Louis Carr and Jordan Muse

Leadership is a privilege that comes with the responsibility to bring in, lift up and inspire others. Hear how Louis Carr and Jordan Muse have helped countless others as they carve out their path to the top.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:07):
None of us got here fire Sol. I mean it
keeps me up at night, I mean literally thinking what
more can I do? How can I get the door
open more? How can I convince people you don't have
to give up anything in order to have a diverse environment.

(00:28):
You just have to make the environment bigger. Hello and
welcome to the Future Legends of Advertising podcasts featuring newly
inducted members of the American Advertising Federations Hall of Achievement
and those in the Hall of Fame. In this series,
will compare notes, gain insights, and explore the future of
the advertising industry. You never before heard conversations between those

(00:52):
who are shaping it. You'll meet industry icons like those
of the st John, Daisy, Exposita, Luillah, Deborah Wall, and
future ones, including leaders from the most impactful brands, agencies,
and media platforms in the world. We're your host Hailey
Romer and Ross Martin. Now let's meet the legends. Welcome everyone.

(01:15):
We are in for a real treat today. I've been
looking forward to this podcast for several weeks now, and
I can't believe that we were able to get these
two legends in the room together. So it's quite an
incredible moment. Lewis Car you are a legend in every way.
From a career perspective, you really made your market the BT,
having spent thirty six years at the network and specifically

(01:38):
the last twenty one as president of Media Sales, and
you've truly transformed the multicultural space for some of the
world's biggest brands including PNG, Unit Leaver, McDonald's, GM, Facebook, Apple,
and more. And you've even throughout your career become a
strategic advisor to these brands about black and brown communities,

(01:59):
which is in credible. But beyond your career and your
time at the b ET, you have been a dedicated
community servant and mentor to young people. Nineteen years ago,
Car founded the Lewis car Internship Foundation, which has provided
over two hundred paid internships, and you've also created the
Blueprint Men Summit and Blueprint Connect podcast, which brings together

(02:22):
some of Black America's high profile thought leaders to educate
black men on everything from finance to health, to careers, relationships,
and entrepreneurship. You've also authored two books, I Don't Know
How You Found the Time, Dirty Little Secrets and Little
Black Book, Daily Motivations for Business and personal growth and
all of this has not gone on noticed. Car has

(02:44):
been recognized by the Board i Q at the top
one hundred Hall of Fame African American and was named
by Savoy magazine as one of the most influential Black
corporate directors. Car has served on more ad industry boards
than any other African American and including having held seats
on the boards of the International Radio and TV Society,

(03:04):
the Video Advertising Bureau, the AD Council, and the a AP,
and he currently sits on the boards of Drake University,
which he attended, Cedar Fair's Board of Directors, and the
US Track and Field Association. Louis Carr, thank you so
much for joining us. I don't know how you do
it all. We're very excited to hear more about it.

(03:25):
Thank you so much, Earlie for giving me this opportunity.
Really appreciated and thanks to the AA. Well welcome and
really really excited to hear you in conversation today with
the legend Jordan's Muse. Jordans, in case you're not familiar,
is currently managing director at the Martin Agency. Jordan has

(03:46):
been called the embodiment of greatness. That's what a legend.
He is already and is recognized for truth as his superpower.
Jordan runs some of Martin Agency's key accounts, including Buffalo
Wild Wings, Were Caribbean, Door, Dash, Gay and sab A,
Google and Amazon, and is responsible for getting a legendary
rap group to change its name without a hitch Bone

(04:06):
Thugs and Harmony and Jordan, we want to hear more
about that. Jordan's org helped to lead the Martin Agency
to winning ad Week's Agency of the Year back to back,
and Jordan himself was recognized by Campaign us IS two
as account Person of the Year. Prior to winning Martin,
Jordan led other brands to greatness at Widening, Kennedy and

(04:29):
B B d O as well as Mused Communications. We're
talking about friends like Nike, Sprite, Old Spice, American, Honda,
and more. And this does include the development of award
winning campaigns like the Men You Could Smell Like and
Nikes Olympic Anthem that united the US men's and women's
basketball teams, and partnership with then up and coming Chance

(04:51):
the Rapper for unique rendition of the national anthem. At
each place he's worked, Jordan emphasizes creating a culture of
inclusion and true partnership between people and clients. Jordan's welcome
and thanks for being here, Haley, appreciated and honored to
be here. And it's a little weird to hear my
name in conjunction with the word legend, but you know,

(05:12):
I'll take it a live in it. That's right. Well,
you know what, you are already a legend, and you
will be inducted into the Hall of Achievement in just
a few short weeks, Jordans and so deserving of the recognition. Um,
and I thought where we might start is the fact
that this year is the thirtieth anniversary of the Hall
of Achievement, Um Lewis, you are deeply familiar with the

(05:34):
Hall of Achievement and the A A F. Perhaps you
could talk a little bit about what the Hall of
Achievement needs, what it what it was meant to be
started to do, and how you see legends of future
legends like Jordan's really driving impact for the industry moving forward. Well,
when the award was created, Hailey, it was for the

(05:58):
impact that you had on your industry, the skill set
that you brought to the table, and the type of
impact you have on on particular brands and clients and
agencies and things like that, but it also meant the
work that you did outside of that. It also meant

(06:20):
the impact and the influence, whether it would be on
the next generation of leaders or whether it be as
what we call now E S G or D E
and I. It really sort of went outside of your
day job, but also your commitment to a broader environment

(06:43):
and also a broader community. So we really wanted to
sort of see people who said, I'm doing a great
job at what I do nine and five, nine and
seven or nine and nine, whatever the hours were, but
I also understand and that with my influence, my impact

(07:03):
and my power, I need to make it a better industry.
I need to make it a better community. So that
that's how it really sort of got started. So we
put a lot of emphasis on making sure that people
were I guess we would call three sixty and they're thinking,
uh and their vision for a better industry. Thank you,

(07:25):
And Jordan's what does this moment mean for you and
what is it like for you? Also to here directly
from Lewis who has done so much both for our
industry as well as for bringing those into our industry,
and then their community, and in the black community in particular. Yeah,
it's Um, it's been an honor, I think. UM. In

(07:46):
this business, especially where I'm at in sort of my
pathway point to call it, you spend so much time
in the work. You spend so much time in the
process that it's hard to like take a step back
into the sort of realign or to recognize the work
that you've done, or to like get focused on the
bigger purpose. Uh. And I think this moment for me

(08:09):
has allowed me an opportunity to look back at the
things that I've accomplished, recognized and sort of lived within
that moment. Because we're you know, especially where I've grown up, UM,
you spend so much time thinking about the broader team.
You spend so much time thinking about other people that
you don't really have taken moment to sort of reflect

(08:31):
on your journey. And this has given me an opportunity
to do that. Um. And then also like giving me
more confidence in my purpose UM, and the things that
I believe that are important to who I am in
this or and this industry is seeing that come to
life and being recognized has been really cool. Uh. And

(08:53):
it gives me more power and sort of a boost
to continue to push that forward for the industry, for
the people in my life, and then obviously with the
organizations that I work with. So it's been a it's
been an honor to like see myself in it with
the likes of Louis or the legends that you speak of,
with the past honorrees. But it's all still given me

(09:16):
great confidence and um, a sort of a kick in
the butt to try to push for more and to
even increase my impact. I love that, Lewis. I'm curious
just listening to how Jordan answered that question. You've you've
spent a lot of time focused on helping people within
the black and brown communities to both get into this

(09:39):
industry as well developed themselves. We spent a lot of
time thinking about giving young people access to voices that
they might not otherwise have access to. Um, what is
that meant to you and what would you encourage or

(09:59):
how would you encourage Jordan's to continue to pursue as
he said he's doing, like pursue impact and think about
how to you know, take what you've done and continue
to bring it along. None of us got here by ourselves.
You know, a lot of people may say that, but
when they go to sleep at night, they know the
people who helped them. Um, they know, as I would say,

(10:22):
the way makers in their life. And for me, that
was extremely special because not only did they helped me
get to who I am to day, they showed me
a place that I didn't know that existed. Right. I
didn't know that this industry, this type of job, this

(10:43):
type of influence, you know, this type of office even
existed from where I came from. So they showed me that.
Then they showed me a path to get there, and
then they had to convince me that I want it
to get on that path. So now that I'm here,

(11:04):
I'm trying to pay it forward, as we would say,
for all the other people who may have been like me,
who who doesn't know this industry existed, who doesn't understand
how powerful this industry, who doesn't understand that our industry
shapes wants, desires and needs. So I am trying to

(11:24):
open up that door and say, come in, come in,
come in, take advantage of it. You know, this is
not only good for you, but it's also good for
an industry because, as we know, Hailey, it takes different voices.
It takes different thoughts, It takes different visions to create
this wonderful creative industry that we have. Whether we're talking

(11:48):
about advertising or whether we're talking about content, it takes
all of that. So I want to make sure that
we bring as many different typle thoughts and voices inside
to create a great product slash industry. So that's why
I do it. I mean it keeps me up at night,

(12:11):
I mean literally thinking what more can I do? How
can I get the door open more? How can I
then convince people you don't have to give up anything
in order to have a diverse environment. You just have
to make the environment bigger. And that's what different thoughts

(12:33):
and minds. When you look at the number of women
in our industry, I've been alone, uh this journey long enough, Haley,
when it wasn't a lot all right. Now they're the
majority of the of the industry because we opened up
people's minds and thoughts and opportunities to say this is
good for everybody, not just for women, It's good for everybody.

(12:54):
So that's what I spend a lot of my time
and effort on really thinking about how we can do that.
And to Jordan's I would say, do the same. You
have a legacy of Hey, your dad was great, Now
it's on. You got the betime and you're in sort
of a different arena. You're in a broader arena. You

(13:16):
can have even greater impact then your dad had. In
this arena, you're in different types of rooms, all right,
seeing different types of people. So I would ask you
to sort of do the same and understand that it's
not just about the awards that you will win, because
you will win plenty, but it's the opportunity to help

(13:37):
other people win awards, help other clients and agencies and
everything else. See how big this opportunity is and how
much impactful you can have on communities. So that's what
I would advise to you, my brother. Yeah, I appreciate that.
I think there's um extremely important. Um. I've been lucky to,

(13:59):
you know, sort of push on what you were talking
about yourself and not necessarily having an example, knowing the
industry existed and the opportunities that it provide. Um, I
was lucky enough to have the blueprint and sort of
be able to see it firsthand. And honestly, I would
say I kind of took that for granted A little

(14:19):
bit as as I was going through this industry and
always always trying to find my own right my path
and not necessarily recognized the greatness of my father and
trying to um, you know, set my own direction at
But as I started to get more involved and spending
more time with people and also reflecting UM on my

(14:42):
experiences as a as a as a child, seeing that
it became so much more uh visible of how important
that it is and how it shaped me and my
sort of approach to who I am as a leader, UM,
as a as a creative and it sort of give
me more confidence to be that example for those who

(15:03):
don't necessarily have it at home like I did. I
was very fortunate. So over the last twenty some years,
I've been trying to be that example every day. UM
Lewis is a perfect example of someone that I can
strive to to basically take that impact and make it
broader to know my world. But I think this moment

(15:25):
and being recognized for the whole achievement isn't necessarily for me.
It's for others to see someone that looks like them,
who speaks like them UM and shows up like them,
that they can have that same impact and be in
my position or Lewis position, you know, in their future Jordan's.
As you're meeting young candidates now who are looking up

(15:48):
to you, what's your advice to them about this industry
moving forward and how to navigate how to navigate everything
that we're experiencing right now. I'm a hiring manager, so
I been a lot of time with candidates, and you
immediately can feel the tension and pressure that they have
in those in those in those moments, in those meetings,

(16:10):
I immediately tried to get to who they are as
the person, because I think that is extremely important, you know,
similar to what Lewis is saying, is that we want
to continue to build this industry with diverse minds and experiences. Uh.
It's so important for me to have that. At the
center of what I do in my organization is making

(16:32):
sure that I'm bringing and and and hiring the best
minds who have different experiences that we can come together
to impact each other and obviously impact the work. So
what I try to do is make sure that I
get to know who the candidate is as a person, UH,
and spend more time understanding their aspirations, UH, their desires

(16:53):
and interests UH. And I tried to give them confidence
to be their their full selves UH. And me as
the manager, coming into those interviews, UM, looking less about
their experience in the business and more their experience as
a person. I've seen and it gives them confidence to
sort of open up. UH. And that is just the

(17:14):
sort of an entry way to who we are as
a company. If I can set that sort of example
and provide that experience in an interview, UM, it shows
up when they enter the building or when they get
in a team environment. And it's so important for me
is to making sure that building environment people can be
their true selves and bring those outside influences into the work,

(17:35):
into the workplace because that's when the workplace is a
lot deeper and more rich for our own personal interactions
and relationships. But you also see the impact on the work. UM.
So I try as as much as I can to
sort of provide them confidence and that that opportunity for
them and that space for them to be themselves. UM.

(17:58):
And I try to do that every step of a way.
Starting with the image prospect. You mentioned the work and
so I want to switch gears for for a moment here,
because the work that both of you have done and
you continue to do and produce. UM has another level
of impact on the black community as much as you

(18:18):
do on a one to one basis about hiring and
mentoring people directly, but the impact of of the work
that you're doing and in terms of representation and visibility
also obviously cannot go under understated, underestimated. So maybe Louis,
you could talk for a moment about some of the
work that you've done with brands to help them understand

(18:42):
and in terms of advising or actually just directly with
the easy help help them understand the importance of impact
on the black community and where you've seen this go.
You know, over the course of your career trajectory, I've
had you know what I call really probably were great
to jobs and in I get to educate brands and

(19:04):
corporations on the value of black people, uh and whether
that is on how much they spend or whether that
is on trends, whatever it is. I get to be
able to go about and educate corporate America on Black
people and their differences at how those differences work for

(19:26):
the value of everybody. You know, we have the saying
that the et we say what black people do today,
the world does tomorrow. Everything unique about America comes from
Black people. I mean, we have been able to influence
everything from paper towels to politics. So what a privilege

(19:48):
I've had to be able to be a part of
that education. And you know, one of the things that
we realize with education is the more you know about
some one or something or some product, the better you
have to evaluate it. So that's what my job has

(20:08):
been over the last three decades of the ET is
really getting America to understand black people all that we
are and all that we aren't. And you know, it's
been a privilege, and I think we've changed some things.
I mean when when I look at the number of
brands and the amount of content that has African Americans

(20:32):
in it, I kind of smile, said I had a
little bit of something to do with that. When I
look at the number of competitive sets and a number
of black creators, I said smile because we had a
little bit something to do that. Because if we hadn't
been successful, you wouldn't have all of that because people
would not have followed that path. So it's this opportunity

(20:54):
that the b ET brand has given me and I
think take it as a privilege that we've been able
to change sort of America and how America engages, looks
and values black people, not just the b et consumers,
but all consumers of color. And I when I say that,
I think about Hispanics, I think about Asians and everything else,

(21:18):
you know, even with women, as we say civil rights
help women or than it help black people. All right,
So we're very excited, and we continue to be engaged,
and we continue to have hope that things will continue
to change for our communities and for brands who serve
our communities. So I'm one of those people who wake

(21:41):
up excited every single day about the opportunity to educate, influence,
and impact people's thoughts, minds, and vision on what this
country is gonna look like, what particular brands and industries
are gonna look like, because I believe in people who
you know, look like me in a major way. There's

(22:04):
a lot in there that we can unpack. But I
think in the broadest sense, you've struck a really optimistic
tone about the work that you've done, and you should
be so incredibly proud of how far we've come. And
yet sometimes people often look at this work as a
check the box moment. And so when you're in the
room with a brand and you feel like, well, there,

(22:25):
this is just a check the box thing. Do you
ever sort of pivot, you know, without directly saying it
feels like you're just checking the box, but this is
a bigger opportunity you might be missing, you know, how
do you handle that type of moment or encounter which
I can imagine You've got countless examples that I want,
I want to ask for you to name brands. But well,
first of all, I tell people, let's not just do

(22:46):
it because it's the right thing to do. Let's do
it because it's the right thing to do for your business,
because you really become satisfied and come become excited about
doing it when you know it's going to move the
needle and for your clients, for your agency. So when

(23:10):
people sort of look at it from a business standpoint,
then they have goals, they have objectives, they have share
they have all the key fundamentals in place to sort
of say, right now, where do I want to be
and what is the journey gonna be like? And what
do I have to contribute From an asset standpoint to

(23:33):
get there the same thing. Like you know when you
launching new products, Okay, you're starting from zero. How do
I get from zero or five percent? How do I
get from five percent to ten percent? You have a strategy,
you have tactics, you have goals. You have to check.
And that's what I tell people to look at when
they're thinking about the black consumer market. We know it

(23:56):
can change share really I mean politics, even though now
that it can change results. So I asked people look
at it from a business point of view, and you
feel much better and be more engaged to participate when
you look at it like that, Yes, is it the
right thing to do? Yes, But when it's the right

(24:20):
thing to do about your business, you are more enthusiastic
about your participation. I like that. Thank you, Jordans. I
can't uh get past the zone thugs and the name changing.
Can you tell us about that? Just give us a
little anecdote here, how did that happen? And talk a
little bit about that experience. That's a huge deal. Yeah,

(24:43):
it was. It was an easy sell, to be honest
with you. We've obviously worked with Buffalo Wow Wings and
we were There has always been this debate about traditional
wings and Bonus Wings, and a creative just sort of
ca into one of us and was like, we would

(25:03):
love to do something that sort of stops culture against
people to talk about about the brand, but doing it
in a more uh interesting way than like talking about
the food. And I guess they were listening to Bone
Thugs one time. I was like, Hey, what happens if
we were to reach out to this this group and
have them change their name to Boneless Thugs and doing
it in a way that's unexpected and obviously pushing golf

(25:26):
sort of their culturals at guys And I thought it
was going to be something that would take, you know, um,
a lot of time, took evince a client, uh, but honestly,
we presented a one page presentation uh and the clients
bought it instantly. And now that the challenge was just

(25:46):
trying to get the group together because at this time
they weren't touring, um and they weren't spurning and spending
that much time together. So luckily enough we were able
to get in contact with them, and before you know,
three weeks later, we're in Los Angeles shooting a shooting
a parody. It was it was fantastic. That's awesome. I'm

(26:07):
wondering if you have any questions you want to ask,
Louis I do I do? UM? First off, it's not
lost on me, lewis the work that you have done
over the years, especially as you talk about the education
that you've had with with brands to understand the impact
of of our community. I find myself now in positions

(26:29):
where that education has landed and I'm finding more opportunities
to speak to our community unless of of doing the education,
because of the work that you have done another So
I appreciate that now the duty is on us to
make sure that we are we show up in those
authentic UH and those sort of UM celebrate asselbratory ways

(26:50):
for our community. So I appreciate the work that you
and others have done for us. UM. My question for
you is is that UM, obviously, like I'm sort of
in this half have willing point in my career as
we sort of learned more about you and all the
work that you've done for the community and others, there's
a sort of clear purpose to to to the work

(27:12):
that you do and the work that you've done, and
would that show up for you? UM? When was it
clear to you that this purpose of yours is much
bigger than um in selling media or advertising? And when
did that show up for you? And then how did
you sort of harness and provide greater direction for your stuff?

(27:34):
Great question, Jordan's. When I graduated from college, I remember
asking a lot of mentors, how will you know when
you're doing the thing that you know God has meant
for you to do? Right? Basic question is how will
you know when you find your purpose? How do you

(27:57):
find your purpose? And everyone and said, it'll hit you
like a ton of bricks. You don't have to spend
a lot of time searching for it. It's gonna come
to you, and it may come to you in the
morning and the night, on your job, in your sleep,
and you're just know that that's your purpose. And I

(28:17):
remember I was sitting in my Chicago office looking out
the window, and that's my stuff. I would say, there
he goes again, doing nothing, just to looking out the window.
And it hit me like a ton of bricks that
my purpose was to give people who would not normally
get opportunities. I was in a position to give them opportunities.

(28:41):
And whether that was inside b et or outside b et.
I had sort of grown to put together a tremendous ROLLERDX.
I had broad relationships across the industry, and I had
people coming to me asking for help, and whether that

(29:02):
was a help to get a job or one that
was a help to navigate their jobs someplace else. You know,
how do I get a promotion, how do I get
a new position? How do I get raised? And so
it hit me my purpose is to be able to
give people opportunities, advice and motivate them to their next now,

(29:31):
and that's what I've been doing now, I would probably
say over twenty years of my almost forty year career,
because it just came to me. It's to help people.
And uh, I don't think it's work. I think it's joy.
A matter of fact, I had a sales retreat what

(29:53):
time Jordan's called how to get joy out of success
of others? You know, teaching people, you know, motivating people,
inspiring people, and you're feeling just as great or greater
than that. So, uh, it has been amazing for me.
Every time we have around an intern, sometimes I'm tired, man,

(30:15):
and I'm like, this is just too much work. And
then they'll say something and just motivate me. I just
had my men's confidence last weekend, and on the second day,
which is the day for teens, I was dragged. I
mean I was super dragged. And I walked in the
room and saw three hundred teens on twelve going nuts

(30:39):
over g Herbo, and all of a sudden, I wasn't
tired anymore because they gave me that energy, that inspiration
that I needed. So it not only works for giving,
it works when you're receiving, you know, people's energy. You're
receiving their gratitude, their appreciation, and it says that you

(31:02):
are making a difference. So that's how I found my
purpose came to me in the middle of the day.
Looking afterwards, that's great, I UM. One of the things
that you said that sort of sits with me is
that you know, it's so important to find success in others, um,
especially as you get to a certain point in your careers.

(31:22):
It was a challenge for me and I see as
a as a challenge for young leaders in the organizations
that that I'm a part of. Is it sort of
that that switched to leadership, uh, And instead of being
so focused on the work and the doing, it's now
becoming that coach and that leader that sees success in

(31:43):
the impact that you have on others. And it's such
a pivotal point in one's career is to sort of
change those KPI s and those those goals. It's not
so much more about you know, how you finish a
project or UM in some cases you know the impact
or the bottom line of an account or a business.

(32:03):
It's more about the impact that you have on the
people who then can can succeed and grow. And it's
it's a it's a sort of a switch in somebody's
career that it's hard to want to deal with UM
because those metrics are a little bit more soft, you know,
not as hard. But I find when you were able

(32:24):
to UM make that switch, they are that there's so
much more gratifying because it makes the work that you
do so much more impactful, UM and rich and to
yourself feel to like you said, fill with purpose. But
it is a challenge that I see quite often UM
sort of that midway point in your career is how

(32:45):
do you become that leader that sees success in others.
One of the things during our New Channel leaders remember
leadership is never about yourself It's always about others. Once
you step into a leadership position, selfish going, it's always
about others and how you make others better, how you

(33:06):
grow others, and how you teach others to be leaders
and make it sort of this selfless app and you know,
you know, people are realized, maybe I'm not gonna be
a leader. I'm just too selfish. But great leaders doing
for others very rarely for themselves. That's the percent correct. Gosh.

(33:30):
I love that, and I feel like this is the
perfect place to just put a pin in it. Thank
you so much Louis and Jordan's for joining this. I
personally have gotten so much out of this conversation. I
can just imagine that our listeners are somewhere begging for more.
Thank you for taking the time to be best. Thank you,
thanks for having me. Thank you. Well, that doesn't for

(33:56):
this episode of the Future Legends of Advertising podcast, I'm
Smartin and I'm Hailey Rohmer, and thank you for listening.
We'll be back with another episode before you know it.
And for more information on the American Advertising Federation, go
to a A dot org.