May 2, 2024 • 48 mins
No-shows remain in the 20% range in the fine-dining industry, Head of Tock Matt Tucker tells Bloomberg Intelligence, despite demand that far outstrips supply, hurting unit profitability. In this episode of the Choppin’ It Up podcast, Tucker sits down with BI’s senior restaurant and foodservice analyst Michael Halen to discuss how the prepayment of reservations can help fine-dining establishments maximize revenue. He also comments on the shift to earlier dinner reservations, the state of the M&A market for restaurant-tech companies and unique ways restaurants are implementing dynamic pricing.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:22):
Welcome to Chopping It Up.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
I'm your host, Mike Halon, the senior restaurant and food
service analyst at Bloomberg Intelligence. Today we're joined by Matt Tucker,
the CEO of Talk. Talk is a reservation platform for
high end restaurants. So thanks for doing this, Matt.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Thanks for having me, Mike, looking forward to the conversation.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, same, And we mentioned.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
As I mentioned to you before we got started, I
noticed that you're a fellow Hoya. You're the third I'm sorry,
the second Hoya. Actually a fun fact, our first guest
ever was also a Hoya. The gentleman's younger than both
of us. Greg Frankfurt covers restaurants stocks for movies.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Yeah, yeah, I know the name. And you're going to
have the Sweet Green Guys on at some point as well.
They're kind of famous Holier restaurant tours. Yeah. I mean,
I grew up down the street from Georgetown and my
mother worked there for forty years. So proud to have
gone there for grad school. Like you played football on
the roof of the building a little bit, then you
(01:19):
did it for real. I did it for fun in
grad school. But yeah, it's great to be on with you.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
Yeah for sure, man, Yeah, George sounds a great place.
I love getting back.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
There's amazing, It is amazing. I mean that's why I
got a lot of my formative hospitality experience. So oh yeah,
yeah for sure.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
So yeah, okay, yeah, so you had mentioned you mentioned
you worked as a bouncer, what other any other.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Hospital I've worked in restaurants too, So yeah, I worked
as a bouncer at some bars in Georgetown and nearby
that I'm sure you remember. And I worked as a
bus boy, a bar back, a waiter very very briefly,
I want to I won't call it a samlier. That will
(02:02):
do a disservice to incredible professionals in that business. But
I recommended wines and a private club downtown. And it
was terrifying because after maybe the first question, I had
no idea what I was talking about, and they just
prepped me in the morning and I was certainly not qualified.
But it was a new private club and they moved
(02:25):
me off of that job very quickly to just a
regular waiter job. But yeah, so a lot of formative
years in Georgetown related hospitality establishments.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
That's really cool.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
I actually kind of regret that I didn't work more
in restaurants. I did a little stint as a short
order cook, you know, on a kind of an as
needed basis for a friend of mine, but that was
really it. So I definitely wish it, you know, now
that I'm you know, covering the restaurant industry, I wish
I had some more experience being a server and stuff
(02:57):
like that.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Yeah, there's I mean, the restaurant is so broad. You
described talk for fine dining, and certainly that's the category
or the segment we started in, but there's so many
different segments. Even if you had an amazing experience, you know,
in one segment of the restaurant industry doesn't even necessarily
translate to others. I mean that the vast difference in
(03:18):
experience between someone like me, who was just a waiter
briefly and professional staff who work in these fine dining
restaurants who have worked in the industry for decades. In
many cases, it's hard to even compare. It's like professional
basketball player versus junior varsity So sure, yeah, it's not
(03:40):
one industry, that's for sure.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Yep, all right, good stuff.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Let's start with I guess if you could give us
a little information about your career prior to Talk and
what attracted you to this opportunity.
Speaker 3 (03:56):
Yeah, sure, happy to talk about that, Micah. Prior to Talk,
for just under ten years part of Talk, I was
the president and chief operating officer of a restaurant tech
company named Olo, or called Olo. You know some of
the Olo folks. You had one on recently, Juwan George,
who I must say did an amazing job. That was
a great podcast. Juan was awesome. So I was there
(04:19):
for nine years, Mike and joined Noah Glass, the founder
and CEO, when there were ten people and we were
doing I don't know, two million dollars in revenue, and
left a year after we went public with a couple
of hundred million revenue and probably eight hundred or so employees,
a very different company than when I started there and
(04:41):
prior to Olo, I've been in the really the software
and e commerce space for a long time since the
late nineties, starting at the first startup I worked at,
which is called lending Tree, which is still around. It
was a startup when I joined, eventually went public. It
was eventually acquired by Interactive Corp. Then it was spun
(05:04):
back out as a standalone public entity, and so I've
been the e commerce and software space for a long time,
like and yeah, joined Talk. Asked me why I joined Talk?
So it was really I wasn't sure I wanted to
stay in the restaurant technology world, to be quite frank,
you know, after nine years and watching the growth of
(05:25):
Volo and the digital ordering part of the restaurant industry,
I wasn't totally sure I wanted to stay in it
solely because I like learning about new industries. I always
find that fascinating, and I didn't want to, you know,
get bored in a certain area, and I again like
I like to learn. But in meeting with Anthony Caslanoos,
(05:45):
the founder of Squarespace they acquired Talk about two and
a half years ago, and spending time with Nick Kokonas
was the founder of Talk. Those two guys are incredible entrepreneurs,
and you know, I felt like I was in a
good place. And I felt ultimately like like, you know,
the fine dining category was one that is, like I
(06:07):
was saying in the intro, like it's a different business
in a different world, and I felt like I really
needed to understand that I have my own perspective on
fine dining, having not historically you know, been you know,
had been someone who had grown up in the fine
dining world at all, wasn't used to find dining as
(06:29):
a consumer to a very large extent as well. So
I felt like this is a great opportunity to learn
a very, very different part of the world. And the
more I dug into talk, the more I realized we served,
you know, beyond fine dining. We served the hospitality industry,
you know, outside of restaurants and hotels and private clubs
and wineries, which is a big part of our business.
(06:51):
So the challenges were were interesting and clear, and I
felt like my background was the appropriate one and I
felt like I could learn I had I've learned so much, Mike,
it's been It's been an amazing experience.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yeah, fine dining is definitely a different animal, uh than
a lot of the companies I'm sure you worked with
with Olo for sure.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
Yeah. Absolutely, it is a totally different animal. And I
had a perception based on some fine dining experiences when
I was younger, that you know, we're radically different from
you know, what I found when I joined the industry,
and the people who are in the fine dining industry.
Their passion for service and hospitality, for the food, for
(07:34):
the wine, for the experience. It's just amazing. I mean,
they're they're I was going to say they're artists, but
they're way beyond that. They are incredible people to work with.
And you know, we do our best to Talk to
create an incredible software and e commerce product and get
out of the way, you know, get out of the
way of hospitality, make the product is easy to use
(07:57):
so they can do their job and that's served and
serve them with passions. So it's been great to watch
and participate.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Very cool. And can you talk a little bit of
how Talk is unique?
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Yeah, for sure. So when Nick started the company about
a decade ago, his original idea, Mike, was pre payment
for reservations. And you know, so the idea of pre
buying something isn't unique, but the applying of that idea
to the restaurant industry was indeed unique. And so you know,
we're buying tickets ahead of time for lots of things,
(08:33):
you know, sporting events, concerts, and Nick's idea was, well,
wait a minute, we have you know, demand that far
exceeds supply. Yet at the same time we have this
no show issue at restaurants in the you know it's
in the twenty percent still, twenty percent of people just
make a reservation don't show up. So his thought was, well, wait,
(08:56):
I could charge for this. I mean, I should charge
for this. If I charged for this, I know the
revenue I'm gonna have, I have the cash in the door.
I could pay my you know, my food providers. I
could pay my service people properly. I could pay my rent.
I know the money is coming in. And the original
idea behind talk was merely that was the pre payment
(09:17):
of reservations. Obviously, going along with that is you know,
the table management and everything else you did, and the
sort of core reservations platform. But that was the idea.
The company started inside of the linear group that next
in a linear and then really spun off from there.
But I really caught fire amongst the fine dining world
because you know, they had the same no show issues.
(09:38):
They had the same high food cost, high labor cost.
I mean, we talked about people who worked in fine dining,
they've done it for decades. They cost more, they turn
over less, but they cost more the food they serve.
You the component parts of that dish costs more, and
so you know, talk really took off from there and
really spread, you know, very rapidly into fine dining establishments
(10:01):
all over the world. Today we serve restaurants in thirty
three countries, and we've moved beyond fine dining. But that
was the original genesis of the idea. That was one
way we're different. We continue, certainly, in my opinion, to
be by far the most innovative of the the reservation
platforms out there. There are many of them. They're probably
more than a dozen reservation platforms out there, because every
(10:24):
point of sale provider now has basic reservations that they
give away to get you to buy the point of sale.
But what we do from an innovation perspective continues to
lead the industry across the board.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
What's a typical amount that the high end restaurants will
charge for those reservations and are they able to set
that themselves.
Speaker 3 (10:44):
So they can absolutely set it themselves. It's a great question.
What's typical. I mean, there's probably an average might but
typical is completely up to them. So and they may
charge differently at different days of the week, different times
of the day. So you're all a card you, you know,
on a Tuesday night could be very different from your
price fix on a Friday night or a Saturday night,
(11:07):
And so we don't take control of that pricing at all.
We leave it in the hands of our customers, the
restaurant tours, who are far more capable of pricing. They
know their guests better. But we do create products that
allow them to experiment. We just release something called multi
Experienced tables that we allow you now to take the
(11:30):
risk out of pricing an interesting meal on a table.
So you know, if I have a table available, a
four top on a Friday, I may want to put
a six course tasting menu on it and charge five
hundred dollars, But maybe I'm a little nervous about that.
I'm not sure people will buy it, so maybe I'll
put a I'll have that on there for a couple
of days, but after two days, if no one's bought it,
(11:53):
I can also offer a five course tasting menu for
four hundred dollars or an ALLA card menu. So we
allow you to control not just everything that's going on
inside the four walls of the restaurant, but down to
the table level. You can have this dynamic pricing at
a table level. So again, we don't tell the restaurant
to our customer what to charge, but we do give
(12:16):
them the tools to sort of maximize revenue. I've described
TALK before as a revenue management company, and I think
that's probably a decent way to think about us. So
you know, if you have a restaurant, we can help
you maximize revenue. Yes, we know, we help drive butts
and seats, which is critical. We help manage the tables,
(12:37):
we help the front of house staff, but all of
that is in service of maximizing the revenue for the restaurant.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Yeah, it's an interesting way to apply dynamic pricing, right
because I think surge pricing has people and it tizzy
at the moment. Oh yeah, so doing it at the
table level is really interesting.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
Yeah, I mean I think you know, it's interesting because
we're obviously laughing at you know, the Wendy's example, right, So, yeah,
they really stepped in it there. Well, I suspect it
wasn't their intent, just poorly communicated, you know. I think
in retrospect they said they were talking about lowering prices.
But you know, the qs R consumer, you know, I've
(13:22):
done a lot in the QSR space before they you know,
generally speaking, you know you're if you're hitting the drive
through line at Wendy's, you know, in a lunchtime crowd,
you know exactly what the price is going to be.
You may even have the exact change in your hand,
and so you're really potentially screwing around with something that's
(13:44):
almost sacrisanct to the guests and can drive the guest
away to another store. For for talk, restaurants, they do
have the ability to dynamically priced. They could do it
by day of the week, they could do it by table,
they could do it by type of meal. Again, all
the card versus price fix. But the consumer still has
a choice. I mean, they're not pulling up to the
(14:05):
drive through asking for their regular burger and being charged
something differently. They are pre paying in many cases, but
they know exactly what they're paying for, and they can
make some of those choices before they go to the restaurant.
They can also make choices once they get there. I mean, oftentimes,
I'm sure you've seen it. You go into a restaurant,
you have a reservation, they want to potentially upsell you
with the you know, the wine selection. The seller selection,
(14:28):
maybe it's a caveat upgrade, whatever the case may be.
So it's very clear, I think to the consumer, you know,
how the restaurant is, you know, is sort of marketing
the products that they're putting out in front of you.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
Very cool and talk allows the customers to keep their
data ring.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Oh yeah, for sure. I mean we are not stepping
in between our customer, the restaurant and their guest data.
I mean I saw it alllough with third party delivery
providers that we worked with and Uber that they would
take the data from the restaurant and the data being
the guest data, and then convert that guest or that
(15:08):
consumer into a door dash consumer in a sense, a
very real sense, stealing that consumer from the restaurant. And
there's no way we would allow that to talk. Now,
some of our competitors own that data as well, and
they're going to market to that guest. They may try
to steer that guest to a different restaurant if they
(15:29):
open that app. That's not our job. Our job is
to help the restaurant, help the restaurant market themselves. Restaurants
are amazing marketers, and so we want to give them
a platform to show great videos and great pictures and
great descriptions, but we are not stepping in the middle
of that relationship that.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Is their guest awesome, you know, And you mentioned talk
is more of a revenue management tool. Can you talk
about how you're helping restaurants generate repeat visits?
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Yeah, well, that's kind of the key. I mean that
that's something that is almost regardless of the segment you're
at QSR fast casual, regular casual dining, elevated casual, fine dining,
wineries for us, you know, private clubs and hotels that
we work with, it's trying to figure out a way
(16:20):
to get the guest back. And I think you're seeing now,
you know, in some of the economic data coming out
with you know, how people are spending their discretionary income.
To the extent they have discretionary income, they don't want
to always go back for the same old menu. And
so I talked earlier about this multi experienced table product
(16:42):
that we just released. That's a way that we help
the restaurant market something different to the guest. It's not
just about the regular menu. It's like, here's an experience.
So if you're a you know, an oyster bar, you
know in Georgetown, you know, have an oyster shucking class.
You know, if you're known for your your beer selection,
(17:02):
you have a beer tasting menu. Like these are things
that are not unique. And again, restaurant tours are so creative.
They come up with this stuff on their own. We're
just trying to help them touch the guest additional times
and show the guests something that could be just another
occasion to come back into the restaurant, you know, not
(17:24):
just Mother's Day brunch, not just you know, Saint Patrick's Day,
you know, green beer that you have, not just the
Thanksgiving you know, takeaway meal, whatever the case may be.
We want to give restaurant tours the experience, the ability
to be creative, be thoughtful. It's not just about experiences.
But that's one way that we, you know, help them
(17:46):
drive guests right back in. And we also give restaurant
tours a marketing platform to reach out to guests. Again,
we don't own that guest, so we just need to
provide the tool to the restaurant tour so they can
continue to have a conversation with their guests at the
appropriate time.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
Right, and you're looking to expand into other restaurant types
right outside of fine dining.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
Well, we've certainly spent a lot of time over the
last year expanding beyond fine dining mics, So it is important,
you know, I think that certainly our heritage is in
fine dining clearly, and that's still a category that's incredibly
important to TALK. But if you look at just a
product advisory board that we formed early in twenty twenty three,
(18:32):
you could see across that just that product advisory board,
we have very much fine dining folks on that board
who are incredible contributors and upscale casual, neighborhood casual restaurants.
So you know, the total addressable market for restaurants is
quite large, but the total addressable market for fine dining
(18:53):
establishments is a tiny segment of restaurants. So, no doubt,
in order for TALK to grow, we have to look
at restaurants beyond fine dining. Now we will never not
be in that category. And we're really lucky, Mike, Like
when I walked in the door, we've done so much
for fine dining that it's a matter like so much
(19:16):
innovation had occurred at TALK, we can apply so much
of that to casual dining establishments to upscale casual. You
know I just talked about experiences. Well, I'm very fortunate
to have spent nine years at OLO, and now I
know a lot of restaurant tours at much larger chains
who can use the same exact concepts. They're probably not
(19:38):
going to do pre payment. That's very unique, I think
to you know, fine dining to a large extent, but
there are plenty of other features and products that Talk
already has. That's just a matter of marketing them to
a different segment in the restaurant industry.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Great, it's exciting.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Cool.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Let's talk a little bit more about fine dining, just
because I find it to be one of the more
interesting segments of the industry this year. I mean, we
spoke a couple of weeks ago, and I mentioned to
you it's hard to figure out where things are going
because ye of year comparisons are easing, but the consumer,
especially low end consumer, seems to be weakening. Fine dining
(20:17):
had a really bad year last year, and so they
have pretty easy year over year comps coming up. But
we haven't seen things really improve that much just yet.
So I guess, you know, if you could share any
trends that you're seeing with fine dining covers and check
sizes in that segment of the industry.
Speaker 3 (20:38):
Right now, we're seeing covers. Yeah. First of all, you're
right like, we're still suffering from post COVID comps a
little bit, you know, twenty three twenty four over twenty three,
I think will hopefully normalize. We are. We are seeing
cover count about the same in Q one as we
saw Q one twenty twenty five three. We have seen
(21:02):
a lot of variability and check size. We have seen
less interest in some of the supplements that are offered.
I talked before about you know, Cavea ourselves wine supplement
that has kind of going up and down certainly over
(21:22):
the last year and a quarter. And the year over
year comps for Q one are difficult to understand. And
I'm talking about sort of same store sales. I'm not
talking about new customers in twenty four over twenty three.
I'm talking about the exact same customer cohort. Now, the
problem is sometimes you know, dates change, or a number
(21:44):
of weekends in a you know, in a month. We
had leap year this year, which throw things off, throw
things off a little bit. Easter shift, Easter shift exactly.
So we feel that pretty acutely in the numbers that
we see come across the board. I will tell you though,
I think to your point a minute ago, like it's
so hard to read what's going on, and you see
(22:05):
the numbers from this week. So now the FED may
not be cutting this year, is what I read in
the journal, you know, like who knows, and you know,
Bloomberg's re pouring similar stuff, Like the numbers that are
coming across are really hard to figure out. I had
an exec at a well known chain come and speak
to the Talk team recently, and he was saying, I
(22:29):
was talking about sort of wine and caviar, people buying
that or not buying that. He said the same thing
in his chain. He said, it's not wine and caviar,
but it was hot peppers and cheese sauce. And they
saw a similar thing that people in twenty four and
in twenty three as well were just not spending on that.
(22:49):
So you know what's going on with income and you
know interest rates. I think consumers are across any category,
any demographic. You know, fine dining, I think you know
incomes over one hundred thousand dollars. You know, they're driving
a lot of revenue to the restaurant industry. I think
(23:11):
it's like sixty percent of the revenue the restaurant industry
is one hundred thousand dollars income and above. But I
think even that category is uncertain. What's going on right now?
So cover count generally the same average order value, average
check size, what however you want to call it. It's
it's really fluctuating very heavily right now. So I'm playing
(23:35):
a poor economist, so my apologies for that, but I
can't figure it out. I can't figure it out, and
so it's varied, and again like the holidays and easter
and leap year, that's just making it even harder to
figure out.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
Yeah, for sure. You know, I've been I've been saying it.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
It's very difficult to project and protict where things are going.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
That Ploomberg's you know what, you guys, what your economists
are are saying. But you know, it's it would be
a tough one, right how to try to predict the
rest of the year.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Yeah, the cover is being flat. I think that's a
good sign. I mean, I'm hopeful that the rise in
asset prices will support spending by people that making that
are making one hundred thousand.
Speaker 3 (24:17):
And talk about bitcoin.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
Bitcoin stuck at the Nasdaq s and P. I mean,
you know, at home, prices are still elevated, so inflation
has taken its toll, and inflation remains higher for longer.
In my opinion, I don't see how the Fed can
cut rates.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
But I think you're right about that. I mean, but
the Nasdaq, the Nasdaq is up, but if inflation stays high,
the Nasdaq will drop. H I mean, the Nasdaq is
a tech heavy index, and so you know tech is
hurt in a high interest rate environment. So maybe the
Nasdaq is artificially high right now.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
But it's been underperforming over the last few weeks, and
we've seen inflation. We've seen commodities outperform over the last.
Speaker 3 (25:01):
Yeah, commodities are outperforming, bitcoins outperforming with I'm gonna touch
with a ten foot poll. But you can't You still
can't use bitcoin in most restaurants, I know, and certainly
you can't use them on talk so not yet. But uh,
I'm I'm always nervous for our customers. Uh right now,
(25:22):
I see them. You know, in many ways, restaurant tours
are in their element only because you know, they're so
creative that they can. You know, if you maybe through COVID,
you're going to make it through this period. But you know,
I was talking to a consultant in the restaurant industry
here in New York the other day, and he was
saying his restaurant partners are are feeling it acutely right
(25:46):
now in New York too. So if it's bad here
in New York, you know it's bad in the US.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
Yeah, all right, let's switch gears a little bit. I'm
a big concert guy, So bots really pissed me off?
Speaker 3 (25:58):
Did I?
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Did? I hear right?
Speaker 2 (26:00):
People are now using bots to buy up reservations at
high end restaurants.
Speaker 3 (26:04):
Yeah, you heard right, But what what's the concert that
really pisses you off the most that you could you
got priced out of?
Speaker 2 (26:10):
Listen, man, I'll you know, I'm blessed. I have a
great job, you know, So I'll pay up. I'll pay up,
But you're always paying I'm always paying up. Recently, I
went to tool. I saw a tool and MSG and
I saw Run the Jewels nice uh in in the fall.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
They were both phenomenal.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
So yeah, I love concerts, man, and I'll pay it,
but it sucks for the regular consumer.
Speaker 3 (26:36):
It does suck. I mean, there is this it's it's
really it's infuriating for consumers and guests who want to
go to these restaurants and you know, folks published like
a top hundred list and you can't get into any
of them. It's really, really bad. We are fortunate to
work with some of the you know, highest demand restaurants
(26:58):
in the world, and you know, they they will drop
a reservation, let's say, on the first day of the month,
and it will be gone very quickly. You know, we
do our level best to you know, to make sure
that bots are not hitting talk. It is a constant
(27:20):
effort of our engineering team. We use our own tools
that we've created, we use third party tools that do
a wonderful job. But you know, Mike, sometimes a bot
can slip in there, or you know, just a regular
human who wants to who has no intent of going,
who just wants to try to resell something, which broadly speaking,
(27:42):
our restaurants really can't stand. And the reason they can't
stand it is, I mean, there are several reasons, but
number one, they want to know their guest, you know,
who's coming in the door. Tell me about Mike. Okay,
Mike's made the reservation. You know, I want to know
who Mike is. I want to know what he likes.
I want to know where he wants to sit. I
want to know what kind windy drinks. I want to
welcome him by name. I want to re welcome him
(28:04):
if he's a regular, you know, I want to you know,
bring something over to his table from chef because you know,
you know, I know Mike and he's always been great
to us, and like that is destroyed in this bot
and resale environment and that kind of hospitality, which is
what if certainly in the fine dining world they practice
every day they wake up out of bed for is
(28:26):
to have that kind of experience with their guests. They
hate that too. And by the way, the other idea
that you know someone's going to it's like your concert
tickets a tool someone's gonna you know, go and resell
it and charge a fortune for restaurants. Even in fine dining,
people have this idea that you know, when I talked
about sort of high income people, they do drive the
(28:48):
restaurant business. But it's not always high income people who
are going to these fine dining establishments. Oftentimes, you people
who are saving up for a long time to experience that,
and these resta runs want those guests coming in. They
don't want them to be pushed out of the restaurants
because someone's going to resell a ticket. So it's really
(29:10):
it's a bad thing for the industry for so many reasons,
and so we do our best. We work a lot
a lot on trying to stop this. You know, I
actually worked in the security software space for a long time,
and you know, it's it's a game of whack a mole,
and it's kind of a game of pushing the bots
to somewhere else, right, Like, don't attack us because we're
(29:33):
pretty good at this. Go find it somewhere else where
you can you know, you can attack. And that that's
the security software game, I think to a very large extent.
But we won't really rest on our laurels here because
you know what, the good damages the restaurant industry.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
Cool.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
Are you still seeing earlier reservations at dinner time?
Speaker 3 (29:52):
Yeah, we're seeing that for sure, Like we are definitely
seeing that. This is a I suppose you know, your
guess is probably bear in the mind, this is a
permanent byproduct of COVID that you know, we're seeing people
out of the cities still. You know, I see it
every day when I walk to the office in Manhattan
(30:13):
or Chicago where talk is based. Either way, it's just
not as populated as it was. And so therefore, if
people are coming into work, you know, they're coming in
generally Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, and you know, so a few things. One,
you want to get them before they go home if
they're commuting back to Jersey or Long Island, if they're
in New York. Two, it's the people who are working
(30:33):
from home in the cities who are finishing up early.
They're not commuting home. They're already in the city, and
so they're going to go and have an earlier meal. Well,
they don't have an hour and a half commune anymore. So,
for lots of reasons, meal time has changed. The six
pm the six pm reservation is way more difficult to
get than it used to be, and the nine pm
(30:55):
reservation may not even be something that a restaurant takes
any more. I mean, we absolutely have customers who, many
of them in big cities, who have stopped serving after
a certain time for several reasons. One is sort of
population density, commuter density has changed, and also crime is
(31:17):
going up in certain cities. So in the big cities
like Chicago and New York and others San Francisco, you know,
they're feeling that pretty acutely, and they are adjusting to
make sure that they are guests and their employees who
are closing up and then going out late, you know,
bring stuff out into the alleys and bringing the trash
(31:37):
like that is a more dangerous proposition that it used
to be in some places. So yeah, things have changed.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
Okay, how are how is staffing? Are they fully staffed yet?
In terms of the high.
Speaker 3 (31:51):
End, Irond's fully staffed, I mean the high end. Listen,
the turnover rate you know is significant in QSR casual dining.
You know, you walk into your favorite casual restaurant, Mike,
you know you're going to recognize the host or hostess
for a month or two and they're probably going to
(32:12):
switch over. You know, in the fine dining world, they
have folks who have worked there for years and in
some cases decades, and in some cases with the restaurant
tours or the chefs at multiple places. So it's it
is different. It is a it's more than just a
(32:32):
job there, It is a career for those folks. You
can feel it acutely and how they you know, how
they interact with you as you're if you're a guest
in these places. So staffing is you know, across the
restaurant industry, staffing is is a challenge. I'm very lucky
to be on the board of a company called seven Shifts,
(32:53):
which does scheduling for restaurants, and you know, we could
see it there. We serve you know, much more casual dining,
but also SMBs outside of casual and you know, no
doubt that across North America, staffing is an issue and
fine dining will always be less of an issue.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Great, are your customers in California feeling an impact from
the law raising the quick service minimum wage of twenty
dollars an hour. You know, we've written that we think
you know, the damage isn't going to be limited to
fast food because you know, people cooks and people that
work in the kitchen are going to want a spread
and assistant gms and tenured manager tenured employees and gms
(33:37):
are going to want to spread between a new employee
and what they're making. So you know, what are you hearing.
I guess from your fine dining customers.
Speaker 3 (33:45):
They're not feeling it yet. They feel it's coming. You know,
many of them pay you know, beyond that dum wage
of course, and you know, folks are salary. It can
vary greatly, but you know, as an industry, it's it's
it's going to be interesting and it's going to be
(34:08):
problematic and it's gonna you know, it's certainly going to
drive more innovation because you know, in the QSR world,
people will not be able to afford you know, this wage,
and that's an issue and the path for growth in
the restaurant industry, you know, oftentimes starts as a cashier
(34:30):
and a qs are and you know what this, what
this minimum wage law can do is eliminate, you know,
a traditional job for so many people. And it's such
a great way to grow and get into this incredible industry.
And you know, I don't know how the average restaurant
tour can survive some of these some of these changes
(34:53):
in the law. I mean, people think of these unfortunate
at all to have worked with some many of these
large chains. And people think of these large chains is
you know, massive companies, but typically they're a franchise or
franchise e. So a franchise e is a small business person.
The name may say McDonald's, but it's not McDonald's, you know,
(35:14):
it's like, you know, Mike and Matts is really the
company it's And so you know, I really fear for
what this will do, and it will change a lot.
The fine dining world will be changed less, no doubt
about that. But you know, long term, you know, if
(35:34):
you are choking off the entry point to people into
the industry, it will affect fine dining. You won't have
people who want to be in the restaurant industry because
plenty of people in fine dining start out, you know
as cashiers McDonald's.
Speaker 2 (35:49):
A lot of times they start as teenagers too, right,
and so like if it's twenty dollars an hour, you're
going to be less likely to give a teenager a shot, right.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
You got it? Like absolutely, I mean that's really problematic,
really really problematic. And you know, we don't have the
labor to fill some of these jobs. So you know,
the price is going up, labor force is choked off,
so technology is going to step in the middle of
some of this stuff. And you know, for better and
(36:17):
for worse, again, it's not gonna happen to fine dining.
You're not going to walk into the French laundry and
go to a kiosk to place. That's not going to happen. No, no, no,
it's not plus you know, you know the plus many
other types of restaurants. But you know that certainly will
happen almost everywhere else in California. And I really I
(36:39):
just think the downstream effects of a law like this
have not been carefully considered. You know, wages, you know,
the tax rolls from taxing payroll like like, I'm sure
there's some smart people in California. I'm not sure they
worked on this law.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
Yeah, it's going to be interesting to see.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
You know a lot of the companies we cover are
you know, just gonna build less stores, if any in California, right,
they're going to move to to low tax states and
lower wage states and where they they're going to have
you know, better ROI on their investment.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
Yeah. I think it's was not carefully considered. I get
the desire to do it for you know, the votes,
like so many other things the politicians do for the votes,
but the downstream effects the restaurant industry are gonna be
significant and for guests too, Like your choice will shrink
for sure, Yeah, and your prices will rise. It's already happened.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Yep.
Speaker 2 (37:38):
All right, let's talk about the restaurant tech industry a
little bit. How's the M and A market looking. Is
it showing any improvement in this rise in asset prices
that we've seen?
Speaker 3 (37:50):
Well, I think so, yes. We are seeing seeing deals
get done, certainly along the margins in the edges. I
think that will continue to occur, not just because of
the you know, sort of the economic issues, but because
of the sort of over availability of similar concepts. From
(38:13):
a technical perspective. Actually, I think Juwan on your podcast
did a great job, an amazing job, and that was
great conversation you guys had on just kind of the
sameness of so many of the solutions, very very hard
to distinguish between the technical players out there. We all,
(38:34):
I'm guilty of it. We are all using the same phraseology,
the same nomenclature always, you know, every sale, every tech
salesperson ever uses the same language, and it's it's extremely
frustrating for the operators, the restaurant tours, the owners, and
it's very hard for them to tell the differences, and
(38:57):
so oftentimes what you see is a flight to sort
of a single provider. And so the whole idea of
best of breed is going to go away if you
can't prove you're any different from anyone else. And if
I'm a restaurant tour and I'm not a technologist, you know,
(39:17):
and it's just easier for me to do a deal with,
you know, a point of sale provider, because they're going
to have point of sale and payments and labor scheduling
and reservations and it's one neck to choke. And oh,
by the way, because of wages, I can't really afford
a tech guy or gal anymore, and so I don't
(39:38):
really have someone, you know, I can't you know, maybe
can call my nephew or my niece and they know
something about technology, but that's really not a long term solution.
So there's this flight to sort of single neck to
choke that is problematic because that's not where the innovation happens.
And so for me, as sort of a best of
(39:59):
breed provider, it does give me pause and I think
that will also drive some of the consolidation that will
inevitably occur in twenty twenty four. There are too many
players out there, and consolidation has already happened a few.
We were lucky Tolo to get out into in the market.
Toast was able to get out. You know, some other
(40:19):
folks are out like door Dash as well. I don't see,
you know, certainly, depending what the FED does. IPO markets
have opened a little bit, y'all. I don't even know
who would be on the docket from a restaurant tech
perspective to get out right now. And if that doesn't happen,
depending on how long their investors have been in the companies,
then they're going to look for other exits and that's
(40:41):
going to look like M and A.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (40:43):
Yeah, I'd expect the public chains to be active because
there's that public pressure to you know, grow your TAM
and grow your customer base and all that.
Speaker 3 (40:55):
Oh for sure, you know, Yeah, I mean so from
a tech a restaurant tech perspective, see it from a
chain perspective, I'll see it as well. We'll see it
as well, no doubt we'll see private equity guys playing
a much larger role there. And some of that may
have to do with stuff like what's going on in California,
right because they're plenty of California based chains with let's
say thirty to one hundred locations that you know, private
(41:18):
equity may have to not have to may want to
go take over. Now, we may want to move that
concept somewhere else. So across the board restaurant tech, restaurants themselves,
this will be an interesting year. We saw some interesting
small deals recently, child Now just did one. Chill is
great company similar to Olo but serving SMBs based out
(41:40):
in La Their CEO Chris, just did a good deal there.
So we'll see, you know, marginal deals like that. I
mean marginal in a pejorative way, I mean smaller deals,
and you know, we'll see if there's you know, growth
beyond that. But certainly in terms of absolute number of
restaurant tech companies that will that will decline in twenty
(42:02):
twenty four.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Yeah, this is going to be a really interesting year
for restaurant tech, for the restaurant industry all around.
Speaker 1 (42:07):
And we have a front row seat, man, So.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
Yeah, for sure, you're do you do have an amazing
seat for sure, I'm just a participating but you you
have a much more interesting macro perspective than so many people. Yeah,
I'm jealous.
Speaker 1 (42:21):
Yeah, it's fun.
Speaker 3 (42:21):
Fortunately I get I get emails from you, and I
get to read those, and that's super helpful.
Speaker 1 (42:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:27):
Well, I'm glad they I'm glad they help. All Right,
let's just I got one last question, probably the most
important one of the pod.
Speaker 1 (42:35):
What's your favorite restaurants?
Speaker 2 (42:37):
I know you're your workout of you know, you're living
in New York and Chicago as well, so you have
one in each that you're willing to mention or are
you scared to, you know, piss off maybe some of
your Michelin starred customers.
Speaker 3 (42:50):
I have way more than Michelin starret customers. I have
Michelin Start James Beard, and I have regular old folks. Gosh,
I mean how that's like such a question, Mike. That's
so unfair, man.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
This is the least I could do for you talking
smack about my mix.
Speaker 3 (43:10):
That's true. I did. I did tweeted you and Juwan. Listen.
You should feel bad for me. You know, I grew
up in d CMO. Still a Wizards fans, possibly worse
favorite restaurants.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
Just give me a good meal recently, maybe an in
each city.
Speaker 1 (43:24):
Well let's do it that way.
Speaker 3 (43:26):
Okay, good meal in each city. That that's that's easy. Well,
I went to an amazing meal at a restaurant in
Chicago that's a top customer fortunately called Next. Next is
an a linear group restaurant. And I've given Nick a
lot of kudos before for founding Talk, But I've been
(43:48):
to Royster, which is amazing in the office, which is
an incredible bar, incredible bar. But I went to X
for the first time and that's where Talk really started.
And they did a Julia Child and you was just
like the food was out of this world. The service
was out of this world. But the experience, you know,
I talked about experiences, Like at one point they served
the beef bourgignon that Julia Child was famous for, and
(44:12):
they brought over like this vintage little TV and plopped
it on the table and it started to play like
an episode of her show. It was like brilliant, and
all the plating was on like her types of plates,
and you know, it's just again, the food was incredible,
(44:33):
but the experience and the way it was presented and
the way it was described and and you know her
books The Joy Cooking, the joy in which they took
and presenting. It was like it's special. I mean, that's
part of the fine dining world I never knew about,
like honestly, I mean, you know, I was more of
a booeyemonger's guy if you remember those Oh yeah, well exactly.
(44:55):
So a great sandwich shop in Georgetown that great sandwiches.
But the way that you know, the folks at Next
did you know, did this sort of meal and experience
and it's just like it was. It was just like breathtaking.
So I'm gonna I'm gonna shout out you know Next
(45:17):
the Linear Group and the spectacular experience I had there.
Speaker 1 (45:23):
Check there.
Speaker 3 (45:25):
When you're in Chicago. But New York so I live
out on Long Island. I mean, god, there's so many
great restaurants in the city. I I'm I have to
think about that. Well. I mean, we have a restaurant
up in a up in Westchester, Blue Hill at Stone
Barns Restaurant, which is yeah, I just like it's it's
(45:50):
a college of food. Like the smells and the the
feel of walking around and the the pride and what
they take for I was there once just for a meeting,
and I was getting a coffee as I was leaving
driving back to Long Island. You know, the person who's
serving the coffee didn't know who I was, didn't know
(46:10):
why it was there, but the way they described the coffee.
And then a guy walked in and the person behind
the counter said, oh, and this is the farmer that's
delivering the Milton I'm putting in your coffee. It's like, whoa,
this is incredible. So, yeah, there are some amazing places
out there. There really are, and I think, you know,
we need to continually do a better job at talk
(46:31):
at allowing those types of places to promote themselves better
to their guests and just give them more tools to
provide that sense of hospitality that you know, quite frankly,
you're not going to get at the bootymonger. It's a
very different world. And so we need to do a
great job of, you know, helping them, you know, promote
themselves and you know, get more guests in the door
(46:54):
more often to experience you know what I'm fortunate to
be able to experience from time to time.
Speaker 2 (47:00):
Man, I'm confident you'll be able to help them out.
I look forward to following the story and keep it
in touch.
Speaker 1 (47:06):
Man.
Speaker 2 (47:06):
I wish you a lot of luck. Where can the
audience go to find out more about Talk.
Speaker 3 (47:12):
Well, come to explore talk dot com or download our
app and visit all our restaurants wherever you are in
North America. We have an amazing number of wineries. If
you want to go to tastings from where I live
on Long Island to Napa and Sonoma and neverwhere in between.
And that's the place to go. And if you're a
restaurant you want to work with Talk, explore talk dot
(47:34):
com also, but backslash join that's where you go.
Speaker 1 (47:38):
And yeahs good stuff.
Speaker 2 (47:40):
Thanks again for doing this, Thank you Mike, good to
see you same and big thanks to the audience for
tuning in. If you liked the episode, please leave us
a rating and click the bell.
Speaker 1 (47:49):
If you'd like to subscribe.
Speaker 2 (47:50):
Check back soon for a conversation about restaurant m and
A with a. Sheesh Seth, the founder and managing director
of Harrington Park Advisors,
Welcome to Chopping It Up.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
I'm your host, Mike Halon, the senior restaurant and food
service analyst at Bloomberg Intelligence. Today we're joined by Matt Tucker,
the CEO of Talk. Talk is a reservation platform for
high end restaurants. So thanks for doing this, Matt.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Thanks for having me, Mike, looking forward to the conversation.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, same, And we mentioned.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
As I mentioned to you before we got started, I
noticed that you're a fellow Hoya. You're the third I'm sorry,
the second Hoya. Actually a fun fact, our first guest
ever was also a Hoya. The gentleman's younger than both
of us. Greg Frankfurt covers restaurants stocks for movies.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Yeah, yeah, I know the name. And you're going to
have the Sweet Green Guys on at some point as well.
They're kind of famous Holier restaurant tours. Yeah. I mean,
I grew up down the street from Georgetown and my
mother worked there for forty years. So proud to have
gone there for grad school. Like you played football on
the roof of the building a little bit, then you
(01:19):
did it for real. I did it for fun in
grad school. But yeah, it's great to be on with you.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
Yeah for sure, man, Yeah, George sounds a great place.
I love getting back.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
There's amazing, It is amazing. I mean that's why I
got a lot of my formative hospitality experience. So oh yeah,
yeah for sure.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
So yeah, okay, yeah, so you had mentioned you mentioned
you worked as a bouncer, what other any other.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Hospital I've worked in restaurants too, So yeah, I worked
as a bouncer at some bars in Georgetown and nearby
that I'm sure you remember. And I worked as a
bus boy, a bar back, a waiter very very briefly,
I want to I won't call it a samlier. That will
(02:02):
do a disservice to incredible professionals in that business. But
I recommended wines and a private club downtown. And it
was terrifying because after maybe the first question, I had
no idea what I was talking about, and they just
prepped me in the morning and I was certainly not qualified.
But it was a new private club and they moved
(02:25):
me off of that job very quickly to just a
regular waiter job. But yeah, so a lot of formative
years in Georgetown related hospitality establishments.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
That's really cool.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
I actually kind of regret that I didn't work more
in restaurants. I did a little stint as a short
order cook, you know, on a kind of an as
needed basis for a friend of mine, but that was
really it. So I definitely wish it, you know, now
that I'm you know, covering the restaurant industry, I wish
I had some more experience being a server and stuff
(02:57):
like that.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Yeah, there's I mean, the restaurant is so broad. You
described talk for fine dining, and certainly that's the category
or the segment we started in, but there's so many
different segments. Even if you had an amazing experience, you know,
in one segment of the restaurant industry doesn't even necessarily
translate to others. I mean that the vast difference in
(03:18):
experience between someone like me, who was just a waiter
briefly and professional staff who work in these fine dining
restaurants who have worked in the industry for decades. In
many cases, it's hard to even compare. It's like professional
basketball player versus junior varsity So sure, yeah, it's not
(03:40):
one industry, that's for sure.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Yep, all right, good stuff.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Let's start with I guess if you could give us
a little information about your career prior to Talk and
what attracted you to this opportunity.
Speaker 3 (03:56):
Yeah, sure, happy to talk about that, Micah. Prior to Talk,
for just under ten years part of Talk, I was
the president and chief operating officer of a restaurant tech
company named Olo, or called Olo. You know some of
the Olo folks. You had one on recently, Juwan George,
who I must say did an amazing job. That was
a great podcast. Juan was awesome. So I was there
(04:19):
for nine years, Mike and joined Noah Glass, the founder
and CEO, when there were ten people and we were
doing I don't know, two million dollars in revenue, and
left a year after we went public with a couple
of hundred million revenue and probably eight hundred or so employees,
a very different company than when I started there and
(04:41):
prior to Olo, I've been in the really the software
and e commerce space for a long time since the
late nineties, starting at the first startup I worked at,
which is called lending Tree, which is still around. It
was a startup when I joined, eventually went public. It
was eventually acquired by Interactive Corp. Then it was spun
(05:04):
back out as a standalone public entity, and so I've
been the e commerce and software space for a long time,
like and yeah, joined Talk. Asked me why I joined Talk?
So it was really I wasn't sure I wanted to
stay in the restaurant technology world, to be quite frank,
you know, after nine years and watching the growth of
(05:25):
Volo and the digital ordering part of the restaurant industry,
I wasn't totally sure I wanted to stay in it
solely because I like learning about new industries. I always
find that fascinating, and I didn't want to, you know,
get bored in a certain area, and I again like
I like to learn. But in meeting with Anthony Caslanoos,
(05:45):
the founder of Squarespace they acquired Talk about two and
a half years ago, and spending time with Nick Kokonas
was the founder of Talk. Those two guys are incredible entrepreneurs,
and you know, I felt like I was in a
good place. And I felt ultimately like like, you know,
the fine dining category was one that is, like I
(06:07):
was saying in the intro, like it's a different business
in a different world, and I felt like I really
needed to understand that I have my own perspective on
fine dining, having not historically you know, been you know,
had been someone who had grown up in the fine
dining world at all, wasn't used to find dining as
(06:29):
a consumer to a very large extent as well. So
I felt like this is a great opportunity to learn
a very, very different part of the world. And the
more I dug into talk, the more I realized we served,
you know, beyond fine dining. We served the hospitality industry,
you know, outside of restaurants and hotels and private clubs
and wineries, which is a big part of our business.
(06:51):
So the challenges were were interesting and clear, and I
felt like my background was the appropriate one and I
felt like I could learn I had I've learned so much, Mike,
it's been It's been an amazing experience.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yeah, fine dining is definitely a different animal, uh than
a lot of the companies I'm sure you worked with
with Olo for sure.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
Yeah. Absolutely, it is a totally different animal. And I
had a perception based on some fine dining experiences when
I was younger, that you know, we're radically different from
you know, what I found when I joined the industry,
and the people who are in the fine dining industry.
Their passion for service and hospitality, for the food, for
(07:34):
the wine, for the experience. It's just amazing. I mean,
they're they're I was going to say they're artists, but
they're way beyond that. They are incredible people to work with.
And you know, we do our best to Talk to
create an incredible software and e commerce product and get
out of the way, you know, get out of the
way of hospitality, make the product is easy to use
(07:57):
so they can do their job and that's served and
serve them with passions. So it's been great to watch
and participate.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Very cool. And can you talk a little bit of
how Talk is unique?
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Yeah, for sure. So when Nick started the company about
a decade ago, his original idea, Mike, was pre payment
for reservations. And you know, so the idea of pre
buying something isn't unique, but the applying of that idea
to the restaurant industry was indeed unique. And so you know,
we're buying tickets ahead of time for lots of things,
(08:33):
you know, sporting events, concerts, and Nick's idea was, well,
wait a minute, we have you know, demand that far
exceeds supply. Yet at the same time we have this
no show issue at restaurants in the you know it's
in the twenty percent still, twenty percent of people just
make a reservation don't show up. So his thought was, well, wait,
(08:56):
I could charge for this. I mean, I should charge
for this. If I charged for this, I know the
revenue I'm gonna have, I have the cash in the door.
I could pay my you know, my food providers. I
could pay my service people properly. I could pay my rent.
I know the money is coming in. And the original
idea behind talk was merely that was the pre payment
(09:17):
of reservations. Obviously, going along with that is you know,
the table management and everything else you did, and the
sort of core reservations platform. But that was the idea.
The company started inside of the linear group that next
in a linear and then really spun off from there.
But I really caught fire amongst the fine dining world
because you know, they had the same no show issues.
(09:38):
They had the same high food cost, high labor cost.
I mean, we talked about people who worked in fine dining,
they've done it for decades. They cost more, they turn
over less, but they cost more the food they serve.
You the component parts of that dish costs more, and
so you know, talk really took off from there and
really spread, you know, very rapidly into fine dining establishments
(10:01):
all over the world. Today we serve restaurants in thirty
three countries, and we've moved beyond fine dining. But that
was the original genesis of the idea. That was one
way we're different. We continue, certainly, in my opinion, to
be by far the most innovative of the the reservation
platforms out there. There are many of them. They're probably
more than a dozen reservation platforms out there, because every
(10:24):
point of sale provider now has basic reservations that they
give away to get you to buy the point of sale.
But what we do from an innovation perspective continues to
lead the industry across the board.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
What's a typical amount that the high end restaurants will
charge for those reservations and are they able to set
that themselves.
Speaker 3 (10:44):
So they can absolutely set it themselves. It's a great question.
What's typical. I mean, there's probably an average might but
typical is completely up to them. So and they may
charge differently at different days of the week, different times
of the day. So you're all a card you, you know,
on a Tuesday night could be very different from your
price fix on a Friday night or a Saturday night,
(11:07):
And so we don't take control of that pricing at all.
We leave it in the hands of our customers, the
restaurant tours, who are far more capable of pricing. They
know their guests better. But we do create products that
allow them to experiment. We just release something called multi
Experienced tables that we allow you now to take the
(11:30):
risk out of pricing an interesting meal on a table.
So you know, if I have a table available, a
four top on a Friday, I may want to put
a six course tasting menu on it and charge five
hundred dollars, But maybe I'm a little nervous about that.
I'm not sure people will buy it, so maybe I'll
put a I'll have that on there for a couple
of days, but after two days, if no one's bought it,
(11:53):
I can also offer a five course tasting menu for
four hundred dollars or an ALLA card menu. So we
allow you to control not just everything that's going on
inside the four walls of the restaurant, but down to
the table level. You can have this dynamic pricing at
a table level. So again, we don't tell the restaurant
to our customer what to charge, but we do give
(12:16):
them the tools to sort of maximize revenue. I've described
TALK before as a revenue management company, and I think
that's probably a decent way to think about us. So
you know, if you have a restaurant, we can help
you maximize revenue. Yes, we know, we help drive butts
and seats, which is critical. We help manage the tables,
(12:37):
we help the front of house staff, but all of
that is in service of maximizing the revenue for the restaurant.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Yeah, it's an interesting way to apply dynamic pricing, right
because I think surge pricing has people and it tizzy
at the moment. Oh yeah, so doing it at the
table level is really interesting.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
Yeah, I mean I think you know, it's interesting because
we're obviously laughing at you know, the Wendy's example, right, So, yeah,
they really stepped in it there. Well, I suspect it
wasn't their intent, just poorly communicated, you know. I think
in retrospect they said they were talking about lowering prices.
But you know, the qs R consumer, you know, I've
(13:22):
done a lot in the QSR space before they you know,
generally speaking, you know you're if you're hitting the drive
through line at Wendy's, you know, in a lunchtime crowd,
you know exactly what the price is going to be.
You may even have the exact change in your hand,
and so you're really potentially screwing around with something that's
(13:44):
almost sacrisanct to the guests and can drive the guest
away to another store. For for talk, restaurants, they do
have the ability to dynamically priced. They could do it
by day of the week, they could do it by table,
they could do it by type of meal. Again, all
the card versus price fix. But the consumer still has
a choice. I mean, they're not pulling up to the
(14:05):
drive through asking for their regular burger and being charged
something differently. They are pre paying in many cases, but
they know exactly what they're paying for, and they can
make some of those choices before they go to the restaurant.
They can also make choices once they get there. I mean, oftentimes,
I'm sure you've seen it. You go into a restaurant,
you have a reservation, they want to potentially upsell you
with the you know, the wine selection. The seller selection,
(14:28):
maybe it's a caveat upgrade, whatever the case may be.
So it's very clear, I think to the consumer, you know,
how the restaurant is, you know, is sort of marketing
the products that they're putting out in front of you.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
Very cool and talk allows the customers to keep their
data ring.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Oh yeah, for sure. I mean we are not stepping
in between our customer, the restaurant and their guest data.
I mean I saw it alllough with third party delivery
providers that we worked with and Uber that they would
take the data from the restaurant and the data being
the guest data, and then convert that guest or that
(15:08):
consumer into a door dash consumer in a sense, a
very real sense, stealing that consumer from the restaurant. And
there's no way we would allow that to talk. Now,
some of our competitors own that data as well, and
they're going to market to that guest. They may try
to steer that guest to a different restaurant if they
(15:29):
open that app. That's not our job. Our job is
to help the restaurant, help the restaurant market themselves. Restaurants
are amazing marketers, and so we want to give them
a platform to show great videos and great pictures and
great descriptions, but we are not stepping in the middle
of that relationship that.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Is their guest awesome, you know, And you mentioned talk
is more of a revenue management tool. Can you talk
about how you're helping restaurants generate repeat visits?
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Yeah, well, that's kind of the key. I mean that
that's something that is almost regardless of the segment you're
at QSR fast casual, regular casual dining, elevated casual, fine dining,
wineries for us, you know, private clubs and hotels that
we work with, it's trying to figure out a way
(16:20):
to get the guest back. And I think you're seeing now,
you know, in some of the economic data coming out
with you know, how people are spending their discretionary income.
To the extent they have discretionary income, they don't want
to always go back for the same old menu. And
so I talked earlier about this multi experienced table product
(16:42):
that we just released. That's a way that we help
the restaurant market something different to the guest. It's not
just about the regular menu. It's like, here's an experience.
So if you're a you know, an oyster bar, you
know in Georgetown, you know, have an oyster shucking class.
You know, if you're known for your your beer selection,
(17:02):
you have a beer tasting menu. Like these are things
that are not unique. And again, restaurant tours are so creative.
They come up with this stuff on their own. We're
just trying to help them touch the guest additional times
and show the guests something that could be just another
occasion to come back into the restaurant, you know, not
(17:24):
just Mother's Day brunch, not just you know, Saint Patrick's Day,
you know, green beer that you have, not just the
Thanksgiving you know, takeaway meal, whatever the case may be.
We want to give restaurant tours the experience, the ability
to be creative, be thoughtful. It's not just about experiences.
But that's one way that we, you know, help them
(17:46):
drive guests right back in. And we also give restaurant
tours a marketing platform to reach out to guests. Again,
we don't own that guest, so we just need to
provide the tool to the restaurant tour so they can
continue to have a conversation with their guests at the
appropriate time.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
Right, and you're looking to expand into other restaurant types
right outside of fine dining.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
Well, we've certainly spent a lot of time over the
last year expanding beyond fine dining mics, So it is important,
you know, I think that certainly our heritage is in
fine dining clearly, and that's still a category that's incredibly
important to TALK. But if you look at just a
product advisory board that we formed early in twenty twenty three,
(18:32):
you could see across that just that product advisory board,
we have very much fine dining folks on that board
who are incredible contributors and upscale casual, neighborhood casual restaurants.
So you know, the total addressable market for restaurants is
quite large, but the total addressable market for fine dining
(18:53):
establishments is a tiny segment of restaurants. So, no doubt,
in order for TALK to grow, we have to look
at restaurants beyond fine dining. Now we will never not
be in that category. And we're really lucky, Mike, Like
when I walked in the door, we've done so much
for fine dining that it's a matter like so much
(19:16):
innovation had occurred at TALK, we can apply so much
of that to casual dining establishments to upscale casual. You
know I just talked about experiences. Well, I'm very fortunate
to have spent nine years at OLO, and now I
know a lot of restaurant tours at much larger chains
who can use the same exact concepts. They're probably not
(19:38):
going to do pre payment. That's very unique, I think
to you know, fine dining to a large extent, but
there are plenty of other features and products that Talk
already has. That's just a matter of marketing them to
a different segment in the restaurant industry.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Great, it's exciting.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Cool.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Let's talk a little bit more about fine dining, just
because I find it to be one of the more
interesting segments of the industry this year. I mean, we
spoke a couple of weeks ago, and I mentioned to
you it's hard to figure out where things are going
because ye of year comparisons are easing, but the consumer,
especially low end consumer, seems to be weakening. Fine dining
(20:17):
had a really bad year last year, and so they
have pretty easy year over year comps coming up. But
we haven't seen things really improve that much just yet.
So I guess, you know, if you could share any
trends that you're seeing with fine dining covers and check
sizes in that segment of the industry.
Speaker 3 (20:38):
Right now, we're seeing covers. Yeah. First of all, you're
right like, we're still suffering from post COVID comps a
little bit, you know, twenty three twenty four over twenty three,
I think will hopefully normalize. We are. We are seeing
cover count about the same in Q one as we
saw Q one twenty twenty five three. We have seen
(21:02):
a lot of variability and check size. We have seen
less interest in some of the supplements that are offered.
I talked before about you know, Cavea ourselves wine supplement
that has kind of going up and down certainly over
(21:22):
the last year and a quarter. And the year over
year comps for Q one are difficult to understand. And
I'm talking about sort of same store sales. I'm not
talking about new customers in twenty four over twenty three.
I'm talking about the exact same customer cohort. Now, the
problem is sometimes you know, dates change, or a number
(21:44):
of weekends in a you know, in a month. We
had leap year this year, which throw things off, throw
things off a little bit. Easter shift, Easter shift exactly.
So we feel that pretty acutely in the numbers that
we see come across the board. I will tell you though,
I think to your point a minute ago, like it's
so hard to read what's going on, and you see
(22:05):
the numbers from this week. So now the FED may
not be cutting this year, is what I read in
the journal, you know, like who knows, and you know,
Bloomberg's re pouring similar stuff, Like the numbers that are
coming across are really hard to figure out. I had
an exec at a well known chain come and speak
to the Talk team recently, and he was saying, I
(22:29):
was talking about sort of wine and caviar, people buying
that or not buying that. He said the same thing
in his chain. He said, it's not wine and caviar,
but it was hot peppers and cheese sauce. And they
saw a similar thing that people in twenty four and
in twenty three as well were just not spending on that.
(22:49):
So you know what's going on with income and you
know interest rates. I think consumers are across any category,
any demographic. You know, fine dining, I think you know
incomes over one hundred thousand dollars. You know, they're driving
a lot of revenue to the restaurant industry. I think
(23:11):
it's like sixty percent of the revenue the restaurant industry
is one hundred thousand dollars income and above. But I
think even that category is uncertain. What's going on right now?
So cover count generally the same average order value, average
check size, what however you want to call it. It's
it's really fluctuating very heavily right now. So I'm playing
(23:35):
a poor economist, so my apologies for that, but I
can't figure it out. I can't figure it out, and
so it's varied, and again like the holidays and easter
and leap year, that's just making it even harder to
figure out.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
Yeah, for sure. You know, I've been I've been saying it.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
It's very difficult to project and protict where things are going.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
That Ploomberg's you know what, you guys, what your economists
are are saying. But you know, it's it would be
a tough one, right how to try to predict the
rest of the year.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Yeah, the cover is being flat. I think that's a
good sign. I mean, I'm hopeful that the rise in
asset prices will support spending by people that making that
are making one hundred thousand.
Speaker 3 (24:17):
And talk about bitcoin.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
Bitcoin stuck at the Nasdaq s and P. I mean,
you know, at home, prices are still elevated, so inflation
has taken its toll, and inflation remains higher for longer.
In my opinion, I don't see how the Fed can
cut rates.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
But I think you're right about that. I mean, but
the Nasdaq, the Nasdaq is up, but if inflation stays high,
the Nasdaq will drop. H I mean, the Nasdaq is
a tech heavy index, and so you know tech is
hurt in a high interest rate environment. So maybe the
Nasdaq is artificially high right now.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
But it's been underperforming over the last few weeks, and
we've seen inflation. We've seen commodities outperform over the last.
Speaker 3 (25:01):
Yeah, commodities are outperforming, bitcoins outperforming with I'm gonna touch
with a ten foot poll. But you can't You still
can't use bitcoin in most restaurants, I know, and certainly
you can't use them on talk so not yet. But uh,
I'm I'm always nervous for our customers. Uh right now,
(25:22):
I see them. You know, in many ways, restaurant tours
are in their element only because you know, they're so
creative that they can. You know, if you maybe through COVID,
you're going to make it through this period. But you know,
I was talking to a consultant in the restaurant industry
here in New York the other day, and he was
saying his restaurant partners are are feeling it acutely right
(25:46):
now in New York too. So if it's bad here
in New York, you know it's bad in the US.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
Yeah, all right, let's switch gears a little bit. I'm
a big concert guy, So bots really pissed me off?
Speaker 3 (25:58):
Did I?
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Did? I hear right?
Speaker 2 (26:00):
People are now using bots to buy up reservations at
high end restaurants.
Speaker 3 (26:04):
Yeah, you heard right, But what what's the concert that
really pisses you off the most that you could you
got priced out of?
Speaker 2 (26:10):
Listen, man, I'll you know, I'm blessed. I have a
great job, you know, So I'll pay up. I'll pay up,
But you're always paying I'm always paying up. Recently, I
went to tool. I saw a tool and MSG and
I saw Run the Jewels nice uh in in the fall.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
They were both phenomenal.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
So yeah, I love concerts, man, and I'll pay it,
but it sucks for the regular consumer.
Speaker 3 (26:36):
It does suck. I mean, there is this it's it's
really it's infuriating for consumers and guests who want to
go to these restaurants and you know, folks published like
a top hundred list and you can't get into any
of them. It's really, really bad. We are fortunate to
work with some of the you know, highest demand restaurants
(26:58):
in the world, and you know, they they will drop
a reservation, let's say, on the first day of the month,
and it will be gone very quickly. You know, we
do our level best to you know, to make sure
that bots are not hitting talk. It is a constant
(27:20):
effort of our engineering team. We use our own tools
that we've created, we use third party tools that do
a wonderful job. But you know, Mike, sometimes a bot
can slip in there, or you know, just a regular
human who wants to who has no intent of going,
who just wants to try to resell something, which broadly speaking,
(27:42):
our restaurants really can't stand. And the reason they can't
stand it is, I mean, there are several reasons, but
number one, they want to know their guest, you know,
who's coming in the door. Tell me about Mike. Okay,
Mike's made the reservation. You know, I want to know
who Mike is. I want to know what he likes.
I want to know where he wants to sit. I
want to know what kind windy drinks. I want to
welcome him by name. I want to re welcome him
(28:04):
if he's a regular, you know, I want to you know,
bring something over to his table from chef because you know,
you know, I know Mike and he's always been great
to us, and like that is destroyed in this bot
and resale environment and that kind of hospitality, which is
what if certainly in the fine dining world they practice
every day they wake up out of bed for is
(28:26):
to have that kind of experience with their guests. They
hate that too. And by the way, the other idea
that you know someone's going to it's like your concert
tickets a tool someone's gonna you know, go and resell
it and charge a fortune for restaurants. Even in fine dining,
people have this idea that you know, when I talked
about sort of high income people, they do drive the
(28:48):
restaurant business. But it's not always high income people who
are going to these fine dining establishments. Oftentimes, you people
who are saving up for a long time to experience that,
and these resta runs want those guests coming in. They
don't want them to be pushed out of the restaurants
because someone's going to resell a ticket. So it's really
(29:10):
it's a bad thing for the industry for so many reasons,
and so we do our best. We work a lot
a lot on trying to stop this. You know, I
actually worked in the security software space for a long time,
and you know, it's it's a game of whack a mole,
and it's kind of a game of pushing the bots
to somewhere else, right, Like, don't attack us because we're
(29:33):
pretty good at this. Go find it somewhere else where
you can you know, you can attack. And that that's
the security software game, I think to a very large extent.
But we won't really rest on our laurels here because
you know what, the good damages the restaurant industry.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
Cool.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
Are you still seeing earlier reservations at dinner time?
Speaker 3 (29:52):
Yeah, we're seeing that for sure, Like we are definitely
seeing that. This is a I suppose you know, your
guess is probably bear in the mind, this is a
permanent byproduct of COVID that you know, we're seeing people
out of the cities still. You know, I see it
every day when I walk to the office in Manhattan
(30:13):
or Chicago where talk is based. Either way, it's just
not as populated as it was. And so therefore, if
people are coming into work, you know, they're coming in
generally Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, and you know, so a few things. One,
you want to get them before they go home if
they're commuting back to Jersey or Long Island, if they're
in New York. Two, it's the people who are working
(30:33):
from home in the cities who are finishing up early.
They're not commuting home. They're already in the city, and
so they're going to go and have an earlier meal. Well,
they don't have an hour and a half commune anymore. So,
for lots of reasons, meal time has changed. The six
pm the six pm reservation is way more difficult to
get than it used to be, and the nine pm
(30:55):
reservation may not even be something that a restaurant takes
any more. I mean, we absolutely have customers who, many
of them in big cities, who have stopped serving after
a certain time for several reasons. One is sort of
population density, commuter density has changed, and also crime is
(31:17):
going up in certain cities. So in the big cities
like Chicago and New York and others San Francisco, you know,
they're feeling that pretty acutely, and they are adjusting to
make sure that they are guests and their employees who
are closing up and then going out late, you know,
bring stuff out into the alleys and bringing the trash
(31:37):
like that is a more dangerous proposition that it used
to be in some places. So yeah, things have changed.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
Okay, how are how is staffing? Are they fully staffed yet?
In terms of the high.
Speaker 3 (31:51):
End, Irond's fully staffed, I mean the high end. Listen,
the turnover rate you know is significant in QSR casual dining.
You know, you walk into your favorite casual restaurant, Mike,
you know you're going to recognize the host or hostess
for a month or two and they're probably going to
(32:12):
switch over. You know, in the fine dining world, they
have folks who have worked there for years and in
some cases decades, and in some cases with the restaurant
tours or the chefs at multiple places. So it's it
is different. It is a it's more than just a
(32:32):
job there, It is a career for those folks. You
can feel it acutely and how they you know, how
they interact with you as you're if you're a guest
in these places. So staffing is you know, across the
restaurant industry, staffing is is a challenge. I'm very lucky
to be on the board of a company called seven Shifts,
(32:53):
which does scheduling for restaurants, and you know, we could
see it there. We serve you know, much more casual dining,
but also SMBs outside of casual and you know, no
doubt that across North America, staffing is an issue and
fine dining will always be less of an issue.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Great, are your customers in California feeling an impact from
the law raising the quick service minimum wage of twenty
dollars an hour. You know, we've written that we think
you know, the damage isn't going to be limited to
fast food because you know, people cooks and people that
work in the kitchen are going to want a spread
and assistant gms and tenured manager tenured employees and gms
(33:37):
are going to want to spread between a new employee
and what they're making. So you know, what are you hearing.
I guess from your fine dining customers.
Speaker 3 (33:45):
They're not feeling it yet. They feel it's coming. You know,
many of them pay you know, beyond that dum wage
of course, and you know, folks are salary. It can
vary greatly, but you know, as an industry, it's it's
it's going to be interesting and it's going to be
(34:08):
problematic and it's gonna you know, it's certainly going to
drive more innovation because you know, in the QSR world,
people will not be able to afford you know, this wage,
and that's an issue and the path for growth in
the restaurant industry, you know, oftentimes starts as a cashier
(34:30):
and a qs are and you know what this, what
this minimum wage law can do is eliminate, you know,
a traditional job for so many people. And it's such
a great way to grow and get into this incredible industry.
And you know, I don't know how the average restaurant
tour can survive some of these some of these changes
(34:53):
in the law. I mean, people think of these unfortunate
at all to have worked with some many of these
large chains. And people think of these large chains is
you know, massive companies, but typically they're a franchise or
franchise e. So a franchise e is a small business person.
The name may say McDonald's, but it's not McDonald's, you know,
(35:14):
it's like, you know, Mike and Matts is really the
company it's And so you know, I really fear for
what this will do, and it will change a lot.
The fine dining world will be changed less, no doubt
about that. But you know, long term, you know, if
(35:34):
you are choking off the entry point to people into
the industry, it will affect fine dining. You won't have
people who want to be in the restaurant industry because
plenty of people in fine dining start out, you know
as cashiers McDonald's.
Speaker 2 (35:49):
A lot of times they start as teenagers too, right,
and so like if it's twenty dollars an hour, you're
going to be less likely to give a teenager a shot, right.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
You got it? Like absolutely, I mean that's really problematic,
really really problematic. And you know, we don't have the
labor to fill some of these jobs. So you know,
the price is going up, labor force is choked off,
so technology is going to step in the middle of
some of this stuff. And you know, for better and
(36:17):
for worse, again, it's not gonna happen to fine dining.
You're not going to walk into the French laundry and
go to a kiosk to place. That's not going to happen. No, no, no,
it's not plus you know, you know the plus many
other types of restaurants. But you know that certainly will
happen almost everywhere else in California. And I really I
(36:39):
just think the downstream effects of a law like this
have not been carefully considered. You know, wages, you know,
the tax rolls from taxing payroll like like, I'm sure
there's some smart people in California. I'm not sure they
worked on this law.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
Yeah, it's going to be interesting to see.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
You know a lot of the companies we cover are
you know, just gonna build less stores, if any in California, right,
they're going to move to to low tax states and
lower wage states and where they they're going to have
you know, better ROI on their investment.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
Yeah. I think it's was not carefully considered. I get
the desire to do it for you know, the votes,
like so many other things the politicians do for the votes,
but the downstream effects the restaurant industry are gonna be
significant and for guests too, Like your choice will shrink
for sure, Yeah, and your prices will rise. It's already happened.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Yep.
Speaker 2 (37:38):
All right, let's talk about the restaurant tech industry a
little bit. How's the M and A market looking. Is
it showing any improvement in this rise in asset prices
that we've seen?
Speaker 3 (37:50):
Well, I think so, yes. We are seeing seeing deals
get done, certainly along the margins in the edges. I
think that will continue to occur, not just because of
the you know, sort of the economic issues, but because
of the sort of over availability of similar concepts. From
(38:13):
a technical perspective. Actually, I think Juwan on your podcast
did a great job, an amazing job, and that was
great conversation you guys had on just kind of the
sameness of so many of the solutions, very very hard
to distinguish between the technical players out there. We all,
(38:34):
I'm guilty of it. We are all using the same phraseology,
the same nomenclature always, you know, every sale, every tech
salesperson ever uses the same language, and it's it's extremely
frustrating for the operators, the restaurant tours, the owners, and
it's very hard for them to tell the differences, and
(38:57):
so oftentimes what you see is a flight to sort
of a single provider. And so the whole idea of
best of breed is going to go away if you
can't prove you're any different from anyone else. And if
I'm a restaurant tour and I'm not a technologist, you know,
(39:17):
and it's just easier for me to do a deal with,
you know, a point of sale provider, because they're going
to have point of sale and payments and labor scheduling
and reservations and it's one neck to choke. And oh,
by the way, because of wages, I can't really afford
a tech guy or gal anymore, and so I don't
(39:38):
really have someone, you know, I can't you know, maybe
can call my nephew or my niece and they know
something about technology, but that's really not a long term solution.
So there's this flight to sort of single neck to
choke that is problematic because that's not where the innovation happens.
And so for me, as sort of a best of
(39:59):
breed provider, it does give me pause and I think
that will also drive some of the consolidation that will
inevitably occur in twenty twenty four. There are too many
players out there, and consolidation has already happened a few.
We were lucky Tolo to get out into in the market.
Toast was able to get out. You know, some other
(40:19):
folks are out like door Dash as well. I don't see,
you know, certainly, depending what the FED does. IPO markets
have opened a little bit, y'all. I don't even know
who would be on the docket from a restaurant tech
perspective to get out right now. And if that doesn't happen,
depending on how long their investors have been in the companies,
then they're going to look for other exits and that's
(40:41):
going to look like M and A.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (40:43):
Yeah, I'd expect the public chains to be active because
there's that public pressure to you know, grow your TAM
and grow your customer base and all that.
Speaker 3 (40:55):
Oh for sure, you know, Yeah, I mean so from
a tech a restaurant tech perspective, see it from a
chain perspective, I'll see it as well. We'll see it
as well, no doubt we'll see private equity guys playing
a much larger role there. And some of that may
have to do with stuff like what's going on in California,
right because they're plenty of California based chains with let's
say thirty to one hundred locations that you know, private
(41:18):
equity may have to not have to may want to
go take over. Now, we may want to move that
concept somewhere else. So across the board restaurant tech, restaurants themselves,
this will be an interesting year. We saw some interesting
small deals recently, child Now just did one. Chill is
great company similar to Olo but serving SMBs based out
(41:40):
in La Their CEO Chris, just did a good deal there.
So we'll see, you know, marginal deals like that. I
mean marginal in a pejorative way, I mean smaller deals,
and you know, we'll see if there's you know, growth
beyond that. But certainly in terms of absolute number of
restaurant tech companies that will that will decline in twenty
(42:02):
twenty four.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Yeah, this is going to be a really interesting year
for restaurant tech, for the restaurant industry all around.
Speaker 1 (42:07):
And we have a front row seat, man, So.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
Yeah, for sure, you're do you do have an amazing
seat for sure, I'm just a participating but you you
have a much more interesting macro perspective than so many people. Yeah,
I'm jealous.
Speaker 1 (42:21):
Yeah, it's fun.
Speaker 3 (42:21):
Fortunately I get I get emails from you, and I
get to read those, and that's super helpful.
Speaker 1 (42:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:27):
Well, I'm glad they I'm glad they help. All Right,
let's just I got one last question, probably the most
important one of the pod.
Speaker 1 (42:35):
What's your favorite restaurants?
Speaker 2 (42:37):
I know you're your workout of you know, you're living
in New York and Chicago as well, so you have
one in each that you're willing to mention or are
you scared to, you know, piss off maybe some of
your Michelin starred customers.
Speaker 3 (42:50):
I have way more than Michelin starret customers. I have
Michelin Start James Beard, and I have regular old folks. Gosh,
I mean how that's like such a question, Mike. That's
so unfair, man.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
This is the least I could do for you talking
smack about my mix.
Speaker 3 (43:10):
That's true. I did. I did tweeted you and Juwan. Listen.
You should feel bad for me. You know, I grew
up in d CMO. Still a Wizards fans, possibly worse
favorite restaurants.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
Just give me a good meal recently, maybe an in
each city.
Speaker 1 (43:24):
Well let's do it that way.
Speaker 3 (43:26):
Okay, good meal in each city. That that's that's easy. Well,
I went to an amazing meal at a restaurant in
Chicago that's a top customer fortunately called Next. Next is
an a linear group restaurant. And I've given Nick a
lot of kudos before for founding Talk, But I've been
(43:48):
to Royster, which is amazing in the office, which is
an incredible bar, incredible bar. But I went to X
for the first time and that's where Talk really started.
And they did a Julia Child and you was just
like the food was out of this world. The service
was out of this world. But the experience, you know,
I talked about experiences, Like at one point they served
the beef bourgignon that Julia Child was famous for, and
(44:12):
they brought over like this vintage little TV and plopped
it on the table and it started to play like
an episode of her show. It was like brilliant, and
all the plating was on like her types of plates,
and you know, it's just again, the food was incredible,
(44:33):
but the experience and the way it was presented and
the way it was described and and you know her
books The Joy Cooking, the joy in which they took
and presenting. It was like it's special. I mean, that's
part of the fine dining world I never knew about,
like honestly, I mean, you know, I was more of
a booeyemonger's guy if you remember those Oh yeah, well exactly.
(44:55):
So a great sandwich shop in Georgetown that great sandwiches.
But the way that you know, the folks at Next
did you know, did this sort of meal and experience
and it's just like it was. It was just like breathtaking.
So I'm gonna I'm gonna shout out you know Next
(45:17):
the Linear Group and the spectacular experience I had there.
Speaker 1 (45:23):
Check there.
Speaker 3 (45:25):
When you're in Chicago. But New York so I live
out on Long Island. I mean, god, there's so many
great restaurants in the city. I I'm I have to
think about that. Well. I mean, we have a restaurant
up in a up in Westchester, Blue Hill at Stone
Barns Restaurant, which is yeah, I just like it's it's
(45:50):
a college of food. Like the smells and the the
feel of walking around and the the pride and what
they take for I was there once just for a meeting,
and I was getting a coffee as I was leaving
driving back to Long Island. You know, the person who's
serving the coffee didn't know who I was, didn't know
(46:10):
why it was there, but the way they described the coffee.
And then a guy walked in and the person behind
the counter said, oh, and this is the farmer that's
delivering the Milton I'm putting in your coffee. It's like, whoa,
this is incredible. So, yeah, there are some amazing places
out there. There really are, and I think, you know,
we need to continually do a better job at talk
(46:31):
at allowing those types of places to promote themselves better
to their guests and just give them more tools to
provide that sense of hospitality that you know, quite frankly,
you're not going to get at the bootymonger. It's a
very different world. And so we need to do a
great job of, you know, helping them, you know, promote
themselves and you know, get more guests in the door
(46:54):
more often to experience you know what I'm fortunate to
be able to experience from time to time.
Speaker 2 (47:00):
Man, I'm confident you'll be able to help them out.
I look forward to following the story and keep it
in touch.
Speaker 1 (47:06):
Man.
Speaker 2 (47:06):
I wish you a lot of luck. Where can the
audience go to find out more about Talk.
Speaker 3 (47:12):
Well, come to explore talk dot com or download our
app and visit all our restaurants wherever you are in
North America. We have an amazing number of wineries. If
you want to go to tastings from where I live
on Long Island to Napa and Sonoma and neverwhere in between.
And that's the place to go. And if you're a
restaurant you want to work with Talk, explore talk dot
(47:34):
com also, but backslash join that's where you go.
Speaker 1 (47:38):
And yeahs good stuff.
Speaker 2 (47:40):
Thanks again for doing this, Thank you Mike, good to
see you same and big thanks to the audience for
tuning in. If you liked the episode, please leave us
a rating and click the bell.
Speaker 1 (47:49):
If you'd like to subscribe.
Speaker 2 (47:50):
Check back soon for a conversation about restaurant m and
A with a. Sheesh Seth, the founder and managing director
of Harrington Park Advisors,
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