August 30, 2024 • 50 mins
Do the mysterious Ica stones genuinely depict humans and dinosaurs co-existing? Did some ancient South American cultures actually possess fantastic flying machines, advanced medical techniques, and telescopes? According to the Peruvian physician Javier Cabrera Darquea, the Ica stones proved all of this and more, fundamentally reshaping the story of human history. However, not everyone was convinced. In part two of this special two-part series, the guys continue their investigation of the Ica stones.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A
production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,
my name is no.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
They call me Bed. We're joined as always with our
super producer Paul Mission Control Decads. Most importantly, you are you.
You are here. That makes this the stuff they don't
want you to know. As we are joining in media
arrests our exploration of the Eca Stones. We hope that
you listen to part one, and more importantly, please feel
(00:50):
free to toss us a review on Apple Podcast. Now
back to the show. This is a puzzle that feels
like it could be solvable right with the information we
have at hand. This seems like it's just a matter
(01:13):
of rearranging the pieces to form a coherent, a coherent
cognitive picture. But these are not the most well known things.
These are not the controversial ecostodes. They're two different buckets.
The ones we just talked about, the simplistic stuff, patterns,
easily identifiable motifs, and styles of depiction. Those things are understandable.
(01:41):
The controversial things. The things that most of archaeology at
large has a problem with today are the They're the
ones that have I don't want to say fanciful. You
could interpret them as depicting different species of dinosaur in detail,
(02:03):
with human like figures hanging out with them. There are
multiple instances of this, there are so many. There are
also multiple instances of advanced technology, apparently, and not just
like loose interpretations. Someone clearly drew a telescope, someone clearly
multiple times drew a flying machine. It is not up
(02:25):
for interpretation. There is no there is no material nor
folkloric precedent that would indicate this is a symbol of
a god or something. It's clearly somebody saw like a
plane of some sort and then popped it into a stone.
Speaker 4 (02:47):
I see what you're saying, but I mean, you know,
you could argue, if we are still on the side
of like the zero authentic, that that kind of parallel
thinking happens outside of like the ability for technology to
create such a thing. You know, someone could be like,
we know what technology is, we know how to make
a tent. What if we just put that in the
sky and like you know, had it like a like
a sailing ship, but like in the sky with wings
(03:08):
like a bird. We certainly have examples of things out
of time like that. And I'm reading a Isaac Asimov
book from nineteen fifty right now. And I know this
is obvious for fans of science fiction, but I'm always
blown away by how close they get it in the fifties,
like of like what modern civilization looks like and what
technology of the future actually looked like. Some of them
(03:30):
really get it right, and it blows my mind. And
I'm sorry, I just had to had to bring that up.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
That's a good point, man. I love it. I love it.
Speaker 5 (03:38):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Asthmav mentioned, I'm.
Speaker 5 (03:41):
Reading the Foundation series.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
I accidentally bought the second one out of sequence and
then realized that, and then I ordered the first one
and now I'm starting fresh. But I'm very excited because
I haven't I haven't. I'm not gonna lie, guys. I
haven't read a book in a hot minute, so I
will report.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
Now, guys. We mentioned that some of these stone depict
also medical procedures, which is super puzzling in itself. One
of the things that you may notice if you're ever
researching this stuff is that there tend to be records
of usually religious rights, sacrifices, funereal rights. When it comes
(04:20):
to cutting into a human body, like you'll see imagery
or writing about that, removing things from the body, putting
things on the body when you're going through one of
these rituals. But rarely do you see a medical procedure
or what would be described as a medical procedure in
the modern day. What are we seeing here?
Speaker 3 (04:42):
I want to set up, Yeah, there is, for instance,
evidence of the practice of trepanation in some ancient cultures, right,
which is you know, if you've ever had a migraine,
you've thought about it, no judgment. And we also know
people did survive some of those procedures, not all of them,
(05:05):
I'm gonna say, not all of them. But to your point, Matt,
which is excellent set up. There, we see that there
are things interpreted as depictions of a cesarean operation, right,
a C section we call it. That's where when someone
(05:26):
is giving birth you have to conduct a surgical operation
to extract the child from the womb. And that happens
every day, every evening. And these are modern nights. But
in times where infant mortality was much higher, we know
(05:46):
that a lot of people died because that technology was
not or that process, that technique was not commonplace. So
if the ecostones as they appear to, if they indicate
that this was common knowledge for some empire, then that
is a game changer because that would show us that
(06:10):
this sophisticated medical procedure was discovered and then lost somewhere
in the sands of time, which is fascinating and quite possible.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Oh yeah, the modern cesarean section as we think about it,
goes back pretty far to the eight the late eighteen hundreds.
But still that if you could pull that off and
keep the mother alive and the baby alive in those
times with the tools available, at least known to be available,
(06:41):
it would be like magic.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
No antibiotics, I mean, that's it's created. No germ theory anyway,
we know that. We know that by the time the
Spanish Empire arrived and met the Inca Empire, there was
not germ theory. So that is another question. To recap
what we have so far. Out in a rural Peruvian
(07:06):
cave or series of caves, there appears to be a
collection of stones not only functioning as a multi civilization
depiction of history unfamiliar to the modern world. But they
also appear to show that human beings interacted with creatures
who look a heck of a lot like dinosaurs and
possess technology and medical techniques far more sophisticated than anything
(07:31):
else we know about during that time. We're setting up
a lot of questions and we're going to get to them.
But first things first, how did these stones get discovered
in the first place? How do we even know about
them today?
Speaker 2 (07:45):
You know, one thing we didn't mention is that some
of the depictions of human like creatures and dinosaur like
creatures were a little more familiar than just attacking them, right, yeah, yeah, yeah,
like maybe some interbreeding of some sort.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
Yeah, there were giants in those days. The sons of
God saw the daughters of man and found them beautiful. Yeah,
there's beastiality. Let's just say it's fun.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Yeah, but in some of them.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
Yeah, but it's there, it's it is undeniably graft that.
Speaker 5 (08:27):
You know what.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
That's one of the ones that's the least open to
interpretation there.
Speaker 4 (08:32):
I mean, if you look at the image, I mean,
if you look at images of them printed, you know,
it's like there's a big old blurt out section, you know,
like with the bodies intertwine.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
Yeah, oh gosh, oh boy, Yeah, that part's true. And
that's actually uh going back to statement about the earlier
two buckets, that belongs to the the more simplistic ones,
the people banging animals, animals banging people, that's the more
(09:05):
simplistic stuff. That's not like the interestings work.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
Well no, just the idea of animals banging people. And
just then there's an implication of agency there.
Speaker 5 (09:16):
I know, but you know it can be done. Yeah,
they we know dolphins will just about anything.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Yes, yeah, especially if you give them enough LSD.
Speaker 5 (09:26):
That story for another day, that actually is out there.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
We've certainly discussed the the works of what is it Lily?
Speaker 2 (09:35):
Yeah, and we do know thes was triple the horny
that any other dinosaur was. Sorry, very good.
Speaker 5 (09:46):
Impact right into that one.
Speaker 3 (09:48):
Every palaeontologist in the audience tonight nodded, solemnly.
Speaker 4 (09:54):
Threw up a little in their mouths.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
Triceratops the horniest of the So how do we know
about these eco stones today? The story begins, this is weird.
The official story begins on May thirteenth, nineteen sixty six.
It starts with the story overall starts with two men.
There's a farmer in the Ika province in Peru. His
(10:19):
name is Basilo Lusha and a there's a physician son
of a Spanish aristocrat. His name is doctor Javier Cabrera d'arqua.
And according to the doctor Cabrea, he learns about the stones.
A little later in life. He has a friend of
photographer Felix Josa Romero, who gives him one of these
(10:44):
stones as a present for his forty second birthday. This
guy does not know. He doesn't know paleontology from m
Canna paint right. He is a physician's a good doctor,
and like a lot of very smart people, he has
(11:05):
a hobby. His hobby is Peruvian prehistory.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
Yeah, and he's like, hey, thanks for that gift, man,
how'd you make this? Yeah? No, I'm just joking.
Speaker 5 (11:15):
And then he's like, how dare you sir?
Speaker 2 (11:18):
No, But he noticed some weird things specifically, and I
love that we're pointing this out. Specifically, a fish hanging
out with some humans that should have been gone way
before the humans would have even known that that thing existed.
Speaker 4 (11:34):
Well, isn't that part of the weirdness, as some of
these depict creatures that just their timelines would not have
crossed in general.
Speaker 5 (11:41):
Right, that's sort of the idea.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
One hundred percent. Yeah. Yeah, the so our good doctor
gets his gift. Here's forty second birthday. You know, he's
an eclectic guy, he's a renaissance man. And he says,
hang on, I you know, I'm an armchair historian. I
I've never I know enough about fish to know exactly
(12:04):
he called you out. Man, He's like, I know exactly
what No Brown's gonna say later. This fish would never
have been around in the time of the modern humans.
Interestingly enough, doctor Cabrera never explained specifically what particular fish
he believed this stone depicted. And I mean, I've looked.
Speaker 4 (12:26):
Everywhere a rudimentary cave drawing esque style of a fish.
They've got a whole lot of discerning like like a stegosaurus.
That's a stegosaurus. But there was the fish that tipped
him off. I just I don't quite quite get that.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
It was a come on, we're all whatever.
Speaker 4 (12:44):
I don't It's a little specific, That's all I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Yeah, But also it doesn't start with the dinosaurs. It
starts with the fish, right, that's how it's like scientology.
That's how they get him in. They get him in
with psychic just off the far enough, and he says,
you know, we can only imagine. He goes back to
Romero and he says, thank you so much for this gift.
You know, fel to me, this also is an impossible thing.
(13:15):
This is clearly made by Homo sapien, and it's clearly
depicting a fish that I know did not exist during
the time of Homo sapien. Where did you get this?
You must tell me? And he learns through his friend
that people in the Ika province have been finding stones
(13:38):
in a nearby cavern actually due to some meteorological phenomenon,
and he says, I must have these, right, and he's
let's be honest, no shade one way or the other.
But the good doctor here is in the upper echelons
of Peruvian society, so he can forward to have an
(14:01):
expensive hobby like this.
Speaker 4 (14:03):
Sure, So I guess I'm trying to understand his motivation.
Initially when he said the thing about this fish, like
he is suspicious of their authenticity or he thinks they
represent something massive he'sfisious.
Speaker 5 (14:20):
He is suspicious. Okay, oh god, got it. Gots making
sure that I'm on the same.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
Fish page.
Speaker 5 (14:29):
Carry on, pay me, no mind, all right.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
Well, no pun left behind. You're absolutely right. No. What
he does here is he is intrigued, right. He doesn't
suspect any scoundrel activity or cons or griffs or chicanery.
He wants to know more because he's long held an
intense interest in Peruvian prehistory. He's a good faith actor,
(14:57):
as we called him on this show. And he starts
he starts hitting the streets for lack of a better phrase,
and he wants to find more stones. He wants to
find this cave in particular, he wants to figure out
where this came from, because you know, if we assume
(15:20):
his perspective, this is something that could fundamentally upend history.
I mean, imagine, you know, imagine if we found something
like this. We're on an adventure and we find something
that seems to indicate people provably ran into Bigfoot or something.
Speaker 4 (15:40):
The stuff that we've long wanted to be proved true,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 5 (15:44):
I mean that's part of this too.
Speaker 4 (15:46):
Is that confirmation bias, I guess or that drive within
us to like have our dreams, you know, come true.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Right, that'd be awesome, dude, if any of us found
something like this, I can guarantee we'd be feeling trepid
day fish about it.
Speaker 5 (16:00):
I almost said, one almost swam right past me.
Speaker 3 (16:05):
Oh buddy. Oh, And we'll pause here for a word
from our sponsors. We'll be right back. And we have
returned not just to the show, but to Peruvian conspiracies.
So this guy, doctor Cabrera, he ends up purchasing more.
(16:30):
But the word gets around and there's a pair of brothers,
Carlos and Pablo Soldi, and they hear about his interest
and they approach him and they say, hey, Doc, we
have an interest in pre inca art as well. We
have found a lot of stones. He ends up purchasing
(16:51):
something like three hundred and ten individual samples of these
stones from a nearby region. And they say, look, we've
been trying to talk to archaeologists about this. No one's
really into it. They think it's boring or it's honestly
not going to help them in their dissertations or whatever.
(17:12):
And so he says, okay, I'll buy it, and he
gets it for a song. He gets it for like,
let's see, this is the mid nineteen sixties. He gets
it for the equivalent of thirty pound sterling, so like
thirty British pounds that comes to us from the forty
een times. So he gets it at a very reasonable rate.
(17:35):
And he's still hungry for more stones. So he runs
into a farmer. Our second character we mentioned earlier, Basilia Usha,
and this guy, this farmer, Basilio, says, hey, look, duck,
I found this huge cash of stones because the Eco
River overflowed its banks and it destroyed nearby a globoration
(18:01):
of soil that exposed a cave. And I have also
been tried to get the attention of the Peruvian government.
I need I need the boffins on this, and and
the doctor says, well, hey, I'm wealthy, I'm smart, I'm interested.
Tell me where the cave is. And the farmer says,
(18:23):
oh no, no, no, no no, I can't tell you
where the cave is, but I will sell you some
of these stones.
Speaker 4 (18:30):
Who That's where things get a little sussy though, right,
because like, let's just come at this from the perspective
that these are authentic, doesn't that make this extra illegal
this type of yes, because.
Speaker 5 (18:42):
I mean yes, the government I believe is.
Speaker 4 (18:44):
Very hard on, you know, the theft of Peruvian artifacts,
which is what this would be.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
Considered one thousand percent and you would have motive here.
It would exist if you were a detective looking at this.
You know, in every light possible, you say, oh, this,
this man knows that this particular person is pretty wealthy
and willing to purchase something that you know he's already purchased.
(19:12):
Would you say three hundred and something, which would be
a pretty big windfall if you could sell three hundred
or maybe even more.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
Yeah, it's tasty. There's a new mommy to it, right,
So yeah, he says, look, Doc, I can't tell you
about the cave, but I can sell these to you
because the archaeologist won't pay attention to me, and we
can only assume. The doctor said, I feel you I
could contact the archaeologist, and the farmer said, no, okay, okay, okay,
(19:47):
one step at a time. Let me tell you some stones.
Doctor Cabrera ended up buying thousands of these. He had
more than, according to some report, to have more than
ten thousand, more than eleven thousand by the nineteen seventies
and over the years, because these guys had a relationship
(20:09):
for more than a decade. Over the years, Basilio produced
hundreds of these carved stones, and Cabrera, leveraging his social position,
became their greatest promoter, and he would always reach out
to scholars, to other aristocrats, fringe theory enthusiasts, and everybody
(20:33):
that he was speaking to. He was less asking them
for analysis and more proselytizing toward them and saying, these
stones are evidence that everything you know is wrong. Right
up and down right his left, shortest long blah blah blah.
(20:54):
That's a weird Al Yankovic reference. I don't think it'll land.
We'll keep it. But he's also he's also calling to
religious fundamentalist crouts, calling to creationists. And this gets us
to the point where we see that there are more
(21:16):
easily more than ten thousand stones as we record this evening.
They've been identified as eco stones. The majority belonged to
the estate of Cabrera. He was the hugest promoter. He
made his own museum. Imagine being that well off, you
could make your own museum for a thing. Why don't
(21:37):
we have a museum? Can we do a museum.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
I could with the magic cards.
Speaker 4 (21:45):
I could with synthesizers and action figures, but I kind
of want to keep them, so maybe maybe maybe after
I died, but then I'll be able to use them, you
know what.
Speaker 5 (21:54):
The museum could be hands on, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (21:56):
Yeah, like Sidetracker for a big museum he created originally
just contained stones he had purchased from those brothers that
we mentioned earlier, along with stones from his father's collection.
We said he was an aristocrat. His father, Bolivia Cabrera,
(22:17):
was from Spain, and his father had also collected stones.
Now this may be something that's familiar to various members
of the crowd tonight, but like just a quick personal anecdote,
I remember growing up on some family land that was
(22:40):
riddled with arrowheads. Did you guys ever do that, like
go digging for arrowheads?
Speaker 5 (22:45):
I did go digging.
Speaker 4 (22:47):
I don't know that I ever found anything authentic, but
it was also easiest to find chipped rocks and just
say that's what they were, you know, as with your
childlike imagination.
Speaker 5 (22:56):
That was probably more me.
Speaker 4 (22:57):
I bet you guys found some real deals though, trick
myself into believing a lot of like flint like things
were ever, tie it onto a stick and make yourself
an improvised bow out of a more bendy stick with
a nice piece of twine.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
I can't say that I did that.
Speaker 5 (23:12):
I did. Oh, is that unusual? I did, for sure.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
I don't know. I found some you know, probably canines
or some teeth from small animals that I totally believed
were shark teeth back in the day as well.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
Oh, I thought you were going to say you made
them into you made arrows from them, arrows from teeth.
That's the most subtle thing.
Speaker 5 (23:33):
Yeah, that would be sick.
Speaker 4 (23:34):
You can put the backwards part forward, you know, with
all the little spiky parts.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (23:39):
But Cabrera wasn't He also kind of a bit of
a hype man, like he really wanted to spread the word.
Speaker 5 (23:44):
Of these things far and wide.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
And this is where we see the folklore progression, or
the evolution the telephone game of this theory, because he
was talking to everybody about this, right, anyone who would
hear him out in academia, outside of academia. He wanted
their not even their opinion, certainly not their criticism. He
(24:11):
wanted their coside. And as the word transmitted throughout the
globe in different circles. It came to the attention of
a guy named Eric Vaughan Danakan, Eric von Danakan, Yeah,
publishes a paperback that I loved when I came out,
The Chariots of the Gods question Mark A little bit
(24:31):
of hedging there. He publishes this first in nineteen sixty nine.
It becomes an international bestseller, and a deluge of similar
books hit the market right after, you know, like when
an Action Blockbuster comes out, then they're inevitably a bunch
of direct to It used to be direct to vhs,
(24:55):
but now it's like direct to streaming sort of one offs.
What's the name of that the b studios.
Speaker 4 (25:02):
Well, they called the mockbusters was that term that was used,
but it was one called like the asylum, I think,
like so instead of transformers, it was transmorphers. And they
were literally banking on people I think, getting confused at
the video store and probably made some made some bucks
off of that.
Speaker 3 (25:19):
Similar in the mass market paperback game. At this point,
all of the The key thing here is that all
of these books name checked the mysterious Eca Stones, and
then later religious uh religious types took up the cause
of the Eca Stones because they were creationists, and uh,
(25:41):
not to not to call any of us out, but
anybody raised in a very religious Christian religious environment knows
that there's, uh, there's a lot of controversy around the
age of the Earth.
Speaker 4 (25:57):
Right, Well, there's certain perspectives in that kind of school
of thought. I guess they would even argue that dinosaurs
aren't real.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Right, Oh yeah, I've heard that argument.
Speaker 3 (26:06):
Is that real, like people saying dinosaurs aren't a thing?
Speaker 2 (26:09):
Absolutely, it's the speculation goes that it's a big trick
by the Smithsonian and other government organizations that are based
in Satan, and it's trying to trick human beings to
believe the Earth is much older and all this stuff,
when in fact, firmament and flat earth and all that
all just kind of want.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
To simply pointing out an extremity of this position, right,
and then it's definitely what you might call fringe. A
lot of this is but there are certainly people out
there that do put forth that that might well be
a possibility.
Speaker 3 (26:43):
Interesting contradiction because a lot of the creationists who championed
the idea of the ego stones championed it because it
showed that it appeared to show dinosaurs and humans living together,
which vibed with their idea that humans and dinosaurs both
existed in a world that was like six thousand to
(27:05):
five thousand years old.
Speaker 5 (27:07):
Max, Oh, if I'm not mistaken.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
Though, in certain kind of religious, more religious parts of
the country where there was controversy around depicting, you know,
evolution in textbooks, I believe there were some more creationist
leaning versions of textbooks that did express that very same sentiment.
Speaker 5 (27:28):
Ben, And this is a long time ago.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
I don't think this is maybe as much of a
thing anymore, but I do remember when that was a
real controversy. There were teachers in certain schools in certain
parts of the world that might.
Speaker 5 (27:40):
Have taught such things.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
Yeah. I had a T shirt for a long time, guys,
you might remember it. It was a great T shirt
and had a picture of Jesus writing on a raptor,
and it was kind of poking fun at some of
that stuff.
Speaker 5 (27:54):
You know.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
I'm a little embarrassed by it now, but it was
one of my favorite shirts.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
Wait do you not have that shirt before?
Speaker 4 (28:00):
I think that would be a thrift store find right there.
Let me tell you, people would pay good money for that, Oh.
Speaker 3 (28:07):
Man, I agree with Noel on this one. We also
know that riding the wave of this attention, the Good
Doctor wrote his own book where he set forth the
majority of the claims that have become sort of the
manifesto for people who believe in the Eca Stones. And
this is the hidden history. We got to talk about it, right,
(28:30):
We've made this a two part episode. Let's get into it.
What does he say in his book The Message of
the Engraved Stones of Eca.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
Let's say these one at a time. The first one
is that the stones themselves are way older than you think. Well,
I promise they're way older than you're imagining the thing
I'm about to say at least.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Oh, let's prices write it.
Speaker 2 (28:54):
One dollar million dollars.
Speaker 3 (28:57):
Okay, twelve thousand years, one million years.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Way way more four hundred and five million years old
at least according to the book Wow, based on what exactly.
Speaker 5 (29:16):
Vie It does say.
Speaker 4 (29:21):
Equally does go on to claim that through the transplantation
of cognitive codes to highly intelligent primates, the men from
outer space created new men on Earth. So these are
like gods. These are like like kind of godlike entities.
It's almost like the uh the Engineers and Prometheus in
(29:44):
the in the in the Alien World universe.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
The important thing to know there is that, according to
the book, humans did not start here on planet Earth.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
Which technically could be seen as supporting the idea of
pan spermia, which is really concept with a terrible name.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
Again, every time that word comes up, I think about
Dan Harmon being like that, what did you say?
Speaker 3 (30:09):
He roasted us on that one. Yeah? Dad, if you're listening,
shout out man. Yeah. The stones also, according to doctor Cabrera,
they depict dinosaurs and these proto humans he calls the
stones that he likes. The doctor calls them glypto liths,
(30:32):
and he says the show that these hypothetical ancient people
interacted with these reptiles, and they had larger brains than
those of modern man, these alien humans, and that they
used a form of quote, concentrated psychic energy ends quote,
(30:52):
with which they were able to influence celestial events, and
they would record those massive, those massive instances of esp
on the stones. So of course they would so like,
you know how, I want to be careful. I would
say this. We all have at some point met a
(31:15):
person who is low key convinced they can control the weather. Yeah,
I'm not kidding. There there are people who and we're
not saying they're jerks or assholes or anything like that,
you know, but they're saying, Oh, I can make it rain,
or oh I can stop the rain.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
I've had my moments when there's some gusting winds in
the back where I put my hand out right as
the wind starts back up and I go, oh, oh crap.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
And to explain the science with that, because there is
science to that, it's it's a matter of psychological interpretation
of the physical signals, like your body will tell you
when it's about to rain, or when sometimes when the
rain's going to stop. Things like that. You know, if
you want to impress us if you can control the weather,
(32:06):
then show us video of you make enlightening.
Speaker 2 (32:10):
Yes, please, let's pause right here for a word from
our sponsor and get back with more on the eco
stones and we're back really quickly, jump back in here.
The concept that some incredibly psychically powerful civilization, right manlike
(32:35):
creatures could have all of this technology or all of
this understanding, could be disadvanced and would choose stones as
the medium to record what they do into to a
historical record into stones. It may sound silly when it
first when you first hear it, but it always makes
me remember our discussions we've had about what actually sticks
(32:59):
around after nature takes over.
Speaker 5 (33:03):
Something.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
Yeah, is stones, stone work, stone carvings specifically, even this
kind of carving, paintings.
Speaker 4 (33:12):
Even, I mean, we have so much information from the
historical record, not only just in terms of like sedimentary record,
but like actual artifacts that were created by stone because
they're just damn resilient. Then, as we pointed out, these
particular types of stones, these volcanic stones, are particularly resilient,
which is kind of a feature and a bug in
this scenario, at least in terms of the provenance of
(33:34):
these things.
Speaker 5 (33:35):
Right. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:37):
Check out the research that US scientists and sci fi
writers did a few decades back when they were trying
to figure out how to warn future civilizations about the
dangers of radiation. They ultimately end up going back to
stone glyphs. Yep, because that'll stick around. So there is
(33:59):
there is a lot of plausibility to that or possibility.
But are but.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
The way ben Yeah, stone glyphs and pictograms, right, like
pictures not words.
Speaker 6 (34:09):
Not words like ikea instructions wow man, Okay, sorry, Ike,
it reminds me of this thing, like, if this is real, maybe.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
That is how somebody would try and get a message
across millions of years.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
Mm hmm, yeah right, it's It's one of the most
effective ways. So if you ever want a lasting monument,
make it in stone, honestly, and just hope the tectonic
plates play ball.
Speaker 5 (34:38):
They don't collide too hard, right.
Speaker 3 (34:41):
Right, And speaking of when worlds collide, our buddy doctor
Cabrera runs into science fiction, right. He does a lot
for future sci fi writers when he says, furthermore, I
believe that some of the machines depicted in these in
these motifs, they look like spacecraft, which to me means
(35:03):
they traveled through space without consuming fuel. And the Nosca
lines are definitely, foresure remnants of an ancient spaceport. I
am taking no questions at this time.
Speaker 4 (35:20):
Become a good dayson I said, yeah, I mean, look, okay.
Speaker 3 (35:26):
Also, before, lest we sound like we're dunking on this
guy unnecessarily, it is true that the earliest Peruvian artifacts
do date back to around twenty thousand years ago. These
are true things. They do not make any claims about
living around dinosaurs. They don't make any claims about traveling
(35:46):
through space or any great celestial psychic power esp revelations.
We know that engraved stones have been around in the
region and discovered way before the Ecostones gained prominence in
nineteen sixty six. There were Jesuit missionaries who traveled through
(36:06):
Peru during the Spanish conquest, and they even sent some
of these stones, like engraved stones from previous civilizations back
to Spain. Some of these stones are legitimate, but there
are problems. I think we can talk about that, right
if there's an actual All right, here's the thing. Technology
(36:29):
leaves more than a single imprint future, Like in this
kind of time window, you know, two thousand years from now,
the idea of a fossil fuel powered civilization is not
going to be based on the discovery of a single
cache of stones in a cave. There are going to
(36:50):
be other pieces of residue, a sort of sociological ectoplasm,
if you will, right, vestiges of these things. Well, thank you,
thank you. Yeah. The Inca didn't have a written record,
but they had a rich oral tradition. So you're telling
us that not one single story from this super dense
(37:12):
catalog of folklore. Not one of those stories mentioned a
telescope or a beat me here a machine that could fly.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
Oh man, that is such a good point.
Speaker 3 (37:22):
Just never mention it. It's just the one one stone.
I mean, dinosaurs also died out, as far as we know,
for the most part, way before primates hit the scene.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
At least that we're we're aware of. That's what science
says right now, yeah.
Speaker 3 (37:39):
Quote unquote science. I mean, also, you know, if we're
tracing the modern story. The BBC produced a documentary on
the Eco Stones, and they had some scathing conclusions. It
goes back, I think to your earlier point, Noel. The
Peruvian government felt a lot of Western pressure and they
(38:02):
felt like they had to respond to this.
Speaker 5 (38:04):
That's right.
Speaker 4 (38:05):
They did have a mandate to, you know, kind of
oversee the historical relics, the antiquities of the country, and
so the government felt that pressure to kind of have
a show of force here. So they arrested the farmer
for selling these stones under the pretemps these were in
fact legitimate artifacts, at which point the farmer does about
(38:28):
face and quickly changes his story. Whether or not you
believe this is just a self serving act of a
desperate person that's been backed into a corner.
Speaker 5 (38:39):
Or if this is the real story in LA, you
be the judge.
Speaker 4 (38:41):
There were farmer re candidates story claiming in fact that
he had carved all ten thousand of the stones himself.
Get a step further, guys. He demonstrated his technique. Remember
we were talking about how do you penetrate the you know,
the very durable seven out of ten mose scale surface
(39:04):
of these volcanic rocks. We're gonna need something a little
more powerful than just like a hammer and chisel, and
he showed that he had been doing it with sort
of like a drimal type tool or I guess maybe
you could a dental drill, maybe, Ben, which was my
teeth throw on.
Speaker 5 (39:20):
I just thinking about it.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
Makes your teeth sing. Yeah, apparently, he said. Just we
were relating there, this is how I did it. Not
only did I create these historical hoaxes like this shrouded
to it, but I also used a dental drill. Let
me show you the these methods. The government considered this
(39:42):
all a hoax. They shut it down and they said,
all right, our geopolitical embarrassment is over and done with
you know what I mean, Like, if you fart in
a busy elevator and then you get to your floor, hey,
just walk away, you know, you just hope you don't
meet those six people again. Cynthia, I'm sorry, Well, can I.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
Can I posit something here just as a again, maybe
a minor devil's advocate.
Speaker 3 (40:10):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, major devil's advocate.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
I'm trying to put myself in the shoes of this farmer.
And the government finally gets wind of what you're doing,
and they're none too happy about it. They're saying, hey, uh,
what you've been doing is illegal, and you are going
under the jail for betraying your country basically, and all
(40:36):
of the people's in the history you're you're going to jail.
Would you maybe, put in that position be willing to
say something like I hoaxed this whole thing to try
and get out of that.
Speaker 4 (40:50):
Well, that's yeah, that's what I was kind of saying.
I wasn't being a total jerk. I mean, like, it
does seem backed into a corner or perhaps because of
the influence of others, that this person took the fall,
you know, and uh and acted as sort of a
knowing Patsy.
Speaker 3 (41:07):
Yeah, I like that. I like this. I think this
is a fitting wave for us to begin wrapping this up,
because even now a ton of people believe that Eco
stones are legitimate and that there is a cover up
of some sort of foot because the person with the
lowest socioeconomic status, Let's be honest, Basilio I was forced
(41:28):
to announce that he had faked the stones to avoid imprisonment,
and they were going to lock this guy up for years. Uh.
Peruvian law explicitly prohibits the sale of archaeological discoveries. So
what if under that pressure, perhaps pressure against his family
as well, he took the fall right and said, hey,
(41:51):
I'm faking it. Nothing to see here, you know. Just
let me be a free man, Let my family be safe.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (41:58):
And I've learned not to interact with the one percent
or whatever. He later has an interview with a journalist
wherein he says, I did not forge any of this.
I had to claim they were a hoax so I
could avoid jail time because you know, I'm not a
(42:19):
wealthy man.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
I have to keep my job because of the iron
fisted approach to pursuing folks dealing in these types of
stolen antiquities right.
Speaker 3 (42:30):
Right, and then we see other ripples in the pond.
Here there are other folks like a archaeologist Alejandro Pezi Eserito,
They who argue that they have found other stones that
are similar, that also have engraved patina, that if not,
(42:52):
if they don't purport to show the same things, they
show similar things.
Speaker 4 (42:58):
I think it's really important that we'd tina. I think
is very interesting because if you look at like a
raw one of these types of volcanic stones, they're real rough,
you know, the outside, and they aren't like this kind
of smooth obsidian quality. And if you look at images
of these stones they have that. That's why I brought
up a massage stone thing. That's what those look like.
They have this sort of patina that that has to
(43:20):
be carved into.
Speaker 5 (43:22):
Well, what do you think, who's full of crap? Here?
Speaker 3 (43:27):
Well, some of the stones, this is the thing. Part
of this is true. Some of these stones are legitimate.
That's fantastic news. The slightly less fantastic news is that
the legit stones, which are weathered for sure, and are
ancient and are engraved by human hands, they're all what
(43:48):
we will call the tamer stones. They don't have fanciful
depictions dinosaurs and humans high five and none of the
sci fi stuff. It looks like historical hoaxes got mixed
in with the general article as part of the booming
illegal trade in ancient artifacts. That's a distressingly common phenomena
(44:08):
throughout the world and throughout history, like how many pieces
of the True Cross were sold in the Middle Ages.
You know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (44:18):
I do, yeah, And it makes sense, as we said
at the very top of this, if you find there
is a side hustle and all you need is a
drill in some smooth stones and you can make bank.
M Maybe you take that.
Speaker 3 (44:37):
We got into the wrong business, you know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (44:40):
Like I think we should be all the time.
Speaker 3 (44:42):
Faking historical stuff right.
Speaker 2 (44:44):
Now, gosh, in my dreams.
Speaker 3 (44:47):
Here's here's the real bullet that hit Kennedy. Too dark.
All right, we'll do something, We'll do something different. So
this is mostly a hoax unless we choose to believe
doctor Cabrera and Usja, both of whom ultimately maintained that
there is something the Peruvian government and perhaps the world
(45:08):
doesn't want you to know. Unfortunately, we cannot ask the
doctor about his beliefs directly as he passed away in
two thousand and one. However, if you want to learn more,
he has a museum. His estate has museum, the Museo
Scientifico Avier Caberettra, which you can visit.
Speaker 4 (45:29):
I do think it's really interesting, man, when you google
this stuff and look for, like, you know, Ikostone's dating
and all of this kind of thing, the majority of
the bulk of like articles that come up are megacreationist websites.
Speaker 5 (45:45):
They are really behind this thing, man, at first.
Speaker 4 (45:48):
And I was looking at it first, say, and again,
I'm not here to diss anybody's religion or whatever. That's
not the point here. But I just think it's very
interesting that obviously has a a there is an agenda
here in terms of like helping to bolster someone's set
of beliefs. And I was reading this article on creation
dot com before I realized it was on creation dot com,
and it seemed very like scientifically measured talking about different methods.
Speaker 5 (46:11):
Of dating and stuff.
Speaker 4 (46:12):
And I'm not saying the stuff in here isn't necessarily accurate,
but it is very much on this site that says
humans and dinosaurs existed together. And that's what they're trying
to prove through various means.
Speaker 5 (46:27):
It's interesting.
Speaker 2 (46:29):
I just want to see the dino movies that were
created before mankind came around, Like, what kind of cinema
are they making?
Speaker 5 (46:38):
You know, I love it.
Speaker 3 (46:39):
I want to see the conspiracy about a meteor landing.
You know, it's crazy staggo man a media from space.
Speaker 2 (46:50):
Oh, it's like that movie twenty twelve. But just yeah, yeah,
a couple million years, hundreds of millions of years before, folks.
Speaker 3 (46:59):
We can't wait to hear your I love that pitch, Matt.
We can't wait to hear your pitch for a dinosaur
version of a movie? Right, pre human? Right? What would
what what would Devil's Advocate be about if it were
by dinosaurs for dinosaurs so B D f D And
(47:23):
what would what would your favorite tropes be? What would
what would your interpretation of a classic dynos cinema be? Uh?
Equally as important.
Speaker 4 (47:32):
What kind of dinosaur would al Pacino be? Just that's
just a straight up question.
Speaker 3 (47:37):
As specific as possible, Yes, as specific as possible. Bonus
points if you base it on science. Christopher Walken as well, obviously.
Speaker 5 (47:47):
Hawkins a t rex because of the hands.
Speaker 3 (47:49):
Do you think so?
Speaker 4 (47:50):
I think I don't know why. I'm sorry it doesn't
have weird hands, but it just hit me, just hit
me that way.
Speaker 3 (47:58):
Also, we understand that some human actors can't really be
put in a box like that. Shout out till the
Swinton Gary Oldman in particular. They're just they're chameleons already.
We also want to know, perhaps equally or more importantly,
what other pieces of anachronistic technology should we explore in
(48:19):
the future. Let us know. We try to be easy
to find online. That's right.
Speaker 4 (48:24):
You can find us at the handle Conspiracy Stuff, where
we exist on YouTube where we have video content galore,
on x FKA, Twitter, and on.
Speaker 5 (48:34):
Facebook we have our Facebook group. Here's where it gets crazy.
Speaker 4 (48:37):
Hey, feeling charitable, why not hit us up on Apple Podcasts.
The podcast is called stuff they Don't Want You to
Know and leave us a five star review. Really help
people discover the show, and we really appreciate your service.
You can also find us at the handle Conspiracy Stuff
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Speaker 2 (48:54):
Hey, and also tell your friends about the show. Talk
to your friends about these weird stones, see what they think,
na and then send them our way.
Speaker 3 (49:03):
If you don't like the show, tell your enemies.
Speaker 2 (49:06):
That's right, especially your enemies. If you want to talk
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Isn't that weird? You can call one eight three three STDWYTK.
That's our voicemail system. When you call in, give yourself
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the rest of that three minute voicemail is yours. Use
(49:29):
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Speaker 3 (49:36):
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favorite dinosaur jokes? What do you call a dinosaur wearing
a cowboy hat and boots? Tyanosaurus texts that's how low
(50:01):
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Stuff they Don't Want You to Know is a production
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From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
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Speaker 2 (00:24):
Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,
my name is no.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
They call me Bed. We're joined as always with our
super producer Paul Mission Control Decads. Most importantly, you are you.
You are here. That makes this the stuff they don't
want you to know. As we are joining in media
arrests our exploration of the Eca Stones. We hope that
you listen to part one, and more importantly, please feel
(00:50):
free to toss us a review on Apple Podcast. Now
back to the show. This is a puzzle that feels
like it could be solvable right with the information we
have at hand. This seems like it's just a matter
(01:13):
of rearranging the pieces to form a coherent, a coherent
cognitive picture. But these are not the most well known things.
These are not the controversial ecostodes. They're two different buckets.
The ones we just talked about, the simplistic stuff, patterns,
easily identifiable motifs, and styles of depiction. Those things are understandable.
(01:41):
The controversial things. The things that most of archaeology at
large has a problem with today are the They're the
ones that have I don't want to say fanciful. You
could interpret them as depicting different species of dinosaur in detail,
(02:03):
with human like figures hanging out with them. There are
multiple instances of this, there are so many. There are
also multiple instances of advanced technology, apparently, and not just
like loose interpretations. Someone clearly drew a telescope, someone clearly
multiple times drew a flying machine. It is not up
(02:25):
for interpretation. There is no there is no material nor
folkloric precedent that would indicate this is a symbol of
a god or something. It's clearly somebody saw like a
plane of some sort and then popped it into a stone.
Speaker 4 (02:47):
I see what you're saying, but I mean, you know,
you could argue, if we are still on the side
of like the zero authentic, that that kind of parallel
thinking happens outside of like the ability for technology to
create such a thing. You know, someone could be like,
we know what technology is, we know how to make
a tent. What if we just put that in the
sky and like you know, had it like a like
a sailing ship, but like in the sky with wings
(03:08):
like a bird. We certainly have examples of things out
of time like that. And I'm reading a Isaac Asimov
book from nineteen fifty right now. And I know this
is obvious for fans of science fiction, but I'm always
blown away by how close they get it in the fifties,
like of like what modern civilization looks like and what
technology of the future actually looked like. Some of them
(03:30):
really get it right, and it blows my mind. And
I'm sorry, I just had to had to bring that up.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
That's a good point, man. I love it. I love it.
Speaker 5 (03:38):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Asthmav mentioned, I'm.
Speaker 5 (03:41):
Reading the Foundation series.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
I accidentally bought the second one out of sequence and
then realized that, and then I ordered the first one
and now I'm starting fresh. But I'm very excited because
I haven't I haven't. I'm not gonna lie, guys. I
haven't read a book in a hot minute, so I
will report.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
Now, guys. We mentioned that some of these stone depict
also medical procedures, which is super puzzling in itself. One
of the things that you may notice if you're ever
researching this stuff is that there tend to be records
of usually religious rights, sacrifices, funereal rights. When it comes
(04:20):
to cutting into a human body, like you'll see imagery
or writing about that, removing things from the body, putting
things on the body when you're going through one of
these rituals. But rarely do you see a medical procedure
or what would be described as a medical procedure in
the modern day. What are we seeing here?
Speaker 3 (04:42):
I want to set up, Yeah, there is, for instance,
evidence of the practice of trepanation in some ancient cultures, right,
which is you know, if you've ever had a migraine,
you've thought about it, no judgment. And we also know
people did survive some of those procedures, not all of them,
(05:05):
I'm gonna say, not all of them. But to your point, Matt,
which is excellent set up. There, we see that there
are things interpreted as depictions of a cesarean operation, right,
a C section we call it. That's where when someone
(05:26):
is giving birth you have to conduct a surgical operation
to extract the child from the womb. And that happens
every day, every evening. And these are modern nights. But
in times where infant mortality was much higher, we know
(05:46):
that a lot of people died because that technology was
not or that process, that technique was not commonplace. So
if the ecostones as they appear to, if they indicate
that this was common knowledge for some empire, then that
is a game changer because that would show us that
(06:10):
this sophisticated medical procedure was discovered and then lost somewhere
in the sands of time, which is fascinating and quite possible.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Oh yeah, the modern cesarean section as we think about it,
goes back pretty far to the eight the late eighteen hundreds.
But still that if you could pull that off and
keep the mother alive and the baby alive in those
times with the tools available, at least known to be available,
(06:41):
it would be like magic.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
No antibiotics, I mean, that's it's created. No germ theory anyway,
we know that. We know that by the time the
Spanish Empire arrived and met the Inca Empire, there was
not germ theory. So that is another question. To recap
what we have so far. Out in a rural Peruvian
(07:06):
cave or series of caves, there appears to be a
collection of stones not only functioning as a multi civilization
depiction of history unfamiliar to the modern world. But they
also appear to show that human beings interacted with creatures
who look a heck of a lot like dinosaurs and
possess technology and medical techniques far more sophisticated than anything
(07:31):
else we know about during that time. We're setting up
a lot of questions and we're going to get to them.
But first things first, how did these stones get discovered
in the first place? How do we even know about
them today?
Speaker 2 (07:45):
You know, one thing we didn't mention is that some
of the depictions of human like creatures and dinosaur like
creatures were a little more familiar than just attacking them, right, yeah, yeah, yeah,
like maybe some interbreeding of some sort.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
Yeah, there were giants in those days. The sons of
God saw the daughters of man and found them beautiful. Yeah,
there's beastiality. Let's just say it's fun.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Yeah, but in some of them.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
Yeah, but it's there, it's it is undeniably graft that.
Speaker 5 (08:27):
You know what.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
That's one of the ones that's the least open to
interpretation there.
Speaker 4 (08:32):
I mean, if you look at the image, I mean,
if you look at images of them printed, you know,
it's like there's a big old blurt out section, you know,
like with the bodies intertwine.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
Yeah, oh gosh, oh boy, Yeah, that part's true. And
that's actually uh going back to statement about the earlier
two buckets, that belongs to the the more simplistic ones,
the people banging animals, animals banging people, that's the more
(09:05):
simplistic stuff. That's not like the interestings work.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
Well no, just the idea of animals banging people. And
just then there's an implication of agency there.
Speaker 5 (09:16):
I know, but you know it can be done. Yeah,
they we know dolphins will just about anything.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Yes, yeah, especially if you give them enough LSD.
Speaker 5 (09:26):
That story for another day, that actually is out there.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
We've certainly discussed the the works of what is it Lily?
Speaker 2 (09:35):
Yeah, and we do know thes was triple the horny
that any other dinosaur was. Sorry, very good.
Speaker 5 (09:46):
Impact right into that one.
Speaker 3 (09:48):
Every palaeontologist in the audience tonight nodded, solemnly.
Speaker 4 (09:54):
Threw up a little in their mouths.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
Triceratops the horniest of the So how do we know
about these eco stones today? The story begins, this is weird.
The official story begins on May thirteenth, nineteen sixty six.
It starts with the story overall starts with two men.
There's a farmer in the Ika province in Peru. His
(10:19):
name is Basilo Lusha and a there's a physician son
of a Spanish aristocrat. His name is doctor Javier Cabrera d'arqua.
And according to the doctor Cabrea, he learns about the stones.
A little later in life. He has a friend of
photographer Felix Josa Romero, who gives him one of these
(10:44):
stones as a present for his forty second birthday. This
guy does not know. He doesn't know paleontology from m
Canna paint right. He is a physician's a good doctor,
and like a lot of very smart people, he has
(11:05):
a hobby. His hobby is Peruvian prehistory.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
Yeah, and he's like, hey, thanks for that gift, man,
how'd you make this? Yeah? No, I'm just joking.
Speaker 5 (11:15):
And then he's like, how dare you sir?
Speaker 2 (11:18):
No, But he noticed some weird things specifically, and I
love that we're pointing this out. Specifically, a fish hanging
out with some humans that should have been gone way
before the humans would have even known that that thing existed.
Speaker 4 (11:34):
Well, isn't that part of the weirdness, as some of
these depict creatures that just their timelines would not have
crossed in general.
Speaker 5 (11:41):
Right, that's sort of the idea.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
One hundred percent. Yeah. Yeah, the so our good doctor
gets his gift. Here's forty second birthday. You know, he's
an eclectic guy, he's a renaissance man. And he says,
hang on, I you know, I'm an armchair historian. I
I've never I know enough about fish to know exactly
(12:04):
he called you out. Man, He's like, I know exactly
what No Brown's gonna say later. This fish would never
have been around in the time of the modern humans.
Interestingly enough, doctor Cabrera never explained specifically what particular fish
he believed this stone depicted. And I mean, I've looked.
Speaker 4 (12:26):
Everywhere a rudimentary cave drawing esque style of a fish.
They've got a whole lot of discerning like like a stegosaurus.
That's a stegosaurus. But there was the fish that tipped
him off. I just I don't quite quite get that.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
It was a come on, we're all whatever.
Speaker 4 (12:44):
I don't It's a little specific, That's all I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Yeah, But also it doesn't start with the dinosaurs. It
starts with the fish, right, that's how it's like scientology.
That's how they get him in. They get him in
with psychic just off the far enough, and he says,
you know, we can only imagine. He goes back to
Romero and he says, thank you so much for this gift.
You know, fel to me, this also is an impossible thing.
(13:15):
This is clearly made by Homo sapien, and it's clearly
depicting a fish that I know did not exist during
the time of Homo sapien. Where did you get this?
You must tell me? And he learns through his friend
that people in the Ika province have been finding stones
(13:38):
in a nearby cavern actually due to some meteorological phenomenon,
and he says, I must have these, right, and he's
let's be honest, no shade one way or the other.
But the good doctor here is in the upper echelons
of Peruvian society, so he can forward to have an
(14:01):
expensive hobby like this.
Speaker 4 (14:03):
Sure, So I guess I'm trying to understand his motivation.
Initially when he said the thing about this fish, like
he is suspicious of their authenticity or he thinks they
represent something massive he'sfisious.
Speaker 5 (14:20):
He is suspicious. Okay, oh god, got it. Gots making
sure that I'm on the same.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
Fish page.
Speaker 5 (14:29):
Carry on, pay me, no mind, all right.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
Well, no pun left behind. You're absolutely right. No. What
he does here is he is intrigued, right. He doesn't
suspect any scoundrel activity or cons or griffs or chicanery.
He wants to know more because he's long held an
intense interest in Peruvian prehistory. He's a good faith actor,
(14:57):
as we called him on this show. And he starts
he starts hitting the streets for lack of a better phrase,
and he wants to find more stones. He wants to
find this cave in particular, he wants to figure out
where this came from, because you know, if we assume
(15:20):
his perspective, this is something that could fundamentally upend history.
I mean, imagine, you know, imagine if we found something
like this. We're on an adventure and we find something
that seems to indicate people provably ran into Bigfoot or something.
Speaker 4 (15:40):
The stuff that we've long wanted to be proved true,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 5 (15:44):
I mean that's part of this too.
Speaker 4 (15:46):
Is that confirmation bias, I guess or that drive within
us to like have our dreams, you know, come true.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Right, that'd be awesome, dude, if any of us found
something like this, I can guarantee we'd be feeling trepid
day fish about it.
Speaker 5 (16:00):
I almost said, one almost swam right past me.
Speaker 3 (16:05):
Oh buddy. Oh, And we'll pause here for a word
from our sponsors. We'll be right back. And we have
returned not just to the show, but to Peruvian conspiracies.
So this guy, doctor Cabrera, he ends up purchasing more.
(16:30):
But the word gets around and there's a pair of brothers,
Carlos and Pablo Soldi, and they hear about his interest
and they approach him and they say, hey, Doc, we
have an interest in pre inca art as well. We
have found a lot of stones. He ends up purchasing
(16:51):
something like three hundred and ten individual samples of these
stones from a nearby region. And they say, look, we've
been trying to talk to archaeologists about this. No one's
really into it. They think it's boring or it's honestly
not going to help them in their dissertations or whatever.
(17:12):
And so he says, okay, I'll buy it, and he
gets it for a song. He gets it for like,
let's see, this is the mid nineteen sixties. He gets
it for the equivalent of thirty pound sterling, so like
thirty British pounds that comes to us from the forty
een times. So he gets it at a very reasonable rate.
(17:35):
And he's still hungry for more stones. So he runs
into a farmer. Our second character we mentioned earlier, Basilia Usha,
and this guy, this farmer, Basilio, says, hey, look, duck,
I found this huge cash of stones because the Eco
River overflowed its banks and it destroyed nearby a globoration
(18:01):
of soil that exposed a cave. And I have also
been tried to get the attention of the Peruvian government.
I need I need the boffins on this, and and
the doctor says, well, hey, I'm wealthy, I'm smart, I'm interested.
Tell me where the cave is. And the farmer says,
(18:23):
oh no, no, no, no no, I can't tell you
where the cave is, but I will sell you some
of these stones.
Speaker 4 (18:30):
Who That's where things get a little sussy though, right,
because like, let's just come at this from the perspective
that these are authentic, doesn't that make this extra illegal
this type of yes, because.
Speaker 5 (18:42):
I mean yes, the government I believe is.
Speaker 4 (18:44):
Very hard on, you know, the theft of Peruvian artifacts,
which is what this would be.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
Considered one thousand percent and you would have motive here.
It would exist if you were a detective looking at this.
You know, in every light possible, you say, oh, this,
this man knows that this particular person is pretty wealthy
and willing to purchase something that you know he's already purchased.
(19:12):
Would you say three hundred and something, which would be
a pretty big windfall if you could sell three hundred
or maybe even more.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
Yeah, it's tasty. There's a new mommy to it, right,
So yeah, he says, look, Doc, I can't tell you
about the cave, but I can sell these to you
because the archaeologist won't pay attention to me, and we
can only assume. The doctor said, I feel you I
could contact the archaeologist, and the farmer said, no, okay, okay, okay,
(19:47):
one step at a time. Let me tell you some stones.
Doctor Cabrera ended up buying thousands of these. He had
more than, according to some report, to have more than
ten thousand, more than eleven thousand by the nineteen seventies
and over the years, because these guys had a relationship
(20:09):
for more than a decade. Over the years, Basilio produced
hundreds of these carved stones, and Cabrera, leveraging his social position,
became their greatest promoter, and he would always reach out
to scholars, to other aristocrats, fringe theory enthusiasts, and everybody
(20:33):
that he was speaking to. He was less asking them
for analysis and more proselytizing toward them and saying, these
stones are evidence that everything you know is wrong. Right
up and down right his left, shortest long blah blah blah.
(20:54):
That's a weird Al Yankovic reference. I don't think it'll land.
We'll keep it. But he's also he's also calling to
religious fundamentalist crouts, calling to creationists. And this gets us
to the point where we see that there are more
(21:16):
easily more than ten thousand stones as we record this evening.
They've been identified as eco stones. The majority belonged to
the estate of Cabrera. He was the hugest promoter. He
made his own museum. Imagine being that well off, you
could make your own museum for a thing. Why don't
(21:37):
we have a museum? Can we do a museum.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
I could with the magic cards.
Speaker 4 (21:45):
I could with synthesizers and action figures, but I kind
of want to keep them, so maybe maybe maybe after
I died, but then I'll be able to use them, you
know what.
Speaker 5 (21:54):
The museum could be hands on, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (21:56):
Yeah, like Sidetracker for a big museum he created originally
just contained stones he had purchased from those brothers that
we mentioned earlier, along with stones from his father's collection.
We said he was an aristocrat. His father, Bolivia Cabrera,
(22:17):
was from Spain, and his father had also collected stones.
Now this may be something that's familiar to various members
of the crowd tonight, but like just a quick personal anecdote,
I remember growing up on some family land that was
(22:40):
riddled with arrowheads. Did you guys ever do that, like
go digging for arrowheads?
Speaker 5 (22:45):
I did go digging.
Speaker 4 (22:47):
I don't know that I ever found anything authentic, but
it was also easiest to find chipped rocks and just
say that's what they were, you know, as with your
childlike imagination.
Speaker 5 (22:56):
That was probably more me.
Speaker 4 (22:57):
I bet you guys found some real deals though, trick
myself into believing a lot of like flint like things
were ever, tie it onto a stick and make yourself
an improvised bow out of a more bendy stick with
a nice piece of twine.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
I can't say that I did that.
Speaker 5 (23:12):
I did. Oh, is that unusual? I did, for sure.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
I don't know. I found some you know, probably canines
or some teeth from small animals that I totally believed
were shark teeth back in the day as well.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
Oh, I thought you were going to say you made
them into you made arrows from them, arrows from teeth.
That's the most subtle thing.
Speaker 5 (23:33):
Yeah, that would be sick.
Speaker 4 (23:34):
You can put the backwards part forward, you know, with
all the little spiky parts.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (23:39):
But Cabrera wasn't He also kind of a bit of
a hype man, like he really wanted to spread the word.
Speaker 5 (23:44):
Of these things far and wide.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
And this is where we see the folklore progression, or
the evolution the telephone game of this theory, because he
was talking to everybody about this, right, anyone who would
hear him out in academia, outside of academia. He wanted
their not even their opinion, certainly not their criticism. He
(24:11):
wanted their coside. And as the word transmitted throughout the
globe in different circles. It came to the attention of
a guy named Eric Vaughan Danakan, Eric von Danakan, Yeah,
publishes a paperback that I loved when I came out,
The Chariots of the Gods question Mark A little bit
(24:31):
of hedging there. He publishes this first in nineteen sixty nine.
It becomes an international bestseller, and a deluge of similar
books hit the market right after, you know, like when
an Action Blockbuster comes out, then they're inevitably a bunch
of direct to It used to be direct to vhs,
(24:55):
but now it's like direct to streaming sort of one offs.
What's the name of that the b studios.
Speaker 4 (25:02):
Well, they called the mockbusters was that term that was used,
but it was one called like the asylum, I think,
like so instead of transformers, it was transmorphers. And they
were literally banking on people I think, getting confused at
the video store and probably made some made some bucks
off of that.
Speaker 3 (25:19):
Similar in the mass market paperback game. At this point,
all of the The key thing here is that all
of these books name checked the mysterious Eca Stones, and
then later religious uh religious types took up the cause
of the Eca Stones because they were creationists, and uh,
(25:41):
not to not to call any of us out, but
anybody raised in a very religious Christian religious environment knows
that there's, uh, there's a lot of controversy around the
age of the Earth.
Speaker 4 (25:57):
Right, Well, there's certain perspectives in that kind of school
of thought. I guess they would even argue that dinosaurs
aren't real.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Right, Oh yeah, I've heard that argument.
Speaker 3 (26:06):
Is that real, like people saying dinosaurs aren't a thing?
Speaker 2 (26:09):
Absolutely, it's the speculation goes that it's a big trick
by the Smithsonian and other government organizations that are based
in Satan, and it's trying to trick human beings to
believe the Earth is much older and all this stuff,
when in fact, firmament and flat earth and all that
all just kind of want.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
To simply pointing out an extremity of this position, right,
and then it's definitely what you might call fringe. A
lot of this is but there are certainly people out
there that do put forth that that might well be
a possibility.
Speaker 3 (26:43):
Interesting contradiction because a lot of the creationists who championed
the idea of the ego stones championed it because it
showed that it appeared to show dinosaurs and humans living together,
which vibed with their idea that humans and dinosaurs both
existed in a world that was like six thousand to
(27:05):
five thousand years old.
Speaker 5 (27:07):
Max, Oh, if I'm not mistaken.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
Though, in certain kind of religious, more religious parts of
the country where there was controversy around depicting, you know,
evolution in textbooks, I believe there were some more creationist
leaning versions of textbooks that did express that very same sentiment.
Speaker 5 (27:28):
Ben, And this is a long time ago.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
I don't think this is maybe as much of a
thing anymore, but I do remember when that was a
real controversy. There were teachers in certain schools in certain
parts of the world that might.
Speaker 5 (27:40):
Have taught such things.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
Yeah. I had a T shirt for a long time, guys,
you might remember it. It was a great T shirt
and had a picture of Jesus writing on a raptor,
and it was kind of poking fun at some of
that stuff.
Speaker 5 (27:54):
You know.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
I'm a little embarrassed by it now, but it was
one of my favorite shirts.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
Wait do you not have that shirt before?
Speaker 4 (28:00):
I think that would be a thrift store find right there.
Let me tell you, people would pay good money for that, Oh.
Speaker 3 (28:07):
Man, I agree with Noel on this one. We also
know that riding the wave of this attention, the Good
Doctor wrote his own book where he set forth the
majority of the claims that have become sort of the
manifesto for people who believe in the Eca Stones. And
this is the hidden history. We got to talk about it, right,
(28:30):
We've made this a two part episode. Let's get into it.
What does he say in his book The Message of
the Engraved Stones of Eca.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
Let's say these one at a time. The first one
is that the stones themselves are way older than you think. Well,
I promise they're way older than you're imagining the thing
I'm about to say at least.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Oh, let's prices write it.
Speaker 2 (28:54):
One dollar million dollars.
Speaker 3 (28:57):
Okay, twelve thousand years, one million years.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Way way more four hundred and five million years old
at least according to the book Wow, based on what exactly.
Speaker 5 (29:16):
Vie It does say.
Speaker 4 (29:21):
Equally does go on to claim that through the transplantation
of cognitive codes to highly intelligent primates, the men from
outer space created new men on Earth. So these are
like gods. These are like like kind of godlike entities.
It's almost like the uh the Engineers and Prometheus in
(29:44):
the in the in the Alien World universe.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
The important thing to know there is that, according to
the book, humans did not start here on planet Earth.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
Which technically could be seen as supporting the idea of
pan spermia, which is really concept with a terrible name.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
Again, every time that word comes up, I think about
Dan Harmon being like that, what did you say?
Speaker 3 (30:09):
He roasted us on that one. Yeah? Dad, if you're listening,
shout out man. Yeah. The stones also, according to doctor Cabrera,
they depict dinosaurs and these proto humans he calls the
stones that he likes. The doctor calls them glypto liths,
(30:32):
and he says the show that these hypothetical ancient people
interacted with these reptiles, and they had larger brains than
those of modern man, these alien humans, and that they
used a form of quote, concentrated psychic energy ends quote,
(30:52):
with which they were able to influence celestial events, and
they would record those massive, those massive instances of esp
on the stones. So of course they would so like,
you know how, I want to be careful. I would
say this. We all have at some point met a
(31:15):
person who is low key convinced they can control the weather. Yeah,
I'm not kidding. There there are people who and we're
not saying they're jerks or assholes or anything like that,
you know, but they're saying, Oh, I can make it rain,
or oh I can stop the rain.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
I've had my moments when there's some gusting winds in
the back where I put my hand out right as
the wind starts back up and I go, oh, oh crap.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
And to explain the science with that, because there is
science to that, it's it's a matter of psychological interpretation
of the physical signals, like your body will tell you
when it's about to rain, or when sometimes when the
rain's going to stop. Things like that. You know, if
you want to impress us if you can control the weather,
(32:06):
then show us video of you make enlightening.
Speaker 2 (32:10):
Yes, please, let's pause right here for a word from
our sponsor and get back with more on the eco
stones and we're back really quickly, jump back in here.
The concept that some incredibly psychically powerful civilization, right manlike
(32:35):
creatures could have all of this technology or all of
this understanding, could be disadvanced and would choose stones as
the medium to record what they do into to a
historical record into stones. It may sound silly when it
first when you first hear it, but it always makes
me remember our discussions we've had about what actually sticks
(32:59):
around after nature takes over.
Speaker 5 (33:03):
Something.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
Yeah, is stones, stone work, stone carvings specifically, even this
kind of carving, paintings.
Speaker 4 (33:12):
Even, I mean, we have so much information from the
historical record, not only just in terms of like sedimentary record,
but like actual artifacts that were created by stone because
they're just damn resilient. Then, as we pointed out, these
particular types of stones, these volcanic stones, are particularly resilient,
which is kind of a feature and a bug in
this scenario, at least in terms of the provenance of
(33:34):
these things.
Speaker 5 (33:35):
Right. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:37):
Check out the research that US scientists and sci fi
writers did a few decades back when they were trying
to figure out how to warn future civilizations about the
dangers of radiation. They ultimately end up going back to
stone glyphs. Yep, because that'll stick around. So there is
(33:59):
there is a lot of plausibility to that or possibility.
But are but.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
The way ben Yeah, stone glyphs and pictograms, right, like
pictures not words.
Speaker 6 (34:09):
Not words like ikea instructions wow man, Okay, sorry, Ike,
it reminds me of this thing, like, if this is real, maybe.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
That is how somebody would try and get a message
across millions of years.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
Mm hmm, yeah right, it's It's one of the most
effective ways. So if you ever want a lasting monument,
make it in stone, honestly, and just hope the tectonic
plates play ball.
Speaker 5 (34:38):
They don't collide too hard, right.
Speaker 3 (34:41):
Right, And speaking of when worlds collide, our buddy doctor
Cabrera runs into science fiction, right. He does a lot
for future sci fi writers when he says, furthermore, I
believe that some of the machines depicted in these in
these motifs, they look like spacecraft, which to me means
(35:03):
they traveled through space without consuming fuel. And the Nosca
lines are definitely, foresure remnants of an ancient spaceport. I
am taking no questions at this time.
Speaker 4 (35:20):
Become a good dayson I said, yeah, I mean, look, okay.
Speaker 3 (35:26):
Also, before, lest we sound like we're dunking on this
guy unnecessarily, it is true that the earliest Peruvian artifacts
do date back to around twenty thousand years ago. These
are true things. They do not make any claims about
living around dinosaurs. They don't make any claims about traveling
(35:46):
through space or any great celestial psychic power esp revelations.
We know that engraved stones have been around in the
region and discovered way before the Ecostones gained prominence in
nineteen sixty six. There were Jesuit missionaries who traveled through
(36:06):
Peru during the Spanish conquest, and they even sent some
of these stones, like engraved stones from previous civilizations back
to Spain. Some of these stones are legitimate, but there
are problems. I think we can talk about that, right
if there's an actual All right, here's the thing. Technology
(36:29):
leaves more than a single imprint future, Like in this
kind of time window, you know, two thousand years from now,
the idea of a fossil fuel powered civilization is not
going to be based on the discovery of a single
cache of stones in a cave. There are going to
(36:50):
be other pieces of residue, a sort of sociological ectoplasm,
if you will, right, vestiges of these things. Well, thank you,
thank you. Yeah. The Inca didn't have a written record,
but they had a rich oral tradition. So you're telling
us that not one single story from this super dense
(37:12):
catalog of folklore. Not one of those stories mentioned a
telescope or a beat me here a machine that could fly.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
Oh man, that is such a good point.
Speaker 3 (37:22):
Just never mention it. It's just the one one stone.
I mean, dinosaurs also died out, as far as we know,
for the most part, way before primates hit the scene.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
At least that we're we're aware of. That's what science
says right now, yeah.
Speaker 3 (37:39):
Quote unquote science. I mean, also, you know, if we're
tracing the modern story. The BBC produced a documentary on
the Eco Stones, and they had some scathing conclusions. It
goes back, I think to your earlier point, Noel. The
Peruvian government felt a lot of Western pressure and they
(38:02):
felt like they had to respond to this.
Speaker 5 (38:04):
That's right.
Speaker 4 (38:05):
They did have a mandate to, you know, kind of
oversee the historical relics, the antiquities of the country, and
so the government felt that pressure to kind of have
a show of force here. So they arrested the farmer
for selling these stones under the pretemps these were in
fact legitimate artifacts, at which point the farmer does about
(38:28):
face and quickly changes his story. Whether or not you
believe this is just a self serving act of a
desperate person that's been backed into a corner.
Speaker 5 (38:39):
Or if this is the real story in LA, you
be the judge.
Speaker 4 (38:41):
There were farmer re candidates story claiming in fact that
he had carved all ten thousand of the stones himself.
Get a step further, guys. He demonstrated his technique. Remember
we were talking about how do you penetrate the you know,
the very durable seven out of ten mose scale surface
(39:04):
of these volcanic rocks. We're gonna need something a little
more powerful than just like a hammer and chisel, and
he showed that he had been doing it with sort
of like a drimal type tool or I guess maybe
you could a dental drill, maybe, Ben, which was my
teeth throw on.
Speaker 5 (39:20):
I just thinking about it.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
Makes your teeth sing. Yeah, apparently, he said. Just we
were relating there, this is how I did it. Not
only did I create these historical hoaxes like this shrouded
to it, but I also used a dental drill. Let
me show you the these methods. The government considered this
(39:42):
all a hoax. They shut it down and they said,
all right, our geopolitical embarrassment is over and done with
you know what I mean, Like, if you fart in
a busy elevator and then you get to your floor, hey,
just walk away, you know, you just hope you don't
meet those six people again. Cynthia, I'm sorry, Well, can I.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
Can I posit something here just as a again, maybe
a minor devil's advocate.
Speaker 3 (40:10):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, major devil's advocate.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
I'm trying to put myself in the shoes of this farmer.
And the government finally gets wind of what you're doing,
and they're none too happy about it. They're saying, hey, uh,
what you've been doing is illegal, and you are going
under the jail for betraying your country basically, and all
(40:36):
of the people's in the history you're you're going to jail.
Would you maybe, put in that position be willing to
say something like I hoaxed this whole thing to try
and get out of that.
Speaker 4 (40:50):
Well, that's yeah, that's what I was kind of saying.
I wasn't being a total jerk. I mean, like, it
does seem backed into a corner or perhaps because of
the influence of others, that this person took the fall,
you know, and uh and acted as sort of a
knowing Patsy.
Speaker 3 (41:07):
Yeah, I like that. I like this. I think this
is a fitting wave for us to begin wrapping this up,
because even now a ton of people believe that Eco
stones are legitimate and that there is a cover up
of some sort of foot because the person with the
lowest socioeconomic status, Let's be honest, Basilio I was forced
(41:28):
to announce that he had faked the stones to avoid imprisonment,
and they were going to lock this guy up for years. Uh.
Peruvian law explicitly prohibits the sale of archaeological discoveries. So
what if under that pressure, perhaps pressure against his family
as well, he took the fall right and said, hey,
(41:51):
I'm faking it. Nothing to see here, you know. Just
let me be a free man, Let my family be safe.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (41:58):
And I've learned not to interact with the one percent
or whatever. He later has an interview with a journalist
wherein he says, I did not forge any of this.
I had to claim they were a hoax so I
could avoid jail time because you know, I'm not a
(42:19):
wealthy man.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
I have to keep my job because of the iron
fisted approach to pursuing folks dealing in these types of
stolen antiquities right.
Speaker 3 (42:30):
Right, and then we see other ripples in the pond.
Here there are other folks like a archaeologist Alejandro Pezi Eserito,
They who argue that they have found other stones that
are similar, that also have engraved patina, that if not,
(42:52):
if they don't purport to show the same things, they
show similar things.
Speaker 4 (42:58):
I think it's really important that we'd tina. I think
is very interesting because if you look at like a
raw one of these types of volcanic stones, they're real rough,
you know, the outside, and they aren't like this kind
of smooth obsidian quality. And if you look at images
of these stones they have that. That's why I brought
up a massage stone thing. That's what those look like.
They have this sort of patina that that has to
(43:20):
be carved into.
Speaker 5 (43:22):
Well, what do you think, who's full of crap? Here?
Speaker 3 (43:27):
Well, some of the stones, this is the thing. Part
of this is true. Some of these stones are legitimate.
That's fantastic news. The slightly less fantastic news is that
the legit stones, which are weathered for sure, and are
ancient and are engraved by human hands, they're all what
(43:48):
we will call the tamer stones. They don't have fanciful
depictions dinosaurs and humans high five and none of the
sci fi stuff. It looks like historical hoaxes got mixed
in with the general article as part of the booming
illegal trade in ancient artifacts. That's a distressingly common phenomena
(44:08):
throughout the world and throughout history, like how many pieces
of the True Cross were sold in the Middle Ages.
You know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (44:18):
I do, yeah, And it makes sense, as we said
at the very top of this, if you find there
is a side hustle and all you need is a
drill in some smooth stones and you can make bank.
M Maybe you take that.
Speaker 3 (44:37):
We got into the wrong business, you know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (44:40):
Like I think we should be all the time.
Speaker 3 (44:42):
Faking historical stuff right.
Speaker 2 (44:44):
Now, gosh, in my dreams.
Speaker 3 (44:47):
Here's here's the real bullet that hit Kennedy. Too dark.
All right, we'll do something, We'll do something different. So
this is mostly a hoax unless we choose to believe
doctor Cabrera and Usja, both of whom ultimately maintained that
there is something the Peruvian government and perhaps the world
(45:08):
doesn't want you to know. Unfortunately, we cannot ask the
doctor about his beliefs directly as he passed away in
two thousand and one. However, if you want to learn more,
he has a museum. His estate has museum, the Museo
Scientifico Avier Caberettra, which you can visit.
Speaker 4 (45:29):
I do think it's really interesting, man, when you google
this stuff and look for, like, you know, Ikostone's dating
and all of this kind of thing, the majority of
the bulk of like articles that come up are megacreationist websites.
Speaker 5 (45:45):
They are really behind this thing, man, at first.
Speaker 4 (45:48):
And I was looking at it first, say, and again,
I'm not here to diss anybody's religion or whatever. That's
not the point here. But I just think it's very
interesting that obviously has a a there is an agenda
here in terms of like helping to bolster someone's set
of beliefs. And I was reading this article on creation
dot com before I realized it was on creation dot com,
and it seemed very like scientifically measured talking about different methods.
Speaker 5 (46:11):
Of dating and stuff.
Speaker 4 (46:12):
And I'm not saying the stuff in here isn't necessarily accurate,
but it is very much on this site that says
humans and dinosaurs existed together. And that's what they're trying
to prove through various means.
Speaker 5 (46:27):
It's interesting.
Speaker 2 (46:29):
I just want to see the dino movies that were
created before mankind came around, Like, what kind of cinema
are they making?
Speaker 5 (46:38):
You know, I love it.
Speaker 3 (46:39):
I want to see the conspiracy about a meteor landing.
You know, it's crazy staggo man a media from space.
Speaker 2 (46:50):
Oh, it's like that movie twenty twelve. But just yeah, yeah,
a couple million years, hundreds of millions of years before, folks.
Speaker 3 (46:59):
We can't wait to hear your I love that pitch, Matt.
We can't wait to hear your pitch for a dinosaur
version of a movie? Right, pre human? Right? What would
what what would Devil's Advocate be about if it were
by dinosaurs for dinosaurs so B D f D And
(47:23):
what would what would your favorite tropes be? What would
what would your interpretation of a classic dynos cinema be? Uh?
Equally as important.
Speaker 4 (47:32):
What kind of dinosaur would al Pacino be? Just that's
just a straight up question.
Speaker 3 (47:37):
As specific as possible, Yes, as specific as possible. Bonus
points if you base it on science. Christopher Walken as well, obviously.
Speaker 5 (47:47):
Hawkins a t rex because of the hands.
Speaker 3 (47:49):
Do you think so?
Speaker 4 (47:50):
I think I don't know why. I'm sorry it doesn't
have weird hands, but it just hit me, just hit
me that way.
Speaker 3 (47:58):
Also, we understand that some human actors can't really be
put in a box like that. Shout out till the
Swinton Gary Oldman in particular. They're just they're chameleons already.
We also want to know, perhaps equally or more importantly,
what other pieces of anachronistic technology should we explore in
(48:19):
the future. Let us know. We try to be easy
to find online. That's right.
Speaker 4 (48:24):
You can find us at the handle Conspiracy Stuff, where
we exist on YouTube where we have video content galore,
on x FKA, Twitter, and on.
Speaker 5 (48:34):
Facebook we have our Facebook group. Here's where it gets crazy.
Speaker 4 (48:37):
Hey, feeling charitable, why not hit us up on Apple Podcasts.
The podcast is called stuff they Don't Want You to
Know and leave us a five star review. Really help
people discover the show, and we really appreciate your service.
You can also find us at the handle Conspiracy Stuff
show on Instagram and TikTok.
Speaker 2 (48:54):
Hey, and also tell your friends about the show. Talk
to your friends about these weird stones, see what they think,
na and then send them our way.
Speaker 3 (49:03):
If you don't like the show, tell your enemies.
Speaker 2 (49:06):
That's right, especially your enemies. If you want to talk
to us directly, you can use your mouth and your phone.
Isn't that weird? You can call one eight three three STDWYTK.
That's our voicemail system. When you call in, give yourself
a cool nickname, and then let us know. If we
can use your name and message on the air, then
the rest of that three minute voicemail is yours. Use
(49:29):
it as you'd like. If you've got more to say
than can fit in that message, why not instead send
us a good old fashioned email.
Speaker 3 (49:36):
We are the entities that read every piece of correspondence
we receive. Be aware, yet unafraid. Sometimes the void writes back,
send us just like our pal Humor. Is Harry your
favorite dinosaur jokes? What do you call a dinosaur wearing
a cowboy hat and boots? Tyanosaurus texts that's how low
(50:01):
the bar is, So press us, elevate us. Let's journey
into the darkness together. Conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.
Speaker 2 (50:29):
Stuff they Don't Want You to Know is a production
of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio, app,
Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Stuff They Don't Want You To Know News
Hosts And Creators
Matt Frederick
Ben Bowlin
Noel Brown
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