Triangle of Sadness with James Adomian

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
On the Bechde Cast, the questions asked if movies have
women and them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands,
or do they have individualism? It's the patriarchy, zeph and
Vast start changing it with the Bechdel Cast.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
Bo Wow, incredible.

Speaker 3 (00:18):
It was me barfing and shitting at the same time.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
God, something really so satisfying about seeing someone just slip
around in their own.

Speaker 3 (00:27):
Goof, especially a rich fuck slipping around in their own waist.

Speaker 2 (00:33):
Yeah, from both holes, just projectile both holes. And that
is the thing that I remembered most strongly about this movie.
And what does that mean? I was like, yeah, class commentary, mmmmmmmm,
And do you remember the scene where both holes were exploding?
And I think that's just like human nature. I knew
that there was a deep message. And I saw this

(00:55):
movie I think twice, and as I was returning to
it last night, I was like, hmmm, when is both
holes happening? Yeah, Welcome to the Bechtel Cast. My name
is Jamie Loftis.

Speaker 3 (01:06):
My name is Caitlin Derante. This is our show where
we examine movies through an intersectional feminist lens, using the
Bechdel test as a jumping off point. And that's a test,
of course, created by a queer cartoonist, Alison Bechdel. Also
she credits Liz Wallace as a co creator. That's why
it's sometimes called the Bechdel Wallace test. And it is

(01:27):
a medium metric that has many versions. Ours is this
due to two characters of a marginalized gender, have names?
Do they speak to each other? And is their conversation
about something other than a man? And we especially like
it if it's a narratively substantial conversation, a nice, meaty

(01:50):
conversation that you could puke up later.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
Yeah, shit out, puke whatever you want, which, as we'll discuss,
is you know, not really that much of a problem
in this movie, which is wild in a two and
a half hour movie where basically two men start a
podcast on a sinking ship that sounds like really fun
and they're really like forcing it on the people around

(02:13):
them in the way that a lot of podcasters do.
It felt like representation matters. So yeah, we say, we
were talking about Triangle of Sadness twenty twenty two movie
from Oh God, I'm gonna say, Ruben Austland, Is that right? Okay?

Speaker 3 (02:28):
Yeah? Great?

Speaker 2 (02:29):
I thought I was gonna have an Ewan McGregor sort
of brain problem.

Speaker 3 (02:34):
No, I think he's going easy on us with his name.
This this Ruben Austland.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
Yeah, and this is sort of in I'm excited to
talk about. We'll first talk with our guests and also
talk about how this movie sort of came out at
the time where like Rich People Satire was, there were
like five, I think movies and TV shows that had
similar themes in like this calendar year. But I like
this one the best. So let's let's get our guests.

Speaker 3 (02:59):
In here, do it. He's a comedian. His new special
is out now called Paths with Most Resistance. You can
find it on YouTube and eight hundred Pound Gorilla. It's
James Adomian.

Speaker 2 (03:09):
Welcome.

Speaker 4 (03:10):
Hello, well by Caitlin. Hello, Hello Jamie.

Speaker 2 (03:14):
How's it going good?

Speaker 4 (03:16):
Happy to talk to you both. And I was excited
to talk about this movie because I remember it being
one of two extremely funny movies of twenty twenty two
that I laughed a lot at. You know, I don't
know if it passes the BEGDL tess, and I was

(03:36):
interested in finding out.

Speaker 2 (03:38):
Let's tell you, we'll get there, We'll get there.

Speaker 4 (03:40):
It very well might not.

Speaker 2 (03:42):
What was the other movie in twenty twenty two that
was really funny for.

Speaker 4 (03:44):
You official competition.

Speaker 3 (03:46):
Oh oh, I haven't seen that me either.

Speaker 4 (03:49):
You know, it's not Alma Dovar. It looks like an
Almodovar movie because it has Penelope Cruz and Antonio Benderis,
but I want to see who the director is. It
was very, very funny, and it's like a It was
clearly like a film in the pandemic because's a very
cast of basically three people.

Speaker 2 (04:05):
Oh huh, oh that rocks.

Speaker 4 (04:06):
It was basically two actors who hate each other and
the Penelope Cruise is the director who puts them in
a movie for the first time.

Speaker 3 (04:13):
Oh, that's a fun premise.

Speaker 2 (04:15):
That sounds great.

Speaker 1 (04:16):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (04:17):
Oh it was Mariano Cone and Gaston Duprat.

Speaker 2 (04:20):
Okay, the movies. I was thinking this was kind of
in conversation with and I was finding like some old
kind of clickbaity pieces to this effect was like it
was triangle of sadness. It was was it the meal,
the food?

Speaker 3 (04:32):
What was it called the menu?

Speaker 2 (04:34):
The menu?

Speaker 1 (04:35):
The food?

Speaker 2 (04:36):
The meal which didn't do very much for me, nor
did glass Onion did even less. And then you have
the White Lotus, which I do like. But it was
interesting because I feel like these movies all sort of
had made being Rich still look kind of fun, and
Triangle of Sadness does not make being Rich look fun
at all. I feel like it's the only one that

(04:57):
really effectively depicts misery at every class level in a
really funny way. Anyways, James, what is your history with
this movie? This director? Take it away?

Speaker 4 (05:11):
Okay, So Ruben Oastland, I did not see Force Majeure,
which I've been meaning to for years, which was the
one about the avalanche at a ski resort. Yeah, and
the father who runs away from the family.

Speaker 3 (05:25):
Which they remade as an American movie with I want
to say, Will.

Speaker 2 (05:28):
Ferrell and Julia Louis Dreyfus. Yeah, I haven't seen either.

Speaker 3 (05:32):
I should.

Speaker 4 (05:33):
Yeah, let's do more American remakes of everything. There was
too much snow. So I did see, uh, probably in
twenty eighteen. I believe his previous film, you know, the
second of the three that I know of, The Square,
The Square, which was very funny and I wasn't expecting

(05:54):
it to be. I thought it was going to be
like an art film, and it was much funnier. Than
I thought it was going to be. And that was
kind of like a satire of the art world and
how people have to pretend that obviously ridiculous art is
very important. Right. There was moments of that in this
movie that are very very funny in The Square. So

(06:16):
I guess, you know, you make a couple funny movies.
If it runs two weeks in America, they consider that
a hit for an international production. True, And so I
mean when I saw there was a preview for this
and I was like, this looks interesting. And then I
saw I was like directed by you know, from the
director of The Square, I was like, yep, that's the one.
Gotta catch it. This is for me. Hell yeah, I

(06:37):
imagine they must have had to film it during the
pandemic as well. If it came out in twenty twenty two,
it must have been like an early production or one
that they were sitting on.

Speaker 2 (06:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (06:46):
I was reading up about this production halted for some
amount of time because of the pandemic. It was one
where they were like doing constant COVID I read something
like they did over a thousand COVID tests throughout the production.
Each one turned up negative. So yeah, they were like
shooting during the I think height of the pandemic.

Speaker 4 (07:06):
Wow. Yeah, and it's kind of like it's a hermetically
sealed cast for most of the movie on a boat
or on an island.

Speaker 2 (07:14):
Yeah, it's gonna be interesting to have to like spot
COVID movies in the future where you're like, why do
they never leave this room? And you're like, oh, right, yes.

Speaker 4 (07:24):
I wonder if there's movies like that from nineteen twenty
or nineteen nineteen, right, Yeah, because of the ogs of
Spanish Yeah, exactly, No, wonder Buster Keaton was at the
front of the house fall on him and something else.
It all makes you couldn't get any other actors in
there to prop it up. Yeah, And so I was

(07:44):
like delighted. I saw this movie an opening weekend Triangle
Sadness and really laughed loud, really, like almost too loud
the way I do. I really laughed too loud in
the theater, But it was it was so fun to
see it minded me, you know, after the lockdowns and stuff.
It reminded me the joy of like a shared experience

(08:07):
of a large room full of people in a packed
movie theater laughing at the same moment.

Speaker 2 (08:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (08:14):
A beautiful thing.

Speaker 4 (08:15):
It's a beautiful thing to be a part of. It
was it was just so fun. It was so fun,
you know, the kind of rolling laughter as a scene
builds and goes where you're like, oh no, they're not,
Oh yes they are.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
It's it's fucking awesome, Like I loved. Yeah, getting to
see this movie in a full theater everyone should get.
Like it still holds up by yourself, but it's way
better with people.

Speaker 4 (08:40):
Right. I actually have not watched it by myself. I'm
looking forward to doing that. I thought it was so funny,
and it's interesting because it's like there's two parts there.
It's basically two different movies.

Speaker 3 (08:52):
Yeah, kind of three almost.

Speaker 4 (08:55):
Yeah, before the ship on the ship and then after
the shipwreck. Yeah, yeah, you're right. It's like there's a
through line of a couple characters basically that go through
all three what you could consider short films or something.
Who knows, maybe it was written that way in case
they you know, they didn't get the funding immediately and
had to go the proof of concept short film route,

(09:15):
which a lot of people do.

Speaker 3 (09:17):
Right. Yeah, I feel like this movie could very easily
work without part one, which is like just the two
models arguing about gender roles.

Speaker 4 (09:27):
To pay the check.

Speaker 3 (09:27):
Yes, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (09:29):
But he's cooking, Jamie.

Speaker 3 (09:31):
What's your relationship with the movie.

Speaker 2 (09:33):
I also saw this movie when it came out. I
also have not seen Force Masure. I'm almost certain I've
lied about it though, So if I told you I
saw it, I was lying to try to get through
the conversation a little easier.

Speaker 4 (09:48):
It's an important movie.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
Yeah. People do love to say have you seen Force Masure?
And I haven't, but I have said I have, but
I haven't. So this was my first Rubin also lynd movie,
and I really like it, and like we were saying,
a lot of similar movies came out around this time,
I think this is like the most fun one. I
was kind of burned out on this concept, and so

(10:12):
I sort of went into this movie not being sure
because I think I had already seen the menu at
this point and been like, Okay, we'd sea glass Onion
later and be like Ryan Johnson made a hundred million
dollars doing this movie, Like what are you talking about? Like, sure,
you know, eat the rich, but also accept one hundred
million dollars shit like that, right, Like Ruben Alson I
think gets it the most like clear, and I really

(10:37):
enjoyed it. And that's my entire history with this movie, Caitlin,
what's your history?

Speaker 3 (10:43):
Very similar? I saw in theaters, really liked it. It
was probably my like fourth favorite movie of twenty twenty two.
I've left a lot. I feel like I had a
similar theater going experience recently with the Substance, where oh yeah,
things escalate and you're just like, oh my gosh, because

(11:04):
what's unfolding on screen is just chaos and grotesqueness in
a really fun way.

Speaker 2 (11:12):
I also thought I had seen The Square, but it
turns out I was thinking of the movie The Box
starring Cameron DS. I was like, wow, that's crazy that
he directed The Box.

Speaker 3 (11:22):
There's also Cube.

Speaker 4 (11:24):
It'd be really funny if people had like an awards
show and they gave the award to a movie thinking
it was another movie. Oh no, we were thinking of, oh,
not The Box but the Cube. Oh my god.

Speaker 2 (11:38):
We gave Best International Picture to two thousand and nine
movie The Box. Whoops.

Speaker 3 (11:45):
I haven't seen The Box.

Speaker 2 (11:46):
It's like, absurdly not very good, but I enjoyed it.
They receive a box and if you press the button,
you get a million dollars but someone dies.

Speaker 3 (11:57):
Okay, interesting the end. Well, I'll check it out someday.
The point is, I really liked Triangle of Sadness, and
I remember it was nominated for a handful of Academy Awards,
including Best Picture. I remember the conversation about how Dolly
da Leone was snubbed for Best Actress, although she won

(12:18):
a couple other accolades that year for the movie won
the Palm d'Or it can. So I was like, I
have good taste. I liked this movie and other people
did too, but anyway, yeah, I really enjoyed it, and
there's so much to unpack.

Speaker 4 (12:36):
You said something interesting. It got nominated for a couple
of Oscars, I guess, and I don't. It might have
won one, but maybe not. But it struck me as
unusual because I'm conditioned to expect that the best movies
won't even be considered for Oscars usually, and that there's
a certain kind of like less good movie that's considered

(12:58):
for Oscars, where they're aiming for the accolades of the
award shows. And this didn't feel like that. It felt
like much funnier than anything that usually gets considered for
an Oscar, So I was interested that it slipped through.

Speaker 3 (13:14):
The same Yeah.

Speaker 2 (13:15):
I feel like that's been happening. I mean not to
like overgive the Oscars credit, but I feel like that's
happening more and more in a way that's kind of
encouraging that poor things did it as well as it did.

Speaker 3 (13:24):
Stuff like that, everything everywhere, all at once from the
same year.

Speaker 2 (13:28):
Yeah, like weird stuff.

Speaker 3 (13:30):
Well, let's take a quick break and then we'll come
back and do the recap.

Speaker 2 (13:34):
Shall we write?

Speaker 3 (13:44):
And we're back? All right? So here is the story.
We open on a casting call for male models. Here
we meet Carl played by Haristick, who goes in for
an audition. There's also this like I guess documentarian who's

(14:07):
interviewing some of the male models. And it's like, oh,
is this a grumpy brand or a happy brand? And
the cheaper the product that's being sold, this more smiley
the models, And the more expensive the product or the brand,
the frownier they are. I thought that was really funny. Yeah,
the casting directors see Carl, they're pretty judgy about his appearance.

Speaker 2 (14:31):
Yeah, and you're like, this Swede has a thing or
two to say about America, you know.

Speaker 3 (14:37):
One of them asks Carl to relax his triangle of sadness.

Speaker 4 (14:42):
Hey, that's the.

Speaker 2 (14:42):
Name of the movie. We're all cheering. We're cheering. Yeah, yeah,
the family guye joke.

Speaker 3 (14:48):
Normally, it doesn't come so soon into the movie. Usually
it's like, oh, and that's the silence of the Lambs,
and it's like somewhere in the third act, but yes, or.

Speaker 4 (14:59):
There's like a waste land where dystopia has landed upon
the earth and somebody's like, truly, it's always been a
triangle of sadness, right, but.

Speaker 3 (15:10):
This when you get it like five minutes into the movie.

Speaker 2 (15:12):
Not to keep bringing it up, but I bet that
happens in the box. Surely they say the box early
on in the movie.

Speaker 3 (15:18):
Oh yeah, like what's in the box?

Speaker 2 (15:20):
What's in the this the box?

Speaker 3 (15:22):
Yeah? Uh, that should be a quote in every movie,
not just seven in the box.

Speaker 2 (15:29):
It's true. It's wild that it happened twice, and that's
the only time the phrase comes up in the entire movie, right,
I think, so, yeah, yeah, And it refers to the
like area between your eyebrows, crucial.

Speaker 4 (15:41):
Area of making facial expressions, I guess.

Speaker 3 (15:45):
Especially sadness.

Speaker 2 (15:46):
We don't want to be making facial expressions.

Speaker 4 (15:49):
Now, I'm playing with my triangle of set. I can't help.
But when you start talking about it, and.

Speaker 2 (15:56):
People hate when people move their faces around when you're
supposed to look at so way, they're like, have a
static a face as humanly possible, because they're.

Speaker 3 (16:04):
Like, maybe he needs botox and that would really do numbers.

Speaker 2 (16:08):
He's like twenty four anyways.

Speaker 3 (16:12):
Okay, So from here the movie is divided into three parts.
Part one is called Carl and Yaya, referring to Carl
and his girlfriend, whose name is Yaya played by Ooh
and I don't actually know how to pronounce her first name.
It's just charlby Charleby Okay, yeah, charlby Dean, who is
a model and influencer and who makes more money than him, because,

(16:36):
as it's mentioned earlier, modeling is one of the few
industries where women tend to earn more money than men.
And this does not bother him at all. He's not
bothered by it. He's absolutely fine with it.

Speaker 2 (16:48):
It's fine.

Speaker 3 (16:49):
Huh.

Speaker 4 (16:49):
Is that when they fight over the check?

Speaker 2 (16:51):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (16:51):
Yeah, So Yaya expects Carl to, for example, pick up
the bill at their expensive dinners, and he confronts her this.
He also questions why it's so hard for her to
talk about money, and he speculates that it's perhaps because
it's so tied to gender roles, and he resents that

(17:11):
she subscribes to, you know, stereotypical gender roles of the
man expected to be the financial provider. He tells her
he feels used. He wants their dynamic to feel more equal,
and then she's like, but what if I become gregnant
and I can't work as a model anymore?

Speaker 2 (17:29):
What then?

Speaker 3 (17:31):
And then the conversation kind of like tapers off because
we then cut to part two.

Speaker 2 (17:36):
Unfortunately I do I mean not to say. I frequently say, actually,
this whole conversation has been a test and you failed.
But you know many such cases it's happened.

Speaker 3 (17:48):
Well, I mean, I've got thoughts. I can't wait to
talk about this because again, there's lots to unpack.

Speaker 4 (17:53):
Yeah, it was interesting for me to watch that scene
and see what exploration of like beautiful people having an
unpleasant dinner with their problems that they have.

Speaker 3 (18:03):
Yeah, I know, you just don't expect it to happen because.

Speaker 2 (18:06):
They're talking about money, for sure, but they're also not
talking about money, Like it's there's just there's so much
going on and they're both so hot and so unable
to communicate.

Speaker 3 (18:17):
Right, it's great. So then part two, called the Yacht,
we see a luxury cruise on a large yacht is
about to set off and a I don't know what
her job is, like guest services director or something, this
character named Paula. She's addressing the service crew about how
they should work hard to make this a great experience

(18:40):
for the wealthy passengers in the hopes that they get
a generous tip, and.

Speaker 2 (18:44):
They start like chanting.

Speaker 4 (18:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (18:46):
It kind of reminded me of like the McConaughey and
to cap like the chest pounding thing. Yeah yeah, capitalists
pounding of the chest scary so scary.

Speaker 4 (18:57):
Yeah, where it's like, hey, team, get together, time make
a bunch of big money. Go team.

Speaker 2 (19:02):
Yeah right, the chest pound of class mobility.

Speaker 3 (19:06):
Frightening. So we see them. We also see the like
cleaning and housekeeping crew, and there's like a clear class
hierarchy even among the crew, because it's implied that they're
on a lower hierarchical tier than the service crew. One
such member of the housekeeping crew is trying to clean

(19:27):
the room of Karl and Yaya who are on this cruise,
but they pretty rudely dismiss her, telling her to come
back later, and boyd does she come back later? In
the story that is wish. Then we see some of
the other wealthy passengers on this cruise, such as Dmitri,

(19:52):
his wife Vera, and his girlfriend Ludmilla. He's the like,
I sell shit guy because he made a fortune from
selling fertilizer, like agriculture fertilizer.

Speaker 4 (20:05):
This is my favorite character in the movie. He's fun
This is the James Adomian favorite characters are.

Speaker 2 (20:10):
Just saying this is just the idea of the King
of Shit is just so satisfying.

Speaker 4 (20:16):
And his name is Latgo Burick, and he's the character
actor from Eastern Europe. And I followed him on Instagram
after the movie because I thought he was so funny.

Speaker 2 (20:27):
He's really great. Got him and him and Woody Harrelson.
I wouldn't listen to that podcast, but many ex boyfriends would.

Speaker 4 (20:34):
Yeah. When he's first introduced, I mean, there's there's like
a magnetic presence to his character where he's kind of
like quizzing the couple that we've already been introduced to
and he's like, so you travel the world looking beautiful,
a pretty good gig, pretty good gig.

Speaker 2 (20:52):
Meanwhile, I'm the king of shit.

Speaker 4 (20:54):
Yeah right, And he's supposed to be like from he's like,
you know, lived through communism in Eastern Europe somewhere and
became this like very wealthy capitalist businessman. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (21:07):
They explicitly say he's Russian, so yeah.

Speaker 4 (21:10):
He's right, and the character is Russian. The whole movie
is full of these topsy turvy things where it's like
the man who's not making as much as his girlfriend
because of this particular industry, and then like the Russian
capitalist and the American communists and all this kind of things.

Speaker 3 (21:27):
You love to see it. So we meet him and
his various partners. We meet Clementine and Winston. They're the
older British couple who we will later learn our weapons manufacturers,
mister and missus.

Speaker 2 (21:43):
And grenade more industrial complex.

Speaker 1 (21:46):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (21:47):
We meet Teres, who recently had a stroke. She uses
a wheelchair and has limited speech. She can only say
a few words in German as a result of this stroke.
Vulcan do we know what this translates to? They say
it in the movie up in the sky. Oh okay,
so we meet her. We meet this uber rich code

(22:10):
developer guy Yarmo, who Carl and Dimitri think seems kind
of lonely and pathetic, but then he ends up flirting
with both of their girlfriends.

Speaker 2 (22:21):
And then they lose it.

Speaker 4 (22:23):
Yeah, yeah, yes, yes, he seems like the dorky guy
and he's the wealthy guy in the boat.

Speaker 3 (22:30):
Yeah, exactly what.

Speaker 4 (22:31):
The money plays in the board game.

Speaker 3 (22:33):
That's right. Meanwhile, Paula has been knocking on the door
of Captain Thomas, trying to get him to come out
and attend a safety drill or to plan the captain's dinner,
but he keeps saying he's not feeling well, though it's
heavily implied that he's actually very drunk all of the time.
We recognize the voice of Woody Harrelson. Of course, we

(22:56):
come back later.

Speaker 2 (22:57):
Yep, yep.

Speaker 3 (23:00):
I love his performance. It's incredible.

Speaker 2 (23:03):
I really love that his I mean, I guess spoilers
of you you should just watch the movie. But like
that his character is confined to this second act only
it just it feels right. I like it.

Speaker 3 (23:14):
Yeah. Then one of the rich people, Vera. This is
Dimitri's his wife, insists that all the crew should go
for a swim because quote unquote everyone is equal and
the crew works too hard, but that night is the
captain's dinner, and there's not really enough time to like
facilitate allowing the crew to go for this casual swim.

Speaker 2 (23:38):
Also off the water slide, to like it's just like
a weird humiliation ritual for the entire crew.

Speaker 3 (23:46):
Absolutely, it's obviously like commentary on what rich people think,
like their idea of generosity or their idea of equity.
You know.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
Well, it's like there's all these like repeating like at
the beginning of the movie, you have like, I don't know,
I guess this is a Reubenaus and thing. Again, I
lied about seeing force masure, so I don't fucking know.
But how at the beginning the fashion show where it
says like everyone is equal now and you have the
parade of models, and then that image is kind of repeated,
and the second act with like the crew on the
water slide and whatever on.

Speaker 4 (24:15):
And the slogans, the slogans that are deployed in place
of any kind of fair treatment of people.

Speaker 2 (24:22):
Exactly cynicism masquerading as optimism. I had to keep pausing
to like write down all the like horseshit that they're
putting on at the fashion show is fun.

Speaker 3 (24:33):
Something interesting about that scene too, is the there's like
people sitting in the front row of the fashion show,
but they're made to move because they're not as important
as the people who need their seats. So there's like
all these hierarchies, and even within like upper class people
or you know, like working class people, there are still hierarchies.
It's it's very interesting. So there's this swim that the

(24:57):
rich people are insisting on, and the chef in the
kitchen are like, well, if we leave the kitchen and
go for this swim, the food was gonna spoil. But
everyone's still basically forced to do this crew swim.

Speaker 4 (25:11):
Right, not going to argue about it, right.

Speaker 3 (25:14):
And also a storm is on the horizon, and all
of this culminates in almost everybody getting very very ill
at the captain's dinner. They're puking everywhere.

Speaker 2 (25:25):
Well, it's like all the rich people because I also
didn't pick up on this the first time. It is
because they're eating the food that is spoiled, and it's
their fault that it's spoiled. Like that'll bit precisely.

Speaker 4 (25:35):
Yes, it's because they distracted the crew.

Speaker 2 (25:39):
Yeah, I was like, why are only the rich people
throwing up? You're like, oh, yeah, because they're eating like
poisonous jelly or whatever. It's great.

Speaker 3 (25:45):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. So yeah, that's planted. It's
kind of subtle, so I could see why you would
miss it. But it seems to be a combination of
food poisoning and seasickness because there's this like storm that's
rocking the boat. But the people who avoid it are
for example, Captain Thomas, who eats a burger and fries

(26:05):
for dinner, which also.

Speaker 2 (26:07):
Happens in the menu. There's a huge like I was
born in the middle class, but now I have money.
Like that is I guess signaled through.

Speaker 3 (26:16):
A cheeseburger eating a yeah exactly. I don't know why
Dmitri avoids getting sick also, but he manages to evade
the barfing in the diarrhea.

Speaker 4 (26:27):
Right, it's only the people who had the seafood or
something like that, which is the popular dish. And it's
a fantastic visual imagery because you realize it's almost like
the director Rubenoslan, he sets up there's an element of
setting up these characters as like a kid playing with toys.

(26:48):
There's these rich people that are dressed in tuxedos and
now oops, they're gonna shit and vomit everywhere.

Speaker 3 (26:56):
It is honestly one of the most memorable and cathartic
and gratifying moments I've ever seen in any movie ever.
Just like watching these rich people in utter despair, humiliated,
puking everywhere, shitting themselves like helpless.

Speaker 2 (27:14):
It's beautiful. We covered The Exorcist earlier this week, so
it's just been a really great week for projectile vomit
on the cast.

Speaker 4 (27:21):
It really has Yeah, huge, I mean, I guess in
the preview there's some hint that there's something like this
that happens, but you don't realize the scope of this
scene because you think, like a lot of movies, you're like, well, okay,
they're gonna cut away from like they're gonna imply it
and get enough out, and then they're gonna cut away
to the aftermath or some other way of showing it,

(27:42):
you know, where there will be like we'll just show
vomit running from under the door or whatever, and then
you realize shot by shot, oh, he's gonna show all
of it. He's gonna show like fifty people getting seasick
and food poisoning at the same time.

Speaker 3 (27:59):
It's like a ten minute sequence. It goes on so long,
and it keeps escalating too, where like at some point
the plumbing starts overflowing with literal shit water and it's
like seeping out into the hallways and everything. So we're
watching all that unfold. Meanwhile, Captain Thomas and Dimitri are
getting drunk and discussing their political ideologies, with Captain Thomas

(28:23):
being a Marxist and Dimitri being a capitalist. And then
they go into the Captain's quarters and here's a Jamie
start a podcast over the intercom.

Speaker 2 (28:32):
Yeah, it's a hostage podcast.

Speaker 4 (28:35):
They're speaking over the intercom and presumably everyone's sick and
recovering from what just happened. And this is my favorite
scene of the movie, the conversation they have with each other. Yeah,
because they're both very funny. It's Woody Harrelson, it's Latko Buick,
and they're these opposites in two different ways, because it's
the you know, the Eastern European capitalist and the American communist.

(29:00):
She's rare, but not impossible, you know, and uh, it's
statistically rare, but there's you know, lots of communists in America,
and they're not just all constantly protesting. Sometimes they have
jobs and stuff.

Speaker 3 (29:12):
Sometimes they're the captain of a luxury cruise.

Speaker 4 (29:15):
It's a little bit of an absurdity. It's definitely like
a oh, well, that would really happen, but that's not
why I go to the movies and uh yeah, And.

Speaker 2 (29:25):
It felt like Rubin Assen was like aware of that too,
because the first time I saw it, Like, the scene
is so fucking funny. The Woody Harreld's character does say
it where he's like, I'm a shit socialist and it's like, yeah, man,
you are, like you're your whole like everyone who is
beneath you. You're just ignoring and literally locking out of
the room while you discuss theory, which is what a
lot of Marxists do is instead of going to like

(29:48):
talk to people.

Speaker 4 (29:49):
It's a great deep irony and the thing is full
of and this is what I love about him. It's
these upside down worlds that are then put in conversation
with each other. And I really though, I mean, there
was a moment in that scene watching it, where I
thought the filmmaker Ruben Ostlund was doing something very brilliant
that I had not seen before. Maybe I had read

(30:11):
it in like an ancient comedy play. It reminded me
of like Aristophanes, when you're halfway through the proceedings of
a comedy and then the character kind of breaks the
fourth wall and grandstands directly to the audience. Right.

Speaker 2 (30:26):
Yeah, Like there's just like a philosophy segment of this.

Speaker 4 (30:29):
Yes, And there's an interesting thing here. It's a captive
audience on the boat where they're all sick and they
have to listen. It's the captain. He locked himself in
the cabin and he's using the PA system from the boat,
and so they have to either put pillows over their
ears or they have to listen to it and it
and similarly, the movie audience is a captive audience for

(30:49):
this message. And it's this sort of politically radical theory
based history lesson that's delivered by a disc at a
ted narrator who's drunk and a bad captain. So by
the rules of comedy, he's allowed to say anything because
you don't care if he's the good guy or not.

(31:10):
And then I felt like he was holding the movie
critics and the elite academy hostage and forcing them to
listen to this scene and it was so preachy that
it's overtly preachy in the narrative where they're actually literally
just on a microphone bothering everybody with a podcast.

Speaker 2 (31:29):
Right.

Speaker 4 (31:30):
I loved when he goes, we knew it was wrong
when there were all those assassinations in the sixties, and
I was like, yes, I was like an ale.

Speaker 2 (31:39):
Yees a CIA killed MLK.

Speaker 4 (31:41):
Like there, I was like holding back from like vocally
cheering in the movie theater because I'm like he did it.
He forced everyone in the academy to sit through this
lecture about how America killed many of its greatest leaders
back in the sixties.

Speaker 3 (31:56):
He also mentions how, like you know, they'd install these
like dictators pup dictatorships, yes, in socialist countries in Latin
America and stuff like that, and You're just like what.
I also like, how he can't he's too drunk to
say shit socialist, so you be like I'm a shit socialist. Stop.

Speaker 4 (32:16):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (32:17):
And again like having that like layered sort of thing
where it's like you're forcing people who do not want
to hear this to listen to it, you're basically locking
everyone in the room. And like with the Woody Harrelson character,
he is like a Champagne socialist and like having that
sort of level too, where it's like he clearly wants
to argue with this Russian guy more than he wants

(32:40):
to like do other stuff.

Speaker 4 (32:42):
Yeah, but they're having one of these very they're making
each other laugh too, which is an interesting thing. Yeah,
and you wonder how much of that is the actors
just liking each other. And that scene is also I mean,
I guess it must be said. It's like the opposite
of a Bechdel test scene where it's just two guys
holding everyone off.

Speaker 3 (33:00):
But I don't mind. I'm having a great time watching.

Speaker 2 (33:02):
It, which is wild that like, yeah, this movie does
actually pass the bactal test, but if there was doubt,
that scene will only increase the doubt. It's such a
good scene because it's like they're these characters are like
weird tethers to each other.

Speaker 3 (33:15):
Yeah, and then Dimitri's like, I'm the new owner of
this ship and it's going down and everyone's like, oh
my god. Yeah he's joking, but like, everyone's scared.

Speaker 2 (33:25):
They don't know.

Speaker 3 (33:26):
They think maybe the ship is crashing. There's a huge storm.
It's wild. It's such a bananas scene that I enjoy
very much. And again, while they're like doing their political
ideology podcast over the intercom, we see an addition to
all the rich people puking and shooting their guts out,
we see the housekeeping crew trying to clean up the mess,

(33:48):
kind of to no avail because again the shit water
is seeping into the carpet and stuff. And then the
yacht is attacked by like modern day potates via gunfire
and hand grenades, the very hand grenade that the British
couple who are weapons manufacturers, they're killed by their own grenade.

Speaker 2 (34:11):
It's so awesome. They're like, oh, it's one of us.

Speaker 4 (34:16):
Yeah, yeah, that was a very funny line. Madam Clementine,
Oh dark, there's a grenade that rolls on and she goes.

Speaker 3 (34:24):
It's cut to explosion. They die. The yacht presumably sinks,
because then we cut to part three, called the Island,
where a few people have made it to a nearby
island that seems uninhabited.

Speaker 2 (34:41):
Wait, Caitlin, did you think I was like, well, it's
like they skipped the second half of the movie Titanic,
like they just were like, a.

Speaker 4 (34:48):
Few hours later, the whole shipwreck, we just we don't
even do it. Because that's interesting because you know, James
Cameron would make that the entire movie, and well, yeah,
there's many filmmakers that would be like, we gotta get
eyes on all these people who've just vomited as they're
as they're slowly sinking in a shipwreck.

Speaker 3 (35:07):
I feel like Reuben Austin was either like, well, yeah,
we've already seen that movie, or he's like, we don't
have the budget for a shipwreck, so we're just gonna
cut to we blew everything on the vomit.

Speaker 2 (35:18):
It works. I Like I remember, like for the for
the first ten minutes of the Island sequence, the first
time I saw it, I was like, all right, Woody
Harrelson's gonna be back any second now, and then you're like, oh,
he's not coming.

Speaker 3 (35:30):
He didn't.

Speaker 4 (35:30):
He just implied he didn't survive the shipwreck.

Speaker 3 (35:33):
Well, the captain always goes down with the ship.

Speaker 2 (35:35):
Captain, So was he really a shit socialist after all?

Speaker 3 (35:41):
True?

Speaker 2 (35:41):
He's for the people.

Speaker 3 (35:43):
Yeah, Okay, so survivors on the island include yah Yan,
Carl Dimitri, the coder, Guy Yarmou, the like cruise director,
Lady Paula Teres, the Indian Vulcan woman, is well as
a character who we've never seen before, Nelson, who Dimitri

(36:04):
accuses of being one of the pirates, and Nelson is like, no, no, no,
I work in the engine room. Oh you think just
because I'm black, I must be a pirate And that
keeps like getting called into question throughout the rest of
the movie. In any case, that first night on the island,
everyone is scared and hungry and thirsty, and there's animal

(36:24):
sounds coming from the nearby jungle. And then the next morning,
a lifeboat with some supplies and a person inside washes ashore.
This person is Abigail played by Dolly de Leon. She's
one of the housekeeping crew who we've seen before.

Speaker 4 (36:42):
And it's like a metal lifeboat, right, it's a.

Speaker 3 (36:45):
Yeah, it seems pretty sturdy. There's like a roof attached
to it. It's like enclosed.

Speaker 2 (36:49):
It's like a little submarine.

Speaker 3 (36:51):
Yeah. The others soon realize that Abigail is a great
asset for the island because she's the only one who
knows how to fish, who knows how to build a fire,
who knows how to prepare and cook her catch. Her
first catch is an octopus, and she takes half of

(37:12):
the octopus for herself, and then the rest is divided
between or I guess, among the seven other people. And
they're like, well, why do you get so much food Abigail,
and she's like, well, I did all of the work.
And Paula, who was Abigail's boss on the yacht, is
acting like that power dynamic still exists between them, saying like,

(37:33):
you know, you're just a toilet manager, Abigail, and Abigail's like,
things have changed. I'm the captain now.

Speaker 2 (37:40):
I like that. You see, I kind of forgot that.
There's a moment where you see Abigail like earlier when
Paula is like, oh, Abigail, give us the water, give
us the chips, like you see a moment where Abigail
sort of defaults to the structure that did exist on
the boat because she keeps hesitating being like wait, I
don't and then by the next thing and she's like,

(38:01):
I don't have to do this, and then the movie
gets crazier and great, yeah, is it.

Speaker 4 (38:06):
Right around here that they she asked them what skills
they have? Yeah, and so my favorite guy is let
go Burrick. She asked him and another guy, like, do
you guys have any skill useful skills? And he just goes, no, no,
that's his answer. So funny that someone would just say
that's do you have any survival skills? No?

Speaker 3 (38:28):
No, no, Yeah, that's only Abigail. And so as the captain,
she decides who gets to sleep in the lifeboat with
her and like be safe from the animals lurking in
the forest. Yeah, So that night, Abigail, Paula, and Yeah
Yah sleep inside the lifeboat while the others are left
to tend to the fire and keep it going so

(38:48):
that Abigail doesn't have to put all the work into
building a new fire the next day. But those people,
primarily Carl and Nelson, fall asleep and the fire goes
out and.

Speaker 2 (39:00):
They steal pretzel sticks.

Speaker 3 (39:01):
They steal pretzel sticks and then lie about stealing them,
and Abigail is not happy about this, and so she
punishes them by not feeding them that day. But then
she's like, well, Carl, because you didn't eat anything, now
you can sleep in the lifeboat with me.

Speaker 4 (39:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (39:19):
I also like that. She starts by that. Abigail starts
by being like, Okay, all of the women are going
to be in like the safest place. But then when
that like does not, I don't know, it's like it
starts with that, but then she's like, wait a second,
this actually is not working because the women inside the
boat are still trying to enforce the class dynamic. So
she's like, okay, well let's switch it again. And it's

(39:40):
just like interesting watching her navigate, like what is the
smartest way to do this and survive and like maintain power.

Speaker 3 (39:48):
She realizes she has all the power on this island
and she does not hesitate to exert it.

Speaker 4 (39:53):
Very quickly realizes it.

Speaker 3 (39:57):
And so Yaya after Abigail is like, Karo, come sleep
with me. Yah Ya is like, well, she probably wants
to have sex with you, but you can't do it.
But sure enough, Carl and Abigail start a sexual relationship.
The dynamic being Abigail is using her power to gain
access to this young attractive man, which you know, upsets

(40:20):
ya Yah and upsets everyone else on the island because
they're like, well, we want pretzel sticks too, and she's
like no, no, I control whetzel sticks.

Speaker 4 (40:30):
Yeah, I think there's a there's a moment where some
of the uglier guys try to get the same deal
well because.

Speaker 3 (40:35):
They're they're trying to trade their like expensive watches as
if that has any currency or any value on the island,
and she's like, what the fuck am I gonna do
with your watch right now? I don't need that shit.
Then there's a brutal scene where they kill a donkey
I hate.

Speaker 2 (40:52):
It, which is weird foreshadowing unfortunately to like the last
shot of the movie.

Speaker 3 (40:57):
True.

Speaker 4 (40:57):
Yeah, because they're like scared, they don't know what it is.
They think it's a and it turns out that it's
just a donkey.

Speaker 2 (41:02):
Yeah, it just takes a really long time to die.
It's like and then, I mean I thought that was
kind of funny. It is like, yeah, it's like the
Koder guy who's like, okay, I'm going to like hyper mask,
like I'm gonna kill the donkey, and then it takes
so long and he gets so upset that he's like
weeping by the end. It needs to be comforted.

Speaker 3 (41:20):
Yes, it's easy, and we're like, what if that was
donkey from Shrek?

Speaker 2 (41:26):
Damn?

Speaker 3 (41:26):
You know makes you think.

Speaker 2 (41:28):
Makes you think it's one grieving dragon. I guess it's.

Speaker 4 (41:32):
An unnecessarily violent rewrite on Shrek.

Speaker 2 (41:35):
Yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 4 (41:37):
Don't remember where it falls. Where is the scene where
I always call him as Lotco but the Dmitri? What
is the scene where Dimitri?

Speaker 3 (41:46):
Are you referring to the moment where his dead wife
washes ashore and he takes off all of her expensive jewelry.

Speaker 4 (41:53):
It is so darkly funny. It's one of the darkest
funniest moments I've ever seen, where he's weeping and holding
the pale dead body of his drowned wife and crying
and caressing, and then stops and takes off the very
expensive necklace to.

Speaker 2 (42:12):
Keep like putting on a show for himself. Basically, yeah,
I think it's right around here.

Speaker 3 (42:21):
It may have already happened, but yeah, that takes place,
and it's very funny. Then it seems like it's been
a couple weeks since they've been on the island, and
Yai y'all wants to go on a hike over the
mountain to see if she can find anything, and Abigail
offers to go with her. There's also a quick scene

(42:45):
where seems like a local who lives on the island
shows up trying to like sell his wares, but the
only one around is Teres, who, because of her very
limited speech, is not able to communicate what the situation is.
So he like gets free out and leaves. So like
they had a chance to be saved, but it didn't
work out. So back on the hike, Yaya discovers an

(43:09):
elevator to a resort. So it turns out there's this
luxury resort that's been on this island the whole time,
and they find it, and so it seems like they're saved.
And then the end is a bit ambiguous. I will
share my interpretation of events, curious to hear what other
people thought about it. But so here's what I felt
was going on. They find the elevator, it seems like

(43:31):
they'll be able to get off the island and continue
on with their lives. Abigail, presumably not wanting to give
up the power she has accumulated on the island, picks
up a large rock, intending to smash it over Yaya's
head to kill her donkey style what they did with
the donkey moments earlier. But before she does this, Yahya

(43:53):
is like, by the way, I can try to help you,
you know, maybe you can come and work for me,
be my assistant, which makes Abigail hesitate, and we don't
see her actually like smash the rock on Yaya's head
or anything, but we do cut to Carl running through
the forest panicking. Seems like he's going in the same

(44:14):
direction we saw Abigail and yah Ya go, maybe because
he heard yah Ya cry for help. We're not sure.
It's very ambiguous again, but I feel as though Abigail
did end up killing ya Ya because she was like,
why would I want to be an assistant to this
like rich woman when I could be captain of the

(44:36):
island right the end.

Speaker 2 (44:38):
And I could just ration brattel sticks forever. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 (44:43):
It looks like that's what happens. It looks like that
was that's what happens, or at least there was an
attempt to do that in the movie ends.

Speaker 3 (44:50):
Yeah, well, let's take a quick break and then we'll
come back to discuss, and.

Speaker 2 (45:03):
We're back Where to begin? Where to begin?

Speaker 4 (45:07):
What a dark film? Hilarious and ominous and it's interesting
how funny it is for how ominous and dark it
is like pessimistic about human ethics.

Speaker 3 (45:20):
Right.

Speaker 4 (45:20):
Yeah, there's not really a great good character in the movie.
It's more as like.

Speaker 2 (45:26):
Doing the right thing, and it definitely does sort of
subscribe to like the absolute power her ups absolutely kind
of idea that like there's never a possibility that there's
going to be shared wealth. But when you're with Abigail's character,
you're like, well, she'sn't fucking ohe them anything, Like it
is cathartic seeing her treat them like shit. One of

(45:49):
the things I really liked about this movie, especially, I know,
like you could paregre it to the others, but it
really did like bug me in twenty twenty two was that, like,
I think a lot of movies that are like talking
about class or even like trying to talk about class
present the like halves and the havelves not in a
very like binary way, and there's so many like shades

(46:10):
of gray, and like the way that this like boat
is presented where you have obviously the uber wealthy, but
there's shades of gray to the uber wealthy in the
fact that it's like Yaya and Carl are wealthy for now,
but they're also sort of living on borrowed time, and
it's implied that they'll only be valuable for as long
as they're beautiful.

Speaker 4 (46:30):
They're aware of that, Yes, yeah, there's a shelf life,
and they're not.

Speaker 3 (46:34):
As wealthy as the people who paid their way onto
the cruise because they got the cruise for free, so
we can assume, you know, some influencers do make millions
of dollars and end up being wealthy, but they're not
the same level of like I've exploited people and made
my wealth off of grenades, grenades and land mines. So

(46:57):
there's even a hierarchy there.

Speaker 2 (47:00):
And that's like part of what the first section addresses
is that they're both very conscious of like this possibly
being temporary and that they'll have to like scrabble to
maintain it. And then in like the middle section, you
have the like mostly white service crew on the boat
and they're sort of like aspiring to be of a

(47:20):
higher class and completely ignoring the lowest class on the ship,
where it's like implied that there's no chance of moving classes.
It's mostly people of color and like scurious what you
guys said, because the lowest class. In the movie, we
do see Abigail a number of times, but we it's intentional,
but like, we don't get to know anybody until we

(47:42):
get to the island. We get to know a lot
of people in the highest in the middle class in
like the first two acts of the movie, but it's
not really until we get to the island that we
get to know Abigail with any sort of like nuance.

Speaker 4 (47:55):
I saw the whole thing as a filmmaker roasting and
satder rising a well off, important audience, and I think
it's made. It's made for all of us to laugh
at them, but it's also made. It's made for them
to be like, look at you idiots, right. I think
there's a there's a heavy metaphor allegory you could put

(48:17):
onto it, which is that the boat itself is like
the planet that we're on.

Speaker 3 (48:20):
It's a microcosm.

Speaker 4 (48:22):
Yes, this is a microcosm of our planet. And you know, hey,
look at you, Look at you assholes. You're also mortal. Yeah,
you're bound to the same cycle of life that the
rest of us are. I think it's a very interesting
attack on the hyper wealthy. I think that the boat itself,
the yacht, makes a fantastic story vehicle, like no better

(48:47):
place to have a bunch of classes illustrated and the
hypocrisies and the struggles of the different social classes. And
also I do think it works as a an allegory
figure for the planet that we live on. M M.

Speaker 2 (49:03):
The first time I saw in theaters, I was like,
I wish we got to know, you know, people from
the lowest class on the boat sooner. But it does
feel like it's almost like Rubert Ousland is very likely
trying to like prey on his viewers willingness to ignore
them and then have Abigail be a really prominent character
later in the movie because the way that society trains

(49:24):
you is to ignore people of the lowest station. And
I don't know, Yeah, Caitlyn, what was your take on that?

Speaker 3 (49:31):
So the first time I saw the movie, I had
a slightly different reaction than I do now, which was like,
is this really the story we need to be telling that.
You know, this working class like toilet manager, like literal
shit cleaner, has a very undesirable job, gets access to
power because of her skills that none of these wealthy

(49:55):
class people have, and you know, you see her like
rise to and you're like, yes, go, But then she
basically installs a dictatorship on this island right then, and
you're like, oh, to the point where she's like dolling
out punishments to people, she's withholding resources, she is about

(50:17):
to murder someone exploiting sex, like right, She's like yeah,
she's exerting her power to gain access to the sexual
conquest and all this stuff. And I was like, well,
I don't know if that's the message we should be
sending out that, like a working class woman of color
is gonna be evil if given the opportunity, especially like
coming from a white cis man director. But then I

(50:41):
was like, well, I guess this is more a commentary
on like meritocracy and how it's actually not great and
how it's basically capitalism because it is still it's like
inherently ablest and still dependent on hierarchies and an imbalance
of power because like she's like, well, I have the skills,
so I deserve more. But it's like, well, also she's

(51:04):
fucking over all these rich people, and that is satisfying
to watch.

Speaker 2 (51:08):
But it's like as a revenge story, it's very satisfying.

Speaker 3 (51:12):
As a revenge story. Yes, So there's like all these
moving parts. There's all these things. I still don't know
quite what to make of the end. I have complicated
feelings about it. I think at the end of the day,
I appreciate it as a commentary on power corrupts those
who possess it, and that meritocracy is actually not a

(51:33):
good solution as a system of government. Right, So that's
where I'm landing.

Speaker 4 (51:42):
I disagree with that, and I think that very similarly,
I think it's a playful warning from within the upper class,
the elite, hyper wealthy. I think it's a warning from
within that there is a fantastic reck and come up
and surround the corner.

Speaker 3 (52:03):
That too, right, rich people are not afraid enough of
the working class.

Speaker 2 (52:08):
That's the tricky part of all these movies is they're
all made by rich people, so it's like always gonna
be the paradox. I don't know, Yeah, kill I hear
what you're saying. And also realistically, if you're Reuben Auslind,
you're like, well, who's going to see this movie. Who's
this movie going to get to? Probably mostly middle class,
upper middle class and rich people. So like, I definitely

(52:30):
understand the criticisms of it. I like it more every
time I watch it though mm hmm, maybe I just
haven't read enough Marx, and by that I mean any
I haven't read any say like Force Mazure for me.

Speaker 3 (52:41):
Well, one of my favorite moments of the movie is
you see the Dimitri character spouting all these Reagan quotes
and talking about how awesome capitalism and then and then
the second the tables have turned and he is no
longer in a position of wealth and power and he
is at the mercy of someone else's power. He says

(53:02):
the you know, from each according to ability, to each
according to need in that.

Speaker 4 (53:07):
Because he would have grown up under that and would
have remembered it of course.

Speaker 1 (53:11):
Right.

Speaker 2 (53:11):
That's like the part of the movie that I've like,
there's like no doubt that it has done super well.
Is like watching the rich people squirm and have their
ideology adjust in real time to like the rich people
become like, well, no, we should do socialism now that
we have nothing to contribute.

Speaker 3 (53:27):
Now that it would benefit us exactly, yes, right, because like,
on one hand, it's commentary about like the undervaluing of labor,
especially what is considered to be quote unquote low skill labor.
But it's that type of labor which only Abigail knows
how to do, which allows them to survive because she's

(53:49):
feeding them, and like the currency now is food, but
also beauty, and that's something that the director discussed as
being like the primary theme he was interested in exploring
this movie. He wanted to talk about beauty as currency,
which is why there's so much focus on the model

(54:10):
couple at the beginning, and how you can use beauty
if you have it as a means for upward mobility,
because that's how this couple ends up on this cruise
that they probably wouldn't have been otherwise able to afford.

Speaker 4 (54:28):
Even in the post apocalyptic tables turned world.

Speaker 2 (54:31):
Right, it's like still currency, right, because we have this
situation where Abigail, now that she is this dictator, she
uses her power to gain sexual favors from the most
attractive man on the island, and it's something that we
see men in power do all.

Speaker 3 (54:54):
The time, and so we get this kind of gender
role reversal here. Doesn't make it any better, It still
makes it disgusting to, you know, exploit your power for
any kind of gain and exploitation. But it's just really
interesting to see play out.

Speaker 2 (55:11):
And I like that part of the function of that
first part is that it's not like the the hot
people are presented as like infallible, like there, it's also
clear that what their power is is potentially temporary and
like how I mean whatever I guess, Like The Substance
is the most recent movie that illustrates that point of like,

(55:32):
if you are in a position where your value is
connected to how traditionally beautiful you're perceived to be, then
things are always going to change. And like that conversation
towards the beginning with Yahya and Carl and Yaya being like, well,
what if I got pregnant, Like, what would happen?

Speaker 4 (55:50):
Then?

Speaker 2 (55:50):
If my value shifted in the public eye? How would
that affect me? And what would I do? And I mean,
obviously she doesn't get pregnant, but you see, you see
her value shift and you see his value shift. As
the movie goes.

Speaker 3 (56:04):
On, there's a line from Yaya toward the end where
she and Abigail are on the hike and she's like,
I'm so impressed by what you've done here, Abigail. You've
managed to run a fucking matriarchy here, and you've domesticated
all the old alpha males and on the surface, like
a very surface level, Yeah, that's true. It's a you know,

(56:26):
a woman is the leader of this group. She has
these other women like helping her and defending her, because
there's that scene where shortly after she has declared herself
the captain and Karl is protesting and he's pointing at
her and he's using this aggressive body language and he's
just like, well, I don't see how this is fair,
and his girlfriend Yahya turns on him, is defending Abigail,

(56:49):
being like, don't have that aggressive posture. You're lying and
you're stealing and da da da. So like on the surface,
it seems like, yes, it's this group of women led
by a woman who has taken charge. And again, like
on a very surface level, that's satisfying to see, especially
as like a woman of color rising through the ranks

(57:12):
by circumstance to become the leader of these formerly rich people.
But again it's still if you like, peel away the
layers of the Shrekkian onion, who if you are. Again,
she's the leader only because she feels entitled to these things,

(57:34):
and it's complicated.

Speaker 2 (57:37):
Yeah, I mean that's part of why I feel like
Yaya is like such a tricky character to talk about
because I guess, yeah, I'd about to be like this
Swedish guy had something interesting to say about intersectional feminism,
but hear me out. I do think Ruben Auslin is
trying to say so many things and address so many
dynamics in this movie that it's not humanly possible really

(57:59):
for all of them to come together in a cohesive way.
They don't necessarily have to. It's just like it's there's
so much. But I do think it's interesting with Yaya,
where you know, Abigail originally, I think she like appeals
to the women and the women one of whom, especially
like Paula, was originally condescending to her, and only kind

(58:20):
of joins as a subordinate because it's a way to survive,
not because it's actually a showing of mutual respect. We
know that Paula doesn't respect Abigail for sure, and so
it's like interesting watching the like sub class dynamic between
women because I feel like sometimes it's just suggested that,
you know, like everyone of one gender will all come
together to overthrow blah blah blah blah blah, and it's

(58:42):
like a nice idea, but there are sub dynamics obviously,
and you have three women from three different classes, and
so of course it doesn't you know, that line from
Yaya at the end sort of rings hollow. And then
once there's like the promise of the natural quote unquote
order being restored, Yaya immediately becomes kind of condescending to

(59:02):
Abigail again and is like, you should work for me,
when ten minutes ago, Yah, y'all worked for her, right?

Speaker 3 (59:10):
I mean, I think, and this is something we talk
about a lot, but the tendency to assume that everyone
in a particular group is a monolith, that oh, women
will show solidarity for other women, or all women of
color will handle things the same way because of their experience,

(59:31):
and we see time and time again that that is
not true.

Speaker 2 (59:34):
Women of all like classes or whatever exactly.

Speaker 3 (59:37):
Like it take any you know, classification of people. There's
so many examples to the contrary of that, and I
think this movie like shows an interesting example of that
with the Abigail character and her behavior. But I don't know,
I'm just like, was this guy the right person to
make that claim? I'm not sure this guy being the

(01:00:00):
writer director, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:00:02):
I think there's a pessimism at the heart of the movie,
which is reflected in the title Triangle of Sadness. And
I think you know, and you can look at it
like three acts that are tied together, where it's sort
of like a cycle that keeps happening, or you could
look at it as it's a comedic mirror of suffering,

(01:00:24):
that people keep repeating a pattern of the same suffering
upon each other and different in these groups, in these
class groups, and that there's like injustice and a reaction
to it that's also imbalanced, and then it goes back
to a status quo and that it repeats and repeats
and repeats, and that we're basically it looks to me
like we're locked in a triangle of sadness. Wow, Like

(01:00:48):
as much as possible, he's showing a mirror of like, well,
this is how it is. Even people who are trying
to make it better are making it worse.

Speaker 2 (01:00:57):
Right, Yeah, this is like Ruben awesome kind of presenting
his worldview kind of because it doesn't I mean, the
movie isn't going to give us like clean answers because
Ruben Auslin does not have the solution to society. I
don't know if like this movie presents a lot of questions,
it doesn't really hit answers, but that makes sense. I

(01:01:18):
kind of like the ending for that reason, Where would
it be cathartic? I guess to see Abigail land the
rock on Yaya's head, even if you like Yaya a
little bit, sure like, but it makes sense that Abigail
is because it's still a tragic ending on a long

(01:01:38):
enough timeline. Even if Abigail does do that, she's buying time.
But their system is not sustainable, you know, Abigail cannot
sustain this group of people forever. Eventually they're gonna have
to go to the resort, or eventually someone's gonna find
the resort because we and we know that because someone
from the resort has already found them. So Abigail could

(01:02:00):
be by killing someone, you know, buying herself a couple
of hours, right, and so like it is this brutal cycle.
It's not like there's a happy ending, even by like
Abigail's definition, and she seems to possibly know that.

Speaker 3 (01:02:16):
Right yeah, I mean, like flash forward to a few
hours after the movie ends, It's like, okay, they have
been discovered. She's arrested for murder, Abigail is for the
murder of Yah Yah. Yeah, and she's even worse off
than when she started as an incarcerated person. So it's

(01:02:38):
such an interesting movie. I love all the the queries
it poses.

Speaker 4 (01:02:44):
Like a good comedy, it raises more questions that it answers. Yeah,
I mean it is something to be talked about or
to inspire a conversation about large issues. I don't think
that they're I'm kind of relieved there's not like a
companion manifesto of like, how should we solve this strigle

(01:03:05):
of sadness.

Speaker 2 (01:03:06):
As I was rewatching it, I was like, oh, that
was like part of what was irritating about the other
things in the genre. Whereas it's like there is some
sort of like clean conclusion to it that it feels
like this is this director's version of solving class inequality.
And you're like, okay, like you know, it just always

(01:03:26):
kind of doesn't really work.

Speaker 4 (01:03:28):
But yeah, it looks like the messages, it's gonna be
really messy and ugly if you want to solve it.

Speaker 2 (01:03:35):
Yeah, yeah, right. I wanted to just mention Teres really
quick because we get to know her the smallest bit.
I mean, I think the characters we get to know
least to survive are Nelson and Teres, and they're kind
of paired off together at different points where it seems
like they kind of forge your friendship. Yeah, I think
it's interesting that we learn about Teres. We don't really

(01:03:56):
learn about Nelson other than the fact that here in
the engine room or worked in the engine room of
the ship that blew up. But there is like one
character sort of development about Therese where it's like a
humanizing moment for her because we don't really know anything
about her other than that she's rich and that she
has this disability and that we learn that like she's

(01:04:20):
like used sex to get a job before. But it's
like this very like I don't know's I thought it
like a weirdly sweet moment between the two of them
where she yeah, yeah, like I liked.

Speaker 3 (01:04:30):
It, like goofing around about it.

Speaker 2 (01:04:32):
Yeah, I liked that moment. But otherwise, I mean, it
feels like it does sort of go into this very
like you're saying, James, like this really dark worldview that
Ruben Oslin has where it's like her disability means that
the able bodied characters frequently forget about her. And that

(01:04:53):
she is like treated you know, inherently differently by the
other characters, and we don't really get much more than that.
I mean, I would be curious to hear what disabled
people thought of that character. But yeah, I mean it
felt like an acknowledgment that when these able bodied characters
were put into an extreme situation, they you know, sort

(01:05:15):
of treat Teres as a second class citizen.

Speaker 3 (01:05:17):
I mean, that's what happens in a meritocracy, right, right, Yeah,
it just means that the two characters of the Survivors
who we learn the least about are a black character
and a disabled character. Yeah, and those optics aren't great.
I I don't know, I just like have other stray

(01:05:39):
thoughts about the movie, like the rich people's idea of
what generosity is, because you have things like at the beginning,
ya Ya saying I'm a very generous person. Ask any
of my friends. I gave you that shirt, I took
you to dinner, and then Carl retorts with like, well
you got this shirt for free, and I was the

(01:06:00):
one who ended up paying for dinner. So those are
bad examples. So you have like Yah Yah's inflated sense
of self in thinking she's so generous when actually she's
probably not generous at all. You have Yarmo telling Yahya
and Ludmilla, who we don't see very much in the movie,
but it's Dimitri's like younger trophy girlfriend that he tells

(01:06:25):
the two of them, Oh, you're so generous for like
taking a picture with me. I'm gonna buy you both Rolexes,
and it's you know, he thinks they're generous because they
paid attention to him, a billionaire, and so his idea
of generosity is so skewed. You have the whole thing
with Vera being like, oh, life is so unfair to

(01:06:48):
you working class people. We're all equal, and that's why
I'm forcing you to go down a water slide.

Speaker 2 (01:06:56):
Literally dance, monkey dance, like literally, yeah, I think that
she's doing a good thing when like everyone is clearly
very uncomfortable.

Speaker 3 (01:07:04):
And then there's the character Alicia, who she makes like
sit in the hot tub in her like Leonardo DiCaprio moment, wow,
fly clothed in water. But it's just laughable and again
just like a stupid commentary on rich people's idea of
generosity is and how skewed it is. Similarly, the things

(01:07:27):
that the rich people try to offer to Abigail once
they're on the island. We touched on this already, but
like the rich men trying to like give her their
watches are saying, Oh, as soon as we get off
the island, I'll make your life easy and comfortable. Knowing
that like they'll probably forget about Abigail immediately, yah yah,
being like, come and work for me as my assistant

(01:07:49):
and be at my beck and call.

Speaker 2 (01:07:51):
Right the second that there's a chance for her to
get out.

Speaker 3 (01:07:54):
Yeah. So I enjoyed those bits of commentary. I thought
they were very effective.

Speaker 2 (01:07:59):
The Alicia moment reminded me of I don't know if
I've talked about it on the show before. My first
job out of college was like working at this bakery
where we were called guest huggers.

Speaker 3 (01:08:09):
Oh, I remember you talking about.

Speaker 2 (01:08:11):
It like that weird like coercion moment where you are
like a middle class worker. I mean, that's like who
most closely identified with on the boat. I was like
serving their coffee, making their law dies, giving them biscuits
or whatever. But any guest could come in and make
you hug them, and that was like a part of
the job. Where it could just be some fucking creep,

(01:08:32):
which it always was. No person who's normals like, hey,
twenty one year old girl, give me a hug, but
you did have to do it. And that is what
that scene felt like to me, is having to hug
a stinky rich person in the financial district at five
thirty am. But just to like talk a little bit

(01:08:53):
about the Yaya Carl dynamic. It's so hard to talk
about because I mean, and that's like part of why
I feel like the movie's so well written. But I
don't know, there's moments with like you're not allying with
the hyper wealthy women, but also you can feel that
they are being used for their looks, and so there

(01:09:16):
is like an exchange taking place there. The conversation between
Carl and Yaya is so infuriating because he is being
an asshole, but he also does have a point, yeah,
and the thing that is like weird to be like
at the end of that scene, Yaya comes back and
apologizes to him, which again you're like, well maybe, but

(01:09:40):
he was like being a real asshole too, Like they
were just both being.

Speaker 3 (01:09:44):
Assholes for sure, and she admits to like manipulating him.
She's like, I don't even realize I'm doing it, but
I know that I am.

Speaker 4 (01:09:52):
Right.

Speaker 2 (01:09:53):
I do hate the Carl character where like and then
Carl is just like, thank you for saying that, Like
he doesn't admit any fault, Like she a apologizes to
him for being manipulative, which is true, and then he's like,
thank you so much for saying that, But he doesn't
apologize for being cruel, for blah blah blah, like anything
like that.

Speaker 4 (01:10:09):
I feel like it's fun to see that early in
the movie. As early in the movie, you see that
the two quote unquote it's an ensemble film, but the
two main characters of the through line of the movie
are in a toxic relationship that looks beautiful and perfect
from the outside to everyone else, right, and in other
scenes they maintain it. They act like they're very lucky,

(01:10:33):
very perfect people.

Speaker 3 (01:10:34):
For sure. Their conversation in part one where Carl is presenting,
He's like, why don't you want feminism? Why don't you
want equality between us?

Speaker 2 (01:10:48):
I just want us to be equals. And I feel
like when he's getting something right, yeah, Also, okay, so
I've just speaking from personal experience here this conversation, like
it touches on something that I've been.

Speaker 3 (01:11:02):
Thinking about a lot lately, where in the context of
heterosexual dating, which I tragically engage in, and in the
context of like paying for things on dates. I used
to be very like, I'm a strong independent woman. I
don't need a man paying for me for things. Let's

(01:11:23):
split the bill or you know, da da da. I
was like pro distributing wealth in a relationship or whatever
or in a date in context. And now I'm like,
men owe me money. Like every man I've ever dated,
every man who's ever been inside me, owes me money.
And I don't want to pay for anything, and they

(01:11:44):
should pay for everything. As long as like gender based
income disparity exists, as long as we're living under the patriarchy,
men owe me money. And that is my brave statement.
Thank you so much, incredible.

Speaker 2 (01:11:58):
Yeah, that seed is so hard, right because I, like, thankfully,
or maybe I'm just not hot enough cannot relate to
that exact dynamic between people. But it is tricky when
it's like, you know, I've been in relationships where like
I am the financially dominant person and in a hetero couple,
it is fucking weird. And you're like it is a

(01:12:19):
strange thing to navigate. There's not at least you know,
like certainly not how I grew up, there was no
precedent for it. It was either equal or because of
how payment structures worked, like even if both couples worked,
the dad made more money. And it is interesting watching
these two fail to have a productive conversation about that.

(01:12:43):
I guess because I think points were made. Also the
fact that like they just acknowledge Yeah, I don't know.
I also hate Carl, so I'm like, just pay for dinner,
you fucking loser. So I guess that's sorted with either.

Speaker 4 (01:12:57):
To me, it just looks like two manipulative people who
are locked into like two cobras that are stalking each other.
It looks like two toxic narcissists who are who've settled
into an awful, terrible orbit around each other.

Speaker 2 (01:13:12):
Yeah. Well yeah, because I mean on the Yaya end
of things, the dynamics switch. Every time there's a power shift,
the things between them flip flop, like several times in
the movie where originally he also another thing that just
I find so irritating about this character that kind of
comes all the way around is at the beginning where
he's like, I'm gonna make you fall in love with me,

(01:13:35):
where she's clearly like, this is a casual thing for me.
I Am not like in this for life, and he
at the end of this like act on conversation, is like,
I'm going to make you fall in love. I'm going
to do it, and she's like, all right, we'll.

Speaker 3 (01:13:48):
See, okay, good look ye. She even says she's like
I'm in this to eventually become someone's trophy wife because
I know that that's kind of like my only option,
because she doesn't want to do like, you know, working
class labor. She admits to that, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:14:02):
It's like I think she at the beginning of the movie,
she's coming from a very pragmatic place and he's coming
from an emotional place. And then at some point it switches.
I hate I mean the part of this the scene
where like Carl is the most despicable. I feel like
it's that moment when they're on the boat and she
talks to a crew member and he's like, why the
fuck are you talking to a crew member and then

(01:14:24):
goes and like narcs to Paula and is like, did
you know that there's a sexy shirtless crew member out there,
you should probably fire him, and then tries to buy
like a wedding ring that she would not have accepted.

Speaker 3 (01:14:37):
And that he can't afford. It seems like because when
she tells him the price, he like recoils in horror.

Speaker 2 (01:14:43):
I guess I would argue she's a little better, but
not by much, because later on, when they're on the island, Yeah, yeah,
all of a sudden acts as if she's had an
emotional attachment to him all the time. When the power
switches again and he's the one in the submarine with
Abigail and she's the one left out in the cold,
She's like, but wait, I love you, And I'm like, well, no,
you don't.

Speaker 3 (01:15:03):
You know, like I mean, it just speaks to the
toxicity of their relationship where they both feel ownership over
the other person. Yeah, where you know, he's like, don't
talk to that sexy crew member. I own you, and
then she's like, don't go sleep with Abigail.

Speaker 2 (01:15:19):
I own you.

Speaker 3 (01:15:21):
I do think it's again this like gender reversal thing
where yah Ya is instructing Carl how to behave to
get something you want from a rich person. She's had
to do it with rich men. And now she's like, Okay,
here's what you do. You stroke her ego, you laugh
at her jokes, but don't do anything sexual set boundaries.

Speaker 4 (01:15:45):
That's so funny that she knows that from experience. I
never thought of that. Yeah, of course she does, because.

Speaker 3 (01:15:51):
She's kind of doing that with Yrma when they're like,
come over here, have a drink with us, take a
picture with us. And then he's like, do you want
Rolexes and they're like, TIHI, okay.

Speaker 2 (01:16:01):
Yes, I want God Champagne or like whatever fucking billion
dollar bottle he orders, Like yeah, yeah, there's like some
sort of power dynamic and like really subtle power dynamics.
I feel like we're not usually used to seeing and
they're all still so funny. I don't know how he
did it.

Speaker 3 (01:16:20):
Yeah. I think a great way to watch this movie
is to watch parts one and two and then pause
and then watch tape two of Titanic VHS Tape number two,
which is the shipwreck and the sinking and everything.

Speaker 2 (01:16:36):
You feel like you're missing anything in this shipwreck that's
all addressed in Titanic Part two.

Speaker 3 (01:16:40):
Yeah, just map carl Is Jack Dawson yah ya is
rose just map some of the characters onto each other
and then as soon as the ship sinks. Now you
watch part three of Triangle of.

Speaker 2 (01:16:54):
Sadness where a crew member takes over Titanic Island.

Speaker 3 (01:16:58):
Yeah island. Yeah, where the guy from the engine room,
the one who's like, shut all the dampers, He's now
king of the island.

Speaker 2 (01:17:12):
He's a captain.

Speaker 3 (01:17:14):
Does anyone have any other thoughts about the movie?

Speaker 4 (01:17:18):
Triangle of Sadness truly a triangle of laughter, So they
go hand in hand. For it's really an interesting thing
about human storytelling that something so funny can be so
sad and vice versa. M and I just I really
loved that. I really loved that. There is some fantastic
artistry in being able to force people to laugh like

(01:17:42):
that in a room that you're not in with a
stable hand, knowing that you're in. You know, it's like
a great masterful comedy of that we used to do
in America.

Speaker 2 (01:17:54):
Indeed, it's so good.

Speaker 3 (01:17:55):
The movie does pass the Bechdel test.

Speaker 2 (01:17:57):
It does not a ton, but it does pass. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:18:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:18:00):
You have conversations between Abigail and Paula. You have conversations
between Abigail and ya ya. I think most of the
passes are on the island. But then you have like
the crew member Alicia talking to Vera, and Vera being like,
get in the hot tub and go down the water slide,

(01:18:21):
and Abigail being.

Speaker 2 (01:18:22):
Like, no, that that whole thing passes that whole I mean.

Speaker 3 (01:18:27):
Yes, So there are a number of conversations that do
pass the Bechdel test. Interesting imagine that as far as
our scale, though the famous, the infamous Bechdel cast nipple scale,
where we rate the movie zero to five nipples based
on examining it through an intersectional feminist lens. I mean

(01:18:51):
this is tricky because I think this movie says so
many interesting things about class and income disparity and undervaluing
labor and meritocracy and all of this stuff. I want
to give it like a three point five or so.
And again, it is cathartic, even if it's a very

(01:19:13):
kind of surface level thing, just to watch a woman
of color who had been undervalued probably her entire life
and especially while working for wealthy white people, to suddenly
become the leader of a group because she has skills

(01:19:34):
that no one else has and that everyone else has undervalued.
There's I feel things that complicate that a bit, but
I still very much enjoy watching it from a surface level,
And yeah, I think I want to give it like
three and a half nipples. I'll give one to Dolly
de Leon. I'll give one to Charlie by Dean Rip.

(01:19:59):
I will give one to Captain Woody Harrelson reading his
communist Manifesto as a weird podcast that has an audience
of I don't know forty people. And I'll give my
half nipple to that poor donkey who perishes RIP to him,

(01:20:24):
the RP to the donkey.

Speaker 2 (01:20:26):
I'm tempted to go four. I don't know this guy.
It's like, there's a lot of criticisms of this movie,
and I do think that like one of the tricky
things that Ruben Auslin can't really control is that this
movie does seem to be directed at a wealthier audience
to self reflect or at least a middle class audience.
But there's so many like subclass dynamics that are really

(01:20:50):
funny and really specific that I just like, I haven't
seen done very much. And I think just especially I'm
almost like grading it on a scale because there are
just so many shady class commentary movies out at the
same time, and this one is both like thoughtful and
doesn't pretend it has a solution to any of it,

(01:21:13):
which I at least appreciate because obviously one random guy
doesn't have the answer, but it's fun to watch him
not have the answer. And I really like this movie.
So I'm gonna go one nipple for Dolly Deleion, one
nipple for charleby Dean, one nipple for I Guess Nelson,

(01:21:34):
because I just wish we'd gotten to hang out with
that character a little more. And I'll give my last
nipple to the movie Force Majeure, which I will get
around to.

Speaker 3 (01:21:44):
We'll watch it, we'll cover someday. Maybe it's true, No Jans,
how about you?

Speaker 4 (01:21:49):
Well, I feel bad. I did not know that charleby
Dean had passed away around the time the movie came out,
I guess right after it or something. I just learned
it from you, and that's very sad because I would
have loved to see more from her. I give them
orders on a scale of five.

Speaker 3 (01:22:07):
Yeah, nipples, nipples, that's correct, Okay, So I'm sorry. Do
you have questions about that?

Speaker 4 (01:22:13):
Have lots of questions that works for me. This is
a five nipple flick. I didn't actually intend that. I
didn't even think of that before I said, but there's
a five nipple achievements.

Speaker 2 (01:22:27):
One after the other, right after the other.

Speaker 4 (01:22:29):
Yeah. I think to raise the issues matters way more
than to solve them in a two hour movie, and
to do that while being so funny is like an
almost impossible high wire act. Movies that say as much
important things are very rarely this funny, and so I

(01:22:52):
think that's what makes it something that I would I
give it my highest compliment, where which is I think
that it should be preserved for future centuries to see
what our time was like.

Speaker 3 (01:23:03):
Comedy and satire are such a wonderful vehicle for class commentary,
for commentary on many, if not all things. So yeah,
I love how funny.

Speaker 2 (01:23:14):
It is and there's nothing more exhausting than watching it
not work. So it's really nice.

Speaker 4 (01:23:18):
That's on us.

Speaker 3 (01:23:19):
Yeah, sure, well, James, thank you so much for joining us.

Speaker 4 (01:23:23):
Yeah, this was a very fun discussion about a movie
that I liked. Reliving the movie again with you both.

Speaker 3 (01:23:28):
Thank you, Oh my gosh, thank you Come back anytime please,
And where can people follow you on social media, plug
your special plug anything.

Speaker 4 (01:23:39):
Yeah, the Specialist Path of Most Resistance. It's on eight
hundred pound Gorilla. It's on YouTube. You can watch it
for free on YouTube. You can pay for it on
eight hundred pound Gerrillamedia dot com. All the informations on
my website James Adomian dot com. I have a link tree. Also,
there's a mailing list which I'm trying to start using
I never have before, and I've been posting a lot

(01:24:02):
on Instagram in the last several months, which I have
way more than I have before. So it's at Jadomian
and then it's the same handle on threads and blue
Skysgadomian dot bsguid dot social, and on YouTube. My personal
YouTube channel is James Adomian xoxo, and the special lives

(01:24:24):
on the eight hundred pound Gorilla YouTube channel as well.

Speaker 2 (01:24:27):
Got it cool, It's so fucking good. Congratulations, Thank you.

Speaker 4 (01:24:31):
I had a lot of fun doing it, and I'm
glad that. I'm glad that it seems to have held
up at least one year since I taped it.

Speaker 3 (01:24:40):
Absolutely. You can follow us mostly on Instagram at Bechdelcast,
as well as subscribing to our Patreon aka Matreon, where
for five dollars a month you get access to good Right,
you get access to two bonus episodes month, including the

(01:25:02):
entire back catalog of somewhere around one hundred and sixty
or so bonus episodes. So scoot over there, become a matron.
You won't regret it.

Speaker 2 (01:25:13):
Hell yeah, you can get merch over at teapublic dot com.
Slash the Bechdel Cast and with that, let's toss a
rock on someone's head and return to the islands. Yayue bye.

Speaker 3 (01:25:31):
The Bechdel Cast is a production of iHeartMedia, hosted by
Caitlin Derante and Jamie Loftis, produced by Sophie Lichterman, edited
by Mola Board. Our theme song was composed by Mike
Kaplan with vocals by Catherine Vosskrosenski. Our logo and merch
is designed by Jamie Loftis and a special thanks to
Aristotle Acevedo. For more information about the podcast, please visit

(01:25:54):
linktree slash Bechdel Cast

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

The Bechdel Cast News

Follow Us On

Hosts And Creators

Caitlin Durante

Jamie Loftus

Show Links

Popular Podcasts

Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang

Dateline NBC

Crime Junkie

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Triangle of Sadness with James Adomian