Ghost with Nicole Byer

On this episode, Caitlin and Jamie have passed away, but they're sticking around because they have some unfinished business to tend to, mainly talking about the movie Ghost with their wonderful guest Nicole Byer!

(This episode contains spoilers)

Follow @nicolebyer on Twitter! While you're there, you should also follow @BechdelCast, @caitlindurante and @hamburgerphone

  

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
On The Bechdel Cast. The questions asked if movies have
women and them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands,
or do they have individualism the patriarchy? Zef in best
start changing it with the Bechdel Cast. Hi, Welcome to
the Bechtel Cast. My name is Jamie, my name is Caitlin.
Welcome to a very spooky episode. I wanted the confidence

(00:24):
to open with a spooky but I did not. Um.
Welcome to the Beachdel Cast. This is our podcast where
we talk about the role of women in movies. Hey,
why is it called the Bechdel Cast Because it's inspired
by the Bechdel Test by Mr Jerry Bechdel. Jerry Tyrone Bechdel.
I'm man, just kidding. Alison Bechdel developed a test whereby

(00:51):
two women in a movie have to talk to each other,
they have to have names. First of all, they have
to talk to each other. Their conversation has to be
about some thing other than a man. Is this too
much to ask of any movie? Usually? Yeah, I wouldn't
think so. But you think it would just be really
easy to write two women into your story and have

(01:11):
them talk about a fucking sandwich or something. Yeah, Hey,
nice sandwich. Thank you. My name is Carrie. My name
is Carrie Done. Two women named carry talking about a
sandwich that passes one of them. One of them c
A R y the other one spells at c A
R R I E. Yeah. But still this never happened.

(01:32):
I don't know why I'm so angry so far, but
I'm I have a Mike's Hard. I have a Mike's
Hard Lemonade. You never have a Mike's Hard lemonade. I
know we both have one. For the record, I love
when people who listen to the podcast tweet pictures of
them drinking Mike's Hard Lemonade to us, just to check
in and be like, hey, we're supporting the brand that
you've never received any financial support from. You just happened
to be a fan of their products. And to you, guys,

(01:55):
I say, hey, thank you. Keep enjoying the Mike's brand.
I know waiting at us with your photo of it
Mike's Hard Lemonade. Answer our tweets, please send us a
case enable us. Anyways, it's got a nice cold Mike's
Hard Lemonade in hand, strawberry lemonade. Baby Aristotle was giving
us a hard time about it, because he was like,
isn't that the bad flavor? And it's like, well, isn't

(02:16):
every flavor the bad flavor of misade? So true tastes
like my problematic past. Speaking of problems now anyway, Hey,
let's introduce our guest. Hey, I'm excited for it to
talk about today's movie, and it'll explain the spooky the
failed spooky motif. We did a great job. But hey,

(02:41):
before we talk about that, let's introduce our guests. You've
got a terrific comedian, very funny lady. You know we're
from Girl Code on MTV. That cute dogs, Nicole Buyers.
I love how the original segue was speaking of problematic here.

(03:02):
I know it didn't make any sense. I was like,
this is a dumb transition. Now I liked it, and
I wish you had an abandon and I wish you
had doubled down, Like this woman is a real problem.
She got here five minutes late. She's bad. She's not
drinking a Mike's hard lemonade. She's a bad potato only
because we didn't offer you one. No, it's okay, I'm
gonna go to the gym after this. Oh you're a

(03:27):
better woman than we are. We're literally going to get
another mix. That's the plan. So we're talking about the
movie Ghosts. When did you first see the movie? Um,
I don't remember how old I was, but I assume
maybe like eight, maybe seven, maybe six. I was very young.

(03:50):
A lot of the things went over my head. But
I just loved Whoopie Goldberg. I thought she was so
funny in it. And then I loved Patrick Swaze. I
was like, oh man, he makes my downstairs quiver. And
then I would just I just watched that movie so
many times. Would you say it's one of your favorites,
it's my favorite favorite of all? Yeah? I love it.

(04:13):
I had seen it, I think probably for the first
time in college. Remembered the very famous pottery fox. Of course,
I didn't remember much else about it many years past,
and then I rewatched it again for this episode, and
I was like, oh, ship, this is a good movie.
It's a great movie that would never get made today, right,
Yeah it is. So. It's funny, it's scary, it's sweet.

(04:37):
I love it. It holds up, it does. I was
a little nervous because I watched it with my mom.
I think when I was like a young teen aby
thirteen or fourteen, and I remember loving it and being
like maybe I was just a babe, but I was
like I was a little bit afraid of it, but
I was also a little bit turned on. But it
like it has everything, has everything you could possibly want,

(04:58):
but it holds up in a pretty major I was
like so pleasantly surprised that how much fun it was
to say, And if you just analyze it from like
a storytelling screenwriting standpoint, it's really well crafted. Like you mentioned,
this movie would never be made today, which yes it
would not. But also a movie just came out called

(05:19):
a Ghost Story starring Ruoney Mara and Casey Affleck, and
the problematic, speaking of problematics, the log line is in
this singular exploration of legacy, love loss in the enormity
of existence, a recently diceased, white sheeted ghost returns to

(05:41):
his suburban home to try to reconnect with his bereft
wife to find white like an old school. That's the
movie poster. And I bet you it's not a comedy
and it should be. Like a woman turns around in
her bedroom and she's like a child ghost chicker tree

(06:02):
in my bedroom yeah, yeah, look up, this is the
movie covered in a sheet. What is it? I mean,
I'm all for covering Casey have like in a sheet
wherever he may be. What is it called a ghost story?
A ghost story? Oh Man, bad HANDA hilarious came out

(06:30):
July seven. Okay, it has sent on rotten tomatoes. Oh
I just shall we go see it? Honestly, maybe we
should go see it. But Roger Ebert gave it four
out of four. I don't buy it's not even alive.
But really, yeah, it was his website. Probably I thought
Siskel was dead or they both? Did? They know who's

(06:52):
reviewing movies? Who we are? Who's a roper? Roper? Al? Oh? Fuck?
I really confused with two people? Who's roper? Replaced Cisco
and Siskel died? Oh so who replaced Ebert? No one?

(07:13):
You can't replace Ebert. I wonder if they're like arguing
in Heaven't like, how come I got replaced? Replaceable? But
he sings it like replaced every time you're irreplaceable. It
reminds me of my freshman in high school history teacher,
because that was when that song came out. She would

(07:34):
try to connect with us by asking us to pass
all our homework to the left to the left and
then would turn this song on while we would pass
our homework. What an awful job? What a terrible do
you have to try to? Like? She sat at home.
I was like, how can I get through Beyonce? Beyonce
will help me teach the love of science. Now I

(07:55):
just need to develop a lesson plan that involves the left.
Sad shout out to Miss McCray. You did your best anyway, Jamie.
When did you first se this movie? I saw it
when I was probably around the Miss McCray era. My
mom sometimes would just choose a summer night to show
us one of her weird, horny movies. This was one

(08:17):
of them that she'd had on cassette. And then she's like, Jamie,
I think that because she knew that I had a
thing for Patrick Swayze, and she for some reason was like,
that's good because you and Patrick Swayze have the same birthday.
And my mom believes fun fact about my mom, she
thinks everyone who has the same birthday shares a part
of each other's soul. So she believed she believed because

(08:40):
Patrick Swayzy was alive at the time. She believed that
Patrick Swayzy and I had in August eighteenth connection and
that I should see the movie, and I thought I
loved it. So me and Michael Jackson had a connection.
We were both born on August twenty night. Yeah, both
of your birthdays are coming up pretty soon? Are you
a liover go? I'm a Leo. Oh, I'm a virgo.

(09:02):
I've been wronged by virgos in the past. Oh well,
I'll push you down the stairs. Let's keep the trend
going my way out. I'm just like your leg will
splint her out of your body, just like in the Beguild.
Just go in the Beguild. That doesn't pass the back
to old test, does it? Um? I don't even remember.

(09:23):
It was such a terrible movie that I've blocked it
from memory. It's a wild movie, right, It's like set
during the Silver War and there's no black people, and
there's yeah, the Sofia couple of the couple in their
original version. It's just like way more interesting and better,
and it's not all white people. We shouldn't be the
Silver War era. It was like in Virginia pretty heavily black.

(09:44):
Granted we were in the background picking up things but
like just put us in there. Yeah. No, Sofia couple
is like, I don't know how it's going to be
white blonde, Yes, Sofia a couple of games all the
shrug and she was like, we don't know what she
really was she like asked about Yeah, I mean she
very intentionally wrote out the only black character and yeah,

(10:05):
she's unnoticed. She's unnoticed. Wow. Yeah, So she like had
to like a thought in her brain and she was like, oh,
I'll just get rid of that problem her. I mean,
her excuse was like, well, I don't know how to
write a black character. It's like, well, then talk to
someone do your job. But also, dummy, all you have
to do if they're not speaking in like the language

(10:26):
of the time, you just cast a black person in
that part. Do you know what I'm saying. If she
didn't know how to write slave talk like and if
nobody else is speaking the way they spoke back, then
you just write that character the way you write the
white people and then cast a black person. That's like
people like I don't know how to write women. Just
write a man and then change his name from Jason
to Allison, and then you have a woman congratulations, very easy.

(10:49):
Everyone is horny and tortured regards of Yeah, Sofia couple
is unnoticed. She's unnoticed. But let's talk about the movie.
Ghost Goes is a fun movie that doesn't suck the
way that Beguiled does. So I'll do the recap of
Ghost Molly Molly Jensen. Molly Jensen is married to Sam Waite.

(11:12):
They're not married yet. Oh sorry, Oh yeah, they never
get married and never get married because he goes on her. Yeah,
he ghosted her the Ultimate ghost in Ultimate Ghost Her,
but then like hung around. Yeah, he's like every fucking
man of now right, Like, I don't want to be together,
but I'm going to scare you and I have to

(11:33):
follow your every Move's gonna watch you. Another man comes
in your house, I'm going to scare him away and
follow him home. I'm gonna learn how to kick a can.
Oh man, I'm mad. I think we pretty much already
recaped love the kick a can scene, the whole montage
where he learns how to be a better ghost montage. Honestly,

(11:56):
if someone knows how to do this, please put that
whole sequence to other with milans make a man that song,
I'll make a man. How do you? I would really
love it. There's also just like, okay, I know that
we didn't even get one sentence into the recap, but
there's so many fun one scene character actors in this movie.

(12:19):
The hospital ghost who presently hangs out it waits for
other ghosts. No, he's waiting for his wife to die. Yeah?
Oh does he is that what he meant by that? Okay?
Because then he just watches a man die in the
surgery table in his life, Yeah, that's gonna happen, just like,
thank you so much. And then there's a scary subway ghost.
Oh my god, guy's incredible. One flew over the cuckoo's nest.

(12:43):
He's perfect. You think I jumped always pushed me, which
I guess I do anything for. Who are you? Who
sent you? Joe? It's my love it? Suicide again right

(13:04):
onto that train, but this time he's dead. I love it.
Oh wait, do you want to do the really fast?
So Molly and Sam are together. They live in its nice, new,
huge fucking apartment in New York City. How do they
afford it while he's a rich banker? Fine? They're out
one night and they get mugged and he gets murdered

(13:25):
and they think it's just like a random killing, and
his spirit stays behind. He's a ghost now, but Molly
can't see him. So he goes to a psychic, Odo
May Brown played by Whoopi Goldberg, and he starts to
figure out that this murder was actually like an intentional
First Whoopee is a psychic who's faking it the whole time.

(13:48):
So then Patrick Sweezy Sam Weed is giving like audio commentary,
like give me a brick, and then she's like, who
is it? Huh? And her sisters are like, what's happening?
And then he's like, say my name Sam Wait, Say
my name Sam wait. And then she's like then she
runs to a closet and then and then her sisters
go some queen. Her sister's there's so funny, there's no

(14:16):
she's talking to a white man again. We gotta called
the doctor. It's so funny, it's great. So he goes
to her to try to because it turns out that
she can actually like communicate with the dead, the spirits
who have who She has that crazy backstory like the
more you learn about you're just like this woman has
lived a very interesting way. Yeah, So He goes to

(14:40):
her to be like, can you communicate to Molly for me?
Because I gonna warn her that she's in danger. Because
he starts to figure out that he was set up
and he was murdered intentionally because his friend Carl Carl
was so hot. Carl Carl, I suppose he takes his
shirt off. He's sure. Tony Goldwin, I had like my

(15:03):
sexual awakening watching this movie. But then odom A Brown
goes to Molly after Molly like doesn't answer, and then
she's talking to Molly and then Sam's like, tell her
she's in danger, and she's like, I tell her my
own way. She goes Molly, you and danger girl. It's
another favorite line reading of mine. It's so good. It
took me a while. It took me till midway in

(15:24):
the movie. I'm like, oh my god, it's fits from Scandal,
And then I got horny. He plays the president. Yes,
he's the president on Scandal. Has a badass, beautiful man.
I saw her once in the airport and I almost died.

(15:45):
I don't get star struck, and I don't think I was.
I was just like, I don't want to open my
p I just love him. Oh, God, he's great. You
did get to see him shirtless, which I forgot if
you were if you did in this movie, and I
was like, well, thank god. Because he spills the coffee
on himself because I think he's trying to seduce Smolly.

(16:06):
But I don't understand why he's trying to seduce Molly.
Oh no, that is gibolical. No, it's to get her
on his side, Odo May says anything. She's already slept
with him, so she feels an allegiance to him. That's
so fucked up. And I can't believe I've watched that
movie a hundred times and just now unders him. I

(16:26):
feel very dumb. No, I mean it's not super explicit,
but perfect. He's a manipulative That's that's what it is
to me. It's just like it. But it turns out
he is a bad guy. He's trying to He hired
money Willie Lopez to not murder Sam Weet, just steal
his bank book with like codes in it because he's

(16:48):
like laundering money. But then Willie Lopez couldn't get it,
so Willie Lopez accidentally kills him. So then they're having
a conversation. He's like, you murdered. Hi, man, He's like,
did you won't feel free? And yeah, And at first
I was feeling for for Willy Lopez, but then at
the end you find out when you see Willie Lopez
go to Hell, all the blood rises from the floor

(17:08):
and it's like, oh, this man has killed and that's
why he's got that bear clow tattoo and the like
it's like a tear drop tattoo. Fact. Willy Lopez. I
cannot remember his actual his like real life name, but
he's a comic. He was, Yes, he stand up and
he was like pretty funny. I watched a couple of clips.
Hell yeah he did his Oh yeah he died. His

(17:33):
Wikipedia picture is just a picture of him from Ghost. Yeah.
It's literally like Ricky Vellis that looks like the picture
when he's looking in the mirror when Sam we makes
it all foggy and writes boot, I literally have seen
this movie so many times there. That was one of
the things that stood out to me. That scene when
like Willie is like basically going through a series of

(17:55):
rooms before he's hit by three cars at one. But
they're like a practical effect in this movie are really
they're really great, Like she flying off the walls and
the and the boo and you're just like, funk, this
is like really it is a well done as movie.
It was scary. I remember like that that freaked me
out when I was a little The beginning scares me

(18:15):
when they because they're in the new apartment they're renovating
it and it's Carl, Molly and Sam and they're like
hitting through this thing and then like as like light happens,
a big noise happens, and I still I'm like, oh,
and it's not the scariest part of the movie, no,
but but I get it's like and it's kind of

(18:35):
like foreshadowing. Yeah. So he goes to Otomey is like
your dead boyfriend, Sam Weed is communicating to you through me,
and here's everything he's saying. And at first she doesn't
believe otomy, and then she starts to come around. She's like, hey, maybe,
but then meanwhile Carl is manipulating her into being like, actually, no,
you're crazy, you're not here, like go start real. And

(18:59):
then they still to just piece more and more things.
Soone they don't believe, don't believe her. And that woman said, honey,
if you go start watching me every day, I'd never
take a shower again, and then walks away and I
was like, you can't, you're so rude, which is technically
a scene that by our rules passes the back del Well,
she doesn't have a name's just an officer. She's not

(19:22):
giving a name. Well, we'll get there later. One of
the coolest things about this movie for me was the
fact that, like in most movies, it's very hard to
identify what everyone's motivation is at every point in the movie.
But for this, like every main character is super motivated
in a way that makes a ton of sense, Like
down to the fact that Patrick Swayze low key kind

(19:43):
of blackmails Whoopi Goldberg into continuing to work with him,
and she has stuff at steak, and me Moore has
stuff at steak because she, I mean, everyone around her
saying something different. And it would be so easy to
just write her characters like this lady's grieving and she
things ghost surreal, but like she's taking in all the
information and doing the best she can, just being gaslighted

(20:05):
by Tony freaking Goldwin. And like it's just every character
has like a very specific It's so each scene is
like a sketch because each character has a game and
everyone plays their game, and it's like, if it's true,
what else is true? Like all of Odomy Brown scenes
to meet our sketches, they heightened perfectly, and you blow

(20:27):
out the world and you get out, and then like
the next scene heightens what she's doing. So like when
I learned how to write sketches, I would watch Ghost
a lot because I was like, these are perfect, like
especially when they're in the bank and sam Weed is
whispering to Odomy and she's like, why are you whispering?
That is such a funny specific because like she remembers

(20:48):
she was talking to a ghost and has to do
like x Y and it's my favorite moment. Uh No,
you're right though, Like if you just isolate every scene,
it's just like every scene serves a purpose, it heightens well. Yeah,
everything is just a very well crafted story. I'm kind
of upset with myself that I didn't like, revisit it
sooner and pay more change into it. It works on

(21:10):
every level, and the romance is really good and I
get it and I love that to me more sort of,
I mean for the most part immediately before he dies, granted,
but basically proposes to Patrick Swayzy and he's like, hey,
I don't have any jewelry on me, but I do.
We should get married, you know, and and and that's
like I want to talk about that scene. Yeah, yeah,

(21:31):
I think the recap is done. He's a ghost. He's
a ghost. He gets murdered in a billowy burgundy shirt
that he used to wear for the rest of his
chucked into his pants. What happens, What happens to the
world if he untuch, I don't know, it would explode
and maybe he untucked and then it magically goes back
in because that's the way he died. And I like

(21:54):
in the Santa Claus where he shaves off his beard back.
I love that this schizophrenic subway gust. It's like, your
shirts not real, your body is not real. But he
references the shirt specifically, and it's like, thank you. I've
been thinking about what a great outfit to die in.
For sure. Yeah, he woren't to the play. They went

(22:15):
to go see Macbeth Mabeth another grade. He fell asleep
and he was snoring, but anyway, so yeah, he finally
convinces to help Molly talk to the thing and they
figured all the thing out, and the ministery, the murder
gets solved, and then all the bad guys die and
then finally Sam's spirit can ascend Molly. It's amazing the

(22:39):
love inside you get to take it with you, and
then he goes up to heaven. I was weeping. It's
really touching, it really is. And there was and and
this was while I was watching the movie because I
love Swazie. We after all share each other soul Annway

(22:59):
and then in August eighteenth cents. But I I did
posit at one point because every time I watched the
scene between Patrick Swayze and Whoopi Goldberg, I'm like, oh,
for sure they were real life friends, like you can
just yes, that's how she got the job. Patrick Swayzey
was like, I won't do this movie unless Whoopi Goldberg
does this movie. Yeah. Then I read some article that
Tina Turner was like one of the original choices and

(23:19):
then the reference tinga turn in the movie. But I
don't know how true that is, and I didn't get that.
I started reading. I looked up and this is like
slightly more bid, and like, I bet Whoopie Goldberg had
a great tearful public appearance after Patrick Swayze's death. And
I watched what she said several days after on the view,
and it was check it out YouTube dot com, YouTube
dot com. I've never been to that website. It's it's

(23:42):
a new cool It's just short clips of your favorite
song of history and time. I better get it. It's
pretty cool. It's pretty cool. Whoopi Goldberg basically credits quite
a bit of her success to Patrick Swayze. Is like
vouching for a year, want to fucking oscar for it,
and became a legitimate movie star. And I can't think

(24:06):
of another bankable black movie star like that. I mean,
she's she's one of a kind in everyone, but I
didn't realize the role Swazy had and man, and she
also said, fun fact this Swazy loves to moon his
close stars, like whenever she was saying, like, she cited

(24:27):
a specific scene where it's her and Swayzie and and
it's like, you're the shots are back and forth between
a tight shot on her and a tight shot on him,
and She's like, whenever it was like a shot on
just me. Swazie was off on the side moon and
me making me laugh. What a goofball, what a warrior
arrest in paradise and you're just like they were good friends.
That makes me so happy because they had they have

(24:51):
such a great chemistry together. It's so it's so much
fun to watch them together. I don't know, it makes
me feel like a kid to be like, oh, man,
I hope they're really friends in real life. But it
may be they were really friends in real life. But okay,
So I wanted to talk about that scene where she
effectively proposes to him. It's right before he gets murdered,

(25:12):
which is just more great writing. I never started telling
chance to get married, but she's like, I want to
marry you. I've been thinking about a lot, and I
think we should just do it. And he's like, well,
you never wanted to talk about it. So the implication
is that maybe he proposed, or maybe he was just like, hey,
are we gonna get married? Like what's going on? And
she's like, well, no, like which I like because so

(25:34):
often in movies and just society in general, this idea
is put forth that if you're in a hetero relationship,
women are just like I can't wait to get married
and want to get me so much and I can't
wait till it happens. I just want to have to
sit around and wait till he asks me. And I
can't wait for that day because it's gonna be the
best day in my life. And just so I like

(25:55):
that she was the one who was like, actually, I
don't want to talk about it. It's not important to
me right now. And then finally it was on her
terms where she's like hey, She's like I thought about
it and I'm ready. Yeah. Yeah, I think Molly is
you can like write her off. Is like just like
this whiny, sad, widowed woman, but like she's pretty complex.
She's got short hair, which is the baldest woman is

(26:16):
in charge, and then she has her own business. She's
like a pretty successful sculptor. She wears masculine clothing, she
wears like overalls and stuff, but then she has like
a soft feminine sign and then she proposes to her boyfriend. Yeah, like,
I I like her character. I like that she and
then like the fact that she did go to the
police to talk about a ghost. Takes a lot of

(26:38):
balls to be like, well, I mean I don't know,
this ship seems true. Let me fucking figure this out.
And she was like totally aware of how crazy she sounds.
She's like, I know this sounds so stupid, but like
I gotta hear me out. And it was also the
way that the scenes between her and outamate and we'll
get to also Patrick Spacey play out was also believable,

(27:00):
and that she does not respond to Odamy the first time,
because that was probably scary and confusing, but then eventually,
I mean it, that seemed like a realistic betrayal of
grief of like, Okay, there's been enough specifics and like,
what do I have to lose by just listening to
this person a little bit? And that sort of is
like and even down to like the shirtless Tony Goldwin

(27:23):
the deceiver, that's a very common and that was something
that and not to get personal, but like that was
something that resonated with me specifically of like the deceased
man's best friend trying to look out for not quite
the widow, but basically the widow of his best friend.
I feel like that's sort of a normalized thing of like, well,

(27:44):
if his friend can't take care of her, then you know,
he'll take care of her. And I think that that's
a creepy thing and the reason that my uncle Butch
is in my life and I hate Uncle Butch, but
he's the Tony Goldwin except a liar and not hot.
But anyways, I but it was even realistic how those
scenes played out between the two of them. Of like,

(28:06):
you know that dem Moore's characters really isolated herself from people,
and Tony Goldwyn is one of the only people she
really trusts and has a connection with because she knew
and and so even the fact that they might have
hooked up if Patrick Swayzy hadn't overture of himself remember me. Oh.

(28:28):
Then also, Carl was pushing Molly so hard to like
get over it. I feel like that happens a lot
when a loved one passes away. The people around you
were like, you have to move on. It's like well,
and I like that she like slapped him at one
point and she was like, no, Carl, and it was like, yeah, Carl,
let her fucking grieve, even though I know that, like
you murdered her boyfriend, Like if you hadn't let her grieve,

(28:50):
still be wrong even if you murder. Yeah. Oh, I'd
like to propose a new movie role that I noticed
in this movie The Man in the Loosest Khakis is
up to something before and well because Patrick Swayze, who
in their right mind would put a pair of loose
khakis on Patrick Swayze, He's got the bus but the

(29:12):
butt of the center so there, so he's in tight
pants the whole time. But Tony Goldwin, they they like
to put him in loser. Yeah, I guess I gotta
go and attention to that. You know what scene. I
really love the elevator scene in the beginning, it's like
towards the beginning, they're like, in the elevator they talk
about how Karl needs to pay off his Mustang. They

(29:34):
get in the elevator and then he starts coughing and
he's like the doctor says, it's contagious, and uh, I
do that often. I won't do sickness. But when I'm
in an elevator with my roommate, I'll look at him
and I'll go, why won't you just have a baby
with me? And he goes, now is not the time,
and I'm like, please, when is the time to talk? John?

(29:55):
I love you? And then he always like, it's into
exactly what I want, even though he doesn't mean to it.
He'll be like I'm never taking elevated with you again,
and I'm like why are we fighting? And he's like
stop it. And then people are always like, oh no,
that's very funny. That's a great scene because it's basically

(30:17):
it's like it uses a diversion so that we won't
suspect Carl is this evil militias there showing how close
they are. The movie is really well written and very
well executed. It's a great movie. I was blown at
how many different points. I'm like, wow, I didn't I
forgot that part happened. And that's so smart because every

(30:39):
scene has a purpose that never happens never. It's so well.
It's so famous for the pottery Fox scene, which actually
makes me furious because but it's so horny. She's sculpting
az if you will out of clay and he puts
his hand into it, sucks it up, and she's just

(31:00):
like okay. But I feel like she did a good
job of being like, huh, well it's not now, because
she does get a little terse with him, and I
was like, oh, I like that. That's like a real relationship.
I would have like elbowed him in the face and
been like fuck you, you ruined, but but then you
win and get to funk. When I was little, I

(31:21):
was like, why aren't their hands dirty? How did they
did they clean? What makes me furious? So they get
all that, they get all I know, I know, but
I just well, I want to see a tense scene
of penersuavy and for me more washing their hands and
we're going to hook. So even before that, when they're
like getting their hands all dirty, I just and it's
supposed to be very hot because they're running on their

(31:42):
hands on each other and getting each other more laid.
To me, that so grows. I think sex should be
in a sterile environment, in a white room. We're not
all gonna pods unchane melody playing while their little fingies
are touching. And I think no part of two people's

(32:03):
bodies should touch during sex except for their genitals. I
think people should just be far, just farm and just
just rusting and receiving. Yes, that is how I think
sex should be. So this scene here's a fun to
Really I asked my old roommate Evan to take my
virginity and he said okay, and he's gay, and I

(32:24):
was like, okay, but I don't want you to touch
me because that might change our relationship. So I was like,
I will wear a crotchless le a tart or like
a snap crotch last, and you can interview that way,
but do not touch my titties, and do not touch
my face and don't kiss me. We didn't end up
having sex because I had too many rules. He was like,

(32:45):
I can't just like do my thing, and I was like, no, no,
absolutely not the best. Yes, it was definitely for the best.
It would have been fun for either one of us.
You've been like I wish you were a man. I'd
be like, I wish you were a straight man who
loved me. Well, anyway, that that the part where he's

(33:09):
where is it? Hope that wasn't a masterpiece did make
me laugh because I was trying to like in my head,
I'm like, what if she had done like what if
she was an oil painter? And he just was like,
wasn't a masterpiece? Would you like to fuck me? I
mean that's with any creative job. I imagine she was
doing a stand up show and he walked on stage
was like, I hope you weren't trying to have a

(33:31):
good set. Yeah, or if she was a surgeon, he
just came in and stuck his hand and a body.
This wasn't a casualty. He heckled her pottery. But okay,
here's a plot. Hole does bother me? He passes away.
It seems like he's pretty well off. He's doing well

(33:52):
in his profession. There's a promotion on the table, etcetera.
They just moved into this really nice apartment. Are we
to expect on a potter sal She can afford this
apartment by herself life insurance and then they do packages
when people die. They give you a bunch of money
to loved ones when you have a good job. And

(34:12):
then if they had sold any assets, so like if
they each owned a home and sold it or whatever,
she would get the money from his house, so it
could work. Yesbsolutely yeh. Dead people with good jobs usually
take care of you, Okay, Because it was like I
didn't want her to move, but I was just like,
how that's a great apartment. They live in New York

(34:34):
and she has like a Also, remember it's the eighties
or the early nineties and he and he works in
finance in some ways, so we're to believe he like cats. Okay,
that brings up a point I wanted to talk about.
He never offers to nor pays what Pio Goldberg's character
for all of her services. Oh no, he should be

(34:58):
like like a mutual well kind I mean, no, a
ghost can't pay you. Well, but he could have been like, hey, Molly,
throw her a bone. Well, I think she's gonna be
fine because she can hear ghosts and she can charge more.
Remember when he goes back and she was like, I
got ghosts from New Jersey coming in. And then uh,
that woman was just like where's the money. And then

(35:22):
that man jumps in her money and wouldn't you do
to your hair? Do you like it? It's autumn sunra.
That's so good. It's very funny. But I think she
because he did help her. He showed her that she
can speak to dead people, so then she will always
be busy and she can charge so much money. Sure,

(35:42):
I still I think that he should have offered to pay,
especially because he kind of teases her with like you're
going to get formed, or like he doesn't tease her.
He shouldn't know how much money he was murdered for.
He just knew it was money. So then when that's
why when the guy goes, oh, you are taking out
four million dollars and she goes four million? Do say yes?

(36:04):
Say yes? How would you like that? Tess in twenties?
Excuse me? Cash? She has check? I think a cash
she has check is best. I love it. I her
outfit that hole, It's like it's perfect. And she's like,
you don't like my outfit. He's like, no, I love
it's great. Don't change, Nicole. I want to see your

(36:26):
one woman show where you just reenact the entire movie
of GHOL. I mean, if they ever do a remix
and I am not casting it, I will literally end
my love. I love it so much. I just got overwhelmed. Well,
I mean, and also, we haven't talked about Odomay his

(36:47):
first outfit with the fun when her sister opens, oh, no,
one's in the door, and then and think, or no,
is it bronze? Or is it is it like maybe
a closet is orange? Maybe, but she's had a metallic
like golden robe. And then and then does this amazing

(37:08):
Oh god, and Patrick Swayze as most of like most
scenes in the movie, lurking, Patrick Swayzy really mastered a
resting expression in this movie, just like yeah, but but
in a way that was very You're like, you know,
he really is listening. He really is listening in that
beautiful bergun t shirt billowing, very billowing billowing. So we

(37:33):
talked a lot about Molly being a pretty complex character.
She's a little boring, especially when you compare her everybody
else in the movie she has. She's working with a lot.
Like growing up, I'd be like Molly, but then like
as I got older, I was like, oh no. She
was literally dealing with the love of her life, dying

(37:55):
and trying to figure out this woman who says she
can hear him, and then a best friend he was like,
it's okay, come on, touch my body. And you know,
she's got a new house. It's a lot. She's dealing
with so much and she's still and she continues working.
And also they renovated it. It was fixed. It was
like just like an empty space. So I'm sure they

(38:16):
got it very cheaply, great time to die sway renovating stressful. Yeah.
I I was not like particularly impressed by her, like
because everything she does in the context of what happens
in the story and makes sense, and her reactions pretty
much universally makes sense to me. But things are usually

(38:37):
happening to her versus her doing things like she goes
to the police, but that doesn't really yield anything. It's
mostly we I feel like most things we see with her,
she's receiving information right, so it's like, you know, which
makes sense because she's not really Sam Weeds, the protagonist
of this story, makes sense that he's the one driving

(39:02):
the story. So the fact that she does pretty much
anything that influences anything is good because often women in
a story are just there is a set piece, really
just oh I look hot and I'm here to look
at and uh, that's all I have to Women in
this movie are treated well. I think. I think they're
well written, and they serve a purpose. Even that cop

(39:24):
being so nasty sets the tone of how Odemy is
going to be treated in that scene, because then the
other cop is like, we have her file, and it's like, oh,
oh no, and then it makes the audience even start
to well, not even doubt because we know, we know.
But when you're like, oh, ship, this may not work
out because ode May has a record and Will Lopez

(39:46):
is clean, we understand why Molly then might start to
question her own reality of what's happening, and we're so
it's like fuck. So it's like, really a great victory
when she starts to believe ode may again because we
see like she used to fake ideas. Con artist makes sense. Yeah, yeah,
it's we're so horny for this movie. It's such a

(40:09):
good movie. I can't remember who I just watched it with,
but they're like, yep, holds up, yeah, I have some
some fun behind the scenes facts about tell them so.
In terms of possible casting, Deme Moore's character could have
been Julia Roberts right, which would have made sense for
the time, but thank god Harrison Ford was the original pick.

(40:33):
But then and this really brings the view in and
brings whoop be back, you know. But I guess the
director or the writer I think exactly which I saw
an interview with Patrick Swayze where he openly cried about
the death of his father and they were like, Wow,
what a hot man being sad in public. We've got
to have him as as Sam Wheat, And so that's

(40:56):
how Patrick Swayze got the part. And then Patrick Swayze,
I guess Oprah was the original pick for to May Yeah,
and they really wanted her, but Patrick Swayzey was like,
you've gotta cast Whoopee and then what we had some
amazing Oprah would have been just so different. I don't
know if that role would have been funny, right, I
don't think. And that's the thing is, I did not

(41:17):
realize that. I just didn't have like I didn't recognize
the name. But the I feel like the reason that
Whoopie works so well in this movie and is like
directed so well, and that this movie has so many
funny moments is because it's the same director as Airplane
and The Naked Gun. Oh. I didn't know. There's like
just like a bunch of famous older comedy movies. Um,

(41:38):
what a versatile director. That guy who directed it, Jerry
Jerry Jerry Zucker, Yes, and then Robert Zemeckis I think
was a producer on it. He was involved. He did
a Back to the Future is another favorite of mine.
It's my all time favorite. I just watched it last night. Really,

(41:59):
I watch that there's like five movies that I will
watch forever. I can do what you're able to do
with ghosts basically reciting the entire script, all the dialogue.
I can do that with Back to the Future. Such
a great movie. Another very well crafted story, is it?
It's a wild story? Well the first one, Like there's

(42:19):
so much plant and payoff in that story, and just
like every little detail gets paid off later on. Like
so I like the third one better than the second one. Honestly,
the second one kind of sucks. I like the second
half of the second The second half of the second
one is good because when he goes back to and
then the wild wild last that's fun. I like it.

(42:41):
That was that was three? Yeah, I go it goes
one three two for me. Fair, I've got another effect
about ghost Please please tell us this is This is
fun and sort of speaks to um what we were
talking about earlier of just like just write a female character. Um.
Originally Otomy was written as a white male psychic character. Yeah,

(43:04):
the first draft of this movie, right, I don't think
I've ever met Oh no, that's a lot. Well, no,
he read my tarot cards, but like he was really
I don't I've never read my cards were New Orleans.
It's very strange, that is, Yeah, how did he fall
into that? It was very bad? I handed him all
the tarot cards upside down somehow, because he was like,

(43:26):
handing to me anyway you want. So I twisted a
bunch of them around and he went, huh, I don't
know what that means. And I was like that you're
bad at this. You're very bad at your job. They're
straight men should not be allowed to read cards. They
just shouldn't honestly, shouldn't be allowed to do anything in society. Yeah,
noticed banned them from Ghost By apparently was written as

(43:49):
a white male character. And then the writers of stand
By Me, for some reason, there was some sort of conversation.
You mean that movie was almost exclusively straight white man.
You know, suggestions come from strange places. But they suggested, hey,
that's an interesting character. What if it was a woman.

(44:09):
And then the writer wrote otomy and the world was
better off. So it's really not that difficult, and in fact,
usually your output will benefit from another good female character.
Do you think Molly and Otomy Brown retain a friendship
and go remember that ghost The Molly otomy seemed that

(44:33):
we as an audience don't get to see, Oh man,
where is that? I love to watch them because let's
Samy use her body and then they like dance and
I think kiss right now, almost just stay there. I
mean it's intimate, it's very intimate. But you get the

(44:54):
beginning with Odomy's red fingernails as they like intertwined, so
you know that this is the deal, Like it's not
just like they're closing their eyes and like they're making
physical contact. And then cut too, and and the scene
that I like very clearly remembered was like, you know,
like Swazie and to me reuniting beautiful and you're crying,

(45:16):
but you just gotta go that whoopee is the one.
And then you see at the end of that scene
there's a very quick shot of them, you know, because
then Tony goldans like hey, I'm about to die. And
then and then you see them like physically separate. So
you're like, oh that all happened. Why not just inter
cut some of it for for us? And I was

(45:37):
I was like, oh, yeah, whoopy and to me are
at the same height. How did it work? How did
she nestle her sweet little head? Gotta just suspend that disbelief.
I did want to see that though. Well that brings
up another point where men are always trying to control
women's bodies. They're always trying to enter you. And the
scene she gives, but earlier she not give consent. Orlando

(46:01):
did not get consent. Nando, Like God, I forgot his
name was Orlando? Oh, Nando, You can't be jumping into
a bout as you know, that WAPs you out. I
love that's a rule that this movie. Yeah, when they
follow it, and it pays off later on because then

(46:23):
Sam's like, I'm too tired and too weak, and then
those cars get in trouble. But then you hear and
he like push his carl and then all the ghosts.
I liked in that big scene where suddenly out of
May is an actual psychic and now she's there's like
a million people in her room. All the ghosts are
friends and they all know each other out. But then

(46:46):
there's weird like it's just like the regular world where
there's like the scary schizophrenic guy who hangs out at
the tracks, but there's also a community that you can
hang in, like there's all sorts of people. Here's a
question and I don't know the answer. It's not a trick.
Are there any female ghosts in the movie and dead husbands? Yeah? Yeah, yeah,

(47:08):
it's kind of hard to tell in that scene because
at sam Wat's funeral, he sees a ghost walks through
the grave. And then when all when she tells all
the ghosts to get out, I believe I saw someone
in a skirt walk through the wall. That's yes, But
there are no like real female ghosts who have a
effect on the movie. They don't. They don't get they

(47:31):
don't get Orlando moments. I mean when I'm glad Orlando,
because that was like one of my that made me
laugh really hard when well, I was annoyed that he like,
without what these permission, enters your body, which is like,
can we call it rape? But not ghost? Ghost rules
are confusing, which are confusing that I loved that. I

(47:54):
love the first time that Patrick Swayze someone like walks
through him with his with their guts and You're like, no,
Patrick Swayzy can see poorly random body animation. What a curse?
I forgot that happened. And I love that he was
so scared to go through he'd be like, oh no,
oh no. Then he leaps through the door and he's

(48:14):
like and he like looks back at the door and
was like, yeah, dude, you're fucking ghost. What don't you
get And then when he goes to the turnstile for
the first time and he like stops and looks back.
You're a ghost. Keep going, he's new, he doesn't know
every single time or yeah, whenever he sticks his head through,
something's like is this safe? Yes, and you're like, you're

(48:35):
a goddamn ghost. You are fine, You're fine. There's a
lot of great Swayzy reaction shot when he finds when
he finds out Carl is betraying him the first I
thought you were my friends, right, But but first that
long shot of just Swayze's eyes watering, like, but I
thought friendship was forever, so beautiful. Oh, this movie is

(48:58):
so fun and I love really some woman knows where
you live. A lot of women know where I live.
Can we talk about the climactic sequence at the end,
whenever Carl's like banging on the door he breaks in.
Sam is all weak because he's just been inside of May.

(49:19):
And then Molly and Otomy are kind of like left
to fend for themselves for a few minutes and they
go up to the roof and there's a moment where
Molly tackles Carl Um when yeah, like Carl's kind of
attacking oto May, Molly attacks him, gets away, but then
he holds a gun to Molly's head. Then Sam needs

(49:40):
to save her. It always bugs me when a man
needs to save a woman because it's a trope that
happens again and again. Yes, but I do think those
women were smart enough that they could have saved themselves
if given enough time. Yeah, I think so. I think
they could have figured something out because I do think
they were strong women. But yes, then Sam comes and

(50:00):
he flicks the gun away, and then he pushes Carl,
and then I mean Carl kind of kills himself because
because he flings that look and it hits the window
and then the glass falls down and impales him. And
then his little thing he wipes down the window and
he's like his death is like hilariously gruesome. It's very gruesome.

(50:23):
That was what I that most scared me the first
time I shot like Carl's I remember having dreams about
it because it was so It's weird with this movie
because they do like get a ship and a fucking
there every once in a that they don't need to
and they don't need to impale him like that. But
I'm so glad to know, but I'm glad they did.
And then when he comes up from his dead body

(50:44):
and he's like, hey Sam, and it's like what you
can't know? You know what just happened? Were not cool? No,
you guys can't be friends now you're both dead, and
he's like, oh, Carl. And then the little little mentors,
like those things scared me when I was little. I

(51:05):
was like, I hope they don't get me in my bed. Yeah. Yeah,
they're just little de mentors. Yeah. Then they make that noise.
And my favorite part is when Willie Lopez gets hit
by three cars and then they like show him dead
and then you hear in the background that dude is dead.

(51:30):
It's obviously an extra who is just like someone needs
to say I want to say it, I'll say it.
And he probably said it every take and someone probably
was like, hey, man, don't say that again. But then
they saw it, like the dailies were like, oh no,
that's a that's great. We have to keep it. You
know what. This guy's getting his sad probably from that
dude is dead. He went from being a featured extra

(51:52):
to it's good for him. Perfect. Can we talk about
how okay. So it's implied in the movie that cats
can see or sense ghosts because Sam we figures it
out and then he uses it to advantage to scare
off Will Lopez. So I would just like to, for

(52:15):
the record, just remind everyone that cats do have eight
nipples and they can see ghosts nipples. This has been
cat facts with Caitlin. Eight nipples ghosts and you didn't
realize how many nipples you've grazed And it was a
boycat boycats. That was your question, all question. Yeah, you're

(52:37):
stand by it. All mammal male, female, gender non binary
animals and people. All mammals have nipples because all embryos
start out as female and grow little nipples, and then
a certain like hormone is introduced in the womb to

(52:58):
determine whether or not it's it ends up being maybe
it's probably like a litter of kittens thing like cats
have tend to have so many babies at once that
they need more nipples. There's a direct correlation to like
how many offspring a mammal has at a time to
how many nipples they So we're only twins, two little nippies. Yeah,

(53:20):
you should be double fisted. Honestly, humans should only have
one boob, imagine because we only have usually one baby
at a time. So I'm going to campaign for a
one boob movement. Well, then I should have no titties.
I don't want babies upset me. I want to pull

(53:41):
my boobs and have one good one great tips. I
want to have one decup instead, and said to too
little midgets, it's fine, it's it's manageable in the heat.
I accept it. I mean, yeah, big old titties in
the heat. That can't be fun. Right, I want and
I want in the winter. But keep time of year.

(54:04):
I'm grateful this time of year. I count my blessings. Yeah. Well,
this has been a very enlightening des Niptalk Nip Nip
nip Talk, nip Talk, nip slash talk. That's the name
of this podcast. There we go. Hey, let's talk about
whether or not ghost passes the Bechtel test. I see,

(54:26):
I I haven't told this, but I think it does.
I think it technically. Okay, are you your point please? Um? Well,
I wrote in a few different places. You're right. I didn't.
I didn't think that the police scene doesn't pass because
the officer doesn't have a name. Do we ever find
out Odemy's sisters names, because there's an extreme I do

(54:46):
not think they do have names. They do have names.
I just I by the time it occurred to me
that I should have known their names, it was too late.
And you were right. Because they have a conversation about
our cineo hall oh wait, that's a man by our rules.
They just have to have There has to be two
lines of dialogue where they talk about yeah, and they
talk about Otomy, and they talk about like, I don't

(55:08):
I don't have the quote in front of me, but
they're like, oh, you know, she finally got the power
or whatever. And then there's a response that also has
to do with Otomy, and I wish I had written
down the exact exchange, but I think I because I
detailed all of these they technically don't have names. They
don't they are credited and I am dB as Odomy's
sister and Odomy's sister. So those scenes where there are

(55:30):
women interacting. It starts off with Otomy and Mrs Santiago,
who does have a name, but they talk only about
Mrs Santiago's dead husband, so that does not pass. Then
we've got odom May and her sisters. During the scene
where Sam is all like, I'm a ghost and you
can hear me, and now you have the gift that
you didn't think you had, her sisters are like, oh,

(55:52):
she's talking crazy. She hit her head harder than we thought.
The other ones like she was talking to nobody before
she even hit her head, So that would pack as
the test if we knew their names, but we don't.
Then we've got Auto May calling Molly on the phone
to be like, I'm a spiritual reader and I have
a message from your friend Sam doesn't pass. Talking about Sam.
Then the scene where Automy goes to Molly's apartment, same

(56:14):
thing doesn't pass because they only talk about Sam and
all the things like because she's trying to convince her
I've got your dad friend. Then we've got the cop
who is the woman who is all like, I'm never
going to take my clothes off again. If there's ghosts everywhere,
we don't know her name does not pass. And then
we've got Auto May in the psychic shop talking to

(56:37):
another lady who's trying to communicate with her dead husband.
They either only talk about a man. Either way, that
woman is not named I have. I have like a
sneaking feeling that there is, and I wasn't doing the
close enough notes that that I should have been doing.
But I do think that there is an exchange in
this movie somewhere that likely technically passes. But I don't

(57:01):
think that that between and Molly. Yes, probably, but I
think it happens. They always talk about Sam. But if
I mean, but even if there's like the next I
think an exchange the lines between them of like do
you believe yes or no? Like that is the type
of exchange that would pass, right, It would be, but

(57:22):
it would be so fleeting right right, it's yeah, it's
one of those if it's barely right. I think this
does pretty right by its female characters. I think they're
both well developed and because like May is just such
a like dynamic character, just like she's so fun and
fun to watch, and Molly is also again she's dealing

(57:42):
with a lot of ship, but she's serving the story.
So I think the movie treats its female characters well,
but I don't think it passes the Bechdel tests because
every conversation where women are talking, they're either not named
or they're talking about Sam. So that is my stance.
But as we've only Swaysy weren't such a lurker, right,

(58:06):
or if we just got maybe like a scene of
Aftermath after Sam goes to heaven and then is like, well,
it's nice meeting you. You want to get some ice cream?
You owe me money. I did a lot of work
for Sam, and please give me a hundred dollars that
could pass the test. And also she would get the
money I feel she's entitled to. And I don't think

(58:28):
that dem would be stingy about it. No, she'd be like,
she'd be like, and also, here's a weird pottery I made.
I mean, she helps save her life. To me, was
going to get murdered by Willy Lopez otherwise, so or
Carl or car Yeah, one or the other. But as
we've often mentioned, the Bechtel test isn't necessarily like, it's

(58:51):
not the end all be all, like if this movie
does pass the test, it's great to women, and if
it doesn't, it's bad like shitty movies. It's like like, like,
what the guild, But aren't they Oh, I guess they're
not constantly talking about Colin Farrell. There's like three scenes
where they're like, let's talk about our French lessons. Here's

(59:12):
a fun one that passes. Sister act Yes, and I
love that that. It's a there's a real Whoopie Goldberg
career Foreshadow and Ghost where they're like, give the money
to the nuns and she's like, no, none suck. For
some variation on that, Nicle probably knows the exact line,
give money to a bunch of nuns. They can't even like,
they can't even buy panny y. That was a great

(59:36):
like end ending line to a senior, always end on
a button. I'm trying to think of other favorite movies
and if they pass, are probably not. Twang Foo passes,
Thanks for everything, Julie Newmar, we see my cousin Vinny
does not pass. I wouldn't think so. I haven't seen

(59:57):
it in a long time. I think Mercy to me
is the only female archer who speaks. I don't think
there's another woman for her. I've not seen it, but
that sounds about right. Eddie passies. Another Whoopie Goldberg movie,
Eddie that passes because she has a friend and they
talk about basketball. A nice white lady. I like how

(01:00:17):
this movie. I mean, there's not a whole lot of
like tackling race in this movie. But there's a few
different lines where Odom will be like you're a white guy,
aren't you? Like and then and then she sees a
picture of Sam and she's like, oh, you're cute, cute
white guy. Yeah, and then oh yeah the line where
she's basically like, uh wait I wrote down when Whoopy

(01:00:38):
goldbergs like you know are you? Are you hit? And
then she's just like literally like a white guy? Why me? Like, well,
I don't. It doesn't truly tackle race, but it does
tackle that like she lives in a bad area and
a murderer lives in her neighborhood, and this white guy
is very concerned about his white fiance who lives in

(01:01:00):
a good area. So I think, I don't it's does
It doesn't tackle race at all, but like I it
does tackle like she's like, oh shit, like there's bad
ship happening in my neighborhood and I'm hoping out this
white man like you're dead. Yeah, I think let's write
the movie. We we rate each movie on our Nipple
scale nipple scale of one to eight. We should adjust

(01:01:25):
it for cats. For any movie with a cat in it,
we should know, but we do. On a scale of
one to five nipples. No animals have only five nipples,
unless maybe they started out with six or eight and
some of them were surly them off. Oh boy, I
would hate having my nipples are removed. Yeah, I give
it five Little nippies. It's literally my favorite movie in

(01:01:48):
the whole world world. We we we rate it on our
it's portrayal of female Yeah, I stand by Drive Little Nippies.
I think the women are great in the movie. I'm
going to give it four. It get some marks off.
I don't like that the women have to be saved
by Sam at the end. That's a trump that's always
gonna bug me. It's still Sam driving the story it is.

(01:02:11):
He's the protagonist, so that makes sense. But I feel like, maybe,
I don't know, Molly couldn't maybe have a little more
to do or because she is kind of passive. There's
also a scene where Willie Lopez is like watching her undress,
which I guess, like, sure, that's to communicate to the
audience she's in danger, this is scary. But then Odamy

(01:02:31):
tells her, yeah, he watched you undressing. Whatever. But that
scene like didn't really need to happen, like, we don't.
Why do we have to see like a voyeuristic naked
lady scene. She's not. She's also think it paints how
gross Willie is. Yeah, but and then he gets scratched
by a cat, which does have eight nipples, so in

(01:02:56):
a way, it's an eight out of it. But yeah,
I think that Molly and especially Otomy are just really interesting,
multidimensional characters that are enjoyable to watch. And there wasn't
any moment where I was just like, well, I don't
like this. There are opportunities where it could pass the

(01:03:18):
Bechdel test, but there the whole thing is about a man,
their relationship otomy, and Molly's relationship is completely contextualized by
this man. So if they talked about other stuff, would
it make sense for the movie? Maybe not, but I
don't know. Just throw a line in there. Oh did
you watch Oprah yesterday? Yeah? I loved it? How about you? Too? Bad?

(01:03:40):
She didn't get this part that's gonna happen? Yeah, I'll
get I'll give it a ford to based on I mean,
the two main female characters are both and I wouldn't
have said this for Molly the last time I saw it,
but after seeing her this time through our are both
really well developed and have very clear, strong motivations and

(01:04:03):
their storylines. Although they are propelled forward by men, they
seem like two independent women with heads on their shoulders
and deal with problems in a way that makes sense. Yeah,
I mean basically just uh, the one nip off based
on missed opportunities and less so having to do with
Odomy and while because I feel like it would be
disingenuous to the story if they like ended up being

(01:04:26):
best friends like that that would not happen in real life,
but missed opportunities more in terms of it would have
been very easy to give Otomy's sisters names. It would
have been very easy to not have almost all male ghosts.
It would have you know, it would have been very
easy to flip one of um Odomy's clients into a
man trying to talk to his wife, you know, like

(01:04:47):
they're just little stuff like that. Uh. Four nipples. I'm
gonna give two to both of Otomy's unnamed sisters. I
do like that of the women with speaking roles in
this movie, they are almost all women of color because
it's o May her sister's Mrs Santiago. Molly's kind of

(01:05:08):
the only white woman. Yeah, you don't very much of
her world, which is like interesting, like you get the
you get that, like Sam's a Wall Street broker or whatever.
But then like they spent a lot of time in
Brooklyn in Prospect Park, I think is where it would
be like, which was like not gentrified, so like everybody
on the street as a person of color, like it

(01:05:28):
was on the subway to I think they did a
great job of depicting New York because so many movies
will be in New York and they'll be like in
Brooklyn and it's like filled with white people. I'm like,
I don't know where you are, but now I do.
Now it's any part of Brooklyn very gentrified. Take some notes.

(01:05:49):
So how dare you have a Civil war movie without
somebody being like, here's your tea. It's like, come on now, Nicole,
thank you so much for paying. Thanks for Heavy, It's
been a blast. Where can people find you online? He
seeing on Twitter and Instagram at Nicole Buyer for both.

(01:06:10):
I have a Facebook page because I had a show
an MTV called Lucy exactly in a call that got canceled.
But it's being resurrected by Facebook, so you can look
for that soon. And you can look at my fan
page and I'll I guess update it great. There's only
two pictures up. I don't know how to do it,
but yeah, so you can find me out and I

(01:06:31):
perform all over l A. I usually tweet about it
and I tour, so look for them tweets. Look for
those tweets. Speaking at tweets, you can follow us on
Twitter at becktel Cast. You can email us at the
backtel Cast at gmail dot com. Anytime you're drinking a
Mike's Hard List now let us know. Also, you can
donate money to us. We have some production costs and

(01:06:53):
we gotta keep we gotta survive, we gotta keep going
with hit us up on papal. Donate a dollar, two dollars,
three dollars, three thousand dollars. Thanks to your generosity, I
was able to pay my student loans this month. Really,
to be clear, they did not pay my student loans,
but because we didn't need to absorb the cost of
the podcast this month, I could pay my students. Yeah,

(01:07:15):
I keep giving them money. So go to PayPal dot me, backslash,
backtel Cast and you can throw us a few dollars,
that would be great. We'd so appreciate it. Again, Nicole,
thanks for being here. It's been a lot having me
have a great time. And men don't ghost on women. No,
don't call us back, calling back, call us back. But

(01:07:36):
also feel free to die. Yeah, it just dies longing
to leave us some money, all right. Bye,