Jamie and Caitlin Answer Your Questions

To kick off the New Year, Jamie and Caitlin answer listeners' questions in this special Q&A episode!

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
On the Doe Cast, the questions asked if movies have
women and them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands,
or do they have individualism? The patriarchy Zef and best
start changing it with the Beck dol Cast. Room Room, Room, Room, Room, Caitlin, Yeah,

(00:24):
I'm starting up the engine. Oh that's okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
I see you hear it, because we're back. Because we're back.
We took one week off for the first time. In
you're very long room room. And also that is a
little hint into something I would be talking about later.
Room room. Keep that in mind. Room room. Oh my gosh, wait,

(00:45):
I don't even know what you're referring to. I know
will be a surprise for me. But when it hits,
you're gonna be like, oh, brother, and you're gonna roll
your eyes. I was gonna say, you're gonna be so excited,
but like, you're probably gonna be kind of annoyed. Welcome
to the Beck Doel Cast. It's twenty twenty two. My
name is jab Loftus, my name is Caitlin Darante, and
this is our show where we examine movies through an

(01:07):
intersectional feminist lens using the Betel test as a jumping
off point. However, we're not doing that specifically today because
today is a special episode to kick off the new year.
I think, very special episode. It's an after school special. Yeah.
I think we did the same thing last year and
the year before, if I'm not mistaken, and probably other

(01:27):
times throughout the the legacy of this podcast. No way
of telling. We're not going to look there. We're entering
year six of this podcast this year, which is wild,
truly and so yeah at the you know, the end.
In the beginning of the year, we like to take
time to check in with ourselves, check in with our listeners,

(01:49):
and uh kind of doing our version of a State
of the Union, a town hall discussion, if you will.
We invite all the ken Bones and do you remember
Ken Baum? I do remember ken Bone. Oh my gosh,
I haven't thought about ken but I think he ended
up being villainous. Oh no, wait again, I'm not gonna

(02:09):
check um. Today. We're doing a fun episode in which
we are answering some questions from our listeners, but not
to any listeners are s tre Elite gold Star listeners.
Not to discriminate, but they are subscribers over at our
Patreon a k a. Matreon. UM, truly such a fun community.

(02:33):
So uh well, we'll plug that at the top. If
you're a listener that is looking for more buckle Cast content,
we do two additional episodes there on a fun theme
every month, just episodes with me and Caitlin, kind of loose,
kind of fun still the show. We asked our Matreon
subscribers if they had any questions that they would like
us to cover, and it's a fun, interactive community, and

(02:56):
we got some fun questions this year. We certainly do. UM,
so thank you to everyone who submitted a question. We're
not going to have the time to answer all of them,
but um, we really appreciate everyone who's submitted a question
and your matronage and your matronage. We also, again, we
have done a few of these Q and A episodes

(03:16):
in the past, both on the main feed and as
Matreon episodes. So if you submitted a question and we
aren't answering it now, chances are we've already answered it
in a past episode, so go back and listen to
them all. Always be answering questions a back a reporter.

(03:39):
That's what I say to people when I interviewed. I mean,
look are our listeners are curious people, and we've got
answers for you, and and there there were some there
were some head scratchers. I think everyone was really firing
on all cylinders. There's fun questions, there's hard questions, there's
questions in between. So shall we get into it. Let's

(04:02):
get into it a starting with this question from Marie asks,
is it hard to watch movies just for fun? After
five years of the cast? Any tips for how to
just enjoy a sexist romp? Well? This this one actually, um,
I had to take a beat with this question. What

(04:23):
is what do you? What do you think? Because I
think that I'm for me at least for the first question.
I feel like there's like this I'm imagining like a
sign wave in terms of like that journey of like
it was hard for me to watch movies just for
fun for a while, but now five years in, I
have no problem doing it. I feel like you have

(04:44):
to like, I don't know, I guess we've just been
doing it for a while. But there are certain movies
that like, especially if I'm like excited to see a movie,
I won't watch it. Really with the Bechdel lens the
first time I see it, I'm like, let me just
see how this movie makes me feel, and then same shame.
I'll go back and watch it again with the Beck
dolens and see if paying attention with an analytical eye

(05:07):
changes how it made me feel the first time I
saw it. Yes, make sense, of course, because I do
something pretty similar. I I mean, unless something is very
blatantly like I mean, if it sucks, it sucks, and
if it's misogynist and racist or whatever it is, and
it's really obvious, it's like, well, yeah, shut it off, right,

(05:29):
We're right, um. But if I'm just watching a movie
for fun and not because I'm prepping for an episode,
I usually just go in with a kind of a
neutral point of view, not analyzing it for anything in particular,
and that usually allows me to experience the entertainment value
of a movie. Because I don't want this podcast to

(05:51):
ruin the idea of movies for me, and so far
it hasn't, which I'm very grateful for. There's also an
interesting thing about our jaw, which is that it's super fun.
Our job is to watch movies and talk about them.
That's a very fun thing to do, and so it
can be kind of hard to separate our job from

(06:12):
like leisurely watching a movie or again, it was it
was hard for me at first because like my main
hobby is watching movies. So I was like, oh no,
like now that I've blended these two things, like, am
I ever going to be able to enjoy movies again?
But I've found that it hasn't been that much of

(06:32):
a challenge for me, so as far as like tips
on how to just enjoy a sexist romp. And this
is gonna be for for me, Like for it'll be
movies that I already loved. That's what I was gonna say.
It's like, and it's going to be different for I mean,
obviously we're not telling you how to live your life.

(06:54):
This is just our opinions. But yeah, it's like I
there are certain movies that it's like, uh yeah, and
I've been watching this movie my whole life, like if
there's I mean, I feel like Back to the Future
is a perfect example of that for you. It's like
there's obviously gigantic, enormous red flags all over that movie,

(07:15):
all over Indiana, jus all over you know, like all
these famous movies and I think it just depends on
how long it's been with you. Have you like put
in the thought to like what the what the damages?
Do you understand the problems, and then ego from there
it is tough, I mean, And and again it's like,
this doesn't This isn't something that I have had any

(07:36):
issues with with movies that I'm seeing recently, because it's like, yeah,
I don't really enjoy any sexist romps that I'm seeing
for the first time. Yeah, exactly. So if it's a
movie that I'm coming into fresh and it's a sexist romp, yes,
doing this podcast has made me not be able to
enjoy that anymore. But the movies that I already loved

(07:59):
that many of which we've covered on the podcast, and
I've had to really grapple with like, oh my god,
this is horrible looking at it through this lens, but
I still love it that I can to help it.
I think it's a willingness to do the grappling, and
it's a willing to like examine the era was released
into and what was tolerated and why it was tolerated,

(08:24):
and who is harmed when stuff is tolerated And and again,
I mean it's just like just be willing to do
the work and then see how you feel. Yeah, and
then I guess my last tip would be, like, if
you're watching a movie with friends or something like that,
something I do because I've got friends, I've heard of them,

(08:46):
and I watched movies with them. I've seen it. You've
been there. I've been there countless times. Not as a friend,
just as an observer. Yeah, I say, Jamie, you can come,
but you have to sit in the corner and observe
and then Cayleys and you're not my friend. Yeah, I'm
a real monster. Yeah no, But like part of the

(09:08):
enjoyment of watching like an older like sexist romp is
like us having the discussion or like calling it out
and kind of like poking fun at it during it
and like right when you're watching it. Yeah, that's just
like a way in which I find viewing movies like
that to be enjoyable and productive. So that's my big tip.

(09:31):
Oh my goodness, I totally agree. Yeah. I think it's
it's like have the discussion with your like with yourself,
have the discussion with your friends. Same guys. For we
had a few listeners, say I have young children, who
I kind of want to expose them to the movies
that I loved growing up, but they don't age well,
so like, should I just not expose them to those

(09:52):
movies at all? Or should I? And then we like
have a discussion about it if it were I mean,
it's entirely up to each individual. We're famously parents, so
I feel right happy way. I'm famously amazing at rearing
and raising children, so I'm not coming at this from
a parents perspective. But if it were me, I think

(10:13):
I would like show kids movies I loved, but then like,
either during or right after, have that discussion about it, like,
oh did you notice this? Let's talk about how that
is harmful, or like you know how it could have
been handled handled differently, things like that, And honestly, I
think that there's a lot of cases at least and
again I'm not a parent, but of my many friends

(10:35):
I do have kids, I have a lot of friends
who will show their kids, you know, their favorite movies
from when they were a kid that have problematic elements,
and the kids have no interest in it, and they
don't even want to talk about it because they don't
want to see it again because kids movies are operating
kind of, you know, thankfully on a higher level now,
and I mean not in every single way, but there's

(10:57):
you know, I again, it's just I think it's like,
like you're saying, it's a willingness to have the discussion.
And is your you know, is your kid at an
age where they're able to have the discussion with you
and they're not just sponge braining, um things spongebraining? Sure, yep, no,
I understand exactly what you mean. Thank you for the question, Marie.
I hope. I think I think we think we've covered it.

(11:18):
I think we nailed it. Our next question comes from
Jesse h. Jesse says we love the growth the pod
has seen, especially the pivot from hobby to job, from
hobby to jobby. Um. Jesse asks, what is the biggest
gift you got from the pod? How do you define
success with the pod? And what do you think the
pod will look like in five years? Oh, baby, Jesse,

(11:43):
thank you for the vote of confidence that Caitlin and
I will be alive in five years. Honestly, let's start, Okay,
biggest gift you got from the pod, I think easily
friendship with you and and having a friend for life,
and also just like getting to meet so many wonderful
people through the podcast has been so personally fulfilling and rewarding.

(12:07):
And all of our guests are so wonderful and generous
and kind, and Sophie lictive, and our producers amazing, Aristotle
asavadour producer is amazing. We love the people we work
with like we're very, very lucky. And then I think
for me that the gift has also been because I
don't know, I mean, I guess at this point you
kind of might not even know this unless you've been

(12:29):
listening to the show for a long time. But when
we started doing the show, I had not I did
not consider myself a film lover. I had not seen
a ton of movies. And I feel like doing this
show has really not just broadened my horizon in terms
of perspectives and ways of looking at movies. I'm kind

(12:50):
of like growing your brain with the community, which is
also a huge thing. Our our listener community is a
huge gift. Um, getting to talk to you all and
like hear your thoughts and yeah, your perspectives has been
so awesome. Um. And also I've just seen like literally
hundreds of fun movies, Like there's very little downside to

(13:13):
this job. As I was saying earlier, yeah, we have
a really fun job. We're super lucky brag. Yeah, very lucky. Yes,
I completely agree with all of that. And I'll just
like piggyback a little bit further and say that the
feedback that we get on the podcast both people being like,
you're amazing, thank you so much for this, blah blah

(13:36):
blahlah blah. No, but like what I really mean is like,
what do you okay? Let me going into full on
bragg territory, Like my favorite part would be when people
say I'm so amazing what I mean. What I mean
is the feedback we get when people say that this

(13:59):
podcast has opened their eyes about representation and that they
see media in a whole new way and that they've
just learned a lot. And I think what people might
not realize that much as like we are both on
that journey of learning just as much as our listeners are.
I mean, for sure thanks to other feedback we get,
which is listeners saying like, hey, have you considered this?

(14:23):
There's other tropes that you might not be familiar with.
There's other there's other movies that you maybe haven't heard of,
Um check these movies that you know, just like the
feedback we get both like positive reinforcement and constructive feedback,
those are like incredible gifts that we get from the podcast. Yeah,
it's it's there's nothing but gifts were very very lucky.

(14:47):
And so I guess in terms of how you to
find success with the pod, I mean that is such
a such a murky question. I don't know. I mean,
it's it's honestly like success with the podcast for me,
it looks like are people enjoying it? Are people engaging
with it? Are people listening? You know, like we're trying.

(15:08):
You know, it's I think we've had pretty consistent listenership
over the years, which, um and that is like grown
also and and so that is very lucky and very cool.
And yeah, I mean I think it's just sort of
like are y'all happy? And are we bringing new people in?
And you know, I think we've been kind of like

(15:29):
a slow but steady, kind of consistent show and I'm
very happy with that. Yeah. One of my favorite little
anecdotes is our first ever live show had like twelve
people in the audience. One of whom was my mom,
one of whom was your mom who was actively very
disrupted hitting on the guest. And and then one of

(15:53):
the most recent live shows we did, which was also
like two years ago because of COVID ever heard of it? Uh?
But um, there were more people there. There's I mean,
we we sold out like a three hundred. We'll say
we've yeah, we've played some pretty big rooms folks, Okay
for a podcast. Yeah, so that's what we would like

(16:16):
to continue doing. So I guess what we're saying is,
if you enjoy the show, tell your friends friends, uh,
and then what what do you think the prop will
look like in five years? Both of you to ask
a question that involves time, because we don't fucking no.
I hope, I mean, I hope we're still doing it.
I hope we're still doing it. I hope we're still happy.
We hope we're still having fun, and we hope you're
still having fun. Oh my gosh. And that's my answer.

(16:37):
My answer is I think we will have done at
least five more Titanic episodes. That's five years. I mean, yeah,
that's a given. That's a given. For every year the
show lives, another Titanic episode is just dated. That is true.
So that's not even that wasn't even a bold statement. Okay,
I'll let me change it. Fifty more Titanic episodes. Okay,

(17:03):
then we do it well, lose every subscriber we have,
and then we can finally sink into the walk into
the ocean and rejoined our friends at the bottom of
the Atlantic. Wow. No, I mean I don't I don't know.
They we hope, we hope we're still around. We hope
we're still having fun. I hope, I just hope we're Yeah,

(17:24):
we're we're still having fun. We're still growing and learning
because this is a constant process and there's always much
to learn. There's always much to learn. Yeah, and we
want to keep learning new ship and talking about fun movies.
Thank you, Jesse. Good question. Indeed, Burham asks you recognized

(17:49):
that you hadn't been as intersectional as you could have
been in your assessment of representation. How do you think
you fared on this front in will you do anything differently?
In too? I mean, similar to what we were just
talking about. Is just a matter of like, yes, we've
learned along the way, but there's always room to learn more.

(18:10):
I do think we made good on a promise to
analyze things more intersectionally, because it very clear that it
was necessary for us to do and and and and
I yeah, I'm I'm happy with um the strides we've taken.
We could certainly always do more, and it's our intention
to to do more and continue on that. And that's

(18:32):
something that we're always open to feedback on and we
hope that that, you know, it's it's clear to our
listeners that the line of communication is very open there
as well as with our guests. Absolutely, I think we
made we made a lot of necessary improvements in our
approach and in the kind and in the movies we
were covering in general. UM, We've talked about this many times,

(18:54):
but it was I think part of the adjustment was
also making sure that we were balancing movies that are,
you know, highly demanded by our listeners, and also making
sure that we're bringing new voices into this discussion, making
sure that we're covering classic movies that are not just
directed by white guys. There's plenty of them, and that's

(19:14):
something that we are continually working on. And we were
just having a discussion the other day about kind of
how that's going to play into our UM our movie load, gross,
our movie load. For there's got to be a better
way to say that movie selection, maybe our roster. I'm

(19:35):
sticking with load. Sticking with load. But that is a
part of our intent and discussion. It has been for
a couple of years now in a way that it
honestly wasn't in a way it should have been when
we started the show. So always open to feedback about it,
and UM as always you know, we I posted about

(19:56):
it on Twitter the other day. And also you know,
there's our spreadsheet is always open to your requests. So
if there are movies by um, not white guys, by
by women, by non binary filmmakers, by trans filmmakers, by
black filmmakers, by brown filmmakers, but you know, but by
what movies you want to see, we want to know
about and UM we want to find guests that want

(20:19):
to talk to us about it and that we can
have a cool discussion about. So I think we're just
going to stay the course for this is the plan.
I agree, Thank you. Burn. Indeed, let's take a quick
break and then we will come back and answer more
questions and we're back. UM, we have a question from

(20:44):
Nuala here. I hope I'm saying that correctly. They ask
would you consider a neurodiverse aspect to your analysis of films?
Loving films is often a big part of being autistic
for various very interesting and fun reasons. But I struggled
to find explorations of film that even consider a neuro
atypical viewpoint, let alone involve it in an intersectional way.

(21:06):
Love the podcast as you take a multifaceted approach to
what feminist movie criticism looks like. A neuro diversity is
another interesting facet of the feminist film criticism. Titanic, Heart
of the Sea Diamond first of all, stuck the landing
on the question, really know how to to to really
serve it to us, steaming hot on a platter. Thank you.

(21:29):
This is an excellent question, and I think it's something
that we um This is an aspect of the show
that we really could do better with. Yes, And I
think it will mean bringing on guests who are neurodiverse
and selecting movies that will generate an interesting discussion as

(21:49):
far as neuro diversity is concerned. And yeah, I think
it's just a matter of us, like making more of
an effort to include that in our analysis us as
far as the films and the guests and just applying
neurodiversity as a lens by which where analyzing movies. Yeah,

(22:09):
I was very, very excited to see this question. This
is like the exact thing we were just talking about.
Actually going back to Burns question, is when our listeners
bring up questions like this, sometimes Caitlin and I are like, oh, yeah,
of course, and it, you know, almost immediately becomes part
of the discussion when we are setting up our next

(22:30):
kind of loads of movies to talk about um and
and this is like, this is an excellent reminder that
this is something that we have had discussions about in
the past. Certainly, I think we've we've certainly had neurodivergent
guests on the show, and we've talked i think several times,
not as much as we should, but but several times

(22:52):
about neurodivergent coded characters and kind of how that can
play out in movies and kind of the further you go,
the less easy it is to to do the analysis
and have the discussion, but their important discussions to have,
and that's something that I'm I'm really interested in continuing

(23:12):
to do this year and actually make you know more
of a concerted efforts. So thank you new all that
that is I think a reminder we needed. So yeah again, listeners,
if you have any specific requests or guests suggestions, we
are very open to it all years. Thank you for
your question. The next question comes from Sharry Sherry, not

(23:37):
exactly sure how to pronounce your name, so apologies. They
ask how much do you think the changing of tides
for modern movies to have more and better representation is genuine?
And how much is it just performative or marketing? But
also doesn't matter what the intentions are if the outcome

(23:59):
of having more and better representation happens either way. Another
great question. This is a fascinating question that we could
not possibly answer with any real authority. However, I don't know,
I can. I think about this a lot, and I
feel like it is I don't know why. I mean,

(24:20):
I bring up that like weird Supreme Court quote a
lot where it's like I know it when I see it.
It's I do think that there is a lot of
performativity in general, as it pertains to representation of many
different kinds, and again it has a lot to do
with I think, uh, you know, one form of performativity

(24:42):
is when there is representation in front of the camera
and not behind. I think that there's a lot of
performativity when you know you're kind of doing the very
very baseline of like, look at this character who is
not a white guy, and then failed to treat that
character as a person, or you know, just exploit the

(25:03):
elements of the character that are not I guess, quote
unquote the norm that we see in movies. You know,
characters that are there but are sidelined, or there but
are there to support the you know, white straight lead.
And there's a lot of hollowness and it's still I
mean very much so like now right, But then there's

(25:26):
also there will be like executives, you know, studio executives
who are like out of touch, rich white men who
are like, oh, diversity seems really in right now, let's
like try to fill a quota or whatever, you know,
because I see it in those terms, right, we have
to fill a quota. We have to like you know,

(25:47):
give this many shows or green light these many movies
that are going to tell the public like we care
about diversity. But then when creators who are women, people
of color, queer people, and so on, are then given
opportunities to tell their stories and given funding to tell
their stories. Then we get representation from the creators that

(26:12):
we want to see telling their own stories, even though
it did come from a kind of like performative. So
I think that's like the question of, like does it
matter what the intentions are if if the outcome does
mean better representation, it's like it does still matter, Like
it does still matter that the slog of capitalism, which

(26:34):
is what it goes back to, and like, you know,
we can trace it all the way up and you
know colonial you can, we can trace that line, right,
And I think it does matter because that fucking sucks
and it creates a a I don't know, like this
kind of like void of like we should be grateful
to see as much representation as we do when obviously

(26:58):
that's not the case. And and it just kind of
by the question of, like, well, can these executives, you
know die, I don't know, like can we get some
new people in here? But but I do think it's
like like your sand culin the demand from viewers and
as poison and evil as the internet is they think
the Internet has done a lot to push these conversations forward. Um,

(27:21):
very double edged sword, as anyone listening very likely knows. UM.
But I do think that, you know, getting to interact
directly and make it really clear of like this is
what we want has made a difference. I wish that
it made a quicker difference. I wish I had made
a less cynical difference. I wish that it was making

(27:41):
a less money motivated difference. Unfortunately, we live in a
society and it fucking sucks. So I don't know it's
for sure. I mean, that's a really difficult question. I
feel like you kind of answered it in a way
in the second question, where it's like the outcome is
having more and better representation and that is ultimately a

(28:05):
good thing, and that ultimately, I hope, sets a bedrock
of like we're creating a new bare minimum that will
hopefully continue to build and build and build, and that
is positive. But it's just frustrating that it has to
be done that way. But the way we talk about
like stepping Stone movies that are not great by our

(28:25):
very current standards, but we're ahead of their time and
kind of paved the way for better representation. I guess
we're in like a stepping stone era where like the
intentions are often motivated by money and capitalism, but I
think will end up paving the way for a media

(28:47):
landscape that isn't so motivated by like, oh, diversity is
so hip right now, so let's do that because it'll
make us money. It I think we're just in this
like era of ushering in better representation the will come

(29:08):
from a more earnest and genuine place and not be
so motivated by capitalism. Yeah. I mean, we may be
fucked in that regard um, however, but I do think
it's like it's and and again it's as consumers that
we are kind of empowered to some degree to ask
for what we want and hope and sometimes we get

(29:30):
it and sometimes we don't. I hope that, you know.
I feel like it's generally a good thing when you
can look back several years in like media landscape and
like film landscape and like cringe at what you were saying,
because that means that growth has taken place. And I
do think we can say that for the past couple
of years, you look back on the fucking crumbs we
were taken in. You know, there has been changed, there

(29:56):
has been growth. I am generally optimistic and still a cynical,
annoying capitalist structure. I was actually going to say the
same thing too. I forget which question this was for,
but when we were talking about, you know, like, we're
growing and we're learning and as far as like the
podcast goes, if I go back and listen to an

(30:18):
episode from three years ago, chances are I'm cringing because
we were like, I was like, oops, we forgot about
this thing, or we like, you know, things that we
failed to notice, things that we overlooked back then that
we pick up on much more easily. So, yeah, the
whole thing landscape is changing. It is, and I hope

(30:42):
it will continue to. I've been like, I mean, yeah,
there's been so much good stuff that's come out in
the past couple of years, which I you can't always
say it's very exciting. We're living in the worst of times,
but in some ways there's been a loggo checking the
best of times, which which brings us to our next question,
which comes from Gig what's one of your spicy film takes?

(31:04):
For one? Also, thank you so much for doing the
podcast and being so funny and insightful. I like that
you kept the compliments in. You've helped rect my love
for movies good and bad. It's like this is my
flex episode. UM, thank you, Gigi. It's nice to be appreciated,
That's all I'm saying. It makes me so uncomfortable. UM,

(31:26):
so thank you, Gi. We really appreciate your comments and
your compliments. What's your spicy film take? For Caitlin, I
was looking back through Letterboxed, which plug everyone. If you're
on letterboxed, we have a bectel cast account where we

(31:48):
mostly just keep track of movies that we have done.
Our Matreon episodes is on like a separate list. Um,
there's our watch list of frequently requested episodes that we
plan and doing in the future. You know there's activity
on there, so check us out on letterbox I also
have a personal Letterboxed account, which you can find by searching.

(32:11):
My name is Caitlin Darante on letterboxed. I don't because
I'm cringe. I don't want people know what I think
about anything. UM. Anyway, So I was going back through
just basically all the releases from one on letter box
and I was reminded that and maybe this is not
a spicy hot take, or maybe it is. I'm not sure.

(32:32):
At least of the movies I've seen that came out,
I feel as though this was an incredibly underwhelming year
as far as cinema goes. Wow, that is kind of
a spicy take. And it's very possible that there are
amazing movies that came out this year that I just
have not yet seen. But again, of the ones I

(32:54):
have seen, which is a fair number, I you know,
I try to stay up to date on new releases,
I was not really into basically anything I saw. With
one exception. There was one movie that I absolutely loved
came out this year was Barbon Star Go to Vista
del Mar. Oh, my gosh. I was going to mention

(33:16):
that as like one of the highlights of my Yeah,
let's hear your um. So there's two movies that I
saw that came out in one that I really really
liked when I just saw last night because I couldn't
wait for it to go on streaming anymore, so I
just bought it, which was Zola. Oh. Yes, really really

(33:38):
loved we We're Gonna Cut We were So we've been
getting a lot of requests for Zola, So for your reference,
we try to wait until the movie is streaming somewhere
a little more generally before we cover it on the show,
so it's more accessible to people. Um, but we may
just have to jump the gun because I'm I'm just
so stoked on it. So I really love Zola. And

(33:59):
then one movie that we both saw that did not
even remotely come out in but I saw it and
I think I've seen it five times now is the
movie Pin and my my spicy film take of is
you gotta watch Pin? And it came out in something

(34:19):
I don't know Pin. Is I truly like, I don't
think I'm bullshitting you when I say it in my
top ten movies. Well, yeah, you and some other friends
of ours liked it so much better than I did.
I loved Pin. I thought Pin was such a special film.

(34:40):
And it's on YouTube doc I mean, talk about access
to movies. It is a wild one. It is about
a m It's a story. Is it a story about
fathers and sons? Yes, but but ultimately it's also about
a a ventriloquist dummy that they put skin on that

(35:01):
is this and he's a sex said teacher and he's
a murderer and you gotta watch Pin. It is such
it actually like I've it sounds like I'm lying, but
it will make you think. Yeah, I suppose I loved Pin.
Uh Well, we both watched Pin for our friend Alex's
horror movie marathon that he does every year time honor tradition.

(35:21):
Another film that we watched for the marathon was Malignant,
which was one of my favorite movies, not because it's good,
because it wasn't, but it was. I loved it. I
thought it was pretty good. I was pretty good. I
enjoyed it there. And then the movie that I know
you didn't like, but we've mentioned it on the show before.

(35:43):
I druly think it was like made for me to
watch it is Titan by Juliette Ducarne. Is that where
the room room referenced the car. I think it's pretty
with a car um. If you haven't seen it and
you're in a and you're feeling very French, I can't.
I mean, it's not for everyone, but it's not supposed

(36:04):
to be. I really love that movie. I think that
we may cover it on my birthday month on the Matreona.
It's she I will mentally prepare myself. Yeah, you have
eight months to get ready. So my spicy film takes
are Those are the three movies that I oh four,
including Barb and Start, which I really loved that really

(36:28):
rev to my engine. Money twenty one. Oh my god,
I she has sex with a car and that's at
the beginning of the movie. It's unbelievable. Um, thank you
Gigi for your question Room for Room. I'm like a
I'm like a Mazda Wow. All right, Okay, Sophia, how's

(36:54):
the next question? And asks which movies do you regret
giving high scores to after rethinking their impact? And then
Sophia lists Wonder Woman as an example, which is definitely
one that we rated too highly. That's the game to
mind for me. Um, we talk about being trained for crumbs.

(37:14):
You know, that was a trained for Crumbs moment for us,
Which is like something that I have been grappling with
as we've been doing the podcast for many years, is
that I have this habit of like going easier on movies,
or like evaluating them differently based on who has made them,

(37:38):
or like if it fills a void that needs to
be filled in terms of representation. I will be like, well,
it fills a void, so it's perfect or it's amazing,
but that might not be true. It's just that it
fills a void. But I will get too excited about
it and be like, Wow, this representation that we haven't
seen yet, uh five million nipples, which is like, I

(38:03):
mean fat, I mean I think it's a very human
reaction that is cringing retrospect, and I think that's okay. Like, yeah,
I think of UM, I think of that. I think
of Um as much as I love Moanna. I think
that movie is directed by white guys, and I think
that there's been a lot of productive conversations before and
after that movie came out that we were not engaging

(38:25):
with to the degree we should have at the time
about that tendency that is still happening at Disney and
in movies in general. Those are the two that I
think come to mind for me. Yeah, I were like
the Matrix. Did it deserve the four and a half
nipples that I gave it? Probably not, But I love that.
But I'm like even movies that have rated recently Barbin Star,

(38:49):
I think we probably gave too many nipples too, did
But but yeah, but we sometimes it is like inevitable,
and I think we acknowledge it in the moment too.
Sometimes it's like difficult to not you know, we're not math.
You know, it's something your feelings are going to come
into account at some point, and there's I think that
there is, like especially with movies that just came out,

(39:11):
which with Mo Wanna and Wonder Woman were at least
relatively true or covered it in the first wonder Woman
was like right away, right away, Wanna was like within
a year of it coming out, and so I think
we were still just really excited about it. And also
those are two episodes that are like over three years old,
and so we were just like, not, we're not functioning

(39:32):
on the same level that the show does now. So
it's true that said, I still love Mohanna and I
I tried to rewatch Wonder Woman, and there's moments in
it that's still get me really juiced. But I honestly
think it's not very fun to watch. It's a little
um underwhelming by UM standards. Yes, yeah, Mo Wanna gosh

(39:56):
nearly perfect movie. I love it so much. It is wonderful.
But we also gave The Wizard of Oz five stars.
Across the board, which is absurd. I wonder what our
reasoning was there. I don't know. And also I'm like,
I don't want to go back and read that. If
there's any takeaway here is that take the Nipple scale
ratings with a grain of salt, because we often are

(40:16):
just pulling a number out of our little bombs, little
bombs things for excuse me, I got a big ass. Um. Okay,
let's move on. Let's move on. We have a few
more we have we have, we have just a couple
more questions. Yes, our next question is from Erica. Erica says,

(40:39):
I teach film as literature at the high school level,
and I was curious what you both wished you had
learned in high school about movies. Honestly anything, I don't
I learned anything about movies in high school. I think
the most I learned about movies was in like the
fifth grade, because I had this amazing teacher who and
this is like not speaking to the character of this director.

(41:02):
I just think that it was really cool that he
showed us these movies. Um, he showed he was really
into like Hitchcock movies, and he would show us Hitchcock
movies in the fifth grade, which is actually not responsible, um,
because they're various. I remember he one day he was like,
shout out, Mr Brewster. He was like an amazing teacher.
He like, how does do Shakespeare plays? And like showed

(41:22):
us the birds. Like I don't know how he was
getting away with it, but it was really fun. But honestly,
like in terms in high school, movies were generally just
turned on so you would shut up, Like I didn't
have any any media literacy in high school. In college,
where I did study film allegedly, um, I think that

(41:44):
there was, there was like so little attention paid to
any sort of diversity. It felt very like my at
least the curriculum that I did at Emmerson College call
out post at least when I was going there was.
And I'm sure that it's improved since I went there,

(42:06):
but or I hope it has, but it felt very prescriptive.
It felt very copy paste, you know. Yeah, we were
just talking about that on the Double Indemnity episode, about
how so many film programs just regurgitate the same curriculum
over and over, everyone seeing Double Indemnity because that's the
noir movie that everyone watches. Yeah, like very frustrating, and

(42:30):
I feel like in classes like that for me in college,
it would be like, Okay, we're having one day with women,
and we have one day with black filmmakers. We'll have
one day where here's a movie with a gay character,
like and then it would be like, okay, now now
back to Yeah, Sisten came for like seven weeks, and

(42:54):
it's you know, obviously we're not saying that those movies
have no value, but they're given outsized value, or they
certainly were to me. I will never, ever, ever stop
being annoyed that I had to take a class called Wilder,
Alan and Kaufman, even though I there are Billy Wilder
and Charlie Kaufman movies I like. But I'm like, could

(43:15):
you come up with a more egregiously incurious group of people?
And also one of them is Woody fucking Alan. Give
me a break. UM got in trouble in that class
for saying correct things about what are you on? Um
shout out Jamie when she was twenty one. Um, yeah,

(43:37):
that all that to say in high school. Nothing in
college a different kind of nothing right about the same.
For me, there was a communications class that focused more
on filmmaking than it did on Oh that's kind of cool. Yeah,
so I and I jumped at the chance to take
it because I was kind of really the only class

(44:00):
like it that my high school even offered. And in
that class, I did make a short film called Car
Wars Return of the Jetta, in which a character Caitlin,
in which what am I supposed to do with this information?
You're supposed to just revel in it, Jamie. I'm rolling

(44:20):
around like a pagan slash lit a wash over you, yeah,
wallow and the joy that is Car Wars Return of
the Jetta. So I like it more. At the time,
I drove a Buick sky Hawk. Cool. That is really cool,
Thank you so much. It's a hideous car. It sounds

(44:41):
cool that. Um, I cast my sister in the movie.
Her character's name is Sarah sky Hawker because she drove
the sky Hawk. Wow, you really put a lot of
thought into this. Oh my gosh, it was. It's one
of my finest works, and I made it when I
was seventeen. Um, there was another character I just took, like,

(45:02):
I just basically like took my friends used their first
name and then added like a Star Wars flourish to it. Anyway,
it was a it was a spoof. It was a romp.
It's about a big race that the Jetta and the
sky Hawk they raced each other and whoever wins the
race saves the galaxy or something. I don't know, But

(45:22):
did you get an A? I got a plus? Wow. Okay,
so you you learned. I learned so much, um. But anyway, Yeah,
I wish I had learned more about actual like film
history in high school, um, and more about I guess
because I went on to get a master's degree in

(45:44):
screenwriting from Boston University, a fact that I hate to mention,
but I wish I had learned more about like how
to craft a narrative in general and specifically like a
cinematic narrative. Those have been cool things to learn. So
I don't know if that helps you out, Erica. I
wish I had learned about movies in high school, but

(46:05):
ultimately I wish that someone had taught me how to
do my fucking taxes at any point. So you know,
it's kind of like there's a lot of things I
should have learned in high school that I didn't. I
really specifically remember my history teacher being like, um, let's
watch a historical movie, and then he turned on Zoro
starring Antonio benderis there, so you know schools are underfunded.

(46:31):
You guys, My sixth grade math teacher taught children, sixth
grade children how to balance checkbooks. First of all, why
are you teaching that to sixth graders? And secondly, that's
a skill I never needed to use. Yeah, but at
least they were thinking like at that time you could
have maybe needed it, Like you know, yeah, that's just true. God,

(46:54):
no one ever taught me how to do anything. The
most useful thing that happened to me in high school
is my high school English teacher set me up a
Gmail account that I used to this day. Um. Incredible,
So thank you Ms. Rich. Okay, we got a couple
more questions, a couple more questions, but first let's take
a quick break and then we will come back and
finish off those questions and we are back with the

(47:23):
next question from Genevieve asks what's your process for planning
episodes parentheses? Do you choose guests than movie or movie
than guest? It kind of depends, Um, if there's a
movie that we really want to cover either, because like
the sequel to it or the reboot or whatever is
coming out soon, then we will kind of do movie

(47:47):
first and then figure out a good guest for it. Um.
In other cases, we will just like have a list
of guests that we know we want to have on
the show and then we leave it up to them
as far as what movie they want to do. For
the most part, you know, it's just it's kind of
like a mixed bag of different things. So there are

(48:10):
movies that I feel like our listeners are like, why
haven't you covered this one yet? The podcast has been
going on for five years. It's probably because like, of
the many many guests we've haven't had on the show,
none of them have chosen that movie yet. And the
last thing we ever want to do because this everyone
loses in the scenario is as have a guest cover
a movie that they have no particular interest in covering. Like, um,

(48:34):
so yeah, I mean, it's it's definitely a mix. Sometimes
there are a movie that we really want to cover,
and if we don't know a guest already who's really
passionate about discussing it, will sometimes be like, well, is
there are there any writers who have written about this
movie and that we know will hopefully be interested in
discussing it with us. That's sometimes how we'll find an

(48:54):
end to discuss a movie that we've been wanting to discuss.
Other times, we just sort of I mean, you know,
like our our guests who have been on multiple times,
we just kind of have a feel for the kind
of movies they like, and sometimes we'll be like, hey,
this one and sometimes they're like yeah, or sometimes you're
like I don't really feel strongly about that one, but
here are three that I would love to cover, and
then we'll kind of take it from there. So it's

(49:16):
kind of an intuitive it's free form jazz. Yeah, and
I would say listeners, if there are any movies that
you're like, wow, surprised you haven't covered this yet, and
I know, like, here's the perfect guests for it. If
you have any like recommendations, suggestions, anything along those lines,
feel free to tweet at us let us know because

(49:38):
that sounds helpful for us. That sound helpful for us? Thanks. Um. Yeah, Yeah,
So that's hopefully that answers your question. Jenemy. I'm very
excited for this next question. It's from Harriet. Harriet asks
or says I'm sixteen and about to make a podcast
for a big school project. What advice would you give me?

(49:58):
Oh my god, Harriet the is so excited. First of all,
congratulations on entering. Hell um there, no, this is really cool.
I I was thinking about a conversation with my friend
Sarah recently where she was just like, you know, people
say that there's too many podcasts in the world. I
don't think that that's true. Like, everyone has something that

(50:19):
they're passionate about and like a unique way of discussing it,
and the more of that that's in the world, the better.
So my advice would be, you know, talk about something
that matters to you and something that you're curious about,
and do your research and find people to talk to
who share that curiosity and hopefully have more knowledge on

(50:42):
it in a in a different perspective than you do,
and that reads to people like it's I feel like
podcasting is such a cool form where when you're passionate
about something, it shows, and when you're curious about something,
it shows, and it's such a collaborative for and it's
so easy to you know, have access to and so

(51:04):
easy to reach people and to and to make and um,
choose something you're you're passionate about, don't. I feel like
it's always kind of very clear when there's um, I'm
not thinking of anyone in particular her, but like when
there's a very cynical, like algorithmically like designed, people are
gonna want to hear a podcast about this, And then

(51:24):
it's usually fucking boring because you know, it's like there's
no heart in it, there's no like curiosity, so or
it's just sort of like people talking about nothing. Don't
just shoot the ship unless you're the funniest person in
the face of the earth. And I'm not saying this
to Harriet specifically, but like all of you, no one,
I mean, no cakes, I mean that. But even that

(51:47):
is like, there are some podcasts I listened to that
are like vaguely focused conversations that are shooting the ship
that are very funny, like there's no rules, just don't
be an asshole. That's the that's the rule, and don't
be afraid to get specific. Like some of the best
podcasts are like very niche things. And and then because

(52:08):
this is a question that a few different people asked
that they're like looking to start a podcast or they're
you know, they're like getting one up and going. And
I would say kind of just from a technical standpoint,
it's helpful if you have and I know that this
is an investment, and you know, everyone is probably operating
on a different budget, and it's probably not that HI

(52:28):
have a budget, But if you can get your hands
on a decent microphone, and if you can just do
some basic editing, that's going to make the quality of
your podcast a brazilion times better and just easier for
your listeners to enjoy. So obviously, like the creative and

(52:49):
the fun parts of podcasting are very important, but the
technical stuff is as well. Yeah, if you're able to
not cut corners, don't yes, okay, uh yeah, and um
we always like to end these episodes with a few
fun questions. Morges board. A lot of people had very

(53:13):
specific questions about three main topics that kept coming up
again and again. So I'll just list them all off
and Jamie, you know, I can just sort of rapid
fire talk about these things. A lot of people wanted
to know about the Lego Titanic that I built. Yes,
tell them, Caitlin, you made a financially reckless decision and

(53:36):
it and it paid off uge as Titanic. I mean,
I didn't get any sort of return on my investment
unless you count Sarahtonin exactly. Yeah, I did spend over
six hundred dollars. I'm I'm horrified. Like, Look, I never

(53:57):
treat myself, I never buy anything, and I just I
really felt I could and should. Look, I have a
Lego Titanic. It was worth every penny, just the building
of it, the documenting of the building of it, and
sharing that with very compelling You should. If you haven't
gone to Caitlin's Instagram and watched the time laps it is,

(54:20):
it's like it's it's like you're in Belfast. It's amazing.
I felt like I was there and I am there
for a little bit and you are there. Yeah, you
make a little cameo that was lovely. Um and basically
Mr Andrews engineering the damn thing before your very eyes.
And you're also, you know, like a several thousand irishmen

(54:40):
you're doing You're doing the damn thing, and I'm doing
the damn thing. It's very impressive. I'm really bummed because
I took so many more time Laps videos than I
ended up posting, but I didn't realize that they didn't
actually save on my phone because I had taken so
many other time Labs videos that I ran out of storage.
So I took all these videos that didn't even save
to my phone because I had done too many already.

(55:03):
So that's a bummer. But there are fair number on
my Instagram, so check those out. And people wanted to know,
you know, like how it went, how many hours it took.
I think I put somewhere between fifteen and twenty hours
into building it over the course of a few a
couple of weeks. Um, I don't know where to put it. Still.
We did talk about this on our little mini week
off episode. It is still just sitting on my floor. Um,

(55:28):
I don't know what to do with it. I think
that you need to just get like a hefty shelf,
a hefty shelf for a Titanic will write our our
next question are our next course that we get all
the time, and thank God, is about Alfred Melina. It's
just about Alfred Billina in general. And I mean a
lot of questions were like who would Alfred Millina play

(55:51):
in a Christmas Prince or a Princess switch movie? Because
we got a lot of questions about the Christmas Netflix movies,
which is I mean, I'm honestly just glad that people
are still on board with those episodes because we have
so much fun doing them. Um. So I mean to
answer that specific question, I think, you know, with all
due respect, Vanessa, go out there, let's get Alfred in there,

(56:14):
and he's all of the princesses obviously obviously, but Alfred
Billina in general. I mean, another amazing year for our guy,
al Freddie Freddie as we call him because friend and
he's been on the show. And then people were asking
about his performance in Spider Man No Way Home, which
I have not yet seen but I have received. I mean,

(56:34):
it made me feel good. I've received so many texts
asking if I've seen it yet, and I haven't because
the second I was going to see it in theaters,
guess who reared her little head again? It was the coronavirus.
And so I'm waiting. But this year, this year in
Alfred Billina for me was I collaborated with super Yocky

(56:57):
and UM made to Alfred Maline themed t shirts UM,
and that was very rewarding. That was my Molina moment
for this year. I love that. I have one of
those shirts. And Molina Freddie, our friend got married this year,
so good for him, you know he married. Um, oh

(57:17):
my gosh, I'm a misogynist. The director of Frozen, Jennifer
for Jennifer Leey, she and Alfred Milena are married. They
seem very happy. What a power couple. We love that
for them. Congrats Freddy. Just a banner year for Freddie.
I think, honestly like Freddy's career wise personally, he was

(57:38):
knocking it out of the park this year certainly, and
as someone who did see Spiderman No Way Home because
I saw it on opening day. Yeah, you saw it.
You got in right in the nickdtime. I got in early. Yeah,
I would say it's well worth the watch, Jamie. So
when you do have a chance to see it safely,
please do you won't be disappointed. I look forward to it.

(57:59):
Um yeah, I'm I'm When it comes to Freddie, I
can wait and I hope he's listening. Um. So, another
another fun question we got was from Michelle asks which
movie that you've covered would be a hundred times better
if Shrek was the main character? Though, Titane, titane not

(58:25):
to not to call up my favorite movie of one
and saying, what if Shrek ad sex with a car?
But it does make you think it Maybe it would
be a less of a feminist text if it was.
But but if Shrek got pregnant by a car shre
Tin Shrek Shrek Taine. I think that that's my final answer.

(58:45):
I I I still want, I want. I just want
two cuts of the movie. I want the original Titan
and then I want Shrek Tane because I think it
just it just opens your eyes in a whole new way.
Here's my answer for this. Because you said, you know,
you mentioned different cuts of a movie made me think
of the butthole cut of Cats. What if Cats was

(59:06):
just shreks? Oops, all shreks. Think about it? I mean,
I'm I'm thinking about it, and I'm gonna I'm getting
all horny. Yeah, well, well this isn't This will be
an ongoing question for us. It'll be on my mind.
Um Marvin Starr. More like Shrek and Shrek to Festal

(59:28):
means the movies right themselves, truly Shrek to get more
Shreks in there, there were enough Shreks. That's my main
note about Trek to um God Shrek rocks. It's it's staggering,
and and and then we're gonna close on a question

(59:49):
because we always give our guests an opportunity to to plug,
but do we ever plug our personal projects? I think
for the most part, we don't because we're so and
modesty is just overwhelming. So so MJ asked, I follow
you both on social media, so I catch some of this,

(01:00:11):
but please brag. What other projects have you worked on
that we should check out? Slash follow, Kay, would you
like to go first? Sure, Well, here's what I'm going
to do is plug my screenwriting classes, of which I
have a new intro class starting up in February, and
there are spots at the time of this recording spots

(01:00:34):
still available. It is a class that is suitable for
pretty much anyone complete beginners. It's suitable for someone who
has maybe some screenwriting background, but maybe just wants to
be held accountable to develop a new project. You know,
if you have maybe a film background but not a
screenwriting background, you know, it's it's I've designed it so

(01:00:56):
that it's just a good intro that is a pro
bring it for basically anyone who isn't already someone who
has a master's degree in screenwriting. Okay, so, um, I
have spots. It starts in February. I believe it's on Saturdays.

(01:01:16):
It's an online class that I conduct through zoom. If
anyone is interested in that, tweet at me and I'll
send you the registration link. Um. I'll also be oh,
I should update you know what? I will have updated
my website Caitlin Toronto dot com slash classes and the
link will be there as well as just more info

(01:01:36):
about the different screenwriting classes I teach. So check that
out and also follow me on Twitter and Instagram. I
would actually love that because, um, the more followers I have,
the more valid I feel as a human being, because
that's the sad state of society we live in. So

(01:01:58):
so give me a little. Will follow on Twitter and Instagram.
It's at Caitlin Toronte on both platforms. Please and thank you. Jamie,
what about you? What would you like to plug? Um?
You can follow me on Twitter and Instagram if you choose. Uh,
Jamie Loft has help on Twitter, Jamie christ Superstar on Instagram.

(01:02:21):
But I would point you to a few things I've
I've been doing solo podcasts that are investigative for the
last two years now if you haven't listened to them.
I did My Year in Mensa, which is about a
year long sort of investigation and UH piece I did
about how fucked up the mental organization is. Last year

(01:02:45):
I did Lolita podcast, which um we talked about on
We've talked about on this feed as well, but was
kind of a deep dive into Vladimir Nabokov's Lolita and
all of the kind of uh complicated cultural elements that
were pulled into that work over the years. And this
last summer I did UH feminist intersectional analysis of the

(01:03:09):
Kathy comics called act Cast, and I got to talk
to creator Kathy Guys, but I got to talk to
a lot of amazing artists, a lot of and in
all of those shows there are people who are part
of the bectel Cast expanded universe involved. So if you
looked at me and produces them, Caitlin does voices in them.
It's all very fun and uh, I work really hard

(01:03:30):
in them and I'm proud of them. So if you
like stuff like that, go listen to that. I write
for a show called Teenage ruthan Asia that's on Adult
swim that is difficult to stream, but if you can
watch it, it's quite good. It's stars Maria Bamford and
Joe Firestone and it's about three generations of women living

(01:03:52):
in zombie funeral home in Florida. It's very fun. And
I have a book about hot dogs that's coming out
next year, so don't worry about it. Amazing, Jamie, you
are truly a superstar, just like are your friend. Instagram

(01:04:13):
says yes, Uh, that's what I'm trying to say with
JP Price superstari um. Yeah, So listeners check out all
of that and follow us and validate our existence please
and things, and then follow the becktel Cast as well,

(01:04:35):
uh in all the regular places Instagram, Twitter, at becktel Cast.
Once again, when we're plug for the Patreon ak Matreon,
which is where we got all these wonderful questions today.
And thank you again to everyone who's submitted such such wonderful,
thoughtful people we have as matrons, truly, thank you so much.
Our community fucking rocks. Thank you for another awesome year.

(01:04:57):
And and again, like we do this at the beginning
of most years, because we're just kind of like taking stock,
We're we're in the planning phases. We've got an exciting
year planned for you. Lots of returning guests, lots of
new guests, lots of movies that I mean, we've been
going back and you know, there's it's been five years,
and there's some movies that you guys are like, hey,

(01:05:18):
what the funck and it and and look you're not wrong,
and we're gonna be addressing some this year, um and
just you know, bringing in a lot of new filmmakers
and guests. So thank you again for for being with
us and for being a part of our community. Indeed,
and yeah, we'll we'll catch you next week on the feed.
And we've got I think a lot of popular requests

(01:05:41):
coming out in January, so look forward to that, we
sure do. Bye bye,