The Post with Lizz Winstead

Publishers Caitlin and Jamie made the very difficult and high-stakes decision to publish this episode about The Post with special guest Lizz Winstead!

(This episode contains spoilers)

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
On the Beck Dol Cast. The questions asked if movies
have women and them, are all their discussions just boyfriends
and husbands, or do they have individualism the patriarchy? Zef
in best start changing it with the Beck del Cast. Hi,
welcome to the back Dol Cast. My name is Jamie
loft Is. My name is Caitlin Dronte. I'm still getting
used to the last name thing. We started out early

(00:22):
episodes we were saying our last names, and then we
dropped and we got really casual, and then I was
I was about to say, I've got I haven't done
this in like, I think four or five episodes. Now
I do have Mix Hard Lemonade with me today. Yes, congratulations,
thank you so much. I do think this was a
cute bit when we were recording most of the episode
that night. However, it's three pm and buying a Mike's

(00:43):
Hard Lemonade three pm is a bad look. People get worried. Yeah,
I panics, and I also grabbed oatmeal raising cookies to
be like no, but I also care about my health. Sure, yeah,
I balanced lunch, Jamie, great job. Yeah. To address the
Mike's Hard Lemonade ongoing storyline, on the back to cast.
They have followed us on Twitter. Have we dem them yet?
We have not? God, I know, I guess we should

(01:06):
do that. Mike's Hard lemon that's a full name, right,
mike Age Lemonade. Yeah. Okay, so that's the state of affairs.
Our guest is horrified with your choices. I'm just waiting
to say something about your choices. You want me to.

(01:26):
So I'm literally sitting only other time I've ever seen
anyone drink Mike's Hard Lemonade is on Dateline Predator. It's
literally the drink of Predator's choice every time. Every time
I used to be assessed with that show, and it
would be like the fake adult would be like, I'll
but don in a minute, and then the creepy predator

(01:47):
would be like, you got some Mark's Hard Lemonade. And
so I kind of feel like the crew of Dateline
Predator love Mike's Hard Lemonade. So the way that they
got it for free was to tell the person posing
as the person and it was going to be predated,
they don't have it was gonna be datelined. Um to
tell that guy that she liked Mike's Hard lemonade. He

(02:08):
gets hauled off to jail. They're like, here's our Mike's
Hard Lemonade. Who we are nailing it? That's super sneaky,
I love. I mean maybe that, maybe it's there's some
sort of people who love Daateline, people who love Mike's Hard.
Because I love day Line and BC. I've been known
to crack a Mike's Hard and enjoy an episode. The
correlation is obvious. Molesters Mikes It's hard, I know. So

(02:35):
it's got all of the ingredients of a Dateline predator episode,
a dude something that's hard, and a non alcoholic beverage
for your underaged team. But then the hard I don't know,
you know what, I just ruined your sponsorship to listen
to the head that would be I would I think
it would be a wild I mean, if Mike's Hard

(02:56):
Lemonade WANs to clean up their image a little bit,
sponsor a feminist podcast, you know, that's how we do
not have an actual sponsorship. No, we've just been harassing
them from years. Also predators probably like you know, chocolate
and and soft pillows too. So it's not like I'm
not trying to like deem this the beverage of of
Roy Moore, Mike's Hard, Lemonade, and a goblet. Alright, anyway,

(03:26):
what's the podcast about? So we are the Bechtel Cast.
We talked about the portrayal of women in movies. We
use the Bechtel test, created by cartoonist Alison Bechtel, as
sort of a yard stick, a jumping off point. The
Bechtel test requires that two women in a movie have names,
they talk to each other, and their conversation has to
be about anything besides a man. Do I do a demo?

(03:47):
I'd love to. Oh, it's going to bring up Mike's Hard.
I can't about that oatmeal cookie. The oatmeal cookie is bad.
We just passed that. Yeah, perfect, Well you've already heard
her voice. But let us actually give up normal introduction
to our wonderful guest today. She is the co creator
of The Daily Show, Ever Heard of It? And she

(04:08):
is the founder of Lady Parts Justice Liz Winston, I
don't think. I was also the producer of Dateline Predator.
It was amazing. Thank you so much for being here.
Thanks for having me. I'm really excited. Yeah, so you
brought us the movie The Post I did. Tell us

(04:30):
why you chose this movie. Well, I um, as you
would maybe uh guess for my CV that you just said.
I'm a big political junkie and a media junkie. And
when I heard there was going to be a movie
about Katherine Graham's sort of taking over the post from
her husband in an era where you know, women weren't
running media anything's and women weren't really even working in

(04:53):
the media that much, and it was just twenty or
twenty five years that women even covered Why Shington, you know,
it was Eleanor Roosevelt who said, when I do press conferences,
I will only talk to women, which forced every single
newspaper to have to hire women reporters because they didn't
have any. And it was genius. And so I figured, yeah,
that was in like, you know, the late thirties, So

(05:14):
that means that this was in two I think. And
so you know, forty years of just having this woman
take over the paper. It was owned by her family,
they gave it to her husband, not her, and then
her husband does it. So and I just love news
and media and all that stuff, and I really love
Watergate and the Knicks administration and all that. So it

(05:35):
was exciting for me to have a story that told
of how the Pentagon Papers came to be and the
injunction with the Times, and how the Washington Post kind
of had to come back. So that's why I picked it,
because I thought it was going to be really great,
and I didn't find it really great. I was so
ready to enjoy this movie. It was because it has

(05:56):
and this will be I think this is like my
main thing with it. It's like it had as all
the ingredients for a great movie, but it's not. It's
extremely mediocre. It's it was really frustrating because it's like
they have this it's an amazing story. They've got the
actor that you would think, but the all star casts,
you've got Steven Spield this one. Yeah. I just saw

(06:17):
it about two hours ago, so Jamie, you had already
seen it, and I only thought today, So it's like
already switching roles. I was ready. I mean, I I love,
or I have loved like journalism movies. I think that
they can be great, very exciting, but this one wasn't. No,
and it's I was reading that they wanted to get
it out this year because of the parallels of journalism

(06:38):
and controversy and government overreach. And all of that, and
it was so thrown out. And I'm a historian and
so I knew who all the players were, but I
can't imagine. And I don't know if you guys are
like news nerds or anything, but like they didn't really
tell me enough about who Daniel Ellsberg was is a

(07:01):
backstory what the Rand Corporation is as a backstory. Um,
the first time you meet Ben Bradley, you don't even know,
you know, the guy named Ben, you don't know like
that he is, you know, running the Washington Post. So
it was all and even Robert McNamara they kept calling
him Mr. Secretary in this opening scene that introduces his
role as the Department of Defense secretary who crafted this

(07:24):
incredible dossier that we now know as the Pentagon Papers
that showed that we knew we were losing the war
and we sent men anyway, and and then our government
covered it up. But like, you don't learn that he's mcnamarital.
And so it's to me, I felt like you need
to give people a context. You know, when All the
President's Men was made, it was made just under two
years after Watergate happened, So everybody had the information and

(07:47):
they knew this is forty five years later cut us
a break on the story. And then when I saw
David Cross is in it and Bob Owner Kerk. The
first time I watched it, I thought that they were
um Woodward and Bernstein. They're not. They're absolutely that, you know.
I was like, I thought they were going to be
Woodward and Burnt. Yeah, why would David Cross and Kirk

(08:10):
not play wood And I was like that's a failing.
I'm yeah, yeah, this was tricky. It was like because
I I am like aware of everything that happened and
and know all the the main you know players, but
it was confusing with the way the movie treats a
lot of the characters like it does. Assume that you're
going to make a lot of connections that there's no
reason that you would unlece you knew everything where yeah,

(08:35):
like that that's the secretary connection took me, I think
until almost halfway in the movie like, oh that's where
they're talking. That makes way more sense. Where like that
sometimes they're using like Mr. So and so, sometimes they're
using their titles, sometimes they're just using their first name,
and there's never any connection. And I'm not surprised to
hear that. There was like a timeliness thing to it
because that that felt like a little like we're being

(08:56):
kind of hit over the head with it too. Where
there were like two scenes I wrote done like Tom
Hanks may as well break the fourth wall and look
to camera and like wink of like hear that. Mr
PRESI like, it's just like it was at getting his
accent a lot, yes, being like I'm sorry, who are
you right now? What accent was he meant to be doing? Hey,

(09:17):
I don't know it sounded but sometimes and other times
I'm just like what is happening? Also, the protest scenes
were so cheeseblly, so it looked like they gave every
extra sharpie and said write something that sounds like it
was back then. I mean there was so many fringe
vests and so many dudes of like long hair singing

(09:37):
like everybody played the guitar. It was like there was
four people in a pod playing guitar and singing a
pizze song and other people have like moltough cocktails. It
was like, is all of the everything that happened happening
at once? It was so there's a lot of like
Uncanny Valley qualities to this movie. I'm just like, what
is it like this? This era had been described to

(09:58):
the set dresser but not actually heard that Meryl Street
just kept sleeping in her own in her own paper,
like she had a notebook, and she every scene of
her was like waking her up from the narcolepsy moments
that she was having. And I keep calling her Mery
from Catherine Graham, the ke I know her as Meryl Street.

(10:23):
Listener's of the pulp fiction episode might recall that, according
to me, her name is Meryl Street anyway. And the
other the other part that I thought was so lame
is whenever they would cut to the Nixon lookalike on
my phone, Like you see him through like a window
of the White House and he's like talking on the phone.
He's like making these insane hand gestures, not a particularly

(10:43):
good impression. No, and just like not shot. Well, Like
I was just like, what is this? I don't know.
So I I've taken history classes, I've learned about the
Vietnam War. I read a whole book about it, and
somehow I don't remember a single thing about it. I
know almost anything about the historical events that were depicted

(11:04):
in this movie. For some reason, American history goes in
one year not the other. I just cannot absorb it
or remember. That's helpful because it's because this movie must
have been truly insane to watch. Yeah, yeah, so yeah,
not not really not knowing any of the major players
of this story, not remembering or knowing much about it
to begin with. I would say I was watching the

(11:26):
movie for about forty five minutes until I even understood
what was happening. Well, it's true, and that's the part
that and for somebody who does understand it, all I
kept doing was getting more frustrated that they weren't filling
other people in what was happening. And for me, like
I got so I'm old as fun. So I when
Watergate was happening, I was around eleven or twelve or

(11:48):
I don't know. I was like, yeah, but I got
like preteen chicken pox one summer, so I couldn't go out,
and I watched the Watergate hearings every day, Like I
was like a crazy looning kid who watched the Watergate
hearings every day, and I was sort of fascinated by it.
So I loved it, and I was kind of like
I don't know what a nerd, So this life changing

(12:09):
chicken pox it was, you know. And so I was
like this eleven year o kid talking about Sam Irvin
and John Dene and like I kind of knew what
was happening, and then I would ask my dad to
kind of fill me in. And then I realized my
dad was like a total right wing kook, and so
um that was problematic. And so I had a whole
bunch of older siblings who were like protesting the war,
and our dinner was always like a ship show of

(12:30):
screaming at each other. So I wanted to see this
part of because we always heard about the New York
Times and then we saw the Presents Man, and I
just wanted to hear this like take on what happens
when a woman takes over a paper. And all I
did was see somebody going, have me check to Bob?
What is Bob? Bob, Bob, are you on the phone?
Where big glasses? That this guy I don't know? And

(12:52):
it was like, what the well, Meryl is meryling out.
It's just like Beryl Street, what was happening? She's like
she's doing like I was. Because I went back and
watched interviews with Katherine Grandma, was like, why did she
make these choices that she made? It didn't make like

(13:12):
she was doing sort of her Julia Child voice, but
like if Julia Child was very tired, Katherine Grandma was
asking God blesses. There's a few different times where she
went ben characters. The was also that was also problems

(13:41):
too many bends. I would argue that in a cast
a pretty amazing cast, almost Noah does a good job,
Like it's it's it's kind of amazing, how how bad
everybody does. Steven Spielberg, I would say, did a pretty
horrendous bang up job totally. It just really bothered me
of like even in the first scene where it's like, okay,

(14:03):
we start with the flashback and then we go to
um the story being put together, and it's all this
it's all like swelling music, cross fading in of headlines,
spoken exposition. It's like, there has to be a more
could this scene be faster? Why is this scene slow?
It's the most important part. It just was driving reenactment.

(14:24):
I'm gonna say a line and you guys are gonna
repeat what the next line is? Okay, I have a
little kid you want some lemonade? What do they like? No?
How much is it? No? No? Is there von? Okay?

(14:45):
I'm disappointed in the both of you. We're not like
taken by the I have a question, was one of
the female lines, does that counts? The child selling lemonade
says yeah, is there vodka? Well it is too woman
talking about so we find out what the kid's name is.
I think we do, right, No, that was like I

(15:07):
feel like there's a lot of female characters in this
movie whose names we do not know. Also, speaking of
it was confusing. You are drinking lemonade with basically vodka
in it. You know, who knows what's indence camp could
be anything, could be anything taking years off my life,
But I'm not sure what was in it exactly. Couldn't
tell you no, no, no. In the theater, I saw
this movie for the first time last week, and so

(15:28):
we've all seen it in theaters, right, yes, okay and
my theater. Every time the Nixon impersonator was on screen
and the movie closes with him too, there was audible laughing.
There was like what the funk is this like when
it closed on him, being like, I forget where Like
the closing line, but he's just like, hopefully nothing else
bad will happen, and then his little cheek noise like whatever,

(15:51):
his jowls are clattering together like symbols, and everyone was
like cackling. And then it was like, oh, the movie
is over. What great They could have literally cast a
great Dane to play Nixon and that's how bad so
and it was shot so lame. It was just like

(16:12):
and like another part where there was audible laughter in
the theater was when they cut to the picture of
Tom Hanks and his wife and the Kennedy's and it
was a really bad photoshop that frame photo. Everyone was like,
what the fuck is this? This is so stupid. Also,
it was for me, I guess you know, this is

(16:34):
like a marginal detailed drue me in saying. But Ben
Bradley was married three times and this was his second wife.
Amazing waste of Sarah Paulson in a roll, and so
it was like his last wife. Sally Quinn also wrote
for The Washington Post, and so if you didn't know
the history, but you maybe knew about her because the
cool thing about Sally Quinn and Ben Bradley is that

(16:57):
they bought the Gray Gardens House from Crazy Little from
the Beals and they redid the whole thing. Oh, I'm
a treasure trove useless bullshit. That's good, thank you. Yeah. Yeah.
So I was like, that's not Sally Quinn. That's got

(17:17):
to be her name was like and Twinette. I think,
I literally think her name is an. She was like
teen you know, that's like going like some doing some
deep cuts. Oh, so I guess we're gonna do the
research and find out her nickname was teen I. And
then she's really only and I mean she appears in

(17:38):
it several times, but usually she's serving food. She's uh,
you know, facilitating whatever. And then she's in that one
near the climax of the movie we want some Sandwiches? Yeah, yeah,
do you want some sandwiches scene, which is all of
her scenes. Uh, and then the scene where she explains
to Tom Hanks actually being a woman hard sometimes and

(17:59):
he goes, oh, never thought about it. Also, her sister
was having an affair with JFK and so Ben Bradley
used to be really good friends with James Jesus Engleton,
who was the head of the CIA then, and they
did a whole giant investigation because the CIA was trying
to do all of this crazy much more interesting story

(18:21):
is this crazy covert operation where the CIA was trying
to manipulate and control what the media was reporting. So
they were really good friends. And then when it was
revealed that his sister in law was having an affair
with JFK, they had like a big breakup around all
of it, Like there's a lot of palace intrigue around
the CIA and Ben Bradley and the Kennedy administration, so

(18:44):
many interesting things that would have made the movie more fun. Time.
Ben Bradley's Wives would have been a better movie. They
cover those three wives and they met in Paris. It's
like a whole thing, like there's some good ship, but
we got the garbage heap. Tom Hank, I mean, and
and maybe there are exceptions to this role that I'm
not thinking of, but Tom Hanks has like pretty exceptionally

(19:05):
bad taste in like period movies, because he's in one
of my least favorite movies of all time, Charlie Wilson's War,
a movie that is ten years old and yet is
like how did this movie come out? And people were
like it's so cute? How this like political effict role
is harassing women for three hours. It was God, But wait,
can I just talk about one more thing about the movie? That? Okay,

(19:27):
So when Bob and Kirk's character Ben goes to me
Daniel Ellsberg, and it goes to hotel room and there's
literally thousands and thousands and thousands and thousands of stacks
of paper everywhere, and then he compiles it into two
file boxes and brings it on the plane. And I

(19:49):
was a trailer moment to deliver that trailer moment. Okay,
trailer guy, easy job for you. We're all laughing. And
also there's so much weird bumbling for no reason, like
Ben has to make a phone call every time. He's

(20:10):
like he drops his notebook and reporters are falling, and
I was like, why is he bumbling? I do not
have to do it? Is that a choice? I wrote
that done? Because every time he's had a pay phone,
which is like three or four times, there's some sort
of fit there like let's let out and kirtius and
physical improv like not, why that's not what this movie is?
What do you builds the tension of the scene. One

(20:31):
of my got in a movie full of my least
favorite scenes. At some point Jesse, Clemens and Zach would
show up and it's like are they would word in Bernstein,
No they're not. But there's that scene at the end,
and this is like another time where I don't know why,
but in so many recent episodes, like the way music
is used in movies has really been like bugging me,

(20:52):
and it's so it's just lazy in this where it's
just like, yeah, let's just throw in some swelling strings
and hopefully people won't notice, you know. But there's like
the scene at the end where a woman in the
office is getting a call and she's like, oh my gosh,
it's so and so and the ruling is in and
they say that journalism is good and journalists are good,
and then like the music is like do do do

(21:13):
do do do? I was like, funk this, what do
you How dumb do you think we are? Exactly not
to mention like the way that all went down, I
can't imagine that's how it goes down. For a screamed
line of exposition, journalism wins. It's like and it's like
just make eye contact with the camera, like that's oh boy,

(21:35):
right now? Should I even attempt to recap. I don't
know if I'm gonna yeah, well, well we can help
fill in the gaps. This is a tricky this is
a hard movie to recap. Trure is So it's nineteen swo.
We're in the middle of the Vietnam War. Nixon, President,
k Graham, the publisher, I guess the Catherine again, I

(21:57):
don't even know what The first forty five minutes of
the movie are like. Oh, opens with this scene in
the Vietnam War where this journalist he's like observing, he's
checking things out, and then he reports back to Bob
McNamara and he's like, actually, things in the war aren't
really good, and they're like, well, we can't tell anyone this.
We have to lie. So it becomes this like huge

(22:19):
study that becomes these talk secret documents, and then Daniel
Ellsberg is like, why shouldn't I should steal and link them?
So The New York Times gets hold of them first
and leaks a little bit of it. But then the
Supreme Court is like, no, you can't do that. I'm
sending up for a long week. Well no, no, the
Spreme Court didn't say you can't do that. What happened

(22:40):
was there was an injunction because of the White House. Um,
so the White House tried to get this from not happening,
saying that it was it would be a national security risk. Right,
yeah again, I'm going. And meanwhile, Katherine Graham and Ben
one of the Bends, they're like, wow, crap, like, oh
this paper, we should take it public and no one

(23:02):
takes out seriously and they're all upset about that. And
then the people are like, there's like the implication of like, well,
we have a woman running a paper. It's a liability
right exactly. Yeah, No one really is confident in her abilities.
And she's really good friends with a guy who wrote
the Pentagon papers, and she fired she fired out friendly

(23:23):
like they had in such weird specific details. I'm like,
who is this for? Yeah? Anyways, So the Washington Post,
via another of the Bends, the Bob Owen Kirkman, gets
ahold of this huge study the Pentagon Papers as they
later become to be known all the phone. But he's
a great journalist. There's this whole sequence about oh do

(23:45):
we publish these like it's our journalistic responsibility to let
the American public know that the Vietnam War is actually
not good, and that the government knew that we couldn't
win it from the very beginning, but we still keep
sending soldiers over there to die in this war. And
then but then they're like, oh, but what will it
do to our newspaper? It might you know, will collapse
and all this because of the injunction. So they were

(24:08):
trying to decide whether or not they would be shut
down because of whether or not the Supreme Court would
rule that it was illegal. Do you know, I did
not check this, but was like the timeline of like
because the timing of this. Part of the reason that
she that k is like, I don't know if we
should lead the papers is because there's some sort of

(24:29):
like week long thing when they were going public. So
what happens is the newspaper was was a family owned paper,
and they were hemorrhaging money and they were in debt.
So what they were going to do is go public,
so people go by shares in the newspaper could stay afloat.
There's a window of time when you go public and
you have shareholders, there's a window of time where if

(24:50):
you do something that is highly illegal or unethical, the
deal can fall through and the shareholders can back out
of the deal. So that window of time when they
were deciding whether or not they were going to defy
what could possibly be a Supreme Court ruling that said
freedom of the press does not mean that you can
take government acquired whistleblowing papers and expose them to the public.

(25:14):
And the Supreme Court ruled that it is in the
public's good to know that this is happening in the
in their name. But this was the timeline where this
was happening during that window where they so after a
lot of like kathin Kay being like should I publish
or should we not publish the story? What do we do?
She finally decides to go ahead and run the story,

(25:36):
publish and then I'm going to bed. She's sleeping for
a lot of yess right, She's slow, tired, she's exhausted.
And so they're like, oh no, what's this going to
do Because there's another like extra obstacle at the last
minute where the lawyers were like, oh wait, your source
was the same source as the New York Times, and

(25:56):
that could really like you could go to prison for that.
Like the steaks were very high. Catherine's like fuck it
published the damn paper and they do and everyone's like,
oh my god. And then all the other papers follow
suit and they're like, wait, we saved the world. And
then there's a forty five minutes sequence of Steven Spielberg
filming newspaper presses, which I actually kind of liked. That

(26:20):
was the most visually interesting part of the movie, because
the rest of it's just toss yeah like that. It
takes like there's a million I can give you a
million papers where they spin around. It's the headline, like
that visual effect that it is not insufferable time you'll
never get back. It's just like, can we reallocate the
time spent looking at newspaper presses explaining what's happening in

(26:44):
the fucking movie? Because actually newspapers that aren't yours and
we just keep reading the New York too. It was
smiled the majority of revelations come from the New York Times,
which is because it's eventually the Washington Post does get
a story, but that is not really focused on what

(27:06):
that actually happened. I don't I don't know, I don't know.
I don't know what is happening in this movie? Uh?
Is that everything? Though? I mean the Supreme Court rules
that created the press. Yeah, and then could we have
seen that instead of hearing someone screaming on to the
office on a phone. Yeah, that would have probably been
more appropriate. And then the movie ends with the like

(27:29):
Watergate scandal robbery thing happening, like, oh wow, is gonna
not be the president anymore? Yeah, that's why. That's what
I realized. It wasn't would Ward and Bernstein because they
have heard yet. It's like, oh, right, they're breaking into
Daniel Ellsberg's psychiatrists office, is what they did. Yeah, that

(27:53):
craziness so right, it was. I mean, it was such
a cheeseball ending to the movie, like yeah, audible laughter,
you literally don't mean you don't. Yeah, listen, I know
we've been talking about it for a while now, but
skip the post. I've got to see its sanator early
in the podcast there. Well, well, let day with us, though,

(28:17):
keep listening because we haven't even told you if it
makes the grade, yeah, it's true. I mean, let's get
into the female characters discussion, because oh boy, I mean
boy so much. It's all just missed opportunity after a
missed opportunity, right, I feel like until the third act
Katherine Graham is not very much an active character in

(28:39):
this story. She's not really doing any I mean, she's
making decisions, but we don't actually see her doing much
like she's not I mean, I guess, and that's like
not necessarily her role as the publisher to be like
like in the middle of the excitement and like reporting
on stuff. But well, partly part of what bothered me
from like very early in the movie is that I

(29:00):
don't even know if, like the way the movie portrays
her and kind of a little bit the way Meryl
Street plays her, it's not super clear to me that
she's extremely competent at her job, which in real life
she was, And so it was like weird where they
were just like, well, we don't know if she's able
to do the job, and I'm like, I don't know
if I'm I'm sure she's able to do the job

(29:21):
because she's always just waking up and being liked. But
but I feel too, it's like this was her family's business, right,
So you were the newspaper of record through monumental things.
You grew up in a newspaper family. Do you have

(29:41):
passion about information? Do you do you have passion about
freedom of the press, caring about what the public thinks,
or was your family just like these rich publishing people
who were hob nobbing around with lb J and all
the way that they sort of dropped that stuff about
she and her husband, but forget about the husband. Her

(30:03):
dad owned the paper, So I was like, do you
care about this ship? It's not clear. I mean, I
feel like she is far more like her motivation in
regards to working for the paper, like her character always
connects it back to like I want to make my
dead husband and father proud, Like it never really has
to do with like journalistic integrity or or breaking stories,

(30:26):
and and and I haven't done a deep dive on
kay Graham, and I don't know what her actual you know,
like interviews. She loved it, I mean, yeah, it was.
This movie is weird because it made me like her,
Like I had more like excitement and respect for her
as like a historical character before I went into the

(30:47):
movie than when I left. Because the way the movie
portrays it, it's weird. And there's that scene with her
and her daughter towards the end of the movie where
it's like I feel like ka, like the movie sells
out the character entire really in like one of the
last scenes where she's just like, you know, she's saying
like it was very stressful, and but she's only talking
about I want to make my dad proud. I want

(31:08):
to make my husband proud. I wanted, and just going
on and on and to the point where she's saying, oh,
and when my father wanted to give the paper to
my husband and not me, I thought that made total sense.
I was like, what is She also says something weird,
like people always say that whenever they see a woman
doing something. I forget what verb she was, but it

(31:29):
was like, when a woman does this thing, it's like
seeing a dog walk on its hind legs. It's bad
and it's weird, and like dog shaming. Don't shame a dog. Well,
And also it was like when they were going public,
they were saying, oh, you know, maybe you could try
to think about expanding and becoming more than just like
a local paper and the Washington And she was like,
I don't know, I kind of just want to reach

(31:51):
for the top shelf. I'm not really reaching for the
moon of the stars. I know, I just want to
keep it going and pay people and and even the
opening scene was just like she was all consumed with
making sure that the paper was covering Richard Nixon's daughter's wedding.
That was the hill she was ready to die on
for some reasons. Die on that hill, girl. Well. Another

(32:13):
early scene is when I don't know the guy's name,
but she was kind of being coached by this guy
of what to say whenever they go into this big
board meeting about when they're discussing like what the stock
prices are going to be, breading it down as like
Meryl Streep's friend. Yeah, I mean he worked for the paper,
but I don't know what his name is or what
his role is. Maybe now Bradley Witt for the actor,

(32:34):
isn't the older guy? Yeah? Maybe? And every role he's
in recently, I'm just like, wow, that wasn't because he's
in't get Out too, And I'm like, he was in
West Wing, Yes, he was in west Wing. West Wing. Yeah,
that was a west Wing guy, wasn't. Oh my god,
he wasn't the west Wing guy. So so him, he's
like coaching Katherine Graham on like what to say, and

(32:57):
she seems flustered and she's like, I feel like I
don't know this stuff, and then you see a scene where,
like immediately following that, she's in the board meeting. She's
the one woman out of like twenty other men and
they're all talking about, oh, I thought the shares were
going to be sear And there's like an opportunity for
her to reveal the knowledge that she was practicing with

(33:17):
this guy, and she's going to say, well, you know,
quality drives profitability, and then she totally chokes and then
her friend See, I actually kind of liked that scene
if it were paid off on in any way later on,
But it's not like if she would like gets a
chance to redeem herself. Maybe is that what you mean?
Because I feel like the way that that scene plays out,
like we as an audience know, it's like what I

(33:38):
missed chance? And you know, she has in this huge
room full of men who don't want to listen to her.
But then the movie kind of, I mean, like sputters
out in terms of keeping that going, in terms of
like developing her as someone who you want to see succeeds. Like,
I don't know, I was hoping that that would come.
I was hoping we would see her in a meeting
later where she would, you know, have one of those

(33:58):
movie moments of like, actually I have something to say,
and but you know that never happened. We do, well,
we do. I mean she does and kind of redeem
herself by the end when she's like, I know the steaks.
I know I might go to jail over this. I
know that the paper might totally fail, but I say
publish anyway, and we're like going to bed. But that

(34:20):
character arc, we don't see the actual arc happen. Like
it's just she like flubs up at the beginning and
then we don't, like you said, yeah, we don't really
see her character grow and develop and build over the
course of the story that leads to that point where
she like suddenly has strong decision making skills. She has
a few moments that I'm like, you know, there was

(34:41):
like there's one scene she had with Tom Hanks been
uh where they're sort of challenging each other on uh
yeah yeah, and and like the way that Tom Hanks
character treats Meryl Street is you know, a ma of
respect and condescension. But I mean there are scenes where

(35:03):
they're challenging each other and it is like a lively discussion.
We have no idea. If you don't know the exact
particulars of the history, you have no idea what the
funk they're talking about. But they're challenging each other, and
so she has these few moments of like, oh, she
does know things, we just don't see her demonstrate knowing
things in the way she does her job. So also,
there was a scene, and I'm sure that it was

(35:25):
put out there for discussion, but it was just angering
where there's a dinner party and then somebody starts to
talk about some kind of smart thing, and then a
woman says, well, that's time for us to move, and
all the women and Katherine Graham go into one room
and talk about outfits or some ship, but the men
talking about politics. Yeah. Yeah, that scene was fucking infuriating,

(35:49):
And to keep our discussion about Titanic always going from
I was thinking this far more effectively done in Titanic.
But there, I mean, but this is sort of you know,
the women go to one room, the men staying in
the room and smoke cigars, and you know, what's the
line politics? Wouldn't it just do anyway? Exactly? The famous

(36:10):
Billy Zane performance Shout out Billy Zane every day always.
But the way this knows that to Jack, he's like,
you're too poor to know about feminist ion. Jack Dawson's like,
I'm going with the ladies, see you later. I just
want to watch Titanic again. Um. But in the post,
the way that rolls out, it challenges nothing. They're like, oh, yeah,

(36:31):
the women are not going to talk about anything but clothes.
We don't know what any of their names are. And
one literally goes like, kay, that that dreadful day job
of yours, and are you fucking Katie? They are you know,
according to the post, women are that dumb? I mean, honestly,
it was just an endless and it felt like they
were wedging things in to remind people how sexist things

(36:54):
were by like ship like that, where it's like I
get that. You can't show me into posortable ways, any
redemption at all, you know. Even her decision to change
the course of journalistic history was like are you there?
Are you on the line? Are you on the line?
It's everybody on the line of the Russians on the line.

(37:20):
So many climactic scenes in this movie take place over
the phone. It's very frustrating. I'm like what's actually happening,
also to the point of like all the women talking
about like oh, gowns and whatnot. There's a scene at
the end after like after the climax, and they're like, wow,
we won. Journalism saves the day. And there's a group
of people gathered around a woman's desk in the newsroom

(37:41):
and she says something like no more articles about dresses
or shoes, and but it's just like a throw white
line that like you probably it's just like, oh, subtle,
great job. But there's also that scene where she goes
and challenges Robert McNamara and she's just like, how could
you do this? Like you knew all this stuff, you

(38:02):
kept it secret, and Bob, could you do my dirty
Bob so my son, my nephew, Bob. I think I
might take back what I said about like not really
seeing her arc because you do see those times where
she does go and like challenge people, and she seems
like she's getting more confident in her abilities and decision

(38:22):
making and whatnot. And I also think it's cool that
you do see kind of the stakes of the country
and different parts of the globe kind of resting on
her shoulders in terms of like do we leak this information?
Do we let the public know about this like very
important thing that was happening at the time. I like
that you get to see a woman in that position

(38:44):
where she's making such a crucial decision. Was it told
interestingly in this movie? I felt like this movie was
not interesting, which is crazy given the story it's telling.
But I also feel like it just like does a
huge injustice to the story and its characters. Like it
just if I knew nothing about depending on Papers or

(39:04):
any of that going into this movie, I'd be like, oh,
so this was kind of a drag kind of thing that,
which is crazy because there's there's so much and they
just do nothing like they're One of my main things
with this movie was like I feel like this exact
movie in every single way could have been made fifteen
years ago. Like it just feels like it could have

(39:25):
come out at any time, Like there's no especially because
they're like, oh, it's a timely movie. It's a timely story.
If you told me this movie came out in two
thousand and two, I would believe you because of how
he treats his characters and how it treats the source
material it could have come out fucking whenever well, and
also likes somebody who created a TV show that wanted

(39:46):
to ship all over the nepotism in the media, which
is how the Daily Show came to be. It's driving
force was observing the media and watching, you know, all
these shows the storylines for me. I literally when Catherine
Graham is challenged by Ben Bradley, the editor of the paper,
and he says, wait, Robert McNamara has literally written this

(40:07):
massive dossier that shows there's election near fraud. We've covered
up the war where we send people to die knowing
we were losing. And she goes, oh, do we have
He said, haven't kind of a bad time lately, you know,
And it's like so it's like that is the point.
You know, even the journalism that's supposed to be the
best journalism we have in this country is so full

(40:27):
of bullshit. And Tom Hanks started touches on it by
like everybody wants to go to the same parties with
this one and that one, and and those stories of
like of how those things intersect and how people finally
do the right thing, Like I think that's really important.
And so it was like a ship bath up until
she finally pulls the trigger. But like, how much do
you have to be convinced when there's thousands and thousands

(40:49):
and thousands of paper and thousands and thousands and thousands
of dead people and young people and and you're like, oh,
my friends, I don't know. It's got you know, restless
leg syndrome and it's just trying to make it work.
And life and him had a fight, Yeah, a hard time.
It's so yeah, I mean all of it was just

(41:10):
sad by and large Yeah, I feel like Kay's character
is under service and kind of largely just like unexamined
as a person. It just kind of all over. She
doesn't get that much screen I mean, this is an
ensemble cast. I don't really know if we're supposed to
identify any one character as the protagonist of the movie,
because it seems like it's her and Tom Hanks's character,

(41:32):
but she doesn't get that much screen time. Okay, if
they were doing a movie called the Begdell Cast and
you were hardly in it, right, that would be weird,
and they made one of us significantly dumber than we
were in real life, that would be Yeah. Like it's
like it's called a post, right, And I don't know.

(41:55):
I just kind of feel like, I mean, I know that,
like there's not like two und of people that work
out your podcast, so I know that's different. How dare
you that we feel your strength? She's so clearly amazing,
Um that you don't need to hundred people. That's right,
That's what I'm saying. That would be funny if there
was a betel Cast movie and I was in it

(42:16):
for three minutes and I was only drooling. I feel
like all you did was strength. I'm just like, um,
what are we doing? Where are we haming? And my
name was Bob but all but a stripe? Who else

(42:37):
do we have for female characters? We have Judith, who
is the She was the person who was maybe going
to report on the wedding because they were like, you're
not allowed, right. She said that Tricia Nixon looked like
it looks like trash. She said, she looked like a
vanilla scarpe coat. Sick for DELI get that money, vanilla,
I screen cop. Oh my god, you're fired. That's too

(43:00):
sick of burn she is, So she is in it.
There's another woman who appears to be a journalist or
reporter of some cod She's the one who at the
end was on the phone and kind of like dictating
what the journalist or Tom Hanks's secretary. Oh yeah, I was.
I'm clear about her role. Yeah, there was the daughter,
the daughter who did we have a name? I don't

(43:20):
know if we learned her name. I was struggling with that.
I was like, did I miss it? Did I miss it?
Because those were the scenes that I thought like, well
this and it sucks because there's two extended scenes with
k Graham and her daughter, and there are some exchanges
that you're like, this could maybe pass the Backeal test.
But I'm not sure what her name is. I don't think.
I mean, from what I could tell, you don't learn
what we know her Her maiden name is probably miss Graham,

(43:45):
but we don't. I'm like, I don't think we learned
her name. And the little daughter's name, did we learned
her name? I don't think. I don't think so. Also,
it would be hilarious if this movie passed the back
to test strictly on that lemonade standing direction. I think
it might name vodka, Yeah, vodka. And Catherine also has

(44:09):
an assistant or secretary. She's walking up the steps and
that's I don't know if we know her name either. No,
she was like you have to be at this place
at five, Yeah, thank you. Yeah, there was that scene.
And then there was the scene with the daughter but
we don't know, And then was there an exchange between
to say who wants sandwiches? And there was one woman

(44:30):
in that room? Was that Judith or not Judith? I
think it was not? Oh yeah it was Judith? Was
it Judith? There is this movie so I couldn't tell
you the name of literally anyone if I didn't pay
and teen or Tin and Twinette twin Tin. Yeah. Actually
Tom Hanks being lady not easy. Oh that was Oh

(44:53):
my day was fine, Thanks for asking um. Feminist icon
look out. There's a scene where a woman and I
don't know who it is, says to Okay, I got
a cake? Is that okay? And Kay says as long
as no one counts the candles because it's her birthday.
What's her name? I don't know his name. Am walking

(45:15):
towards the door to answer it when Ben Bradley is
there to say, I'm at your part day. Oh my god,
tell you something, Ben, Bradley comes to her house at
the beginning of scene to this movie, He's like me again,
and to the point where the movie even starts calling
it out of like wow, Ben, you keep showing up
at my house. It's like yeah, almost like there's a
more interesting way to do this scene, Like I know

(45:37):
it's And I also just feel like we have to
ask some old people if you just went over to
people's houses on announcement, before the times of phones and things.
Did people just show up that your house all the time?
I remember when I was a kid, like my dad's
friends would just maybe people just came over to your boss.
I feel like I'm kind of glad that that trend

(45:58):
has died out when whenever someone is like, hey, I'm
just popping in, I was like that you have to
leave my home. I'm not I'm not home, no matter
of how many clear indicators that I'm home. Yeah, my
grandfather would do that or a little and it would
drive maybe than it is like an old person thing,
because we're drive My mom fucking crazy. She was just like,
why is he what? He's got a phone, Like, there's

(46:19):
no need to just show up places. Yeah. Yeah, feminist
like your grandfather. No, he's actually pretty bad person. So
we're all my grandparents. Okay. So as far as the
movie passing the Bechtel test, I don't couldn't identify any
scene where there were quite a few scenes where women
were interacting, but they were either talking about men or

(46:40):
we did not know. It's usually Katherine Graham talking to
someone else, but I don't think we know the other
character's name in almost all of those scenes. With I
don't think I was the same way because I was
like super because I did the same thing. I watched
it three weeks ago, and then I watched it again
for the podcast, and I was really look get through

(47:00):
the lens right, and I have notes of like this
happened at this And I took a note of every scene,
and I was like, do I know that person's name?
Like do I have to go back and rewind it
four times to see if maybe? And I was like,
I don't know any of these people's names, right, and
this is and and something else that I noticed that
really bugged me, especially in the second viewing, was how
many times there are several women in the same room

(47:21):
and their characters don't interact in any way and that
to me, it says like, I don't think that was
done intentionally. But to me, that's even worse of just like, oh,
this filmmaker, it wouldn't even occur to them to have
female characters interact like it. Just there's so many scenes
where Meryl and her secretary are in the same room
the whole time. They do not speak well and they

(47:42):
didn't speak to them, but that's it. Well, And there's
that same when she walks in to talk to all
the stockholders and she walks up these steps and all
of these women are standing out there and they open
the door, and I was like, are they the secretaries
of all the men in there? Like? Who are all
those women on the stairs? But yeah, and they all
have these weird forty yards stairs and what are they?

(48:06):
Why were they all standing there? For? They were like
smiling at her to a good job. They're also ladies,
there's right, it's just like a very vague over like
women other women, But it's like, why would you know
who she is? There's that scene I forget why exactly
she's in court at this point, but there's that scene
where she's speaking to a young woman and young woman's

(48:27):
like I hope you in and then she sees that
woman's boss mistreat her and be like you're late even
though traffic or something. And that was another weird scene
that I'm like, I think that Steven Spielberg thought he
was being a feminist just then, but it was ultimately
just a weird scene that and it never comes back.
Oh yeah, she worked for She was like work for

(48:49):
the one of the judges. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it was.
I was like, okay, Like that was the one who's like,
She's like, my brother is still over there, and I
hope you win, but don't tell my boss I said that,
or even that I talked to you. I can't. Well,
I'm really glad that I because I came in here

(49:10):
fucking hating this movie and I, oh my god, these
women are like, I'm so happy. You guys were just like,
oh my god. I was worried that you picked it
because you liked it. No. I was like, man, this
is the smartest person in the world. How could she
like this movie? Oh no, I will never let you
down by telling you this. Right now, I tell you

(49:35):
I haven't say Titanic. No, that's that you know you're
going to have an amazing night. I'm gonna watch it
and then I'm just gonna call you about the like
I watched it. It's it's like, I'm really happy. It
does so much better than you would ever in your
life think it would do in terms of the way
it treats female characters. However, it's not necessarily a great movie.

(49:58):
Hover counterpoint, it is the greatest movie of all time,
I know, and I haven't seen it. I think it's
one of those movies where do you ever meet those
people who like, they didn't have sex in high school,
and then they didn't have it in college, and then
their virgins and by accident they're like, now I just
am keeping it as a point of pride, and maybe

(50:19):
I'm just And I feel like that way about Titanic,
where it's like I just didn't see it, and then
I was gonna and then I haven't, and like do
I not see it? But I feel like I should
just funk. Titanic just hasnicually just the Titanic suck the Titanic. Yeah,
I'm the same way with The Godfather. I've never seen it,
and then I think it's like extremely cute when I

(50:40):
tell people I haven't seen it and then they go
and unhinge their jobs, and like, that's right, it's not
on purpose, but yeah, it becomes on purpose after a while.
Let's see how far into my life I can make
it without seeing The Godfather. Yeah, it's good, you should
say it. That's kind of an amazing movie. I've heard
good things, largely considered to be a better movie than

(51:02):
the first time. Similar with Paddington Too, and how it
is the other best movie ever made, along with alright,
Paddington Too. Love it anyway, everyone's upset with me. I'm like,
I haven't seen even a Paddington one. I think I'm
a bear. It's a bear with a raincoat. He's got

(51:22):
a defle coat and a red hat. Yeah. I had
to kill two hours yesterday and so I saw about
seventy of Jumanji. Oh, I wouldn't talk to you about that.
I stayed until Nick Jonas showed up. I'm like, well,
guess I'm out. I guess I'm fun. I guess I'm good,
and I'm gonna just go do what I have to do.
But you know not, Jamie, No, it's no. It's like

(51:45):
a board and board game. Right. I hadn't seen the first,
I'm very familiar with Jumanji whatever. I don't know what Jumanji.
I know something I don't know the new Jumanji. There's
a lot of colors. It's kind of like a sensory
overload car tune. No, no, it's a It's Jack Black,
Kevin Hart, The Rock, The Rock, Nick Jonas Jonas a

(52:08):
woman from doctor who whose name escapes me. I feel
like you deserve better. I thank you so much. Your
time deserves better. I just didn't have enough time to
go home. So I'm like, I guess I'm going to
just see part of Jumanji. Did you pay money? I had?
Used movie Pass? Is that free? So? Yeah? Yeah, So
it's like you can see one movie a day for

(52:29):
like ten dollars a month. So it's not free. It's
not free, but if you go to the movies, movie
pass is much like freedom. And you know what else
and that is not granted to everyone. You have to
ask for him. No one else isn't free? Is the
press for a little bit in this movie that we're
talking about, Thankfully they I love trying it back to

(52:52):
killing the relevant topics. The master you are, so you
are the seguess, shall we rate the movie on our
Apple scales, so as we have a scale of zero
to five nipples by which we rate the movie based
on its portrayal of women. I'm gonna have to say
it's not like this isn't the worst one we've ever done,

(53:14):
but certainly not the best. I'm gonna I'm gonna give
it like maybe a two and a half nipples. We've
talked about how disserviced Katherine Graham was in the movie.
I feel like we're not really ever on board with her,
and that might be because she doesn't get a lot
of screen time or opportunity for us to get to
know her. Um. I feel like the story could have
just come from a different angle and told her version

(53:36):
of it much better. Of the other female characters there are,
we never even get to learn their names. We don't
even know what their situation is. We see eighty billion
men on screen at all times, and that's frustrating. I
don't know it could have done better. I don't know
what I'm trying to say. Who are you? The most
important question? But yeah, I'm going to give two of

(53:56):
them to the Lemonade, and the half nipple will go
to k Graham. I'm gonna give it to and and
I would like to see what this movie would look
like in the hands of a female director, because I
feel like a lot of missteps would not have been
But I mean, and I know that we're commenting on

(54:16):
how women are treated by the movie and not the
movie itself, but this movie is just so lazily done
in every single way, and I feel like just the
way it treats its female characters is one of the
very lazy components. John Williams composed the music for his
and it's the worst. Like, it's just no one is
doing a good job. I think that they give us
a female protagonist and they're given the source material for

(54:39):
a very interesting, nuanced character, and we just don't get it.
Women be servant sandwiches, women be providing exposition, women be
talking about shoes. It's just like it's just also fucking
lazy and is a bummer on many levels because there
is a good movie to be had about the subject
matter and this was not it. It's like there is

(55:00):
a movie called The Pentagon Papers, which have you seen it?
Is there? I haven't seen it years ago? Okay, I
should have done more research on it. Sorry, everyone. If
you know about the movie The Pentagon Papers, please twe
someone's favorite movie. It was the movie was co written
by a woman, Liz Hannah and Josh Singer, so you

(55:21):
feel like it would have been a better movie. But
just kidding, not this time, not this time. But yeah,
I give it two nipples. I'm going to give one
of the nipples to Zach Woods because yeah, I like
him a lot, but he didn't blind this movie. And
I'm gonna give the other uh nipple to Sarah Paulson
because she also deserved way better. Yeah, I mean, I
guess I would give it to grudgingly um, because really,

(55:45):
what did you want me to walk out of this
movie knowing and feeling like I don't know the answers
to those two questions. There's a biography about Katherine Graham
that I would say we should all probably read because
if Catherine am was a fraction of how she was
portrayed in this movie and Bren Bradley saved that paper,

(56:07):
then that's the movie. And why are you making that
movie trying to act like she did something if he
pushed her into everything, you know, I just feel like
everything about this movie was sexist. If she was not awesome,
then why did you make the movie? It's like, and
if you wanted to make a movie that was about
Ben Bradley and how awesome he was, and that Katherine

(56:29):
Graham said, I inherited this newspaper. I didn't want to
be in the newspaper business. But you're really smart, and
I'm willing to put my family business on the line
because you are willing to like fight for democracy. That's
a movie. But like, I don't know what this movie
was other than I felt insulted by Katherine Graham's ineptitude.
I felt insulted by the fact that I thought I

(56:50):
was going into a movie that was going to tell
me a little bit about her journey in this historical
context and didn't. And I just feel like every woman
in it, I don't know who they were. It was
sometimes you literally cannot tell them apart and you don't
know their names. So I'm gonna give my two nipples.
I'm gonna give, I guess one to Judy for wanting

(57:11):
to have some Mike's hard lemonade. Hell yeah, what it matters.
And the other nipple I'm gonna give too. I don't
even know who deserves it. I guess I guess Sarah
Paulson for having to suffer through that bad photoshop picture. Yeah,
we all had to. We were right there with her.
I feel like I feel like Steven Spielberg or you

(57:32):
know who, whomever tied to him. We're like, we want
to make a journalism movie. Give me five ideas for
a journalism movie. And he arbitrarily was like, oh, women
are hot right now, like the woman journalism movie. And
it's just like every it's just so thrown together and
wishy washing, and the movie doesn't know what it thinks
about itself. And then it ends on that horrendous like

(57:53):
like a bad SNL sketch of Richard Nixon imprisonator. But like,
here's the thing that, like, after knowing they made this
movie because of the parallels of the times, like they
chose the subject matter but also of the times, is
now you know, it's like, then, do a movie about
women in journalism who we don't know about because they

(58:15):
got sucked over by creepy bosses. Who are the women
we don't know? Like, where's the journalism version of Hidden Figures?
Make that movie? Yeah, that's what we need. We need,
we need the hidden figures version of every everything in
the world. It's hidden figures of and call me later.

(58:36):
It's the new hidden figures, extended universe, forgotten women through history.
I mean, it's just unbelievable. There's like, way too many
cool people who did really cool ship like that. I
can't even and we don't know about them because history
has buried them. The Post has gotta go. Yeah, it's
gotta go. Don't like it, and it's going to be.

(58:58):
It's nominated for everything, to the point where I don't
think that anyone who like nominated the Post for an
award has actually seen it. No, I don't know, because
it's not winning no way, didn't win anything. No good. No,
it's also you have to nominate Meryl Streep or uh,
Ninja comes after you, Caryl Streets, Ninja, Army Street. I'm sorry,
You're right, Meryl Street. Well, Liz, thank you so much

(59:22):
for being This is so much fun. I'm saying I
loved it. I come back. Are you Do you have
those one guest rules like the people who like, No,
you can't five years dad whenever you want? Okay? Policy?
Where can people find you online? Is there anything you'd
like to plug? Oh? My gosh. Yes, you can find

(59:44):
me online at Liz Winstead on all platforms. I spelled
my name with two z's because I'm an ass whole um.
And then maybe what you want to do, because this
is going to be super fun. On February first, Lady
Parts Justice, which is my reproductive rights crazy comedy organization,
is to a big livestream telephone at Lady Park Justice
dot com. It's Rachel Bloom, Sarah Summer and I are

(01:00:05):
hosting it and it's a whole fun evening two hour
broadcasts of comedy and learning about what's happening to reproductive
rights and abortion access and how you can join in
and have fun. You can pledge. Mark Hamill is going
to be sitting for two hours making crafts that are
going to be auction. It's gonna be Does Mark Hamill
make craps? Yes, he doodles and he does crafts and

(01:00:27):
he's a bunch of stuff like you have me at
Mark Hamill jass. Go to Lady Parts Justice dot com
for all the info. It's gonna be a ballas there
may or may not be a Piniona that is the
patriarchy with garbage inside. Oh my god, gat my blood
pressure is rising. Yeah, well hey on that. You can
follow with the Bechtel Cast on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, You

(01:00:51):
can go to our website backtel cast dot com, tweet
on US, rate and reviews on iTunes, Pledge to our page.
Yeah yeah, coming up on the Patreon in February, it's Oscar.
What did what I call it? You called it biopic March? Okay,
but it was actually February, and it was actually not
even biopics. It was it was Oscar Watch February. I

(01:01:11):
accidentally called it biopic March about forty sons. But this
month in the Patreon, we're doing a Tania and the
Disaster Artists, which are biopics. So I understood your mistake,
but unfortunately it was not for March. I don't know
why I spent the whole day thinking it was. But
subscribe to the patreon five dollars a month gets you
two extra episodes a month. You bet you pretty good?
And yeah, journalism is alive and well, especially print journalism swelling.

(01:01:36):
John Williams score doing great. All right. Bye by