June 27, 2023 • 39 mins
Paige kicks off the episode with a solid dose of T&A, answering questions about what turns her on, the best looking pro golfers, her favorite tournament to watch, and more. Afterwards, Paige and Sam welcome Ian Fraser from Club Champion to discuss the importance of club fitting, the cost benefit analysis, and his response to those who think they're not good enough to get fit.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (00:45):
This is Playing Around with Page Renee.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Hello everyone, welcome back to the Playing Round podcast. I'm
your host, Page Renee. Later on in this episode, I'll
be joined my by co host Sam and the founder
of Tour Experience Golf and the co host of the
t XG YouTube channel, Ian Frasier. We're going to talk
all things equipment club fitting. He gives you some really
(01:12):
great insight, so keep on listening for that later on
in this episode. But I thought I would start out
with some T and A. So let's just get right
on into it. The first question is when do you
feel the sexiest. I feel like the popular answer to
this and most women say no, makeup, sweatpants, hair tied up,
(01:32):
and you know the Drake song, that's what I feel
my sexiest, and I'm like, yep, I am the complete
opposite of that. I feel my sexiest when I am
dressed the nines, hair's done, makeup's done, I'm wearing this
tight little outfit. You know, the girls are popping, they're
saying hello to the world. That is when I feel
(01:54):
my sexiest. And I think that's when I shoot my
content when I am dressed as Paige Renee. Talk about
this all the time, where it's almost my alter ego
now is Paige Renee, And I feel like I almost
need to do that when I'm creating content to feel
my most sexiest and my most confident, and it's almost
this mass that I'm wearing in a way, but it's
(02:15):
just how I feel my best. And a lot of
people talk about my clothes. It's always a big subject
of discussion and people say, oh, you do it for
and attention, and you know, I think everyone on social
media is on you know, they're on social media for attention,
but yes, I do it because that's how I feel
my best. That's how I feel my most confident is
(02:36):
when I'm wearing those outfits that you know are nice
and tight and I love it. Next question, what is
your favorite golf tournament to watch? Definitely the majors, all
of the majors, Masters probably my favorite, then the US Open,
the Open, and then the PGA Championship. But this year
(02:56):
the PGA Championship gave the US Open a run for money,
and I think that it was actually better than the
US Open. So we'll see what the Open has to
offer for US. But if I have to rank this
year for the majors, it was the Master so far,
the PGA Championship, and then the US Open, so.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
We will see.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
What is your favorite cuisine? I would probably say Asian.
I love Asian food, any type of Asian food always
a go to, but it's not my favorite meal to have.
Ice Cream is my most favorite thing to eat. If
I had one last meal, it would one hundred percent
be ice cream, and then probably corn dogs and a
(03:36):
grilled cheese or like mac and cheese, anything with cheese.
What turns you want cheese? Now?
Speaker 3 (03:43):
What turns me on the most?
Speaker 1 (03:45):
I think a good sense of humor. That's something that
I really appreciate in someone else, as someone who can
laugh their self can make me laugh. I like to laugh.
I have a I think I have a really great
sense of humor. I know some people say that I
take myself too seriously. I'm always playing the victim on
social media, which is a lie. If one headline goes
(04:07):
viral from this podcast, I hope it's this one because
people are constantly like, you're always.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Planning the victim.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
You never own up to let you do, and so
New York Posts please write about this. I want to
read paid Sporanic owns up to her brand and is
unapologetically herself done. Period. I love how I got there
from what turns you on the most? Yeah, that's just
how my brain works. Would you ever consider running a
(04:34):
golf clinic for beginner golfers? Yes, one hundred percent. I
have been wanting to do this for the longest time.
My ultimate goal in all of this is to make
enough money where I can open up my own golf
course with amazing driving range, an amazing group of golf
instructors and help everyone become a better player, but specifically
(04:55):
junior golfers. That is a passion of mine and something
that I really want to do and something that I
I'm working towards. That is the long term goal because
every time someone would be like, how do you see
yourself in five years or ten years or fifteen years,
and I never really had an answer, And so one
day I just sat down, I said, what am I
most passionate about? Why do I do this? And the
reason I do this is to grow the game of golf.
(05:17):
And to do that it's through great golf instruction through
the junior golf level and beginner golfers and getting people
into the game. So that is what I want to do.
How long did it take you to teach Nico tricks?
So I taught him where I go bang and He'll
play dead. But I got to give my mom a
lot of credit for this one. She loves teaching Nico
(05:40):
tricks and so she did majority of the work and
we would do some of them together, but she did
so many from the very beginning, Like as soon as
he was a puppy, he could sit, he could give paw,
he could do all of these things, and he can
do so many tricks. It's actually really impressive. N Goo
is a very smart doggie. Who's the best looking professional
golfer men's and women's I would say, I mean, you
(06:05):
gotta go with Adam Scott. That's a popular pick. And
on the women's side, there's a bunch. There's a lot
of really beautiful female golfers. I think Nellie Korda is
the full package. I think she speaks well, she's beautiful,
she has a great personality. Clearly, she's an amazing golfer.
She looks incredible in all of her editorial pictures that
(06:27):
she does. She can do high fashion, she can also
do just you know, her fun, really candid pictures that
she does on Instagram. So yeah, she's she's a great follow.
What is your favorite hobby that's not sports related. I've
talked about this on the podcast where I've gone through
a lot of therapy, and one thing we were working
(06:48):
on in therapy was getting hobbies because from a very
young age, I really just got into sports and I
was a competitive gymnast and I went to golf and
I didn't have time I'm to do anything else, and
so My whole life has revolved around being the best
that I could possibly be in sports, gymnastics, in golf,
(07:09):
and after golf it was social media. And so I've
always been really driven on one singular goal and I
have never put any of my energy into hobbies. And
my therapist said that that's really unhealthy and you do
need to get away and have hobbies and have other
things in your life and other interests, and that was
(07:32):
something that was never a part of me or my life.
And so that's a very long winded way to say
that I still don't have any hobbies and I'm a
work in progress. What's your advice on overcoming fairway bunkers.
Fairway bunkers are difficult for a ton of different reasons,
but the biggest reason is that you never practice them.
There are very few bunkers on practice facilities, and most
(07:56):
of the time, if there is a bunker, it's a
green side bunker, and you can't hit fairway bunker shots.
And so when you're thrown into a fairway bunker on
the golf course, you're looking at and you're like, hmm,
I've never hit this shot before, or the last time
I did. Is when the last time I was in
the fairway bunker and I didn't hit it well, and
so you never practice it. So when you dig your
feet in, you need to choke down. Most people will
(08:18):
not choke down, but they forget the fact that they
have dug their feet in at least an inch, and
so they'll always hit it fat because of that reason.
A lot of people also struggle with hovering the club
because they're so u sick holding it on the ground.
So when you're practicing on the driving range, hit a
few shots when you hover the club, and that way
you can get the feeling just a little bit. So
(08:40):
choke down, stabilize your lower body. If you have any
excess movement in the bunker, your feet are going to slip.
You're going to dig back into it or hit it thin.
So minimize your like movement. Choke down just a little
bit depending on how far you dig in. If you
dig in a lot, then choke down a little bit more.
So choked accordingly to how much you dig in, and
(09:02):
then hover and practice that on the driving range, and
that should help out your fairway bunkers. Can you do
a lakings hall on your site in the future, yes,
so as you guys know, I have my subscription site,
Only Page. You guys are loving it so far, which
makes me so happy because I've put so much into
that and my team as well has worked really hard
(09:23):
on creating a really great product for you, the people
who want to see only me, Only Page, and so
we've done a lot of really great golf instruction, a
ton of really great golf instruction. That's something I'm most
proud of is the golf instruction there. But also behind
the scenes of all of the events that I do.
You guys have first access to any events, any merch drops.
(09:47):
I just did a meet and greet with Only Page
fans at the Brewers game. It was really awesome. I
got to take pictures with everyone, I signed them bibbleheads,
got to interact with them, and that was only available
through Only and so things like that. We do a
ton of giveaways and fire pictures. I mean, the fourth
of July is coming up and I have some fun things,
(10:09):
some really fun things planned for the Only Page community,
So make sure you guys go check that out. It's
literally Onlypage dot com and it's all yet to do.
But that is all for today with TNA, but not
for the episode. So I know you're probably like, oh, Man, Page,
episode's overallready. No it's not. We're you talk all things
(10:30):
club fitting, golf equipment. It's a really great interview, so
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Speaker 3 (11:18):
And welcoming in now to the Playing Around podcast. Ian Fraser,
the founder of Tour Experience Golf, which owns Club Champion.
Club Champion is one of Page's favorite partners to work
with all about club fitting, and we're going to talk
to Ian about club fitting and how I can benefit
you today and get into a lot of the specific details.
So Ian, thanks for coming on the pod.
Speaker 4 (11:37):
Guys. Great to meet you both. Thank you so much
for having me so ian.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
To kick it off, what is in your bag?
Speaker 4 (11:44):
Paige? That is a great question. That is a is
a revolving door. Right now? What's in my bag? Okay?
Starting stop Stealth to plus in the driver, sim to
three woods, stealth to five wood. I have pa g
O three seventeen CB irons, and I have some custom
(12:04):
sm nines from wedge Works and a Scotti camera putter.
But every day, every hour, it's subject to change. I
always say to people it's a results driven business and
if you're not performing, you're out the door.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
I want to ask that because most people see tour
players who have you know, all callaway, all tailor made,
all tireless. But when it comes down to it, you
should actually have what works best for you. And almost
one hundred percent of the time it's a completely different
brand from your wedges to your irons, to your woods
to your driver. How do you feel when someone walks
(12:39):
in and they're like, I'm a big tileist guy. I
only wants you just roll your acts in that you know.
Speaker 4 (12:45):
I try and always think of it from a standpoint
like it's their session, and you know, we're here to
facilitate and help them just you know, obviously get what
they want out the session. But you're one hundred percent
right that we have to gently nudge them towards being
you know, that's to that we can of using maybe
something over you being brand agnostic. Don't make it about
the brands. Realistically, if they're not paying you big bucks
(13:08):
to play their clubs, play what's right for you and
that's all that matters. I'll never forget is that a
young tech rep in Scotland being on the range and
we go to these multi vendor demo days and working
at Tailor Made at the time, we never had any
good forged irons. So people would come to us and
be like, you know, I want to try your driver,
(13:28):
and I want to try your irons, and I'm like, sure,
come and try your driver, but go down there and
see the mazur guy and go see the titles. Yeah,
they've got great irons down there. So even even at
that that point, when I was working for a manufacturer,
I was very much in the mindset that you have
to use what's right for you, regardless of the brand.
Speaker 3 (13:47):
So one of the biggest questions we get on the
podcast Instagram account, on the pages email address, we get like,
I'm an ex handicap should I get fit for clubs?
Or I'm starting golf? What clubs do you buy?
Speaker 1 (14:00):
What do you have to say to.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
Those people who maybe are just starting golf, let's start there?
And where should they go to begin? Because I know,
if you can barely hit the ball, maybe spending thousands
of dollars on clubs, it's not very realistic.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
It might sound rather like a harsh, like one liner,
but I always say to me, you know, unless you're
low single digits, you're not good enough not to be fit.
So you really have to be fit. So we want
participation numbers to be high. We want people to enjoy
the game and love it. There's nothing more demoralizing than
using equipment that you cannot even get the ball up
(14:34):
in the air, or you know, you're making swings and
the clubs feel heavy, and you're like, oh, enjoy this game.
It's just this isn't for me. So you know, I
think the tools that we have in the bag are
really will dictate a lot of our enjoyment of the
game because we want to get some reward out of
being out there. We all loved it. Good shots. It
doesn't mean going blowing six seven, eight thousand dollars in
(14:56):
a set. That to me is not you know, club
fitting is club Fitsing is using clubs that help you
play better and enjoy the game more. So that's the
most important thing for me. I don't care how you
go about it and how you do it. Just don't
make purchases based on marketing spiel. Make it based on
what works for you.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
That's a great point there, because we were talking about
I like, my boyfriend loves tailor Maid because he likes Rory,
and I'm like, but that doesn't mean that that's necessarily
what's best for you. Like I played Titleist irons growing up,
and in college I had the same ap twos for
like seven years, and I refuse to get rid of
them because I hit them so good. And then one
day I tried Mizuno irons and I was like, well,
I didn't even know Maszuno like had average irons, and
(15:37):
they hit them so good and you would never know.
And I'm like, Page, I have a very mixed bag.
And it's funny. We'll talk about something and she'll be
like Oh, I really like this wedge, and I'm like,
I can't get that wedge off the ground. So it's
very interesting. One thing that we get a lot of
questions about, too, is about the benefit of hybrids, and
Page loves her seven wood. I have a seven wood two.
(15:58):
How beneficial a club like that to a weekend.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
Golfer hugely usually, and without getting too much into like
the specifics of it, because it really is about the
physics of it. It's where the center of gravity lies.
It's the height of the golf club comes down, it
becomes a shallower head. We pull the mass back a
little bit and that makes the ball go up a
touch more. They generally are a little bit lighter, but
it's just you know, for some people who like some
(16:24):
people who like irons, the hybrid is literally that middle ground.
It's it's the best of both worlds. So, you know,
I think that really changed the game for a lot
of maybe slower swing speeds that that kind of they
were able to get the ballflights that the tour pros got.
You you know, you always admire the player and the
range that hits it high and far and land soft,
and and you know, it just gave the average golfer
(16:47):
the ability to play those same shots as these really
elite golfers. You know, going back in a few years
in Scotland, Sandy Lyle once said to me, you know
when when hybrids can came out and had lofted fairwoods
came out, He said him, Jack Nicholas, Tom Wise Coough,
and I think it was Tom Watson, he said it
(17:08):
was the other person. Those four guys had such an
advantage over the other players playing professional golf because they
hit their one in two irons high and none of
the other guys really hit it that high. And then
with the invention of the hybrid and this lofted woods,
everyone can do that now. So it kind of took
that superpower that those players had away from them. So
(17:29):
I think everyone should at least try them and see
what benefit they are for their game.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
I definitely agree with that. I see so many high
hendic kappers trying to hit a three iron, and I
would never hit the three iron. It's just so interesting
where there's just a lot of misinformation within golf, and
I think it is so tied to ego, and you're like, well,
I see the tour players do this so I have
to do this because I want to be as good
as them. And I think there's also a lot of
(17:54):
misconceptions around club fitting and what is a normal process
like when someone walks in and how do you kind
of walk them through a normal club fitting.
Speaker 4 (18:06):
I think the first thing page is just getting them comfortable, right,
Lots of people are just not comfortable in that environment.
They see all this technology, they see all the chaft
well and they're like, this is this is a little overkill.
So I think the first thing for me is just
I like to settle the person down. We send it
a prefit questionnaire, so I know a little bit about them.
So we'll just we'll just get into a little bit
(18:26):
about them and their game and we'll just well chit chat.
And then after that becomes we baseline their current equipment,
so you know, we kind of talk about the objectives
and you know, like I said earlier, it's their session,
so we're we're there to facilitate what they want from
their game. If they have data, you know, whether it's
shot scope or or what's your arcas or whatever company
(18:48):
you know gives them some data, great, we'll look over
that together and you know, look at it for us
strokes game perspective. But you know, we're just going to
start to baseline their equipment, and we're going to start
to explain why maybe the equipment they've got right now,
like you said about three iron, why the apex of
a three irons too low and the angle of descent
is too flat and you're never going to be able
to stop at green. So we start to kind of
(19:09):
make these exit or give them some examples of if
your ball comes in at forty five degrees versus thirty
five degrees, the green effectively expands by four or five times, right,
So we want that. You know, we look at the
best players in word, what do they do. They hit
lots of greens, Their proximity is very very good to
the flag. No one is good hitting in a golf
(19:31):
ball at thirty five degrees coming into a green, especially
not in the summertime. We've got no chance. So you know,
try and explain these sorts of things to them and
just tell them listen to you, you're in good hands
with us. We're kind of here to make your game
the absolute best it can be, and you leave a
better golfer than you came in.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
So I've been getting fit for a very long time
Sam as well. I mean, if you play at a
high level, it's just something that you have to do.
I can never imagine playing clubs off the rack. And
I talk about working with Club Champion and how much
how beneficial it truly is to being a better player,
(20:08):
and I think people think I'm just bullshitting them because
you hear it all the time where it's like, get
this driver, you'll pick up ten more yards. Do this,
you'll pick up twenty more yards. And I don't think
people truly believe it anymore. I did a video recently
where I grabbed a club off the rack. It was
a six hundred dollars club new club. It said it
had a premium shaft in it, and I compared it
(20:29):
to the driver that I got fit a Club Champion,
and there was a massive difference from control, to distance,
to the spin everything. It just was not good compared
to my fitted club. What are some of the biggest
success stories that you have seen through the fitting process,
(20:51):
because I don't think people truly believe it. And I
tell them this constantly. I'm like, go get fit, because
you will hit it, you know. Times farther, or your
irons will be this much more consistent, or you can
shave ten shots off and they're like, you're bullshitting you
paging and it's not actually true, but it is true.
So I want you to share some of your success
stories that you've seen throughout your career.
Speaker 4 (21:13):
Man, there's there's honestly page it like it happens. It
happens in the bay every single day. And you know,
we share someone or some of the fittings that we
do on our YouTube channel, and I get the same
as you. It's like, well, everyone you seem to have
on the channel gains twenty to forty yards. You guys
are just handpicking people. It say, no, this is every
(21:34):
single day that people come through the store and get
these gains. And the funny thing is some people come
through and get thirty yards in the driver and they
walk away and go, yeah, that was good. I think
I'll stick with mine for an now, And I'm.
Speaker 5 (21:45):
Like, are you.
Speaker 4 (21:48):
I want to buy it for you. I'm like, I
can't possibly see you leaving like that. That distance, you know,
stay on the table. But probably one of the coolest
ones was was working with Gary Woodland a few years ago,
so I was doing some stuff with him, and he
came over for the Canadian Open after the Open Championship
at Royal Birkdale. So you know, inevitably playing in the
(22:10):
wind over there, he's kind of get a little bit.
He can get a bit steeping his driver anyway, and
extra steep trying to flight it down on the links,
and his driver was just a bit of a mess
and he had at that time it was kind of
the old PGA Tour schedule of I want to say
it was like the WGC was just before the PGA Championship.
(22:30):
There was like two or three really big events coming up.
So he came up and he was he was swinging
at one twenty three, one twenty four with the driver
ball speed, you know, like one seventy eight, one seventy nine,
and he was flying at maybe like three oh five,
three ten. But the time we were done, he was
flying at three forty five. His ball speed went from
one seventy nine to one eighty five, and it was
(22:53):
just like, you know, just all the all the pieces
and playing. We actually made his driver shorter, but we
added some headweight change shafts into the shaft. He actually
still playing the same shaft today and we kind of
built a foundation for him around his driver that you know,
he had great success with, won the US Open and
all these other things. But you know, in terms of
(23:14):
a notable, he would probably be the biggest one. And
it was. It was a showstopper. We were at Glen
Abbey just outside Toronto here and down in the far
side of the hospitality tent, and he went from hitting
drivers that were kind of running off the back end
of the rain, he was flying into the hospitality tent
and people were kind of stopping to taking of watch.
You could hear them thud off the top of the
(23:35):
tent down on the other side. But yeah, I mean
those gains though, are not just for those those players.
I think there's there's percentage gains in the ten, fifteen,
twenty percent, you know, gains of distance and accuracy for everyone.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
Thank you for leading me right into what I was
going to ask you mentioned. You mentioned a lot of
terms right, like li loft, ball, steed, all this stuff
that maybe if you were a week in golfer who's
a boogie golfer who's only hit off of mats at
your local range with a shitty golf ball into the water.
You don't know what any of that means, right, So
do you think is that an important understanding that you
(24:10):
need to know going into a fitting or do you
guys do a little bit of education or do you
not even bother? You're like, I know what it needs
to be at let's work to get there. Do you
think that's important?
Speaker 4 (24:20):
I think that's a great point. So I think it's
very important. I think, you know, having an understanding of
why we're making making your lang goes a little bit
more upright. And you know, when we start talking about
have a term called compound club fitting, which is we
try and layer performance on top of each other. Right,
we know what compound and interest does for our bank account.
We want to know what compounding you know, technologies and
(24:44):
sort of technical specs of golf clubs do to make
the golf club performing even better. So for someone who's
leaving the face a little bit open and dynamically toe
down on their six houn, they don't really have much
of a chance to square that club face. Whereas if
we get the lang but more upright, and we get
a go that rotates a little bit more, we're adding
multiple things into helping them hit it a little bit better.
(25:05):
So yeah, it was one of my biggest goals when
we set that it started the YouTube channels.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
One.
Speaker 4 (25:09):
I wanted educated consumers. I didn't want people making bad
purchases based on just not knowing you know, the right
information about you know, the terms like you said, ball, speeding, CG. Location,
And it's always you're always treading a bit of a
fine line between going to technical where they're like right
over my head or educating to the point where it's
(25:30):
useful information. So we try and sort of, you know,
depending who's in front of us, somebody who's more technically
mind as we can go there with them, they love it, right,
you can't give them enough technical information, and then other
people you can just you just want to kind of
gently kind of hold their hand through it. But that's me.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
I'm that person.
Speaker 4 (25:47):
Yeah, totally page and you know, honestly, like Gary Woodland
was the same way. I always use him as an
example because he was working with Butch Harmon. I said, Okay,
tell me a little bit about your specs, tell me
a little bit about your levery, what's your normal angle attack?
And he's looking at me like he's like Ian Butch
never turns launch moitor on. Ever. He's like, I have
no idea, and you know some people are. I think
(26:10):
that there's there's highly likely the ten handicapper who goes
for lessons every single week and goes and gets on
a launch onsor knows more of it their delivery than
most of the PGA tour players out there. There's only
so much information you need to know. I just think
you need a good mechanic in the garage who's you know,
happy to take that burden. And that's the job that
we take. You know, we look after the tools, you
(26:31):
look after playing the game.
Speaker 3 (26:32):
We talk about that.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Like all the time. Yeah. No, it's good to know because,
like you're saying, there are players who want to know
all of that information. You're able to do that. And
then there's times where someone will hand me a driver.
I'm like, it's too shiny. I don't like it, but
I'm like, okay, it's like the look of it, the feeling,
you know, that's what I go off of. And I'm
a real field player, And they're like, okay, too shiny,
We'll get you a mat one. You know, like they
(26:55):
can always adjust, which I think is great.
Speaker 4 (26:57):
I think that's such a great point. I mean, I
hate a driver that sits up right, I hate I'm
like you, I hate a shiny driver. I hate a
driver that's two round, because I lately think like anything
with that much curvature on it is surely got more role,
to the point where if I hit one on the
tony heel, it's going to go worse than if I do.
It's something that looks like it's got flatter face. So
we have all these little, you know, internal biases towards
(27:19):
you know, what clubs look like or how they feel,
and it shapes how we perform.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (27:25):
So something that's an interesting point on that is putter
fitting that I feel like a lot of people don't
necessarily consider. They think club fitting, they're thinking ironed driver,
whatever comes in between. A quick little shout out on
page subscription side only page. In September, we will be
giving away three free putters and putter fittings from Club Champion.
(27:45):
Thank you Club Champion. So can you talk a little
bit about that and how important that is too, because
I feel talk about buying shit off the rack like
that is what people do they see. Oh my god,
it's Scottie Cameron and they spend five hundred dollars and
maybe I mean the toes ninety degrees up in the
air like gives me. It gives me a migraine.
Speaker 4 (28:04):
One hundred percent putter fitting is I mean, like we've
said it till we're blue the face. The stats show it.
That's the club that we use the most. It's it's
our biggest opportunity to impact or score is to be
Obviously you have fear putts. People have no idea what
they're putter is designed to do. They really don't. And
(28:24):
we start talking again. You know, get without two technico,
but you know the length of the blade right, we
extend the length of the blade. We reduce the rate
of rotation. So for me, just I just simplify what
side do you miss on most? Left or right? Because
if I can stabilize your club face, I can help
you putt more consistently. I think the other thing that
(28:46):
people don't realize is the value of speed versus line.
It's very important obviously to pick a right line. It's
going to be hard to hold the putts if we
don't get the right line. But speed is five times
more impactful on three put of avoidance the line. So
when I'm looking at the player's performance, I'm looking for
a consistency of ball speed. So I want that ball
leave in the club face at the same speed every
(29:08):
single time. I need to know that what's in their mind,
what their eyes translate to their hands, translates to the
potter results and obviously a consistent result. So if I
know I can get your ball speed good and I
can control your club face from a direction standpoint, it's
up to you to the letner to read greens. And
I'm good with with people taking their chances on that.
(29:28):
But people don't realize nearly how impactful a fitted putter is.
Speaker 1 (29:33):
I just did a putter fitting and yeah, I didn't
realize it. The shape of the neck of my putter
didn't fit well for me, and so I tend to
miss right and they're like, well, the next the way
that the next sets up, you're actually going to miss
even farther right. And there was like the toe hang
and all this stuff, and they were saying these things,
and I'm like, I've been doing this forever and I
know this, and I thought, this is what you know.
(29:53):
I like the look of but you could see the result.
Speaker 4 (29:56):
It was.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
It was massive. And when I talk about the people
always say, well, you're good, so it's easy for you
to go get fit because you know what you want.
But people who are you know, twenty handicaps or so
they can get fit, right, how do you work through
that process? I think a lot of people don't go
because they feel like they're not good enough to get fit.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (30:17):
I think it goes back to again back to the
higher the handicap, the more opportunity or the more benefit
you stand to gain from from being fit. So we
can make it super simple. And things like the two
ball putter, right, they totally change and revolutionize the way
people could sort of visually line themselves up. And it's
so important to get those basics fundamentally right. But like
(30:41):
you said, the amount of toll hang you have, the
face inset? Do you like an insert or do you
like a you know, mild face? Do you like something
that has offset or no offset? Do you have something
even just being over the potter, right over the ball
and having your eye line somewhat over the ball. And
if I want you to end increase your arc and
make you stand up a little bit more for what
(31:02):
you the decrease your arc A, shorten your putter and
get you over it a little bit more. Do we
want the grip to be thin where you have high release,
or do we want it to be thicker and have
a much slower release so we can influence that rate
of rotation at all times. And it's just I think
the technology that we use at Club Champo, whether it
be SAM or whether it be Quintic, I think the
(31:23):
technology is an absolute eye opener. The putter fits the
most fun for me because I know people don't have
any idea as to what their putter needs to be
for them specifically, They've done exactly what you said page.
They go in there, they take a look at one,
and they go I like the look of it. I
can get a put fairly close with it. Feels quite
nice that that'll do for me, but it does not
(31:44):
generally translate to good results.
Speaker 1 (31:46):
Yeah. I feel like the theme of the segment is misinformation,
and I feel like when it comes to club fitting,
one of the biggest things that I hear is I
can't get fit because it's too expensive. So I just
want you to talk about the cost of it, because
any equipment is expensive, and I say that it is
(32:07):
an investment and you will have these clubs for a
lot longer, and you feel more comfortable with the clubs,
and it is so worth it to go through the
fitting process instead of going and getting a driver off
the wreck, which is still expensive six hundred dollars or so,
and then you don't like it, and then you get
another one and another one, and you guys can actually
do it on a budget, correct, Like you can. Someone
(32:28):
can walk in and say, hey, this is the amount
that I want to spend and what does that look like?
What is the least amount of money that you think
someone could spend on a new set of clubs.
Speaker 4 (32:37):
I think you're absolutely right. People can come in and
get I mean, there's I guess some of the companies
who offer more budget kind of friendly products now, maybe
something like Cobra or Mizzuo. You know, those those drivers
tanying to be a little bit less than like a
titlest and a ping. There's ranges of shafts from one
hundred and fifty dollars up to five six hundred dollars.
(32:59):
So don't people, I think you're right. People think that
it's it's you know, I can't possibly afford the custom
you know, fitted for a driver. The average lifespan of
a driver for our clients is about four to five years,
and if we look at the buying behavior of clients,
it's like every year searching for the latest and greatest.
(33:19):
You do that twice inside that four to five year
timeline that we see our clients keep a driver for
And you're already spending too much. So I'm with you.
I think it's cheaper in the long run to do
it and do it right. And then most important to
be honest is knowing that when your swing changes, and
I use the word when, not if. When your swing changes,
(33:40):
you have someone then you can go back and they
can can readjust it. We know how adjustable drivers are
nowadays with weights and loved sleeves and all these different things.
Maybe it's a cheft change, not a head change. But
you want to work with a technician that you trust,
someone that you know you know has got the right
technology with track man er GC quad and they can
tell you what's right for you. But you're making little
(34:02):
tweaks over that time to incrementally get better all the time,
not wholesale changes to a new driver every single year.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
I noticed that too, So I go back into Club
Champion all the time because they fix my loft and
lies for free. And that's one of the services that
people don't, you know, realize that they offer, which I
think is great. How do you deter people from getting
excited about like a new equipment that's constantly coming out
and knowing that maybe that's it's not what's best for
(34:29):
you and maybe there's not a big jump in changes
every single six months when something comes out. How do
you deal with that?
Speaker 4 (34:38):
Yeah, it's definitely something we do deal with all the time.
And we get people delay in their fit because they
heard in three months there's a new line coming out
from this company or that company, And I say the
exactly what you said. It doesn't it won't make a difference.
There isn't seismic changes every every you know, new model
of iron or driver. There isn't those leaps forward to anore.
(35:00):
I think it just I think it just comes down
to really we changes as individuals, or swing changes, and
you're going through it right now with your swing changes,
so you're probably going to look at your equip I
think we're getting together, not you know later this year
to do some equipment stuff with you, and like, I
can't wait to see where your swing has got to
to see what equipment changes you need. Yeah, that's going
(35:21):
to be a really really fun part of the process
with you is you're putting in all this time and
I can see that the differences it's making. Already your
swing's really starting to look great, but you're probably not
that comfortable with it yet. So in a couple more months,
you know, we're we're going to have a look at
your equipment and going to see what's changed. So I
think that's that's a huge, huge part of it is,
(35:43):
you know, making those on the goal changes. Love to lie,
you know, adjustments. I say to our clients, I want
to do it with I want to look at that
with you every year. I want to make sure I
have a little tune up session with you, see what
you're working on. Did you make a golf ball change?
That's another really you know, underrated part of the equipment.
It's the fifteenth club for me is the golf ball.
I mean, if we take the low spinning golf ball
(36:05):
and the high spinning golf ball with a six iron,
there's about fifteen hundred RPMs a difference between those two.
So it's it's it's way more than we can make
with the loft of laye adjustment. So you may have went, oh,
I love the titleist whatever and prov one and then
I'm going to go to a Kirkland. Those two golf
balls about a thousand RPMs a spin difference, And you've
made that decision off of cost. Ye, right, and those
(36:27):
whole that whole set of clubs that you get fit for. Yoh,
my driver doesn't work pretty good anymore. Those irons are
really not going to keep coming up short. We've added
a thousand rpm of spin to your irons and you
can't get the ball to the target anymore. And so
you know, we're just there. We're you know, we're just
part of the team to help people make those correct choices,
(36:50):
not bad ones.
Speaker 1 (36:50):
Yeah, one hundred percent agree. Before we wrap, I want
to ask you what are some of your favorite products
that are out in the market right now.
Speaker 4 (37:00):
Was a huge fan of Ping drivers. I just think,
you know, Ping make incredible drivers. Specifically, I think they're
so forgiven they have gotten a lot faster. They used
to lag a little bit ball speed. Now they don't
they're they're they're really really good. I think Titlest have
absolutely killed it with with SM nine. In the wedges,
I think Mizuno and Strickson are making two of the
(37:21):
most underrated irons out there. And in the potter world
even Thole have just released a new putter fitting system
that I think is going to change the way that
we fit putters in our studios. I was talking to
the guys and I was in Chicago last Thursday, and
I was talking to the guys about their new for
putter fitting kit. And there's so many things now. If
(37:44):
actually we told you how many things were like the consumer,
how many things are to change, it probably would put
them off if we said, like we're changing nexts and
weights and lens and balance points on the shaft and
grip size. But it just gives us so many more
tools in our toolbox. So yeah, a few things to
keep your eye on.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
That's really exciting. I always love trying new equipment and
everything else that's out Bean. Thank you so much for
sharing all of your insight and knowledge with us. I
think that all the listeners learned a ton. If you
guys want to go get fit. Don't forget to use
my code page. That's Paige and you guty discount on
your fitting, so definitely go check that out and Ian
(38:22):
thank you so much again.
Speaker 4 (38:23):
Thank you guys.
Speaker 2 (38:25):
Follow playing Around with Paige Renee on IR radio or
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Speaker 2 (00:45):
This is Playing Around with Page Renee.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Hello everyone, welcome back to the Playing Round podcast. I'm
your host, Page Renee. Later on in this episode, I'll
be joined my by co host Sam and the founder
of Tour Experience Golf and the co host of the
t XG YouTube channel, Ian Frasier. We're going to talk
all things equipment club fitting. He gives you some really
(01:12):
great insight, so keep on listening for that later on
in this episode. But I thought I would start out
with some T and A. So let's just get right
on into it. The first question is when do you
feel the sexiest. I feel like the popular answer to
this and most women say no, makeup, sweatpants, hair tied up,
(01:32):
and you know the Drake song, that's what I feel
my sexiest, and I'm like, yep, I am the complete
opposite of that. I feel my sexiest when I am
dressed the nines, hair's done, makeup's done, I'm wearing this
tight little outfit. You know, the girls are popping, they're
saying hello to the world. That is when I feel
(01:54):
my sexiest. And I think that's when I shoot my
content when I am dressed as Paige Renee. Talk about
this all the time, where it's almost my alter ego
now is Paige Renee, And I feel like I almost
need to do that when I'm creating content to feel
my most sexiest and my most confident, and it's almost
this mass that I'm wearing in a way, but it's
(02:15):
just how I feel my best. And a lot of
people talk about my clothes. It's always a big subject
of discussion and people say, oh, you do it for
and attention, and you know, I think everyone on social
media is on you know, they're on social media for attention,
but yes, I do it because that's how I feel
my best. That's how I feel my most confident is
(02:36):
when I'm wearing those outfits that you know are nice
and tight and I love it. Next question, what is
your favorite golf tournament to watch? Definitely the majors, all
of the majors, Masters probably my favorite, then the US Open,
the Open, and then the PGA Championship. But this year
(02:56):
the PGA Championship gave the US Open a run for money,
and I think that it was actually better than the
US Open. So we'll see what the Open has to
offer for US. But if I have to rank this
year for the majors, it was the Master so far,
the PGA Championship, and then the US Open, so.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
We will see.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
What is your favorite cuisine? I would probably say Asian.
I love Asian food, any type of Asian food always
a go to, but it's not my favorite meal to have.
Ice Cream is my most favorite thing to eat. If
I had one last meal, it would one hundred percent
be ice cream, and then probably corn dogs and a
(03:36):
grilled cheese or like mac and cheese, anything with cheese.
What turns you want cheese? Now?
Speaker 3 (03:43):
What turns me on the most?
Speaker 1 (03:45):
I think a good sense of humor. That's something that
I really appreciate in someone else, as someone who can
laugh their self can make me laugh. I like to laugh.
I have a I think I have a really great
sense of humor. I know some people say that I
take myself too seriously. I'm always playing the victim on
social media, which is a lie. If one headline goes
(04:07):
viral from this podcast, I hope it's this one because
people are constantly like, you're always.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Planning the victim.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
You never own up to let you do, and so
New York Posts please write about this. I want to
read paid Sporanic owns up to her brand and is
unapologetically herself done. Period. I love how I got there
from what turns you on the most? Yeah, that's just
how my brain works. Would you ever consider running a
(04:34):
golf clinic for beginner golfers? Yes, one hundred percent. I
have been wanting to do this for the longest time.
My ultimate goal in all of this is to make
enough money where I can open up my own golf
course with amazing driving range, an amazing group of golf
instructors and help everyone become a better player, but specifically
(04:55):
junior golfers. That is a passion of mine and something
that I really want to do and something that I
I'm working towards. That is the long term goal because
every time someone would be like, how do you see
yourself in five years or ten years or fifteen years,
and I never really had an answer, And so one
day I just sat down, I said, what am I
most passionate about? Why do I do this? And the
reason I do this is to grow the game of golf.
(05:17):
And to do that it's through great golf instruction through
the junior golf level and beginner golfers and getting people
into the game. So that is what I want to do.
How long did it take you to teach Nico tricks?
So I taught him where I go bang and He'll
play dead. But I got to give my mom a
lot of credit for this one. She loves teaching Nico
(05:40):
tricks and so she did majority of the work and
we would do some of them together, but she did
so many from the very beginning, Like as soon as
he was a puppy, he could sit, he could give paw,
he could do all of these things, and he can
do so many tricks. It's actually really impressive. N Goo
is a very smart doggie. Who's the best looking professional
golfer men's and women's I would say, I mean, you
(06:05):
gotta go with Adam Scott. That's a popular pick. And
on the women's side, there's a bunch. There's a lot
of really beautiful female golfers. I think Nellie Korda is
the full package. I think she speaks well, she's beautiful,
she has a great personality. Clearly, she's an amazing golfer.
She looks incredible in all of her editorial pictures that
(06:27):
she does. She can do high fashion, she can also
do just you know, her fun, really candid pictures that
she does on Instagram. So yeah, she's she's a great follow.
What is your favorite hobby that's not sports related. I've
talked about this on the podcast where I've gone through
a lot of therapy, and one thing we were working
(06:48):
on in therapy was getting hobbies because from a very
young age, I really just got into sports and I
was a competitive gymnast and I went to golf and
I didn't have time I'm to do anything else, and
so My whole life has revolved around being the best
that I could possibly be in sports, gymnastics, in golf,
(07:09):
and after golf it was social media. And so I've
always been really driven on one singular goal and I
have never put any of my energy into hobbies. And
my therapist said that that's really unhealthy and you do
need to get away and have hobbies and have other
things in your life and other interests, and that was
(07:32):
something that was never a part of me or my life.
And so that's a very long winded way to say
that I still don't have any hobbies and I'm a
work in progress. What's your advice on overcoming fairway bunkers.
Fairway bunkers are difficult for a ton of different reasons,
but the biggest reason is that you never practice them.
There are very few bunkers on practice facilities, and most
(07:56):
of the time, if there is a bunker, it's a
green side bunker, and you can't hit fairway bunker shots.
And so when you're thrown into a fairway bunker on
the golf course, you're looking at and you're like, hmm,
I've never hit this shot before, or the last time
I did. Is when the last time I was in
the fairway bunker and I didn't hit it well, and
so you never practice it. So when you dig your
feet in, you need to choke down. Most people will
(08:18):
not choke down, but they forget the fact that they
have dug their feet in at least an inch, and
so they'll always hit it fat because of that reason.
A lot of people also struggle with hovering the club
because they're so u sick holding it on the ground.
So when you're practicing on the driving range, hit a
few shots when you hover the club, and that way
you can get the feeling just a little bit. So
(08:40):
choke down, stabilize your lower body. If you have any
excess movement in the bunker, your feet are going to slip.
You're going to dig back into it or hit it thin.
So minimize your like movement. Choke down just a little
bit depending on how far you dig in. If you
dig in a lot, then choke down a little bit more.
So choked accordingly to how much you dig in, and
(09:02):
then hover and practice that on the driving range, and
that should help out your fairway bunkers. Can you do
a lakings hall on your site in the future, yes,
so as you guys know, I have my subscription site,
Only Page. You guys are loving it so far, which
makes me so happy because I've put so much into
that and my team as well has worked really hard
(09:23):
on creating a really great product for you, the people
who want to see only me, Only Page, and so
we've done a lot of really great golf instruction, a
ton of really great golf instruction. That's something I'm most
proud of is the golf instruction there. But also behind
the scenes of all of the events that I do.
You guys have first access to any events, any merch drops.
(09:47):
I just did a meet and greet with Only Page
fans at the Brewers game. It was really awesome. I
got to take pictures with everyone, I signed them bibbleheads,
got to interact with them, and that was only available
through Only and so things like that. We do a
ton of giveaways and fire pictures. I mean, the fourth
of July is coming up and I have some fun things,
(10:09):
some really fun things planned for the Only Page community,
So make sure you guys go check that out. It's
literally Onlypage dot com and it's all yet to do.
But that is all for today with TNA, but not
for the episode. So I know you're probably like, oh, Man, Page,
episode's overallready. No it's not. We're you talk all things
(10:30):
club fitting, golf equipment. It's a really great interview, so
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Speaker 3 (11:18):
And welcoming in now to the Playing Around podcast. Ian Fraser,
the founder of Tour Experience Golf, which owns Club Champion.
Club Champion is one of Page's favorite partners to work
with all about club fitting, and we're going to talk
to Ian about club fitting and how I can benefit
you today and get into a lot of the specific details.
So Ian, thanks for coming on the pod.
Speaker 4 (11:37):
Guys. Great to meet you both. Thank you so much
for having me so ian.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
To kick it off, what is in your bag?
Speaker 4 (11:44):
Paige? That is a great question. That is a is
a revolving door. Right now? What's in my bag? Okay?
Starting stop Stealth to plus in the driver, sim to
three woods, stealth to five wood. I have pa g
O three seventeen CB irons, and I have some custom
(12:04):
sm nines from wedge Works and a Scotti camera putter.
But every day, every hour, it's subject to change. I
always say to people it's a results driven business and
if you're not performing, you're out the door.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
I want to ask that because most people see tour
players who have you know, all callaway, all tailor made,
all tireless. But when it comes down to it, you
should actually have what works best for you. And almost
one hundred percent of the time it's a completely different
brand from your wedges to your irons, to your woods
to your driver. How do you feel when someone walks
(12:39):
in and they're like, I'm a big tileist guy. I
only wants you just roll your acts in that you know.
Speaker 4 (12:45):
I try and always think of it from a standpoint
like it's their session, and you know, we're here to
facilitate and help them just you know, obviously get what
they want out the session. But you're one hundred percent
right that we have to gently nudge them towards being
you know, that's to that we can of using maybe
something over you being brand agnostic. Don't make it about
the brands. Realistically, if they're not paying you big bucks
(13:08):
to play their clubs, play what's right for you and
that's all that matters. I'll never forget is that a
young tech rep in Scotland being on the range and
we go to these multi vendor demo days and working
at Tailor Made at the time, we never had any
good forged irons. So people would come to us and
be like, you know, I want to try your driver,
(13:28):
and I want to try your irons, and I'm like, sure,
come and try your driver, but go down there and
see the mazur guy and go see the titles. Yeah,
they've got great irons down there. So even even at
that that point, when I was working for a manufacturer,
I was very much in the mindset that you have
to use what's right for you, regardless of the brand.
Speaker 3 (13:47):
So one of the biggest questions we get on the
podcast Instagram account, on the pages email address, we get like,
I'm an ex handicap should I get fit for clubs?
Or I'm starting golf? What clubs do you buy?
Speaker 1 (14:00):
What do you have to say to.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
Those people who maybe are just starting golf, let's start there?
And where should they go to begin? Because I know,
if you can barely hit the ball, maybe spending thousands
of dollars on clubs, it's not very realistic.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
It might sound rather like a harsh, like one liner,
but I always say to me, you know, unless you're
low single digits, you're not good enough not to be fit.
So you really have to be fit. So we want
participation numbers to be high. We want people to enjoy
the game and love it. There's nothing more demoralizing than
using equipment that you cannot even get the ball up
(14:34):
in the air, or you know, you're making swings and
the clubs feel heavy, and you're like, oh, enjoy this game.
It's just this isn't for me. So you know, I
think the tools that we have in the bag are
really will dictate a lot of our enjoyment of the
game because we want to get some reward out of
being out there. We all loved it. Good shots. It
doesn't mean going blowing six seven, eight thousand dollars in
(14:56):
a set. That to me is not you know, club
fitting is club Fitsing is using clubs that help you
play better and enjoy the game more. So that's the
most important thing for me. I don't care how you
go about it and how you do it. Just don't
make purchases based on marketing spiel. Make it based on
what works for you.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
That's a great point there, because we were talking about
I like, my boyfriend loves tailor Maid because he likes Rory,
and I'm like, but that doesn't mean that that's necessarily
what's best for you. Like I played Titleist irons growing up,
and in college I had the same ap twos for
like seven years, and I refuse to get rid of
them because I hit them so good. And then one
day I tried Mizuno irons and I was like, well,
I didn't even know Maszuno like had average irons, and
(15:37):
they hit them so good and you would never know.
And I'm like, Page, I have a very mixed bag.
And it's funny. We'll talk about something and she'll be
like Oh, I really like this wedge, and I'm like,
I can't get that wedge off the ground. So it's
very interesting. One thing that we get a lot of
questions about, too, is about the benefit of hybrids, and
Page loves her seven wood. I have a seven wood two.
(15:58):
How beneficial a club like that to a weekend.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
Golfer hugely usually, and without getting too much into like
the specifics of it, because it really is about the
physics of it. It's where the center of gravity lies.
It's the height of the golf club comes down, it
becomes a shallower head. We pull the mass back a
little bit and that makes the ball go up a
touch more. They generally are a little bit lighter, but
it's just you know, for some people who like some
(16:24):
people who like irons, the hybrid is literally that middle ground.
It's it's the best of both worlds. So, you know,
I think that really changed the game for a lot
of maybe slower swing speeds that that kind of they
were able to get the ballflights that the tour pros got.
You you know, you always admire the player and the
range that hits it high and far and land soft,
and and you know, it just gave the average golfer
(16:47):
the ability to play those same shots as these really
elite golfers. You know, going back in a few years
in Scotland, Sandy Lyle once said to me, you know
when when hybrids can came out and had lofted fairwoods
came out, He said him, Jack Nicholas, Tom Wise Coough,
and I think it was Tom Watson, he said it
(17:08):
was the other person. Those four guys had such an
advantage over the other players playing professional golf because they
hit their one in two irons high and none of
the other guys really hit it that high. And then
with the invention of the hybrid and this lofted woods,
everyone can do that now. So it kind of took
that superpower that those players had away from them. So
(17:29):
I think everyone should at least try them and see
what benefit they are for their game.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
I definitely agree with that. I see so many high
hendic kappers trying to hit a three iron, and I
would never hit the three iron. It's just so interesting
where there's just a lot of misinformation within golf, and
I think it is so tied to ego, and you're like, well,
I see the tour players do this so I have
to do this because I want to be as good
as them. And I think there's also a lot of
(17:54):
misconceptions around club fitting and what is a normal process
like when someone walks in and how do you kind
of walk them through a normal club fitting.
Speaker 4 (18:06):
I think the first thing page is just getting them comfortable, right,
Lots of people are just not comfortable in that environment.
They see all this technology, they see all the chaft
well and they're like, this is this is a little overkill.
So I think the first thing for me is just
I like to settle the person down. We send it
a prefit questionnaire, so I know a little bit about them.
So we'll just we'll just get into a little bit
(18:26):
about them and their game and we'll just well chit chat.
And then after that becomes we baseline their current equipment,
so you know, we kind of talk about the objectives
and you know, like I said earlier, it's their session,
so we're we're there to facilitate what they want from
their game. If they have data, you know, whether it's
shot scope or or what's your arcas or whatever company
(18:48):
you know gives them some data, great, we'll look over
that together and you know, look at it for us
strokes game perspective. But you know, we're just going to
start to baseline their equipment, and we're going to start
to explain why maybe the equipment they've got right now,
like you said about three iron, why the apex of
a three irons too low and the angle of descent
is too flat and you're never going to be able
to stop at green. So we start to kind of
(19:09):
make these exit or give them some examples of if
your ball comes in at forty five degrees versus thirty
five degrees, the green effectively expands by four or five times, right,
So we want that. You know, we look at the
best players in word, what do they do. They hit
lots of greens, Their proximity is very very good to
the flag. No one is good hitting in a golf
(19:31):
ball at thirty five degrees coming into a green, especially
not in the summertime. We've got no chance. So you know,
try and explain these sorts of things to them and
just tell them listen to you, you're in good hands
with us. We're kind of here to make your game
the absolute best it can be, and you leave a
better golfer than you came in.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
So I've been getting fit for a very long time
Sam as well. I mean, if you play at a
high level, it's just something that you have to do.
I can never imagine playing clubs off the rack. And
I talk about working with Club Champion and how much
how beneficial it truly is to being a better player,
(20:08):
and I think people think I'm just bullshitting them because
you hear it all the time where it's like, get
this driver, you'll pick up ten more yards. Do this,
you'll pick up twenty more yards. And I don't think
people truly believe it anymore. I did a video recently
where I grabbed a club off the rack. It was
a six hundred dollars club new club. It said it
had a premium shaft in it, and I compared it
(20:29):
to the driver that I got fit a Club Champion,
and there was a massive difference from control, to distance,
to the spin everything. It just was not good compared
to my fitted club. What are some of the biggest
success stories that you have seen through the fitting process,
(20:51):
because I don't think people truly believe it. And I
tell them this constantly. I'm like, go get fit, because
you will hit it, you know. Times farther, or your
irons will be this much more consistent, or you can
shave ten shots off and they're like, you're bullshitting you
paging and it's not actually true, but it is true.
So I want you to share some of your success
stories that you've seen throughout your career.
Speaker 4 (21:13):
Man, there's there's honestly page it like it happens. It
happens in the bay every single day. And you know,
we share someone or some of the fittings that we
do on our YouTube channel, and I get the same
as you. It's like, well, everyone you seem to have
on the channel gains twenty to forty yards. You guys
are just handpicking people. It say, no, this is every
(21:34):
single day that people come through the store and get
these gains. And the funny thing is some people come
through and get thirty yards in the driver and they
walk away and go, yeah, that was good. I think
I'll stick with mine for an now, And I'm.
Speaker 5 (21:45):
Like, are you.
Speaker 4 (21:48):
I want to buy it for you. I'm like, I
can't possibly see you leaving like that. That distance, you know,
stay on the table. But probably one of the coolest
ones was was working with Gary Woodland a few years ago,
so I was doing some stuff with him, and he
came over for the Canadian Open after the Open Championship
at Royal Birkdale. So you know, inevitably playing in the
(22:10):
wind over there, he's kind of get a little bit.
He can get a bit steeping his driver anyway, and
extra steep trying to flight it down on the links,
and his driver was just a bit of a mess
and he had at that time it was kind of
the old PGA Tour schedule of I want to say
it was like the WGC was just before the PGA Championship.
(22:30):
There was like two or three really big events coming up.
So he came up and he was he was swinging
at one twenty three, one twenty four with the driver
ball speed, you know, like one seventy eight, one seventy nine,
and he was flying at maybe like three oh five,
three ten. But the time we were done, he was
flying at three forty five. His ball speed went from
one seventy nine to one eighty five, and it was
(22:53):
just like, you know, just all the all the pieces
and playing. We actually made his driver shorter, but we
added some headweight change shafts into the shaft. He actually
still playing the same shaft today and we kind of
built a foundation for him around his driver that you know,
he had great success with, won the US Open and
all these other things. But you know, in terms of
(23:14):
a notable, he would probably be the biggest one. And
it was. It was a showstopper. We were at Glen
Abbey just outside Toronto here and down in the far
side of the hospitality tent, and he went from hitting
drivers that were kind of running off the back end
of the rain, he was flying into the hospitality tent
and people were kind of stopping to taking of watch.
You could hear them thud off the top of the
(23:35):
tent down on the other side. But yeah, I mean
those gains though, are not just for those those players.
I think there's there's percentage gains in the ten, fifteen,
twenty percent, you know, gains of distance and accuracy for everyone.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
Thank you for leading me right into what I was
going to ask you mentioned. You mentioned a lot of
terms right, like li loft, ball, steed, all this stuff
that maybe if you were a week in golfer who's
a boogie golfer who's only hit off of mats at
your local range with a shitty golf ball into the water.
You don't know what any of that means, right, So
do you think is that an important understanding that you
(24:10):
need to know going into a fitting or do you
guys do a little bit of education or do you
not even bother? You're like, I know what it needs
to be at let's work to get there. Do you
think that's important?
Speaker 4 (24:20):
I think that's a great point. So I think it's
very important. I think, you know, having an understanding of
why we're making making your lang goes a little bit
more upright. And you know, when we start talking about
have a term called compound club fitting, which is we
try and layer performance on top of each other. Right,
we know what compound and interest does for our bank account.
We want to know what compounding you know, technologies and
(24:44):
sort of technical specs of golf clubs do to make
the golf club performing even better. So for someone who's
leaving the face a little bit open and dynamically toe
down on their six houn, they don't really have much
of a chance to square that club face. Whereas if
we get the lang but more upright, and we get
a go that rotates a little bit more, we're adding
multiple things into helping them hit it a little bit better.
(25:05):
So yeah, it was one of my biggest goals when
we set that it started the YouTube channels.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
One.
Speaker 4 (25:09):
I wanted educated consumers. I didn't want people making bad
purchases based on just not knowing you know, the right
information about you know, the terms like you said, ball, speeding, CG. Location,
And it's always you're always treading a bit of a
fine line between going to technical where they're like right
over my head or educating to the point where it's
(25:30):
useful information. So we try and sort of, you know,
depending who's in front of us, somebody who's more technically
mind as we can go there with them, they love it, right,
you can't give them enough technical information, and then other
people you can just you just want to kind of
gently kind of hold their hand through it. But that's me.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
I'm that person.
Speaker 4 (25:47):
Yeah, totally page and you know, honestly, like Gary Woodland
was the same way. I always use him as an
example because he was working with Butch Harmon. I said, Okay,
tell me a little bit about your specs, tell me
a little bit about your levery, what's your normal angle attack?
And he's looking at me like he's like Ian Butch
never turns launch moitor on. Ever. He's like, I have
no idea, and you know some people are. I think
(26:10):
that there's there's highly likely the ten handicapper who goes
for lessons every single week and goes and gets on
a launch onsor knows more of it their delivery than
most of the PGA tour players out there. There's only
so much information you need to know. I just think
you need a good mechanic in the garage who's you know,
happy to take that burden. And that's the job that
we take. You know, we look after the tools, you
(26:31):
look after playing the game.
Speaker 3 (26:32):
We talk about that.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Like all the time. Yeah. No, it's good to know because,
like you're saying, there are players who want to know
all of that information. You're able to do that. And
then there's times where someone will hand me a driver.
I'm like, it's too shiny. I don't like it, but
I'm like, okay, it's like the look of it, the feeling,
you know, that's what I go off of. And I'm
a real field player, And they're like, okay, too shiny,
We'll get you a mat one. You know, like they
(26:55):
can always adjust, which I think is great.
Speaker 4 (26:57):
I think that's such a great point. I mean, I
hate a driver that sits up right, I hate I'm
like you, I hate a shiny driver. I hate a
driver that's two round, because I lately think like anything
with that much curvature on it is surely got more role,
to the point where if I hit one on the
tony heel, it's going to go worse than if I do.
It's something that looks like it's got flatter face. So
we have all these little, you know, internal biases towards
(27:19):
you know, what clubs look like or how they feel,
and it shapes how we perform.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (27:25):
So something that's an interesting point on that is putter
fitting that I feel like a lot of people don't
necessarily consider. They think club fitting, they're thinking ironed driver,
whatever comes in between. A quick little shout out on
page subscription side only page. In September, we will be
giving away three free putters and putter fittings from Club Champion.
(27:45):
Thank you Club Champion. So can you talk a little
bit about that and how important that is too, because
I feel talk about buying shit off the rack like
that is what people do they see. Oh my god,
it's Scottie Cameron and they spend five hundred dollars and
maybe I mean the toes ninety degrees up in the
air like gives me. It gives me a migraine.
Speaker 4 (28:04):
One hundred percent putter fitting is I mean, like we've
said it till we're blue the face. The stats show it.
That's the club that we use the most. It's it's
our biggest opportunity to impact or score is to be
Obviously you have fear putts. People have no idea what
they're putter is designed to do. They really don't. And
(28:24):
we start talking again. You know, get without two technico,
but you know the length of the blade right, we
extend the length of the blade. We reduce the rate
of rotation. So for me, just I just simplify what
side do you miss on most? Left or right? Because
if I can stabilize your club face, I can help
you putt more consistently. I think the other thing that
(28:46):
people don't realize is the value of speed versus line.
It's very important obviously to pick a right line. It's
going to be hard to hold the putts if we
don't get the right line. But speed is five times
more impactful on three put of avoidance the line. So
when I'm looking at the player's performance, I'm looking for
a consistency of ball speed. So I want that ball
leave in the club face at the same speed every
(29:08):
single time. I need to know that what's in their mind,
what their eyes translate to their hands, translates to the
potter results and obviously a consistent result. So if I
know I can get your ball speed good and I
can control your club face from a direction standpoint, it's
up to you to the letner to read greens. And
I'm good with with people taking their chances on that.
(29:28):
But people don't realize nearly how impactful a fitted putter is.
Speaker 1 (29:33):
I just did a putter fitting and yeah, I didn't
realize it. The shape of the neck of my putter
didn't fit well for me, and so I tend to
miss right and they're like, well, the next the way
that the next sets up, you're actually going to miss
even farther right. And there was like the toe hang
and all this stuff, and they were saying these things,
and I'm like, I've been doing this forever and I
know this, and I thought, this is what you know.
(29:53):
I like the look of but you could see the result.
Speaker 4 (29:56):
It was.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
It was massive. And when I talk about the people
always say, well, you're good, so it's easy for you
to go get fit because you know what you want.
But people who are you know, twenty handicaps or so
they can get fit, right, how do you work through
that process? I think a lot of people don't go
because they feel like they're not good enough to get fit.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (30:17):
I think it goes back to again back to the
higher the handicap, the more opportunity or the more benefit
you stand to gain from from being fit. So we
can make it super simple. And things like the two
ball putter, right, they totally change and revolutionize the way
people could sort of visually line themselves up. And it's
so important to get those basics fundamentally right. But like
(30:41):
you said, the amount of toll hang you have, the
face inset? Do you like an insert or do you
like a you know, mild face? Do you like something
that has offset or no offset? Do you have something
even just being over the potter, right over the ball
and having your eye line somewhat over the ball. And
if I want you to end increase your arc and
make you stand up a little bit more for what
(31:02):
you the decrease your arc A, shorten your putter and
get you over it a little bit more. Do we
want the grip to be thin where you have high release,
or do we want it to be thicker and have
a much slower release so we can influence that rate
of rotation at all times. And it's just I think
the technology that we use at Club Champo, whether it
be SAM or whether it be Quintic, I think the
(31:23):
technology is an absolute eye opener. The putter fits the
most fun for me because I know people don't have
any idea as to what their putter needs to be
for them specifically, They've done exactly what you said page.
They go in there, they take a look at one,
and they go I like the look of it. I
can get a put fairly close with it. Feels quite
nice that that'll do for me, but it does not
(31:44):
generally translate to good results.
Speaker 1 (31:46):
Yeah. I feel like the theme of the segment is misinformation,
and I feel like when it comes to club fitting,
one of the biggest things that I hear is I
can't get fit because it's too expensive. So I just
want you to talk about the cost of it, because
any equipment is expensive, and I say that it is
(32:07):
an investment and you will have these clubs for a
lot longer, and you feel more comfortable with the clubs,
and it is so worth it to go through the
fitting process instead of going and getting a driver off
the wreck, which is still expensive six hundred dollars or so,
and then you don't like it, and then you get
another one and another one, and you guys can actually
do it on a budget, correct, Like you can. Someone
(32:28):
can walk in and say, hey, this is the amount
that I want to spend and what does that look like?
What is the least amount of money that you think
someone could spend on a new set of clubs.
Speaker 4 (32:37):
I think you're absolutely right. People can come in and
get I mean, there's I guess some of the companies
who offer more budget kind of friendly products now, maybe
something like Cobra or Mizzuo. You know, those those drivers
tanying to be a little bit less than like a
titlest and a ping. There's ranges of shafts from one
hundred and fifty dollars up to five six hundred dollars.
(32:59):
So don't people, I think you're right. People think that
it's it's you know, I can't possibly afford the custom
you know, fitted for a driver. The average lifespan of
a driver for our clients is about four to five years,
and if we look at the buying behavior of clients,
it's like every year searching for the latest and greatest.
(33:19):
You do that twice inside that four to five year
timeline that we see our clients keep a driver for
And you're already spending too much. So I'm with you.
I think it's cheaper in the long run to do
it and do it right. And then most important to
be honest is knowing that when your swing changes, and
I use the word when, not if. When your swing changes,
(33:40):
you have someone then you can go back and they
can can readjust it. We know how adjustable drivers are
nowadays with weights and loved sleeves and all these different things.
Maybe it's a cheft change, not a head change. But
you want to work with a technician that you trust,
someone that you know you know has got the right
technology with track man er GC quad and they can
tell you what's right for you. But you're making little
(34:02):
tweaks over that time to incrementally get better all the time,
not wholesale changes to a new driver every single year.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
I noticed that too, So I go back into Club
Champion all the time because they fix my loft and
lies for free. And that's one of the services that
people don't, you know, realize that they offer, which I
think is great. How do you deter people from getting
excited about like a new equipment that's constantly coming out
and knowing that maybe that's it's not what's best for
(34:29):
you and maybe there's not a big jump in changes
every single six months when something comes out. How do
you deal with that?
Speaker 4 (34:38):
Yeah, it's definitely something we do deal with all the time.
And we get people delay in their fit because they
heard in three months there's a new line coming out
from this company or that company, And I say the
exactly what you said. It doesn't it won't make a difference.
There isn't seismic changes every every you know, new model
of iron or driver. There isn't those leaps forward to anore.
(35:00):
I think it just I think it just comes down
to really we changes as individuals, or swing changes, and
you're going through it right now with your swing changes,
so you're probably going to look at your equip I
think we're getting together, not you know later this year
to do some equipment stuff with you, and like, I
can't wait to see where your swing has got to
to see what equipment changes you need. Yeah, that's going
(35:21):
to be a really really fun part of the process
with you is you're putting in all this time and
I can see that the differences it's making. Already your
swing's really starting to look great, but you're probably not
that comfortable with it yet. So in a couple more months,
you know, we're we're going to have a look at
your equipment and going to see what's changed. So I
think that's that's a huge, huge part of it is,
(35:43):
you know, making those on the goal changes. Love to lie,
you know, adjustments. I say to our clients, I want
to do it with I want to look at that
with you every year. I want to make sure I
have a little tune up session with you, see what
you're working on. Did you make a golf ball change?
That's another really you know, underrated part of the equipment.
It's the fifteenth club for me is the golf ball.
I mean, if we take the low spinning golf ball
(36:05):
and the high spinning golf ball with a six iron,
there's about fifteen hundred RPMs a difference between those two.
So it's it's it's way more than we can make
with the loft of laye adjustment. So you may have went, oh,
I love the titleist whatever and prov one and then
I'm going to go to a Kirkland. Those two golf
balls about a thousand RPMs a spin difference, And you've
made that decision off of cost. Ye, right, and those
(36:27):
whole that whole set of clubs that you get fit for. Yoh,
my driver doesn't work pretty good anymore. Those irons are
really not going to keep coming up short. We've added
a thousand rpm of spin to your irons and you
can't get the ball to the target anymore. And so
you know, we're just there. We're you know, we're just
part of the team to help people make those correct choices,
(36:50):
not bad ones.
Speaker 1 (36:50):
Yeah, one hundred percent agree. Before we wrap, I want
to ask you what are some of your favorite products
that are out in the market right now.
Speaker 4 (37:00):
Was a huge fan of Ping drivers. I just think,
you know, Ping make incredible drivers. Specifically, I think they're
so forgiven they have gotten a lot faster. They used
to lag a little bit ball speed. Now they don't
they're they're they're really really good. I think Titlest have
absolutely killed it with with SM nine. In the wedges,
I think Mizuno and Strickson are making two of the
(37:21):
most underrated irons out there. And in the potter world
even Thole have just released a new putter fitting system
that I think is going to change the way that
we fit putters in our studios. I was talking to
the guys and I was in Chicago last Thursday, and
I was talking to the guys about their new for
putter fitting kit. And there's so many things now. If
(37:44):
actually we told you how many things were like the consumer,
how many things are to change, it probably would put
them off if we said, like we're changing nexts and
weights and lens and balance points on the shaft and
grip size. But it just gives us so many more
tools in our toolbox. So yeah, a few things to
keep your eye on.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
That's really exciting. I always love trying new equipment and
everything else that's out Bean. Thank you so much for
sharing all of your insight and knowledge with us. I
think that all the listeners learned a ton. If you
guys want to go get fit. Don't forget to use
my code page. That's Paige and you guty discount on
your fitting, so definitely go check that out and Ian
(38:22):
thank you so much again.
Speaker 4 (38:23):
Thank you guys.
Speaker 2 (38:25):
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