It’s Not Jesus - It’s the Fanbase (Featuring Kristian A. Smith) - BFF: Black, Fat, Femme

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The Black Fat Felm Podcast is a production of iHeartRadio
and Doctor Sean Paul LLC. Hey, everyone, welcome to another
episode of the Black Best Film Podcast, where all the
intersections of identity are celebrated. I'm one of your hosts,
John Wilson, known as Doctor John Paul, coming to you
with shing on the days of yesteryear when gas was

(00:22):
a dollar, Chinese food was five dollars, and rent was
seven hundred dollar? Has quick fact? Do you know that
my first apartment I had a one bedroom, one bathroom.
I used to sit next to a little a little
freeway and I kid ties on the roll when your brain.
That was like my favorite thing. My first apartment was
only six hundred and fifty three dollars a month. Do

(00:43):
you know what I could do if my rent was
still that little? Like I just one day, one day,
I have to tell y'all about the story of how
I slept on an air mattress for almost four months
right out of college. But God, but god, A we're
here now anyway. Queen Joho, how are you?

Speaker 2 (01:01):
I just want to like miss saying you had six
fifty for a woman in one mouth, alter your.

Speaker 1 (01:05):
And fifty three dollars a month, don't the fifty three,
because the fifty three made the difference, the difference.

Speaker 2 (01:14):
But for about a month, for your whole place, for yourself,
for yours.

Speaker 3 (01:17):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (01:17):
And it was and it was. It was decent too.
I'm not gonna say it was super nice because I
had the best credited time shout out to growth, but
I will say that it was a cute little space
that was just enough for me. It was it was,
it was home. It was home, girl.

Speaker 2 (01:32):
If I can pay that, if I can pay that,
I can pay that price today.

Speaker 4 (01:35):
Right, he sat for everything?

Speaker 3 (01:37):
Right?

Speaker 4 (01:38):
Well, okay, lovely, it's your girl, Jordan a Ken Joho.

Speaker 2 (01:43):
Who aa he he broke girl Joe of the multi
avoid winning podcast BFF.

Speaker 1 (01:49):
Fly Fat Fat, Amen, Amen, Amen on it Now.

Speaker 2 (01:52):
I'm here to tell you that, in case you did
not know, we are in fact those girls.

Speaker 4 (01:56):
Yes, we're in fact those bitches. We did the damn thing.

Speaker 1 (02:00):
And then with our.

Speaker 2 (02:01):
Gold and Silver awards Gold silis.

Speaker 1 (02:05):
Yeah, let's be real. Let's let's make sure that we
let the dollar is know that we are gold and
we are silver, honey. And uh and I do want
to say it is not lost on me real quick.
I don't want to take away from your thunder Joe.
It is not lost on me how many people like.
So first off, y'all woke me up. I want to
say that. I was literally laying there and I was like,

(02:27):
why is my phone going off like this? I said,
what is happening? And I turned over and it was Bay,
it was you, it was Joey. It was like, will
text me? And I was like, what is going on?
And sure enough it was that we had won the
Signal Awards. So I just I'm I'm so grateful and
to everybody who, you know, the outpouring of love from
all of our listeners and the people that we love

(02:49):
who shadowed us out, Like I just, I'm lost for words,
I really am. I literally cried for most of yesterday morning.
I was just so thankful.

Speaker 2 (02:57):
So yeah, you know, I heard that it was a
record break like votings time as well too, So thank
y'all for voting for us.

Speaker 4 (03:04):
Two categories, having us win in two gagories.

Speaker 2 (03:08):
It's so amazing and such a to join in such
a gift and such a privilege. As a privilege, we
do the show alongside you, John and them, so so
thankful to see, but we're going experience it.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
And I love too. Whenever I do anything, people are
always like, where's Joho, And I'm like, I'm like, me
and Joho are co hosted, they have a life at
a job. Well, I'd love that now whenever people see
me they think of you, and I hope the same
vice versa. But I just love that for us, that
we are literally the two black fat fan girls, you know,
taking on the world the way that we do. So

(03:38):
all jokes aside, we are here to have a really
good time with our guests. So we do have someone
in our thirteet this week, which I'm actually really excited about.
I've been looking for. So I'll say this, we're literally
what we're episode one seventy three. I've been thinking about
this episode forever. We've talked about it, we've entertained the
concept of this this this episode, and what I will
say is almost feels chismic because soon as we started

(04:01):
kind of talking about we really need to do a
religion episode, we really need to talk about religion and
the ways that it's impacted us. We got to ask
for this guest to be on the show, and so
I'm really really excited that we get to head down
to the New Life National Baptist, First Mother African Bethany
Emmanual Church, Honey, to connect with our new friend, to
the show about all things holy. Honah ho no hona

(04:23):
hon ne ki yes, honey, we get to talk about
all things holy. All jokes aside. Christian is a multifaceted
leader and pastor of Just the Well. So you're at
the faith community where he helps people develop their best
internal image and how they live out their faith, which
I absolutely love and think is a great idea. Welcome

(04:45):
to the show, Christian A.

Speaker 4 (04:46):
Smith.

Speaker 1 (04:46):
How are you, my dear.

Speaker 3 (04:49):
I am doing well. I'm excited to be here. I
love y'all energy. It's just amazing. I've just seen here,
just just enjoying it in my first apartment out of
college thousand and seven in the Hunstol, Alabama. Won't big
one bath, four hundred and fifty dollars has me beat?

Speaker 1 (05:06):
Has me beat?

Speaker 5 (05:07):
Could you could you imagine four hundred and fifty.

Speaker 1 (05:10):
Dollars prices this time? Girl? The bags I would have you?

Speaker 4 (05:16):
Can you can even pay that for a square foot?

Speaker 1 (05:19):
Look? You can't even you can't even get gas for
that much tva by rug By rug for four hundred dollars.
My god, what a time, What a time to be alive.

Speaker 2 (05:28):
We are so happy to have you here with us
and we're we and I appreciate you loving that energy
we loved versus well, bring into love all together today.
So you have a girl we do every week on
our girma Sasha Campbell and are still.

Speaker 4 (05:40):
Here segment And I'm gonna stay in my spiritual bag.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
It was last week and asked a question to us all,
what lesson have we learned from our biggest spiritual challenge
and or awakenings?

Speaker 4 (05:50):
I go first, what passed to our guests? That will
pass it to John. So for me, I'll say I
used to have five as atheist and and or not sick.

Speaker 2 (06:00):
When I was younger, I chose not to believe high power,
not necessarily because I wanted to, but because I had
only heard that God would not love me and such
and my my my parents weren't religious. I don't know,
but that was like deeply into spirits and such. But
when I first start partic saying yoga and you know,
like during our during our prep practices and now doing

(06:21):
meditation as well too. I feel like I am a
lot of deep love of my intuition that I had
not like remembered because I think I had around a
kid kid, but I was like a grown adult.

Speaker 4 (06:30):
I was like, oh, what is this?

Speaker 2 (06:31):
And I would feel presents during my practice like I
would I remember, I would say, like really, they say
sometimes we've meditally, well, you feel like you're limitating, But
I feel like I was limertating about I was, but
like something was lifting me, like I felt presence around.
And so I realized that for me, there was something
there and I was tired of denying it because I
kept denying and tell myself that it's not there, it
can't be true. Rather, I wanted to celebrate it. And

(06:53):
so that was like that for me, like I think
what I've learned is that, And I had mentioned this
in my like like in my of our tour went
my when my birthday last year, like, miracles happen, whether
I believe it or not. That's why I'd rather choose
to believe that then then but then believe.

Speaker 4 (07:09):
That's not that's not possible. Miracles will still happen.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
A man, Yes, she said, I'm navitating. You mean I
know that's right, she said, I'm navitating. Yes, yes, I
love it. What about you Christian?

Speaker 3 (07:28):
Yeah, Like, my biggest lesson comes from the fact that,
like my spiritual awakening really started as an intellectual project.
When I felt like I was called to preach, my dad,
who's a pastor, told me, all right, son, that's cool.
But if you He's like, I need you to know
that a call to preach is a call to prepare.

(07:49):
So you need to go get educated, you need to study,
go to seminary. So I went to seminary just to
get educated, to learn how to better do what I
was already doing. And in seminary, in seminary, like my
whole theological world changed. And my biggest lesson is discovering

(08:10):
how much I don't know because you know, Joe, unlike you,
I was raised in the church. I was raised with
like real strong faith and really deeply rooted, but so
much of it was presented to me as certainty that
you know, this is how it works. It just is
what it is because the Bible says so. And then

(08:33):
when I started to educate myself theologically, it was like,
oh no, there's actually way more to this than anybody
told me, and it opened up my eyes and expanded
my curiosity in such a way that I never want
to get tied down to that level of certainty ever again,
because you know, spirituality is mysterious, it's ambiguous. That has

(08:56):
been a major major shift for me.

Speaker 1 (09:00):
That's that's actually low key, really powerful. I think both
of you finding it because I think what I hear
is kind of the through line is even though Jojo
said I didn't grow up with religion, I still found faith.
And for you to say I grew up with religion
and I still had to redefine what my faith looks like,
I think really speaks to kind of the work. And

(09:21):
we're gonna be talking about that for those who are listening,
will be getting into a little bit more of that
a little bit later in the show. But I was
gonna say, like, I hear this through line, and I
think that's kind of where this conversation is headed. I
appreciate you both sharing that because I think for me,
I in the same way, I grew up very and
again people know this about me, I grew up extremely

(09:41):
religious as well. I grew up with Joe was witness,
so growing up a j dub and you know, growing
up what I to call now the borg and also
I've named as a cult. It is what it is.

Speaker 3 (09:53):
I had.

Speaker 1 (09:54):
There was a lot of things that I grew up
with that I thought was true and then I had
to like relearn for myself as to not be true.
So I think that's what the challenge for me was
was the stuff that I thought was true, having people
be like, well, girl, have you ever questioned it? And
I was like no, and then having to be like, wow,

(10:15):
some of this stuff actually doesn't align with the way
I want to live my life and the way I
want to actually feel about my spirituality. Right, So there
was that, But I also think the Week Awakening that
I really truly learned in that And this is actually
what I put in the notes. I said, one of
the big things for me was that not all people
who say they love the Lord are good people, because
there were a lot of mean, terrible things said to

(10:38):
me when I decided that I didn't want to be
at JW anymore, and that's when it really opened up
the eyes to me that oh, not all religious people
are good people, and and and and and that was
really hard for me to kind of come to terms
with it. And we're seeing that now, right, we're seeing
a lot of people use religion as a form of
hatred to harm people or to further fear. And so

(10:58):
it's it's it's it's a very interesting thing to see
and it's very interesting to know. What I will say
is what I've learned in all of this in my
time is that there's a lot we can learn from
other religions and that there's no in my opinion, personally,
I feel like I have a very universal list way
of thinking. Right, whether it be the hum yum numbrae
kikyo or whether it be you know, praise God. Right,

(11:21):
there's something that we all can learn from all of
those things. Joho, please stop laughing at me. It's so
I'm just saying, like, like you personally, you know, whether
it be Catholic, whether it be Christian, whether it be Buddhists,
whether it be like mom, whatever you want to do,
if you have a a if you have a teaching
that it's going to make me a better person. I

(11:42):
want to hear. If it's going to make me see
life better, if it's going to make me love better,
if it's going to make me be happier. If it's
going to help me make other people happier, please bring
it my way. But I just ain't got the time
for the hatred. So I think that's been the biggest
awakening for me, is that how do I spot that,
how do I spot that undertone of hatred, right and
ugliness that a lot of people use in religion to

(12:04):
cause harm? And so yeah, I just I you know,
if you if you want me to move like Jesus,
then that we all got to be like Jesus. If
that's worse, Yeah, but that's where I'm.

Speaker 4 (12:15):
I feel that I feel that so much for that
so much in my spirit.

Speaker 2 (12:18):
And I wish, I wish with the world were people
didn't feel the need to to weaponize God one because
God don't like that, right, like like like I know
God's and they're like, why use me now?

Speaker 1 (12:30):
Now? Why in it here?

Speaker 4 (12:34):
I said nothing about this in my now.

Speaker 1 (12:40):
Tell me in weeks.

Speaker 4 (12:41):
But yeah, you know, okay, you know.

Speaker 2 (12:45):
So I I do appreciate when people are able to
bring like the basis of spirituality and into a space
really share how it's actually meant to be loving.

Speaker 4 (12:54):
And caring and kind. I just felt laughing because just
like not because not, just like I just I love them.
And I was like, not you saying I'm numb.

Speaker 3 (13:03):
H'm numb.

Speaker 4 (13:04):
Hum nam no, And I was like, no, no.

Speaker 1 (13:06):
No, y'all, no, no what she said.

Speaker 5 (13:07):
But I felt it with Tina, I did.

Speaker 1 (13:11):
I said, I don't know what she's said, but I
feel it. I feel it, girl, Please give me.

Speaker 4 (13:18):
Well.

Speaker 1 (13:18):
Well, no that we.

Speaker 2 (13:19):
Are wide away sans Kitty Perry, we need to take
our first break.

Speaker 4 (13:24):
We back in a second with our amazing guests and Jessavan.

Speaker 1 (13:35):
All right, y'all, So now that y'all have been able
to grab you a snack and come on back, this week,
we are talking a little bit more about something we
have mentioned in the past, and like I said, I'm
so happy we get Christian to dive in a little
bit deeper with this and get it from the actual
what they say, the horse's mouth. We get to get
it from the horse's mouth. I love that. So we're
gonna be talking about, you know, the thing, the good

(13:57):
old church hurt that we've we've you know, daunted on,
we've kind of played around, but really thinking about this concept,
this concept of church heard and how often it can
refer to people like myself who have left religion because
of some type of trauma or pain. And what I
want to make sure that I say very much at
the top is that this whole epicy. I don't want
folks to feel like this whole episode is us bonding

(14:19):
in trauma. I really want folks to hear this episode
and hear our perspectives and hear US talk about these things,
and really hear Christian too as they share their experience
about how we can heal with something that oftentimes is
used as a weapon to harm us. And so that's
the thing we really wanted to hit on. So this week,
since we have Christian and a pastor in our third seat,

(14:41):
we thought it would be great to have this conversation
that might help you on your healing journey or coming
to terms some of the stuff you may be dealing
with in your own back pocket. So I would love
to start asking or start this conversation my asking, do
you have a specific moment where you realize that maybe
you may have experienced And again, I also don't want
to assume that I know your your experience with religion,

(15:02):
but I know there's a through line right in some
of the stuff we've experienced and heard, but I would
love to know is there an experience specifically maybe where
you were like ouch that that actually kind of you know,
hurt me or didn't make me feel good if you
feel comfortable sharing, and what maybe instituted the want or
the need for you to heal from it and how
to use that in the work that you're currently doing.

Speaker 3 (15:25):
Yeah, that's a great question. And you know, my journey
actually didn't start with my own hurt. And you know
what I should I should say, you know when I
when I had these conversations, I make a distinction between
church hurt and religious trauma. And not everybody has to
do that, Okay, it's just it's just helpful for me.

(15:46):
My wife is a religious trauma therapist, so you know,
we really like have a lot of conversations about this.
But like when I think about church hurt, I think
about being hurt by people at the church.

Speaker 1 (15:57):
Yeah, and so somebody at.

Speaker 3 (15:59):
Church mistreated you, did you wrong, so on and so forth,
And that's I put those types of experiences in the
church her category, like me being a fat kid and
kids at church making fun.

Speaker 1 (16:12):
Of me because I was that you know, that's the
time I look at church.

Speaker 3 (16:16):
Religious trauma is tied to the theology. Specifically, religious trauma
is tied to what the belief system says about you
as a human being and how it conditions you to
see yourself and treat yourself. And for me, my awakening

(16:38):
really happened not when I considered how the theology was
harmful to me. It hit me when I realized how
harmful it was to my siblings, Like, because I was
always raised to treat people right. That's what my parents
always stressed. Even with my even with some of my
theological blind spots, it was still treat people right. So

(17:02):
I remember growing up in Oakland, California, over on MLK
that's when my church was, and right across the street
from the church was the block where the transsex workers
posted up. And I remember one time walking over there
with my dad. He was the pastor, and I didn't
know what the interaction was going to be like, but
they was like hey, pastor, and he was like hey, y'all,

(17:22):
and it was just love.

Speaker 1 (17:23):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (17:25):
And he had some beliefs that you were not affirming
of them. At the end of the day, though he
was still trying to like just be kind of people.
So when I went to seminary and I had my
views challenged on human sexuality, and I began to reflect
on how human sexuality works and how that doesn't align

(17:49):
with what my theology told me. I realized just how
damaging my theology was to my neighbors around me because
I grew up in the Black Church with a whole
lot of privilege. I'm assist gender, heterosexual, black boy, you
know that can sing a little bit, got a little charisma,
you know, yes.

Speaker 1 (18:14):
Yes, yes, yeah, these spots. I know that's right.

Speaker 3 (18:19):
So you know that's privilege in the Black Church. You
don't get any more privileged than that. So I wasn't
aware of how damaging the theology was because you know,
I grew up in a don't ass, don't tail space.
So yeah, there were gay people, they require people in
the church, but like everybody accepted the fact that it
was like the thing you're not supposed to talk about.
So I didn't think to really push back until I

(18:42):
got in seminary and I was around people who believed
differently than me, and they were like, hey, maybe you
should like take a second look at that and when
I started to reflect on my own sexuality, and I
asked myself Christian because I was I was told growing
up that you know, sexuality is a choice, and so
I had to sit with that, like, okay, Christian, let me,
let me apply that to myself. Was my sexuality and choice?

(19:04):
And it was very clear to me that I didn't
choose my sexuality, that sexuality isn't a choice. It's a discovery,
like you just discover who you are. And I say, okay,
if I just discovered who I am, why would I
practice the theology that says my queer SIPs chose it right.
It was that that doesn't even make sense. And that

(19:24):
just started me on this whole journey of just like
questioning so many things. And then I worked my way
around to how the theology was actually harm for me.
But I didn't start there.

Speaker 6 (19:37):
Yeah wow, wow, Okay, well, I mean, I mean, but
also like it's just it's really it's really special and
powerful to hear to hear that what prompted your experience
wasn't so much about wasn't much about your experience for
like seeing others, because it's also.

Speaker 2 (19:54):
Like like it's hard to especially like a younger age,
it's hard to see things beyond yourself, and so for
you to hear that that like you're actually your viewpoint was, Oh,
I'm seeing how it's having others and I'm seeing how
maybe I'm a part.

Speaker 4 (20:10):
Of that as well too, that that that that's just
not that people.

Speaker 3 (20:13):
People do it all.

Speaker 2 (20:14):
So I really appreciate hearing that from you, And I'm curious,
ask like so so like knowing knowing that no orthology
you were raised with was disconnected from how people really
were and and also was you know, it was also
a participation in the harm of others. Curious how it
affected your sense of trust in other faith leaders around

(20:34):
you growing up, and just like what that felt like
and how you reconcile with that.

Speaker 3 (20:40):
You know, For me, it really made me question the
system itself, you know, because my my faith leader was
my dad, and so I knew him on a real
personal level. So I knew that he really wanted to
do right by everybody. Yeah, I knew that, you know,

(21:00):
and he had he had some limiting beliefs. He had
some beliefs that weren't affirming. We were not affirming space
for for Q plus people, you know, but he was
he was very like adamant about women's equity, So I
always had that that there. But like when I started

(21:21):
to unpack the theology and then I was like, oh,
this was a whole system, right, this is like this
whole thing, like going back and looking at the history
of black people and how we were introduced to Christianity
and the context of slavery, and how those beliefs you know,
you know Johnny talking about that through line, like there's

(21:42):
a through line theologically if you go through our history.
So it made me question and have a have a
immense distrust for the system I throughout so much of
my theology because I decided I don't want to continue
to practice any theology that causes harm to anybody. So

(22:05):
the whole system had to go out of the door
for me, and that's what helped me to develop my
own theological framework for myself. I was like, I need
to find a theological framework that works for me because
I'm still very spiritual, I still believe in a higher power,
and I still love the Black Church, but like, I
can't continue to practice that harmful theology. So I just

(22:27):
landed on this interaction that Jesus had with this attorney,
where the attorney was like, what's the greatest commandment in
all the law? And Jesus said, here it is love
God with your heart, soul, mind, and your strength. And
the second part is like it, or the second part
is equal to it. Love your neighbor as yourself. Yes, yes,
And I realized I had heard in church a whole lot. Yeah,

(22:50):
you know, love God, love your neighbor, and nobody ever
put any stress on the as yourself part. So I'm
supposed to love myself. Nobody ever had that conversation with me.
Nobody ever told me how important it is for me
to love myself. But if I'm supposed to be following
the way Jesus, he bases everything on love for self,

(23:12):
love God, and love your neighbor as yourself. And he
said everything in the law and everything in the prophets
he enjoyed these too. So you can't love God if
you don't love your neighbor as yourself, because they go
hand in hand. Right. So it was like, oh, wow,
you have a theological system that actually stigmatizes self love

(23:36):
when in fact, if we're going to follow the way
of Jesus, the way of Jesus is self love and
that that just flipped everything for me. I didn't trust
the system at all.

Speaker 5 (23:47):
You said, put the fishes and loaves, let's get to it,
let's get to the work.

Speaker 1 (23:53):
Let's get work. I know that's right you're talking about,
and I think that's the thing I think oftentimes to
what I hear, And again, please correct me if I'm wrong,
But I think if you don't when you don't really
engage this conversation, I'm really not just trying to sound
like one of those people who really sound who's trying
to sound deep when they really not. I'm really trying

(24:15):
to make a point here. I think there's something in
controlling people or getting folks to kind of move a
certain type of way, when you can get them to
see religion out of themselves. Right, If you can get
someone to see themselves out of that, it's easy to
not hold people accountable. Right. So that means I can

(24:35):
you know I'm a better Christian than you because I'm
doing X, Y, and Z. But are you really doing
what the Bible says? Because you're treating people poorly and
you're not treating them the way you would treat yourself.
So why would you treat yourself poorly. So like there
is this conversation, in my opinion, as I was listening
to you talk, I hear you saying, oh, I never
thought about myself because a lot of people are so busy,

(24:58):
at least for me, and talking like said, the religious
trauma versus the church hurt. There's so many people in
the church hurt, pointing their fingers that other people rather
than focusing on themselves and the work they need to do.
That is what I heard, and I think that's that's
so that's such a fantastic thing to think about when
we're thinking about you know, like you said, I love
how you framed, you know, church hurt versus the religious trauma,

(25:21):
because I think that's something that really needs to be
kind of be focused on. So I guess the next thing,
you know, I was going to ask you another question,
but this, I guess for me, the biggest thing is,
you know, I don't know what. And again I'm trying
not to be like I'm not trying to be like
Oprah like tell me, you're tell me all your whole life.
But I'm wondering, like maybe in the moments of you

(25:42):
taking on your own theology, versus the theology your family
had or the folks around you had, and maybe this
idea of maybe them not aligning and finding peace in
between that, right, this idea of knowing like the ways
again the religion, the way that the religion moves Christianity moves,

(26:04):
is not the way I want to move, And there's
going to be a lot of tension between that. How
did you find peace or even how did you find
forgiveness in the ways that people made you feel around that?

Speaker 3 (26:18):
Oh man, that's been a journey. You know, when you
are bound together in community based on shared beliefs and
your beliefs change, your community connection crumbles because the community
was built on shared.

Speaker 1 (26:35):
Beliefs, right, right, and.

Speaker 3 (26:37):
It was like, so now we don't believe the same thing.
And a lot of times that's why church kids are
socially awkward when they come out of very like strict
spaces where you're only supposed to be friends with church friends.
Yeah you don't know how, Yeah you don't really know
how to interact with people outside of that echo chamber.

(27:00):
So you know, you wind up changing your beliefs and
have to figure out how to interact with people in
a totally different way Now, it wasn't that extreme for me,
you know, I wasn't bound up like that, but it
did definitely impact a major, like communal part of my
life because I believe that's what the work of the
church is to like create community, to bring people together

(27:22):
around some type of shared affinity, and that is that
is what it serves for a lot of people. And
in my theological evolution, by making the decision to not
practice anything that causes people harm, that definitely brought a
lot of pushback I've had. I've had falling out with

(27:45):
people who are like literal blood family. I have people
who called me family. I actually went through this evolution
after I started preaching and already had an itinerary. So
all of the churches that used to have me come
preach all the time, they stop inviting me. I actually
went to one church in Chicago for the first time,

(28:07):
and my theology had already evolved in a lot of ways.
But you know, I know how to preach what people
can handle. So I went to this church. I gave
him a message that they could handle theologically. They really
appreciated it. And then when it was over the pastor
it was like, we're gonna make this Sunday Christian Smith
Sunday every year. He gonna come back and preach this

(28:29):
Sunday every year. And then I was like yay, and
then I left. I went home. They went to my
social media and started watching my videos and saw the
expanse of what I believed. And he called me back
and was like, hey, we're going in to a different direction.
Uh huh.

Speaker 1 (28:45):
Of course of course they are.

Speaker 3 (28:48):
Yeah, yeah, because you know, people, people don't want to
be challenged like that, because again what I said earlier,
our theology is presented to us as certainty. Right, this
is the way it is. Don't question it. Whatever the
Bible says, that's what you do. And if you question it,
it's like a cardinal sin. And here I am saying, Nah,

(29:08):
let's question everything, you know what I'm saying, Let's have
a conversation about it all. Let's just make sure we
don't cause harm to anybody. Let's make sure we love
in our neighbors as ourselves. And that's just that's just
too scary. So yeah, I had a lot of relationships
that feel by the wayside, and I had a lot
of people that have questioned everything about me, like my sanity,

(29:31):
my heart, you know what happened to him type stuff.
But I built some brand new relationships along the way
that I would have never had. I would have never
been able to sit here and talk to YouTube right now. Yeah,
that would have never happened, Never would have happened.

Speaker 1 (29:47):
Yeah, and I'm so glad that it did because I'm
sitting here and I'm being like, yo, I wish all
pastors religious folks thought the way you did, because I
think to you know, to your point, to be so
locked in to one way of seeing, I mean, it's
kind of like you know, I so I'm not a
huge reader, but I do enjoy reading books, right and

(30:08):
you know, me and Joe have talked about this. We'll
read something, or we'll talk about an article, or we'll
talk about even a show and we'll see the same themes.
But Jojo said, actually I saw it this way and
I thought, and it's like, yes, yes, thank you. Tell
me more about this thought process because I want to
learn on that. When you can, when you can look
at a concept that way, how much beautiful the world becomes.

(30:28):
Because now you're not just getting your thought, you're getting
Christians thought. You're getting JoJo's thought, you're getting my thought,
you're getting anyone else's thoughts, and so I I just
I really appreciate you being so open and so expansive
in the ways that you use your your spiritual platform.
If that makes sense.

Speaker 3 (30:46):
Yeah, yes, yes, somebody's want to say, I think it
was a fortune cookie fortune and that said, education turns
an empty mind into an open.

Speaker 1 (30:56):
Mind, and we're trying to take education away.

Speaker 4 (31:01):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (31:02):
Oh, the more you learn, the more you realize you
don't know, the more you realize there how much there
is to know. So it keeps you open, it keeps you.

Speaker 1 (31:09):
Curious, and that's why they don't want slaves to read.
But now that he had know that, go ahead, Joe.

Speaker 4 (31:14):
Oh, wake it up, y'all, wake it up. Christian.

Speaker 3 (31:17):
What you're like.

Speaker 2 (31:18):
You remind me a lot of one of my woman
must beloved people. Is also a pastor's son, and he
he he doesn't he isn't he doesn't like going pastor himself.
But he's like very is still very like very most
in the church, verygardly. He does the work that focuses
on spring on the house communities. And when I first
met him, he was someone who like tried a lot

(31:40):
with understanding accepting human sexuality and like in the in
the past decade or past thirteen years saying no him
like he's gone from being like listen, you're gay, being
my friend and I love you, get the last job,
I love you so much to now like like to
now to now, Like he was just awarded by the

(32:03):
locals as a teeth Center, like for his work with
queeran transfers, especially just.

Speaker 1 (32:08):
Standing next to you. Yes, okay, go ahead, go ahead,
keep going by. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm not
I'm not trying.

Speaker 4 (32:14):
I'm not trying to because being able to. But like,
like I've known him for so long and I've watched
his journey.

Speaker 2 (32:24):
One one thing I love about him is that like
he's someone who I feel like, He's someone who I
feel like like exemplifies and like actually like like lives
godly in that way because his framework of God in
situality and theology and what when it means to be Christian,
like it hasn't adapted to life around him. And I
think that's been really powerful and beautiful and I appreciate
hearing that in yourself too, that like like like because

(32:47):
God is adaptive like God is not static.

Speaker 4 (32:49):
God actually is adaptive.

Speaker 2 (32:51):
You know, any higher power, they're they're they're they're always
they're always being adaptive to what's happening in the moment.
And so especially it's I I appreciate hearing you talk
about this because I also have been like the only
person that I know that that that that that lives
out the values that he says.

Speaker 4 (33:08):
And also and also like like God manifesting really.

Speaker 2 (33:11):
Peopful ways with him and and it's been amazing to
see his art and so it's nice and that there's
that now there's somebody else I can say, Oh, it's
not just him anymore. I know, you know two people
now who do that. And so I'm you know, I'm
I'm just asking you just just my point. And there's
it's a bit of a twofer, like no, now that
your yours practice has adopted, your lens of it has

(33:33):
shifted and you know, and evolved in this way.

Speaker 4 (33:36):
I'm curious about what.

Speaker 2 (33:37):
Are the like, how do you set how do you
picked yourself from others who may who may have a
more pers like but like like maybe our two beheld
to beholden to older ideals, you know, And also right
to that point, how do you separate the character of

(33:58):
your higher power from the actions of those who misrepresent
the higher power?

Speaker 4 (34:03):
Are right?

Speaker 3 (34:04):
Now? Okay? Okay? So first, like how do I protect myself?
Like what boundaries do I have in this space? I've
learned that over time, because when I first started thinking
differently and really shifted my theology to do no harm.
That's that's where I landed. When my theology shifted do

(34:27):
no harm. You'll figure everything else out. So as I'm
presented with some type of ethical or moral dilemma, how
can I ensure that I'm doing no harm here? I'm
doing no harm to my neighbor, I'm doing no harm
to myself, right, And that's how I started sharing my
new theology with people. But and then come to find

(34:48):
out a lot of people aren't really concerned about not
doing hard. They don't really care that harm is being
done because if it's what God want them to do,
then that's just the consequences of great So early on,
like when I first started sharing my theology publicly, I
would try to reason with everybody. I would try to

(35:10):
give people logical arguments of like, you know, why I
think this, and why I believe this, and here's this
Bible verse, and here's this study, and here's this data
and all of this. And my wife is a therapist,
so she saw the interactions I was having with people,
and she said, Christian, you're absolutely right in what you're saying.

(35:34):
But people don't connect to their theology intellectually. They connect
to it emotionally. Like you know, John, you talked about
it earlier about how so much of it is rooted
in fear. That's an emotional connection. When your connection to
your theology is fear based, you cannot be reasoned out

(35:55):
of it because you connect to it emotionally. I was
trying to just give people logic. So once I realized
that I was putting in too much work to try
to move people intellectually and logically, then I actually started
to preserve my own emotional energy and how much energy

(36:17):
I put into these interactions. So I stopped. I started
trying to meet people at the point of their emotions,
and for people who were willing to unlearn, I would
engage them in whatever way I felt was helpful. But
I learned not to try to reason with unreasonable people.

(36:37):
That's my boundary. Like if your mind is already made
up and you are committed to your bigotry. I can't
help you. I'm not about to try to argue with you.
And it's like, hey, if that's what you own, that's
what you own. You just got to go your way
because you can't be that around me. So that just me,
we're not going to be in relationship with each other.

Speaker 1 (37:00):
Like, not to cut you off, but some people like
to argue. Some people get so much joy out of
trying to prove you wrong.

Speaker 3 (37:08):
Absolutely, my comments every day on social media people ain't
never responded to. They be writing whole dissertations in my comments,
like there's no way in the world I'm going to
read this.

Speaker 1 (37:25):
I don't know who you who is? Like what they say?
Who are these niggas, each.

Speaker 3 (37:34):
And every one of them? Goddamn? Because I swear that's
been a major for me, just like not giving that
kind of energy to people who don't want to do
the work. Once you once you show me you're not
interested in unlearning, you're not interested in being curious, this
conversation is over because there are people who want to

(37:55):
have the conversation, want the information, want to do the work,
And those are the people that I want to get
my energy too. So so when it comes to the
second question, remind me again exactly.

Speaker 4 (38:11):
Yes, I was like, which I.

Speaker 2 (38:13):
Just just how you separate the character of your higher
power from the actions of those who misrepresentative.

Speaker 3 (38:20):
Yeah, yeah, I don't think Jesus is the problem. I
think it's Jesus's fan base.

Speaker 4 (38:28):
And don't be nasty if it does, be nasty for real.

Speaker 1 (38:31):
Yeah we see, yeah, child looking at Niggi minaj girl,
look at Niggi minaje.

Speaker 4 (38:36):
But go off.

Speaker 3 (38:38):
Yeah. Absolutely, When I when I when I look at
the story of Jesus, because you know, I'm a I'm
a I'm a theologian. I went to school at a
I got a master's in divinity where I really studied
this stuff heavily. I learned how to think theologically in school,
and then my education has been ongoing even since school.
So I'm just constantly thinking that iologically and when I

(39:03):
actually look at the story of Jesus, look at the principles,
it's like, how is it Christian nationalism is trying to
represent this character, Like whether you think Jesus walked the
earth or you just think he was a character in
a story that's that's that's not important to me. I
don't care what you think about that. But there is

(39:24):
a narrative framed around this character in this story. So
for people like Christian nationalists to try to represent this
character is insane to me. Because when Jesus comes onto
the scene and introduces his ministry, he says, the spirit
of the Lord is upon me and has annoying to
me to do four things. First thing he said was

(39:45):
preach good news to the poor. If I was going
to apply that in our context, that sounds like economic justice.

Speaker 7 (39:52):
So Jesus, okay, you see what I'm saying, go off,
so annoying me to preach good news to the poor.

Speaker 3 (40:05):
And then the second part was released for the prisoner.
That sounds like prison reform or abolition, is what that
sounds like to me in our context. And then third
he said, healing for the sick. That sounds like access
to health care. So if Jesus were alive today, I
believe Jesus would be trying to get everybody health care right.

(40:26):
So that's how I can take my Jesus and apply
it to what's going on around us, because right now
we're in the middle of a government shutdown because some
people don't want us to have affordable health care. And
I believe these are things that Jesus cared about. He
said economic justice, prison reform, or abolition access to health care,
and then he said liberation for the oppressed. So when

(40:47):
I look at those who are marginalized around me, those
are the people that Jesus said he cared about out
the gate. So I just come to the conclusion that
it's not Jesus, it's the fan base. So I don't
currently identify with the fan base, if that makes sense.

Speaker 1 (41:07):
Yeah, so you know, I'm notorious for this, but that
is going to be the tidle of this episode. It's
not Jesus, it's the fan base.

Speaker 7 (41:15):
Ah.

Speaker 1 (41:16):
That is a perfect, perfect, perfect title for this episode.
But you know, I'm sitting here thinking as I'm listening
to you, I'm said, I'm not you know, and I
hope you receive this. When I say this, I was like,
I wonder if this nigga got like a link so
I can start, you know, creeping in on Sunday to
watch because you you you, yeah, you've won me over

(41:37):
you wan Ova. I said, this is a pastor that
I could get with right here, because you appreciate you
break you know, you're breaking it down, and like I said,
I'm with you when you're right, and I appreciate you,
know I I want to say this and I mean
this with so much love. I I there are going
to be so many people and I'm not gonna say
like like we have you know, millions of people who listen.

(41:57):
One day we will, but there are multiple people who
have listened to this, this podcast and have said this
podcast or this episode has hit me or touched me
or helped me in this way. I believe a lot
of what you've shared today is going to I don't
know why I'm getting so emotional on saying this. It's
going to help a lot of people. I really believe

(42:19):
that in my heart of hearts. Like I feel like
we've done a lot of great episodes and I'm sitting
here and I'm going this ep but like, I'm so
excited for this episode to come out because I know
so many people need to hear exactly what you're saying
in this time. I have trans friends who can't get
hr you know, they can't get hormone replacement therapy right

(42:40):
because HRT because of what's going on. They have family
that have denounced them. I have friends who are saying,
I don't want to go to my family's house for
the holidays because of the way that they talk about it.
But yet they are these prompts. You know, Christian people
who claim to be one way or the other, and
I think you are. So much of what you said
today has validated so much of what I've even thought

(43:01):
about my own family who purports themselves to be Christian.
And I just, you know, by I don't know you
from you know a can and pagint, But what I
will say is I I just I really want to say,
from the bottom of my heart, thank you for the
me like when I think of God or to think
of of what's holy, or I think of you, you
embody that you embody exactly everything I think that a

(43:25):
pastor or a person preaching the Word should be. And
like I said, people know this by me, I'm not
a super Christian person, but I will say this that spiritual, spiritually,
I feel like what you said today is just really
timely and it's and I'm just so grateful that you exist.
I really really do so yeah, and I just you know,
I again, thank you, thank you for what you do.

(43:47):
It really means a lot to me. All right, go ahead.

Speaker 3 (43:52):
I went through when I went through my evolution, my
thought wasn't how can I be a great Christian? How
can I be a great person? What is it look
like to practice of theology? That doesn't just make me
useful to Christianity, it makes me humanity, so that a
person doesn't need to be a Christian to say, I
appreciate what you're saying. You know what I'm saying, And

(44:15):
I think that's kind of shaped how I approach it,
because like when I landed on the greatest commandment, love God,
love your neighbor as yourself, that's not relegated to Christianity
our faith community. Only a third of the people in
our faith community identify as Christian, like the rest of
them are somewhere in like that. I don't know what
I am, or I'm agnostic or atheist, but I appreciate

(44:38):
the message of this ministry and the connection to the community.
So yeah, I don't think. I don't think Jesus cared
so much about people's religion either, So that's just you know.

Speaker 1 (44:52):
Just you really, you're just saying, be a good like,
it doesn't. And I feel like I'm appreciating on a
soapbox when I say it doesn't. It doesn't hurt anybody
to be good, like, to be a good person, Just
be a good fucking person. Like we are all dealing
with so much stuff as humans and this human experience.

(45:12):
It doesn't take anything from anybody to be like. People
say that to me, Oh, John, you're such a nice person.
Why wouldn't I be Like? Why wouldn't I Why wouldn't
I come into a space and say I want people
to be happy when they're around me. I want people
to feel safe when they're around me. I want people
to know that they're loved. I want people to know
don't touch my food, but I'm happy to share it
with you, right like I like I why not? Like?

(45:35):
I just don't get it. I don't get And maybe
this is you know, maybe this is a no man
paman and we can maybe get into that later. I
just I just don't understand why we are all And
I say this not specifically talking about any woman. I'm
just saying I don't understand why people and I know why,
but I don't comprehend in this moment, why everyone is
being so nasty to one another, and it just it
makes me sad. It makes me very sad. But at

(45:58):
the end of the day, it does give me a
lot of hope that you are out there doing what
I believe is the Lord's works. So while I stand
over here in this corner and sing rain uh to
Jordan's little friend who won that a war, rain down
on me. Let your love just showing me, Just rain

(46:19):
on me. Yes, while I seen that in this corner,
We're gonna take another break, and when we come back,
we are going to top pop culture.

Speaker 4 (46:28):
We'll be back in a second, and we are Black fam.

Speaker 2 (46:39):
And as you all know, these last few weeks have
been a heart because we've lost really important names to
the culture, to not not just black culture, but culture around.
Because first of all, I'll say, Diane Keaton, who I
mean is not blocking out.

Speaker 8 (46:51):
Whatsoever, but you know, but you know, culturally culturely was
culture was arm Dian Keaton was why not on leg
On films.

Speaker 2 (47:03):
But and then also di Angelo, who has love black
women forever and provide the best love songs and Shoe
was songs who we could ask for. So we over
here setting out so much love to their families and
really helping that the transitions into the world beyond is
smooth and beautiful and peaceful. And I want to ask
you all, this is one of those topics. What selety

(47:24):
passings have had the biggest impact on you? And if
they're still around, how much how much different do you
think your life would be? So I'll start the Christian
John For me, I'll say it was two of them.
My first one was Anyone, any White House. She's my
favorite singer in the twenty tens. I feel like she
had a voice sided no other. When she passed, I
was legit criteris. I was like, I literally hoped like

(47:47):
that morning, woke up, woke up her was in tears,
which the school was like Seleiday in school played every
city that had of hers.

Speaker 4 (47:55):
I had all of her CDs.

Speaker 2 (47:56):
But to me, I think someone like She's someone who
I think like like when like like like Lyrically she
had such like powerful vivid lyrics are just so like
she talked about pain and joy and pleasure and such
beautiful words and such powerful words like she can paint you,
she can pat you pictures with with with her songs.

Speaker 4 (48:16):
And I think like that's just the talent that not
like not everyone has to that level.

Speaker 2 (48:23):
And you know, and I think like I would have
given to hear her sing life like like like to me,
like to me like like there's just is not a
voice like hers whatsoever.

Speaker 4 (48:34):
And even their voices.

Speaker 2 (48:35):
I just like people are saying, oh this for this,
this artist sounds like her. No, no, they don't, don't
sound like they never will think so on today. I
think like, you know, like like because because also like
she like she would do do wop songs, she do
jazz songs, which are like which in some cases certainly
black black culture and genre music too. I think I

(48:55):
would have had like not note like a more not
eligible face of it, because I really love some jazz albums.

Speaker 4 (49:03):
I love some like love some. I also do have stuff.
But I think I always just had like a lot more.

Speaker 3 (49:10):
I didn't like her.

Speaker 2 (49:10):
She got me into live music. I would have a
I would like go to live music more because she
was here. When I think a live music, I mean
like live intimate like intimate shows, coffee house shows, like
like like like her voice obviously was big and she
was selling out you know arenas, but like but her
voice was giving like the most intimate coffee shop where
it's just shoot her. So I really, I really I

(49:31):
wish she was still here. That impacted me a lot.
Then I'll say, I'll say cha Chawick Boseman and not.
I was like such a huge consumer of his work,
but because like I mean, I mean when like his
possing was just so sad and so sudden, especially because
I mean especially because like Fort Panther was so was
so culturally Yes, it was so culturally important, and then

(49:53):
it was a cultural shift and people were waiting for
my father two with him and.

Speaker 4 (49:57):
Like and I and I think like that movie. I
remember like that movie every day for like a year,
like another black person.

Speaker 1 (50:06):
May be like this what kind of just like literally
literally it was like like like I feel like that
that was the.

Speaker 2 (50:14):
Moment where like being black to being black always felt cool,
but that was the moment We're like everyone was like, oh,
being black is so cool, like like this movie is
for us, this this whole thing is for us. And
to have lost that right to like in some cases
represented that was really really sad. And I think if
he was still hear one two have been so different.

Speaker 4 (50:35):
But also I think, yeah, for sure.

Speaker 2 (50:38):
I think like the way like the especially the way
that we like like in some common culture, I think
I think we've been different. I think there there were many,
many more stories that focus on black superheroes if he
was still here too.

Speaker 4 (50:52):
That's my thoughts. Christian, how about you past?

Speaker 3 (50:55):
So you actually mentioned two of mine, like the two
that I was gonna mention. First one is DiAngelo. It
just happened this week. Like I'm a huge DiAngelo fan.
I listened to DiAngelo weekly. He gave us three classic
no skip albums. Yeah, yes, Like, as far as I'm concerned,

(51:19):
DiAngelo has a perfect desiography. I can put on all
three of his releases and just let him play and
not skip a track. And to that, to that extent,
like I asked on my social media, ask people, you know,
what's your favorite d Angelo song? And there are so
many answers because there was no clear favorite because he

(51:41):
has so many great songs and people like, oh, I
forgot about that one and I forgot about that one. O. Man. Yeah,
I can't really choose because that's how that's how amazing
his work was. And I appreciate DiAngelo because Voodoo was
like my soft entry into destigmatizing African spirituality.

Speaker 1 (51:58):
Yes, yeah, you say that.

Speaker 3 (52:02):
So that was real for me because I have, you know,
really really come to embrace African spirituality and more meaningful ways,
Like in our faith community, we have a group of
black women in that group, they just do African spirituality
type stuff. So voodoo really was like an introduction of that,
the de stigmatizing the spiritual practices that sustained our people

(52:24):
before we ever got here, before we ever had Christianity. Right,
So that has been very difficult because I was hoping
for more music from Dangel I really was. And then
Chadwick Boseman. I was a fan of Chadwick Boseman. I
don't watch a lot of TV, but I like going

(52:45):
to the movies, and every time I saw Chadwick in
a role, I believed him. He was a he was
a character actor too, so like I believed him as
Jackie Robinson, I believed him as Thirdgood Marshall. I believed
him in these roles. He made me believe him and
I felt like he was a generational talent. I was

(53:06):
looking at Chadwick like, Oh, he's gonna be the one.
He's gonna be our Denzel.

Speaker 1 (53:11):
That's he's gonna be our Denzel. Yep, that's what I
was thinking.

Speaker 3 (53:15):
And you know how we feel about Denzel, right, Oh,
I don't know about Denzel. I felt like the universe
robbed us when Chad Will because think about how how
much Denzel has impacted our lines with all of his art.
I expected that with Chad Will, So that one was tough.

Speaker 1 (53:34):
Fin It's it's hard because I'm not gonna even purport
myself to be this huge D'Angelo fan. But I there
were songs that and there are songs in my catalog
that I love. You know, his cover of Cruising I
thought was probably one of the best covers of that song.
I've heard it in so many different generations that his
was the best one. It's kind of the same way
I believe in random but related Anita Baker. I would

(53:58):
have never let her cover Lately because I felt like
Anita did better than Tyrese on that song. If you
have not heard Anita singing lately, whoo, she ate that
song up. But that's not either nor there. I will
say this too before I go onto mine. I got
so I posted this on threads. I in my years,

(54:19):
I think it was about thirteen or fourteen, when when
Untitled came out. I got in trouble by my mom
for singing that song because I wouldn't stop doing the
princil at the end when he's like yeah yeah, yeah, yeah,
yea yeah yeah, Like I wouldn't stop doing it. And
my mam was like, if you keep you a out
of but you gonna be all punishment. You can't go videos.

(54:41):
And sure enough I gotta put on punishment because I
thought I was testing a duena and she and she won.
So we we love around these parts. And people always
do that too when they see me, they say shut
out to tell you, Mama said I, I said, I will.
She don't listen, but she she she knows that she
is a fan favored around these parts. So yes, I
did get in trouble. I will also say I didn't
know until yesterday. Did you know that the ending of

(55:04):
that song was not intentional? That the ending of entire
the ending of Untitled. It's because the tape ran out,
so that's why it cuts off the way that it does.
And the producer there was a producer who came forward
and said he that DiAngelo wanted to recut that part
and the producer came back and said, no, let's let

(55:26):
keep it because the the Beatles do this in another song.
He played the song for him, the Beatles song, and
that is what the creative decision was made to keep
that ending of untitled, and so the how does it feel?
And then it cuts out that was a creative decision.
So it just it just goes to speak like di'angelo
as much as like I said, I'm not the hugest

(55:48):
D'Angelo fan, but I cannot deny the talent that was there.
I cannot say that his talent and his work didn't
inspire you know, when you think about it him Eric Abadu,
who you think about uh Andre three thousand, and you
think about you know them as a as a, as
a just the feet of that era from ninety seven

(56:11):
to like two thousand, the whole neo soul of it
all Angie Stone music soul. Like you can't deny that
di'angelo didn't usher that in, Like he was the one
who ushered that whole way then, And so I really
just want to speak his name and just really say
like I'm really sorry to his son who has had
to do with so much tragedy this year. It's I
couldn't imagine. I really couldn't imagine. And I'm sending love

(56:34):
to any of you know. I have friends who work
in the industry too, who I'm sure are connected to
him and his legacy in so many different ways. So
I want to send my love out. But anyway, for me,
I was gonna say, I think it's unfair you Actually
you negated what I was gonna do. So I don't
have two people. Actually I do, you know what I'll say,
I think it. I think for me, what really shook
me was the death of Left Eye. I was really, really,

(56:59):
really left unwell after left I passed, but I was
even more unwell when Aleia died. I definitely felt like
we were all robbed, like you said, of her greatness
because you know, and there's this whole conversation O Leah
couldn't seeing Aliah could. Aliyah was an entertainer, and I
think that's the thing people keep getting mixed up that
just because you're a great singer doesn't mean you're a

(57:20):
great entertainer, and vice versa. And I believe that Aliyah
had star quality. She was able to hold herself in
a film. She was able to act. She had a charming,
beautiful personality, and I mean I rewatched the making recently
on YouTube. I rewatched the making of the rock the
Boat video, and I was just so filled with emotion

(57:41):
because you could just see so much light in her.
You could see that her life was just starting to
really become what she wanted it to become. And yeah,
it just it just for that to be snatched from
us in such a such a tragic way is really
hard for me. When you ask the question, you know,
how would my life be different? I think I actually

(58:01):
don't think that I would have given up on entertainment
the way that I wanted to, because my dream was
to be one of her backup answers. And I think
that if she wouldn't have passed, I wouldn't have made
the decision to go the other direction I did, which
was business and honestly now having a pod and having
a book and being a speaker and all these other
things that I do on the other on the outside
of this work. But yeah, I had a dream that

(58:22):
I was gonna be her backup dancer. I was so
set on that, and I think that if she would
have still been here, I probably would have stayed in
entertainment as a career the way I wanted to. But
you know, situations happened, and now we just are grateful
that we have all these great ancestors and angels who
can watch over us and make sure that we're good.
So we speak all of your names, all the black excellence,
including you, Diane. You ain't black, but you still family

(58:45):
over here.

Speaker 4 (58:46):
So well, what we got to take a moment to
tipping out for our homewies in the sky.

Speaker 2 (58:54):
Yes, yes, when we come back and back with y'all
ever segment and no man, Pam, what's the fame of the.

Speaker 1 (59:01):
To put out all ye my God, by God? All right, ch'all.
So we are back with the final segment of this
of this episode. And this episode is, just like I said,
easily one of my favorite episodes, no cap. I'm just

(59:24):
I'm sitting here. It's so grateful that we had this
convo today. So what we'll get into so for those
of you who are new here, our yes ma'am and
are no ma'am, yes ma'am, is the things that we
want to give love to, things we want to shout out,
things we want to uplift. Are no ma'am. Are usually
the things that we definitely are over or things that
we just can't stand. And this week minor fairly quick.

(59:45):
I will say this, so my yes, ma'am. This week
I would say they're quick, and they're not my yes, ma'am.
This week is the passing of the bills in California
that protect trans people. There were four. One got vetoed,
and so I'm looking at newsome like, girl, what the fuck?
But all that to be said, the four that actually
did get picked up, we're thankful for. One of them
specifically protects youth in classrooms and so our youth that

(01:00:07):
are ultimately wanting to change their gender markers. And I think,
you know, outside of the protections and all the things
that have been done around trying to make sure that
queer kids are safe in schools, it's really cool now
that on paperwork and documentation and things that people are
protected if they decide that they want to change whatever
they want to change in their documents and things, and
so yeah, it's just there. There are a couple of

(01:00:29):
cute safety precautions that have that have happened here in California,
and I'm just grateful that they're here, well people abide
by them. Who knows. But ultimately, the biggest thing I
can say is, do your homework on these bills. If
you are a queer person, if you're a transperson, and
you're looking to protect yourself or protect your loved ones,
make sure you study these bills, make sure that you
know them, because that is ultimately what folks are using

(01:00:50):
to harm us. The other thing I do want to
say too about bills and things. I know. I don't
know if we're going to get in trouble for this,
but if you are a California girly, study Prop fifty.
You need to know what Prop fifty is about. I'm
not gonna tell you to vote yes or no, but
what I will tell you is that you need to
vote because ultimately that is going to be That is

(01:01:12):
something I truly believe. And I know a lot of
people are like, oh, voting, he's not gonna change anything.
Yes it will. It is ultimately what can help you
or can harm you. So do your homework and make
sure you vote when it comes down to November fourth.
All that to be said, I have one more yest
man that I want to say, because I knew I
was like, I need to make sure I use my
platform to say this, Dua motherfucking Lipa girl, you didn't
have to go as hard as you did at your concert.

(01:01:34):
So I'm gonna say this. I went into that concert
being like, if it's a terrible concert, oh, I'm okay
with losing the money. If it's a great concert, at
least I can say I saw it. Mama did what
need to be done. And I've been a fan. Y'all
know I love me some Dua leap, but I love
that little Albanian lady. But baby, when I tell you
that she like even my husband looked at me and

(01:01:55):
he said, I am thoroughly impressed. I said, so am,
I like we were bald gooped and how good that
concert was. So I just want to say shout out
to door Lipa, shout out to the girls who have
seen her and know that she's bomb. I will be
at whatever next tour that she decides to do, because
mother puts on a show and she can't dance to
save her life, but she definitely can put on a show.

(01:02:17):
I will say that that it was a very good show.
I'm lastly my no man Pam for this week now,
I no, I'll probably get some heat for this because
I know how people feel about this woman. I really
don't give a fuck, and if you send me a
message about it, I'm gonna ignore it. I'm sick of
people heckling Kamala. I'm really sick of it. And what
I mean by this is I understand that y'all have

(01:02:39):
qualms about what she could have done when she was
a vice president. I understand y'all have qualms about what
she ran on in terms of her of her presidency.
What I will say is this, and I understand, oh, well,
she's a private citizen now, blah blah. That's not even
what I'm saying. My frustration is I wish y'all gave
the same in energy to the white folks doing the

(01:03:02):
harm out here that you give to folks like Kamala.
That's what I'm saying. I wish, and I don't care
who it is. They can be back, dude. People are
holding Hakeen Jeffries accountable, people are coming after Van Jones. Good,
get all of them niggas together. But what I am
saying is keep that same energy for the white niggas

(01:03:25):
who are out here causing us harm, y'all. Don't ever
be beating nobody down at the Starbucks when they're getting drinks.
You don't ever say nothing to them, y'all. Don't ever
say nothing to these Republicans who are out here passing
bills to harm us. Keep that same energy. Leave Kamala alone.
She is trying to make a buck off of this book.
She is doing what she thinks is best for her. Yes,

(01:03:48):
she may have made some fucked up decisions, but I'm
sure if we dig deep enough in your closet will
find some stuff too. You are not perfect. Please stop
expecting black women to be perfect too. That's all I
got to say, Christian, do you have any yes ma'ams
and no man PAMs for this week?

Speaker 3 (01:04:04):
You're not gonna preach like that and then just hand
me the mate. That's disrespectful. You know, wait a minute,
we need another break.

Speaker 1 (01:04:17):
Sick of it. I'm really sick of it. Like it's
just I she can't do anything right, and I'm like,
what the fuck? Like what what else? What else could
Kamala do?

Speaker 8 (01:04:27):
What could she do?

Speaker 1 (01:04:28):
What can she do now that she's not in office?
What could she do? Because we can't even do it
and we're marching, we're going to know Kings marches, we're
using we're using community funds to try to help people.
We can't even do anything. So if we can't do it,
then what the fuck do you expect her to do?
That's where my thoughts are. I just I want I
want someone to answer it for me. I just I
really need someone to explain it to me.

Speaker 3 (01:04:49):
Like I'm five, Yeah, I feel I ain't even got
into this conversation about Kamala, you know, I just question,
you know, is just the best use of our energy?
It's not that that's what I'll be thinking, Well, you know,
what's the best use of our energy? And you know,
if I have to prioritize things, I think Heckerlen Kamalo
would be really really.

Speaker 4 (01:05:07):
Low lower the list.

Speaker 1 (01:05:09):
It's yeah, yeah, it's very little priority. With milk is
still ten dollars a gallon. She also six dollars a gallon,
and eggs is twelve dollars a gallon. Make it make sense?

Speaker 3 (01:05:22):
Yeah, yeah, it's wild, I hear, But so so for
for my yes, ma'am, I'm gonna go with the arts.
I'm a big music head. I'm a really big fan
of Robert Glasser, and he just released the album recently,
so I'm looking forward to diving and that because he's
been giving us a lot of music this year. I
think I think we've got like three albums from him

(01:05:43):
this year. So as a as a fan, a big fan,
that's a really big deal to me. And I just
saw this play called Covenant at the Alliance Theater in Atlanta, Georgia.
So if you're listening and you're in Atlanta, like, Covenant
is a really good play. It talks about like black
people and religion and it's just I don't even want

(01:06:07):
to give it away, but it's kind of a thriller.
So if Covenant comes to your city or whatever, yes,
ma'am to Covenant, and then no, ma'am, is the government
shut down? And these health subsidies. I don't think people
realize how impactful these health subsidies are and how much

(01:06:28):
people's premiums are about to increase next year if they
run out. So when people say like or when they imply,
I'm not worried about that stuff until it comes to
my front door, It's already at your front door. It's there,
it's sitting in your living room, even for people who say,

(01:06:50):
well I don't have insurance. Yeah, like the system is
so shitty you don't even want to get insurance, Like
you know, I really I really hate that. I really
hate that. So yeah, that's that's where I am with it,
and also kind of tell people where to find me
because we look at that because I'm sorry, we got

(01:07:12):
no professionals.

Speaker 4 (01:07:13):
Let me sit back, Fine, fine, Okayampam.

Speaker 2 (01:07:19):
So I was gonna be it's gonna be to the show,
but I say change it because the show is a.

Speaker 4 (01:07:22):
My ahow, I mean not, let me not do that.

Speaker 2 (01:07:25):
I will said Vampam for an album I've been rocking
with the past month, and it's Whole Whimsy by Dustin Conrad.
Dustin Conrad who is a young queer like pop artist.
But but now this this album is a jazz album,
alternative jazz. They have Ryan Crags for Kailani like they're
super shrit dope. There they have, they they have I

(01:07:47):
have for sure heard them with their song called Babbage's
Feature kill one and then they.

Speaker 4 (01:07:51):
Have they have a whole album. I think it's a
love on digital or EP.

Speaker 2 (01:07:54):
They also dropped an alternative jazz album last month, Whimsy
and it's just so good. This is the type of
shit that I'm like, this would make me go to
a jazz where and listen to somebody I will if
it is a poem by our girl Bay Davis as
well too, which is amazing.

Speaker 4 (01:08:08):
The poem's gorgeous, and it's just it's just it's it's
a really really good album.

Speaker 2 (01:08:14):
I actually play a lot while I'm working because it's
just like, it's like, it's interesting, it's fun. It's like
there's the it's fun to listen to and sing along with,
but also just to work with. So if you haven't
learned yet, Whimsy by Destin and Conrad My no man, Pam,
it's just to this year twenty twenty five, I got
album to pick with you, Like, I also want to
know what's.

Speaker 4 (01:08:33):
The reason why you're ting out our loved ones? Like
who hurts you?

Speaker 3 (01:08:38):
Like you?

Speaker 4 (01:08:39):
Like you start off okay, It's like it's like is
it twenty minute?

Speaker 2 (01:08:42):
First start trying to start off saying like, listen, I
know the world's left, so I'm gonna let you all have.
I'm gonna let you have most of the year to yourselves.
And in this past month she was like, actually, I've
grown a little restless, so I'm just going.

Speaker 4 (01:08:56):
Good damn day, My god.

Speaker 1 (01:08:57):
Yes, baby, but I saw somebody say I need to
have a talk with the grim Reaper because baby, you
getting old and you keep missing.

Speaker 4 (01:09:11):
One or two people.

Speaker 1 (01:09:14):
Yeah, keep saying no, not that today, you keep getting
the wrong D. That's what somebody else said, we need.

Speaker 5 (01:09:23):
We didn't say the Angeloe is in a l ding.

Speaker 1 (01:09:31):
The wrong D from us? What about that?

Speaker 5 (01:09:40):
Let me put on my car because I'm going to
give I would I would I need to speak to
the manager about why all of these black.

Speaker 1 (01:09:52):
People I love keep being taken from us? Yes, that's what.
That's it. This hit twenty twenty five is one for
the books, girl, And I'm trying to stay. I'm trying
to find joy where I can find it. But my god,
every time I wake up, I'm like, all right, I'm
literally what's her name from the Help? When she was

(01:10:13):
walking in and she walked up to that white lady,
she said, ain't you tired, miss Hilly eighth tired? That's
how I feel to twenty twenty five? Ain't you tired? Oh?
But anyway, all that to be said, please send us
your thoughts feedback and emails to Blackfefempod at gmail dot com.
We love your messages, We love any emails. Anything you
send us, whether it be funny or not, we love it.

(01:10:34):
So thank you for sending whatever whatever information you send over.
We love it and we definitely will share it on
the show with and if you feel as if you
want us to share this with the listeners. So you
can also send us your thoughts for your social by
interacting with our Instagram and threads by using the handle
blackfatfem Pod. We are there, we are active. Shout us
a message. Come on down, Come on down. It's a

(01:10:54):
fun time, all right. Queen Joho, Where can the dolls
find you?

Speaker 2 (01:10:58):
Of Chris Man loves as you can every week You'll
find me at your hole downs across all socials website
during Downs dot comment. If not there, you can find
me at Crojenet Chamber, sleeping the sounds of innaissance and
emerging hopefully in twenty seventy four when the US is
hopefully better or nonexistent.

Speaker 1 (01:11:14):
Who's to say real that is? I feel that on
the same real level. Christian, where can the dolls find you?

Speaker 3 (01:11:22):
Yes, it's the Christian A Smith that Christian is spelled
with a K, so it's k R I t I
A N A Smith, the Christian A Smith on Instagram, Facebook,
TikTok threads. If you go to my Instagram or Facebook
and type disrupt in the comments on my most recent post,

(01:11:42):
I'll send you some information about how to connect with
our digital community. Because we do all of our programming online.
We only meet in person like two or three times
a year. So yeah, we go live every Wednesday night
and our Patreon, so yeah, just go to the Christian
A Smith on Instagram is the type disrupting the comments
on our most recent posts, and then we can connect

(01:12:04):
from there.

Speaker 1 (01:12:05):
Hey man, and I'm sure, like I said, they're gonna
be listeners and people who are really happy that they
found you and that they've heard from you today. So
we are really really grateful for that. As for me
and mine, you can find details about me and where
I will be and what I will be doing at
ww dot doctor John Paul dot com. You can also
find me on all the socials Doctor John Paul. You
have to spell out doctor, I'll be telling the babies.

(01:12:26):
You can't just put DRS d O C T O
R John Paul j O N P A U. L.
You can also go buy my book down to the Amazon.
You can buy that Barnes and Noble. You can buy
your local bookstore. Support the local bookstores because baby, they
are going out of business because ooh, money is drying
up left and right. Honey. It's tough out there, honey,

(01:12:47):
it is. Love is a battlefield. You can also watch
my spot on ABC Our America Who I Meant to Be?
You can watch that on ABC or Hulu. And yet
there's a whole bunch of other stuff. I'm on FUSE
you can go. You can catch me on MSNB he
all of the different places pretty much. Yeah. That that
that that's that's that on that. We want to thank
our super producer Joey pat for making this ship pop

(01:13:10):
and everyone over at iHeartMedia for making and keeping this
show up and running. We would like toss so shout out.
I wanted for editor Chris Rogers because without him we
would have no audio or visuals down to the tubes
of you. That's YouTube for those of you who don't know,
this has been another show stay black, facts him and
fabulous and remember what Jojo, we.

Speaker 4 (01:13:30):
We're gonna be a cup of tea. But honestly, girl,
you can choke on our trophies darlings.

Speaker 1 (01:13:36):
Across the board. I love us for real until next week. Fine,

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It’s Not Jesus - It’s the Fanbase (Featuring Kristian A. Smith)

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}It’s Not Jesus - It’s the Fanbase (Featuring Kristian A. Smith)