May 6, 2024 • 21 mins
Once more, it's time for a weekly dose of Stuff to Blow Your Mind and Weirdhouse Cinema listener mail...
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Hey you welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. Listener mail.
My name is Robert Lamb.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
Here we are again, and I'm Joe McCormick, and it's Monday,
the day of each week that we read back messages
from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind email address. If
you have never gotten in touch with the show before,
you should email us at contact at stuff to Blow
your Mind dot com. We appreciate any kind of feedback
to the show, or just anything interesting you'd like to share.
(00:37):
We especially like it if you have something fascinating to
add to a topic we've recently covered on the show.
Let's see Rob, I think I'm going to kick things
off today with one of these messages. In response to
our series on dust, Let's do it So. One of
the things we talked about in part five of that
series was about dust storms and about the threat dust
(00:59):
storms to machinery and vehicles. You don't want to drive
in a dust storm, but you also just don't want
to get too much dust into your vehicle, engine and stuff.
And Thatcher writes in on that topic, Thatcher says, Hello,
he talked about dust damaging vehicles. In your part five episode,
(01:23):
I wanted to add that dust can clog air intake
filters very quickly. My friend was a first responder on
nine to eleven and when he drove his truck home afterward,
he noticed that it had reduced power and wasn't and
just wasn't performing the way it usually does. When he
checked the air intake filter to the engine, it was
completely clogged with concrete dust from the twin towers. I
(01:46):
wonder if any other listeners have had similar experiences. Thank
you for a wonderful show. I've been listening for many,
many years, and I look forward to each episode every week.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Thatcher, Oh wow, that's quite a story there.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Yeah, obviously for how it connects to nine to eleven,
but also I I mean, I wonder if different types
of dust have a different sort of engine clogging or
machinery wrecking powers, Like if concrete dust is of a
finer grain than the standard kind of dust you'd get
blowing in and say a natural dust storm coming off
(02:21):
of the desert or something. I don't know for sure,
but yeah, that's interesting either way, and one of many
reasons not to drive in in clouds of dust.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
All right. This next one comes to us from Jeff,
and I think this one's kind of dual purpose because
into a little bit of dust and a little bit
of weird house cinema. The subject line is dust wind Dude.
Jeff writes, greeting science humans. Just wanted to thank you
(02:51):
again for the variety of topics you investigate on your shows.
It's probably the greatest era of earth history for laundry
and other chores. My primary interest in horn dust is
the way it activates cheap mode for sunset photography. You
don't have to have nice equipment or much skill. You
don't have to be on the shore or at altitude.
Just point your phone west at Golden Hour with an
(03:12):
appealingly shaped something silhouetted in the foreground, and for a
spectacular photo with a brilliant orange background. Turns a quick
snap of a telephone pole or a corner convenience store
into frameable art and other dusty news. I've always thought
the Sandman was an explanation for the gross sand in
your eyes when you wake up. I also wanted to
(03:33):
thank you for opening up old memories of Dragonslayer. Unlike
some of the other eighties movies, you've featured. I hadn't
thought much of it since those endless summers of HBO
couch time. I haven't played YouTube clips of favorite scenes,
hunted down the soundtrack, imdbat, which actor played the wizard, etc.
Those memories were all locked away, waiting to be reactivated
(03:54):
by your show. The moments that immediately jumped into my
mind were telling the horrible baby dragons devouring the sacrifice,
the hero levitating the egg, thus proving he actually did
have access to real magic, the half second of partial
nudity during the reveal scene at the pond, smashing the
amulet for the win. What I definitely didn't process back
(04:16):
then was the parallel between the old Wizards sizing up
the value of the remainder of his life and the
dragon doing the same, putting their energy into the generation
to come. Jeff continues here he says time is a
relentless B word. This is the longer of the two
B words. I'll let you figure out the rest, just
being just out of an abundance of caution. We don't
(04:37):
even get flagged or labeled with anything on any of
the podcast publication systems without due reason.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
I think we're getting rated by AI or something.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Yeah. Anyway, Jeff says, as is often highlighted when you're
doing the connection segment and you note how many of
the people involved are no longer with us. I'll think
that can't be right. But forty years to the average
age of a competent artist, and you're bound to see
a fair bit of that. On a happier note, thanks
for featuring Return to Oz on Weird House. I must
(05:09):
have passed on it when I was a kid, since
the original somehow never made much of an impression on me.
I've always been allergic to musicals. However, after watching the
delightful Ladies movie on your recommendation, I've since read all
of the original L. Frank Baum Oz books, as well
as some of his other works. The movie had the
benefit of being based on the second and third OZ books,
which I thought were the best. They aren't exactly great literature,
(05:30):
but they are fun reads, and it's fascinating trying to
figure out what was going on in BAM's mind as
he wrote them. He led an interesting life and had
interesting friends. What was he trying to tell the children?
The running dialogue he had with his fans, and the
preface of each book was almost as entertaining as the
stories themselves. After a while, Bomb got sick of writing
about Oz. He wrote other sorts of stories, but they
(05:52):
didn't sell as well. He tried Oz books with different protagonists,
but the kids constantly bombarded him with letters saying, that's nice,
but what our Dorothy and Toto up to. He seemed
increasingly exasperated as the series went on, but kept a
sense of humor about it. Sometimes he would drop Dorothy
and other fan favorites into an unrelated story, the same
way Marvel editors used to try to punch up sales
(06:13):
by adding Wolverine to a given title. Oh, I mean
now I'm excited about Wolverine and Oz. So someone's done it.
Someone's done it, I'm sure, so write in and tell
us about it. The fan interaction reminded me of old
school comic book letters pages. Bomb's books actually had a
lot of shared DNA with comics, including crossovers, shared universes,
and retcons. The explanation for why Toto didn't speak in
(06:35):
the first book when other mundane animals gained the ability
to talk in Oz gave me one of the better
laughs in the series.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
I love that Jeff alludes to that, but then doesn't
tell us what the explanation is.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Was there an explanation? They didn't get into it and
return to Ozy. I don't recall, I don't even.
Speaker 3 (06:54):
Recall the chicken talks, doesn't it?
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Yeah? Anyway, Jeff continues. He probably also responded to parental
feed back in that the Tin Woodman and the Cowardly
Lion become much less murderous as the series continues. They
have a pretty high kill count in the early books,
but the stories remain suburbly superbly weird. Once the rules
established that no one can die in Oz itself, Bomb
goes full Cronenberg with the possibilities of characters who can
(07:17):
be carved up without experiencing the sweet release of death.
The original story of the Tin Woodsmen and his ramifications
are most horrible in a fun way. One king would
punish subjects by having two people cut in half lengthwise
and the mismatched parts sewn together. Both beings retained their
sense of self and let a miserable existence in control
of only one half of their body, with the other's
(07:39):
thoughts intruding upon their own. There are also more beasts
who fling their own heads at our heroes. Lots of
monster fact material in those books. Good to know. Thanks
again for continuing to direct us to new piles of
weirdness to explore.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Jeff Man love a beast that throws its own head.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
Absolutely, Oh well, there's a lot of great stuff in
this uh this feedback, I will say on the connections,
you know note in older movies, Yeah, it is always
it can be a little sad, little little sobering, you know,
to look at up the cast and crew for a
film and realize that, like everybody's dead. Like sometimes it's
you know, the cast, it'll be everybody's dead except for
the child actors or maybe and or maybe one of
(08:19):
the leading ladies. That sort of thing. I don't know,
it's just, uh, it's that's how it goes.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
But especially when it doesn't feel like an especially old movie.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
Yeah, yeah, it's true. I mean, you know, some of
these these folks that are relatively young. But on the
other hand, it's also kind of refreshing when we cover
a movie and I'm going through the connections, I'm like, oh,
I think everybody's alive. It happens every now and then
it's like like like winning at Bingo.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
I do think this is funny hearing about Baum getting
the same kinds of messages that that fans are like
posting to internet forums and on Twitter today about their
favorite comic book, movies or whatever. It's that like, I
didn't like that this character wasn't included. How can it
be that the animals talk in OZ but this animal
doesn't talk. Doesn't make any sense, you.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Know, I don't think I've ever read any of his works,
so occasionally emails like this recommendations from various folks, it
makes me want to check it out. It does sound
fabulously weird.
Speaker 3 (09:18):
Now, as to Jeff's note about wondering if the story
of the sand Man putting sand in the child's eyes
to make them sleep, the explanation you gave in the episode,
Rob made a lot of sense to me, because you know,
sand would make you rub your eyes, and you rub
your eyes when you're sleepy. But Steve also agreed with
(09:39):
this explanation of it basically having to do with eye cruds.
So Steve wrote in and said, Hi, Robin Joe, it's
been a while, but in listening to your Sandman discussions
from the very dust, I remember to question I never
found an answer to in my childhood. When I was
a little boy, the first time I woke up with
(10:00):
eye crust in the corners of my eyes, I asked
my mom, is this sand Is this why people used
to talk about the sand Man? She did not know.
I still wonder if there's a connection to the myth
or folk tale. Then Steve provides a link and asks
if we can confirm or dismiss his hypothesis. Steve, I
doubt we can settle this one for you, But you
(10:23):
and Jeff are thinking on the same frequency. Okay, Rob,
do you mind if I read this message from Luisa?
Speaker 2 (10:37):
Yeah, let's have it.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Okay, Luisa says, Hi, Guys, who would have thought that
something as mundane as dust would be interesting enough for
five episodes? Only you? I kept putting this email off,
expecting you to talk about dust in literature, but you
either still have to release part six or that's it
for the series. That is it for the series for now?
We're done for now, Luisa says, Just in case you
(11:01):
don't get around to it, I would like to remind
you of the role that dust plays in George Orwell's
nineteen eighty four In the plot. Dust plays a symbolic
part and is all pervasive, just as much as Big Brother.
The main character. Winston begins the book feeling protected by
it and ends up feeling completely overwhelmed. It is everywhere,
and it also represents his own unraveling. I cannot find
(11:25):
a better literary use of dust in a plot. Yeah,
I do remember a lot of references to dust. In
nineteen eighty four. I think Winston talks about his neighbor
in his apartment building, Missus Parsons, having creases in her
face that always looked as if dust was trapped in
the creases. And it's like a detail he mentions over
(11:46):
and over, as if it represents some kind of like
decay of life itself. You know, there's just kind of
like ash and grime building up on our bodies. And
there's one part where Winston thinking about sort of the
general hopelessness of life under the Party and Big Brother,
and he describes London as quote vast and ruinous, a
(12:09):
city of a million dust bins. I think that's a
really striking image. It's like it selects as the defining
object of a civilization, the place where waste is discarded,
and it actually reminds me of those visions of the
underworld of the dead and the epic of Gilgamesh, you know,
the house of dust, where dust is their food and
(12:29):
clay is their bread. But anyway, to come back to
Luisa's message, Luisa says, I can, however, tell you that
I used to think dust was the bane of my
domestic existence until I had German shepherds. Every time the
female sheds, it's like brushing out another dog from her.
I'm seriously considering buying a loom and making dog thread.
(12:52):
Wait didn't In one of our episodes we talked about, like,
you know, boutique clothing made out of dust bunnies.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
We discussed the possibility.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
Maybe I brought it up and you were you shamed
me for doing so.
Speaker 2 (13:05):
I don't remember shaming you.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
I deserve to be share.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
I have questions about how it would work, but.
Speaker 3 (13:12):
Let's see. Luisa says, thanks so much, as always for
your wonderful work. Best regards, Luisa. Oh, and then she
attaches a picture of the hair from her dog, Alma.
This is the hair shed in one sitting. That is
truly wow. That it's a lot of hair. But I
know a lot about shedding dogs. I've had my share
(13:34):
of shedding dogs in my life too, and they can whoo,
they can they can shed a storm.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Yeah, that's a lot. I have to stay on top
of our cat with the ferminator, but still not quite
this much for he comes out.
Speaker 3 (13:48):
Does your cat like the ferminator?
Speaker 2 (13:50):
Well, she loves the brush, and then she'll tolerate the ferminator.
So I'll use the ferminator in the brush at the
same time, one in each hand, and it's kind of
a careful dance. It used to be even more of
a dance because she gets so riled up that she
would also try and scratch me. But she's older now
she's a little slower, so I can usually stay on
top of her her over excited aggressions. All right. This
(14:13):
next one comes to us from Mike. Mike says, I
love the four Dust episodes. In episode four, when you
were talking about Sandman's Dust, I immediately thought about Neil
gaman Sandman comic. The comic is about an entity called
Dream and his realm, the Dreaming. In the early issues,
he has to track down some of his tools that
(14:34):
were stolen from him an issue three and also episode
three of the television adaptation Dreams. Bag of dream dust
falls into the hands of an innocent woman who becomes
helplessly addicted to the dreams and fantasies that the dream
dust gives her. She ends up more or less wasting
away because she wants to spend more time in the
dream than in real life. It's an excellent read with
some pretty disturbing imagery. Thanks for the podcast. Stuff to
(14:56):
Blow Your Mind is the podcast I recommend to most people. Mike, Yeah,
the good good note, Mike. You know, we didn't mention
the Sandman comic or the Netflix adaptation in these episodes,
but both are excellent. I was. I was a fan
of the comic back when I read it years ago,
and I really did enjoy the Netflix adaptation as well.
(15:17):
I thought I had a great cast, very well put together.
I seem to recall that David S. Goyer is involved
in that as well, has a tremendous cast.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
Though I am not familiar with it.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Oh well, treat yourself. It's good stuff.
Speaker 3 (15:32):
Yeah, may get there someday. Goes on the list with
everything else.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
All right.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
This next message is in response to the series we
did on the Egyptian God Osiris. This comes from Constantinos.
Constantinos says, good day, gentlemen. I enjoyed your episode on
Osiris and have two comments. These are big topics, but
(15:58):
I'll try to be assistinct as possible possible. Part one
a slice of pie that stands for proto Indo European.
The first is that any Greek attestment to Egyptian origins
of Greek mythology has to be taken with a grain
of salt. I think that Greeks like Herodotus, who cited
Egyptian mythological roots were simply overreaching and letting conjecture get
(16:19):
the better of them. Oh yeah. This connects to the
idea that maybe the Greek gods were in some sense
the same as the Egyptian gods and just different names
for them, or maybe A later take on a similar
view is that the idea that the Greek mythology evolved
from the Egyptian mythology, which some people have proposed, and
Constantinos here is saying that that is not likely the case.
(16:44):
So he says, here is a mainstream academic view of
Greek mythology origins. In summary one, proto Indo Europeans migrated
from the Russian Steps to Greece. Proto Indo European settlers
were pastoralists, their economy center around cattle. Meanwhile, the indigenous
Greeks were in agricultural society. We know precious little about
(17:07):
the Proto Indo Europeans and indigenous Greeks, but the Proto
Indo European settlers brought the Greek language to Greece. Proto
Indo European settlers brought their pastoral gods Zeus at All
and melded them into the indigenous people's agricultural gods demmeter
at All, and together they created the Olympian Pantheon. There
(17:28):
are other non Proto Indo European and non indigenous influences
on Greek mythology Parentheses, Apollo, question Mark, maybe Dionysus. The
latter's origin is still controversial, but they seem more Anatolian,
maybe Cypriot or in Cretan than Egyptian. I tend to
view Greek mythology as sedimentary rock with layers upon layers
(17:50):
of development, rather than one single thing. Anyway, there does
not seem to be a lot of evidence for direct
imports of Egyptian myths during the early formative phases of
the Greek mythos. But that is not to say that
it did not happen. We just have clearer paths to
other places. Part two, Resurrecting the resurrecting god's debate. This
(18:11):
is a reference to us bringing up the question of
whether Osiris and other gods from the ancient world should
be thought of as gods that die and then rise
again in the way that say Jesus, or maybe some
of the figures from other mystery religions would would be
said to die and rise again. And Constantinos is about
(18:32):
to bring up one of the gods of one of
these mystery religions. He says, I'm surprised that your discussion
on resurrecting gods did not include Dionysus and Orpheus. Again,
this is a huge subject, but I will try to
just hit the high points. The god Dionysus was killed
and torn apart by evil Titans. At the direction of
the goddess Hera. Athena saved Dionysus's heart, and Zeus resurrects him.
(18:58):
Orpheus may have been the name of a religious figure
from northern Greece, regardless of whether he existed. Orpheus is
credited as being the prophet that founded a mystery cult
centered around the resurrected Dionysus. Orphists believed that humans are
born of the original sin parentheses the dust of the
burnt Titans, but also have a divine spark, the soul.
(19:21):
Long story short, be good and your soul gets to
heaven the Elysian Fields. Orphism is old and foundational to
Western religious traditions. In fact, the oldest surviving European written text,
the fourth century BC Dirveni Papyrus, is an orphic hymn.
Many have drawn direct lines from orphism to Neoplatonism and Christianity.
(19:44):
It is a deep rabbit hole to go down, and
the case is compelling its links to Christianity. Aside, Dionysus
is demonstrably one of the earliest resurrecting gods that did
indeed spawn a religion centered on his resurrection. Hope you
found that interesting. Thank you all for a love podcast
that I cannot stop recommending to any that will listen. Cheers.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
Oh that's excellent. You know, I do think we could
come back in the future and do a proper Orpheus
or Dionysus podcast series, you know, focus it because you
know we do love our deep dives into mythology. All right,
We're gonna go ahead close up the mail bag here.
We had some that we didn't have time to get
to today, but we will come back to those in
(20:24):
a future installment of Listener Mail, so keep them coming.
We'd love to hear from you on episodes past, episodes
present or episodes future, your recommendations and so forth. And
if you're on the fence, if you're like, I'm kind
of thinking about writing into the show, but I've never
done it before. I don't know if this is interesting enough,
go ahead and give it a shot. We'd love to
(20:45):
hear from you regardless, and we do. We do read everything,
even if we don't read everything on listener Mail, and
even though we don't respond to everything via email, we
do read it. So it's the best way to get
in touch with us, the best way to share your
enthusiasm in the best way to share any feedback, constructive
feedback about the show itself, though, don't be shy about
(21:07):
throwing some positive reviews and some stars our way. Wherever
you get the podcast. I will remind you that listener
mail airs on Mondays. In the Stuff to Blow Your
Mind podcast, feed core episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays, short
form episode on Wednesdays and on Fridays. We set aside
most series concerns to just talk about a weird film
on Weird House Cinema.
Speaker 3 (21:25):
Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway.
If you would like to get in touch with us
with feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest
a topic for the future, or just to say hi,
you can email us at contact at stuff to Blow
your Mind dot com.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For
more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Hey you welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. Listener mail.
My name is Robert Lamb.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
Here we are again, and I'm Joe McCormick, and it's Monday,
the day of each week that we read back messages
from the Stuff to Blow Your Mind email address. If
you have never gotten in touch with the show before,
you should email us at contact at stuff to Blow
your Mind dot com. We appreciate any kind of feedback
to the show, or just anything interesting you'd like to share.
(00:37):
We especially like it if you have something fascinating to
add to a topic we've recently covered on the show.
Let's see Rob, I think I'm going to kick things
off today with one of these messages. In response to
our series on dust, Let's do it So. One of
the things we talked about in part five of that
series was about dust storms and about the threat dust
(00:59):
storms to machinery and vehicles. You don't want to drive
in a dust storm, but you also just don't want
to get too much dust into your vehicle, engine and stuff.
And Thatcher writes in on that topic, Thatcher says, Hello,
he talked about dust damaging vehicles. In your part five episode,
(01:23):
I wanted to add that dust can clog air intake
filters very quickly. My friend was a first responder on
nine to eleven and when he drove his truck home afterward,
he noticed that it had reduced power and wasn't and
just wasn't performing the way it usually does. When he
checked the air intake filter to the engine, it was
completely clogged with concrete dust from the twin towers. I
(01:46):
wonder if any other listeners have had similar experiences. Thank
you for a wonderful show. I've been listening for many,
many years, and I look forward to each episode every week.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Thatcher, Oh wow, that's quite a story there.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Yeah, obviously for how it connects to nine to eleven,
but also I I mean, I wonder if different types
of dust have a different sort of engine clogging or
machinery wrecking powers, Like if concrete dust is of a
finer grain than the standard kind of dust you'd get
blowing in and say a natural dust storm coming off
(02:21):
of the desert or something. I don't know for sure,
but yeah, that's interesting either way, and one of many
reasons not to drive in in clouds of dust.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
All right. This next one comes to us from Jeff,
and I think this one's kind of dual purpose because
into a little bit of dust and a little bit
of weird house cinema. The subject line is dust wind Dude.
Jeff writes, greeting science humans. Just wanted to thank you
(02:51):
again for the variety of topics you investigate on your shows.
It's probably the greatest era of earth history for laundry
and other chores. My primary interest in horn dust is
the way it activates cheap mode for sunset photography. You
don't have to have nice equipment or much skill. You
don't have to be on the shore or at altitude.
Just point your phone west at Golden Hour with an
(03:12):
appealingly shaped something silhouetted in the foreground, and for a
spectacular photo with a brilliant orange background. Turns a quick
snap of a telephone pole or a corner convenience store
into frameable art and other dusty news. I've always thought
the Sandman was an explanation for the gross sand in
your eyes when you wake up. I also wanted to
(03:33):
thank you for opening up old memories of Dragonslayer. Unlike
some of the other eighties movies, you've featured. I hadn't
thought much of it since those endless summers of HBO
couch time. I haven't played YouTube clips of favorite scenes,
hunted down the soundtrack, imdbat, which actor played the wizard, etc.
Those memories were all locked away, waiting to be reactivated
(03:54):
by your show. The moments that immediately jumped into my
mind were telling the horrible baby dragons devouring the sacrifice,
the hero levitating the egg, thus proving he actually did
have access to real magic, the half second of partial
nudity during the reveal scene at the pond, smashing the
amulet for the win. What I definitely didn't process back
(04:16):
then was the parallel between the old Wizards sizing up
the value of the remainder of his life and the
dragon doing the same, putting their energy into the generation
to come. Jeff continues here he says time is a
relentless B word. This is the longer of the two
B words. I'll let you figure out the rest, just
being just out of an abundance of caution. We don't
(04:37):
even get flagged or labeled with anything on any of
the podcast publication systems without due reason.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
I think we're getting rated by AI or something.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Yeah. Anyway, Jeff says, as is often highlighted when you're
doing the connection segment and you note how many of
the people involved are no longer with us. I'll think
that can't be right. But forty years to the average
age of a competent artist, and you're bound to see
a fair bit of that. On a happier note, thanks
for featuring Return to Oz on Weird House. I must
(05:09):
have passed on it when I was a kid, since
the original somehow never made much of an impression on me.
I've always been allergic to musicals. However, after watching the
delightful Ladies movie on your recommendation, I've since read all
of the original L. Frank Baum Oz books, as well
as some of his other works. The movie had the
benefit of being based on the second and third OZ books,
which I thought were the best. They aren't exactly great literature,
(05:30):
but they are fun reads, and it's fascinating trying to
figure out what was going on in BAM's mind as
he wrote them. He led an interesting life and had
interesting friends. What was he trying to tell the children?
The running dialogue he had with his fans, and the
preface of each book was almost as entertaining as the
stories themselves. After a while, Bomb got sick of writing
about Oz. He wrote other sorts of stories, but they
(05:52):
didn't sell as well. He tried Oz books with different protagonists,
but the kids constantly bombarded him with letters saying, that's nice,
but what our Dorothy and Toto up to. He seemed
increasingly exasperated as the series went on, but kept a
sense of humor about it. Sometimes he would drop Dorothy
and other fan favorites into an unrelated story, the same
way Marvel editors used to try to punch up sales
(06:13):
by adding Wolverine to a given title. Oh, I mean
now I'm excited about Wolverine and Oz. So someone's done it.
Someone's done it, I'm sure, so write in and tell
us about it. The fan interaction reminded me of old
school comic book letters pages. Bomb's books actually had a
lot of shared DNA with comics, including crossovers, shared universes,
and retcons. The explanation for why Toto didn't speak in
(06:35):
the first book when other mundane animals gained the ability
to talk in Oz gave me one of the better
laughs in the series.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
I love that Jeff alludes to that, but then doesn't
tell us what the explanation is.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Was there an explanation? They didn't get into it and
return to Ozy. I don't recall, I don't even.
Speaker 3 (06:54):
Recall the chicken talks, doesn't it?
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Yeah? Anyway, Jeff continues. He probably also responded to parental
feed back in that the Tin Woodman and the Cowardly
Lion become much less murderous as the series continues. They
have a pretty high kill count in the early books,
but the stories remain suburbly superbly weird. Once the rules
established that no one can die in Oz itself, Bomb
goes full Cronenberg with the possibilities of characters who can
(07:17):
be carved up without experiencing the sweet release of death.
The original story of the Tin Woodsmen and his ramifications
are most horrible in a fun way. One king would
punish subjects by having two people cut in half lengthwise
and the mismatched parts sewn together. Both beings retained their
sense of self and let a miserable existence in control
of only one half of their body, with the other's
(07:39):
thoughts intruding upon their own. There are also more beasts
who fling their own heads at our heroes. Lots of
monster fact material in those books. Good to know. Thanks
again for continuing to direct us to new piles of
weirdness to explore.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Jeff Man love a beast that throws its own head.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
Absolutely, Oh well, there's a lot of great stuff in
this uh this feedback, I will say on the connections,
you know note in older movies, Yeah, it is always
it can be a little sad, little little sobering, you know,
to look at up the cast and crew for a
film and realize that, like everybody's dead. Like sometimes it's
you know, the cast, it'll be everybody's dead except for
the child actors or maybe and or maybe one of
(08:19):
the leading ladies. That sort of thing. I don't know,
it's just, uh, it's that's how it goes.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
But especially when it doesn't feel like an especially old movie.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
Yeah, yeah, it's true. I mean, you know, some of
these these folks that are relatively young. But on the
other hand, it's also kind of refreshing when we cover
a movie and I'm going through the connections, I'm like, oh,
I think everybody's alive. It happens every now and then
it's like like like winning at Bingo.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
I do think this is funny hearing about Baum getting
the same kinds of messages that that fans are like
posting to internet forums and on Twitter today about their
favorite comic book, movies or whatever. It's that like, I
didn't like that this character wasn't included. How can it
be that the animals talk in OZ but this animal
doesn't talk. Doesn't make any sense, you.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Know, I don't think I've ever read any of his works,
so occasionally emails like this recommendations from various folks, it
makes me want to check it out. It does sound
fabulously weird.
Speaker 3 (09:18):
Now, as to Jeff's note about wondering if the story
of the sand Man putting sand in the child's eyes
to make them sleep, the explanation you gave in the episode,
Rob made a lot of sense to me, because you know,
sand would make you rub your eyes, and you rub
your eyes when you're sleepy. But Steve also agreed with
(09:39):
this explanation of it basically having to do with eye cruds.
So Steve wrote in and said, Hi, Robin Joe, it's
been a while, but in listening to your Sandman discussions
from the very dust, I remember to question I never
found an answer to in my childhood. When I was
a little boy, the first time I woke up with
(10:00):
eye crust in the corners of my eyes, I asked
my mom, is this sand Is this why people used
to talk about the sand Man? She did not know.
I still wonder if there's a connection to the myth
or folk tale. Then Steve provides a link and asks
if we can confirm or dismiss his hypothesis. Steve, I
doubt we can settle this one for you, But you
(10:23):
and Jeff are thinking on the same frequency. Okay, Rob,
do you mind if I read this message from Luisa?
Speaker 2 (10:37):
Yeah, let's have it.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Okay, Luisa says, Hi, Guys, who would have thought that
something as mundane as dust would be interesting enough for
five episodes? Only you? I kept putting this email off,
expecting you to talk about dust in literature, but you
either still have to release part six or that's it
for the series. That is it for the series for now?
We're done for now, Luisa says, Just in case you
(11:01):
don't get around to it, I would like to remind
you of the role that dust plays in George Orwell's
nineteen eighty four In the plot. Dust plays a symbolic
part and is all pervasive, just as much as Big Brother.
The main character. Winston begins the book feeling protected by
it and ends up feeling completely overwhelmed. It is everywhere,
and it also represents his own unraveling. I cannot find
(11:25):
a better literary use of dust in a plot. Yeah,
I do remember a lot of references to dust. In
nineteen eighty four. I think Winston talks about his neighbor
in his apartment building, Missus Parsons, having creases in her
face that always looked as if dust was trapped in
the creases. And it's like a detail he mentions over
(11:46):
and over, as if it represents some kind of like
decay of life itself. You know, there's just kind of
like ash and grime building up on our bodies. And
there's one part where Winston thinking about sort of the
general hopelessness of life under the Party and Big Brother,
and he describes London as quote vast and ruinous, a
(12:09):
city of a million dust bins. I think that's a
really striking image. It's like it selects as the defining
object of a civilization, the place where waste is discarded,
and it actually reminds me of those visions of the
underworld of the dead and the epic of Gilgamesh, you know,
the house of dust, where dust is their food and
(12:29):
clay is their bread. But anyway, to come back to
Luisa's message, Luisa says, I can, however, tell you that
I used to think dust was the bane of my
domestic existence until I had German shepherds. Every time the
female sheds, it's like brushing out another dog from her.
I'm seriously considering buying a loom and making dog thread.
(12:52):
Wait didn't In one of our episodes we talked about, like,
you know, boutique clothing made out of dust bunnies.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
We discussed the possibility.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
Maybe I brought it up and you were you shamed
me for doing so.
Speaker 2 (13:05):
I don't remember shaming you.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
I deserve to be share.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
I have questions about how it would work, but.
Speaker 3 (13:12):
Let's see. Luisa says, thanks so much, as always for
your wonderful work. Best regards, Luisa. Oh, and then she
attaches a picture of the hair from her dog, Alma.
This is the hair shed in one sitting. That is
truly wow. That it's a lot of hair. But I
know a lot about shedding dogs. I've had my share
(13:34):
of shedding dogs in my life too, and they can whoo,
they can they can shed a storm.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Yeah, that's a lot. I have to stay on top
of our cat with the ferminator, but still not quite
this much for he comes out.
Speaker 3 (13:48):
Does your cat like the ferminator?
Speaker 2 (13:50):
Well, she loves the brush, and then she'll tolerate the ferminator.
So I'll use the ferminator in the brush at the
same time, one in each hand, and it's kind of
a careful dance. It used to be even more of
a dance because she gets so riled up that she
would also try and scratch me. But she's older now
she's a little slower, so I can usually stay on
top of her her over excited aggressions. All right. This
(14:13):
next one comes to us from Mike. Mike says, I
love the four Dust episodes. In episode four, when you
were talking about Sandman's Dust, I immediately thought about Neil
gaman Sandman comic. The comic is about an entity called
Dream and his realm, the Dreaming. In the early issues,
he has to track down some of his tools that
(14:34):
were stolen from him an issue three and also episode
three of the television adaptation Dreams. Bag of dream dust
falls into the hands of an innocent woman who becomes
helplessly addicted to the dreams and fantasies that the dream
dust gives her. She ends up more or less wasting
away because she wants to spend more time in the
dream than in real life. It's an excellent read with
some pretty disturbing imagery. Thanks for the podcast. Stuff to
(14:56):
Blow Your Mind is the podcast I recommend to most people. Mike, Yeah,
the good good note, Mike. You know, we didn't mention
the Sandman comic or the Netflix adaptation in these episodes,
but both are excellent. I was. I was a fan
of the comic back when I read it years ago,
and I really did enjoy the Netflix adaptation as well.
(15:17):
I thought I had a great cast, very well put together.
I seem to recall that David S. Goyer is involved
in that as well, has a tremendous cast.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
Though I am not familiar with it.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Oh well, treat yourself. It's good stuff.
Speaker 3 (15:32):
Yeah, may get there someday. Goes on the list with
everything else.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
All right.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
This next message is in response to the series we
did on the Egyptian God Osiris. This comes from Constantinos.
Constantinos says, good day, gentlemen. I enjoyed your episode on
Osiris and have two comments. These are big topics, but
(15:58):
I'll try to be assistinct as possible possible. Part one
a slice of pie that stands for proto Indo European.
The first is that any Greek attestment to Egyptian origins
of Greek mythology has to be taken with a grain
of salt. I think that Greeks like Herodotus, who cited
Egyptian mythological roots were simply overreaching and letting conjecture get
(16:19):
the better of them. Oh yeah. This connects to the
idea that maybe the Greek gods were in some sense
the same as the Egyptian gods and just different names
for them, or maybe A later take on a similar
view is that the idea that the Greek mythology evolved
from the Egyptian mythology, which some people have proposed, and
Constantinos here is saying that that is not likely the case.
(16:44):
So he says, here is a mainstream academic view of
Greek mythology origins. In summary one, proto Indo Europeans migrated
from the Russian Steps to Greece. Proto Indo European settlers
were pastoralists, their economy center around cattle. Meanwhile, the indigenous
Greeks were in agricultural society. We know precious little about
(17:07):
the Proto Indo Europeans and indigenous Greeks, but the Proto
Indo European settlers brought the Greek language to Greece. Proto
Indo European settlers brought their pastoral gods Zeus at All
and melded them into the indigenous people's agricultural gods demmeter
at All, and together they created the Olympian Pantheon. There
(17:28):
are other non Proto Indo European and non indigenous influences
on Greek mythology Parentheses, Apollo, question Mark, maybe Dionysus. The
latter's origin is still controversial, but they seem more Anatolian,
maybe Cypriot or in Cretan than Egyptian. I tend to
view Greek mythology as sedimentary rock with layers upon layers
(17:50):
of development, rather than one single thing. Anyway, there does
not seem to be a lot of evidence for direct
imports of Egyptian myths during the early formative phases of
the Greek mythos. But that is not to say that
it did not happen. We just have clearer paths to
other places. Part two, Resurrecting the resurrecting god's debate. This
(18:11):
is a reference to us bringing up the question of
whether Osiris and other gods from the ancient world should
be thought of as gods that die and then rise
again in the way that say Jesus, or maybe some
of the figures from other mystery religions would would be
said to die and rise again. And Constantinos is about
(18:32):
to bring up one of the gods of one of
these mystery religions. He says, I'm surprised that your discussion
on resurrecting gods did not include Dionysus and Orpheus. Again,
this is a huge subject, but I will try to
just hit the high points. The god Dionysus was killed
and torn apart by evil Titans. At the direction of
the goddess Hera. Athena saved Dionysus's heart, and Zeus resurrects him.
(18:58):
Orpheus may have been the name of a religious figure
from northern Greece, regardless of whether he existed. Orpheus is
credited as being the prophet that founded a mystery cult
centered around the resurrected Dionysus. Orphists believed that humans are
born of the original sin parentheses the dust of the
burnt Titans, but also have a divine spark, the soul.
(19:21):
Long story short, be good and your soul gets to
heaven the Elysian Fields. Orphism is old and foundational to
Western religious traditions. In fact, the oldest surviving European written text,
the fourth century BC Dirveni Papyrus, is an orphic hymn.
Many have drawn direct lines from orphism to Neoplatonism and Christianity.
(19:44):
It is a deep rabbit hole to go down, and
the case is compelling its links to Christianity. Aside, Dionysus
is demonstrably one of the earliest resurrecting gods that did
indeed spawn a religion centered on his resurrection. Hope you
found that interesting. Thank you all for a love podcast
that I cannot stop recommending to any that will listen. Cheers.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
Oh that's excellent. You know, I do think we could
come back in the future and do a proper Orpheus
or Dionysus podcast series, you know, focus it because you
know we do love our deep dives into mythology. All right,
We're gonna go ahead close up the mail bag here.
We had some that we didn't have time to get
to today, but we will come back to those in
(20:24):
a future installment of Listener Mail, so keep them coming.
We'd love to hear from you on episodes past, episodes
present or episodes future, your recommendations and so forth. And
if you're on the fence, if you're like, I'm kind
of thinking about writing into the show, but I've never
done it before. I don't know if this is interesting enough,
go ahead and give it a shot. We'd love to
(20:45):
hear from you regardless, and we do. We do read everything,
even if we don't read everything on listener Mail, and
even though we don't respond to everything via email, we
do read it. So it's the best way to get
in touch with us, the best way to share your
enthusiasm in the best way to share any feedback, constructive
feedback about the show itself, though, don't be shy about
(21:07):
throwing some positive reviews and some stars our way. Wherever
you get the podcast. I will remind you that listener
mail airs on Mondays. In the Stuff to Blow Your
Mind podcast, feed core episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays, short
form episode on Wednesdays and on Fridays. We set aside
most series concerns to just talk about a weird film
on Weird House Cinema.
Speaker 3 (21:25):
Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway.
If you would like to get in touch with us
with feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest
a topic for the future, or just to say hi,
you can email us at contact at stuff to Blow
your Mind dot com.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For
more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
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