How much do we really know about MKULTRA (spoiler: not much). What about Project Monarch? What's the deal with all these viral stories about Venezuelan gangs invading apartment buildings in Colorado -- and fighting off the cops? All this and more in this week's listener mail segment.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A
production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,
my name is Noah.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
They call me Ben. We are joined as always with
our super producer, all Mission Control Decant. Most importantly, you
are You are here. That makes this the stuff they
don't want you to know. Oh, finally again we say it.
It's a tumnal you know, here in the fair metropolis
of Atlanta, Georgia, coming to you semi live from the
(00:51):
United States. We are so excited. What's that line from
Hell Raisers like I have such wonders to show you.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
Yeah, you know, kinky wonders.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
I think it's hell Razors singular too, think it is.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
It's you know, it's funny.
Speaker 5 (01:07):
I was. Actually there's a bunch of like deep divy
YouTube explorations of the Cenobites and the hell Razor universe,
and they're apparently not actually demons at all. No, yeah,
they're just weird kinky zombies.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Oh, I didn't know that, you know, Uh, I don't
know if you guys ever have this sensation that maybe
someone is well, very heller if you wake up in
the middle of the night and well, we all have animals.
If your animal is acting weird when you wake up
in the middle of the night and you get this
the hair stand up in the back of your neck
and you're like, something's wrong, something's off. My go to
(01:43):
line when I walk around the house with my you know,
my bat usually my implement. Yeah right, yeah, the one
that Ben gave me. It's so good, Ben, I will say,
quietly and sinisterly, I can smell you.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
I just say, show yourself.
Speaker 4 (02:03):
Shut yourself, coward.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
That's great, man, that's great that you sleep at night sometimes.
Speaker 6 (02:11):
Bro.
Speaker 5 (02:11):
Since I've quit drinking, I've been getting solid seven and
a half a night baby tracked on.
Speaker 4 (02:17):
My Apple Watch. That's also tracking.
Speaker 5 (02:19):
All of my other metrics and funneling them directly to
the NSA.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
Man, they're all loading up, dude, Apple watch, all the
sleep cutting boards.
Speaker 5 (02:29):
When you write it all down like that, I really
am living the life of the well.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
I asked, I asked Matt on one of our group
conversations earlier, or I asked, both you guys, let's be
fair uh for recommendations on house cleaning services, and Noel
had a great recommendation and actual actionable Yeah. And then
Matt was like, there's a naked guy who goes through
(02:57):
my house about twice a week.
Speaker 4 (02:59):
It's me, by the way.
Speaker 5 (03:00):
Yeah, he said he looks a lot like me. And
he said, actually I think he is. I said, don't
get your ding ding caught in the bread box.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
My son was in the vehicle when I was when
I texted that to you guys, and he didn't see
the initial thing, but then he saw notifications that you
guys were texting me come up and he and he
clicked on it, because you can, he reached them and
he clicked on it, and it was a response to it.
And then I had to explain the joke that I
had made to you.
Speaker 5 (03:27):
Also it was it my don't get your ding down
caught in the bread box? That was he had questions understandable, and.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
The cutting board reference there was entirely for you, Matt.
I felt bad, Noel that that you thought I was
talking about your your cutting board pursuits. I just think
a kitchen is a dangerous place to come.
Speaker 6 (03:47):
Now.
Speaker 4 (03:47):
Then you know it was a call back to my
cutting board.
Speaker 3 (03:50):
This was not, it was not. I'm not being fair
enough anyway. That's a killery it is. That's our cold open.
This is listener mail.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
And we've returned and we are jumping immediately to the
phone lines to hear a message from Young's Skip. He
calls himself Crazy Skip. He's a distinguished gentleman who's seen
a lot of what life has to offer. He's a
Vietnam veteran, he's a retired firefighter, and he wants us
to look into something, something very specific that's also related
(04:28):
to a two parter classic episode that we released in
the recent past and we've explored extensively.
Speaker 4 (04:35):
He's also very.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Interested in a certain book that he's read multiple times,
and he believes the contents to be true, or at
least based in factual events. So we're going to look
at that today, and let's say, we're going to scratch
the surface and see where it takes us. So here's
our message from Crazy Skip.
Speaker 6 (04:55):
Hey guys, this is Crazy Skip from Baltimore. I've read
Kathy O'Brien's book Transformation of America three times. Her partner
Mark Phillips saved her life. He's deceased God somehow in
two twenty seventeen. Don't know how, but I've read her
(05:18):
book three times and couldn't put it down. And what
she's saying is true. I really believe it. From an
old conspiracy theorist of seventy six Vietnam, that entire firefighter
that's done it all. And now I love you guys.
(05:38):
Love conspiracy theories, love conspiracy for realists. That's what we are.
Thanks for what you do.
Speaker 4 (05:48):
Keep it up there we go.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
Thank you so much, first of all for sending us
that message, for spending time with us, Crazy Skip. We
love that you're a part of the show, and I
don't know, gives me a lot of joy. It probably
does for you guys too, Just knowing that you're out
there listening to us when we're talking.
Speaker 5 (06:04):
Absolutely, I'm consistently surprised that that is the case. There
are people out there in internet land listening to We're.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
All here together, you know what I mean, gathered around
a campfire in the dark, I think, and Crazy Skip
looking forward to meeting you. Looking forward also to some
advice about best restaurants in Baltimore, because I got to
go back to Mount Vernon. I don't remember if I
(06:33):
told you guys this.
Speaker 4 (06:34):
Do tell or keep your secrets.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
Well, there's a great museum there. It's gonna be fine.
Crazy Skip has read a book three times, Yes, correct.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
Yes, a very specific book that you're going to have
trouble looking it up unless you hear this. The title
is spelled trance t R a n CE space for
of America love it. So yeah, there's spaces between the
other words. But just it's not transformation, it's transformation. And
(07:10):
the subtitle is an MK Ultra Mind Control Survivor, a
Whistleblower's true story. So I have never heard of this
book before. I have, however, heard about the author the
authors of this book, because guys, we've talked about this before.
But Roseanne Barr has a podcast.
Speaker 5 (07:31):
Yeah, that's the one where RFK Junior revealed his old
bear debacle.
Speaker 4 (07:36):
Yes, she has an awkward interview of all time.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
She has a way of just getting through to people,
you know, as she did when she was on television.
Speaker 4 (07:45):
I remember watching your show a.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
Lot, and I think it's episode twenty one. It is
episode twenty one of her podcast. She had this author
Kathy O'Brien on as a guest and at least I
listened through some of it, not the entirety of the episode.
But these two people, roseannebar and Kathy O'Brien, are very
good friends. They've known each other for a long time,
(08:07):
and they had a very frank discussion about the contents
of this book, as though it is very much real
and everything that it's said to have happened inside that
book occurred. So let's go for just a basic description
of this book. And I'm taking this from the website
Trance dashformation dot com. Quote Transformation of America is the
(08:30):
documented autobiography of a victim of government mind control. Kathy
O'Brien is the only vocal and recovered survivor of the
Central Intelligence Agencies MK Ultra project Monarch mind control operation.
Before we go any further, guys, we've talked about MK Ultra.
(08:50):
It is a real thing. There are documents that you
can find that were declassified, some of it still redacted,
but you can see the actual documents about this mind
control attempt, this operation, this thing that is known as
MK Ultra. Guys, do you want to just talk about
it a little bit about what this program was, the
(09:12):
stuff we know.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
Yeah, Mkultra is the tip of an iceberg accidentally discovered
by the American public through remnants of documents that were
miss assigned. They were not where they were supposed to be.
All the other stuff. The vast majority of documentation and
(09:34):
research from mk Ultra was destroyed well in advance. The
global public will never know the full extent of the
CIA just kind of doing what we call FAFO, right, Yeah,
freak around and futs out.
Speaker 5 (09:52):
I mean, basically, among other things, dosing unsuspecting civilians with
LSD to find out what happens. Yeah, if anyone wants
to dig a little deeper into that, there's a really
cool iHeart original series called Operation Midnight Climax, which was
another name for that program. I was lucky enough to
(10:13):
be able to narrate that, but I didn't do any
of the writing or any of that is all our
amazing team headed by Jason English, but really cool music
and sound design. It's a really fun show, and it
really digs deep into this whole program.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
And just to set the stage here to light the
candles at this dinner or for this ritual in k
Ultra is a proven conspiracy, a proven set of conspiracies.
As you said no, Operation Midnight Climax is a stem
to stern Banger and worth a listen it. Also it
(10:46):
goes into detail with the idea of dosing people with
LSD height of the Cold War kind of thing, partially
to figure out whether one could create a truth serum
which doesn't really exist, and then also to ideate on
whether we could program people via the generation of like
(11:08):
different personalities Sirhan Sirhan type time windowed or freeze triggered.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Yes, and if you're interested in this actual program, also
see Project Artichoke as well as I think Bluebird is
the other title that was given to this. These are
provable things that the Central Intelligence Agency did where they
were looking at all that kind of stuff, but also
using not just LSD and other you know, psychoactive substances,
(11:38):
using isolation, psychological torture techniques, essentially ways to make interrogations.
Speaker 4 (11:47):
More effective, enhance them. There that perhaps there you go.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
To make ah, to make a feel like you have
lost the anchor of what you define as yourself. Yeah,
such that there's just a little butterfly that replaces you.
Speaker 4 (12:04):
Oh God.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
And this all begins post World War two, as we
get into real Cold War tensions in the early nineteen fifties.
This is a real thing.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
Now.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
The other thing that is mentioned in here is Project Monarch. Now,
that is a thing that, at least to my mind, guys,
has been alleged but is not but is not documented
in the same way that Artichoke, Bluebird and mk Ultra
are documented. Monarch is the alleged version of this that
(12:38):
goes way beyond any of the official stuff. And there
are allegations that this is the program that has caught
people up. Like Britney Spears, we talked about that in
the past. Project Monarch has caught up other people and
it involves often sexual abuse, it involves way more psycho
(13:00):
logical torture, and again the attempts essentially to get someone
under total control. We have to say again, there are
allegations of this. This is an alleged thing, but this
book and this person are saying this is absolutely true,
and Kathy is saying I was a victim of this. So, guys,
(13:21):
we are going to continue exploring what Kathy and Transformation
of America says. By going to another page on their website,
it's the about Mark and Kathy page. You can find
it pretty easily. And this is where we will learn
a little bit more about Kathy herself as well as
Mark Phillips, her partner who did pass away in twenty seventeen.
(13:43):
As Skip said in the message there, Mark Phillips, at
least according to the writings on the website, is a
person that assisted Kathy from escaping the clutches of whatever
she was going through, as well as documented these things.
But it goes back to regression therapies that we've also
(14:04):
talked about on the show, Guys. And if you go
through this about page, you're going to find information that
Guys I can only describe as wild. It feels like, well,
you know, what's that quote about claims and.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
Needing extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I'm paraphrasing, but yes,
exceptional claims require exceptional evidence something something, Yes.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
So, but you can learn about Mark and how he
at least according to this bio which looks like it
was written by him, he says his first encounter with
mind control research began in the late nineteen sixties in Atlanta, Georgia,
at Emory University in the Primate Center there.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
And then you know he was interested in that stuff.
He was apparently what is it?
Speaker 2 (15:00):
He worked for the DoD as a contractor, and then
he met Kathy O'Brien. Then he says he was able
to quote liberate MK Ultra victims, Kathy O'Brien and her
daughter from the invisible grip of the US government's secret
weapon of control.
Speaker 4 (15:18):
It's a bold claim. It is a bold claim.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
There are very important human beings in history and US
politics that are mentioned, specifically by Kathy O'Brien, that were
allegedly involved in some of the stuff. Look it up,
see what you think it feels. It feels intense to
me and requires way more proof than is currently there.
According to them, the proof is not allowed to be
(15:44):
shown because it is against the law. That's according to
Mark and Kathy O'Brien. They can't even share the real stuff.
So I don't know, come up with your own ideas
about it. But you know, maybe if you're like Skip,
you're gonna believe it fully, maybe going to be more skeptical.
Just take it, Just take the information and try and
process it, and then we'll look at it again.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
And we would love primary sources because continually, the devilish, dangerous,
tantalizing thing about projects like mk Ultra is. We only
know part of it exactly.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
So we're gonna hear a couple more words from our sponsor.
We'll be right back with more messages from you.
Speaker 5 (16:32):
And we have returned with another couple of pieces actually
of listener mail messages from you.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
Yes, you.
Speaker 5 (16:42):
This first one coming from Matt, and it's about the
CIA and the question of do you ever really stop
being CIA?
Speaker 3 (16:53):
He's also different man, Yeah, different.
Speaker 4 (16:55):
Man, that's right. And you know it's funny, guys.
Speaker 5 (16:57):
I actually, you know, when we do these listener mails,
I kind of research or inbox or whatever using keywords
from you messages coming to us from a certain email address.
I actually accidentally searched for our old email address, the
old House Stuff Works conspiracy blog email, and that's where
this one came from. So this is probably referencing something
we said many, many, many years ago.
Speaker 4 (17:18):
But it really grabbed me and I thought it was
a really cool.
Speaker 5 (17:21):
Thing to discuss because this is not something that I
knew or had thought about.
Speaker 4 (17:25):
So mac starts.
Speaker 5 (17:27):
On a recent episode, you asked the question do you
ever stop being CIA? Now, I am not part of
the CIA, but my grandfather was in the fifties and sixties.
By the time I was born in the early seventies,
he had retired and gone on to being a high
school history teacher. He used to tell us stories of
the countries that he and his family had lived in
during his career in the Agency, but very rarely did
(17:49):
we actually hear any stories about operations that he'd been
a part of. I guess my personal experience tells me
that he was always aware of what he could and
could not talk about to his immediate family, but his
time in the Agency was solidly part of his past.
One thing of note, however, everyone who works for the
CIA signs an agreement that they have to have all
(18:12):
artwork and writing approved by the CIA before it can
be published. Ostensibly this is to prevent the leakage, intentional
or otherwise, of classified information. This means that the comics
writer Tom King, for example, has to have every Batman
script approved by.
Speaker 4 (18:29):
The CIA before it can be published.
Speaker 5 (18:31):
To that extent, I think that, no, the CIA never
really stops being a part.
Speaker 4 (18:37):
Of your life. Matt.
Speaker 5 (18:40):
That blew my mind, and I guess it makes sense,
But there was a part of me that was even like,
is this true?
Speaker 4 (18:46):
No, shade on you, Matt.
Speaker 5 (18:47):
I was just like, this seems insanely broad, and I
sure enough. The CIA website CIA dot gov has an
entire page dedicated to something called the Pre Publication Classification
Review Board, and it does seem to largely revolve around
things like memoirs and you know, recounting one's time specifically
(19:13):
in the CIA, but it can absolutely pertain to fictionalizations
of those things, you know, for the very reason that
Matt said, the idea that something that shouldn't be public
information could intentionally or accidentally be leaked.
Speaker 4 (19:28):
This is from the website itself. Definition of publication.
Speaker 5 (19:31):
The CIA Secrecy Agreement requires such communication to be submitted
for pre publication review and approved prior to discussing the
material with or showing it to individuals such as a publisher,
co author, agent, editor, ghostwriter, personal representative, family member, or
assistant relating to CIA or intelligence activities. Former and current
(19:55):
CIA officers and contractors are not required to submit all
proposed publications for prep plication review. For example, the requirement
does not apply to material created around subjects such as gardening,
wine tasting, stamp collecting, or sports. These are likely to
be outside of the purview of the CIA mission and intelligence. However,
commentary on matters such as intelligence operations or tradecraft, even
(20:17):
fictional works, foreign intelligence, foreign events, or intelligence interest, one's
career at CIA, scientific or technological developments discussed in an
intelligence context, and other topics that touch upon CIA interest
or responsibilities need PCRB approval.
Speaker 4 (20:35):
Guys, I bet you already knew this. I did not
know this.
Speaker 5 (20:39):
The comics angle is interesting because I do think Tom
King some of his run of Batman there's like a
military side to it.
Speaker 4 (20:46):
There's like kind of like a spy sort of bent
to it.
Speaker 5 (20:51):
So maybe that's not true that he has to have
every single script reviewed. Ben, you seem a little skeptical
on that front, But I do believe Tom King, who
we met at Comic Con one year, a former colleague
of ours, Christian Seger, interviewed him for a video series
All the Old House Stuff Works YouTube. But if I
remember correctly, there was some kind of intelligence bent to
(21:15):
Tom King's Batman comics. So I don't know, Ben, what
do you think on that side? You're also probably more
familiar with the comics than me.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
Oh yeah, no comment, I have to send some emails first.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Well, I was just gonna say, this message from Matt
could be from a dozen two dozen episodes that we've
done in the past, because I can hear Ben's voice
ringing in my head every time we say X CIA officer.
You know Ben, where You're always.
Speaker 4 (21:42):
Like yeah, right, X is almost a joke.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
Also, also, this is one thing. One thing we can
say here is that this is a necessary stopgap measure, right.
There are more sinister versions of this, like this is
not inherently a bad thing to check in. We have
to remember that actionable intelligence is perishable, right. The real
(22:16):
kind of move by move secret beat me here, Paul.
The move by move secrets is kind of like when
you buy an avocado or a banana, it goes bad quick.
You know this, Max, right, right?
Speaker 5 (22:31):
And so yeah, I mean, but that's also why things
get declassified, yes, yeah, and when everything works as it
should now.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
Another less understandable version of this would be the restrictions
placed on other intelligence agencies. For instance, if you happened
to somehow survive working intelligence under stalin, you don't say
a thing. You don't have the same name at this point,
(23:03):
you know what I mean? You just run away and
hope Joseph doesn't find you this. Does that sound too
anti Russian?
Speaker 5 (23:11):
Okay, I think it's also fine to be anti Russian
kind of suck.
Speaker 3 (23:14):
Okay, we'll keep the whole thing in with this.
Speaker 7 (23:18):
H the.
Speaker 3 (23:21):
I don't know, you know, conspiracy realist. Matt, you are
absolutely correct, and Noel, you are absolutely correct as well.
I would argue there is I would argue this is
sort of a checkpoint thing. It doesn't necessarily stop people,
(23:42):
but if you're at that level, then you wouldn't. You
should already know not to cross certain lines, you know
what I mean.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
I'm sure that's been drilled into your head a couple times.
Speaker 4 (23:56):
Of y'all. I'm so excited.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
I just found the online web portal to quote contact CIA,
and there's an online form you can fill out and
just by me clicking on it, I'm assuming somebody's got
a portal open on the other side, just waiting to
watch what I type in here. You can find it
if you go to CIA dot gov slash contact dash CIA.
Speaker 4 (24:21):
It's really cool. That is cool.
Speaker 5 (24:23):
It's literally like a like a contact US form, like yeah,
a business website.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
But it's got it's really cool. It's got some kind
of java or active animation, So when you hover over
you know where you'd put your name or your email
or phone number in there, it actively is like animating,
which makes it feel like it's logging watching you.
Speaker 5 (24:45):
Yeah, I'm looking up some of the plots of this
Tom King hundred issue Batman run and for some reason
in my head when we interviewed him back at Comic Con,
I just seem to remember there was so plot points
that revolved around war or like military stuff.
Speaker 4 (25:04):
But now I'm not seeing that.
Speaker 5 (25:05):
So I am a little skeptical as to whether he
would have had to have all these scripts reviewed because
but I don't know, Ben. I guess the question there
becomes how broad is this application by the CIA. Like
in the website it says wine tasting or stamp collecting.
But if you're doing a fictional series about a you know,
(25:26):
a crime fighting, vigilante individual who might use tools that
could have been inspired by military technology or intelligence, does
that potentially fall under this, you know, need for review.
Speaker 3 (25:41):
Well, let's also think, for example, in the world of Batman,
that's pretty intense conversations about Batman. Recently, in Christopher Nolan's
film adaptation Batman, they deploy a spirit. Even before that,
they deploy a fictional version of a real life project
(26:02):
called Skyhook.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Yeah wait, is that Batman begins that we're talking about?
Or I think that's The Knight.
Speaker 4 (26:09):
Darnest the way they extract him from like.
Speaker 5 (26:13):
They whip him out of an apartment, you know, with
the little like harness or whatever, just yanks.
Speaker 4 (26:18):
Him right on out of there. But that was real.
It was a way of extracting people from ops.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
It was it was a pitch that.
Speaker 5 (26:26):
It was more of an experimental thing. Okay, got it,
dang it necessarily Okay, I see.
Speaker 3 (26:30):
That's what we're going to go with.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
The movies are getting just jumbled in my head. Batman begins.
The first one, The Dark Knight is the second one?
The Dark Knight Rises is the third one? Is it
the second or third film?
Speaker 3 (26:43):
Think it's it's the second. It's the one with the
it's the one with the current best joker.
Speaker 4 (26:50):
Jared agreed, Killer rewatched that recently.
Speaker 3 (26:53):
Also boy holds up Also no, uh no shade, not
to disparage you, Queen Phoenix, am I saying that correct?
Speaker 4 (27:02):
His joy Joaquin?
Speaker 3 (27:04):
All right, well, Joaquin Phoenix has a very different joker.
Which exists in a different universe. To your question, Matt,
Dark Knight, The Dark Knight, the second of that trilogy
by Christopher Nolan, is the one that is perhaps the
most sort of espionage based I would argue, right, because
(27:27):
to your point, Noel, that is like the spoiler, by
the way, folks, that is the film wherein mass surveillance
is deployed like mass echo location.
Speaker 4 (27:39):
Right, yep.
Speaker 5 (27:40):
And I am looking at some panels from some of
these Tom Kine Batman comics, and there's a.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
Lot of depictions of soldiers.
Speaker 5 (27:47):
There's a lot of depictions of like sniper type situations
and things that could potentially have been influenced by stuff
that Tom King experienced as a participant in CIA operation.
Speaker 4 (27:59):
So I think it does make sense.
Speaker 5 (28:01):
But again the question then becomes it is obviously at
the discretion of the CIA what falls under that you know,
that umbrella. So really the answer is no, you never
really stop being CIA, because they're always going to kind
of have their hooks in you in terms of what
you can and cannot say, you know, but it's it's sorry.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Guys, And now I'm in all of this Batman world.
I'm thinking about Scarecrow and the portrayal in the dark
night of that and that's what I mean, like some
of that stuff that was going on.
Speaker 4 (28:35):
Hmmm.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
Silly Murphy, by the way, just seems like a badass
human being.
Speaker 4 (28:39):
Oh, he seems lovely.
Speaker 5 (28:40):
I love his like bored, like the memes of him
just looking really bored and listless during light pressers or whatever.
Speaker 4 (28:48):
So man, I think we're good with that one. Huge
thanks Matt for this food for thought here.
Speaker 5 (28:53):
I think he got all of us, got all of
our gear spinning a little bit, and yeah, it just
really does us all up to the discretion of the
CIA as to what falls under you know, what might
be considered subject to review in terms of art writing.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
Heck music, who knows.
Speaker 5 (29:11):
You know, if you're writing songs that have stuff in
them that could potentially spill the beans about some sort
of secret op, they'd probably want to know about that.
Speaker 4 (29:20):
So we're gonna take a.
Speaker 5 (29:21):
Quick break here a word from our sponsor, and then
come back with another message from you.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
Welcome back and congratulations to everyone who survived the ad break.
We're glad that you are here. One important note about disclosure.
If you work with any sort of intelligence operation, you
might not be aware that you are doing so. And
(29:51):
again I just want to point out that, yes, it's
an imperfect track record, but not all of these people
are bad. Sometimes the news and indeed history can become
can have a weaponized narrative, right, the story can get twisted,
and that may indeed be the case in Colorado recently.
(30:15):
We want to give a huge thanks to multiple fellow
conspiracy realists tuning in tonight hopefully joining us at the campfire,
Captain Crimson Fox Christa from Key West at All who
wrote in and asked us what the heck is going
on with Venezuelan gangs in Colorado. Now, we talked about
(30:39):
this a little bit off air. The logline right like
the elevator pitch of this is the idea that organized
crime based from Venezuela is overtaking residential apartment blocks and
that the local govern is wilfully playing the proverbial ostrich
(31:04):
and sticking their heads in the ground.
Speaker 4 (31:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
I remember encountering this, just studying up for a strange
news episode and looking for, you know, articles that were
out there that we could cover. And there was one
story specifically about a woman in Colorado that caught some
strange activity in her apartment complex on a ring camera
and was attempting to use it to prove to the
local police that there was.
Speaker 4 (31:28):
Gang activity happening.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
That's at least how I found this story for the
first time.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Yeah, in this experience, I got some direct reach outs
regarding this. We'll read the correspondence from Captain. Hello, you
can call me captain c APTI n you can call
me cap ten. I guess we would pronounce it chapin
cap cap. Please feel free says Captain, to use my
(31:58):
name and message on air if you I'm from northern
Colorado and a family living near where this is happening,
Luckily not close enough to be directly affected. I stumbled
across a headline on Reddit and did a little digging.
There are only a few articles about it so far.
The mayor did make a statement that it was vague,
(32:20):
had no hint of a plan of what they were
going to do. It seems like mister mayor is hinting
at a larger conspiracy. Perhaps I'm just sort of shocked
that this is not a bigger deal. Seems like kind
of a big deal, but I'm no expert. Where were
the police is anyone doing anything about this. Are things
(32:43):
like this happening elsewhere and are not being publicized? And
then Captain ends on a very nice note saying, thank
you all for being a voice that's logical, rational and
get this, guys downright entertaining. In these chaotic days, we're
blessing aw shucks. But he links to the same video
(33:07):
that you bet are describing, and then we have you know,
Christa from Key West is writing in with the same thing.
Crimson Fox is writing in as well, and the concern
seems to be that this is a collapseive rule of law, Right,
(33:29):
that's the idea. Yeah, I'd love to hear you guys'
thoughts on this before we dive into the specifics of
trende Aragua.
Speaker 2 (33:38):
Well, I'm so sorry, guys, I don't have the original
reporting in front of me that I stumbled upon in
the video that I watched when I first encountered this.
Speaker 4 (33:48):
But what I.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
Recall hearing, at least from the witness who took that video,
who ended up moving out of the apartment complex. I think,
with the help of like a major city official, helter
move out of the apartment comp because she was so
fearful of her own life. But the response initially that
she got when she would try and report gang activity
or you know, what she thought was gang activity in
(34:11):
her apartment complex, the response from the police was, yes,
of course, we'll send somebody out there. But behind the scenes,
they wouldn't deploy anyone to check out anything in that
at that apartment complex or in the immediate vicinity of
that apartment complex unless they could send four officers right
in total, or more four or four officers for a
(34:32):
single call. And that very rarely happened or was able
to happen.
Speaker 3 (34:37):
And I am immensely, immensely excited that you bring that
aspect of it to bear here, Matt. As far as
we understand, the story goes viral around August twenty eighth
of twenty twenty four, a local TV station out of Denver, Colorado,
(34:58):
or a reporter that station post a video on Twitter
which I refuse to call X because that's just a
stupid name. The post on Twitter showing this video that
you Crimson Fox and Key Wes Christa and Captain are describing,
and if you watch it, it shows a group of men, right,
(35:20):
four of whom are visually armed and they're entering an apartment.
This is not occurring in Denver. It is occurring in
a suburb of Denver, Aurora.
Speaker 4 (35:33):
That's where Wayne's world is said.
Speaker 3 (35:34):
Sorry, I just love the joy that you had with that.
Speaker 5 (35:40):
Party on, then please carry and carry on party on.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
The reporter is working for specifically a regional outlet KDVR
Fox thirty one and this is, you know, an affiliate
franchise of the Fox network. The claim is there is
some sort of takeover right and l EO will not
(36:05):
respond for one reason or another, sort of like the
Favella in Brazil where Bope is not gonna rock in
unless they're functioning as a military force. This is where
we get to things that I don't know, muddy the water,
(36:28):
as we said earlier, because it's hitting the zeitgeist. It's
a little bit of a dog whistle in my opinion.
Or regarding immigration, we know that Uncle Sam created many
of the monsters it now purports the hunt and you
can see that the world over.
Speaker 5 (36:49):
Armed them, you know, yeah, gave them an ideological reason
to exist.
Speaker 2 (36:55):
Well, it's true, and yet simultaneously, just as we covered
in Strange News this week, there are weird occurrences lower
level occurrences where they're like with the what do we
call it criminal tourism or crime tourism things that are
happening where they are. Enterprise is built up for that
very thing. It's not the same as the dog whistles
(37:18):
stuff that's happening.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
Yeah, it's not the same. Look, and I appreciate us
bringing that up because the gang that is accused, in specific,
the organized criminal outfit is TREND de Aragua, and this
is a real outfit, just like how MS thirteen is
a real thing. They're bad dudes, they're hard cases, they're
(37:43):
not good. You don't want to hang out with them,
just to be honest, and they are considered a transnational
criminal organization that came from the Biden administration back in
twenty twenty four. The issue, though, is that when the
police of Aurora, Colorado made a statement about this, they
(38:06):
said the following quote, we are aware that components of
TDA are operating in Aurora. APD has been Aurora Police
Department has been increasingly collecting evidence to show the gang
is connected to crimes in the area. However, as we
have said previously, and as the DEA similarly stated, it
(38:30):
would be improper at this time for the city and
APD to make any conclusory statements about specific incidents or
provide details about law enforcement strategy and operations. So to
unpack that. What they are saying is, yes, the gang
is real, or at least groups of people purporting to
(38:54):
be associated with this gang are operating in this suburb
Denver Overalls metro area. But we can't say whether the
claims you're hearing from your local Fox news station are
in fact true. And this makes me think, you, guys,
(39:15):
gang activity. Gang activity can often be decentralized, you know
what I mean? Like right, Like uh, I.
Speaker 5 (39:24):
Mean sometimes they operate very similar lead to the way
terrorist cells operate, right.
Speaker 3 (39:29):
So that that's a great example, because let's imagine then,
let's say you commit a crazy crime, a notable crime.
Let's say instead of podcasting, we all saw like god
in sixty seconds and got super into grand theft auto.
Speaker 4 (39:46):
We're just steal in there.
Speaker 3 (39:48):
You get in situations at phase. We had a phase,
and so let's say that one of us gets apprehended
stealing all these Aston Martins in these lamb bows, and
one of us who gets caught says we're part of
something bigger, something you cannot imagine. We're actually, I don't
(40:09):
know what's a fun gang. We're the Apple Dumpling Gang.
Speaker 5 (40:13):
Oh, I thought you said a fun game, and I
was gonna say Tittley Winks, But that would also be
a fun name for a gang, the Tiddley Winks Boys.
Speaker 3 (40:22):
Tidle Winks Boys, and so let's imagine then there is
a Tittley Winks Boys, or there is an Apple Dumpling Gang.
They exist somewhere else in the world. We've never really
hung out with them. We're not. They don't consider us
part of their larger organization. We're just claiming.
Speaker 4 (40:43):
False flag almost.
Speaker 3 (40:44):
Yeah, the Crip and Blood example would be false flag.
That's what I think. I think the most important part
of this is to remember that there were people endangered.
Right There were a rest of two folks who, as
law enforcement describes them, had gang ties. What does that mean?
Speaker 4 (41:10):
Ganggang?
Speaker 2 (41:11):
What does that mean?
Speaker 4 (41:12):
What gangang? Yeah, it just means like bitchin Oh. I
may be using it completely incorrectly.
Speaker 3 (41:19):
It's like when you hit someone with a thumbs up
emoji in the text.
Speaker 7 (41:23):
That's what is Yeah, well, hey, speaking of gangang for us, guys,
call back to Matt who wrote into us in twenty
twenty by the way I found it, I found the
episode Matt was referencing.
Speaker 2 (41:41):
It is titled your News Agency or the CIA colon
the Story of Operation Mockingbird. A banger of an episode.
If if we do say so ourselves.
Speaker 4 (41:51):
Have we released that as a classic recently? If not,
maybe we should.
Speaker 2 (41:56):
I don't think so, but it is worth your time.
Talks about infiltration of news agencies by the agency.
Speaker 3 (42:02):
And in August thirtieth, twenty twenty four, statement on Facebook,
the mayor of Aurora, Colorado, Mike Kaufman, said they're going
to request a court order to clear out this apartment
complex with the idea that they would or with the
aim that they would get these quote, get these properties
(42:24):
back under the control of the property owners.
Speaker 2 (42:27):
Now we're at did we mention the name of the property.
Speaker 3 (42:31):
Let's say it the Fitzsimmons Place apartments.
Speaker 2 (42:35):
Oh wow, I was looking at Whispering Pines apartments.
Speaker 3 (42:39):
Yeah, there are multiple multiple things in.
Speaker 4 (42:43):
Play here, Holy mackerel.
Speaker 3 (42:46):
We're also thinking of the Edge at Lowry right, that's
one of our camb places named. So in general, we
see the allegation or the accusation being that a look,
an armed gang functioning in concert is essentially a militia,
(43:06):
you know what I mean. So what we are looking
at here is the idea that some sort of militant
force is violating rule of law, and that the law
is somehow unable or unwilling to crack down. And this
is I don't know, man, it's dangerous because it's such rich,
(43:31):
fertile soil for people who want to push a given narrative,
you know what I.
Speaker 2 (43:36):
Mean, absolutely, And it's also a super difficult situation. Some
you know, it doesn't matter how big your police department is,
do you really want your department to go to war
with a gang?
Speaker 7 (43:49):
Like?
Speaker 2 (43:50):
Really do you want that? Probably not if you're an
elected official like the mayor or you know, a police chief.
He was, I guess not elected. But still it's I
can imagine it being a real tight spot, Like what
actions do I take here to make Oh gosh, it's
it's personal, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (44:09):
It's to make myself look good? Hey, Bobby?
Speaker 5 (44:11):
And though this is not Illinois, this is Colorado. Wayne's
world did not take place in Aurora, Colorado. It was Illinois,
but we tied a little conversation off Mike and I
just think this kind of loss of control by a
city is the kind of stuff that oftentimes politicians when
they're trying to kind of demonize cities, referring to them
(44:34):
as quote unquote like war zones.
Speaker 4 (44:36):
This is the kind of stuff you picture, isn't.
Speaker 3 (44:37):
It You also purported loss of control.
Speaker 1 (44:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (44:43):
The thing is if you go to like if you
go to the Denver Post, if you go to the
other local news affiliates like NBC or ABC super creative names, guys,
what you'll see is interviews. What you well, ABC or
NBC is a series of interviews with people who actually
(45:06):
live in these apartment complexes. And a lot of these folks,
candidly are what you would call migrants if you're a politician.
And when they're asked whether a gang is taking over,
they're all saying no. And when they're asked whether they
feel safe, they also say no. But the reason these
(45:28):
folks say that they do not feel safe is because
these apartment complex management companies are apparently asleep at the wheel,
like they're not doing basic upkeep and you know, health
code stuff.
Speaker 5 (45:43):
Dude, This is just the kind of story I could
see certain politicians getting a hold of and having a
field day with though you know what I mean, like
in terms of like pointing to problems with immigration, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (45:53):
Because I have two things just that I noticed in
re looking at some of these articles. The first is
that these apartments, at least Whispering Pine apartments, they are
described as affordable housing essentially, and it does mention that
it is mostly they say Hispanic families, working class families.
That's the way it's at least described by CBS. And
(46:15):
in there they note that rents go from anywhere from
fourteen hundred dollars a month to two thousand dollars a
month for affordable housing. But I mean, but really that
blows my mind. First of all, that that's the price
that you pay for an apartment complex that is described
in that way.
Speaker 4 (46:34):
The second thing.
Speaker 2 (46:35):
Is that I kept trying to figure out why I
remember Aurora, Colorado. Yeah, and we just talked about the
Christopher Nolan Batman movies. If you go back to twenty twelve,
that's when there was the shooting at the Aurora Theater,
which is it was at the dark Knight Rises screening.
So just sorry, the weird connections there are all present here.
Speaker 5 (46:56):
Yeah, it seems like there's a few little red threads
acting some of our stories today.
Speaker 3 (47:02):
And one thing that I would note here as well,
it's not uncommon for certain aspects of the American population
to immediately conflate any large gathering of people they don't
care for with crime. You know what I mean, you
gotta go. You got a bunch of You got a
(47:24):
bunch of Albanians, you know, at a cookout. That doesn't
make them the mafia, right, Or I should say, you
got a bunch of Sicilians, you know, somewhere off the turnpike,
just hanging out at a picnic. That doesn't make them
the mafia. That doesn't make them Coaster Nostra or whatever.
(47:45):
There is a great requirement the US is still dealing with,
which is how do I recognize the people I meet
here as not dangerous strangers, but as neighbors. And if
you if you live so where in this country, someone
probably lives pretty close to you, learn about them. You know,
(48:08):
not to be too ted lasso about this because I'm
still recovering from our adoption episode, but be curious, you
know what I mean. Don't tell people who they are
in your head, ask them to tell you who they
are in their head.
Speaker 2 (48:24):
It reminds me of that M One song. I think
it's m One called Confidential. We're just talking about, you know,
get to know your neighbors, but also you ever noticed
that there's one neighbor who's really nosy.
Speaker 4 (48:38):
And if we don't have it, it might be.
Speaker 6 (48:41):
Right.
Speaker 3 (48:42):
And with that we are going to call it an evening.
We are off to noctivigate. Thank you again, fellow conspiracy realist,
for joining us here in the dark. We want to
hang out with you, perhaps on an episode, perhaps on
a few future listener mail or strange News. Tell us
(49:03):
your thoughts. We try to be easy to find online.
I forgot to put that part in.
Speaker 4 (49:07):
It's the game boy, do we ever?
Speaker 5 (49:09):
You can find it at the handle conspiracy Stuff, where
we exist all over the internets, on.
Speaker 4 (49:13):
Facebook where we have our Facebook group. Here's where it
gets crazy. Join up, get in on the conversation.
Speaker 5 (49:18):
It's a lot of fun, good folks. They're good memings
as well. You can find us on YouTube, where we
have video content for you to enjoy, and on.
Speaker 4 (49:27):
X fka Twitter.
Speaker 5 (49:29):
I don't like saying x either man on Instagram and TikTok. However,
we are Conspiracy Stuff show.
Speaker 2 (49:35):
Hey, if you are looking for some video content related
to this episode, why not head on over to our
YouTube channel. As Noel said, conspiracy Stuff, check out Project
Artichoke colon the Manchurian Candidate. It's a great video. It's
only ten years old at this point.
Speaker 4 (49:51):
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
Hey, if you want to call us, our number is
one eight three three STDWYTQ. That's just stuff they don't
want you to know in letter form that you have
to turn into numbers.
Speaker 4 (50:04):
Good luck.
Speaker 2 (50:05):
If you pass the test, you can leave a three
minute voicemail, give yourself a cool nickname, and say whatever
you'd like do. Let us know if we can use
your name and message on the air, And if you've
got more to say they can fit in that voicemail.
Why not instead send us a good old fashioned email.
Speaker 3 (50:19):
We are the entities that read every piece of correspondence
we receive. Be well aware, yet unafraid. Sometimes the void
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Stuff they don't want you to know is a production
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From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
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production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,
my name is Noah.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
They call me Ben. We are joined as always with
our super producer, all Mission Control Decant. Most importantly, you
are You are here. That makes this the stuff they
don't want you to know. Oh, finally again we say it.
It's a tumnal you know, here in the fair metropolis
of Atlanta, Georgia, coming to you semi live from the
(00:51):
United States. We are so excited. What's that line from
Hell Raisers like I have such wonders to show you.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
Yeah, you know, kinky wonders.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
I think it's hell Razors singular too, think it is.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
It's you know, it's funny.
Speaker 5 (01:07):
I was. Actually there's a bunch of like deep divy
YouTube explorations of the Cenobites and the hell Razor universe,
and they're apparently not actually demons at all. No, yeah,
they're just weird kinky zombies.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Oh, I didn't know that, you know, Uh, I don't
know if you guys ever have this sensation that maybe
someone is well, very heller if you wake up in
the middle of the night and well, we all have animals.
If your animal is acting weird when you wake up
in the middle of the night and you get this
the hair stand up in the back of your neck
and you're like, something's wrong, something's off. My go to
(01:43):
line when I walk around the house with my you know,
my bat usually my implement. Yeah right, yeah, the one
that Ben gave me. It's so good, Ben, I will say,
quietly and sinisterly, I can smell you.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
I just say, show yourself.
Speaker 4 (02:03):
Shut yourself, coward.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
That's great, man, that's great that you sleep at night sometimes.
Speaker 6 (02:11):
Bro.
Speaker 5 (02:11):
Since I've quit drinking, I've been getting solid seven and
a half a night baby tracked on.
Speaker 4 (02:17):
My Apple Watch. That's also tracking.
Speaker 5 (02:19):
All of my other metrics and funneling them directly to
the NSA.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
Man, they're all loading up, dude, Apple watch, all the
sleep cutting boards.
Speaker 5 (02:29):
When you write it all down like that, I really
am living the life of the well.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
I asked, I asked Matt on one of our group
conversations earlier, or I asked, both you guys, let's be
fair uh for recommendations on house cleaning services, and Noel
had a great recommendation and actual actionable Yeah. And then
Matt was like, there's a naked guy who goes through
(02:57):
my house about twice a week.
Speaker 4 (02:59):
It's me, by the way.
Speaker 5 (03:00):
Yeah, he said he looks a lot like me. And
he said, actually I think he is. I said, don't
get your ding ding caught in the bread box.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
My son was in the vehicle when I was when
I texted that to you guys, and he didn't see
the initial thing, but then he saw notifications that you
guys were texting me come up and he and he
clicked on it, because you can, he reached them and
he clicked on it, and it was a response to it.
And then I had to explain the joke that I
had made to you.
Speaker 5 (03:27):
Also it was it my don't get your ding down
caught in the bread box? That was he had questions understandable, and.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
The cutting board reference there was entirely for you, Matt.
I felt bad, Noel that that you thought I was
talking about your your cutting board pursuits. I just think
a kitchen is a dangerous place to come.
Speaker 6 (03:47):
Now.
Speaker 4 (03:47):
Then you know it was a call back to my
cutting board.
Speaker 3 (03:50):
This was not, it was not. I'm not being fair
enough anyway. That's a killery it is. That's our cold open.
This is listener mail.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
And we've returned and we are jumping immediately to the
phone lines to hear a message from Young's Skip. He
calls himself Crazy Skip. He's a distinguished gentleman who's seen
a lot of what life has to offer. He's a
Vietnam veteran, he's a retired firefighter, and he wants us
to look into something, something very specific that's also related
(04:28):
to a two parter classic episode that we released in
the recent past and we've explored extensively.
Speaker 4 (04:35):
He's also very.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Interested in a certain book that he's read multiple times,
and he believes the contents to be true, or at
least based in factual events. So we're going to look
at that today, and let's say, we're going to scratch
the surface and see where it takes us. So here's
our message from Crazy Skip.
Speaker 6 (04:55):
Hey guys, this is Crazy Skip from Baltimore. I've read
Kathy O'Brien's book Transformation of America three times. Her partner
Mark Phillips saved her life. He's deceased God somehow in
two twenty seventeen. Don't know how, but I've read her
(05:18):
book three times and couldn't put it down. And what
she's saying is true. I really believe it. From an
old conspiracy theorist of seventy six Vietnam, that entire firefighter
that's done it all. And now I love you guys.
(05:38):
Love conspiracy theories, love conspiracy for realists. That's what we are.
Thanks for what you do.
Speaker 4 (05:48):
Keep it up there we go.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
Thank you so much, first of all for sending us
that message, for spending time with us, Crazy Skip. We
love that you're a part of the show, and I
don't know, gives me a lot of joy. It probably
does for you guys too, Just knowing that you're out
there listening to us when we're talking.
Speaker 5 (06:04):
Absolutely, I'm consistently surprised that that is the case. There
are people out there in internet land listening to We're.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
All here together, you know what I mean, gathered around
a campfire in the dark, I think, and Crazy Skip
looking forward to meeting you. Looking forward also to some
advice about best restaurants in Baltimore, because I got to
go back to Mount Vernon. I don't remember if I
(06:33):
told you guys this.
Speaker 4 (06:34):
Do tell or keep your secrets.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
Well, there's a great museum there. It's gonna be fine.
Crazy Skip has read a book three times, Yes, correct.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
Yes, a very specific book that you're going to have
trouble looking it up unless you hear this. The title
is spelled trance t R a n CE space for
of America love it. So yeah, there's spaces between the
other words. But just it's not transformation, it's transformation. And
(07:10):
the subtitle is an MK Ultra Mind Control Survivor, a
Whistleblower's true story. So I have never heard of this
book before. I have, however, heard about the author the
authors of this book, because guys, we've talked about this before.
But Roseanne Barr has a podcast.
Speaker 5 (07:31):
Yeah, that's the one where RFK Junior revealed his old
bear debacle.
Speaker 4 (07:36):
Yes, she has an awkward interview of all time.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
She has a way of just getting through to people,
you know, as she did when she was on television.
Speaker 4 (07:45):
I remember watching your show a.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
Lot, and I think it's episode twenty one. It is
episode twenty one of her podcast. She had this author
Kathy O'Brien on as a guest and at least I
listened through some of it, not the entirety of the episode.
But these two people, roseannebar and Kathy O'Brien, are very
good friends. They've known each other for a long time,
(08:07):
and they had a very frank discussion about the contents
of this book, as though it is very much real
and everything that it's said to have happened inside that
book occurred. So let's go for just a basic description
of this book. And I'm taking this from the website
Trance dashformation dot com. Quote Transformation of America is the
(08:30):
documented autobiography of a victim of government mind control. Kathy
O'Brien is the only vocal and recovered survivor of the
Central Intelligence Agencies MK Ultra project Monarch mind control operation.
Before we go any further, guys, we've talked about MK Ultra.
(08:50):
It is a real thing. There are documents that you
can find that were declassified, some of it still redacted,
but you can see the actual documents about this mind
control attempt, this operation, this thing that is known as
MK Ultra. Guys, do you want to just talk about
it a little bit about what this program was, the
(09:12):
stuff we know.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
Yeah, Mkultra is the tip of an iceberg accidentally discovered
by the American public through remnants of documents that were
miss assigned. They were not where they were supposed to be.
All the other stuff. The vast majority of documentation and
(09:34):
research from mk Ultra was destroyed well in advance. The
global public will never know the full extent of the
CIA just kind of doing what we call FAFO, right, Yeah,
freak around and futs out.
Speaker 5 (09:52):
I mean, basically, among other things, dosing unsuspecting civilians with
LSD to find out what happens. Yeah, if anyone wants
to dig a little deeper into that, there's a really
cool iHeart original series called Operation Midnight Climax, which was
another name for that program. I was lucky enough to
(10:13):
be able to narrate that, but I didn't do any
of the writing or any of that is all our
amazing team headed by Jason English, but really cool music
and sound design. It's a really fun show, and it
really digs deep into this whole program.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
And just to set the stage here to light the
candles at this dinner or for this ritual in k
Ultra is a proven conspiracy, a proven set of conspiracies.
As you said no, Operation Midnight Climax is a stem
to stern Banger and worth a listen it. Also it
(10:46):
goes into detail with the idea of dosing people with
LSD height of the Cold War kind of thing, partially
to figure out whether one could create a truth serum
which doesn't really exist, and then also to ideate on
whether we could program people via the generation of like
(11:08):
different personalities Sirhan Sirhan type time windowed or freeze triggered.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Yes, and if you're interested in this actual program, also
see Project Artichoke as well as I think Bluebird is
the other title that was given to this. These are
provable things that the Central Intelligence Agency did where they
were looking at all that kind of stuff, but also
using not just LSD and other you know, psychoactive substances,
(11:38):
using isolation, psychological torture techniques, essentially ways to make interrogations.
Speaker 4 (11:47):
More effective, enhance them. There that perhaps there you go.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
To make ah, to make a feel like you have
lost the anchor of what you define as yourself. Yeah,
such that there's just a little butterfly that replaces you.
Speaker 4 (12:04):
Oh God.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
And this all begins post World War two, as we
get into real Cold War tensions in the early nineteen fifties.
This is a real thing.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
Now.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
The other thing that is mentioned in here is Project Monarch. Now,
that is a thing that, at least to my mind, guys,
has been alleged but is not but is not documented
in the same way that Artichoke, Bluebird and mk Ultra
are documented. Monarch is the alleged version of this that
(12:38):
goes way beyond any of the official stuff. And there
are allegations that this is the program that has caught
people up. Like Britney Spears, we talked about that in
the past. Project Monarch has caught up other people and
it involves often sexual abuse, it involves way more psycho
(13:00):
logical torture, and again the attempts essentially to get someone
under total control. We have to say again, there are
allegations of this. This is an alleged thing, but this
book and this person are saying this is absolutely true,
and Kathy is saying I was a victim of this. So, guys,
(13:21):
we are going to continue exploring what Kathy and Transformation
of America says. By going to another page on their website,
it's the about Mark and Kathy page. You can find
it pretty easily. And this is where we will learn
a little bit more about Kathy herself as well as
Mark Phillips, her partner who did pass away in twenty seventeen.
(13:43):
As Skip said in the message there, Mark Phillips, at
least according to the writings on the website, is a
person that assisted Kathy from escaping the clutches of whatever
she was going through, as well as documented these things.
But it goes back to regression therapies that we've also
(14:04):
talked about on the show, Guys. And if you go
through this about page, you're going to find information that
Guys I can only describe as wild. It feels like, well,
you know, what's that quote about claims and.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
Needing extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I'm paraphrasing, but yes,
exceptional claims require exceptional evidence something something, Yes.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
So, but you can learn about Mark and how he
at least according to this bio which looks like it
was written by him, he says his first encounter with
mind control research began in the late nineteen sixties in Atlanta, Georgia,
at Emory University in the Primate Center there.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
And then you know he was interested in that stuff.
He was apparently what is it?
Speaker 2 (15:00):
He worked for the DoD as a contractor, and then
he met Kathy O'Brien. Then he says he was able
to quote liberate MK Ultra victims, Kathy O'Brien and her
daughter from the invisible grip of the US government's secret
weapon of control.
Speaker 4 (15:18):
It's a bold claim. It is a bold claim.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
There are very important human beings in history and US
politics that are mentioned, specifically by Kathy O'Brien, that were
allegedly involved in some of the stuff. Look it up,
see what you think it feels. It feels intense to
me and requires way more proof than is currently there.
According to them, the proof is not allowed to be
(15:44):
shown because it is against the law. That's according to
Mark and Kathy O'Brien. They can't even share the real stuff.
So I don't know, come up with your own ideas
about it. But you know, maybe if you're like Skip,
you're gonna believe it fully, maybe going to be more skeptical.
Just take it, Just take the information and try and
process it, and then we'll look at it again.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
And we would love primary sources because continually, the devilish, dangerous,
tantalizing thing about projects like mk Ultra is. We only
know part of it exactly.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
So we're gonna hear a couple more words from our sponsor.
We'll be right back with more messages from you.
Speaker 5 (16:32):
And we have returned with another couple of pieces actually
of listener mail messages from you.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
Yes, you.
Speaker 5 (16:42):
This first one coming from Matt, and it's about the
CIA and the question of do you ever really stop
being CIA?
Speaker 3 (16:53):
He's also different man, Yeah, different.
Speaker 4 (16:55):
Man, that's right. And you know it's funny, guys.
Speaker 5 (16:57):
I actually, you know, when we do these listener mails,
I kind of research or inbox or whatever using keywords
from you messages coming to us from a certain email address.
I actually accidentally searched for our old email address, the
old House Stuff Works conspiracy blog email, and that's where
this one came from. So this is probably referencing something
we said many, many, many years ago.
Speaker 4 (17:18):
But it really grabbed me and I thought it was
a really cool.
Speaker 5 (17:21):
Thing to discuss because this is not something that I
knew or had thought about.
Speaker 4 (17:25):
So mac starts.
Speaker 5 (17:27):
On a recent episode, you asked the question do you
ever stop being CIA? Now, I am not part of
the CIA, but my grandfather was in the fifties and sixties.
By the time I was born in the early seventies,
he had retired and gone on to being a high
school history teacher. He used to tell us stories of
the countries that he and his family had lived in
during his career in the Agency, but very rarely did
(17:49):
we actually hear any stories about operations that he'd been
a part of. I guess my personal experience tells me
that he was always aware of what he could and
could not talk about to his immediate family, but his
time in the Agency was solidly part of his past.
One thing of note, however, everyone who works for the
CIA signs an agreement that they have to have all
(18:12):
artwork and writing approved by the CIA before it can
be published. Ostensibly this is to prevent the leakage, intentional
or otherwise, of classified information. This means that the comics
writer Tom King, for example, has to have every Batman
script approved by.
Speaker 4 (18:29):
The CIA before it can be published.
Speaker 5 (18:31):
To that extent, I think that, no, the CIA never
really stops being a part.
Speaker 4 (18:37):
Of your life. Matt.
Speaker 5 (18:40):
That blew my mind, and I guess it makes sense,
But there was a part of me that was even like,
is this true?
Speaker 4 (18:46):
No, shade on you, Matt.
Speaker 5 (18:47):
I was just like, this seems insanely broad, and I
sure enough. The CIA website CIA dot gov has an
entire page dedicated to something called the Pre Publication Classification
Review Board, and it does seem to largely revolve around
things like memoirs and you know, recounting one's time specifically
(19:13):
in the CIA, but it can absolutely pertain to fictionalizations
of those things, you know, for the very reason that
Matt said, the idea that something that shouldn't be public
information could intentionally or accidentally be leaked.
Speaker 4 (19:28):
This is from the website itself. Definition of publication.
Speaker 5 (19:31):
The CIA Secrecy Agreement requires such communication to be submitted
for pre publication review and approved prior to discussing the
material with or showing it to individuals such as a publisher,
co author, agent, editor, ghostwriter, personal representative, family member, or
assistant relating to CIA or intelligence activities. Former and current
(19:55):
CIA officers and contractors are not required to submit all
proposed publications for prep plication review. For example, the requirement
does not apply to material created around subjects such as gardening,
wine tasting, stamp collecting, or sports. These are likely to
be outside of the purview of the CIA mission and intelligence. However,
commentary on matters such as intelligence operations or tradecraft, even
(20:17):
fictional works, foreign intelligence, foreign events, or intelligence interest, one's
career at CIA, scientific or technological developments discussed in an
intelligence context, and other topics that touch upon CIA interest
or responsibilities need PCRB approval.
Speaker 4 (20:35):
Guys, I bet you already knew this. I did not
know this.
Speaker 5 (20:39):
The comics angle is interesting because I do think Tom
King some of his run of Batman there's like a
military side to it.
Speaker 4 (20:46):
There's like kind of like a spy sort of bent
to it.
Speaker 5 (20:51):
So maybe that's not true that he has to have
every single script reviewed. Ben, you seem a little skeptical
on that front, But I do believe Tom King, who
we met at Comic Con one year, a former colleague
of ours, Christian Seger, interviewed him for a video series
All the Old House Stuff Works YouTube. But if I
remember correctly, there was some kind of intelligence bent to
(21:15):
Tom King's Batman comics. So I don't know, Ben, what
do you think on that side? You're also probably more
familiar with the comics than me.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
Oh yeah, no comment, I have to send some emails first.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Well, I was just gonna say, this message from Matt
could be from a dozen two dozen episodes that we've
done in the past, because I can hear Ben's voice
ringing in my head every time we say X CIA officer.
You know Ben, where You're always.
Speaker 4 (21:42):
Like yeah, right, X is almost a joke.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
Also, also, this is one thing. One thing we can
say here is that this is a necessary stopgap measure, right.
There are more sinister versions of this, like this is
not inherently a bad thing to check in. We have
to remember that actionable intelligence is perishable, right. The real
(22:16):
kind of move by move secret beat me here, Paul.
The move by move secrets is kind of like when
you buy an avocado or a banana, it goes bad quick.
You know this, Max, right, right?
Speaker 5 (22:31):
And so yeah, I mean, but that's also why things
get declassified, yes, yeah, and when everything works as it
should now.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
Another less understandable version of this would be the restrictions
placed on other intelligence agencies. For instance, if you happened
to somehow survive working intelligence under stalin, you don't say
a thing. You don't have the same name at this point,
(23:03):
you know what I mean? You just run away and
hope Joseph doesn't find you this. Does that sound too
anti Russian?
Speaker 5 (23:11):
Okay, I think it's also fine to be anti Russian
kind of suck.
Speaker 3 (23:14):
Okay, we'll keep the whole thing in with this.
Speaker 7 (23:18):
H the.
Speaker 3 (23:21):
I don't know, you know, conspiracy realist. Matt, you are
absolutely correct, and Noel, you are absolutely correct as well.
I would argue there is I would argue this is
sort of a checkpoint thing. It doesn't necessarily stop people,
(23:42):
but if you're at that level, then you wouldn't. You
should already know not to cross certain lines, you know
what I mean.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
I'm sure that's been drilled into your head a couple times.
Speaker 4 (23:56):
Of y'all. I'm so excited.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
I just found the online web portal to quote contact CIA,
and there's an online form you can fill out and
just by me clicking on it, I'm assuming somebody's got
a portal open on the other side, just waiting to
watch what I type in here. You can find it
if you go to CIA dot gov slash contact dash CIA.
Speaker 4 (24:21):
It's really cool. That is cool.
Speaker 5 (24:23):
It's literally like a like a contact US form, like yeah,
a business website.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
But it's got it's really cool. It's got some kind
of java or active animation, So when you hover over
you know where you'd put your name or your email
or phone number in there, it actively is like animating,
which makes it feel like it's logging watching you.
Speaker 5 (24:45):
Yeah, I'm looking up some of the plots of this
Tom King hundred issue Batman run and for some reason
in my head when we interviewed him back at Comic Con,
I just seem to remember there was so plot points
that revolved around war or like military stuff.
Speaker 4 (25:04):
But now I'm not seeing that.
Speaker 5 (25:05):
So I am a little skeptical as to whether he
would have had to have all these scripts reviewed because
but I don't know, Ben. I guess the question there
becomes how broad is this application by the CIA. Like
in the website it says wine tasting or stamp collecting.
But if you're doing a fictional series about a you know,
(25:26):
a crime fighting, vigilante individual who might use tools that
could have been inspired by military technology or intelligence, does
that potentially fall under this, you know, need for review.
Speaker 3 (25:41):
Well, let's also think, for example, in the world of Batman,
that's pretty intense conversations about Batman. Recently, in Christopher Nolan's
film adaptation Batman, they deploy a spirit. Even before that,
they deploy a fictional version of a real life project
(26:02):
called Skyhook.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Yeah wait, is that Batman begins that we're talking about?
Or I think that's The Knight.
Speaker 4 (26:09):
Darnest the way they extract him from like.
Speaker 5 (26:13):
They whip him out of an apartment, you know, with
the little like harness or whatever, just yanks.
Speaker 4 (26:18):
Him right on out of there. But that was real.
It was a way of extracting people from ops.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
It was it was a pitch that.
Speaker 5 (26:26):
It was more of an experimental thing. Okay, got it,
dang it necessarily Okay, I see.
Speaker 3 (26:30):
That's what we're going to go with.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
The movies are getting just jumbled in my head. Batman begins.
The first one, The Dark Knight is the second one?
The Dark Knight Rises is the third one? Is it
the second or third film?
Speaker 3 (26:43):
Think it's it's the second. It's the one with the
it's the one with the current best joker.
Speaker 4 (26:50):
Jared agreed, Killer rewatched that recently.
Speaker 3 (26:53):
Also boy holds up Also no, uh no shade, not
to disparage you, Queen Phoenix, am I saying that correct?
Speaker 4 (27:02):
His joy Joaquin?
Speaker 3 (27:04):
All right, well, Joaquin Phoenix has a very different joker.
Which exists in a different universe. To your question, Matt,
Dark Knight, The Dark Knight, the second of that trilogy
by Christopher Nolan, is the one that is perhaps the
most sort of espionage based I would argue, right, because
(27:27):
to your point, Noel, that is like the spoiler, by
the way, folks, that is the film wherein mass surveillance
is deployed like mass echo location.
Speaker 4 (27:39):
Right, yep.
Speaker 5 (27:40):
And I am looking at some panels from some of
these Tom Kine Batman comics, and there's a.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
Lot of depictions of soldiers.
Speaker 5 (27:47):
There's a lot of depictions of like sniper type situations
and things that could potentially have been influenced by stuff
that Tom King experienced as a participant in CIA operation.
Speaker 4 (27:59):
So I think it does make sense.
Speaker 5 (28:01):
But again the question then becomes it is obviously at
the discretion of the CIA what falls under that you know,
that umbrella. So really the answer is no, you never
really stop being CIA, because they're always going to kind
of have their hooks in you in terms of what
you can and cannot say, you know, but it's it's sorry.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Guys, And now I'm in all of this Batman world.
I'm thinking about Scarecrow and the portrayal in the dark
night of that and that's what I mean, like some
of that stuff that was going on.
Speaker 4 (28:35):
Hmmm.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
Silly Murphy, by the way, just seems like a badass
human being.
Speaker 4 (28:39):
Oh, he seems lovely.
Speaker 5 (28:40):
I love his like bored, like the memes of him
just looking really bored and listless during light pressers or whatever.
Speaker 4 (28:48):
So man, I think we're good with that one. Huge
thanks Matt for this food for thought here.
Speaker 5 (28:53):
I think he got all of us, got all of
our gear spinning a little bit, and yeah, it just
really does us all up to the discretion of the
CIA as to what falls under you know, what might
be considered subject to review in terms of art writing.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
Heck music, who knows.
Speaker 5 (29:11):
You know, if you're writing songs that have stuff in
them that could potentially spill the beans about some sort
of secret op, they'd probably want to know about that.
Speaker 4 (29:20):
So we're gonna take a.
Speaker 5 (29:21):
Quick break here a word from our sponsor, and then
come back with another message from you.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
Welcome back and congratulations to everyone who survived the ad break.
We're glad that you are here. One important note about disclosure.
If you work with any sort of intelligence operation, you
might not be aware that you are doing so. And
(29:51):
again I just want to point out that, yes, it's
an imperfect track record, but not all of these people
are bad. Sometimes the news and indeed history can become
can have a weaponized narrative, right, the story can get twisted,
and that may indeed be the case in Colorado recently.
(30:15):
We want to give a huge thanks to multiple fellow
conspiracy realists tuning in tonight hopefully joining us at the campfire,
Captain Crimson Fox Christa from Key West at All who
wrote in and asked us what the heck is going
on with Venezuelan gangs in Colorado. Now, we talked about
(30:39):
this a little bit off air. The logline right like
the elevator pitch of this is the idea that organized
crime based from Venezuela is overtaking residential apartment blocks and
that the local govern is wilfully playing the proverbial ostrich
(31:04):
and sticking their heads in the ground.
Speaker 4 (31:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
I remember encountering this, just studying up for a strange
news episode and looking for, you know, articles that were
out there that we could cover. And there was one
story specifically about a woman in Colorado that caught some
strange activity in her apartment complex on a ring camera
and was attempting to use it to prove to the
local police that there was.
Speaker 4 (31:28):
Gang activity happening.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
That's at least how I found this story for the
first time.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Yeah, in this experience, I got some direct reach outs
regarding this. We'll read the correspondence from Captain. Hello, you
can call me captain c APTI n you can call
me cap ten. I guess we would pronounce it chapin
cap cap. Please feel free says Captain, to use my
(31:58):
name and message on air if you I'm from northern
Colorado and a family living near where this is happening,
Luckily not close enough to be directly affected. I stumbled
across a headline on Reddit and did a little digging.
There are only a few articles about it so far.
The mayor did make a statement that it was vague,
(32:20):
had no hint of a plan of what they were
going to do. It seems like mister mayor is hinting
at a larger conspiracy. Perhaps I'm just sort of shocked
that this is not a bigger deal. Seems like kind
of a big deal, but I'm no expert. Where were
the police is anyone doing anything about this. Are things
(32:43):
like this happening elsewhere and are not being publicized? And
then Captain ends on a very nice note saying, thank
you all for being a voice that's logical, rational and
get this, guys downright entertaining. In these chaotic days, we're
blessing aw shucks. But he links to the same video
(33:07):
that you bet are describing, and then we have you know,
Christa from Key West is writing in with the same thing.
Crimson Fox is writing in as well, and the concern
seems to be that this is a collapseive rule of law, Right,
(33:29):
that's the idea. Yeah, I'd love to hear you guys'
thoughts on this before we dive into the specifics of
trende Aragua.
Speaker 2 (33:38):
Well, I'm so sorry, guys, I don't have the original
reporting in front of me that I stumbled upon in
the video that I watched when I first encountered this.
Speaker 4 (33:48):
But what I.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
Recall hearing, at least from the witness who took that video,
who ended up moving out of the apartment complex. I think,
with the help of like a major city official, helter
move out of the apartment comp because she was so
fearful of her own life. But the response initially that
she got when she would try and report gang activity
or you know, what she thought was gang activity in
(34:11):
her apartment complex, the response from the police was, yes,
of course, we'll send somebody out there. But behind the scenes,
they wouldn't deploy anyone to check out anything in that
at that apartment complex or in the immediate vicinity of
that apartment complex unless they could send four officers right
in total, or more four or four officers for a
(34:32):
single call. And that very rarely happened or was able
to happen.
Speaker 3 (34:37):
And I am immensely, immensely excited that you bring that
aspect of it to bear here, Matt. As far as
we understand, the story goes viral around August twenty eighth
of twenty twenty four, a local TV station out of Denver, Colorado,
(34:58):
or a reporter that station post a video on Twitter
which I refuse to call X because that's just a
stupid name. The post on Twitter showing this video that
you Crimson Fox and Key Wes Christa and Captain are describing,
and if you watch it, it shows a group of men, right,
(35:20):
four of whom are visually armed and they're entering an apartment.
This is not occurring in Denver. It is occurring in
a suburb of Denver, Aurora.
Speaker 4 (35:33):
That's where Wayne's world is said.
Speaker 3 (35:34):
Sorry, I just love the joy that you had with that.
Speaker 5 (35:40):
Party on, then please carry and carry on party on.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
The reporter is working for specifically a regional outlet KDVR
Fox thirty one and this is, you know, an affiliate
franchise of the Fox network. The claim is there is
some sort of takeover right and l EO will not
(36:05):
respond for one reason or another, sort of like the
Favella in Brazil where Bope is not gonna rock in
unless they're functioning as a military force. This is where
we get to things that I don't know, muddy the water,
(36:28):
as we said earlier, because it's hitting the zeitgeist. It's
a little bit of a dog whistle in my opinion.
Or regarding immigration, we know that Uncle Sam created many
of the monsters it now purports the hunt and you
can see that the world over.
Speaker 5 (36:49):
Armed them, you know, yeah, gave them an ideological reason
to exist.
Speaker 2 (36:55):
Well, it's true, and yet simultaneously, just as we covered
in Strange News this week, there are weird occurrences lower
level occurrences where they're like with the what do we
call it criminal tourism or crime tourism things that are
happening where they are. Enterprise is built up for that
very thing. It's not the same as the dog whistles
(37:18):
stuff that's happening.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
Yeah, it's not the same. Look, and I appreciate us
bringing that up because the gang that is accused, in specific,
the organized criminal outfit is TREND de Aragua, and this
is a real outfit, just like how MS thirteen is
a real thing. They're bad dudes, they're hard cases, they're
(37:43):
not good. You don't want to hang out with them,
just to be honest, and they are considered a transnational
criminal organization that came from the Biden administration back in
twenty twenty four. The issue, though, is that when the
police of Aurora, Colorado made a statement about this, they
(38:06):
said the following quote, we are aware that components of
TDA are operating in Aurora. APD has been Aurora Police
Department has been increasingly collecting evidence to show the gang
is connected to crimes in the area. However, as we
have said previously, and as the DEA similarly stated, it
(38:30):
would be improper at this time for the city and
APD to make any conclusory statements about specific incidents or
provide details about law enforcement strategy and operations. So to
unpack that. What they are saying is, yes, the gang
is real, or at least groups of people purporting to
(38:54):
be associated with this gang are operating in this suburb
Denver Overalls metro area. But we can't say whether the
claims you're hearing from your local Fox news station are
in fact true. And this makes me think, you, guys,
(39:15):
gang activity. Gang activity can often be decentralized, you know
what I mean? Like right, Like uh, I.
Speaker 5 (39:24):
Mean sometimes they operate very similar lead to the way
terrorist cells operate, right.
Speaker 3 (39:29):
So that that's a great example, because let's imagine then,
let's say you commit a crazy crime, a notable crime.
Let's say instead of podcasting, we all saw like god
in sixty seconds and got super into grand theft auto.
Speaker 4 (39:46):
We're just steal in there.
Speaker 3 (39:48):
You get in situations at phase. We had a phase,
and so let's say that one of us gets apprehended
stealing all these Aston Martins in these lamb bows, and
one of us who gets caught says we're part of
something bigger, something you cannot imagine. We're actually, I don't
(40:09):
know what's a fun gang. We're the Apple Dumpling Gang.
Speaker 5 (40:13):
Oh, I thought you said a fun game, and I
was gonna say Tittley Winks, But that would also be
a fun name for a gang, the Tiddley Winks Boys.
Speaker 3 (40:22):
Tidle Winks Boys, and so let's imagine then there is
a Tittley Winks Boys, or there is an Apple Dumpling Gang.
They exist somewhere else in the world. We've never really
hung out with them. We're not. They don't consider us
part of their larger organization. We're just claiming.
Speaker 4 (40:43):
False flag almost.
Speaker 3 (40:44):
Yeah, the Crip and Blood example would be false flag.
That's what I think. I think the most important part
of this is to remember that there were people endangered.
Right There were a rest of two folks who, as
law enforcement describes them, had gang ties. What does that mean?
Speaker 4 (41:10):
Ganggang?
Speaker 2 (41:11):
What does that mean?
Speaker 4 (41:12):
What gangang? Yeah, it just means like bitchin Oh. I
may be using it completely incorrectly.
Speaker 3 (41:19):
It's like when you hit someone with a thumbs up
emoji in the text.
Speaker 7 (41:23):
That's what is Yeah, well, hey, speaking of gangang for us, guys,
call back to Matt who wrote into us in twenty
twenty by the way I found it, I found the
episode Matt was referencing.
Speaker 2 (41:41):
It is titled your News Agency or the CIA colon
the Story of Operation Mockingbird. A banger of an episode.
If if we do say so ourselves.
Speaker 4 (41:51):
Have we released that as a classic recently? If not,
maybe we should.
Speaker 2 (41:56):
I don't think so, but it is worth your time.
Talks about infiltration of news agencies by the agency.
Speaker 3 (42:02):
And in August thirtieth, twenty twenty four, statement on Facebook,
the mayor of Aurora, Colorado, Mike Kaufman, said they're going
to request a court order to clear out this apartment
complex with the idea that they would or with the
aim that they would get these quote, get these properties
(42:24):
back under the control of the property owners.
Speaker 2 (42:27):
Now we're at did we mention the name of the property.
Speaker 3 (42:31):
Let's say it the Fitzsimmons Place apartments.
Speaker 2 (42:35):
Oh wow, I was looking at Whispering Pines apartments.
Speaker 3 (42:39):
Yeah, there are multiple multiple things in.
Speaker 4 (42:43):
Play here, Holy mackerel.
Speaker 3 (42:46):
We're also thinking of the Edge at Lowry right, that's
one of our camb places named. So in general, we
see the allegation or the accusation being that a look,
an armed gang functioning in concert is essentially a militia,
(43:06):
you know what I mean. So what we are looking
at here is the idea that some sort of militant
force is violating rule of law, and that the law
is somehow unable or unwilling to crack down. And this
is I don't know, man, it's dangerous because it's such rich,
(43:31):
fertile soil for people who want to push a given narrative,
you know what I.
Speaker 2 (43:36):
Mean, absolutely, And it's also a super difficult situation. Some
you know, it doesn't matter how big your police department is,
do you really want your department to go to war
with a gang?
Speaker 7 (43:49):
Like?
Speaker 2 (43:50):
Really do you want that? Probably not if you're an
elected official like the mayor or you know, a police chief.
He was, I guess not elected. But still it's I
can imagine it being a real tight spot, Like what
actions do I take here to make Oh gosh, it's
it's personal, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (44:09):
It's to make myself look good? Hey, Bobby?
Speaker 5 (44:11):
And though this is not Illinois, this is Colorado. Wayne's
world did not take place in Aurora, Colorado. It was Illinois,
but we tied a little conversation off Mike and I
just think this kind of loss of control by a
city is the kind of stuff that oftentimes politicians when
they're trying to kind of demonize cities, referring to them
(44:34):
as quote unquote like war zones.
Speaker 4 (44:36):
This is the kind of stuff you picture, isn't.
Speaker 3 (44:37):
It You also purported loss of control.
Speaker 1 (44:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (44:43):
The thing is if you go to like if you
go to the Denver Post, if you go to the
other local news affiliates like NBC or ABC super creative names, guys,
what you'll see is interviews. What you well, ABC or
NBC is a series of interviews with people who actually
(45:06):
live in these apartment complexes. And a lot of these folks,
candidly are what you would call migrants if you're a politician.
And when they're asked whether a gang is taking over,
they're all saying no. And when they're asked whether they
feel safe, they also say no. But the reason these
(45:28):
folks say that they do not feel safe is because
these apartment complex management companies are apparently asleep at the wheel,
like they're not doing basic upkeep and you know, health
code stuff.
Speaker 5 (45:43):
Dude, This is just the kind of story I could
see certain politicians getting a hold of and having a
field day with though you know what I mean, like
in terms of like pointing to problems with immigration, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (45:53):
Because I have two things just that I noticed in
re looking at some of these articles. The first is
that these apartments, at least Whispering Pine apartments, they are
described as affordable housing essentially, and it does mention that
it is mostly they say Hispanic families, working class families.
That's the way it's at least described by CBS. And
(46:15):
in there they note that rents go from anywhere from
fourteen hundred dollars a month to two thousand dollars a
month for affordable housing. But I mean, but really that
blows my mind. First of all, that that's the price
that you pay for an apartment complex that is described
in that way.
Speaker 4 (46:34):
The second thing.
Speaker 2 (46:35):
Is that I kept trying to figure out why I
remember Aurora, Colorado. Yeah, and we just talked about the
Christopher Nolan Batman movies. If you go back to twenty twelve,
that's when there was the shooting at the Aurora Theater,
which is it was at the dark Knight Rises screening.
So just sorry, the weird connections there are all present here.
Speaker 5 (46:56):
Yeah, it seems like there's a few little red threads
acting some of our stories today.
Speaker 3 (47:02):
And one thing that I would note here as well,
it's not uncommon for certain aspects of the American population
to immediately conflate any large gathering of people they don't
care for with crime. You know what I mean, you
gotta go. You got a bunch of You got a
(47:24):
bunch of Albanians, you know, at a cookout. That doesn't
make them the mafia, right, Or I should say, you
got a bunch of Sicilians, you know, somewhere off the turnpike,
just hanging out at a picnic. That doesn't make them
the mafia. That doesn't make them Coaster Nostra or whatever.
(47:45):
There is a great requirement the US is still dealing with,
which is how do I recognize the people I meet
here as not dangerous strangers, but as neighbors. And if
you if you live so where in this country, someone
probably lives pretty close to you, learn about them. You know,
(48:08):
not to be too ted lasso about this because I'm
still recovering from our adoption episode, but be curious, you
know what I mean. Don't tell people who they are
in your head, ask them to tell you who they
are in their head.
Speaker 2 (48:24):
It reminds me of that M One song. I think
it's m One called Confidential. We're just talking about, you know,
get to know your neighbors, but also you ever noticed
that there's one neighbor who's really nosy.
Speaker 4 (48:38):
And if we don't have it, it might be.
Speaker 6 (48:41):
Right.
Speaker 3 (48:42):
And with that we are going to call it an evening.
We are off to noctivigate. Thank you again, fellow conspiracy realist,
for joining us here in the dark. We want to
hang out with you, perhaps on an episode, perhaps on
a few future listener mail or strange News. Tell us
(49:03):
your thoughts. We try to be easy to find online.
I forgot to put that part in.
Speaker 4 (49:07):
It's the game boy, do we ever?
Speaker 5 (49:09):
You can find it at the handle conspiracy Stuff, where
we exist all over the internets, on.
Speaker 4 (49:13):
Facebook where we have our Facebook group. Here's where it
gets crazy. Join up, get in on the conversation.
Speaker 5 (49:18):
It's a lot of fun, good folks. They're good memings
as well. You can find us on YouTube, where we
have video content for you to enjoy, and on.
Speaker 4 (49:27):
X fka Twitter.
Speaker 5 (49:29):
I don't like saying x either man on Instagram and TikTok. However,
we are Conspiracy Stuff show.
Speaker 2 (49:35):
Hey, if you are looking for some video content related
to this episode, why not head on over to our
YouTube channel. As Noel said, conspiracy Stuff, check out Project
Artichoke colon the Manchurian Candidate. It's a great video. It's
only ten years old at this point.
Speaker 4 (49:51):
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
Hey, if you want to call us, our number is
one eight three three STDWYTQ. That's just stuff they don't
want you to know in letter form that you have
to turn into numbers.
Speaker 4 (50:04):
Good luck.
Speaker 2 (50:05):
If you pass the test, you can leave a three
minute voicemail, give yourself a cool nickname, and say whatever
you'd like do. Let us know if we can use
your name and message on the air, And if you've
got more to say they can fit in that voicemail.
Why not instead send us a good old fashioned email.
Speaker 3 (50:19):
We are the entities that read every piece of correspondence
we receive. Be well aware, yet unafraid. Sometimes the void
writes back conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.
Speaker 2 (50:51):
Stuff they don't want you to know is a production
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Stuff They Don't Want You To Know News
Hosts And Creators
Matt Frederick
Ben Bowlin
Noel Brown
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