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October 6, 2023 52 mins

This week, in the wake of the Love Island drama, the girls discuss the phenomenon of becoming "soft" in relationships---what it means, what it looks like, and whether or not "its healthy." The girls then dive into the general idea of living the "soft life" and why it has become an aspirational trend after the pandemic.

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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Hello everyone. The heat wave has finally ended, thank god.

Speaker 2 (00:14):
But like it wasn't a heat wave because like a wave,
it was a heat sosunami. Yeah, like a wave insinuates
that it came and it went. It came in March,
and it's probably gonna come back tomorrow.

Speaker 3 (00:24):
So did you see what that un rep said about
global boiling?

Speaker 4 (00:29):
Oh you kind of ate you with that one.

Speaker 3 (00:30):
I'm not gonna lie if you're unfamiliar. Some un rep
came out and was like, global warming is over, global
boiling has begun. It was really ominous and I.

Speaker 1 (00:37):
Didn't like it.

Speaker 2 (00:39):
I was like, hmmm, yeah, I don't know, like it
did what it needed to do. But I keep forgetting
that I have long hair now, and I feltening like
brush against my arm and I like punched the air
and I realized it to my own hair.

Speaker 3 (00:50):
So I know, after I took my extensions out, I
just I feel like I'm grasping to play with something
that isn't there, Like I have phantom hair.

Speaker 2 (00:57):
Now, because like when I take my extensions out, I
feel like part of my head's missing because I'm used
to like the weight of it, because I have a
lot of extensions and they're like twenty five inches long.
So I'm like, my head feels like I gotta wait
on it, so I take it off. I'm like something's missing.

Speaker 3 (01:14):
I know, I'm literally so scarred by my last extension experience,
which I talked about last episode. But I think the
problem is is I just need to get it done
at a salon that specializes in like k tips or something,
and get like the best quality ones, fork up the money,
maybe asked for it for like Christmas or something, and
then go on from there.

Speaker 2 (01:31):
You know, yes, and it's like yes, no, I feel
you because like I got curly extensions and I keep
forgetting and I'm like, now me looking. I don't know
it's getting multiracial or something, but.

Speaker 4 (01:44):
It's so hot.

Speaker 2 (01:44):
They keep getting stuck to my neck and I'm like,
I don't have people do this, like get me my bob,
back my bob.

Speaker 3 (01:50):
Before we begin in anything that's actually notable or meeting
in this episode, I really want to talk about Love Island.
I understand not all of our listeners are watching Love
Island right now.

Speaker 4 (02:00):
You aren't.

Speaker 2 (02:00):
I'm personally judging you. Yeah, it's my personal duty as
a citizen of the world to personally make every person
a fan of the violand if you don't like it,
that means that you and I are not compatible as
people for sure.

Speaker 1 (02:12):
Not compatible as friends, not compatible.

Speaker 4 (02:13):
As human beings existing in the same universe.

Speaker 1 (02:16):
It is so good.

Speaker 3 (02:17):
Obviously right now we're on season ten because that's the
newest one. The finale is tonight. We're all very excited.
I still have a lot in catching up to do.
If you're a Love Island fan, you know what this is.
I just got to cast some more. If you don't
know what Love Island is, first of all, you have
to watch the UK version.

Speaker 1 (02:32):
If you watch any other version, you're doing it wrong.

Speaker 3 (02:33):
I think it goes in order of best to worst,
so I've heard, because I've never watched US or Australia.
I think it goes like UK, Australia and then US
in terms of like how entertaining it is, whatever, whatever.
And I don't know if it's just because like it's
their little accents, it's their a little banta, so they'll
chat like, I don't know what it is about Love
Island UK, but it is just the best reality TV

(02:54):
show I've ever watched.

Speaker 1 (02:55):
If you are looking for the.

Speaker 3 (02:56):
Best seasons to watch, I would recommend in this exact order,
season five, season three, and season ten good.

Speaker 2 (03:00):
Starting points because like the last they started doing like
winter and summer, like switch off seasons and whatever. But
actually serious, correct, I would literally say five, three, ten.

Speaker 4 (03:12):
Seven the best are the best seasons.

Speaker 2 (03:15):
But it just like it's funny because the Love Island
USA season just started and I watched it and I
was like, eh, I don't want to watch horny Americans
do their thing on teeth that I could walk out
and touch grass and see that happen, So why would
I want to see that on my television. I want
the Brits, I want the language, I want the accents,
I want the vibe. And I think what I've really
learned these last few weeks of watching The Islands that

(03:37):
I need to move to the UK for a little
bit and then I'll come back wife it up.

Speaker 1 (03:41):
These men are really attractive that they're bringing on this season.

Speaker 2 (03:44):
And they're like and sometimes other seasons I've been like, Okay,
let's go back to the drawing board and bring someone
else back. But it's also like weird that we're at
that age now where like when I used to watch
it when I was younger, Like they were so much
older than me that I was like, I don't get
why they're acting so crazy, But like now have the
cast is younger than me andry Me and Sarah, and
I'm like, I get it because if you had to

(04:06):
date that in the wild, what would you be doing?
But it is the only reality TV show that I like,
and it's just so good.

Speaker 1 (04:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (04:13):
Some girl came in this season from Casa More. She
was like nineteen years old.

Speaker 2 (04:19):
That was like she started college last like last fall.
She's supposed to be on the last season and she
was like, no, he's moving into my dorm. And everyone's like,
why is she acting like that and crying every episode?
And I'm like, cause she's a child, she's a teenager.
She wasn't legally allowed to hold a battle of alcohol
until this year, and mind you, in America, she wouldn't
be able to another three years, and they drink all

(04:39):
day every day on this show. Of course she's crying
every day because she doesn't know what's going on.

Speaker 3 (04:43):
Yeah, I feel so bad. Also, she's like not very
close to any of the other cast members.

Speaker 2 (04:47):
No, she's not close to the single person on that
show and doesn't get close to any of those I'm.

Speaker 1 (04:51):
Like, no, no, I feel so bad. And then like, well,
I mean sometimes it makes.

Speaker 3 (04:56):
Sense though, because you have these cats. I don't know
if this is just like a British thing, but you
have some of these cast members on there. Like just
perfect example, she is twenty one years old. She is
a full two years younger than you and me almost
because my twenty third birthday is in like a week
and yeah, just plugging in my Leo Leo season. But
she looks like she's thirty five years old. She looks
not like in a bad way, it's really really mature.

(05:18):
She's super tall, like she has all this botox, like
in that kind of way.

Speaker 1 (05:22):
She looks like she's thirty.

Speaker 3 (05:23):
Five, you know what I mean. I don't mean that
as an insult, just like it's objectively true. She looks
like she's thirty five years old. She's literally just forty one.

Speaker 2 (05:30):
I have like a really big fear of like, oh,
I definitely will get past the surgery at some point
in my life, and not talking like major surgery and
talking about.

Speaker 1 (05:36):
Like okay, like my jaw done.

Speaker 2 (05:38):
Yeah, Like actually I don't really know because you know,
black done crack an Asian no reason. So like I
got a good odd playing for me. But maybe you'll
get like a little botox or something, just like you know,
little mommy makeover or whatever. Sorry, i'smronging with my mother.

Speaker 4 (05:53):
I'll get that of your mother.

Speaker 2 (05:54):
I get it, Okay, Okay, but it's crazy, Like that's
part of so like ingrained in the culture. I think
obviously in the UK, but I think also in the
US as well, is that like so many of my
friends were getting like lip flips and lip filler and
their boobs done as a senior in high school eighteen
years old. And like I'm all for like, if you

(06:14):
want to change something, to do it. Like I'm the
biggest advocate of plastic surgery. Like, if you want to
change it, do it. As long as you're going to
like an accredited person who has a good reputation and
like is not gonna give you like health issues.

Speaker 4 (06:26):
From doing it, I'm all for it. And once you're
transparent about it.

Speaker 3 (06:29):
I was just about to say, especially if you're a celebrity,
you have to be transparent about it because then you're
just so part of the problem. You're setting these unrealistic
beauty standards that no one can achieve unless you have
butloads of money like you do.

Speaker 2 (06:40):
Like Kylie Jenner single handedly popularized lip fillers and lip
injections for girls in the US, like by herself, hands down,
And it's crazy to me because like in my brain,
I don't get how lippiller works, because like I think
about it and I watch the videos and I'm like,
do your lips just like expand, Like the skin really

(07:00):
scares me. But I'm all for plack of surgery. But
it's just like as long as you're transparent about it.
And I think that's one thing I love about Love
Island is that everyone who goes on that show ends
up being an influencer. Like that's just like the model
of being Love Island contestant in twenty twenty three, Like
that's just how it works. And almost every single girl
on that show is under the age of twenty five
and has heavy passive surgery and they don't really ever

(07:21):
talk about it. But I will say I do credit
Molly May because like she's probably the most famous person
that's been on Love Island ever. She's like Lily a
millionaire now from it, and she has like an entire
series on YouTube about how she felt so much pressure
to get like her lips done, her cheek's done, filler,
done whatever at so young, like in her like nineteen

(07:42):
twenty twenty one because it was so popular in culture
and like she's going to Love Island and like that's
what people do, and she got all of it dissolved
after the show, and she like takes you through process
of like how that happens, like what it looks like,
is it hurt, et cetera.

Speaker 4 (07:54):
So like I.

Speaker 2 (07:55):
Appreciate her being so transparent and like I don't say candorous,
it's not a word candor candid.

Speaker 4 (08:01):
Yes, I'm worried about her process.

Speaker 2 (08:03):
I think that that's what girls need to see, is
that like people do do this stuff, they do get
things changed, but you don't have to like that it's
not real, you know. So I feel like if I
was in like sixth or seventh grade right now with
TikTok Girl, I was already insecure with like having Tumblr,
because like that was when like the leg gap or
big gap was like the big thing. I can imagine

(08:23):
having like an entire app dedicated to like unrealistic beauty standards.
And like having to navigate like not being the European
beauty standard but also realizing that like that's not real.

Speaker 3 (08:34):
For me, it was like Tumblr and wapad because those
POV stories would start.

Speaker 1 (08:38):
He ran my he ran his hands through.

Speaker 3 (08:40):
My beautiful hair, and like ran his fingers down my waist,
which is as skinny as a twig.

Speaker 1 (08:46):
Just like stuff like that.

Speaker 2 (08:47):
You know that. Imagine reading that as like because some
of them were like they call them whyan stories, like yeah,
answer your name here. Imagine being like a twelve year
old black girl who's obsessed with one direction, and every
single story was I put my long blonde with your
nett low shadow roots hair into a messy amount.

Speaker 4 (09:05):
I just looked into my.

Speaker 2 (09:06):
Blue orbs and I'm like, okay, well you lost me there,
you know, and you wrote.

Speaker 3 (09:11):
Me this is actually really funny because in the fanfic
you wrote, you describe yourself, not how you look at all.

Speaker 2 (09:18):
Right, yeah right, because I know that, like that's what
we get. Yeah, because I know what would get into
because like, think about this, I think it translates in
a lot of different contexts. And I knew this from
a very young age as a black girl. I follow
a bunch of white influencers, probably the majority. Off I
follow our white influencer just because like that's what comes up.

Speaker 4 (09:36):
On my page.

Speaker 2 (09:37):
Of course I make a conscious effort to follow all
black creators. Is like, obviously we have the same skin tone,
we have the same like makeup interest, we have the
same like body types, whatever, so I obviously connect with
them more. But like all of my like Outo for example,
all my black friends follow her. That's just like what
it is. That's just like she's.

Speaker 4 (09:53):
Pop or whatever.

Speaker 2 (09:55):
Like all of the really big black creators that we follow,
none of my white friends follow. And it's not it's
like a bad thing, but it's like I think that
black girls have been assimilated or kind of forced to
assimilate to realize that, like that's what's popular if you
want to know the trend at fall of those girls,
that's never happened in reverse, Like I would take be
the advice from a white girl, but so might not
take that from a black girl. And it's a weird

(10:17):
way that that's like transpired. But I think the same
thing with like reading stories, Like almost every romance novel
I read, I know the main character is white. You
don't mention it because on the cover she will be white.
I've already had to like make my brain realize, like, Okay,
if I read this book in my perspective, she's going
to be a black girl. But like, if there's a
novel where the main character is black, it's more likely
that people aren't going to buy it unless they're black.

(10:38):
So I think I've noticed that from a very young age,
and that's why I did that.

Speaker 3 (10:41):
Yeah, that's really sad that it was so ingrained in
you at such a young age as well, obviously, but
I know we have to not to like change topics.
But miss miss Tammy, miss miss mother of.

Speaker 1 (10:58):
The mothers, has I trusted that there? Yeah, Sidney's mother.

Speaker 3 (11:01):
Sorry, I should have spent time, needs something to be
done in this podcast episode.

Speaker 1 (11:06):
So if you're listening with Tammy, this one's for you.

Speaker 2 (11:09):
I often forget that my parents listen to this podcast.

Speaker 4 (11:13):
So I do speak open and freely.

Speaker 2 (11:15):
And before I issued this reaction that my mother has
now forced me to post, she lily called me and
was like, Sidney Jordan Winter, like, get on that podcast
right now and apologize to me. So I'm gonna preface
it with this this is what I said was true.
That's how I took it because and I would read
it word for a word, but I appreciate the leading
our messages for storage purposes. But I was just saying

(11:37):
how frustrated I was in I grouped out with my
mom and my sister that like, I feel like there's
are no good men left, Like I feel like no
matter what, like in terms of dating, I have to
give up one of my like hard requirements. So I
can't find a guy who's like, you know, tall, attractive,
has a good job, is educated, supports me, and like
doesn't feel masculated by me wanting to be ambitious, Like

(12:00):
I haven't found a guy that marks off all of
those things. And my mom was like sometimes, and this
is verbagana what she said, it's time you have to
take a guy who's a seven and make him a
tin on your own, like you have to add to him.
And I was like, Mom, I'm not a charity. I'm
not a nonprofit organization, a five oh one c three
government funded organization, Like I am not going to take

(12:21):
a man and build him. I'm not. I'm no interest
in doing that, Like I'm not building a boyfriend. So
we had like a debate about it. I took that
as a seven, meaning like he's lacking qualities that I want.

Speaker 4 (12:34):
I'm not talking about style.

Speaker 2 (12:35):
And I mean like maybe he's short, or he's a
little bit broke and I act to be the one
to help him reach his potential.

Speaker 4 (12:42):
Or a little bit disloyal or like I'm not a
life coach.

Speaker 2 (12:45):
Yeah, my mom claims that she meants it as like
maybe he has a great job. He's a doctor, but
he's in jests very well and wear his glasses, and
like I show him contacts and like give him good style.
I'm gonna do that regardless because I know it can
elevate them. What I but like, I have such hard
requirements that you need to meet for to be like
in a relationship with me. So I took the message

(13:09):
differently than my mom intended it, and she thinks I
made her sound crazy. So she wants you to claim
that she meant like style, elevate their style, make them
like have more swagger, is what she claimed to say.
So sorry, mom for a turfating. That's wrong, but that's
how I took it.

Speaker 3 (13:25):
I just remember the other day being in a New
ber on the way to my boyfriend's house and I'm
just going through Times Square, which is a ridiculous place
for this, and uh, I got a call from Sydney's
mom and she's like, Sarah, I have a bone to
pick with my daughter.

Speaker 1 (13:38):
And I was like, oh my god. She was like,
I was listening to the podcast and she'd describe the situation.
So she said, you make sure she apologizes to me.

Speaker 4 (13:45):
I was like, oh, oh goodness, I don't think any
remembers outside you.

Speaker 1 (13:48):
But that's so funny.

Speaker 3 (13:50):
I was laughing so hard.

Speaker 1 (13:53):
Yeah, she was very passionate about it.

Speaker 3 (13:55):
So, Okay, now that that is over with, Now that
that is done, we love you, miss Tammy. You are
the official mom with the podcast along as mine. And
that's moving on the the true dead mother of the
body of crying in public Oing. Okay, what is the
topic of this episode?

Speaker 4 (14:14):
I forgot being soft?

Speaker 2 (14:16):
Okay, So this topic kind of comes from Love Island
because there is the best character on the show this season.
Her name is Whitney. And the reason why I like
her is because I know I'd be friends with her
if I met her like outside. But also I feel
like we have similar personality traits in the sense that, like,
we have very big personalities, like we're very vocal about

(14:39):
our opinions. We're both ambitious and like business women, so
like I relate to her as that also like being
a black woman. And everyone on the show has a
bone and pick with her about her being book about
her opinion. Mind you everyone is that's the way they're
in a villa for twenty four hours a day, of course,
people are going to talk about their opinions. And so
she meets this guy and all the girls are sudden

(15:00):
like I love the change, like he's made for you,
like he's making you soft. And for some reason that
like really really bothered me because my friend said the
same thing about me, and my last like little tryst
is that I was like becoming soft because I was
like sending him emojis and like being mushy, gushy, and like,
I guess, yeah, it's soft. But I started thinking more

(15:22):
about like that word in the context of women in general,
because like there was a whole trend last year where
girls are like I want the soft life, which is
like fine because it's in a different context, but I
think this whole thing of like wanting women to quote
unquote embrace their softness at the same time using softness
as the derogatory word for a man, like why you
so soft? I hate that, Like women can't just like

(15:44):
be happy relationship, while I have to be soft in
order to show that, like you're with the right partner,
you know.

Speaker 4 (15:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (15:49):
Also it's like, why are you soft in a relationship?
And you can't be soft in other aspects as well.
It's like what you were talking about the soft girl
life trend involves.

Speaker 1 (15:58):
Going on six am walks and just having a very
peaceful lifestyle.

Speaker 3 (16:03):
So it's very weird how that's often compared to relationships
as well, because it's like, when you're in a relationship, Yeah,
of course you are going to be more romantic towards
that person. Why does that mean that you're soft? It
kind of reminds me of how how we say to men,
like you're being a P word when that is used
to describe female genitalia, if that makes sense, Like I
don't know why that reminds me of like the whole thing.

(16:24):
Or it's like if you're being abrasive an asshole, you're like, oh.

Speaker 1 (16:28):
You're being a dick right now? Do you know what
I mean, it's like it's very very.

Speaker 3 (16:32):
Controversial, and like not not controversial, it's very very contradictory,
like opposite whatever.

Speaker 2 (16:37):
Let me give birth through there. So I'm like, yeah,
so why didn't actually afflicts it? So, like what are
you comparing it.

Speaker 1 (16:43):
To human life? I mean, when you get kicked in
the balls, what do you do? You cry? You like
get on the ground.

Speaker 3 (16:47):
You literally cannot function for the next hour and a
half of your life. But women can birth children the
size of foraging by your hydrants out of their vaginas.
Yet that like human life is literally created inside a woman.
Yet that is what is used to describe people who
are being soft.

Speaker 2 (17:04):
And I think it's funny, like in like sixteen fifty,
like some man's in a fight and he was like,
you are a vagina, and like the whole saloon was
like whoa.

Speaker 1 (17:13):
The saloon and then people stopped shooting each other.

Speaker 2 (17:17):
And that's how I imagine that like phrase came to be.
But like I'm not even kidding, Like dictionary dot com
is that the leading person dictionaries?

Speaker 4 (17:24):
I don't really know.

Speaker 2 (17:25):
They got the website titles, so I guess they're like
good whatever. Yeah, yeah, they define soft girl as soft
girl is a fashion style popular among young women on
social media, based on deliberately cute and feminine look. It
often features pink and yellow colors, floral and heart patterns,
oversized sweaters and plaid skirts, and heavy blush makeup. Being

(17:48):
a soft girl may also involve a tender, sweet, and
vulnerable personality. So you like pink? What happened to being soft?
Because I think it also insinuates it if you aren't
like that, you're hard And I'm like, like, I will say,
like I subscribe to idea like I want to soft
life in sense that like I don't want undue stress
or burdens or like to spend like my whole life fighting,

(18:10):
and like like I just want to be able to
relax for a long period of my life Like that
I subscribe to. But I think that like being called
soft in relation to a relationship with the man, I
think it undercuts the fact that like I'm also strong.
I've been through a lot, I healed from trauma, like
all this stuff, I feel like it negates all of
that because I'm happy for the first time, Like, why

(18:31):
do I have to be considered like weak or soft
or like overly vulnerable because I'm like wanting to get
like past that part of my life.

Speaker 1 (18:39):
Yeah, And I feel that it's often.

Speaker 3 (18:44):
Revered in women to be soft in that way towards relationships,
but it's often ridiculed when it's directed at men who
are in relationships.

Speaker 1 (18:52):
You know, with the word whipped, you're like, oh my god,
I just got you whipped, Like you want to spend
your weekend with her? Oh, like you're so boring.

Speaker 3 (18:59):
You're not for the You're not for the men anymore,
Like no, no, no, you know, it's it's so crazy, how
it's literally nuts. And I have been in I think
four relationships in total, including the one that I'm in,
and in every single one, my boyfriend's guy friends have
had something to say about him being whipped or soft
or whatever, you know, when he wants to just hang
out with me one day week So weird. I think

(19:21):
that is such weird behavior. I think that's fangirl behavior.
I think that's jealous behavior. I think you're insecure about
like your relationships or you can't get any I just
I really do think.

Speaker 1 (19:30):
It's more of an insecurity thing than anything.

Speaker 3 (19:32):
But it is coming across in a really derogatory way
towards women in general as well.

Speaker 2 (19:38):
I think, especially me and Sarah's talking about this a
little bit earlier. Is that Okay, for example, like there
are two people on Love Island with like very similar
personalities in some aspects. Like Whitney, who I was talking
about earlier, is like obviously a black girl. She's like outspoken,
she's vocal, she's opinionated.

Speaker 1 (19:58):
Whatever are you going to compare with Mall because Molly's
really outsped.

Speaker 4 (20:02):
He started on Molly, She's so nice? Okay?

Speaker 2 (20:04):
With Tyreek, oh, I was like, oh, I can't stand him.
He is like the ring leader of the men. Like
the men will literally ask him for permission to like
kiss a girl. I'm like, see your father.

Speaker 1 (20:14):
And then they'll do it. They'll do it ever he tells.

Speaker 2 (20:16):
He'll be like kiss that girl and be like okay,
I'm like, is he You're literally the leader of the scouts.

Speaker 1 (20:21):
Like is your dead father?

Speaker 2 (20:23):
And I've seen so many people, mostly non black women,
on Twitter like drag Whitney and calling her angry and
all this stuff. So then like the fact that now
that she's what someone she's happy with and like she's
not necessarily quieter. I think she spends more time with
her couple than like other couples. People are like, oh,
now she's getting soft, like she's finally been like tamed

(20:44):
by her man.

Speaker 4 (20:45):
Is she a lion?

Speaker 3 (20:46):
Like?

Speaker 2 (20:47):
And it has to in my head, I think it
plays into like some notion of her being like a
quote unquote angry black woman because like watching like non
black women on podcasts like debanning her behavior and being like,
I'm so glad she's spent now, like the man put
her in her place, like all this stuff, and I
think about like how it's being used for me in

(21:07):
the same context, and it really bothers me. I don't
know what it is. So it's my mission to literally
like yell everyone on Twitter, and I'm like, that's not.

Speaker 1 (21:14):
The I know.

Speaker 3 (21:16):
I feel like we talk about things that are going
on in Twitter in every podcast episode. But I think
it's good because Twitter is where most people are most opinionated.

Speaker 1 (21:24):
I feel it.

Speaker 3 (21:24):
Because everyone goes on TikTok to fuck around, everybody goes
on Instagram to look pretty, but people go on Twitter
to state their opinion constantly.

Speaker 1 (21:30):
So I think that's it's good you bring that up.

Speaker 3 (21:34):
Yeah, with the whole thing with like just in general
being like oh my god, for both men and women's like, oh,
you're being tamed by your relationship, or like.

Speaker 1 (21:44):
Your relationship has changed you.

Speaker 3 (21:46):
I first of all, I don't think that a relationship
should ever change who you are as a person, and
I don't think that that's what's.

Speaker 1 (21:51):
Happening on Love Island.

Speaker 3 (21:52):
The fact that I think people are thinking that is
also where another problem lies. It's like, not only are
they being like, oh my god, you're you're being calmed
down by your boyfriend, which is some in general, like
even if it was true, that's controversial, but it's not true.

Speaker 4 (22:03):
You know.

Speaker 3 (22:03):
It's like I in my I've I know I'm a
little bit behind on Love Island, but I've seen Whitney
with her man like for a couple episodes now, and
I don't really think she's changed that much at all.
Like I don't know where people are getting this from,
and I think the fact that they're being drawn to
this conclusion is messy in itself, Like, first of all,
why does she need to be calmed down? I Thinkney's

(22:25):
the best character on the show or best cast member
that is not character. And also, like I just think
that it's so expected for like women to have a
boyfriend and then stay home all the time, become homebodies,
like change who they are like for this man. And
because that is such an expected, like standard, I think
people just start to see what they want to see.
Same with men, except just in a different way, Like

(22:46):
that's revered with women and with.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
Men it's kind of ridicule.

Speaker 3 (22:48):
It's like men see their guys wanting to spend more
time with their girls, wanting to cook them dinner and
do like household chords for them, stuff like that, stuff
that would usually traditionally.

Speaker 1 (22:56):
Be considered like the women's job or the women's role.

Speaker 3 (22:59):
They see men doing stuff like that because hello, we're
in twenty twenty three, and they get all mad and
they make fun of him, and it's just really it's
not cool.

Speaker 2 (23:05):
And that like brings you to two other points, also
loviv and related, is that in the past, the couple
who wins has always been a girl who's been loyal
to the guy for the entire like ten weeks of
the show or eight weeks of the show, with a
guy who was like a player at first, and like God,
with all these different girls had all these different couples

(23:26):
and then was changed and changed. It's like this arc
of like playboy to loyal boy or whatever. But whenever
they're like genuinely nice guys on the show, the first
thing I see is, Oh, he's a simp.

Speaker 4 (23:38):
He doesn't really like her, Like he's so soft? Is
he gay?

Speaker 2 (23:41):
Like all this stuff? And I'm like, why have we
associated like good behavior or like being a good partner
to being weak, Like I don't care if a man's
a simp, he should be you should be obsessed with me.

Speaker 1 (23:52):
Actually, So that's what Whitney says.

Speaker 2 (23:54):
Like why would I want to be with a man
who's mean to me? And the fact that we've regularized regularize,
we normalize like men treating us like crap as like
them actually wanting us, And that goes back so far,
Like think about when we're like four or five and
our moms are like, oh, is he being mean to
you on the playground?

Speaker 4 (24:11):
That means he likes you. Why are men like conditioned.

Speaker 2 (24:13):
To use like violence and meanness and nastiness as a
way to convey that they like someone. I'm good, be
nice to me, I will say. And it's a toxic
thing that like I am attracted to guys who like
I have to chase a little bit, or like who
are very like back and forth with me.

Speaker 4 (24:28):
That's because of what I'm used to.

Speaker 2 (24:30):
So I'm like, once I get out of that like pattern,
when I tell you, I want something so normal and easy,
I don't have to fight every week.

Speaker 4 (24:36):
To like get your attention or stay with you.

Speaker 3 (24:40):
It all starts in the third grade when a little
boy chases you around the playground. You go home crying
because you like pushed you face first in the dirt,
and your mom's like, oh my god, that means he
use a crush on you. Like what are you even
kind of out like it's so crazy because not only
do women look for that kind of what is it
not derogatory? But it's it's not, That's not the word
I'm talking about. It's like, what is it when you

(25:03):
have like a blank sense.

Speaker 4 (25:04):
Of humor like crass?

Speaker 1 (25:07):
Yeah, but it's like a it's like a degrading sense
of humor, like you're making funny yourself. Oh, self degradation,
self deprecation.

Speaker 4 (25:14):
What did we say, degradation?

Speaker 1 (25:15):
Degradation like degrading.

Speaker 3 (25:17):
Yeah, or just like a self yeah, self decorative sense
of humor just either.

Speaker 1 (25:21):
One of those words I guess can apply.

Speaker 3 (25:23):
Some relationships are like that as well, and they can
get really like physically. Play fighting for example, can go
away too far, and like words can get a little
heated or just you know what I mean. Like men
think they can kind of push you around because that's
what they've been taught to do, that's what's been normalized.
And I sort of God, all starts in the there,
and I feel like this is such a unionized experience.

Speaker 1 (25:42):
This happened to every single woman I've ever met in
my entire life.

Speaker 3 (25:45):
It's like we get really upset that our crush or
that a boy chased us around the playground and like
pushed us or like even got physical with us, or
as being mean to us, and our parents were like, Oh.

Speaker 1 (25:55):
My god, don't worry.

Speaker 2 (25:56):
That means he likes you.

Speaker 1 (25:57):
That's so what are you talking about? Yeah, I'm like
a little crush.

Speaker 2 (26:00):
Well maybe well in Matthew is a little psychopathic. Yes,
why are you pushing girls head in the dirt for fun? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (26:05):
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3 (26:07):
It all begins there and then yeah, I don't know,
I just think that and I don't think like I
think It has a lot to do with how men
are brought up in a lot of cases because we
were raised Sidney and I are both twenty three, we
have been raised by this generation where this behavior is extremely,

(26:28):
extremely extremely normalized. And so while we are working to
completely deconstruct those boundaries and those like stereotypes that are
just not so good and that's not how you should
build a relationship. While we work to, you know, kind
of deconstruct those, it's really sad because it is always
in the back of our mind, like he mean to
me because he likes me, which makes zero.

Speaker 2 (26:48):
Sense, and like I'm going back to like attachment styles,
I'm anxious avoidant or like I'm kind of always waiting
for the shoe to drop for me to leave relationship
because like I'm scared it's.

Speaker 4 (26:58):
Going to happen.

Speaker 2 (26:59):
It's not like an is it going to happen? But
when is it going to happen? So I'm never going
to be that girl that's like soft and in love
and happy and like picking out daisies and those things
that you blow dandelions.

Speaker 1 (27:10):
Guess what I have anxiety?

Speaker 4 (27:11):
Yeah, Like I have chronic anxiety.

Speaker 2 (27:13):
I'm not getting rid of that once I meet someone
that like will give me attention, So I hate that
that's like considered to the standard right now. And also
like I hate this thing that TikTok has where like
they feel the need to name everything like Latte Girl,
Ooh Girl, au Girl, clean Girl, Fisco Girl, clean girl girl,
you stick your hair back with Joe?

Speaker 4 (27:33):
What have they do with being clean?

Speaker 2 (27:35):
So this need to categorize and name everything, And honestly,
the things that they're naming are all the same clean Girl,
soft Girl, Visco Girl, Like those are all the same.

Speaker 4 (27:44):
Thing.

Speaker 2 (27:44):
I hate that, like you have to be categorized as something,
but I think it just leads to further like insecurities
about like why am I not this way? Why am
I not seen as like a clean aesthetic, et cetera.

Speaker 3 (27:54):
I feel like it's also obviously guys have categories two
that they're placed in, but I feel like it's so prominent,
specifically on social media to do that with women, to
totally just place them in categories, Like even I've noticed that,
Like I feel like in the LGBTQ community, gay men
only have two categories really that you could fit in.
Essentially women have like fourteen thousand you know, like oh,

(28:14):
the mask lesbian or like the whatever. You know, it's
like literally fourteen categories. And I don't know whether or not,
like we do it to ourselves or the outside world
does it to us. But it is just really it
feels like I have a perfect place to be and
if I'm not there at all times, then I'm not
succeeding as a woman, or my femininity is not up
to par. It's just always this like pedestal you're trying

(28:35):
to climb and put yourself on.

Speaker 1 (28:36):
Everybody, go watch the Barbie movie right now.

Speaker 3 (28:38):
It's like this place where I'm constantly trying to climb
to get to but society standards are always just out
of reach, because that's society.

Speaker 4 (28:48):
For you, you know.

Speaker 1 (28:48):
We want everybody to be something that we can never
have in real life. It's true, especially with women.

Speaker 2 (28:55):
And it's like the people that hated Barbie, we already
talk about this. I'll make it brief.

Speaker 4 (29:00):
Yeah, they were like, it's a man hating movies.

Speaker 2 (29:04):
And I'm kind of like you missed the whole point
because there's a literally an entire scene where Barbie was
talking to Ken and she was like, I don't want
to be with you right now, because right now your
identity is tied to me, and you're being held down
in two ways, one by like you thinking that like
you only and Ken like attached to Barbie as a boyfriend,

(29:25):
but also that like you guys are all behold into
like these stereotypical ideas of what men are supposed to be,
like riding horses and mocho dojo, casta house and all
this stuff, like find out who you are outside of
those labels. And he was like what, I was like,
it just went all it went straight over all of
the men's head.

Speaker 4 (29:40):
I think so.

Speaker 2 (29:41):
But for me, I thought that was just as powerful
as like the mom's what she realizes, like, oh, patriarchy whatever.

Speaker 1 (29:45):
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3 (29:46):
I also thought that the part that I really liked
best in the Barbie movie actually happened really early on,
like before she learned all over lessons and before.

Speaker 1 (29:53):
Ken did too.

Speaker 3 (29:54):
But one thing that I really liked that Barbie did
was Ken was like, and it wasn't supposed to be
a funny bit, but it's the thing she said afterwards
that stuck with me. She was like, she was like, oh,
you know nothing, but just going on with me tonight
I'm just throwing like a bespoke party with all of
the other.

Speaker 1 (30:08):
Barbie's and choreograph dances and choreograph dances whatever.

Speaker 3 (30:10):
And then Ken is like, awesome, can I come over?
She's like sure, it's like Barbie, can I stay the night?

Speaker 2 (30:15):
Just like why?

Speaker 1 (30:16):
And he goes because her boyfriend girlfriend, she goes to
do what.

Speaker 3 (30:19):
He's like, I don't really know, but I want to
come over anyway, Like can I can I stay after
the party?

Speaker 4 (30:23):
She was like no.

Speaker 3 (30:25):
He was like why, Like there had to be a reason.
She was like because I don't want you to, and
then turn around and walked away.

Speaker 4 (30:29):
And I love that.

Speaker 1 (30:30):
I love that for her.

Speaker 3 (30:31):
Oh it was so good, such a great such a
great line, and such a great movie. Because we as women,
I feel like, are also expected to always give a
reason and exploray, No, I went.

Speaker 4 (30:42):
On my period for like six months.

Speaker 2 (30:43):
Yeah, but like I tell like, actually, I mean that's
why I say. I'd be like, wow, sorry, I thought
you met you literally were on your period. I was like, like,
it's crazy me that, like I can't go on a
date and just and like expect to go home and
be fine with that, Like I don't have to like
crack just an excuse and the uber right over there,
because I don't want to do that on the first date,
you know, so I hate that that's like expected. But

(31:05):
also like if I say, like June leants, I don't
want to I'm on period, They're like, well, like this
are complaining and like trying to convince me otherwise, And
I'm like, take no as no. I think that, Like
I like that we're teaching that in schools now or
like in sex ed like no means no, but we
really need to do is say that, like no doesn't

(31:27):
just me no, Like no can also be said in
ways like I'm not feeling well tonight, or like I'm
not comfortable doing this or like maybe let's not Like
it might not be seen as like or given as
a hard no, but it still means no. Yeah. I
think that's the reason why there's so much like blurring
between men being like, oh, I didn't do anything to her,
I just convinced her.

Speaker 4 (31:44):
If you have to convince like, it's a no.

Speaker 3 (31:47):
Yeah, And if it's not an enthusiastic yes, it is
a no. Also if it's not an answer, if there's
no answer, that means no. Does that you know, and
I like that too. I completely agree, but I think
that culture is ridiculous and two things.

Speaker 1 (32:00):
It's one to add to your point.

Speaker 3 (32:02):
It's so funny, how like if Sydney and I are
in a really bad day that we want to get
out of, like both of them, we were single pringles,
we would literally text each other under the table, call
me saying, you're throwing up on the side of the
street and have to come get you. Do you know
we would have to come up with this elaborate excuse
just to save someone's ego. But mostly most of the
time it's not just to save a man's ego. It's
to save ourselves physically, you know, because it's like if

(32:24):
you directly tell a guy no, even at a club,
Like if a guy in a club ask for your
number and he's like seven feet tall, saying no to
him could actually put you in physical danger.

Speaker 1 (32:32):
Hi, I would know, do you know what I mean?

Speaker 3 (32:33):
It's like, as a woman in New York City, we
have all you know, they say, it's not all memnbod,
it is all women, Like we've all been through that
experience where we've tried to be like it's not going
to happen and we've either we've just gotten a negative
outcome out of a situation, whether it's like assaul or whatever.
But another thing is that I don't like how when
you do give that excuse, sometimes that is not even enough.

(32:55):
That's why it's like saying no, I don't find you
attractive directly to someone's face doesn't work out the time
because you know what else doesn't work at the time.

Speaker 1 (33:02):
I have a boyfriend, I have a husband. I don't
swing that way.

Speaker 3 (33:05):
I can't understand you right now, I'm hanging out with
my girlfriends. Like half the time, the excuse doesn't even
work when you're trying to like maintain your safety.

Speaker 1 (33:13):
So why would no work? You know that might make
them even angrier.

Speaker 2 (33:17):
And then going back to a conversation earlier, I read
this article on why we should all resolve to be
softer and it's like written by like a relationship quote
coaching question or quotation marks. I'd like to say, can
you just like name yourself a coach, like you have
a certification?

Speaker 3 (33:33):
I think you have to have a certification, yeah, because
I know, for example, I know it's not the same thing,
but live coaches.

Speaker 1 (33:39):
I think if you charge for.

Speaker 3 (33:42):
One on one coaching sessions or even group coaching, Like
if you're going to charge for advice, you have to
have a certification in some aspect?

Speaker 4 (33:49):
Are we think? Are we sure on that?

Speaker 2 (33:50):
I like, if you pretty sure, just be calm themselves,
like I'm an Like I know some nutritionists like you're
supposed to have a nutrition like masters, but I think
behind girls on TikTok are like paying me to build
you a meal plan, Like, girl, what is your You
are skinny?

Speaker 4 (34:04):
That's your own qualification.

Speaker 1 (34:05):
Oh, you know what you right?

Speaker 2 (34:08):
Because like life coaches, I couldn't ever get a life
coach because I know you don't have your shit together
and if you do, it's probably off luck. So you're
not unless you are a licensed therapist that in time,
what's wrong with me?

Speaker 4 (34:19):
I can't do it?

Speaker 1 (34:20):
Also, it's so funny because therapists.

Speaker 3 (34:23):
What I found from personal experience is that therapists and
people who are related to therapists are the people who
do not have.

Speaker 1 (34:29):
Their shit together the most.

Speaker 3 (34:31):
Like they're in their room with their couch telling their
patience to take X, Y and Z medication, to breathe deep,
to like count to ten in their head before they
speak to stop drinking, to stop whatever, and they are
out doing all this toxic shit in their own lives
and teaching their kids to do toxic shit. Like I
know from experience that just because you are a licensed therapist,

(34:53):
even if you are a licensed even if you have
your master's, even if you have adoctorate, and you're out
here telling people one thing, I know for a fact
you're doing opposite behind closed doors.

Speaker 4 (35:01):
I know.

Speaker 1 (35:01):
I just know in my heart.

Speaker 2 (35:02):
It's like if I feel like a doctor vape, I'm like, yo, yo,
what's going on here? Now? We'll say my ex his
mom and his sister were both therapists, and like they
were such nice people and like they both have like
very long term like met when they were ten relationships.
But he I feel like maybe they pariplized him so
much as a kid, Like how do you feel about that?

(35:25):
The like he reverted so badly in his adulthood where
like he can't communicate a single thought or emotion without
like yelling anyway, this article was like why we should
it all resolve to be softer? And in talking about
how to be soft or like what soft means, the
person's basically like it's a way of showing like love
and affection and vulnerability. Shouldn't you do that anyway? Yeah,

(35:49):
I don't think that necessarily should be categorized as like, oh,
by doing so, I'm becoming softer. But like for me,
it's like no one will ever describe my personality as soft.
I'm loud, abrasive, brash, like that's just my personality and
I hate to think that, Like I can simultaneously be
like loud and opinionated and voice my thoughts, emotions, whatever,

(36:15):
at the same time also be like nurturing and carrying
and passionate and romantic, like those things can coexist and
they do.

Speaker 4 (36:21):
Because I'm a water sign, I'm a cancer.

Speaker 1 (36:24):
Ah, sorry, you're a human. I just think again.

Speaker 3 (36:26):
You know, talking about categorizing women, people forget that women
are so multifaceted just like men are.

Speaker 1 (36:31):
Does that make sense? So I agree.

Speaker 3 (36:34):
I think that just because you see me also act
a different way, does that mean that I am transitioning
into like a different person or becoming someone different or
changing my entire personality.

Speaker 1 (36:46):
It just means like, while.

Speaker 3 (36:47):
I can cut a bit for cutting me in line,
I can also you know what I mean, like make
my boyfriend dinner one night if I won't.

Speaker 2 (36:53):
And that's my thing is like I'm internalized, and like
I think the reason why it is dangerous is because
people into nalize it. Like for me, you guys, I
don't like my long term relationship. It was just going on,
and so many times I thought, like, am I in
some way the problem because like I am so opinionated

(37:14):
and like if I get disrespected, I'm gonna stick up
for myself. Like, am I the issue in the sense
that I don't let things pass. I'm not soft and
pleasant and happy and like all the time like you
see on these like TikTok relationshipshe people are like getting
up making the bed, making their husband coffee and breakfast
and like like I have like I'm gonna be working
a career, Like I'm not gonna be able to do
that for my person all the time or when I

(37:35):
so we want to. But like something in my head
was like, is it my fault that like I'm not
soft enough or like passive enough for this relationship to work,
like joining to do that in the future. I think
part of that is why I was like that in
my most recent situationship where I was so like lovey
dovey and sending kissy emojis and like, oh my god,

(37:55):
good morning, good night, like I've never been that person.
Part of me thinks it because it was the first
time I let myself like really trust someone, like after
going through all that stuff with my exes and like
feeling comfortable enough to like be quote unquote soft again.
At the same time, I thought, if I made myself
seem like more demure and like more passive, like they

(38:16):
could see me more so as a girlfriend. Obviously not
because it didn't work out, but like I'm now still
stuck in that cycle again.

Speaker 4 (38:23):
Or it's like should I be softer?

Speaker 2 (38:24):
Should I be like less myself to make myself seem
like girlfriend material?

Speaker 1 (38:30):
You know, yeah, I completely agree.

Speaker 3 (38:32):
I went through something similar but not the same. I
felt myself for my ex in particular sacrificing and also
because we were long distance, so like I would sack
go above and beyond to sacrifice my time and energy.

Speaker 1 (38:46):
Like I missed.

Speaker 3 (38:47):
I can't count the amount of like events, fashion weeks,
like even birthdays here and there to go and like
visit my long distance boyfriend, and like I just was
going above, above and beyond to sacrifice what made me
me because like, for example, my ex didn't understand why
fashion week was so important. He didn't understand why like
events in New York City was so important to me

(39:08):
in my career and stuff. He always felt like his
stuff should be prioritized because he, like his job was
an engineer, and like he went to.

Speaker 1 (39:16):
A big state school.

Speaker 3 (39:16):
So it's just very like it was different lives, and
I don't think we ever fully understood each other in
that way. But I just remember I never expected him
to sacrifice any of his stuff.

Speaker 1 (39:25):
It was always just me.

Speaker 3 (39:26):
I feel like given, give and giving because I also
wanted to seem like the perfect girlfriend in a very
traditional way, when in reality, it's like, no, my shit
is just as important, even if you don't understand fashion,
even if you don't understand influencing, even if you don't
understand content creation, podcasting, my friends, whatever. It's like, my
stuff is just as important because I'm also a human.
Like just because I'm a woman and I like makeup
and stuff, that doesn't mean I'm like lesser than which

(39:50):
I think is coded a lot in society, Like even
if you call someone soft, you're not automatically think or
like whipped or whatever. Like if you're joking around with
your buddies and you're like, oh my god, your whip
And obviously you're not trying to be harmful. You probably
do not have malicious intent or mal intent, but I
would I think the whole point of this episode is Sydney,
and I just urging you to look at what you
say a little bit more and just see how codd

(40:13):
it is.

Speaker 1 (40:14):
Look at the like, what is it? What am I
trying to say?

Speaker 3 (40:19):
Look at the look at the manifest content behind your wording,
because just because it doesn't seem a certain way, it
can actually have bad repercussions or just like it can
change someone's mindset and just have like consequences in general.
So just be conscious of what you say in terms
of like this specific topic.

Speaker 2 (40:39):
I think also people don't realize like how much effect
it has on you mentally, because this was my thing
and I kept thinking about this a lot. Actually, is
that I'm portraying myself, Like I'm not saying I was
being fake, like it is who I am at my core,
but I kindself repressing like opinions or like tynd to
be too loud or like too oisterious, like we were

(40:59):
out and things like that, just like to me myself,
seem like more I love flowers. I'm girl it, I'm
not that kype person at all.

Speaker 1 (41:07):
But do you like getting flowers?

Speaker 2 (41:08):
No? They think they smell so there and I always die.
The thing reminded me of my own death.

Speaker 1 (41:13):
Yeah, but then men are always like all women love flowers.

Speaker 2 (41:16):
I like, I like the gesture and if they're like roses,
that's fine, but like, please spray them before you come
to my house that they smell so bad to me.

Speaker 3 (41:24):
I think if you're gonna give me a kind gesture,
I think you should know me well enough to know
what I would actually consider to be like something that
I like. You know what I mean, Like, the gesture
can only go so far, you know, Like I understand
if we just like it's our second. You want to
bring me flowers, great, you probably don't know that I
don't like flowers. I appreciate that gesture, but like, yeah,
at this point, give me something that you know I'm

(41:46):
gonna love for sure anyway.

Speaker 2 (41:48):
Yeah, granted I've never gotten flowers. I've actually gotten flowers
once and it was on Valentine's Day and he brought
them to the restaurant in a CBS bag and CVS
is like next art to the restaurant, and I was like,
you know what, I'm just gonna appreciate they gave me
any gesture at all, even if it was like two
minutes before you came here.

Speaker 1 (42:05):
But that's so funny.

Speaker 2 (42:07):
Yeah, I think that, like the issue with that is like,
of course, at my heart, I'm like the sweet little
girl who loves to like listen to music and like
plants around and skirts and stuff like that whatever, but
like there's so many different layers to me that like
I feel like I was having to suppress to try
and like make myself seem more like appeasable. But do
you know, like so let's say like I did that

(42:28):
did work, and like we're dating, but now I can't
like be myself or like fully myself because I've portrayed
myself to be one way.

Speaker 4 (42:35):
For so long.

Speaker 1 (42:35):
Yeah, when does the mask come off?

Speaker 2 (42:37):
So it's like I think keeping up like charades, that's
one thing, And like that's why I hate all these
TikTok fans that are like clean girl, like my god,
be a soft woman, soft life whatever. Life is not
soft all the timic life is hard, so like this
whole thing that you can like retire at twenty five
and like plants around the world and your life will
be so happy and it'll be getting chanel backs random
and like that's not reality. Like I think of growing

(43:00):
up and like learning about yourself and like growing and evolving,
like getting to a place where you can be like
genuinely happy is like dealing with hardships. So I think
trying to repress us and act like they don't exist
or happen is part of the issue.

Speaker 1 (43:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (43:13):
I also just think the dichotomy is so funny. Why
do you either have to be soft or hard? Like
why is that the community?

Speaker 2 (43:19):
Like I'm just human.

Speaker 3 (43:20):
Yeah, it's just those two like descriptive words I find
very interesting, like why are you hard if you're single?

Speaker 1 (43:26):
And then soft fear in a relationship?

Speaker 3 (43:28):
Why are you soft if you like to have asie
bowls in the morning, but hard if you like eggs
or don't eat breakfast, Like I don't understand you know
what I mean?

Speaker 2 (43:33):
And their only I have used to describe women, Like
for men, it's like you're either a man or you're
a simp. Yeah, or like p word simp is like,
you made your girl friend breakfast, you got her a dinner,
you said.

Speaker 4 (43:44):
I love you, are like ill, you're treating her right.

Speaker 2 (43:49):
So I'm like that. So like that stuff is why
I don't understand. I feel like that cuts both ways
because now, like the kind of man I want is
a simp. Someone who respects me and treats me right,
prioritizes me and it's a nice person. But god forbid
his male friends liked, you're not disrespecting her like that?
Oh not only hurts me, but i'llo reinforce this idea,

(44:10):
like I need to be like sounding about things like
that and like it's okay if I don't get that,
because I don't want to upset him. Like no, I'm
gonna say what I want to get. If I don't
receive that from my partner, then you shouldn't be a partner.

Speaker 3 (44:20):
I have a story, but I'm going to disclaim it
with something, and that is when you are not exclusive
or dating somebody, you can do whatever you want.

Speaker 1 (44:27):
At least that is in my eyes. It's like if
we are just going.

Speaker 3 (44:31):
On dates, I do not expect you to be exclusive
or act like my husband. That's number one, so like,
if you're gonna come at me after the story being like, no,
you can't expect them to be obsessed with you from
day one. Okay, first of all, yes I can. Second
of all, Second of all, I am going into this
story with the like premise that I don't like, I'm
not expecting you to be loyal to me if we.

Speaker 1 (44:52):
Didn't make that clear.

Speaker 3 (44:53):
Anyway, I went out this was like last year with
a bunch of my guy friends from back home from Philly.
I don't know if it's just like a Philly but anyway,
we went out clubbing and my friend was just starting
to get in a relation. One of my guy friends
was just starting to get in a relationship. They weren't exclusive,
they were not dating, they were not married whatever, but
he was really starting to like her and he was
thinking about having that conversation.

Speaker 1 (45:15):
We go out.

Speaker 3 (45:16):
It's like me, my girlfriend, and the rest like six
guy friends. So just like setting the scene for you.
We go out and this girl is like all up
on this guy, like very flirty with him, and he's
not giving her anything back. And one of my other
guy friends looked at him, was like, why aren't you
so like she's so attractive, why aren't you hopping on
this whatever? Already controversial And then he was like, well,
because I really like X, Y and Z, I'm not

(45:38):
trying to ruin anything whatever. And he was like, well,
you know, like you're such a stem, like you're whipped.

Speaker 1 (45:44):
He used the whip in particular.

Speaker 3 (45:46):
He's like, you're being so whipped right now, like you
guys aren't even dating blah blah blah blah blah. I
think that ideal is so crazy because like, yeah, you're
allowed to do whatever you want to do if you're
not dating, I guess. But even then, it's like, if
he doesn't want to do it again, why does he
have to give an excuse He just doesn't want to
do it, don't make fun of him for it. And two,
it's like, god forbid, he actually likes a woman and

(46:06):
doesn't want to ruin what he already has, Like he
doesn't want to ruin a good thing just because, not
even because of any label, because he likes her and
that is maybe all he really needs as a reason.

Speaker 1 (46:15):
It's just so annoying that like.

Speaker 3 (46:16):
That was not a good enough reason to not hook
up with this random girl at a club do you
know what I mean?

Speaker 2 (46:21):
So nuts? And like what I was going to say
was actually offensive, and then I did the work in
my brain to realize that it was. And I'm so
glad I did that because my thing was like, why
do men have to have like their friend's approvals to
do actually anything like I've been hiding, like are you
like in a trench coat and he's hiding under you,

(46:42):
like telling you what to do, like literally pulling on
your hair. To that video of that block party in
Brooklyn and it's like a rat and they're bumping.

Speaker 3 (46:52):
Yeah, yeah, and they're like hanging out with the rat
and they're all circling him so the rat can't escape.

Speaker 1 (46:57):
I was like, Okay, so funny. No, it's true.

Speaker 3 (46:59):
I mean, and guys love to make fun of women
for traveling in packs to go to the bathroom together
and stuff. Boy, you are basing your life decisions off
what your friends think of you. Is it really that deep?

Speaker 2 (47:08):
And like I will say, because like part of me
was like, maybe that's like double faceted because women do
that too, Like I text my friends the minute anything happens,
but it's different because I don't listen to my friends
that's the thing. I will be like Sarah and Chance
give me advice. They're like, don't do it. I'm like okay,
and then I do it.

Speaker 1 (47:24):
No, and then no.

Speaker 3 (47:25):
She won't even be like I'm gonna do it. She'll
text us after she's already done it. Yeah, I'd be like,
guess what I did.

Speaker 2 (47:30):
I just meant to be reassured of my decision, like
I'm gonna do what I want to do. At the
end of the day, I want validation.

Speaker 1 (47:36):
Yeah, It's like that's the thing.

Speaker 3 (47:37):
It's we I interact and I guess this is definitely
specific to me in my circle.

Speaker 1 (47:42):
I don't know about any of y'alls.

Speaker 3 (47:43):
But like my circle and I kind of speak to
each other to get advice and validation and that's it.

Speaker 1 (47:51):
You know. And I feel like guys, most.

Speaker 3 (47:53):
Guys travel in their circles in ways where it's like
what should I do?

Speaker 1 (47:59):
Do this? Okay?

Speaker 2 (48:00):
Got it?

Speaker 1 (48:01):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 3 (48:01):
It's very and I feel like this is especially common
in like sports groups, like all my jockey friends who
are in high school listen to Yeah jockey like jocks.

Speaker 2 (48:11):
Oh, I mean jockey, like the people that ride on
horses in here, Oh, No.

Speaker 1 (48:14):
I like jock dash eat.

Speaker 2 (48:16):
I was like, is that like a sport that's common
in the peace state?

Speaker 1 (48:19):
No, jock dash? Why yeah? Jock like jock jock jock
at jock Jockel. Like all of those guys listen to
every single word each other said. They were hyping each
other up so much.

Speaker 3 (48:29):
It's one of those things where it's like, if your
friend Jimmy jumped off a bridge, would.

Speaker 1 (48:32):
Tommy do it too? The answer is always yes, yes, yes,
they would all the time.

Speaker 2 (48:36):
I know when men do bad things, never like by themselves.
It's always another man that's the accomplished.

Speaker 3 (48:43):
I'm just like, yo, women women have women have the
audacity to fuck up by themselves.

Speaker 4 (48:48):
Men suck up with the men do it, and then
it's just like.

Speaker 2 (48:55):
I and like when the man makes decision, honest owen,
it's so awful.

Speaker 4 (49:00):
So I'm like, where.

Speaker 2 (49:02):
Can we rectify this issue? That's what we should ask for.
And like even like with my guy friends, like oh
my gosh, oh my gosh, it's like dumb, dumber and
dumbest in a circle. Like they'll come to you about
a situation and I'll give them the most heartfelt womanly
movely advice ever that could change their lives, and they're like, eh,
maybe they go to the boys and the boys are like,

(49:24):
maybe you should like tell her about it or like
communicate or like, I don't know, like figure it out.
And they're like whoa, and I have to ask to
a direct and I'm like, there's no use wasting my time.
I gave you all this heartfelt advice exactly what to
do and say, and you took just talk to her
as the writer, Okay, maybe say something. You just think

(49:47):
about it for like an hour and like see what
you want to do. And they're like, whoa. It's literally
like the brain cells clocking together. And I watch it
happen and I'm just like, you guys really think that,
like I should behind glens literally.

Speaker 1 (50:02):
And also that was me, but I don't care.

Speaker 3 (50:04):
And also I feel like vander Pump Rules is a
great indicator of.

Speaker 1 (50:08):
This as well, because in their couples.

Speaker 3 (50:11):
Like especially in the earlier seasons when it was like
Kristen Tom Tom, Katie Jack's Stallcy whatever, they were all
really loyal in their couples, and then they would have
a guy's night in Vegas and every single one of
them would cheat every single one.

Speaker 2 (50:26):
No, And it literally happens on Love Island, like when
they were in cost some More.

Speaker 4 (50:30):
I'm not going to spoil it.

Speaker 2 (50:32):
Like one of the boys did something and the woman
confronts him once she gets back to the.

Speaker 4 (50:37):
Villa and he was like, well they made me do it.

Speaker 2 (50:40):
You are twenty seven years old. I'm talking about oh
Lea's guy Montel. Yeah, literally Montel Or I'm not to
say a person. The person was like, I love the
girl that I have, Like back on the villa, like,
I'm not going to do anything crazy. The boys literally
said to him, They're like, yo, it's the lad's vacation.
Like you gotta kiss a bad thing. He goes. He

(51:02):
literally gets up from the conversation, walks over, kisses the
girl and comes back and was like I did it.
And then the girl's like, you cheated on me, And
he was like, but the boys told me to do it.

Speaker 4 (51:13):
Do you have a spine?

Speaker 2 (51:15):
Now? I actually said i'd agreewind. I was like, just
know what he just said that as his excuse, Like
that was it?

Speaker 3 (51:18):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (51:19):
And then to make it worse, he was like to say,
I'm sorry because I embarrassed you. I'm gonna embarrass myself
and goes up to the terrace and yells like I
disrespected my girlfriend, Like I'm so sorry. Okay, you just
made it. Now you're even more embarrassing.

Speaker 1 (51:34):
Yeah, that is so funny. And then the same thing
and cost some more.

Speaker 3 (51:38):
This one guy was told by the ringleader to literally
the right literally we all know it's tie to be, like,
go kiss that one girl. He did, came back said
I kiss it, and then he was like, go kiss.

Speaker 1 (51:49):
That other girl.

Speaker 3 (51:50):
He kiss like three girls in one night, all because
Ty told him to a puppet bastard.

Speaker 2 (51:53):
Because Chi knows he's gonna win, and he's making all
the guys like misbehave like he knew when to hit.
Costs some more if he didn't settle now and he
wasn't gonna win. That's why he acted crazy the first
half like a bad boy cost him more. Suddenly he's
reformed and now he's perfect and perfect such a strong word.
But if you'll notice, he literally says in the show,
he'll be like I've really changed guy us like she's

(52:14):
changing my I feel it, like we get it. You
don't have to expel it out for us, like we
see it happening, and just even when it's so bad.

Speaker 1 (52:21):
If they get back together, they're gonna break up the
first week. Guys.

Speaker 4 (52:29):
That's how Sarah always.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
Guys, we're done. We love you as always.

Speaker 3 (52:35):
You can listen to us on Spotify, up a Podcasts,
and wherever you got your podcast, and you could also
follow us on Instagram at Crying in Public That Sydney.
I'm Sarah.

Speaker 2 (52:44):
Good Night,
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