August 7, 2024 • 56 mins
Miles and Jack were pleased to be joined by NBA historian and author Pete Croatto for today's episode. The trio discussed Team USA's continued dominance and some of the other Olympic highlights before shifting to our 90s nostalgia conversation. Pete waxes poetic about Patrick Ewing, Arvydas Sabonis and the late, great Drazen Petrovic!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Well it chie well, ITCHI well, ITCHI. Team usays Men's
squad is still rolling.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
As the games become more and more competitive, the stakes
get higher, but the results still feel a little predictable,
which I like.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
As a team USA Basketball, I like it. I love it,
and we are like exactly. I cheer for the Terminator
and the Terminator films.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
We're gonna continue our nineties nostalgia conversation with a true
NBA historian, author Pete Brauto on today's episode.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
I'm Miles Gray and I'm Jack O'Brien, and this is my.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Wooes dot chicory got it, look at dot chic hits ta.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Okay, there you go, driving spinning batch got it with five?
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Who's gonna try another three?
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Mister, look god, James, to be honest with the tail.
Look at shut time.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Yes, oh well yeah, it's it's a hot day here
in the United States, especially.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
On the West coast.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
One. Oh, but I guess I'm on the West coast. Jack,
you are on the East Coast and holding our day. Pete,
you're also on the East coast. You are the author
from hangtime to prime time, and what a great time
to have you on.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
As we take a look.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
Back at some of some players that we I feel
like aren't talked about enough from the nineties. And yeah,
but like I said, welcome to the show. Thank you
for joining us.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
How are you? We were wondering if we could have
a little hangtime with you here in prime time on
our podcast.
Speaker 4 (01:42):
That you thank you, no, thanks for having me back. Guys.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Yeah, looking forward to this.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
So what about how are you looking at Team USA
Olympic basketball? Are you like following every match you kind
of like I'll check the highlights when they come out.
Speaker 4 (01:57):
What sort of your yeah, you know, I mean, I mean, sorry,
I'm a I'm a highlight guy with with uh with
with Team USA basketball, both men's and women's.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
The other thing, too, is like there's really no I.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
Mean not to sound like a narrative wind bag, but
there's no like storyline really like gets me into this,
Like there's no redeem team, there's no you know, there
really isn't anything really kind of hooking me into to watch.
And I mean also the fact that the games are,
you know, when they're showing a lot or kind of
you know, all over the places, hard for me to
(02:33):
kind of catch up. So now I'm just you know,
reading accounts and pulling stuff on social media.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Like, sure, what is it about the international game? Like
is it the spacing? I feel like there's a lot
of there's a differencing. It just feel it feels a
little like college hoops played by NBA players or something
like everything's like kind of clogged up. There's still like
big men still matter. That's cute, it's quaint.
Speaker 4 (02:59):
I'm all with that. I'm you know again, as a
as a fan, as a fan of the backs of
the basket style of playing, as someone who does it
when he does play. Yeah, you know, it's this this
should this should very wont it should very well be
in my my wheelhouse.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
But I don't know what it is with with Olympic basketball.
Speaker 4 (03:17):
I just I don't know. It just it doesn't hit
me the same way that it did, you know, twenty
twenty five years ago. But that's that's okay. I mean,
I'm obviously rooted for.
Speaker 3 (03:25):
The for the US to win, so that's you know,
that's yeah, yeah, that's fine.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
Well, your nineties players, by the way we're going to talk,
you're some of your favorite nineties guys, and you've gotten
some of some of my favorite Back to the Basket
highlights that I've watched in a long time. Makes it.
I was going to say, get back to the basket. Yeah,
yeah for sure.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
If if like we had the Dream Team and Redeemed team,
what nickname would you give this squad?
Speaker 1 (03:53):
Is it just like hurry up and just win the goal?
Speaker 4 (03:55):
It I'm trying to you know, it's funny. It's it's
a little late in the day for me here, so
my my gears aren't ring the way.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
They should be thought nicknames. I don't know, maybe the
geez that's a good question.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
More like I guess the more the expectation, right, because
you were saying there's like sort of a lack of
like a narrative you can invest in.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
The results seem pretty like.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
For I don't know, like the you know, I don't know,
the go get them squad.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
Yeah, I get it.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
It's sort of just like we I think we all
have the feeling of like, well, they're gonna win, so yeah,
they're gonna win.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
I mean it would be yeah, I don't know. Again,
I think at some point there's gonna be another.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
Rejiggering of how this works.
Speaker 4 (04:44):
There's gonna be maybe a mix of like college players
and pro players on.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
The US side.
Speaker 4 (04:50):
So I don't know. I mean, the next the next
wrinkle that gets thrown in, the next obvious narrative that
gets thrown in, you know, that's when that's when I
think I'll be a little more interested in what's going on.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
But I mean, I also don't think it's over. It's
not over. The US has been playing really well up
to this point. They have to play Serbia for conservatively
the fourteenth time this summer in the final four coming up.
But I mean they always say beating a team for
the fourteenth time is always more difficult than the first
(05:22):
time you're playing them. So I can see, you know,
something wild happened. I did come into this Olympics saying
I don't know why the US is so heavily favored,
and now I know why. And that's called learning, folks, Yeah,
it's called Maybe those warm up games were truly warm
up games, Like, I don't know, I feel like they
(05:43):
were holding something back a little bit. Yeah, it feels
like you're just watching them toy with, not toy with,
but like the way that they like don't even have
the beginnings of a rotation. There's like, yeah, we're gonna
let this guy get his run. Like heading in, we
(06:04):
were talking about how it felt like a YMCA basketball
team where they're like you five play now, you five
play now, you you know, like just get letting everybody
get their minute, and my dad coach, Yeah, and it
still feels like that, like just on a game to
game basis where they're like, all right, we're gonna tell
(06:25):
eight guys that they're in the rotation tonight and then
just warn a couple other guys that they're sitting.
Speaker 4 (06:31):
I mean, it's so crazy if you think about it,
how quickly the Olympics starts right.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
After the NBC NBA season ends. I mean, it's it's absurd.
Speaker 4 (06:41):
It's what what maybe maybe six weeks over the finals ends,
and then you go right into international play and you
have to just again orchestrate chemistry and lineups on the fly.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
I mean there's no there you know there is. There's
not a lot of runway to to get lineups now.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
So yeah, I mean I can absolutely see that happening
where Steve Kurrs like okay, like Derek White, great, let's
try this, let's put let's let's sit Jason Tatum down
for a bit. So I don't know, that's interesting. That's
interesting to me, But I don't know how you guys
feel about this too. Maybe I'm just maybe it's a
side of my increasingly creaky old age. But like between
(07:21):
the Olympics the w n B, A, I don't know,
I kind of I kind of needed to be a
break from play, Like I think to me, like it's
kind of nice to just have a little bit of
rest before we go into the pre into you know,
into the into the NBA preseason, you know. I mean,
I'm I do follow the w n B a little bit,
(07:41):
but not to into the NBA. But I do think
it's okay to have a break. But maybe I'm just
the weirdo who who doesn't want wall to wall basketball.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
No, you need you need those You need to punctuate
the action with a little bit of breathing space in between,
so you can kind of be in to reset your expectations,
build new fantasies in your brain, as I do as
a Lakers fan. If they're playing all the time and
Rui's hurt, I can't begin to write fan.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
Fiction in my mind with NonStop basketball, seeing the team
not look that great with Mbat in there, until this
past game against Brazil has really not given my brain
the break it needs to begin dreaming of a fantasy
seventy six er season where it all comes together and
you know, the seventy six ers win the title, because
(08:27):
now I'm still seeing the same problems with them be
being in the middle out there. So I'm like, I
can't even dream. I can't sleep in this offseason.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
Yeah, like again, it's you know again with the ninety
two dream team, like that was very much just a
one big celebration from start to finish, and it really
and you and watching those games, you know, as a teenager,
it didn't really feel like there was much struggle involved.
Like I was watching I was a nick guy, so
(08:58):
watching Patrick doing you know, play, I wasn't thinking about
I don't know, like he's not adjusting all of the
double teams. I was just happy watching him clean you
know someone you know, some guy from Brazil's from Brazil's clock.
So like. But now, because because the teams are so
much more competitive internationally, you don't have that ability to
(09:20):
just see Joel Embiid drop thirty five points and feel
good about yourself.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
You can't have to think about like, oh, boy, like,
you know, he.
Speaker 4 (09:29):
Looks like he looks he looks like he's struggling here
in the summer, and he's not gonna have.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Time to reach hard.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
So yeah, it adds a lot of drama, a lot
of drama too. If you're if you're if you're, if
you're a fan of a team, Yeah, I mean, I
I can't. I mean, I love him bid, but I can't.
I can't imagine being a Sixers fan and watching this unfold.
Speaker 3 (09:47):
It's got to be, you know, painful, a.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Joy, like being a six fan is always a joy. Yeah,
I don't know. I was talking to my Philly cousins
shout out Drew shout out of Alma cousins from Philly,
and they were talking about like they get frustrated at
about like Sixers fandom is like everybody. It's just like
everybody's constantly depressed and like sad. Like even in this
(10:14):
off season where they like finally put us a really
compelling team together around Embiid, they're like, yeah, but Embiad's
the problem, And uh so, I don't know, I'm just
gonna I'm gonna stop being as critical and just immediately
depressed as I usually am until you know, at least
ten games into the regular show.
Speaker 4 (10:33):
I get it because, look, I used to be a
diehard Knicks fan, and in a way it became impossible
to enjoy the game at a simplest level. So like,
you know, again, like I, you know, I tell the
story a lot, but like I was a Knicks fan
during Michael George's heyday, when basically every spring he would
just beat the Knicks like like yote the money, like
(10:56):
it was just every spring was the same narrative played
over and over again. And as a as a kid,
as a teenager, my springs were miserable because Michael Jordan
was just killing the Knicks and torturing Hubert Davis and
John Starts for forty points a game, and I couldn't.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
I couldn't.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
Not only could I not enjoy it the.
Speaker 4 (11:15):
Knicks, I couldn't enjoyed Michael Jordan. And I couldn't enjoy
arguably the greatest player of all time at his apex
because I was worried about you know, Anthony Mason not
getting enough playing time, or Ubert Davis not not you know,
Uber Davis inability to take the ball to a hoop.
So the one cool thing about being sort of a
(11:36):
basketball I don't know, like just being a basketball fan
basone just watches the games to watch them, is that
I can watch any game without that nagging feeling that
you have Jack of being the Sixers fan. Yeah, and
you know, and wondering like, you know, is Paul George
going to be effective when this when this contract ends
and he's like thirty eight years old. I mean, yeah,
(11:57):
those are that's those are things I don't have to
deal with anymore. And it's it's kind of nice just
to be able to watch a game, to watch a game. Yeah,
but I don't know, it's my take.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
That's what. The one thing I really enjoy about like
watching the international games or like the Olympic Games is like,
especially when the US is playing, is I actually I
feel happy for all of.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
The people that are clearly in there to see all
these NBA players and just like the excitement they get
was just like, yeah, Lebron's on a fast break, you dunked,
and they're like it's just like exploding.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Everyone is like, yes, I saw it. I got to
see this. I got to see the thing. Yeah, And
like Katie having great games special effects, he can actually
do that.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
Yeah, he just did that in front of me, Like
right here, did you see he shook Tony Parker's hand.
Tony Parker looked like a little guy next to him.
Shocking stuff. Shocking stuff.
Speaker 3 (12:51):
Yeah, but that's but but that's I think.
Speaker 4 (12:53):
But you're that's a really good point though, cause I
think it's very easy to forget those little things.
Speaker 3 (12:57):
Yeah, basic things.
Speaker 4 (12:58):
That we just take for granted it, like you know, again,
just to you know, to see Lebron James performing the
way he is a what thirty.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Nine, Yeah, incredible, it's incredible, Like.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
Just just just say to me, like, that's the beautiful
Boby of the Olympics.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
That there is a part of it that I think
is that I think I that I think I gravitate
toward is the fact that you can enjoy players.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
Without having to worry.
Speaker 4 (13:22):
About the the baggage they bring, right, Like I can't.
So like, if you're a Cavaliers fan and you're still
upset about Lebron bolting twice, you can watch the Olympics
and just enjoy Lebron being Lebron. Or you know, if
you if you're if you hate Steph Curry. You can
just enjoy Steph Curry shooting threes with ease.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
Yeah, you know, it just naturally.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
That's kind of the nice part about the Olympics that
it just allows you to be, I guess, more of
a fan instead of having these these allegiances you know,
way down way way down your your you're viewing.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
The USA Basketball did have to come out and specifically
say yes, USA does include Cleveland. I know there is
some question about that, but you are we do represent
you as well. So that was exciting for them. I
do wonder like if they continue this dominance, and I
don't I don't personally, I don't expect that to happen.
(14:17):
I think they're going to have tougher games against Serbia
and then France or Germany, But like, would this be
the most impressive because they haven't been this dominant since
the Dream Team, and there's so much more talent around,
like in on these other teams than even four years ago,
(14:41):
Like that, it would be pretty wild if this team
was able to just like kind of continue doing what
they're doing so far.
Speaker 4 (14:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
So I in that way, they're kind of underdogs because
they're playing against history, they're playing against themselves and they're
playing against titaned competition that is not nearly as good
as them and jet Lag, Oh the jet Lag. Can
you what Bron's eating like the bed No Olympic village food, No,
(15:08):
not a chance, right. I don't think any of the
I doubt any of the US athletes.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
I don't like the steaks are so high like for it,
like because this is like also like you know, soft
propaganda for the world, so like it's like, yeah, dude,
we brought it, we bought, we brought like a herd
of cattle to process our own beef.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
So they're eating enough red right there.
Speaker 3 (15:27):
Yeah they're not. I don't think they're either.
Speaker 4 (15:28):
They're they're walking the streets of powers looking for McDonald's.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
You don't think so, Yeah, you don't think Lebron's being
forced to swim in the Seine. There was like that one.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
I think an Italian swimmer who was like sleeping in
a nearby park because he's like the Olympic village was
like too uncomfortable for him.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
Like the guy just took a nap in a park
and they're like, yo, this guy just competed in the Olympics. Yeah,
it's a very I think it's just been out drinking
to be To be fair, I've slept in parks before,
but right after a pretty wild night. All right, let's
take a quick break. We can come back. We'll talk
(16:04):
about some of the other international teams and some great
nineties player. This is going to be a history lesson
that I'm gonna you might have forgotten about. I didn't, certainly,
but you the listener may have. We'll be right back
(16:27):
and we're back. We're back, and Australia has been eliminated.
Australia Sorry, sorry, annoying just across the board in the
Olympics this year. Wow, I'm standing by it. I don't
like you. No, that's not true. There were just there's
a doubles team that beat the US that was annoying
(16:47):
to me. That's mainly who I'm talking about. But Australia
basketball has been eliminated by Serbian and overtime. Despite a
great game from Patty Mills. You're never gonna guess who
closed the show for Serbia. Jokic. I'm just gonna read
this from leor Kozi summary of the end of the game.
(17:09):
Jokic block. Jokic knocks a layup off the rim, Jokic Steele,
Jokic jump hook in traffic to take a one point lead,
Yokic turnaround, fade away to go up by three, all
within ninety seconds. Wow, yeah, he just took it over.
He's good at basketball, I think.
Speaker 4 (17:25):
I mean, I'm still waiting to you know, afore the
MVP would convince me, but like, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
Not quite there. We got a World War matchup coming
between Germany and France. Germany defeated Greece and Jannis. France
defeated Canada and Dylan Brooks and Jamal Murray and Shay
Gilgess Alexander Canada. I think a lot of people were
(17:54):
expecting to be up there on the podium, so that
I'd say that was the biggest surprise of a team
going out earlier than expected as of yet. And they won.
Despite Wembiyama not having his best stuff in this game,
he did give us the photograph of the Olympics so
far by blocking Dylan Brooks in an otherwise you know,
(18:19):
forgettable game. But just you know, his head is at
the backboard, his arm is up incredibly high. Dylan Brooks
is shooting a floater that is getting easily gobbled up
by Wee Biyama in mid air. It's pretty wild.
Speaker 4 (18:34):
Yeah, he's he's gonna be a special player.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
I mean, it's it's it's yeah, he's just so talented
that guy.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
Where do you do you think he is in the
MVP competition two years from now, three years from now,
next season, I think two years, I.
Speaker 4 (18:51):
Think be expected as as he gets, as his body
gets used to an NBA schedules, he gets as he
grows up, as he gets older, he gets more weight
on it, waiting on the frame. The Yeah, I mean,
I think I think in two years he'll be he'll
be riding that he'll be right in that competition, especially
if the Spurs get good, you know, and and and
that's that's that's a big part of this too. But yeah,
(19:11):
I mean it's it's every time I've seen him play,
it's just he's I mean, he is, he is. He's
an anomaly. I mean you don't see that body, that
that that length, that height, the ability shoo from the outside.
I mean it is, he's, he's he's a creature. I
mean it's just there's no other way, there's no other
way to put it.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
Yeah, did you guys, watch any three on three basketball.
I just want to bring sad really quickly. I did
watch the I'd watched the gold medal game. Was this
sport specifically invented to create a basketball medal that the
USA did not win in Chile?
Speaker 2 (19:43):
Because I I'd imagine, right, Because I mean, and here's
not even my conspiratorial thinking. I mean, it's like truly,
like even as the Olympic, like the IOC describes the
history of three on three, it's like American street basketball,
you know what I mean. It's like so clearly they're like,
we're taking this from American culture. But you know, as
I think most of us were like, bro, we should
be putting out a team that should just be serving.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
People out there.
Speaker 5 (20:07):
It's the eligibility rules you have putting this team together. Well,
you have to be playing foeba three on three basketball
and you get enough games. Yeah yeah, So what player
is going to be Like, I just finished my NBA season,
I'll now spend my entire summer trying to get enough
games in and the FOBA three by three on three
circuit to be eligible. That's why, like some you know,
(20:29):
I think the closest thing was maybe Cameron Brink who
before she injured her a cl she was going to
be on that three three on three team. But like
so they're definitely there's w NBA representation and for NBA
players who have either played the game or not whatever.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Jim or it did not happen. They came in seventh
out of eighty. Canyon Barry, I didn't know they were
still a Berry person playing. I know, I had no idea.
Speaker 4 (20:55):
Yeah, I mean the thing that the thing that I
found really curiousbout the three on three tournament. And this
is just me being being just you know, just seeing
pictures and whatever, but like, why why was the ball?
Does he really really weird something you get from a supermarket?
Like it's small, yeah, Like it was different colors too.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
It just it looked I don't know, I don't know if.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
That's just the design of it or just it wasn't
even like a leather basketball.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
It was like a it just looks like something you
get like like like a.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
Like those big river balls that are like like you
know the supermarket.
Speaker 1 (21:28):
That yeah, like a big page.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
Yeah, like dodgeball balls, Yeah, exactly, Like you know, the
ball is slightly smaller than the Foeba size.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
Because they said they're trying to humiliate us. What is
going on exactly? Do all the little things to throw
Americans up? The ball is different, like and sometimes the
ball is uneven and like when you bounce it, it
just goes in a different direction. Yeah, like when you've
been treating an outdoor ball terribly. All right, but like,
(21:59):
who do we need to get involved here? Like one
name came up before I think Jabari said it, and
I was like, yes, that is who would be the
best three on three player from from the NBA is Kyrie?
Speaker 4 (22:13):
Oh I was going to say, like Kyrie is great,
but if you're looking for retired, I mean Joe Johnson
has been the name that's coming.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
Jo Johnson has been so good. Yeah, three on three who.
Speaker 4 (22:24):
Amazing? So fun amazing.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
I feel like, yeah, you could easily like create some
kind of like development league where it's like the old
like and one type players are like, let's because I
would that would just be such a show. But but
that didn't really even look like what was winning in three?
It was slow and people cutting and yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:45):
In my mind, it's just straight up like clear out
the clear out the lane every time, Like.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
Yeah, just doing one on one and then shooter. I
mean it feels like there are some like the the
amount of three point shooting is very inconsistent and like
sometimes like there were some games where the US took
like six threes total, which are twos in this but
the reason like it took the NBA two and a
(23:11):
half decades to realize, Wow, threes are mathematically worth so
many more points than twos. We should like change the
way we run our offenses to take that into account.
Two is even more than one, Like it's double, you know,
like mathematically. And I did crunch the numbers on this,
(23:33):
and I spent a lot of time on this is
more than one. It's actually yeah, I did run the
numbers by Terrence Howard and Helogy.
Speaker 4 (23:44):
Two.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
It's so if you just have Kyrie and shooting, and
then you know people who are able to defend, I
don't know, so like a big who can shoot.
Speaker 4 (23:57):
Since to me, you get a point guard, you get
a really good outside you do you get a big
man or yeah, you get it, you get a center. Yeah,
I mean they just thinking now like you probably do
that with recently retired NBA players.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
Yeah, just and but I don't know.
Speaker 4 (24:11):
I mean, I again, I'm this, this sounds great in
my mind, but again, you know, I'm a dumb ass.
So this is probably some of the probably also ready
to refute this, but like, I don't know, if you
if you got like let's say Kyle Korver and Dwight
Howard from whatever lead He's roam around and and and
I don't know, let's say, let's just say rayper Austin
(24:33):
to go back.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
Yeah, yeah, you know, does that team do well?
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Does that team, yeah, right, do better than seventh of eight? Probably?
I think I think maybe maybe Jamal Crawford is also
an idea that was thrown out by a super producer, Jabari,
that I really liked, and I'm a little concerned that
he wasn't actually involved. I think Jamal Crawford Joe Johnson like,
(24:57):
where what are we doing here? Guys?
Speaker 4 (24:58):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (24:59):
It was Why were they not on this team?
Speaker 4 (25:01):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Just a big three to just get the three? Well,
the big thing's run right now, right, so you can't
really do that.
Speaker 4 (25:07):
You can't have the big three?
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Yeah, I mean, it feels like it would be worth it, like,
find a way to make it worth their while? All right,
we should get to the continuation of our Summer of
nineties hoops conversation. I'm a big Patrick Ewing fan. Uh
So it's Ewing, it's Petrovitch, and it is the guy
(25:30):
who was referring to up top, back to the basket magician,
our vetus, Sibonis, he is our vetus, he is Sibonis,
he is your desire. I but Ewing has definitely become
underrated over the years because he's just one of those
(25:52):
guys who like never quite got there in terms of
the title, but was so great and like had his
peak was blocking everything was you know, a bucket was
just so good on the on the glass, just unbelievable.
Speaker 4 (26:10):
You know.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
Yeah, do you think if he hadn't been injured in
ninety nine, do you think they win the title?
Speaker 4 (26:17):
Me? No, I don't think they do. I think I
think I mean again, you know that that rum was
was incredible and it was it was it was led
by you know, spree Well and Canby. You know, Youing
at that point was fourteen years into his career and
you know had played heavy, heavy minutes you know, the
majority of the of of that time. You know, he
was not the Patrick Ewing of nineteen eighty nine or
(26:39):
even nineteen ninety five. He was. He was a good center,
but he was I don't think he was going to
hold up against David Robinson and Tim Duncan in the
nine finals.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
And when he got hurt is when they went on
the run, so exactly.
Speaker 4 (26:51):
Yeah, So yeah it was. And that's I think what
ultimately led the Knicks to say to themselves like, we
really don't need yeah, Patrick Ewing uh anymore, which was
a whole drama you know when I was you know,
when I was reading the sports pages back in the day.
But you're right, I mean, Ewing was somebody who I
think as time, as as time has gone on, he's
(27:14):
become forgotten. I think for a few reasons. A. He
didn't win a championship. B he became A he came
during an era of just superstar centers with Shaquille O'Neill
and Kim Olajuan, David Robinson, Baile won championships and and
Ewing sort of became kind of like the eighties nineties
version of like you know, Elvid Hayes, just you know
(27:37):
a player that was you know, you look at him,
you look at the stats, you put up wonderful stats,
but he kind of gets lost in the shuffle. But
it's funny when you look at you Ing now, he
really was. He was really the beginning of, or rather
the start of the out of the outside shooting centers.
Speaker 3 (27:56):
I mean there were a few, there was a few
that were Yeah, there were a.
Speaker 4 (27:58):
Few that were around, like in the seventies, in even
the sixties, but Ewing was really a lot of his
game was, you know, baseline jumper, top of the circle jumper,
and he had he had great post moves, but he
was he liked to be in the outside. And I
think back then now sort of knock against him was
that he wasn't really as physical as he should have been,
kind of like embiad is now where you know, I
(28:19):
think if you watch him be play, I think he
kind of favors the outside little too much.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
But Patrick Guan was a great player.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
I think I think it was just his misfortune that
not only did he not want a championship, but he
didn't for whatever reason. The Knicks front off is Dave Checkets,
and you know, primarily they never surrounded him with great
complimentary players. They never really strouded him with with a
with a great number two player. He never really had,
(28:48):
you know, the way that you know, Steph had Clay,
you know, Lebron James had Kyrie Irving Patrick who didn't
really have a terrific number to play, kind of dominicqe
Wuilgans in Atlanta, you know.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
So, yeah, they drafted Mark Jackson. He won the Rookie
of the Year, but he was gone pretty quickly, you know,
he was he was gone pretty quickly.
Speaker 4 (29:10):
And he wasn't like he wasn't like Kyrie Irving. He
wasn't a guy that he wasn't the kind of player
that you could depend on to.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
Score twenty five was like a bucket. Yeah. Yeah, he
was just a great great great point guard.
Speaker 4 (29:23):
Great point guard, great player, but again not not you know,
wasn't gonna put up twenty five points a game. And
you know, the Knicks tried to get Yeling that they
traded for Rolando Blackman back in ninety two. That didn't
work out because Rolando Blackman aged about fifteen years in
the season he was in New York, you know, Charles
uh when blacking, like like Xavier McDaniel was a little
(29:45):
you know, pass his problem, and they picked him up
in ninety one. Charles Smith wasn't who they thought who
wasn't the premier talent he was gonna they thought that
the Nicks thought they were going to get. So it
just never really worked out for Patrick Ewing with getting
number two. But I you know, again as a Knicks
fan growing up, and I love Patrick Doning because he
just he he just always seemed to work so hard.
(30:07):
And again the image I of Patrick Ewing is him
part of the free throw line, sweating like he had
just run two marathons like he was. He was just
pouring sweat, And I think that further kind of further
accentuated this whole warrior aspect about him.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
But no, yeah, he was.
Speaker 4 (30:26):
He was a great player.
Speaker 1 (30:27):
I mean, yeah, it was awesome.
Speaker 2 (30:29):
Absolutely, I mean like what I mean, And I was
too young, but like when he was at Georgetown, was
he known for being as offensive a player as he
added those dimensions, Because I felt like I remember, like
at least my childish perception of him was like he
was an insane defender in college and then then added
these other and credit to him, like evolved his game
(30:51):
in a way that you know, obviously makes them.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
As Shaq would.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
Say, one of the greats, which is wild too because
for me, I always thought, I like, you know, being
when when Shaq came in the league, I'm like, this
is what I think is like a dope center. But
I remember later on Shaq was on NBA TV and
like got emotional talking about Patrick Ewing, and that's when
I sort of was like, oh, I'm I'm a child
(31:15):
or like obviously I have a very one dimensional way
of looking at, like, you know, judging someone's game, and
that was like a very interesting I'll just play like
a quick clip of it because it was sort of
like one of these things was like, oh wow, like
Shaq is truly giving this man his flowers. And as
he always put it, he's like I saw him as
a great that I was modeling my game after.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
But I had to build on that.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
So yes, that part of that does include destroying him,
but that's just my spirit as a competitor, not because
I have no respect for him. You are right, No,
let's you getting look like you're getting emotional?
Speaker 6 (31:43):
Yeah, I saw it. I just saw Patrick Ewing. Man,
that's a real tier too. I was Patrick Ewing, did
we get.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
A close up on the deck? Can we zoom in
that that's real tears, ladies and John, that's not trick
rat are you saying not like the real tissue?
Speaker 6 (31:56):
You know, you know a lot of people. You know
a lot of people when they talk about the great
and never comes up. But I'm putting patching you in names.
There's great. It was a great competitor, even though he
never even at the time when you scream this is
my house, get out of course, listen, listen. I watch
a lot of karate movies, and in every karate movie,
(32:16):
the student always had to kill the teacher to become
the best. So you know, even even though Pat was
better than me, I had to to say that to
psych myself out.
Speaker 2 (32:24):
But yeah, so yeah, yeah, it's like when you hear
those kinds of sort of kind words that kind of
really put things into perspective of like where it was.
Speaker 1 (32:33):
I think a lot of people remember the missed layup
and like a crucial miss lay up towards the end
of his career. But just watching some of these highlights
that super producer Jabari put together, the violence with which
he dunked on people. Yeah, early in his career, I mean,
and like throughout his career is really like, yeah, it
feels kind of influential in some ways.
Speaker 4 (32:55):
Like he was he was, he was, he wasn't informer
And again like I don't think you played with Charles
Oakly for eight nine years and you know thrivee with
him if you're timid or if you're if you're weak willed.
Speaker 3 (33:10):
Patrick Ewey was was a scary dude, and he was.
Speaker 4 (33:14):
Somebody who, as you put it, jack like he would
he would dunk on you, and he was he was.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
He came to the hoop hard, you know.
Speaker 4 (33:23):
But but I think, but it's unfortunate that again, we
remember the times that he came up short, Like the
ninety four finals is a perfect example. You know, a
kim Alavn just cleaned his clock, and I think that
is what people remember.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
They remember, they remember a Keeam going.
Speaker 4 (33:40):
Bana going bananas against against Patrick Ewing and John Starts
going was it two for nineteen.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
In game seven appeals?
Speaker 3 (33:48):
Yeah, so yeah, so it's very so yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:52):
I mean he unfortunately if he had won one championship
with it, Elvin Hayes did the way that Dolve Chase
did and back Aways Wolves reed one too.
Speaker 3 (34:02):
He's remembered a lot.
Speaker 4 (34:03):
I think he'd be remembered a lot more fondly, and.
Speaker 3 (34:06):
It would take.
Speaker 4 (34:06):
It would take it wouldn't take Shaquille O'Neill to kind
of get people to remember him.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Yea, he was.
Speaker 4 (34:13):
He was an outstanding player, and he also played an
impossible media market in Miles as he said, like, yeah,
at Georgia he was like he was more like a
Bill Russell type, like a block, a rebounder, defensive guy.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
And he yeah, I mean if you look.
Speaker 4 (34:26):
At his highlights in college, like he's not doing those,
you know, he's not doing that back to the basket,
curl to the center jump shot. He's not you know,
posting up on the low blocks. He's very much just
a kind of a the ultimate. He's a defensive presence.
He's a defensive monster. And so yeah, I mean I
don't think he gets nearly enough credit for being for
(34:47):
being a truly great player. I mean, he had fourteen
or fifteen great seasons. How come does that happen?
Speaker 1 (34:54):
Right? Yeah? Yeah, he was also like Embiid and like Alajuan,
like started hooping pretty late in life, you know, he
didn't come to the US until eleven and started playing
basketball then. So I think that's like, you know, Embiid
in college was not a like the thing you'd noticed
about him was not his like deft offensive touch. It
(35:16):
was like, Wow, he's like really athletic and like good
at blocking. And yeah, yeah, but I don't mean to
talk about I was speaking of Shack.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
Yeah, someone who really something that really puts things into perspective,
especially like we got to talk about.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
Our Vitas Sabonis.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
So I grew up watching us do battle with him
in these Western Conference finals, in the playoffs, just throughout
the regular season, and he was one of the most
frustrating players.
Speaker 1 (35:44):
I remember being like, but we got Shack, but this
guy's Sabonis. He's like not even as athletic.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
I don't understand. It was really frustrating. And then I remember,
like later on I learned, I was like, oh, we
were playing the dusty version of R Vita Sabonis, like
we've missed peak Arvet and that's in my mind, Wizard's
version of R give his Shack that work.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
And I was like, yeah, yeah, you know who.
Speaker 4 (36:15):
It's funny looking at the old highlights of Arvidas Sabonis
and he's so much like Jokic, you know, very I mean,
great outside touch, amazing passer, just a guy that just
a just a great team player.
Speaker 3 (36:32):
And and you're right, wus like he I remember.
Speaker 4 (36:34):
Watching I think it was a the Rookie, the Rookie Showcase,
the Rookie first year Player whatever that's called the Rising
Stars Challenge, like in ninety five ninety six, and I
remember Sabonis played in that game, and like he's like
exactly like he's saying, it's like Joe Smith and like
(36:55):
he's you know, up and all these like these young
these young bloys. He looked like he was running in sand.
Like he was so moving so slowly and so tenderly. Yeah,
it almost looked like it was it seemed like he was.
Speaker 3 (37:09):
In pain playing right at that kind of pace.
Speaker 4 (37:13):
But he was, but he was just but even at
at the minished state he was, he was not only
was he was he a good player, He was a
very good player. But he was a key contributor to
some really really good Portland Trail Plazer teams. I mean
that that two thousand team, that game seven, aside that
that meltdown, they they headed the finals. So so you know,
(37:36):
to to watch Sabonis like that's one of the great
what ifs like what if Sabonis when he was there
but he was drafted by Atlanta originally at eighty six
straight five?
Speaker 3 (37:46):
What if he came out then? What if he was
able to make.
Speaker 4 (37:49):
That jump and play with Dominique Wilkins, doc whit gosh,
Kevin willis like that to me is one of the
great Or what if like what if he played you know,
what if he came back five years before, like at
eighty nine and played with ky.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
Drets and potentially Draws and Petrovitch even Yeah, yeah, but
it was also part of that part of the start
up in Portland.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Yeah, I think I think we're talking about a completely
different world. I think he comes over, he's giving Bird
the work, like he's better than Bird right away, and
we lose the Cold War, like America's spirit is completely
deflated and it's like rocky for him. Reverse he comes
over and we're just like they're they got us man,
(38:35):
Like this is our best absolutely hoop, Like I had nothing,
no frame, Like my brain would not have been able
to compute somebody coming over from Russia, Like I was
like Russia, like yeah, okay, they they might be superior
in ice hockey. Like they don't have basketball over there,
(38:56):
it's too cold, and like having just like have the
nastiest game. Like some of these highlights, we'll link off
to them in the show notes, but like some of
these highlights are it's like, oh yeah, I've never seen
that pass anywhere except for maybe Magic and Jokic. And
it's like a behind the back pass where he's not
(39:19):
even like looking. He just like has a sense that
somebody's where he knows they are, and it goes past
three people's heads, like just over their shoulders, like three defenders,
and just like weaves its way through in a way
that seems like it's it doesn't make sense.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
He was he was a magician, and he was he
was so splendid in the low post passing. I mean,
I can watch clips of or Vitas a Bonus in
Portland passing to Scottie Pippen and Steve Smith and Kenny
Anderson all day because the meam like that. Once or
twice a game, one of them would cut and Sabona
but just delivered the bullet bounce pass hits the guy
(39:57):
riding's drive like he to me, what what I love
of watching Yokic playing is to me.
Speaker 3 (40:04):
This is gonna sound silly, but.
Speaker 4 (40:07):
I kind of wonder what would be like to play
like half court basketball with them, yea, and like I
get so excited and that's why, and that's what it
would be. I can't imagine what it be like playing
half court with with Yokic or with Sabonis, because like
you just know that if you make a cut to
the basket, you're gonna the ball is going to be
in the right location and you'll be and if you move,
you'll be rewarded. Or it was like that magic was
(40:29):
like that where they just they just had they just
they had just great anticipation and they just they trusted
their teammates to be in the right spot. But I mean, Sabonis,
it's so but yeah, I mean when Sabonis came to
Portland and you touch on this on this just now, Jack,
Like now we hear about players coming in from overseas
(40:50):
and it's not a big deal, Like you know, Wemby
goes first, and it's it's okay, Yeah, of course some
foot three Greek of Nature can shoot outside jump shots.
Speaker 3 (41:01):
He's nineteen.
Speaker 4 (41:02):
Of course we're going to get them. But back in
back in the eighties, and nineties. Even in the early
two thousands, there wasn't this pipeline of information. There wasn't,
you know, there wasn't. There wasn't The basketball hadn't really
spread the way that it has it has now, where
you know, we can actually talk about the Olympic Games
being competitive among multiple countries. So when our Vita Savonas
(41:22):
came along, and even when you know, Drosen got drafted,
Petrovich and a lot of depots, there was a lot
of suspicion because like, that wasn't a normal thing to
get players from overseas and bring them into the NBA, right,
not like unless they were like a Chemo Lagat or
Dela Shrimp and they went to a US college, right,
(41:43):
got refined, got reps and then okay, it's fine. But
like to pluck someone from a foreign country and bring
them into the NBA, that was not That was almost
underheard of, especially in the late nineteen eighties, And.
Speaker 1 (41:58):
It was as of this show that it go back
to that way. We don't like them at US all
the way Russia. Jack, there was the US s R
back then, but he's from the US s R. Whatever.
Man too much Rocky to your Rocky Brain dies the
USSR though, man, that would have been that would have
(42:20):
been close enough for me, right up.
Speaker 2 (42:25):
I mean that's I mean again huge what if what
if the bonus comes through? You know, if if first
of all, if the Soviet Union had allowed it, and
then maybe he doesn't get that Achilles injury that he
needs to read. Which is another thing too, is like
this guy was playing with like a busted Achilles and
so he still still playing well, still playing yeah, right,
(42:47):
But the next what if, which I think as I
was looking into this more and more, seems to be
like one of the biggest what ifs in the NBA,
which is Draws and Petrovitch.
Speaker 1 (42:58):
He played what like three seasons in the NBA.
Speaker 3 (43:02):
I think eighty eight eighty nine was his first season.
Speaker 4 (43:05):
Was see he played in the finals against the Pistons
nineties eighty nine nine. I think's like, yeah, it's eighty.
Speaker 2 (43:10):
Nine and many yeah, but yeah, all that to say
is like, as I you know, there was this one
interview I was watching with Reggie Miller and he's like
the greatest shooter of all time is actually Draws and Petrovitch.
Oh yeah, And I was like, whoa, whoa, that's I mean,
I knew he was nice with it, but when a
lot of people really talk about just like what his
last season with the Nets, and you're like, oh, this
(43:33):
thing is about to go off like fully, and he
tragically passed away in a car accident at twenty eight
that you know, cut his career short. But you know
what was sort of when you saw the list of
people you can talk about, like when we were talking
about nineties nostalgia players, like aside from the what ifs,
like or maybe it was the what ifs, what really
drew you to Draws and Petrovitch, I mean.
Speaker 4 (43:54):
With Draws and Petrovitch is more about that team, the Nets.
I think, you know again, I grew up in central
New Jersey, which was very much Knicks territory, even though
the Nets played in the Meadowlands, which was like thirty
minus from my house from my parents' house. So but
but the but the that Nets team, like ninety three,
ninety three, ninety four was absolutely stacked, like they were
(44:15):
primed to do to do great things because Drazen Petrovitch,
who was coming into his own who's a remarkable shooter.
And this is why why YouTube is such a gift
if you're a sports nerd or any any kind of devotee,
because you can go back and watch game footage and
draws and Petrovitch if you watch the game Foich, I'm.
Speaker 3 (44:36):
Sure you guys have.
Speaker 4 (44:37):
His release is just lightning quick like he he comes
off curls and just shoots and it's a it looks almost.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
Like an optical illusion.
Speaker 4 (44:45):
He is so so quick, and he would have thrived
in today's game. He was He was almost like a
Klay Thompson type where he was just he he just
could shoot from anywhere, could get to the basket if
he needed to. Great player, but Rosin was was was special.
But that team, like you have to remember this New Jersey,
New York was always Knicks still lives to a certain degree.
(45:08):
But back in ninety two, nineteen ninety three, No. Ninety three,
ninety four, I believe I'm getting my my dates mixed up.
Chuck Daly gets hired to coach the Nets, which is
a big deal because Chuck Daly again coached his dream team.
Speaker 3 (45:21):
He was also Piston's head coach during the glory years.
So this is a big gat.
Speaker 4 (45:26):
You get Tuck, you get Chuck Daily, and then you
get Derrick Coleman, who was a great player inside outside guy,
could could good great rebounder. You have Kenny Anderson was
one of the one of the best point guards coming up,
who was just you know, explosive left hander which is
you know again throws everyone off. And then johnsa Petrovitch.
(45:47):
That is a great big three right there, and you
have the right coach, you have players involved. I think
also on that team was Rick Mhorn Moe Cheeks, like
good veteran stability there.
Speaker 3 (46:00):
And they had one season. They didn't really get very far.
Speaker 4 (46:04):
I think they lost the Knicks in the first round,
I want to say, and and that was it, Like
you know, Dowson, patrickck dies you know in June and
that terrible car accident on the Autubahn, and the Nets
never recover, you know, Kenny Anderson, you know, I think
it gets injured. I think right around the middle of
ninety three, ninety four, sees know when was that he
gets injured? He breaks his wrists. One year isn't really
(46:27):
the same. Derek Coleman never puts it together, He never
kind of gets he never reaches full maturity, and that
window closes. So that's one of the to me like,
one of the great what ifs is if that NETS
team had another season, if you put together Anderson, a
healthy Kenny Anderson, Derek Coleman, that isn't you know that
(46:51):
gets it together maturity wise and Drasan Petrickish You get
those three together and.
Speaker 3 (46:56):
Chuck daily, how far do they go?
Speaker 4 (46:58):
Yeah? You know, I really think that's one of the
great one of the great what ifs in basketball history,
along with you know what if Marie Stokes doesn't hit
his head and has and basically becomes a paraplegic when
he's at the Rock, when he's at the Royals. It's
one of those great what ifs, right, I think.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
Amazing. All Right, we're going to take one more break.
We're going to come back and we're going to do
the fastest rapid fire round of questioning that you've ever heard.
We'll be rappid and we're back. We're back. Pete, my
(47:43):
dear Pete.
Speaker 2 (47:43):
Yes, we've had a had a great time talking nostalgia
ball with you, but now it's time.
Speaker 1 (47:48):
To ball B A W L tiers of pain because
you have entered the hot seat. It's the fourth quarter
rapid fire around a question.
Speaker 2 (47:57):
It's very hot in my office as I record, so
forgive my stutters the moment.
Speaker 4 (48:03):
Yeah, I was gonna say, I hope this isn't a
video time I am. I'm sort of like a pot
roast here.
Speaker 1 (48:07):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no.
Speaker 4 (48:09):
The doors are closed, and it's like, I'm this is
why this is.
Speaker 1 (48:12):
Going to be the fastest one, because I only have
a few more breaths before. You don't much time to
come to heat stroke.
Speaker 4 (48:19):
I guess. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (48:19):
I think we just got to replace our nineties players.
I think we need I think we need to take
advantage of Pete's immense backlog of knowledge and do that,
and it'll be rapid, so rapid, because it's only gonna
be one shot. We're gonna take one shot.
Speaker 3 (48:36):
I'll do the best that I can.
Speaker 1 (48:37):
Okay, all right, right, we'll get ready because here we go.
Start the clock. Don't, don't, don't don't? All right, you
want to go first? Or well, there's only one question?
Speaker 4 (48:49):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (48:49):
Wait where is the which one are you going to do?
Speaker 4 (48:51):
The one question?
Speaker 1 (48:53):
Yeah? Where was the we had this second ago? I
wasn't messing around the dog? Did you do something? Replace
the ones we were there? It is all right, you
want to do that one I'm gonna ask I'm gonna
ask another on. I'm gonna ask another question though too. Okay,
I think we should do I think we should Yes.
Hold on so fast, dude, I know you can't believe it.
Good how we are, Pete. We have two more installments
(49:15):
of the Nineties Nostalgia Conversation. So who are asking each
guest to give us a few more names to replace
the ones we discussed today. Uh, you've seen the overall list,
so give us a few more to discuss. Who are
the players that were missing from our list?
Speaker 3 (49:30):
Let's see who are miss I'm trying to remember the
list we've got.
Speaker 1 (49:33):
I'll give you. I'll tell you who's still on the board.
Sean Kemp, Iverson, Reggie Lewis, Alan Iverson, Glenn Robinson, Ray Allen,
Alan Roberson, Uh Debt Li of shremp Hakeem Free Vlade,
Sam Cassell, Anthony the Iceman, Peeler. It's from our last
(49:54):
week's guests, Matt Leeb.
Speaker 3 (49:56):
Anthony Peeler. Oh my goodness, someone's the Missouri fan in.
Speaker 4 (50:00):
Uh. That was gonna be Anthony Peter was gonna be
my guest?
Speaker 3 (50:07):
Or Anthony pig Miller.
Speaker 4 (50:09):
No, I will go with.
Speaker 3 (50:11):
That's a fine list. You know who, you know you
talk about Sam Perkins.
Speaker 1 (50:16):
That's one person, so smooth, so smooth with it. What
a smooth stroke. Okay, yeah, you give us one more,
one more, Okay.
Speaker 3 (50:27):
One more, you know what.
Speaker 4 (50:31):
Let's let's go a little off the beaten path here,
let's Marty Conlin. You know again, the there are very
few players who I watched who remind me of me
when I play. And again, I'm a slow, not terribly
talented back to the basket player, and Marty Colin would
be my avatar if I played in the NBA. He
(50:53):
he had the worst head bake and everyone always did
on it on the same way. And again, like you're
not you don't really see players like him anymore, these
very traditional bangers back to the basket type players who just.
Speaker 3 (51:07):
Sort of stick around for five to ten years. But
you know, they're just you know, they're they're they're there
are quite.
Speaker 4 (51:14):
Essential hustle, hustle to hustle guys. So yeah, my, so
Sam Perkins and Marty Kalina would be my my. Oh
can throw a third one in there?
Speaker 1 (51:23):
Sure please?
Speaker 4 (51:24):
Okay, you know what, and you can probably replace Marty
Collin with this because I don't think anyone's going to
listen to anyone.
Speaker 1 (51:30):
Discussing AKA the Celtic Killer, so he will be on
the list. Uh yeah, but he did per game.
Speaker 4 (51:43):
There you go. See that's what That's what I would
be if I if I were playing an NBA player's body,
I'd be ten points easy.
Speaker 3 (51:51):
Again, probably is his finest.
Speaker 4 (51:55):
But I but the player that I didn't stand that
list I thought was great in the nineties. That doesn't
get enough love.
Speaker 3 (52:00):
Mark Price.
Speaker 4 (52:01):
Yeah, yeah, phenomenal playmaker. Was one of the pretty much
started the trend of when a double team comes you
split the middle like he would do that a lot.
He would split like on a pick and roll. He
would just like kind of duck in and take you
to the hoop. Great three point shooter. I think he
shot over forty percent from three point line back when
that was more of a novelty. But yeah, amazing player.
(52:24):
Career was cut short because of an ecl injury and
yeah he was. He was, and he was phenomenal on
some really really good uh Cleveland Cavaliers themes back in
the day.
Speaker 3 (52:34):
So yeah, Mark Price would be my choice as well.
Speaker 1 (52:37):
One of the most beautiful strokes I've ever seen. Yeah,
just jump shooter, just a gorgeous Yeah.
Speaker 2 (52:43):
Final question for you, p yes, please describe to us
your personal highlight for you as a basketball player.
Speaker 4 (52:50):
As a basketball player, that's a.
Speaker 1 (52:52):
Great Really, what's your greatest performance? You've putting it on
my court?
Speaker 3 (52:55):
My greatest performance?
Speaker 4 (52:56):
Oh boy, this is gonna sound this is gonna sound
a little silly, but I guess I'll go with it
because it's contemporary. And I don't want to bore people with,
you know, back in my day stories because they're not
they're not that impressive.
Speaker 3 (53:09):
But I'll tell you it's it's My daughter is is seven, and.
Speaker 1 (53:15):
You know, so she'll where's this going? And you just
put up like windmilled her and I am just.
Speaker 3 (53:23):
Torturing her with right w jump boxs.
Speaker 4 (53:26):
No, but my daughter is seven years old now, and
she she will One of the great joys is like
we will shoot baskets together, or like, you know, we'll
go to the wine. You know, she'll chase down rebounds
and one of the nice one of the greatest moments
is just being able to shoot with her and her
being impressed that I can actually make a basket. Yeah,
(53:46):
that's not going to last for too much longer because
you know, I'm She's going to know that I'm a
terrible athlete and that I that you know, I'm a
thirty five percent shooterest so like that, you got to be.
Speaker 1 (53:57):
Adding tools in the off season when she's like, I know,
I know.
Speaker 4 (54:02):
I should be dedicated to working in my left hand,
but you know, only so many eighty hours a day.
Speaker 3 (54:07):
But that's probably the nicest moment, is just being able
to go out there and.
Speaker 4 (54:11):
Have that moment with my daughter and and maybe and
I hope that she's able to appreciate or maybe get
into sports because she sees me doing it. So that's
really that's really that's been a recent development that I've
really have I really cherish, you know, better than the
time I you know, I did like two behind the
(54:32):
back passes in a game or right right, you know,
almost puts the backward on a layup.
Speaker 1 (54:38):
So yeah, Pete, it turns out that was the correct
answer that we had written answer and correct roto.
Speaker 4 (54:49):
Yeah, I'm trying, I'm just trying to elevate the conversation.
Speaker 1 (54:52):
So you know, yeah, one story of the time, that's
what you on?
Speaker 2 (54:55):
Man, where do the people find you, follow you, read you,
support you, all that good stuff.
Speaker 4 (55:00):
Oh well, thank you.
Speaker 3 (55:01):
Well, yeah, i mean I'm on x Twitter whatever it's called.
Speaker 4 (55:05):
Now Twitter at Pete Crowado my name which is p
E t E c r O A T t O.
You can buy my book from Hanging on the Prime
Time pretty much anywhere, still on Amazon, still on Barnes
and Noble.
Speaker 3 (55:17):
It still hasn't been turned to mulch, so today.
Speaker 4 (55:21):
Buy it there. And yeah, i mean, I'm always you know,
I'm always you know. I'm on also most of the
social media under some variation of my name, and I'm
always posting stories and stuff.
Speaker 3 (55:31):
So yeah, I'm easy to find.
Speaker 4 (55:32):
Awesome.
Speaker 2 (55:33):
Well, you can follow our show at the hashtag Matt
boost 's b w S t i E S on Twitter.
That's we can find show links, show notes, ways to
get into our listener discord, amongst other things.
Speaker 1 (55:44):
You can find me at Miles of Gray. You can
find me at Jack Underscore Obrian and that's going to
do it. Another one on the.
Speaker 2 (55:53):
Books, another one and we'll be next week. We'll see
what happens with Team USA.
Speaker 1 (55:59):
Will the glory continue?
Speaker 4 (56:01):
I think? So?
Speaker 1 (56:02):
All right, we'll see you the next thing
Speaker 2 (56:04):
I said to see you next team, next time, the
next gam Bye, Bye, Okayama,
Well it chie well, ITCHI well, ITCHI. Team usays Men's
squad is still rolling.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
As the games become more and more competitive, the stakes
get higher, but the results still feel a little predictable,
which I like.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
As a team USA Basketball, I like it. I love it,
and we are like exactly. I cheer for the Terminator
and the Terminator films.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
We're gonna continue our nineties nostalgia conversation with a true
NBA historian, author Pete Brauto on today's episode.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
I'm Miles Gray and I'm Jack O'Brien, and this is my.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Wooes dot chicory got it, look at dot chic hits ta.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Okay, there you go, driving spinning batch got it with five?
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Who's gonna try another three?
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Mister, look god, James, to be honest with the tail.
Look at shut time.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Yes, oh well yeah, it's it's a hot day here
in the United States, especially.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
On the West coast.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
One. Oh, but I guess I'm on the West coast. Jack,
you are on the East Coast and holding our day. Pete,
you're also on the East coast. You are the author
from hangtime to prime time, and what a great time
to have you on.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
As we take a look.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
Back at some of some players that we I feel
like aren't talked about enough from the nineties. And yeah,
but like I said, welcome to the show. Thank you
for joining us.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
How are you? We were wondering if we could have
a little hangtime with you here in prime time on
our podcast.
Speaker 4 (01:42):
That you thank you, no, thanks for having me back. Guys.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Yeah, looking forward to this.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
So what about how are you looking at Team USA
Olympic basketball? Are you like following every match you kind
of like I'll check the highlights when they come out.
Speaker 4 (01:57):
What sort of your yeah, you know, I mean, I mean, sorry,
I'm a I'm a highlight guy with with uh with
with Team USA basketball, both men's and women's.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
The other thing, too, is like there's really no I.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
Mean not to sound like a narrative wind bag, but
there's no like storyline really like gets me into this,
Like there's no redeem team, there's no you know, there
really isn't anything really kind of hooking me into to watch.
And I mean also the fact that the games are,
you know, when they're showing a lot or kind of
you know, all over the places, hard for me to
(02:33):
kind of catch up. So now I'm just you know,
reading accounts and pulling stuff on social media.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Like, sure, what is it about the international game? Like
is it the spacing? I feel like there's a lot
of there's a differencing. It just feel it feels a
little like college hoops played by NBA players or something
like everything's like kind of clogged up. There's still like
big men still matter. That's cute, it's quaint.
Speaker 4 (02:59):
I'm all with that. I'm you know again, as a
as a fan, as a fan of the backs of
the basket style of playing, as someone who does it
when he does play. Yeah, you know, it's this this
should this should very wont it should very well be
in my my wheelhouse.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
But I don't know what it is with with Olympic basketball.
Speaker 4 (03:17):
I just I don't know. It just it doesn't hit
me the same way that it did, you know, twenty
twenty five years ago. But that's that's okay. I mean,
I'm obviously rooted for.
Speaker 3 (03:25):
The for the US to win, so that's you know,
that's yeah, yeah, that's fine.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
Well, your nineties players, by the way we're going to talk,
you're some of your favorite nineties guys, and you've gotten
some of some of my favorite Back to the Basket
highlights that I've watched in a long time. Makes it.
I was going to say, get back to the basket. Yeah,
yeah for sure.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
If if like we had the Dream Team and Redeemed team,
what nickname would you give this squad?
Speaker 1 (03:53):
Is it just like hurry up and just win the goal?
Speaker 4 (03:55):
It I'm trying to you know, it's funny. It's it's
a little late in the day for me here, so
my my gears aren't ring the way.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
They should be thought nicknames. I don't know, maybe the
geez that's a good question.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
More like I guess the more the expectation, right, because
you were saying there's like sort of a lack of
like a narrative you can invest in.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
The results seem pretty like.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
For I don't know, like the you know, I don't know,
the go get them squad.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
Yeah, I get it.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
It's sort of just like we I think we all
have the feeling of like, well, they're gonna win, so yeah,
they're gonna win.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
I mean it would be yeah, I don't know. Again,
I think at some point there's gonna be another.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
Rejiggering of how this works.
Speaker 4 (04:44):
There's gonna be maybe a mix of like college players
and pro players on.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
The US side.
Speaker 4 (04:50):
So I don't know. I mean, the next the next
wrinkle that gets thrown in, the next obvious narrative that
gets thrown in, you know, that's when that's when I
think I'll be a little more interested in what's going on.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
But I mean, I also don't think it's over. It's
not over. The US has been playing really well up
to this point. They have to play Serbia for conservatively
the fourteenth time this summer in the final four coming up.
But I mean they always say beating a team for
the fourteenth time is always more difficult than the first
(05:22):
time you're playing them. So I can see, you know,
something wild happened. I did come into this Olympics saying
I don't know why the US is so heavily favored,
and now I know why. And that's called learning, folks, Yeah,
it's called Maybe those warm up games were truly warm
up games, Like, I don't know, I feel like they
(05:43):
were holding something back a little bit. Yeah, it feels
like you're just watching them toy with, not toy with,
but like the way that they like don't even have
the beginnings of a rotation. There's like, yeah, we're gonna
let this guy get his run. Like heading in, we
(06:04):
were talking about how it felt like a YMCA basketball
team where they're like you five play now, you five
play now, you you know, like just get letting everybody
get their minute, and my dad coach, Yeah, and it
still feels like that, like just on a game to
game basis where they're like, all right, we're gonna tell
(06:25):
eight guys that they're in the rotation tonight and then
just warn a couple other guys that they're sitting.
Speaker 4 (06:31):
I mean, it's so crazy if you think about it,
how quickly the Olympics starts right.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
After the NBC NBA season ends. I mean, it's it's absurd.
Speaker 4 (06:41):
It's what what maybe maybe six weeks over the finals ends,
and then you go right into international play and you
have to just again orchestrate chemistry and lineups on the fly.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
I mean there's no there you know there is. There's
not a lot of runway to to get lineups now.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
So yeah, I mean I can absolutely see that happening
where Steve Kurrs like okay, like Derek White, great, let's
try this, let's put let's let's sit Jason Tatum down
for a bit. So I don't know, that's interesting. That's
interesting to me, But I don't know how you guys
feel about this too. Maybe I'm just maybe it's a
side of my increasingly creaky old age. But like between
(07:21):
the Olympics the w n B, A, I don't know,
I kind of I kind of needed to be a
break from play, Like I think to me, like it's
kind of nice to just have a little bit of
rest before we go into the pre into you know,
into the into the NBA preseason, you know. I mean,
I'm I do follow the w n B a little bit,
(07:41):
but not to into the NBA. But I do think
it's okay to have a break. But maybe I'm just
the weirdo who who doesn't want wall to wall basketball.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
No, you need you need those You need to punctuate
the action with a little bit of breathing space in between,
so you can kind of be in to reset your expectations,
build new fantasies in your brain, as I do as
a Lakers fan. If they're playing all the time and
Rui's hurt, I can't begin to write fan.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
Fiction in my mind with NonStop basketball, seeing the team
not look that great with Mbat in there, until this
past game against Brazil has really not given my brain
the break it needs to begin dreaming of a fantasy
seventy six er season where it all comes together and
you know, the seventy six ers win the title, because
(08:27):
now I'm still seeing the same problems with them be
being in the middle out there. So I'm like, I
can't even dream. I can't sleep in this offseason.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
Yeah, like again, it's you know again with the ninety
two dream team, like that was very much just a
one big celebration from start to finish, and it really
and you and watching those games, you know, as a teenager,
it didn't really feel like there was much struggle involved.
Like I was watching I was a nick guy, so
(08:58):
watching Patrick doing you know, play, I wasn't thinking about
I don't know, like he's not adjusting all of the
double teams. I was just happy watching him clean you
know someone you know, some guy from Brazil's from Brazil's clock.
So like. But now, because because the teams are so
much more competitive internationally, you don't have that ability to
(09:20):
just see Joel Embiid drop thirty five points and feel
good about yourself.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
You can't have to think about like, oh, boy, like,
you know, he.
Speaker 4 (09:29):
Looks like he looks he looks like he's struggling here
in the summer, and he's not gonna have.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Time to reach hard.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
So yeah, it adds a lot of drama, a lot
of drama too. If you're if you're if you're, if
you're a fan of a team, Yeah, I mean, I
I can't. I mean, I love him bid, but I can't.
I can't imagine being a Sixers fan and watching this unfold.
Speaker 3 (09:47):
It's got to be, you know, painful, a.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Joy, like being a six fan is always a joy. Yeah,
I don't know. I was talking to my Philly cousins
shout out Drew shout out of Alma cousins from Philly,
and they were talking about like they get frustrated at
about like Sixers fandom is like everybody. It's just like
everybody's constantly depressed and like sad. Like even in this
(10:14):
off season where they like finally put us a really
compelling team together around Embiid, they're like, yeah, but Embiad's
the problem, And uh so, I don't know, I'm just
gonna I'm gonna stop being as critical and just immediately
depressed as I usually am until you know, at least
ten games into the regular show.
Speaker 4 (10:33):
I get it because, look, I used to be a
diehard Knicks fan, and in a way it became impossible
to enjoy the game at a simplest level. So like,
you know, again, like I, you know, I tell the
story a lot, but like I was a Knicks fan
during Michael George's heyday, when basically every spring he would
just beat the Knicks like like yote the money, like
(10:56):
it was just every spring was the same narrative played
over and over again. And as a as a kid,
as a teenager, my springs were miserable because Michael Jordan
was just killing the Knicks and torturing Hubert Davis and
John Starts for forty points a game, and I couldn't.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
I couldn't.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
Not only could I not enjoy it the.
Speaker 4 (11:15):
Knicks, I couldn't enjoyed Michael Jordan. And I couldn't enjoy
arguably the greatest player of all time at his apex
because I was worried about you know, Anthony Mason not
getting enough playing time, or Ubert Davis not not you know,
Uber Davis inability to take the ball to a hoop.
So the one cool thing about being sort of a
(11:36):
basketball I don't know, like just being a basketball fan
basone just watches the games to watch them, is that
I can watch any game without that nagging feeling that
you have Jack of being the Sixers fan. Yeah, and
you know, and wondering like, you know, is Paul George
going to be effective when this when this contract ends
and he's like thirty eight years old. I mean, yeah,
(11:57):
those are that's those are things I don't have to
deal with anymore. And it's it's kind of nice just
to be able to watch a game, to watch a game. Yeah,
but I don't know, it's my take.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
That's what. The one thing I really enjoy about like
watching the international games or like the Olympic Games is like,
especially when the US is playing, is I actually I
feel happy for all of.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
The people that are clearly in there to see all
these NBA players and just like the excitement they get
was just like, yeah, Lebron's on a fast break, you dunked,
and they're like it's just like exploding.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Everyone is like, yes, I saw it. I got to
see this. I got to see the thing. Yeah, And
like Katie having great games special effects, he can actually
do that.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
Yeah, he just did that in front of me, Like
right here, did you see he shook Tony Parker's hand.
Tony Parker looked like a little guy next to him.
Shocking stuff. Shocking stuff.
Speaker 3 (12:51):
Yeah, but that's but but that's I think.
Speaker 4 (12:53):
But you're that's a really good point though, cause I
think it's very easy to forget those little things.
Speaker 3 (12:57):
Yeah, basic things.
Speaker 4 (12:58):
That we just take for granted it, like you know, again,
just to you know, to see Lebron James performing the
way he is a what thirty.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Nine, Yeah, incredible, it's incredible, Like.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
Just just just say to me, like, that's the beautiful
Boby of the Olympics.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
That there is a part of it that I think
is that I think I that I think I gravitate
toward is the fact that you can enjoy players.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
Without having to worry.
Speaker 4 (13:22):
About the the baggage they bring, right, Like I can't.
So like, if you're a Cavaliers fan and you're still
upset about Lebron bolting twice, you can watch the Olympics
and just enjoy Lebron being Lebron. Or you know, if
you if you're if you hate Steph Curry. You can
just enjoy Steph Curry shooting threes with ease.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
Yeah, you know, it just naturally.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
That's kind of the nice part about the Olympics that
it just allows you to be, I guess, more of
a fan instead of having these these allegiances you know,
way down way way down your your you're viewing.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
The USA Basketball did have to come out and specifically
say yes, USA does include Cleveland. I know there is
some question about that, but you are we do represent
you as well. So that was exciting for them. I
do wonder like if they continue this dominance, and I
don't I don't personally, I don't expect that to happen.
(14:17):
I think they're going to have tougher games against Serbia
and then France or Germany, But like, would this be
the most impressive because they haven't been this dominant since
the Dream Team, and there's so much more talent around,
like in on these other teams than even four years ago,
(14:41):
Like that, it would be pretty wild if this team
was able to just like kind of continue doing what
they're doing so far.
Speaker 4 (14:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
So I in that way, they're kind of underdogs because
they're playing against history, they're playing against themselves and they're
playing against titaned competition that is not nearly as good
as them and jet Lag, Oh the jet Lag. Can
you what Bron's eating like the bed No Olympic village food, No,
(15:08):
not a chance, right. I don't think any of the
I doubt any of the US athletes.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
I don't like the steaks are so high like for it,
like because this is like also like you know, soft
propaganda for the world, so like it's like, yeah, dude,
we brought it, we bought, we brought like a herd
of cattle to process our own beef.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
So they're eating enough red right there.
Speaker 3 (15:27):
Yeah they're not. I don't think they're either.
Speaker 4 (15:28):
They're they're walking the streets of powers looking for McDonald's.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
You don't think so, Yeah, you don't think Lebron's being
forced to swim in the Seine. There was like that one.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
I think an Italian swimmer who was like sleeping in
a nearby park because he's like the Olympic village was
like too uncomfortable for him.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
Like the guy just took a nap in a park
and they're like, yo, this guy just competed in the Olympics. Yeah,
it's a very I think it's just been out drinking
to be To be fair, I've slept in parks before,
but right after a pretty wild night. All right, let's
take a quick break. We can come back. We'll talk
(16:04):
about some of the other international teams and some great
nineties player. This is going to be a history lesson
that I'm gonna you might have forgotten about. I didn't, certainly,
but you the listener may have. We'll be right back
(16:27):
and we're back. We're back, and Australia has been eliminated.
Australia Sorry, sorry, annoying just across the board in the
Olympics this year. Wow, I'm standing by it. I don't
like you. No, that's not true. There were just there's
a doubles team that beat the US that was annoying
(16:47):
to me. That's mainly who I'm talking about. But Australia
basketball has been eliminated by Serbian and overtime. Despite a
great game from Patty Mills. You're never gonna guess who
closed the show for Serbia. Jokic. I'm just gonna read
this from leor Kozi summary of the end of the game.
(17:09):
Jokic block. Jokic knocks a layup off the rim, Jokic Steele,
Jokic jump hook in traffic to take a one point lead,
Yokic turnaround, fade away to go up by three, all
within ninety seconds. Wow, yeah, he just took it over.
He's good at basketball, I think.
Speaker 4 (17:25):
I mean, I'm still waiting to you know, afore the
MVP would convince me, but like, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
Not quite there. We got a World War matchup coming
between Germany and France. Germany defeated Greece and Jannis. France
defeated Canada and Dylan Brooks and Jamal Murray and Shay
Gilgess Alexander Canada. I think a lot of people were
(17:54):
expecting to be up there on the podium, so that
I'd say that was the biggest surprise of a team
going out earlier than expected as of yet. And they won.
Despite Wembiyama not having his best stuff in this game,
he did give us the photograph of the Olympics so
far by blocking Dylan Brooks in an otherwise you know,
(18:19):
forgettable game. But just you know, his head is at
the backboard, his arm is up incredibly high. Dylan Brooks
is shooting a floater that is getting easily gobbled up
by Wee Biyama in mid air. It's pretty wild.
Speaker 4 (18:34):
Yeah, he's he's gonna be a special player.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
I mean, it's it's it's yeah, he's just so talented
that guy.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
Where do you do you think he is in the
MVP competition two years from now, three years from now,
next season, I think two years, I.
Speaker 4 (18:51):
Think be expected as as he gets, as his body
gets used to an NBA schedules, he gets as he
grows up, as he gets older, he gets more weight
on it, waiting on the frame. The Yeah, I mean,
I think I think in two years he'll be he'll
be riding that he'll be right in that competition, especially
if the Spurs get good, you know, and and and
that's that's that's a big part of this too. But yeah,
(19:11):
I mean it's it's every time I've seen him play,
it's just he's I mean, he is, he is. He's
an anomaly. I mean you don't see that body, that
that that length, that height, the ability shoo from the outside.
I mean it is, he's, he's he's a creature. I
mean it's just there's no other way, there's no other
way to put it.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
Yeah, did you guys, watch any three on three basketball.
I just want to bring sad really quickly. I did
watch the I'd watched the gold medal game. Was this
sport specifically invented to create a basketball medal that the
USA did not win in Chile?
Speaker 2 (19:43):
Because I I'd imagine, right, Because I mean, and here's
not even my conspiratorial thinking. I mean, it's like truly,
like even as the Olympic, like the IOC describes the
history of three on three, it's like American street basketball,
you know what I mean. It's like so clearly they're like,
we're taking this from American culture. But you know, as
I think most of us were like, bro, we should
be putting out a team that should just be serving.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
People out there.
Speaker 5 (20:07):
It's the eligibility rules you have putting this team together. Well,
you have to be playing foeba three on three basketball
and you get enough games. Yeah yeah, So what player
is going to be Like, I just finished my NBA season,
I'll now spend my entire summer trying to get enough
games in and the FOBA three by three on three
circuit to be eligible. That's why, like some you know,
(20:29):
I think the closest thing was maybe Cameron Brink who
before she injured her a cl she was going to
be on that three three on three team. But like
so they're definitely there's w NBA representation and for NBA
players who have either played the game or not whatever.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Jim or it did not happen. They came in seventh
out of eighty. Canyon Barry, I didn't know they were
still a Berry person playing. I know, I had no idea.
Speaker 4 (20:55):
Yeah, I mean the thing that the thing that I
found really curiousbout the three on three tournament. And this
is just me being being just you know, just seeing
pictures and whatever, but like, why why was the ball?
Does he really really weird something you get from a supermarket?
Like it's small, yeah, Like it was different colors too.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
It just it looked I don't know, I don't know if.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
That's just the design of it or just it wasn't
even like a leather basketball.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
It was like a it just looks like something you
get like like like a.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
Like those big river balls that are like like you
know the supermarket.
Speaker 1 (21:28):
That yeah, like a big page.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
Yeah, like dodgeball balls, Yeah, exactly, Like you know, the
ball is slightly smaller than the Foeba size.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
Because they said they're trying to humiliate us. What is
going on exactly? Do all the little things to throw
Americans up? The ball is different, like and sometimes the
ball is uneven and like when you bounce it, it
just goes in a different direction. Yeah, like when you've
been treating an outdoor ball terribly. All right, but like,
(21:59):
who do we need to get involved here? Like one
name came up before I think Jabari said it, and
I was like, yes, that is who would be the
best three on three player from from the NBA is Kyrie?
Speaker 4 (22:13):
Oh I was going to say, like Kyrie is great,
but if you're looking for retired, I mean Joe Johnson
has been the name that's coming.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
Jo Johnson has been so good. Yeah, three on three who.
Speaker 4 (22:24):
Amazing? So fun amazing.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
I feel like, yeah, you could easily like create some
kind of like development league where it's like the old
like and one type players are like, let's because I
would that would just be such a show. But but
that didn't really even look like what was winning in three?
It was slow and people cutting and yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:45):
In my mind, it's just straight up like clear out
the clear out the lane every time, Like.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
Yeah, just doing one on one and then shooter. I
mean it feels like there are some like the the
amount of three point shooting is very inconsistent and like
sometimes like there were some games where the US took
like six threes total, which are twos in this but
the reason like it took the NBA two and a
(23:11):
half decades to realize, Wow, threes are mathematically worth so
many more points than twos. We should like change the
way we run our offenses to take that into account.
Two is even more than one, Like it's double, you know,
like mathematically. And I did crunch the numbers on this,
(23:33):
and I spent a lot of time on this is
more than one. It's actually yeah, I did run the
numbers by Terrence Howard and Helogy.
Speaker 4 (23:44):
Two.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
It's so if you just have Kyrie and shooting, and
then you know people who are able to defend, I
don't know, so like a big who can shoot.
Speaker 4 (23:57):
Since to me, you get a point guard, you get
a really good outside you do you get a big
man or yeah, you get it, you get a center. Yeah,
I mean they just thinking now like you probably do
that with recently retired NBA players.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
Yeah, just and but I don't know.
Speaker 4 (24:11):
I mean, I again, I'm this, this sounds great in
my mind, but again, you know, I'm a dumb ass.
So this is probably some of the probably also ready
to refute this, but like, I don't know, if you
if you got like let's say Kyle Korver and Dwight
Howard from whatever lead He's roam around and and and
I don't know, let's say, let's just say rayper Austin
(24:33):
to go back.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
Yeah, yeah, you know, does that team do well?
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Does that team, yeah, right, do better than seventh of eight? Probably?
I think I think maybe maybe Jamal Crawford is also
an idea that was thrown out by a super producer, Jabari,
that I really liked, and I'm a little concerned that
he wasn't actually involved. I think Jamal Crawford Joe Johnson like,
(24:57):
where what are we doing here? Guys?
Speaker 4 (24:58):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (24:59):
It was Why were they not on this team?
Speaker 4 (25:01):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Just a big three to just get the three? Well,
the big thing's run right now, right, so you can't
really do that.
Speaker 4 (25:07):
You can't have the big three?
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Yeah, I mean, it feels like it would be worth it, like,
find a way to make it worth their while? All right,
we should get to the continuation of our Summer of
nineties hoops conversation. I'm a big Patrick Ewing fan. Uh
So it's Ewing, it's Petrovitch, and it is the guy
(25:30):
who was referring to up top, back to the basket magician,
our vetus, Sibonis, he is our vetus, he is Sibonis,
he is your desire. I but Ewing has definitely become
underrated over the years because he's just one of those
(25:52):
guys who like never quite got there in terms of
the title, but was so great and like had his
peak was blocking everything was you know, a bucket was
just so good on the on the glass, just unbelievable.
Speaker 4 (26:10):
You know.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
Yeah, do you think if he hadn't been injured in
ninety nine, do you think they win the title?
Speaker 4 (26:17):
Me? No, I don't think they do. I think I
think I mean again, you know that that rum was
was incredible and it was it was it was led
by you know, spree Well and Canby. You know, Youing
at that point was fourteen years into his career and
you know had played heavy, heavy minutes you know, the
majority of the of of that time. You know, he
was not the Patrick Ewing of nineteen eighty nine or
(26:39):
even nineteen ninety five. He was. He was a good center,
but he was I don't think he was going to
hold up against David Robinson and Tim Duncan in the
nine finals.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
And when he got hurt is when they went on
the run, so exactly.
Speaker 4 (26:51):
Yeah, So yeah it was. And that's I think what
ultimately led the Knicks to say to themselves like, we
really don't need yeah, Patrick Ewing uh anymore, which was
a whole drama you know when I was you know,
when I was reading the sports pages back in the day.
But you're right, I mean, Ewing was somebody who I
think as time, as as time has gone on, he's
(27:14):
become forgotten. I think for a few reasons. A. He
didn't win a championship. B he became A he came
during an era of just superstar centers with Shaquille O'Neill
and Kim Olajuan, David Robinson, Baile won championships and and
Ewing sort of became kind of like the eighties nineties
version of like you know, Elvid Hayes, just you know
(27:37):
a player that was you know, you look at him,
you look at the stats, you put up wonderful stats,
but he kind of gets lost in the shuffle. But
it's funny when you look at you Ing now, he
really was. He was really the beginning of, or rather
the start of the out of the outside shooting centers.
Speaker 3 (27:56):
I mean there were a few, there was a few
that were Yeah, there were a.
Speaker 4 (27:58):
Few that were around, like in the seventies, in even
the sixties, but Ewing was really a lot of his
game was, you know, baseline jumper, top of the circle jumper,
and he had he had great post moves, but he
was he liked to be in the outside. And I
think back then now sort of knock against him was
that he wasn't really as physical as he should have been,
kind of like embiad is now where you know, I
(28:19):
think if you watch him be play, I think he
kind of favors the outside little too much.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
But Patrick Guan was a great player.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
I think I think it was just his misfortune that
not only did he not want a championship, but he
didn't for whatever reason. The Knicks front off is Dave Checkets,
and you know, primarily they never surrounded him with great
complimentary players. They never really strouded him with with a
with a great number two player. He never really had,
(28:48):
you know, the way that you know, Steph had Clay,
you know, Lebron James had Kyrie Irving Patrick who didn't
really have a terrific number to play, kind of dominicqe
Wuilgans in Atlanta, you know.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
So, yeah, they drafted Mark Jackson. He won the Rookie
of the Year, but he was gone pretty quickly, you know,
he was he was gone pretty quickly.
Speaker 4 (29:10):
And he wasn't like he wasn't like Kyrie Irving. He
wasn't a guy that he wasn't the kind of player
that you could depend on to.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
Score twenty five was like a bucket. Yeah. Yeah, he
was just a great great great point guard.
Speaker 4 (29:23):
Great point guard, great player, but again not not you know,
wasn't gonna put up twenty five points a game. And
you know, the Knicks tried to get Yeling that they
traded for Rolando Blackman back in ninety two. That didn't
work out because Rolando Blackman aged about fifteen years in
the season he was in New York, you know, Charles
uh when blacking, like like Xavier McDaniel was a little
(29:45):
you know, pass his problem, and they picked him up
in ninety one. Charles Smith wasn't who they thought who
wasn't the premier talent he was gonna they thought that
the Nicks thought they were going to get. So it
just never really worked out for Patrick Ewing with getting
number two. But I you know, again as a Knicks
fan growing up, and I love Patrick Doning because he
just he he just always seemed to work so hard.
(30:07):
And again the image I of Patrick Ewing is him
part of the free throw line, sweating like he had
just run two marathons like he was. He was just
pouring sweat, And I think that further kind of further
accentuated this whole warrior aspect about him.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
But no, yeah, he was.
Speaker 4 (30:26):
He was a great player.
Speaker 1 (30:27):
I mean, yeah, it was awesome.
Speaker 2 (30:29):
Absolutely, I mean like what I mean, And I was
too young, but like when he was at Georgetown, was
he known for being as offensive a player as he
added those dimensions, Because I felt like I remember, like
at least my childish perception of him was like he
was an insane defender in college and then then added
these other and credit to him, like evolved his game
(30:51):
in a way that you know, obviously makes them.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
As Shaq would.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
Say, one of the greats, which is wild too because
for me, I always thought, I like, you know, being
when when Shaq came in the league, I'm like, this
is what I think is like a dope center. But
I remember later on Shaq was on NBA TV and
like got emotional talking about Patrick Ewing, and that's when
I sort of was like, oh, I'm I'm a child
(31:15):
or like obviously I have a very one dimensional way
of looking at, like, you know, judging someone's game, and
that was like a very interesting I'll just play like
a quick clip of it because it was sort of
like one of these things was like, oh wow, like
Shaq is truly giving this man his flowers. And as
he always put it, he's like I saw him as
a great that I was modeling my game after.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
But I had to build on that.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
So yes, that part of that does include destroying him,
but that's just my spirit as a competitor, not because
I have no respect for him. You are right, No,
let's you getting look like you're getting emotional?
Speaker 6 (31:43):
Yeah, I saw it. I just saw Patrick Ewing. Man,
that's a real tier too. I was Patrick Ewing, did
we get.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
A close up on the deck? Can we zoom in
that that's real tears, ladies and John, that's not trick
rat are you saying not like the real tissue?
Speaker 6 (31:56):
You know, you know a lot of people. You know
a lot of people when they talk about the great
and never comes up. But I'm putting patching you in names.
There's great. It was a great competitor, even though he
never even at the time when you scream this is
my house, get out of course, listen, listen. I watch
a lot of karate movies, and in every karate movie,
(32:16):
the student always had to kill the teacher to become
the best. So you know, even even though Pat was
better than me, I had to to say that to
psych myself out.
Speaker 2 (32:24):
But yeah, so yeah, yeah, it's like when you hear
those kinds of sort of kind words that kind of
really put things into perspective of like where it was.
Speaker 1 (32:33):
I think a lot of people remember the missed layup
and like a crucial miss lay up towards the end
of his career. But just watching some of these highlights
that super producer Jabari put together, the violence with which
he dunked on people. Yeah, early in his career, I mean,
and like throughout his career is really like, yeah, it
feels kind of influential in some ways.
Speaker 4 (32:55):
Like he was he was, he was, he wasn't informer
And again like I don't think you played with Charles
Oakly for eight nine years and you know thrivee with
him if you're timid or if you're if you're weak willed.
Speaker 3 (33:10):
Patrick Ewey was was a scary dude, and he was.
Speaker 4 (33:14):
Somebody who, as you put it, jack like he would
he would dunk on you, and he was he was.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
He came to the hoop hard, you know.
Speaker 4 (33:23):
But but I think, but it's unfortunate that again, we
remember the times that he came up short, Like the
ninety four finals is a perfect example. You know, a
kim Alavn just cleaned his clock, and I think that
is what people remember.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
They remember, they remember a Keeam going.
Speaker 4 (33:40):
Bana going bananas against against Patrick Ewing and John Starts
going was it two for nineteen.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
In game seven appeals?
Speaker 3 (33:48):
Yeah, so yeah, so it's very so yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:52):
I mean he unfortunately if he had won one championship
with it, Elvin Hayes did the way that Dolve Chase
did and back Aways Wolves reed one too.
Speaker 3 (34:02):
He's remembered a lot.
Speaker 4 (34:03):
I think he'd be remembered a lot more fondly, and.
Speaker 3 (34:06):
It would take.
Speaker 4 (34:06):
It would take it wouldn't take Shaquille O'Neill to kind
of get people to remember him.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Yea, he was.
Speaker 4 (34:13):
He was an outstanding player, and he also played an
impossible media market in Miles as he said, like, yeah,
at Georgia he was like he was more like a
Bill Russell type, like a block, a rebounder, defensive guy.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
And he yeah, I mean if you look.
Speaker 4 (34:26):
At his highlights in college, like he's not doing those,
you know, he's not doing that back to the basket,
curl to the center jump shot. He's not you know,
posting up on the low blocks. He's very much just
a kind of a the ultimate. He's a defensive presence.
He's a defensive monster. And so yeah, I mean I
don't think he gets nearly enough credit for being for
(34:47):
being a truly great player. I mean, he had fourteen
or fifteen great seasons. How come does that happen?
Speaker 1 (34:54):
Right? Yeah? Yeah, he was also like Embiid and like Alajuan,
like started hooping pretty late in life, you know, he
didn't come to the US until eleven and started playing
basketball then. So I think that's like, you know, Embiid
in college was not a like the thing you'd noticed
about him was not his like deft offensive touch. It
(35:16):
was like, Wow, he's like really athletic and like good
at blocking. And yeah, yeah, but I don't mean to
talk about I was speaking of Shack.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
Yeah, someone who really something that really puts things into perspective,
especially like we got to talk about.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
Our Vitas Sabonis.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
So I grew up watching us do battle with him
in these Western Conference finals, in the playoffs, just throughout
the regular season, and he was one of the most
frustrating players.
Speaker 1 (35:44):
I remember being like, but we got Shack, but this
guy's Sabonis. He's like not even as athletic.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
I don't understand. It was really frustrating. And then I remember,
like later on I learned, I was like, oh, we
were playing the dusty version of R Vita Sabonis, like
we've missed peak Arvet and that's in my mind, Wizard's
version of R give his Shack that work.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
And I was like, yeah, yeah, you know who.
Speaker 4 (36:15):
It's funny looking at the old highlights of Arvidas Sabonis
and he's so much like Jokic, you know, very I mean,
great outside touch, amazing passer, just a guy that just
a just a great team player.
Speaker 3 (36:32):
And and you're right, wus like he I remember.
Speaker 4 (36:34):
Watching I think it was a the Rookie, the Rookie Showcase,
the Rookie first year Player whatever that's called the Rising
Stars Challenge, like in ninety five ninety six, and I
remember Sabonis played in that game, and like he's like
exactly like he's saying, it's like Joe Smith and like
(36:55):
he's you know, up and all these like these young
these young bloys. He looked like he was running in sand.
Like he was so moving so slowly and so tenderly. Yeah,
it almost looked like it was it seemed like he was.
Speaker 3 (37:09):
In pain playing right at that kind of pace.
Speaker 4 (37:13):
But he was, but he was just but even at
at the minished state he was, he was not only
was he was he a good player, He was a
very good player. But he was a key contributor to
some really really good Portland Trail Plazer teams. I mean
that that two thousand team, that game seven, aside that
that meltdown, they they headed the finals. So so you know,
(37:36):
to to watch Sabonis like that's one of the great
what ifs like what if Sabonis when he was there
but he was drafted by Atlanta originally at eighty six
straight five?
Speaker 3 (37:46):
What if he came out then? What if he was
able to make.
Speaker 4 (37:49):
That jump and play with Dominique Wilkins, doc whit gosh,
Kevin willis like that to me is one of the
great Or what if like what if he played you know,
what if he came back five years before, like at
eighty nine and played with ky.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
Drets and potentially Draws and Petrovitch even Yeah, yeah, but
it was also part of that part of the start
up in Portland.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Yeah, I think I think we're talking about a completely
different world. I think he comes over, he's giving Bird
the work, like he's better than Bird right away, and
we lose the Cold War, like America's spirit is completely
deflated and it's like rocky for him. Reverse he comes
over and we're just like they're they got us man,
(38:35):
Like this is our best absolutely hoop, Like I had nothing,
no frame, Like my brain would not have been able
to compute somebody coming over from Russia, Like I was
like Russia, like yeah, okay, they they might be superior
in ice hockey. Like they don't have basketball over there,
(38:56):
it's too cold, and like having just like have the
nastiest game. Like some of these highlights, we'll link off
to them in the show notes, but like some of
these highlights are it's like, oh yeah, I've never seen
that pass anywhere except for maybe Magic and Jokic. And
it's like a behind the back pass where he's not
(39:19):
even like looking. He just like has a sense that
somebody's where he knows they are, and it goes past
three people's heads, like just over their shoulders, like three defenders,
and just like weaves its way through in a way
that seems like it's it doesn't make sense.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
He was he was a magician, and he was he
was so splendid in the low post passing. I mean,
I can watch clips of or Vitas a Bonus in
Portland passing to Scottie Pippen and Steve Smith and Kenny
Anderson all day because the meam like that. Once or
twice a game, one of them would cut and Sabona
but just delivered the bullet bounce pass hits the guy
(39:57):
riding's drive like he to me, what what I love
of watching Yokic playing is to me.
Speaker 3 (40:04):
This is gonna sound silly, but.
Speaker 4 (40:07):
I kind of wonder what would be like to play
like half court basketball with them, yea, and like I
get so excited and that's why, and that's what it
would be. I can't imagine what it be like playing
half court with with Yokic or with Sabonis, because like
you just know that if you make a cut to
the basket, you're gonna the ball is going to be
in the right location and you'll be and if you move,
you'll be rewarded. Or it was like that magic was
(40:29):
like that where they just they just had they just
they had just great anticipation and they just they trusted
their teammates to be in the right spot. But I mean, Sabonis,
it's so but yeah, I mean when Sabonis came to
Portland and you touch on this on this just now, Jack,
Like now we hear about players coming in from overseas
(40:50):
and it's not a big deal, Like you know, Wemby
goes first, and it's it's okay, Yeah, of course some
foot three Greek of Nature can shoot outside jump shots.
Speaker 3 (41:01):
He's nineteen.
Speaker 4 (41:02):
Of course we're going to get them. But back in
back in the eighties, and nineties. Even in the early
two thousands, there wasn't this pipeline of information. There wasn't,
you know, there wasn't. There wasn't The basketball hadn't really
spread the way that it has it has now, where
you know, we can actually talk about the Olympic Games
being competitive among multiple countries. So when our Vita Savonas
(41:22):
came along, and even when you know, Drosen got drafted,
Petrovich and a lot of depots, there was a lot
of suspicion because like, that wasn't a normal thing to
get players from overseas and bring them into the NBA, right,
not like unless they were like a Chemo Lagat or
Dela Shrimp and they went to a US college, right,
(41:43):
got refined, got reps and then okay, it's fine. But
like to pluck someone from a foreign country and bring
them into the NBA, that was not That was almost
underheard of, especially in the late nineteen eighties, And.
Speaker 1 (41:58):
It was as of this show that it go back
to that way. We don't like them at US all
the way Russia. Jack, there was the US s R
back then, but he's from the US s R. Whatever.
Man too much Rocky to your Rocky Brain dies the
USSR though, man, that would have been that would have
(42:20):
been close enough for me, right up.
Speaker 2 (42:25):
I mean that's I mean again huge what if what
if the bonus comes through? You know, if if first
of all, if the Soviet Union had allowed it, and
then maybe he doesn't get that Achilles injury that he
needs to read. Which is another thing too, is like
this guy was playing with like a busted Achilles and
so he still still playing well, still playing yeah, right,
(42:47):
But the next what if, which I think as I
was looking into this more and more, seems to be
like one of the biggest what ifs in the NBA,
which is Draws and Petrovitch.
Speaker 1 (42:58):
He played what like three seasons in the NBA.
Speaker 3 (43:02):
I think eighty eight eighty nine was his first season.
Speaker 4 (43:05):
Was see he played in the finals against the Pistons
nineties eighty nine nine. I think's like, yeah, it's eighty.
Speaker 2 (43:10):
Nine and many yeah, but yeah, all that to say
is like, as I you know, there was this one
interview I was watching with Reggie Miller and he's like
the greatest shooter of all time is actually Draws and Petrovitch.
Oh yeah, And I was like, whoa, whoa, that's I mean,
I knew he was nice with it, but when a
lot of people really talk about just like what his
last season with the Nets, and you're like, oh, this
(43:33):
thing is about to go off like fully, and he
tragically passed away in a car accident at twenty eight
that you know, cut his career short. But you know
what was sort of when you saw the list of
people you can talk about, like when we were talking
about nineties nostalgia players, like aside from the what ifs,
like or maybe it was the what ifs, what really
drew you to Draws and Petrovitch, I mean.
Speaker 4 (43:54):
With Draws and Petrovitch is more about that team, the Nets.
I think, you know again, I grew up in central
New Jersey, which was very much Knicks territory, even though
the Nets played in the Meadowlands, which was like thirty
minus from my house from my parents' house. So but
but the but the that Nets team, like ninety three,
ninety three, ninety four was absolutely stacked, like they were
(44:15):
primed to do to do great things because Drazen Petrovitch,
who was coming into his own who's a remarkable shooter.
And this is why why YouTube is such a gift
if you're a sports nerd or any any kind of devotee,
because you can go back and watch game footage and
draws and Petrovitch if you watch the game Foich, I'm.
Speaker 3 (44:36):
Sure you guys have.
Speaker 4 (44:37):
His release is just lightning quick like he he comes
off curls and just shoots and it's a it looks almost.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
Like an optical illusion.
Speaker 4 (44:45):
He is so so quick, and he would have thrived
in today's game. He was He was almost like a
Klay Thompson type where he was just he he just
could shoot from anywhere, could get to the basket if
he needed to. Great player, but Rosin was was was special.
But that team, like you have to remember this New Jersey,
New York was always Knicks still lives to a certain degree.
(45:08):
But back in ninety two, nineteen ninety three, No. Ninety three,
ninety four, I believe I'm getting my my dates mixed up.
Chuck Daly gets hired to coach the Nets, which is
a big deal because Chuck Daly again coached his dream team.
Speaker 3 (45:21):
He was also Piston's head coach during the glory years.
So this is a big gat.
Speaker 4 (45:26):
You get Tuck, you get Chuck Daily, and then you
get Derrick Coleman, who was a great player inside outside guy,
could could good great rebounder. You have Kenny Anderson was
one of the one of the best point guards coming up,
who was just you know, explosive left hander which is
you know again throws everyone off. And then johnsa Petrovitch.
(45:47):
That is a great big three right there, and you
have the right coach, you have players involved. I think
also on that team was Rick Mhorn Moe Cheeks, like
good veteran stability there.
Speaker 3 (46:00):
And they had one season. They didn't really get very far.
Speaker 4 (46:04):
I think they lost the Knicks in the first round,
I want to say, and and that was it, Like
you know, Dowson, patrickck dies you know in June and
that terrible car accident on the Autubahn, and the Nets
never recover, you know, Kenny Anderson, you know, I think
it gets injured. I think right around the middle of
ninety three, ninety four, sees know when was that he
gets injured? He breaks his wrists. One year isn't really
(46:27):
the same. Derek Coleman never puts it together, He never
kind of gets he never reaches full maturity, and that
window closes. So that's one of the to me like,
one of the great what ifs is if that NETS
team had another season, if you put together Anderson, a
healthy Kenny Anderson, Derek Coleman, that isn't you know that
(46:51):
gets it together maturity wise and Drasan Petrickish You get
those three together and.
Speaker 3 (46:56):
Chuck daily, how far do they go?
Speaker 4 (46:58):
Yeah? You know, I really think that's one of the
great one of the great what ifs in basketball history,
along with you know what if Marie Stokes doesn't hit
his head and has and basically becomes a paraplegic when
he's at the Rock, when he's at the Royals. It's
one of those great what ifs, right, I think.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
Amazing. All Right, we're going to take one more break.
We're going to come back and we're going to do
the fastest rapid fire round of questioning that you've ever heard.
We'll be rappid and we're back. We're back. Pete, my
(47:43):
dear Pete.
Speaker 2 (47:43):
Yes, we've had a had a great time talking nostalgia
ball with you, but now it's time.
Speaker 1 (47:48):
To ball B A W L tiers of pain because
you have entered the hot seat. It's the fourth quarter
rapid fire around a question.
Speaker 2 (47:57):
It's very hot in my office as I record, so
forgive my stutters the moment.
Speaker 4 (48:03):
Yeah, I was gonna say, I hope this isn't a
video time I am. I'm sort of like a pot
roast here.
Speaker 1 (48:07):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no.
Speaker 4 (48:09):
The doors are closed, and it's like, I'm this is
why this is.
Speaker 1 (48:12):
Going to be the fastest one, because I only have
a few more breaths before. You don't much time to
come to heat stroke.
Speaker 4 (48:19):
I guess. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (48:19):
I think we just got to replace our nineties players.
I think we need I think we need to take
advantage of Pete's immense backlog of knowledge and do that,
and it'll be rapid, so rapid, because it's only gonna
be one shot. We're gonna take one shot.
Speaker 3 (48:36):
I'll do the best that I can.
Speaker 1 (48:37):
Okay, all right, right, we'll get ready because here we go.
Start the clock. Don't, don't, don't don't? All right, you
want to go first? Or well, there's only one question?
Speaker 4 (48:49):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (48:49):
Wait where is the which one are you going to do?
Speaker 4 (48:51):
The one question?
Speaker 1 (48:53):
Yeah? Where was the we had this second ago? I
wasn't messing around the dog? Did you do something? Replace
the ones we were there? It is all right, you
want to do that one I'm gonna ask I'm gonna
ask another on. I'm gonna ask another question though too. Okay,
I think we should do I think we should Yes.
Hold on so fast, dude, I know you can't believe it.
Good how we are, Pete. We have two more installments
(49:15):
of the Nineties Nostalgia Conversation. So who are asking each
guest to give us a few more names to replace
the ones we discussed today. Uh, you've seen the overall list,
so give us a few more to discuss. Who are
the players that were missing from our list?
Speaker 3 (49:30):
Let's see who are miss I'm trying to remember the
list we've got.
Speaker 1 (49:33):
I'll give you. I'll tell you who's still on the board.
Sean Kemp, Iverson, Reggie Lewis, Alan Iverson, Glenn Robinson, Ray Allen,
Alan Roberson, Uh Debt Li of shremp Hakeem Free Vlade,
Sam Cassell, Anthony the Iceman, Peeler. It's from our last
(49:54):
week's guests, Matt Leeb.
Speaker 3 (49:56):
Anthony Peeler. Oh my goodness, someone's the Missouri fan in.
Speaker 4 (50:00):
Uh. That was gonna be Anthony Peter was gonna be
my guest?
Speaker 3 (50:07):
Or Anthony pig Miller.
Speaker 4 (50:09):
No, I will go with.
Speaker 3 (50:11):
That's a fine list. You know who, you know you
talk about Sam Perkins.
Speaker 1 (50:16):
That's one person, so smooth, so smooth with it. What
a smooth stroke. Okay, yeah, you give us one more,
one more, Okay.
Speaker 3 (50:27):
One more, you know what.
Speaker 4 (50:31):
Let's let's go a little off the beaten path here,
let's Marty Conlin. You know again, the there are very
few players who I watched who remind me of me
when I play. And again, I'm a slow, not terribly
talented back to the basket player, and Marty Colin would
be my avatar if I played in the NBA. He
(50:53):
he had the worst head bake and everyone always did
on it on the same way. And again, like you're
not you don't really see players like him anymore, these
very traditional bangers back to the basket type players who just.
Speaker 3 (51:07):
Sort of stick around for five to ten years. But
you know, they're just you know, they're they're they're there
are quite.
Speaker 4 (51:14):
Essential hustle, hustle to hustle guys. So yeah, my, so
Sam Perkins and Marty Kalina would be my my. Oh
can throw a third one in there?
Speaker 1 (51:23):
Sure please?
Speaker 4 (51:24):
Okay, you know what, and you can probably replace Marty
Collin with this because I don't think anyone's going to
listen to anyone.
Speaker 1 (51:30):
Discussing AKA the Celtic Killer, so he will be on
the list. Uh yeah, but he did per game.
Speaker 4 (51:43):
There you go. See that's what That's what I would
be if I if I were playing an NBA player's body,
I'd be ten points easy.
Speaker 3 (51:51):
Again, probably is his finest.
Speaker 4 (51:55):
But I but the player that I didn't stand that
list I thought was great in the nineties. That doesn't
get enough love.
Speaker 3 (52:00):
Mark Price.
Speaker 4 (52:01):
Yeah, yeah, phenomenal playmaker. Was one of the pretty much
started the trend of when a double team comes you
split the middle like he would do that a lot.
He would split like on a pick and roll. He
would just like kind of duck in and take you
to the hoop. Great three point shooter. I think he
shot over forty percent from three point line back when
that was more of a novelty. But yeah, amazing player.
(52:24):
Career was cut short because of an ecl injury and
yeah he was. He was, and he was phenomenal on
some really really good uh Cleveland Cavaliers themes back in
the day.
Speaker 3 (52:34):
So yeah, Mark Price would be my choice as well.
Speaker 1 (52:37):
One of the most beautiful strokes I've ever seen. Yeah,
just jump shooter, just a gorgeous Yeah.
Speaker 2 (52:43):
Final question for you, p yes, please describe to us
your personal highlight for you as a basketball player.
Speaker 4 (52:50):
As a basketball player, that's a.
Speaker 1 (52:52):
Great Really, what's your greatest performance? You've putting it on
my court?
Speaker 3 (52:55):
My greatest performance?
Speaker 4 (52:56):
Oh boy, this is gonna sound this is gonna sound
a little silly, but I guess I'll go with it
because it's contemporary. And I don't want to bore people with,
you know, back in my day stories because they're not
they're not that impressive.
Speaker 3 (53:09):
But I'll tell you it's it's My daughter is is seven, and.
Speaker 1 (53:15):
You know, so she'll where's this going? And you just
put up like windmilled her and I am just.
Speaker 3 (53:23):
Torturing her with right w jump boxs.
Speaker 4 (53:26):
No, but my daughter is seven years old now, and
she she will One of the great joys is like
we will shoot baskets together, or like, you know, we'll
go to the wine. You know, she'll chase down rebounds
and one of the nice one of the greatest moments
is just being able to shoot with her and her
being impressed that I can actually make a basket. Yeah,
(53:46):
that's not going to last for too much longer because
you know, I'm She's going to know that I'm a
terrible athlete and that I that you know, I'm a
thirty five percent shooterest so like that, you got to be.
Speaker 1 (53:57):
Adding tools in the off season when she's like, I know,
I know.
Speaker 4 (54:02):
I should be dedicated to working in my left hand,
but you know, only so many eighty hours a day.
Speaker 3 (54:07):
But that's probably the nicest moment, is just being able
to go out there and.
Speaker 4 (54:11):
Have that moment with my daughter and and maybe and
I hope that she's able to appreciate or maybe get
into sports because she sees me doing it. So that's
really that's really that's been a recent development that I've
really have I really cherish, you know, better than the
time I you know, I did like two behind the
(54:32):
back passes in a game or right right, you know,
almost puts the backward on a layup.
Speaker 1 (54:38):
So yeah, Pete, it turns out that was the correct
answer that we had written answer and correct roto.
Speaker 4 (54:49):
Yeah, I'm trying, I'm just trying to elevate the conversation.
Speaker 1 (54:52):
So you know, yeah, one story of the time, that's
what you on?
Speaker 2 (54:55):
Man, where do the people find you, follow you, read you,
support you, all that good stuff.
Speaker 4 (55:00):
Oh well, thank you.
Speaker 3 (55:01):
Well, yeah, i mean I'm on x Twitter whatever it's called.
Speaker 4 (55:05):
Now Twitter at Pete Crowado my name which is p
E t E c r O A T t O.
You can buy my book from Hanging on the Prime
Time pretty much anywhere, still on Amazon, still on Barnes
and Noble.
Speaker 3 (55:17):
It still hasn't been turned to mulch, so today.
Speaker 4 (55:21):
Buy it there. And yeah, i mean, I'm always you know,
I'm always you know. I'm on also most of the
social media under some variation of my name, and I'm
always posting stories and stuff.
Speaker 3 (55:31):
So yeah, I'm easy to find.
Speaker 4 (55:32):
Awesome.
Speaker 2 (55:33):
Well, you can follow our show at the hashtag Matt
boost 's b w S t i E S on Twitter.
That's we can find show links, show notes, ways to
get into our listener discord, amongst other things.
Speaker 1 (55:44):
You can find me at Miles of Gray. You can
find me at Jack Underscore Obrian and that's going to
do it. Another one on the.
Speaker 2 (55:53):
Books, another one and we'll be next week. We'll see
what happens with Team USA.
Speaker 1 (55:59):
Will the glory continue?
Speaker 4 (56:01):
I think? So?
Speaker 1 (56:02):
All right, we'll see you the next thing
Speaker 2 (56:04):
I said to see you next team, next time, the
next gam Bye, Bye, Okayama,
The Daily Zeitgeist News
Hosts And Creators
Jack O'Brien
Miles Gray
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