July 27, 2023 • 39 mins
It wasn’t until MTV network’s first show dedicated entirely to rap music, was created several years after the first hip-hop music video. This episode reminisces over the journey of Yo! MTV raps, a show that launched as an experiment, only to become a hit. But before Yo! Brooklyn native Ralph McDaniels created Video Music Box, a Hip-Hop culture series that was first to predominately feature hip hop videos. Episode guests include Ralph McDaniels. Ed Lover. Doctor Dre.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
From iHeart Podcasts, I Am Fab five Freddy, and this
this fifty Years of Hip Hop podcast series. It was
nineteen eighty three when Brooklyn native Ralph McDaniels created the
iconic and impactful music television show Video Music Box and
trust Me. Back at that time, I was tuned in.
(00:25):
Video Music Box was influential in hip hop's prevalent growth.
Hosted by creator Ralph McDaniels and his then partner Lionel Martin.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Aka the vid Kid.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Video Music Box featured new emerging rap artists, hip hop interviews, performances,
and the debut for many on television of people like Nas, Notorious,
Big jay Z, and a whole lot more. I was
tuned in the Video Music Box back in those days,
way before cable TV's had two dolls, one dial for
(00:59):
the main channels and another doll called UHF, which was
a weird dial you return and barely tune in. Other
little TV shows had a lot of static going on
back in that time.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
These are the days with the old TVs.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Keep in mind, you used to have to put aluminum
foil on the antenna or to get the reception at
least decent enough to see what was going on. It
was crazy back then, man, big impact to rush home
after school time, you know, to tune in to Video
Music Box. What was it, Channel thirty one, Weird channels,
and that was how that went down. Video Music Box
(01:34):
a big influence on all of us in New York City,
Doctor Dred, producer, radio personality.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
MTVVJ video shows were all over the place the way
they were even MTV was in its infancy, so we're
talking about between nineteen eighty three and nineteen eighty six.
Speaker 4 (01:54):
We used to watch Carlos Beazous on Neor Contracts and
we got to see new addition for the first time
doing Candy Girl. You got a chance to see Grand
Me Suppleasure and the Furious Pride with the blessing.
Speaker 5 (02:09):
Yeah, whoa wait a minute, get out, and this whole
explosion of videos that you wouldn't be able to see
on MTV at the time. We got to watch on
commercial television.
Speaker 6 (02:22):
But there also was a graph.
Speaker 7 (02:25):
McDaniels and Nava Marking Well did a program called Video
Music Box, which basically have to do it on the
UHF channel because it wasn't on table and it wasn't
on commercial TV.
Speaker 5 (02:35):
So we got to stand there and shake. Yeah, then
you gotta watch whatever videos they were, how because there
weren't a bunch of rap videos at that time.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Ralph McDaniels, co creator of New York's pioneering show Video
Music Box and currently the hip Hop coordinator for the
Queen's Public Library.
Speaker 8 (02:55):
Or an artist to have their video playing in the
eighties on TV was unheard of. Yeah, especially if you
were a black artist. You didn't see that. You know, look,
let's keep it one hundred, you know, like MTV definitely
wasn't really doing that. It took a minute, you know.
It took Michael Jackson and Columbia Records to say, if
(03:15):
y'all don't play you know these artists, we ain't giving
y'all these big name markets. You're not gonna get Whitney,
You're not gonna get Michael, You're not gonna get Lino,
Richie or whatever.
Speaker 6 (03:25):
So you had to play the big name.
Speaker 8 (03:27):
You had to play some of the upcoming artists, and
that's what got artists on TV. But prior to that happening,
it was very pop, you know, and you didn't see
Eric being rock him on TV like that. You know,
I thought that everybody was playing it because I was like,
who wouldn't play Eric being rock him, you know? Or
(03:47):
who wouldn't play Slick Rick or Dougie Fresh or the
Fat Boys or run dmc ordeni or Ll Young you know,
you know who wouldn't be playing these artists. But because
I was so into what I was doing, That's why
I believe that you everybody's going to start playing it tomorrow.
Speaker 6 (04:04):
And they were doctor dre back in those days.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Ideo budgets forty fiftousand dollars.
Speaker 5 (04:11):
And remember it was an empty marketing scheme because once
you put it out there, you didn't make money from
a video. You were opening it promote the song visually
so it would sell. So record companies, especially the majors,
they could rollbos die. But if you're an independent, like
a Profile Records making a run dm C rock Box video,
(04:34):
that was a big roll of the dice.
Speaker 6 (04:36):
Even when they.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Laid that song was because of group called the Virus.
Speaker 5 (04:40):
Sounds imitating them with what people they imitate, it sounded
like we're see so they actually took it and said
we're going to take to someplace else and they came
up with rock box, So we are rock box and
said whoa, they're taking it to all another plate.
Speaker 2 (05:00):
So those video budgets back.
Speaker 9 (05:02):
Then were very, very very hu fence because you usually
used to what to You would go to MTV producer
or associate producer, somebody does work for MTV and they
would make videos, or independent filmmakers who just wanted to make.
Speaker 5 (05:21):
A thing to show the work they could.
Speaker 6 (05:23):
Do, and they were created. Sometimes they weren't you created.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
The bottom line was expensive cropit.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
You know, by this point in the game, I was
directing music videos in thirty thousand, was considered low budget.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
At that point in time.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
In fact, that's kind of a budget I have for
the My Philosophy video Kris One's first video, So that
was definitely going on.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Ralph McDaniels.
Speaker 8 (05:46):
I don't even think the artist realized how important video
music box was to that until later, and they probably
were getting people coming up to them singing on TV.
I sing it and they were like why. I remember
Russell Sinners said like, what are you going to do
with this? And I'm like, I'm putting it on TV
and he was like really, like they most people at
that time, if you were into hip hop, the whole
(06:07):
idea was to get your record played New York Anyway
on Mister Magic Show, or get your record played on
a Red Alert or do you know? Or Kiss Bls
and the underground shows you know Awesome too and Stretching Barbido,
those are all underground shows. That was nothing compared to
what Video Music Box was do. We reached everybody, like
(06:30):
everybody watched it. Video music Box was an idea that
I started out with in nineteen eighty two and I
kicked it around to the TV station. They tried another
show called Studio thirty one Dance Party, which you know,
was basically my idea, and I was like, you know,
that's my idea. You can't do that, and so they
were like, okay, well you you can help out with it.
(06:53):
And so I was the voice of that show, which
was like maybe five or six shows that we did,
and it came on late at night and it was
just videos that they picked that I did the voiceovers for.
And then after a while, I was like, this is
not it, this is this is not it. And that's
when I came up with Video Music Box, which was
(07:14):
it came on after school three thirty to four thirty,
and I did it six day, five days, a week,
and you know, I wanted to reach young people, you know,
that was that was my main goal, was to reach
young people that were into music that I was into,
you know, and it was really out of my head.
There was no playlist, There was no you know, oh,
(07:37):
this is the highest selling artist, we're going to play
no more than we play anybody else.
Speaker 6 (07:41):
It was really just Ralph likes this and Rachaasca I
play this.
Speaker 8 (07:46):
And because I was a DJ and I was in clubs,
I had a good idea of what people might like
and so I just basically based it off of that.
Speaker 6 (07:54):
And it wasn't just hip hop.
Speaker 8 (07:55):
You know, if you look at the opening of Video
Music Box, you see you know, Gruce Springsteen and Madonna
and James Brown and Prince and the Fat Boys and
run dmc Bernard Wright, who do you love video and
you know, and it was a mixture of all of that,
which was to me what New York.
Speaker 6 (08:17):
Wanted to see. And so that was it. You know.
Speaker 8 (08:22):
We went with that and we did it every day,
and then one day after week on Tuesdays we played
slow jams, which you know, tasty Tuesdays, which people you
know enjoyed, you know, because it was an opportunity to
hear some slow jams that you maybe you weren't familiar with,
so that was cool too. I mean the early challenges,
(08:42):
probably the biggest challenge was getting people to understand what
we were doing. And then I think they were like,
what is this, you know, like what's going on? Like
we've never seen this before. This is before I got
on the air. And then Hot Tracks came on and
Hot Tress came up like six months before Video Music Box,
(09:03):
and I said, this is what I've been talking about
this show right here.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
This is New York Hot Tracks to the Butt House
in New York City.
Speaker 8 (09:12):
And so they saw it and it was on ABC.
I said, on ABC, this is popping, you know, like
this is a real station. So we could have beat
them to it, but y'all, you know, sitting around trying
to figure it out. I'm telling you this is what's
going on. So they were like, all right, fine, Literally,
you know, six months after we were on the air,
we're doing our thing. I'm playing as many music videos
(09:32):
as I can, whatever it is, I'm playing it and now,
but we don't have any budget, Like there's no promotion,
there's no nothing, you know, like when you would turn
on you know, some of these other video shows that
maybe they.
Speaker 6 (09:47):
Didn't play hip hop.
Speaker 8 (09:47):
At least there was a commercial sometime during the day
that would like watch at eleven o'clock and you'll see
Friday night videos Da Da Da Da or bots at
whatever time and to watch hot track. We had no promotion, nothing,
and nobody was watching that station anyway. They had no rating,
There was nothing, There was nothing going on there. What
we made flyers. We just treated it like a party
(10:10):
and we made fliers.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
You know.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
But some of the other early hip hop groups that
had music videos were Houdini. They had a few good
videos from that time, the message Grandmaster, Flashing and Furious
five definitely had the earliest first music video. There was
a video that used to play for Flashing and Furious
Five for their song White Lines. But believe it or not,
(10:33):
Spike Lee had directed the video for White Lines, has
sent it in to sugar Hill with the time code
that's those numbers that play at the bottom of the video,
meaning the videos not finished, just the rough cut.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
People at sugar Hill just took.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
Spike's video and played it as a music video back
in that time, so there were just a handful, but
it was the beginning and many people were learning how
to work in film, but also how to tell our
stories effectively. That's what motivated me to get behind the camera,
being that I'm a part of the culture. I want
to be one of the ones helping shape those images,
(11:09):
helping tell those stories, extend what these artists have put
down on these records. Are the many videos I directed,
ones where I got to tell a story, like what
I did for Nas with the song one Love, what
I did for Gang Star with just to get a
rep ladies first, for Queen Latifa.
Speaker 2 (11:27):
Don't Don't let Me go on down the line.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
But I did over sixty videos back in this time
period while I'm hosting your MTV raps ed Lover Them rapper, actor,
radio personality and former MTV VJ.
Speaker 6 (11:40):
Yeah, they were on.
Speaker 10 (11:41):
You know in New York City, we all went home
to watch Video music Box because video music Box played everything,
you know what I mean. You got a taste of everything,
and you got that first real taste of hip hop
watching video music Box. You know, the hip hop videos
that were actually created were put on your music box.
And I think a lot of the hip hop videos
(12:02):
that were actually created because of Video Music That was
their outlet. That was what New York wants, Uncle Ralph,
and that was what we paid attention to. Was Video
Music Box. It spread hip hop around. I mean before that,
it was just records. You buy the records, so you
don't have the record, or somebody has a tape and
you dubbed the tape, or you tape the record off
(12:25):
the radio because if Red and Molly mal played it
before it was in the stores, you get to sit
there and listen to it. And then you had to
you know, the pause button the record. But and you
get it, you know, and you made sure that you
hit that pause button before they said WBLS or you know,
K to you or whatever or ninety eight seven kids.
You want that on your tape. You want the tape
(12:46):
of the songs. And Video Music Box made it visual
for us. You got to see it. You got to
see who the artists were, even if you didn't know
what they look like, if you never saw a flyer
with their face on it, you got to see exactly
who the artist is.
Speaker 6 (13:03):
And you know they.
Speaker 10 (13:04):
Will talk to the artists, so you got to hear
from the artists and it put you inside these parties
that were going around New York City, so you got
to see some performance stuff from some artists. So it
meant everything to everybody in the Tried State area to
be able to tone that and watch it and actually
put your face on television because there was no other
outlet for hip hop artists to be on television at
(13:26):
that time.
Speaker 6 (13:27):
For video music.
Speaker 8 (13:28):
Pop, Ralph McDaniels, the influence of Video Music Box is
always there. You always wanted to be fun, you know,
And so when I first started seeing YO, I felt
like it was similar to what we were doing. Wasn't
quite there yet, it was still had that MTV produced
feel to it. As time started to go on and
Ed and Dre really kind of loosened it up a
(13:49):
little bit. Freddie is a historian and kept Freddie is
the man, you know bab five Freddy, but Ed and
Dre made it a little bit more loose, a little
bit more funny, comedic, and they were out, you know,
doing things that were happening in the clubs like that.
So I feel like that's when I really start to
see the influence of what we do. And also with TRL,
(14:10):
it kind of had that that feeling I'm not sure,
you know, like I don't know if TRL had any
influence from us, but any kind of live interaction, any
kind of cool conversation, shout out is always, you know,
something that we started. We brought that to TV and
people were like, you know, doing shout outs. So anytime
I back then, I'd be sensitive to it, like, hey, hey,
(14:33):
waylet's the same shout out a little bit too much
right now, But I think that we it's well. So
when it comes to b T I feel like we
had definitely a big influence on that. Big tickets from
the Bronx. Big ticket was dancing and videos that I directed.
He was a dancer, so he grew up on me,
(14:53):
you know. So I feel like his reference was video
music bos that was his only reference prior to doing
what he did with the Basement, and he understood what
it was the Basement, you know, he gave it that
they came with that kind of energy and you know,
and I'm not sure if that was his idea, but
he could definitely knew what it was when it was
proposed on. So yeah, I think we definitely have a
(15:16):
print on all types of visuals in hip hop and
videos and visuals, how it's presented, and just making it.
You know, let's do it like Rol McDaniels does it.
You know that just that you couldn't help it. If
you watched me for ten years growing up, he had
no choice if you were from New York. I think
(15:37):
Video Music Box played a big, a major role because
only run DMC was getting played on MTV. There were
no other hip hop videos getting played. So I watched
record labels go jump up and down, spend a whole
lot of money to get their videos played at MTV,
and it wasn't happening because MTV wasn't ready to do that,
(15:59):
And the only thing that those labels and those artists
had was Video Music Bob and that was a way
to show MTV that this is a real thing and
it can be programmed every day and people will watch it.
And I think that even MTV started to see that,
(16:20):
you know, kids are watching this show and they're talking
about this show called Video Music Bop, So maybe we
should think about doing a hip hop show, you know,
maybe we should do it.
Speaker 6 (16:30):
And I knew that, you.
Speaker 8 (16:31):
Know, because I went to them, you know, like in
nineteen eighty five, and she was like, yo, I just
did this thing called Freshfest. I take the whole show,
very diverse audience in Long Island, and.
Speaker 6 (16:45):
Y'all should do a hip hop show. What's up?
Speaker 8 (16:48):
And they were like, nah, MTV is not ready for that.
We're not you know that that's working in New York, proud,
but it's not working in the Midwest. And I was like,
the groups are on TAK like that's a tour. It's
not just one city that they're doing this concert at
and kids are coming and this is the new thing,
and they were just not with it. And then in
(17:10):
eighty seven eighty eight they came up with Your on
TV Raps and that's when everything changed for hip hop
because now you had a national show playing hip hop
videos on a daily basis, and that was a big deal.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Yeah, I really dug Ralph McDaniel show Video music Box.
That was important watching to come home and get that.
UHF Dill tuned in right to people all them videos
and once again they didn't like like ROP said, they
didn't just play rap, they played R and B. They
played a little bit of rock stuff here and there.
You had the right beat. Ralph and his partner back
at that time, the vid kid Lionel Martin did their thing,
(17:48):
and I remember when they first went on the air,
they didn't appear on screen at all.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
They would introduce the videos radio.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Station style, so they you'd hear their voice, they'd play
the video, they'd come out of it, maybe mention what
that was, and then play another video. And that was
how I remember Video Music Box in the beginning. And
then soon on they started covering a lot of cool
events around the city, you know, and then they got
iconic and famous for letting people get on the mic
(18:18):
and shout out they whole hood, they family. It was
really a highlight moment be able to tune in and
see New York's finest music video show, No Question Baby,
Video Music Box.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
So ah, yeah, what's up everybody. It's ten o'clock. Black
is Black. I'm in full effect. That's right that far
Freddie welcoming you to my show, Yo, MTD Rapper. Today.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
In nineteen eighty one, something hits Cable, and keep in
mind Cable is still relatively new. A channel called MTV
for music Television. They go live in nineteen eighty one
and what are they doing. They're playing music videos clips
that rock artists mostly make little fantasy surreal type jumping
(19:06):
around singing the song, and they created a whole channel
that just played these music videos and MTV got hot.
They were on fire in the beginning, but they were
only playing rock or what was known as pop at
that time.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
Basically radio was very segregated.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
Back in the days, pop stations basically meant you a
white artist, and they played your pop or your rock song,
and the other charts they were, you know, black artists
making music that was R and B, soul or dance,
so it's pretty segregated. If you was like Michael Jackson
making soul and R and B but that could also
(19:50):
fit pop, you were still relegated to only be on
those charts. So the idea behind MTV in the beginning
was to emulate what radio was doing. So basically black
music wasn't getting barely any love, with the exception of
maybe Lionel Richie Little Something Something from Prince. But then
Michael Jackson, when it was time for Billy Jean and Thriller,
(20:14):
the force of his label got behind MTV and basically said,
if you don't play this, we're pulling everything on our
roster off the channel, which included Bruce Springsteen and a
lot of other big acts.
Speaker 10 (20:26):
Ed Lover You on TV raps came about for me
because I saw the pilot of you on TV raps
running them did the pilot. They did it from one
running them's tours, and I saw the pilot and at
the end of the pilot I saw the name Ted
Demi and I was like, Ted Demi, I wonder if
(20:49):
that's the same Ted Demi that I know from Rockville Center.
And then I found out that it was that Ted
was working at MTV. Ted and I went all the
way back because my best friend, Kurt's mom is episc
companion as she's part of the diocese, and so was
Ted's father. So Ted was whenever they went on one of
(21:11):
those religious rist treats or something like that, to keep
her son, Kurt, my best friend, out of trouble.
Speaker 6 (21:16):
She'd bring me, bring Edwin, so you have something to do.
Speaker 10 (21:19):
So I would go with them, and that's where we
met this little white boy from Rockville Center named Ted Demi,
who knew hip hop like we knew hip hop, who
loved the music as much as we loved the music.
So we kept in touch with them, and we used
to take our boys to Rockville Center to play Ted
and his and his boys in flag football, a touch football.
Speaker 6 (21:38):
All throughout high school.
Speaker 10 (21:40):
And then with Ted went to college, we stayed in
touch with Ted and they used to have the annual
big Courtland State Picnic up there at Courtland, New York,
and we jump in the cars and we drive all
the way up to Courtland. So we stayed in touch
with Ted. We knew what Ted was doing after college.
During high school, we always knew what Ted was doing.
(22:00):
So when I saw his name, I started calling him
right after Fab got on and I was like, wait
a minute, this is a weekly thing. Like I thought
that was a special you know. I was like, this
is a weekly thing, and they doing this every Fab
five Freddy. So I started calling Ted. It's like your Ted.
I remember Ted invited me to the video that he
(22:20):
did he did Push It, and I was there on
the video set for Push It.
Speaker 6 (22:25):
He did get up for Salt and Pep. I was there.
Speaker 10 (22:28):
And then I was working at Andrew Jackson High School
in Queen and he was going to direct rolling with
Kid and Play. But they had this whole scenario of
doing it and then high school, so that I secured
the high school for them to shoot the rolling with
kid and play video. I'm actually in the video a
little bit.
Speaker 6 (22:45):
So when it.
Speaker 10 (22:47):
Came around time for your on TV reps, I just
started bugging him. I was like, listen, man, don't nobody
know more about hip hop than I do? I love
this and listen, I know y'all gotta do something. You
just can't have Fab on there talking I do a
record report about what records are hot, or let me
do a movie reviewal And he kept on ed, hold
on this brand new let's see what happens.
Speaker 6 (23:07):
We don't you know.
Speaker 10 (23:08):
So once they decided that it was a highly rated show,
and I guess Fab was into so many other things,
you know, like he's a director in his own right
and an artist and you know, or one of Botskaya's
closest friends, fad knew everybody from Debbie, Harry and all
of them. Bab didn't want to, as he says, he
(23:29):
didn't want to overexpose himself by doing a daily show,
so they had to find somebody. So Ted called me
and asked me if I wanted to audition for and
I was like, damn right, And I came down in audition.
Peter Dougherty God rest his soul, also knew Dre from
when Dre DJ'ed on the tour for the Beastie Boy.
He asked Dre to come in and audition, and Ted
(23:51):
asked me then Ted Dre was in Peter's office on
a different floor and I was still in the office
with Ted, and Ted called Peter says, dot Dre's still
up there, and he's like yeah. He said, send them
down to my office and we both did Ted's cramp
office and Ted looked at us and said, can y'all
do something together on video? Because I think this is
what I want. I like this Laurel and Hardy and
(24:14):
that's how I got my job. That's that's how it happened.
It was Ted emp that I was like, y'all too
for the Daily Show and they had to go in
and convince MTV, and MTV came back and said we
got one thousand dollars a week.
Speaker 6 (24:27):
That's all we got, and me and Dre.
Speaker 10 (24:29):
Said, okay, I'll take five hundred piece because I was
still working at school Safety at the time, so extra
five hundred dollars and no contract for a long time,
so you know, we made it work.
Speaker 6 (24:38):
We didn't know how long it was gon last. We
just made it work. Man.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Great to hear my man Ed Love speak about Ted Demi.
Rest in peace. Ted Demi and Peter Doughty. These were
the two guys that were the reason for your MTV raps.
I told you in the beginning of this about my
friendship with Peter Doughty, who was the one that you know,
knew things that I had done on the Downto Town scene,
from making art to making the movie Wild Style, to
(25:04):
getting in Blondie's ear and helping inspire him to make
the record Rapture. But Ted Demi was a kid from
Long Island Man. Ted was an incredible guy, an incredible personality.
He was super duper passionate about hip hop. I mean
we would sit around and just rap together different songs,
(25:24):
slick ricks, Lottie Dottie.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
We can go back and forth on that to the utmost.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
And Ted started to direct music videos as I was
also doing during the same time we were making your
MTV raps. But Ted just super passionate and once again
Ted Demi brought at Lover to the table. Peter Doherty
brought Doctor Dre to the table. Doctor Dre had also
been an early DJ for the Beastie Boys from the
(25:50):
group original concept with some of the dopest beats. But
Ted was just an incredible guy. I can't say enough
about him and how much he's mist but Ted was
able to parlay and become a big movie director, producing
some directing some really good films. The last film Ted
made was a film that starred Johnny Depp called Blow.
(26:12):
But sadly the early two thousands, Ted left us. But
he was super passionate about hip hop and was such
a driving force behind what Yo MTV raps was and
was all about keeping it real. Ted would run any
new artists that was easing into the mix that he
kind of liked. He would make sure that we all
agreed they were the ones, and we gave him that
(26:35):
light and let him go from there, Doctor Dre.
Speaker 5 (26:38):
So when you start getting the evolution of rock Box
and even of the Message and the Fat Boys in
that Infanthou stage, it wasn't as many, but when we
get to you old TV raps premier, especially for our show,
we didn't have a little videos that thar do his
show every day on the week. He pulled James Blown,
(27:01):
he pulled Bob Marley, we pulled Parliament Funk, the delic
and we were just making stuff up as we went along.
And as that evolution of videos started to grow, you
started to get better videos.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
You started to get stuff.
Speaker 6 (27:15):
With salt and pepper.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Took a long time.
Speaker 5 (27:18):
I mean, we really think about unlike my recollection is great,
is there a video for rock, say Roxanne?
Speaker 2 (27:25):
And if it is, it wasn't like a video compared.
Speaker 5 (27:28):
To add the Man and Roxanne. Roxanne by ETFO was
a huge internat show. Yet even the video for Planet
Rock it was it was done on the cheese effect.
It wasn't like done with the intentions of old on MTV.
But the song was an international Leggy show me the
(27:50):
video for from Rackers July, show me the video for
Christmas Wrap. There weren't videos for those songs or the bricks.
In the beginning two we started to accumulate the crew.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
Yeah, we had a nice run from the late eighties
into the mid late nineties, YOURMTV raps as the number
one destination because once again, at the time when YOURMTV
Raps came on in the fall of eighty eight, hip
hop was not on every radio station everywhere, Like New
(28:23):
York had some underground shows on the weekends where you
got to hear the flavor. LA had Kday, like a
twenty four hour AM rap station.
Speaker 2 (28:33):
You know, you got to see it as well as
hear it.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
So it was like such an impact on the culture
overall and definitely made Yo like a key destination because
once again you got to see your favorite artists in
their neighborhoods. We went around the different parts of the country.
We went in Compton with NWA, We were in the
Fifth Ward, in Houston, Texas with the Ghetto Boys. We
(28:58):
were in Liberty City and over Town with Luke. I mean,
we were going where the artists were from, where they
were making and showing the rest of the country what
that was. So it was like, oh, Man, artists was
hoping and dreaming. They used to tell me. I used
to meet artists. They used to say, Man, fab I
used to dream about standing next to you holding that mic,
you know, with that OOMTV rap symbol on it.
Speaker 2 (29:19):
It's amazing to realize what.
Speaker 1 (29:21):
That meant to so many artists that got to talk
to their audience in a way that never existed, particularly
for artists of color just was non existent. We used
to have to sit around on the weekends and watch
Soul Trained Baby, seeing them on Don Cornelius, you know,
that was one of the main windows the whole country had,
let alone, seeing what was going on from hood to
(29:44):
hood across America. Ralph McDaniel's when I first saw it,
and I think, I don't know, maybe I saw it
on I was in somebody's office at a label and
you know, sitting around watching it, and I was like,
this ain't me is they can't compete with me?
Speaker 8 (30:00):
You know, like I didn't think it was possible. And
because I felt like we were definitely more street and
you had to be street to do this, I didn't
still didn't look at hip hop in a pop way,
you know, And I was like, nah, we still gotta
keep it funky, we still gotta keep it to the street.
And we would never do certain things that they would
(30:21):
do on that show. So I was like, that's cool.
But I saw the potential that where it was going,
so I wasn't stupid, So I said, it's going to
be something. I know, it's going to be a big
deal because they have all access to all the artists,
you know like they coming on back to back to
back to back to back, and I'm like and Dre
and they know they from the street, they know what
(30:41):
time it is. They're going to ask the right questions
and Freddie and it's going to get to the point
where it's going to be to make the biggest thing.
So and that's what it was. It was the biggest
thing and Love It three were a worldwide show.
Speaker 10 (30:55):
See Your TV Raps was actually a show called Yo
that was on in England and was a young lady
by the name of Sophie Brahma where they decided to
do YO. But she played everything. She played dance, she
played techno, she played everything. Yo is a term as
like right in your face, like Yo, this is what's
happened right, But she didn't. They didn't specifically tailor that
(31:17):
show to rap music or hip hop. Tad and Peter
came out with YO MTV Raps because it's MTV and
we wanted to show everybody that MTV is into hip hop.
Yo MTV hip hop was thrown around. It just didn't
sound so it was Yo, EMTV rap. But what we
were able to do because we were in places that
(31:41):
rap city came behind us.
Speaker 6 (31:43):
There was a lot of local shows.
Speaker 10 (31:45):
Graffiti Rocket came out, it didn't work, and then you know,
Video Music Box and then the Box. Because we were global,
we gave the world the field of him. You know,
I still run into people that's older, thirties or forties.
I'll become out of bag. A Nigerian dude to stop
me and say, yo, I learned to speak English watching
(32:07):
your own TV raps and they come on to midnight, Well,
I stay up and watch it just so I learned,
you know, hip hop and the language. And we gave
it that crossover appeal because that's really where white boys
didn't watch video. White boys watch your all TV rap,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 6 (32:25):
So we gave it.
Speaker 10 (32:25):
Yeah, we absolutely collectively everybody that was involved with it
gave it that global appeal from the top top, from
Doug Herzog and Judy McGrath, all the way down to
the cameraman and all the way down to me, Dre
and t. All of the humor and stuff that was
(32:46):
attributed to your TV raps came from us. But they
gave us the opportunity and a platform and believed in
us enough to let us go. You know there was
nothing scripted about your on TV rats at all.
Speaker 6 (32:57):
You kind of know.
Speaker 10 (32:57):
That you got a hit show, but the significant of
the show didn't dawn on me until the show was gone.
I knew it was a great show. I knew it
allowed us to be on our Citio Hall. I knew
it allowed us to be on different magazines. I knew
it allowed us to do things. But what the significance
of it was for that time period we didn't know
(33:19):
until at least I didn't know, and I ain't gonna
claim that I knew until after the show was gone.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
Yeah, you're on TV raps. I mean, come on.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
It was like such a huge, important cultural moment with
just the impact that it had. MTV felt it significantly,
you know. And then at the same time as the
show blew up, and as the culture and the music
was getting bigger, it was under attack for things being
said on records, and presidents and Vice President Dan Quayle
(33:48):
and this one and that were like yelling out the
different artist names and coming at Iced Tea and different
people like Luke for things that were being said. And
MTV did stand firm and defend people's right to free speech.
As a platform to let artists express themselves. So the
influence was as big as you can get at the
(34:09):
time when you have something new, a voice from the hood,
people that really haven't had voices at that level, you know,
getting heard, getting seen, having influence on the culture that
continues to this day, but at that time it was
transformational and it was felt from one end to the other,
and then you begin to see it influence other artists
(34:31):
their swagger, their style, and their music. So really a
big influence channel wide at MTV, but also BET, which
was a little late to the party, had to play
catch up and figure out how to get a rap
program on the air to represent over there at Black
Entertainment Television. It was good to see them finally figure
(34:52):
it out.
Speaker 8 (34:53):
Ralph mcdanield's video music bots and YO and BT we
took hip hop to a whole other level because once
you saw it, people from outside of New York always
wanted to know what was happening in New you know,
like New York is just this New York doesn't mean
if it has to do it hip hop, it has
to do it the subways, whatever it is. It's something
(35:14):
a mystical about New York right. That's always been and
never will go away. To me, people always want to
know what's going on. I don't care how bigger artists
come from the South, they still want to know what's
going on in New York. Then New Yorkers got an
opportunity to see what was going on in these other areas.
So now you're looking at artists from DC, Atlanta, Midwest, Chicago, Detroit, La,
(35:39):
San Francisco, Houston, and you're like, oh wow, I never
imagined that this was happening like that. You know me,
I traveled, so I had a little advantage because I
was going to these places to make videos, so I
was kind of up on it before it happened. So
I was playing videos from other areas, other regions because
I knew and I was in those areas, and I
(35:59):
heard them music and I saw people reacting to it.
Speaker 6 (36:01):
I'm like, they big, yo.
Speaker 8 (36:03):
Too short is big in the Bay Area, y'a'm bugging,
and but New York was like, we don't get it,
you know. And that's the way it was. But I
think videos helped open up eyes to people. I think
like when I first played NWA, people were like, yo,
I don't know what just happened, But that was powerful.
(36:23):
I think Video Music Box I packed our culture in
a number of ways. One was it was interactive before
the internet, so you could make a shout out, or
you could hear me at the club or see me
at the club. I would tell you about the next
place we were going to be at and you would
be there and then you get your chance to do
a shout out, which was kind of interesting because people
(36:47):
would go to clubs all the time and that wouldn't
that experience wasn't happening, you know where it was the
guy from the TV is there. You know, Joe would go,
fat Joe, the guy from TV is going to be
at the club down the block. They're going there and
we're gonna be on TV and he's gonna put his
on TV and the next week he's gonna play it.
That whole interaction with the culture, with the artists, with
(37:09):
the graffiti artists, with the MC's, with the DJs. You know,
it wasn't just the stars. You know, we were you know,
I'm interviewing DJ Clark Kent. You know, we in Brooklyn,
you know, we in some spot, you know, and not
everybody knows who Clark kent Is I do.
Speaker 6 (37:24):
I know he's important, but not everybody knows.
Speaker 8 (37:27):
Now he's the Sneaker King and he's one of the originals,
but nobody knew that. Like then, I just knew that
that's my man from around the way. And that's what
we did. You know, to bring that type of information
to people, I think was critical because now you could
go to school the next day and you have some
information about hip hop that most people didn't know unless
(37:49):
they were really paying attention. You know, you might not
see that in the magazines or you know, or hear
that on the radio, but you found out some information
about the artists or people in the cold that you
didn't know.
Speaker 6 (38:01):
And that was always a big thing.
Speaker 8 (38:03):
When you know something about, you know, a culture that
everybody doesn't know.
Speaker 6 (38:07):
That's why we do what we do.
Speaker 1 (38:10):
On the next episode of the Fifty Years of Hip
Hop podcast series, new York is no longer known as
the leader of hip hop.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
New York held that crown for a long time, and
now other parts of the country are rising to the
top and begin to usher in sounds from everywhere. I mean,
of course Miami, new sounds from the Southeast Southwest, Midwest,
and of course the West Coast continually banging on, banging strong. Obviously,
(38:41):
even Canada has got into the mix, and many artists
of course rising and thriving out of Atlanta, Georgia. We're
gonna also look at the global influence of hip hop
culture and how it has reshaped the world of fashion.
I'm talking about from high end fashion, you know, top
shelf luxury items all the way.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Down to them sneakers and them jeans on your feet.
Speaker 1 (39:05):
Baby, it don't stop. This episode has been executive produced
by Dolly S. Bishop, hosted and produced by your Boy
Fab five Freddie.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
Produced by Aaron A.
Speaker 1 (39:17):
King Howard Edit, mixed sound by Dwayne Crawfort, music scoring
by Trey Jones, Talent booking by Nicole Spence
From iHeart Podcasts, I Am Fab five Freddy, and this
this fifty Years of Hip Hop podcast series. It was
nineteen eighty three when Brooklyn native Ralph McDaniels created the
iconic and impactful music television show Video Music Box and
trust Me. Back at that time, I was tuned in.
(00:25):
Video Music Box was influential in hip hop's prevalent growth.
Hosted by creator Ralph McDaniels and his then partner Lionel Martin.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Aka the vid Kid.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Video Music Box featured new emerging rap artists, hip hop interviews, performances,
and the debut for many on television of people like Nas, Notorious,
Big jay Z, and a whole lot more. I was
tuned in the Video Music Box back in those days,
way before cable TV's had two dolls, one dial for
(00:59):
the main channels and another doll called UHF, which was
a weird dial you return and barely tune in. Other
little TV shows had a lot of static going on
back in that time.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
These are the days with the old TVs.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Keep in mind, you used to have to put aluminum
foil on the antenna or to get the reception at
least decent enough to see what was going on. It
was crazy back then, man, big impact to rush home
after school time, you know, to tune in to Video
Music Box. What was it, Channel thirty one, Weird channels,
and that was how that went down. Video Music Box
(01:34):
a big influence on all of us in New York City,
Doctor Dred, producer, radio personality.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
MTVVJ video shows were all over the place the way
they were even MTV was in its infancy, so we're
talking about between nineteen eighty three and nineteen eighty six.
Speaker 4 (01:54):
We used to watch Carlos Beazous on Neor Contracts and
we got to see new addition for the first time
doing Candy Girl. You got a chance to see Grand
Me Suppleasure and the Furious Pride with the blessing.
Speaker 5 (02:09):
Yeah, whoa wait a minute, get out, and this whole
explosion of videos that you wouldn't be able to see
on MTV at the time. We got to watch on
commercial television.
Speaker 6 (02:22):
But there also was a graph.
Speaker 7 (02:25):
McDaniels and Nava Marking Well did a program called Video
Music Box, which basically have to do it on the
UHF channel because it wasn't on table and it wasn't
on commercial TV.
Speaker 5 (02:35):
So we got to stand there and shake. Yeah, then
you gotta watch whatever videos they were, how because there
weren't a bunch of rap videos at that time.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Ralph McDaniels, co creator of New York's pioneering show Video
Music Box and currently the hip Hop coordinator for the
Queen's Public Library.
Speaker 8 (02:55):
Or an artist to have their video playing in the
eighties on TV was unheard of. Yeah, especially if you
were a black artist. You didn't see that. You know, look,
let's keep it one hundred, you know, like MTV definitely
wasn't really doing that. It took a minute, you know.
It took Michael Jackson and Columbia Records to say, if
(03:15):
y'all don't play you know these artists, we ain't giving
y'all these big name markets. You're not gonna get Whitney,
You're not gonna get Michael, You're not gonna get Lino,
Richie or whatever.
Speaker 6 (03:25):
So you had to play the big name.
Speaker 8 (03:27):
You had to play some of the upcoming artists, and
that's what got artists on TV. But prior to that happening,
it was very pop, you know, and you didn't see
Eric being rock him on TV like that. You know,
I thought that everybody was playing it because I was like,
who wouldn't play Eric being rock him, you know? Or
(03:47):
who wouldn't play Slick Rick or Dougie Fresh or the
Fat Boys or run dmc ordeni or Ll Young you know,
you know who wouldn't be playing these artists. But because
I was so into what I was doing, That's why
I believe that you everybody's going to start playing it tomorrow.
Speaker 6 (04:04):
And they were doctor dre back in those days.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Ideo budgets forty fiftousand dollars.
Speaker 5 (04:11):
And remember it was an empty marketing scheme because once
you put it out there, you didn't make money from
a video. You were opening it promote the song visually
so it would sell. So record companies, especially the majors,
they could rollbos die. But if you're an independent, like
a Profile Records making a run dm C rock Box video,
(04:34):
that was a big roll of the dice.
Speaker 6 (04:36):
Even when they.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Laid that song was because of group called the Virus.
Speaker 5 (04:40):
Sounds imitating them with what people they imitate, it sounded
like we're see so they actually took it and said
we're going to take to someplace else and they came
up with rock box, So we are rock box and
said whoa, they're taking it to all another plate.
Speaker 2 (05:00):
So those video budgets back.
Speaker 9 (05:02):
Then were very, very very hu fence because you usually
used to what to You would go to MTV producer
or associate producer, somebody does work for MTV and they
would make videos, or independent filmmakers who just wanted to make.
Speaker 5 (05:21):
A thing to show the work they could.
Speaker 6 (05:23):
Do, and they were created. Sometimes they weren't you created.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
The bottom line was expensive cropit.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
You know, by this point in the game, I was
directing music videos in thirty thousand, was considered low budget.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
At that point in time.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
In fact, that's kind of a budget I have for
the My Philosophy video Kris One's first video, So that
was definitely going on.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Ralph McDaniels.
Speaker 8 (05:46):
I don't even think the artist realized how important video
music box was to that until later, and they probably
were getting people coming up to them singing on TV.
I sing it and they were like why. I remember
Russell Sinners said like, what are you going to do
with this? And I'm like, I'm putting it on TV
and he was like really, like they most people at
that time, if you were into hip hop, the whole
(06:07):
idea was to get your record played New York Anyway
on Mister Magic Show, or get your record played on
a Red Alert or do you know? Or Kiss Bls
and the underground shows you know Awesome too and Stretching Barbido,
those are all underground shows. That was nothing compared to
what Video Music Box was do. We reached everybody, like
(06:30):
everybody watched it. Video music Box was an idea that
I started out with in nineteen eighty two and I
kicked it around to the TV station. They tried another
show called Studio thirty one Dance Party, which you know,
was basically my idea, and I was like, you know,
that's my idea. You can't do that, and so they
were like, okay, well you you can help out with it.
(06:53):
And so I was the voice of that show, which
was like maybe five or six shows that we did,
and it came on late at night and it was
just videos that they picked that I did the voiceovers for.
And then after a while, I was like, this is
not it, this is this is not it. And that's
when I came up with Video Music Box, which was
(07:14):
it came on after school three thirty to four thirty,
and I did it six day, five days, a week,
and you know, I wanted to reach young people, you know,
that was that was my main goal, was to reach
young people that were into music that I was into,
you know, and it was really out of my head.
There was no playlist, There was no you know, oh,
(07:37):
this is the highest selling artist, we're going to play
no more than we play anybody else.
Speaker 6 (07:41):
It was really just Ralph likes this and Rachaasca I
play this.
Speaker 8 (07:46):
And because I was a DJ and I was in clubs,
I had a good idea of what people might like
and so I just basically based it off of that.
Speaker 6 (07:54):
And it wasn't just hip hop.
Speaker 8 (07:55):
You know, if you look at the opening of Video
Music Box, you see you know, Gruce Springsteen and Madonna
and James Brown and Prince and the Fat Boys and
run dmc Bernard Wright, who do you love video and
you know, and it was a mixture of all of that,
which was to me what New York.
Speaker 6 (08:17):
Wanted to see. And so that was it. You know.
Speaker 8 (08:22):
We went with that and we did it every day,
and then one day after week on Tuesdays we played
slow jams, which you know, tasty Tuesdays, which people you
know enjoyed, you know, because it was an opportunity to
hear some slow jams that you maybe you weren't familiar with,
so that was cool too. I mean the early challenges,
(08:42):
probably the biggest challenge was getting people to understand what
we were doing. And then I think they were like,
what is this, you know, like what's going on? Like
we've never seen this before. This is before I got
on the air. And then Hot Tracks came on and
Hot Tress came up like six months before Video Music Box,
(09:03):
and I said, this is what I've been talking about
this show right here.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
This is New York Hot Tracks to the Butt House
in New York City.
Speaker 8 (09:12):
And so they saw it and it was on ABC.
I said, on ABC, this is popping, you know, like
this is a real station. So we could have beat
them to it, but y'all, you know, sitting around trying
to figure it out. I'm telling you this is what's
going on. So they were like, all right, fine, Literally,
you know, six months after we were on the air,
we're doing our thing. I'm playing as many music videos
(09:32):
as I can, whatever it is, I'm playing it and now,
but we don't have any budget, Like there's no promotion,
there's no nothing, you know, like when you would turn
on you know, some of these other video shows that
maybe they.
Speaker 6 (09:47):
Didn't play hip hop.
Speaker 8 (09:47):
At least there was a commercial sometime during the day
that would like watch at eleven o'clock and you'll see
Friday night videos Da Da Da Da or bots at
whatever time and to watch hot track. We had no promotion, nothing,
and nobody was watching that station anyway. They had no rating,
There was nothing, There was nothing going on there. What
we made flyers. We just treated it like a party
(10:10):
and we made fliers.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
You know.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
But some of the other early hip hop groups that
had music videos were Houdini. They had a few good
videos from that time, the message Grandmaster, Flashing and Furious
five definitely had the earliest first music video. There was
a video that used to play for Flashing and Furious
Five for their song White Lines. But believe it or not,
(10:33):
Spike Lee had directed the video for White Lines, has
sent it in to sugar Hill with the time code
that's those numbers that play at the bottom of the video,
meaning the videos not finished, just the rough cut.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
People at sugar Hill just took.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
Spike's video and played it as a music video back
in that time, so there were just a handful, but
it was the beginning and many people were learning how
to work in film, but also how to tell our
stories effectively. That's what motivated me to get behind the camera,
being that I'm a part of the culture. I want
to be one of the ones helping shape those images,
(11:09):
helping tell those stories, extend what these artists have put
down on these records. Are the many videos I directed,
ones where I got to tell a story, like what
I did for Nas with the song one Love, what
I did for Gang Star with just to get a
rep ladies first, for Queen Latifa.
Speaker 2 (11:27):
Don't Don't let Me go on down the line.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
But I did over sixty videos back in this time
period while I'm hosting your MTV raps ed Lover Them rapper, actor,
radio personality and former MTV VJ.
Speaker 6 (11:40):
Yeah, they were on.
Speaker 10 (11:41):
You know in New York City, we all went home
to watch Video music Box because video music Box played everything,
you know what I mean. You got a taste of everything,
and you got that first real taste of hip hop
watching video music Box. You know, the hip hop videos
that were actually created were put on your music box.
And I think a lot of the hip hop videos
(12:02):
that were actually created because of Video Music That was
their outlet. That was what New York wants, Uncle Ralph,
and that was what we paid attention to. Was Video
Music Box. It spread hip hop around. I mean before that,
it was just records. You buy the records, so you
don't have the record, or somebody has a tape and
you dubbed the tape, or you tape the record off
(12:25):
the radio because if Red and Molly mal played it
before it was in the stores, you get to sit
there and listen to it. And then you had to
you know, the pause button the record. But and you
get it, you know, and you made sure that you
hit that pause button before they said WBLS or you know,
K to you or whatever or ninety eight seven kids.
You want that on your tape. You want the tape
(12:46):
of the songs. And Video Music Box made it visual
for us. You got to see it. You got to
see who the artists were, even if you didn't know
what they look like, if you never saw a flyer
with their face on it, you got to see exactly
who the artist is.
Speaker 6 (13:03):
And you know they.
Speaker 10 (13:04):
Will talk to the artists, so you got to hear
from the artists and it put you inside these parties
that were going around New York City, so you got
to see some performance stuff from some artists. So it
meant everything to everybody in the Tried State area to
be able to tone that and watch it and actually
put your face on television because there was no other
outlet for hip hop artists to be on television at
(13:26):
that time.
Speaker 6 (13:27):
For video music.
Speaker 8 (13:28):
Pop, Ralph McDaniels, the influence of Video Music Box is
always there. You always wanted to be fun, you know,
And so when I first started seeing YO, I felt
like it was similar to what we were doing. Wasn't
quite there yet, it was still had that MTV produced
feel to it. As time started to go on and
Ed and Dre really kind of loosened it up a
(13:49):
little bit. Freddie is a historian and kept Freddie is
the man, you know bab five Freddy, but Ed and
Dre made it a little bit more loose, a little
bit more funny, comedic, and they were out, you know,
doing things that were happening in the clubs like that.
So I feel like that's when I really start to
see the influence of what we do. And also with TRL,
(14:10):
it kind of had that that feeling I'm not sure,
you know, like I don't know if TRL had any
influence from us, but any kind of live interaction, any
kind of cool conversation, shout out is always, you know,
something that we started. We brought that to TV and
people were like, you know, doing shout outs. So anytime
I back then, I'd be sensitive to it, like, hey, hey,
(14:33):
waylet's the same shout out a little bit too much
right now, But I think that we it's well. So
when it comes to b T I feel like we
had definitely a big influence on that. Big tickets from
the Bronx. Big ticket was dancing and videos that I directed.
He was a dancer, so he grew up on me,
(14:53):
you know. So I feel like his reference was video
music bos that was his only reference prior to doing
what he did with the Basement, and he understood what
it was the Basement, you know, he gave it that
they came with that kind of energy and you know,
and I'm not sure if that was his idea, but
he could definitely knew what it was when it was
proposed on. So yeah, I think we definitely have a
(15:16):
print on all types of visuals in hip hop and
videos and visuals, how it's presented, and just making it.
You know, let's do it like Rol McDaniels does it.
You know that just that you couldn't help it. If
you watched me for ten years growing up, he had
no choice if you were from New York. I think
(15:37):
Video Music Box played a big, a major role because
only run DMC was getting played on MTV. There were
no other hip hop videos getting played. So I watched
record labels go jump up and down, spend a whole
lot of money to get their videos played at MTV,
and it wasn't happening because MTV wasn't ready to do that,
(15:59):
And the only thing that those labels and those artists
had was Video Music Bob and that was a way
to show MTV that this is a real thing and
it can be programmed every day and people will watch it.
And I think that even MTV started to see that,
(16:20):
you know, kids are watching this show and they're talking
about this show called Video Music Bop, So maybe we
should think about doing a hip hop show, you know,
maybe we should do it.
Speaker 6 (16:30):
And I knew that, you.
Speaker 8 (16:31):
Know, because I went to them, you know, like in
nineteen eighty five, and she was like, yo, I just
did this thing called Freshfest. I take the whole show,
very diverse audience in Long Island, and.
Speaker 6 (16:45):
Y'all should do a hip hop show. What's up?
Speaker 8 (16:48):
And they were like, nah, MTV is not ready for that.
We're not you know that that's working in New York, proud,
but it's not working in the Midwest. And I was like,
the groups are on TAK like that's a tour. It's
not just one city that they're doing this concert at
and kids are coming and this is the new thing,
and they were just not with it. And then in
(17:10):
eighty seven eighty eight they came up with Your on
TV Raps and that's when everything changed for hip hop
because now you had a national show playing hip hop
videos on a daily basis, and that was a big deal.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Yeah, I really dug Ralph McDaniel show Video music Box.
That was important watching to come home and get that.
UHF Dill tuned in right to people all them videos
and once again they didn't like like ROP said, they
didn't just play rap, they played R and B. They
played a little bit of rock stuff here and there.
You had the right beat. Ralph and his partner back
at that time, the vid kid Lionel Martin did their thing,
(17:48):
and I remember when they first went on the air,
they didn't appear on screen at all.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
They would introduce the videos radio.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Station style, so they you'd hear their voice, they'd play
the video, they'd come out of it, maybe mention what
that was, and then play another video. And that was
how I remember Video Music Box in the beginning. And
then soon on they started covering a lot of cool
events around the city, you know, and then they got
iconic and famous for letting people get on the mic
(18:18):
and shout out they whole hood, they family. It was
really a highlight moment be able to tune in and
see New York's finest music video show, No Question Baby,
Video Music Box.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
So ah, yeah, what's up everybody. It's ten o'clock. Black
is Black. I'm in full effect. That's right that far
Freddie welcoming you to my show, Yo, MTD Rapper. Today.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
In nineteen eighty one, something hits Cable, and keep in
mind Cable is still relatively new. A channel called MTV
for music Television. They go live in nineteen eighty one
and what are they doing. They're playing music videos clips
that rock artists mostly make little fantasy surreal type jumping
(19:06):
around singing the song, and they created a whole channel
that just played these music videos and MTV got hot.
They were on fire in the beginning, but they were
only playing rock or what was known as pop at
that time.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
Basically radio was very segregated.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
Back in the days, pop stations basically meant you a
white artist, and they played your pop or your rock song,
and the other charts they were, you know, black artists
making music that was R and B, soul or dance,
so it's pretty segregated. If you was like Michael Jackson
making soul and R and B but that could also
(19:50):
fit pop, you were still relegated to only be on
those charts. So the idea behind MTV in the beginning
was to emulate what radio was doing. So basically black
music wasn't getting barely any love, with the exception of
maybe Lionel Richie Little Something Something from Prince. But then
Michael Jackson, when it was time for Billy Jean and Thriller,
(20:14):
the force of his label got behind MTV and basically said,
if you don't play this, we're pulling everything on our
roster off the channel, which included Bruce Springsteen and a
lot of other big acts.
Speaker 10 (20:26):
Ed Lover You on TV raps came about for me
because I saw the pilot of you on TV raps
running them did the pilot. They did it from one
running them's tours, and I saw the pilot and at
the end of the pilot I saw the name Ted
Demi and I was like, Ted Demi, I wonder if
(20:49):
that's the same Ted Demi that I know from Rockville Center.
And then I found out that it was that Ted
was working at MTV. Ted and I went all the
way back because my best friend, Kurt's mom is episc
companion as she's part of the diocese, and so was
Ted's father. So Ted was whenever they went on one of
(21:11):
those religious rist treats or something like that, to keep
her son, Kurt, my best friend, out of trouble.
Speaker 6 (21:16):
She'd bring me, bring Edwin, so you have something to do.
Speaker 10 (21:19):
So I would go with them, and that's where we
met this little white boy from Rockville Center named Ted Demi,
who knew hip hop like we knew hip hop, who
loved the music as much as we loved the music.
So we kept in touch with them, and we used
to take our boys to Rockville Center to play Ted
and his and his boys in flag football, a touch football.
Speaker 6 (21:38):
All throughout high school.
Speaker 10 (21:40):
And then with Ted went to college, we stayed in
touch with Ted and they used to have the annual
big Courtland State Picnic up there at Courtland, New York,
and we jump in the cars and we drive all
the way up to Courtland. So we stayed in touch
with Ted. We knew what Ted was doing after college.
During high school, we always knew what Ted was doing.
(22:00):
So when I saw his name, I started calling him
right after Fab got on and I was like, wait
a minute, this is a weekly thing. Like I thought
that was a special you know. I was like, this
is a weekly thing, and they doing this every Fab
five Freddy. So I started calling Ted. It's like your Ted.
I remember Ted invited me to the video that he
(22:20):
did he did Push It, and I was there on
the video set for Push It.
Speaker 6 (22:25):
He did get up for Salt and Pep. I was there.
Speaker 10 (22:28):
And then I was working at Andrew Jackson High School
in Queen and he was going to direct rolling with
Kid and Play. But they had this whole scenario of
doing it and then high school, so that I secured
the high school for them to shoot the rolling with
kid and play video. I'm actually in the video a
little bit.
Speaker 6 (22:45):
So when it.
Speaker 10 (22:47):
Came around time for your on TV reps, I just
started bugging him. I was like, listen, man, don't nobody
know more about hip hop than I do? I love
this and listen, I know y'all gotta do something. You
just can't have Fab on there talking I do a
record report about what records are hot, or let me
do a movie reviewal And he kept on ed, hold
on this brand new let's see what happens.
Speaker 6 (23:07):
We don't you know.
Speaker 10 (23:08):
So once they decided that it was a highly rated show,
and I guess Fab was into so many other things,
you know, like he's a director in his own right
and an artist and you know, or one of Botskaya's
closest friends, fad knew everybody from Debbie, Harry and all
of them. Bab didn't want to, as he says, he
(23:29):
didn't want to overexpose himself by doing a daily show,
so they had to find somebody. So Ted called me
and asked me if I wanted to audition for and
I was like, damn right, And I came down in audition.
Peter Dougherty God rest his soul, also knew Dre from
when Dre DJ'ed on the tour for the Beastie Boy.
He asked Dre to come in and audition, and Ted
(23:51):
asked me then Ted Dre was in Peter's office on
a different floor and I was still in the office
with Ted, and Ted called Peter says, dot Dre's still
up there, and he's like yeah. He said, send them
down to my office and we both did Ted's cramp
office and Ted looked at us and said, can y'all
do something together on video? Because I think this is
what I want. I like this Laurel and Hardy and
(24:14):
that's how I got my job. That's that's how it happened.
It was Ted emp that I was like, y'all too
for the Daily Show and they had to go in
and convince MTV, and MTV came back and said we
got one thousand dollars a week.
Speaker 6 (24:27):
That's all we got, and me and Dre.
Speaker 10 (24:29):
Said, okay, I'll take five hundred piece because I was
still working at school Safety at the time, so extra
five hundred dollars and no contract for a long time,
so you know, we made it work.
Speaker 6 (24:38):
We didn't know how long it was gon last. We
just made it work. Man.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Great to hear my man Ed Love speak about Ted Demi.
Rest in peace. Ted Demi and Peter Doughty. These were
the two guys that were the reason for your MTV raps.
I told you in the beginning of this about my
friendship with Peter Doughty, who was the one that you know,
knew things that I had done on the Downto Town scene,
from making art to making the movie Wild Style, to
(25:04):
getting in Blondie's ear and helping inspire him to make
the record Rapture. But Ted Demi was a kid from
Long Island Man. Ted was an incredible guy, an incredible personality.
He was super duper passionate about hip hop. I mean
we would sit around and just rap together different songs,
(25:24):
slick ricks, Lottie Dottie.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
We can go back and forth on that to the utmost.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
And Ted started to direct music videos as I was
also doing during the same time we were making your
MTV raps. But Ted just super passionate and once again
Ted Demi brought at Lover to the table. Peter Doherty
brought Doctor Dre to the table. Doctor Dre had also
been an early DJ for the Beastie Boys from the
(25:50):
group original concept with some of the dopest beats. But
Ted was just an incredible guy. I can't say enough
about him and how much he's mist but Ted was
able to parlay and become a big movie director, producing
some directing some really good films. The last film Ted
made was a film that starred Johnny Depp called Blow.
(26:12):
But sadly the early two thousands, Ted left us. But
he was super passionate about hip hop and was such
a driving force behind what Yo MTV raps was and
was all about keeping it real. Ted would run any
new artists that was easing into the mix that he
kind of liked. He would make sure that we all
agreed they were the ones, and we gave him that
(26:35):
light and let him go from there, Doctor Dre.
Speaker 5 (26:38):
So when you start getting the evolution of rock Box
and even of the Message and the Fat Boys in
that Infanthou stage, it wasn't as many, but when we
get to you old TV raps premier, especially for our show,
we didn't have a little videos that thar do his
show every day on the week. He pulled James Blown,
(27:01):
he pulled Bob Marley, we pulled Parliament Funk, the delic
and we were just making stuff up as we went along.
And as that evolution of videos started to grow, you
started to get better videos.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
You started to get stuff.
Speaker 6 (27:15):
With salt and pepper.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Took a long time.
Speaker 5 (27:18):
I mean, we really think about unlike my recollection is great,
is there a video for rock, say Roxanne?
Speaker 2 (27:25):
And if it is, it wasn't like a video compared.
Speaker 5 (27:28):
To add the Man and Roxanne. Roxanne by ETFO was
a huge internat show. Yet even the video for Planet
Rock it was it was done on the cheese effect.
It wasn't like done with the intentions of old on MTV.
But the song was an international Leggy show me the
(27:50):
video for from Rackers July, show me the video for
Christmas Wrap. There weren't videos for those songs or the bricks.
In the beginning two we started to accumulate the crew.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
Yeah, we had a nice run from the late eighties
into the mid late nineties, YOURMTV raps as the number
one destination because once again, at the time when YOURMTV
Raps came on in the fall of eighty eight, hip
hop was not on every radio station everywhere, Like New
(28:23):
York had some underground shows on the weekends where you
got to hear the flavor. LA had Kday, like a
twenty four hour AM rap station.
Speaker 2 (28:33):
You know, you got to see it as well as
hear it.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
So it was like such an impact on the culture
overall and definitely made Yo like a key destination because
once again you got to see your favorite artists in
their neighborhoods. We went around the different parts of the country.
We went in Compton with NWA, We were in the
Fifth Ward, in Houston, Texas with the Ghetto Boys. We
(28:58):
were in Liberty City and over Town with Luke. I mean,
we were going where the artists were from, where they
were making and showing the rest of the country what
that was. So it was like, oh, Man, artists was
hoping and dreaming. They used to tell me. I used
to meet artists. They used to say, Man, fab I
used to dream about standing next to you holding that mic,
you know, with that OOMTV rap symbol on it.
Speaker 2 (29:19):
It's amazing to realize what.
Speaker 1 (29:21):
That meant to so many artists that got to talk
to their audience in a way that never existed, particularly
for artists of color just was non existent. We used
to have to sit around on the weekends and watch
Soul Trained Baby, seeing them on Don Cornelius, you know,
that was one of the main windows the whole country had,
let alone, seeing what was going on from hood to
(29:44):
hood across America. Ralph McDaniel's when I first saw it,
and I think, I don't know, maybe I saw it
on I was in somebody's office at a label and
you know, sitting around watching it, and I was like,
this ain't me is they can't compete with me?
Speaker 8 (30:00):
You know, like I didn't think it was possible. And
because I felt like we were definitely more street and
you had to be street to do this, I didn't
still didn't look at hip hop in a pop way,
you know, And I was like, nah, we still gotta
keep it funky, we still gotta keep it to the street.
And we would never do certain things that they would
(30:21):
do on that show. So I was like, that's cool.
But I saw the potential that where it was going,
so I wasn't stupid, So I said, it's going to
be something. I know, it's going to be a big
deal because they have all access to all the artists,
you know like they coming on back to back to
back to back to back, and I'm like and Dre
and they know they from the street, they know what
(30:41):
time it is. They're going to ask the right questions
and Freddie and it's going to get to the point
where it's going to be to make the biggest thing.
So and that's what it was. It was the biggest
thing and Love It three were a worldwide show.
Speaker 10 (30:55):
See Your TV Raps was actually a show called Yo
that was on in England and was a young lady
by the name of Sophie Brahma where they decided to
do YO. But she played everything. She played dance, she
played techno, she played everything. Yo is a term as
like right in your face, like Yo, this is what's
happened right, But she didn't. They didn't specifically tailor that
(31:17):
show to rap music or hip hop. Tad and Peter
came out with YO MTV Raps because it's MTV and
we wanted to show everybody that MTV is into hip hop.
Yo MTV hip hop was thrown around. It just didn't
sound so it was Yo, EMTV rap. But what we
were able to do because we were in places that
(31:41):
rap city came behind us.
Speaker 6 (31:43):
There was a lot of local shows.
Speaker 10 (31:45):
Graffiti Rocket came out, it didn't work, and then you know,
Video Music Box and then the Box. Because we were global,
we gave the world the field of him. You know,
I still run into people that's older, thirties or forties.
I'll become out of bag. A Nigerian dude to stop
me and say, yo, I learned to speak English watching
(32:07):
your own TV raps and they come on to midnight, Well,
I stay up and watch it just so I learned,
you know, hip hop and the language. And we gave
it that crossover appeal because that's really where white boys
didn't watch video. White boys watch your all TV rap,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 6 (32:25):
So we gave it.
Speaker 10 (32:25):
Yeah, we absolutely collectively everybody that was involved with it
gave it that global appeal from the top top, from
Doug Herzog and Judy McGrath, all the way down to
the cameraman and all the way down to me, Dre
and t. All of the humor and stuff that was
(32:46):
attributed to your TV raps came from us. But they
gave us the opportunity and a platform and believed in
us enough to let us go. You know there was
nothing scripted about your on TV rats at all.
Speaker 6 (32:57):
You kind of know.
Speaker 10 (32:57):
That you got a hit show, but the significant of
the show didn't dawn on me until the show was gone.
I knew it was a great show. I knew it
allowed us to be on our Citio Hall. I knew
it allowed us to be on different magazines. I knew
it allowed us to do things. But what the significance
of it was for that time period we didn't know
(33:19):
until at least I didn't know, and I ain't gonna
claim that I knew until after the show was gone.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
Yeah, you're on TV raps. I mean, come on.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
It was like such a huge, important cultural moment with
just the impact that it had. MTV felt it significantly,
you know. And then at the same time as the
show blew up, and as the culture and the music
was getting bigger, it was under attack for things being
said on records, and presidents and Vice President Dan Quayle
(33:48):
and this one and that were like yelling out the
different artist names and coming at Iced Tea and different
people like Luke for things that were being said. And
MTV did stand firm and defend people's right to free speech.
As a platform to let artists express themselves. So the
influence was as big as you can get at the
(34:09):
time when you have something new, a voice from the hood,
people that really haven't had voices at that level, you know,
getting heard, getting seen, having influence on the culture that
continues to this day, but at that time it was
transformational and it was felt from one end to the other,
and then you begin to see it influence other artists
(34:31):
their swagger, their style, and their music. So really a
big influence channel wide at MTV, but also BET, which
was a little late to the party, had to play
catch up and figure out how to get a rap
program on the air to represent over there at Black
Entertainment Television. It was good to see them finally figure
(34:52):
it out.
Speaker 8 (34:53):
Ralph mcdanield's video music bots and YO and BT we
took hip hop to a whole other level because once
you saw it, people from outside of New York always
wanted to know what was happening in New you know,
like New York is just this New York doesn't mean
if it has to do it hip hop, it has
to do it the subways, whatever it is. It's something
(35:14):
a mystical about New York right. That's always been and
never will go away. To me, people always want to
know what's going on. I don't care how bigger artists
come from the South, they still want to know what's
going on in New York. Then New Yorkers got an
opportunity to see what was going on in these other areas.
So now you're looking at artists from DC, Atlanta, Midwest, Chicago, Detroit, La,
(35:39):
San Francisco, Houston, and you're like, oh wow, I never
imagined that this was happening like that. You know me,
I traveled, so I had a little advantage because I
was going to these places to make videos, so I
was kind of up on it before it happened. So
I was playing videos from other areas, other regions because
I knew and I was in those areas, and I
(35:59):
heard them music and I saw people reacting to it.
Speaker 6 (36:01):
I'm like, they big, yo.
Speaker 8 (36:03):
Too short is big in the Bay Area, y'a'm bugging,
and but New York was like, we don't get it,
you know. And that's the way it was. But I
think videos helped open up eyes to people. I think
like when I first played NWA, people were like, yo,
I don't know what just happened, But that was powerful.
(36:23):
I think Video Music Box I packed our culture in
a number of ways. One was it was interactive before
the internet, so you could make a shout out, or
you could hear me at the club or see me
at the club. I would tell you about the next
place we were going to be at and you would
be there and then you get your chance to do
a shout out, which was kind of interesting because people
(36:47):
would go to clubs all the time and that wouldn't
that experience wasn't happening, you know where it was the
guy from the TV is there. You know, Joe would go,
fat Joe, the guy from TV is going to be
at the club down the block. They're going there and
we're gonna be on TV and he's gonna put his
on TV and the next week he's gonna play it.
That whole interaction with the culture, with the artists, with
(37:09):
the graffiti artists, with the MC's, with the DJs. You know,
it wasn't just the stars. You know, we were you know,
I'm interviewing DJ Clark Kent. You know, we in Brooklyn,
you know, we in some spot, you know, and not
everybody knows who Clark kent Is I do.
Speaker 6 (37:24):
I know he's important, but not everybody knows.
Speaker 8 (37:27):
Now he's the Sneaker King and he's one of the originals,
but nobody knew that. Like then, I just knew that
that's my man from around the way. And that's what
we did. You know, to bring that type of information
to people, I think was critical because now you could
go to school the next day and you have some
information about hip hop that most people didn't know unless
(37:49):
they were really paying attention. You know, you might not
see that in the magazines or you know, or hear
that on the radio, but you found out some information
about the artists or people in the cold that you
didn't know.
Speaker 6 (38:01):
And that was always a big thing.
Speaker 8 (38:03):
When you know something about, you know, a culture that
everybody doesn't know.
Speaker 6 (38:07):
That's why we do what we do.
Speaker 1 (38:10):
On the next episode of the Fifty Years of Hip
Hop podcast series, new York is no longer known as
the leader of hip hop.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
New York held that crown for a long time, and
now other parts of the country are rising to the
top and begin to usher in sounds from everywhere. I mean,
of course Miami, new sounds from the Southeast Southwest, Midwest,
and of course the West Coast continually banging on, banging strong. Obviously,
(38:41):
even Canada has got into the mix, and many artists
of course rising and thriving out of Atlanta, Georgia. We're
gonna also look at the global influence of hip hop
culture and how it has reshaped the world of fashion.
I'm talking about from high end fashion, you know, top
shelf luxury items all the way.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Down to them sneakers and them jeans on your feet.
Speaker 1 (39:05):
Baby, it don't stop. This episode has been executive produced
by Dolly S. Bishop, hosted and produced by your Boy
Fab five Freddie.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
Produced by Aaron A.
Speaker 1 (39:17):
King Howard Edit, mixed sound by Dwayne Crawfort, music scoring
by Trey Jones, Talent booking by Nicole Spence
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Nikki Glaser Podcast
Every week comedian and infamous roaster Nikki Glaser provides a fun, fast-paced, and brutally honest look into current pop-culture and her own personal life.