My Neighbor Totoro with Miles Gray

Jamie, Caitlin, and special guest Miles Gray head into the forest to befriend the local spirits and discuss My Neighbor Totoro.

(This episode contains spoilers)

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
On the bel Cast, the questions asked if movies have
women in them? Are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands?
Do they have individualism? The patriarchy? Zef invest start changing
it with the Bechdel Cast. There you'll be with tot
Row tot Row. It's the toe too row to to

(00:23):
row episode of the Bechdel Cast. Wow that you should
throw in some music there too, just to really really
hit it home. I'll think about it. I've heard this
song a million times and then it's it's this sort
of thing where it's kind of Miyazaki's It's a small
world where you're like, I appreciate where this song is
coming from, but I do want to walk off a

(00:46):
cliff because it's going to be following me around for
the next, you know, six days. I'm having a good
day today, but the rest of the week is going
to be rough. I'm fine with it. I will be
fine with it. I just you know, when you hear
like a little earworm like that and you're like, oh,
this is awesome, but it won't be soon. But it
won't be soon. Yeah. Anyways, Welcome to the Becktel Cast.

(01:09):
My name is Caitlin Darante. My name is Jamie Loftus,
and this is our podcast where we take a look
at your favorite movies using an intersectional feminist lens. Ever
heard of it? Yeah, And we use the Bechdel test
simply as a jumping off point. Most of the time
we forget to pay attention to if the movie passes

(01:30):
the Beck Doeld test or not, or at least I
do this one does? It does so much um and
here done by the Bechtel test, of course, being a
media metric created by queer cartoonists Else and Becktel, sometimes
called the Bechtel Wallace test, in which our version that
we use requires that two characters of a marginalized gender

(01:52):
have names, and they speak to each other, and their
conversation has to be about something other than a man,
ideally for a at least two line exchange of dialogue,
and one that is narratively meaningful or irrelevant. Not a
big deal for for this week, because we've got oh
my gosh, it's it's my neighbor Totoro week. It's it's

(02:15):
a part of our Miyazaki ongoing series. We are going
to be kind of just like checking in with with
Mr Miyazaki over the course of the next several years.
So just a quick disclaimer, please don't yell at us.
If this isn't your favorite of his movies, that's not
our problem. Yeah, we'll get around to the others. I do.

(02:37):
There is sometimes a little bit where you're just like,
oh my god. They're like, why didn't you We were
talking about this on the kikiS episode. They're like, why
not Princess Mononoka. I'm like, this isn't a personal vendetta
against Princess Mononoke. She will be, But what if there was?
What if Caitlin and Princess Mononoke word princess narrative? We
quietly don't address it. We'll get around to other Miyazaki movies.

(03:01):
These are the three we chose for this year, and
I think we're we're ending strong, strong movie and a
strong guest who can see clearer than he's ever been
able to see in his life. I mean that mentally
and physically. He watched this movie with such clear vision.
And that guest, of course, is co host of The

(03:23):
Daily I Geist and for Twenty Day Fiance. You know
him from such episodes as The Rock This Christmas, It's
Miles Gres. Thank you so much for having me. I'm
always always honored and touched when you asked me to
be on your very special show. Uh, and I hope to,

(03:46):
you know, I just hope to continue my streak of
good performances and good good dialogue discourse with you both.
Everything's riding on this one. It's funny you just got
so you just got LASIX surgery. I did. I was
realizing as we were introducing you, we make it sound
like we don't let most of our guests watch the
movie with clear vision. Yeah. Yeah, we we added an obstruction.

(04:10):
It's like when you go to a show and you
pay less money because you're sitting in front of a pole,
Like damn, why was that on the ticket? Like? Wow?
One half of the Phantom of the Opera was so
good at the Pantages. That was okay, everything that's on
stage right, So Miles, let's get right into it. What's

(04:31):
your history with my neighbor Totoro And let's just say
the Miyazaki Expanded Studio Jubilie World, Oh man, tot is
like one of my favorites. I don't know if you
guys know this. I'm Japanese, okay, so yeah, I grew
up watching a lot of Miyazaki cartoons and Toto was
like one of those ones that came out when I

(04:52):
was like four or five, So I remember was so
big in Japan, like as it was coming out, and
I remember seeing it on like tape. I remember seeing
it like with my friend's house. It was me and
a few other family friends were watching it. But Mononoke
is like one of my other favorites, so yeah, I
probably would have been like Dooka calling in. But for me, yeah,

(05:15):
total was like a very It's it's so pure and
I just like that about it, and it's so Japanese.
That's another thing I really like about it is a
lot of American people don't always get it when they
watch it or think it's good, you know, because it's
just so different from like what most animation or most
stories are about, like especially you know, Western American cinema

(05:40):
type stuff. But yeah, it's like it's just one of
those things. It's like it's fucking Disney for us in Japan,
all of it, the entire universe. But yeah, for me,
totally like a thing that i've just I don't know,
I've always liked, Like when I was a kid, I
like stuffed animals and the scenes are like the scale
of total little like as a kid, I was like,

(06:01):
that's that's all I want. I just wanted a totoro friend.
I just wanted I want a sentient pillow. Yeah, on
a big pillow that yells at me. And then and
then called the bus was so cool and the cat bus.
I've kind of forgot about the cat bus when the
cat bush? Did you guys when you watched it? Were

(06:23):
you watching it dubbed? Are you watching with subtitles? How
do you? How do you take it in? So? I
watched the English dub they like Disney one from two
thousand five the Fanning Sisters. Yes, but I grew up
watching the original English dub, which I have a little

(06:44):
anecdote about when we get into my history with the movie.
I watched the first half of it in Japanese the
other day and then I needed to take a nap,
and then I just watched the Red not because I
was just tired, but Rice, Okay, it's just tired. And

(07:05):
then I um watched the rest of it in English.
But I do want to go back and watch the
entire thing in Japanese with English subtitles. So I've never
seen the Mizaki not in Japanese, which is so wild.
When I was when you asked me to do it,
I was like, oh, maybe I should, like I only
know it in Japanese, like maybe I should just check
it out. And part of me was like, no, I'm

(07:27):
just gonna watch. But yeah, so I'm always curious how
people take it in Sure, I watched it with the
dub first, and then I watched the original Japanese version second,
and I liked I mean, I liked them both, but
I always, I mean, it's always better to watch a
movie not dubbed, Like even if the dub is pretty good,

(07:48):
which I thought the fanic Sister dub is like it's fine,
it's it's cute, but it's always wait, oh that's what
you meant that Wait what it's Dakota and Dakota and
l inning when they were like like eleven and seven.
So this is my other thing with my personal issue
in me zacky stuff. I have no idea what's happening

(08:09):
with it in the US, like I don't whenever I
hear about it, it's because I'm hearing about it through
my cultural pulse in Japan versus like, how it's happening here?
So I have not had no fing idea that Ellen
Dakota Fanning, We're okay, good now, now I might have
to hear it. It was I thought l Fanning especially
did a really really good jobs as May. She was

(08:29):
really cute. Um and the Ursula the Sea Witch does Granny, Pat,
Carrol and Carol. So oh shit, Okay, it's a fun
dub cast. Yeah, it's it's reverberating with my American brain now,
I'm like, okay, I know those voices and those are iconic.
That's good casting right there. It's fun cast. Yeah. And
then the only other and then we don't mean it's

(08:51):
it's just a very Disney casting. But they did cast
Um Scooby Doo as Totoro and the cat Bus, Frank Welker,
Frank Welker, icon legend king Scooby himself. Um, Jamie, what
is your history in relationship with Totru? Uh? Not very extensive.

(09:12):
I think that I saw this movie maybe once or
twice as a kid. As I was watching it back,
I'm like, no, I don't. I've definitely seen this before. Um,
I guess I would have been seeing I don't know,
it could have been either of the dubs, because that
there was a dub done in three and then again
in two thousand and five. I don't really remember. I
remember really liking it, but I was just such a

(09:35):
kikiS delivery service stand that if we were going to
watch a Miyazaki movie, Kiki was always going to be
my choice. But it was really really fun to watch.
I've never I don't think I had seen it as
an adult, and it was fun to go back and
watch as an adult. It's just like the sweetest, most perfect,

(09:56):
thoughtful movie. I don't know, I just really love it.
It's beautiful, it is. It feels it truly. It just
feels like, uh, I don't know, a blanket. It feels
like a Totoro is hugging you. It does. It does.
It's so well because it's like, oh, I sort of
associate sometimes. I've like, every time I see Totoro, I'm like,
what is there a sale at Hot Topic because Miyazaki

(10:18):
stuff is so popular there. Like I think of Totoro
as being in the window of Hot Topic when I
walked by at the Glendale Galleria. But he's so much
more well It's funny because like it was just a
when it first came out, like they were not really
interested in marketing it at all in the US because
there's so much that people like they're bathing together like wet,

(10:41):
like that was a huge thing that a lot of
the studios I think want to take it out, like
in the American versions of it, but like as a
character like in Japan, like to total is like visually
so like iconic that it's funny that here it's sort
of distilled into like only fandoms of people who are
like really an animal and stuff that. Yeah, like it's
more of a topic when it should be. I mean

(11:02):
it should be. It should be coming down the Macy's
Thanksgiving Day parade. I mean, I mean it probably has
has he I feel like he should. I was like,
I hope, so wait, I gotta look into this. Did
you know that as far as licensed merchandise sales, this
movie has made one point one billion US dollars in

(11:26):
revenue from licensed merchandise. Not surprise at all. That's like globally,
I think, Yeah, So honestly, I wouldn't have been surprised
if it were even higher, because I feel like most
people who even if you haven't seen this movie, you
know who what he looks like. Yeah, but it's it
is great because it's like the sort of iconography where

(11:49):
the story also like lives up to it, where the
story is so beautiful. And we were talking about this
with kikiS too, but like this era of Miyazaki movies
are like fantastic, but also it's very very grounded where
it's like, oh, yeah, this is a story about kids
trying to adjust to a new home and having a

(12:10):
sick parent, Like that's just like dealing with really really
heavy stuff. And then also and cat Bus and it's
not like, oh my god, the nuclear power plant is
coming to tear down to Toto's home and we have
to save it, which is like what I think most
kids story like we're used to, is like what's the

(12:33):
gigantic fucking behemoth conflict and like who's the bad guy
and who's the good guy? And I think that wasn't
I remember as a kid, Like I've seen it with
like an American friend of mine, and they just they
did They're like this is dumb, Like I mean it is.

(12:53):
There's so he gave them the umbrella and he didn't
even know what to say. It just drew all ruism.
You wouldn't fucking know about that because this country's fun, right,
there's selective values. It's like it's a character driven story
in the way that most children's media or like family

(13:13):
media is not very character driven. There's always especially for
like American media, like intended for like children and family audiences,
it's always like some yeah, some big comment, like you know,
you're like fern Gully, they're tearing down the rainforest kind
of thing of friend Gully though, same, you know, the
stories like that are perfectly valid as well. But I

(13:35):
do love that of the Miyazaki movies I've seen, they're
all just like kind of quiet character studies that also
have really cool fantasy elements and uh mythology incorporated in
the narratives and beautiful imagery of course, but they're just like,
and what if we just kind of examine the lives

(13:56):
of these two sisters for ninety minutes and it's wonderful.
What's your history with this movie? Yes? Um, I watched
this movie every time I went to visit my grandmother,
and it is the only fond memory I have of
spending any time with my grandmother, who was a terrible person. Um,

(14:20):
but it's fine because I have Totoro because thank you, okay,
swop it out, um. But she had it on VHS.
So that was just like the activity there was to
do at my grandma's house. And why did she have
total I'm not sure. That's like just so I guess
those things are really interesting to me because I feel
like most grandparents, like American grandparents, have like the soft

(14:42):
box Disney VHS tapes at their house, you know, like
get real dirty and stinky. Yeah, exactly, sticky and just
covered in nonsense, whereas like your grandma's like I'm cultured, man,
you want some you want some Miyazaki ship, which is
hilarious because my grandma was also otherwise completely uncultured. Um

(15:03):
and like a Fox movie scary person. I'm here to
get my grandma's on this episode. But so anyway, uh,
that was like my favorite movie that she had on
VHS at her place, because she did have a couple
other you know, I think, like Disney movies and stuff
like that. But I was like, I we didn't have

(15:25):
Toto at home, so I was like, this is my
chance to watch it, and I just fell in love
with it, especially because the dynamic between the two sisters
was very similar to the dynamic I had with my sister.
I I'm like the older sister. I'm three years older
than my sister Sarah, and it was like a very
similar like she looked up to me the way that
May looks up to Sotsky. I had to like look

(15:47):
out for my younger sister the way that Satsky has
to look out for May. A lot of the time.
I also lived in a very rural area and was
always just like trapesing around the woods and stuff like that.
I so desperately wanted to go into the woods and
find a Totoro friend and be best friends, and like

(16:09):
this was a fantasy I had as a kid. I
wanted so badly to ride around on a cat bus.
Like this movie connected with me in a very major
way as a kid, and then I kind of fell
off of it as I got into my teen years
and stuff. But I've rediscovered it as an adult a
couple years ago, and I was like, all right, this

(16:30):
is like the best movie ever made. I love it
so much. Um, I do have a little Totoro enamel
pin that I will and I'm also thinking about getting
a Totoro tattoo. We'll see. Oh yeah, you kind of
tattoo bene this year. I'm cool. Now you get a

(16:52):
bunch of tattoos. What are the tattoos you get? I
got a Titanic one. Oh dope. I got a quote
from Paddington too. If we are kind of polite, the
world will be right. And I got the mad Max
Fury Road or rig within the past year, dude, And
then you need the Neco bus coming at the mad
Max Fury Road just straight up head on collision. Whatever.

(17:13):
I don't know. Look, I'm not here to you know
that it's your man and your tattoo artists, you know,
between your tattoo artists. I'm making the appointment right now.
I'm sure there's got to be like a Nyazaki like
specialist tattoo, right, because I know there's like Sip like
that for Disney tattoo. Right. Yeah, I'm sure I'm sure
there is. Okay, should I do the recap of my

(17:37):
neighbor totor? Please? Do? Let's do it, Okay. We meet
Satsky and her younger sister May. They are traveling with
their dad, Mr. Kusakabe to their new house in the
countryside of Japan. I think the year is like nineteen five.
I read it's postwar in rural Japan. On the way,

(18:01):
they run into some neighbors, including a young neighbor boy
who we will learn his name is Conta. They all
arrive at their new house and start exploring outside. They
notice a huge tree in the nearby forest. Their dad
tells the girls it's a camphor tree. Inside the house,
they find a bunch of acorns, and they also see

(18:24):
a bunch of little black dust bunnies or like dust
gremlins that seem alive and sentient, and they scatter when
you turn on the lights. They're similar to Spirited Away. Yes, yeah,
the footballs in Spirited Away exactly. Satski in May search
for more of these little dust spirits. Their neighbor granny

(18:47):
comes by and she's like, oh, yeah, those are soot spreaders,
and she mentions that their house is possibly haunted, but
that that's not like a bad or scary thing. Everyone's
excited about them living in a haunted house. We see
Stotsky May and their dad cleaning the house and settling in,

(19:07):
and then one night we see the soot spirits float
away into the night sky. The family then heads into
town to visit Satsky and May's mom, who is in
the hospital. She is ill, but she's been feeling better
and will hopefully be able to come home soon. Then

(19:28):
Satsky goes off to school and May stays home because
she's not old enough for school yet, so she's just
kind of occupying herself around the house. She finds a
trail of acorns, which she follows that leads her to
this little spirit, This little white, fluffy thing with kind
of pointy bunny like ears, just a little friend, just

(19:51):
a little friend, is translucent. It's bobbing around, and May
starts following it, but loses it for a moment, But
then she sees it again, and a bigger spirit bobbing around.
This one's blue and white, and it's carrying a bag
of acorns, and May follows them both into the woods
and into the depths of this giant camphor tree that
they saw, where she meets Totoro, who is the maximum

(20:17):
of Totara, the biggest Toto, biggest you've seen thus far. Yes,
the chars are of Yes, he's big and furry, He's
so cute. I would die for Toto and I would
kill for Totoro. Holy shit, every time Totoro is, he

(20:37):
does a lot of like ah, like he yells a lot,
and every time I see to yelling, I think it's
very like sweet. The kids are like not afraid of that.
If I was a kid, I would be crying, uh,
giant teeth, big old I was like, okay, if if

(20:58):
may slip even a little. But but I was always
like almost have like pretty good breath. I'm always thinking
about like what does this breath smell like? Because that
because even if you're not afraid of the big old teeth,
you would think that the breath might not be good.
He was sleeping, but maybe what breath smell like? He's fresh.

(21:21):
Those are like these weird story tropes that are like
reinforced that we like expect right Like as kids were like, oh,
the thing, the giant thing is showing its teeth and
in my you know history of looking at stuff as
it kid like, that means danger. Usually if a big
thing shows you its teeth, and I was like, and
the kid is not afraid, okay, weird oh And then
the other thing would be like pu is like the

(21:43):
next thing like like these sort of storytelling habits that
were used to like and that wasn't there. And I'm like,
so this big fucker was like had pleasant breath and
the teeth were I mean, teeth were beautiful, they were
immaculates and hygiene. Yeah, well it's because we've seen like Shrek. Okay,

(22:04):
and Shrek keeps coming up these last couple of weeks.
Shrek keeps coming up. But there's that scene in Shrek
where like he's baring his teeth and he's scaring off
like the villagers and you see like all this goo
come out of his mouth and everyone's like Shrek. And
then later Donkey he's like you need a mint and
stuff like that. So wild, but this is nothing like Shrek.

(22:24):
Toto is fresh. It goes against everything total. It blows
up everything we thought about big creatures exactly, true, pleasant, smelling,
docile as hell. It's true. And then May it's just like,
all right, I think I'm gonna take a nap. She
becomes best friends with Totoro and the other little Totoro's.
Toto's just kind of like napping and chilling, and yeah,

(22:44):
he wakes up and he yells a little bit but
she's like, I love that for you and we are
best friends. She's like, oh that's your name. Cool, good night,
all right. And then later that day, Satsky comes home
from school and finds my eeping in the middle of
the woods and she wakes up and she's like, where's Totoro.

(23:04):
He was right here and he's my best friend. And
Stotski and their dad are like, we believe you, and
also we should go give the foest spirits a proper greeting.
So they go into the woods and pay their respects
to the Camphor tree. But the opening that May had
kind of tumbled into where she found Toto is now closed. Um,

(23:27):
and their dad is like, oh, it's probably because the
fourest Spirits don't want to be seen right now. And
then Stotsky is all bombed out because she wants to
see Totoro and friends too. Then Stotsky goes to school
ps that neighbor boy Kanta is there in class with
her and he has a big crush on Stsky. And

(23:50):
then May shows up to the schoolhouse. I love this part,
it's so sweet. So Granny is babysitting May because their
dad is I think in Tokyo teaching at a university,
and May wants to be with Stotsky, so she stays
at school with Stotsky until the end of the day,

(24:10):
and then on the walk home from school, it starts
raining heavily. Kanto walks by gives them his umbrella because
again he loves Stotsky. It's very cute. And then Satsky
and May return home and notice that their dad left
his umbrella, so they head out to meet him at
the bus stop. Um they returned Kanta's umbrella on the way,

(24:31):
and at the bus stop they wait. They wait, their
dad's bus isn't coming, but then who does show up
but Totoro. May has fallen asleep, but Stotsky has a
fun interaction with him. He gives them this little pouch
of acorns, and then a cat bus shows up. Totro
gets on the bus that is also a cat and

(24:54):
it runs off just takes a different line than them exactly.
Satsky in May return home. They plant the acorns in
their mom's garden, but nothing grows until one night when
Toto shows up with his little totos and they all
raise their arms and their umbrellas and their leaves up
in the sky and then the seeds start to sprout

(25:16):
and another huge camphor tree grows. It's so that scene
is beautiful, just beautiful, so beautiful, and sounds so beautiful,
and the music in this movie is incredible. Um. And
then Toto gets on this flying top and he and
Sot sky in May and the little Toto's fly around
and play instruments, and the next morning the tree is

(25:41):
not there, but the little seedlings have started to sprout.
I just love how whimsical the description is. And I'm like, yeah,
I love this, Like and they take a magical top
to the highest tree and they play their instruments under
the moonlight, you know, And I'm like, oh man, that
was great, awesome. Everything in this like the I don't know,

(26:03):
like there's there's plenty of moments where in this movie
where things are urgent, but like how urgency is conveyed
in Miyazaki movies is just different. And even with like
little things where how granny Granny brings made a school
because she's like, yeah, I don't know, she just like
I just wanted to come to school, sorry, And I

(26:23):
was like, oh, yeah, I guess why not. And then
the teacher is just like very sweet about it. It's like, yeah,
come in and like it just these things that again
I think myles are totally right of just like these
story conventions, you don't even realize that, like you expect
of something being a big conflict and then it's like, no,
let's just deal with it. Our instinct is like, oh no,

(26:44):
like you can't have your sister at school, right, And
then like it's completely inverted and the teachers like their
mother is really sick, you know, and it's a terrible situation.
Please everyone be really kind to them. Okay, yeah, and
everyone and all the kids are like, yep, than they
are right. I feel like in most Western movies that

(27:07):
would have there would have been like some kid with
frosted tips that was like your mom is what her
head right? Right? What the fuck? Like it's like, no,
most kids are pretty sweet. That's very thoughtful. And then
they get a telegram from the hospital their mom was

(27:29):
supposed to come home that weekend, but she's not feeling
well so she can't come home anymore, which really upsets
May and Stsky. Satsky kind of takes out her upset
on May and calls her a baby and tells her
to grow up. And then May sets off without Stotsky knowing,
presumably to go to the hospital to take their mom

(27:51):
and ear of corn to make her feel better, which
is so sweet. And then when Satsky realizes that May
is gone, and like law us, she starts frantically running
around trying to find her. The whole village is looking
for her. Everyone's worried that May might have died. And
then Stotsky goes to Toto's tree and asks if he

(28:14):
can help her find May, and Toto is like, of course,
I'll except without using words, but he is more than
happy to help. Yeah. He Toto summons his cat bus
friend and Stotsky gets inside cat bus and cat bus
is like, next stop May, and then they race across

(28:37):
the countryside until they reach May. She and Stotsky reunite.
It's really nice, and then cat bus takes them to
the hospital where they kind of watch their mom through
the window and she's doing fine. And then Stotsky and
May ride back home in cat bus and there's like

(28:58):
a few kind of like credit images, is of like
their mom returning home and them all spending time together
and Toto is doing stuff in the woods, Granny's relieved.
Everyone is happy that made save yes, and it's beautiful
and that's the story. So let's take a quick break

(29:18):
and we will come right back to discuss and we're back.
Uh man, It's but Carolin and I were texting before
we started recording. We're like every I liked everything there

(29:39):
starting with I mean the and this is something not
because this is our third episode in Miyazaki movies, you know,
we again we have girls centered in the story, and
specifically in this one. I think it's kind of like
a bonus because it's like two sisters relating to each other,
and you know, they are in conflict almost constantly because

(30:03):
their siblings, and that is how that works. Um, but
you can also tell like there's this huge genuine love
between them, like there's it's it's just so like, I
don't know, presented matter of fact. It's like effortless how
Miyazaki is able to center kids and kids stories and
then relating to each other and also like prioritizing girls,

(30:25):
which is um in a in a just a very
matter of fact way where this could have easily been
brothers or a brother and a sister. You're kind of
any combination of siblings and yeah, totally, I think it's great,
perfect no notes. Um, yeah, and especially the relationship between
the sisters, it felt again so authentic. It felt very

(30:47):
reflective of like the relationship dynamic between me and my
younger sister, although I was far less patient and supportive
of my younger sister as a because I was a
little asshole, But um, I love that you see like
a version of a sibling dynamic where the older sister

(31:07):
is very patient and is very supportive and the younger
sister clearly looks up to Stsky. But again, this is
not without conflict, and the conflict that does exist between
them feels very authentic, and everything is just happening very organically,
despite they're also being like forest spirits that they are

(31:29):
always on the lookout for and like hoping to meet
and interact with. And I remember like the part where
they go to pay the respects at the Camphor tree
and the idea of like your younger sister getting to
see something or do something before you the older sibling,
and like when Satsky is all like, oh, but I

(31:51):
want to see Toto too, and I was like, oh,
I know what that feels like. Because anytime, like my
sister got to do something and I didn't, I was like, oh,
what the Yeah. But it's just like it's these little
moments that are captured in the movie and just like
watching the way the characters handle them and just like

(32:13):
showing these just everyday moments that are just like so
familiar and beautiful and cool, things like the corn, like
the like Mom's going to sleep in my bed and
like brush my hair and like just like thive. You know,
it's like there's an order, get in line. Okay, Mom's
brushing my hair first. And plus it's wavy like hers

(32:36):
used to be assholes. Sit down. Yeah, yeah, it's so
great there. Yeah, there is something just the pacing of
very Japanese too, you know, of just going to set
the table set that just like really anchor it wherever
you are. And for me, like you're saying, there are
a lot of familiar things that you saw me spending
so much time as a kid in Japan, like in

(32:56):
the summer too, like where a lot of this is
taking place was really fun to see. And there's so
many of these like little moments that he shows that
are like are really just even from animation or sense memories,
like when they're going up to the attic to to
go up the stairs, like the way may comes down
the stairs like slowly, or they go up them climbing

(33:17):
them is because staircases are so steep in Japan. They're
like fucking ladders basically that like when you're a kid,
like you don't have the fucking balance to be like
confidently walk upstairs. You're gonna like crawl step by step
to get up because you could fall down. Like I
remember falling downstairs as a kid because it was they
were too steep, and like watching you know, the kids

(33:38):
navigate the steps was like a thing that I'm like,
oh shit, like yes, like you know, especially as I
watch it again because it's been at least ten years
since I've seen this after like till we watched it
recently um or then like falling asleep in the summer
like on like the tatami floor just like passed out
because you're hot and your kid and you just fucking
just just knock out because it's hot. And the long

(34:00):
playing of like the cicadas like just sort of you know, singing.
There's are just such like very you know, specific things,
but they're done so like you know, they're very effortless
and it's just like and here we are just showing
you these slices of life, but each single one, like
every I don't know that they're they're really efficient in
what they convey every single time. It's like not a

(34:21):
wasted frame really in that sense, right, Yeah, and yeah,
I love that attention to detail to some like very
specific Japanese things, but that like also feel familiar to
anyone watching the food again there. We talked about this
in kikiS as well, but anytime that there's food prepared
in a Miyazucky movie there, there's just like such attention

(34:45):
to detail and you get hungry. Yeah, you're like, oh
that I could I could hear those vegetables being chopped properly,
like oh like when they trenched down on the cucumbers,
and like I was watching it with you know, my wife,
and when they were putting you know, my wife come

(35:09):
circle circle and she loves cucumbers. But for me, like
seeing there's like a very folkloric image in Japan of
like putting vegetables in a cold stream. Like that's like
a very like it's like even used in marketing They're like,
this is how fresh these vegetables are. Man, They're in
a bamboo basket in this like stream. Like that's like,

(35:31):
you know, like the version of like in America, like
the Heartland type stuff like in Japan, Like this cooling
stream has brought these fresh vegetables out. And she was like,
is that that's that's real? And like I mean if
you live by one, yeah for sure. It's like I
want to river cucumber and I'm like, yeah, we all do,
we all do. But it's so refreshing someday. And the

(35:52):
way even like the granny is like, oh, I think
they're ready, like there what like there's even a perfect
time and that you like I thought we were just
cooling them off in this dream. Okay, granny knows is awesome.
A couple other things about the relationship between the sisters
that again just like felt very grounded and relatable and authentic.

(36:16):
I guess just the idea of like Stsky kind of
having to take on a somewhat like mothering and caregiver
role for both her younger sister May and their dad.
And I feel like that's such a relatable thing for
a family dynamic like that where the mom is absent

(36:37):
for whatever reason, and it's like the the eldest siblings
responsibility to kind of take on a lot of that,
maybe like domestic short stuff and because we see Saltsky,
you know, preparing lunches for everybody and again just always
looking out for may you know, bringing dad the umbrella

(36:57):
he forgot kind of thing. Because we talk about like
female characters doing domestic things in movies, especially in like
American or Western movies, and the way that's often presented
as a way of like, well, of course, because women
do domestic stuff, But in a story like this, the
way it's presented, it's just like, well, of course, like

(37:18):
these things need to be done, and Sotsky is the
one to do them because she It's just like that's
just kind of what makes sense. Although I guess you
could make the argument that like why isn't there Dad
doing more stuff and why does he always seem to
be not knowing where his kids are? But I sort
of thought that, like I do think that some of

(37:38):
that it has to do with like the nineties, where
I like where it kind of like pings for people
of our generation to be like, why are these kids
just wandering around right, but sure all of our parents
were like just allowed to wander around but before the
internet and everyone was like everyone's a murderer right right

(37:58):
right there, like just be back a sunset, which I'm
just like wild that you all made it good for you.
It seems risky, but um, but I thought that they
threaded the needle of the dad sort of having to
operate as a single dad for a period of time,
A think, pretty pretty realistically where it's like he's definitely

(38:19):
not killing it, where it's like and they added in
those moments of like he forgot about lunch and like
he's trying to bat like he's it's single parents, single dad,
stuff that you don't see often on screen anyways. And
also I think that it's like especially I mean I
think you usually see it with single mothers, but like

(38:40):
the single parent portrayed as like a superhero too, when
it's like no, it's like fucking hard and you know
things are going to be dropped and that's not fair
to either of the children, certain and like certainly not Satzky,
who has to kind of pick up the slack. But
I did, I mean, you do see the dad trying
he's doing laundry with them. He's cooking some of the

(39:03):
time and then like kind of phoning it in other times.
It just felt like a thoughtful portrayal. And also it's like,
of course he wouldn't have been used to doing everything,
because we know that it's a relatively new situation that
their mother isn't well, it's like he's getting used to
in patriarchy out there, gender roles even now, like in Japan,

(39:25):
I mean it's it's it's not you know it, those
those roles are pretty defined, so like in that way, like, yeah,
I'm sure their dad was a little bit like oh
boy cooking, whereas like I feel like the modern version
now would be like I'm just gonna go to the
convenience store where I can get everything pre made and
like and like when you see like modern sort of

(39:47):
like Japanese dramas of like bumbling dad kind of thing,
it's like everything's bought at the store like that. It
just has to be microwaved, is the person now, because
men don't got no cooking skills. But their dad's also
like so sweet and wonderful with them, and there's trying
he's trying. A scene that really struck me was the

(40:11):
scene where where May has just befriended the Totoro's but
then like falls asleep, and when she wakes up, she's
kind of closer to the house and the totoroes are gone,
and she's like, I swear I saw them. They were
right here, and I'm not lying. This is not a lie,
and both Saski and her dad are like, we believe you,

(40:32):
and in fact, probably the reason they're not here anymore
is that they don't want to be seen, but let's
go pay our respects. And then they go to the
camphor tree and to the shrine and they say thank
you for looking after May. And again we are so
conditioned by American media, where if this happened in a

(40:53):
Western story, it would be like, no, I swear I
saw Totoro and the elder sister and the parents would
be like, yeah, right, you silly little kid, you fool.
Those things aren't real and we don't believe you, and
it would take so long into the story, right, and
then she cos out. She's like, Totals my boyfriend, now,

(41:17):
Total just got out of jail for stealing catalytic converters,
and he got a tear drop tattoo because he had
to shank a snitch Like what yeah, and I'm hooked
on jewel pods Dad, whatnot? So it's like euphoria at
euphoria high. Uh. I mean, and that goes back to

(41:38):
the very beginning when both of the kids are like
we live in a haunted house and Dad is like
awesome dream right. Yeah, it's like this parental like jiu
jitsu where it's like the children's energy like I or
like aikido, like I'm gonna just redirect it right back
at you in a positive way because I think again,
it's almost like as a Western and writer, there's no

(42:01):
way you'd write a scene where a little kid sees
a mythical creature, tries to tell the adults and then
they're like, oh wow, cool, right, that's great. It's normally
like that's like this like habitual storytelling thing we're used to.
It's like, well, this is what happens when you tell
the adults about the mythical thing. They don't fucking believe you,

(42:21):
and in fact, they're going to tell you they're gonna
ridicule you, yeah and gaslight you and be like that's
not what you saw or you know whatever, Yeah, which
is so interesting to see like over and over there
these moments. I'm sure if you're watching, like only watching
like Western cartoons or storytelling, like you see this like
what the fund was supporting as dad and teacher and classmates.

(42:41):
It's so refreshing. It's it's really nice, so nice. And
then I wanted to jump back to part of what
especially worked for me about like the even though Sotsky
has to take on some kind of like caregiver slash
domestic chores, you know, picking up that black that worked
for me, especially because she's still allowed to be a

(43:05):
kid and so many of the scenes and like the
story doesn't make her into this like that you know,
precocious child thing where she's wise beyond her years and
she's abandoned any semblance of being a kid because she's
still like wants to see the spirits and she gets

(43:26):
to see them, and she's young enough that she's able
to because it's implied that like adults can't see the
totoros or the cat bus or anything like that, they
just like perceive it as a gust of wind when
the cat bus is running by. But she's young enough
to be able to see and you're like, oh, is
that what Polar Express stole it from? Is it Polar
Express stealing cat bus starting a beef? But yeah, she's

(43:50):
like she she has this you know, like childlike curiosity
and imagination and all these you know, childlike qualities that
are appropriate for her age. And even like her parents
comment on, like, yeah, she does act super grown up,
but like, you know, she's still just a kid. And um,

(44:11):
we see that scene where they learn about her their
mom not being able to leave the hospital, and they're
both really upset by it, but like May responds in
a way that's that tracks for a much younger like
a four year old, where she like cries and you
know doesn't really know how to comprehend this because she
had this idea, Oh, Mom's coming home and I'm going

(44:32):
to get to see her, where Satsky has a clearer
understanding of what must be going on, but she's still
upset by it, and she ends up kind of like catastrophizing.
She's like, well, what if Mom's already dead and and
I'm gonna yell at my younger sister and call her
baby and tell her to grow up. And it's just
like again a very like appropriate reaction for whatever, like

(44:53):
a nine or ten year old however however old Satsky
is supposed to be. But like, I don't know, I
just love that, like she was able to like still
be a kid and like her her choices and actions
and behaviors still attract for the kid that she is.
So yeah, I just loved it. Yeah. I mean it's
like in watching her finally reached that breaking point. And

(45:15):
like the Another aspect of this movie that I really
love is the like community aspect where it seems like
class wise, I was like, oh, this is interesting. I
should have done more research on the exact moment that
this is depicting. UM, But you know, they're kind of
like a I guess like middle class to some extent family.

(45:36):
They've moving into a countryside sort of lower income area.
The only way that attention is really called to it
is that on um, like harvest days, some of the
kids who go to the school have to work, so
there's no school and Um Satsky doesn't do that. She's

(45:57):
she's like new here and doesn't participate in that area
of it. But that's how they end up meeting Granny,
who immediately just like becomes this extension of their family
in a way that's like and I really loved that
when Satsky does reach her breaking point, that like it's
Granny who's there for her and like hugs her and

(46:21):
it's like, don't worry, I'll stay and it just what
an angel. I loved Granny and I just love in
general how their community is there to support the girls
kind of like no questions asked, um. Where again it's
like in in Western media, I feel like you would
get more slammed doors, um, and that just doesn't happen. Oh,

(46:43):
your sister's missing chasing a totoro. Yeah, alright, shut, that's
what it is, Hi, I need help, fuck you kind
of the dynamic we're conditioned to I need help fuck you. Yeah.
Now it's like I need help. Let me strip down
to my very traditional Japanese underwear and get the bamboo

(47:07):
pulls out because we found the sandal by the pond. Yeah,
it's so And I guess that's what's so interesting too,
is like I grew up. It's it's interesting to have
these dualities, like even in my mind, I grew up
very much thinking like a like graized Japanese, where like
neighbors look after you. You You you help each other. Like
it's very community oriented. It's always about putting the the

(47:28):
group before yourself first. Obviously too detrimental levels at times societally,
but like on the other side, which Americans so much
like you know, got to take care of yourself. You know,
you gotta figure it out, you know, we figure stuff
out here, yourself up by your bootstraps and yeah, and
like not to say that there's no sense of community,
but the way our stories are told, it's usually about

(47:48):
an individual triumphing despite everything. That's not always like look
at these people come together and think this is how
life is for us, Like it's always like no, man,
despite all the fuck use, they figured it out. And
that just shows you how strong you gotta because everyone's
gonna say fuck you, like on your way there. And

(48:08):
in the US sometimes that's very true. Right, And then
in this story it's about like a community rallying together
and like everyone's looking for May and the third act
of this movie and then you have Totoro is an
extension of that community to the spiritual community like also

(48:29):
shows up for them and this like no questions asked
kind of way fucking mutual aid group. You know what
I mean. It's like, let me hit up the neco
bus fucking faction real quick. They're really good at finding
lost people. Great group of activists. They'll be here and
don't worry about it. We protect us, okay, Stsky, we

(48:51):
protect us. That's how this works. And tot was part
of the community because everyone respects there's no fear the
spirits and the Totoro was in the capital, like everyone's
just like, yeah, it's awesome that this house is haunted,
and yes we have to go pay our respects to
the spirits who look out for us. And there's even
like a line to that's like, again, if you were
this was like a Pixar film, right, if the little

(49:14):
like there would have been a boy or a child
who cried wolf moment, if someone got lost in the
community got together and even bother to look they're like,
it's not even her sandal, What the hell I could
have blah blah blah, And there would have been a
lot of grum Yeah exactly like the next time you
needed help. That would have been a barrier to that

(49:34):
character to have been like, well, I can't ask because
the last time because there is in the Japanese version.
There might be in the subtitled or dubbed version where
they're saying like, it's okay, you know, that's just what
we gotta do, like it could have been anybody, and
like that was like the sentiment that the groups like, yeah,
there was some frustration, but at the end of it,
they're like, no, it's all right, like whatever, like this

(49:56):
is what we get, is what it is. There is
that part where someone's like when it and out to
not be maze sandal in the pond, Someone's like, it's okay,
Granny just caught carried away again. It's like that made
me sad. They're like that, They're like treating this older woman,
this hysterical old woman, like that she's still missing, like
what do you where what? They're like, oh my god,

(50:19):
Like she was right to be concerned. All right, did
you call cat bus? Okay? Then why are we You
didn't call cat bus? That's the first call you make,
your first call, you make a missing kid, You called
cat bus fucking time. Oh my god. Alright, I love Granny.
Granny fucking rules and I feel like Granny and Totto

(50:42):
are like the two strongest allies of the girls in
their neighborhood, but everyone's their ally and then like it.
It is like such Anta Conta. I love that. Okay,
let's let's let's switch to Conta world, because I thought
that that was yet another thing that in a you know,
he has a crush on Stsky. It's really sweet, but

(51:05):
it doesn't like it just kind of is like there
doesn't need to be in a way that felt like
really age appropriate for those characters that would be whatever,
like fifth or sixth grade aged where it's like, I
have a crush, I'm just gonna act weird and be
helpful and like, and Satsky also clearly doesn't know what

(51:25):
to do with it, and it's just like, Okay, it's
going to be a very sweet friendship. Like I just
I loved it. Yeah, I like to that. Like the
male character in this Is in the beginning just reduced
to grunting and groaning, like this motherucker didn't even have lines.
He's like for Granny from mom, Like, okay, bro, it's

(51:48):
just like the silent baker husband in kikiS Delivery Service.
We're at the end, You're like, oh he can talk, wow,
okay ye, like and great, I love that because he
doesn't need to do much more than that, Like we
get it just from his very efficient groaning and you know,
one word, simple sentences. Yeah, and she's like, thank you,

(52:13):
thank you, You're so good. That reminds me so much
of like, yeah, my like best friend growing up, where
we were just like had crushes at each other, but
we were also just like never mind, and then we
would just be like, oh, it's your litter, like shake
hands or whatever. Yep, let's take another quick break and

(52:38):
then we'll come back for more discussion and we are back. Um,
shall we talk about another way that this movie kind
of inverts Western tropes that that I am conditioned to expect,
which is how the mom has treated in this movie.

(53:02):
I thought, again, just like a very thoughtful and interesting
way of having because we most movies that you know,
if you grew up watching Disney Renaissance movies, you're used
to a mother's absence, but in a way that is
barely acknowledged, and it's almost like she was just like whoop,
Like her absence is I don't know, like that's like

(53:26):
the trophiest thing in the world. We've we've talked about
it to death on this show. In this movie, you
do have a mother who is mostly absent. They don't
they do not kill her off, um, but she is sick.
And but what you're bracing for I think as a
Western story watchers like when's a mom gonna die? Because

(53:48):
you know, that's how the characters become interesting or I
was always like, I think ever since Bambi, I'm like,
the mom's gonna die, Mom's gonna die. Being a mother
is a huge liabilita in children's media. It's just like
you can't you're you're fucked. But but in this I
I love how it's handled where I think that like

(54:11):
story wise, what their mom's absence brings out is the
fact that their dad isn't quite ready to be a
single parent, doesn't really know what he's doing, but it's
like trying his best in a way that like subverts
I think usually in the Western trump you see the
dad doubled down on having to be a single parent
by being really mean and really aggressive and very like

(54:34):
I'm gonna destroy your grotto full of forks or whatever
the fuck. Um. And this not only is the mom alive,
but her relationship to her children is like I thought,
really well developed and like I really loved her, and
then at the end they're like she's gonna get better,
and you're like, oh, she gets to live lives. Yeah,

(54:58):
it's weird that that fields like such. Ah, not even
necessarily like a deliberate subversion of because like you know,
like Miyazaki is Japanese, He's telling stories from his Eastern perspective.
I don't think he's like looking at American media and
like I have to consciously subvert this. He's just like

(55:19):
telling stories from his culture and point of view. It's
just better storytelling, right, Yeah, but it just like feels
from a Western point of view, like, Wow, you can
have stories without all this contrived conflict and it still
works as a compelling narrative. And that's what watching all
these Miyazaki movies, that's like been my experience covering them

(55:42):
and watching them. It's just like, oh, you can have
a compelling slice of life story about girls and their
relatable struggles and their adventures that also often incorporates elements
of fantasy, much of which is rooted in East Asian
and Jack needs mythology, Like there's a lot of Shinto

(56:02):
symbology in my neighbor Totoro, which I don't know an
awful lot about, but based on some research I was doing,
you know, that's a big part of Totoro, and you
know the narrative that plays out. Uh. But yeah, like
we've talked about on other Miyazaki movie episodes we've done recently,
it's just so refreshing to watch these stories that are

(56:26):
both culturally specific and universally relatable because they are about
girls experiencing life and they're learning and growing and making
mistakes and discovering their strengths and navigating the world around
them and forming bonds and making friends and having sisters

(56:48):
and having families and all the stuff that everybody experiences.
And I like that you get a little moment of
the parents talking to each other too, just felt like
a rare, nice look into their relationship, and um, their
daughters are watching their parents like love each other and
watching their I mean, I just feel like for children

(57:11):
of divorce, you're like, well, great for the sure, yeah, yeah,
that totally happens all the time at my house too.
But it was just so sweet to like have that
moment of their kids see that mom is doing better
and that they're getting along and it's just like it's
such a gentle conclusion to the movie. I really loved it. Yeah,

(57:35):
And I think it's like, you know, the for when
like Miyazaki grew up like he's he was born like
in so like you know, in a way, this kind
of reflects his own childhood, I'm sure, because they talk
about how his own mom like really informed a lot
of the characters because his mom had like long term
illness and was in the hospital and then came home.

(57:57):
So like I think there there's like some biographic goal
sort of energy to that portrayal. But yeah, there there's
I think and that I think just in like growing up.
You know, my mom was born in seven. Like growing
up like right after World War two in Japan was
like you know, it's like it was on an upward
trajectory because you're basically rebuilding the country after the war.

(58:18):
But I think on some level you wanted like nice
stories or there's something about you know, this yearning media, Yeah,
like for a pleasant ending two things, especially through a
child's lens when you're probably looking a lot of adults
who have a ton of you know, been through a
ton of ship just from everything that's happened like in
the country. But yeah, like I think all of those

(58:41):
they're so realistic, even though like for me, like you know,
my parents marriage wasn't the most pleasant thing, but like
you kind of see those moments you're like, yeah, no,
that's that does feel real, even though I may not
have seen it, but that feels like real and is nice.
Other people have experienced that, I'm sure, Yeah, I mean
many other people. I'm like that, Wow, fantastic giving me

(59:03):
the imagination for something, well do you give them? Um?
Does anyone have any other thoughts about the movie? Uh? No,
I just I just think that this is like a
really beautiful, thoughtful, sweet movie that I don't know, like
just everything that is great about this movie is I
feel like it has everything to do with it being

(59:25):
so effortless and like just letting What I've loved about
this chunk of Miyazaki movies that we've covered is that
they're all sort of centered around letting kids be curious
and like taking their curiosity about the world around them seriously,
even though it's like sometimes you know, if you watch

(59:46):
it back as an adult, you're like, oh, I can
see how you know, Like this is like could be
a metaphorical projection of A B and C. But you
all also can watch it as a child or an
adult and be like, this is all real, Like it
just is so cool. I love that he just like
and and that he I guess that um, I was
reading a little bit about his writing process and that

(01:00:07):
may was like pulled from his own nieces sort of
attitude about the world, and just like that. I just
think it's it's great and it's even better to see
young girls curiosity centered in a movie, because that doesn't
happen a lot without it coming with like a really

(01:00:28):
tact on love story, or like their curiosity starts as curiosity,
but then it somehow ends in the suddenly suddenly she's
living with a beast in a castle, even though she
wanted to explore. Boy needs save Boy needs save, right, right,
And that's like the only place that a woman's curiosity
can leave at lead as fixing him, or it leads

(01:00:50):
you to a place that now requires boy need to
save you like what you did getting all curious and
ship right right? Yeah, I feel this like aame way,
you know, it's as a child, it captured me because
it presented no obstacles to me narratively, like in terms
of being like man and you who knows, man, one
day you might fucking find a total just this thing

(01:01:12):
didn't reflect back to me that it's dangerous or not
going to happen, or adults are going to treat me
with contempt for wanting something to happen that might not
be real. And then even as an adult watching it again,
I was like even more touched because I really then
because I saw all of the real nuance that you
miss as a kid. Like as a kid, I was

(01:01:32):
just taking it and it's like this is like a
really fun, frictionless like journey that just feels good and
I can feel all kinds of great emotions. And then
as an adult, I'm like, this is so like this
is just so good to watch, you know, like it's
it's so you're you know, if we like conflict is negative,
this is like just taking in so much like positive energy,

(01:01:53):
even with like the you know, the like the dramatic
elements of it, but it just feels i don't know,
nourishing in this very strange way that I didn't find
watching it, like you know as a kid. Right, it does, Yeah,
it does sort of make you think like, oh wow,
there is Like when you see a truly beautiful piece
of kids media, you're like, damn, I spent all that

(01:02:14):
time watching movies about terribly c g I talking dogs
with be like, hey what I can I mean? Also
an incredible genre, but it doesn't hold a candle. Who's
talking now to the beauty of a movie? Like that's true. Um.

(01:02:36):
The last thing I want to say is cat Bus
facts with Caitlin. How many nipples are we talking? Well,
there's some math involved, Okay, okay, based on those arms. Right,
So if cat Bus has twelve legs, which is three
times the number of legs as a regular cat, and

(01:02:56):
if a regular cat has eight nipples, if you multiply
that by three, cat bus has twenty four nipples. Everything
about that, And that's cat Bus facts with Caitlin. Thank
you for indulging me. Um does this movie pass the
Bechtel test? Oh? Hell yeah? Oh yeah, hell yeah. With

(01:03:20):
growny boy with the barely speaking boy, I like that.
I like that Miyazaki goes the extra mile and actively
removes the voice of at least one male character. Yeah,
you're you're gonna have a hard time contact just doing
the basics and this is real. Man can't even give
an umbrella. Oh you're so sweet. Yeah, yeah, you've got

(01:03:43):
May and Stotzky talked to each other about a bunch
of stuff. May and her mom, Stotzky and her mom.
Satsky and May talked to granny individually, the teacher. I
believe that there's an example. Satzky talks to her new
friend from school. Oh, yes, you love that. They the
movie goes out of the way to give her friend.
We don't really learn anything about the friend aside from

(01:04:06):
her name. Yeah, but you're just like man Stotski, she
can do it all. Yeah. Even then they like it
wasn't the dad even like what you made a fucking friend.
She's like, yeah, I gotta go. I'm out. Yeah, I'm Stotzky.
I'm awesome. Yeah, you be jopping my hairstyle for years
to come. But yeah, lots lots of combinations of characters

(01:04:28):
that passed the Beckel test, and the movie is like
almost constantly passing, especially because I would argue that even
though Toto and friends are I think referred to with
like he him pronounced, they gendered Totoro as male, and
Toto's voice by a male voice actor, a male Scooby

(01:04:51):
and male Scooby do. I would argue that Toto's are genderless.
I think so they're sentient pillows exactly with great breath. Yeah,
you don't need to gender a mutual aid pillow. That's
a genderless entity. Total is the concept of mutual aid
as a sentient pillow, like that's planting community gardens. I mean,

(01:05:13):
this is first fucking legend. And then the point being
when Satsky and May talk about Totoro, they're talking about
a genderless icon. So I think I think it absolutely
passes the bastile test to talk about absolutely And then
that brings us to our nipple scale zero to five

(01:05:34):
nipples based on how the movie fares when examining it
through an intersectional feminist lens, I think this is five nipples.
I cannot think of a reason why it deserves any less.
I think it's a five nipple movie. I love that.

(01:05:55):
And this is a common thread of all the Musaki
movies we've heard so far, that it centers girls in
a way that like just presents them as being very
authentic and just exploring their lives and choices and and
behaviors and actions in a way that tracks so much

(01:06:17):
better than basically every other story I've ever seen that
focuses on girls, which, as we've discussed, is like kind
of surprising considering these movies are made by a man.
But when you know someone like Miyazaki just has a
vested interest in it actually like authentically representing girlhood on screen,

(01:06:40):
like it can happen. It works, he sits, he pulls
it off. I love the characters. I love the relationship
between the sisters. It's five nipples. I want to give
one to Satsky, one to May, one to Granny, one
to the cluster of totoros, and one two their mom.

(01:07:03):
I love it. I'm gonna go five as well. I
totally agree. I think this movie is so like beautifully done,
and I love how it brings in spirituality in a
way that is like very again just like matter of fact,
The way that um Miyazaki is able to bring in
like fantastic and grounded elements is just like a fact

(01:07:25):
of the world is like so it seems so effortless,
but like having seen other movies, like it's really hard
to do. It's so beautiful. Um the only thing that
I would say, so, I'm completely on board with everything
you're saying, Kaitlin. The only thing that really pings for
me is more just like behind the scenes stuff of
like this is a beautifully told story about childhood and

(01:07:49):
at about and I guess about girlhood specifically. Um, so
you would hope to see more women in prominent roles
behind the scenes in a movie like this, true, which uh,
you know, we always try to be mindful of as well. Unfortunately,
in this case, it does appear that all the at
least the top titles. Unless I'm missing something listeners, let

(01:08:10):
me know. I would love to be wrong, but it
seems like it is mostly men, which is a systemic issue.
But also you would think Mizak you would have some
say in uh, his crew, So there is that, But
in terms of like story wise and presentation, I just
think it's like fucking incredible across the board. So five nipples,
and I've giving them all to cap bus Hell. Yeah yeah, Miles,

(01:08:35):
what about you? I mean, I don't know if I
can give five just because we arrived at such a
great number, which is twenty four nipples, and I think
this deserves twenty four nipples for all of the reasons
that were stated, plus the criticisms, which are very valid overall,
I think the other thing too, which is really I

(01:08:55):
really don't didn't even really think about, is I never
thought of this as being about like a gendered story,
that this is like it's about two girls, you know,
like and I was never as a partially like in
real time being he brained boy in the eighties and
nineties could still look at this and be like, yeah,

(01:09:17):
like it had nothing to do like because it wasn't present,
you know why, Because I think it wasn't hitting any
of these like weird notes in my brain which is
spen to go this is supposed to happen, this trope
is present. That means this, The story means this, And
it allowed me to really engage with something that was
just about being curious and innocent and a child. That
plus just all the nostalgia for me, you know, I

(01:09:40):
just uh, yeah, it's fantastic. Um, So I'm gonna split
the twelve nipples twelve to the concept of mutual aid
in the form of to total and then twelve to
nickel bus Well. Yes, so you're giving the movie twenty
four nipples. Okay, I see what's happening. Yes, yes, I'm
just saying if we can take the five and multiply
them by five, what I'm trying to divvy it up

(01:10:03):
so it would at the conversion rate of nipples, this
would be a five nipple film. I'm just using a
different I'm using a crypto or nipto currency, not nipto.
Nipto currency is tanking right now. You've got to be careful.
Oh not no, not mine, Jamie. I told you should
have got in, should have got in early when I
told you I gave my totoro slurp juice. And now

(01:10:26):
there's there's eight hundred of them. Oh yeah, no, no,
I don't funk with the slurp juice straight up Nipto
all nippta. Well, here's what happens. If you give the
smallest toto a slurp juice, you get two more, including
the scooby. So okay, well, okay, I'll think about we'll
offline about it. Well, look, it's an investment, think about it.

(01:10:48):
Nipto coin. Yeah, I mean, look, dude, I mean, if
you want to come to the moon with me, let
me know, because I got I got room on the
spaceship I got room, no pressure, but you're probably gonna on.
I'm not going to be greedy about it any unlimited
slurp juices. Miles, Thanks for coming back, Thank you for
having me. It's always again a pleasure and honor to

(01:11:09):
talk to the Bothy All about film because I don't
I don't know as much, but you ask me on
the ones I can speak relatively well about, so I
appreciate that. Miles, you absolutely crushed. I mean you've covered
three very different genres here. You've done an action movie,
a holiday movie, and a children's movie. Yeah. All Up
by Alley was like the Rock. I'm like, yep, pretty much.

(01:11:31):
You're like his wife of course? Of course, was that
the movie that inspired you to get married yourself? Absolutely?
When I saw how much purpose it gave him to
stand over a gravestone that said his wife, I was like,
that's want that that's missing in my life. I want
what they have. Yeah, that's why I'm not committing active

(01:11:53):
domestic chemical terrorism. Oh God, that movie good. Anyways, Where
can we find you on online? Miles? And where can
we listen to? You? Find me? At Miles of Gray,
At Miles of Gray, wherever there's at symbols also Daily
Zeitgeist every Day and if you like trash reality shows,

(01:12:14):
check out Force with Sophie, Alexandra and I Hell Yes Yeah.
And then you can check out us on Twitter and
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at patreon dot com slash becktel Cast, where you get
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whole back catalog of over one bonuses. It's a it's

(01:12:38):
a darn delight, if I do say so myself. You
can also check out our merch at dot com slash
d Bechtel Cast, and you can follow us online wherever
wherever you find us. I don't think there's anyone impersonating us.
We're kinda we're not We're not on that level. So
don't worry about it. Yeah, don't don't sweat it with

(01:13:00):
I gotta get on this cap us because I gotta
go save my sister