, in some
small way, part of a larger conversation. Yeah that's interesting.

Speaker 5 (54:06):
Yeah, absolutely, Yet now I want to see that, but
she don't. But you don't.

Speaker 6 (54:09):
I'll find it right.

Speaker 3 (54:12):
When we've been I've been trying.

Speaker 4 (54:13):
I've been asking this guy for years, if you can
give me that final push, Let's.

Speaker 5 (54:19):
Let's find the tape. Let's find the tape.

Speaker 2 (54:22):
I've got I've got one last thing here, Gab that
i just want to put out there because I there's
a feeling in the air, and there has been for
a long time that the next big military conflict is
on its way. When we're talking about like potentially a
world war of some sort, some form or fashion, with
all of these massive conflicts that are rising up around

(54:43):
the world, and that's probably a feeling that humanity has
shared since the end of the Second World War, right
where we're like, oh, the next one's coming, the next
one's coming. You have a feeling, at least I do,
uh that something's coming. The concept of these drones being
used or these whatever, these objects are being used to
monitor nuclear sites, so sites that in the heartland of

(55:06):
the United States, and you know, in places like Nebraska,
in places like Colorado out in the middle of nowhere,
missile sites that have nuclear missiles inside them or once
did that would be launched in the event that there
is a need for those things, at least according to
the people at the top of the country. What do
you think there's any type of experimental aircraft experimental security

(55:30):
forces that are out there being used. Did you see
any evidence of that?

Speaker 5 (55:35):
I mean when I was as far as like, as
far as related to the drones or as far as yeah,
I mean I didn't personally see that. I mean, it
would be a great area too, and that was one
of the theories test new things. There's not a highly
dense area out there, and there's a lot of pasture
and stuff. I didn't see anything, you know, personally in

(55:58):
that regard. And when it comes to like you said,
there there are there are missile silos in the area,
all kind of scattered throughout the great planes, which we
delve into in the podcast a little bit. But you know,
one of the biggest things for me with these drones
and like all the sidings and that in the Pentagon
went on the record you know about Langley Air Force
Base and all of those different things, is that it

(56:20):
is a security risk because we don't know what's flying
obviously those drones do we don't know what capabilities those
actually have and what is behind those and you know,
if you take away the surveillance aspect, but just think about, like,
we don't know what's actually flying in the sky, and
you've seen all the things that have happened, you know,
recently with different incidents in the sky. I think it's

(56:40):
very important to know what's flying in the sky and
where and how it could could impact different things. I
think that's you know, one of the biggest, biggest questions.

Speaker 6 (56:51):
And that's a commonality among a lot of UAP sightings
is that they sometimes tend to hover around nuclear sites.

Speaker 2 (56:59):
Yeah, you're two thousand with the disclosure projects that we
heard multiple stories.

Speaker 4 (57:04):
Of that dating back to post World War two exactly right, Yeah,
and there there are you know. I love the point
you made earlier, Gabe where he said, yes, there were
newspaper reports from back in the day, from decades past,
but I don't know how dependable those were, right, where
these just sort of were these reports with maybe a

(57:27):
light editorial touch, a little bit of embellishment to sell
the paper. That's an open question, but we do. When
you see people telling the same story over a window
of time, right, and they have little in common other
than their location on the planet and their eyewitness accounts,
as flawed as eyewitness accounts can be, when they seem

(57:48):
to bring true and hold those commonalities, it's time to
really start digging in and exploring the questions, figuring out
what is going on with this strange Gordian knot of
social dynamics of technology that outpaces legislation. I feel like
I'm ted talking here.

Speaker 3 (58:06):
Gave.

Speaker 4 (58:07):
The main question is what do you hope listeners take
away from the first season of Obscure Them.

Speaker 5 (58:14):
I hope listeners really are challenged to question the world
around them and step out and figure out what's going
on in their local community and realize that a lot
of the stuff they may see, you know, on mainstream
news is great for a broad perspective, but there are
so many things that need to be asked right in
your own backyard, and you need to be a citizen
journalist and go out there and ask questions. I hope

(58:35):
people are inspired to learn more about the stories that
really surround surround them and where they live.

Speaker 3 (58:46):
You're here, yeah, beautiful.

Speaker 5 (58:48):
Yeah so, and I think too, I think, you know,
I alluded to it before with my circus and the
sky comment, but I think now more than ever, we
have the most things, you know, I think it would
be safe to say historically in the sky than ever.
And I think there are a lot of things happening
at the same time in the sky, and to kind
of take everything into account, there's helicopters, there's UAP, there's airplanes,

(59:10):
there's people flying consumer drones, there's probably military drones. There's
probably people doing other types of surveillance. There's probably the
electrical company. You know, there's a lot of different things
happening at the same time.

Speaker 6 (59:21):
And I think, and to your point about the FAS capabilities,
like it's getting so crowded out there. I can't imagine
being able to know exactly what all of them are
doing at all times. It doesn't even seem logistically possible.
Or maybe that's more something in the realm of military surveillance,
but even they would probably be struggling with that.

Speaker 5 (59:41):
I mean, it has to be tough. I mean, think
about that. I mean you can go buy you can
go buy a drone and fly it. Yeah, and think
if everyone's doing that, you know, how do you how
do you regulate that they sell.

Speaker 6 (59:52):
Them at Barnes and Noble.

Speaker 3 (59:55):
I didn't know that. Yeah, act now it's funny.

Speaker 4 (01:00:00):
It's funny you mentioned that game because I was texting
the guys earlier this morning to see about getting some drones.
So I don't know if I got the right takeaway
from the show, but one thing we can say for
sure is that this is the kind of investigation that
needs to happen more often, you know, because for every

(01:00:25):
hundred of people right, or every two hundred people who
see something right, how many will come forward or how
many will look further into it. One thing I thought
about a lot while researching the show and listening through
was the threshold that it would take for your average
person to actually contact authorities. I don't know how it

(01:00:49):
is over in Nebraska, but in a lot of these
United States, that's a pretty high bar. So that I
think as to the reality, the concrete nature of what's happening.
And this is where there's something you do at the
end of every episode where you and your team ask

(01:01:10):
people who have similar stories or may have some insider information,
you ask them to reach out to you all directly.
Where's the best way for folks to contact you and
your team.

Speaker 5 (01:01:23):
So there's a few different ways you can do that,
and that is a great point because and I've gotten
some interesting people reaching out that have seen, you know,
drone things in a lot of areas of the country.
And if you want to go on the website, there's
a spot where you can share your story. So share
your story, you can go on there. You can also
hit us up on social media at Obscure Them that's

(01:01:46):
obs c U r U M Underscore series and send
me a DM. I'd love to hear from you there.
And then the thing too that's been really inspiring with
that is to see people commenting on the podcast on
where the podcast is too, and it's almost like a
conversation there and people are saying, oh, I saw this,
I experienced this. So if you wherever you listen to

(01:02:06):
your podcast to if you can, if you can comment there,
that's a great way for us to see your stories too.

Speaker 2 (01:02:13):
And Gabe, we've listened through episode eight. Are there more
episodes coming?

Speaker 5 (01:02:17):
Yeah, So there's one final episode which is going to
come out tomorrow, and then hopefully, hopefully we're gonna like
I said, I was, so I was in New Jersey.
I literally decided to get on a plane as we
were finishing production on these because I didn't know what
would happen there. So I flew to New Jersey and

(01:02:38):
was kind of on the ground. I just randomly booked
a flight and took my producer with me and we
went all over kind of New Jersey at the height
of everything that was happening there. So we're hoping to
put more episodes together and release those soon. In the
New Jersey content this season is very, very compelling. But
the New Jersey stuff, I'm excited to get that out

(01:02:59):
there because there are a lot of high level kind
of officials that were kind of talked to at the time,
and we were chasing these with the Sheriff's Department in
with the Coast Guard on the Jersey shore, which is
very which is very weird, and so I'm excited for
you all to uh, hopefully, hopefully we'll get those together soon.

(01:03:19):
But but I tell you, it's it's a story that
won't go away, but it just gets a stranger and stranger.

Speaker 2 (01:03:26):
I love that You're gonna have a different pellette of accents.

Speaker 5 (01:03:30):
Trust me, Gabe.

Speaker 4 (01:03:33):
Gabe has not given us spoilers, so we're right there
with you. Uh, we're going to be tuning in as well, Gabe.
Thanks million Man. Just full disclosure because we we uphold
transparency in everything we do on this show.

Speaker 3 (01:03:50):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (01:03:50):
Your West coast, we're East coast. You woke up early
for this.

Speaker 3 (01:03:55):
I forgot that.

Speaker 5 (01:03:56):
I just appreciate. I just appreciate you guys that doing.
It's been some much fun to hang out and yeah,
hopefully hopefully we can do it again soon. And yeah
it is early, but I got some coffee. I'm gonna
go get some more.

Speaker 3 (01:04:07):
So oh good.

Speaker 4 (01:04:09):
Absolutely Obscureum Invasion of the Drones available now wherever you
find your favorite podcast. What a cool guy, you know, folks, friends, dabors,
fellow conspiracy realists. It's not all the time, or it's
not super often that we get to hang out with
a colleague. We're interviewing just off air, and we kept

(01:04:33):
it was like the no you hang up things.

Speaker 2 (01:04:35):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (01:04:36):
It was a fascinating conversation, one that will only become,
I would argue, more important in the near future.

Speaker 6 (01:04:44):
Lovely fellow and super talented storyteller and weathermen apparently.

Speaker 2 (01:04:48):
Oh yeah, and there's so much that we didn't cover
that exists within that series there. God, we didn't even
talk about cattle mutilation.

Speaker 4 (01:04:56):
We didn't talk about the abduction experience.

Speaker 1 (01:04:59):
Yeah, we don't.

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
I mean that stuff is a little more out there,
right when it comes to talking with somebody who like Gabe,
who you know, I was going to say, is a
little more serious about that. But those those are serious topics.
It's just they're definitely more fringe, I think. Then the
series goes in that wants to explore, the series, wants answers.

Speaker 4 (01:05:20):
Yeah, but it's woven into the narrative so well, it's real,
no stone left unturned thing. And I didn't get to
say it when we were in the interview, but you guys,
my favorite chapter title is space Potatoes, Space potastic. It's fantastic.
We are not blowing smoke. We want to hear your opinions, folks.

(01:05:42):
If you dig our show, you will love obscure them.
And you know, the community is a big part of this,
So send us your stories of strange things in the sky.
You can find us via email. You can find us
on a telephonic device of your choice hopefully, or you
can hit us on the lines online on the Internet.

Speaker 6 (01:06:05):
Indeed, you can find us at the hamlic Conspiracy Stuff
where we exist, on Facebook with our Facebook group Here's
where it gets crazy, on YouTube with video content galore
for your perusing enjoyment, and on x FKA, Twitter, on
Instagram and TikTok over. We're Conspiracy Stuff Show.

Speaker 2 (01:06:20):
We have a phone number. You can call this number
and leave us a voicemail. Our number is one eight
three three std WYTK. When you call in in that message,
give yourself a cool nickname and let us know if
we can use your name and message on the air.
If you've got more to say than can fit in
a three minute voicemail, one instead, send us a good
old fashioned email.

Speaker 3 (01:06:41):
We are the.

Speaker 4 (01:06:42):
Entities that read every piece of correspondence we receive. Be
well aware, yet unafraid. Sometimes the void writes back, wait
are you kidding?

Speaker 3 (01:06:50):
Is this a weird bit?

Speaker 4 (01:06:52):
Did I listen to the end of this show for
no reason at all? There's one way to find out.
Drop us a live conspirac at iHeartRadio dot com.

Speaker 2 (01:07:20):
Stuff. They don't want you to Know is a production
of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.